Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2541: This Strength Building Technique Activates More Muscle Fibers... & You're Probably Not Using It (Listener Live Coaching)

Episode Date: February 26, 2025

In this episode of Quah (Q & A), Sal, Adam & Justin coach three Pump Heads via Zoom. Mind Pump Fit Tip: Here is the ONE strength-building technique NONE of you are doing that is killing your progress. (2:27) The most important thing to consider when training your kids. (18:53) Turbocharge collagen production in your skin with red-light therapy. (27:40) Cluster vs. traditional sets. (29:17) Shout out to Ben Bruno! (33:32) Adam has a gift for numbers. (35:23) Look out for parasites! (38:10) The grossest thing you have dealt with as a parent. (41:14) The ultimate scam artist. (47:29) GHK-Cu benefits the skin. (50:55) #ListenerLive question #1 – Are my workouts too long? I am averaging 2 hours. (54:04) #ListenerLive question #2 – You guys always talk about ‘muscle memory’. Is there ‘fat’ memory? Would that explain weight gain and how easily people gain weight back? (1:06:51) #ListenerLive question #3 – How would you help someone lose over 100lbs and get absolutely jacked? (1:14:39) Related Links/Products Mentioned Ask a question to Mind Pump, live! Email: [e-mail] Visit Joovv for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Code MINDPUMP to get $50 off your first purchase. ** Visit Luminose by Entera for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Promo code MPM at checkout for 10% off their order or 10% off their first month of a subscribe-and-save. ** Mind Pump Group Coaching February Promotion: MAPS Anabolic & No B.S. 6-Pack ** We are offering them both for the low price of $59.99, which is a savings of $114! ** Cluster sets and traditional sets elicit similar muscular hypertrophy: a volume and effort-matched study in resistance-trained individuals Ben Bruno trainer post "Scamanda": All About the Viral Cancer Scammer Saga Visit Paleovalley for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Discount is now automatically applied at checkout 15% off your first order! ** Train the Trainer Webinar Series Mind Pump #1142: Nine Signs You are Overtraining Mind Pump #1297: 3 Ways to Know If Your Workout Is Not Right for You Mind Pump #1695: How to Lose 100 Pounds Mind Pump #2385: Five Reasons Why You Should Hire a Trainer Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources People Mentioned Brad Schoenfeld, PhD (@bradschoenfeldphd) Instagram Ben Bruno (@benbrunotraining) Instagram  

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind pump with your hosts, Sal DiStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded fitness, health, and entertainment podcast. You guessed it, this is mind pump. In today's episode, we had people call in. We got to help them on air. We coached them on air, but this was after the intro. In the intro, we talked about fitness, science, nutrition,

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If you're trying to get back into shape, if you were in shape before, got out of shape, get back into shape, we're looking for a group of people who want to get coached by a mind pump trainer and by us. We're gonna pop in as well. Go to mindpumpgroupcoaching.com, sign yourself up if there's any space available. Finally there's three days left for our maps sale maps anabolic and the no BS six-pack formula combined $59.99 that saves you a hundred and fourteen dollars if you want to do it and you should go to maps february.com All right here comes a show It's t-shirt time ah

Shit, you know it's my favorite time of the week. One winner this week for Apple Podcasts, that is Scotty C. Scotty, send the name I just read to iTunes at mindpumpmedia.com. Include your shirt size and your shipping address, and we'll get that shirt right out to you. And again, if you want to have a very good chance of winning a t-shirt, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts or on Facebook, and you could be picked. The vast majority of you are killing your gains.

You're not reaching your full potential because you're not doing this one strength building technique that has been proven, dramatically improve your strength, build muscle, activate more muscle fibers. What is it? Isometrics. You gotta do those.

We'll start with the first thing that I just said, which is the data shows that isometrics, in particular, overcoming isometrics, it's a type of isometric, activates more muscle fibers within a muscle than any other type of strength training technique. It's so effective at activating. So effective, so powerful.

So whenever you're exercising, or you're strength training I should say, part of the goal is to activate more muscle fibers. This is one of the factors, not the only factor, it's one of the factors that determines, well, how much muscle and strength am I gonna build? And the more muscle fibers you can recruit, the more effective you're making the exercise.

And more advanced lifters are able to do this more effectively. Somebody who's been working out for 10 years can activate more muscle fibers than somebody who just got started. So it's a technique you can learn and grow with over time. You can build the skill. But if you really want to activate the most muscle fibers,

like isometrics does this better than lifting heavy, better than lifting light, better than eccentric contractions, which is when you lower the weight, or concentric, where you raise the weight. Just holding steady and driving into something, or pulling into something, or squatting into something that doesn't move,

that'll activate the most muscle fibers. Well, you guys know what an evangelist I've been forever since we started the podcast, but I'm trying to highlight this as well in the series I'm doing right now, because the pursuit is like a PR, it's a strength goal. And so to even get my body to respond again at that high level, to be able to start really working

on the recruitment of it, like I really have to summon as many muscle fibers as possible. The only way for me to do that in a safe, effective way is through these types of isometrics. Yes, yes. I saw you training that way the other day, getting ready for your lifts. Be really interesting for people to watch

as you progress through that. Why do you think it's not as popular? Great question. I'm so glad you asked that, Adam, because I was just asked this on a recent podcast that I was on. I can answer that too. Yeah, I know you'll know the answer.

So what's crazy is isometrics were extremely popular with strength athletes way back in the day. It was like one of the preferred ways of exercise. Back when strength athletes or even bodybuilders had to show what they could lift. Back in the day, it was great looking muscular, but you also had to perform. And the way that these bodybuilders,

at the turn of the century, or the previous century, I should say, the way that they made money was they competed. They would go on a stage and see who could lift the most weight. And so, isometrics, one of their favorite forms of exercise. Isometrics are done in other strength sports quite a bit, but they're not as popular because they don't look cool. Like if I film myself doing an isometric,

what am I doing? I'm not moving. It's not nearly as cool or awesome or fun to look at, so it just doesn't sell as much as me lifting away. But it is. Is that really the theory? Yeah, that's not just the theory, it's a fact. Yeah, I mean, if you're trying to talk

about the general population and what you see in the gyms, if you just look at that as a big pie chart, even just performance in general is going to be this tiny sliver. And I noticed this because of what I'm passionate about is totally not popular. So now you're taking that. On top of that, you get is isometrics which is like you don't

get any glorified videos showing this to where it looks exciting and people don't really understand the value of it to the degree because they're not trying, I guess, like the pursuits towards having like these PRs and strength goals. I don't think that a lot of people are actually pursuing it. I don't know if I agree of people are actually pursuing it. You know, I don't know if I agree with that. I think it has to be like just a lack of education because the things, the stupid things that people do in the fitness space to gain the competitive edge

or get a little bit better is that they don't all, I mean, come on, you have men wearing corsets to get their waist down an inch. You have dudes lugging around an e-stim machine this big, sticking a bunch of things on themselves while they work out in order to get this much more. They're considered hypertrophy. This much more out of training and stuff like that.

So why, why? No, no, you're right, Adam. You're absolutely right. But the way, the reason why we're here, the reason why there's so little education or so little discussion around isometrics is because it doesn't look as cool. It's harder to sell.

So it fell out of favor and people forgot about them. But if you look at the data, there's a lot of data. There's a lot of studies on isometric contraction training. When they compare it to others, the curve is faster, right? The gains come on faster on isometrics. They're fast and furious in a very short period of time. Now you'll plateau faster, by the way. You'll plateau, yeah. You'll plateau faster with isometrics, but that initial strength gain is ridiculous. And an isometric should not be used alone. That's the thing. If you

use them in a routine, it's like you're adding, you're going to add jet fuel to your current routine is what's going to happen. And to do it in the very beginning makes the most sense because it's so much less damaging and so you can recover quickly from it. And you're, I mean you're really just priming your body for more force production. I mean I guess you're right because, and I remember arguing this when we were building

map symmetry, I don't remember which one of you wanted to do like a full phase of isometrics. And't remember which one of you wanted to do like a full phase of isometric. And I'm like, bro, you can't do that. People will people will be bored to death. I don't care if it gives you better results than anything else, people won't stick with it. And so I couldn't argue against that because I totally, you know, just training clients like I see that it gets yeah it gets you know mundane. So that so to I see that. It gets, yeah, it gets, you know, mundane. So that, so to me, that's the, the secret sauce is as a, if you're a trainer listening is because

you know the benefits is, is learning to integrate it into your regular training. That way you, because at the end of the day, you have to appease the client too. Like you, like the end of the day, like your client has to show back up. You got to be able to help them. It's like, and I don't care if isometrics are the best, because in a perfect world, if you think about it, based off the way the research points, it would make sense that almost all programs, when someone's getting back into the gym or getting started for the first time, should look very isometric based to begin up. It's the safest, brings on the most gains, less likely probably to overreach too.

I mean, you could still overreach to an icebreaker. You could tax your CNS, but still you're gonna recover. No, no, so here's the deal. So to be clear, a just isometric routine is applicable for a small segment of population, like injury, when we're looking at risk assessment. The way isometrics should be used for most people is in conjunction or to supplement or to turbocharge their current routine. That's how you use

isometrics. And strength athletes who compete in sports where they have to, by the way, actually not even, no I'm gonna take it back, all strength sports including bodybuilding where you just pose, they all use isometrics. Body builders use isometrics. They practice posing. Posing is isometrics. And bodybuilders will tell you, posing after your workout, Arnold used to talk about this all the time, that posing after his workout brought out,

he would say more definition, more muscle control. Power lifters have used isometrics forever. They use yielding isometrics quite a bit. Yielding isometrics are like, I lower a weight and I hold it. They're holding it, yeah. Overcoming isometrics would be me pushing against something that can't move. Yeahrics quite a bit. Yielding isometrics are like, I lower a weight and I hold it. You're holding it, yeah. Overcoming isometrics would be me pushing against something that can't move.

Yeah, like a wall. Yeah, that activates more muscle fibers, yielding a little bit less, but both of them extremely valuable. And all the strength, Olympic lifters use isometrics. I mean, of course, the top of all of their Olympic lifts is a very strong isometric, where they're holding that position.

Well, and I love the yielding because for me, it's like, whenever you see a weight and it looks intimidating, just to be able to hold it and acclimate to it, there's a lot of value in that. Yes, in fact, starting your workout with isometrics is a great way to work out always. So whatever your workout is doing, if you added a couple sets of isometrics

before you did your lifts, the rest of your lifts will be more effective. That's like a very easy, basic, general way to add isometrics in your training. You know, this supports the a little bit, right? Even though I know we're not, I'm not a fan of it because I think it can also cause poor recruitment patterns and is not ideal. But I mean, this is probably why a lot of the bros continue to work out with your training partner where you had the overcoming isometrics where you give them 315 on the bench press

even though he can, they just, ah, grinding weight on it because they probably saw results. They probably saw gains. Well you said you did that, right? Didn't you say that's the way how to do that? Oh yeah, that's how, I mean that was both squatting and bench pressing. This is early, I'm like 20, I'm 21, 22 maybe,

at the early, or 22 at the latest. And I was training with some old school dudes that were much older than me that took me under their wing and I just was following their routine. And I remember he's like getting me to squat and I'm just like at that at that point where I could like squat a plate that's it you know I'm saying it was put 315 on I'm like I've never seen two plates dog it'll be fine don't worry I got you right and they get behind me and say the for the bench press like at that time it was he just had you hold the weight yeah but I mean yeah he's supporting me right he just wanted

me to feel that was what he kept telling me was this, you just need to feel it. Your body needs to feel the weight. It'll acclimate. He didn't have the science to explain it. Yeah, yeah, it'll get acclimated, you know what I'm saying? I mean, and it did kind of make sense theoretically, like okay, I guess you're right,

like if I've never felt anything close to that, if I can get comfortable with just- Yeah, the shock of it. Right, if I can just get over that fear, then when I go down to 225 to 25 will feel so much There's an old piece of exercise equipment that Bruce Lee used to use and you can still find this It's literally a it's like a board with two chains and then a bar Yeah, and you would stand on old McKee Jim had it did you okay?

And you would do these isometrics on it and Bruce Lee was a huge fan of isometrics And you were talking about how much it contributed to his ability to generate force. You just lower it down with the links. You lower the links, yes, yes. You could get underneath it, you could pull it, whatever. The other part of isometrics that are great is you can do them frequently. Because you don't get sore from isometrics,

like you do other type of muscle contractions, it doesn't cause as much damage. It's still a stress on the body, but not as stressful as a traditional exercise, you can do them often. So if you're looking at your routine and you wanna add a little more to get better results, because sometimes that's challenging.

Okay, if I add more, am I gonna do more than my body's gonna be able to adapt to? What do I do? Start with isometrics. You could do these at home. You could do isometrics at home, add 15 minutes of it every single day to your routine, and you've added something that's probably for, for many people

going to significantly improve their strength and muscle gain and not really compromise the recovery. It's one of those tools that is powerful yet, uh, not as damaging. And that's valuable. It's very valuable when you're trying to program your workout, or if you're a trainer or coach trying to add thing to your clients routine without stressing them or stressing their bodies too much. So from the audience that cares about this, some people won't care about this, but

there's gotta be some percentage that care about their calves. This was like, and I noticed a difference when I'm doing this and when I'm not doing this. That happened to be not in one of the times of doing this right now, and I can tell. Just, I do isometric calf holds in the shower. And that's all I do. Just- You think you're showering your toes?

Yes. I swear to God. And I swear to God, when I do that every morning in the shower, and that's all I'm doing, just that alone, I see a significant difference in my calf. Just that alone by itself. Yeah. You know, nothing else, just at least doing that.

And I mean, again, it's not gonna grow world-class calves, but if you're somebody who is looking for a little bit more from your calves, you're in the shower already. It's not hard. I also think there's a little bit of stability in there too. It's good for ankles, strength and mobility. So there's other benefits. That's kinda like how I justify it.

And I would do that, and I notice a big difference. The other thing about isometrics which this is very rarely will you see this combination with a strength training or exercise technique and a combination of extreme effectiveness but also mirrored with a very low risk of injury. Usually the more effective something is the risk of injury. Usually the more effective something is, the risk of injury, goes up too. The skill required to perform it starts to come up as well. Like some of the best exercises

typically require the most skill. And they typically come with a high risk of injury because the skill required to do them is so, there's so much skill required. Isometrics require very little skill. You're not moving. It's the safest muscle contraction you can do. Now, can you hurt yourself doing isometric? Of course. Yeah.

But you're far less likely. So this is a form of exercise that you can do when you're injured, when you're rehabbing. So this is the best strength training technique for rehabbing an injury. And it's excellent for people who are deconditioned. This is how I would, many, many times, I would do isometrics with my advanced-age clients because it was so safe. And the strength gains would be so, like we said earlier, so fast and so furious.

Yeah, it's awesome. I mean, the only other comparable thing in terms of safety and having a lot of return from it is a sled or something that's all concent concentric then you can get rid of at any time it's not anything you need to stabilize it's not anything that you know is is gonna give you those forces back where you have to slow it down so and then you can do that with like throwing something or you know so there's there's some other ways to, but there's not a lot of options

where it's like, you can get that much return for the safety and the risk being low. This is also, I mean, for that reason, this is great for rehab purposes. Oh yeah. 100%. So when you have somebody who is, you know, and you're trying to wonder like, Oh, is it too early to really start the rehab? I mean, you start them in the isometric place. This is the safest, smartest place.

I mean, just when I went through that injury with my pack, like that was like the isometric place. This is the safest, smartest place. I mean, just when I went through that injury with my pec, like that was, like the isometrics were the first things that I was already practicing right away. Even when I was probably too early to start the rehab process, I could at least start creating contraction in there and recruiting there so you can start to get some sort of development

or at least slow down the atrophy part. That's right. What's also cool about them is that you can do them anywhere. They require very, very little equipment. It's super versatile. You don't need much to do it, which makes it something you can practice frequently. And again, practicing these frequently because they don't cause lots of damage, it's an incredible addition to almost any routine.

I mean, I'm going to say it very clear. Most people, if you start to apply isometrics to your routine, you're going to add a grand apply isometrics to your routine, you're gonna add a grand total of 10 minutes to your workout, but you're probably gonna get a 10% or more improvement in your results, which very few things you can do for 10 minutes will give you that much of an improvement. It's pretty remarkable. And by the way, do them at the beginning of your workout if you really want to do them best. And then here's something for people with home gyms.

I had a friend of mine who did this and I'm thinking about doing this myself. He was super, super into strength training. He was like a student of the game. When I say he lived in my old neighborhood. And what he did is he bolted, what are those ring bolts called that you put? Eye bolts.

He put two eye bolts deep into the concrete and then he attached chains to it and he would put the chains on a bar and he could get underneath it with a bench and he could do overcoming isometric with a bench. He could do a deadlift on it, he could do a squat on it, an overhead press just by lengthening the chain,

getting the bar and pushing and it wouldn't move. I've drilled those into a platform before. Have you done that? Yeah. And then like I said, Bruce Lee used to use one. It looked like that. It was like a plank with chains and then like a bar. And what's funny is too, like strength athletes know this

as well, to use them too prior to trying to go for your max lift and to get that kind of recruitment at the highest point, but not to the point of fatigue. You let off and then you go perform, and it's like, all of a sudden, you've already summoned all these muscle fibers. You're ready to go. They're totally primed.

Yeah, it's pretty cool. Anyway, so I was having a conversation. I was on some other podcast recently, and the conversation started to revolve around exercise for kids. Because, well, I mean, we know obesity and poor health and chronic health conditions, it's affecting every age group, every single age group.

But it's probably saddest to see in children because children used to be a category that was untouched by chronic health issues. Well it's also sad because the way they got there is through learned behavior. It's like they didn't, most of them don't know better yet. You know what I'm saying? They ate what their parents fed them or allowed them to.

Yeah, that's what makes that so sad and difficult. It's very, very challenging. I remember when I first got my first certification in 1997 they had just changed the name of Adult onset diabetes to to type 2 diabetes It used to be called adult onset diabetes because adults got it and it was you develop diabetes through an unhealthy lifestyle they changed it to type two diabetes because they started seeing kids get it.

And now you still see this, you see this even more. So anyway, conversation was around children and the question was like, how do you train kids? How should kids exercise? How should I? And what I said to them, and I think this is important to communicate to our audience, because we have a lot of listeners who have children, the most important thing to consider

when it comes to exercise for your kids is not the programming, it's not the exercise itself, it's not even the technique. These are all important. I'm not saying those are important, but they're not the most important. The most important thing to consider is the relationship your child builds with exercise. Are they enjoying it? Yes. Because what you don't want to do, and I've seen this already, I've seen this in the fitness space with fitness fanatics and their kids,

they create such a poor relationship with exercising their kids, we've all seen this with sports, like the dad that forces their kid to play soccer or whatever and just makes them hate it so much they never want to do it again. The most important thing with your kids is that they enjoy it, so when you're doing exercise with your kids and they don't want to do what you're telling them to do it again. The most important thing with your kids is that they enjoy it. So when you're doing exercise with your kids and they don't want to do what you're telling them to do,

that's okay, make it fun. Because what you want is for them to have this, you want them to have this relationship to where when they grow up, they want to continue doing it. Versus they do the perfect routine but they hate it and you're forcing them to do it. Then they become a teenager, they rebel, and that's it. They don't want to do it anymore.

That's why I think some of the best advice is purely play. Yes. I mean, I think that, you know, my son's not a big athletic person. He's not into sports whatsoever. He showed little interest in me lifting here and there, but not really, but he's active. We wrestle, we run, we play, we do a lot of other things,

and he's physical, and he eats whole foods, and play, we do a lot of other things and he's, and he's physical and he eats whole foods and he doesn't need to strength train yet. And I don't even need to think about pushing it on him or talking about it to him. It's like, there'll come a time as he sees his mom and his dad do it very consistently inside our house. And so he gets to see it and be around it. But you know, he eats the foods we eat and he sees what we do on a basis that I don't even worry about this. Like, I mean, I don't even think it's not even a thought of like, oh,

when do I introduce this to him or what? It's like, no, at this point he's an active, but I can't understand why this has become such a big topic because I think a lot of that has to do with the processed foods that we're allowing our kids to eat and the iPads. It's the environment. If you allow these kids to sit on iPads for four hours and they're eating Cheetos, then yeah, even at four, five, six years old, you're going to start to see them put on excessive weight. But if they're eating whole foods and they're active, they're playing, I don't know a five-year-old that isn't attached to an iPad, that isn't running around the house and climbing and jumping on things and doing stuff. Even my son, who's not an athlete, he's not into sports, he's not into playing, but he's definitely jumping off the couch into the bean

bag, he's chasing me up and down the stairs, like they're active. And so, you know, the way I look at it is like, as long as we keep the nutrition, good choices around there, we don't ever allow him to You know sit on an iPad for extended period of time like they're they'll stay very healthy for a very long time And then I figure at one point He'll probably get in a junior high or high school and maybe then he'll be interested in sports and even if he's not Maybe then he might get interested in strength training and he'll come to me and he'll have seen his mom and dad creating these behaviors for so long that it'll be a very natural progression doesn't have to be this like forced relationship with you.

You talk about processed food if you go through your grocery store and you look at foods that are marketed and made for kids that is 95% processed food. Yeah. Like they're all and they're all extremely processed. Bright colored food dyes. And yes it does, and look I'm a parent, okay, I get it. It's a lot of work. Then the biggest struggle that you challenge with when you're challenged with when you feed your kids

is just like, they're not gonna eat it. Like, are they gonna eat it? They're not gonna eat it, you know, type of deal. So it's easy to give them something that they like and they'll eat. So I get that it's a challenge. And the food industry, it goes in that direction. Okay, we make foods that people will buy

and people buy things that are easy for their kids to eat or that they like, but here's why it's even worse for kids than it is for adults. Forget the fact that they're little and that it's terrible to see chronic health issues with children. Their brains are developing and they're hyperplastic much more than as an adult.

Our brains are still plastic, but there's plasticity in a child's brain that at a certain age you don't have anymore. If a kid learns four languages before a certain age, they'll have no accent in all of them. They'll speak all fluently. I can learn four languages and every single one's gonna have an English accent because I speak English.

And that's it, my brain is in its plastic. So what happens when a kid is exposed to frequently hyper-palatable engineered foods is their brain molds itself to these foods. It actually molds and shapes itself to this food to the point where there are gonna be permanent changes when they're an adult. Now they can change their heating habits and all that stuff,

but they'll have a pull towards hyperpalliability that they wouldn't have had had they not been exposed that will probably stay with them forever. It's like giving a kid drugs at a young age versus an adult using drugs or whatever. So both are bad, but for a child, it's totally different. The key to this, and I can't stress this enough to people that are listening that don't have kids yet,

or you're about to have a kid, the key is what you introduce and what is in your home initially. It's once you let the cat out of the bag, and how early you do that and how often you do that is what's going to set you up for success or failure. If you do a really good job of when that time comes when that kid is born at Whole Foods is all we have in the house and all we eat,

they won't know better. They won't know anything but that. And eventually they will get introduced and they will have friends. But what's cool is that if you've built that relationship with food for three, four, five years of consistently eating whole foods, they will have a good relationship with that stuff.

And it's, it's, it's so cool to watch that unfold now that my son is going to be six years old this year and he's got friends and he's had fruit snacks now and he's had candy now and he's had it all. My son's tried everything, but the relationship he has with it is a trip. And he knows it's so unique. He knows it's a big deal if he gets to even try it or have it because it's just not normally in our house. So when his friend comes

over and his friend's got fruit snacks and things like that, and I allow him to have it, sure, he allows it, but we don't go buy it. We don't go to the grocery store, but I also don't deprive him and say, no, you can't have that. Watch buy it. We don't go to the grocery store. But I also don't deprive him and say, no, you can't have that, watch your friend eat his fruit snacks and you can't. Of course not. But because we laid that foundation, it's a real easy thing to manage.

That's why the relationship part's so important because at some point they're gonna navigate the world on their own. So, you know, back to exercise, you want your kids to have this great memory and great experience with exercise so that they don't rebel against it or think of it as some negative thing as they get older.

So that's the most important thing, because that's a workout. And you have the ability to really create that environment that's inviting like that. And you're talking about just play, like wrestling, jumping, running, anything outside, experiencing, hikes, whatever it is that's active and fun and engaging and creates movement,

there's ways to construct that, even if you're limited on space. So I was looking up one of our partners, Juve, right? They do red light therapy. Do you know how soon people start to see changes in their skin after using? Immediately. It's like two or three sessions.

I was gonna say, I swear I noticed right after the first session. Two or three sessions, people will notice. The collagen, the way it stimulates collagen production is so remarkable. It's actually quite profound. It literally turbocharges collagen production in your skin and people will notice within two or three sessions.

Definitely by 10 sessions. By 10 sessions, people are like, oh, I noticed a big difference. I mean, I think that's what, I don't think it would have gained the traction in the legs had it not produced results that quick. Yeah. Yeah, if it took like a month or two.

Yeah, you know, I mean, that's one of the hardest reasons to sell fitness and exercise for people is because it takes time. Yeah. Because you know people took like a month or two. Yeah, you know, I mean that's that's one of the hardest reasons to sell fitness and exercise for people is because it takes time. Yeah. You know, if in two sessions I could show people dramatic change in their physique, everybody would do it. You know what I'm saying? It'll constantly be in their ear. It's coming. But yeah, I remember when we got we first got introduced to the JuveLight and I started using it and it's like it it's it's almost like you have this your skin has this glow and I noticed it right, I noticed it right, I think I noticed it right at the first session.

I'm pretty sure it was the first session, but I definitely can tell when I'm not using it and I go right after using it, you just have this kind of light glow to your skin. Can you find like a manly way to describe that? I'm at a loss. Yeah. I know what you're talking about,

and you know, I'm like, oh, it's like a baby's butt. Well, maybe that's, maybe just my complexionion glows I don't know what yours would do. Yours is fades. What does yours do? I don't know. I just go from radiant to translucent. I don't know any terms for that. I read a study the other day that I would love to so let's see if you guys can poke holes. The study itself isn't a problem, I'll pull it up. It's that.

Are we gonna talk about how fat you are today or no? No, what? We'll get there. Oh, sweet. Jesus Christ. Guys, I don't know how you're so good with numbers, dude. It's ridiculous how good you are with numbers. Okay, so this study, and I was kind of,

like I did a post about it and I was a dick and I took it down, because I'm like, I shouldn't be like, I shouldn't talk like that. But I read the study, I read the post and it's by Brad Schoenfeld, which I love. He's got great research. This dude's got some of the best research. I love his stuff, I absolutely love his stuff.

But sometimes these studies, many times, they give us good information, but then a trainer or a coach or a fitness influencer will try and take it and apply it and they start to miss the force for the tree. So I'll read you what he wrote, right? So they did a study comparing cluster sets to traditional sets for muscle hypertrophy.

So you guys know what a cluster set is, right? That's where you do so many reps, you wait 10 seconds, do more reps. I really like them. Okay, so here's what it says. Our new study showed similar increases in muscle thickness between cluster sets and traditional sets.

Okay, in other words, equal. Now here's the part where I'm like, okay. When total volume and intensity of effort were equated between conditions. Here's the deal. I don't know anybody who has ever done a cluster set and not dramatically increased the intensity. It never comes along with the same intensity as a traditional set. It's

always a intensity increase. Increase. This is why people will swear by cluster sets. It works so great. It ramps it up. So in a study they controlled that but in the real world nobody controls it. How would you control that? Perceived effort. So I think they're just like how important. You'd have to make the cluster set so light that it doesn't... Exactly. It doesn't... I mean, I don't know how they did it. One of the things that makes the cluster set so awesome...

The intensity. ...is you can grab a weight that you can't complete, say, 12 reps with, and you do these little sets of four, basically, and set it back down. And it allows you, in a short period of time, to do 20 reps of something you can never do 20 straight reps. So of course the intensity is going to increase and so if you had to match the intensity as the same as a straight set then you would defeat the purpose of why I do the cluster set. You would take super intense or something. Well you would have to yeah you need that to make the

straight set super intense to failure or beyond, or you would have to reduce the intensity in the cluster set so much that it almost defeats the purpose of doing the cluster set. Yeah, and it also doesn't take into account, so here's the real world, here's what happens in the real world when someone uses a cluster set. It's like where studies go bad, bro. Well, I like the study, but it doesn't apply to,

like in the real world, this isn't how they're used. So did you see like some trainer clowning on it? No, no, no, no, he just did this post, and then post and people are commenting underneath like oh all these variations don't mean anything just do traditional sets And I'm like we guys missed that you guys missed it said in the real world When cluster sets are applied there's usually almost always two factors that you see one Intensity is increased nobody does a cluster set and has the same intensity as before, it's always a way to increase intensity. So they're controlling intensity,

making me equal or equating them, that doesn't happen in the real world. Number two, a cluster set is almost always employed as a novel way of training. It's almost never the way I always train. It's almost always something I just added. This is also why, because what research says, if all sets, volume, intensity is all equated for,

that there is no difference in body part splits versus full body workouts. But why do we advocate for full body workouts? Because nobody hits a perfect week forever for a year. Just never happens. You end up missing days. You end up skipping muscle groups, and you're behind and now

you're playing catch-up. And your 15 sets in one workout don't look like the five sets you did on Monday, Wednesday, Friday, and full body workout. Yes, it's because you factor in human behavior, which is a huge piece to the puzzle. That's the biggest piece. So that's, I mean, I always get fired up when we, when people hang on to studies like this and they try and use that to support, I mean, to me it's always an example of somebody who's a new young trainer who's just all excited to learn all this beautiful. Buried in books and they're not out there doing it.

Yes, yes, yes. I agree. Speaking of that, no, speaking of that, I wanna shout out, we haven't shouted out somebody in a long time, so this, we'll call this kind of a shout out. Maybe our editing team can put this clip up. I shared it with you guys. I don't know if you watched it or not. Came across a trainer. I shared it with you guys. I don't know if you watched or not.

Came across the trainer. I'm familiar with him before. I've seen him before. And I'm so glad he popped to my feet again, because I like his stuff. I invited him on the show. He'll be coming on probably soon. Ben Bruno. Oh, yeah. He did a really good post of talking about like social media and trainers. You can tell just for 10 seconds in, like oh he's trained a lot of people. Yeah, I'll give it to the editing team so they can play the clip because I'll probably tear it up if I try and repeat exactly how I said it.

But very, very well said about what we're. Good page to follow. And to summarize it, it's just that we've got into this trap of click bait and that's why this came up right now. So what you're talking about is like to be controversial and counter stuff like that is what goes more viral. And if I do something that's controversial,

say a controversial statement, and then you come to my page and then my, they're all pictures of me looking sexy. Like I quickly can grow to be this massive trainer online. And so it adds, it gives credibility to these people that really don't belong there. Yeah, because you have a lot of followers, so he must know what they're talking about.

Exactly, oh, he looks fit, he must, he's dropping this, you know, counter this, and then he must, but meanwhile, the really, really good trainers are busy out applying science that we've known for a really long time that hasn't evolved and changed, and yeah, getting experience and helping people not very good at hacking algorithms

and getting click bait and stuff like that. And so, it's like such a true statement. I mean, I bet there's, I bet there is more good trainers that people don't know about than good trainers that you know about. So we're always looking for them. Yeah, give them the spotlight for a bit. Yeah, I'm glad you brought them up.

All right, you wanna talk about how fat I am now? Yeah. You know what's crazy? What's crazy is your ability to predict just numbers in general is so great. So you guessed my body fat at a certain percentage, so I brought calipers, so I'm like, there's no way that's my body fat percentage.

And you were like within point two. Yeah, because I didn't just guess a round number, I was like, ah, you're 7.8 to 8.5. Yeah, I thought for sure I was 10. I didn't think, because I'm heavy right now. So I'm like, there's no way I'm that lean. But you were right. She tested, or he tested me, Justin did, and it was, what was it, 7.5?

So it was right there. Yeah, I mean, the thing that I was, because I know you thought, you're like, oh, I'm not, you know, I'm thick right now, or I'm not as lean, I've been leaner, you've probably felt leaner, but you have so much more muscle. And that plays another role. And like, so I know when you got that much muscle, and I also, I've seen your physique enough times

and known when you're at 9% and 10% that I'm like, I bet he's leaner than what he thinks, just based off that alone. And yeah, sure as shit. I mean, and you're at such a cool place too. Like when was the last time you tracked in senior calories, you have any ideas? It was like when Sal's cold he's like 8.5.

I eat a lot, I eat a lot. I don't eat garbage but I do eat a lot. Well that's why you're so ripped and shredded is because you're eating a lot and you're eating good food. So that's a good example. And my wife is really good about cooking and preparing my meals for me and all that. And shout out to my wife, she just,

it really makes a big difference. Eating out definitely would make it more challenging. But I'm not trying, that's the crazy thing. I'm not really trying. So it's my metabolism is so high. Yeah, for sure. Well, you have like an unbelievable discipline around, but I mean, you've also talked about it,

like your gut has forced you into that place. You know what happened? How is that my way? It used to be real bad and you haven't even mentioned your gut in a long time. You know what, I got, I pushed it. You have moments where I see you testing it with stuff that I.

That I'm stupid, yeah, because I push it. The difference between my good gut health and bad gut health for me is about eight pounds of lean body mass. That's how big of a difference it makes. It's like eight pounds. And right now, my gut health is good. So, and I'm not going to mess with it. I'm not going to push it. Cause there was a moment that we got really good. Remember I got cocky and I was like, I was eating a cheeseburger. Oh yeah. You know, I could eat dairy again here. And then

threw it way off. I had to back way out. it. Now when that happens, how long till it resets and kind of goes back? Well, it took me probably two or three weeks. And are you, what's kind of, do you have like a protocol of all the things you, I know you always take the ziba, or not ziba, but take a seed and stuff like that, but is there anything that when that happens, do you like?

I just have to really, really stay away from foods that I know can cause intolerances. And if it gets really bad, I even have to really really stay away from foods that I know can cause intolerances and if it gets really bad I even have to be careful with starch so potatoes and even rice have to be careful with it. I was gonna ask you like Vicki actually mentioned this to me before I told you guys I've always had a problem grinding my teeth yeah and it's just like this weird thing that's like it's it feels like it's out of my control uh she's like, yeah, she had heard that there's a lot of associations with parasites, people that grind their teeth, and I was like, really, I gotta get on top of that.

You can buy, I'm not gonna say the site, because I don't know how we can, if we're getting in trouble for this, but you can buy an ivermectin-phenbendazole combo, and you can buy it online, and that- Horse grade? And that, no, no, it's capsule form. He needs horse grade. Doug knows, because him and I bought some. You can's capsule form and it'll kill any person

by the way there are some people that recommend I'm not saying this this is not me it's not my pump but some people who recommend that you should do some kind of a parasite cleanse once a year hmm based off of you they say if you eat sushi how many times it's almost guaranteed, right? If you eat sushi often, you probably have- I heard it's like 80% of the population walks around with parasites. At one point, I don't know what the data is.

Crazy stats. I don't know what that number is, but if you eat raw vegetables ever, which we eat salads and stuff like that, if you sexual contact, you can definitely pass parasites. So if your spouse has a parasite, you have a parasite. And the sushi. And so if you've never done a parasite treatment

and you're 30 years old, 40 years old, whatever, the odds are you might. You probably collected some. Yeah, dude. And then when you treat a parasite, here's what's crazy. You treat it, you'll take something, it'll kill the parasite, then you have to wait two weeks and then do it again because the eggs are there. So you'll take something, it'll kill the parasite, then you have to wait like two weeks, and then do it again, because the eggs are there.

So you'll kill off the parasite, and then two weeks later the eggs will hatch, and you gotta do it again. And you gotta treat it again. Really? Yeah, I'm just so mad. You're making a face like that's so gross. It is gross.

It sounds so disgusting, dude. Yeah, dude. So gross. Yeah, bro. I mean, I probably should too, just to see, you know what I'm saying, be interested. You for sure have parasites, man. We know what you do. They make you grouchy. I mean I probably should too just to see

What do you would you pull up there Doug yeah an estimated 60 million people in the US are chronically infected with Paris Well, that's chronically. That's not that's just chronically chronically a lot of people though Yeah, dude, so out of 350, right? So what is that? I think 320 so what percentage is that do the math Adam? I mean, it's like one fifth. Okay Decent percentage But I'll show you I'll show you where you. Is it, whew. Yeah, you're full of parasites. I believe it, dude. But I'll show you, I'll show you where you can buy it. I won't recommend it here, because you're not supposed to, whatever. But yeah, those are the common ones there, Doug.

Oh boy, I mean there's hookworm, I can't even tell you what these are. They have funny names. Was that the one that lowers your IQ? In the south? What's all the crazy names? Oh, Trichonomus Vaginalis. Justin has that one.

I definitely have that one. Justin definitely has that one. It's an STI. I think I ate that one. That's disgusting. Dude, did I tell you guys, I have to tell you, my daughter, my two-year-old daughter, she comes up to me. She walks up to me with her finger like this.

And she just, from across the room, ba-ba, ba-ba. Smell this. Ba-ba. And I'm like, what? And she goes, booger. I finger like this, and she's just like from across the room, ba-ba, ba-ba, ba-ba. And I'm like what? And she goes, booger. I'm like, oh, come on, come on. I had to like clean her finger. She does that like twice now.

So this is something we have to like untrain. You know when you train your kid to do something and then like it eventually like starts to backfire? So we trained Max like to blow his nose, like blow hard right? So we would teach him to do it. So now anytime he gets a runny nose he just starts blowing. He has no tissue, no nothing. And like you're like sprinting across the room and we get to Max, hold on! It's all hanging on. Yes. But it's our fault because we teach him blow, blow, if you got a blow and then we keep telling him that so now it's like as soon as he it. He just starts doing it. Yeah, what's the worst for you guys?

Cuz you do the farm as a parent you have to deal with poop Boogers and throw up and pee right? Those are the four gross. What's the grossest out of all? Every parents different, you know, like like like my wife if she gets poop anywhere. It's like, oh Like my wife, if she gets poop anywhere, it's like, oh, poop doesn't bother me. I don't care about poop. You know what's funny is I- The boogers and mucus, you get me out of the room. Yeah. I can't handle that.

I feel like since having my son, a lot of that has kind of changed, right? Like I do remember like the boogers thing being really tough for me, but I definitely know as a dad now, I'm like so normal, just grab it with my hand. Oh no, I can't do that with boogers. My bare hands, and throw it.

Pukes, close second. I wouldn't be able to do that, say five years ago. Look at just his face. I'm grabbing it with my bare hands. I wouldn't be able to do that, say five years ago, but I definitely have gotten that point with my son now where I'm like, that's, it's so natural. You played football where you guys were blow snot rockets. Oh, I do all the time. Yeah. I have some gross stories. I'm not even gonna bring up. Yeah. I don't know. For me, like, I, there was one big blowout, though, I could definitely remember, like, Everett had,

that when he was in his crib, and it was just like, it was all over the walls, it was like all, like, and I was just, I just walking into it, and you're just hitting the face with the smell. It was like, whoa, and I was by myself, because at that time, there was a good period where my wife was working nights as a nurse. And so I was like daddy, daycare every day.

Yeah. I imagine you and Doug probably had a different, a little bit different transition. So Sal and I are oldest, right? So I'm sure you did too, right? You probably got a little bit of practice on your younger siblings with being around them. So I would like changing diapers and all that stuff was not

foreign to me. But when you're like the, when you're the youngest son and boy and you guys don't have anybody, do you guys, was it all brand new to you? Yeah. Yeah. It was all brand new. Do you remember like, were you nervous, like some dad really nervous to like even hold the baby, really nervous, change a diaper. I take that back because so I used to work at camps a lot and I was like a camp counselor and I did like day camps and things like that through these churches and You know like you I was working with younger kids and she I was always like, you know 10 12 years old or something like that inside sometimes like

One of the only girls we can you come help me and I'm any you know Another set of hands the whole time like, oh God, like holding this dirty diaper. So I did have some exposure to it, but not like, I didn't have a younger sibling or anything. So yeah, I was pretty much just like horribly trying to figure it out. When you were- I had a buddy that was terrified of it.

Yeah, cause he's the youngest, all boys. Especially if you're a guy. Yeah, it's pretty common. You're not encouraged. It was, I know you're the same way, Adam. It was a super power for me with clients who had babies, because here I am, young man trainer, and they'd have, postpartum sometimes,

client would bring their baby in, and I was so comfortable with their baby. The baby would pee on me, I wouldn't trip out over it. And you know, I'm a guy, so they don't expect me to be like super chill. So it was always like, oh my God, he's the greatest or whatever, I love that. It's funny, it's some of my favorite memories though,

cause like my niece, when I went to the hospital to meet and she was just born and my brother handed her to me and like, oh, you know, sweetie, and then she just like pukes all over me. And I'll forever remember that, I'm gonna tell her that at her wedding. Infant puke is nothing though. Infant puke is just... But it almost went in my mouth.

It was... Oh my God. No. It was bad. I'm pretty sure I won over Katrina. That was probably, so I've talked about how... Played with babies and kids? No, no, no.

How her brother's like, I swear they didn't like me forever, right? And I think when we had Max, and then her family getting to see me with Max, I think changed a lot for their family. Because I had raised, yeah, and he was a preemie, right? So he was super tiny. And even at that age, I was not, I mean, I'd tuck him in my forearm and be doing dishes and be doing stuff like Katrina's resting and her family would be all looking at me all crazy like, dude, he's so comfortable with the baby and well when we were young we had my sister my two siblings were 10 12 years below

us and my mom had us watching the kids at a pretty young age so I got used to five but I look back now you know I'm saying well that was pretty young pretty young to be responsible for making them lunches like I think back to some of the stuff I'm like wait a second that was I'm doing the be responsible for him. You're like making him lunches. Oh, dude, dude. I think back to some of the stuff, I'm like, wait a second, that was, I'm doing the math. You know what I'm saying? When you're in it, you don't think about it. It wasn't until like therapy later, my therapist would tell me like,

you know that's not normal, right? You're only like 12 years old, you're watching an infant. My four year old, he'll cook his own scrambled egg. We'll watch him. Like, we'll watch him. I saw the video yesterday. Yeah, so he'll turn on the stove. So great. He'll crack the egg. I've seen him use a knife, everything. You guys got him, like we'll watch him. I saw the video yesterday. Yeah, so he'll turn on the stove. It's so great.

He'll crack the egg. I've seen him use a knife, everything. You guys got him doing all kinds of cool stuff. So yeah, Jessica will give him a butter knife to slice like zucchini and stuff. And he'll do everything on his own. He'll olive oil it, salt it, do the whole thing, all on his own, which is pretty cool.

When I was a kid, I wasn't allowed to touch any of that stuff. So I'm assuming, so is Jessica better with that than you? Because I know, like, Katrina would freak out if I let him do some stuff like that. You know, I... I let him do stuff and she's just like, what? No, I love it.

I absolutely love it. I let him plug in stuff in the plugs or the other day. Katrina's like, what are you doing? I'm like, yeah, yeah, he's fine. I teach him though, you know, I tell him. Like, listen, your finger touches that, it'll shock you, trust me, you don't want to do that. And so, but...

You're crazy. I trust him to do all kinds of stuff. The power saw. Oh yeah, yeah yeah, not quite the power saw. Don't put the fork in there. I wanna ask you, Justin, about Scamanda podcast. Thank you for bringing that up. Yeah, you got it, bro. It's been there forever.

You're like, what is Scamanda? And you've been itching to talk about it. And I'm like, so curious. So this was a conversation my youngest actually brought to me from school and they were kind of talking and I guess, well, so I had just read this article that there's this like Netflix series coming out, totally describing this lady, Amanda, who had scammed everybody that she had cancer. And this is totally like a goob expose.

Yeah, like you'd be all over this. But she was here. She's literally here in San Jose. And it was like doing this at a local church and was getting all these donations because she was claiming that she was going through treatments and all this kind of stuff. Dude, I was like, you want to talk about what's evil, that's evil. That's super evil, dude. And. I was like you want to talk about what's evil. That's evil Oh, that's where super evil dude inside like there's this whole podcast like dedicated to it and apparently Everett's one of his buddies like that was his she like worked at a school and that was like He went to that school knew her intimately. There's a Netflix series about it, isn't it? Yeah, it's coming out

Yeah, I saw the preview for it's not out though. Is it So she lied about having cancer so she could collect donations. So she could get money. That's sociopathic dude. It's so wrong. That's so messed up. I couldn't believe it. That's messed up for people who have cancer. You know what I mean? I feel like though people do stuff karma bites that, bites you in the ass bro. There's not a lot of people get away with that stuff. You get away with it temporarily but that comes around bro. I mean, whether you believe that or not, how spiritually, you know, the spiritual illness you must have to be okay doing that. Yeah. You know, because you're not just robbing people, which is already, you're already in a bad place, but you're also, you're asking for people through empathy and compassion. Listen, that's what I mean by-

Is it sociopath or is it psychopath? So it's like the one that doesn't feel any morality. Sociopath. Sociopath, yeah. That's what I mean by that too, is like maybe, and I truly believe this, I think it always happens. I don't think it's a maybe, it always happens. Whether something really bad happens back to her, the public or she's just internally tortured

for the rest of your life. Like you'll be tortured for that. And whether something bad happens to you or you now set the tortured for the rest of your life. Like you'll be tortured for that. And whether something bad happens to you or you now set the table for the rest of your life, no one trusts you, or internally. So it's like, no matter what, you're not getting away from that. You do something like that bad,

oh yeah, there it is right there. Oh what? I might know her. I know, that's why I brought her up. Because I was tripping out that she was local. Like almost like like Area yeah She went to a church I've been to before and like she was like

They brought her up on stage and she's asking for donations and I'm like wow the level and extent this lady went through With this scam is it's unreal. Oh my god. Yeah, that's familiar. That's weird. I know no, I don't know her. Okay So what they like What they like interviewing her afterwards to and like trying to get her to tell it she still was like kind of lying Like they did they did a whole like 60 seconds or whatever Her and they're trying to get her to tell the truth and she was still like yeah, you don't have any moral compass. I mean, I guess that's the fallback right? You just continue to lie Oh, that's what is it out? It's coming out soon. I think on netflix. That's really sad. Yeah, that is You know, i'm gonna i'm gonna take a left here I am seeing more and more articles on the peptide for skin called g h k c u

You're seeing this in really high end skincare products that are very hard to find. Maybe, Doug, you could type in GHKCU studies for skin. Really remarkable stuff. That's what's in the Intera, right? That's what's in Luminose by Intera, but there is 3% GHKCU. You don't find 3%.

That's pretty high, yeah. It's very high. The highest you'll find anywhere is.51, if you. You don't find 3%. That's pretty high, yeah. It's very high. The highest you'll find anywhere is.51, if you're lucky, there's 3%. I love that stuff. Yeah. It's incredible. So does Katrina.

Yeah, Doug, read that real quick. Yeah, studies on GHKCU for skin have shown promising results, indicating its potential to significantly improve the appearance of aging skin by reducing the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles, increasing skin density and thickness, and promoting collagen production through its antioxidant

and anti-inflammatory properties. So you think there's like uber rich people that just bathe in it? It's just. I would. If I could afford a whole bathtub of that stuff. Oh my God. Yeah.

Right? It's a million dollars worth of. Maybe that's LeBron's secret. I mean, there's gotta be somebody wealthy enough they can bathe in it. You can't tell me someone hasn't tried to do that. You're probably right. Yeah. You're probably right. I hope it's that. It's not, you know, the. So GHKCU is so powerful. Okay. That if you get a sunburn, so I know somebody who did this, they got a sunburn. They applied this on the sunburn. We should have Justin test this. It would be perfect. Yeah. For kids. Come summer. Tell them their commercial comes summertime. We're going to burn Justin. We're going to burn Justin really bad. I have that horrible farmer tan on my neck, dude. It's like my face and my neck. It's such a funny experiment. So he's like his face is all red

with the sunglasses. No, do a NASCAR to do a proper test burn the shit out of those what we'll do Justin will go out in the Sun get a summer on his face will only apply half of his face so we can see the difference between half of your we gotta do a cool design or something so I know somebody did this they got sunburn and it was not a good subvert It was a pretty bad sunburn and they put it on and the next day the next day the sunburn was gone Wow, like the next day it was gone. Okay. I'm definitely do it Who was it that we know that we were on virtual call with that talked about this? It was one of the representatives from from in terror. It was I remember talking about that. Yeah, it was Nick

Wasn't it? It was it was Nick. Oh, yeah talking about that. It was Nick wasn't it? I think it was. It was Nick because he's got skin like Justin. He's super pale like Justin. Same last name too basically. He's a Scottish guy. Is he Andrew? Andrew. A couple albino buddies huh? Paleo Valley makes the best meat sticks anywhere. Grass-fed, delicious, not dry. They're great. Go check them out. It's a great gut health friendly, clean protein snack on the go. Go to paleovalu.com forward slash mind pump. On that link you'll get 15% off. All right, back to the show. This segment of the podcast is brought to you

by trainerwebinar.com. Adam and I get on every other month and teach trainers and coaches how to be more effective and successful and it's free, trainerwebinar.com. Our first caller is Ron from Rhode Island. Ron, what's up, man? What's going on, Ron? How can we help you?

How you doing, Sal? Thanks for taking my call, I appreciate it. I work out from home, and I'm home at my home gym, so I really don't have anybody to kind of talk to and boss my ideas off, so I really appreciate it. Yeah, you got it. So, yeah, um, well, just want to get you real quick.

Um, I'm, I'm, I'm 5,400, uh, 5, 6, 165 pounds, um, been working out, um, on and off god since my, my, my, uh, my mid twenties, after I got out of the service. Um, you really kind of got back into it the last six years or so, and they've been very consistent the past year and a half um

It's just I I I do like um, I work out five days a week Uh three three days with waste two days the abs a little bit for um or routine there um Just seems like it'll take a little too long about it's what i'm about two hours in each day, which I mean I got a lot to do so so it doesn't bother me, but it's just, at times it kind of gets, it's tough to get motivated when you know you've got two hours of work ahead of you.

And at times I just feel like I'm spinning my wheels here. I had a couple of decks of scans, came in about 19% body fat, but in a nine month period, I gained about five pounds of muscle, which is about a half a pound per month, which I'm not that's good or bad for a guy my age or not. Had a couple of testosterone tests.

I came in at 687 and with the total and free at 91. I did one previous about two years prior and I actually increased my testosterone by like 34 points. I don't know if that means anything or not but any advice you have would be appreciated. Yeah, yeah you know on the surface if somebody said I strength train two hours five days a week, is that too much? Generally speaking, I would say yes.

Here's the problem with that. On an individual basis, I mean, it could really vary. You've been strength training for a long time. So what I would typically ask you is, why are you asking this question? Now you kind of told me a little bit in your question. You said you're finding it hard to get motivated and you're sometimes feeling like you're spinning your wheels.

So I think a better question to ask would be, would I get the same results if I worked out less, or would I get better results if I worked out less? Probably, you probably, if you cut it down to an hour, I don't think you'd see any slowdown in progress. I mean, five pounds of muscle in a year is pretty damn good. You're doing pretty well.

So if you cut it down to an hour, I don't think you would see a reduction in progress. You might actually see yourself progressing more, but really the only way to know that is to test it out and see for yourself. Yeah, I would love to put you on MAPS anabolic. The two days that you were kind of doing abs and form, you could still do that as your trigger days.

So in Maps Anabolic, we've got the three days a week plus two days or trigger sessions. And so you could follow that protocol, still do your kind of going to the gym or going in your garage working out five days a week, but it's a little more organized. It's probably gonna be, well, not probably, it is less volume than what I'm looking at right now with your program.

So I mean, I would love to let you follow that for three months and see what happens. And I bet you get as good of results, if not better with about half the work. I just feel like if I would miss out, like I, you know, I, I do the, uh, you know, the, the main primary compounds that are You know bench overhead and then I do some isolation I just feel like those isolation is so important that I wouldn't you know, I wouldn't want to kind of get rid of them You know, I just don't know where you know, that's why I asked me am I doing too many too many You know, I'll do one main like I, one main compound and then I'll add another isolation

to kind of help with some secondary stuff. I kind of like the routine I have, but I don't know. Yeah, well, I mean, if you really, because you're progressing, your testosterone's good, you're building muscle. Yeah. So I don't know if you're necessarily over training. I mean, if you're noticing like insomnia, excessive soreness and stiffness, if your

progress is going backwards, then you're probably overdoing it. But if you're slowly progressing, you feel good, you're probably okay. But so the real question is, can I do less and get the same results? If what you said was something you're really feeling, which is sometimes I don't wanna work out for two hours. In other words, you don't wanna work out for 12 hours. You probably don't have to, but are you over training? I'm not sure, I don't think so,

because you have been progressing. I saw something in there about your rest periods and you're worried that you're resting a bit too long. So is that what's extending it to two hours? Or, because I don't have a problem with you resting a long time. I think that's great. Especially if you're focused on building strength

in the compound lifts, if you're just focused on that and doing long rest periods in between, you should be, you know, gaining quite a bit of strength with that. But is that, is that what's trying to squeeze everything in with long rest periods? Well, I experimented with that, Justin. I actually cut it down to a minute and a half. And then the grand scheme of things, they really only cut like 10 minutes out of the

total time. So it's not like I'm rushed for time. That's not the thing. It's just kind of like, it's almost like a second job at times where, okay, now I know I got two hours to go out in my basement now to work out. Working off my passion, that's pretty much my main hobby. and And then it's like it's first spin on my wheels like I'm just not seeing like the huge games. I you know all this time putting in I kind of would have expected a bit more from this I'm coming up looking favorite out and it all kind of went to my gut

So I'm like, you know, that's a little disheartening there, too Well, yeah, that's that's just it. I think I think Sal said it well, which is you're I don't think you're necessarily over training And you can I don't think you're necessarily over training and you can I don't necessarily think you have to change this but I think you could I think you could do something like Maps anabolic which is about half the volume and I think you would see as good maybe even better results but so it really comes down to you and what you want to do if you if you really enjoy these long

two-hour workouts and you feel good and fine, you're seeing results. I mean, at your age, how long you've been training, putting on, you know, five, six pounds like that in the timeframe you did is not bad. No, you're moving forward. But yeah, it could be better. And you know, always remember too, what you can tolerate isn't necessarily what's optimal. So even though your body can handle the two hour workout and all the exercise you're doing, it doesn't necessarily mean it's the most optimal

amount of volume for your body. So that, and sometimes that's hard to gauge because you're like, I feel fine, I'm doing it. I don't, I'm not too sore. I'm still recovering. I'm still seeing results. And so, but it is a lot. And maybe if I were to cut back a little bit, would I see more?

And so I think a good experiment would be, you know, let Doug send you a Maps Anabolic, run it for a while. It's not going to hurt just trying it out. Yeah, follow it the way it's laid out. You could still go into the gym five days a week like you are, the days that you were kind of doing abs and stuff, you can keep doing that with your trigger sessions and see how your body responds and see if you enjoy it. And it should take you about half the time. You know, the thing too, Ron, that just from what I'm

hearing from what you're saying, if this is something you want to be able to do for the rest of your life, right, you want to exercise, you want to stay mobile and strong and independent for the rest of your life The most important thing to consider in the in the entire in the entire context of this is the relationship That you have with exercise. Okay So if you're finding yourself getting to the point where you're not liking it and it's drudgery and I'm showing out two hours I don't know if I want to do this. The risk, forget the risk of gains. The risk is you're going to start hating this and then

you're not going to do it anymore. So, so, okay. So let's just look, worst case scenario. You cut your workouts down to an hour. You sacrifice a pound of muscle a year, but your relationship to exercise stays strong. That's better. That's a better trade off.

So consider that as well. So another thing to consider too, I mean, I would love for you to try maps and a ball look, but here's another thing stimulus Here's nothing you're gonna go into your garage gym your basement gym. You're like, oh my god, I got to do two hours There's nothing wrong with going. I'm gonna see you 30 minutes today because I'm gonna protect the relationship I have with exercise There's nothing wrong with that whatsoever And I would bet my house that you wouldn't lose any gains from doing that occasionally. It doesn't need to be an all or nothing situation. Am I chasing ghosts at my age? I mean is it still possible for me to get so much jacked hair?

Yeah, of course. Yeah, you're doing fine. Look at Doug. Doug's 75 years old. Look at how good he looks. He's almost 60. He's 20. He's almost 60. Now the maps ain't a bock. Again, I not. Yeah. No, the map's not a ball. Again, I work from home, so I mean, I don't know if. Yeah, it's yeah, it's fine. I don't have access to certain machines and all that. You know what I mean?

No, no, it's perfectly fine. You're fine. We're going to send it to you, Ron. You got a barbell and dumbbell, squat rack, bench, you're good. Yeah. Doug's going to send it over to you. And then I'd love for you to stick to it. Yeah, I'd love for you to stick to it.

And then just circle back with us. Reach back out after you've done that. And let us know what you noticed. And like Sal said, I love for you to stick to it and then just circle back with us. Reach back out after you've done that and let us know what you what you noticed and like Sal said, I do agree like the important part of this is the relationship regardless of you because you're what you're doing is working. You can keep doing that. But what I think we all keep hearing from you is like, man, two hours can be daunting sometimes. Yeah, so yeah, don't do that much. And let's see what happens.

I mean, is that average though? Or I mean, what's, what's the average time usually? 45 minutes to an hour. An hour. I mean, my workout's like 20 minutes right now. You could, you could, you know, when you've been lifting for a really long time, you'd be surprised how little stimulus you need to maintain the muscle that you have. Look, look, I've had two hour workouts, point. Look, I've had two hour workouts, but the reason why I've had two hour workouts

is I had long rest periods and I was going really heavy. So it's not like two hours of double the volume. It's typically two hours of the same volume. I'm just taking really long rest periods, doing a little bit of mobility in between, stretching, foam roll, whatever. And so when I train more powerlifting style, sometimes my workouts are an hour and a half or two hours,

but it's not because I'm doing tons and tons of work. Same. But those shorter workouts, you're still able to hit all the main. Absolutely. Those compound lifts really cover a lot, so you're including those, you're pretty good. Honestly, I think less is more for you,

and you're doing the rest periods and everything. It's probably just a nice little change. Yeah, you're going to notice a big difference. Yeah. I appreciate that guys. Thanks for your time. You got it. Thanks for calling in. We'll send that to you. All right guys, thank you very much. Yeah, I used to do two hour workouts all the time.

How many, was it 10 exercises? I can't see into the scroll. I think that's, is that all in one day? Yeah, it's all one day. He said that's a typical workout. So that is, let's see here, he's got three on the compound lifts and two on the Iceland.

He's not crazy overdoing it. No, but it's one, two, three, four, I mean, count the sets there, Doug. When he's doing squats and deadlifts. It's about 25. In one workout. In one workout. Yeah, 25 sets in one workout. He could switch that out.

Well, what he doesn't need to do that he keeps, that he's doing is he's doing a compound lift and then an isolation of every muscle. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you don't need to. No. He could just, he could lift. Just all compound lifts. And he can also one workout, do more isolation, one workout, one workout. That's right.

I mean, we could have taken this thing and split it, but I mean, maps on a, that's what, maps on a ball is just a better version of what he's trying to do. Yeah totally. So hopefully he follows that doesn't have to train for that long and then sees as good or better. These are all great exercises. Like I said I've done two hour workouts but it wasn't because I was doing a ton of volume it was because I sat on the bench it's rested for five to six minutes. The intensity up is way way better to up your rest periods. You're gonna have a lot better rest periods. Well, I mean, I feel like you,

ideally for that, because I agree too, and I'm sure there's times where he licenses you, you build a program that should only take 45, 50 minutes, but then there's times when you drag it out for two hours because you're gonna go extra heavy. Take your time. And rest, and you got all the time, but you don't wanna build a program

that takes two hours of moving. You also don't want to follow every time a routine that you start to heat, uh, because then you'll stop at some point. Our next caller is Andrea from California. Hi, how can we help you? Good morning. Hi, thanks for having me. Um, my question, uh, well, first of all, I'm a certified personal trainer and nutrition coach and all

those things, but the question, I wrote it down, I always can get to my goal weight and I'm probably like 5 to 10 pounds away right now, but every time I get to my goal weight it always comes back even if I'm still eating the same, haven't changed anything. And I was just saying, since you guys are always talking about muscle memory, I was just wondering if you guys thought there was maybe like fat memory, and that's why it's so easy to gain the weight back all the time.

What a great question. What a great question. Metabolically adapted is more the case. Not like muscle memory. With muscle memory, we actually have observed epigenetic changes that make the adaptation the second or third time around much, much easier.

Now with body fat, what can happen? Your fat cells grow. Well, fat cells grow and shrink, and you really only add the number of fat cells to your body. Well, as a woman during puberty, third trimester of pregnancy, and for both men and women, it's suggested,

and there's some studies that actually show this probably happens, where if you gain body fat rapidly, that you might add fat cells to your body. Adding fat cells would make gaining body fat easier. I thought that was a known fact. There's a little debate, but yeah, I think this happens. I totally think this happens. You see this very, yes, with bodybuilders because they put on the weight so fast. So fast. And then every time they do the next show, they follow

the exact same protocol, but then this time they can't get quite as lean. And the theory, the prevailing theory on that is because every time you rapidly gain weight, you end up adding fat cells and they don't go away. They just shrink. So if you you every time you rapidly gain weight you end up adding fat cells and they don't go away they just shrink so if you think every time you've kind of yo-yo dieted in your life where you put on body fat especially if it came on relatively quick what ends up happening is your body adds more fat cells than it had before that and they don't go away they just shrink and so if you can over years or decades have always lost weight gained weight lost weight gained weight then every time we go back to gaining weight, many times you're probably adding fat cells,

which makes it that much more difficult to lose it and it's that much easier to get it back because it just grows. Now the key with that is the gain, the weight gain would be rapid and the theory is that the body tries to find a way to capture the extra energy more effectively because of the rapid fat gain and so then it adds fat cells. Also your fat can change itself to being more or less metabolically active. You've heard of brown fat, white fat, like cold temperature can make fat more thermogenic

or metabolically active. Healthy people versus unhealthy people. You tend to see this as well. So that may also play some kind of a role. I've heard people talk about a set point, body weight set point type of deal. I think that genetically speaking there's probably a range that your body wants to stay within. I don't think it's obese. I don't think it's super ripped. It's kind of somewhere in this kind of like you know healthy middle. But you know it's hard to separate that from our behaviors as well. Behaviors also tend to take a set point right? Like if you grow up your entire

life eating you know with with really no regard, developing a relationship with food that isn't you know loosely put loosely put, it's not healthy. And then you change your life and you try to pursue a healthy lifestyle. You know, and it's two years into this, like you've lived a long time in a particular way. And so that's a difficult chain to break, I guess. So it's hard to separate it, it right to see what's going on

But in terms of like how muscle memory works No, no, not this not the same is different, but I think there you know there's something to it though There's also the variable too of if you have to cut calories Really really aggressively to lose that body fat and that that calorie number keeps getting lower and lower It just makes it that much easier when you dip out of it and the surplus to add it back really fast. For example, if you can lose those five or 10 pounds, but you have to go down to say 1300 calories

every single time you do that. Well, when you're only eating like 1300 calories, you make a little 300 calorie mistake and it's a big portion of your daily intake, right? What your body can handle versus if we reverse dieted then we slowly leaned you out and you got you lost your five pounds but your body is at like say 2400 calories and then you go up 200 calories. It's not as significant of a percentage as you know the person who's only eating 1300. So that plays a role also, depending on how low of calories you have to go to.

Yeah. Awesome, yeah. Thank you for clearing that up. I feel better. Are you following any of the MAPS programs right now? I have anabolic and aesthetic, but I'm not currently doing one. Oh, cool.

You wanna follow one of our other programs, like Power Lift or Muscle Mommy? I would love to do power lift. Let's send it. Oh, yeah Great program you got it. Thanks for calling in. Bye. Bye You know every time we travel Adam feeds me ice cream triggers my fat When you remember being fat, you know, what's if you think of the body as an adaptation machine, and let's say, I'm just gonna create a scenario, not a realistic one, but let's just,

just for argument's sake, let's say you lose 50 pounds of body fat and then you gain it back and you do this every two years, right? At a certain point, your body is probably like, this is gonna happen again, so I'm gonna capture more calories, I'm gonna prepare for the starvation, I'm gonna make this easier to survive,

and make this less stressful on myself. And so your body probably would get better at holding on to those calories. And again, metabolism, fat storage, where your body sends energy, it's, we understand a lot of it, but there's a lot we don't understand. metabolism, fat storage, where your body sends energy. It's, you know, we understand a lot of it, but there's a lot we don't understand. There's just really, there's this huge gap

between what we know and what we don't know. It's so complex that at this point, all we could do is base some of this off of our own experience and anecdote. And general practices. And look, and again, you know, you can make the argument it's biological, it's emotional or psychological.

As a trainer or coach, I don't care. I don't care, all I know is you can try separating all you want, but what I know is when somebody loses and gains weight, loses and gains weight, loses and gains weight, it gets harder and harder each time. So whether that's just biological, just psychological, all of the above, whatever, it does make it more challenging. I didn't know that that was just a theory.

I thought it was a fact. I thought we knew that if you put on- It's been observed, but I think you probably need to keep seeing it before you can make it like a fact. I mean, I agree with it. I think that's what happens. I feel like that's what I've seen with clients in the bodybuilding world, myself personally. I mean, feel like I've that's what I've seen with clients in the bodybuilding world myself personally

I mean, so I thought when that the study studies came out good studies on it. Yeah, it's just I guess I guess What constitutes fast? Yeah, it's probably where that gray area. It's also like it counters long-held Beliefs and how we add fat cells so forever. We've been taught. You don't add fat cells. It seems like a natural like advantage for surviving. Right? So it seems like the body would want to do that. Of course. That's why it makes sense. And we've seen stuff like that. So I would say based on the studies on our experience, I'm sure it happens. Our next caller is Kyle from New Hampshire.

Hey Kyle. How are you doing? How can we help you? So, um, let me find my question again. I listen to you guys a lot. A lot of your advice helps me very much, but I am six foot one and over 390 pounds. And I noticed a lot of your advice and advice that I hear online everywhere tends to be more towards aimed at people looking to cut maybe 10 to 25 pounds or to bulk up

a little bit. I was wondering what advice you would give to somebody who has as much as 200 pounds to lose like I do. Because like reverse dieting, eat more to lose more. It's kind of hard to do that when somebody ate their way to almost 400 pounds. I'm running a three day full body routine that I, I like a bit that I built myself and I used to power lift a lot. I had a 330 pound bench, three 70 squat and four 35 deadlift, but I'm starting to get joint pain if I try to lift like that again. Um, so I'm just wondering what your advice would be for somebody who has a lot to lose instead of just like a little bit and trying to get in shape. So I'm going to actually like completely change their life.

I love this question because you know, it gives us an opportunity to address this and it's not true. Yeah. It psychologically, it can be much more difficult because let me tell you, when you sit across from somebody who has that much to lose and you tell them, hey, I want you to add these things into your diet, they absolutely would look at me like I was crazy and be like, do you not see where I'm at

and how I got here? I eat too much, but it's too much of the wrong foods and there's things that we need to go after and start targeting. And so much of the advice is actually very similar in the fact that I want you to start focusing on eating whole foods. We're going to go hit your protein target in, in your goal weight, right? So whatever your goal weight is of, uh, you want to be, um,

say that's 250 pounds or two 30 or something. We go, okay, well, we're going to go after 230 grams of protein every day through Whole Foods. And that would be like step one. And that step one would be the same for you or the person who's probably trying to lose 20, 20 pounds because we first have to get your, feed your body what it needs and make sure we get you in a metabolically healthy place first, before I just start cutting you. If I take youically healthy place first before I just start cutting you.

If I take you where you're currently at and just start cutting, cutting, cutting, it might lose a few pounds initially, but eventually you'll hit a plateau going that route and you'd be far better off hitting those protein intake, lifting weights to get strong and building metabolism to where your metabolism is roaring before we start to come back

down the other direction. So it's very similar, longer obviously the process when I have a client that's got to lose over a hundred pounds. It's a longer process of reverse dieting and take some time but very very similar advice still. Yeah Kyle I appreciate you calling in and being so open and vulnerable. I think that's great. The key here with what Adam's saying is prioritize the protein first from whole natural foods. So what we're not saying is eat like you currently eat

and add the protein on top of it, not necessarily. What we're saying is with every meal, start with protein and stick to only whole natural foods. If you just do those two things, you don't have to do anything else. That's a big step that will actually take you. It's gonna taper down your calories naturally anyways. It'll take you pretty damn far.

It'll take you pretty far before you have to make any other changes. Here's the challenge, the big challenge with, and I've worked with a lot of clients who've had to lose over 100 pounds, okay? A significant amount in the 20 plus years that I've trained people. There's two big challenges.

They're actually the same challenges that other people have, but they're more challenging because it's a little bit more complex. Number one is you just have a longer road to get to your quote unquote goal. It just takes longer to lose 100 pounds than it does to lose 20 pounds. So you just gotta kinda stay on that a little longer.

And number two, your relationship with food and exercise is more complex, it's just more complex. So someone may reach the point that you've reached when they're 30 pounds overweight, but for you it took a lot longer because the relationship with food is a little bit more complex. So you probably have a relationship with food where you find yourself eating in binge or you find yourself eating for reasons other than hunger, whether it's comfort, hedonism, stress, whatever.

As a result, your hunger signals are a little mismatched. And so what you feel or identify is satisfaction or full or whatever is far off from what would be considered healthy and that's okay. You can rebuild and change your relationship with those things. So for someone like you, like I'll ask you this question Kyle, if this is something that you're very serious about, now that doesn't mean when I ask people that they think that means I'm not gonna mess up, I'm gonna do everything perfect, but no it literally means like is this important to you? If it is, I'm gonna be very honest with you Kyle, nothing is going to guarantee your success as much as working with a coach

through this whole process. The best possible investment you can make for this, I mean we're gonna give you some advice now, that's great, you can listen to the podcast, that's phenomenal, you can try doing it on your own, that's great as well, but your success rate will triple or quadruple if you have somebody that you're working with on a weekly basis virtually even. Doesn't even have to be in person. In person would be great, but virtually I think that would be and what will happen with

this person is as you're going through this process you're going to hit those stumbling blocks, those challenges, you're going to get on with them and they're going to be able to coach you through and guide you through that process. You're going to make mistakes, you're going to getslide, 100% just accept the fact that that happens. We're all human, give yourself grace, but you're gonna have that guide and that coach to pull you out of that hole, pull you out of that shame, to help, to give you an anchor

so that you can keep somewhat moving forward. Even if it means you're moving backwards sometimes, but you're kinda keeping. So a guide or a coach, like there's nothing I can tell you on this that will come close to the success that that could potentially bring you. Kyle, are you in Are you in a place financially where you can invest in something like that?

I'm not unfortunately. Okay, so then the next best thing this is what we're gonna do. I'm gonna I'm gonna put you in our private forum if you're not in there already. Are you in there? No, no. Okay. I'm gonna I'm gonna put you in our private forum if you're not in there already. Are you in there? No, no, no. Okay, I'm gonna have Doug put you in the private forum. Okay. And then the first thing that I would do with you, which is what I would do with anybody, no matter what is all I want you to do is is track your food for a week. Don't try and impress me. Eat how you eat, eat how you normally would eat

so I can see where our starting point is. If you update with me, okay, I'll help you. The guys and I will get in there and we'll give you subtle changes on and direction also set you up on a program that you should follow. Do you have access to a gym or do you work out at home? Where would you work out at? I have access to a commercial gym. Okay, cool. So you have pretty much any equipment, everything like that. So yeah, all kinds of stuff. I'm gonna I'm gonna have Doug set you up with a program to start you on Okay on so the workout that's taken care of and then in the forum if you you know Give me what you eat. Okay with either fat secret my fitness pal

One of those in fact we get off this I'm gonna have Kyle See if I can have Kyle put you in our app so I can track you directly So I'm gonna have Kyle reach out to you. We have a Kyle too, okay? Kyle's our head trainer. So I'll have Kyle reach out to you, see if I can put you in there so that I can directly see what you're eating, and then we'll make some adjustments. And then the boys and I are gonna follow along and get you going.

I think the first 60 to 90 days will be the most crucial to setting this off after I think we've been communicating with you for a while, I think you'll piece it together pretty well. And there is no such thing as too slow a progress. There is such a thing as too fast a progress. So keep that in mind, an inch moving forward is forward. That's the key to something like this, because the big mistakes I've seen people make over and over with this is they go too far too fast make too many

changes too quickly and then they rebound or and so we got to do this don't need to build man we need to build the muscle we need to build the palate and build these better habits and so this is still building in the beginning to take you even further long term so So it seems counter intuitive. But honestly, this is the best approach we've found with anybody any size. So you're going to do great with this. And it's all going to kind of unfold if you approach it the right way.

Any limitations before I send the program to you so I know you have any sort of issues like working out lifting wise, injuries, anything? Not anything specific. Being as big as I am I try to deadlift and my belly kind of gets in the way I've done some trap bar deadlifts But other than that, I don't have a whole lot of issues Okay, those are all things that we can I see I saw in your question that you you've been you've lifted pretty heavy before So yeah, you're not you're not

Okay, good That's it I don't come back quick'll be a huge advantage to us that you're familiar with those movements and we can put some weight on and get strong. So that'll actually help us a lot. So I'm gonna have Doug send you, I'll probably send it, maps, anabolic,

you think we start off with? Starter, I mean not starter, excuse me, 15. Oh, 15 first. I like 15, bro. I love 15. We'll go 15 first and then we'll go into anabolic. Yeah, I love that because you'll be in the gym every day

for a little bit. And so it's really just building a habit. You're only gonna be in there for 20 minutes. And I'd like to see you walk for five to 10 minutes after breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Do you have a tool that will track your steps? I have a Fitbit. Perfect.

One of the bigger issues I have with it though is my job is sedentary, but I'm moving my arms a lot. So it tracks steps that I'm not taking. So I haven't used it in a while. You know what you could do Kyle, if so if you're sedentary throughout the day, you could every- Put on your shoes. How many hours a day do you work?

Look at Doug, look at this right now. There is like literally like a dollar, there's pedometers for like a dollar on Amazon. Yeah there and they just clip onto your belt and that'll be that'll be accurate enough We don't need the most sophisticated tool. We just want something and and you're like me. I do the same thing My wife teases me. She says you're not walking that much. You're just talking with your hands. So I'm the same way. So those aren't those aren't the best for me So look I'll have Doug send you a link to probably a basic Amazon one, get something like that, just so we have,

and really all it is, is just so we have a consistent tracker, so we have an idea, because what I'll have the guys do is they're gonna give you goals, like, okay, hey, this week I just want you to step this many steps per day, and we'll incrementally increase that over time.

But I'm gonna have the guys and I, we're gonna help you through this, okay? Because I wanna show you that absolutely this is the way to do this, and we'll be right there to help you out. Awesome, I appreciate it very much. You got it, man. All right, dude, we're gonna send that over to you

and then be looking for a message from our guy, Kyle and Doug, and then we'll take it from there, dude. All right, thank you guys. All right, brother, thank you. Bye. Strange things forever. I'm glad he called in. Yeah, yeah. I'm glad he called in. Bye. Strange things forever. I'm glad he called in. Yeah, yeah.

I'm glad he called in. And for anybody listening who's in that situation, you make one small step, you stick to it, then you make another small step and you stick to it. The challenge is when you make the decision like he did, to call in, be on camera or whatever, you're often like, I'll do it all now, and then you just, you just.

Well, there's a lot of urgency and intensity around it when you get big. But yeah, I mean, I've had to talk to a lot of them. I have a lot of friends in that category from football and it's like, you know, it just happens. And so it's the same process though. And it applies to you. We've all helped a lot of clients in this position.

The biggest difference between him and the lady who needs to lose 20 or 30 pounds is the psychological piece. Of course. At that point, and he said it, you know what I'm saying? Like, this is how I got here. And that's exactly how that client would talk to me when they're sitting across from me, and I'm like, listen, this is what I want you to start doing.

I want you, you're gonna eat six meals a day. And they're like, what the fuck are you talking about? Like, are you not seeing what I look like, how I got here?? Like I eat too much. It's like listen it's just trust me and so getting them to trust me that this is how we're going to go about that is the hardest part because that person really just thinks that this can't be possible that we're going to do this but I'm telling you it is you know when we do it the right way it's amazing. When you have Kyle talk to him Doug why don't you tell Kyle just to talk to him about coaching to see if he can actually do it?

Because he doesn't know how much it costs. He said it's not feasible. I'd like to have Kyle talk to him a little bit more just to see if it's something you do, even for a few months. Even if he did it for three months, it was significantly better than doing nothing at all. And oftentimes people say that because they're afraid, not necessarily, because it's not feasible.

Maybe, you know, I'm not saying he's lying, but have Kyle approach him about that. Let's see what happens. Yeah, fine, regardless, no matter what, I'm gonna help him on this. This is not, I mean, I literally think if we can just help him for the first 90 days and show him, you know, this.

Build that trust. Yeah, yeah, build that trust. And when he starts eating more and giving that feedback of, oh my God, I'm eating so much, Adam, and he sees his strength go up in the gym and he doesn't see the scale go up That's like where you get that switch for them to go like, okay, I get it I believe it and stuff and the fact that he's got a history of heavy squatting and deadlifting and benching is gonna be a massive

Advantage to us Yeah, so I hope I hope he hangs in there sticks with us and trust us Oh, look if you like the, come find us on Instagram. Justin is at Mind Pump. Justin, I'm at Mind Pump. DeStefano Adams at Mind Pump. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body,

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