Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2084: The Key to Building an Hourglass Figure, What to Do if Can’t Seem to Recover Between Workouts, the Best Way to Work Out if You Do Manual Labor & More (Listener Live Coaching)

Starting point is 00:00:00 If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded fitness health entertainment podcast in the world. This is Mind Pump right in today's episode. We answered live, callers questions, but this was after a 60 minute introductory conversation. That's where we talk about fitness, our lives, family life, studies, current events, much more.

Starting point is 00:00:30 By the way, you could check the show notes for timestamps if you just want to fast forward to your favorite part. Also, want to be on an episode like this one, email your question to live at mypupmedia.com. This episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Creatures of Habit. This is a high protein plant-based oatmeal. Great way to start your day. 30 grams of plant-based protein plus digestive enzymes, plus vitamin D, plus probiotics. It's a great

Starting point is 00:00:55 product, inexpensive, tastes great. And again, it's start off your day with high protein. Go check them out. Go to creaturesofhabit.com, creatures spelled with a K, forward slash mind pump, use the code MP25 and get 25% off your purchase. This episode is also brought to you by Caldera. They make all natural skincare products that really, really work. I mean, this stuff is pretty amazing. The company is exploding because their products actually work. And again, they're all natural. None of those Xenoestrogens, none of those compounds that can cause hormonal effects. All great stuff. Go check them out.

Starting point is 00:01:30 Go to calderalab.com. That's C-A-L-D-E-R-A-L-A-B.com forward slash mind pump. Use the code mind pump and get 20% off your first order of the good serum. There's also only 48 hours left, only two days left for our special maps, bands, workout program launch. So this is a bands program. All you need a resistance bands, but it's an advanced workout program. This is not a beginner program. This is a program designed to build muscle, burn body fat, sculpt your body, and use the benefits of resistance bands. Because it's launching and because we're in the launch period.

Starting point is 00:02:05 If you sign up now, you get $30 off the program, plus we'll throw in two free ebooks, ultimate bodyweight training guide and quick meals for health and fitness. It's our first cookbook. If you're interested in the launch special, go to mapsbans.com and then use the code bands30 for the discount and the free ebooks. All right, here comes the show. You're trying to lose body fat. Check this out. You're better off building than you are to try to burn. You want to lose weight?

Starting point is 00:02:35 Stop trying to burn so many calories. Build the machinery that burns the calories for you. So whether you want to build muscle, you want to get stronger, or you want to get leaner, your goal should be to build muscle. That's the best approach. I wish more people took that. You got to build the machine. That's it.

Starting point is 00:02:50 I feel like we've actually made this pretty popular now because I've seen the counter now. Oh really? Uh huh. I would love to hear what that argument is. Oh, I'll share it with you. It's not, I mean, it's just a stupid calorie argument always. Oh, there's fitness people out there

Starting point is 00:03:04 that are telling you that if you want to lose weight, you should add calories. This is the, you know, they try and do it. You use the calories in calories out, through a thermodynamics argument. Listen, listen, if there's people telling you that if you want to run real fast, you need to give yourself a little space to get some runway. No, no, just take off right where you are. Okay, that's what we're saying essentially, is we're giving you some runway.

Starting point is 00:03:25 If you build muscle, you're going to build more of that calorie burning machinery. You're going to make it easier for yourself to get leaner and stay leaner. So will you lose weight as quickly as if you just cut your calories or just try to burn a ton of calories through activity? No. You go strap yourself to a treadmill and starve yourself. Yeah, you'll lose weight way faster. Let's see where that ends up.

Starting point is 00:03:46 Let's see where you are six months or a year from now. You're gonna be with 90% with the 90%. So, sustainability always has to be part of the conversation. You gotta build that machinery. There's your metabolism. There's speed up. There's another actual angle to this also. In fact, I actually just had this conversation

Starting point is 00:03:59 with my brother-in-law who's gotta lose a lot of weight right now. And his thought process was, he's like, I didn't even wanna come bother you until I proved to myself that I can walk in every single day. I'm trying to make better food choices. And so I'm gonna stick to this cardio thing. And then once I got that, then I'm gonna come to you and I'm gonna ask,

Starting point is 00:04:19 wait, so I'm like, well, brother, I said, you're better off, that time that you're spinning, going on that hour high, could just actually lifting some weights, or at least splitting that time up with lifting weights. He said, oh, you know, I wanted to first do this. I said, let me explain to you why you want to do that or why you would be better off lifting weights. And I know his like eating, how my brother likes to drink, drink beer, you like to eat candy, like he's not that he's definitely nowhere near like where he needs to be nutritionally, right?

Starting point is 00:04:45 I said, so let's say, and let's just use hypothetical numbers. I said, you go, let's say for a run, for an hour and you burn, four or 500 calories, okay? The drawback of you running for, or just running and not lifting weights, is you run for four or 500 calories. And then let's say we just had this barbecue with the family, you and I are getting some steels right now,

Starting point is 00:05:04 we have two or three of those, I have some extra tray, and you over, you over eat your calories by those 500 calories. It literally negates that hard work you did there. Okay, so now let's say instead of that, you did a weight lifting workout that burned about the same amount of calories. Same situation with the overage on the calories,

Starting point is 00:05:21 but here's the positive part of lifting weights, is you've now sent a signal to your body, that your body needs muscle because, oh, you're stimulating, what is this guy doing? And the overage on calories, some of those calories are gonna get partitioned over actually the building muscle and not just being stored as fat.

Starting point is 00:05:38 Which also turns into, is the machinery that burns more calories all the time. Exactly, so. You get this like double win by that. And then so, and he was like, there's a light bulb, you could see one off of his head, like, oh shit, I said, yeah, I said that way, you're not so stressed out about always under having

Starting point is 00:05:54 to eat so low calorie, so low calorie. Man, when you're lifting weights consistently, and you have a day where you eat a little over, that little over is gonna get partitioned over a building muscle. Listen, a lot of this is counterintuitive, but I'll say this, look at the evidence, okay? The evidence is not that people can't lose weight. The evidence is that people can't keep it off. So that approach doesn't work.

Starting point is 00:06:14 It's like this, okay? It's no different than this. You want to build wealth. There's two potential approaches. One of them is to work more hours. You make 40 bucks an hour. Well, I'm just going gonna work 12 hours a day, make more money.

Starting point is 00:06:26 That's one way to do it. Here's the other way. Continue doing what you're doing with your job. You work eight hours a day, but now take that money. Right, spend less and invest. Figure out a way to invest it so that that money makes money for you by properties that make you a little bit of money, invest in the stock market, build businesses

Starting point is 00:06:42 that can run without you, et cetera, et cetera. Which one is the strategy that builds wealth? Is you working 12 hours a day into build wealth? No. That'll make you more money right now, but I ain't going to build wealth. The investment strategy. So, building muscle is literally investing. It's the same thing as investing.

Starting point is 00:06:58 So if your goals are lose as much weight as you can in the next four weeks, fine. Forget what I'm saying. Your goals are lose weight, keep it off forever, and feel amazing amazing and be able to eat more, have a sculpted body. That analogy is so clear. That's not the case. That's why I love that analogy too, is because one of the hardest parts about disciplining yourself about spending less and investing. It's a slow process. If you were a snowball process, if you make $40 an hour and you work 12 hours a day,

Starting point is 00:07:20 you automatically make more. You don't have a lot of extra money is what I'm saying and that you have to, and then to invest it, it's like, you're, you're right. You're not gonna get rich overnight. Yeah. You're not gonna, you're not gonna build a body builder physique overnight, you know, building, building muscle,

Starting point is 00:07:35 building muscle building, it's a slow process. But what's great is over time, it, it, you, it gets you at such an advantage that the rest of the work is so easy. Yeah. Which is just like investing. It's like, yeah, putting away a few hundred dollars it gets you at such an advantage that the rest of the work is so easy, which is just like investing. Putting away a few hundred dollars every single month, you're not going to be a millionaire tomorrow.

Starting point is 00:07:51 But hey, 10 years from now, because you've consistently done that for years and years, now you ain't got to work because your investments are covering what your hourly is. Literally the counter to these calorie people or just the paycheck to paycheck people. It is. I know, I can just, I can just work more. I'll just take more shifts. I'll do overtime on this weekend. And it's like, yeah, so you can burn yourself up and like lose all your free time. Yeah. No, listen, you take two twins doing the exact same thing, both making the same money.

Starting point is 00:08:18 One of them decides to work 50% more hours. The other one takes the investment strategy. Initially, the person working more hours is going to have more money. So initially they are. But it's not going to take long for the person with the investment strategy to surpass the brother and then work less and less and less and continue to grow their wealth. That's what we're talking about. A lot of it's counterintuitive. Look, I'll give you another example. Okay. I could tell somebody and it took me years to figure this out. What's funny about what I'm about to say is the three of us who did not train altogether at the same time for the most part came to the same conclusion. And this is what I'm about to say. I could tell somebody, cut your calories. And that's what I used to say. Or I could tell somebody,

Starting point is 00:08:59 don't worry about cutting your calories, hit your protein targets and prioritize them from whole foods. Hit 130 grams of protein a day or 150 or whatever, right? Do that instead of cutting the calories. Now it sounds counter-intuitive because I'm telling you to eat more. I'm making you eat more protein, but here's what happens. Eating more protein results in more satiety, results in less calories, automatically the person doesn't feel deprived. And that protein, in combination with strength training, builds more muscle, speeds muscle speeds up them talism and leads to a better long term success.

Starting point is 00:09:29 Same thing. It sounds counterintuitive. He's telling you to eat more. That doesn't make any sense. No, no, no. I don't give a, I don't care how intuitive or counterintuitive it is. Here's what I care about. What works and what works is this build, not try to burn everything.

Starting point is 00:09:43 Now yes, if you're trying to lose weight, don't go on a crazy bulk. That doesn't make any sense. We're gonna add tons of body fat, but can you build muscle? Can you build lean muscle without gaining a ton of body fat, or gaining no body fat?

Starting point is 00:09:54 You can, especially when you're first getting started. So this is the approach, and I wish more people knew this, and this is one of the reasons, not the only reason, but it's one of the reasons why the fail rate on diets and weight loss is nine. It's north of 90%. So all these morons on social media who are trying to counter this by saying the same old tired message, ask them, where's your evidence?

Starting point is 00:10:17 Where's your evidence? Because it doesn't work. It's never worked. What's happening? It's not people are gaining the way back. Nobody's having success with this. So you were trying to come out with the counter message because you want to get clicks or whatever.

Starting point is 00:10:29 Shut your mouth. Anyway, back to the protein. Look, you know, one of our partners is a company called Creatures of Habit. They make a high protein oatmeal. I love this so much, not because it's a high protein oatmeal, but because people like to eat oatmeal for breakfast and breakfast is one of those meals that you don't have a lot of time, you want it to be convenient. Here you go, 30 grams of protein, right out the gates, add water, warm it up the microwave, and you're totally done. So this is one of the reasons why we work with that company. It's what I just said, right? Hit those protein

Starting point is 00:11:01 targets. This will lead you to success better than just cutting calories. My favorite part is all the free cookies that we've been getting. Dude. People are making amazing. I'm going to cook for you to get a few of them. Okay, so the original ones that someone said in, we're good, very good. But these no bake ones that we just got. Unbelievable. Do we know who sent them in, ducks?

Starting point is 00:11:21 We can give credit. Yeah, boy. I think we mentioned the first person on the last time we mentioned on the podcast. And I don't have that information in front of me right now. Yeah. But the most recent one, the no bake ones is from Kerry Souter. I think I'm pronouncing it right. Oh, you made a great. That was amazing.

Starting point is 00:11:37 Yeah. So they're fantastic. And so she used the maple creatures of habit. She used dates, pecans, coconut oil. They're fantastic. That's good. Yeah, and there was a chocolate coating on them, which is coconut oil and unsweetened cocoa powder. That's all the ingredients?

Starting point is 00:11:54 That's it. But we can put it together. So she put it together, you freeze it or refrigerate it. Yes. Yeah, and the instructions she said to throw it in the freezer for like a camera at the time in the freezer, but we actually just put it in the refrigerator. It worked camera of the time on the in the freezer But we actually just put in the refrigerator and it worked fine The refrigerator got it cold enough to make them hard enough and make it perfect

Starting point is 00:12:10 You know, I like about this is that is if you have kids because kids, you know They like the treats or whatever and you want to give them an alternative to the garbage crap that's out there Why I mean this is a great like this like legit. It's not one of those fake like those healthy treats that really don't taste good This one tastes good. Your kids will like it. You know what I, what, and this is, I don't know, this is just your guys, if you guys experienced this or not, because I was so consistent with,

Starting point is 00:12:33 with max with like sugar treats, things like that. And by now I've allowed things to creep in, like here and there, and I like to be the one who controls that and gives that to him. I talked about giving him gummy bears at the movie theater stuff. It's pretty cool because these are the types of things that he's had pieces of like these like homemade,

Starting point is 00:12:50 you know, quote unquote healthier versions of treats. And so he would prefer that. So if you give him like a regular like, it's too sweet. Oh, it's way too sweet. He'll give it back. We had, we were at the Gilroy Gardens and my niece, she wanted an icy, and we were not gonna tell

Starting point is 00:13:06 she's 13 years old, we're not gonna tell her she can't have an icy or what that. So she gets an icy, and Mac sees that she has one, and he's like, I want one, and so we take a little tiny one where I give it to him. And he's like, well, too much. You know, I remember that. Too sweet for him. I remember that with my older kids, we go to birthday parties, and then that's when they would get soda, because we never drink soda in the house.

Starting point is 00:13:26 And I remember my kids would, they would want this much in their cup and they wouldn't want any more because it was overwhelming. It's like you train, you have to train your brain. 100% that way. And any adult should know this. If you ever remembered your trend, you remember when you first had a glass of wine or beer, think you fucking like it, you liked it the way you like it now You did coffee. Yeah, you worked on it. You did no crazy. We do that. Oh, yeah, you work I'm like this a beer. Yeah, and then maybe now you love it and stuff like that

Starting point is 00:13:54 I've never met anybody who can honestly be oh, yeah, the first time I taste that beer It was like the best ever. Yeah, you're a liar. I still think it's disgusting. I mean, it's just I hate beer I think I tried just enough tried I crave it for you that I had we had a disgusting. I mean, it's just, I hate the arresting. I've tried, Justin, I've tried. I crave it for you. This is for you that I had. We had a barbecue and I was like, that it was a hot day. Dude, I haven't had, isn't it like that with cigarettes too?

Starting point is 00:14:12 I miss beer. Dude, people actually like cigarettes the first time they do them. I don't think so. I feel like they have to keep. There must be like, yeah, select fee, but yeah, that was always just an immediate no. Yeah, I feel like you have to try it. And I remember I had family members who,

Starting point is 00:14:26 they started smoking as teenagers, and I remember them like they had to like keep doing it until they started to like it. Well, I was just a cool thing, like because people would watch movies and it was really out there in pop culture. Everybody had a cigarette in their mouth and they wanted to be James Dean

Starting point is 00:14:40 and they want to be the cool guy. You know, and then it just was a thing, but it was always a, you smell like a disgusting astray. So I, obviously I told you I have, right? I remember the first time in that. Here's what it is disgusting tasting, but you feel that high the first time ever.

Starting point is 00:14:57 It doesn't feel good for me. Oh, I had the head change the very first time, especially the very first time, it was such a major head change that that is what you're kind of drawn to. I figured. Yeah, you're more drawn to that. Where you're sipping glass of wine or a beer, you're not getting drunk the first time, having sipping the first glass of wine or beer.

Starting point is 00:15:16 So it's like, maybe once you finally get drunk, that's what you're drawn to originally is that drunk feeling or whatever. Well, so coffee is a great example. Actually, this is a good, what's funny that we're talking about this because this is how you develop good relationships with healthy food too. Absolutely. So I remember coffee, I never like coffee.

Starting point is 00:15:35 I only liked it if you sweeten the shit out of it and added milk, so it tastes like coffee candy. Then as an adult, when, especially when we first started the podcast, I would start drinking coffee in the morning, and I didn't like it, I don't like it, I don't like it, but I started to like it over time, and I think it's the association with the caffeine, waking up, feeling good, getting a workout,

Starting point is 00:15:56 and now I like the taste of black coffee, but I remember that transition, it took me a while of drinking it on a regular basis to start to enjoy, and it's the association that I built. Yeah. Because it still tastes the same, I just perceive it now. And it's the association that I built. Yeah. Because it still tastes the same. I just perceive it now differently. No, you're so right.

Starting point is 00:16:09 And you're with healthy food too. 100%. I mean, that's the main takeaway from this conversation that I think is really interesting. And it's fascinating to watch it when, as a parent, I have control of this new born and then toddler that's like growing up in this world. And so I can control how I introduce it,

Starting point is 00:16:28 how I celebrate it in a real association. Yeah, and we've totally built this healthy relationship around certain foods and he's such a great eater. And I think, as adults, we're no different. The difference is that we have many times decades of bad associations with these healthy foods. I mean, I hated, you know, Brussels sprouts and broccoli and vegetables most of my life.

Starting point is 00:16:50 It took me till later on in my adulthood until I changed that association. Now there's times where I crave it. If we go off on trips and we eat out every single day and stuff like that, I like crave like a steak and vegetable, like a big little vegetable. So I just my body wants it because I've now. It's like home base.

Starting point is 00:17:07 And what that is, like, how do you do that, right? Like, what I, the association that I've created, when I eat that way, my digestion feels amazing. Yeah, so, and then over time, it's right. My stomach feels good, I sleep good that night. I don't have blood. And so, what I've learned to attach to, oh man, when I eat this big bowl of broccoli,

Starting point is 00:17:24 instead of filling up on like or pasta or something like that, it's got a total different way my body feels. And so now that I've paired that, my body now, especially when I'm off the other direction, great. What a great example. I can't learn to enjoy health and food. Did you like coffee the first time you drank it?

Starting point is 00:17:41 Same thing. Same exact thing. Yeah, it's interesting we're talking about this too, because we have been struggling a bit because Ethan's at the age now, he's 13 and he's always like out and about with his buddies and they're going to like, you know, convenience stores, liquor stores, all these things and getting like,

Starting point is 00:17:59 like sodas and like candy and whatnot. And so he was kind of like going off the rails for a bit and then he's, you know, he's starting to kind of realize like, oh, this doesn't make me feel good. Oh, this is like, you know, flaming my gums and like, he goes to Dennis and it's like, and we're trying to kind of associate all these things with that and so, you know, I love courting,

Starting point is 00:18:21 but also like, there's just been, we've been devoid of like any, so any kind of like, fizzy, anything also there's just been, we've been devoid of any, so any kind of like fizzy, anything, it's just all water. And I'm like, we can't, I mean, that's great. That's like ideal, but also we need to have options that are like maybe like an in-between thing. So maybe having like more mineral water available and like so you can still get that kind of same feel of it

Starting point is 00:18:43 because there is something different about drinking something with bubbles in it. And then, you know, and like having some lime in there. So we started doing that. And like, so with Topo Chico and like all these kinds of like, you know, Minerwaters, I'm starting to bring them in to the house and he's finding himself like, again, building that association with that

Starting point is 00:19:01 like a more healthier version of it. And he's craving them now now and he's drinking way less soda That's such an interesting thing to me when I think about that the the car how carbonated beverages There's like a craving for the carbonation. Yeah, well, that's what the right now what's going on with Nitrogen in coffee you see nitrogen's made to me Yeah, but night, but that's different. That's the mouth feel that well, I guess it's all mouth No, it's all mouth feel right now It's all mouth feel, but nitro was smooth and creamy. I mean the point is the same thing Yeah, it's like your your brain is get this sensation

Starting point is 00:19:31 The nicest really is things that carbonated water is spicy Spicy spicy Who it burns Keep burp through his nose Did you know that they that, when carbonated water and beverages first came out, they were sold as medicines? Oh, really?

Starting point is 00:19:48 Did you know that? Oh, that's where, because dude, my grandma used to, like, her recipe always, for when I was sick, was a sprite or seven up in those like, Saltine crackers. Yeah. What was that about like 50s error or whatever? So the original, you could look up soda shops.

Starting point is 00:20:07 They were at pharmacies. Pharmacists sold them and they would mix the carbonation. Well, they used for the longest time. So my aunt and uncle used to when I would be sick over there how they had this like coke syrup that used to They took out the carbonation. No, it was like it was medicine. It was sold as like it was only a small thing

Starting point is 00:20:23 and it was just the pure Coke syrup. And I for, it's for coughs. They used to use it for cough syrup. Just to show it to your throat. Originally had coffee in it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it was like, it was like, Cola syrup or whatever.

Starting point is 00:20:33 Maybe there was a caffeine in it and that helps because caffeine can be a brachodiala. No, it was four, it was four, it was four coughs. Well, that's what I mean. Caffeines, a mile bronchodiala. Oh, I don't know. They used to give it to kids with asthma. You know that?

Starting point is 00:20:43 With, with, with kids had asthma before the asthma treatments, kids would drink a big ass coffee in the morning. You think that? Really? Yeah. But you know, Justin, you bring up a really interesting, because I'm not there yet, like to have to do that. But we have a lot of carbon.

Starting point is 00:20:55 We have a lot of severas and carbonated water. Like we do the, what's that other, Le Croix, the other ones. Yeah, I'm the one with some of those in Bubbly's. And I do think that's a smart strategy, because if he gets introduced to that early, and he likes on those and bubbly's and I do think that's a smart strategy because If he gets introduced to that early and he likes that and then he's with his friends when he's 13 14 years old going to the liquor store And his friends go to deal. Yeah, they reach for Pepsi. He grabs a look boy. No one's gonna say shit Yeah, he's in he's he's he's still experiencing the whole hanging out with friends going to buy in like a drink and so

Starting point is 00:21:21 That he just prefers that because he grew up and going to buy in like a drink and so on that, he just prefers that because he grew up tasting that. I think there's a smart strategy probably, as parents, like maybe introducing things like that for that exact reason. I never really thought about that until, right now, because like Max drinks like water, like he's literally like mostly water.

Starting point is 00:21:37 He doesn't even like juicer. That's how they started, yeah, for sure. And it was like nice and controlled. Dude, that's the mistake. It gets away from you. The mistake I feel like is all these, you know, healthy juices that are marketed to kids. They're not.

Starting point is 00:21:49 Yeah, yeah. 30 grams of sugar. I'm sure, I think you're kidding me. Like, that is priming them for soda. Yeah. Like, you want to prime your kid for soda, give them a juice box. Dude.

Starting point is 00:21:59 Because the juice box has got 20 to 30 grams of sugar, which is like, what soda has? I know, I know parents whose kids that all they gave, because in the 80s and 90s, that's what they thought was healthy. Give your kid juice. Little kids with tooth decay. Little kids, four or five years old

Starting point is 00:22:14 because they were drinking all they drank with apple juice all the time. Okay. We grew up on that. That was around, which probably contributed to my sugar addiction because the orange juice and apple juice was in the inside. That was, if I wasn't drinking milk or water,

Starting point is 00:22:29 it was orange juice or apple juice. So I didn't drink that stuff, not because my parents thought it was unhealthy, but because it cost more money than water. So my parents thought it was saving money. Drink for the fuck. Drink for the garden hose. Doug, did you find that where the soda's originated?

Starting point is 00:22:41 The garden. Yeah, the soda shops definitely were pharmacies. Yeah, I think if you ever watch, it's a wonderful life. Oh, yeah. But they have a sodas shop there, they do. Probably a pharmacy as well. It's a wonderful life.

Starting point is 00:22:53 It's the old, that's one of the most classic Christmas movies. You never seen that? Angel gets its wings. It'll make you cry, bro. Every time a bell rings. Bell rings, yeah. It's, they said that it had medicinal properties

Starting point is 00:23:06 and it cured all kinds of different shit because someone figured out how to carbonate water. Yeah. What is this? Oh, it's magic. I want to try, like, the store is have like, Target, so that have like the app. Where you can carbonate yourself?

Starting point is 00:23:18 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I bought one of those for just. Oh, you did? I did. What do you think? I guess if you're not partial to how much carbonation, it's fine, but she likes it super-carbonated and didn't reach that level.

Starting point is 00:23:30 Like you know how to talk with Chico? Yeah. It's like way more carbonated. There's so many bubbles per whatever like square footage in there. I don't know what that measure is. It's gonna bullshit my way. BPS.

Starting point is 00:23:41 Yeah. How many BPS do you want? BPS in there is like super- Bubble-for-square-foot. Constructed in high. Yeah. It does though. If you have sample- BPS yeah, how many BPS do the BS in there is like bubble first work with concentrated high yeah it does though if you have a sample is that why we all like to but she goes so much is it's it's more than normal yeah yeah it's more bubbly compare it to sample a greeno uh sample a greeno doesn't bite like sample like uh

Starting point is 00:23:58 oh you know what I mean I we all like to but she go I like to but she go also it's got way more bite I but I've never like compared had like fuck out of it. Yeah. Yeah. That's funny to me. Yeah. I know. Yeah. And the nitrous is just like way smaller bubbles, right? That's what gives it that. Have you guys seen? Do you guys see? I actually bought some. I tried the Pepsi now has nitrogen in it. I bet it feels good. It's weird. So you know what it reminds me of. Because I love nitro coffee.

Starting point is 00:24:26 Love it. It's like butter coffee. The best. So you, okay, to that point, like this kind of buttery creamy. Yeah. So it, you know what it reminds me of is when you have like a coke float or a root beer float. Oh god, don't say that.

Starting point is 00:24:38 I'm gonna go buy some. I'm gonna go buy some. The bottom of it after the melt. After the ice cream's gone. Yes. Oh, I'm gonna go buy some. Yeah, that's that. Don't say that. Yeah, try. what I wanted to do I wanted to me a little target or any right now Everywhere they come in this they look like a brown like a brown

Starting point is 00:24:50 Camps you count it's it's tall the reason why I actually don't like it is because it comes in it It comes in a big tall kid. It's like three hundred and eighty calories Well, that's a lot of calories for me to just have a little still a diabetes right there But I what I haven't done so I gave him my buddy, my buddy, when he comes to my house, he's always mad because I have all diet stuff and he's a regular soda drinker. And I had those and he like sucked them down. He loved them. And I was like, I was keeping him because I wanted to pour it over ice cream because I figured,

Starting point is 00:25:18 okay, that's a long. If it's got that kind of cream flavor already, and then he poured over the ice cream, it might be balls. You know, my kids have never had a root beer float. I'm very, very, very happy. There they are, there they are. See those, oh, what's the, what's the blue one? What's the difference?

Starting point is 00:25:31 I think one's diet, one's not. Okay, hand-reaching. I know one's vanilla. Oh my god. So that's the one, oh, that's why it tasted like the ice cream. So I've only had the vanilla one. I haven't had a regular one yet. Oh, I'm gonna have to try the regular one.

Starting point is 00:25:42 Okay, so what's your favorite root beer though? Cause that, that determines something for me. Oh, I'm gonna have to try the right. Okay. So what's your favorite root beer though? Because that that determines. And W's great. Dad's is I like them all, but I like it. And I'm his one of my favorite Henry Wine Hearths, dude. I never had that. Oh, what? Yeah. Now is it sweet or is it more because you know, a root beer can either be more in candyish or more like bite? It's more I guess that we should say it's more like a bite, but it's like

Starting point is 00:26:01 brew. It's like brewed like a beer. So it's like more. I don't know. It has more kind of like an adult. How did Root Beer get its name? Why is it Root Beer? Come from a root. That's a Sprilla. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:26:12 So that's what the flame, the flame comes from a root. You guys want to hear something funny? And then why a beer though? So why is it, why is it not root? Because that was, they just named it beer. Yeah. Make it like an alternative to beer. It foams out.

Starting point is 00:26:22 So when you're ordering it at the bar, you don't feel like it's just a turd. I don't know. I'll have a beer too. Yeah, I want to to beer. It foams out. So when you're ordering it at the bar, you don't feel like it's just turd. I don't know. I'll have a beer too. You can have a root beer. Did you guys know that, okay, Saspirilla root, that's in root beer. There used to be a supplement.

Starting point is 00:26:35 This is great. I remember this. I used to take this, would've wasted the money. Saspirilla root. It used to be smilax. Look up smilax. Oh, I do remember that.

Starting point is 00:26:42 Do you remember that? I do remember. Raised testosterone takes my last So I remember I bought it say talk I bought everything by the way a 15 year old train of razor testosterone Bro, that's like it probably worked the opposite That's like putting a shot glass in the ocean I got more water Somewhere yeah, no, but I bought everything right bought everything as a cake

Starting point is 00:27:01 I worked and I just wanted to build muscle and I remember you know Smilax pills, and my uncle, who's an herbalist, he's like, what's that? I looked at him, he's like, why don't you just drink root? You know what, you actually should explain to the audience so they understand, because as,

Starting point is 00:27:12 here's why I thought as a teenage boy that taking a test off. You still sell it. They do. Doug, look up Smilax, is Smilax, Sasprilla root. I think they're connected. So they are.

Starting point is 00:27:24 It is. Oh, it is. That's is. Yeah, yeah, that's all it is That's what my uncle may follow me because I want you to just drink root beer It's full circle now again. It's a pharmacy. Yeah, that's you want to know what's funny? I'm gonna buy against you What happens? I said bro, come on? Okay, so let's explain to the audience especially our young audience because This was this is what I didn't understand until I got older, like how testosterone boosters work. Why are they so popular? Why are there so many of them?

Starting point is 00:27:51 Why are you still see research that's around them that shows they do work? Why would it not boost me at 15 years old? Why would I get more? Okay, so 90% of the quote unquote test boosters really just increase libido, So that's number one. There's lots of compounds out there that will temporarily increase libido and that gives the person like the feeling of like, oh my god, I have more testosterone. So that's number one.

Starting point is 00:28:14 Number two, the 10% that actually raised testosterone really only do it in men with depressed testosterone. If your testosterone's high and kind of a waste of time. Even then, it brings you up to normal, not superficial levels. So if you're a young teenage boy, which most average young teenage boys are already peak testosterone for their life, they're already at the upper, upper echelon. So where you see benefits is the 50 year old guy who has like, so low, yes, so low, then he takes it and it brings him up to here. And then that's a traumatic difference for a 50 year old guy who's in the floor

Starting point is 00:28:49 who also takes it. But you take a 15 year old boy who never even goes below here and he's mostly up here all the time and he give him his time- Wait, is that time? Nothing. Wait, so many things.

Starting point is 00:28:59 I always thought it would do this. It would put me above my line. Yeah, like, oh, I'm like taking steroids. Right. If you, look, let me put it this way.. Yeah, like, ooh, I'm like taking steroids. Right. No, if you, if you, look, let me put it this way, if you took something that gave you a 15% measurable increase into testosterone, which is statistically significant, still nothing, even if you had high testosterone,

Starting point is 00:29:17 your number is at, let's say you're at 800, right? You're gonna go up what 100 something points on, not on free testosterone, total testosterone. Yeah, you're not on free testosterone total testosterone. It's not going to do anything for you. It's not going to do anything for you. So now, like, there's supplements out there, like ashwaganda, that'll raise testosterone a little bit, but also builds muscle, also improves, you know, stamina and strength.

Starting point is 00:29:37 The stamina and strength and all that stuff is not the testosterone boosting effects. That's kind of a side effect. It's because things like ashwaganda is an effective, what's known as adaptogen. And adaptogens, they improve your body's ability to adapt to us. Well, wouldn't you guys say too, like if I had somebody who has like really low or low testosterone, like, there's things that you could do in their their diet and sleep, rest more and lifting weights that will be far more more impactful than the testosterone. Like you getting somebody who has lower testosterone,

Starting point is 00:30:08 no matter what their age is, to prioritize sleep, eat a more balanced healthy diet and strength train two times a week, you will show rocketing testosterone that was in comparison to the best testosterone. It's not just testosterone either. There was a study where they tested all these different men and they looked at total best testosterone. It's not just testosterone either. There was a study where they tested all these different men and they looked at total free testosterone. So total testosterone, free testosterone,

Starting point is 00:30:31 and Androgen receptor density. And then they had them work out and they looked at their results. Now all these men were within a particular range. So some men had lower within range, some people had higher within range. And the correlation between testosterone and muscle wasn't that big.

Starting point is 00:30:46 You know what was? Angerogen receptor density. The more angerogen receptors they had, the more muscle they built. Okay, what builds angerogen receptor density? Lifting weights. So even if your testosterone numbers don't go up from lifting weights, the amount of testosterone

Starting point is 00:31:02 you'll utilize goes up because the angerrogen receptor density. So in other words, if you had a 400 testosterone level and you doubled your Androgen receptor density, it would be like doubling your testosterone or more because there's more that the Androgen receptors do than just allow testosterone to exert its effect. There is one thing you get from test boosters. It's gyno. You got that going for me. That's from the hormones that they sold as pro hormones.

Starting point is 00:31:27 That's the shit I took. Okay, how would you explain it? So, since we went this direction, I actually wasn't even playing on Thomas, but I do want to hear how you would explain that so I was trying to articulate this to my brother and law. So I was talking about him, about his diet and trying to get him to strength train. The other thing that he was frustrated with, that he was

Starting point is 00:31:43 like, he was asking me, hey, how much testosterone are you taking? Cause we have, he's on hormone therapy. He's been on hormone therapy for like a whole like three, four months or whatever. And he's like, you know, I just, I don't really feel it. He's like, I don't, and he's taking the exact same dose that I'm taking, right? And he's like, yeah, I was telling his wife, Jirlene,

Starting point is 00:32:01 that he's like, I was gonna tell her to give me double the dose. I'm like, oh dude, it's a calm down. Yes, I said, I said, you know what? I said, this is what I explain. I know, like, maybe you can put better words to this, but I was like, you know, you're doing, for exercise, you're doing cardio, your diet isn't dialed in really well. And then you add in this test, I'll show you.

Starting point is 00:32:21 Okay, what you're probably only feeling, if I had to to guess was probably an increase in your libido and sex drive and you're not feeling this crazy strength, energy, like you don't feel like, oh, like that's probably what all you're all you're really getting from that. I said, when you take testosterone synthetically like this, all it's really doing is taking you up to like your optimal levels, but where it starts to feel the feeling becomes compounding is when you start coupling it with eating well, trait lifting weights, then you're going to feel like, you're going to build muscle faster, you're going to recover quicker, your body's actually more animalic. Yes, so you're going to feel a way better. But if all you do, you take this to the bathroom and you don't, you're not using it.

Starting point is 00:33:00 Yeah, and you're not eating your protein, you're not hitting your protein intake, right? You're doing your exercise, regimen isn't cardio only. You're, you're all you might feel from it is an increased libido. Yeah, he feels something, but you're not using it, right? It's like eating extra protein, but not having the signal to utilize that protein in the way that you want. Essentially, right? So you more testosterone will give you some effects if you were low. So go from low to high There's health benefits because being low is not healthy, right? Just like being too high with like if you let's say you took this ridiculous doses Too low is not good high normal is better

Starting point is 00:33:35 But you there are ways you can use more that testosterone through your lifestyle And if you don't do those things then you'll feel, but you're not gonna reap the full benefits of it. Like, look, if you've been, I felt profound effects from going on testosterone, but that's cause I'm lifting weights for so long that I think my Androgen receptor density was through the roof. I had optimized everything.

Starting point is 00:33:58 At the time, I didn't realize it was because my testosterone was so low, and there's a whole story to why. But when I went on, it was like, boom, cause now I'm using it, now I'm utilizing it. It was like the missing piece. But if you have missing pieces, one of them's hormones,

Starting point is 00:34:11 and they've all these other missing pieces, like, yeah. Well, I was highlighting to him. I said, I said, this is the myth around taking test awesome. People think it's like this magical hormone. And there is, like, there is some things to about make it feel magical. I said, but there is this myth around it that you just take it

Starting point is 00:34:26 and you're gonna be like this, you know, buff monster. Average muscle gain for a man or lean mass gain, I should say, which includes water. Average lean mass gain for a man who goes on testosterone, who had low testosterone is between 68, so I think around six or seven pounds. Oh, I've never seen a research on that. Yeah, so like they'll go, they'll gain about six pounds of lean body mass and lose,

Starting point is 00:34:46 I think like two pounds of fat mass or something like that. That's it. The one that, that's it. That's all you got. Now you take that person, you have them work out. And you eat good. Oh my, now it's like, dumb, old or triple right?

Starting point is 00:34:56 Right, that's kind of how I was trying to explain to them. It was like see what you start pairing that with training, lifting weights, and then hitting your protein and takes, I said, and then I also reminded them too. I said, the other boss had been, remember what I told you earlier? I said about you, instead of doing cardio-lifting weights,

Starting point is 00:35:11 and then if you actually, if you had like today, I said, because we were drinking beer and eating steak. I'm like, and we're probably gonna overeat a little bit. What's great is, because you're on testosterone, that's probably gonna go right to building muscle for you, because you, if you were lifting weights, since you're not lifting weights, these extra beer calories and steak that we're having

Starting point is 00:35:27 is gonna get prioritized as body fat. That's right. Because you're not sitting at sitting at the body that it needs muscle and he was like, oh, shit, that was all I had to say to him. Your beer and steak was gonna go to build muscle. I'll lift it away tomorrow. I can get more steak.

Starting point is 00:35:38 That's a good beer. It's my best. It's beer build muscle. Do you guys know back in the day, it was healthier to drink beer than it was to drink water? Do you guys know this? Yeah, it brought medieval times. Because you had shitty water.

Starting point is 00:35:51 Yeah, exactly. Everybody's getting dysentery. Yeah. So better to drink beer. Hey, speaking of that. Speaking of back in the day, we talked about the software. I want Doug to look this up.

Starting point is 00:35:59 Doug, look up whipping boy, the origins. Okay, so I'm almost positive, not 100%, that this is the story. It's crazy if I'm right, that when there was royalty, there were children who were royalty, and when they fucked up, they didn't get punished. It was a kid that was their job was to get punished for them.

Starting point is 00:36:17 Okay, so let's say you're the king on your son. Okay, I'm the prince. You're the prince. This is the whipping boy. Okay, so I fuck prince. You're the prince. This is the whipping boy. Justin, we hire him. So I fuck up and I, we get Justin and we get, I let the dog out and the dog ran away

Starting point is 00:36:31 or something like that. I'm in big ass trouble. I have to sit down and watch you whip it. You watch him get his ass beat. You watch him get his ass beat. So it's kind of a punishment, but also I'm doing the ass beat. Now I think part of it was you tried to make your friend.

Starting point is 00:36:44 Like fear. I would think no, I think part of it was you tried to make your friend. Like fear. Like fear. I would think no, I think it would be a strategy to strike fear in me that I'm watching this kid get beat. Unless you're like a messed up like Caligula. Well, or I'm sure there's like this arc, right? Like when I'm really young, I see another kid get whipped. I probably see her.

Starting point is 00:36:59 Eventually you're like, yes, terrified you. But then you get to be like a teenager like. Yeah, this is just kid. So what's that that King in Game of Thrones the one like the shitty little shitty boy. Jofrey. Yeah, he's gonna create a bunch of Jofrey Yeah, I think it modeled him after I want to say colligula. Didn't they model him after that? Probably wasn't colligula the one who the history of his mom killed her husband poison him with mushrooms

Starting point is 00:37:23 So that her son who I believe was collegial I think I'm not I'm probably wrong could be the emperor and then kill eventually killed his mom Because whatever slept with the sister was just a set Roman fire Yeah, that's correct. So what they do is they have a young boy for example prince and then there's a young boy that would take the whipping is they have a young boy, for example, Prince and then there's a young boy that would take the whipping. You're actually correct. It's an early year. That's so okay. Okay. Now we're so I thought they hired a little kid. You know, for people all bad though, like it was I, did you hear me out here? Back then, the disparity between the wealthy and rich versus the poor was like, you know,

Starting point is 00:38:04 you think it's crazy today, it was crazy. Right. Okay, so I come from a family, okay, and like my family, that was time, I'm like the fucking, we're eating on the streets, we're fucking, we're poor, poor. You scoop me up, okay?

Starting point is 00:38:16 Your job is getting whipped. That's right, my job is to get whipped, but I now live in the castle. Yeah, exactly. I get three meals a day. So my understanding, So the boy was actually educated. The long side you educate me. I just got to get asked beating when my friend fucks up. Yeah, I guess in the context of yeah. That's so bad. Look, we always do this right.

Starting point is 00:38:33 We judge the past by based off of the standards of today. Yeah, if you do that, sure, but still fucked up. I mean, it's fucked up no matter what you imagine your class teacher And I mean I mean I mean if you look even further out what do you think war is? What do you mean because the king's sending everybody out to do their bidding and die on half of your name And it's the same thing like in you know the bigger No, but does it again you think process after a minute. Yeah, if you if you were that like I I don't know bro I would take you want to be the whipping boy. Yep. If you were that like, I don't know, bro, I would take you. You want to be the whipping boy? Yeah, fuck yeah.

Starting point is 00:39:07 Sign me up. I'm on the street fucking eating at a trash cans and whatever and like rough life. And it's like, I got to get asked beating once a week maybe. Bro, you know what's funny is that people take for granted. People take for granted so much of how far we've come. They think that it's natural for people to have rights, to for everybody to be treated a particular way,

Starting point is 00:39:27 that this is not natural. What is natural is how you live. Never been the case. The wibby boy deemed it in honor to take a beating for him. Yeah. Yeah, Adam was right. So basically the wibby boy got to do everything the royal prince got to do.

Starting point is 00:39:39 Fuckin' A, sign me up. I'm a ruffian. What if the prince was a ruffian? I got a beat for free. Plus. I got, I got bait for free. Plus. Yeah. I got, I got to get out of tough that kid.

Starting point is 00:39:48 I was pouring in. I got beat. Bro, he's okay. Fuck you. You can't, you can't beat him. He was pouring. Yeah, you're saying like that's way worse. That's way worse.

Starting point is 00:39:58 You didn't get a deal. You just stand for it. You have to play with the prince. You said get the fuck out of here. I have to make a freaking argument. Sign me up. Wow. That's a bad point. To play with the prince Get the fuck out of here And freaking our Me That's a bad point You got to be anywhere for you

Starting point is 00:40:11 I still got people out of here Yes, I did get a pony though So you didn't get a pony though No, it wasn't mine, Doug Oh, yeah, no electricity though Doug They had horses You said no, I don't even like saying I was poor anymore, because I already feel like Sal was definitely more broke

Starting point is 00:40:27 than I was. We were irresponsible with money. But I definitely got whips. I got whips. We were irresponsible with money. And in today's time, and like, it's sign up to hang out with the billionaire's son, and I just kind of take his ass whooping

Starting point is 00:40:42 there once in a while, but get to do all the things with him. Like, come on. When I go take the pictures at the back everyone so well, we get to do all the things with him, like, come on. When I take the pictures at the back of the yacht, you know, yeah, dude, yeah, then they slip. Oh, great. Make me talk to the dungeon. Adam got to selfie with the prince, but he has a black eye. He's half-picked.

Starting point is 00:40:56 Yeah, he got a big ass grin on my face, though. Big ass grin on me. That prince loves him. Hang on, I'm very young to buy, you know what I'm saying. Dude, I was telling, but I telling Jessica stories when I was a kid. Sometimes you ever hear words come at your mouth. They're like, oh yeah, that was kind of fucked up. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:41:09 I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. If I woke up my mom to her leaks and go and take a shower, she threw her shoe at me. And I laugh about it, Jessica's like, Jessica stop me, she goes, she threw a shoe at you. Yeah. I was like, yeah. She's like, wait a minute.

Starting point is 00:41:22 A shoe. She picked up a shoe and went through it. Oh yeah, that's kind of funny. That's been my whole relationship with Katrina. Tell her her childhood story. She's like, you, just like wait a minute. A shoe, she picked up a shoe and we'll throw it at you. Oh yeah, that's kind of funny. That's been my whole relationship with Katrina. Tell her, her childhood story, she's like, you know that's not normal. Yeah, yeah. Oh, I guess I never really thought about that.

Starting point is 00:41:31 Whoa. I was like, wait a minute, it's not wild though, because that's your world, that is normal. You think it's normal. Yeah, I mean, I would never throw a shoe at my kid. You know what I'm saying? Like I would never throw a shoe. I would be like, what am I doing, you know?

Starting point is 00:41:44 Half all the time. You say half it all the time. I'm in with them. And the throw a shoe. I'm like, I would be like, what am I doing, you know? Half all the time. You stay happy all the time. And the aim was just, let me tell you, that should be coming around the floor. Hey, speaking of your family, I saw things news in Italy that like, that stuff is. I represent Italy.

Starting point is 00:41:55 I do. You represent. Okay, go ahead. It's a bunch of like sinkholes, like cities like falling in. What? Yeah, I don't know that that yeah, it's like brand new Hold on I'm gonna defer to Justin. Is this the sign at the end times again? Oh, I'm gonna

Starting point is 00:42:09 Miss kid you look up from me. It's in the middle east. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Oh shit. Yeah. Hey, why he's looking this up I don't know. Yeah, I'm gonna pull this up here. I saw you know you were talking about your picture of your four buddies and stuff on the Scooters bro, can I say something? Yeah, I Yeah, I realize now why you take the fat joke so well, because you grew up being a skinny kid. Bro, yeah, you're literally like the skinny kid. Bro, you look tiny. I know. You look tiny.

Starting point is 00:42:33 Don't make you guys look tiny. I know. Oh, I mean, hey, yeah, second. I know, it's okay. Bro, I was always here, okay, because my dad here, here, I think I was talking to Ed about this too, my friend. He's the biggest guy, right? He's like, oh, boy, that guy was a fucking mountain in college.

Starting point is 00:42:46 Holy shit. Dude, okay. So he came from Western Michigan and he was like, you know, a top rated player. And like, he came to our school and like, I was like, roomed with him. My whole job was to get him into the weight room because like, that fucking, I love him to death. He's one of the laziest dudes. I'm glad. I'm glad he's so big. You know it. It's one of the laziest dudes. I'm playing it.

Starting point is 00:43:05 I'm a one man. Because he's so big. But you know it. It's true. I know he was so gifted, bro. He's so gifted. Okay, so here's the thing. Like, was he strong or shit or what?

Starting point is 00:43:12 Like unbelievably strong. Like, you've never even met somebody this strong that doesn't use it, right? So you go to like, try to tackle him or, or like, so he was a offensive lineman All he had to do was like stick out his arm like this and it was like Nobody would ever even he would knock people just flat on their back just by this like effortless And so he did that with me one time in practice, and I'm like, you know

Starting point is 00:43:38 Blitz in through one of the holes and he just did this and I just felt like a little toddler Wow, you know, and he I've seen them hold people up like over like, we were at this party, held this guy over the railing, just to teach him a lesson. And the guy was like, literally thought he was gonna die and he's like, ah! And he like put him back down gently. He was massive. How strong was he in the gym?

Starting point is 00:44:02 Was he just hitting crazy numbers? You know, he never even tried, dude, but like, you could just stack plates on it forever. And he'd be fine. That's like my cousin Andy, who you guys know. He's a mousse too. Bro, he was, he's met me at the gym the other day, the other day.

Starting point is 00:44:15 Oh, yeah, I love this. This is great. And we were just, we were lifting weights, dude. This dude, he comes up. Just as Adam's been working out for his life. Bro. And he lifts, we were, I was dead lifting, right? And he's like, and he has terrible form.

Starting point is 00:44:27 He's just know how to do it at all. And he just comes over and just like, how do I do this? And he's just like, yeah, picks up 315, like all like no problem. And I'm just like, dude, you're so, I hate you. Nice retire. Yeah, I'm done.

Starting point is 00:44:37 He's like, put more on there. I'm like, no, dude, your form is terrible. We have to get good mechanics. He's like, why, it's too easy. I can't even feel it. I'm like, fucking hate you, dude. Oh, that's hilarious.'s like, why, it's too easy, I can't even feel it. I'm fucking hate you dude. That's hilarious. Serious, just a moose.

Starting point is 00:44:47 Oh yeah, so I mean, I, my whole childhood, my dad was six, seven and he was a monster. Like, and he's, he's definitely shrunk over the years and like, he's, you know, like his, his spine, everything's kind of like, you know, rounded him forward, but like, I, I idolized him, you know, and he's like this huge monster. And so it's like, I've just, I've always kind of gravitatedized him, you know, and he's like this huge monster. And so it's like, I've just,

Starting point is 00:45:05 I've always kind of gravitated towards like, you know, big kind of dudes. They're attracted to big guys. I'm just real attracted to big bears. It's like, hug me. Yeah. Hey, so what is it? A bunch of singles.

Starting point is 00:45:17 What do you mean a bunch of things? This is like, a whole, a whole, a lot of these are a couple years old. But yeah, there's been singles and they, there's a couple of things like, like literally like today. I was really something. Yeah, yeah, I was reading on I think it was. End of time.

Starting point is 00:45:28 I'm telling you. I saw I saw one of those I saw and then there was other ones were like in the city and stuff that were the houses were falling. Look, Doug, if you took a picture of you and know with your family, I thought you could come. Did they have like a crazy rain storm like over the winter or something?

Starting point is 00:45:45 No, I like listen to soil. This is just like no idea. I feel like this is one of those like viral things. Maybe you click on and then they made to try to make it. It's like I mean, he just click on news. That's all. Yeah. There's nothing super recent. So I don't know why it's not showing up here.

Starting point is 00:45:59 Because I remember in Utah, they had that one like whole complex. Oh, I know that brick was talking about. Yes. I saw Cliff. I saw a clip This guy was on the lake. I don't know. Look. It was like a lake and he was sitting there and there were trees along the bank And all of a sudden the tree started moving and they all fucking sink and then the lake started going into the hole And he's hitting the gas on the boat to try to get out. Oh, that's terrifying. Wow that's terrifying Yeah, you can't do nothing. I think drowning is got it

Starting point is 00:46:25 I know they say it's you fork like if you drown die that way that but that's like a scary way for me I know that by the way Maybe yeah, I don't know would you rather burn or drown drown? I'm not a burn you can me Well because of that that I know that the it's supposed to fill you for I would rather drown No, I think when you It only hurts for a real short period of time I think you suffocate first, right? There's got to be a lot of problems.

Starting point is 00:46:51 I think that's the worst way to go. Well, so here's what I feel like with the drowning, why it would be so terrifying. You're in the water, you're going under, so you're going to hold your breath as long as you can, and you know at some point, you can't hold your breath, and you have to suck water in. Ooh, that's scary.

Starting point is 00:47:06 That's rough. Yeah, that's a scary, it's rough. Yeah, but there's, whatever that period of time, you're talking about burning though, there's like a period of time where that shit really hurts. Yeah, it's not like, with drowning, there's never gonna be any pain.

Starting point is 00:47:19 It's literally more fear. There's a terrible conversation, but we were like, I should've been talking about it. We were talking about it. Being were talking about being exposed to things like faces of death growing up and that. Oh my God, everybody passed. Do you guys watch that?

Starting point is 00:47:30 Pass this DVD to their friends, it came from like the, you know, their older brothers and then it was passed around and passed down. What was it? Why was this a phenomenon? You never watched that? What's it called? Faces of death.

Starting point is 00:47:41 Faces of death. No, I can't watch stuff like that. Okay, yeah, yeah, remember it? No, I think I've heard of it Okay, so when we were kids for people. No, we didn't have the internet, right? So there was a DVD It was VHS when I saw I think yeah, I think it was VHS and it was called faces of death and it was Clips of people of like horrible things. Yeah, I saw 30 seconds of it and got traumatized and walked out the room. Yeah, it bro, it's bad.

Starting point is 00:48:06 I watched like four of them. You see, I got to talk about, hit by a train and I left. I'm like, I'm not watching this. Yeah, it just makes me think of like the internet in general in terms of like, if you're a curious teenager, you get through that, like what they're like searching, like nobody knows about, you know, and then there's a whole underground thing. I'll tell you right now.

Starting point is 00:48:25 So my older son told me that there's a website, he watched, he looked at when he was like 13 thanks kid, or dad, I guess I did a shitty job. That you start at the top and it starts with like nice pictures and you keep scrolling down and the more you scroll down, the more disturbing it gets. And the goal is to see how far you can keep scrolling down. And it shows worse and worse stuff, the more you scroll down. Oh wow. Yeah. Yeah. And he was telling me about

Starting point is 00:48:48 it. I'm like, wow, you shit. I guess I shouldn't let you sit in your room on your computer. Anybody hear about the news? Also today, I about Facebook, they're $1 billion lawsuit for what? The privacy. So yeah yeah. Who's suing him? I don't know, who's, I don't know. Is it the EU? I think so actually. I think it is the EU. Yeah, the EU has been going after these companies.

Starting point is 00:49:12 Yeah, I think, and I don't know if they, I don't know if they officially won, and that's what the news is, or with that, but it was like a billion dollar. Massive hit. Yeah, that's like bankrupt somebody. Yeah, but will they pay it, or do they have to? I mean, maybe.

Starting point is 00:49:24 Well, that's why I wanted to ask you, like what happens when someone, like a company gets sued for a billion dollars by like the EU, like, I mean, well, they either cease business or you're gonna get enough money to do that by shutting them down. I am. So it says here, anyone in the US

Starting point is 00:49:38 who used Facebook in the last 16 years can now collect a piece of $ $725 million settlement by meta. So they did the settlement. So this is a US based thing. And it's a settlement. Now hold on a sec. What do we all get? $2?

Starting point is 00:49:50 Uh, yeah. And the attorneys make a killing. Yeah. So we'll make like make like two bucks. We should all claim. That's the thing with all those class action lawsuits. Do you guys follow Sean Whalen? Do you know that is the he's like he's the lines?

Starting point is 00:50:02 Not she. Yeah. Yeah. Line's not she guy. Did you see he had a big lawsuit that he lost? No, he lost. You were telling me, not. Because somebody was trying to say that he

Starting point is 00:50:12 manufactured everything overseas. Yeah, so like he went through this process where he was like saying that like all his stuff was made in US and it was like there was a period of time where like some of the clothes he was getting was still from like from China or whatnot like that and then like what everybody does. Prince on the shirts, whatever.

Starting point is 00:50:26 It sounded like it was a bullshit like small transitional period for him that like he was he still had inventory that was coming from here. He had made the transition here and that's when he had whatever. Like so anyways, you got slapped with like I think $250,000 or whatever. And so everybody who had bought one of those shirts got a $15 check mail to them. Really? Because of that? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:50:49 I thought that was interesting that he got hit like that. The best lawsuit that I ever had money from, and you got money from them too, was 24 of fitness. Did you get a net? I got a net. I got a big chunk of it. I got a good chunk of it. How much did you get?

Starting point is 00:51:00 15 or 17. So did I. You know, it was under 20, but it was more than eight. You know why I got so long, I was later on. You know why I got so much money though? Because I worked a fraction of the time you worked there. I was only there. It was over time, right?

Starting point is 00:51:13 That was the thing. Yeah, we used to sign that I remember, okay, I remember being taught by my boss, like I'd be asking him, well, how do I, we take a break for 15 minutes here? He's like, listen, just when you get to work, put in and then when you leave, you put in. So, so we just, here was the lawsuit for get to work, put in, and then when you leave, you put all the shit in.

Starting point is 00:51:25 So, he was the lawsuit for people, no, right? It was hanging out forever. You're a salaried employee, but you did non-salaried work and you can get paid for it. You had to log your hours. Yeah, so what you used to do is you would log your hours. Now, here's where people fucked up,

Starting point is 00:51:38 because I had friends that worked with me, who they put nine to five, nine to five, right? Just because you fill it out. They just want you to fill it in. No, I put what time I came, what time I left. That's what I did. I'm like, I'm being honest. I got here at eight and I left at 10.

Starting point is 00:51:50 So I put eight to 10, six days a week. I was only there for a couple of years, but those hours had it up. And later on, I left the company, everything I'm doing my own thing. I got a check in the mail. I think it was like 17G. Yeah, I got like three checks from them for that

Starting point is 00:52:01 of those lawsuits. That was like a nice surprise. Yeah, it was, it was a huge come up for me at that time. Yeah, I know, right. Yeah, it was like, it was not because I was expected. Yeah, and I had left a company by that time. And of course, I had kind of a sour taste in my mouth the way that ended.

Starting point is 00:52:15 And I was like, okay, this is the pain a little bit. I was happy that I was honest. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that's why I'm so cautious about us. I remember when we were first starting to scale and add employees, I remember telling Katrina, I'm like, hey, you can't be telling our staff to do this

Starting point is 00:52:32 or tell our staff to do that. Like, that shit will come back and buy you an ass. So you can't, that's not, they have to be able, they have to have a break every four hours. You have to do this, like, I know we have this really cool like environment that we have, but that's how it starts. That's how what happened in 24 was like, such a laid back environment.

Starting point is 00:52:47 Nobody really cares. I'll just write down whatever you are here, like, you know, say, meanwhile, your boss was telling you, like, hey, you're under goal. You work Saturday. You know, say it didn't matter that you had fucking 70 hours you already logged in. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:52:58 Yeah. The weekends were just, you had to get, like, everything done. Yeah. I was, I did seven days a week, eight or nine a.m. to nine or 10 p.m. and I did that for almost a year straight, almost an entire year, every single day, year after. And that was a lot of speed stacks involved. That's a speed stack. Some sleeping at the gym.

Starting point is 00:53:19 You know what, one less adrenal plan. Yeah, for Justin. Yeah. It's interesting. I think about this a lot because obviously I did the longest working for them and I had my son afterwards. And I can't imagine what it would have been like, obviously, because I've been blessed to be able

Starting point is 00:53:37 to have the relationship with him now, but I'm like, man, I guess you don't really think about that as a non-father, like this never crossed my mind that like, oh shit, if I have a job that I worked till 8 PM at night, like, and then I also have a child, like I'm gonna miss, like, I did most of his life. I did, I'm not even really thinking about it.

Starting point is 00:53:56 By the way, I took that mentality with me when I went and worked for, you know, cause I started my, I worked for myself at 23, and that mentality is what I continued with. And I'm so young, and you're just working, and you think that's your value, I did, or I didn't know my kids. I didn't know my kids till after

Starting point is 00:54:14 when I got divorced, and I was like, okay, I gotta really make sure I have quality time. I was like this wake up call. And then I was like, holy shit, I don't know, I don't even know my own kids, because that's how you get to know them, as you make their lunches, you take them to school, you know, you know.

Starting point is 00:54:26 Did you know, kid, I'm curious, because did you feel that way? Like, because I, you guys all have, you guys both have such great relationship with your kids that for me outside are looking in. I feel like when I see a dad who is disconnect from his kids, it's very obvious to me. So I don't feel like you guys had that.

Starting point is 00:54:41 I don't feel like you guys, like, I don't. I felt, you don't know it when you're in it, dude. Like, I was like, well, I play with my kids. I love them, I hug them, I kiss them. I don't feel like you guys, like I- I felt, you don't know it when you're in it, dude. Like I was like, well, I play with my kids. I love them, I hug them, I kiss them, I'm home every night. We go on vacations or we do trips, but you just don't realize it because you're in the mindset of, this is my value.

Starting point is 00:54:54 I need to work, I need to make money. This is what I do. And men have this ability to compartmentalize and disconnect. It just, we have it. And we can do it and it can sometimes be valuable, sometimes oftentimes. It's abused where we're like, this is what I do. Laser focus, turn everything off.

Starting point is 00:55:13 Gotta get the family out of the hole. Yeah, that was like, I was, went through a period of that too. Did you feel that, did you ever go through that with, feeling that way with the boys or something like that? Or they were very young, but yeah, I would definitely like the first few years. It was like, I mean, I was around, but I wasn't, because I was always thinking about like,

Starting point is 00:55:31 how I was gonna get us out of like our situation or like, you know, be able to get enough. So like, we could, because we were two ships in the night, two Courtney was working on top, so we didn't have like insurance if she wasn't working as a nurse. And so it was like this, it was like, I would spend the time of the kids would she would work, and then it was like vice versa.

Starting point is 00:55:53 So it was like, I did kind of have that, but I was so not focused on being present at all. It was just like everything I could do to get out of my current situation for a couple years. Was there a moment then when you felt like how he says, how South says, when he got divorced, and then he like had to do all those things, like that was a big period for him to like, like, did you have a time where I was like, oh shit, now I'm really connected to my kids where I don't think I was before as well. Yeah, it was, I think it was when we started doing the podcast,

Starting point is 00:56:25 it was around that time because before that, it was getting Courtney to stay home longer for Everett. So when he was born, I was like, you're staying home. Like you're staying home for the whole first year. Like I don't care. I'm gonna put everything on my back and we're gonna make this happen. You're not working.

Starting point is 00:56:43 And so that happened and then it was like, okay, the first six months of like, you know, she had her pay and all that for being off and maternity leave or whatever. And then that ran out and then I was like, oh shit. So then I had to like create, and it's being our community, you have to create another opportunity in that. So I'm like, okay, I created a bootcamp. And now, you know, I'm doing some slinging supplements with some guy. I hate, you know,

Starting point is 00:57:08 just to like, like extra income and then like, I'm also running and booking as many appointments as I possibly can and like, and then I get home and I'm fried, but I'm also like trying to like, hey, remember dad, you know, so the, yeah, I, Trying to like hey, you're dead, you know, so yeah, I it was right after that where like I started making more money. I started having like a little more space And then we started working on this and I was like I was I just had this this switch is like I just got to focus more on You know playing with my kids and like being outside my kids and taking time to invest in them and build. I started playing Legos with them. It was like, we started bonding a lot more for sure.

Starting point is 00:57:54 But I was so spinning in the chaos of the day-to-day pay. I really only know you guys as that. But it sounds like it's actually around the same time for both of you then. A lot about when Mind Pump really started to take off, you guys as that so but so but it sounds like it's actually around the same time for both of you then So a lot about when when mine pump really started to take off you guys were able to grow you might have you might have fallen into the same trap had we Jump on board with the footwork every day belt about remember when it was a struggle for oh, yeah Yeah, no how do we all done that? I think we all you would have probably jumped you know you need to yeah, you know That was your button to right well kids too, and I think that when we started it,

Starting point is 00:58:25 like your mentality towards that shifted. Mind it. And I was like, I agree. Like I had that same kind of energy coming in. I was like, I don't want to like just stay here all day till like 10, like I normally would do that same thing. I just grind, grind, grind. I know you do.

Starting point is 00:58:40 Yeah, then you're, I come what you learn. We influenced you on that for sure. No, hey, man, I tell you what though, you know, what's hard now for me is I feel guilty because I have a relationship with my little ones that I never had on my older ones. Oh, I bet. I play with my daughter, you know, my infant

Starting point is 00:58:55 and I change your diaper and sometimes I do the nights with her and with the Relias, you know, he's a toddler and I do things and I never did that with my older kids. You know what though? I feel guilty. So you feel guilty like that, but at least I don't see it in their behavior. Do you do you

Starting point is 00:59:07 think they feel that or have resentment? All they know is what they know, right? And they know, they've known me now for, I mean, it's been, it's been good, you know, eight years of me being way more present, right? So I feel like they probably don't even remember dad did. They don't know what they, they missed it. Like I don't feel like they, they just go like, oh, they see you with your girl and they're like, he never did that with you. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no back and you're always gonna be like, I should have done that better. That's just, I don't care who you are, who you are, how great you are. You're always gonna look back and be like, oh, I could have done that better.

Starting point is 00:59:50 Why did I do that? So I know that that's just part of being a parent that cares. Yeah, yeah. So that's the case. That's the thing, right? Hey, I want to say something real quick that I'm very proud of. Caldera continues to use our clips. More.

Starting point is 01:00:04 For their product. I know, I'm going to, you know, taking a left here, we're supposed to talk about Caldera and I love the fact that they use our clips because it just makes me feel good about the fact that we can communicate their product. Well, I'm waiting for you all to get on the board with the soap.

Starting point is 01:00:18 I know Doug, you've now tried the soap, right? You said it's the best lather of all time. Absolutely. So is it like Nitro? Like we were just talking about nitro. Is it like the l-vowels? Yeah. Wow.

Starting point is 01:00:28 So, okay, you know how like nitro's, like your standard bar soap or like, I mean, we, So it's not big, but like, it's like little tiny lots of like wonderful. It's, it's, it's a trip how much it foams up. Like you compare it to a regular bar soap or sometimes, especially like all natural soaps,

Starting point is 01:00:43 you got to like really like scrub on it to get any sort of lather. You, I like literally, and it's like, wow. Yeah, I just, I love it. I really do like it. And I know that's like a silly thing to like it, but there's something, which is why, of course, the, you know, toothpaste does it,

Starting point is 01:01:00 why soap does it, why shampoo does it. There is something about that feeling that you get when you are washing your hair or washing your body of the lathering up that just makes me feel better. Yeah, what is it when like bubbles pop off your skin and it's the weird sensation? I don't know, I don't think there's something to do. I don't even know if I noticed that.

Starting point is 01:01:17 You don't know, they pop off your skin? Well, yeah, well, that's what it's doing, it's fizzing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a shampoo, remember those shampoos that makes that tingled your scalp? I feel the tingled. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's just champ, remember those champs that makes that tingled your scalp? I feel the tingled. Yeah, yeah. That's just him.

Starting point is 01:01:27 Yeah, they put menthol in there. So the Caldera serum is what I use regularly. That's it. That's the only thing I use. But I use it every single day regularly. And there's nothing that comes close to that for my face or whatever. I love the room.

Starting point is 01:01:40 All right, so we got a shout out. I want to give a shout out. We've never done this before. But I'm going to shout out somebody in our forum. Hey, I'm gonna show you guys, we don't ever post before and after. Now here's why, we don't post before and after, I saw this because I didn't see this.

Starting point is 01:01:54 Okay, I'm gonna send it to Doug's, we can put up on the TV. His pre-damage press. We don't post before and afters, because this just feeds the whole like, you know, body image stuff. Body image stuff. Yeah, body obsession type stuff.

Starting point is 01:02:06 And we have lots of these. We have lots of these, okay. But this one was so remarkable. It's a young dude and Jesse Conrad in our forum. This is his before and after from following maps and a ball of advanced. This is freaking remarkable, Doug. I just texted it to you.

Starting point is 01:02:22 Yeah, I'm pulling it up. If you could pull it up. It's an image that I have to paste it in here. Bro, look at this. Oh shit. Look at the difference. What's the timeframe on this? Bro, March 27th till now. That's it. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. He says was a bit skeptical with maps and a ball of advanced. And then he says March 27th is the first picture and the second one is today. And then bro, look at the before and after in that.

Starting point is 01:02:46 Now I know the program is effective, but he's also probably got some great genetics. Is that is not, I wouldn't say that's normal results. That's pretty insane. No, that's not normal. He looks like he got shredded and built like a bunch of muscle at the same time. He didn't post any stats,

Starting point is 01:02:58 so I don't know how much muscle he gained, but that's a pretty crazy. How young is he? He looks pretty young, right? He's got to be like in his early 20s, is what I would guess. Yeah. Wow.

Starting point is 01:03:08 Wow. So he got a shout out in the show, Jesse. Good job. Thanks for posting work, man. Hey, check this out. Organifies a company that makes organic supplements to help your performance help you build muscle, burn body fat and improve your health.

Starting point is 01:03:22 One of my favorite products is peak power. This is an energy producing supplement. I use it as a pre workout. That's all natural. I get good, even clean, strong energy. It's euphoric feeling and it lasts a long time. Great product, but they have many other things. Go check them out.

Starting point is 01:03:38 Go to organifi.com. That's ORGANIFI.com forward slash mind pump. Use the code Mind Pump and get 20% off. All right, back to the show. Our first caller is Kaylee from Colorado. Hi Kaylee, how can I help you? Hi guys. Our first caller, okay, cool.

Starting point is 01:03:54 Big thanks for the show. A little bit about me. I started my journey in like 2022, at like 254 pounds and just in a year, I dropped about 50 pounds, I'm staying at 200 and I started in the gym this January. So I'm also recently learned I'm ADHD and high-permobile because of that. So I think I'm dealing with some traders that aren't really sure how to help me with this specific question. So I'm kind of struggling to connect with appropriate muscle groups because of my hypermobility.

Starting point is 01:04:34 So any tips and pointers you guys can give for that, and I guess you can start there. Yeah, no, good question. So hypermobility isn't necessarily connected to an inability to connect to muscles. That's probably more related to the fact that you kind of, because I saw in your note that you've been in the gym for about four months, is that true? Yeah. Okay, it just takes a little while to really get the skill of connecting squeezing to a muscle. Now hypermobility is basically hyperflexibility without stability. So, are you the kind of person like without even working out, you can totally fold yourself

Starting point is 01:05:10 in half, you can sit in a squat, super, super flexible, is that what you mean? Yeah, just my range of motion is beyond your normal versatility. I can move away in an extended range of motion. Okay. And yeah, I know it's not normal now. Okay. and the next thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the

Starting point is 01:05:38 most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the most important thing is the fullest range of motion they can do. So I limit the range of motion so that it's a proper rep, not a full, like most people I encourage them to do the deepest rep they can do with control. With someone like you, I would say stop your rep short of as far as you can go, just make it look good.

Starting point is 01:05:56 And pause there for a second. Yeah, and then when you get stronger, rather than adding weight, add pauses to the reps. So hold the weight at the bottom, squeeze the weight at the top, that kind of stuff. As you start to get stronger. And. So hold the weight at the bottom, squeeze the weight at the top, that kind of stuff, as you start to get stronger. And then when you're holding at the bottom, don't let, don't just sit in the bottom or just relax. You have to support it with your muscles. Yeah. In each of those positions and hold for five seconds, six

Starting point is 01:06:18 seconds, that type of deal. That'll help a lot with what you're talking about. Yeah, the whole goal. So yeah. And then I guess my struggle with that is the class that I'm doing at my gym, they focused a lot on like getting your rep counsel in a timeframe. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no In fact, I don't want to take you, another thing you can do aside from what Sal was saying where you kind of paused, you could even just slow down the tempo, like really slow, like instead of doing tension. Yeah, instead of doing let's say 15 body weight squats,

Starting point is 01:06:56 let's say I might do five with you, but are hell slow. That's a, they take the same time. Yeah, exactly. One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, you're at the bottom. Eight pause for a second. One, like that slow, which is the opposite of what a class setting's going to want you to do.

Starting point is 01:07:13 They're going to want to be like up tempo, keep you moving. And for someone like you, I would go the opposite direction. We would slow down and pause. And I care less about how many reps you're getting. I care more about the many reps you're getting. I care more about the quality and the tempo of the rep. Yeah, I can see you working with bands like for this reason

Starting point is 01:07:31 of being like very slow but increasing tension. Like so if you do what Adam's talking about in terms of like bringing that entire tempo down to a really slow pace, holding and exaggerating that hold the bottom so you get like an isometric hold. So you're just, your whole goal really is control and like increasing muscle recruitment and tension. And so to be able to do that,

Starting point is 01:07:52 you're gonna build a lot more off of that if you just do a whole block just devoted to that and then come back to weights and see how that applies. It's gonna give you a lot more control. Yeah, Kaylee, you're taking classes right now. Are you in a gym or is this just a class-based facility? I am, it's a class-based facility. So it's a train that was working for a bigger gym.

Starting point is 01:08:13 He's now starting his own thing. So he's fully bringing in more equipment. But I'm just supporting like local people that I know and trust. But I also like understand I any kind of more from the classes. I just I'm so new to this. I don't really know what programming to do. And all of that. So I'm like just finding the shepherd at this point. Kaylee, Kaylee, is hiring a trainer for one-on-one sessions maybe once or twice a week? Is that feasible for you?

Starting point is 01:08:43 I could probably work that in. There's a trainer at the gym I connected with, and I threw some challenges through the gym of our 8-1-1 with her. So I could totally try to add in, I think I could afford one day a week for sure. Okay, I would do, I would do one day a week with a trainer, and then one or two days a week on your own. I would not do classes.

Starting point is 01:09:03 I don't think classes for someone like yourself, I mean, for most people who are just getting started, classes are terrible. They just generally are. No matter how great they're run, they just, it's not individualized. You end up learning bad technique and form. In reality, although classes attract beginners,

Starting point is 01:09:21 the only people that might benefit from classes or people who advance, who know their bodies, know how to control things, know how to... Yeah, I feel like I'm in a set of places where I'm not kind of outroeing what I can learn in the class. I know. Especially for you guys. I feel like the nutrition aspect of my classes was kind of garbage, it wasn't working for me.

Starting point is 01:09:39 And hearing you guys recommending reverse dieting. I was definitely under eating protein. Now around 2100 calories, 150 grams of protein a day, and I've noticed the big changes, and my muscle growth and stuff like that. All from you guys. Awesome. What do you think, Cemetery? What would you like to,

Starting point is 01:10:00 because this is what I like to do is, if she can afford one day with a trainer, I'd love to give you a program to give to the trainer to take you through then in addition to that I'd love to put you in the forum so that you can tell us as your journey with the trainer So let us know how it's going with the feedback you're getting from them. So that combined With actually getting one-on-one help. I think we could we could do a lot Yeah, what I would do Kaylee is I'd show the trainer this right here So in this episode air he has the trainer, so they can hear what we're talking about and

Starting point is 01:10:27 ask them if they have any, if this is something they can do. Work with the trainer once a week, then work out once or twice a week on your own, and I would avoid the classes. And you'll get better results that way. Yep. Okay, perfect. Awesome. Alright, we're going to send you a map symmetry and we'll put you in the forum too, okay?

Starting point is 01:10:40 Oh, wonderful. Thank you so much. You got it, Kaylee. Awesome. Awesome. The irony of classes is You got it, Kaylee. Thank you. Awesome. The irony of classes is that they attract the wrong person. Yeah, the exact opposite of anyone who, like, I could take a class and I could make it

Starting point is 01:10:54 benefit me because I know my body. I know what I need to do. I don't need to listen to the instructor if they're saying to do something. Is that worth me? You're getting the right. I can modify it. Yeah. Form and posture.

Starting point is 01:11:04 Did I hear her mention when she first started talking to you? She says she has ADD. Is that what she said? I don't know if we're getting the right. I can modify it. Yeah, form and posture. Did I hear her mention when she first started talking to you? Did she say she has ADD? Is that what she said? ADHD, which leads to hypermobility, there's no connection. Yeah, that's what I don't know why she said that. Well, you know what though? Because I have it.

Starting point is 01:11:15 What it does, I'll tell you what it is connected to, is people that are attracted to those classes. Oh yeah. So you get the ADHD type people, the cortisol junkies, I mean, all the wrong people are attracted to class settings. They just really are not designed. I mean, they're not ideal for anybody. They're really not ideal for the beginner

Starting point is 01:11:33 that is a cortisol junkie that can't sit still. Like, I want to take this person in the complete opposite direction. She needs to slow down everything, long rest periods. And so, hopefully the trainer gets to listen to this conversation and then we'll actually take her through symmetry. I think she'll do great.

Starting point is 01:11:50 And then if this is a trainer listening, my recommendation is like, like lean in to the slowing the reps down even further than what we recommend in the program. Yeah, look, that's not to say there isn't any benefit from classes, I think in some cases, in many cases it helps someone get motivated, helps them connect with the accountability in their area.

Starting point is 01:12:08 And the reason why trainers start classes, just, just as a hundred, hundred percent full disclosure is because it's a low, low barrier to enter. So it's a great way for them to get more clients who can pay less. And then from there, they tend to get clients and a one on one say, but, but for most, especially if you're a beginner and you have money to spend, you're better off training with a trainer once a month

Starting point is 01:12:29 than you are taking classes every single week. I mean, it's just the fact. So if you're going to spend money on anybody helping you, go with the one-on-run route, find a good trainer. Our next caller is Katia from Arizona. Hi, Katia. How can we help you? Hello. How you guys doing? We're doing good. Thank you for having me. It we help you? Hello, how you guys doing? We're doing good.

Starting point is 01:12:52 Thank you for having me. It's an honor to be here with you guys. Thank you. And my question is, I guess, how to achieve the hourglass figure. I know that there's not necessarily a special like a special way for a man or for a woman, but I wonder if there's, I guess, specific muscles that you want to work out to look, I guess, give it more of a feminine look, I guess. Great question. Okay, so, um, yes, you can. Yeah, I'm glad you asked this because. Because it's cool, Pia. Number one, a symmetrical, healthy body is always what's going to look best. So let's start with that, because what sometimes what people do is they look at the body and they say, okay, these are the muscles I wanna develop

Starting point is 01:13:30 and I wanna ignore everything else. And when that's happening is they do that, but because the body doesn't look complete to the onlooker, it just doesn't look as good. So a symmetrical healthy body is always best. Now that being said, I'm glad you asked about the hourglass figure and how to look feminine because a lot of women think lifting weights will produce the opposite.

Starting point is 01:13:51 That's not true. By developing good, strong posture, so the muscles of the back, the shoulders, the shoulders always make the arms look really good, staying relatively lean and developing the glutes and hamstrings. You can emphasize the hourglass look, and those are the body parts that you'll see bikini competitors tend to focus on,

Starting point is 01:14:10 because on stage, when they're super, super lean, they still want to present a feminine figure. And those are the muscles that tend to do that. So I would say overall fitness and health, but then special emphasis on back. So good posture, so mid back, shoulders, glutes and hamstrings would be the most important. Shoulders and asses what I was gonna say.

Starting point is 01:14:29 So you build your shoulders, you build your ass. Now here's the biggest challenge to that, is most of my women that want to do that also are also very scared to add calories and put some weight on the scale. So you have to also be okay with that because you have clients that want that, but then they also wanna stay in a calorie deficit

Starting point is 01:14:52 so they put no weight on. Now that's what's impossible. And then you waste your time. To try and build an hourglass physique and think that we're going to do it in a calorie deficit or while we're doing hours of cardio is just not going to happen. So part of that process is being okay

Starting point is 01:15:07 With putting on some cat putting on some weight and sometimes you're gonna put a little bit of body fat on along the way While you're also building muscle now we can potentially Be in this perfect sweet spot where you build mostly all muscle But I always try and get the client to understand that you got to be okay with a little bit of body fat potentially coming on on the pursuit of building this hourglass physique because what I want to do is put 5, 10, 15 pounds on the scale on you and then go the other direction and diet you back down and then get rid of just a body fat and then maintain the muscle. And then that's what will give you this more pronounced hips,

Starting point is 01:15:45 pronounced shoulders to create that kind of hourglass look. But we gotta be okay with increasing calories in pursuit of doing that. Because if you don't increase the calories, you're just gonna be burning while you lift weights and you're not gonna have enough adequate nutrition to actually build the muscle on your body. In other words, you have to eat in a calorie surplus

Starting point is 01:16:05 if you're gonna make this happen. No workout will work without enough calories and enough protein. So that's the bottom line with it. How long have you been working out, Katia? Why are you asking this question? Are you noticing any results or you? Yes, I actually been working out for about a year.

Starting point is 01:16:21 Just my main focus was glutes, to be honest. And so in order to, I guess I didn't want to put much pressure. So I figured I would just start with glutes and legs and stuff like that. But obviously now I would like to start looking more, I start working on my upper body a little bit more, but I was so afraid, you know, I guess, I know, maybe that doesn gonna make sense, but I guess look male-ly or something. So that's why I wanted to ask, maybe if there's a certain way to do it or in order, I guess, to do the exercise.

Starting point is 01:16:53 This is a super, this is a super common question and it's also based on a lot of myths around strength, friend. You could train like a male bodybuilder and you would never look masculine. It's just not gonna happen. The women that you see that look that way are a combination of genetics, muscle building genetics that are so rare,

Starting point is 01:17:13 it's like as rare as someone who's seven foot tall, in combination with male hormones, let them take male hormones in order to emphasize that look. But you could lift like a male bodybuilder and you would never look masculine. What you would end up accomplishing is a very sculpted type physique. So yeah, I would just show your muscles off more at that point. Like you're, what builds muscle builds muscle at the bottom, you know, bottom line. So it's, that's a, that's a big myth is that I was thinking to create this like boxy kind of shape by doing compound lifts

Starting point is 01:17:42 and things like that. But in fact, those are gonna be your best type of exercises to produce muscle. I'm gonna have Doug send you our Maps Esthetic program since that was created with this intent. Like that program was created to sculpt the physique, it was inspired by what I used to do to train for a show. And I want you to pick shoulders and ass for your two muscles. So when you get this program,

Starting point is 01:18:06 we give people the option to pick one or two muscle groups to focus on, to develop, and then you follow the routine the way it's laid out. And so shoulders and butt are going to be the two ones that you focus on to help create that hourglass. But then also do that. In fact, center also the reverse dieting guide. So we have a reverse dieting guide. So following that, increasing your calories while following that program,

Starting point is 01:18:32 and you'll achieve what you're looking for. Right on. Thank you. So you guys are amazing, so entertaining. So it's amazing what you guys are doing. So keep up the group. Great work. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you. Do you, when you're talking to a guy about building his glues, do you say ass also? Absolutely. Absolutely. If a guy asked for that, right?

Starting point is 01:18:56 I got you guys. Bro, you're going to train your ass. Yeah. Well, you know, you know why it sounds weird? Because I got a guy never asked that. I've never had a man hire me and go, I wanna build my ass. Never, have you ever? No. Okay, that's why. Or else I would. I would, if a dude said, hey, I want an hourglass.

Starting point is 01:19:14 Oh my god, I want to get an hourglass. Look, it's a yo bro, we got to build him shoulders and build that ass. It's what I would say. But that doesn't happen, a guy just, guys don't seem to care about it. If that guy's asked to build every single other muscle group on their body, but-

Starting point is 01:19:26 You got no daddy dump truck. Which is interesting though, because most women would tell you they like and ask on a guy too. Of course. So- Well, the well-gloots means you can move. I know. But it's funny, don't you find that kind of interesting

Starting point is 01:19:39 that, especially since most guys are lifting weights to impress women. Guys lift, when guys are lifting weights- It women guys lift what if when guys are lifting weights Yeah, any muscle that a girl or ever has ever complimented them on I know but so maybe that maybe that's why because because it's it's socially acceptable for a woman to go like Oh, you have nice arms, but if not go if you nice ass So but you know in the back of their head most women are thinking that right most they're talking to their girlfriends You like dude you see his ass

Starting point is 01:20:07 So but they but they don't say that so then we think that oh she wants arms. Oh she wants shoulders. Oh she wants legs But deep down she's like no, I want some ass. Oh, that was a good culture Yeah, if they just would point that out and tell guys like it would definitely be so for all the dudes out there We got a butt builder mom just for you dudes too. You guys build an ass We're gonna be cheeks. I'm just for you dudes too. You guys build an ass, we're gonna do the cheeks. I'm glad you asked this question. That's funny that this myth still exists. That women will lift weights and that,

Starting point is 01:20:30 oh, you got a training particular way otherwise you're gonna look like a dude. It's not gonna happen, I promise you. There's a reason why it still is prevalent in the space because there is this piece that does happen. You were probably gonna start to, your clothes are gonna start fitting tighter. And that fucks with, that fucks with both men and women.

Starting point is 01:20:49 Well, that just confirms the bias. I think that what it is is you go on social media and you're gonna see these extreme examples of women. Yeah, I know, I don't wanna look like that. Like women athletes, it's self-selection, right? Yeah. Your body type does well and that specific sport. That's right.

Starting point is 01:21:01 So you're associated. That's right. High level female athletes and most sports also don't have the genetics that makes them look like they're, you know, good. I just had this conversation with my cousin Stephanie up north and she's like, I've been training consistently, I've been eating good so that she goes out and I'm up like five pounds on the scale and all my clothes are feeling tight. I'm like, do you look better naked today

Starting point is 01:21:26 than you did five weeks ago? Yeah, okay, you're doing better. You're building muscle. We just get caught up with, I mean, most girls already wear their clothes pretty fitted in tight, so there's not a lot of room to add anything. And then all of a sudden, you're going up a size

Starting point is 01:21:40 or ever just because of the hours for your muscles. That's right. That's right. That's right. That's right. That's right. It is funny how men and women are different. Like a guy will add a little weight on the scale. Yeah, got better. You know what I'm saying?

Starting point is 01:21:49 I'm like, all right. Yeah, it's the opposite, right? Yeah. But I mean, I get it though, as for a woman that doesn't want to go up a pants size, and then I'll send you, your trainer tells her to do this, and then she does, and she's like, oh, fuck, this is not what I want. But it's like, you know, you got to judge yourself off

Starting point is 01:22:03 of what you look like, you know, look like before you started doing that. And then after it, if you can be honest with yourself and say, okay, I definitely actually look better, then forget about the scale and the gene size. Our next caller is Caleb from California. Caleb, what's happening? How can we help you? Hey, how's it going, guys? Good.

Starting point is 01:22:22 Um, I, uh, I just was curious how, um, I've been working out about a year and a half Hey, how's it going guys? I Just was curious how I've been working out about a year and a half consistently now and I'm curious how I can't look like Michael hern yet But I want to thank you guys for having me on. And I want to say too, I appreciate all of the content you guys put out about, Fatherhood. That's something that I love, because I got a two-year-old and a little one on the way.

Starting point is 01:23:01 And so it's encouraging to hear that sometimes your fitness gets thrown off and it's okay. And you know when you're losing sleep and you're like, man, my hormones are thrown off. And it's yeah, it's cool to know that you're not the only one that's like fallen behind. So I appreciate that. You got it thank you. So a little bit about me, I'm 2790 pounds. I work construction mainly like carpentry, welding, electrical, and I'm also an actor. I've been trying to, like my goal has been to build functional strength for work and also helps me to not get injured and stuff. And then also along with that to build a good physique that's kind of versatile for different

Starting point is 01:23:59 roles. I've been trying to like figure out how to get my body to a really good cut state if I need to do that for roll and stuff. So that's kind of been like my dual goals. So where it comes to the hurdle I've run into is I ran anabolic and then I ran aesthetic and towards the end of aesthetic, there's the supersets and I was doing the supersets of squats and it's like 15 reps of squats and then you go into the dumbbell squats

Starting point is 01:24:40 and short res periods. And I started running into a lot of fatigue in my quads. And I was like, okay, well, I'll just kind of take it easy, maybe take one extra rest day and stuff and then come back to it. But I think I was just pushing myself too much with weight and just pushing myself too much with weight and not throttling it back a little bit, adjusting for the change of phase. And I've ended up having quad fatigue and both my legs for probably a couple of months now and trying to do maps performance. It's been like a it's weird because I um I'll try to do anything that's like you know really hit in the quads and I'll get like really painful fatigue and have to like back off.

Starting point is 01:25:36 So I'm like I'm curious what what things I can do um to help that if that just like I took actually this whole last week off of any workouts just to like try to give my life to breath like a breath and I'm still like even when I climb ladders and stuff I still feel the fatigue so yeah I curious you guys thoughts. Yeah and I also notice here that you wrote in your note that you have a high, you have a lot of inflammation, you did a test with Dr. Cabral. Yes, sir. So I did the test probably a month ago,

Starting point is 01:26:12 and I've been taking the omega-3 capsules like pretty heavy for the last month, so. Okay. And when you take time off, let's say you take four or five days of no exercise, do you notice any differences with the fatigue versus you like it sticks around? It tends to stick around. I think it's like, if I push it in an exercise, it'll get higher as far as like pain and

Starting point is 01:26:42 feeling it. But then it kind of lowers back down, but then it just kind of stays there for a little bit. So. Are you noticing anything like a brain fog or any loss of balance or anything like that? No. No, I wouldn't say any of that.

Starting point is 01:27:02 And it's just in the lower body, it's just in the upper body as well. Just my quads. Okay, so a couple of things. Now the obvious stuff I would say is cut your, you know, I didn't even ask you about your sleep. So the most obvious places I would look would be like sleep and nutrition.

Starting point is 01:27:18 But in the meantime, you cut your volume way down, like way down, like a third of what you've been doing. So if it says do cut the weight way in half, that's how I would do. You can go lighter, but even the volume I would go. Why that does cut the volume. Yeah, but I'll go like like if it says three sets or if it says three exercise, I would do one exercise or one set of each exercise until you feel like you're your back. So do that for however many weeks it takes until you feel like you're coming back. And the reason why I'm asking you these other questions is, you know, I would also,

Starting point is 01:27:49 you know, bring this to your general practitioner and have them test you for any autoimmune issue or anything else that might be popping up. Just in case, you may be having something else that's kind of underlying, you know, what's going on because the fact that you take weeks off, it still seems like it's not recovering it's mostly the legs. I want to go and just double check hey doc here's what's going on is there anything I should check out. As I work on this other stuff but how is your sleep Caleb you have a two year old and a baby on the way is your sleep just not great or. So I get. Probably on average seven hours to like six and a half and not usually.

Starting point is 01:28:27 Okay. Do you feel tired? Not too bad. I would say like definitely it's coming into some up in Reading, California and coming into summer months. It stays like 110 degrees all summer and working out in that and so that definitely starts making feel tired a lot when it comes to that but he says that not too bad. All right and what about your diet? Did you do anything to your diet or has it stayed the same

Starting point is 01:28:57 as the entire time? Yeah so I've been experimenting a lot with like doing carnivore. I did like a month of carnivore right after aesthetic and that felt it felt good. It felt like I was running clean. Salt. Yes. I'm seeing the same thing. Yeah. No, you just think the same exact thing before he showed you. Before he showed you. Just a mess with that. Have you have you have you used element yet? Yeah. So I just I just been used an element recently, and I love it Okay, yeah, because when you go carnivore or no carb you need more sodium and then you work outside And it's a thing you need more sodium and cutting your carbs. You are gonna reduce performance

Starting point is 01:29:37 Don't care what anybody says you'll notice a reduction in performance So going carnivore even increasing sodium even doing the right you're gonna notice a decrease in performance. Yeah So going carnivore even increasing sodium even doing the right you're gonna notice a decrease in performance. Yeah, okay I as well. I did I did carnivore with the exception of I had fruit Okay, so that was it I had a source card, but still I'm pretty low. Yeah, it's still probably pretty low. Yeah, that's still really low. Yeah, but do you have you have maps 15? I have maps 15? I have maps 15, maps static maps in a ball can perform us. Okay, I think maps 15 would be a decent option for you too.

Starting point is 01:30:11 I mean, I think first of all, I think maps 15 should be, or we should have called it the parent program. I think if you're a parent, it would be, yeah. That's totally right. We should have owned it. If you're a parent, if you're a mom or a dad, you should have maps 15 because it's just like a solid go-to

Starting point is 01:30:22 program when rough nights with the kids and stuff like that, I think it's just like a solid go to program when you know rough nights with the kids and stuff like that. I think it's a great default for most people. So, but yeah, I would increase, increase water sodium, do that back off volume or significantly reduce weight, same difference, potentially do maps 15 for a little bit. And then I would get, yeah, I would continue potentially digging deeper because it it I know that's what Sal is trying to get to the bottom of it just seems odd that you notice that just in your your lower body like that and it's this kind of quad fatiguing thing that's really interesting to me too.

Starting point is 01:30:57 That's not like a total body fatigue or it's not like you're saying it's heart and cardio like you're at a breath. It's more just your quads fatiguing. It's interesting. Did you notice anything else in terms of, it's more just your quads for teaking. That's interesting. Did you notice anything else in terms of when you went on carnivore? Because for me, it was like, I realized, oh, while there's more stuff going on with my gut that I need to address, you know, if you went back to like eating more regular,

Starting point is 01:31:19 if like any foods stood out or like because, like, to sales kind of investigation thing, like really kind of diving a little bit further into your gut health, which maybe contributing to some of that fatigue on some level. Yeah, I mean, I definitely work with Dr. Cobrall's team. They're gonna help you a lot with some of the stuff. But I mean, the low hanging fruit is like reduced volume,

Starting point is 01:31:41 increased sodium and water, maybe don't go so low carb and then see how you feel. And if you're still like, this is weird, it's not going away. I would go and get looked at, make sure there's no neurological or autoimmune issue that's popping up. Okay, yeah, I do, I am trying to figure out gut issues because since I got off of carnivore, like just being super strict,

Starting point is 01:32:05 I've reintroduced some foods, and I've noticed like gassiness again, I'm bloating again, I've been taking seed to try to like help with that, but I don't know, I'm looking at a different cleanses. I know Dr. Brolls got a couple different cleanses, so I don't know if there's like a good gut health cleanse you would recommend. You know, like workouts, it needs to be individualized. So like, if you

Starting point is 01:32:30 consult you about all that, if you just go and you're like, Oh, I have gut issues, let me just do this. You don't know what you're, you're, you're addressing and it can make it worse. You know, probiotics, if you have SIBO, can sometimes make it worse, you're just throwing more bacteria in your small intestine. You shouldn't have it. So when it comes to treating the gut, you want to get tested and know what you're dealing with before you do anything. Because a cleanse can be a basket, it can make it worse,

Starting point is 01:32:55 and you're going to just keep kind of shooting in the dark. So I would work with Dr. Roballs team and get some more specific testing to see what you're dealing with. Okay, yeah, That makes sense. All right. And then again, okay, low hanging fruit, less volume, more sodium and salt, more balanced diet, work with Dr. Cabral's team, and then take it from there. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:33:15 Okay. So would I, would I run maps 15 then? Yes. Beginning the end and then, and then after that, what would you recommend? Reassess. Especially. Yeah. Look at you recommend? Reassess. Yeah, look at, reassess. Reassess. I mean, straight up, maps aesthetic is gonna be too much volume for most people,

Starting point is 01:33:30 especially if you're working physical labor. Yeah. And you got small kids. Okay. Maps aesthetic, even in a perfect world for you, probably gonna be too much volume. Got it. Okay, so back into performance then probably.

Starting point is 01:33:42 Performance and a ball rolling. All right, yeah. Yeah. What are the other. Okay. All right. Okay, so back into performance then probably performance and a ball like yeah, yeah, yeah, what are the other? Okay? All right, okay, cool. Thank you. That that gives me some good direction. Keep us posted Caleb. Yeah, good luck, man. All right. Okay. Thanks guys. Thank you. Yeah, we're all going with that is when you hear this like oh, I take time off doesn't go away. It's in my legs only they feel heavy You know, and if you said something like I'm losing balance or I feel like I'm not a stable, I'd be like, okay, go make sure. There's nothing. Yeah, because it can creep up in those ways where like no matter what you do, you're like, what the hell's going on? I feel like my muscles just aren't especially in the lower

Starting point is 01:34:18 body. Yeah. But obviously that's like, you know, you you have to go to a doctor for that. But everything else we says, like, that's a low hanging fruit, like that's the, you know, you'd have to go to a doctor for that. But everything else we says, like that's a low hanging fruit, like that's where you go when you feel that way. And then if it doesn't work, then you can start to look at people. I'd be curious to see if he does apply all those things that we were talking about, like how much better he feels, I'm sure,

Starting point is 01:34:35 it'll at least make a bit of a dent. I really thought it was water and sodium. That's what when he was, it could be, when he was first time, that was before he said the carnivore thing. And then I just, I was like, then I was like, okay, maybe for sure, but I mean, he says he's been using it. So, but it's just his legs. That's the part where I was like, that is

Starting point is 01:34:52 weird. Our next caller is Daniel from California. Daniel, what's happening? How can we help you? It's going on guys. How you doing? Good. Good. Thanks for having me on. I've been a fan for a few years now. Oh yeah. All right. I just had a few questions. I heard a couple to the exact, I do manual labor for living, I've done climb trees and do tree service for living and I've logged and wildland firefighting and all that stuff. And I noticed you guys don't necessarily talk a lot about like the manual labor side of things as far as like people that do that and their activities. So one of my questions is, how do you like maintain growth and fitness without like kind of depleting or

Starting point is 01:35:46 overexerting yourself and I totally understand less is more. I don't work out really more than four days a week anyways, but the job is always extremely active so just kind of curious if you guys come across any of that stuff in your career. How many how many years you've been doing this? Working this way. Yeah. Oh, boy. Uh, five about 10 years now. I'm with 31. So yeah, there was inside out of college. Daniel, in my experience, this is general, let me give you a general answer. Okay. Uh, in my experience with people who work, uh, manual labor, who do a lot of activity just throughout the day because that's their job

Starting point is 01:36:30 Strength training the routine typically that works best is about two days a week two days a week full body And you really don't need any additional activity You're probably moving enough Throughout the day and just go to the gym full body two days a week and you'll build muscle and strength and then the other part of that is You got to eat enough you got to eat enough to fuel all of that. So if you are sitting at a pretty lean light body weight for your height, one of the easiest ways to do that would be to add a shake in between your meals. So breakfast, shake, lunch, shake, dinner. It's just an easy way to do it.

Starting point is 01:36:58 Now the other way to do it would be to increase the size of your meals or add meals in between those, those meals. But in my, like I said, I've worked with quite a few people like yourself. And I rarely ever do I see them respond well to, you know, three, four, five days a week of strength training. They always do well with like two basic full days a week because they're already moving so much. I couldn't agree more.

Starting point is 01:37:23 And I'm looking at, I'm reading this question right now, and I see that you had like athletic performance type of programming, cross fit type programming, and then bro session stuff. I think you just are doing too much. I think sales advice to pull back to two days a week, because what that does too is it does two things. Not only does it give your body some time

Starting point is 01:37:45 to rest, recover, and build, and grow. It also reduces the amount you're burning. So it makes it easier to hit the calorie intake that you need to hit to grow also. So scaling back to two days a week of full body routine, which may sound crazy to you, maybe exactly what you need to grow. How often have you done a stint of just pure strength training

Starting point is 01:38:06 where you have like really long rest periods in between, you keep it about five reps max? I think about a year and a half years ago, I did your guys's strength program, I believe it was, the Olympic one or the weightlifting one. Okay, yeah, there's a lot of volume in that one in the work sessions and all that are strong program. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:38:29 That one is when I like that one a lot. But I mean, back to what Adam was saying for like my career and working out, it was those were things I did in the past in the past few years. I haven't done any crossfit or like any type of grow. I've been doing a lot of kettlebell stuff the past year. Okay. I'm not sure if you guys are familiar with that. Adriel Maze guy, he's like all over Instagram with kettlebell programming. I should not. I don't know.

Starting point is 01:38:57 Daniel, so let me just illustrate this a little better. Okay. Some of the... illustrate this a little better, okay? Some of the, when you're looking at workout routines, the best routines that were written or created for people like yourself are going to be the ones that were done in the late 1800s, early 1900s. We're talking about the bronze era of strength training. Now why do I say that? Because everybody worked hard labor back then.

Starting point is 01:39:23 Everybody did. All those people that, you know, the Eugene Sandows and, you know, the George Hacken Schmitz, all those guys also had to do a lot of physical labor. And how did they work out? Two to three days a week, full body, never to failure. They trained like they were practicing skills and they got very muscular and very strong.

Starting point is 01:39:42 Because your activity is so high, your routine is not gonna look like a fit office worker routine who sits down most of the time, but then in order for them to have really good fitness, they gotta work out about four or five days a week. Someone like you, two days a week, three days a week max, is gonna give you the best results. Anything more than that, and you can tolerate it,

Starting point is 01:40:04 you probably can tolerate a lot, but it's not gonna necessarily build the best results. Anything more than that, and you can tolerate it. You probably can tolerate a lot, but it's not gonna necessarily build muscle and strength. But literally a two day week full, like a MAPS endabolic. Yes. Two day week option. You follow, give me eight weeks of that. You follow anabolic for eight weeks consistently, two day week routine, and I'll blow your mind.

Starting point is 01:40:20 I promise you, I guarantee you just from the way you're talking about what you've done in the past, the type of job that you have, scaling to two days a week, following that program as it's laid out, don't do more because you know you can do more, do what it says, and trust us, and you'll come back in eight weeks,

Starting point is 01:40:37 and I swear to God, you'll thank me. Daniel, if your workouts make your job harder, in other words, and I'm sure you've experienced this, you work out hard and you're like, oh man, tomorrow's gonna be tough. And then you're at work and you're sore and you're trying to do your job and it sucks because you just work out, beat you up, way too much. Way too much.

Starting point is 01:40:54 Your workouts, this is how, this is a good gauge for you, okay? Your workouts should make your work easier. So if they make your work harder, it's too much. If you go to work and you start to feel better at work, you're doing the right amount. So don't try to do the most you could tolerate. Do the right amount that's gonna produce these results that you're looking for which is building muscle.

Starting point is 01:41:14 So I would scale you back. Like I said, two days a week, Maps and a Bolic follow it as it's written. Watch what happens. I think you're gonna be blown away. I see on the right, you have another part of your question where you say, too, why am I always hungry? And this is why you're just moving and burning

Starting point is 01:41:28 and you're not giving your body, you want more, it wants more rest recovery and nutrition. Yep. Which is definitely hard to do. And I mean, I try to maintain, and I'm pretty frequent at hitting 3,000 to 3,500 calories a day with an adequate protein intake

Starting point is 01:41:44 and everything else I can think of So I don't know if there's I have no idea how much I'm burning because it'd be yeah kind of hard to figure that out So how many weeks you working on enough calories? Yeah four days you said you're going four days of the gym right now Well, no, we still we have our own home gym And I just do kettlebells and barbell stuff and we have like aier, and a rower that I'd mainly just use to warm up on. I like to do, and I don't really do cardio workouts. Yeah, no, buddy.

Starting point is 01:42:13 You go in there, and you do like, like a Mapsetabolic style workout, which is essentially full body compound lifts, two days a week, you're gonna see some good gains. You'll probably get stronger by week two. Oh wow. Yeah. We're gonna definitely try that.

Starting point is 01:42:30 Yeah. I think I was one of the programs I didn't try out at the time. I think I didn't. Done two of your guys is just not all over. I'll send it to you. Yeah. We'll send you maps and a ball. Try it.

Starting point is 01:42:41 I'm gonna love it. Yeah, trust us and then circle back. I want to hear how it goes because I have a feeling you're gonna see some great results I've got to trust that you got to trust us though. You got to stick with it and then This one last question. I know that I've heard you guys talk a lot in recent episodes about grams per protein and that like after You reach the over point eight mark for body for per pound of body you have

Starting point is 01:43:06 It doesn't really help you any longer. So if you're eating like, say I'm hitting like 220 a day and I weigh 190, that's just excessive for no reason type of deal. It's not gonna hurt you. Yes, especially somebody who's actually got as an intense laborer, right? Yeah, it's not gonna hurt you.

Starting point is 01:43:18 That's a good amount. But if you pursue it. But if you took out 30 grams and replaced it with 30 grams of carbs, that's fine too. It's not going to hurt you in other words Got you. I see I see what you put as your average 180 to 20. That's actually beautiful if you were a client Oh, if you're averaging. Yes, they there. Yeah, that's a that's a great spot to be your body weight Yeah, and then going a little over is not bad. It's when people get excessive Yeah, when I mean like two two seven or five, three hundred grams, consistently, it's like,

Starting point is 01:43:46 that's, that's excessive and it's not doing them any good to be eating that much. But one 82 20, an active guy like you trying to build, that's a, you're, you're in a perfect, personal, personal stress, you know, like that kind of stuff. You get, yeah, I'd back off a bit, but other than that, you're doing fine. Gotcha. And then does it matter as far as like the carb ratio and the fat ratio? You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:44:10 How there's like the perfect macro split, which I don't really agree with, but I don't know. Yeah. As long as you're getting your essential fat, it doesn't matter. It's based, based it off of how you feel. And the reason why I say that, and I know the guys will agree with me, is some people just feel better with more carbs, other people feel better with more fat. So, the only limiting factor is you gotta get an adequate amount of fat because it's essential.

Starting point is 01:44:31 Yeah, make sure you're getting at least 100 grams. So, I don't know if you're tracking your fat right now or not. Make sure for your size, your amount of calories, your movement, you should be at least at 90 to 100 grams. Yeah, I think I'm, because I mean, I don't drink shakes, I get all my protein and fats from me and I do eat a lot of meats,

Starting point is 01:44:49 so I'm not sure if that matters either, but I definitely get that's ideal. That's ideal, especially and you should be eating things like chicken thighs and having some tri-tip every now. Like, you know, feel free to eat good fatty meats because you can afford it. All right, oh man, well, thank you guys. I appreciate it. You got it, man. All right, oh man, well thank you guys, I appreciate it.

Starting point is 01:45:06 You got it, man. All right. You know, the other part of this, the psychological part with people that work, men and women that work hard labor is they're so used to the feeling of pushing themselves. They're so used to the grind of work or whatever. That they, I mean, most people who are fitness minded tend to,

Starting point is 01:45:25 they tend to veer towards do what is tolerated and not necessarily what's ideal, but these people really do it. They just go and so it ends up happening. It's like work. I'm at the gym and oh, I'm supposed to feel this way. No, and that was the gauge I use with people who work this kind of labor. It's how do you feel at work? Well, man, it was, it was hard for me to, to swing the hammer because my arms are sore. So, okay, we gotta go back. You should feel better in your job, not work.

Starting point is 01:45:48 Well, yeah, well, that's the thing. It's built this sort of idea that doing hard labor, I have to be able to compliment that hard labor with hard training in order to get stronger. It has to have that kind of same intensity. When in fact, to make it complimentary and actually be able to build and develop muscle, we need that adequate amount of recovery.

Starting point is 01:46:06 So he's a bit of an anomaly in our society today. It's just rare. So he's the opposite of the study that I've shared or where they talked about, people that report, not study, but the survey they did where people report how active they are. And most people consider themselves very poor.

Starting point is 01:46:25 Yeah, like people that who think they're very active or still consider sedentary, even because they train an hour a day every day, but then they have these jobs that are sedentary. So in the scheme of activity for the day, they're extremely low. They're still considered sedentary. He's the opposite of that.

Starting point is 01:46:41 You gotta remember that if he's doing physical labor eight hours a day every day or five days a week, he's very active even without his training. And then you add an hour or two hours of lifting a week, he's more than active enough. And that's still a physical stress. Even if the body's adapted to it and it's used to it for years,

Starting point is 01:46:57 it's still filling that physical stress bucket. And so scaling back, if he, I hope he trusts us and sticks to two days a week of anabolic, because I think within a month, he's going to feel and see a difference right away. Yeah, I had a guy once I trained, he was a, he played high level, high school football at a, at a pretty high level. Then he got into construction afterwards. He was working out four to five days a week. He hired me. I got him down to one day a week and then

Starting point is 01:47:22 eventually went up to two days a week. And he me, I got him down to one day a week and then eventually we went up to two days a week and he was hitting more numbers than he did in high school. He couldn't believe he's like, we're working out so little. I'm like, bro, 90% of everybody I train, I have them strength train and then I find ways to make them active throughout the day. You're already doing that. All we got to do is make sure you eat healthy and just, you're not here to add activity. That's not why you're working out. We're working out to just try to build a little bit of muscle and that doesn't take much, doesn't take much to do that. Look,

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Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2084: The Key to Building an Hourglass Figure, What to Do if Can’t Seem to Recover Between Workouts, the Best Way to Work Out if You Do Manual Labor & More (Listener Live Coaching)

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