Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2698: Why Everyone Should Try Bulking (Even You!)

Episode Date: October 3, 2025

In this episode of Quah (Q & A), Sal, Adam & Justin answer four Pump Head questions drawn from last Sunday’s Quah post on the @mindpumpmedia Instagram page. Mind Pump Fit Tip: Everyone needs to try BULKING! (2:20) Feel healthier with Green Juice. (24:20) The Mind Pump dead hang challenge. (26:36) Hate losing or winning more? (30:05) Strongwoman showcase: Abbye "Pudgy" Stockton. (34:48) One of the greatest weightlifting legends of ALL-TIME! (37:22) The excitement surrounding the UFC White House card. (39:48) Cocaine shrimp. (44:31) Rock Recovery cares. (46:06) How exercise can open amazing paths of conversation. (47:55) Navigating the different stages of parenthood. (50:01) Unlocking the value of deep tissue massage. (55:38) #Quah question #1 – What should your training look like while on a cut? Heavy weight, low volume? Low weight, high volume? Slow down tempo, etc.? I know you don't build on a cut, but I want to do the best I can to maintain the muscle I already have. (58:41) #Quah question #2 – I want to do the top 8 exercises for 6 weeks. I have 5 days a week and 30 minutes a day. How would you go about programming it? (1:03:53) #Quah question #3 – Is it ok to exercise daily, as a 59-year-old woman, if I vary my workouts (different muscle groups for strength 4-5 days per week, and cardio 2-3 days per week)? (1:05:18) #Quah question #4 – How do you combat high hematocrit and high hemoglobin on TRT? (1:06:52) Related Links/Products Mentioned Visit Organifi for the exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! **Promo code MINDPUMP at checkout for 20% off** Visit Rock Recovery Center for the exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Ben and Tom know firsthand the struggles of addiction and alcoholism. With years of experience helping thousands of individuals, they offer a free consultation call to discuss your situation. Whether you’re personally battling addiction or have a loved one in need of help, they’re here to guide you toward the support you need. By filling out the form and scheduling your call, you’ll also be entered for a chance to win a free 60-day scholarship at Rock Recovery Center, their premier treatment center in West Palm Beach, Florida. Don’t wait—take the first step today. ** October Special: MAPS GLP-1 50% off! ** Code GLP50 at checkout. ** Mind Pump #2690: The NEW DIET Everyone Is Using For Fat Loss Mind Pump #1565: Why Women Should Bulk Mind Pump #2385: Five Reasons Why You Should Hire a Trainer MP Dead Hang Test Dana White reveals UFC White House renderings for 'one-of-one incredible' event Cocaine Found In Every Shrimp Tested In England's Waterways Mind Pump #2695: How Family Members Enable Their Addict Loved Ones | Rock Recovery Center Sal Di Stefano’s Journey in Faith & Fitness – Mind Pump TV Parenting: Getting It Right Get your free Sample Pack with any “drink mix” purchase! Find your favorite LMNT flavor or share it with a friend. Try LMNT risk-free. If you don’t like it, give it away to a salty friend and we’ll give you your money back, no questions asked! Visit DrinkLMNT.com/MindPump Mind Pump #2210: Best Workouts for Bulking & Cutting Mind Pump # 2684: Do ONLY These 8 Lifts to Achieve an Amazing Body Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources People Mentioned Layne Norton, Ph.D. (@biolayne) Instagram Thomas Conrad (@realrecoverytalktom) Instagram Ben Bueno (@realrecoverytalkben) Instagram Jay Cutler (@jaycutler) Instagram   

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind Pump. Mind Pump with your hosts. Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded fitness, health, and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode, we answered listeners questions. People went to Instagram at Mind Pump Media.

They posted some questions. We picked four of them, but this was after the intro. Today's intro is 53 minutes long. in the intro. We talk about fat loss and muscle gain, nutrition, current events in family life. It's good time. By the way, again, if you want to post the question that we can pick, go to Instagram at Mind Pump Media. Now, this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Organify Organic supplements for health, performance, muscle gain, and fat loss. Today I talked about their green juice. It's one of our top selling supplements. I take it daily. I notice a difference

for sure when I take it. I just feel better vitality. Go check them out. Go to Organify dot com forward slash mind pump that's o r g a n i f i dot com forward slash mind pump use the code mind pump get 20% off this episode is also brought you by rock recovery this is a rehab facility uh if you or a friend or a family member or someone you know needs rehab this is what you got to do go to rock recovery center dot com forward slash mind pump every uh so often they give away a scholarship a 60 000 scholarship to somebody to go get treatment, but every single person does get some help when they go to that site. So rock recovery center.com forward slash mind pump. We know them very well. They're good people and they're really good at what they do. Also, this month, MAPS GLP1 is 50% off. This is a program

that has workout, nutrition guidance, lifestyle guidance tailored for people using a GLP1, like Ozempic or Wigovi, terseptide, somaglutide. If you're using one of those for weight loss, you want to minimize muscle loss or you want to build muscle, you don't want your metabolism to slow down, you want to maximize its effects.

Maps GLP1 was literally designed for you, and it's 50% off. Go check it out. Go to Maps, gLP1.com. Use the code GLP 50 for 50% off. Back to the show. All right, I'm going to make a general statement, everybody should try bulking.

You'll probably benefit from going to calorie surplus. Doesn't matter what your goal is. You should probably try it out. And if you haven't for a long time, I'm talking to you. Let's go. Yeah. I'm trying to remember when this switched for me, where it did not matter kind of what your goal was when you hired me,

meaning even if your main goal would lose to lose 100 pounds, right? really, I began to shift all clients into a reverse diet, mild bulk, no matter what. It just, it went in, in all pursuits, athletic pursuits, strength pursuits, losing body fat pursuits and obviously building muscle pursuits. It makes sense, especially if you've been off for a while or haven't trained ever or just getting started a routine to move in the direction of a a small surplus first before doing whatever the goal. And that I know for somebody who's probably got a lot of weight to lose, that sounds ridiculous and crazy. But you'll be far more successful doing that than going straight to the cut.

Which is what I think a lot of people do. The term bulk already turns off anybody who doesn't want to get huge, right? It sounds bad. Bulk? You know another way saying is? Eat adequate amount of calories to build muscle. Yeah, or feed your muscle. We actually, we had to change the term to reverse diet for people.

Yeah. Because what a reverse diet is is essentially a bulk. We've used terms like mini bulking to make it more palatable for people to maybe adopt and accept. Building. The history of this, I mean, this goes way back. This goes back to, you know, muscle building, body building where they go through periods of building and then, you know, trying to get leaner. And so they say, I'm on a, I'm bulking. I'm cutting.

And again, the term turns off a lot of people, especially women. and especially anybody who wants to get leaner. If you want to get leaner at all, the last word... Not even on your radar. No, you don't want to hear, let's go on a bulk, right? But all a bulk is is a calorie surplus. Anytime you're doing a... It's just needed to build muscle.

You have to. That's the thing. So all you're doing is you're eating more than you're burning with the goal, the intent of building muscle. Now, why would a bulk benefit someone who wants to lose weight? Don't you have to be in a calorie deficit? Well, yeah, you do have to be in a calorie deficit, but the reason why a bulk benefits a deficit

is because it helps build the machinery that can cause the deficit to be easier or more easily accomplished. In other words, I'll use another term. And this one's thrown around all over the place, and I know some people don't like it, but essentially, you're trying to do is speed up your metabolism. Okay.

If you have a faster metabolic rate, if you have a body, that burns more calories on its own, that makes being in a calorie deficit easier, a lot easier. I mean, if your body's only burning 1,000 calories a day, okay, but in an extreme case, being in a calorie deficit would mean you'd have to eat less than 1,000 calories.

If you have a metabolic rate that's burning 4,000 calories a day on the other end of the extreme, well, anything under 4,000 calories perts you in a deficit, can you, can you influence, your metabolic rate. Yes, you can. And although it's very complex, the most direct way we can do this, the most straightforward way we could do this, is through the process. And I say process because it's quite complicated. Metabolism is very complicated. It's not just having more muscle. There's a lot of things that happen through this process of getting stronger and building muscle

that actually causes the metabolic rate to get hotter or faster. So everybody benefits. fits from doing this. Now, how you do this makes a big difference because you have terms like dirty bulk. This is like, these are like, this is what I would do when I was a kid, right? I was, I thought I was too skinny. So every time, you know, when I worked out, it was I just want to get bigger. I could care less about getting leaner. God forbid the scale goes down. I just want to gain. So for me, it was every calorie is great. Every extra calorie is great. And so if I found high calorie foods, it didn't matter what it was, junk food, candy. It's all fast food. It didn't even matter. Just eat as much as I could.

Cram it in there. This is called a dirty bulk. And yes, you could eat in so much of a surplus that there's excessive calories above and beyond what is needed to build muscle, in which case then it gets stored as body fat. But that's not what we're talking about. What we're talking about is eating in a calorie surplus with the intent of building strength and muscle, which benefits even those who want to lose weight or get leaner. I hate that you have to put so much emphasis on the process and that there's so much more going on there because of the information that people are putting out in the science and fitness community around, you know, the muscle only burns a couple more calories a day. And so it deters to people from from adhering to this advice that I think is so valuable. It's like there's so much more going on when somebody builds five pounds of muscle on their body than just what.

it measures in a lab metabolically as far as, like, how many calories it burns in comparison to body fat. The behaviors that came along with that, the strength throughout today. The hormone changes, the hormone changes, the work now to maintain that muscle that you now do, the added activity you probably are because you feel more energetic and better. So to try and argue that building muscle doesn't speed the metabolism up as much as we talk about is such a terrible argument to try and make, and it deters people that are in this position right now.

Because if I came across a post like that, and I'm the 100-pound client that's over 100 pounds, and I heard Sal telling me I should reverse diet or bulk first and build muscle because it's going to help my metabolism and make this whole process. And then I come across the science kid who's like, well, technically, even if you add a 5 pounds muscle, it's only going to burn 20 more calories a day.

What are you even doing? So it's not as big of a deal as what we make it out to be. It's just a horrible message. It's wrong. It's also just wrong. Look, if I didn't have experience, by the way, every coach and trainer who knows what they're doing, who's been doing this for more than five years, we'll tell you this. We've all done this.

When I've worked with people and done this properly, everyday people, I'm not talking about genetically gifted athletes or building tons of muscle. Like, I'm talking about Mrs. Johnson, who gained six pounds of lean body mass with me. or, you know, Mr. Smith, who over a year gained 10 pounds of muscle, right? Routinely would get their metabolic rates to go up between 500, 800 calories, routinely. Like, that was expected, okay? In some cases, much higher. In some cases, 1,200 calories, depending on how low they were when they were working with me.

meaning we influenced their bodies through strength training and appropriate nutrient intake, which was in a surplus, that got their bodies to burn those extra calories on their own. Okay. So how much activity would you need to do? Because I routinely, like I said, routinely would get people's metabolisms five to 800 calories. It was expected. Okay. This is like what I did.

If that didn't happen, there was something else going on, either hormonal or whatever. but it was pretty, pretty regular, pretty consistent. How much activity would you need to perform to burn five to 800 calories? Yeah. That's like two hours of cardio. Right. Hour and a half, two hours of cardio a day.

Yeah. Which, by the way, if you did an hour and a half of cardio hard and let's say you did burn 600 calories doing it, that's not going to last very long. Because your body adapts to that activity, that physical endurance-based activity, and it learns how to burn less calories doing. It actually slows your metabolism now to make up the difference.

It's different than when you speed up your metabolism. When you speed up your metabolism to burn 600 more calories a day, guess what you burn extra every day? 600 calories. It's a remarkable, effective way at producing consistent, sustainable results. So who benefits from a bulk? Anybody that would benefit from having more strength, more muscle, a faster metabolism, and a better hormone profile.

So if you're listening to this, and that's you, raise your hand, and I can pretty much guarantee every single. person has got to be everybody is raising their hand now why are people afraid of a bulk uh they're afraid of bulking because it doesn't cause initially doesn't cause a scale to go down although it does sometimes i'll start there for a second sometimes the person's body is so desperate for those nutrients so desperate for appropriate strength training this this avatar typically is the overtrained individual who's under eight for years and been chronically under fit yes and then we suddenly have them bump their calories 300, we drop their activity, do a couple days of

strength training, and then they're surprised to see that they drop three pounds on the scale. But nonetheless, everybody's afraid of it because, but I want the scale to go down. Like, Adam, you're telling me, someone who wants to use 50 pounds that I got to go through a three-month process and you're telling me the scale's not going to move. Yeah. Or even possibly go up. Or maybe go up a few pounds. Yeah.

Screw you, man. I'm hiring somebody else. I'm going to go on that liquid diet that says I'm going to lose 15 pounds, you know, ran out the game. Not to mention the psychological warfare that's going on to that if you're somebody who's overweight like that and you view yourself through that lens, then any fluctuation of water retention, weight gain, anything is going to be interpreted as, I'm getting fatter. This is a terrible strategy. Bale. And so that's also, it's similar to the, of what you and I went through as being the skinny kid, but just the opposite. It was just like, you know, I'm stuffing my

face because if all of a sudden I look like the scale went down or I look like, oh, wasn't filled out, then, oh, my God, I'm losing muscle. In fact, you know what that would do for us. I know you were the same way. It pushed me towards these high sodium bloat, reducing foods. Totally. Because the scale would go up. Yes, 100%, which is terrible.

So I mean, I get, so I understand. I just, I have the, I had the reverse insecurity, right? My insecurity was I was too skinny. And so I did things nutritionally that were backwards and wrong because of that, because I looked through the lens like that. I looked at myself as I'm always too skinny and it, and it affected. at the way to choose. People that are overweight do the opposite. They are insecure about being overweight. They view themselves as fat. And so when you tell them to reverse diet, even if it's

working the way it's supposed to, the lens at which they view themselves is, my waist, it's going bigger. Oh, the scale went up or, oh, I look bloated or I'm holding one. I mean, everything is interpreted as I'm getting fatter. I got to go the other way. Really, really, really. I mean, this is why we talk about hiring a coach so much because having a professional who understands this, even if you're, if you understand program, you understand nutrition, having another pair of eyes tell you to go, you're fine, you're doing great, stay the course is so powerful when you are battling with these deep rooted insecurities about how you view yourself because you will you'll mind fuck yourself because of the nutritional because of the

sodium water retention on the daily basis how it fluctuates well how did this look for you guys as you started figuring that this out as a coach because i can remember distinctly as an early coach as an early trainer and i started 1997 i was 18 years old a lot of energy and passion and but no experience at zero experience all i had was experience training myself maybe a couple friends and I had some certifications. And what I thought the approach was that the proper approach to weight loss was I get a client wants to lose weight. We're going to put them in a calorie deficit, and I'm going to try and get them to burn a lot of calories. So it was like cardio, circuit training, and a calorie deficit right out, right out the gates.

That was my approach. I remember the shift. The shift wasn't too long after I first became a trainer. Well, I say not too long. It was probably a few years, but I was a trainer for so long. Right. So it was like a couple years, maybe two, three years where I just, I didn't think of as a bulk. I just wanted my clients to get stronger. And I remember thinking like, I'm getting these people who are hiring me. I'm putting them in a deficit. I'm having them to do all this

cardiolist, whatever. And they're not getting stronger in strength training. I want them to get stronger. So what I started to do is, and the reason why this is so important is strength is so beneficial for all physical pursuits. It makes you feel good. You get nice. sculpt and shape to your body. Plus, as a trainer, I could objectively show my client progress within the first few weeks. Like, look, you're stronger. And that's really important for motivation. So I was just about getting stronger in the beginning because I knew I could control the

workouts. You're seeing me twice a week. The diet, fine. We'll worry about that later. And so my initial approach was, I'm going to help you get stronger. And then later we'll worry about the diet. Not realizing what I was kind of doing was moving in the right direction. It wasn't probably until about seven years.

into my career that I said, no, no, no, no, we got to build. We got to build first. That's going to make fat loss so much easier later on. Yeah, I made the mistake early on of really over-emphasizing, like, the calorie burn and also the calories in and just playing that whole math game, which is totally like a failing strategy. And to see it kind of play out, and the worst part is like you get just like your clients, like you feel this initial success because you're seeing the. scale move in the right direction, they're feeling good about their clothes and all this kind of

stuff. And then you get to a point where it's just like, well, where do we go from here? And it got really frustrating because, you know, I didn't really have any answers once we got to that position where it was like, we're way too low calories. We're, you know, you can't just cardio your way through any more of this. And so. And they start showing up. They stopped showing up. Yeah, they're frustrated. I put all the work and I'm not there. And so, yeah, reevaluating that and then realizing, you know, to. to really build them up and get them in a better position from the beginning with strength training as the main focus and, you know, reinforcing and feeding that was so much better.

Yeah, I probably took seven or eight years, I think, before this came full circle for me. I needed to see enough clients because early on I just thought they were lying to me. Oh, same. And so it really, I think what really switched for me was when I actually started to believe, I had enough clients that were 100 pounds or more overweight. sitting across from me that were telling me they were only eating 1,300 to 1,500 calories to the point where I went to houses, made them take pictures when they ate. I mean, I just, and it was, it's what they were doing.

And I was just, this can't be, their, their cupboards look good. She's telling me everything she's eating. This isn't adding up. And then they were already so low that I knew that I can't go any lower than that. And so it just became almost like a health thing for me. It's like, you know what? The cutting thing is, and the moving thing is just, impossible to go any further

that direction. So why don't we just try and build muscle and get you stronger and healthier? And then that result, and then what started to happen which tripped me out, which was we would start to add calories, back off the cradient endurance cardio and then the scale would start to go

down. It was like, huh? What's this magic? That was bizarre. It just and I remember this is actually this is around the time when I think I first started finding content online that I believe Lane was putting out because he was talking about reverse dieting with his bikini competitors.

And so I think I started finding stuff like that related to that type of content and to to help me figure out what I was seeing because what I was seeing didn't make sense to me. We were, I was told, you know, everybody was told law thermodynamics. So it's calories in calories out. This client's only eating this much. Get them moving more. Cut them less calories. Whenever you've done that to enough people, especially someone who's really overweight,

who's not seeing any results anymore and they're already down 13,500 calories. It's like, this can't be good. And they're miserable. There's two points I want to make with this. One is you could follow, the biggest loser has been on air now for a long time and you could see the documentation

of how they lost the weight on the show, which typically involve lots and lots of crazy activity with severe caloric restriction and where they're left at after the show, Well, they're left at is they're like, oh, my God, if I eat anything over 1500 calories and I do anything less than hours of activity a day, I started gaining weight. And so the majority of them end up gaining the weight back as a result. But the second point I want to make, which really hurts my heart to think that I, same thing as you, Adams. I thought they lied.

I thought they were lying for years. They're not telling me the truth. And this is a message. And then I just punish them in their workout even more. Even more. Yeah. We've got to go harder. Terrible.

This is a message to train. here's a message. Always believe your clients. Always, always, always believe your clients. Even if they're lying, you're better off believing them because you're going to build a better relationship with them. Well, they'll tell you the truth later. Even if they're lying. But always believe your clients. You're going to be so much more effective because it took me years to start to always believe my clients. I always thought I knew. Like, oh, you're not telling me the truth. But the truth is, it doesn't matter. Believe them anyway because you'll get to a place later where they can tell you the truth. Well, they will tell you the truth. And then you can start to really make some changes. But it makes me sad. Same exact thing, Adam. And I did the same exact thing. Track this. Track this.

Send me pictures. And then I was like, what is going on here? Yeah, I mean, you see enough of it. And then you're like, okay, like, that's enough proof for me. It was an, I had enough of these 100 pound overweight clients showing me what they were eating that it just no longer mathed anymore. And I said, okay, there's something going on outside of the law of thermodynamics. You know where you're seeing this? GLP1 people.

Yeah. who lose a lot of weight with the GLP1. You see that quickly because of, yeah. And they plateau. And it's like, oh, I got another 40 pounds to lose. I'm only eating 1,200 calories. In fact, I can't eat more than 1,200 calories because this GLP1 makes me so adverse to food.

What do I do now? My doctor said, raise my dose. Like, no, no, no, no, no. Let's reverse diet. You build some of that machinery. Getting stronger and building muscle makes all the rest easier. I don't care what your goal is. I don't care.

So this is why everybody should try this out. and especially if you never do this. If this is the scariest thing to you and you've never done it, you'll benefit the most from doing something like this. It's actually so much easier. You feel better while you're doing it. I mean,

cutting calories and just strictly cutting calories and moving more and white knuckling the temptation is just, and some people got it. Some people have got that discipline that they can just chew gum, you know, think about something else, like for months. And they get there. And, you know, kudos those people that can do that.

But most people can't do that. And it's not worth it. So they end up going back the other way. This way where you were actually eating. And that really how it started for me was just like, I want to stop restricting. And just let's just agree to eat from these list of foods. And I'd put together like a list of all the foods. Yeah.

And so I start saying like, hey, when you're hungry, eat. But I want you to eat from these foods. Just that's what we're going to do. So let's know more of this like restricting, cutting calories. Eat. Just stay within these parameters. If you're hungry, go eat again. I don't care.

Show up. Make sure we lift weights. Let's get strong. And it's like, then all of a sudden you started. Oh, you started to see a turn. And it turned hard and fast. It wasn't like a, I noticed a couple clients got somewhat results. It was like profound what I was seeing.

And then for- Herodime shift. Then it became a point where I'm like, oh, I'm not even, I'm actually, I rarely cutting calories, like, especially like extreme cuts and so like that, to me is like a short-term strategy in the bulk of someone's. program. Like if it's like, I'm really going to cut you 500,000 calories, it's only for short burst to get us to drop a little bit like this. Overall, I think hovering more around a maintenance to a surplus, if somebody is strength training, making good food choices is a much

better strategy long term to get anybody to lose any amount of weight. In fact, when people, you know, get more detailed, when people stick to whole natural foods, hit their target body weight and protein, eat it first, strength train, try to get stronger, listen to their appetite and kind of stay within those parameters, their body naturally puts them in that kind of maintenance, slight cut, slight bulk, sometimes they get a little more, sometimes. And what ends up happening is over time, over time, men tend to fall around 13 to 16 percent body fat generally. Now, genetics will make that can go up or down from there, but generally speak, it's where they fall eventually. And women tend to fall in the low 20s body fat percentage

without doing anything else. Without doing anything else. And look, when I got this right with clients, this is what people would say. I don't know how this is working. I feel like I'm barely doing anything. And I'm just getting easy. And that's how you know.

It's not like you're fighting your body's physiology. You're working with it. And that's how you know things are working. Huge. Huge difference. Anyway, I got to tell you guys about, so I started, I added, I've been adding the green juice into my daily supplements.

And every time I do it, feel good. Yeah. I'm like, why did I stop? You know why? Because it's not like this crazy stimulant or something. And so you kind of take it for granted when you're using it. Yeah. Yeah. But when I use it regularly, I feel, this is going to be a silly term. I just feel healthier. I just feel better. I mean, obviously, ashmaganda, you've always touted like how. It's the micronutrients too. It is that too. Yeah, dude. Because it's more than just osmigranos. There's these phytonutrients that are in there because of the way it's broken up. They're more bioavailable. It's got all these wonderful greens in there. It's got all these wonderful greens in there. And it's just, you know, I could definitely, I feel a deficiency. Yeah. It's almost like, yeah, you're like sponge it up. I'm lacking them. Yeah.

And it just feels. Do you think there's also a little bit of feedback, like a quick feedback loop because that you're, you're drinking it, like that you feel it pretty quick versus if you were to eat something and consume it or try and get all those vitamins and minerals through different foods throughout the day? Well, there's, there's my, you're going to get it concentrated in one hit? Yeah, but I don't think it's not the vitamins and minerals. There's phytonutrients that have benefits, uh, health benefits.

that you only get from from plants. Now, the problem with consuming a lot of plants is their bioavailability. Well-cooked vegetables, they're more bioavailable than like raw, for example, even though those are just like whole movement for raw vegetables, which was weird. It's hard to digest, though.

Yeah, but the green juice is, I mean, everything's broken down into a powder. So when you drink it, you're, it's all bioavailable, highly concentrated. Yeah, it's funny because, I mean, mean Courtney left for a few days over the weekend and like I'm you know I tend to just go out and pick up food for the boys and me just to like make it easier and you know I don't realize how much plants and things like from farmer Thomas is like our CSA that we get how much she includes

it like every single meal and like you know even in our our meat dishes and things she's like incorporating a lot of these phytonutrients you feel that huge drop off and so yeah I had to like take some green juice to supplement because I'm like I'm not eating my vegetables at all how do you uh so what do you guys think about uh the idea that our our social media crew had for um the dead hang contest stupid stupid yeah not terrible I'll take a big L for that I knew I was gonna get crushed on that so I think uh they they must have saw the same clip that I saw it was Peter Atia yeah Peter Atia was talking to somebody uh And he made, he made this statement that I was like, bullshit. No way that a two-minute hang is something that the average 40-year-old should be able to do. I'm like, I do that a lot of times just kind of to warm up. I'll just hang there for a little bit. So they're like 150 pounds.

Yeah, sure. And I know, and I don't like, I'm not like being competitive about, but I try to hang up there for as long as they can. And when I do, it's like 30 seconds. Yeah, I just do the stretch. And I'm like, maybe a minute, two minutes? Hell no. I know I couldn't do that. So, and I'm like, I mean, I'm.

I know I'm not peak strong me, but I'm not weak. You know what I'm saying? I'm not like, I'm not like that. So I don't, I'm not a fan of that as a proxy for strength or health because I know that's not. Now, I think that there's got to be a weight factor that plays a role in that too. Of course. That's going to be. Well, it's an endurance too.

It's not like, you know, like crushing the grip strength, completely different beasts. It is, but you're right. So, yeah, I was not a fan. I knew, I knew I was going to get my ass kick. Well, look, you get a guy like half-four, who is a giant man, who's the world-strongest man in many, many regards. Yeah. He's not going to hang on a bar as long as a 15-year-old female gymnast. Yeah.

Well, that's not even the same universe. No, no. She'll hang on one hand or two fingers for long. Yeah, right. So, no, but, you know, hanging is a good exercise. The grip strength is a proxy for overall body strength, but there's a lot of ways to measure. I mean, so, like, my kids could. hang there for like five minutes.

It's not like impressed to me. I mean, I just want to make that clear. I'm salty about it. You guys are. I took a big hell, dude. Of course. Of course. Of course.

I mean, but I knew it going into it. I was like, nah, bullshit. I already know this is bullshit. I don't even, yeah,

dude. I mean, I'll do pull-ups, but like, I don't. And I want to make that clear that I don't think that I like to prime that way.

I think I'll, I love to hang there to get your shoulders all kind of woken up, stretch to lap. Like, it feels good to do that. I'm pro doing that. For sure.

But when he made that statement, I'm like, and like the next day I was in there, you just want to see. I'm like, no way, I can't hold that for two minutes. Well, we did it. It was fun. Doug beat all of us. Yes. I was, I was close.

But I was, I mean, we got some trainers in here. I know. Female train? We got smoked by all our time. Yeah. So I did. I barely missed two minutes. Doug did like two, 18, I think it was,

two minutes and 18 seconds like that. Yeah. Alyssa. She's like three minutes and 30 seconds. We were all like, what, dude? Yeah, dude. She's strong, like, oh my God, that's impressive. She does power lifts, too, yeah.

She does power lift. But I think it's fun. I think it's fun. I think a Will, all the mail did. Will was first. He was like three, he got the highest. Oh, he was the highest. Yeah.

Oh, so he was over her. Kyle. I have a few challenges I want to push on them next. That's all I'm saying. You want to fucking. Do that to me? Bottoms up kettlebell. press.

Sporatically just throw that one. I mean, make me look like a little pussy. It's fine, dude. It's fine. It's coming for you. I mean, you didn't come in last. I came in last,

so at least you didn't come in last. Yeah, but come on. Who in the room handles losing the worst? That's Justin, for sure. All of us don't do well. I'll say, I don't do very good. You don't either.

Justin gets mad, and if any time we bring this up for the next 10 years, he's going to get mad about it. I know. Yeah. We've actually will regret. A long time ago, I don't remember everybody's answers.

A long time ago, we talked about this. Do you hate losing more or do you like winning more? So which one is more powerful of a motivator? So you hate losing more. So I like to win more. So you're right. So he would be the worst loser in that situation. I'm not a highly competitive person.

I don't think I'm competitive, but I'm not highly competitive. Yeah, you're lame. Do you hate losing more or do you like winning more? it's a good question it depends on the situation oh really well i mean like the dead hang thing uh you know i i thought i did great up until i didn't when all the younger people yeah but did you okay so great example did you care because you went last i did care about winning i was i said i cared about winning against you guys okay yeah so were you more motivated to beat us or just not be last however i was kind of resigned when all these younger trainers got up there and and kicked my

mass so yeah yeah so i didn't really take that too hard it's so funny how mad everybody gets i know i mean i don't like losing but it actually doesn't bother me i like to win way more i just like winning just is my favorite like i get competitive with uh like if i have a team like our team then i get real competitive and want that like whole thing personally i'm not highly i guess i can get competitive some with some stuff but i don't get get too bothered as to whether or not I win or lose

necessarily. I guess, yeah, I guess the two for me it's like the impromptu stuff where you don't train for it. I wasn't ready. I don't like that,

dude. The more you talk, you just, you solidify your point. You just don't like to lose. Hey, that's just, years ago,

years ago, I don't remember where, we were in Austin, there was a punching machine and Justin and I went to hit it. And he's still mad. See, he gets so.

He still mad. Well, I remember, because I know, Justin's competitive. And like to all credit, Justin went the highest in sports. You have to have that level of like, that's a part of who you are.

By the way, tons of integrity. So it's not like so competitive that he cheats. He's very, very honest. No, I don't cheat. No, very honest. So, uh, the incredible integrity. But I remember we did that and I saw Justin's night got ruined. He got really mad about it. And I remember like being like,

oh, he got ruined his month. I thought we're going to have, I thought it was fun, you know, we're going to have some fun, you know? And he actually got like really upset about it. I was like, oh, no, I shouldn't have done. I wish I wasn't like that. It's hard, dude. I can't, like, shake it sometimes, yeah.

I mean, I think it's just, I think, well, I think the worst thing is when you think you should win and you don't. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, no, that's, well, that was, that was the race car. I know. I don't. I mean, that one, that, you're probably, okay, so in that situation, that's something

like that really bothers. Because you were like, oh, I'm going to win. Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's nothing worse in like being overly confident about something and then getting humbled like that, that's like more like, like, Have you, so I know you've told this story, Justin, and when you went D1 and the first time you went up against, like, those guys. Oh, yeah.

I had that experience in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. At one point, I was, like, pretty good. I thought it was awesome. I was like a good gym guy. I could hang with a lot of people. Yeah. And these dudes visited from Brazil, and there was this black belt that came. And, yeah, he was a higher rank to me.

But at that point, I could hang with black belts in my local community. So I could hang with them, meaning they'd have to try hard to get me. this dude I was a child it was it was it was so humbling he was so much better than me

that he was telling me what he was gonna do and he was having fun with it and I was I got to the point where I was like I just started laughing because I was like this is this is silly yeah

he could take my lunch money and he could he could just violate me there's nothing I could do about it yeah I know it's crazy it's frustrating yeah like I had many moments

like that playing football especially where it was just like I would literally put 100% effort into a play like as hard as I could possibly hit somebody and then just get flattened because this guy you know yeah he was heavier but like I've been able to hold my own to the point where it's like they have genetically they're just faster and bigger and have all these factors and you just are like oh okay I guess I'm just I'm just going to do it's Speaking of levels, I, so I've brought her up before on the show. Doug, I just sent a picture to the group, if you could show the fellas. This woman, Abby Stockton, was a female who lifted weights in the 1940s.

Okay, look at her physique. This is the 1940s. By the way, by the way, that is 135 pounds. That's 135. Are you sure? Yes. It is? 135 pounds.

She was under 100 pounds. She was a tiny. woman and she great physique and she I'll send another one Doug she was part she would hang out with those like kind of golden era not golden it's even before bronze era ish maybe silver eraish bodybuilders and she would lift weights with them and work out and look at this next photo I just sent you Doug this straight old time strength actually and she I she needs to be more popular for current women who are trying to build physique because this was the 1940s when If you were anywhere but the kitchen, you would get chastised.

And here she was lifting weights, having a great physique, and 135 pound one arm overhead press. Look at her physique here. Wow. Great, right? Yeah, incredible. Isn't that amazing? Is it 40s right here? This is 1940s.

Who's smoking. Isn't that great? Yeah, totally. And think about all of the... Did she compete? Was she doing competitions and stuff? No, because they didn't exist for women. Wow.

So she would try, she would just do these... I never even heard. How'd you know of her? She's famous. crazy because that was your grandma yeah oh how awesome would that be yeah grandma how would you how did you even find her so when you read up on um like old time athletes the 1940s was when bodybuilding started to really develop yeah if you look up like women at that era she's the only one that really comes up uh and they called her nickname was pudgy which is funny

because she's lean yeah uh she was tiny and just incredibly strong and built why does it say cheese bummer What is that? Oh, that's just from notes. I think... Oh, I was so confused by why that was an extra frame. That is confusing. Anyway, how awesome is that? It's super awesome.

Isn't that great? I would love to popularize her for women today. Because, by the way, this is before steroids. This is before supplements. She had a full-time... I don't know if she was a mom, but I think she had to take care of it. And here she was working out a few days a week, developing this incredible physique.

And she was strong as heck. I wish I remember the page, but they have a lot of these historical lifters that they promote on there all the time. Another guy I want to talk about is Paul Anderson. You guys know who he is, right? Paul Anderson. Show me the picture. One of the greatest strength athletes. Doug can look him up.

You want to type him up, Paul Anderson. One of the greatest weightlifting legends of all time. He was 5'9. He was so strong in those days that people just had no idea how this guy even was human. Again, the guy with the wheels, the big, huge. The Russians called him the wonder of nature because he squatted with these freaking wagon wheels. So, trip off this.

That's him? That's Paul. Yeah, I've seen that. That's a famous picture. He would do squats in his farm house while drinking whole milk. His legs. So strong. So trip off this, Doug, see when he competed.

What years were those that he was competing? Does it say? Was it the 1940s, 50s? Olympic games, 55. Okay, mid-50s. Okay. So trip off this. The world record clean and jerk in 1960 was Olympic gold medalist Yuri Vlasov, who did 436 pounds. So this is a clean and jerk. And by the way, their technique back then was not as good as it is today. Yeah. Paul cleaned and pressed. He didn't jerk. He pressed 440. Wow. He squatted. By the way, this was before they wore like belts and wraps. 900 pounds. Wow. He had a bench press of 615 and an 800 pound deadlift.

Wow. Isn't that incredible? Monster. It's so wild that these, you know, back. Well, it also highlights, too, because this is all before all these crazy steroids and things I'm taking that. How much the percentage of the, you see these crazy feats of strength is genetics. Yeah. I mean, we just saw like a world record again, or I think just got broken again right on deadlifting for like 1100 pounds.

But, I mean, that's, you're talking about 50, 70 years later. It's not like even. with all the science, all the... Oh, and they're wearing wristwraps and everything. Yeah, all the gear, all the drugs possible. And, you know, he's not that far behind. I mean, that's... Yeah.

Highlights how much the genetic factor plays for sure in the world. You know what I think about when I read about stuff like this is like throughout, you know, like the ancient world, how many genetic anomaly... We don't even know about, you know, that you just... It didn't actually... It didn't formally compete or anything like that. No, it was just a dude that just fought in, you know, in five different wars and killed 150.

You know what I mean? Nobody could touch them, you know, whatever. It's just crazy. It's really, I love reading about that. Crazy. About that kind of stuff. You know, especially like feats of strength and fighting and all those things. I am, uh, I am looking forward to this UFC fight on the White House long.

I cannot believe that is going down. That is crazy. It's such poor taste. It is kind of, why do you think it's poor taste? It is, bro. It's kind of brilliant, actually. Yeah, I know what he's doing. But it's like, the card is so stacked.

Oh, it's so stacked. Oh, man. It's incredible. This is, this harks back to, like, Coliseum, distract people with fights, you know, bread and circuses. Yes. What are you doing? It feels like that. Was it comadus, you know, in the gladiator?

It almost feels like. So I don't, so. I actually don't interpret it that way. I actually interpret it as Trump has really figured out his core demographic and it fits UFC crowd perfectly. You're right. And so it's just, I'm going to lean into that. So I don't, I don't, there's so many more things going on with social media.

It's smart politics. Today's Coliseum, in my opinion, is not sports and fighting anymore. It's social media. Yeah. So today's Coliseum, all the way government used Coliseum back of the days, it's social media. Propaganda ways. So when I see this fight on the lawn, I don't see that. I see this is my core audience.

There's probably no other sport that has my core audience more than that. I'm going to lean all in on it. 100%. I agree with you 100%. It's smart politics, it's poor taste, in my opinion. It's like, oh, in front of the White House, we're going to do this and have a UFC event. I don't know. It turns me off.

I mean, I'm for sure probably the least political of us. I don't even, it's not that big. It's cool. It's smart politics. Yeah, it's smart. I don't know. Of all the distasteful thing that politicians do, it doesn't, it wouldn't even scratch the top. That's another good point.

Top ten for me. I mean, another good point. You're right. They do a lot of. All right. You got me. I mean, this is a good fight, dog. You're right.

You're right. You're right. You're right. In the context of what politicians do? Oh, yeah. It's a lot greasedier, shittier things that they could do. And, yeah, it's clever, it's smart, what he's doing. I'm just like, what Justin said, I'm like, I'm pumped about the card.

I haven't seen a card. It's even better than that. What was the, what was it? John Jones made it back, so he's allowed to fight now. Yeah, the lineup is he going to be. Is he going to fight? Yeah. Yeah.

Look at the, pull up the line up the line up for a white. House UFC card. Look at this lineup. Do you guys know Connor McGregor? Isn't he running for president? Yeah. He's going to fight too. He's on the card also. Yeah. He's on the card. No, the card is insane. That'd be cool. Like, I mean, I don't know what kind of chances he has. He's super popular.

Yeah, he is popular, but. I would think he has a hell of a chance, don't you? I would, I hope so. I mean, I don't really know his politics. I don't know. I don't know his political stance. Bro, we're moving towards idiocracy so fast. 100%. I mean, this is all sponsored by Brondo. Everybody watched that movie. I mean, it's so crazy how accurate.

Politics are this close to WWE, dude. I mean, it's like this close to the same, same type of show, you know? You know, you know, I used to, you know who really, you couldn't Google the White House card? That's it. Well, that's, all we got to do is get like, you know, governors to fight in there is just like one of the... Rumored matchups. These are rumored. John Jones, Tom Aspinall.

Yeah. That's the guy who, everyone's saying that he's been ducking because Tom. crushing everybody. It's like the only person they think that could be John Jones. I talked to Dana White about getting like DeSantis and Newsom to duke it out.

Now that would be cool. That would be fun. I would love to say that. Now you're talking, Justin. I'm for sure going. You know who ruined combat sports for me? It's when I trained. I trained a bunch of doctors, surgeons.

And I had this one buddy of mine, Mike, and he's a phenomenal, very intelligent guy. We'd have all these great conversations. And he explained to me brain trauma so well. And what happens when you get in the head? What happens the brain? What happens later? And we had these great conversations about it over weeks because I kept asking questions.

And then it ruined it for me. Now when I watch fights, I see someone get hit. I just think of all this stuff. I mean, isn't football and boxing way worse? Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, this is a volume. You know what they're showing too?

also has impacts on future cognitive performance. What? Soccer. Oh, yeah. Heading the ball. Yeah. Head budding the ball is like super bad. Soccer.

Yeah. Of all sports. I know. I mean, I also get the whole like, what are you going to do with sports? Yeah. Like, let's,

I'm over it. Yeah. I mean, I've always thought that's why you get paid so much. You do something that's elite, dangerous. Dude, speaking of John Jones. It's over sensationalized.

You guys just reminded me of this crazy post I saw. Let's see if I saved it. Because John Jones made me think of Did you guys know? You ready for this? I'm sure. Researchers from King's College of London and the University of Suffolk

uncovered a starting discovery in England's waterways. You ready for this? Every freshwater shrimp tested was found to contain trace amounts of cocaine. Say that again? What? Okay.

So researchers studying shrimp, freshwater shrimp in English, England's waterways. Okay. He studied them all. Every single one was found to have trace amounts of cocaine in them. Is this like a major problem? I didn't hear about like cocaine being a big deal out there.

I don't know. I mean, are people, are they jumping it? I was just saying is that like a normal pathway where you would transfer? I don't know. And what, why shrimp of all? Shrimp or bottom feeders, dude. Yeah, they eat all the garbage. Same thing with clams and muscles.

I thought you're going to say like, Every one of them had traces of cocaine. Every one of them had traces of cocaine. Wow. You would think that would be like a market for like the shrimp over there would be like really expensive? It's like an extra $5 a pound, you know what I'm saying, for that shrimp? Get some popcorn. Why is that so expensive?

Grill shrimp. See a couple grams of cocaine. Eat the shrimps. See how you feel afterwards. I know I thought that was funny. That is hilarious. We brought John Jones, so I thought of the cocaine. Oh, I was like, how did it?

Great segue. Right. Sorry. Okay. Trim. Sorry, John Jones. Speaking of drugs. Oh, you're going to move to real rock right now.

Isn't that great? This is all perfect. Terrible. Hey, I got it. I got to, might as well. You guys, dude, Ben and Tom, the guys that run rock recovery, they're such good men.

There's such, do you know how much they work with people when they don't even sign up for their, yeah, yeah. Like, they'll get these people that will go in. Above and beyond. Oh, they'll just, I talk to Tom and he'll talk to, he'll say, hey, this person found us through your show. I've been working with. them for the last five weeks and we're having all those conversations like oh really are they are they

getting you know rehab he's like no they just inquired and so i'm just helping them out i'm like you're doing all that work i mean and they're texting them yeah back and forth yeah like you know have a real heart for it for i mean they're they're in it to really help people like if you're looking if you need rehab or a friend or family member like you want them to go to a place that is not just, you know, trying to generate revenue because there's a lot of those places. And they know how to gain the system. These guys care, like genuinely care.

They're such good guys. And I talk to them about these. And sometimes I'll send a video because they'll say, hey, this person found us through the show, huge fan, would you mind sending an encouraging video? And then that's when I'll find out, like, you've been talking this person for weeks. Yeah.

They're not even paying you? He's like, yeah, man, I'm trying to, you know, help them out. Didn't Ben just formally give his heart over to the Lord? Isn't that what I heard? Yeah, he did. he's a new Christian. Yeah. Yeah.

That just happened, right? It just happened. Oh, wow. I had a really cool talk with him and discussion after he was on our show. And he, you know, shared some personal stuff. And so we talked a little bit about it. And he's been, he worked with Chad a few times. Oh, he did?

He did. I hooked him up with Chad for a few sessions. And then he just told me he's now a Christian. Did your, did your episode with Chad go live yet? No. What do you have coming up right now? What's on the, what's on the series? I don't know what's up next.

We're going to have to ask Dylan that. Which one he's, he's going to drop next? Oh, the one where I work out with Dennis. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, so that's going next? That should go up next. Okay. But I have, the one with Chad was really good.

He's so, he's so knowledgeable. What did you guys do? Record a Zoom? Is that what you guys did? I did a Zoom with Chad. Yeah. With Dennis, we had a conversation at his jiu-jitsu school. And then we also did a workout together.

I took him through a bodybuilder workout. You know, the whole deal is like, you know what I'm real like, it's just so stupid, you guys. You guys are like, you guys are like, you guys. guys are going to be like, duh. You guys know this as trainers. When you're working out with someone, you have the best conversations. Exercise tends to open up, you know, pass of communication. It opens up vulnerability. Subconsciously, we all want to break. That's why. And so we come up with a conversation, right? I don't want to grab that bar again. Quickly, let me tell you about my life. No, but it does, right? It's like, you have the best. You ever clients that used to do that? I know. I used to have some

clients that were, I remember like the first time. You started to figure that out that like I had clients that would like, you know, they, I mean, because we talk about there's a bit of an art form to that as a trainer. Like, you know, you know, how can you connect with your clients, educate them, give them proper rest, but then also give them the proper amount of volume and intensity to work out. I really believe there's a bit of an art to that of, you know, the right balance of conversation that doesn't impede on a good workout. But, and, and so when you find. clients that hack that and they, you know, start asking questions, like right before their set is supposed to go again, like, you know, and they ask good questions. And so then you don't catch, you don't catch it until you start to notice there's a pattern here. Like, oh, every time we're about to go to that next set. Good trainers pick up on the set. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I had clients sometimes that would fake, uh, like they'd, they'd grimace or they'd fake exertion because they'd want to stop the set. Yeah. And you start to pick up on it. You're like, yeah. No, no, no, you got two more of those. You got two more of those. I can tell the way where the bar's moving. I got to tell

you guys with a conversation, I'm having the best conversations with my 15-year-old because she's getting into lifting. You guys are going to crack up. Listen to this. She goes, this is the text they get from her at night, right? Because she was with her mom and she went to the gym. Hey, if I run a mile after working out, will that ruin my workout? This was her text. Yeah. I'm like, what an interesting question. Will that ruin my workout? Yeah. So I'm like, it'll reduce the muscle building signal, but it will improve endurance. So less muscle, more endurance. So she's like, well, what if I just walk I don't understand this, Papa. How come some girls who play soccer are both muscular and condition?

Why are you saying I can't be both when so many people are? So I'm like, look, walking is best for muscle. Athletes build muscle. But those same soccer plays would have more muscle if they just strength train. But if you want to have stamina, then yes, run after. Sprinting is good. And so she's like, this is her reply, but I'll lose muscle. I'm like, you know, I'm just in my heart.

She's so fucking stuff building. Which is so great. So like it's a balance. It's crazy. It's almost like a switch just half and like not even a year ago, right? Yeah. Overnight, she went from like not interested to just not just kind of interested, like, full

on. She's becoming a meathead. I'm like, well, look, if you want to play sports, you got to be in condition too. You can't just build, you know? She's like, but I want to build. Oh, wow. This is so hilarious. Oh, wow.

So fun. That's so awesome. I'm having a blast with her. That's cool. It's going to be, I predict it'll be a few years before her and I get some workouts together. Still too soon. Oh, so are you avoiding that right now?

Intentionally, huh? Yeah, dude. I don't want it to be me. making it happen, pushing it. Well, yeah, but what if she asks you, though? Oh, then I'll do it. Oh, okay. Yeah.

Oh, so you're saying, I'm not going to, you're not going to ask me then for sure. Oh, okay. Well, that makes sense. I get it. Like, I thought you were like, avoiding that. Like, if she wanted to work out with you. She's going to go down all the mistakes. She's going to do all the mistakes.

She's going to do too much. She's going to challenge me and then go do the stuff after she asked me. And I'm, you just, you let them because if you push too hard, especially with the teenager, they're just going to go in the other direction. So, you know, this is like this game, this balance game. In fact, I had a conversation with her the other night. And I said, you know, you're at the age now where it's no longer, you know, I give you these boundaries and then I punish you every time.

We're entering into a phase where we have conversations. Yeah. And I said, and so long as you're open and we have conversations, I won't have to revert back to. I mean, she's 15. So she's technically in the coach phase, almost friend phase. Yeah. You know, 18 is when you transition to the friend phase. And so you're in that kind of limbo stage of just kind of coaching, but transitioning over to where more kind of a friend than you are.

It's interesting. The daddy role, you know. It's an interesting transition. Oh, I can imagine how, I mean, I'm not there. I have no idea what it's like, but I can only imagine how difficult that is. I mean, I think this is a challenging thing for all parents. I think, I mean, that's why that last book that I read was so good. Because it's like, they're going to go through that, whether you like it or not. And so, you know, if you end up being stuck as a parent who parents in just, one phase. And I think we all, I think all parents probably have a natural gift for one of the phases more than others. And so kind of like how you get stuck in a workout routine of like you really like it, you're really good at it. And so you do it all the time and you don't move out of it. I think parents probably do the same thing with like their parenting style. It's like, oh,

you're a really good like rule setter or you're a really good coach or you're really good friend. But it's like the kids have actually phases neurologically that they, that they're in. And they're going to move through those, whether you like a. or not, or whether you're a good type of, that type of parent or not. And so learning to adapt to that and be aware of kind of what stays they're at is. How are you navigating that, Justin? Because I know you got it. I mean, your son's 15, same age.

Yeah, he's same age. And it's interesting because he's really getting into training too. They have like, um, uh, it's a sports performance class where they wait train at school, which I was super pumped on. But we're getting into this conundrum here where he's over training and I'm having to kind of coach him like through that. of what's probably appropriate, you know, as he's training there, but then also having to go to practice so consistently.

Because he's already training so much of the gymnastics. And I, and I've made sure to go to these gymnastic practices because, like, I know they do a lot of, like, calisthenics and also, like, but, you know, I'm starting to see him like, oh, wow, they do a lot of body weight, like, exercises and training. Like, it's not just skills training. Like, he has them doing a lot.

So, you know, he's he's kind of working with the coach to back off a little bit of that so he can do a little bit more weight training focus and then just, you know, concentrate more on the skills and it's starting to do better. But, you know, it's funny. He's had his first, like, I have like a knife pain in my shoulder blade and, you know, they think it's like a real injury. Yeah. And I'm like, okay, you know, it's kind of like the first real, like, a strong, like, knot that that's like really ear. irritating and inflamed and it's like you know we can work through this has he experienced like a deep tissue massage yet has he yeah so so he wouldn't even he wasn't even open to that and i was like going to get in there and work and so now he's finally kind of allowing like Courtney started to

to work on him a bit and he's realizing that there could be relief there and i'm taking him through a lot more mobility type of movement so he could like help to kind of you know alleviate that so it's he's learning now too how to navigate when he gets the pain signal and like if it's a if it's a real like alarming pain signal or if it's just something that's like tight over yeah use

kind of stuff you know I speaking of this like I I did not unlock deep tissue massage until way later way later same I thought it was I thought it was silly I thought it was like more of meditation yoga thing I did not think

I didn't think there's any benefits at all To muscle. Oh, it wasn't, I don't think it was until my mid, mid to late 20s before I got really introduced to like a sports massage. Yeah. And it like unlocked a whole other level to me that I'm like, damn, man, I wish I was more open to this when I was younger. And so I can only imagine at that age, like, huh? What? Why?

No. It doesn't make sense. I had a massage therapist in my studio that was so good. Was that finally when you did unlock for you too? Because that was like late 20s or 30s for you also. Exactly. So they would train with me and they'd have dysfunction. I do correctional exercise.

They'd work with her either before or after and they improve so much faster. And then I was like, oh, maybe I should try this for myself. It makes a huge difference. I mean, I feel so, it's crazy how everything kind of just aligned perfectly with when we were first starting to build this business and I was competing and kind of using that as like a little bit of, to get some attention and attraction for the show. And that was also right when Katrina and I were first starting to date and she was also still running a massage clinic and was.

massaging me. I got massaged every night for like well over a year of consistency. I swear that unlocked my ability to train at the volume and intensity I did to get that. Jay Cutler was big on it too. He was huge on it. And you get a pump after, by the way, you get a pump after good massage. Yeah. The blood flow increases. Yeah. And you speed up recovery like crazy. Yeah. And so if you have if you have high training volume and training as hard as I was training back then, like, I, you know, if I didn't have that, I don't think that I reached the level or definitely don't put on the size and get to where I was at in the short time I did. It's funny, though, uh, so this is, I knew this was going to eventually happen, but like

teenagers, you kind of have a stereotype, they're going to all of a sudden eat you out of the house. He's like six full meals, like, every day. Isn't that crazy? Yeah. And it's like heavy protein, like lots of protein. And he's, I mean, he's starting to really fill out, like, even since last you guys seen him, like, working in here.

and I'm just like tripping out like it's just like I with him especially and again you never know because like your kids are different personalities and whatnot but like I'm like him being the buff one I didn't see it coming you know he's he's a he's a beast right now so it's interesting yeah that's cool it's cool element is an electrolyte powder you add it to your water it has enough sodium to actually make a difference most electrolyte powder is too low in sodium to actually make a difference not element by the way it's sugar free no artificial sweet It's amazing. It tastes good. And it works, hydrates you. I get better pumps in the gym when I drink them. Anyway, go to go to drink elemente.com forward slash mind pump. On that link, you'll get a free sample pack of their most popular drink mix flavors with any purchase. Back to the show. Our first question is from Jenea May. What should your training look like while on a cut? Heavy weight, low volume, low weight, high volume, slow down tempo, etc. I know you don't build on a cut, but I want to do the best I can to maintain the muscle I already have. Well, that last part of the question really speaks to what's important when you're on a cut. When you're on a cut, obviously the ultimate goal is to lose body fat.

That's why people want to cut. The second goal is to preserve as much muscle as possible. You don't want to lose muscle on a cut because that makes the subsequent cut or the as you progress with the cut much more difficult. Because your metabolism starts to adapt. And one of the ways it adapts is it starts to, your body starts to pare down muscle. So the goal with your training always on a cut is to preserve, the number one goal is always to preserve as much muscle as possible. Now, the problem or the challenge with that is people think, okay, I want to preserve muscle. That means they need to hit my body harder with strength training.

I need to do more strength training, more volume. That's the wrong approach. Your calories are lower. Your nutrients are lower. your ability to recover and adapt are lower because of the lowered caloric intake. Your body can't handle as much stress on lower calories. So the key is actually to do less. So you still want a strength train, but you want to do less volume.

And that typically looks like less sets, less exercises, and oftentimes lower reps. So people don't realize that increasing the amount of reps that you do, even if the weight is lighter, generally means you're doing more volume. The formula for volume is sets times reps times weight. It's not a perfect formula, but it gives you a nice good idea. So typically in a cut, believe or not, and of course there's always caveats, which I'm sure we'll get into, you want lower volume, lower reps, and some less sense. Which, okay, I actually don't think you even need to change to this. I think it organically happens when you're in a cut. so when I'm following a program and I go into a cut I'm weaker just I mean I'm lower calorie I'm

fatigued quicker which is going to organically lower volume I'm I'm going to do the same programming that I was doing the week before when I was in a bowl or surplus the difference is when I go I I just I accept that when I probably go to get that put that weight on I won't be as strong as I was the previous week and that's okay I'm not pushing it I'm not going like oh I got to do the same wait as I did last week. It's like, oh, I'm going to, this is all I'm moving today because I don't have the same energy and strength, but I'm going to go through the same amount of sets for me. I don't change it because the volume comes down because I'm weaker. And so what the mistake that I think people do is because they try and ramp up the volume because they notice that they're

weaker and they try and do more trying to gain, which that's a recipe for going the wrong direction. Well, a lot of times the ramping up comes from the idea that they need to burn more calories or that or that, which is just, it's just not a good way. good approach. Look, the amount of volume required to build muscle is higher than the volume that is required to keep muscle. That's right. And trying to build muscle in a deficit is, is not a good approach. You're reduced caloric intake, reduced nutrient intake. It's not going to happen. Yeah, true strength signal is, is the best move here. And so, yeah, I mean, if there's any element of endurance, like, it's probably not beneficial at this point being as

you're not providing yourself with that adequate amount of energy to expend. And so it's going to look a lot more like longer rest periods. You know, you're going to use these bouts of intensity to just press, you know, these compound lifts. So it really looks like a true, like, strength training regimen. Yeah, I think the point you made and where you're going right now is the, it's like, let's talk about what the, probably the biggest mistake people make.

Here's what they do. They're on a cut. They start doing cardio and they start doing a bunch of supersets. and moving faster in the workout trying to chase like a sweat and burn. Like that's like the worst thing you could do. In fact, all the opposite. Like Justin's saying, longer rest periods, focus on lifting. You're not going to be stronger, but try and be stronger, right?

So you're lifting heavy, you're giving long the rest periods. You're not doing a bunch of cardio endurance. So the worst thing you do is go in a calorie deficit, pick up all kinds of cardio and pick up volume and intensity in your training. And it is so common. It's common in the professional, like, you see it with all the pros. It's crazy. Again, it was one of these things that you might have heard me comment on the podcast

that I thought was like a massive advantage. I'm like, man, these guys are just way doing this wrong. There's three ways to lose a lot of muscle in a cut, okay? That's it right there. One is don't strength train. Two is over train. Three is do a ton of cardio. All three of those.

Four is cut a bunch of calories while you do all that. Too many calories. Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm talking about you cut calories. All right, how should I train if I want to lose muscle? Do what I just said. How should I train if I don't want to lose muscle? Lower volume, strength, training, focus on getting stronger, longer rest periods.

That's what it looks like. Next question is from C-Moss 23. I wanted to do the top eight exercises for six weeks. I have five days a week and 30 minutes a day. How would you go about programming it? The grade eight. Yeah, the great eight. You're doing one to two exercises a day.

Doug, if you could pull up the list, it's squats, dead lifts. Like two a day? Yeah, but okay, what order? Let's order them for them. Okay. Yeah, so they kind of have... Because two a day will fall in that 30-minute range perfectly. Yep, yep.

Pick either your squat or deadlift is a good one to start with. Yeah, so it goes squat. There's a squat deadlift. There's an incline press. There's a row, overhead press. I think there's a lateral slide drag. There's a windmill and then a perfect sit-up. If I'm not mistaken.

Did I get them all there, Doug? Yeah, I believe so. If you could put them on so I could just look at them and then order them all in the workout for five days. I'll break that down for somebody. Give them kind of a good idea of what it's going to look like. There you go. So day one, you could go squat, incline press. Day two, deadlift, overhead press.

Day three, row, lateral sled drag. Day four, windmill, and perfect sit-up. And then day five, you could start with squat, take two days off, and repeat the cycle. There you go. Yeah. And then you got a great, great routine. Great eight. That's what it is.

Great eight. Next question is from Sue's Germain. Is it okay to exercise daily as a 59-year-old woman as long as I vary my workouts, different muscle groups for strength four or five days per week, cardio, two to three days per week, et cetera? It depends on the intensity. It depends on what exercises and what you're talking about. If you're strength training every day, you're probably doing one or two lifts a day. as a 59-year-old woman.

Yeah. Maintain your cardio and you're good. The challenge or the difficulty or the problem, well, that happens with everyday hard workouts, everyday, you know, long workouts. You get to undulate your intensity and, you know, pay attention to that in volume. So, yeah, if you keep your volume really low

and maybe you, you know, have an intense day and you follow it up with a less intense day, you could pretty much do it each and every day. I think the most important things you're saying is that I'm hearing is intensity and volume, and this person's asking the wrong question, they're asking about varying the workout. So this is not a matter of,

can I train every day because I vary it up, doing different exercises, different type of stuff. No, that'll be too much. It's probably a lot of volume. You heard Sal say two exercises a day. So if you're training every single day, it's probably like a math 15 type of routine.

Two exercises, that's it. You varying them up, but still training an hour a day every day, especially with also two to three days a week of also cardio. Throw in, yeah, like mobility focused days and they're one to two times a week. Of course.

If you can't break it up, that'd be ideal. Of course, but Matt's 15 for this person right here would be perfect. Yep. Next question is from Snackpack 86. How do you combat high hematicrit and high hemoglobin on TRT? That's easy. So you do run the risk, some people, when they're on TRT or their body produces too many red blood cells, okay?

And this is a problem. This could cause issues. Now, there's a range of where your red blood cells can be. But if they get too high, you can run the risk of things like heart attack or stroke, blood clots, stuff like that. This is an easy fix. You give blood. Give blood, yeah. That's it.

In fact, bodybuilders who are not on TRT, they're very, very high doses will schedule themselves two or three a year when they give blood. You can get a prescription for this, by the way. So you can go to your doctor. hey, I have high, you know, red blood cell count. And what they'll do is they'll schedule you for, you know, for a, for them to take blood from you. And it's not actually donating. They're just taking the blood from you to remedy this. It's, again, it's pretty simple.

Or. Giving it to Doug for later. Yeah. Or if you're healthy. If you get bathed in it. Sorry, I had to throw it. Or if you're healthy and you want to go donate blood, you go to your local Red Cross. and you do their tests

and then you give blood. I do this once or twice a year, both for the health benefits, but I also have type O blood. So it's a universal blood type. And by the way, most men, the studies will show, giving blood once a year as healthy for men once a year anyway, regardless if you're on TRT or not.

So that's it, easy fits. And you get a cookie. I'm not giving any of my blood away. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. We'll see you at Mind Pump Media. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. Your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and

maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbundle at Mind Pumpmedia.com. The RGB Superbundle includes MAPS Anabolic, Maps Performance, and Maps Aesthetic, nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal, Adam, and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee,

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