Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2878: Why You're Losing Muscle While Trying to Lose Fat (And How to Fix It)

Episode Date: June 12, 2026

In this episode the guys break down the muscle paradox! Why people are losing muscle while trying to lose fat, why this crisis is being amplified by GLP-1 use, and the three things that cause it: inadequate protein, poor resistance training programming, and a cardio focus. They also get into the testosterone U-shape curve and how more isn't always better for libido, Sal's upcoming talk at the World Peptide Congress in Arizona, Adam's sauna routine and how it kept him from getting the norovirus that took down his whole family, the shriek bird that impales its prey on thorns, and polar bear fun facts nobody asked for. Then they answer questions submitted through Instagram, covering how to add cardio after years of strength training, what's actually happening in your body when you under-eat but still get stronger, physical standards for men and women in their late 30s and early 40s, and how to approach warm-up sets. MAPS Summer Sale — https://mapsfitnessproducts.com Code: SUMMER40 — 40% off everything including Maps Prime — June 1–14 only SPONSORS Paleo Valley (grass-fed meat sticks) — https://paleovalley.com/mindpump 15% off automatically applied at checkout — no code needed. Fermented, gut-friendly, 8g protein per stick. Legion (supplements) — https://buylegion.com/mindpump Code: MPB2G1 — Buy 2 get 1 free. Third-party tested, efficacious doses only. Rice Krispie protein bars and pure creatine highlighted this episode. Hiya (kids' multivitamin) — https://hiyahealth.com/MINDPUMP 50% off first order — no code needed, deal only available at this link. Zero sugar, non-GMO, vegan, allergy-free. LINKS Mind Pump Store:  https://mindpumpstore.com Maps Fitness Products:  https://mapsfitnessproducts.com Instagram: @mindpumpmedia 0:00 - Intro 2:59 - The muscle paradox — why you're losing muscle while trying to lose fat 8:21 - How GLP-1 and Retatrutide are amplifying the muscle loss crisis 17:27 - The 3 causes: inadequate protein, poor RT programming & cardio focus 23:01 - Testosterone U-shape curve — why more isn't always better for libido 27:16 - Sal's World Peptide Congress talk at the Biltmore in Arizona (June 20th) 39:26 - Adam's sauna routine — how he dodged the norovirus that wrecked his whole family 52:15 - The shriek bird, the barrel-eye fish & polar bears that hunt humans 59:53 - Q&A: How to add cardio after 2–3 years of just strength training 1:04:22 - Q&A: What's happening in your body when you under-eat but still get stronger? 1:06:12 - Q&A: Physical standards for men and women in their late 30s and early 40s 1:10:57 - Q&A: Should you do warm-up sets for every exercise?  

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Visit night and day, day decor.com or call 647-360-6151. That's night and day, day decor.com. If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind Pump. Mind Pump with your hosts. Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded Fitness, Health, and Entertainment podcast in the history of podcast. That's right, this is Mind Pump. In today's episode, we answered listeners questions.

People went to Instagram, Mind Pump Media. They posted some questions. We picked four. And we answered them at the end of the episode. But the beginning of the episode was 57 minutes long. It's the intro. So we're talking about exercise and fat loss and strength training and cardio and diet. We also talk about current events and family life.

It's always a good time. By the way, I'm going to be speaking on June, I believe, 19th or 20th, June 20th, in Arizona at the World Peptide Congress. This is a Congress where they're discussing the latest research on peptide science. So you're interested in peptides what they do, how to use them, what works, what doesn't work. Or you just want to come hear me speak. I'll be speaking Saturday, June 20th at 1030 a.m. And you can register, sign up, attend virtually or in person.

Go to SSRP Institute.org. Now, this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Paleo Valley. Today we talked about their gut-friendly, clean protein snacks. They're meat sticks. These are fermented meat sticks. That means they're juicy. They taste good.

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off for the summer. Huge sale. Go to Maps at Fitness Products.com. Use the code summer 40 for the 40% off discount. All right, real quick, if you love us like we love you, why not show it by rocking one of our shirts, hats, mugs, or training gear over at at my pumpstore.com. I'm talking right now, hit pause, head on over to mindpumpstor.com. That's it. Enjoy the rest of the show. All right, we're going to talk about a big problem that's happening right now. The muscle paradox. why you're losing muscle while you're trying to lose fat and we're going to talk about how you can fix this.

Let's talk about it now. It's paradoxical. It does feel like this is going to be the theme for the next like five, 10 years with the rise of GLP ones. Totally. Oh, yeah. Good point. This is going to be an ongoing conversation.

There is a silent muscle loss crisis that's happening. I want to be clear, this was a crisis before too. It was just overshadowed. by the obesity epidemic. Like we referred to the poor health epidemic. It should have been renamed the poor health epidemic, but obesity is the clear outward sign of it, right? It's easy to see when somebody's really overweight.

But really having too little muscle or too little strength or too little quality muscle was a big part of this problem. And you can see this in the data. A significant percentage of people who get heart disease or cancer or chronic disease are not overweight. Now, the majority are overweight, but there's a significant percentage of people that are not overweight that get those problems as well,

including diabetes, significant to the point where we're talking about millions and millions of people. And when you look at people who fall in the category of obese, what you also see alongside of it, much more often than not, vast majority of the time, is something called sarcopenia, which is low muscle mass and weakness.

And I'll add to this a better predictor of all cause mortality than simply being overweight, because that's also a predictor, is how weak you are. It's actually a better predictor. So this crisis has been happening for a while, but now it's going to amp the heck up because now what you have is a very powerful medical intervention, the likes of which we've never seen. We've never seen anything as effective as a GLP for weight loss. And what this causes, if not handled appropriately, is significant muscle loss to the tune of 40 percent, 38, 35 to 40 percent of the weight that people are losing right now, this is almost half, is coming from muscle. So,

it's only going to amplify this problem even more. Well, it's interesting, too, because there was a common thought that obesity or people that were obese actually had a little bit more lean muscle to be able to withhold this body mass, which when they did those MRI scans, and they started to show actually sarcopenia was pretty prevalent amongst a lot of like overweight and obese people as well. In a society that in a culture where activity and hard labor is the norm, so let's think 100 years ago, that might have been true. So if you were, and this was unlikely back then, but let's say you were overweight, but you also worked a physical job. You probably did have more muscle because you were moving more body weight. But today, obesity is closely connected to being sedentary. Yeah.

So you're also eating, you're not just eating poorly, but you're also very sedentary. We're all sedentary, like just as a culture. You're not building muscles sitting here. So, yeah. So sarcopenia is right along with it. In fact, it's, you can bet on it. If you see, if you yourself are struggling with being obese or you pick 100 people who fall in that category, and then you test them with an MRI, like Justin said, what you see is also low muscle mass. So it's actually both.

And low muscle mass or weak muscles contribute to all kinds of terrible. Lots of problems. Yes, in fact, an overweight or obese person who has good quality muscle who is strong has better. mortality outcomes than someone who is underweight with low muscle mass. So just to go to show you how big of a problem this is or how much it contributes to poor health. What percentage of GLP1 users do you guys think are aware of this? I believe that they fall in like two categories, the GLP1 users. You are either completely naive to this and you're just,

and you're fixated on the weight and not very aware that as you lose this weight, you're probably losing just as much muscle. And then I find there's, and it seems that this is a rising group of GFN are aware of that because there's a lot of people like ourselves that are kind of screaming this from the rooftop that are aware of it that are excited for Red Trutide or already getting it on the gray market because of what it says about building muscle. Yeah, muscle preservation and even building muscle in a calorie deficit. And so they think it's going to be this miracle drug that's going to solve this problem

that we're talking about right now. The phase three trials on Reddit Trutide actually showed more muscle loss than terseptide. Really? Yes. Now, here's why. And so without getting too deep in the weeds

because people get confused over this. And I often hear peptide, you know, social media influencers communicate this. These GLPs do increase or improve insulin sensitivity through their mechanisms. And insulin sensitivity is good for muscle preservation. But here's what happens. Red or Trutide is so much more powerful of an appetite suppressor.

And it also has a metabolic boosting effect, a slight one, that these people are just in a larger deficit. I don't care how many signals you send your body to preserve muscle from a chemical standpoint. If your calories are super low and you're not strength training, there's no material. You're going to lose a ton of muscle. Yeah. That's just what happens.

And you'll lose bone mass, which is what. what's going to happen. But I think what's happening, Adam, is people are blinded because they see the scale moving down and they're being encouraged by their health care practitioner that we're moving in the right direction. Yeah, I think there's two, that's why I said, I think there's really two camps here. I think there's the, there's the naive person who's probably just taking advice from their medical practitioner who's like, awesome, we're down another 10, keep it going. Or the plateau hits, hey, ramp up the dose. You know, I think that's definitely. one gLP1 user but and of course i'm in a different circle of people that i think are a little more

aware and privy to peptides but i've been sharing recently with how surprised i am with the amount of like average people around me that are talking about glp ones and right now the big conversation is reda i mean everybody is just hyped on it because you can build muscle and you and you don't lose muscle like so they they have this idea that this new glp1 is going to save them for from all this muscle loss. And it's just like, I don't think people were, and I understand what the original studies came out and showed. It was, wow, this is so crazy that it's helping that.

And it's, but if you're still in a massive calorie deficit, like you said, it doesn't matter. No, Doug, if you could pull up phase three trial, red at true tide muscle loss, let's get the exact number. So when did this come? So because the last time I had hurt, huh? This was a phase three trial in humans. So through the mechanisms and through some other ways,

they were like, this might be more, this should be more muscle preserving. But it's not that easy. It's not that easy to preserve muscle. This is why, okay, so remember when the, the first stuff came up? And obviously it was in probably what, chimps when they did it originally? Animals and, yes. And also the mechanisms, because they're looking at the receptors that it's attaching to and it should do this and it should do that kind of thing.

So I remember when we first saw that, we were like, whoa, this is crazy that it's showing this in the studies. Right. And so now you're saying that they've done more stuff on. on it with humans, and it's not as promising as what the original thought was. So what they're looking at is the ratio of fat to muscle, but you're also looking at more total weight loss, and so more muscle loss. So the ratio is great, but it doesn't matter if you're losing more muscle. So, by the way, when we say GLP1,

we're really referring to are the first phase of GLPs, some agglutide. Then you had GLP2s, which acted on two receptors, and Red or Trutide is a GLP3, which acts on three receptors. But again, I think that this muscle loss crisis was already there, but it's getting worse because now you're getting people who are using these very powerful peptides and not the first consideration, the number one consideration when it comes to weight loss or fat loss

is muscle preservation. That's the most important thing to consider when you're losing body fat. Yes. Because muscle loss, loss sabotages fat loss. Muscle loss sabotages health. It sabotages hormone health. It sabotages quality of life. And it will happen predictably when you're in a calorie deficit unless you take all the precautions to keep muscle. So if you're trying to lose weight, the number one thing you focus on, perhaps number two, maybe number one is how do I do this sustainably, but number one in terms of

physiologically in the steps, like, how do I keep muscle while losing this body fat? Because if you lose muscle, your metabolic adaptation moves faster downward, meaning you're going to make it so that it's harder for you to maintain the weight loss. You're going to lose strength, lose mobility, become more frail. Insulin sensitivity gets worse because you just have less muscle. And you potentially, and oftentimes do hit a plateau that will require you to drop your calories even lower. Yeah.

And now you're, you're, you're living on very little calories and nutrients, um, which makes stress harder to handle. You know, when your calories are really low, this is,

this is one of the ways that you get, your body helps and handles itself with stress as it's got nutrients. You got really low calories. You handle poor sleep worse. You handle exercise worse. You handle all stress situations worse. Libido drops, um,

quality of life drops. But again, I think a lot of people ignore this because they see the scale moving down. And you're hearing reports of this, by the way. People are saying things and you see, oh, it killed my libido. That's not what killed your libido. What killed your libido? Under calorie.

Yeah. You're way too low. Yeah, back to the educated user, like the GLP1 type users. Are they under the impression, like this Reda 2 tried? Like they don't need to address like the training aspect, the protein. It's still going to just save their muscle just by taking the chemical. What I think has happened is that, again, I think we have a, a very clear divide in the GLP 1 user,

GLP 1, 2 or 3 users, right? Is that you have people that are, you know, obese, going straight to the doctor. Doctors giving them the prescription. All they're monitoring really is their, they're monitoring their blood markers and seeing things like cholesterol, blood pressure go down.

They're monitoring their scale weight. And so long as all those are going down, it's a thumbs up, keep going. Nobody's monitoring strength. Right, right, right. We'll just ramp up the, and if they hit a plateau, it's double the dose up and just keep,

And so there's definitely that group of people. And I'm not sure what that percentage is. That's why I asked you guys, speculative, right? I would have assumed that it was a larger percentage originally. But just from personal experience and the circles that I've been around and I've been sharing with you guys like how crazy it is that, how many people, just average people are talking about that are selling it on the side now. I think they have heard fitness people like us talking about, hey, you got to be really careful

on these GLP ones. People are losing tons of muscle. and now there's this big talk about Reda. Reda is the one that keeps the muscle. Yeah, it keeps muscle and you lose a fat. That's what's so, like, so there's this hype around just how amazing it is in comparison. And I don't think they realize just how closely similar they really are. I mean, that anybody who's experienced semi-glutide to Giuseppei to Reda,

they're all very, very similar, the mechanism at which they work, right? They crush the appetite and they make you eat less. They quiet the noise. And yes, they've gotten better at like maybe preserving a little bit, the percentage of muscle. But you're still, if you're going to eat 1,000, 200,000 calorie deficits every single day and not strength trained properly and not hit protein intake, you're going to lose a ton of muscle. I'm going to look. Physiologically, yeah, it's impossible. I'll go extreme.

I'll paint an extreme scenario. That happens all the time. do you know who else loses muscle in a severe calorie deficit? And we see this all the time. Pro bodybuilders. These are people men and women with, first off, genetics that build muscle like you wouldn't believe. These are the equivalent of seven foot tall people.

That's how rare their muscle building genetics are. On top of it, they take copious anabolic hormones. Steroids and testosterone and growth hormone. They'll take steroids that are designed for cattle that are banned. and for human use that are so powerful, they could call psychiatric conditions like tremblown, very powerful, 500 times stronger on the anabolic and endogenic markers

than testosterone, for example. They're on these crazy drugs. They've got crazy, insane genetics. They hit protein, but they're in a calorie deficit pre-contest, and guess what happens to them? They lose muscle too. So you're telling me, Mrs. Johnson, who's on Reddict True Tide,

who is just eating way less, who's not doing any of those things, oh, the Reda's going to keep my muscle. Yeah, that's good. Not going to happen. The data shows it. So, and by the way, this isn't just true for people who are on. This is problematic, dude.

This is not a problem. This is not just an issue for people on GLPs. By the way, I want to be clear, the GLPs are not causing the muscle. No, this was a problem. Okay, we've been saying since day one on this podcast, that one of the number one issues I had with all of my clients was under-eating protein. That's right.

And not proper strength training and over-abusing cardio. That's like, that's been around, forever. That's right. Way before these GLP ones got popular, that was already a problem. So you now take that and you add this new drug that makes them eat even less. Yeah, it all is false confidence. Yes.

Yep, 100%. So this is a problem anytime that somebody goes in a sub-calorie diet to lose body fat. So this is the number one thing you need to manage is muscle. And there's a few things. Adam just mentioned them. So we'll break them down a little bit. Number one is inadequate protein intake. So when you look at the data on sub-calorie diets or what are called calorie deficit diets,

in other words, you're eating less calories than you're burning, right? Because you're trying to lose body fat. When protein is high, and when I say high, I don't mean what the RDA considers high. What I mean is what fitness coaches and what the data shows as being high, the upper limit of where you're going to get benefit, which is closer to a gram of protein per pound of target body weight. So it's way more than what you would read the RDA saying as being high. Okay. Now, I'm overshooting it a little bit, but in coaching circles, it's just even more beneficial.

But the data will show it's closer to that. It's like 0.8 grams per pound of target body weight or something like that. So 1 gram per pound of target body weight. What the data shows, when you look at those areas, is even without strength training, it has a muscle preserving effect. When you add strength training, it's even more powerful. So inadequate protein intake as defined by not hitting. getting these super high targets that we're talking about, is a, you're essentially shooting yourself

in the foot and you're going to make muscle loss much more prevalent with your weight loss journey. The second thing is poor strength training or resistance training programming. So I think a lot of people know by now if they want to keep muscle, especially if they want to build muscle, they need to do strength training. But I don't think a lot of people know what that looks like. No. Especially in a low calorie deficit.

That's right. Because appropriate strength training is important here too, not just, oh, like, oh, I do the right movements. The right movements with overapplied intensity and volume can be just as detrimental. You're not going to die. And I think that's the part that's really screwing a lot of people is they're like, I'm still pushing in the gym doing my thing. It's just like, yeah, but you're doing way too much for how little you're feeding yourself.

You're only exacerbating the problem. That's right. So the first problem I see with poor resistance training programming is that people think if you use a dumbbell or a barbell or machines, it automatically qualifies a strength training. that's not strength training, not necessarily. It's the rest periods that make it strength training. So if I use dumbbells, barbells, and machines in a way that looks like cardio, if I'm doing circuits, if I'm doing exercise after exercise after exercise with no rest,

to try to sweat to try to get out of breath, then I'm essentially, I might as well be running on a treadmill. I'm not doing strength training. Strength training that builds muscle or that preserves muscle is known as traditional resistance training or strength training. I do a set, maybe eight to 10 reps, relatively high intensity, then I rest for two to four minutes, and then I do another set.

And then to what Adam's saying, what's really important to consider your ability to recover and adapt, and that consideration is even more important when your calories are low. So if I have a tendency to overdo it at 3,000 calories, my tendency to overdo it multiplies when I go down to 1,500 calories because I have just less nutrients, less food, less calories. Recovery agents. To recover.

So strength training needs to be appropriate. And what it typically looks like with somebody who's in a subcalorie diet is less than what it looks like when somebody is in a maintenance caloric diet or a diet where they're trying to build. You brought up the bodybuilders and the copious amount of drugs they're taking and their genetics and they're training. This was common with them. I remember watching, and you would see them lose muscle. They would ramp up intensity as they get into these severe calorie deficits for six to eight weeks going into showtime. Sometimes 12 to 16 weeks. Yeah.

And so, and what ends up happening, and the average person doesn't know any better because they see somebody who just gets shredded and they get up on stage and they have abs. Oh my God, they look amazing. But they lost 10 pounds of muscle. Yeah, but I'm behind the scene. with a lot of these because they're my peers and we're all checking body fat and doing dexas scans and we're monitoring how much lean body masks we have going into this

and they're showing up every time to the stage with the same amount of lean body mass or less than they did on the previous show. They just, they go through this off season of bulking up 30, 40 pounds and trying to build to go to this crazy cut to show up that's exactly the same as what they were at the last one.

And why that is is because they go on these severe cuts and they also ramp up intensity and training. And you're talking about people that others would look at and go like, oh, they know what they're doing. They've got good form, technique. They're training. They're doing all the right things. But that's, and they're on all those drugs. And yet that still happens to them. So again, using your point. It's an extreme analogy, but it just shows. It is. Exactly. That's the point of bringing

this up is not to lose the audience and go like, well, I'm not a pro body belt. And I'm not taking drugs. No, it's an extreme analogy of even these people with great genetics, taking all the drugs, know how to resist the strain, still do this inappropriately by ramping up intensity while being in a calorie deficit, while doing cardio and low cal. It's like is a recipe for losing muscle. That's right.

And you bet your ass if you're just, you know, Jane or Joe on a GLP one, and you're not taking all those drugs and you're not a genetic freak, and you're doing those things, you will. And you'll lose just as much as you lose fat, which puts you in a worse situation than when you were,

40 pounds overweight. 100%. So what strength training would typically look like in a subcalorie diet for the average person is not every day hitting the gym, hammering myself. It's traditional strength training probably two full body workouts a week or one to two exercises every single day. This is probably what would be appropriate for this individual and to carefully manage intensity. And how do you know if this is going the right way, you're getting stronger? This is the best measure of moving in the right direction is I'm actually getting stronger. At the very least maintaining. If you get weaker, you're going the opposite direction. Because you're almost certainly

get weaker. Most people get weaker. You start cutting, you start cutting and reducing calories and losing lots of way. Most people see a significant drop in strength. And so bare minimum, you should be maintaining. And if you're doing a really good job. You're getting a little stronger. Yeah, you found a way to get stronger during this, which means you probably have a really good balance. Now the last big issue is improper exercise focus, in particular cardio focus. So all different versions or forms of exercise have specific types of value. In the case of weight loss, the number one consideration is preserving muscle. The only form of exercise you should focus on, or the one that does that is strength training. All the other ones don't do this. In fact,

all the other ones may actually contribute to the muscle loss, in particular cardiovascular focus. Now, the problem is, is cardio has been labeled incorrectly as the fat loss form of exercise. By the way, we have studies that compare strength training to cardio in a low calorie diet, head to head. And guess which one wins at pure fat loss, strength training. So strength training should properly be labeled, not just as the form of exercise to build muscle, but also as the best form of exercise for pure fat loss. So your focus should be strength training.

It should not be on other forms of exercise and definitely not on cardio. And if you're in a low calorie diet and you're on a GOP in particular or you're just eating really low calories and you have limited recovery, limited ability to handle stress, it's counterproductive. Don't throw a bunch of forms of exercise at yourself. Focus on strength training. It's counterproductive. Cardio outside of the health benefits that it provides and utilizing it for body composition, the main value of it is to create. a deficit. And if you're already using a GLP1 to create a massive deficit, it's, you don't want to do that. You don't want to create an even bigger deficit because the bigger the deficit does not mean the

faster or the more fat you lose. The more weight you lose. Yes. And it's muscle. That's right. And there's, there's an amount of fat that your body is going to allow you to utilize and to lose at a certain rate. And genetically, it's different from every person. But creating a bigger deficit and ramping up cardio and expenditure is not going to accelerate the fat loss. What will end up doing is accelerating the muscle loss. And so yes, cardio is a great tool for health and heart health, but in the game of body composition, the only thing that it serves is creating a deficit. And when you're on a GLP1, you're already creating that deficit through food. And it's not sending a signal to maintain. Absolutely. It's opposite. It's catabolic. That's right. I predict

over the last, the next, excuse me, decade or two, so the next 10 to 20 years, that the conversation is going to shift from the obesity epidemic to the muscle loss epidemic. And you're going to see this in the future. So I'm just encouraging people right now do this the right way because otherwise you're going to rob Peter to paypal. I do want to make it clear, though, and I'll do my best every time we go on these rants with this. This isn't us like railing on GLP ones.

Yeah, we're not shaming or not. Changing because with the coach. They're amazing. I mean, it's unbelievable. If you do it right with a good coach who understands this and coaches you through this, game changer. Yeah. If you do this without a coach, you're going to run into the problems.

Yeah, somebody who understands everything that we communicated that has struggled with obesity most of their life and utilizes a GLP1 with a coach that helps them through this process, this can be. What's our link for our coaches, Doug? We have coaches here that have been specifically trained to work with people on GLPs. And it's very limited, which is why we don't ever point people in this direction. but what's the link that people? If you go to mind pump personal training.com, you can request. You can request to talk to a coach or whatever.

All right. I got to tell you guys about something very interesting about testosterone in both men and women, but this is especially true for women, that I guess I kind of knew was true, but I didn't really think about it until I had a conversation with our friend, Dr. Fitz, Dr. Fitz. Oh, yeah.

So typically when a woman's, testosterone goes up, either through hormone therapy or just naturally, you'll typically see an increase in libido, right? That's testosterone helps with libido. It also helps a muscle and all that of stuff. And I knew this. I just didn't really think about it. It's a U-shaped curve. If testosterone and women gets too high, it kills her libido. By the way, this will happen with men too because it throws everything off and you just feel like crap. And so we were talking about this, and I looked up the data on women who naturally have high testosterone, like women with PCOS, where they just produce more testosterone than they should, they typically suffer from

lower libido. So it's not like this straight shot. So when I was talking to her, she's like, there's a sweet spot for testosterone for women for all of the benefits. If we overshoot it, they'll feel worse. They won't have higher libido. It oftentimes will go down and they'll feel like garbage. Oh, I imagine that same thing applies for men, too.

It does. Yeah. I mean, so this is just... And you'll hear bodybuilders. be on high doses of gear. Oh, yeah, yeah. And they'll lose. I mean, this is, this is anecdotal.

But, and I wonder if this is the mechanism in which this, this is happening. So, many times in the last, you know, shit, it's been at least seven, seven, eight years, right, right before Max. I utilize HCG. Oh, right. On and off. Like, it was like, when we were trying to get pregnant, I was very consistent with it. Spurn production. And so the point of me sharing this is that over the last seven, eight years.

years, there's been many times where I've been consistent for months, then off for months, consistent for months. And so I've, and there is a direct correlation to my sex drive and libido to when I'm taking HCG. It definitely kicks up the something naturally that I wasn't, that has probably been suppressed a little bit. Even though you're on testosterone also. Yes. Exactly. So it's like, uh, and I, I feel great on testosterone. Like, I think, I would consider it normal libido. I feel fine. And like, we have our, our, our, our sex, all the things like that is the frequency seems. All of a sudden, I'll start taking HCG and I haven't been on it on it.

And I can feel a significant ramp up in libido. And it's very clear because I've done it enough times that it's this like clockwork the next day after I take a shot of the HCG, I feel it right away. It's not the uptick, too, of like estrogen because that will ramp up with higher testosterone levels. And man, that could be part of the reason. Part of it. Yeah, part of the reason is estrogen, but there's also. Well, what is it with the HCG this thing?

because it's producing more. There's a downstream effect. It's not just boosting testosterone. There are other hormones along with it that start to boost. So it probably a more of a hormone balancing thing. Yeah. And that's the thing with hormones. More isn't better.

Well, it kicks up your sperm count, doesn't it? It does. But so it's simulating HG acts like glutenizing hormone. And then that boost testosterone. But I think there's other hormones that it could also increase things like... Well, it just seems logical that if my body all of a sudden naturally starts producing more sperm, that it seems...

That makes sense. Right. It makes sense. But there's some, there's some mechanisms that are happening. Right, right. Like, I don't know the, I don't know how to explain that more scientifically,

but it just seems logical to me that if all said my body says, hey, let's start producing more sperm, that my body would also say like, hey, we should have more sex or try and reproduce, right? It just seems logic. It's interesting to me too because I know people, right?

I know, being in the space for as long as I have, we all know guys that have been on lots of antibiotics, high, high hormones, you know, anabolic steroids plus high dose of testosterone, either bodybuilders or Jim rats or whatever. And one of the more common things you'll hear from them, you'll also hear a super high libido, but then you'll also hear, I have no libido. Like it crushed my libido.

And you'll test their blood and be like, dude, you got the testosterone of like five horses. And yet you're, you're, so it's like this U-shaped effect when it comes to, I think all hormones. So it's like more is not better. There is a sweet spot. I mean, it seems to me, Justin's point, because I agree, the, the, the ride. of testosterone naturally brings up. So estrogen coming up, sperm count going down would make me think that that would directly affect libido. And then the other opposite is true. If you kept estrogen at bay and you increased sperm count, I would think libido would just drive up.

I think so as well. But it is interesting. Like I said, like you look at it, like with women, I went deep into this over the weekend because I was like, oh my gosh, that's, because I'm like, oh, more testosterone is going to make. I think I assume that. Yeah. But I looked up this data. I'm like, oh my God, that's common among, because women who have PCOS oftentimes would produce tons of testosterone. They start to get like all these masculinity-e effects.

Yeah. And one of their complaints is low libido, even though the testosterone is like triple what it should be. Yeah. Interesting, right? Yeah, that is interesting. Anyway, I'm just started kind of preparing

for the talk I'll be doing at the World Peptide Congress. Yeah, that's coming up. Do you know the direction you're going to go? Yeah, just a couple weeks out. Yeah, we're right around the corner from that. I was talking to my friend about it. Because I invited my friend to come.

So for people aren't familiar, the World Peptide Congress, this is like the, this is like the best gathering of researchers and health practitioners. And a lot of the talks and conversations and education is going to be centered around health. But then, you know, if we go down a little more grand, peptide science. So like you want to learn like what's cutting edge with peptides, how to use them, how to administer them if you're a practitioner. like this is the place to be. Dr. Seeds puts it together. He's like the world's premier authority on peptides. I would think this has got to be the largest in the world.

It's the largest and it's like this is where you want to go. This is like the medical, you got the research and literature and data. This isn't like. This isn't like influencers. No, dude. No, I feel like fish out of water when we're there. I know. We are the bros.

We're representing the bros. Yeah, yeah. 100%. They're like, you guys are the smartest bros. It's mostly all doctors and scientists that are there. That's pretty much a majority. Well, I was talking my friend about this because I invited my friend to come because his wife is a, she's a doctor and she started a private practice. And she's going to start using peptides and stuff.

I'm like, oh, you should totally come. And they can't make it. But he was asking me, so her husband, my friend is a pastor. And he's just a great public speaker. If you're a, I think pastors are the best public speakers. Yeah, they get the most practice. They just practice all the time. You're talking.

to a large, you know, group of people. Every week, multiple times. Three times on Sunday, another time on Wednesday or whatever, like every week, you know? It's just super practiced. So I was talking to him and asking him his advice and stuff like that. And he's like, oh, you should be totally comfortable, right? You do this. And I'm like, so different.

Yeah, it is different. Talking on a camera, I have no, you guys know, I'm comfortable. I was comfortable early on, no big deal. Put me in front of a group, a large group of people. I get nervous, dude. Is that the evolution of Sal's speeches is going to be like very, like a reverend when he gets out there? No. And so, well, let me tell you.

you about. That's not my style. Listen up here, all you fat people. Fire and brimstone! I'm here to save you. I'm going to save you from your transgressions. No, dude. That would be hilarious.

But I do, dude. I get nervous. It's so funny. I feel some passion in there. I think about it. You definitely don't come off like you are. I feel like I can tell. You ever watch when some people do speeches or shows or stand up or and you get

nervous for them because you can feel their nervous energy, you don't put any of that off. Oh, I appreciate that. I can hide it pretty well. I think. So I think when I'm going to talk about, I'm not going to, I'm going to stick to my wheelhouse. I'm not going to get up and speak to a bunch of doctors about peptides. Yeah. Let me teach you about stuff that you know more than I do. I'm going to talk about, you know, my expertise, which is how you can coach, because all these practitioners use peptides, but they use them in a longevity, typically longevity clinics. And so, and they're, They're very forward thinking. So these are typically practitioners that are using peptides,

but also helping advise and coach on lifestyle. So, because they know that. They know it's important. There's that there. And there's also those practitioners that I think they're aware of what's going on with the muscle loss. And they want to learn. That's right.

And they, they are not experts in the fitness training side. And so what I think is going to be a really, that's why you become so popular at that thing and why he wants you to be one of the main speakers. Well, you know what it is, dude, because I was thinking about this. This will be the third time. And I've heard some of their talks.

They've got brilliant speakers that go there. But a lot of them come from a data, medical literature standpoint. Working in clinics. And there's a coaching standpoint that I think is so important to communicate because there's what the literature says and then there's how this works in real life. Well, you'll hear them. I've heard them communicate it before. And it's like, and they'll say the same stuff like, yeah.

And so make sure you just hit your protein and do it. It's just like how you coach through that? Yeah, exactly. It's just like what we know, the average person struggles with that. You throw that person on it. And it's like, you know how difficult that is for that person? Or they'll say things like, and you need a strength train. It's just like, well, the proper amount is important.

And like, so I think a lot of them understand from a scientific standpoint what they're supposed to do. I think the coaching. An application of it. Yeah. Yeah. And people is what you bring to that. Yeah. So that's what I'm going to focus on talking about while I'm up there.

And so that's good. Yeah, it'll be cool. And I'm speaking. if anyone listening is going to attend. I'm at 10.30 on Saturday. Saturday. Is the day that I'll be. What's the name of the place

where it's actually at? It's at the Biltmore. In Arizona. Like I know that he outgrew the Vegas halls, which is, was huge already. Like we were last, well, we were in the Bologio, the Venetian last year.

I don't remember which one we were at. This is in Arizona. I think, am I saying it right? Is it the Biltmore? I believe it's a Biltmore. Yeah, let me, I'm just looking that up right now. Thanks.

Thanks, Doug. So anyway, it'll be, it'll be a good time. I'll enjoy. I enjoyed afterwards, but when it, like, the day leading up to it, I mean, I get so. You get, uh, after, do you have an adrenaline rush? Do you get like a high from it? Um, I feel, uh, if you guys like, so now I'm going to put a little too much out there because now I put pressure on you guys.

When you guys tell me, I did a good job. I feel very good. Because I actually want it, it's, I want to do a good job for you guys more than I do. I'm so going to fuck with you. So we have to be honest. I know. I know. I know.

I know. I was bad, dude. That was real bad. What about if we heckle you in the audience? I thought that. help that one time. It does. If you guys listen to me up.

You know what's going to be cool about this time is Jessica's coming. So she'll be able to watch. So she hasn't seen me do a talk. Does that make you more or less nervous? Oh, not more nervous. I feel more confident.

Yeah. Because I want my wife to see me do my thing, you know? She saw me once speak publicly. And it was when I did the thing here in front of all the trainers. Oh, yeah. And I'm going to be so mad.

I said this. After I was done, she walked up to me, whispered in my ear. and she's like, you just turn me on someone. Oh, now we know why he's bringing her now. There's a real motivation. It's like a tool belt.

Your wife can see you do. I would agree with that. I think, I think, like, I think of moments where I've had Katrina, like, it makes me. Oh, let me guess when you're negotiating. Yeah. It's a big deal. Bro, I feel like that about you. Somebody give me a massage.

Yeah. I look at you and I'm like, I kind of turned on this guy. That's stupid. Damn, bro. I can't even believe negotiated that deal or whatever. Yeah. I know. I think you would think that you would be maybe more nervous, but I think you're right. I think there's something about having your partner there that makes you feel, you know, more confident.

100%. Yeah. 100%. So that's cool. Yes. And it is the Biltmore. Okay. That'll be, that'll be fun. It's going to do a good time. Yeah, yeah. We were talking about protein earlier. And I just, because people will often say, well, how do I hit that? Protein powder is typically what people will use. But the Paleo Valley meat sticks are a really, really easy and delicious way to help hit protein. I feel like we haven't talked about it. It's like the best snack that I always go for. What are they? Are they eight grams of protein? Yeah, they're eight each.

Eight each? So I, so I'll typically eat three a day. Yeah, I just say two or three. I'll have them. So that's like, you know, that's like 20, 30 grams of protein. Especially my lunch is delayed. It's like, oh, my God, saves me. They're better than eat, I'm going to say any beef jerse.

By far. Yeah. It's because it's fermented. So it's kind of broken down already. And it's like not dry. it tastes, it's delicious. Even when I mean, in a pinch and I have to pull it, because I think beef turkey for as long as all of us

have been trainers has been a gas station snack, right? And forever, that's been. Like if I'm on a long drive and I don't have anything, I'll pull in a gas station real quick and grab some beef turkey or a protein bar or something. And man, it's Palo Valley's beef turkey has ruined the other beef turkey for me. By far.

Yeah. It's not even close. Yeah. This is why we signed with them. It was their meat sticks. Yeah. We tasted them. But it's an easy way to boost your protein.

So if you eat your meal and you want to add another 8 grams or 16 grams, eat a couple meat sticks, and they have long shelf life because they're in a package so you can store them. And they're good for kids, too. I love giving stuff like that to my kids. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I'm so excited to see as my son grows up because it's such a different house with food,

with food in particular. You know, it's funny. I don't know if I've shared this with you guys. And I just, he got the norovirus, right? So, boy, that, like, ran through our house. So, by the way, you got nothing. I know. So contagious.

You came out with nothing. I was low-key, like, he's going to get it. He's going to get nothing. You, I said, like, Katrina and I were getting into it while we're up in Reno because I'm like, this is going to run through all of us. And I'm not going to be able to drive us home. Like, we have to go now. It was like a fight because she's like, I'm not driving with my son like this.

There's no way we're taking him in the car. He can't hold him down. I'm like as soon as he shows that he can hold something down for four hours and not throw up or, you know, go to the bathroom. I'm like, we're going. We have to because my sister went like, first he got it really bad. Then I watched my sister start to come down. And I'm like, we're in this little house. It's only a matter of time before I get it.

I'm like, the only reason I thought actually might survive was Katrina. But she got it. That's the worst I've seen her since Mexico. But I tell you, I swear up and down by the sauna training. I have again, you talk about things that I've been really consistent than inconsistent. And you're like daily. Oh, every day. Yeah.

Every day I do. And I explain this to Katrina. And maybe you can explain the science better because she was, she was getting in with me. And she doesn't like it as hot as I like it. She got in. She didn't tell me. She turned it down. And I'm sitting there.

I was like, man, this is, why is this not? Did you turn this on off? She was, yeah, you keep it way too hot. I said, honey, you have to work your way up. You can't just keep it the same thing. And she goes, why? I don't get to. the benefits for it? I'm like, think of it like this. It's like you're using five pound

dumbbells all the time. You get some benefits from that. Like, if you didn't strength train it at all and you use five pound dumbbells, like you'll build a little bit of muscle and then you're going to stay the same. But if you want to get that immune system, you get stronger and better, you got to push it up and adapt and just go slowly like that. So I was trying to explain that to her that that's like, if you just do a little bit and you do it like real easy in your body and you're comfortable. And you do get better at tolerating. You do. Oh, I've like, So when I first started it, like 180 was like, whoa. Which is hot.

Yeah, it was hot. Because the gym I go to, they'll, it'll be between 160 to 200. I don't know how the hell they determine that. There's a big difference. Oh, huge. Like 160, I chill, man. 200. I'm like, whoa.

So I'm at, I started at 180. So I'm pushing 230 now. 230? Oh, yeah. 230 is hard. Is that the highest that goes? Yeah. 230 is where it peaks.

I don't think I've ever been. But I worked at that. It was 180, 190. And then two. And then I got to a point where like, oh, I got to. sitting there at 200, like, no problem. And now, 2.30 cooks me. 2.30, I'm like, at the 20-minute mark, I'm like,

I get out. I'm like, that was tough. But I can do that. And I've explained to her that, just like lifting weights, like the body will adapt. And then you'll, and I said, you don't need to go from zero to 230 around the gates. I'm like, but try and make it challenging. She wants it to be like so relaxing.

She's like, I could hang out here for an hour. It's like, no, you're like, it's just like the string training thing. And I explained that to her. But anyways, I've, I've been very, systematic and consistent literally every night I don't miss that's my routine and I've worked up to where I'm 20 minutes over over 220 I'm not super familiar with sauna use and immune system maybe Doug you could have that there has to be oh I went down the rabbit hole because I'm so it's 100% immune boosting that's so it so it makes sense because when you get a fever your body temperature goes up and part of that is your immune system kicking up yeah so I'm wondering if it simulates it's a mild hermetic stressor triggering an artificial fever stage. Yeah, artificial fever. Stimulates immune system.

So the intense heat mobilizes front line defenses, temporarily increasing circulating white blood cells, and promoting the production of protective heat shock proteins. Okay. Yeah. So you're doing like an artificial fever every night. Yeah. Wow.

And I think that this is what, and I've, when I've been, like you, we've all talked about this before, how weak my immune system is. I have a very weak immune system. And if someone gets,

I hear one of you coffee, I'm like, oh, I'm next. You know, it's just, I'm done. And the only times that I haven't been done is when I'm really consistent with this, when I'm really, really good about doing it. And I'm like that every, Katrina's had a couple of her friends that caught the Noravis, Iris. And she's like, it wrecked everybody's whole family.

Everybody that they know that have had it. And they're like, Adam didn't get sick? And I'm like, no. And I was, and I swear it was that. They're reporting it as like flying through Northern California, Doug. Did you, did you know that? Look up stomach bug, northern California. click on news articles.

They're like writing articles about it because I guess it's like flying through our area. I haven't seen. I do not want it. It's the worst. It doesn't, it takes a lot for me to,

I don't, and I obviously I don't let Katrina see this or feel this for me, but I was scared for Max. Like that, there came a point where like, you, like, he's like non-responsive and like, oh,

you know what I'm saying? And seeing him that out of it and sick. And like, and then knowing that like, I should take him to the hospital. And I'm like, oh, my God, I'm going to take him the hospital. And they're going to put an IV in them. And that's going to be traumatic.

Like, oh, being on the fence of that. Look how they test it. They test the wastewater data. So they test it for the stomach viruses. And it says that there's a high amount in San Jose, Fremont, San Francisco, Redwood City, and Palo Alto right now. Oh, our whole area. Yeah.

Oh, awesome. So it's like a whole wave of, yeah. Whoa, dude. Wow. Yeah, I don't want that. No. That's the worst. I think the only thing that I would say is that on par with that is like when you have a really

bad flu that lasts like a week and a half like they're pretty close i mean that took it took us we went we all left for a little break there wednesday to tuesday six days oh of my whole house being just tore up dude the worst time i ever got anything stomach wise do you guys remember when i went to thailand yeah when i first started food poisoning yeah yeah dude that was food poisoning that was not that's what the norovice watching them go through it it reminds me of food poisoning but food poisoning at least is normally out 24 or 48 hours. 24 or 48 hours, you normally, it's a hard 24, 48 hours. But then once you kind of get it all the way, you can start to hold water down and food,

like you're kind of, you're out of it. Dude, that trip, they were bad for a week. That trip was so funny because it was when I first started dating Jessica. So I'm like, you know, you first start dating a girl and you really like her. You're like, yeah, I'll do whatever you want. She's like, we're going to go to Thailand. She's testing you. And I'm like, you know, you guys know me and that kind of stuff.

Yeah, all right, cool. You know, I'll do that. Yeah, the guy doesn't leave his block. That was like that one window of adventure. Sal. I remember that, dude. I was like, whoa, you're doing that cell? And we get there and we land in Bangkok first. And I'm like, in my mind, I'm like, you know what? I'm going to be more adventurous. Like, this is a new cell, right? So I eat street food in Bangkok, which is not a good idea. But guess what? Didn't get anything. So my confidence explode. I'm like maybe I'm just scared

of nothing. Like, I'm totally fine. Then we go to resort. And you have to tour. Any of time issues already? We go to resort in COPP. And so we take a boat there, the whole deal. It's an actual resort. And they made me a mixed drink with a sliced banana in the skin. That's where I think I got it was in the drink. And I drank the drink. That night went to bed, dude, and it started hitting me. And I got so bad, I had a fever that was like 104 or five. And I started hallucinating. You ever hallucinate as an adult? Not a good, that's not a good deal. There's definitely levels of food poisoning, because I've, I've had it three times. And I've had a, you know, very mild, a pretty bad. And then I called my mom.

As an adult, as an adult, as a grown-ass dad. Hey, Mom, I don't feel like. I think you're going to come here. Like, scared, bro. Like, scared as an adult. Like, this is, this was so, I remember it was so bad that you cannot, you can't even hold water down. It's coming out both in.

And then you do that for so long that you can't even lay on a bed because your body aches. Yes. So I was seeing things. I did, I was terrible. And then poor Jessica, we're in Thailand. And I'm like, I need a doctor. And I can't go anywhere. I literally can't move.

so she, poor girl, find some random dude to take her on a motorcycle to a place which, thank God that worked out, to find these doctors that would come to your room. I mean, they came to my room, they hooked me up with IVs. To be in another country and go through that is crazy. Oh.

I mean, I was mad that, like, I told Petrino, like, I want to get to our city. I didn't even like being out of our little city knowing where family and our doctors are. So to be in another country is like... Oh, she just hopped on the back of some motorbike, dude. Yeah.

And they showed up by my room. room and they were kind of dressed in like normal clothes and I'm like I really hope the real they're like which procedure are we doing here yeah dude I'm like oh then they hooked up you're still the same genuine and then I got this like crazy like random shaman or something like I know they're gonna burn some but no it obviously worked and then the rest of the trip I was on these antibiotics that made me sensitive to the sun so we're in Thailand and I couldn't even go in the sun because I'd get like a rash oh man it was a bond was a what day was it early in the trip oh yeah it was like the second or the second day or something oh it's uh yeah

Because we were in Bangkok one night, then the second day, and then it was that night. And then I was like, totally messed up. Yeah. And then the rest of the trip, I was just, I couldn't be in that sun that long. And it was just, it was terrible. Oh, my gosh. But it was a nice, like, test for early relationship. Oh, yeah.

How are you going to handle all this? Yeah, yeah. You know, you were bringing up snacks that people love the, I think the one of the other hottest ones that we haven't brought up on the, on the podcast is the Rice Krispy Legion bars. I don't eat those because they're dairy, but you guys love them. Those are always gone, dude. It's you and the staff. Well, I've trained the team when they come in.

I, I have a macros on. I remember asking for that and they were gone. I want to say they're... There's 15, I think, grams of... And they're only like 15 grams. But it's small calories. Like 190 calories. Really?

Yeah, 190 calories. And protein is... Where am I? Oh, 15. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. But they taste like a rice crispy tree.

Like an actual rice crispy. Yes, dude. They're good. Because I see you eating them all the time. I eat them all time. It's like my... my little morning snack that I have, and they go so fast.

Wow. Yeah. To the point where I hide a box. I just saw you pull out. Yeah. You know, it's crazy is that, because we're kind of in our bubble.

And I don't, I feel like everybody, speaking of supplements, I feel like everybody by now knows the benefits of crating. And I was at, I was at a thing last night, and I'm in this group.

And there's a woman next to me and we're talking. And she's asking me about, like, supplements and should I take protein power? her. She's a vegan. And so I mentioned creatine. She's like, how do you spell that? I'm like, you don't know what crate in? She's like, no.

So I'm like telling her all about it. And she had no idea. And I'm like, I'm listing the benefits for women. I'm like, and vegan? She's going to have kinds of benefits. That's what I told her. I said the data shows, well, first of all, creatine benefits everybody, but especially if you're vegan, you'll get a boost in IQ. You'll actually get

a boost in IQ from supplementing. She's like, where do I get it from? I'm like, animal, you know, meat, but you don't eat that. But you could take it in supplement form and it's vegan. So I was talking about it's like it reduces anxiety, increases motivation. It's going to help you with your strength. It's going to help you with your cognitive function. So I cannot wait to hear from her.

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. So it's life-changing. Yeah, that's wild. That is weird. Yeah. So I pointed her to Legion as well because they also have really, really good source. Dude, I actually have some snack information.

What? Too, since you guys keep bringing up. So this is revolving around an animal. It's a shriek bird. You ever heard of a shriek bird? No. Okay. Use your animal knowledge.

I saw your notes and I thought it said Shrek a bird. Yeah. Like the cartoon. Oh, no. It's not a Shrek. It's shriek. Um, but it has this like unique bill.

So it's like a hooked bill and it can't like, it can't kill, uh, prey easy. So it had to come up with like this like solution, which is pretty brilliant. Um, it, it actually lives like in these thorny kind of bushes like a, I don't know if it's like, it's like this crazy long. thorns, some trees. That's a picture of it right there. Doug has it right there. Yeah.

So what it does is it, it takes the prey and then it pales them to kill them. Oh, that's what that is right there. He's stuck another bird through the thing. Yeah, through the thorn. It's a bird. So you'll do that with all kinds of stuff, like rodents with insects, like big insects. It just skewers them. So you'll see some of these bushes with like just, you know, carcasses all over the place.

And they just snack on them and then just like, you know, take pieces of them off. Of course you like this animal. I like this guy. Brilliant bird. That's okay. This bird's metal. Yeah. For sure you know.

What are you reading or watching for this to pop up? Well, I don't know of them, dude. He likes this stuff. Yeah, no, you know what? Did it pop up on the,

on your social? I actually got to give Chris, somebody DM me this one and I was like, oh, wow, this is cool. Yeah. They know me, I think pretty well at this point.

I mean, I like this stuff too. I mean, that, that, that, that, I love that nature's metal. Yes. Oh, God. Yeah. I love that.

Have you guys ever seen that? There's a fish that has its eyeballs inside of its head, but its skin is translucent. Have you seen this? I think I see that. Weird. Yeah. It's super weird.

And then there's a fish with human teeth. That one's my favorite. Look at that. His eyes are inside his head. Yeah. It's the barrel eye fish. But why? Yeah.

It's all like transparent. It protects its sense of eyes. What is it about? And I know you guys are all, we all have this in common. This is one of the few things that we all share. in common. Like, we could all watch, like, the Discovery Channel and just, like, zone out on, like, I geek out on nature, yeah, yeah, I could watch that for our, and Katrina makes fun of me all the time about that. Like, I cannot, how can you just watch that? I'm like, what do you, how could you not?

What are you mean? Yeah. It's so interesting. It's interesting. They have, like, the right music playing behind it and the narrator and the narrator. Oh, man, I like, I'm melting in the couch through my bed watching it. It's like hypnosis, dude. It is. I swear. Like, I'll sit there and I'll watch, like, yeah, it's like beautiful nature and then it's like, you know, then you'll see some predator coming out nowhere and just like... I mean, I feel like it's the closest thing to you actually, because nothing trumps you being out in that, right? Like, nothing like sitting on the sand and the waves crashing in the beach in front of you

or being in a rainforest or something like that. There's nothing like that experience in person. That's the next closest thing. Would you guys ever want to do like a safari? Oh, I totally. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That would be so crazy to like watch a lion.

I would love that, you know? Yeah, I would love that. or something like that. Yeah. You've ever seen the videos of safaris where the lion or the tiger looks like it's coming after the vehicle and they try and take off? There's one video of this like safari. And I think,

I don't know where it's at, but it's a tiger. So it's got to be India or somewhere else like that. They're driving away and the tiger runs and jumps. It jumps them in. Almost. Like almost, like they can leap so far.

And it's jump. And it's like a frozen picture of its like claws coming out. Like, oh my God, dude. If I was in that car. Like the San Francisco Zoo, that here. huge gap between, you know, where the, they're, where people are, like, watching from the fence.

Like, it's being able to cross, jump over that and actually, like, make it, it killed somebody. Dude. Yeah. What? Yes. Look at that. See? It just jumps up and just, they're.

That's happened before. Yeah. I forget. It was like, somebody was taunting. There was this one video. The tiger and it jumped up. There was this one video. And there's all kinds of videos of tigers that are on cars, dude.

Tigers are monsters. For sure. In certain areas, they become manhunters. Well, they actually get the taste of human blood. Dude. Well, isn't that movie based off of a true story? Oh, I know what you're talking about. Yes.

It's called... Like this famous tiger that was like... Ghost in the darkness. That was about lions. Oh, that was lying. It was a lion's... It was a lion's... Okay.

But that was based on a true story. Yes, I believe so. Yeah. And it was what you just said. Like, he got the smell or the taste of it, and then all of a sudden it... There's one predator that will almost always hunt a human if they sees it, which a polar bear.

Oh, yeah. Really? Yeah. If you see it in any living... I didn't know that they will actually go hunt a human. If you see a grizzly, it doesn't necessarily mean he's going to come hunt you and kill you. Yeah. When they say you see a polar bear, oh, you're done.

Yeah, he's already tracking you. He's going to track you. He's going to come out of him. Really? Food's so scarce. It's a survival thing for that. There you got. Polar bears are one of the very few animals that will actively hunt humans for food.

Yeah. Wow. So, like, if you see a polar bear... Get the fuck out. Well, you got to be ready. Like, Homeboy, he's going to come. He's coming. Yeah, he's coming.

Yeah, he's coming. They're terrifying. I did not know that. Yes. Wow. You want to know what's even more terrifying? Do you know how? So, like, if a lion or a tiger attacks you, it'll bite your neck and kill you.

If a polar bear attacks you, it just starts eating you. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It just starts chomping. It just starts eating you. It just starts eating you. It just start eating you, dude. The hyenas that eat you ass first?

Is that true? Yeah. I think so. That's best stuff. Like insides and everything. Like, oh, gosh. You know, I think hyenas are one of the more unassuming animals until you see one in person. Like, when you see a hyena, they're big.

It'll beat the crap at a many dog. When you see all the videos, when you see, you see them on TV, they look so frail. They look skinny and little. But when you see them in person, they're- This is the Disney version. Yeah, they're big. You ever seen those, like, those African gang members that, so, you know, how, like, we have gang members here with, like, pit bulls and stuff? They have, like, spike collars on them.

They have hyenas. Yeah. And they roam around with a hyena. That's the ultimate flex, dude. So, Justin, you're correct. They do start with the butt first. What? Yeah, so it says the skin around the anus and genitals

is the thinest and easiest area to tear through. That's nice. You know what sucks about that? If it comes after you and gets at you and then your friends save you, now you have no. Well, thanks, guys. Yeah, you should have let me die. Bro.

A little earlier? Yeah. Cool. No, I'm screwed. This sucks. Yeah. Higher health is the only multivitamin for kids that we here at Mind Pump recommend. So high health is not a candy.

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our kids ourselves. So if you want your kids to fill those nutrient deficiencies, to get those needs with those micronutrients, and you don't want to give them candy, you want something that's going to improve their health and vitality, help them bro the way that they're supposed to go to haiahealth.com. That's hiyahehealth.com forward slash mind pump. By the way, that'll get you 50% off. Here comes the show. First question is from Karan Singh 19. How do you add cardio after two to three years of just focusing on strength training? You know, this is a good question, but I feel like we would want more context. Yeah. Like why? Yeah, what do you look at your motivation? Exactly. Because there's definitely different ways.

I'm going to apply this. Like, is this person looking for, you know, in cardiovascular endurance? Do they want to just be able to get up and run? Do they have a sport? Or is this just for heart health? And so there's a lot of different reasons or ways I would go about this, right? 100%. I would say, if you're looking for athletic performance and stamina and you're fit, you're

already relatively fit a couple sessions of hit cardio 12 minutes would totally do that hit cardio is like where you go all out for 30 seconds and then you slow down to your heart rate comes down and then repeat it that'll build that stamina endurance is very short if you just want just overall health you're not looking to beat yourself up 30 minutes on an elliptical is totally totally fine great steady state great steady state if you're looking for like to get good at something like running well then you need to take some time to focus on your tech and skill, and you'll probably have to take away some strength training to make room for something like that. But I'll say this, I'll add this, a good routine, overall fitness routine will involve

some cardiovascular training. So I know a lot of times we talk about, you know, be careful when you do too much or whatever, but if you're looking at like a perfect routine, you're going to have a cardiovascular component because it's good to. So a generic answer based on what you said, because it aligns with how I would approach this, is I love a post-war. workout 12 minute hit like on cardio some sort like it just right after you work out 12 minutes I do the intense followed by walking or it hill incline or elliptical for 30 minutes yeah and so you kind of get the best of both worlds I get a little bit of that and and that's three times a week three times a week uh 12 minutes of the intervals followed by a walking or hill hill or something

like low steady state for 30 minutes and perfect yeah I think well yeah I totally agree with you guys for that from a programming perspective, but I think, I think cardio is stupid to do in the gym. I really think it's, like, ridiculous. You're an athlete. That's why. Yeah, but, like, go do something fun. Good. Yeah. You know, this is your opportunity to go swim or, like, hike, or, you know, like, go the Friesby or. Well, no, you're right. In a, in a perfect, basketball or whatever. You, you, you, it actually wouldn't be programmed in the gym. Yeah. It wouldn't, uh, I say that because. Like, why be monotonous about it? Yeah. No, I say that because, uh, I say that because, uh, This is, I think, of the person who gets to the gym just three times a week, and that's all their exercise.

Yeah, they're maximizing. I know. So it's like you're already there, so that's how I put it on. But if I had a client who was totally open to they love to swim or they like to pick up the ball and shoot or they love hikes, like, oh, man, I would totally encourage. There's more benefits than just fitness there. That's right. You're actually enjoying yourself outside. You're probably doing it with other people.

Totally. I had this the other day. So I agree with that, Justin. It's just such a formula. I don't know. That's just me. You know, I get, like, stuck in this whole, like, well, we got a program and then we got to do this. Well, no, you're right.

This is how I go about it. I don't do formal cardio right now. I'm swimming in my pool like crazy. Or kitchen and I go for hikes in our backyard. We'll go on a 30-minute walk. So that's how I do it. And I think if you can do it, if you can build it into your lifestyle where you're doing physical activities outside the gym, that is the best idea. I just did this the other day.

I took my kids to the park to try to fly a kite. the wind wasn't cooperating. So I was running all the place trying to get this kite to take off. And I'm getting winded. I'm running. I'm doing it. And I'm like, oh, this is great.

Like I'm having fun with the kids. They're laughing. I was getting frustrated because it wouldn't go up. But it's like, this is way better than getting on a little. There was another dad there, by the way, that was also, I didn't feel so bad. Because I'm like, dude, I'm, I'm the only guy. Then there was a dad with a kite who couldn't make it happen either. So I'm like, all right.

That's just me. Next question is from Maine Fitchick. If you under eat and then, therefore don't get enough protein and also lift heavy and get stronger in your lifts. What is actually happening in your body? Are you building any muscle or is something else going on? First off, if you're getting stronger. Yeah, that's okay.

So let's address that first. Very good sign. If you're getting stronger, then you're probably not losing muscle. And if you consistently get stronger, it typically correlates for the most part, almost always, with more muscle. Now, if you're just lifting and you're not getting stronger, but you're pushing yourself and you're under eating, you'll still lose muscle.

And if you do it long enough, you can even have bone loss. You can even have osteopenia. I've seen this in fitness women. Yes. Who strength train, consistently, good program. They just under eat all the time. Get a dexascan osteopenia.

So you're not doing much if that's the case. But if you're getting stronger, that's a very, very good sign. Yeah, no, if you're getting stronger, that is a really good sign. But to your point, you absolutely, could see signs like this and still see like bone density go down because you are consistently under eating calories and protein.

Totally. And what this points to, by the way, and we talk about this, the central nervous system adaptation. So there's a part of exercise and lifting weights that is skill. We talk about how it's a skill. You get better at lifting. And so even though you may not be building a bunch of muscle, you're getting better at lifting. technique-wise, central nervous system-wise, being able to recruit more. Like, that can all happen in a calorie deficit.

And so that could be what's going on here is like you are getting better at lifting. Therefore, you're seeing strength go up, but you are consistently under eating on any protein. You are not building any muscle and you are potentially even like losing bone density. But if you're consistently getting stronger over time and you can essentially, eventually muscle builds through that process. Next question is from the gut check. what do you believe the physical standards or requirement should be for your average man and woman in their late 30s to early 40s?

Oh, that's a good, that's a really good question. Yeah, I picked this because I figured it would be just a great discussion because I don't think we have a set clear what I think, what you should be able to do. I think, I'll say this. And I say this now because I see this in myself because I work out all the time and I eat, you know, pretty healthy all the time.

But I've generally lost. the skill of running because I never run. And I know this because then I go run and I feel like I don't know what I'm doing. And so I think on there is the ability to just run, the ability to take off and run, the ability to run without feeling pain. It's a skill that you'll lose over time. And I'm experiencing that right now. And so I think being able to run is important. I think being able to squat is important, be able to lift something overhead, being able to hip hinge is important. I think being able to press and row with good technique is important. Now, how strong should you be? That's a much more nuanced question. But I think the ability to do those things is probably a good place to start, I would say. Yeah, I'm going to address your run thing because I think that's an area that we could all admit, especially you and I would admit that we could be better at that I would, I would be below my own standards on what I would want somebody who was trying to achieve this, right? And I've thought about this a lot. I think, Being in your 30s and 40s and being able to run a sub eight mile, good is a good standard.

Sub eight and with good form and technique. So it's not like, I could probably go do it right now and look really like I'm dying and dead. And like that wouldn't be good. Looks like the lizard that runs on water. To be able to run a sub eight minute mile, I think is a pretty, and I think why I say that, because I know it's like a generic number and that's only eight minutes of cardiovascular, but being able to run a mile in that amount of time,

you could probably run too. It's a decent test. Yeah. And it's a decent test. It's not you, it doesn't impede running one mile like that, won't impede in your muscle, strength, all the things you're doing.

I think if you're capable of that, and then to your point, I can squat, deadlift, over the primal patterns like, you know, you're strong in all those, like hipinging and squatting

and picking things up off the ground and getting up off the ground, And especially too, like that was a skill that it's interesting that you start, you know, putting clients down on the ground and like, okay, now get up. And like you start figuring out how they can organize their body to make that happen. And I think just like definitely lifting things over your head is a skill people lose a lot as well. And so you have to intentionally do that. Otherwise you get into problems with that.

And then running. And then even, I mean, I would throw jumping in there, but that's me because, you know, my athletic background, I think like just moving fast with acceleration. decelerating. Yep. It, you know, prevents a lot of problems and injury potentially. But also, too, like, it's just something that you're going to have to react quickly. Yeah.

At some point, you know, outside, you might slip on something or, you know, something. You might throw you off balance. Or your kid runs out to the street. Yeah. You got to grab them. Something. You got to react and you got to still have that ability. No, I love that you brought up.

Get up off the floor because that sounds so silly and ridiculous. But you'd be surprised how many people lose with no hands, right? So literally get up off the ground without using your hands is a skill that a lot of people by the time they're in their 40s lose the ability to do that. So I think you should do that. I think as simple, again, I'll put numbers to what you guys are saying. Like I think being able to do 10 jump boxes where you jump up and jump off the box without your knees exploding, I think is probably a really good ability to do that. I think though the eight minute mile will cover your ability to take off and run and do something like that. If you can run a sub eight minute mile, you'd probably.

pretty reactive. That's not like an all-out hard sprint, but that's fast. You know, it's fast enough to be healthy to go take off after your kid or do something like that. You know, I had throwing onto this.

Because it is a basic human movement and you also lose that skill. I mean, when I was a kid, I could throw hard without an issue. If I throw hard now, I'm afraid I'm going to blow something out. Yeah, I'm going to hurt my shoulder. Yeah.

And it is a skill that you can lose. I mean, I guess in life, you don't necessarily need it like we did, you know, a thousand years ago. But the ability, to throw without hurting yourself has lots of carryover to shoulder health and wrist health and stuff like that.

Next question is from Lulu Williams 15. Should I be doing warm-up sets for every exercise and or does it depend on the level of training or the load or intensity for each specific exercise? I've worked with trainers and used online workouts who haven't programmed them, so not sure what the deal is. Warm up should, the goal of a warm-up, the bar of the bottom bar, of the bottom, is to prevent injury. But if you go up a level higher,

a warmup should allow you to perform the exercise you're going to do smooth. Good mobility, connection, strength, like get into it. Yeah. If I'm doing similar exercises back to back, I don't need to keep warming up. In other words, if I'm going to work out my legs

and my first exercise is squats, I'm going to need to do some priming to get myself set up to be able to squat properly. But after that, I can go into lunges and I can go into Bulgarians without having to do a warm up each time. But if I'm doing totally different exercises, like if I'm doing squats and then the next exercise, let's say, is an overhead press, I may need to do some priming for that movement pattern, I would say. The level of priming and warm up that you need to do depends on the individual.

Really skilled lifters, people who have good technique and form have been working out a while, oftentimes can warm up by doing a set or two of the exercise that are about to do. Yeah. Because they know... Make micro adjustments as they go. They know how to adjust. They know what to squeeze and how to tighten and get into position.

But oftentimes with people who don't have a lot of experience, I have to do different priming exercises because, you know, they don't know how to pull their shoulders back on the bench press properly. So we got to do something that does that first. Or they don't know how to get the ankle mobility

right on a squat with a warmup, which is just a squat. So I have to do other exercises. So a lot of this depends. This is why we created Maps Prime. So Maps Prime, we have a program that you go in, you take a few tests, and then it points, based off of how you do the test,

it points you in directions that individualize what your priming looks like. So once you have that, now you've got your individual warm-up for your workouts. And it's the best online way of doing it short of actually working with a trainer in front of you who can see these things. Warming up is very individualized.

This answer can vary for every single person. I'm glad you brought up prime because there are certain exercises that I do that I do know one. I don't need one. I don't need to go to go do a barbell row. I don't need a warm up. Go right into a barbell row, no problem. To get into a barbell back squat, I absolutely have to warm up, prime, and I have to spend probably more extended time than maybe Justin has to get into a barbell back squat. But if I do a seat a row, a lap pull down, don't eat it. If I do a dumbbell chest press, I need to.

So there's certain movements. And that prime is designed to show you, we try to simplify it for the average person to just break the body up in three zones. And if you fail that zone, any movements that you do within that zone will help. We'll help by priming before you do that. If you don't fail that zone and you actually pass it really good, you could probably get away with doing. movements in that zone and not have to prime and feel okay. But this is very, in fact, I remember at one point as a trainer like using the, like the saying that, you know, learn to stretch with purpose for the first half of my training career.

You know, we did these, you know, foam roll and random, you know, stretches that everybody just did that were generic, you know, to warm them up before. It was like general one. Yeah, that's the problem. It's been that it's so general forever. And it's, yeah, hasn't been real individualized and specific to your joint needs. Yeah, and that's not necessarily bad for you. It's better than nothing.

Yeah, it's better than nothing, but it's close to a waste of time. So it would be far better to understand. Your movement patterns, what you need to work on and really focus on those things. In fact, when I know my ankles and hips are such issues that maybe even when I'm not squatting, I still might do ankle and hip stuff to continue to improve the mobility. stability, stability, and strength in those muscles and joints. And so it really is the individual and where they need the work. 100%. Like if you're listening and you want to minimize injury, maximize connection to the

exercises, you don't have a trainer in front of you that's going to be able to do this for you. Maps Prime is incredibly valuable. It's not a workout program. It sets you up for your workout program. And I believe it's the summer sale applies to Maps price. So it's 40% off. So if you go to Maps Fitnessproducts.com, use the code summer 40, you can get Maps Prime 40% off.

And then literally just take the test and it'll point you in the right direction. Look, if you like the show, you can find us also on Instagram. It's Mind Pump Media. We'll see you there. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super bundle at Mind Pumpmedia.com. The RGB Superbundle includes MAPS Anabolic, Maps Performance, and Maps Aesthetic.

Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal, Adam, and Justin, as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a full 30-day money-back guarantee, and you can get it now, plus other valuable free resources at Mindpumpmedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes, and by introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support, and until next time, this is Mind Pump.