Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2451: The Worst, Most Overrated Fitness Advice (Listener Live Coaching)

Episode Date: October 23, 2024

In this episode of Quah (Q & A), Sal, Adam & Justin coach four Pump Heads via Zoom. Mind Pump Fit Tip: The worst, most overrated fitness advice. (2:23) Adam updates the audience on his muscle-building transformation (30-day body recomp). (10:51) Justin’s nightmare sleep. (39:26) A sign of the times. (45:05) Teaching trainers and coaches how to make a career in fitness. (51:18) Pre-alcohol probiotic drink. (53:41) Shout out to The Emotional Lives of Teenagers: Raising Connected, Capable, and Compassionate Adolescents book by Lisa Damour Ph.D. (56:25) #ListenerLive question #1 – How do you coach somebody who doesn’t want to be coached? (57:31) #ListenerLive question #2 – How do I modify the intensity while simultaneously reducing the volume in half? (1:08:15) #ListenerLive question #3 – Would you be able to share general, specific, and or exact protocols, tips, and advice for recovering and gaining back significant muscle loss? (1:18:02) #ListenerLive question #4 – Should I cut, reverse diet, or maintain and continue to recomp? (1:32:03) Related Links/Products Mentioned Ask a question to Mind Pump, live! Email: [e-mail] Visit NED for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Code MINDPUMP at checkout for 20% off ** Visit Pre-Alcohol Probiotic Drink for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Promo code MINDPUMP24 for 15% off first-time purchasers on either one-time purchases, (3, 6, 12-packs) or subscriptions (6, 12-pack) ** October Promotion: MAPS Muscle Mommy 50% off! ** Code OCTOBER50 at checkout ** Building Muscle with Adam Schafer – Mind Pump TV Mind Pump #2432: The Truth About Essential Amino Acids with Angelo Keely Mind Pump #2320: Throw Away the Scale! "Influencer Studies" Break Into the Ivy League Tuesday Nov. 12 @ 4PM (PST) – TRAIN THE TRAINER WEBINAR SERIES : The Key for Personal Trainers to Retain Clients During the Holiday Season The Emotional Lives of Teenagers: Raising Connected, Capable, and Compassionate Adolescents Visit Transcend for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** From October 1st through October 31st, our patients will have access to 20% off a wide range of cognitive health peptides. This is the perfect opportunity to boost your sales and offer your following top-quality peptides. ** Mind Pump #2355: How to Safely Increase Your Summer Workouts Intensity Personal Trainer Growth Secrets | Powered by Mind Pump MP Holistic Health Mind Pump #1830: Five Steps to Determine Your ideal Caloric Intake Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources People Mentioned Mind Pump Fitness Coaching (@mindpumptrainers) Instagram Dr. Stephen Cabral (@stephencabral) Instagram  

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind there's only one place to go Mind pump with your hosts Sal DeStefano Adam Schaefer and Justin Andrews You just found the most downloaded fitness health and entertainment podcast. This is mind pump right today's episode People called in we got to coach them on air. It's a good time But this was after the intro. The intro today is 57 minutes long. Now during the intro, we talk about current events, took about fitness studies. Today we talked about Adam's fitness journey, some cool stuff.

So it's a good time. Then we get to the live callers. By the way, if you want to be a live caller, if you want to be coached by the best trainers in the world on air, email us at live at mindpumpmedia.com. And I said, but it's brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Ned. the best trainers in the world on air, email us at live at mindpumpmedia.com. Now, Seponis are brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Ned. They make hemp oil extracts that are full spectrum

that actually deliver. Today we talked about their sleep product. Like, look, if you have issues with sleep and nothing else has worked, try Ned's sleep. It will put you out and you'll wake up refreshed. Go check them out. Go to helloned.com. That's H-E-L-L-O-N-E-D.com forward slash mind pump. Use the code mind pump get 20% off. This episode is also brought to you by Zebiotics

pre-alcohol probiotic drink. So this is probiotic that has been genetically modified to break down some of the negative byproducts of alcohol consumption. So you drink Zebiotics, then you drink alcohol, hang out, guess what? You feel way better. Go check them out. Go to zbiotics.com forward slash mind pump 2-4. Use the code mind pump 2-4. Get yourself a massive discount. We also have a sale this month on a workout program. MAPS Muscle Mommy is 50% off. If you're interested, go to MAPSFitnessProducts.com. Then use the code October50 for the discount.

All right, here comes the show. T-shirt time! And it's t-shirt time. Oh, shit, no! It's my favorite time of the week! Wow. Four winners this week, two for Apple Podcast, two for Facebook.

The Apple Podcast winners are PhillyFan311 and LevelHeadedHuman. And for Facebook, we got Kelsey Smith and Josh McVoy. All four of you are winners. Send the name I just read to iTunes at mindpumpmedia.com, include your shirt size and your shipping address, and we'll get that shirt right out to ya. You simply will not get results at all if you follow the worst most overrated fitness

advice. In fact there's three of them I can think of right now. If you do them you're not going anywhere. You guys want to guess what they are? You guys got me on pins and needles. Alright here's the first one. I'll let you guys guess. You're gonna burn the fat off. Oh yeah see you're touching right on it. So the first piece of advice that people tend to get that is just not just overrated but terrible is oh, you wanna lose weight? Go run, just go run.

That's a great way to lose body weight. It's a good way to lose fat. And that's terrible advice for a few different reasons. One, cardio type exercise on its own is not an effective way to burn body fat. Now you will lose weight but a lot of the weight that you'd lose comes from muscle as your body pairs muscle down to make you a more efficient cardio machine. So the result of that being slower metabolism.

So you become a smaller, similar flabbiness version of yourself. And this is why when people do this, and if you're watching this, you may have experienced this, you'll start running. You'll initially lose some weight and you'll plateau real hard. Yeah. And you're like, what's going on? Short-term gain, long-term pain. That's it.

I got to keep doing more. Got to keep doing more. And you plateau, plateau, plateau until eventually you give up, um, gain the weight back. But the problem is of course you gain back the body fat, not the muscle. Yeah, I think it's important to understand that our bodies are either anabolic or catabolic. And when we first start on a journey, no matter how overweight you are, if you just start cutting calories, you may get that initial weight loss, but then the body adapts to that new caloric intake. And then you do it again, and then you do it again. And then before you realize it, you're eating 900 to 1000 calories, and yet you're still

really far from your goal. And then you get stuck in this predicament of where do I go from now? And so then the inevitable happens. You have to switch over to be anabolic and you need to start adding calories and building muscle and building your metabolism up. Which they will have to do at one point. So it just doesn't make sense to me why for so long we've communicated this as a strategy to just start losing weight that way when in fact, they'd be far better off right

from the gates start trying to build the metabolism up. Address the first thing. Yeah. Ramping your calorie maintenance up, building the metabolism and then coming down because what's actually neat about that is in pursuit of that they actually can lean out. Yeah. And also speed their metabolism out where if they just cut there's only one thing going on.

So what you're talking about is a second piece of overrated advice was just to eat less. And that typically goes hand in hand with the first one, which is just start running. It's like just start running, start eating less. Now I wanna go back to running because people might be confused as to why, why would that cause metabolism to slow down?

Why does that cause muscle loss? By the way, the data on this is very clear. When you look at the studies on weight loss, where people do cardio plus calorie restriction, typically 40% of the weight, okay? 30, 40%, sometimes 50% of the weight comes from muscle. And that's because cardio or running, let's just talk about running,

doesn't require a lot of strength. It requires actually very little strength. Now, but it requires a lot of strength. It requires actually very little strength. Now what it requires is a lot of stamina. And because running itself is a high calorie burning form of exercise, your body tries to get better at it. So what does it do? It reduces muscle mass, makes it so that you can run for longer periods of time with more stamina,

burn less calories. You literally become a more efficient running machine. It slows your metabolism down. Especially when people do what you said, Adam, which is combine it with just eating less. If just moving the law and eating less were the solution, we wouldn't be in this predicament. And it's not a discipline thing.

Discipline plays a big role, but if you're the typical person, you need to lose 30 pounds, which is, you know, people who are overweight typically are anywhere between 20 to 40 pounds overweight. So right in the middle, 30 pounds, you need to lose 30 pounds. You just start running. You just start eating less. You know, the first 15 will come off with a lot of hard work and eating less food. But then you're stuck in a situation where you're eating very little and you're doing all this running.

And you're like, okay, I have another 20 pounds, 15 pounds. Plus you lost muscle. So you don't, you're kind of like, well, I don't feel as good as I thought I would. Where do I go from here? Do I just do more? Do I become a fitness fanatic where I'm running all the time and wow, I can't eat that much in the second I do, I gained weight, uh, maybe something's wrong with me, which is where people tend to go with us and not to mention running is actually a skill and the average person who just

picks up running to do a workout, uh, with they've lost the skill of running because they stopped running when they were kids. So, you know, you're in your thirties, forties, maybe even your twenties, you lace up your shoes, go for a run. Your biomechanics are terrible. Uh, and you're running to fatigue on top of it, which means your biomechanics are even worse. and you're running to fatigue on top of it, which means your biomechanics are even worse,

this is why running is the highest injury rate of all forms of exercise. Not that we can't run, we just lose the skill of it. So you just go to do it as a workout and you end up injuring yourself on top of it. It's just terrible advice. I wish there was a better association with discipline. I feel like when people hear discipline,

they feel like it has to involve some kind of pain or some kind of suffering attached to that in terms of like, I need to run because it's something that like, I know it's hard and, you know, it's same thing with like working out, I have to go to the extreme and make sure that I'm continuously doing this thing. That's like really hard for me, when in fact, sticking with a plan that actually works. The real discipline of it is knowing when to back off, when to add intensity, when to

listen to your body, when to recover. Discipline itself is just that consistency. It's showing up and doing the right thing consistently every time. For some reason, we just have this idea it has to suck. You're, dude, so great. That's the third point for some reason we just have this idea. It has to suck. You're dude, so great. That's the third point, right? No pain, no gain, which I understand where that comes from.

But, um, discipline is not, does not mean stupidity. So stupidity is doing things in ineffective ways, inefficient ways. It's glorifying the pain of what you're doing and not necessarily the results or the effectiveness. It's just, oh, I'm hurting myself and I'm just gonna keep, that's like I'm banging my head against the wall,

I'll just keep doing that. That makes me disciplined. No, that makes you stupid. Discipline in the context of fitness is you're doing things the right way, you know when to adjust intensity, you feel good, by the way, you should feel good after your workouts,

you shouldn't feel like you're dying. And then the discipline is just that you're consistent with it and you're smart about it. Not stupid. If you take a dumb approach, you glorify or value the pain of it, you do things in a way that teach your body to slow its metabolism down, you're gonna be in for a lot of trouble. And it's, it's no wonder people aren't consistent.

Why would you stay consistent? I wouldn't stay consistent and I love fitness. I wouldn't stay consistent doing something where I'm putting level 10, you know, effort and getting a one in terms of results. It's like, why would anybody do that? Right? So the discipline is really in the consistency, but of course what plays the role in that consistency is how smart are you?

A much smarter approach would be strength training. Strength training preserves muscle because the direct adaptation from that is because you're telling your body to get stronger, it needs the muscle. Then rather than just eating less, you feed yourself appropriately to fuel that muscle, speed up the metabolism. Now we're setting ourselves up for success. This is where you get the long-term success. That old approach of just running, eating less, keep going until you throw up, just doesn't work. It just doesn't work. I feel like this is really the the theme

of what I'm trying to teach through this whole YouTube thing that I'm doing, series that I'm doing right now. I mean this is pretty much, this is what was so great about this tip that you chose today is like, I mean, this is the message. It fits right in. It's exactly what I'm trying to communicate. You're showing it. Yeah, I'm like step by step every single day. And it's crazy to think though how I still am getting questions around this type of stuff though.

It's just like, are you not watching? Are you looking at the intensity that I'm applying right now? Look at the weight that I'm moving. Look at how little effort I'm putting towards crushing myself in the gym. So let's give some context, because I know you got your results from your first check-in since you started.

Okay, and I'm gonna let everybody know ahead right now, just so you just stay tuned. The results are shocking. Like literally shocking. I had a prediction. We had an idea, but it was even. I predicted the shocking results. I think I crushed those.

You crushed the idea. It was. And I knew it was crazy because I could tell. I look at you and I look vastly different than you did four weeks, when you had started four weeks before, right? Okay, so some context. So Adam stopped working out, had some stressful

things happen to his family, didn't exercise for like three months. Injury. It was injured. Diet was just whatever. So he lost a lot of muscle. Previously at one point was a professional physique competitor, so he had way more muscle before. He's got all that muscle memory working for him. That's important. We'll get into why that's important once he gives us kind of what happened. But what he did is he's got all that muscle memory working for him, that's important. We'll get into why that's important once he gives us kind of what happened. But what he did is he's doing this kind of comeback and he's showing everybody what it looks like to rebuild your body.

Not from a like, look how awesome I am, but rather this is the appropriate amount of training you need to do when you're coming back from a layoff. And it's way less than people think, way less. So maybe talk about before we get to your results, because people are gonna be blown away, what did your workouts look like those first couple weeks? Yeah, I mean, for those that aren't watching, because I've got-

Because it's all documented. Yeah, it's documented, so you can go back and literally see set for set, rep for rep, what I've done. And anything that I did at home, which I did three workouts at home, which were normally really light and easy. But two exercises a day, five to six days a week.

The goal was six, sometimes I only got five days. So five to six days a week, two exercises. And the intensity, like on a one to 10? Well, for me, I would say like a five. Yeah, so moderate at best. Yeah, very, very moderate at best. I mean, I never did a single set to failure. Always left the, like like you hear me communicate this during the series,

like I'll do an exercise, right? And let's say it was the second time coming around to do a barbell back squat. And by the way, I started at like 135. And then the next time I'm doing 130, I think I did like an extra 20 pounds or something like that. And I'm like, man, I feel good. I wanna do more. I can do more. I know I can do an extra 20 pounds or something like that and I'm like, oh man, I feel good I want to do more I can do more I know I can do more and then I would reserve that I and I explained to the camera though. I

Don't need to because I know that the previous week. I only did this much So I'm already progressively overloading because I've added 20 something pounds and even though my ego and my brain and even my body is Tell me oh I could do more. I'm going why? Because three weeks ago I was doing nothing, last week I was doing 135, this week I'm doing like 155. So. Let me add something real quick Adam, to a little context too. It's not that you're saying why should I do more

because you want to make it easy on yourself, it's doing more than is necessary would have slowed down your progress. It's gonna overreach. It'll get, you're doing more damage than is necessary. That's right. And which means you're gonna progress slower. So it's not that you're like, I just wanna make it easy, you're trying to do it smart.

I mean, the whole point of this is literally to the thing that I've said at an ausium on this podcast, right? The goal is to do as little as possible to elicit the most amount of change. So when I approach these workouts, it's always like, okay, what is the bare minimum I need to do to my body to give it the most results?

I'm trying to find that sweet spot. And you hear during the series that I'm not 100%. There's times where I thought, oh, I should easily be able to do this and then I pay for it. Two days I'm really, really sore and I'm like, ah, shit, I did too much. So next time I'm reminding myself that as I approach it. But yeah, I mean, I'm paying attention to these lifts. I'm paying attention to what I did the week before. If I'm increasing the weight or rep at all, I know I'm progressively overloading the body. I know that means I'm sending a signal that we need more muscle than what we needed last week.

What was the feel that you're looking for afterwards? You're looking to just kind of feel good. Yeah, so I want to feel like mild soreness. Like I want to feel like I worked it out, right? Like I wanna have done legs yesterday and then today be like, oh, okay, I can feel I trained them yesterday. Not like I can't walk. Oh yeah, no, I don't wanna have the, you know, like, oh, you know, when you sit down, like that's way overreaching, way overreaching.

Now you did the same thing with diet. You also, cause this is the other part of this, is you're doing the least amount for the most change with workouts. You're also doing that with diet. It's not like you jumped in from like not watching my diet to like this crazy structured perfect bodybuilder diet. You went step by step. So what did that look like? So first steps was just to track. So before I even said I'm gonna set a goal or I'm gonna make things, let's find out what I'm doing. And the first week of just tracking, I was what I figured, which

was I was grossly under eating protein, like really, really low, like sometimes not even hitting 100 grams of protein. In addition to that, I was barely hitting 2000 calories. And so I knew that, okay, after I've tracked and figured that out baseline, I'm like, well, first goal is let's just try and get that protein, which I knew I was probably gonna fall even short still, but I'm gonna go if I can get from 100 up to like 150. That was it, that was it. Just like starting, which means I'm gonna have to increase at least one to two meals of a day that are high protein.

And then I also wasn't setting any like crazy parameters of I can't have this, I can't eat that. It was like, I'm gonna eat when I'm hungry and I'm gonna make the meals protein-centric, which would solve that problem, right? If I'm low on protein and I allow myself to eat whenever I'm hungry, just make a protein centric meal and then let's see where the calories fall.

That first week after that of doing that, they were landing right around 2,400 calories or so. So 400 calorie bump mostly from protein. Yep, exactly. And so, but still falling a little short, you know? And then the following week after that, it was like, okay, let's really try and be aggressive about hitting the 200 grand. So now I'm like a little short, you know? And then the following we got to that, it was like, okay, let's really try and be aggressive about hitting the 200 grand.

So now I'm like a little more planning is happening. I'm like getting up a little bit earlier, having like the 30 grams of oatmeal, I'm adding shakes where I need to like in the day or at the end of the night, I'm adding that in there if I need to. Now supplements, what you adding any? Consistently with EAAs, because of that.

Creightin? Yes. Creightin in essential. Yeah, and this is not, so I guess I should just close. I did this on the thing too. It was like, I always take vitamin D and magnesium because I'm deficient. That's consistent.

Right. But the changes were creightin. The changes were creightin consistently, sodium twice a day also, I bumped that because I'm in T. Yeah, element T twice a day. And then the EAAs, I was taking between one and three servings a day of it based off of how low I was. And since I was.

So proteins low, EAAs higher. Yes. So the way I looked at it was if I knew I was hitting well under 200, which I was for like the first two and a half, three weeks, I was taking EAAs three times a day, then as I got closer to 200, I started taking them like twice a day. And then even now I still take them at least once, just because of the conversation we had and even the benefits of that, right?

It was just like, I'm not crushing protein. If I was hitting protein at 250 and above, I wouldn't even worry about it, but I'm, like my good days are 200 to 210 has been a good day. So. So we're, it's okay, so again, four weeks later, so this is the process you started

Again, and we'll talk about this a little bit more because people are gonna trip out when they hear this Happen in four weeks and you've got all the tests. It's all legit In a four week period now I predicted just from looking at you because I could see some big changes happen I predicted a 13 pound Lean body mass gain with a four pound body fat loss. By the way, that would have been crazy had that been what you did in 30 days. But I also understand muscle memory. Now I want people to really understand this.

When you have a lot of muscle that you've carried for years and years and years and years, which Adam did, and then you lose a lot of it, gaining it back, if you do things right, by the way, people gain muscle back with muscle you do things right by the way people gain muscle back with muscle memory doing things wrong that's how powerful muscle memory they do things wrong they still got gain muscle back but Adam being a smart guy that he is experienced did everything right and then he had the

the crazy turbo charge of muscle memory which is remarkably powerful it's remarkably powerful this is epigenetic, ladies and gentlemen. You are super anabolic when you tap into old muscle that you had on your body for years. Because for at least two decades, you had this much muscle. Lost a bunch of it, gaining it back. So I predicted 13 pounds of muscle, four pounds of fat loss.

The test you came back blew that away. And I was confident in what I said. What did you, what was it? So I ended up losing five pounds of fat and I gained 18 pounds of muscle. 18. 18. Well, lean body mass, cause that includes.

Yeah, water. Yes, and what's gonna happen is you're holding more. Yeah, I'm eating more calories, I'm drinking more water. So my muscles. Your muscles are 70% fat anyway. And I have creatine, so I'm probably definitely, I mean, I definitely attribute three to three to five pounds Right away to that which which is not this is all good by the way. So it's water. Yeah

Intramuscular water is good. It's they're hydrated. They're full. They're pumped 70% your muscle is water and fluid So when you can gain intracellular or intramuscular water, it's a good thing But I mean take that five pounds away, we still talking about 13 trutes. Bro, take 10 pounds away, you gain eight pounds of lean tissue in 30 days. Yeah, so we still put a solid 10 pounds of pure muscle on. And most importantly, and what I think I'm probably most proud of, because I didn't know for sure, right,

I didn't know what to expect, to be honest, because I had never come from a place of have lost that much muscle before. That was the lowest lean body mass you had a long time. Yeah. Because I asked you when was the last time you think you had that low a lean body mass and you said probably what your team? Yeah and to your point that I think is a really important point is I've fallen off the wagon and came back many times and rebuilt muscle but in the past I don't think I was as dialed as this. And so in the past, I probably would have put five pounds

of muscle on and you would have been happy, right? Because everyone would have been like, oh, you had a five pounds of muscle in a month. That's awesome. And yet I probably would have done it in such a terrible fashion. I would have been overtrained, doing way too much, trying way too, like just way too much

and I would have got way less results. So what was most interesting for me was to see how I just really kind of cruised through this month as far as the effort towards it and the discipline around diet and everything, it was very, very, very loose as far as like I didn't put hard parameters, even when I was doing my calories, because a lot of people have asked a lot of questions specifically about the calories, like listen, I know that I've incrementally

increased because I went from 2000 to about 22 to 2400 to about 26 to 2800 and then eventually to 3000, 3200. But all that could easily be off three to 500 calories north or south a little bit because I'm guesstimating and I'm eating out still. I'm not like weighing my, like when I'm like competing, I'm weighing and tracking and everything. I'm like, I wasn't doing that.

I was just. No, no, you have, this is the first four weeks, you have 15 more levers you could pull. Plenty, exactly. You literally pulled one lever, which is start strength training, but it's appropriate, and there's another 15 levers there you could pull, and the other one was hip protein.

But there's still another 15. That's why everybody's tripping out. It's like you weren't pulling all the levers right out of the gates and you got those kind of results and you still have all that out in front of you. And that's exactly, and that's the point, right? And you would have gotten worse results had you done more.

Absolutely. People don't understand that. We tell this to people all the time. By the way, this isn't just true for muscle memory. This is true for somebody just starting out in fitness. If you do more than is necessary, you'll get worse results, period, end of story. Yeah, it's unfortunate that that message isn't sent enough.

I don't know, probably what's exciting about doing this whole thing was, we preach that a lot, we talk a lot about it, but it's not like any of us are beginners, so we don't get to show a beginning journey. But this is the closest thing to that. I know I'm not a beginner, I have muscle memory, so the obviously-

It's a great visual of what we always describe. Yeah. And I also really appreciated, so one of the things I love about the documenting part here and announcing it on air where it's like the accountability piece, so there's two things I've found that have been really interesting for me. One, obviously the accountability piece

that I was aware of, which is why I hadn't said anything before. It's like I know once I say it, I'm not the type of person to say some bullshit and not do it. So I'm gonna do it right. So there's that accountability. The other accountability piece that really helped was knowing that Dylan is videoing all my workouts. Many times I had I checked my ego that I had to be honest with myself that even knowing what I know I need to do, even all the things I say, I probably would have let ego creep in if there was no.

So you would have overdone it. I would have overdone it for sure. So that's how insidious it is. That is how insidious is like, I'm literally like, Like you know better. I know better. And it's like, only cause I need to, I need, it's like, and what kept me was like, I need to prove this point. You know what I'm saying?

Like I need to show the camera would have been even worse for me to like, push it harder. You know, I'm on camera now. Just as a guy doing the video demos for exercises and he has to add like the weight he works out. Yeah. What do you do with your demo? A big check for sure. So let's, let's give you that. I mean, I totally like, I mean you guys, I never, uh, bro you gained a pound of muscle more than a pound of muscle every two days, every other day, every other day. What now? So,

okay, so here's another question. Typically the way that the body progresses, like we see this with clients is it's not like this super linear, consistent. It's like little, like little spurts of growth or did you notice that? Was it like? Totally. So there's a point where in the videos that I start to cover up. So early on, I was just wearing whatever clothes. Then I started wearing these double X shirts. And I communicate that to the audience

that there is actually a psychological strategy of why I do that. Because of that, and I say this, your results aren't linear. It's not like I just get better and better every week. Even though I'm doing everything I'm supposed to. And so sometimes what I'll do is, of course when I'm feeling good, I like to ride that way.

But then when I start to feel that questioning how I look or I notice something, I cover up. I cover up in baggy clothes and I like, I'm like, stay the course. I don't wanna be distracted. Don't be distracted by this lull that you're in right now. And so that's like a legit strategy that I do. And so I went through like two weeks of like kind of covering up.

And then I pull off in two weeks and I'm like, okay, cool, I'm doing better. So it's like, it's a total strategy. Now, what did it, how does it feel on your body to progress? Cause you've never, you've never progressed that quickly, right? You've never been able to come back from muscle memory like that. What does that feel like, you know,

growing that fast with muscle, losing fat like that, you know, progressing, it's four weeks, it's 30 days. What did that feel like? Or were you trying to stay disconnected so you don't mess with your head? There was periods where I tried to stay disconnected, but I have to say that I was pretty surprised. I had lost so much muscle and I had a ways to go that I didn't know how well this first, I didn't know how well it would go.

Of course I had intentions and I expected but I also wanted to be careful not to like, because I know how this game works too. Let's say the next four weeks, how but I also wanted to be careful not to like, because I know that how this game works too is like, like let's say the next four weeks, you know, how disappointing it's gonna be when I add four pounds of muscle. Yeah. But I mean, that's still positive. I'm still moving in the right direction. It's still a good thing. A pound of muscle a week is remarkable. Right, right. I mean, I know,

but like how much that could mess with you psychologically that just did 18. Right? So the thought is you can't help but go like, well, I can do another 18. Well, shouldn't I? I got plenty to go. Right to go, right? So there's that part too of where I didn't want to get overly excited or fixated too much on what I was seeing. But I remember telling Katrina, I'm like, man, I'm shaping up pretty quick. Now is she commenting or did you tell her don't tell me? Yeah, I mean, she gets mad about it.

She doesn't like it. She gets here. Too attractive. Yeah. It annoys her, right? She's like, I cannot stand it. I feel like you just you focus on two weeks. She says it's two weeks. I feel like it's long enough. This is the analogy that I like to give. It's like two people digging a big-ass hole and one guy has a spoon. The other guy has a backhoe and you look over at the guy with the backhoe, you're like, what's going on? How did you do that so quickly? He's using a backhoe. Like you are, you're doing things the right way,

you've got muscle memory on your side, that's what happens. That's what happens. And when you do things the wrong way, here's what's hard. I think people understand when they don't progress that maybe they're doing things wrong, although sometimes it's hard to convince them sometimes then.

It's impossible to convince someone who's still making progress and they're doing things wrong, although sometimes it's hard to convince them sometimes then, it's impossible to convince someone who's still making progress and they're doing things wrong. Because had you over trained, you still would have gained some muscle over the last four weeks. You might even gain five pounds of muscle. And imagine if I came to you and I'm like, dude, you're doing things wrong right now. What are you talking about? I gained five pounds of muscle. Especially where you were, you know, a while back. That is definitely the easiest I've ever evolved. And I know I preach this, but I know that because of the camera, I was even more disciplined to like staying true to what I say about

like only applying the least amount. Right. Uh, this was the most I've ever stayed true to that in a, in a four week period of time of getting back in the swing of things. And I'm glad I did because you know, there, like I said, many times the ego crept in, I wanted to do more, like I felt that. And I was like, no, no, just keep doing what you're doing. You know what you're doing.

And then to see it revealed that way, I was like, man, that's, so there's a little bit of that surprise, even a little bit of me surprised, like damn, the crazy thing that I didn't do, one set to failure, I never once hit a weight, I always left way more I could have done on the bar right now. I didn't get crazy on the diet restrictions or anything

like that. I just hit the protein intake, stimulate the muscle just enough to where I feel it when I work out. Really, really, really simple. And here's a part two that I was explaining this to somebody that I was talking on the video about this is I Missing one of the three biggest muscle. Yeah, you have a peck injury. Can you yeah, I mean that would have been another two

That's a strength of mine to like that. I mean that's at least into the couple pounds Yeah, so cuz someone was just like, oh do you think that helped you or hurt you in this part? I was hurt for sure. Yeah, I was, cause you might have, I didn't have my legs. I'm like, thank God I had my legs to really get after. And like, cause a big part of obviously that weight that came back was my legs. Where do you feel most of the gains? Legs. Yeah. Oh yeah. My leg, my legs definitely, uh, came up the biggest, which is expected. It's the biggest muscle. Yeah.

And I really didn't hit the back of that hard either because of even because of the chest, right? It's the antagonist, so I didn't get to, I was always nervous to go really hard on the back just because of the peck injury. So I was really limited to getting after it. Let's make predictions then, because the next 30 days will be interesting. Now, let's look at pros and cons.

Cons, you've gotten those initial muscle memory gains. Now there's more left, because you're still 30 pounds away from what the lean body mass that you've carried those initial muscle memory gains, right? Now there's more left, because you're still 30 pounds away from the lean body mass that you've carried in the past. You're still far away, you still got muscle memory there. But that initial muscle memory is probably the most powerful. That being said, you have a lot you can do in your workouts

that you haven't even touched. You still have lots of room in your diet that you haven't gone for. So, what do you think? You think you'll match the first month, or it'll slow down? even touched. You still have lots of room in your diet that you haven't gone for. So you think you'll match the first month or slow down? Oh, I definitely won't match. I won't, especially considering I just had a week of a setback right now too. That's another thing. I mean, I had back-to-back weekends of traveling and that's not good for me. And kind of the rule I would tell myself when I was competing, because obviously I had situations that weren't ideal for dieting on a show, is that always moved me back a week.

If I took three days off of travel where I'm in airports, and still attempting to eat better, to eat good, still no working out, not good sleep, and that was like erasing a week. So the way I look at myself right now is I'm a week behind already now. So, and I did that two weeks in a row, which fucking really sucks. So that's gonna make it more difficult. I think I got the bulk of the initial,

what I would say is the easy wave of muscle memory that I got. Also the creatine initially. Exactly, all that initial stuff. So I got all that working against me now. And then I also am still not at a place where I can hit my chest. So, and that still even limits how hard I hit my shoulders. It limits how hard I hit my back.

Now, luckily I really haven't been pushing the weight that much. So I still think I have a month of, I can keep increasing weight before I'm really starting to push boundaries. Um, I think you'll do 10 to 13 lean body. Oh my God. You think again? Yeah, I think 10. I would be ecstatic with 10. I think you'll do 10 to 13 lean body mass. Oh my God, you think again? Yeah, I think 10. I would be ecstatic with 10. I would be ecstatic with another 10.

Yeah, another 10. Just because that first muscle cramp. You know, it also is- If you can do the upper body, yeah, if you can get through that. Yeah, that would help. That would be, if I felt good like that, I would have a different attitude

because then I would know I have a long way to go strength-wise. I'm not pushing hard. There's a lot of potential there, yeah. Because I find myself like, oh, I'll have a good day of lifting and then the next time I lift, I go, I. There's a lot of potential there. Because I find myself like, oh, I'll have a good day of lifting and then the next time I lift I go, I gotta scale back a little bit my chest

or my shoulder or whatever. So that's probably the biggest thing that's a challenge right now is dealing with the injuries still while also trying to do this. So it's hard to say if I'm gonna pull. I'd say eight to 10 is what I'm gonna guess. I mean, I would be excited. The other part is this. I'll go with you on 10. I'm also getting to. I would say eight to 10 is what I'm gonna get. I mean, I would be, I would be excited. The other part is this.

I'll go with you on 10. I'm also getting to a place where the calories are getting more difficult too. So it's really easy for me, I have found. Well, so. Which by the way, there's like, this is another really good conversation to have in regards to this too,

because remember when we started this, the goal was to reduce body fat. I was at 15.8% body fat, right? So the goal would be to lean out, lose body fat. That was the main goal. Like based off of that, you would think the first thing I do is cardio, cut calories, but I was at 2000 calories. So imagine that.

So okay, now let's even take myself where I'm at now. Well, I'm barely hitting 3000 to 3200. Well, you know what I have found is that it takes about 2,800 to 3,000 calories for me to hit 200 grams of protein, like comfortably. Of course, I could eat nothing but chicken breast and rice. You can boil chicken breast. Yeah, like, okay, I could do it that way. But if I want to have, you know, a healthy amount of fats and carbs in there and somewhat enjoy my meals, I've got to eat almost 3,000 calories in order to hit my 200 grams of protein.

So even where I'm at now, if I were to go into a cut, back down to 2,500, now I would be, sure I would lose weight, but I would also probably sacrifice muscle. Yeah, so something else too, just to point out, you went in 30 days from eating under 2,000 calories to eating 3,000 calories, and lost five pounds of body fat while doing so.

It works, everybody. The stuff that we talk about works. Again, he has muscle memory on his side, so this is turbocharged, but the principles still remain. That's the only thing that's, that's the part that, like anybody that says that, like you're stupid, right? I mean, that's, we're not comparing the final number. It's the point that that's the method, right?

It's the point that it works. That's like, so, cause everyone's asked, well what should I expect? Well you're not me so you shouldn't expect 18 pounds of muscle. Have you ever had 50 pounds of muscle on your body you don't have? So don't expect that but what you should expect is that you will just get the best results your body could get by approaching it that way because that is the right way to approach it. It's not compare yourself to me and what I did. You know one other thing to keep in mind is that you're four weeks out you're gonna continue to reverse. You're continuing to build. Oh yeah. What you're not doing,

which a lot of people might have done, is four weeks later, cool now it's time to cut calories. No, no, no, no, no. There's way more potential and when you set yourself up well with a really fast roaring metabolism, good lean body mass, it is easy to maintain a comparison. Otherwise, you're screw yourself. So there are different, based off the results, there are different strategies and approaches I would have had.

So because I lost five pounds of fat and built 18 pounds of muscle, I went into, I'm in, well, I was supposed to. You know you can have way more calories. That's right. So that tells me I can bulk even more aggressive than I was because I lost fat and built muscle. So that tells me that's a signal that, oh, okay, I can push the bulking side.

Now let's say that didn't happen. Let's pretend I put 18 pounds of muscle on and added two or three pounds of fat, which still would be great, right? If you put 18 pounds of muscle on and you only added two pounds of fat, that would be awesome. You're still leaner as a percentage. Yeah. Because you gain more lean body muscle. Yeah, that would be a huge success still.

But what that would tell me is, okay, where I'm at calorie-wise, I don't want to push too aggressive, I either want to just stay right there and keep doing that exchange, or maybe even be a little bit tighter on the calories. The fact that you lost. But the fact that I lost fat and built that much muscle tells me I can push the whole.

Lost pounds of fat, not percentage. So again, everybody, if you gain muscle and gain no fat, your percentage went down of body fat, because it's now a smaller percentage of your, not percentage. So again, everybody, if you gain muscle and gain no fat, your percentage went down of body fat, because it's now a smaller percentage of your overall body weight. Okay, so one more thing I wanna ask you, Adam, because one of the greatest coaching techniques that I ever discovered, you guys communicate the same thing,

and I think if you've been a trainer for a while, you figure this out, is you start to learn how to help your clients understand really the full spectrum of benefits of fitness. Because everybody focused on fat loss, muscle gain, and the scale. But there's so many other benefits that people miss because that's not what they look.

Selective attention is a real thing. I've said this many times on the podcast. If you just focus on the scale, that's all you notice, and you end up missing all these other incredible benefits, then you develop a relationship with exercise that's incomplete because it's only based on the scale and it's not a relationship that you can maintain. Okay, so I want to ask you, we know the muscle gain, the fat loss, strength. How do you feel? How's your sleep? How's your libido? How's your energy? How's your mood? Like what are all the other things you notice in four weeks?

Yeah, I mean this is something I've communicated in my videos also. It's like, and I'm reminded every time the thing that I'm always reminded of And I and this is something I think almost everybody can relate to that's listening right now is Before this all started and I decided to commit to this The biggest thing I was like time I said, what the fuck am I doing right now? I've got so much going on in my personal life at the business right now This is not the time for me to be training like so diligently and crazy.

Why am I putting this commitment on myself? What do I find? As soon as I start doing this and I get in the rhythm, it's like more days or more hours in the day. More energy. Yeah, I'm so much more productive. Now I'm getting as much if not more done with the additional commitment to that.

And it's like, as much as I know that, I even find myself telling myself the opposite before that, right? So that was like a big takeaway and reminder to the audience is like, I get it. Because trust me, right before this, I was going like, you can't commit to this Adam, you have too much going on right now.

But you do, you just. But you're not just committing to the workouts, you're also filming it, having the guys edit it, because you're putting this out there. So it's not just workouts. It's a big wedge of time, it's just that you realize what that does to fuel you for everything else. Oh yeah, remember, I'm documenting every single day,

both inside the studio and still going home and doing lives. We're not asking the average person to do anything. Yeah, you know. The average person's gonna work out three days a week, three hours is all they're asking for. This is a lot more than three hours I'm committing to this project, yet I'm easily being work out three days a week, three hours, is all they're asking for. This is a lot more than three hours I'm committing to this project, yet I'm easily being able to do it

because it's almost like the days went to 26 hour days. What about your mood? What about your sleep? Yeah, I mean, I'm always, I'm a better husband, I'm a better father, I'm a better brother, I'm a better business partner when I'm fit. When I'm fit and I'm healthy, I'm just a better version of myself in all aspects.

And sleep, right away, that's another big one for me, especially because I drink caffeine and not using that energy. Boy, that makes a big difference on the way I sleep. When I first started, as soon as I started working out, the nights I was just like crashing as soon as I hit the bed. Where other nights before, restless. And this is appropriate exercise, because some people think that you get better sleep because you're so exhausted from the workout. No, no. That's not what happens. No, no, I'm never.

It's healthy sleep. None of my workouts did I leave exhausted. I mean, every one of my workouts I have left actually going, man, I wanna do more. Yeah. I should do more, I want more. It's like, no, I don't need to. You know what's cool?

I just ran into somebody at a church on Sunday who approached me, Josh, I think his name is, I more. It's like, no, I don't need to. You know what's cool? I just ran into somebody at church on Sunday who approached me, Josh, I think his name is, I hope that's your name, Josh, so you can hear this. He comes up to me and he's like, hey, are you Sal? My guy's like, oh my God. He goes, your podcast helped me lose 30 pounds. And he tells me this whole story

of how he essentially did everything wrong. Running, cutting his calories, following others. And he's like, and I just couldn't get any progress. He goes, then I found your podcast, and literally, this't get any progress. He goes, then I found your podcast. And literally, this was the exact words. He goes, I realized I did the opposite of what I needed. I was doing everything so wrong. And I realized it, and I did everything

that you guys said on the podcast, lost 30 pounds. The guy's super healthy. He's like, I work out less than I think I need to. I'm able to maintain it. Super. Welcome to the other side. So awesome. I mean, that's the point.

That's everything we learned. That's the part. I mean, we all kinda said this when we first started doing this, I really wanted to reach those people, right? If you're a fitness fanatic and you know. You're fine. And we're not for you, whatever.

I'm trying to save all the people that think it has to be this daunting task. It's gotta be so grueling and so tough and it really doesn't actually. No, it's great when you do it right. Yes, great. It's great. No, it's great when you do it right. Yeah, it's great. It's great. You know, speaking of sleep, Justin,

so you've had struggles with sleep recently. Yeah, in the last few months. And you just said you felt like you've been getting better sleep because what? Well, just as a way for me to actually get deep sleep and I've had to intervene because it's just been a nightmare, like and really it's something bigger I got to address. And actually, my wife, the first time I had a serious health issue was the only person

that actually diagnosed it. And out of all the doctors and all the tests and all these things she figured out because she was in medical school at the time to be a nurse figured out was Kahn syndrome which was you know this this tumor over my adrenal gland which then raised my blood pressure and had all these like side effects and end up getting that removed and that kind of absolved that issue for me however there's ties to that she's reading now that actually does tie in GER, does tie in heartburn, all these other chronic autoimmune type issues that I've been struggling with and doing all

these protocols for and all these stem cell, whatever. Hasn't really done much for me. So I actually have been, every now and then I'll take like some of the Ned sleep and even over, I was testing this because I was sick like Thursday, Friday. I was like, I had like some flu that my son gave me. Thank you. That's going around. Yeah, he had it pretty bad.

He's always patient zero. He always gives it to the whole family, dude. I swear, it's always him. Older one of the- Ethan. Yeah, I don't know who he's hanging out with or what is happening, but he's always with the diseased ones. And he brings that home, and then we all kind of get through it, but I usually get over it pretty quick,

but I mean, I was just like, first night I took NyQuil, and I was like, just powered out, like just, and I was so dead to the world the next day, so like, zombied out, couldn't function, and then I was just like, no, I'm just gonna do the Ned Sleep version, and I was so dead to the world the next day, so like zombied out, couldn't function. And then I was just like, no, I'm just gonna do the Ned Sleep version. And I had rejuvenating kind of sleep. Like I woke up and I was like, oh,

like I felt like actually energetic when I got up, but I was knocked out completely dead to the world at the same time. And so I just, it's such a powerful product that they don't talk about that much. I use it a lot when I go traveling and I'm like I have to intervene. I haven't used anything as powerful as Netsleep.

It's guaranteed nighttime. It's literally the same kind of like, you know, you know you're gonna get into that deep sleep. It's just gonna put you there. But you don't feel like a total complete worthless idiot the next day. Yeah, which is like my sales pitch How do you how do you you always you always do that? You get really sick and then three days later you look fine Yeah, I I dude. I don't know. I just Adam and I get sick and you know, I get angry

It's kind of a rough a rough thing cuz it's like, you know I kind of wish I was a little more of a baby about it Like wait, hold on. Are you calling us baby? You guys take how you want but I'm just I'm saying like I wish I was like a little more like had people like Doting on me or whatever. I'm just like get away from me You know, I'm gonna power like I'm trying to like power through it and like Like will my way out of it, you know,, and it just never people hate to be around me. You'd be the worst how you do anything is how you do everything, right? So I just like just try will my way out of it and sometimes it works sometimes it makes it worse

So yeah, I got over it like Saturday. I was starting to feel better I plan on you know, have you guys in my life for the rest of our lives? So hopefully you never need us to care for you because that'll be just pure comedy. Yeah you and Courtney are gonna be angry like she's she angrily like just force feeds me like pills and you know that we know the whole thing that we went through with Katrina right that that scariness that we had right that was probably part of why like one of the things we've talked about is that, um, man, how much it drew us closer together. I'm convinced it's because in the back of

her head, probably forever up until that point, she always wondered like, I wonder if she got really bad at this fucker could probably take care of this. I really believe that the reason why we got bought it is simply, I think in the back of her head, yeah, I think in the back of her head, she always thought that man, if I'm on my deathbed, we're fucked, this guy's not gonna take care of me. Hopefully that like made you tighter, right? I rose the occasion, she was so impressed

with everything I was able to handle for us, and so I really think that was where the super bond came from is I think in the back of her head she's just like, this guy can't help me. Well when you're that vulnerable, especially if you're that kind of a person, because Katrina's like that, where she just, I'll do it, I'll handle it, right especially if you're that kind of a person because Katrina's like that where she just you know like I'll do it I'll handle it right yeah when you're that kind of a person and you're forced to be

vulnerable because she was forced she had no choice yeah yeah then it's like it's nice to see to be able to trust somebody see this your person that you're you know somebody's caring for you and it's genuine because it's such a fear that's by the way you know because I'm the same way the reason why some people are hard to care for is it's a fear we don't's by the way, you know, cause I'm the same way, the reason why some people are hard to care for is it's a fear. We don't wanna be burdened, we don't wanna be burdens on anybody.

Yeah, she's definitely really struggled with it. Still, I mean still to this day, it still is tough for her when she has these momentary setbacks and she's just not used to saying I need help or I can't or those things like that. It's just really, really been, it's been interesting to watch her go through that

and know that that's been like the greatest challenge for her is to be able to kind of let go and ask for help and be patient, do those things like that. Yeah, I'm the guy that'll like, if this was like 10,000 years ago, I'd just go off to the cave and dive. I don't feel good, guys, I'll see you guys later. You can find me 10 years later, this is where he was.

He died. Hey, I'll see you guys later. You can find me 10 years later, this is where he was. He died. Hey, I'm gonna change topics here. I just learned about a new course that some universities are offering that I guess it's a sign of the times, but it's a little kind of cringey. Did he tell you how to bring your parents to the interviews with you?

No, God. Okay. Probably is a classic. I told Courtney that the other day, she didn't believe me. That people that kids are doing that? That stat, that stat. Yeah. Yeah, 60% or whatever it was.

It's hard to believe. It was 30, right? Some of that was like there. All right, so some universities are offering influencer courses. What? Brilliant. Brilliant.

All right, we're done. How to be an influencer, how to get followers, how to build a business or brand. Ugh, it's so gross. You know what, okay, I actually love this conversation that you brought this up. I knew you would like it. Yeah, I do like this conversation.

This actually came up, so I was with my Hampton group this week. Okay. So I flew up to Jackson Hall, by the way, epic's place. Isn't it gorgeous? Unbelievable. Yeah, I gotta go. Beautiful.

Beautiful. I mean, for me, probably the most beautiful countryside I've been to yet. And incredible food and stuff like that too, so just. The people. Beautiful. I mean for me probably the most beautiful countryside I've been to yet and incredible food and stuff like that too so just the people yeah people oh yeah people are made just beautiful all the way all the way around anyways this conversation kind of came up we were talking about the you know influencers stuff and I always talk about how you guys know this like we are we're all like this like it's like a total insult. Oh God, don't say that. And I was-

Someone says you're an influencer. And so it came up, right? And so of course they were laughing and they were asking me and I said, well, it's because I want to build a business and a brand that provides such a high value service or product that it has nothing to do with my influence. That's what I'm trying to do.

I'm not trying to be so popular or famous. I could peddle shit to you the right for hours long as I'm an influencer. I want to build a brand and a product so valuable that other people use it and tell other people that's going to withstand the test of time. Like it's yes, we tried and true. It's not yet dependent on you showing up with motivation or not 100 and that and so and I get that we're in this period of time where this has become a class and an actual position.

Well, you know most kids when you ask them, have you seen these studies? Yeah, they want to be. Elementary and junior high kids? They want to be influencer or YouTuber. YouTuber. Yeah, YouTuber influencer. And you know, I want to tell this generation coming up,

boy, it's the influencer friends that I have and that I know, a lot of them are miserable because you don't realize what you're signing up for in order to make a living that way where you constantly have to influence people to buy things in order for you to make a living. It's a tough place to be. You'd be far better off trying to create a product or a brand or a service that is provided to people that helps them and change their life. That right there, not only is it rewarding, but it also allows you to scale out of it. When you're an influencer yourself, you got to do that work. If the whole point of what you're doing is just to make money,

you're going to be very, very disappointed because the way to be a successful influencer, and I don't mean money wise, I mean just this is what you enjoy doing, is whatever you're communicating is something that you feel a strong purpose and meaning behind. And a lot of influencers don't, they just don't. For them it's about being popular and then selling products as a popularity

and that's why they're so fricking miserable. And both fame and money are not shortcuts to happiness. And the data on this is clear. This is just me communicating. You can see what the data says that as soon as your needs are met with money, more money doesn't make you happier. And fame, actually, there's a negative relationship

with fame and notoriety and happiness. So it's terrible. That's why I feel like these courses and this message around being an influencer is setting up this generation for a miserable future. Because it is, most everybody I know that went this route, and even the ones that have had lots of success doing it, are miserable.

Because exactly what you said is, they put, first of all, it's already hard to become popular or famous on the internet, right? No matter what they tell you, or what course they try to tell you that it's easy, it takes a unique person to get that, garner that kind of attention, which that's hard in itself. So then you figure that out and now you're like,

okay, I've arrived, I'm an influencer. Now let me take on the brands and start to influence me. Now you are subject to who's willing to work with you in order for you to peddle their shit and then you're dependent on that going well for you to be financially successful. And so all of this energy and effort goes into keeping those brands happy

and those customers buying just so you can get paid. Meanwhile, you probably are- You're just selling your soul. Yeah, yeah. I mean, just rarely ever, I mean, that's. Here, you know, there's another side to this why I think these courses are gonna be dumb, is that, okay, so what are they gonna do?

They're gonna show algorithms, they're gonna show how social media works, and you're gonna do what, a two or four year or three year process of learning this at a university. I hate to break this to you, but by the time you start learning something, 12 months later. It's gonna be start learning something, 12 months later, 12 months later it's not the same algorithm, everything's so different.

This stuff changes every three months. So I don't understand how that's gonna work. Well maybe they have solid principles around it. Well that's called business classes though. That's my whole point. You don't need an influencer course. That's true. You just need to learn business.

Those principles are the only solid principles. That's it. Otherwise, what are they gonna teach? That's my point. What's different about this? I love to see the, the, the, uh, the, you know, the syllabus or whatever, right? I'd love to see what the, what they lay out for somebody like that, you know? Yeah. Yeah. So many, so many of these courses and classes are like all the algorithm gimmicky hack stuff. And it's like, you know, when you go that route, even if you do hit it, maybe you hit it just right at the right timing, you have a good run. But eventually, if you don't have a good product or service

that is helping or changing lives that other people are gonna share with other people because they've had so much success with it, really, really tough to keep that model going for a really long time. And also, I want people to understand, if your goal is to build a business, you don't need thousands or millions of followers.

Just like owning a storefront, if you have hundreds of people that really find tons of value in what you're providing, you have yourself a very successful business. And the way to do that is to provide real value. It's funny you say that too, Sal, because right now, obviously, in the last couple months, we have reinserted ourselves back in our trainer program.

We initially had hired somebody else, hopefully that they were gonna be the CEO running it, they failed miserably, now we're back in there and we're doing it. And one of the things that we're getting as feedback is the messaging that we have around scaling and being a trainer is so different to what all these other online courses and stuff are teaching people because

Everybody else is in the business of hey pay me X amount of dollars for my course I'll show you a quick way to make that five or ten grand back so that you feel like you didn't lose any money on Me, but it's not teaching you principles around how to build a career. Yeah building a business It's just like oh This is how you can use Instagram to hack into some sort of a challenge or thing that you can do to make that five grand that you spent on my course on teaching you how to do that, which is not, we're not in the business of that at all. It's like, listen, this is going to take you a long time. You should probably be chasing mastery and getting

better at your craft. That should be your number one focus and then getting people in front of you because that's what's going to make you a good coach and trainer. I want to teach coaches and trainers how to cashhing out their investments. You go, oh, cash out your investment, get the money, reinvest in it. No, I wanna teach trainers and coaches how to do this as a career. Like, if you love doing this, which you should,

if you wanna be a trainer or coach, you should love doing this, number one. If that's you, I would love to teach you how to do this until you retire. To be able to support yourself and your family, doing what you love, making a good living, actually getting people healthy and fit in a real way. That's it.

Our play is the slower play, but check back with me in six months to a year, and the trainers that are in our course that we are coaching and mentoring and teaching, they're gonna kick the shit at everybody else. We have a, it's okay, we're doing, by the way, this is- Free.

We're putting, yes, we're putting the rubber to the road. So we're doing free classes for anybody who wants to attend. You don't have to pay for this. Stuff that we used to teach trainers and coaches when we managed gyms every other month. So every other month, Adam and I get on and teach you what we think to be the most valuable. You don't buy nothing, you just learn.

Show up. And just show up. And now hopefully you get so much value that you end up becoming one of our coaches and trainers at some point but you don't have to. We're gonna teach you a lot of free stuff. The next one we have is November 12th. 4 p.m. Pacific. Trainorwebinar.com. You can sign up. It's unlimited. Sign up and check it out. It's totally totally free. Speaking of partners and people we work with

z-biotics Now wants to be referred to as and I love that things is brilliant They want to be called a pre-alcohol probiotic drink pre-alcohol free I'm mad that I didn't come up with that. Yes, that is way smart pre-workout pre-alcohol. That's brilliant I love I'm so mad to I drank on this trip to and I didn't have mine that's brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. I'm so mad too, I drank on this trip too and I didn't have mine with me. Oh.

So that's like, I mean I thought, you know, it's like when I checked all the boxes and things I want, I didn't think, I wasn't thinking about alcohol, but I drank almost, by the way too, that's another reason why this is gonna be challenging

for me, like I actually allowed myself to drink too, so pretty much every night. Alcohol is a muscle killer. Yeah, it just is. And you know what, I was like going back through like my food log and seeing like why it's so detrimental, is it just because it fills you know what I was like going back through like my food log and seeing like why it's so detrimental Is it just because it fills you up with empty worthless calories?

It's like I end up drinking and you then I also miss protein. I get meals when I'm drinking Yeah, like yeah when we were in Alabama, I actually introduced some of my friends Xebotics and it was they're tripping out on it But yeah, it was we were we end up like drinking Throughout the day and then we'd skip lunch and then we kind of you know And you just kind of drag it on you eat these little meals But like you don't really get any nutrients or sustenance was this their first time using it Yeah, so why were they they were just tripping because they felt oh tripping the next day

they were like normally based off of like because I hate to like, but we polished a good bottle of whiskey, and we should have been pretty slow going, moving the next day, and we're all like. A bunch of mid-40s guys. Yeah, plus that on top of smashing into people and whatnot, we should have been pretty messed up. But yeah, they're tripping, they're like, this is real, this is legit. Yeah, people who don't know, they're tripping. They're like, this is real, legit.

Yeah, people who don't know, so you drink this before you drink alcohol and then it's probiotic. It's magical. They break down the acetaldehyde in your gut, which is what oftentimes make you feel like garbage. And this is genetically modified bacteria, so you don't find this anywhere else. And it doesn't work like, if a 10 is how I typically feel after drinking alcohol in terms of like not feeling good It brings it down to a no joke a three so I can still tell I drank but it's like a three Which is oh, yeah, which is wild about the only thing it doesn't like what I it doesn't give me good sleep Right like cuz like you still drink. Yeah, I have six drinks

It's not gonna be good, but I don't have the hungover feeling is what it gets rid of Yeah, that's the part which is obviously just as miserable. So it's like, okay, I didn't have the best night of sleep, but at least I don't feel terrible. No headache, no stomach issues. I hate when you drink and you go to bed and you get the sweats. I hate that.

You wake up in the night and you're just like. Sweats and you just constantly just kind of get up because yeah, I'm like hot and like energized. Oh, weird way. Feels like absolute garbage. Do you have a a shout out I just was gonna shout out a book I've been reading with my wife trying to understand our 13 year old son and so it's called the emotional lives of teenagers I think it's Lisa de Moore really good though just kind of helps us

to kind of get a grasp of some of these outbursts and where they're coming from and how to selectively say things to kind of weather it out and deal with it. So it's good. God bless you. If you're interested in hormone replacement therapy, men and ladies, if you are over the age of 35,

especially over the age of 40, hormone replacement therapy can be a total game changer. Or maybe you're just interested in the world of peptides. GLP-1s are peptides. There are peptides that boost growth hormones, those that speed up healing, peptides for sleep. If you're interested in any of that, you want longevity experts, doctors,

you wanna work with them, find out if it's right for you, go to mphormones.com. All right, back to the show. Our first caller is Alyssa from North Carolina. Alyssa, what's happening? Hey, hi guys, how are you? We're great, how are you? Good, how are you?

Good, it's nice to meet you. You too. I just wanna start off with a confession. I've been a listener for like seven years now. And just in the past year, I finally took you guys's advice and I stopped bootcamp classes and I started strength training. Only took six years. And I'm loving it.

And you love it, huh? I do. Yeah. So the point of me saying this is like to anybody listening, start earlier, like I really wish I would have. I could do one pull up now, which is huge for me. I just got it the other day. Awesome. And I don't even listen to music anymore. So thank you guys. Oh,

you got it. Yeah. Um, do you want me to just go into my question? Yeah, okay. I'm gonna read off here so I don't get sidetracked. But my question is in regards to my job. I'm going to read off here so I don't get sidetracked. But my question is in regards to my job. I'm a registered nurse currently in a health coaching role. The company I work for offers wellness programs and health coaching to other companies in order to hopefully reduce healthcare costs. The clients agree to the wellness program and if they're compliant, they get a discount

on their health insurance. So the way it works, they take a yearly health assessment where we get like their blood pressure, labs, weight, and all that, and they get a risk score. So the higher the score, the more often they meet with me. Um, so my issue is that some clients aren't really interested in learning about health and fitness. They just meet with me to get like the, uh, discount off their insurance. Um, so it's frustrating to see these people so unhealthy and not interested in making any

changes. I've known them for about a year or two now. So like in that time, I've just been trying to like develop rapport and get to know them and kind of tie the conversation into health and fitness. I have 20 minute appointments with each person at most once a month. Do you have any advice for me? Like how do you coach somebody who doesn't really wanna be coached?

I love that. You know what's funny Alyssa about this question that you just asked me? Yeah. You opened by saying that you've listened to us for seven years, but it took you six years to start scratching. Oh.

Literally. Literally. Learn it. Yeah so. Oh, got me. No, it's training. You literally, literally. You've got it. Oh, got me. No, it's perfect. You're coaching yourself right now. This is absolutely perfect. So let me ask you, what worked, how did we finally get you to make the decision to stop

the crappy bootcamp and start strength training? What was it that we did that finally brought you over? Yeah, I think I just finally was like not seeing any changes and like, okay, I'm like running myself to the ground here. I gotta try something different and I'm fine. And I was, well, okay. And also I was nervous. I was, it was a little intimidating to start, you know,

just strength, just trying something new, I guess. Yes, I totally understand that. But there's more to this Alyssa, because during that whole period of time you kept listening to us right? Yeah yeah. Had you stopped listening to us we might we may never have gotten here. Yeah that's true. So what was it that kept you coming back? I just finally kept hearing everybody saying so many good things and just kept listening I don't know I just you enjoyed I'll give you the answer.

You enjoyed listening to us. Give me the answer, yeah. You enjoyed listening to us. You enjoyed being in our company. And eventually the message came through. So that's the answer. The answer is continue to be this great person, continue to be this understanding, empathetic person,

and eventually the opportunities will arise. And it may take a while, but that's the only way to do it. You can't force it. These opportunities will present themselves, but what you wanna be is you wanna be this person that your patients, your clients, wanna continue to come and see, because that's the only way you're ever gonna have

any influence with them, is if they actually want to come and see you. Gotcha. There's also, you probably hear us talk about this too, is meeting the client where they're at and that may look way different for all the different, especially in your field and the type of clients that you're getting. It could be as simple as like just convincing this person, hey, let's just see what happens if we try and build a sleep routine. What if we just try to do a couple things to improve your sleep? I'm not going to tell you to go to the

gym yet. I'm not gonna tell you to start weighing your, like, you know, learning that some people, they're just, they don't want to do the gym thing. They're not willing, at this point in their life, they're not willing to commit to all these things. But maybe can be able to commit to making a better choice about something that's related to health that you know can impact them a lot, like their sleep or walking or things like that. And so for sure, the advice that Sal said, that's just it. You just got to be you, be likable, be somebody they want to listen to and show up to meet.

Eventually you break through to those people, but also finding how to communicate to these people where they're currently at. If you have somebody who is just no way right now or anytime soon, you're going to convince them, go to the gym three times a week and lift weights. But you know what? They wouldn't mind trying some things to improve their sleep at night. Like, okay, I'm open to that. Tell me what I, so also thinking about that too, like, okay, where can I, what other things I can do? Cause being healthier, there's a lot of,

there's a lot more things that it encompasses besides just eating better and strength training. There's a lot of things that these people can do to decompress and lower stress and improve sleep and improve mobility and walking. And so trying things like that too, is kind of trying to meet them where they're currently at in their journey.

And you know, some other strategies too, like if these people are seeing you and you start to build rapport and they start to like you, you could just share your own stories and don't make it so obvious like you're trying to push them to do something, but literally be like, oh my God, that was such a great,

how was your day yesterday? And they'll tell you like, oh, how was yours? Oh man, yesterday I had this great workout. You know, I used to do these crazy workouts and I switched to something else and I'm feeling so much better. And that's it, that's it. Step one is that they still gotta, they come and see you.

And as long as they come and see you, the opportunity is always there. But if you push too hard or if you get down on yourself, I'm not making something happen, I gotta push harder, you'll lose that. You'll lose that person and then you'll never have those opportunities. So you're actually doing,

what you said in your question was the build rapport, that's the most important thing. That's the most important thing. So just be patient. I'm not very patient. So maybe this is another, you know, I'm like, okay, I've known for a while, That's the most important thing. Yeah. That's the most important thing. Yeah. So just be patient. I'm not very patient. So maybe this is another, you know, I'm like, okay, I've known for a while, but that is

also good advice. Like say it kind of like not straightforward. Like it's kind of like what you do with the kids, you know, like, oh man, like this happened and a hundred percent humanizes you, right? It humanizes you to them and being able to say things like, man, I, I was working out wrong for the longest time because I thought I had to do all this stuff. It's crazy now.

I do a couple exercises and I can't believe the results and benefits I get. So dropping those seeds like that to them. But this was a trainer hack for sure. Like part of, and a lot of trainers fail at this is because most of us have these massive egos and are insecure. So being comfortable with humanizing or talking about your struggles is hard for a lot, but that makes a great coach and

trainer is somebody who's willing to say like, man, I was fucking up for a long time. I thought I had to do this. I even even with my schooling and all the all those knowledge I have in this field, I still didn't know what I was doing. You tell that to a person who's looking to you for advice and they go like, oh shit, okay, so she's not perfect either, and oh, she struggled with this too. That's the vulnerability that's really

gonna come across the best. Yeah, being vulnerable is huge for those people. Absolutely. You're doing good though. Do you think they like you? Yeah. Yeah, I think they do too. You seem very likable. Not to be like, not to be confident,

but yeah, I think they do. Man, that is- You come off very likable. Yeah, I mean, I think I think they do too you seem very like like not to be confident Yeah, I think they do that's man that is come on very like yeah I mean, I like you I think that's a great like you are that's that's the most important step And you just stay patient stay consistent have them show up have to build that rapport and then those opportunities They will present themselves and it may take a while for some people and just got to be okay with that I mean there were clients I trained, literally, I had clients that hired me to lose weight and didn't lose weight for three years. Like three years, they worked on me for three years

and then they finally. But they enjoyed showing up. But they enjoyed showing up, they loved seeing me, and at least they showed up, at least we did some exercise. And then of course, three years later, something clicked and then they're like, you know what, I'm ready to do this. Just gonna allow that space for it to happen.

That's it, and then it happened. The funny part too, it'll be weird stuff like this too, where you say something a different way and it clicks for them and you're like, I've been saying that to you for fucking two years. That is what got you to do it. From their neighbor. You just never say that. You never know. You never know what it's going to be. I mean, literally, that's the formula of this podcast, right? I mean, it's like we say the same message a hundred different ways. And you know, there's a, there's a whole cohort of people that that time, the seventh time we said it that way, all of a sudden it clicked for them and now they're, they're bought in, you know, so that's just gotta be you. Like me. Yeah. That's funny. That is a great example. Yes. You got it. Yeah. Well, that was my only question. That's awesome. Alyssa, let me send something to you. Do you have any of our programs?

You want any? So I had, I bought Performance, and I, because I stay at home with my kids full time, and this is my part-time thing, so it seems like an extreme sport, you know, like putting them in car seats all day. I figured that was a good program, but I bought it right when Muscle Mommy came out,

so I switched and got that instead. So I'm in the middle of that. Awesome, man. So I don't, You know what might be a good... I'll give you a program that would be good because I'm assuming you're... you probably work with and deal with a lot of deep condition type people. Prime Pro is a great program and it's a great place to meet a lot of people out. Like, maybe I can't get you to lift weights yet, but I can get you to do some mobility stuff to help that knee pain or to help that hip pain. So I'd love to send you Prime Pro. Oh, what a great entry. What a great entry. I'm sure you asked them about pain and people will say, oh yeah, my shoulder.

Oh yeah, no, they tell me about it all the time. Like back pain, I need to send that, the one that you just did, the podcast you guys just did on back pain to a lot of the guys. Oh perfect. Prime Pro, now you have some tools that you can help them. Awesome, thank you guys so much. You got thank you okay bye bye how funny is that seven literally open is like she gave you all the information yeah I've been listening to you guys for seven years finally made it yeah but I can't get these other people to listen to me oh really that's weird you know it's the reason why you know when we open the show I intro and I say we're the the top fitness I intro and I say we're the top fitness and entertainment podcast.

I say entertainment, the reason why there's an entertainment component is because as trainers, this is intentional. When we were trainers, you figured this out. If you're all fitness, you're not going to be very successful. People have to enjoy showing up and being with you and hanging out with you and then doors open and then you can start to influence people and then you can really start to help people and the patience is extremely extremely important you can't push someone to do something they don't want to do you have to pull them in and that sometimes takes a long time. Our next caller is Nikos from Greece. Nikos what's happening?

Hello guys hello mindbomb hello yasas how are you? Good, good, how can we help you? Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, let me introduce myself first. I'm Nikos, I'm 28 years old. I'm from Greece, just like I said. And I really appreciate you guys all your hard work and for the helpful free content you give and I really appreciate the opportunity you give. And I really appreciate the opportunity you give me to come here and talk with you guys. Thank you for taking my call.

So I've been lifting for a year and a half now, and I'm pumping my mind for a year. for a year. See what I did there. I want to make a pause here and make a more personal thank you note, side note. So when you guys got into my life, like I just stumbled upon you on YouTube and like my whole life changed. I became the healthier, healthiest version of me possible ever. And I just, you just saved my life. So thank you very much guys. Thank you, man. Thank you. So, uh, I have my question really down for you. So I have my question ready down for you. It was in regards with the episode

you guys made. It was 2355 in which Adam, you were not there. So I hope everything is all right. I wish you all the best. So let me read it for you. It was a popular episode. You gave an example that if let's say you do five exercises for your workout, your intensity increases should be on one to two of them. But there comes a question in my mind as my program must be more like a maps 15 type of workout due to summer stress and time limitations. My workout till now was four days a week, Monday upper for five

exercises, Tuesday lower for exercises, Thursday upper five exercises and Friday it was lower full body two and two exercises and at the time next week it would look like six days a week two or or three exercises for workout. So how do I modify the intensity while at the same time I reduce the volume to more than half. I mean, we wrote a program that's good that that does it all for you. Do you have maps 15? No, I don't have maps 15. Although I did, because the question was in June, so it was about 15, although I did because the question was in June.

So it was about summer. So I did what I, but my, let's say, under minds, yeah, understanding of the maps, 15 program kind of look like. And in regards to be saying density, I, I changed the rest time, I reduced the rest time. I also slowed the tempo. I focused more on technique on squeezing, let's say, when you drink basses, but you know what I mean? Yeah. And most of it was compound big compound lifts and then

August I added some supersets for more for chest and that's about what I did. That's that's fine you can do that we don't have to. We got we got you. Yeah I mean literally just follow or we'll send you math 15 do the advanced version it's all laid out for you. Yeah it's all laid out for you. It's all laid out for you. Yeah, you just follow the program as it's laid out. As far as intensity is concerned, regardless of your experience, even if you're advanced, intensity increasing techniques don't really need to be applied very often at all. Like once every four weeks, five weeks, something like that at most. For the most part, straight sets are what are gonna get you the best results Like you know like like once every four weeks five weeks something like that at most

For the most part straight sets are what are gonna get you the best results consistently. Yeah So what I did was I did for the whole summer So probably it's why I'm feeling now the way I'm feeling Like tired lazy Everything when we got with over training Probably. Yeah, you probably overdid it. Yeah so now I'm just really trying to get back on my feet. That's why I switch to three times a week full body and that's about it. Nicos do you still want to work out two exercises a day six days a week or do you prefer three three days a week?

Because I can send you a program that'll do it. Now I will have to switch for three days a week because also I'm gonna move out. I'm starting. I'm starting career shift on personal training. I got inspired by you guys. So yeah, very nice. Actually, this week is my first my first lesson this Saturday. Oh, exciting. Yeah, good for you. Maps and a ball. And we'll send you maps and a ball. Like and then are you aware that every other month, Sal and I do free webinars for coaches and trainers to help you with your business. I subscribed. I did but I never I never got into one because of the summer, actually the summer is pretty tough here. Also in my line of previous work.

I do water sports so it's only summer. And no time for almost nothing. That's why I also switch to kind of like MAPS 15. Got it. Okay. Well, we do them every other month. So the next one we're going to be doing is I think November if I'm not mistaken but if you go to Facebook you could you can be in our Facebook personal training group and I believe what's it called personal

trainer growth secrets powered by mind pump site go in there it's a free group and then you'll get notifications for our webinars but maps and a ball it will send you that program follow that three days a week. Perfect for what you're looking for. Yeah. Okay. Thank you very much guys I also I also want to say that one day I really hope I will be able to come there And talk with you in person or be maybe be a guest at your foot your soul. So That would be awesome. Yeah, we'd love that man. Yeah, actually I prefer to come I prefer to come to you Now I'm quitting my job so wouldn't be

Well, yeah, well get in get in the personal trainer forum. We're in there a lot That's where we engaged and it's a big focus of the business right now to be focusing on coaches and trainers like yourself and helping You with your business. So get over there. I better see I better see you in that form. All right. All right. All right, Nico. Thank you, Nico. Thank you. Thank you very much guys. We wish you all the best. Yeah, I think the good thing for for people understand when they hear that is that workout programming isn't it's it isn't as easy as people think. Now there is simplicity to it,

but often times when people try to create a program, they'll misplace a variable, whether it be intensity or volume or even exercises in whatever order, and then it'll work for a second, and then they'll be like, what's going on, why do I feel the way I do? These are all considerations

that really experienced coaches have to consider when they create a workout program for someone. So there are some real simple basic workouts in there, but don't get misled by the simplicity. Like, MAPS Anabolic looks very simple on its face, but there's a lot of complexity in the simplicity of it, and if you start to apply, add variables that you think need to be in there, unless you're very experienced,

like you've trained lots of people, you've been a coach for a while, typically doesn't work out. I think that's the difficulty of explaining it because some people can change a few variables and things and see real results right away, but it's a brief window. And so knowing how to extend that out and then plan even further to bypass a lot of these plateaus, that's all related to really good programming.

I think a lot of that is the faults of all of us coaches and trainers online that are always competing with the latest, greatest study or this gets this, and it's these studies that are done in these six to eight week windows to show strength gains or this, this and it's these studies that are done in these six to eight week windows To show strength gains or this and then people take that and then they start to add it into a program Yeah, that's already laid out like perfect to see you know growth and change and they throw it on top because oh they heard this And then to Justin's point

they see a little bit of results in the first week or two because it is a new stimulus for them and then it ends up being too much and their body adapts and then they regress and go the other way and it's just like there's, I do think that we overcomplicate, this is something I just was communicating to you yesterday, talking about just this, it's just literally like,

it's not that difficult. I think we tend to overcom complicate and hurt ourselves by trying to add all these things from all of our favorite fitness influencers that are giving these tips on how to build more muscle. And then you don't take that into account that if you add something like that, then that's something else needs to probably get pulled out or changed or modified. Otherwise you'll end up hitting a brick wall. Our next caller is Brian from Connecticut. What's going on Brian? What's up Brian?

Hey guys. How you doing? I can't believe I'm on. You guys are great. I want all the content and having a section dedicated to helping listeners is really awesome. So thank you guys. I guess my question is I read in Sal's bio that he had a setback in his twenties

and he lost 15 pounds of muscle, thought it was an autoimmune and he spent a year to recover. And his story is similar to what I'm going through right now. I'll keep it short. I was in, I felt great. I was in great shape. And then six years ago, I just all of a sudden hit a wall. I stopped recovering and then my strength of muscles just been

It's just been withering away and just like melting. Um, I tried to go see medical help I've seen like every all gist in the world. I've gone to the Mayo Clinic. I've gone To see Eastern medicine and like nothing's, nothing's helped. Um, I've tried to basically maximize diet, exercise and sleep. And then it's nothing's working. So, um, I was hoping to ask you, um, if you could share anything on what you learn, what you did to get back to where you are now. So yeah, any help that you guys would give would be great.

That's rough, man. I'm assuming you had your hormones tested just to get the basics out. Yeah, they did. I guess, do you mean by like testosterone levels too? Yeah, testosterone and... Yeah, everything came back normal, quote unquote normal. I mean, after going to the Mayo clinic, I mean, they basically told me I have

high cholesterol, which is great, but my problems are where I'm at right now. So, um, and then lifestyle, um, are you under a lot of stress, too much stress or could, would you, would you be able to label it as such? Uh, yeah, that's probably the first question everyone asks. So it's, yes, six years ago, my parents got into a huge car accident and I've been taking care of them ever since. I didn't bring that up initially because,

yes, stress doesn't make things easier, but I mean, I've just been been losing, I can't train anymore and everything's a mess. And yes, I don't want to discount it, but at the same time, I think I know myself well enough that that's not the real reason of why I'm at where I am. Now, don't underestimate the impact of stress and how, it really, and it's cumulative. So, you know, you may be able to handle it for a while, but then it starts to kind of build up.

And it may not be the root. It may just be fuel for whatever the root is. Now, my issue was gut related. So I had gut health issues and I couldn't figure out what was going on. And back in those days, it was really hard to find a functional medicine practitioner. And I was lucky that I had a young lady

that worked in my studio who was on that path. And so we took a functional medicine approach to some of my issues. We did some gut testing. I did the hormone testing and I found that I had, at the time they called it leaky gut syndrome. Today they label it something different. I saw all the food found that I had you know at the time they called it leaky gut syndrome today they label it something different I saw all the food intolerances I had and I really did have to completely modify my diet and my

training I reduced my training intensity my volume placed the focus on sleep and my diet was radically changed and it took a year of slow recovery before I started to kind of feel like I was back to normal. Have you worked with a functional medicine practitioner or someone holistic in that sense? Yeah actually I did all the initial research with a guy that you guys have in the podcast, Dr. Steven. Yeah and I researched some other people. Um, I guess that would be one option. I'm just,

I'm kind of tired of seeing like every single doctor, but I, I, I'm certainly open to any, any suggestions. So I guess maybe that's one option. Um, typically they're the, they're the last line, uh, or the last person that people will see because you go to your, your traditional doctors and you've probably been to a neurologist, you've been to a hormone specialist, you've been, of course, your general practitioner, you've probably been to a gastro specialist.

And- I'm laughing because these are literally all the things that- I know. I figured when you said you've been to all the ologists, I figured you've gone down the traditional route. And a functional medicine practitioner takes a big picture look and then they start to they start to work with the most common offenders and

go from there but they often test for things that other doctors don't necessarily look at and this is where things start to oftentimes make sense although there often is a long discovery process. So you may work with a functional medicine practitioner, it may take a few months of testing and work before we start to identify things that help or work but they're the most holistic when it comes to these things and anytime I worked with a client who couldn't figure out the cause or the root cause of their issues, that would be the direction that I would often send them. As long as I've been

working with people, they've almost always been successful. It's not always easy though. I had clients that worked with functional medicine practitioners for a year or longer before they really started to see progress. But that's 100% the direction that I would point you because you've already ruled out all of the potential acute, like, you know, emergency type stuff. Life or death, right? That's right, so now what we're left with is,

for some reason, the systems of your body don't seem to be working well. You feel like garbage or fatigued. You've done all the major stuff. You've probably tested for nutrient deficiencies. You've looked at hormones. You've looked at your nervous system. You haven't been able to label any known autoimmune condition. So I'm sure they've tested you for all the major ones. So that would be the next step, would be to go to a good functional medicine practitioner and then start working with them and they're used to this.

Oftentimes they're the last person that somebody will see. That's right. Brian, what is your training kind of look like? Do you follow maps? I was just actually, I'm laughing at this, that was actually gonna be my follow up question. That's why I need your guys help. I took a four weeks, four months off completely just walking and it killed me. I mean, maybe it's just like without training and stuff like that. And

I took four months off the beginning of the year. And then I tried to basically bring it back by focusing on what you guys said, intensity, volume, and sets. And I just started with bands and I literally just tried to do like a, um, a very rough, like maps 15 of what you guys just like basically doing upper and lower body of just using bands. And like, I can't even recover from that. And I just, it kind of sucks just like walking all day because I don't want to be walking for the rest of the year. It's just like, and I try to do mobility.

I try to do some mobility, but it's, it's getting to a point where I want to do, I, I know I shouldn't be doing more, but for example, like my shoulder gets, my shoulder gets cranky and then my hips get cranky, so it's to the point where it feels like I'm just basically mobilizing them. I'd rather be strengthening them, so I don't have to, I don't wanna be mobilizing all the time either. It's kind of like, it's that kind of thing, if that makes sense.

No, I'm just like, it's just like, oh. Interesting, the bands are even getting them that sort. Yeah, this sounds, yeah, there's definitely something happening. Yeah. Especially for somebody your age, you're young, you've had a fitness background. 100% would work with a functional medicine practitioner.

That's 100% the direction I would go to see if they could start to identify some of the areas that need help. And they're the best people for the job. For something like what you're saying, that's where I would go a hundred percent. And I would just say, okay, let's see what this, and it can be a long process of work. I know this might be too hard of a question, but what do you suggest? Just obviously nothing intense training,

but is that a functional medicine question or is there anything I can do besides walking so I don't feel, I don't always feel horrible with my shoulder or my hips or anything without knowing I know that might be too hard of a question. It's not a hard question it's just that we know what the functional they're gonna tell you they're gonna tell you to get to heal yourself first before especially if you did a like it sounds like you did a pretty good job of of regressing all the way down to something like maps 15 and then doing advance. Yeah. If you've regressed that low and that still sending you in these like prolonged

periods of sore and chronic, like that's not a good sign. Have you been tested? Have you been, I'm sure you have, but have you been tested for thyroid antibodies? I'm pretty sure I, um, thyroid's I want to say yes. Antibodies I'm not a hundred percent, but I'm, I, I, I want to, I want to guess without looking at the blood work. Yes. Because at the male clinic, I just, yeah,

they basically did all types of tests that they can get there. That they, they basically did everything that, that I can get my hands on. So, okay. Yeah. Let's go functional let's go functional medicine go functional medicine yeah take it there and they're gonna look at the whole picture and again in my experience they're they're pretty successful and that's and it's it's amazing considering the people they work with are typically people like you who have been like I've been every doctor I don't know too they're almost never

almost never do people go to a functional medicine practitioner first. It's always the fourth or fifth choice. So they deal with really tough cases. So that would be the place I'd go for sure. All right, thanks guys. Yeah. Brian, follow up with us.

I really would like, yeah, after you see Cabral, I would really like to hear, for us, I'm just curious of what it is. So when you get to the bottom of it, please loop us in. Yeah, no, I appreciate you guys always following up with people. I'm watching your videos, Adam. I'm jealous.

All right. I'm glad that you're working back to where you were. Yeah. I was going to originally tell you to watch that, but then when I heard you say that you were going to watch it. I know. Some days I'm watching it, and then some days I try to put it off. It's, it's, it sucks.

Not bad. I can only, I can only imagine bro. Brian, any, any, any strange symptoms? I mean, besides like can't recover fatigue energy, like any strange symptoms like neuropathy? I don't know if it's strange, but I just try to keep things simple. And like with my recovery, like my grip strength, even doing bands, it's just like to the point where I know I shouldn't be doing it. But when I even do bands, like my hands, like they turned discolored, like purple

because of lack of blood flow and just like, and my knuckles basically, if, if I don't, if I try to do any type of exercise and I know I don't recover, they start turning like red and just, it's just like my grip strength is and the color of my knuckles just is not normal. So you've been tested for Raynaud's disease? I want I'm writing it down I I'm pretty sure maybe that came up on my Google search. Yeah. Not they did but I'll put that on my notes. Did you get an MRI to test your your central nervous system for any autoimmune issues like MS? Yeah, they did like a CAT scan MRI. Okay, okay. Alright, good. Or like everything like a neurologist. I'm not sure what you said.

I've seen like every type of neurologist. That's good. Well, that's good. I'm glad they ruled that out because that'd be scary. But okay, functional medicine. Yeah. I go functional medicine for sure. It sounds nervous system related. If you're noticing discoloration in your hands, sounds. But the nervous system's interesting. It can react and respond to a lot of different things, including not just nutrient deficiencies,

but sometimes toxic levels of nutrients, or heavy metal toxicity and stuff like that so sometimes it could be something strange like I had a client once who had all these really strange symptoms and it turned out she she had some toxicity from of all things B vitamins which are water-soluble but it took so long for her to figure it out so yeah functional medicine practitioners they look at everything. Definitely go there.

OK, great. Yeah, Brian. Your case is really interesting, bro. Please keep us in the loop. I want to help you get to the bottom of this, man. Yeah, thanks. I appreciate it. All right, Brian.

You got it, brother. All right, have a good week. You too, man. I hate that. Yeah, that's a fucking tough one, dude. As soon as he said, like I was literally gonna push him in the direction of the docu-series, and as soon as he said he reduced all the way

to a Maps 15 with bands, and he was that sore from that, that's like super regrettable. And then the discoloration in his hands. Yeah, Raynaud's disease is typically what causes that, but not always, but it is interesting. What's the ones where your limbs get like really cold and the blood flow doesn't get to it really cool? What's that called?

That's not rain hours. No, but yeah, the discoloration, the purple coloration of the hands and stuff can also cause that kind of tingling and coldness. Yeah. And I'm glad they did an MRI on them because some pretty scary alder-amine issues that can cause some of that stuff.

So that's cool that they ruled that out. So I'm interested, and I'm wondering if there's some kind of toxicity. You know, oftentimes, sometimes, I mean, I've had a couple, not a lot, it's not a lot, okay, to be honest, but I have a couple clients that have these really weird symptoms. And then they finally did something,

and they're like, oh, I have mold toxicity. You know, and it's like, nobody tested for that. Nobody tested for that until they got to the functional medicine practitioner. Our next caller is Chris from Canada. Chris what's up man? What's up Chris? Hey guys how are all you doing? Good good. We're good man. Good thanks for having me on I really appreciate it. You got it how can we help you? Good I'll just start off by saying I've been watching you guys for probably about a year now. Glad I stumbled

onto your podcast and really appreciate your common sense, no BS approach to everything. It's really resonated with me over the past year and I've learned a lot. Awesome. Yeah, you're welcome. Okay, so what can we help? What can you help out with? You could help out with a lot. But I sent in a summary about a month ago now, I think at the beginning of September. So I'll just go over quick bio. I'm 43 years old, five, nine and a half, weighing in at about 180, 181 today.

I had an in-body scan, found a place that does them for a reasonable price. Back at the beginning of September, sitting at 21.6% body fat. Been training consistently past year and a half, probably the best of my life before that. It was always kind of an on and off thing, never strung together, you know, good amount of consistency. So I did that. Everything's going well with the consistency part of training. For the first year, I didn't focus too much on the nutrition side.

It was just nailing down the consistency of getting to the gym and training, weight lifting. I get in about two to three full body workouts per week. A couple of half-hour sessions of cardio. Last four months that trend has continued two to three full body workouts and I've been doing that for the past few cardio. Last four months that trend has continued

two to three full body workouts, 8500 average daily step count and a couple of sessions of cardio. My first question really centers around the caloric intake.

I decided to start really focusing on that in May. The first thing I did was cut out the nighttime junk food. That was always my kind of Achilles heel there. You know, the sweets, chocolate and chips. So I did that quite well, and I was surprised to see that the scale wasn't moving.

I think I might heed Adam's advice and ditch the scale because admittedly I became a little too obsessed with multiple weigh-ins. But I decided to finally start tracking calories at the beginning of August. And I think I did make a mistake because at the same time, I also decided to start trying to cut. But the goal I have in my mind now is hitting 175. But most importantly is getting down to maybe 18% body fat from 21.6. So, you know, more importantly would be the body fat goal. So when I started tracking, I kind of got it in my mind that maybe about 2500 was my maintenance. So I started at 2000 and Kind of made my life a little miserable. I was my hunger was ravenous

Sleep not so good Performance in the gym in my some in my summary, I said it was significantly impaired but I wouldn't say significantly but it was certainly impaired and even when I bumped up to say twenty four hundred I was still kind of feeling lethargic I haven't tracked for the last couple weeks because I'm going to Hawaii next week. Yeehaw. But just looking for some advice for when I get back, what you think in terms of, you know, putting my head down and trying to cut or continue a cut or spending another month to track and find that true maintenance or perhaps a reverse diet,

maybe, you know, set $2,500 or, you know, go up to $2,627 or just find that kind of sweet spot for everything. What do you think, guys? Yeah, Chris, I like the idea of trying to find the Goldilocks zone or the sweet spot that you're alluding to. I think that you picked up on it pretty well, that your body was telling you, hey, this is not enough calories. I need more for the work that I'm doing.

I think actually what you originally did by just cutting out the sweets was probably a really nice spot to be. You probably reduce calories naturally just by cutting out the junk at nighttime, but yet still giving yourself enough of what the body needs. I think when you actually went into the cut was what you did was you just kind of over corrected on that and went too far too fast. And you probably could have just hovered right around that whatever that calorie intake was

when you were just cutting out sweets. And so what I would do before you actually commit to a number, when you get back from Hawaii is just say, you know what I'm going to do is I'm just going to eat when I'm hungry, but I'm going to make good choices. I'm going to eat whole foods. I'm going to go after my protein. Let's see where my body, where my calories kind of land by doing that, by listening to the body's natural signals of hunger feeding it, but just making good choices Seeing where that kind of lands and then also kind of how you feel after a week or two of sitting at that number And then we would go from there and if it's

Really high like 3,000 plus. Okay. Well, then we could probably cut down to like 2,800 or something like that But what you might find is it might just kind of hover right around 26 to 27 2800 calories Which is probably a nice place where you can build some muscle and lose some body fat And then I would tell you to hover around there And and then maybe talk about our programming It's you wouldn't were you running when you when this all happened this last time what program of ours? I I have ran anabolic twice. Uh, admittedly, uh, I didn't get the trigger sessions in,

so I probably left something on the table there. Uh, so certainly when I get to my next, uh, programs, uh, you know, I'll incorporate those. Uh, that was the, uh, part two, or the second question is I've got performance and aesthetic bundle. I think I purchased what's called the sexy mod bundle from Margaret a couple months ago. I've just put those in the queue

until after I get back from Hawaii. So that was performance. I would back from Hawaii. So that was performance. I would do performance next. And you know the mistake you made was guessing what your caloric intake should be or guessing what your maintenance was. Nobody ever knows. It's like even if I try to guess I'm always off. So I mean what Adam said is perfect. And then track. Track what that does and then you'll get an idea of where your maintenance is and then you can make a decision if you want to bumper or draw. But I think if you stayed right around maintenance and hit your protein

targets with whole natural foods and followed performance, I think I'm pretty confident what you would see is this nice progression of muscle gain with some fat loss at the same time and that's a nice place to be. Chris are you watching the docu-series I'm doing right now? I caught your first session there. I haven't watched since then, but we'll certainly tune in, for sure. Yeah, throw that on on your plane ride, and watch that, and get caught up.

Because a lot of what you're kind of going through is you hear me kind of communicate that and work through this process on camera. So the steps I'm taking to find my caloric maintenance, what I'm focusing on at first, not making any crazy changes, not letting the scale get in my head. Like you literally all the stuff that we're talking about right now that you get to hear me kind of work that out through the process. So and I'm coming up on week four right now and we'll do my body fat test to see how we've done so far

but I think it'll be super beneficial where you're currently at your headspace and then taking the advice that we just gave you already. I think the combination of that and then following performance is going to be the road for you. Totally. Sounds good, sounds good. Yeah, I'll heed that advice. One thing that I'm happy with with the month that I track the calories I did hit, uh, I think my average was a 0.91 grams per pound for protein. Uh, was some of that would be way protein, uh, one or two scoops. So, uh, uh, yeah, that was just to supplement to make sure I hit those targets. So I'm happy with that. Uh, so I uh, yeah, that was just to supplement, to make sure I hit those targets. So I'm happy with that.

Uh, so I think, yeah, the main thing is just kind of letting go of the, letting go of that body fat and weight goal number. And, uh, yeah, just finding that sweet spot, right? You were on the right track. I think you just overcorrected. I think you really were heading down the right path. And then you, you probably got overzealous and decided to try and push more and do more and you didn't need to. And so yeah, I mean I saw already that because you listed in there what your protein was or else that would have been one of my first questions to make sure

that we're reducing body fat and hanging on that muscle. But you're doing good. I think you're doing really good. Get caught up on the docu-series. Are you in our private forum, Chris? I am not. Okay, I'm gonna have Doug hook you up and put you in there. So, and then when you get back from Hawaii and you get back on track, just check in with us. Let us know what it's looking like for you

and then we can help make adjustments if you need to. Sounds good, sounds good. I also, I guess that would be a second part of the, you're suggesting performance. Uh, and I was looking at that and it looks pretty, pretty interesting. I like the variety of exercises. Uh, I also did, uh, see a personal trainer at my gym, uh, just for an intake session. I haven't committed to anything, but it looks like he wants to put me on a, a five day PPL split. So I'm just kind of mulling over whether I, uh, you know,

want to do that. I more wanted, uh, you know, personal trainer just on form checks and stuff like that. Uh, Chris, how long have you been running through performance? How long have you been strength training consistently? Uh, yeah, coming up a year and a half now. If you have a trainer that tells you to lift five days a week then find another trainer. Yeah. Here's what's happening. They're trying to hit their session target for the week. That's just the truth and that's not really a good trainer. So yeah if I trained you I would train you two days a week and have you work out once on your own. That's just the truth. And that's not really a good trainer. So yeah, if I trained you,

I would train you two days a week and have you work out once on your own. That's what I would train you. Yeah. Yeah. My first trainer at that gym, he happens to be the owner of the gym and he just opened up another one. So he's a little too busy to keep me on.

He had me originally on a three day total body split, which worked well. But way better, way better, way better. Just so you know, though, Chris, part of why I saw I'm throwing you in the forum. One of the most popular ways to utilize that and get the value out of it is people will post their videos of them doing squats and stuff and we'll actually help you with cues. So, uh, I mean, you know, mean, obviously if you have a great trainer, we're always encouraging people to, if they can afford it, to have a coach or a trainer

in person, because it's invaluable. But, I mean, we do a pretty good job of helping people out in the forum when they post up videos. And there's a lot of other, you got Dr. Brink in there, Dr. Jordan Shallow in there, you have us in there, so you get a lot of really intelligent coaches and trainers that are helping so it's a great community to be a part of so Hopefully you'll get that from just being in there alone. So hopefully that makes for to seeing you in there, man Yeah, yeah perfect. I love that definitely will utilize it and I had a feeling that would be your nutritional advice

and I appreciate that and I'm sure my family members will appreciate that too because admittedly at the low calories, you know, just wasn't the most enjoyable father or husband there. Thanks Chris, have fun in Hawaii. Yeah, yeah, keep us posted Chris, we'll see you in the forum. Thanks guys, enjoy your day. You too.

All right. Yeah, two points to highlight here. One, don't try to guess what would be a deficit for you because you have no idea. And there's a radical difference between individuals. You gotta track and then figure it out and then go from there. Otherwise, you're gonna be off.

You're always off. I've never met anybody that hit it. Otherwise, you're gonna be off. You're always off. I've never met anybody that hit it on the nose. Nobody just knows off the top of their head. The second point, if you're a trainer watching this and somebody hires you, unless they're an advanced bodybuilder, don't encourage them to hire you five sessions a week. And that's bad for the clients, also bad for your business. If somebody actually pays to train with you five days a week, and that's bad for the clients, also bad for your business. If somebody actually pays to train with you five days a week, the odds that they'll stay with you for longer than a few months is zero,

because the cost is to the roof, and they're gonna burn out. And people don't work out five days a week consistently, strength training, unless they're super advanced fanatics. And most people who hire you are not those people. So stop running. What a crazy difference right there,

the two people that he had. That's right. The owner, who's probably very experienced, versus some new trainer who's trying to hype him up. Look, if you love our show, come find us on Instagram. Justin is at Mind Pump Justin. I'm at Mind Pump DeStefano, and Adam's at Mind Pump Adam. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump.

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