Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2800: They Flipped the Food Pyramid! (Comparing the New vs. the Old Food Pyramid)
Episode Date: February 23, 2026They Flipped the Food Pyramid! (Comparing the New vs. the Old Food Pyramid) A BIG move in the right direction. (2:14) Government policies' profound impact on people's understanding of what was hea...lthy & not in the market. (4:16) The BIG issue with the old pyramid. (5:39) Breaking down the NEW pyramid and the MAJOR changes from the old. (Grains, Dairy and fats, Protein emphasis, Processed foods & sugars, and Fruits & veggies.) (8:06) Why Mind Pump agrees. (25:17) Practical application. (26:21) Related Links/Products Mentioned The Ultimate Guide to Eating Whole Foods – Visit: www.wholefoodsguide.com Visit Butcher Box for this month's exclusive Mind Pump offer! ** New users will receive their choice between Organic Ground Beef, Chicken Breast, or Ground Turkey FREE in every box for a year. ** MAPS Great 8 Launch (Feb. 15-28th) (Retail $127, Code: LAUNCH for 50% off!) ** Launch bonuses include: MAPS GREAT 8 Nutrition Guide + 5 Days of Free Coaching with Top Trainer Cole (Only available to those who sign up by the 22nd. Coaching starts on the 23rd.) Mind Pump Store RFK Jr.'s new food pyramid emphasizes protein, healthy fats Exercise Scientist Breaks Down RFK's Polarizing New Food Pyramid Mind Pump #2450: The Smartest Way to Use Protein to Burn Fat & Build Muscle Mind Pump #2437: What Happens to Your Body When You Quit Ultra-Processed Foods for 30 Days Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources
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If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go.
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Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews.
They flipped the food pyramid in this episode.
We're comparing the new one to the old one.
We're breaking it down and we're going to tell you what we agree with and what we disagree with.
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For over 30 years,
the government told us to eat six to 11 servings
of bread and pasta a day.
They told us fat was the enemy.
And we got fatter and sicker than ever before.
But something just happened.
that we never thought we'd see.
The government just admitted, hey, we're wrong.
And they released a new food pyramid that actually makes sense.
Let's get into it.
Okay, so when this news came out, excited?
Are you guys pumped about it?
Is it whatever?
Like, how do you feel about it?
Oh, I think it's a nice change.
I think it's a move in the right direction for sure.
Yeah.
Especially in when you contrast it to it.
It's almost flipped upside down.
Literally.
It's the opposite.
That's right.
So I thought it was a total move in the right direction.
Yeah.
Initially,
I think I had the reaction of what,
who cares?
Who reads the food pyramid anyways?
This is all,
you know,
whatever.
It doesn't make,
I don't think,
but,
but I mean,
it is,
it is taught in schools.
Yep.
And,
you know,
there is the argument that,
I believe you made this
when I was like,
I don't think it matters that much.
and I've been, I'm slowly being convinced that, okay, you know, part of why I probably feel that way is because I've been taught off of and I grew up with a society that was taught from the old food pyramid.
And if we start teaching our children this stuff and we educate more people on it, does this make an impact?
And I think I think the reason why I felt jaded early was that I don't, I think if this is a real positive thing, it's going to take a while before we actually really feel the impact of just.
how positive it is. Yeah, one thing was like a lot of the food contracts and the businesses
that they would bring into the schools. They're going to have to change and the priorities of that.
So I think, you know, at least looking into it and the restructuring of how, you know,
we introduce kids to what the priorities are with food. I think it's a positive.
Well, so the government policy had a profound impact on people's understanding of what was healthy,
what was unhealthy and the market.
Because you guys remember, so this is 1992
when this original food pyramid came out,
which by the way,
when this food pyramid came out in 1992,
it wasn't groundbreaking in the sense that
they had been communicating some of these things
for a long time already.
So it's not like they came out to the food pyramid
and said,
suddenly fat is bad for you.
That had been communicated for a while.
This just became kind of official
kind of nutrition policy.
But because of government policy,
people were afraid of fat and food companies would kind of follow soup.
And so you saw a lot of low fat foods, nonfat foods, milk, you know, skin milk is super popular.
Everybody was afraid of eating eggs.
People stay away from meat.
And grain-based products completely exploded.
Yes.
And this was a direct result of this.
Now, the new pyramid, I think, is reflecting, is also not groundbreaking the sense that I think a lot of people already figuring these things.
things out. I think the fitness industry, the health industry, um, uh, has been communicating some of
these things for a while. And so now the government policy is kind of following suit. Uh,
nonetheless, uh, it's going to just speed up what people have been figuring out, uh, for a long
time. So can we pull the old one up so we can look at like, like, break down exactly what
it, because I remember the, at the very bottom was the grains. Yeah. And it was like, what was like,
that was like the most six to 11 servings a day. Yeah. Yeah. By the way, what the big, can you just
think of that first six to a lay 11 serving?
of grains per day?
Lots of pastas and brains.
It's the other part of this that I think is interesting.
Like, what's a serving?
Yeah, I know.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's not clearly defined.
Because I think of a serving is,
is an amount of something that you have at a meal.
Right.
So six to 11 servings of grains,
it sounds like a lot.
It just basically.
Sounds like six to 11 meals
that are heavily based in grains.
Well, what it is is,
this is like the majority of your plate.
Remember how they made my plate?
Oh, my plate was the follow up.
A little later.
Yeah.
And so it's just the majority of a plate is made up of grains.
Here's, and I'm just going to just going to take a little segue before we come back.
Here's why this was a big problem.
It's not necessarily that grains aren't good for you.
It's really because, okay, we can make the argument that animal products, meats are better than grains.
And I could make that argument all day long.
But the big issue is a majority of processed foods, the vast majority,
are grain-based.
Yeah.
Okay.
So a lot of people's diets moved away from whole natural foods and towards processed foods.
There's lots of processed foods that have servings of whole grain in them.
Like cereal, breakfast cereal, whole grain.
Yeah.
Cookies, whole-courniquet.
Bread.
Bread, whole, process, really refined carbohydrate bread, whole grain or grain-based.
So this was the issue.
This is why we created our whole food guide.
was, I mean, and we're going to get into the new food pyramid, but literally the most impactful thing you can do for your health and fitness without getting too complicated is to focus on eating whole natural foods, which will naturally eliminate a lot of these grains, by the way.
A lot of them, you might have some rice.
Well, there's natural limiters.
I mean, a lot of fiber and, you know, and then obviously from the meats, you get that satiating effect as well.
But it's like it has these natural limiters in place.
That's right.
So we made a guide.
It's wholefoodsguide.com, by the way.
And when you go there, that really simplifies everything.
And you just follow the steps on there.
And you'll make some of the biggest impacts on your diet just from that.
But I think that's the big, that was the big, big issue.
The new food pyramid takes the grains serving from 6 to 11 down to something like two to,
I wrote it down here, two to four.
Yeah.
And they also put an emphasis on cutting refined carbohydrates.
So a third of what it was before.
A third.
And they said definitely avoid refined carbohydrates, which points even more closely to processed food.
Yeah.
That's right.
Right, right.
Because, again, if you look at the old food pyramid, it's like a lot of things fit on the bottom.
Which would knock out things like cereals and bread.
Yes.
Yeah.
And make it into things.
Rice would be okay.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
But if you're eating like even bread, like even minimally processed like sprouted wheat bread,
has a different, it doesn't affect the body as much as like, you know, hyper-processed, you know, white bread.
One of them has a much more, a much more of a satiety producing effect on the body, whereas the other one tends to encourage overeating, which is the real big issue.
How much better is, I mean, I remember as a young trainer thinking that choosing to eat wheat bread was a better choice than our white bread.
I used to think that as well.
Yeah.
So how much better or worse is, is it like, is it like bread bread?
brown rice to white rice.
Yeah, they're super processed.
But if you did like sprouted wheat, then it kind of makes a little bit of it.
Well, yeah.
I mean, if you did things like Ezekiel bread.
There you go.
By the way, when you try Ezekiel bread.
Very different.
With nuts.
Yeah.
Ezekiel bread does not.
You know, you're eating something.
Yeah.
I'm not about like regular old rainbow wheat bread, whatever brand.
You know what I'm saying?
Same.
It's just.
One's brown.
Yeah.
I mean, that's just an example.
Remember, they did the same thing with brown and white rice to us.
It's just like you thought you were making such a better choice by having wheat bread instead of white bread.
white bread, but it's just as process.
It's like splitting hairs at most.
Right, right.
Right, right.
The next big difference was the old pyramid really demonized fat.
When you looked at the old pyramid, fats were at the top of the pyramid, meaning that's the thing.
Sparingly.
Yes, two to three servings, sparingly at the top.
By the way, you know what this would come out to for a 2,000 calorie diet?
So if you followed the old pyramid and you ate a 2,000 calorie diet, do you know how many grams of fat?
If you followed their old pyramid,
20 grams.
No, no, no, no.
It's about...
That would be...
20 grams times 9 times...
The limit would be...
About 180 calories.
I wrote it down.
So I wrote down the exact amount.
What is it?
The limit would be about
about 65 grams a day total.
That's the limit.
Yeah, times how many calories per gram?
65 grams of fat a day.
Yeah.
So you're talking about 150 to 200 calories.
That's nothing.
And here's those crazy
as a personal trainer.
Yeah.
If I had somebody eating...
That's low.
That's low.
That's a little...
That's low.
That's like you're at the bottom.
Like, we need to get those fats up.
Yeah.
You know the effects of that if you're deficient, you know?
It's essential.
Yeah, it's essential macronitrient.
You need fats for fatty acid, for the fatty acids.
You need fats for fat soluble vitamins.
When fats are too low, which 65 grams of fat is borderline at a 2000 calorie diet.
In my experience with clients, clients would experience things like their hair
wouldn't look so good.
Their joints wouldn't hurt.
They wouldn't have as much energy.
Appetite would go up.
It's not great at all.
The new pyramid, no limit.
There's really no limit to the fat so long as it's coming from kind of whole natural sources.
Is that what it even says?
They don't give you a limit.
Crazy.
They don't really give you a limit.
They don't say, like, limit it.
They say, you know, as long as it comes from whole natural sources, essentially.
So, you know, olive oil, avocado.
butter is okay.
Steaks.
Neats are okay.
Fish is okay.
Whereas the old pyramid,
even if it was like salmon or avocados,
no, no, no.
You got to keep it down to this real low amount.
That's how bad the old pyramid was.
Yeah, yeah.
That's so crazy.
Then protein, this is where it gets a big difference.
So I did the math on the protein.
So the old, in the 1992 pyramid,
had protein at about two to three servings.
The new pyramid has protein at the top.
Basically every meal.
So every meal needs to have protein in it.
Whereas before, it was two to three servings a day.
For a 170-pound man, okay, the old pyramid,
you want to guess how many grams of protein that would recommend it?
For a 170-pound man.
From 90?
90? 80?
Yeah.
61.
Oh, my God, bro.
61 grams.
Man.
If you're a 170-pound guy and you're trying to,
improve your health and fitness, get stronger,
burn body fat, have any kind of satiety.
Dude.
And you're eating 61 grams of protein a day.
It's going to be tough.
Yeah.
That's going to be really, really tough.
Yeah.
Now you're eating essential.
You're having enough to not die from too little protein.
But, I mean, we're painting the picture now of what this diet look like when you follow
the old.
Yeah, you're removing the essential maconutri.
Dude, your meal is like three bites of chicken breast, a loaf of bread.
And like, what else?
Yeah, was this the medieval time?
A glass of juice?
Yeah.
Yeah.
And a glass of juice or something like that.
Yeah.
I mean, crazy.
Yeah.
That's nuts.
So we grew up with.
So off.
The new one, the new one doubles it, more than doubles it.
So a 170-pound man would have 123 grams of protein.
And I'd still say that's minimal.
Which is conservative.
It's, yeah.
Way better than the old.
Way better than the old.
But I still think it's a little low.
So to get your back a little bit on this, I mean, it's been so wild for me to see how quickly
the market responded.
And maybe that's primarily to your point
that you made that, you know,
it's not like the,
well, I'd say the general pop wasn't up to speed,
but we've been talking about high protein
and fats are okay.
It's definitely more mainstream.
Yeah, it's way, it's so crazy though right now.
I don't know how much you guys
are paying attention to this right now.
I've brought it up a couple times in the show.
All the protein options on menus.
I mean, if you guys aren't,
you guys aren't watching commercials and TV and so on that?
I mean, Jack in the Box, Panda,
like Starbucks.
they're all marketing high protein everything.
So they have high protein menus now.
And their commercials are geared towards Chipotle.
They're geared towards come in and get your 30, 70 or 90 gram protein meal.
Like they're all pushing this high protein message.
Like, and I mean, what if this came out less than a month ago?
Part of it is the mainstream is starting to become privy to the benefits of diet that's higher in protein.
the Atkins diet, I think, taught people that fat wasn't scary.
It took a while.
Now, it did make people think carbs were scary, which they're not.
But definitely that fat is scary.
And then you have the, now you have the,
GLP1s.
That's right.
The introduction of GLP1s.
This is shaking up the entire industry.
That's right.
Because now the medical community is like, oh, if you're on GLP1, you need to eat
high protein to prevent muscle loss.
So you just take a perfect storm now to where mainstream now is like,
high protein, high protein.
So you can see lots of high protein, everything.
Yeah.
You know, coming out.
I mean, I'm telling you, it is everywhere now.
Everywhere.
Everywhere I go, I see it, I see it at gas stations.
I see it in Starbucks now.
I see it at the panda.
I see it at the Jacket and Box commercials.
Chipotle.
I'm not mad at it.
No, no.
It used to be so hard to find it.
It's so, it's so crazy to see how quick that was.
I mean, it was just, it felt like just the other day, you know, we were constantly talking,
but now it feels like everybody is,
is on board now with that.
Totally.
In 1992, the pyramid, you know, it said limit sweets,
but it really didn't say anything about processed food.
It didn't mention processed food.
The new one, it talks specifically about processed food.
In fact, it says words, literally, these are the quote,
eat real food.
So we finally have, and again, we have that whole food guide
that talks about the power of whole natural foods.
or should I say getting away from the dangers of ultra-processed food,
which it's whole-food guide.com, right, Doug, I want to make sure people get that.
Yeah, Whole Foods.
It's a free guide.
I mean, I remember when we wrote this guide, we wrote this guy a long time ago.
And it was when we first got together and, you know, obviously we'd all been trainers for a long time before we had even got together and started the podcast.
One of the things that was really cool, because we all have different backgrounds.
We've trained a lot of different clients.
but there was a handful of things
that we had all come to the same conclusion
on, you know, one of those being
the way we programmed for our clients
as far as the basic movements that we preach
and talk about all the time.
The other one was the diet advice.
You know, and we all went through a phase
where we used to write these elaborate diets
and weird things that we create.
Yeah, and meal plan for people.
And we'd all got to this place where,
no, if I just told my client to,
cut out the processed food, eat whole foods.
I give them an unlimited amount.
Like literally, even less parameters than this.
Just say, no processed foods.
Eat whole foods.
You hungry?
Go for it.
Eat a steak.
You want a baked potato?
You want a baked potato?
Just eat real whole foods.
And what we found was how much that naturally regulated their calorie consumption.
And then the next, that's the first huge layer.
They got them to lose the first, like, 20 pounds of fat.
Then the next layer was just,
like go get protein.
Yeah.
Through those whole soup.
That was it.
Like literally those two things, cut out processed foods.
It's like 90 plus percent.
And it's like that gets 90 percent of your clients in great shape.
It's crazy.
You said 20 pounds.
On average, if I had a client who had to lose, you know, a decent amount of weight,
if they just were consistent just with eating only whole natural foods and that's all
they did, between 15 to 20 pounds they would lose.
Easy.
Just what just happened.
Easy.
And people need to understand this.
there's this myth that we have this like we're like eating machines we have this appetite
I know that just makes us eat if there's food in front of so we'll just eat until we're overweight
that's not true that's not true we have natural systems we have natural regulators of satiety
that tell us to stop eating the problem is we've engineered food to bypass it bypass it we've made
we've taken food we've understood and really broken down scientifically uh what's called
palatibility, right, the enjoyment you get from food, which includes its taste, but it includes
many other things. And we've broke it down like a drug. And then we've engineered food using
these principles and the result of which being, if you eat processed foods, you eat more
with the same, so you'll hit your, you'll feel satisfied with way more calories than you would
if you ate whole natural foods. If you look at a picture, I actually saw a picture of this
the other day. I saw a picture of the amount of potatoes in a big, large bag of potato chips,
and there was a table with them. It was like, I don't know, it was like five potatoes,
and then the bowl of chips. And which one do you think you could eat all of? Of course it'd be
the potato chips. By the way, people think calories are a regulator of appetite. Not, that's not
true. In fact, the potato chips would have more calories than the potatoes because the potato chips
are fried in oil.
Yeah.
And yet I could eat way more and faster where I couldn't even finish the potatoes.
So this is like a big deal.
And the new food, this is the first time government policy has called out processed food,
which is a big win because that industry, that food industry, that part of the food industry,
has a stranglehold on government policy because that's the moneymaker.
Yeah.
The entire way they make money is to make sure you keep consuming a lot of calories.
And so it's like, that's been the entire.
motivation is to just keep buying product.
To piggyback off of what you said about how much, you know,
processed foods are designed to hijack our body's natural senses of satiety.
It's so obvious.
I know you guys aren't really into the,
I love the show.
It's on the history channel.
Netflix picked it up afterwards.
And it's called Alone.
And it's the one where they dropped 10 contestants out of the middle.
The last season that just went,
they dropped him in the Arctic Circle, right?
Just,
and there's moose, rabbit, some fish that they could possibly catch.
And most of these people struggle just to get a meal a day.
And when you watch them eat a boiled, you know, squirrel head.
They are the, that they feel.
You can see, oh, my God, this is the nutrients.
Yeah, it's so crazy how much, and you as a consumer watching the television going like,
it can't be that good.
But it's like, when you.
haven't had anything and you've eaten nothing but off of the land with no salt, no seasoning,
no nothing.
It was hard to get.
It's crazy how much we've changed our palettes through, even ourselves, right?
And we, you know, we consider, I consider myself a good eater.
I eat primarily whole foods, but we still season up like crazy.
And I still eat processed foods to make its way in diet.
And so we have changed our palate so much.
And it's so, and I remember when that never really, like, I knew that, like,
intellectually as a trainer.
But I didn't really understand
to what level until I competed.
When I competed, it was the first time in my life
that I was so strict for long periods of time.
Like a year,
it went three years of like literally tracking
and doing everything.
And I remember going months of eating nothing
but whole natural foods.
And I had to account for every single calorie.
And so eating processed anything makes it
because they let it allow it to be 20% off.
I can't do that.
So, and then I remember
here I am almost, I'm 30 years old, biting into an apple.
And I remember though, but I'll still remember thinking like, whoa, where did this one come from?
Because it was so, it felt, and it tasted so foreign to me because my whole life, I grew up eating candy and things like that,
that it changed what vegetables and fruit tasted like.
That's right.
And it tasted so enjoyable and so rich.
And I thought, wow, that's so crazy that I've done that to myself.
We've done that to ourselves.
We have.
And they've engineered these foods so well,
and they're so powerful that the brain reacts like it does to a drug in the sense that
this is why you notice this, is receptors start to downregulate, your brain starts to perceive
this overwhelming sensation of texture and flavor.
And it starts to kind of numb it down a little bit so that when you go eat an apple,
if you always eat apple candy all the time
and apple's going to taste bland
because your brain has changed
how perceives things
because it's getting blasted
with these drug-like effects
from processed foods.
When you go off of them for a while,
then you eat whole natural foods.
You're like, okay.
And so what happens is how your body regulates
appetite and the food intake.
It's so hijacked and so off.
The side effect is obesity and disease.
Yeah.
And the only way to control it
is either a,
count everything that goes in your mouth
and hold on to everything with your hands
real tight and live this really stressful
crazy life, which doesn't work.
Or allow your
natural, allow your body to naturally
work the way it's supposed to
by sticking the whole thing.
This is why, and I know we all agreed on this
when we first got together, why I didn't
like if it fits your macros.
It doesn't take you this account at all.
Because it doesn't take this part
in account. And for the
listener who's never been able to
to stick to a quote unquote diet for a long enough period of time to get themselves in that shape.
If you don't cut these crazy parameters and the only parameter you put is just eat whole foods,
eat as much as you want, but just eat whole foods.
You do that long enough and those, these, those normal foods actually start to taste amazing.
And if you do it even longer than those other things, you get a bit repulsed by and they're
too overwhelming for your senses.
That's right.
And it's easy to naturally, right.
But you let it creep in long enough.
and then they'll readapt again.
And the other part of this is this,
is that, and this is again
why I'm so excited about,
because it's not perfect.
I don't think the new food pyramid is perfect.
And we'll get to that in just a second.
There's some things I would like to add.
But I love that they said for the first time,
avoid processed food and real food.
I mean, people need to understand.
Big deal.
When you look at the food,
the food industry,
the margins on potatoes are nothing
compared to the margins on potato chips.
The margins on potato chips.
The margins on.
wheat or nothing compared to the margins on crackers. In other words, processed foods have the big
margins. They make the money. And that's the, those are the lobbyists. Those are the people
that go in and pay for these new policies. So the fact that we came out and suddenly said,
eat real food is really amazing and remarkable. Now, here's where I think they should have,
I think they should have gone. I think the protein recommendations, although they're way better,
should be higher. I think they should have added, they should have made it higher. And I think
what they should have said was for people who are dealing with or worried about muscle loss,
who are exercising or strength training or are interested in weight loss, eat more protein
and also eat it first.
Makes a big difference.
Other than that, I think they did.
You know, the fruit and vegetable recommendations in there relatively same from the 1992,
which was okay.
Yeah.
So I think this is great.
I think we're entering into a new era of awareness around food.
Well, it's so cool to see this because when you think, I mean, I don't remember what
year it was when we wrote the Whole Food Guide that we and we're because in the guide we also
help somebody who's never try to do this like we take you steps there. It's not just like here's
a pyramid, follow this. It's like here's how we recommend how we used to coach clients through that
process to get there. I mean, this is this is it. The difference is what you're saying right now.
It's like that we have a higher recommendation towards the protein, but it's really close to this.
That's right. So let's talk about practical applications. How can we do this? Number one,
you're aimed for, if you're a woman, between 25 to 35 grams of protein per meal,
if you're a man about 40 to 50, excuse me, grams of protein per meal, eat it first.
And then the rest can be whatever, eat until you're satisfied, single ingredient foods.
That's what a whole natural food is.
Whole natural food is, that's the thing.
Meat, that's the thing.
Egg, that's it.
You know, apple, that's it.
Rice, there it is.
Potato.
There it is.
There it is.
when it has multiple ingredients, if it has a long shelf life, comes in a box or a wrapper,
this is called processed food.
By the way, it's going to piss off people.
This also extends to the health food segment of foods that are processed,
which you also see, protein bars and shakes.
Although they're in a different category,
they're still in that processed food category.
And so although I think there's use for them,
especially for hitting protein targets and the like,
the goal is whole natural foods.
Well, it's the protein first.
So, you know, to play devil's advocate or defend things like that that we all admittedly use ourselves today.
When I'm coaching a client, I want us to first do this.
Yes.
Right.
And then you, then you learn to intermittently introduce those types, those other things like that.
But if you want to, if you want to get back to that place where you crave a vegetable or crave a fruit, which by the way, I thought was impossible because I had in my entire life.
because since a kid, I was introduced to candies and sweets and it was never not a part of my life until I got older.
I didn't realize.
I didn't, and I know I'm not alone.
I know I'm not alone on people that believe that fruits and vegetables are bland or boring or what that.
But if you do this for an extended period of time, it changes into this enjoyable thing.
Then once you've had that and you've changed that chemistry and then you now have that connection to it and a different relationship with it, then it becomes a primal.
source or the primary fuel that you use.
And then occasionally I realize, oh, wow, I'm having a low day on protein.
I can have that protein shake to help me out there.
And you're not going to switch from that to all of a sudden going other direction.
And you still realize teaching somebody that so they can feel it sticking to the Whole Foods
first before you introduce those other tools.
Totally.
And again, I'm going to say it one more time here at the end.
It's a free guide.
It's a guide, the ultimate guide on Whole Food Eating and Diet.
It's Whole Foods Guide.com.
You can also find us on Instagram, Mind Pump Media.
We'll see you there.
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