Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 287: Recovery Vs. Adaptation

Episode Date: May 5, 2016

What is the goal of exercise? To sweat? To break down the body? You would think the effectiveness of an exercise is dictated by how "HARD" you work out but in truth the benefit of exercise comes after it is over. What you are looking for is ADAPTATION... Becoming bigger, leaner, stronger, more athletic... whatever your goals are. Excessive exercise can actually STALL Adaptation. In this episode, Sal, Adam & Justin give you the lowdown on how to ADAPT, not just recover. Get MAPS Aesthetic NOW at www.mindpumpmedia.com Please subscribe, rate and review this show! Each week the best reviewers are announced on the show and sent Mind Pump T-shirts! Learn more about Mind Pump at www.mindpumpmedia.com.

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mite, pop, mite, pop with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. My hair is really short. Yeah. I just feel like I can fight better. I feel like I'm more of a warrior. Science.

When I used to shave my head, when I was, when I competed with Jiu-Jitsu. Yeah, yeah. And I don't know, you just feel like like, you know what it is like we can fight and then I'll be done And my hair won't be messed up at all. You're not gonna be able to grab on the shit Yeah, I just it just feels slick and move quick and there is something about shaved heads and makes you feel tough Yeah shaved head with a go-t No, no, no, shave head shave head with a beer ball. Yeah Girl beard and shave your head

It is it's it's pretty testosterone-esque. It just feels good. It's one of our, one of our foreign members and listeners was asking about, and it just told a remind me of the story, asking about what you do with somebody as far as members who leave their weights all over the floor and stuff.

I remember we used to have this issue. Put it in that car. I fucking hate that by the stuff. I remember we used to have this issue, put it in that car. I fucking hate that, by the way. I hate that. So check this out. This is the olden that you probably can't do this in your gym, but this is what we did. When I worked at Cowboy McKee,

so this is back in early 2000s. This is one of the most traffic gyms they have. And so it's just super busy, primetime, which your 5 PM hour on, it's just madhouse. Literally you would go in there. Now, one dumbbell would be on the rack. It could be just a disaster. And I remember us trainers, and at that time, I was managing uh, we're trying to like clean up the room and try and keep it, you know, and we'd be constantly telling members, and just like, this battle forever. I said, you know what, this is what we're going to do. Fuck it. Go on forward. This is the next time it gets messy. We get that yellow caution

tape. And over the loudspeakeraker we made everybody exit out of the freeway room and we cautioned, taped it out and we made them stand outside the car tape. Why they watched us re-rack all the weights. Beautiful. Oh, dude. That's beautiful. People will be so pissed. What we're doing it. We're like, you know what, we got to keep it clean. This is what we're and we're gonna continue to do this until you guys can oh, bro, it was actually a alarm. It was brilliant though, because then people started

managing themselves. You know, you started seeing other members calling it, hey, we wrecked your weights. I'm not trying to get over the caution table. Yeah, the caution is smart, man. Right, right. I think. That's one of my biggest pet peeves is when I go to a gym

and I see, this is where the 45s go, but the 20s are here and the fives are over there and the sevens are, I want tos are here and the fives are over there and the sevens are I I want to strangle people. I would make announcements. I would make announcements over the loudspeaker You know attention members and guests if you're strong enough to lift the dumbbell You're strong enough to put it back. Don't be a pussy. I would say shit like that Because yeah, like this family gym a mat So they have like all the 45s are valuable commodities for me, you know, like going in there, I'm like,

there's a limited supply. And I look over and it's like on all these like calf machines and like, you know, somebody put on this like crunching bench and I'm like, what the fuck? There's like no 45s on the squat rack, there's one squat rack. And like, these should never leave this zone right here. This is the only place it should exist. Yeah, if you're using all the 45s,

it better be for a legit exercise. If I see someone use all the 45s for a fucking leg press, get out of my face. Take two of those, here's what you do. If you put all, if you're one of those guys, that's, you're listening right now. You're only allowed to use tens. I have a special, from the entire gym. I have a special message to you if you're listening right now

and you use a shit ton of 45s in your leg press. This is what you do, okay? You got 10, 45s? Just take four of them. Go put two 45s on each side of a barbell and do some full barbell squats. I challenge you. Yeah, I challenge you to do some like 10 reps

of good form with that. If you could do that and then go back to your cool, go back to your dad, your, your, your leg press and use all the 45 for your stupid. You can feel proud. Especially that leg press that's on the hinge. Which one is that? What brand is that?

Oh, oh yeah, that does, that's like a, like almost like it's like a hammer strength meets, hammer strength meets a leg press. Yeah, it's not even on a sled. It's like on a pivot. I don't even know that. And people are so proud of look at all the you know Look at my three inches of range of motion with all my 45s

My legs are 20 inches now they're huge Awesome work. It's been a while since we've talked about gym etiquette That's actually what this person was mentioning. They're just talking about overall Gematicated and the things that you see and you catch people doing inside the gym It's it's the worst as people that leave their sweaty sweat all over the machine. I hate that. That's worse.

I don't know. I get more irritated by those two. That's gross, dude. Well, if the person's excessively sweating especially, you know, they have like greasy sweat. Yeah. Oh, really. Why don't you look at me when you said that?

I was just talking to you. I don't know. No, I don't. Is it infer. No, I don't mind sweat as much. I mean, because the sweat, I feel like I can walk over to the towel, because I released it our gym. We have just, you know, towel dispensers and I could wipe it. I don't want to clean your sweat up. I would rather clean your sweat up with a swift, lightweight towel real quick, then go pick up your 75 pound dumbbells that you left across the gym.

That irritates me. It irritates me more that people, it's pushing when you're there to exercise. You're there to exercise. You're there to burn calories. You're there to burn fat. And you're too lazy to put the weight. It's hard to put away my toys. It's almost as bad as the people that drive around the gym parking lot for 15 minutes to

try and find a parking spot that's closer. Well, I have a theory. It's the same person that their parents never taught them how to pull either toys. Is that the person you think so? Yeah, they go to the gym and they're like, yeah, I did my thing and I'm so glad I was here. Yeah, when I'm done with dumbbells, I look on the rack to see the proper place to put the dumbbells.

Yeah, they're numbered. They're numbered. They always find that so funny. It's like it's so annoying. It's so annoying. How did the 20s get on the 75s? One, they don't look like the 20s don't look like the 70s or the 65s. So why did you put it on the 70s?

And I'm going to say something right now. This is the truth. The people that use all the weights on the hammer strength machines are the same people that don't even look like they work out or like they work out properly. Like the guys that use it, I'm benching four plates on the incline hammer strength and you look at him, you look like shit, bro. Did we talk about the bands on the hammer strength yet? Did we already mention that?

Yeah. I think we brought it up. I brought it up. Oh, it's the newest trend right now. Have you seen it yet? Have I seen it? Yes, I've seen it, dude. It's ridiculous.

That's why that's right. Last podcast I brought up that if I see it again, I'm going to slap you with the rubber band. I've tried a different one. I'm saying that it is it you know Never fails man some guru who's obviously selling bands comes out with something Yeah, right something that makes people think like wow any looks really good or she looks really good and then everybody's fucking doing it Have you I even saw this and I think I tagged you guys, somebody, this new band thing that like for glue kicks, it's like a band, it goes to your waist, the belt.

It's like a belt. It's a band belt. Booty belt. Yeah, it's a booty belt. I think it was, yeah, something like that. Some of the courses called that. It was, I think it was called a booty belt, and it was a belt, and then it has a strap,

and rubber bands that hang on the wall, and then you can hook your feet into it and then you can sit down and you can do glue kicks and I thought this is donger cake donger cake donger cake donger and they're laughing all the way to the bank. No, you know, it makes me what's funny with fitness All almost every single time someone comes out with a new gimmick or new like new workout gimmick or here's a new band machine or whatever it's been recycled from before, because when I was a kid,

do you know what, information was on all the time, a piece of exercise equipment, it was called a solo flex. Do you guys remember the solo flex? Yeah, I do remember. And the resistance that the solo flex used were these rubber band type things.

Right. How about the Abo flex, or the BOOF flex, you know, it's just a form of resistance. That's all the resistance garbage. I wanted to talk about, I've got a couple questions on my Instagram page. You can find me at Mind Pump Sal. You might as well plug you guys to.

You can find Adam at Mind Pump Sal. Damn. And you can find Justin at Mind Pump Sal. It is a really good information. You can come to Mind, Mind Pump Sal. I can be. So people have been asking me the difference between adaptation and recovery.

Okay. And I think this is a, this is an excellent subject because I think people confuse the two all the time. Of course you do because we put so much emphasis on this when we designed our program. Right. Of course you like this. This is the, I think this is probably one of the, God, I would say top three, if not the number one neglected or overlooked factors when it comes to designing a program. I don't know how many programs I've looked

at where they don't even take this into consideration when it's been designed. No. Recovery, before we go into, you know, how you train for one or versus the other, recovery is your body just healing from damage. Yeah. Okay. So remember that. You can heal from damage, but then not improve upon your previous condition and adapt. So those can be two different things. Now, does recovery or does the damage process contribute to adaptation? It does. It does carry over from both. It does. But can you get stuck in what I call the breakdown recovery trap? Yes, and most people who work out in gyms are stuck in this where they work out, they

create damage, they get sore, they rest the week or whatever, go back to the gym, no longer sore, they have recovered, but there's been no adaptation, no further adaptation. So they've made no gains. And all they ever do when they go to the gym is break muscle down recover, break muscle down recover, break muscle down recover, and there's little to no adaptation. And it's important to understand the difference

between the two, because then you can pay attention, and you can really determine if your programming is effective or not. Because number one, damage is not necessary for adaptation. And number two, you can make the priority of your body recovery over adaptation, in which point it doesn't really care about adapting anymore, it just wants to recover from the damage.

So I'll give you an example of adaptation without damage. They've done studies in the past where they've taken groups of people. One group works out intensely and another group works out intensely but takes anabolic steroids and then a third group takes anabolic steroids but doesn't do any exercise. So there's no damage whatsoever. All they're doing is taking anabolic steroids. The anabolic steroid group always builds muscle and in many cases builds more muscle than the natural group that lifts weights. And they experience

no damage. There is no recovery with those individuals, but they are adapting to a new signal. And in that case, the signal happens to be the chemical signal of exogenous hormones or testosterone. So this is one of the, we, the understanding of this is one of the, one of the main components that goes into a lot of our program when we design our programs. And it's how do we send a signal to adapt while circumventing the whole damage and recovery aspect because you're limited, right? You can only damage and recover so well. I can't just keep damaging a muscle and expecting it to adapt because eventually my body

is just gonna wanna recover from it. Well, and I think the problem for a lot of people is that they look back at, we always kinda bring up, like what they think they used to be, like their level of fitness used to be this when they were younger. And yeah, you used to be able to recover and adapt a lot quicker. And your body had that signal that was alive.

And over the years, that signal will damper if depending on what you've been doing. If you haven't been moving, if you haven't been training, and then to think that the old go-to then is to just ramp it back up to that level that you were able to achieve that again. When in fact, your body is going to experience that damage without the recovery, like you might have experienced when you're younger. So, you know, hormones and all these things that cells bring it up. It, you know, it plays a factor, but we've actually, you know, thought long and hard about this as far as like,

you know, how do you do this now at, you know, I mean, you can apply this when you're young too, but how can you do this now more effectively to where you're not just gonna like, beat your body up, try to adapt, but you're really just recovering. How do we bypass that and how do we get to just adapt each time and progress our body?

Well, this brings me back to the topic where we talked a little bit about progressive overload. That's something that the whole importance of this is understanding that adaptation recovery process and how they are different systems. You know, you think when you, let's take somebody to like an adaption versus recovery, you know, you've used, I think Sal's used your skin getting tan or you're getting used to, like maybe you all suddenly start waking up now at four o'clock in the morning every single day

and sooner or later the body adapts to this new time, or you moved from different climates and now you're living somewhere that is extremely hot. And the very first time you were there, it's oh my god, it's unbearable. Then before long your body starts to adapt to the new temperatures and environment. So our body has all kinds of different processes of adaptation that is it's always going through where there's no, you know, banging up or beating the muscle where it's having to recover and it adapts. And so you want that still to happen, but they do work synergistically for sure.

And there is a process to that that I think is overlooked with a lot of programs where they don't take into consideration that all they are doing is beating up, beating up, beating up, which is also why I think so many programs are so focused. This is what I want to do, Doug, write this down. I want to. The next time we're doing some sort of, you know, promotion or program or trying to sell

our stuff, I want to take an opposite approach. You know how all these programs are always like, get ripped in 30 days or this that I want to say, I want to promote, get in the best shape of your life and over the next two years. I want to do something that's like, I wanna 100% real. Yeah, I wanna think because really super honest. Yes, no, I think it would be a great. No, but he will tell you, but we will. Yes, right.

This is going to take a lot fucking longer than any other program. They're all doing it wrong. And so are you. Yeah, no, I just feel like the money though is in quick, fast, right away. And when you beat the shit out of a body going through the program, which we just had somebody-

Long-hard and unsexy. We had somebody on our forum just recently. She just joined. She's in competitor. Do you remember this post? I believe Lisa, I think was the name. And she was a competitor. Great shape already.

Really, really good shape. And she was being trained by somebody else. They were doing all this. She was some days doing double days and doing this. And she was being trained by somebody else. They were doing all this. She was some days doing double days and doing this. And she was asking us what program we thought was best. Was it black or red or where she should be? She wanted to get black. And I said honestly, unless you're getting on stage

in the next couple of weeks, sounds like what you've been doing, you would be best actually, doing red and taking back on the volume a little bit. Sounds like you've been overdoing it on volume and, you know, probably stepping back some days, although that's probably going to be difficult for someone like you. But if you're looking for long-term benefits and being able to sustain the physique that you want, it's the better process. But it's really hard to get people to understand this because everybody wants something so

fast. Yeah. But they don't realize that you want, you want, you want, we want to push the bodies in, in, in both scenarios, right? The, in, we've said this before, the goal is to do as, as little as possible to elicit change. You want to leave room for more to do later and more to do later. So you can continually use that. And that's the progressive overload mentality is I'm doing just a little bit more to do later so you can continually use that. And that's the progressive overload mentality is, I'm doing just a little bit more to cause

a little bit more damage and force my body to adapt a little bit more. And then when it gets adapted to that, then I move forward. Well, people forget this. Many pull back too. Yes. People forget this fact. Damage is not good. Okay, it's damage.

Right. Whether it be a sunburn from the sun or whether it be a workout in the gym. The damage itself is actually not good at all. What's good is the adaptation that comes from that signal of damage. Now if I overdo the damage, I overcome the ability to adapt. And all I'm doing now is hurting myself. If I take somebody and I just beat the crap out of them in the gym day and a day out, they are going to have detrimental effects, both on their fitness, on their fat loss,

on their muscle gain, and they'll have detrimental health effects long term. I have seen this many, many, many times I've had people come to me who have been with shitty coaches or who've been competitors and they've got metabolic damage. Their hormones are fucking off. They're, everything is off. Their health has now taken a massive hit, because the damage is not good. It's a tool.

Use it appropriately. And so when Adam says, do the least amount of damage necessary to a list of change, he's not saying it from a perspective of laziness. See, sometimes people hear that and they think, oh, it's because you don't want to do more work because it's a waste of time, you don't want to be lazy. No, you don't want to do more

because you're just creating damage and you're not getting anything for it. You're just throwing more fucking damage at your body. You want to do the least amount to a list of change because you've already hit that switch. That signal is already there for your body to adapt and what ends up happening is more damage doesn't make that signal is already there for your body to adapt. And what ends up happening is more damage doesn't make that signal any louder.

All it does is create more of the negative byproducts of that damage. All it does is damage you more. And that's what we mean. So to use the skin tan example, if you took somebody who lived in a basement for five years and got zero sunlight and was very very pale

I could put them out in the sun for a grand total of five minutes and that alone would elicit some change in their skin Now would they get a tan faster if I put them out in the sun for 30 minutes? No, they wouldn't not only would they not get a tan any faster. They would burn and it would cause Too much damage on their skin and if I did that every single day, they would get really bad blisters since they get a horrible effect. But if I took that five minutes and then I applied it again, maybe the following day or a way to the day and then I did it the day after. And then little by little, all we did was enough to get the skin darker and darker.

And over time, they would need more exposure or more intense exposure, the progressive overload that Adam was talking about now That person has got a golden brown healthy adaptation tan Versus the skin cancer blisters and horrible shit that the other person may have gone. Let me I'm gonna break it down for it Here's here's the bottom line. Uh, you could be milky white. It's fine could be milky white. It is fine. I just have to be healthy.

There's some sexiness to that too. But let me be totally crystal clear here. Like crystal clear, Justin's crystal clear. And he had a transparent ghost there. Any idiot, any idiot can design a program that will cause damage. You actually, you don't need program design to do that. No.

Pick an exercise per body part, go in the gym, and just go nuts. So You can't do it anymore. Just go nuts with it. Right. And here's what's going to happen with you with your results. You're going to get shit results. Yeah. You're going to feel sick. You're going to probably injure yourself. And if you stay hard-headed enough and you continue that path, you will create metabolic damage and you will start to regress. Your body will start to not adapt, not only will it not adapt, but it will pull resources from every other part of your body and to recover to the point where you can't think straight,

you can't sleep, your cravings are completely geared around recovery, you're eating shitty now, and you feel horrible. Well, it feels so against the grain, like when you're talking about people that they don't, they think of it like you're not putting up enough work, you know, like you're being lazy if you're thinking about training this way. And all I can think of is that people don't want to change, people don't want to evolve to new information to, you know, they don't want to quickly get into this mentality

because maybe it had worked in the past or like hard work has been driven so hard and everybody's head that they're like holding onto that. This is the thing that they're so most proud of. And not allowing themselves because of ego, really, I mean, that's the ego coming in to really block you from understanding your body and its fullest capacity. Like, there's a better way to do it. I'm going to drill it in your fucking head.

You know, I hate, I really dislike the whole hard work means grueling labor. And if you don't do that or you avoid that, that makes you lazy, that's stupid. Yeah. To be honest with you, the people that refuse to learn how to do something properly, and just go to the gym and beat themselves up, they're the lazy ones.

They're lazy in the sense that they refuse to go outside of the comfort zone and learn how to do something properly. Look, if we all had a job, and we had to dig a 10-foot hole in a sand pit and we were all giving table spoons to do it with and there's a shovel in the corner and I go over and I grab the big ass shovel and I start digging a hole.

Are you gonna call me lazy? Or are you gonna call yourself stupid for not doing what I just did? You see what I'm saying? That's the big difference. This is how I like that. When it comes to exercise, you know, you see these celebrities, these fitness celebrities, you look on Instagram and you see these ridiculous insane workouts. Sometimes I'll post one that maybe maybe looks kind of crazy or Adam or even

Justin will do so. Is it commendable? Yes, but we're at a level now where it takes that to elicit more change in our body and it took a long time to get there. Is it, does it mean that we're better than the next guy who's a beginner who needs to do something far less and to get his body to change? No, it just means we've been at it longer. And eventually that beginner will get to that point as well where they may need more exposure, more frequency, more intensity to get their body to change. I've just achieved, I've just gotten to that level where to get my body to improve any further, I gotta get really creative with my workouts and I gotta be able to manipulate intensity. And by the way, I've been working out for, you know, over 20 years consistently and I don't, I don't abuse intensity. I gotta be smart with it too,

because my body will get stuck in that recovery, you know, that breakdown recovery trap as well. You know, the original maps program, maps red or maps enabolic, we incorporated in that program something called a trigger session. And then subsequent maps programs, like maps performance and maps aesthetic, use the variation of a trigger

session specific to those routines. But the trigger session concept itself was based on adaptation, separate from damage and recovery. And I had understood at that point that you can send a signal without compromising the recovery, without creating much more damage. And that's what a trigger session is. And so in a nutshell, you have your heavy, hard, damage-inducing workouts,

which you've got to do with resistance training because they're very effective, but you're limited, right? Your body can only adapt, excuse me, can only recover so much. So I can't do a heavy, ass super intense, super frequent workouts all the time. Otherwise, like I said, you're going to get that breakdown recovery trap. So on the days in between, I incorporated what are called trigger sessions.

And a trigger session in a nutshell is a very low intensity movement where I'm going through full range of motion, I'm aiming for a small muscle pump. I'm using bands instead of weights typically because bands create less damage. And I'm doing them very frequently, three times during the day. And what I'm doing there is I'm sending an adaptation signal that's small, but it's cumulative, over time it adds up. And it doesn't compromise my body's ability

to recover from my heavy hard workout that I may have done the day before. The result of incorporating trigger sessions into an effective workout has been mind blowing. I mean, it's been around long enough now. Maps and a ball has been around long enough. We've had hundreds of people write to us and they're blown away at the effectiveness. And this is part of the program and it goes into our program.

You could have, I mean, just that alone, I think. It just has so much significance and it's so unique in terms of other programs that are out there. I think that that was the most impactful thing that I experienced while, you know, I went through like MAPS Anabolic Program when I was, you know, going through the transformation process. All this kind of stuff was just the energy that you're able to promote going into your next foundational, your, your heavier lifting type days where, you know, if you, the, the old mentality is, man, like doing these compound lifts, like it would just beat you up. And you really like, that's why I always voiced some people would, would go next day just as hard and they would back-to-back, you know, workouts like with that intensity. And way back in the day,

I knew how important recovery was at least, but even back then, I can realize now how much of a trap I was in, going up to that intensity, having to rest recover like super hard, and then going right back up to that crazy intensity, whereas these trigger sessions, it's a completely different mentality,

and it's been nothing but beneficial. And in my progress has not hit any sort of plateau. Well, I'm really, I'm so glad that you brought this up, Sal, because, you know, we have to, we need to realize this too. So this is important. What do we, what do we add, Doug? Like 280 or what do we have episodes now? We're up there high, right? 200 close to that, something like that. And, you know, Doug, like 280, or what are we up to? Episodes now, we're up there high, right?

200 close to that, something like that. And originally we first started, and we're going through and we're releasing programs, and we're only like 100 episodes deep or whatever. We were organically growing, and we had a small community of people that we felt like we could probably touch. Now it's grown so out of control that there's hundreds of people that are buying the program and running the program

that we don't even know or have made contact with or realize that these are people that are just connected to the people that have already been through the programs and have ranted and raved so much and said, you gotta go get this match, you gotta do this. And then they just, they just obviously listen to their friends, they buy it, but then they haven't listened to episodes. And then I hear them, like they email me or inbox me and they're like, you know, I feel like there's not enough working out.

I feel like this program is really basic. And at first I get a little offended and then I realize, oh shit, these are people that they have not listened to episodes. No, they've been sold on the old, the, you know, the body parts split, they've been sold on the old concept of just beat the crap out of a muscle that it rests for a week.

For so long that what they look at different type of programming that takes these things in account, to them it's like, well this is too different. This is not gonna work. And if you're a my impump or a pump head like we would say, or OG and you've been speaking, you know better, you would never bring that up because you've heard enough episodes of us. Explain all this. We have been drilling that for a long time, right? But that's why it's important. I think that we revisit some of these topics because, you know, not everybody can get in, get on our podcast if they just got on last week for the first time and listen to

200 fucking 70 episodes. So man, there's some really key points that we probably, and this is definitely one of them. You know, sell you brought up one time. I thought was one of the really, really good analogies that you're given about. When we talked about adaptation and recovery and understanding that's how it works. And the brain is very similar in how, you know, you would not go learn a subject and cram all like a language, a new language.

I'm going to go learn Italian next week. I wouldn't cram all that I could possibly learn in that week in Italian thinking that I would be, I would, you would, you would learn, you would sit back a little bit, you would retain that, you would practice it, then you go back, you know what I'm saying? The process is, I keep thinking of that family guy episode, you showed me, you said, boob correct. All of the systems of adaptation of the body do very well with frequency, with frequency of exposure. And intensity is part of it, right? If you lived in Italy and you were immersed in a tie

and you'd learn very quickly over time, but you're constantly kind of, it's that frequency of exposure, but you'd learn even faster if while you were in Italy, you took two classes a week too, right? But if you just took one 15 hour class, you would retain very, very little

in terms of what you were supposed to learn. Well, there's studies on that, right? There's already studies on how much, like when we watch a video, how much the brain actually absorbs of that. And we know already, it's not 100%, not even close to that, it's a fraction. And this is why our programs are, we utilize frequency in a way that I've never seen any other program

utilized the closest I've ever seen to really understand frequency of stimulation are the strength-based you know powerlifting and weightlifting type programs. And here's the thing now with, and this is why I'd learned so much from power lifters and Olympic lifters. Because Olympic lifters and power lifters, especially Olympic lifters, they have Olympic lifters have competed on the Olympic stage for a long time. It's existed in countries that were communist, that would spend lots of money on the best science to research what the best effects were. You know, it's a big international sport, and there's a lot of science behind it, whereas bodybuilding has never achieved that level of effectiveness.

It's never had, it's never been on an international stage in that particular way. It wasn't in the Olympics, it probably never will be. They never really applied the science in the same way, And you look at Olympic lifters and they understand frequency. Yeah, they understand how it works. I was just gonna see on the bodybuilding side, like I'm sure, at the level of their knowledge of hormone and artificial. That's where they know they're should.

You know what I mean? I feel like that's where they've really experimented and used science to progress their body into a way where it's so big now, it's just, it's so unnatural and looks so unachievable now that I think that they're getting backlash because, you know, they're trying to bring it back down to scale to somewhat of what the human body could naturally sort of achieve. So, here's a deal of bodybuilding. Genes influence how you look, way, just such a tremendous level, and then the drugs that you take.

So this is where all of their, this is where all the time has been spent. You look a certain way because you're on a stage, and then the type of drugs that you take, and then the workouts themselves are like big deal. Break down muscle, let it rebuild. With Olympic lifting, genes do play a role, yes, but it's also how much you lift, and really training and technique are massive in that. And so the science that goes behind, like if you look in a Olympic lifting program,

it's broken down scientifically, power lifting programs, broken down scientifically, fitness programs, not so much. It's like, yo, chest, you're here, throw four exercises there, do a body parts scientifically, fitness programs, not so much. It's like, you know, chest, you're here to throw four exercises there, do a body parts split, do this. When we design the math programs, we try to, we approached it with the programming mentality that you see some of these. And not because the goal was Olympic lifting, the goal is obviously whether it be aesthetics or performance or overall muscle growth,

we went in with that type of mentality and we understand frequency of stimulation. This is why we tend to favor full body type routines where you're working the full body relatively intensely, at least a few days a week versus hitting a body part once a week. The science actually now supports us. We know now you hit your chest really hard. That muscle building signal lasts about 72 hours. Now, it could take you longer than 72 hours to recover, but the building signal lasts about 72 hours.

Now, doesn't it make sense to hit your chest again before that signal starts to dampen? And in a way that won't cause too much more damage, right? Because again, you're limited by your ability to recover. And this is where this is why even the most basic full body routine, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, full body routine for the vast majority of you guys listening, guys and girls listening right now, I would put money that about 80% of you. I was just say, vast majority, I mean, like 80, 90% of you at least will do, will build more muscle, more strength, and burn more body fat, working your full body three days a week

than you will on a five day or six day body parts split. Well, I'll put my money down on that, up, you know, up down left right, no problem. I think, I think to another thing people experience right away, that you're mentioning a bit about the Olympic lifting side and, you know, that powerlifting and those kind of programming. One thing, like, you know, pavels like five by five and like, you know, getting your reps only to be

like between like five, you know, two to five reps, something like that. A lot of people, you know, especially in our demographic here at an art, I've probably never been exposed to that, and what that feels like on the body, and doing that properly with applied rest, and also, the other concept I think that's really impactful is the stopping to rep short. Oh, not going to failure. Yeah, so that's another point.

I wanted to bring up know, bring up. It's, it's like every one of these little nuggets though. Like that's something that, like, uh, you, you immediately apply, you immediately see, uh, that that's going to help your body to get into that adaptation process, that mode. So we're not completely going to kill. Kill is failure. Well, let's be completely honest with our audience too. We knew damn well that when we talk about that and when we implemented that in phase one that We knew that that would show people. We knew that would be a dramatic change for a lot of people and it would show people

Major change. I mean because because most people don't train most people to do that So you know, when that's why I think so many of our fans love phase one Too because it's like the first time they've been introduced to a lot of these compound movements and lifting this low Rebs because most everybody in the world is always about burning fat or losing weight or getting skinny or are looking in a certain way Nobody talks about you in 50 booty bands. Yeah, right exactly. So then all of a sudden they do, they do three to five squats. And it's like, holy shit. And the body responds and change. And then also that we put a lot of, most people, if those that were training super hard already, they were probably overdoing it and always going to failure. So then when we introduce that, we know those two, those two processes

are such big game changers that is the opposite almost almost every program. Yeah, it's interesting No, I don't know any performance sport that Teaches their athletes to train to failure like any performance-based sport. Yeah, you know what I mean like power lifters I do who crossfit. Oh shit. What? I you know what's you know what's a sport? No, can I can I tell you something? Crossfit competitors. I can tell you this right now, do not regularly train before competition to be like till failure, to fuck themselves up. I guarantee you they don't. They wouldn't make it to the actual games. Not all of them.

There's a lot of them that actually that are smart and they run programs different than what they teach and do stuff with that. But you know, the way this one to be said about the competitors, not your average like, you know, crossfitting guy. Just like you brought up in the, just like you brought up with the bodybuilding, the same thing goes for like your crowd. People see those athletes, they're rich froning. I was just watching a video on him the other day, guys, just a phenom. People

do not realize that those guys are such genetic freaks that if you put him, you put that same guy on a bodybuilding routine and trained him, didn't even do any crossroads over, he would look fucking like a freak because they're just, they're freaks, they're genetic freaks and there's the, and most of our professional athletes or the elite of elite are, not to take anything away. They also train hard at genetics. It is. And when people, they look up to these people and they think that, and then when these people are giving advice, it's like, they're giving it, which is also why, you know, you talked, we've talked earlier about, you know, looking at each other as a great sources of information. I know that the gentleman that are sitting in this room with me are fucking average guys, just like me. We're not a bunch of fucking supergeneers. I know,

as much as I would love, you know, we are not a bunch of supergeneedic freaks. Even Justin and I played sports, but I was I was I was never this picked up the ball and I was better than I'm not in a fill. Yeah, it shows right. And I worked my ass off just to hang just to start on a team. I never played football, but I think if I played, I probably would have gone at least D1. So you know, we are not those and we have our we have buddies of ours, right no. It's good. So, you know, we are not those guys. And we have our, we have buddies of ours, right? We have buddies of ours that, you know, influence a lot of people on social media and write

programs and do stuff like that that are that fall in that category of genetic freeze. And sometimes I don't think they realize how, how special and unique they are in compared to everybody else that's paying attention to listening to because I think if they did, they wouldn't, they wouldn't think that they could get away with the same amount of stuff, because they can't unless you or somebody who was just built to be able to take that kind of volume and be able to see it to. And kids like, that's funny because my son's playing soccer and there's just always that one kid that's the same age, you know, everything, but you maybe, you might be a little

bit taller or, you know, a little bit more built But like, you know, the muscle jeans already there, you know, they're just running for the ball Their skills are naturally so superior. Oh, it's like they're he's like running circles around the entire and he's the same age He's running around everybody, you know doing laps and then he scores Well, we're just like we don't have an answer to this. Right. And you, son, let's, let's, let's hit the gatorade. Yeah, right.

You've seen, uh, you've seen videos of Tiger Woods when he was like three years old swing a golf club. Are you kidding me? I can't, I've taken golf lessons. I've done golf. I can't swing a club like that when he was throwing it at three years old. Yeah. You know, like, so they, some people just have got, there was one kid, my, my daughter just

started playing soccer and she's six. Okay. So these are six years old. You know, like, they, some people just have got, there was one kid, my daughter just started playing soccer. And she's six. Okay, so these are six years old. There's six year olds. You ever watch six year olds play soccer? Yeah. It's adorable. It's hilarious.

There's this little boy and he's this little kid and he gets the soccer ball and every time he gets the ball, he makes a goal. The kid is like passing the ball around himself, just going around with these different kids. Hits a goal, runs away from like passing the ball around himself, just going around with his different kids, hits a goal, runs away from the goal, takes a shirt off, twirls it over his head, does the cross and kisses up, blows up, piss up to the sky. And I'm like, this guy, this kid watches, he watches, he watches, he watches, he's telling Mondo

every day and watches, freaking soccer games. And he's obviously, he's waiting for a go. He's obviously bred to play. You're watching that kind of shit. They get excited. No, I think, I'll say this, look, most of our experience is based on training people. It's based on training other people. And when I first became a trainer, and Adam said we're average, and we are average, but we have a lot of experience training ourselves. I would constantly, up until not that long ago, I've been a trainer for a long, I've been

a trainer for 19 years. And for a lot of that time, I would train people based on how I responded to exercise and how I felt during exercise. And I know if I went back, I over did it. And I would train people not the most efficient way. Now I'm much better. And if the average trainer saw me now training people I can guarantee you this especially when I get my My you know

650 something 60-year-old 70-year-old people they would probably be like oh you barely worked them or you know Wow, they're resting a lot in between sets and but they don't you know if you watch me longer You'll see that oh, but she used to have to use a walker She doesn't have to use a walk anymore but that guy now can do a full a full body weight squat and he couldn't do a full body weight squat before. We understand how the body responds and how most people respond. And most people listening right now, the vast majority of you will A,

do better on a full body three day week routine than when all the body will on a body parts split. Will B, do better if you stop two reps short of failure versus going to failure. C, we'll do far better if you stop two reps short of failure versus going to failure see will do far better If you focus on your big barbell compound movements versus going on machines and and indeed will do better with more frequent Exercise for each body part then with what I don't know. Why did you use the alphabet? ABCD. Yeah, I want you just go one two or three. I don't know nonetheless Yeah, I want you to just go one two or three. I don't know. Nonetheless

I was just watching him count his fingers and he's going A B C. I was waiting for this like drawn in there And the last thing is frequency frequency of stimulation he's drawing it on your back Exactly a lot of you will do better with frequency of stimulation and this plus much much much more A lot of you will do better with frequency stimulation. And this plus much, much, much more went into our designing of our programs. And with each of them being very specific, right? Maps and a bulk red focused on overall strength, overall muscle gain.

We had Maps performance, which is your mobility, your broad spectrum performance, being able to move like an ancient athlete. And then Maps aesthetic, which is as close as wherever you're gonna get to training You know bodybuilder, which is training you to help you look the way you want to look bring up lagging body parts And so you know, I want to can I put Doug on the spot right here? Sure. I feel like that when that happens I know Doug. I want to put you in the spot. Doug on the spot. So here's the thing I this is why this is such a crap so glad glad you brought this up, so I feel like,

I don't know about you guys, but I have, I literally have gotten several emails and it's taken up a lot of my time explaining all our program because a lot of people haven't listened everything and I'm like, holy shit, wow. People don't realize that just cause black just came out that I still would recommend you go through red and go through green before you go to black

and the importance of all of it. Yes, you can go black right now. Absolutely. And I've had to answer that to a lot of people that, yeah, you could totally do that. I'm not saying you can't. But if you, if you listen to what we talk about in this show and you're looking for long term, long term, you want the best results, the most optimal, then the best process would be no matter what phase. No, I don't care if you're experienced. If you've been lifting for 10 years, I still would recommend somebody go to red first, then go to green and then go to black, because they all are specific adaptations

that we're focusing on, and they're all very important to learn. Whether you stay, maybe you're somebody who just goes through green and you're like me, where green is not, I'm not performance-based guy, I'm more of a look guy, but I still will forever implement so many of the tools that we have implemented inside

of mobility and performance into my program and routine because I saw what a difference it made on how I feel and how I look and my posture and those things. So, well, it's interesting because now we release green back in January, I think. And so now we're starting to get emails from people who've completed it. And what are we getting?

Oh my God, I can overhead press 50 more pounds and the hips feel so much better. I can squat so much deeper. My deadlift is going up now and it's like, I told you. Because when you first go through it, you're like, oh wait, just feel better. I mean, it's very different. That's the most different program

out of all the three that we have. It's the most different one. But now people are doing it and they're coming out and going, oh shit, I see now why you guys got people on the bus. Okay, so I just talked to one of our, this was yesterday, talked to one of our trainers that has gone through all the faith, has gone through red, has gone through green. I remember when she was going through green, she was texting me, she's like, I feel like I'm losing my strength.

I feel like I'm not as this. And I don't know, I don't feel like my muscles are as pumped up and I was just, I was like, just trust the process. Trust me. I felt the same thing when I went through it too, but I knew that that's not the adaptation we're focusing on. We're focusing on mobility, functionality. You're gonna see when you get out of that and you go either go back to red or you go into black

if it's ready by then. This is what I'm telling her. So she's now gone through her first week of black and I get a text message. And she was like, so pumped to tell me when I'm telling her. So she's now gone through her first week of black and I get a text message. And she was like, so pumped to tell me when I saw her yesterday. And she's like, you know what? Like I swear to God, like I really almost gave up

on green while I was going through it because I just didn't, I didn't feel and as excited as I was going through regs I saw different stuff like that where green I was more focused on how I felt. And yeah, I felt better, but I wanted to see more. more she goes but now being in the first week of black holy shit She goes p-arring everything already and and so I cannot believe how I feel right now. Yeah, I'm like I told you I told you just that's an update to go through the journey. Well, that's adaptation

That's what I mean. That's what we're talking about like if you focus if you make your primary focus of your training adaptation and not damage, you are gonna go very, very far. If you make the primary focus of your workout damage, you're gonna be like most people in the gym and do get very little results and eventually get discouraged, burn out, and stop. Well, this is where I was putting Doug on the spot

and I didn't get to it, but what I want to do, Doug, if you would do this, is, make it picture of yourself. No, these do. I would like to put some sort of a, I would like to put some sort of a bundle program together that includes red, green, and black. That is, it's nine months of basically training.

You get nine months. So you get nine months of programming. Yes, nine months of, follow one, two, three, four. Yes, follow each step all the way through. Maybe you include the forum because I think that's such a useful tool of coaching from all of us and other other peers. Yeah, that's essential. Some sort of a bundle like that that is encouraging them to get involved, whether it be something super low up front or a deal, something, but I would love to do that. And I think that's something

that we should probably start talking more about because I feel like there's so many people that are just now joining us. Is that possible, can we do that? It is possible. And in fact, I'm gonna say go to mindpumpmedia.com. It will be on there as this episode. Oh, here. You know what's hilarious? That totally sounded like a commercial.

You did. It did. It was just like totally random. Can we have been thinking about that? Can we be super transparent, right? Yeah. Okay, because people listening right now, like super transparent, right? Yeah, okay. Cause people listening right now,

like, oh, I just did a commercial. No, we literally did not do anything for a while. We had no fucking idea what we're gonna talk about. Half the time. It's just that Adam is naturally. He's a sales machine. He just naturally does that. He is damn good.

And I'm gonna scramble to put this thing together. Exactly, time to start. Yeah, because, you know what, I wanna make Adam happy. See, I really do. I've witted him. You have witted him. I would've overdue. First, it's over the ice cream.

What's that? Gelato. Gelato. That was in a previous episode. Yeah, right for that one. Whatever. Fuck everybody. Don't forget, you can leave us a five-star rating

and review on iTunes. Cause Doug gives out free t-shirts when you need it. Free t-shirts. I, you can leave us a five star rating and review on iTunes. Cause Doug gives out free t-shirts when you do free t-shirts. I think you should tell people that too. You know, I've noticed that you just say that and people are like, man, I'll get around to it. But bug do, don't know they get a free t-shirt. We give out a lot of t-shirts to people. We do.

You know, I'm a people pleaser, obviously. And so I give out a lot of t-shirts for great reviews. And so every week we pick the best iTunes reviews and we send out t-shirts. Last week we gave out five last week. I believe it was four or five last week, but we've been consistently giving out about five a week. Beautiful. And don't forget to check us on an Instagram at Mind Pump Radio. You can find me at Mind Pump Sal. You can find Adam at Mind Pump Adam and Justin at Mind Pump Justin. And like Doug said, Mind Pump Media.com is what you'll see the programs and the bundle the super bundle

I guess we're gonna call super bundle we have no idea what it's gonna be price it'll probably be a good deal though It'll be Lots of loser Thank you for listening to Mind Pump for more information about this show and to get valuable free resources from South Adam and Justin Visitors at www.mind pumppumpradio.com. Until next time, this is MindPump.