Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2789: 5 Weird but Effective Ways to Add Muscle.

Episode Date: February 7, 2026

Mind Pump Fit Tip: 5 Weird but Effective Ways to Add Muscle. (1:52) The power of God. (23:01) The shift in culture and media. (25:27) Age difference. (28:09) Probiotics for fat loss. (35:30) Crazy patents that exist. (39:03) Androgen receptor density and old-man strength. (41:35) Fighting anti-aging with Caldera. (46:33) Better men lift each other up. (49:52) Mind Pump Recommends Breakdown: 1975 on Netflix. (57:27) #ListenerCoaching call #1 – I've completed Anabolic Advanced and Old Time Strength, which program would you recommend next? (1:08:12) #ListenerCoaching call #2 – Stuck in bad habits from years of body image issues and unhealthy eating habits. How can I continue to move forward without feeling like I need to track my food? (1:15:42) #ListenerCoaching call #3 – How can I look like I lift? (1:27:23) #ListenerCoaching call #4 – I'm a 51-year-old female wanting to be as healthy as possible, but struggling with motivation to workout and food noise. (1:42:22) Related Links/Products Mentioned Get Coached by Mind Pump, live! Visit https://www.mplivecaller.com Visit Caldera Lab for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! **Code MINDPUMP20 for 20% off your first order of their best products. ** Visit Seed for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Code 20MINDPUMP for 20% off your first month of Seed's DS-01® Daily Synbiotic. ** February Promotion: Feb 1 - Feb 14th - The Couple's Bundle (Aesthetic, HIIT, Muscle Mommy, No BS 6-Pack Abs), $498 value, only $197!  Visit: https://www.mpvalentine.com  Mind Pump Store The Soviet Training Secrets That Built Unbreakable Strength and Endurance Occlusion Training Tutorial- How to Increase Muscle Size Using Blood Flow Restriction – Mind Pump TV Muscle Building Secrets of Isometrics - Mind Pump Media Jelly Roll Preaches the Gospel on Netflix's 'Star Search' Everyone Is Roasting Raiders Owner Mark Davis Over His Comments About 26-Year-Old Girlfriend Hayden Hopkins Probiotics for weight loss: a systematic review and meta-analysis Child Birth by Centrifugal Force How androgen receptors impact testosterone effect | Carole Hooven, Ph.D. Science - Caldera + Lab Watch Breakdown: 1975 | Netflix Official Site Visit Organifi for the exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! **Code MINDPUMP at checkout for 20% off** Muscle Mommy Movement Mind Pump #2560: How to Break Free from Destructive Body Image Issues Mind Pump #2690: The NEW DIET Everyone Is Using For Fat Loss Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources People Mentioned Peter Attia, M.D. (@peterattiamd) Instagram Arthur Brooks (@arthurcbrooks) Instagram Jordan Syatt (@syattfitness) Instagram Michael Israetel (@drmikeisraetel) Instagram Corinne Schmiedhauser (@mindpumpcorinne) Instagram  

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind pump, mind pump with your hosts. Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded fitness, health, and entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode, we had callers call in and we got to coach them live on air. So people with fat loss goals or muscle building, strength training, whatever. We get to help them out.

by the way, if you want to be on an episode like this, send your question to MPLifeCallor.com. Now, that segment happened after the intro. The intro today was 65 minutes long. This is where we talk about fitness and fat loss and current events and all kinds of cool stuff. Now, this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Seed.

This is the world's best probiotic. Now, I highlight studies that show that probiotics help with fat loss and muscle gain. It's true. Lots of studies. No joke. Go check it out. Go to Seed.com forward slash mind pump.

use the code 20 mind pump and get 20% off your first month's order. This episode's also brought to by Caldera Lab. Today we talked about their clinical trials. You've got to go on their website. Check out the four week before and afters. These are real clinical trials. Go to calderaLab.com forward slash mind pump. And if you use the code mind pump 20, you'll get 20% off.

We also have a sale. We have something called the couples bundle. This is four programs, 50% off altogether in a bundle. Maps aesthetic. Maps hit, Maps muscle mommy, and the no BS six-pack formula. All of it, 50% off. You get them all for 197. Go check them out.

Go to MP valentine.com. All right, real quick, if you love us like we love you, why not show it by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs, or training gear over at Mindpumpstor.com. I'm talking right now, hit pause, head on over to Mindpumpstor.com. That's it. Enjoy the rest of the show. When it comes to building muscle, the consistent is true.

Strength train, eat high protein, be consistent with it, get good sleep. But there are some weird things you could do that have been shown, proven to add some muscle to your body. And they're weird because you don't do them all the time. But there's data supporting them. And we've seen them work ourselves. We have experience with them with clients and ourselves. So we're going to tell you about these weird ways that actually build muscle. They really work.

Check it out. I live in the weird, cell. Yeah, I was actually looking at this. I'm trying to think of, oh, there's a couple of these. actually you definitely do. Yeah. There's, uh,

I, I see three that Justin does. Yeah. I mean, we've all played with. Well, no, the first one is,

I, I, I, I, I, I, the first one is the only one that I feel like

you really have done. Like, truly tested. I've done like, versions of this first one, but not like, like, how you have. It's so.

And it's on my list of, I need to do this. Yeah, well, I want to be clear. The reason why they're weird is because they're not, these aren't things you do all the time.

Yeah, And they don't replace the staples. So they're not going to replace the things. They're interruptors. In other words, if you're not doing the basics, the important stuff, then don't waste your time doing this stuff. Like don't practice, you know, spinning, you know, backwards slam dunks when you can't dribble, right?

You got to practice the basics because they give you the most output. And you guys are laughing. It's like you take my analogies and just bastardize them. Got you. I like it. I like it. It's my analogy. You've been bastardized it.

That's a thing. That's basketball, right? I've never heard it. It's basketball right. Describe it. All right. All right. Go sports.

Go. Go. Here we go. Stick to your own analogies, bro. Hey, listen. Listen, just talk about mitochondria over there. All right. So look, here's one of them.

And I've done this before, and it's wild. And I got this idea. Actually, a long time. I never really put it into practice until much later. But I got this idea by reading on how, how the Soviets train their Olympic athletes. And then in general, the science of strength training

is the best in Olympic lifting. They have the most science because countries compete with Olympic lifting and they spend a lot of money on it. It's the most scientific form of strength training. That doesn't mean... Lots of government funding.

That's right. It doesn't mean you need to apply how they train because it's different than bodybuilding. It's different than other forms of strength training. It's not appropriate for everybody. But they've invested so much money and time I mean, the Soviet Union at one point was like...

They were all in. All in. And they had athletes living in their labs, essentially. And they produced like crazy athletes. Crazy. They dominated. And it was because they just really applied the scientific method. Found out later they cheated a lot.

Yeah. Well, I mean, look, and that's, I'm glad you brought that up. You ain't trying. Athletes were using anabolics all over the place. When the iron curtain fell down when the Soviet Union dissolved and their coaches came over here and went to other countries, you suddenly saw people... All of a sudden there's an explosion of. Yeah, so their training methods were remarkable. And one thing that they did was they would extend workouts for super long.

Now, it's not because they did tons of exercises. It's because they would do an exercise and they'd take a long time in between. And then they'd do another one. And then they'd take a long time in between. And then they'd go eat and then they'd come back and do it again. And a lot of athletes were taking all that total volume and putting it kind of in one workout. Whereas the Soviets were doing this thing where they were having athletes in there for five or six hours or eight hours because they would kind of spread it. it out and my idea was I wonder what happened if I kind of took a high volume workout that I would

do maybe that would take me an hour and a half or so and I just spread it out over a whole day. Yeah. Like what if I did a few sets at 9 a.m. and then I would come back at 11 a.m. and do a few more sets and come back again at one and did another few sets. What if I did this to like 5 p.m. And in between I would eat and in between I would rest, maybe a little stretching. Like what would happen? Well, I'll tell you what happened. I got stronger. And it was wild. It was really crazy what I got from something like this.

So this is something you can experiment with. And it's obviously not for everybody, but especially if you have a home jam. It's wild. The strength gains that you get. It's a fun experiment. I did it one time after you had mentioned it. And it was wild because you do realize,

like you're capable of a lot of volume as long as you spread it out throughout the day. Because you can recover. And then it's interesting how much. better you get at the lift because it's like if you allow for more rest in between like your body just responds and recognizes

it more powerfully. I want to brand these. Yeah. Like I mean there's not really a name for this right? Sal's workout. Cluster day. Cluster days. A cluster day? Because it reminds me of like a cluster set. Oh sure. Done all through the day. And one of the things that like blew my mind about cluster sets was

that ability to like the amount how heavy of a weight that you could do just by these little break, these little breaks. Now that cluster set has done it in a short period of time. It's like you wait 15 seconds. And so it's like the, in my, in my, like the kind of things, like a cluster day. It's like it's the day you're doing, you're not doing a lot of volume in these little work, these little micro workouts or, you know, all day micro workout would be another thing you could call it. But I've, I haven't done it to the extent that you have. But there was times, and this was back when I was competing and

training all the time, where I would, I'd have these workouts where I'd be the, I'd go to the gym three times. Like I would just, I'd come in the morning and then I'd do a little bit of a little bit of work. And then I'd come out and then I'd also walk because I was trying to move a lot at the time and then come back in the afternoon and then come back in the evening. And I just saw it. And I wasn't really adding a lot more. I was just, I was breaking it up as I was doing. And it was awesome. It's super fun. The thing that blew me away. All three workouts, I felt so strong. Yes. If I put all of it together, you know, when you're when you're, when you're, when you're, when you're, especially you're training as long as we've all been training. you, when you get about 30 to 45 minutes into your workout, like, you feel like you're getting stronger for the first 20 to 30 minutes. And then you feel like you kind of, and then the back, you feel it, you can feel like around 40, 45 minutes an hour. Especially with good intensity.

Yeah, exactly. Like, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're tailoring off. This is where the old, like, finisher sets and exercises. Yeah, junk volume comes in. It's because, like, those exercises, and you tend, if you do it right, you put the ones that are really important in the front and these less important exercises towards the end, you're not really whereas if I spread it out in the day like that I could do all these major exercises and I feel really strong

and all of them and when you think of the total time I'm working out and we're not as much or more time but it's spread out what's what's wild to me here's what I experienced doing this so mine look like this I would pick two or three exercises and I would do three sets of each so typically it was two exercises and I do like squats and bench press or something like that and I do the same exercises all day because the idea was like let me get let me just see what I could do with these exercises and I would would pick a weight that I could do five or six reps with that normally I'd do 10 reps with.

So that's the intensity. Okay. So it's heavy, but it's not like hard. And I do five reps, three sets for squat. And then I'd go to bench and do three sets. What was weird is by the time I got to, so it started at 9 a.m. Then it would come back at 11. Then I'd come back at 1 p.m.

And the 3 p.m. I was stronger. It was weird. It was like I was getting stronger as the day went on. And then as the day continued to go on, then I didn't notice a little bit of fatigue. But by the end of the day, I did all these. of squat, all these sets of bench press, and then I come back to do those lifts, you know, four or five days later, I was like really strong. It was really, really wild. It's a lot of fun.

Yeah, I did the same with that. It was just squat and overhead press. But like, yeah, like you said, it just, it kind of ramped up. I just kept getting, you know, stronger, stronger, and then slowly towards the end and started kind of tapering off. The only thing was the downside was I was pretty sore, dude. Yeah. Pretty damn sore. Yeah. Well, knowing you, you probably went too hard. I definitely teetered over the threshold. Yeah, so next up is blood flow restriction training. I don't see people talk about this anymore, but about 10 years ago, lots of people were talking

about this. This is a super weird way to add quick muscle. It's really, really strange. And it was discovered years ago by, I think it was a physical therapist or scientist who noticed when he would sit on his knees for long periods of times, he would get included in his calves because his calves wouldn't get good blood flow. and they'd get swollen. It'd be like swelling from it, like almost like a pump.

And so he started studying this, and this became a physical therapy method. And so the way they would use it is, if you have an injured knee, we can't put much load on your legs. But we want a strength train still. So what do we do? How do we work around that? You can't put much load, but we want a strength train. So what they would do is they would use a device, and you can use a knee wrap for this, and you tied around the top of your thigh, tight enough to cause occlusion.

So not so tight that you lose. feeling, but tight enough to where blood is not coming out like it did before. It's going in, but not coming out as much. Then they would do some sets of an exercise like leg extensions. And what happens is because you can't get rid of the waist byproduct of the exercise fast enough, it fatigues and it starves the muscle enough to where the fast-twitch muscle fibers act as if they're lifting heavy weight. And so it's simulating heavy weight and you get similar results. Now, I experimented with this and I never added It burns.

It sucks. But the fastest half inch I ever added to my calves was adding BFR. It was like three weeks. I had like a half inch to my calves from doing this. Pretty wild. We've known this in physical therapy for a long time. Long time. I know that professional athletes in particular, I think it started in hockey,

have been using this for a really long time. And it's awesome for that. Like, I think it's a cool, like you've labeled this, weird hacks. to build muscle if you've never messed around with it. I saw the same things, especially with cabs. But really, really cool tool for trainers for rehabbing clients. You know, how many times have you got a client that, you know, is fresh off of a knee surgery and gone through their rehab? And now you're the one who's training them, you know, before it's like, and, you know, you're probably not a good idea to go backload, you know,

and load up a bunch of weight and squat right out the gates early on in this person's training. But I definitely can include them and do some. exercises with that and really get this crazy pump and make it feel like they trained really intense with really lightweight super valuable you pick really lightweight you do a lot of reps you rest for 30 seconds you repeat rest 30 seconds repeat and you will be surprised at how few reps you could do by the second and third set and the fire that you feel there is no burn I felt in my life like occlusion yeah blood flow rest I was just fact checking myself who the origin of it was a doctor in Japan.

Japan. Yeah. Japanese doctor. That's, I, for some reason I thought it was the- Katsu was his last thing. Yeah.

Yeah. And then it gets first introduced. And hockey was, you're right. Okay, yeah. Then it was, then it was hockey who they first started using it. And now all athletes,

it's like a known rehab strategy that they can do really, even when the, when the, the client is still recovering, you know what I'm saying, because it's not a lot of risk because it's so low of weight and resistance. It works best on the extremities, arms and legs.

And you, you would add, you know, this to the end of one of your workouts in a week. And it's crazy. And you get the most crazy pump you've ever had in your life. I play with it a lot and I really liked it. But I started, and I saw such great results from it. I did the typical, you know, knucklehead trainer thing is like I started to, it started to replace other things.

No, you can't do that. And then what I realized was that it's awesome, it's good, it's not better than traditional strain training. And so it complements it really well. It'll add like 10, 15%. It's best if you have restrictions, like you said, like for rehab or in that regard, or his novelty. Yeah, yeah, 100%.

Next up is super slow motion training. Now, this was a method of strength training that came about during World War II. So during World War II, they were rationing metals, iron. You couldn't make dumbbells and weights because they needed it for the war efforts. And so in the 1940s, there weren't a lot of gyms, but there were a few gems.

This is when bodybuilding and strength training started to kind of grow. And so the gyms were stuck with like 20 pound dumbbells and like light barbells. And so what did the athletes do? They said, okay, well, instead of, you know, two or four seconds on the descent and two or four seconds on the positive, what if I made it 30 seconds? What if I did a 30 second negative and a 30 second positive? And this created super slow motion training. And if you do this all the time, it's not great.

But if you do it every once in a while, it's pretty awesome. It's really, and you can do this with any exercise. Pick a really lightweight, though. It's way harder than you. Well, there's an entire franchise that's across the country built off of this. And they really, they target advanced age people. Yeah. It's really safe.

Yeah, that's what makes it. This is a great way you have a client who's, you know, advanced age. So 70 plus, never really strength train. You're trying to reverse or slow down osteoporpeachial. process, you're trying to do something like that. Here's a really cool way to do that with low risk, right? Like, uh, you, you, we all know the benefits of building muscle from, you know, the big compound list, but you get 70 year old frail client who's never lifted before. There's very high risk with doing some of these movements. Great way to start them is these, you know, isometrics

or really, really slow movements with a little bit of resistance and safe and great way to muscle. For the average person, here's where I see the benefit of this. But one, novelty, that's always cool. But two, if you have trouble feeling a muscle, this is great. Yeah, yeah. You're doing a compound lift like a row or a press. And you're like, man, I don't feel it my chest. I don't feel it my lats.

Go real light, make it a 30 second negative, a 30 second positive, where you're just focusing on the muscle. You'll feel the muscle. It's one of the best ways of it can be. Or like if you've been out of training for a long period of time, you're coming back in, you know, just to provide you with a best, amount of stimulus and intensity. I feel like it's a great way to reconnect.

I'm doing this right now. So one of my, like I'm, right now, strength is ramped up. And I have been really fearful of moving past 80 pound dumbbell presses. Now, I started at like 50, 60s, worked my way up. Oh, because you're picked her. And yes. Oh, yeah. And so now I'm at 80s.

And I'm moving 80s really. easy. And I want to go 90, 100, keep going. And I'm just, instead of doing that, I'm moving the 80s really slow. And so I don't want to, because that's, I re-enjured it, if those that followed my journey, barbell pressing after I had the tear. So I tore, tore my peck minor, um, when I was wakeboarding, and then rehabbed, you know, did all the things, came back. And then I was, I was bench pressing. It wasn't even, I want to see it was like 185 barbell. Just wasn't ready. And just re-injured it.

And so, you know, again, I can feel, I can feel it missing. I can feel it's not right. But I can also still do dumbbell presses. And I've gotten strong again. And now I've ramped all the way up to 80. And now I'm at that place where I'm like, okay, I could go to 90 or 100. I'm moving 80s for a lot of reps. And since I'm running out of reps, now I'm going, okay, let me slow down the tempo.

The two times I've used this for clients is one. I don't feel my lats. I don't feel my chest. I don't feel my delts. Go real slow and then we're able to really connect. The other time is, and I know you guys have seen this, right? And people have experienced this. When you haven't worked out in a while and then you go to do an exercise and it's shaky.

It's almost like your muscles are laughing. They're like, da, da, da, da, da. This is what I'll do with the client. So we're doing a press and they're kind of shaking. Like, I'm shaky. What's going on? I'll go light and I'll go, we're going to go slow. We do one set like this and the shaking stops and we connect and we go back to a normal press.

Next up. a form of an isometric lift called overcoming. So overcoming isometrics is when I'm trying to lift something or press something or pull something that I can't move. Yeah, immovable object. This is actually my favorite form of isometrics. I mean, everybody's familiar with just holding a pose or a position. But I feel like this is really a way to maximize your efforts and really ramp up the recruitment. You get way more recruitment this way, don't you?

Oh, this is the advanced. This is the muscle building isometric. This one will really fry you if you. This one right here, when you look at the data on isometrics, this is the one of all the contractions, all the ways you can lift. If you were to try to get gains of strength or force production in three weeks or four weeks, like you're advanced. Let's say you're advanced.

I'm good. I'm strong. I haven't been able to add weight to my squat or whatever. If you did this for three weeks, you would see a 40% increase in your force production. It's crazy how much you increase your force production. short period of time. Yep. This is advanced, but this produces crazy short-term gains.

So if you've been like plateauing for a while, do a whole week or two of this with some of your main lifts. Go back to your lift again and watch what happens. It's pretty wild. Yeah, it's awesome. Next is post-activation potentiation. I love this. Which is, this has a lot of data supporting it.

It activates more muscle fibers, increases neural activation, same thing, builds more muscle. here's what it looks like. You do an explosive movement first. Then you go do your, oh, sorry, you do a heavy lift first. Then you do your explosive movement. So the heavy lift recruits the central nervous system, gets the muscle fibers ready. Then you move to something explosive. So what it looks like is, and you pick a weight that's 80 to 90% of your max.

So you go do a heavy squat, one rep or two reps, rack it up, and then you wait three minutes and then you do a jump. Jump. Yeah. And this is literally what I did to test out for vertical jump. And it works fantastic. You get a higher jump. You get a higher jump. And it's strange because I think, you know, for me, it was like, well, this doesn't seem like logical because, you feel.

Yeah, you're like in a grinding type of exercise. But really it just gets everything lighting up and recruited to now that's useful force that I can apply. So I remember early on early certifications reading about this and understanding this, but never really. applying it or seeing it. And I remember when I first realized the potential of it. And I had pull-ups had been in my routine for a while. So I had a good relative idea of like how hard a pull-up was and how many I could do and some of that.

And I had just done a really heavy deadlift. Oh, you just flew up. And I jumped up to do a pull-up just to kind of mess around. And I went, whoa. Like it's a pro- You just hit the bar. Bro, it's a pro it was I was so strong and I felt so light. I had never felt that before.

And I went, whoa, I'm like, oh, that's what that is. Like, and I, up into that point, read about it, knew about it, never actually really messed that much with it or applied it. It's like, just like this, you know, niche thing that doesn't really apply to me. I don't really need to use it. It's not something I care about. When I did that, it blew my mind what a cool tool is. You know, the, um, the, um, the, um, the, um, um, the, um, um,

What's the reverse called? So you can also do where you do... Explosive and then go heavy? Yes. It's not called anything, but I've done that before. Yeah. So that's why we were getting confused. Yes.

I've used both. Because this is also really useful. Like a lot of times when I was short on time on like priming and warming up and I knew I wanted to get into like some heavy squats, I would do a couple explosive jumps, just jump squats to get. And it just kind of wakes everything up. Maybe pre-activation potentialation. Yeah. I'm pretty sure there is.

there is the name for the reverse because the reverse is a tool also. You can use that before you're going into a heavy grinding squat, do a couple of quick jumps in the air, like explosive, just two or three of them real quick. And then go in there and it wakes that CNS up. And so it's another way to kind of prime all those muscles because if you move them explosively, and I've done it with bench press before, where real light white and then I get on it and then I load it with a really heavy weight

and then you're just better connected. And so both work really well. and are super cool to experiment with getting into your list. I think especially if you're an advanced lifter, besides the rehab applications for some of these. If you're an advanced lifer, have fun with these. I know. It's a blast and it's pretty cool.

The novelty alone makes a difference. Yeah, it just shows you how many more options there are to explore. There's so many things like you can do to train the body. Dude, I got to bring this up because I forgot to bring this up yesterday. So you know that clip you sent me, Adam, of Jellie Roll? and he was doing the, he's like a judge on a show. Yes, yes, yes.

What show is that? Star Search, I think. Something like that, right? So there's this, it's viral, it's going viral right now. So it's this clip and there's,

it's him, he's one of the judges. And apparently the singer had just stopped. And Jelly Roll, who's this artist, is like, he's like tearing up.

It's very emotional. Now, if you don't know who Jelly Roll is, he's had a crazy story, hard life, becomes a Christian, talks about all the time, like huge change to his life.

The dude who finished singing also has the face tattoos and stuff. Almost like, it's like, almost like brothers. It looks identical. And I get, and so he's talking about how, you know, he's had a tough life. This is the singer. He was addicted to drugs. He finds Jesus.

It saves his life. It's the greatest thing, whatever. So Jelly Roll's like, oh, my God, this is crazy. And he picked Jelly Roll song to sing. So Jelly Roll then goes back and says, man, I was praying that I could have an opportunity to talk about God. So it's really cool moment. But here's what I'm bringing this up.

because there was like two seconds of that clip that I noticed. I'm like, Justin will, for sure. Justin has this uncanny ability to notice evil people. He's got crazy discernment.

Crazy. I love his discernment because he's always on point. So there's like a, I know you missed it. I did. There's like a two second where the camera pans. Christy Teigen is one of the judges. Much how uncomfortable she gets.

They're mentioning Jesus and God and you can see her face like, like the demons in her did. I did not. I did not catch this. Needs to say I'm not a fan of her. I don't know much about her. There's a lot of stuff about her and John Legend and some of the posts they did in the past with their, they're just, I don't know, code words that means something.

There's ties. Yeah, it's all that kind of stuff. Oh, I'm willing to go look into that. Like the, yeah, they're like pizza. Now I want to go look back and look at the clip. Oh, man. It's worse than diddy kind of stuff. Yeah, bad stuff.

Yeah, bad stuff. But it's funny because, like, I saw two seconds of her face. like, oh, I got to show Justin, because I know for sure. Right away, when he's watching, he's like, oh, he said so, like, oh, Christy Teagan. We're like, a demon. Yeah, she's burning inside right now. But as soon as they mentioned that, her face is like, well, I was like, why are you so? That's weird.

Yeah, dude. That's so weird. That's so hilarious. Such a cool clip, though. Such a cool clip, dude. Yeah, it's powerful. Such a cool. I mean, I'm tripping out, though.

Like, I've been talking about it, like, the shift in our culture. Yeah. And the shift in the media is just like. I don't know. I struggle with how I feel about it. Oh, the media's fake. You would think, you know what it is? And Justin sent over something yesterday.

That was fascinating. The sound thing, right? And then, like, how our brain recognizes the patterns. And it's like, once you hear this weird sound. You get primed. Yeah, you get primed like that. Yeah, then you hear it forever. So there's a part of me that, like, oh, this is a good message.

And that's good, this is all good stuff. But it's just like, I don't like. I don't like feeling like I'm being primed. Like they're trying to pull a fast one? Yeah. And so why? Because I don't want to be this person who was the anti-woke crapping on all the media content and everything like that two years ago. And media is evil, bad.

And then now all of a sudden I'm like, yay, media. They're sharing all the stuff that I like. It's like they don't give a shit about either one. Because now you're still being manipulated. Yes. I'm still being. Yes. Either way, you're getting manipulated.

And like how many people fall into that trap? Yeah. How many people fall into that trap of like you're like no, they're not on your team. Yep. They're not on your team. No. And the media is, come on. Media just, they just want to sell you stuff.

That's a fact. That's 100%. But there's, I'll tell you what. There's a verse for that. Because I brought this up to Chad. Because I was like, you know what, Chad? So Chad's a pastor. I work with, you know, I work with them once a week or so.

And I'm like, man, I'm noticing like this stuff that's happening and it's getting more popular. But, you know, I get, I get really. what's the word like a skeptical you know and it's like if you don't reminds me of it's like when they remember when they had like uh you know pride month and they all these companies promoting pride but then you saw their their their middle east ads yeah completely different and they're totally different and everyone's like oh these companies support us they don't they're just doing what they did you'd support everywhere yeah you would do that in iran but you know right

so my so i'm skeptical with that so he he showed me a verse from philippians and i'm not going to read the whole verse but essentially it says it doesn't matter what the motives are because it's still getting preached. And it's literally in that verse. So I'm like, okay, cool. So, yeah, I don't trust media at all. Yeah. But fine.

Fine. We still got good messages. Yeah. I mean, that's kind of the attitude I've had about it. It's just like, well, at least it's better stuff. You know what I'm saying? Propaganda or not. Yeah, propaganda or not.

It's like if you figure out how to monetize it. Yeah, yeah. I mean, if you're going to brainwash my son, brainwashing with good morals and positive things. Yeah. You know what I'm saying. Yeah. It's like, because that's what it feels like, it feels like they don't really care.

about, you know, anything other than eyeballs, attention, and that's really... That's really... Yeah, that's really what it's about. I got to tell you guys, so speaking about media and false or whatever. You guys know Mark Davis is, the owner of the Raiders? Yes. Okay. Of course.

Bro, this is the funniest thing. You guys probably already know this, but... No, I don't... Not if it's new news. So... How are you coming up with this new sports news? What are you following now? Nothing.

Just shows up about Tom Brady. Yeah, no, dude. So, have you seen his girlfriend? Doug, look up. Mark Davis' girlfriend. I mean, so I'll just... Is it crazy than Bill Belichick's girlfriend? Yes.

Yes. And then you guys know what Mark David? You know what he looks like? Yes. He's like, he's almost dead. He's like old, he's very old. Overweight. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He's got like a weird bull cut or whatever. Yeah, yeah. Anyway, Las Vegas owner, Mark Davis sparked headlines after saying that his 26-year-old girlfriend, which you'll see... 26. That's his girlfriend. That's him, bro. So listen.

He got interviewed and he goes, oh, no, she had no idea I was a billionaire. She was just like, look at this. He's like, he goes, she just, she fell in love with my smile and my personality. She had no idea as a billionaire. He did not say that. He did. No, he did it. Yes, he did.

It's right there. Like, read that. It's out of here, bro. This is right up there with the lawsuit about the guys because he had too big as long. Yeah, yeah. No. Hey, get out of it.

Okay, that's got to be taken out of context and has to be sarcasm. No, he got interviews. Like from the onion. Come on. Come on.

It's got to be... It's what he said. I don't know. What would you say if you're in his shoes and someone's calling that out? You, you poke fun of it. Yeah, was he like tongue and cheek?

Yeah, that's totally... That's got to be, bro. That's got to be like... Apparently... No, she doesn't know I'm billionaire. She fell in love with my smile. Like, that's... If some reporter's trying to make fun of me,

I'm him, right? Maybe. be told bro come on i hope he does a belief that do some digging dog i'm sure he has to be the most delusional person on the planet you know some people delude themselves to feel better i mean maybe but i bet you i bet you this is taking out of context and this is like him i just cracked me up because i saw it yeah and i was dying of laughter yeah there's no

way that's hilarious yeah she's live you just caught my eye that's to be a joke your smiles i had no idea i mean it's just it makes for it makes for a great meme and conversation for sure i was just like wow Wow, wow. I know. Is that hilarious? Anyway. I mean, okay, you're, you're, okay, you're, you're that.

How old is he? He's, how old? How old is he? He's 70. He's, you're, you're 70 years old. A 26 year old, yeah. Yeah, you're, you're 70 years old. You don't, your kids are way grown by now.

Okay, fast, fast, forward to you. Bro, she's his granddaughter's age. Yeah, I know. Yeah. Do you not? Is like, we just met at a Starbucks and hit it off. I'm just asking you. I'm asking you.

When I date at 26. Your, your wife doesn't exist anymore, or she's moved on or she's passed away. your kids are all grown. You're a single billionaire, okay? And 26-year-old... That's Justin. Well, what's her name? My wife doesn't listen, so, yeah, I'm definitely...

That's... Find me a nice 20-year-old. Well, I mean, okay. Are you out at 70 years old shopping for another 70-year-old lady? I mean... Okay, here's a deal. What does you have in common with her besides the fact that she's young and he wants... What do they do besides sleep with...

I have sex? Like, what's he going to, like, what do you talk about? I mean, do you think that guy... What would you talk about now at your age with a 26-year-old? He'd be like, oh, God, bored. What are we talking about? What are we doing here? Let alone a 70-year-old?

Do you think he doesn't have... He's a dinosaur? Do you think he doesn't have enough hobbies and friends to talk to people and do this, to fill that gap? Okay. I mean, I'm just, I'm just, I want you to think a little bit like a little broader here. Like, you... You're trying to defend him is what you're doing. I mean, yeah, because I would probably be this guy.

If I would, if I, and I would, and my wife listens to the show, she knows that. Like, he's like, I told her, this doesn't work out. Like, it. You're my one. You're my one, man. This is your, yeah, if it doesn't work. Yeah, if it doesn't work, then it's, yeah, it's five, five girlfriends that I don't really care.

You know what I'm saying? And I'll keep my friends and all other stuff like that. And just, I mean, he's, he's got plenty of stuff on his play. He's got plenty of hobbies. He's got plenty of money. He's got plenty of stuff like that. Like, that's the probably part that he can't fill that gap. and a 70-year-old partner

who's gonna... He picks her up from school. They're gonna... She's 26. reads her stories at night. That's funny. It's arm candy. I mean, I'd say,

he gets to walk into dinner and say, you know, I've got one of the hottest chicks at dinner with all his other buddies. Oh, God. You know? Almost like referenced, like, Nikki Minaj or something.

I don't even know, like, an artist right now that would be, like, ridiculous. I mean, she'd pull him to go watch. You know? I mean, Doug, you're approaching that age, Would you date a 26-old? Why am I here?

Yeah, I mean, the politically correct answer is no, of course not. Yeah, I mean. See? Good man. But here's the thing. I'll agree with Sal, too. I mean, you probably don't have a lot in common. I feel like that would be a headache, a nightmare.

Well, depends on the person. Drama. It really does. Depends on the person. She's a 26-year-old who was dating a 70-year-old. What do you think is there? Okay. Yeah, but what I...

What do you think's there? I mean, you can find a hot one with personality. You could also find it. And she could be smart, smart in the fact that, like, listen, I'm, I am, I'm happy with how he lives his life and does his thing. He gives me the freedom to do my thing. When we're together, we have a blast and some of that. When I'm off doing my thing, I'm hanging out with my friends. Like, we have this.

I guarantee he didn't just pick some random 26-year-old that was hot. I guarantee that that's not the only 26-year-old, you hot girl he could have married or hang-bidden girlfriend with it. He found one that probably was like, cool. Like he's like, listen, I don't have to have conversation, 26-year-old conversations all day long. She comes to me at dinner. We have a great time. She looks amazing on my arm. She goes, we go to the boat and she's hanging out next to me, like, you know, on the yacht, you know what I'm saying?

He's not a lot about this. Yeah. And then when I want to go play poker with the boys, she's not giving me shit. She goes, hangs out with her girls. I don't care. You know what I'm saying. Meanwhile, you have kids and grandkids. Come on.

Meanwhile, you got kids and grandkids. You got your granddaughters coming up to you. Grandpa, Adam, who's this? Yeah. I went to school with her. Yeah.

She was younger than me when I was in class. Who is this? Oh, this is Papi's new girlfriend. Come on. You know,

I guess, that is one of the downsides. That's a huge downsides. Okay, so, okay. Come on, dude. It gets publicized because he's obviously in the space of me.

Does this guy, you know, bring, does he marry her? Does he bring her around all his grandkids and so, or is this like,

his girlfriend. You know? It's like, this is my girlfriend. And he does, I don't have to explain that to my granddaughter. You don't hire her. I'm sure she's totally,

I built a ton of her. I'm sure she's totally okay taking the helicopter to Belize with her friends while I go do family time with my grandkids. I'm sure she's not like, why don't I get to go play with the grandkids? I got to go take the helicopter to Belize with my three,

three girlfriends. Right? I mean, don't you think that's how it goes down? I don't know. Yeah, probably. Yeah, I think it's like that. Probably not a helicopter to Belize though.

Yeah. So probably have private jet. All right, I'm changing subject. We just lost every female listener, Adam. Yeah. Good job, dude. I got some studies, some more studies on probiotics. The studies on probiotics on fat loss and muscle gain are starting to compile.

It's wild. Meta analysis. Meta analysis are showing across the board a positive effect on fat loss and probably through speeding up the metabolism. How long until we start to see companies market it as a fat loss? It's coming. They're going to 100%. They're going to start marketing probiotics as fat loss product 100%.

It's got more data. Probiotics have more data supporting them for fat loss than every fat loss supplement that's out there. Is that true? I can't think of a fat loss supplement that's got great data supporting. They don't exist. They don't exist. No. It's pure marketing.

Yeah, dude. So it's pretty cool. I'm looking at there were 45 plus studies that were done to notice an association. All of them notice a positive association. It's kind of interesting why. I wonder, it would be interesting to talk to seed, right? We've been working with a seed for a long time. They're the leaders in the space.

Curious to why they wouldn't do that. If it's got such great... You know how that's one of the touchiest things you can advertise towards. Yeah, exactly. Advertising those claims is rough. Yes. And they're, you know, they're probiotic. They're established.

They do a good job. So it's a good question. I don't know. But here's a thing that I was thinking, right? Metabolism, a big party of metabolism, is the bacteria in your gut. Yeah, of course. That plays a big role in energy production. I mean, breaking food down and, you know, where it goes.

Think of how many clients that we've had and our trainers right now have where they're doing a lot of the things right. But their progress is stalled so bad because they have some sort of gut issue that they're dealing with. And then they solve their gut issue and all of a sudden, bam, they start building muscle, bam, they start losing body fat. Like, it's so important. I think it's more important than the science is caught up to. So here's, so I've been using seed for a long time. and it's like a staple. And I love it.

It really helps with gut health, all that stuff. You know what's really coming in value, what's the value that I'm getting from it a lot right now is that I'm allowed, it's allowing me to push my calories and my protein intake without, because sometimes when you start to push calories and protein, especially when you get past a certain point. It's the gut health. Digestive issues.

That's what stops. You hear this all the time. Wow. Like I go too hot. I can go, I can utilize more of the food that I eat and the nutrients keeps me regular. It makes a huge difference. By the way, do you guys know they have a multivitamin?

Seed? No, I did that. Look them up, Doug. Look up their multivitam. Yes. And I just got it. I've been using it. So here's why I like seed a lot.

A lot of their science goes into the delivery process, which is with probiotics, how do you keep them alive? How do you get them delivered to the right part of the body without them getting broken down, all that stuff? So they use that science with multivitamins. And when you look at nutrients, micronutrients, Some of them get absorbed in this part of the digestive system. Some of them get used in this part of the digestive system.

And figuring out how to get them where you want them to go is a big problem. Usually you just throw them all at the body and whatever comes through comes through. They've used their science in the capsules that they use with the probiotics, also with a multivitamin. So imagining multivitinous in multiple capsules. That's right. So one inside one with different. Oh, wow. Fascinating.

Oh, wow. Oh, that's cool. Yeah, and I've been using it. Oh, wow. Yeah. I haven't seen it. Yeah, and I like it. Do we have any here?

Do you know if we have any here? No, I bought it. I don't want to wait for them to send me one, dude. Oh, that's so funny. Remember they didn't send us there? I mean, it just says how bought it in you are, though. Yeah, it's actually paid for it. The product we get for free, you get to buy it.

Oh, that's cool. You guys want to hear crazy? You guys ever look up crazy patents that actually exist? You ever do? Yeah. Yeah, all the time. There's some weird. No.

It's like my past. It's like you look it up studies. I cannot relate to this conversation at all. Oh, there's weird things that have been patented before. 1965, Doug, look this up. Centrifical force birth delivery, or looked at a birth, birth delivery, centrifical force patent in 1965. What?

A scientist. Like some spinning off like table or something? Cattle, right? You let the cattle come out. You swing them around like that. I don't know that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

No, no, this was a table. Yeah, yeah. Now, this guy invented a table to help deliver babies where a woman lays on it and it spins. So the baby, phew. Look right there. Look right there. Yeah, dude. Facilitating the birth of a child by centrifugal force.

Did you imagine someone in the middle of the... What lady is going to sign up for that? Dude, you... Say it was tested on somebody to get it patent, isn't it? No, they don't have to test it. Oh, you can patent something that not have tested anything. You have to have really good pictures and diagrams. You just think that's going to be a thing.

Somebody thought that was a good. Somebody thought, somebody has, whoever invented this had never been around a real child. Well, how many, they were a childless couple that invented it. Oh,

of course. Wow. So what if we spend like engineers? How many times do patents happen just like a gamble? Like you're hoping that. Most. Oh, yeah.

Most of them. Is that what it is? It is. And a lot of them, I mean, they, they do that to really just try to prevent any competition a lot of times, too,

before they're hiring, yeah, the technology. Yeah. And Apple buys up a lot of, A lot of them if you go in. You'll note that there's a net right in front to catch the baby when it flies out. What, a net?

Thank goodness. I like how the diagram is boobs. What a ridiculous invention. Don't you remember we showed you that one patent, that mouse trap that was with a pistol? Yeah. You saw that one, right? Yeah. It's a mouth, you put your gun on it.

And then the trigger hits and it just shoots. I go through all that money because it's expensive to go all the way through it is isn't it? Oh yeah. Plus you blow brain and to maintain it. And to maintain it. And internationals different from, you know, just. And they expire too, right?

So you have the renew. You have the only few years. Yeah, I went down all that because, you know, obviously I had. Did you. Sal, did you see the clip? I shared a clip of Peter Attia and. So I think a hormone specialist. female hormone specialist doctor talking about testosterone for men and like the argument of that.

Did you see that? No, what do you say? Oh, I just, I thought it was. I mean, I shared it as if, and I said it on the post that if you've been listening to mind pump long enough, we've been talking about this. And you theorized this a long time ago. And I think we've said it many times that you can have two, two men, the same age, same everything, or a lot of things similar, right?

not exactly the same DNA, but there's not to be identical to him, but two men that have 400 test levels, and one of them feels great, builds muscle, all the things, and yet the other one could have all the symptoms of low testosterone. And Peter Atia is theorizing that a lot of that has to, he thinks, to do with enderine receptor density. Yeah, of course. And so, and that's just, and that his ability to upregulate. They did a study, they did this one study to look at the association between natural testosterone levels and your ability to build muscle. So I took a bunch of men and they tested their testosterone and then had them do strength training. And they wanted to see was higher testosterone associated with building more muscle.

Now, all the men were within a kind of in the range. Okay. What was a stronger association was androgen receptor density. I thought they can't measure that. They can with muscle biopsy. Oh. They have to cut it out. No, you can do a muscle biopsy why you're alive.

Because that was one of things Peter Tia was saying is, like, I wish we had a good test. That's not a good test. Like, you can't take people in and bring a piece of their muscle. So what's unfortunate is that we don't have a really good. And it changes. When you strength train, you upregulate, you get more receptors. There's some supplements that might do it or ways of eating. Because you made this case.

He's just like, you take the, and so take that case of the two guys that are on 400. Yep. You give the guy who has all these terrible symptoms, the added HRT to bring him up to say 900 or a thousand. And he feels life changing. You do that same thing for that guy who already felt amazing at 400. Bring him up to 900. He feels no change.

It's also why I think, this is a total theory. I don't have any data to support this. But when you talk to bodybuilders or you look at the bodybuilding space, there's such a crazy variance between their tolerance of anabolic steroids. Like some guys would take a bunch and they're fine. Everything feels good. Some are like, oh, my God, I go, that point. I got all these crazy side effects or worse.

And I think it has. has to do with androgen receptors. Like if you have more androgen receptors, you're going to utilize more of what you, what you take. Whereas some guys, it's like, it's not getting used so it just turns into other stuff. It gets converted to other. I mean, I've seen crazy examples of that,

you know, anecdotally speaking, and also my own personal experience where I remember meeting men's physique guys that were just taking grams of stuff. That's crazy. And just horrible results. Personally, I experimented with increasing my dose and the, the

I could really get without getting like terrible adverse effects was 500 milligrams, which in the bodybuilding world is like a baby dose. Nobody takes that. Yeah, that's like what these, some of these guys. So, and I, I have found that like my body does really good on just a mild dose of it puts, puts me at optimal level like that. And I get no adverse effects. I start pushing those limits and a hundred percent see all these bads. No better effects. Yeah, and no better effects. Like, get all the bad side effects from it. And, and this is what I've seen with some of these people, with some of these other body Some of them that could, though, could push grams, and the more they push, the bigger they got. And the stronger they got.

And it's just, so there's definitely more there than just testosterone, you know, free testosterone levels that we don't know about. Do you know your androgen receptors go up as you get older as a man? Up. Yep. They think it's because your testosterone levels start to decline and your body starts to raise androgen receptors. So, yeah, there tends to be higher receptors. Wow. I mean, this would be, this would be, have to have some sort of correlation to old man strength.

Maybe. Wouldn't you think? Maybe. Could be. I mean, I mean, we, we theorize that that. Well, we theorize that. And so that's probably a factor too. But so is probably that.

Because it's like real strength. Like anyone's ever seen like old man strength. It's like, go wrestle your uncle. It's like, it's weird how it doesn't make sense. And like, you can't think that he's has this. I mean, he has some great CNS adaptation in his body. That's definitely part of it. But there's probably some.

something else there. And if you're saying that androgen receptors go up as you age, you know, he probably needs a lot less of the stuff to which I have also experienced in my own life as I've gotten older. And I've talked about, talked to the show that's, I think it's one of the blessings of aging as a man that I've realized is that, man, I just need very little volume in training to to, to obtain the results that I felt I had to work so hard for in my 20s. Totally. Yeah. Speaking of results, did you, Doug, pull up the before and afters from Caldera Labs clinical trials. Check this.

Caldera Lab, all power to them. They spend money on clinical trials. So this is a skincare company and they advertise to men. But they actually spend money on real studies. Okay, so they're not just like, hey, check this out. They actually did real studies. And the studies show tremendous results. These are the before and afters from the studies.

Enlarge some of those, Doug, so the guys can see them. I mean, it's, look at that. Whoa. Look at that. That's after how many weeks? Four weeks. That's a four week difference. And you can visibly see the difference in his wrinkles and the health of his skin.

Yeah. Like we're talking about like typically that would be like Botox or something to produce something like that. And they have all these before and afters on their site. Well, this goes back to the conversation we had the other day on, yeah, look at that. Wow. Huh. That's so cool they have all those. Yep.

So over 90% of the people in the clinical trials. saw visible improvements after four weeks on their skin. I mean, they're killing it. There's a lot of cool stuff now that we can do naturally to really to fight anti, or to, you know. Well, the way it works is it's just making your skin healthier. And their products facilitate the microbiome and the skin that's good. They don't strip your body of their natural oils and then make you pretty,

like they're literally working with your body. So they've hit the, they've really done it. Yeah. We've done it. I mean, I've gone away complete spending. I don't know how many years it's been since I've used any sort of the steroid creams or stuff from our surrises. I've moved completely all to all natural stuff.

And I've had just as much success, if not better than all those creams that I used to do. I regret that. I feel like all the years that I did that, I screwed myself because it would work so well and then it would come back worse. Work so well, then come back worse. Your body down regulates this receptor and then it starts to rebound and cause this other thing. Yeah. Have you ever seen people?

use steroid creams for the psoriasis or eczema. And over years and years and years and years, they need to use more, more, more, and then they get to a point when it stops working and they have to go off. So there's people that will post this. They're like, I have to go off. And then their skin gets so violent reaction. Violent reaction that'll last like 30 to 60 days and then start to come back. And these poor people have to go through that whole process. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's pretty wild. I mean, I felt like I've experienced a mild version of that. That's what's happened to me is like it got worse after I did all that stuff. And then since it's been years now where I've used products like this, like this and GHK CU are like the go-to things for for my

psoriasis just to constantly use those, the Caldera product and that. And that has kept it the same for I don't know how many years. Like it has it, it's hard when you have psoriasis gets worse as you age. Exema can get better as you age. That's true. It gets worse. And so it's just kept it at bay where I felt like the first few years I had it when I was using all those creams, it just exacerbated it. My daughter gets a little bit of eczema in the crook of her elbow if she eats eggs because she's got an intolerance to eggs. So she thinks, my three old, she thinks it's called eczema because of eggs. I'm like, oh, that makes sense. So I want to bring something up to you guys real quick because I would love your guys's opinion on this.

I think this is so true and it's so incredible. So Thursday mornings, my church has something called Better Man. So better man is this, it's this program, I guess you would call it a program that different churches will do. So it's not just to my church. Like lots of churches, there's lots of people. And it's essentially bringing men together to help make them better men, better fathers, better husbands, better brothers, better sons. And of course, it's all based on scripture, but it's also based on, you know, coaching and psychology. And it's really, really good.

Well, anyway, today was day two, and I love it. And they were bringing something up. So there's a quote. In fact, it's weird. I was wearing the shirt. Proverbs 2717, iron sharpens iron. And so in this proverb, it says iron sharpens iron as one man sharpens another. And so what they brought, what he brought up, and I think this is so true, is he said, only a man can tell another man certain things and lift them up. If you try to have your wife or your girlfriend or a woman say to you, it just doesn't just doesn't hit the same. And that's, think about that. Think about getting called out by your buddy versus. if your wife did it and the difference you would feel. And they were talking about the,

he was talking about data and how men need to have close male relationships because men lift each other up and really can push each other in ways that typically we don't receive from women just as well. Or we'll perceive it as being critical or make us feel weak. Where does your, where does your evolutionary mind go for that? Oh, God. I mean, I could easily come up with the evolutionary theory around that. Like guys going off to hunt.

or go to war, like you want to succeed at the hunt or war, we're not going to sit here. There's no time to, yeah, emotionally talk their way through it. Think about this way. It's just like matter of fact, brass tacks.

Here's what you're doing wrong. Think about this way. Imagine we're at work and we're trying to build, we've done this, 10 years, we're building this business. And I'm doing something. And when you guys look something angrily,

you know, but serious. And I obviously respect you guys. You look at me like, man, you're being a pussy. Yeah, yeah. Imagine if your wife said that to you. Right. Way different.

Well, you know what's interesting? Way different. Well, it's interesting about you're saying that with that. How wild is this? Your buddy can say that to you and it gets you fired up. That's right. To go get to your wife on the other hand says, go slay that dragon from it.

Very different. And that makes you go do that. Very different. And if your buddy said, go slay that dragon. You wouldn't get me up for that. No. You'd call me a pussy would get me more to fire. Pick yourself up.

Yeah, yeah. Or what do you think you're doing that? Quit being a bitch. You could call me out like that And that would fire me up to go Hey man, you're drinking too much, bro You need to cut that out You know, you might be like, oh

But you're telling me, go go slay that dragon for us Doesn't fire me up Where your wife tells you to go do that Very different Yeah, yeah And so they were talking about it And it was like blowing my mind Because I'm like, man, that's so true

Like again, your buddy Your buddy could come to you And be like, hey man, you're, bro, You're eating too much or you're drinking too much, dude and you know, your wife coming to you, you're drinking too much. She's like, come on, stop it. Don't tell me that.

I'm trying to, you know what I mean? I mean, it's very different. The last few years culturally just hasn't resonated with me at all. It's like every, every sports team, every group of guys, everything I've ever experienced is just very cold delivery. Like, this is, you're fat, you know, or you're this. I'm like, ah, okay. You know, and you move on. And everybody moves on.

And it's like, I know it's, it's like harsh. And it's sort of like something that. we've tried to you know we've tried to manage other people's feelings and and be a little more empathetic and I'm definitely I understand that but at the same time amongst men I don't want to lose that

dude my favorite one of my favorite YouTube viral clips of all time is the baseball dad coach with the youth boys yeah and he's talking shit to all of them and it's like if your dad says it's okay like he's like calling out all of them and that's and you know a clip I'm talking about, Doug? Yeah, I remember that.

Yeah, yeah. That is one of the all-time greatest clips ever of that dad. I've heard this before, too, that, like, if your wife wants you to, she has to lift the crown higher than you are so you can raise yourself to it, which is very different.

But your buddies, guys, you respect, I should say, some random dudes I can do this. But guys, they could kick you in the butt. It's very different. I take it, you know, I would receive it very different from a man than I would, but my wife could lift me like no one else. Yeah.

But it's a totally different thing. So they were talking about how iron sharpens iron, and they were talking about the data on how important it is that men have close male relationships and mentors. And you see this throughout culture and history. Yeah, yeah. And men are so isolated today where they have buddies at work, and then they go home and then they're just at home,

but you don't have those male friendships where you guys push each other. And I was like, man, that's so true. I mean, you're pointing out one of the things, and to Justin's point, what's wrong with our culture right now. I mean, this is the loneliest time men have ever reported that, right? And so it's like the importance of having other, and it's not just other men, but other good men, right? Of course. There's got to be men you respect.

Other men that, you're not going to respect some, you know, if you don't respect, like, criticizes you, you're not going to take it. I mean, I tell, I always tell our young male staff and my, my nephews and that are, like, that are younger than me, like, you should be trying to seek out men in your life that you admire in every aspect. Totally. whether that be spiritual, whether that be physical, whether that be financial. Not one guy that's at all of it. No, no, exactly. Like, you should have a specialty of all of them. Like, no, it's great if you have a guy that's got a great balance of all that that you could have as a major mentor.

That's awesome. You have a unicorn if you find that. But easier to find is, you know, that guy that is just like he's just a financial genius. And so like that's what I talk to him about. And it's like, or that guy that is just a spiritual genius or that. Like find that in other men. and foster those relationships. I think the mistake I probably made when I was in my early 20s

is I thought I needed to have like all these commonalities with like, like we were high school buddies. Like we need to have, we need to have, we need like sports, we do this, need all these things. And I needed to find other guys that were just like that when it's like, dude, no, that's not the strategy. I have relationships with other men that we only have a thing in common. Like that when we're together, all we talk about is business.

Right. Or all we do talk about is our spiritual walk. Or all we talk about. You know what I'm saying? So it's like you can build relationships and you don't have to have all these things in common. So there's also tons of value in having an older mentor. So a man has more experience than you who's done the things that you looked up to. And then having someone younger than you that you mentored.

Dude, can I talk? So that's another thing. Can I tell you how, okay. I share this with Doug. You guys, there's a, you should watch this because it really kind of. It really brought me back down to earth a little bit because I'm guilty of this. I think we're all guilty of this on this podcast of talking about just the times right now and just how terrible it is.

Sure, it's true. Well, all this shit, right? And you're probably the most guilty of this for sure. You're like, you know, fucking chicken little, sky's always falling, right? It's like, depends. If we're talking about the business, that's true. Yeah, that's fair. That's fair.

We just said that earlier. Yeah, that's fair. I mean, I'd say something good about the business. Adam forts on it right away. It's fair. That's fair. There's a show on Netflix right now. I think it's called 1975.

Look it, look it up to Currie. Either 1975, you guys should watch it. I have. Have you watched it? Yeah, it's just everything that was going on in culture, the world, Hollywood. It was crazy. It was crazy. It was crazy.

It was crazy. I mean, Paul. Is that the oil embargoed? Yes, yes. Oil embargo, the Watergate. I mean, there was so much. Assassinations. Assassinations, corruptions,

division. The Cold War was crazy. Yeah, 1975. Break down, 1975. You know what the difference was? Yeah. I'll tell you right now what the difference was. We're not social media. You didn't have media in your face all day. If we had Instagram back then, oh God.

Everybody would have gone mental. You, yes, exactly. You would have seen the stuff that was going on every day in your feed, everybody would be worse than what they are. Dude, people couldn't get gas on certain days. Yeah. If you If your license was ended in an odd number, you can only get gas on Mondays and Wednesdays.

So if you have no gas on Thursday, you got to take the bus to work. I'm sorry. And you'd wait in a line. And a long-ass line. Some people would wait an hour. Well, you'd only get like certain news that was national news. You wouldn't get like this state is experiencing this crazy thing that's happening. They've got 24-7 news.

They run out of stuff to stay. Internationally even. And it's like, you know, it's just like now all. the news that's negative we could have access to every single day. That and so it was. It was a good watch for me for that reason. I mean, I just clicked it on. It was like kind of, you know, almost white noise for me.

It wasn't like something else. And I was, and I'm watching. I'm going like, oh my gosh. Like, you know, if this is way worse than what we're experiencing. And on every level, the scare of the dollar. Serial killers. Raids, kidnaps, war, money, inflation. Politics.

Cultural division. I mean, everything you could think of that we talk about today, how it is so bad today. Housing interest rates. Like, like me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All those things were way worse back then and crazier. It's just that, like you said, we didn't have Twitter and Instagram to remind you a thousand times every day of every single thing. You know what my wife's done this week.

God bless her. And I notice a huge difference. She turns her phone all day. She turns her phone. I can't get a hold her. In fact, if I want to get a hold her, you know what you got to do? I got to get on our security camera and talk through it to tell her

I need to talk to her. So she takes her, she bricks it all day. That's awesome. She's done it all week. Yeah. And it's made, for her, it's made a huge difference. That's why my car trip that I just got, it's one of my favorite trips.

When we drive for eight hours for three days straight, that those speeds, I have two hands on the wheel at all times. I never touched my phone. It is in my glove box, plugged in, listening to music while I'm driving. And it's the most,

that's why I love it so much I'm so hyper-present and disconnected from the world and sometimes I need something like that that forces that because it's hard to discipline yourself to just so kudos to her to just brick your phone on a random Thursday you know that's why I like using the sauna in the steam room

yeah you can't bring it in there I can't bring anything because it'll break my phone so I sit in there and I'm sitting it's the only time I really effectively do it where I just sit I mean I just urge everybody to go watch that show because so much of what we talk about today

is just this alarmist about how horrible and crazy and bad Do you know me serial killers from the 70s? Dude, can you imagine social media? Literally, name a thing that you talk about today Worse. That is so bad. Housing, economy, murder,

cultural division, war, politic, corruption. I mean, it was worse. I know. It was. So that's why it's such a good exercise for everyone to, and guess what? We're here.

We made it. I know. We made it all the way to, to 20, 26, and that was in seven, 50 years ago. Here's the difference that today, a lot of our problems are self-inflicted, psychological. 100%. In our heads. 100% of psychological war that we're.

That's why I think it's such a good exercise for you. It's such a good exercise for you. What do you think would happen if everybody turn their phones off most of the time? I think we would see a radical change in mental health, in connection. I think all the problems that we see today that we can label. like loneliness, anxiety, depression. I bet you we'd see a sharp... I think of what they're trying to...

The school... So I guess they're trying to do that with schools, right? So according to the teacher that I was talking to... Yeah, my daughter's school does that. Where they brick the phones for the old day? She has to put it in a Faraday bag when she gets there. They just started that. Yeah, they take...

I think that already we're going to see in our youth is a big difference. If they got to break their phones for the whole day of school, that could be a super powerful. You know what's crazy about what we're talking about right now? Is when we're going to hang up these mics, we're all going to get our phones right afterwards. Yeah. That's right. I just called you out. Iron, sharpen iron guys.

That's how crazy addictive this crap is. I mean, I think that's the reason why we talk about it. I'm fully aware of the pool that it has. You know, and I think there's, because then there's the other side of this, right? Like, I also recognize that our entire business is built off of that. This was my talk. Yesterday, I got interviewed.

Ironically, it was like a menopause show, right? I picked you person. And it was about like a spousal like getting in shape and the challenge of that and it ended up going down

this whole direction the direction I took it is like relationship health. Because if you don't first fix that and you don't have good communication with your partner and you can't come to your partner and say hey,

I want to make 2026 the healthiest year of our life. Let's agree that we're going to cook our meals at dinner you know, and start trying to walk every day. And you can't have that conversation with your partner. Like, you're figuring out macros and figuring out the best. Waste of time.

Waste of time. You need to solve that first. And so I gave like my whole conversation for over an hour, we never touched macros and protein intake and exercise selection. It was all about relationship hacks that I have found to connect me and my partner. You know what data blew me away when I first read it years ago? and I first read it because of gastric bypass surgery. This is when it got kind of popular in the early 2000s, late 90s.

And it's true, by the way, without gastric bypass. When you have a couple that's over, both people are overweight, if one person dramatically improves their health, divorce rate goes up. I talked about this. A lot of people don't, that's a scary stat. Here's what I explained to them, though. I said, it's not what you think it is.

A lot of people think it's, oh, that person got fit and they got the other people attracted to that are looking to them. It's not that. is that one chose to grow and the other one did it. That's right. And they grew. And so replace that with anything, right? You could become a better person.

You can get whatever it is. It's that that one, that team, okay, because you decide when you marry someone that you are one, you're a team. One flesh. Yes. And so if you've agreed upon that and one of you decides to make this radical change of their life and that, towards being healthier. And the other one chooses not to. You just create a distance. The likelihood that they.

And if they do, I wouldn't even argue the ones that just stay together, stay together to stay together. Like, you're saying that the divorce rate is high. It's like, how successful is the marriages that just stay together even with that? Because you have a person who is, they've grown apart. And so, yeah, the whole talk was. I don't want, by the way, I don't want that data to make someone encourage them then to leave their partner if they're in that stress. Because I've also seen this as a trainer. When one person moves in this direction and the other person doesn't, eventually, sometimes it

takes years. Sometimes it takes years, but eventually it bleeds into the other partner and the rest of the family. And it inspires them. And it inspires them. And if you do it lovingly, not controlling, you just do it and you just do it and you just, and you don't try to hammer them and force them to do it. And you just do your thing. Eventually, I've seen it happen time and time again. You hang in there. You love each other. You love them anyway. They start to follow. So I just want to. Well, I mean, I know. I agree. Again, back to like what I talked so much about were all these little hacks on, you know, I talked about how I surrendered. When Katrina and I got together, I surrendered the calendar.

I just said, I don't run the calendar. Like, you tell me where we need to be as a team and stuff like that. Like, I think that's important. Listening to audiobooks together grows us together. Like getting, making sure that every other week that we get away without our son or it's like, you do all that and that forces the communication, the connection, the bond to each other. Then it makes the, hey, let's have, let's eat healthier.

or let's cut out the drinking or let's do this thing, much easier. If you try and do that and you don't have that, and that person also doesn't care about that. It doesn't land well. It doesn't land well at all. Arthur Brooks gave this great analogy. He said, you know,

he said, here's the issue with couples therapy. He goes, you've got a glass with water and dirt in it. And you'll go to therapy and you'll just stir up the dirt. You just keep stirring it up. He goes, what if you did this instead? What if you got a glass of clean water, which is fun together and hanging out together? and hanging out together,

and you just poured it into the glass. Eventually what would happen. It's like, yeah, 100%. Just connect and have fun together and be together. That is the foundation. Isn't that great? And I believe that's your path, if you're listening, and you don't have a partner that is on the same health journey as you,

is fix the relationship first. Yeah. And work on that because that is going to be the foundation of getting that partner to want to do that with you. And if you try and do it without them or in spite of them, turns into resentment. Yes. Yes. It's really, really hard to do that. Organify is a supplement company that is incredibly good at what they do. They use superfood blends like their green juice or their red juice to help with stress, inflammation to make you feel better. The red juice gives you energy. The green juice is good for stress and inflammation.

They have a gold juice. This is great before sleep to give you better sleep. They also have vegan protein powders and lots of other products. Third party tested, very efficacious, clean, and healthy. We've been with the sponsor for years because they do such a damn good job. Go check them out. Go to Organify.com forward slash mind pump. That's O-R-G-A-N-F-I. Sorry, ORG-G-A-N-I-F-I-F-I.

Dot com forward slash mind pump. Use the code mind-pump, get 20% off. Back to the show. Our first caller is Scott from Ohio. Scott, what's happening? How you doing, Scott? Well, great. How are you guys doing?

Good, good. How can we help you? Well, first, let me tell you that you guys are role models well beyond fitness. And I appreciate everything you do. Respect your opinions on a lot of matters. So I have a programming question. I turned 40 this year. And I don't really have my question in front of me.

It's been a hectic day with kids not being in school for basically three days this year. I am, last year was like a resurrection for weightlifting with me and I dove right into Maps Red Advanced and I really liked it. I saw gains all throughout and I noticed that my appetite was way up and I wasn't afraid to eat so I just dove right in and just let my body just kind of tell me what it was going to do. I finished that one up and it was packaged with old time which I jumped right into that and notice some major imbalances from left to right,

and those kind of corrected themselves out throughout the program. Nice. And I'll finish that one up, and I'm not really sure where to go with my 2026 goals, turning 40 if I should maybe dial it back to maybe a 15, or if there's enough juice left in the tank to maybe approach a power lift if need be or recommend it. So I'm just kind of looking at your advice of where I should go for us to just cycle back the anabolic and old time. Oh, good. You seem to be in a good place.

So you feel good? How's your sleep, energy, all that stuff? How you feeling? Sleep's pretty consistent. Go to bed between 10 and 11, get up 5 to 6. Energy is all the way up. I average probably about 17,000 steps a day, I would say. I work on my feet.

I have no problem there with energy. My diet's pretty consistent. I track that for a little bit. I'd say about a pound and a half to two pounds of protein. I cook for a living, so I make 90% of what I consume. So it's very minimal with processed foods. And like I said, I'm not afraid to eat. So I'm probably north of 3,000 calories.

Nice. What about time in the gym? Are you limited on time? Or is your time? Like, can you go to the gym? Not limited in time. I get the three days, three good solid days a week, and then I'm in there, mostly seven days, even if it's just stretching. Nice.

Kind of like on my way to work. I just make it a point to stop there, just to have that consistency. So there's no limitations there. You know, I mean, kids are with me today, but we did both the gym and work. So let's bring your daughters to work day. All right. Nice, dude. Let's do, I think symmetry would be good next.

And then if you feel good after that, going to Power Lift. Okay. You used to have a 600-pound squat. So, yeah. Holy shit. When I was 19, freshman in college, yeah, I was, I hit it pretty hard when I was young. So I started lifting probably 14 and a half to 15 years old. And I would say genetically it's there.

I mean, both my father and my brother, they don't even work out. They're just tanks. So kind of lost it there for a while. but life happens. So I wanted to pick it back up and kind of get back into it and kind of work on the long term now. Yeah, dude.

I like symmetry next because you're probably seeing really good strength gains. You obviously got a lot of potential. 600 pounds squad at 19 places you in a special category. Yeah. And I would want to go symmetry

before power lift because what we're looking at is injury prevention. Yeah. We want to reduce risk of injury. So the potential for injury... Yeah, it goes up as you get stronger. And when you're looking at muscle memory like you,

so what you're tapping into is muscle memory. You had a lot of muscle and strength before. Building it back up is a lot easier than it is the first time. And what we want to do is be careful with how hard we push in a particular direction. Symmetry is really good at building muscle, but it's even better at balancing the body out. It'll fortify your joints. You'll feel good. Old time strength was perfect.

I'm glad you did that. Symmetry will be a great follow-up. Then you go into power lift, and you'll be hit. hitting some big numbers. Yeah, a good, a good rule of thumb for a guy like you, who has a lot of, like, potential to be moving a lot of weight is to kind of interrupt the power lift and anabolic type programs with a symmetry or an old timing, always to like kind of, performance.

Or performance, like to always toggle back. Like, do power lift hardcore, go hard after those lifts and then come back to like a symmetry or old timing. Go after anabolic advance and then come back to like a performance, like kind of toggle. That'll keep you from getting hurt. Like so someone like if you're my client with that much strength potential, my biggest concern would be going too hard, too fast in that direction,

uh, in the injury. So as long as we toggled back and forth and that, we should continue to see gains both aesthetically, strength wise, but then also making sure that we protect you all the way. Is there any like certain rest periods between programs or is it when one ends, you can jump into it.

You go right into it because they take the good bridge program. Yes. Yes. If you felt like you needed a break, there's nothing wrong with taking a week or two off. So that's if you just feel a little burnt. But you definitely would do that if you were running programs like PowerLift, follow up with PowerLift again or PowerLift and Followed by Anablock. Those programs, I would probably want like a Delode Week from you because they are so hard in that direction.

But these ones going to symmetry or going to performance or going to old time me will interrupt that nicely for you. Awesome. We'll send you symmetry. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you, guys. You got it, man. Right on, dude.

Keep it up. All right, Scott. Doug, you send him a discount for Power Lift, too, because that would be a good follow-up, I think, for symmetry. We should have asked them what food he cooks. I saw him in a kitchen. I was asking, like, what do you do? Cooks?

Bro, listen, you work in a kitchen. Oh, that's stress. You are moving constantly. Well, you say up to 22,000 steps a day. Yeah. So I look at his notes. He says he's getting average 22,000 steps a day. So he's moving.

I believe it, too. Oh, yeah. I've been in the back. And I said, no, because I worked in restaurants for a little bit. I know you did even more. Oh, yeah. And it's just, you're on. It'd be interesting to, so when you listen to this, Scott, we didn't say it.

But at one point, he did ask, and I wouldn't mind seeing what a Maps 15 would do with someone like this. Because he's also got the ex-athlet athlete background. It sounds like a killer at work. And so he might be surprised that scaling back on the volume and intensity, we might see amazing results with less work. But it's worth experimenting with. It sounded like he got good result from like anabolic advance though, which was interesting. And old time.

What he's tapping into is muscle memory. Yeah, so that's my point. My point is a guy like that with that much potential, had that much training before in strength, you probably could have done any of our programs and he'd seen great. He's going to see great results because of the muscle member. So that's why I bring up the fact that it might want to play with a Mass 15 program too, just to see. Yeah, I mean, he's moving a lot.

He's doing a lot. And so maybe, you know, he does really well off of that also and surprises himself. So it's worth, it's worth exploring. Our next caller is Alyssa from Michigan. Hi, Alyssa. How are you guys? Hello. Hello.

Good. How are you guys? Good. How can we help you? This is so weird seeing you guys like in person. Okay. So I'll just read my question. Sure.

So bear with me. It's kind of like a two-parter. But I am a 90s baby and grew up with processed foods and being told egg yolks are bad and carbs are bad, all of that you know. I also grew up around yo-yo dieting, ended up being overweight most of my school years. Fast forward to my 20s, I started lifting and became obsessed. I got my personal training certificate through NASM, finding my love of fitness as well. I counted macros to a T for a few years, but with that way, was severely under-eating.

I'm about 5-7. My lowest-y-weight was 125 pounds. I ego-lifted a lot and ended up hurting my L-4 and L-5, which kind of still affects me to this day. I know how to manage it for the most part, but I do avoid barbells, squats, and deadlifts besides RDLs. Macro County became obsessive, so I stopped doing that and tried to eat clean. Since 2021, I gained a lot of weight from heavy drinking, being in a stressful relationship, and using a busy life as a constant excuse. I got to my highest weight of 236. In 2023, I left my relationship, moved home, made a big career change, and got my life back together.

When I started going back to the gym regularly, I was doing a class. last that was an all overbody class, but I really killed myself doing it ended up every day and ended up hurting myself. I started doing some other programming written by a trainer at the gym, which got better, but I still wasn't seeing the results I thought I should be, even though I was down 25 pounds at this point. Fast forward to today, I found your podcast at the beginning of the year and binge. The last couple months, I bought Muscle Mommy, Maps 15, and Muscle Mommy 15. I was running Muscle Mommy at first. However, at the beginning of the year, I started a new job. In the last two weeks of the month, I'm usually working 12-hour days every day, sometimes 10 hours on Saturdays. I do stand during my overtime, so I'm not sitting all day, but the rest of the day I am sitting at a desk. I walk during my lunches, whether it's outside or running to the gym for 20 minutes. I'm currently running Muscle Mommy 15. When I wrote this, I was on week two, phase two, but now I'm on phase three, week two. I'm trying to get 10K steps in a day, if not more.

I started semi-tracking my food again to make sure I'm hitting my protein goals. And I will say you are right. It is like being on steroids, actually hitting your protein goals. I am hitting around 2,100 calories a day, roughly 160 to 175 grams of carbs, 60 to 80 grams of fat, and 175 to 185 grams of protein. I'm eating a lot of meat now, lots of eggs, Greek yogurt, cottage cheese. I'm not 100% sure on my weight, but the last time I checked, I was at 210. And I am getting a Dexas scan at the beginning of February.

I'm trying to do everything the mind-pumped way right now. I'm not studying myself in the mirror, not constantly weighing myself, focusing on protein, even on off days, cut back on alcohol, and focusing on getting stronger, which I am. I've never felt better, and I can do the most weight I've ever done in RDLs and bench press right now, which is really awesome. So I just kind of wanted to know, firstly, if I am on the right track. Am I doing enough? I'm not a busy mom.

I don't have kids. I just work a lot and I'm a generally busy person. Am I eating enough? Am I eating too much? My mind is stuck in bad habits from years of body image issues and unhealthy eating habits. How can I continue to also move forward with feeling like I don't need to track my food? I don't want to fall back into unhealthy habits. I want to live and enjoy my life the best and healthy way possible.

And my other question also is, is it okay for me to be changing barbell squats from the maps programs to other squats because of my L4 and L5 issues? I'm definitely afraid to get back under a bar and I'm wondering what I can do to build that back up eventually. Yeah. So the answer to the last question is yes. You can replace the exercises. You're doing a great job.

You're doing awesome. You're doing a really good job. Just your awareness and how you're posing the question, I think you know what the real challenge is. I think you have a clear – I learned this phrase the other day. I'm sure people have heard it before. It was the first time I heard it, which is a problem that is clearly defined as half the solution. And I think you've clearly defined what the issue has been with exercise and nutrition and all that stuff for you. We want to – we've got to stop focusing on the result.

That's number one. If we focus on the result, you're going to end up where you've ended up in the past. You have to focus on the process, but we have to also go even deeper, which is focus on what causes the right process. Okay. So what's going to cause the right process is a good relationship with yourself, your body, exercise, and diet. So I'll give you one step that I think you can take to move in that direction. Okay. I know you said you're drinking less,

but I think step one would be to not drink. Okay. I don't think you have, just based off what you said, so I'm only based on what you said to me, I don't think your relationship with alcohol is good. And what you're trying to do is manage it, which is like, I got this abusive boyfriend. So instead of seeing him every day,

I'm going to see him three days a week or something like that, right? Still not good. And so the potential's there. So is that possible? Can you cut it out completely? Yes. Okay, good. I'd start there.

I'd start there. That alone's going to do wonders. That alone's going to do wonders. Because, and now you want to find alternate ways to comfort yourself or whatever reason why you end up drinking. Find other ways to do, to try to accomplish that. And it's going to suck at first because alcohol is a great solution for a lot of things sometimes until it's not. So, you know, find something else to replace that with. The second thing is focus on your relationship to yourself and focus on.

enjoying the workouts for the sake of the workouts itself. That's going to move you in the right direction. Yeah. Now, I'm giving you this big general, like, answers. You probably already kind of knew what I was going to say. You're a perfect candidate. Muscle mommy group. You're coaching.

Either one. Yeah, you're a, you should be in our muscle mommy group. At least, at least, at best, I would want you with one of our coaches. You're a perfect candidate. Yeah. You told us what your lifestyle looks like. Your responsibilities are work and your self. you would benefit so greatly from having a guide and then being able to offset some of that trust

and be like, okay, let me just follow what you're saying. Let me just do what you're telling me. Yeah. And within six months, you would make such a radical transformation in your relationship to all this. Literally six months. Yeah. So I think you're- It would be amazing, yeah.

Because I'd always feel like I'm questioning. That's right. And that's how it's always been, you know. You're doing so good. You're doing so good. I just want to encourage you. Just the way you asked your question. you're like perfect.

Yeah. You're on the right path. Thank you. But having the guide there through every step is going to be gold. Yeah. Because you're going to encounter a lot of this. Like, am I doing the right thing? Am I going too far?

What do I do here? Should I do more? Should I do more? That's a big question. A lot of that's going to pop up. Should I keep doing more? Should I push harder? Yeah.

Yeah, because it always feel, and I hear people talk about it all the time on the podcast. It always feels like you're not doing enough when you're someone who is, you know, used to overdoing it. That's right. When you work with a coach that you trust, then you could just say, fine, I trust you. Yeah. I'll trust you. I'll trust you. And then eventually you don't have to try to trust them.

You just start to trust the process because you see what it's like. And our coaches are, we handpick them, so they're excellent. But you'd be a great candidate for that. But Alyssa, you're totally, totally on the right track. Yeah. Like you're doing phenomenal. It's going to be an awesome year. It can be an awesome year.

Yes. I hope so, yeah. I have been feeling amazing. like the best and strongest I've ever felt. Like yesterday I did the bench press and I got 125 for my top two sets for all five reps. That's incredible. Yeah.

So that felt really good. You've already done the hardest part. You've got the momentum. You're doing the right things. You're heading, you're on the hardest part already. You already overcame that part. Now the accountability piece and a coach who's just going to help guide you through

this process just so you don't have any pitfalls, you're going to be great. Yeah. Just by the way, Just by the way, you were asking a question and identifying all that stuff. I'm like, oh, my God, she's going to crush with a good coach. Yeah. So, yeah.

No, great job. Yes. Now, the injury, the L4, L5 injury, can you be more, can I have some details on that? What are we talking about? Yeah. So, gosh, I don't remember the first time it happened, but I was deadlifting. And I literally just felt it go. Yeah.

And so my L4 and L5, like, popped out of place and my sacrum. twisted. Basically is how my, because I went to a chiropractor and they told me, you know, what was going on, because I couldn't even hardly walk. Like, I, to get up from a chair, I had to, like, use my hands to walk up my legs. It was really bad. And so I've just kind of been relying on a chiropractor. And then I kind of learned over time, like, you need to strengthen more of those, like,

well, back muscles and release more of your hip muscles. because everything's like connected. And I was told by one person, you know, well, you're really tight in your hips and it's pulling. So when you're squatting down, it's pulling. And that's what's making it pop out. And do you have like a herniated disc? Is there anything on imaging that you saw?

There was no herniated discs or anything. I do have like a x-ray of it. And you can see how like the two little bones are like, they're not in line. Okay. This is a muscle issue. This is totally fixable. Okay.

Yeah. No her knee to diss, nothing like that. I've got checked a couple times. That's good news. That's good news. Yeah, I feel pretty confident. The trainer's going to give you good mobility work for you to specifically address this. And it sounds like a lateral and rotational stability issue, if I had a guess.

So, yeah, I'm pretty confident you'll be able to barbell exercise again with the right correctional exercise. Which would be amazing, yeah, because I miss getting under a barbell. and I want to see how strong I am. But, you know, I'm like deathly afraid. By the way, this is an awesome goal to focus on for this year. Like that is like we can solve that. We can get to the bottom of this and help you with that. Let's focus on that.

Keep doing what we're doing. Take the advice, Sal said, on the alcohol thing. And I think you're going to have a hell of a year. Yep. We're going to have a hell of a year. We'll have something to call you. Okay. All right, Alyssa.

Good job. Right on. Thank you so much. I appreciate you guys. Looking forward to checking in with you. Yes, thank you. You got it. I love, I love, when we heard that from Scott,

and by the way, I told that to my wife, she was like, you never heard that before? I've heard that in a million times. It's so true. A problem well-defined is half-soled. It's half-solved. So, you know, and I knew this is, I know this is a trainer.

You guys do too. Like, when you hear someone come to you and they're like, listen, I know I have a bad relationship with this, I know I tend to overdo, whatever. It's like, I get the chills because I'm like, this is going to be great. That's the hard part, getting a person to understand.

that stuff can take a lot of time. Yeah. But if they know right out the gates, it's like, let's go. Yeah. You just tweak it a little bit. Our next caller is Natasha from Hawaii. Hi, Natasha. How you doing, Natasha?

Hello. Hi, guys. Wow, life comes out you quick. It's really you. Hi. How can we help you? I just want to say, I've been listening to you guys for many, many years, and I've learned a lot from you.

So I just wanted to start off by saying thank you very much for giving me your time this morning. Awesome. Thank you. Just so I don't ramble on, I'm going to just, read my question. So it's related to looking like I lift. So I've been strength training for about eight plus years between three to five times a week consistently. I've used programs from you guys, Jordan Siat, Lane Norton, Mike Isritel. I've had personal nutrition and training coaches

multiple times over the years. I myself got certified as a nutrition coach and personal trainer just because I love doing this stuff. So I'm confident I've been doing the most important things correctly, like protein intake, consistency in the gym, hitting high intensities, recovering appropriately. And I just don't feel like I look like I lift. So ultimately my question is, where might I be going wrong trying to get that more defined look? Because even though I don't want to look like a bodybuilder, I do want to look like I clearly lift weights because I do. So is it just genetics? Is it too much body fat? On a dexia from November, I was at 28.7% body fat. Is it my hormones?

I am on the hormonal birth control pill. So my natural estrogen levels are pretty low on labs. So I'm just trying to figure out what more I can do, if anything, to get that more athletic look. Gotcha. Gotcha. So I don't have pictures of you, but nine out of ten times, when I have someone who works in fitness,

who is telling me that they know what their protein intake, their calories. It's telling me they've been working out for years. And they say, I don't look like I lift. 90% of the time, it's because they don't see themselves accurately. That's 90% of time. Let me ask you this. Do you think there's a greater percentage of body dysmorphia in the fitness space than there is in the average population? Yes, of course, for sure. Now, let me ask you this. Do other people think that you look like you work out? see that that's part of it too i don't get a lot of comments not that i'm looking for those kinds of comments but it it's not like people say that to me often it's more if they maybe like squeeze my arm or something they can feel my muscles but i don't get a lot of comments about them being able to just visibly see

my muscles yeah but if i were to ask somebody that knows you and i said hey does natasha look like she work out what do you think they would say i honestly don't know really i honestly don't know And I'm not sure. Okay. But I just, I feel like there's just certain areas on my body that, that aren't developing the way I would think they would after all my training. Good. We're getting more specific. What areas?

What areas we're talking about? Delts, glutes, even my biceps a little bit. I'm a strange girl. I like upper body lifts. I like, I would prefer to have bigger delts and biceps. I'm not as, the legs. I mean, sure, I would like great glutes. No, of course, but it's not as important to me.

I prefer that my arms look more defined. Okay, I'm glad you're getting more specific because sometimes when someone says, I don't look like I lift, and then they start to say, well, here's the areas that I'd like to work on. Right. We're getting a little bit more specific. And you do, you have followed our programs and all that. And you got your body fat test that you said you were at what, 28?

28.7. Okay. So typically, if you were to drop like two or three percent, you'd probably be really satisfied. And there's two ways to do that. One is obviously calorie deficit. The other is to build a little bit of muscle. How, what are your calories are at now? What does your activity look like and what are your calories at now?

So I'm basically maintaining right now at about 2,200, so not super high as far as maintenance. But my protein is about 140 grams a day, my average. That's good. When's the last time you did a reverse diet? I did one about a year ago. I was in a reverse diet study with Bill Campbell. So I did that about a year ago. But now I'm kind of hovering around 10 to 15 pounds more than my most comfortable weight. So I haven't wanted to do that at this time. What was your experience with the reverse diet? It was pretty good. I lost about nine pounds and then they reversed dieted me up. But my calories never got that. very high, to be honest. I think they maxed me out at about 2,400 before I started putting back on some pounds.

Okay. What's your activity level throughout the day? Do you ever track your steps? Do you know how much you're moving? I do. Yeah, I average about 10,000 steps a day. I lift four times a week. And then every Sunday, I try to do like a three-mile run just for cardio. Oh, you move. You sound fit. Yeah. We need to, we definitely need to increase calories. And we need to reverse die for sure. That's a lot of activity for that low of calories, for someone who's lifting that consistently and also moving that many steps and then also running. So we should be able to get your calories up and reverse diet. I think that would probably be the greatest challenge right now

is coaching you through the process of like increasing, knowing that maybe the scale might go up a little bit and you're in that mess with your head a little bit. But that's what we need to do is to build some muscle right now to build that metabolism to then take you back down to your, 2200 calories and you actually lean out from that. Because we don't have a lot of runway at 22 and all the activity you're doing. Yeah, where would we end up?

Yeah, I mean, I could drive you down to 1900 calories and you could lose a couple pounds and maybe a little, but maybe a percent of body fat. But then you're eating 1,900 calories. You're doing all that activity and you're not going to like the way you feel. So the move is to reverse diet, focus on getting strong. Don't weigh yourself and let yourself get in your own way. And I mean, if this is, you obviously have the knowledge and the experience. And so, you know, I don't know if you're listening to the show right now.

And I'm coaching Corinne, who is a brilliant trainer, has knows all. She knows more than me, but I'm coaching her. Okay. So, and it's not because she doesn't know what to do. It's for that accountability piece to help her stay out of her own head. And we're doing the same thing. I'm reverse dieting her right now. And I've got her at Calories.

She's never seen before. And she's constantly texting me how she feels. And I'm saying, you're doing a great job. You look great. We're doing good. Keep going. And she knows that if she didn't have me saying that, she would go back the other direction. If you think you're somebody like that and you know that about yourself, you would probably get a lot of benefit from having an outside person taking you through that reverse diet and just reminding you, you're doing a great job.

Because that's what we need to do. I would want to get, if you were my client, I'd want to get you. all the way up to like 2,800 calories. And then I'd want to stair, step you down. And we would lean out into the low 20, 20 percentile body fat or wherever you want to stop at. But going from a cut right now where you're at is just, it's not sustainable and you won't be happy.

And you're active. And how do you feel with your activity? Do you feel healthy, strong, stamina good, mobility good? Yeah, I feel great. Honestly, I have great energy and I sleep really well. Like, everything is super good. Like, I feel great. I just wish that that I looked more tone.

You know, as you move in your arm and I see your arm, I could 100% tell your workout. Just from on Z. So here's a deal. I would do a reverse diet. I would switch you to a different program with way less volume because you're probably so consistent that I bet you benefit from reduced volume. I think MAPS 15 might be your go. I think they'd be a great program for you to go into, which would be really scary for someone like you because you've been working out for so long. You'll know it's working if you get stronger, by the way.

If you do math 15 and your lift start going up, like keep going. So do you have that pro? Can I send that to you? That would be great. I don't have that one. I'm going to send that to you. And I think you should bump your calories. If you want to slowly do it, that's fine.

Bump up 100. I don't care. But let's go MAPS 15. And let's slowly get your calories up. And they just see how strong you get. And I bet you'd be surprised. Just remember what I said about the part that like why Corinz got me too. It's not a lack of, you don't strike me as a person who has a lack of,

of knowledge in this, but like her, know that you can get in your own way. I agree completely. Okay. Are you opening to working with a coach again? Yeah, I'm always open to working with coaches. I just finish working with a strength coach, so I'm kind of deciding where to go after that. But trust me, being able to eat 2,800 calories and not gain a ton of weight, that's like

the dream. Like, I would love to that. You could get there. You absolutely can get there. You are more than active enough. to get there. Totally. Tell me about your lifts. How strong are you? See, that's, that's the other thing. I feel like I have like a high floor, but a low ceiling, because even with my strength, I feel like I should be stronger after all of these years.

But my one rep max on bench is 135. My deadlift is 235. My squad is 200. Stop. That's great numbers. Yeah, are you comparing yourself to like a power lifter? Come on, dude. You're strong. No, like I said, I know. I know I am stronger than the average 41 year old woman. Like, I know that. I just feel like I could be stronger. I just, I mean, I've been doing this for a long time and I can't believe I can't hit higher numbers than that. Natasha, you're 41? Yeah. I am. You look great. Yeah. I can tell on your arms. When you're next to other 41 year old women. Yeah. How different do you look? I don't, I mean, get out of here. Stop it. Yeah. I mean, I have more muscle mass in them.

Yeah, you do. Yeah, you do. Listen, your calories are too low, hon. Yeah. Okay. For sure. And look, you can get your hormones tested if you want to see if that makes a difference. I know you said you're on birth control.

41, you could, if you're open to hormone replacement therapy that sometimes makes a big difference with women, especially supplemental testosterone. So you could also look in that direction. And that can make a big difference sometimes. It's a huge difference. But I'll have a coach call you, but I'm also going to send you Mass 15 and reverse diet. That's what I would do.

If I was training you, that's exactly what I would do. Okay. Well, I trust you guys. I really appreciate all the advice. I will listen. And thank you very much for the program. And your delts look good through your shirt. You got crazy standards.

You're doing great. I like you guys more than ever now. You're doing great. But I also understand what you're asking. Yeah, I do. And it's a fair question. And if I was coaching you, we would do it. But what we're saying is how you do it. It's what it is is... You're not feeding yourself enough.

Yes. You are very active. That much training, that much steps and that much movement for that low of calories. For someone who's that strong, too, so which tells me you're moving weight in the gym, so you have a high volume, you have a lot of volume you're doing. You are definitely not eating enough. And we got to get, we got to slowly get it up to that. And the ways to do that is a cut back on the volume by going to like a Maps 15 slowly increase. Get rid of the scale because it's going to fuck with your head. Okay. So, and this is the coaching part where I, like, I would urge you to do that just for that reason,

not because you don't know, but because I, like, I have to talk to Koran every week. You're doing great. Yes, I know you feel that way. I know, but you're doing perfect. I like what I see. I like where we're going. That's it. That's literally like, I'm not breaking any studies down to her.

I'm not getting, like, it's just me reminding her. She's doing a great job. That's, that would be coaching. you right now. And so just consider that. Or if you don't do it on your own, like we're saying, consider that because I think that's all that you're missing to unlock that if you want to get down to 21, 22% body fat, C separation. You've got plenty of muscle. It's that leaning out a little bit. And we're not in a place calorie-wise to cut to lean out. That's just, that's where you're at right now. So we can get there. Yep. Okay. Sounds good. Thanks for calling in.

Of course. Yeah. Yep. It's so tough, God, fitness people are the hardest with this, man. I don't look like I work out. Everybody else is like, you look like you're working out. Yeah. And it's just the standard. And I get this. Like, the other day, I'll just, this is straight.

That's how I felt. Adam sends us a video of this dude, bench, was it 40? You know, to four plates? Yes, four plates. He did a four plate, bench four plate, brought it down, sits up with it, and then lays back down and does it again. Now, I've been working out since I was 14 years old. Why aren't you comparing yourself to that?

Very easily, I could look at it and go. I don't feel like I work out, you know? It's like, come on, what are you comparing yourself to? But yeah, calories, like, you got to feed the machine. Otherwise, it's going to be limited. It's just not going to go any further. That really sounds like the rest of the way. I mean, this is it.

She's at 10,000 steps a day. She also, it told us too, that she was also running on top of that. She's got lifts. She's fit, healthy. Okay, you don't have, like, you don't have to just be, people think sometimes volume, like, oh, super set, lots of exercise, seven days a week. Like, if she's moving 200 pounds squats and a,

135 pound bench press. She's got decent volume in her workout. So she's... The weight makes... adds up. Yes. And so she is... And she's training four days a week.

So she's doing a lot. And at 2,200 calories... And she's at 28% body fat. It totally... It's totally fair for her. Even though she looks great, doing great, all the things. To say, hey, I... Man, for everything I do, I should be 21% body fat.

And that's totally reasonable. But the pathway to get there is related to nutrition. It's not... her programming, it's not that. First off, a woman that can bench press 135 pounds is in the 1% of strength. Yeah. That is not common.

I've trained a lot of people. It's impressive. Uncommon. If I see any woman benching the big wheels. And over 200 pounds in squats and deadlifts is incredible. 235 deadlift, she said. So she's doing phenomenal. Here's the other thing.

A woman with muscle at 28% body fat almost always looks amazing. I know we say that most women are happy in between 20 to 25%. but if you're strong and you've got muscle and you're up to 28%. You know what you look like? You look like you got nice curves. Well, also, hey, don't forget this too. Every client ever had that was on birth control

and they come off. It looked like they lose two to three pounds of waterway. She's also 41, so there could be, you know, hormone replacement therapy could definitely make a difference. A little bit of testosterone makes a big difference oftentimes. So that could also make a difference. But, you know, like what I've seen, I know, I've worked with women who are in the high 20s body fat,

but we're also strong. They just look amazing. Yeah. You know. Our next caller is Ava from Missouri. Eva. How are you? Hello.

Hey, how's it going? Good. So it's Eva. I usually don't correct people, but I've followed you guys for years. It's pretty crazy to be sitting here talking to you. Nice to meet you. How can we help you? You too.

Happy belated birthday, Justin, so I don't forget. We did. We forgot. That's all right. All right. against no present. Yeah, I don't announce it. Yeah, birthdays are just, they're overrated.

Yeah. For sure. All right, I'm going to jump into this. So I'm 5'9, about 146 pounds, 51 years old. I've lost 125-ish pounds and kept it off about five years now. Wow. I had labrum and bicep surgery eight months ago, lost a ton of muscle, trying to rebuild that. I love, so I do a lot of backpacking when I can.

I love the TRX concept two. I average about 6,000 steps a day. I'm trying to up that, but like it's hard with my job. See, I have MAPS starter, MAPS 15, MAPS 1540 plus. I try to hit my protein target. Like that's big for me. I take fish oil, creatine, the Legion Gummies, magnesium citrate, vitamin D3, biotin, tart cherry gummies. And I just got my first seeds order

yesterday in the mail. So I'm excited for that. Yeah. So, you know, my big goal is long-term health. I want to stay healthy, protect my joints, and be able to hike and chase grandkids around someday, hopefully. I just really would love your advice on what I should be focusing on. I tend to like information overload, so I've stopped following everybody, but you guys and, like, Lane Norton. Man, it's crazy. I've drank so many jugs of Kool-Aid over the year. Keto games, street parking, rip-a-toe, like, I've done it all. So I'm just like, I need these guys that just, like, set me straight.

I love it. You actually look incredibly healthy and sound very healthy. You did a great job. How did you lose all that weight? What'd you do? man well a big calorie deficit which looking back I'm like I knew better you know I went I spent thousands of dollars being like a primal health coach fell for that and not to coach people just because like I love information I just love learning stuff um so a calorie deficit which I knew better um and just like

a ton of backpacking but I lost a lot of muscle because I wasn't hitting my protein because I had to my calorie is so low, you know, it's just, yeah. Well, good job. Well, good job. You're in a good place. Thank you. Yeah. And how often are you backpacking now?

When I can, um, every other weekend, but like I, I hike every week. Okay. And how long are your hikes and how often? 10 miles, maybe 12 miles, something like that. Uh, when I backpack, it's usually like, uh, 40 plus miles. Wow. Pretty, pretty hard. pretty strenuous Ozark Mountains.

Wow. Yeah, I have a gym in my basement that, you know, I have a squat rack, TRX, treadmill, bands. No, you're good. Listen, okay, so every other week you do the hiking when you can, which is the 40-mile one. And then every week you're backpacking, which is like, you say like 10 miles. And that's like once, right? Once that week?

Yeah, I try. Not every way. I try. Okay. So you're going to live in the Mass 15 protocol. That's your programs, always. And we have enough of them where you just cycle through them. Just compliments it well.

That's your strength training. Yeah. Hit your protein targets and enjoy your hikes. And I would say the only place that would change anything is on those weeks where you're not getting those hikes. Try to get your steps up. Yep. Yeah. Just get your steps up throughout the day.

So, you know. Or your treadmill. Yeah. So you get a good, good incline hike on the treadmill if you have to. That's it. And don't over. I'm sure. Yeah.

I imagine you do. Especially somebody who likes to do it outside. Yeah. And don't overthink anything. just we have now we have maps 15 muscle mommy mass 15 power lift the original mass 15 we have math 15 symmetry performance symmetry strong those are your programs just cycle through them yeah that's it don't overthink it just cycle through that's your strength training okay and then the rest of the stuff you do just go have fun hit your protein targets and you're good you're good okay I have a

question for you as far as like the concept too I really like that um it's just so the treadmill is just so boring to me, but I do, I throw on my backpack that I, that I go backpacking with, and it's got about 20 pounds in it, 15 to 20 pounds. And I'll get on the treadmill with that, but on the days that, like, can I substitute some of the mileage, you know, my steps, daily steps with the concept too? Like, how would I, I guess, with meters or? Yeah, that's fine. Just time. You just do it for time. And because we're talking about steps, it's a low intensity. So if the intensity goes up, then the time's going to go down, right? So if you're like, okay, if I were to do 4,000 steps, that would be like a 45-minute walk, then I'll do a 45-minute

low-intensity concept, too. But if it's high-intensity, you're looking at 15, 15, 20 minutes. Okay. Okay. And one more quick question, if I can. So I have a lot of food noise still from being, you know, I've always been heavy. I yo-yo dieted. I fell for the whole, you know, health at every size thing. Like, even that, I'm like, I'm going to be fat and happy. It got me, all right. But, so, I was thinking about micro dosing with like transepitide. Just for the food noise. I heard like that can be beneficial. What's your,

yeah, we've had experts on the show that have talked about, uh, the benefits of doing those things. It is, it is a medication. Yeah. And some people,

especially when they're healthy, are very sensitive to it. Very. So even a microdose for some people just shuts down. Yeah. Where we were, where do you have any idea where your calories are at right now? Uh, it's a slippery slope when I,

I try to track, but I, I, probably too low. They're probably about 1800. Oh, no. Yeah, yeah. So that's, the reason why I ask is that you're, you're not someone who I think would be a candidate for that. I wouldn't want. Yeah.

You know why you have? Because what, what can happen, even on a microdose? So I don't know if you remember when I went through the whole process and, and, shared my whole journey, like, even a microdose would, would tamp my calories down a lot. And if you're only, if you're at 1800 and it tamps it down, even the slightest bit, putting you down in a 15, 1600. calories with the amount of activity you're doing, I don't want you eating more calories. Do you know why you have food noise right now?

You know, I really don't. I've just always been overweight. I know why you have food noise. Your calories are too low. Yeah. You're hungry. Oh, probably. If you're hiking 40 miles every other week and then every other week 10 plus you're lifting,

1,800 calories is low. That's why you have food noise. Yep. You got to eat more. What should I be at? Like, I would, listen, I would bump you up to two to start with. and you're probably going to end up in the low to mid-2000s with that activity. And you just, you can do it controlled and slow, just if you're afraid, but bump it up.

And what you'll notice is you're stronger. You're just going to be stronger when you work out and have more energy. Okay. But 1800 calories is too low. Yeah, you're low. Yeah. You're 5-9 too. Is that what you said?

5-9? Yes. Yeah, you're tall too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, you're not a little tiny, tiny little thing. You definitely need more calories. And that's what you hear right now is your body trying to tell you like, hey, feed me.

We're doing a lot of shit. By the way, you know, when you, with a lot of activity and calories that are not sufficient, you also run the risk of things like osteopenia. And you'll see there's some people that strength train even because their calories are just not sufficient. So, yeah, feed yourself a little bit. You know, if you don't want to track what it can look like is when you feel hungry, have a high protein meal that's whole foods that you go for. So, oh my God, where's that?

I got that food noise again, but you've got a pre-made 300-calorie or 200-calorie high-protein meal. Eat that. Yeah, yeah. I try to do that. I try. But I think you're just probably afraid of food because of all the weight that you had lost. For sure.

Yeah. For sure. I get it. I get it. Yeah. But you need a fuel, though. You need to feel because Sal's right. You're not, you're active.

You're active. I know, I know, I know we're talking about some days where you're not getting sick. But if someone who hikes as long as you hike and move in, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're height. You need to be up there at mid-2000s is where I'd want to get you up to. And you have Maps 15. Doug said you have Mass 15 and Mass 1540 plus. Let me send you another one. So let's see. Which one should we send her? Fellows. 15 performance? Yeah, because of the hiking. I'm going to send you Mass 15 performance. Okay. Thank you. I appreciate that. You got it. You got it. Keep us posted. I'd like to hear

how this journey goes for you. Start reversing those calories up a little bit. I'll do that. Thank you guys. All right. All right. See you. Yeah. Once you said her color, I'm glad you Yeah. For her activity, strength training. I mean, I can see it on her. She actually looks pretty help, I mean, really healthy and lean. And I remember hearing her say 5-9, so she's tall. Yeah.

And that's a lot of activity. And then saying you need Shrezebicide, I mean, you don't look like someone who needs Chersepitide. And then when she said the cowl, oh, God, no, definitely no. Yeah, that's not food noise. That's just normal. That's your hunger. It's your body's like, we just did a fucking 40-mile hike.

I need about 8,000 calories. Well, my calories are low. I got a lot of food noise too. Think about that. A 40 mile hike, I mean, I'm just trying to, in my head, do some quick, quick back in the napkin math, the amount of calories. Oh, my God. Just to support the hike alone.

Oh, yeah. And so. The next day, too. Right. And a 10 mile hike is a, well, yeah, I mean, 40 miles. That's substantial. That's a long, that's a long hike. Yeah, well, how long are you hiking?

That's like a, that's an all day hike. It's an all day hike, right? It seems like it. It might even be two days. Give me, give me, give me, give me. That's a two day hike, bro. You're hiking a lot for two days. Yeah, you're talking about your body needing like 10, 20,000 calories.

Yeah, yeah. Like that it just needs to do the thing you just did. Which means you got to have body. And then if you go back and then you go right to eating 18100, your body's going like, yo, we're way behind. Help me out. Yeah. So is that what, are you doing that?

Did you look it up? I mean, I just know people who fight. Oh, you probably chat cheap to me real quick. Well, bro, walking a marathon would take you seven hours, six. I mean, so, and that's a marathon. That's walking flat surface. hiking yeah that's two days she's hiking in and back and in and getting there late camping and then hiking and only eating 1800 calories yeah way low yeah way low so so way way low that's why i'm like wait a second

this is she's beyond low yeah two to four days oh my god oh my god yeah dude she needs to be she needs to be mid to high two thousands consistently consistently yeah yeah big time that's that that's what's going on right now and oh yeah that's and her poor poor poor body that's not food noise that is like Like, I, we're starving. Help us out. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. We'll see what's at Mind Pump Media. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump.

If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbundle at Mind Pumpmedia.com. The RGB Superbundle includes Maps Anabolic, Maps Performance, and Maps Aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee, and you can get it now, plus other valuable free resources, at Mind Pumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love

by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support, and until next time, this is Mind Pump.