Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2879: How to Eat Carbs for Muscle Gains and Fat Loss (The Full Breakdown)

Episode Date: June 13, 2026

In this episode the guys break down how to eat carbs for muscle gains and fat loss — why they're not essential but are beneficial, how to figure out if you do better higher carb or lower fat, timing carbs around workouts, choosing easy-digesting sources, and why drinking carbs is almost always a mistake. They also get into a deep dive on PDE5 inhibitors (Viagra/Cialis) and the emerging data showing 30–40% reduction in all-cause cardiovascular mortality, potential neuroprotective and anti-cancer effects, and why Sal thinks they'll be recommended to most men over 40 within a decade. Plus: side bends as a highly underrated QL exercise, the Guy Ritchie movie "In the Gray," Sal's son's gem hustle, Adam's commercial-grade mosquito killer, Google releasing 32 million lab-bred mosquitoes into California, pirates and their eye patches, cauliflower ear plastic surgery in Russia, and giant tree spiders in Malaysia. Then they coach live callers submitted through mplivecaller.com — Jesse from Florida on reverse dieting after a bad coach left her overtrained and underfed, Augie from Alabama on combining MAPS PPL with running for fall race prep, Kaylene from New York on sobriety from THC and getting comfortable bulking, and Vanessa from the UK on building her glutes while letting go of the step and scale obsession. MAPS Summer Sale — https://mapsfitnessproducts.com Code: SUMMER40 — 40% off everything — June 1–14 only Mind Pump Fitness Coaching — https://mindpumpfitnesscoaching.com 1.9 NASM CEUs SPONSORS Crisp Power (protein pretzels) — https://www.crisppower.com/mindpump Code: MINDPUMP — 10% off. Up to 28g protein, 15g carbs, baked not fried, zero added sugar, vegan, GLP-1 friendly. New 7.1oz variety pack bundles now available. Joovv (red light therapy) — https://joovv.com/mindpump Code: MINDPUMP — $50 off first purchase. Discussed on air for stretch marks and skin health. Seed Daily Synbiotic — https://seed.com/mindpump Code: 25MINDPUMP — 25% off first month LINKS Submit a live caller question: https://mplivecaller.com Mind Pump Store: https://mindpumpstore.com Maps Fitness Products: https://mapsfitnessproducts.com Instagram: @mindpumpmedia 0:00 - Intro 2:07 - How to eat carbs for muscle gains and fat loss — the full breakdown 17:29 - Bookending workouts with carbs & choosing easy-digesting sources 23:42 - PDE5 inhibitors (Viagra/Cialis) — 30–40% cardiovascular mortality reduction & longevity data 33:41 - Side bends for the QL — the most underrated exercise nobody does 39:32 - Sal's son's gem hustle, World Vision kids & the Lego birthday revelation 47:08 - Adam's commercial mosquito killer, Google releasing 32M lab mosquitoes & laser bug defense 1:08:29 - Caller: Jesse (Florida) — overtrained, underfed by bad coach, incredibly strong, gets a coach 1:17:53 - Caller: Augie (Alabama) — combining MAPS PPL with running for fall races 1:22:23 - Caller: Kaylene (New York) — THC sobriety, cannabinoid hyperemesis, bulking comfort 1:39:16 - Caller: Vanessa (UK) — building glutes, letting go of steps and scale, needs to gain weight

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at Mindpumpstore.com. I'm talking right now, hit pause, head on over to Mindpstor.com. That's it. Enjoy the rest of the show. All right, we're going to talk about carbs, carbohydrates, how you can eat them for muscle gains,

strength, and for fat loss. We're going to give you the breakdown on your favorite foods. Let's talk about it. Let's go. Yeah, don't skip the carbs. Yes. Pro carb. Carbs are, it's such an interesting it was so interesting getting in the fitness industry in the 90s and then watching the evolution of how people look at carbohydrates

in the early 2000s. You came to the devil real quick. Yeah, it was, you know, in the 80s, 90s, fat was demonized, so everything was higher carbohydrate. Oh, I will say it's a better movement than that. Yeah, yeah. I mean, because we don't need the carbs. Right, right.

Non-essential. No, but I remember this, like it was yesterday. Like, you know, they come out with a, book on eating a very high fat diet, no carbohydrate. Atkins was the doctor that wrote the book. And because it was so opposite from what everybody had been told, which you got to be, don't, you know, don't eat fat. Fat's bad for you.

He's like, no, eat all the fat you want. Just don't eat carbs. And it completely flipped a script. And then people became afraid of carbs. And so it's very interesting when you talk about carbohydrates, how people's opinions vary. When you talk to athletes or bodybuilders, they'll have varying opinion. people still have fear around carbohydrates or maybe confusion around carbohydrates. So I think it's good that we talk about it.

I mean, the first thing you said it, Adam, was that they aren't, it's true that they're not essential. There are three macronutrients. So macro, meaning large, micro nutrients are things like vitamins and minerals, but macronutrients are proteins, fats, and carbohydrates. And there's three of them in food. Only carbohydrates are non-essential, meaning you can survive without ever eating a single carbohydrate. Your body doesn't need them. Now, protein, your body needs. There are what are known as

essential amino acids. Your body needs to get them from an outside source. And then there are what are known as essential fatty acids or fats. You need to get them from an outside source. In other words, you can eat 10,000 calories a day, but if you don't have protein or you don't have fat, you'll die. Carbohydrates, again, are not essential. So that gives us more flexibility around carbohydrates, but I will say this. They are, in many cases, beneficial. So just because they're not essential does not mean they aren't beneficial

or does not mean it's better to go without them. I think people have made that argument that because they're not essential, then don't eat them. But lots of data shows that they are beneficial for a lot of different reasons. Even outside of like the reasons

I think you're going to list, which when it comes to like performance and things like that, like I think that just lifestyle. Yeah, mood. The reason why I could never get fully behind the no-carb movement is because there's way too many foods that I enjoy that I want to be, I don't want to, you eliminate it and become ultra-sensitive to it. So that's the one of the things they don't talk about either. So, like, if you decide you're going to go no-carb, and that's going to be the way you're going to live, then when you do occasionally, if you ever do, have a birthday cake or do things like that, boy, the way you respond is so different than somebody who has actually allowed carbohydrates to stay in their diet on a regular basis.

And so then you have these crazy swings. And so to eliminate it completely and it'd be ultra-sensitive to having any at all, I've never thought was a great idea. What's interesting is there's this paradox. I believe it was Dr. Mercola, who early on was an advocate for like no carbohydrate diets. Later, he started advising his no-carbohydrate clients to include a day with carbohydrates because there's this paradoxical thing that happens. When you avoid carbs too long, your insulin sensitivity, gets worse. Right.

Initially, it improves. So you'll improve your insulin sensitivity of avoiding carbohydrates. But over long periods of time,

you can actually cause yourself to have some issues by avoiding carbohydrates to the tune of worse insulin sensitivity. They don't talk about that

enough with the carnivore diet people. Yeah, it's definitely, and I've seen this with clients, too. Like, have been, you know, deprived of carbohydrates

way too long. And then, you know, it's insulin resistance. comes up. And then they have a hard swing the other way. Yes. And they go out through it.

Because that's the other part, the behavioral piece is the other part that's like very few people can live the rest of their life eliminating a macro completely. Forever. Yeah, forever. It's just unrealistic for most people. Understandable if you have a special condition that forces you to do that and that, and the only way you're healthy, that's different.

But for general people, it's actually the first medical diet is a no carbohydrate diet. So the original ketogenic diet, which is different than the ones that people do now, but it was very high fat. Very strict. It was actually low protein. So you ate what was called essential protein. And there were zero zero carbohydrate. And it was to treat epilepsy. It's one of the first, if not the first.

Isn't it recommend for cancer also? In some cases, people can do it. And it has a beneficial effect, known as the Warburg effect, where cancer cells can't survive off of ketones like normal cells. Not true for all cancers. So there's also been some myths around this. Oh, if you just starve cancer cells by going ketogenic, first off, your cancer cells can take proteins and turn them into glucose. But number two, we have found that there are some cancer cells that seem to not be affected.

Do you know what cancers it is? I don't. No, you don't. I don't. I just know it's not a cure-all in that case. But in some cases might actually be helpful. You have a theory on why certain cancers so, but not others? Cancer, I mean, we're going a little off here, but there's a very serious.

very complex. We label one thing cancer, but it's a lot of different dysfunctions that look similar in terms of, you know, cells that just continue to divide and replicate. But one cancer can be very different from another and how it responds to. So it's so hard to treat. Okay. That's why they can be so hard to treat. Interesting. Yeah. So, so carbohydrates are beneficial for many different reasons. Athletic performance, this is a fact. I really hate it when people try to make the case that if you go in a no-carb diet,

you'll have the same athletic performance as if you had carbohydrates. It's so proven to not be true. Athletic performance is better with carbohydrates. You have more power, more explosive power, and more strength. Now, long, steady, state, kind of, of stamina, like if you're going to go on a really, like if you're going to go on a really slow run

for long, long, long distance or a long walk for long long distance, we don't necessarily see a difference. But if you want strength or speed or power or the kind of endurance that requires strenuous energy. Yeah, but even even carbohydrates. Even that, Sal, I remember when we had Zach Pitter. Yeah. Yeah. On the podcast, who's an ultramarathon record holder. Yeah. And yeah, and he is a fat adapted athlete. So he runs a kid. ketogenic diet, right, pretty much year around. But then he, for race day, he actually introduced carbohydrates. So even the ultra marathon person who's running long, long distance like that still finds

and fat adaptive, right? So already used to running on that system finds huge benefits from still utilizing carbs. Right. When it comes to building muscle, they help. They just help. I remember when we dabbled with the ketogenic diet early on the podcast. It was like year two or three.

It might have been even one. Yeah, it was early. I know we were in the other studio. Yep. Right? So it was definitely in the first year or two. And it was going crazy, right? Everybody was talking about.

There's podcasts. Oh, so many podcasts. Yeah, keto, whatever. Yeah, keto everything, you know, Instagram handles, all the things, right? It was definitely the rave, all the brave, right? So anyways, we did it. And I was right in the middle of, I had just, been, I think I had just either stopped bodybuilding or I was in the middle of it. I can't remember,

but I was like peak size. I was 240 pounds and like eating 5,000 calories. And then I switch over this. And I just, for the life of me, I couldn't feed enough to, to build muscle. I mean, I found it great if you wanted to just lose because I could, I kept, I felt, I felt, I filled up so quick. And then my performance in the gym was like horrible. Yep. I mean, I just, I felt flat. I can have the motivation to lift, like the pumps were terrible. Like it was just, it was tough for somebody who is trying to build muscle to run that diet. Now, I'm not saying it's not possible. There's always an example of somebody who is the-

You can still build muscle on it, but you typically would build more and more effectively with some carbohydrates in your diet. It's just building muscle is already difficult. It takes discipline and planning and consistency. And so it just adds, layer of complexity to that process. It's like already something difficult for a lot of people to do is to go out, go build five, 10 pounds of muscle.

It's just not easy for a lot of people. Do it now without a very beneficial macronutrient like carbohydrates is good luck. Right. And what we also see with no carbohydrate diets is they can affect hormones negatively. So we see this in people have prolonged no carbohydrate diets. Women tend to be more sensitive to this than men, but both of them. Now that being said, because carbohydrates are not essential, And there are individual variances to how people feel eating them.

You have flexibility with them. So we're basically saying no carbohydrate is probably not a good idea. But you can go on the lower end or the higher end. Sure. And some people do better on the lower end and some people do better on the higher end. And the only way to know is for you to test this out yourself. And the carbohydrate you want to trade this with, in other words, if I drop my carbs, I'll typically increase my fats to make up the difference.

and if I drop my fats, I'll increase my carbohydrates. Now, when caveat is don't go below a certain amount of fat, essential fat, but if you look that up, it's going lower than what I typically recommend. I don't like women going below 65, 70 grams and men going below 85 to 90 grams. So if you're getting that much fat, you can bump your carbs. And if you lower the carbs, you can bump your fats. Don't go, I typically do not like people going below 100 gram of carbohydrates. I think 100 grams is pretty low.

I don't like people going lower than that. but you could go as high as whatever your calories will allow. And the way to know which one works better for you is to test this out. And you could test this out on a week or on a day. And what you're looking for are things like energy, satiety, mood. Do I have fluctuations in energy? And then my performance in the gym. And I've trained enough clients, and I know you guys have as well,

where I've had clients that do really well with higher carbohydrates. They just feel the best. They have other clients that just do really well on lower carbohydrates. They just feel the best. And so because we have that flexibility, it's awesome because you can kind of play with this to find what makes you feel less.

So a little more advice around how to do that specifically, right, is to figure out, we always talk about eat your grams of protein and your body weight. So if you're your target body weight. So if you're trying to be 150 pounds, eat 150 grams of protein, then you do the math on the calories of that, right? let's say you figure out your calorie budget is 2,500 calories,

figure out your protein first, and then that'll tell you how many calories that is of the 2,500, and then the leftover calories. I normally tell clients first to just split it down the middle. Like half of it fat, half of it carbohydrates. Start there. And then we start teetering back and forth with different directions. Like, hey, let's, like, that's how we start off.

How do you feel? And then the feedback, you know, I feel like I didn't have the most energy. Okay, my workouts throughout the day. Okay, cool. Let's pump your carbs a little bit. and drop your fat a tiny bit and then see how you feel. And then we'll do that for like a week and then report back to me on how you're feeling, how is the food feel, how's your digestion feel, how's satiety feel,

because I notice that that's also a factor in how I manipulate this. I find clients that struggle with discipline around eating do better on a little bit lower carb carb and higher fat because it tends to satiate them more and they tend to have less cravings. And so when I have a client that cares more about the craving side, I tend to run higher on the fat, lower than carburetides. When I have clients that are more performance-driven and they want to feel the pump and they want energy throughout their day

and they don't have as much problems with that, higher carb, lower fat. But every client I've found is this is totally individual on what works best. But that's kind of how I would always start this out. Yeah, I tend to do better, I would say, if you look at my calories, you probably classify my carbohydrates, low to moderate.

And I just kind of feel better that way. but I've had people eating similar amount of calories that I've worked with or friends that'll have twice as many carbohydrates in me. When I get my carbs too high, I just feel groggy. That's all. I just feel a little groggy.

My energy isn't as good than when they're kind of on the lower to moderate range. But again, figure this out for yourself. It's very different from person to person. You also may find that one suits you better at, you know, doing some activities, and another one suits you better for other activities. Right.

If I'm doing nothing but podcasting all day, if I'm flying to another city and I'm going to be on three podcasts in a row, sitting down and need to be sharp in a particular way, very low carbohydrates, I do best. If I'm going to go do a hard workout or I'm going to go hike for a long period of time, higher carbohydrates tend to be best. So that's another thing. I'm glad you said that because I think it does change based off of what you're trying to accomplish. not only at that like say it day by day or week by week what you're talking about but even like phases of your life uh so when we started this podcast uh if you go back far enough you can hear me talking about eating five 600 grams of carbs and that was big carb guy and i was eat but i was training like crazy and and that served me at that time right now it's i'm more like you i'm lower carb to

moderate carbohydrate and the reason why that works better in my life so that is i'm not training at that high of volume and intensity, and this helps manage weight better for me. If I were to eat carbohydrates the way I was eating carbs, my cravings are high when I'm eating a lot of carbohydrates. So there's more discipline for me to try and restrict from certain things versus if I just keep the carbohydrates lower, it's easier for me to kind of manage kind of my health and weight where I like it to be in that phase. Makes sense.

Justin, you're like low to moderate also, right? Yeah, I'm low to moderate. And really it is determined on movement. And so if I know that I have like a really hard workout or I have some kind of like crazy physical activity, like I will bump my carbs just naturally. And that's just something I kind of fluctuate with, you know, naturally on its own. Awesome. Here's another thing too. And this is with timing.

Carbohydrate timing could be awesome for people who are very consistent with their workouts. Bookend your workouts with carbohydrates. I love this strategy. So, you know, carbohydrates an hour or two before you work out. and then that gives you the energy of fuel to have a great workout and the data supports this, okay, very clearly. Like, especially if it's gonna be a hard workout,

an hour or two before, makes a difference in your performance. And then right after your workout, why right after your workout? Because you're very sensitive to insulin. You will suck up those carbohydrates. Your muscles are like sponges. Does it speed up recovery?

Does it help build more muscle? Maybe data suggests that it might. It probably does. I just like the insulin sensitivity. I like to be very sensitive to insulin when I eat my carbohydrates. Why? Because my energy feels good.

If I eat the same amount of carbs, I'll put it to you this way. If I eat the same amount of carbs at any other time of the day, sometimes I'll get this energy dip. 40 minutes after. When I eat it right after I work out, you guys see when I come in here,

I'll have a nice, you know, serving carbohydrates, plus some before I get here. It doesn't, I feel great. I have great energy. I think it's because of the insulin sense. I love this advice, and I love this advice,

regardless of what you consider yourself, low carb, medium carb, or a high carb person. I like booking eating around the workouts. I like first meal, so to start your day, because you've come off of being fasted for eight to ten hours of sleep. So I like a breakfast that's got a good amount of carbohydrates in it and then bookending your workout and then really tapering off.

Regardless of even if you're high, so even if you're a high person, a bulk of your carbs go around that time. If you're a low person, same thing. Most all the carbs you'll have around that. And I find I think it manages cravings. I think you tend to sleep better at night. for most people. Your point of the,

there's not these peaks and valleys, I feel like when the body needs the most, it handles it, digestion-wise, everything. I just think that this advice has worked really well for me personally and for clients

is to teach them to try and prioritize your carbohydrates centered around your workouts, regardless of how high or low your carbohydrates. Totally. Here's another tip

because people are like, well, what carbohydrates should I choose? The most important factor, I think, is to consider how easy they are to digest. The easiest digesting carbohydrates in my experience with my clients and myself tend to be the best. Now, what do they look like typically? Potatoes, rice, sweet potatoes, buckwheat. Tends to be fruit. Like, carbohydrates that you eat and you just don't feel bloated.

You don't feel like you ate a bunch of food. This seems to work the best. seems to help with energy the most. This seems to help people feel the best is to choose those really easy to digest carbohydrates. So I would say that's the most important thing. And then from there, you know, avoid things like sugar and stuff like that. But I think really stick into easy digesting carbs. I think this is also great advice. A little more difficult for the average person to read. I think at least my experience with most of my clients are so unaware of how a lot of the carbohydrates they eat

are affecting them. Because they don't have, because maybe they don't have like a crazy autoimmune or they don't have these severe side effects from it. They think that kind of water retention,

bloat feeling is almost just like what it feels like every time you eat a bunch of food, period. And they don't know what like really good digesting carbohydrates and how you should feel. Totally. This takes a little bit of coaching

or awareness or reflecting around how you feel after meals to really, hone even myself personally because I think that's why I feel so passionate about this is even knowing all this I think that I was really naive to it. It wasn't

until the competing days where I was having to track so diligently. Because you would see how it would affect water. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I'm moderating carbs don't cause you to hold as much water. That's right. That's right. And so I never looked under a microscope like I did during that time and I quickly realized

like oh wow those those sandwiches I was eating were affecting me a different different than I thought. Because I didn't have crazy, I didn't have like diarrhea or constipation. I didn't have like distended gut or anything like that. But I definitely would have this, you know, puffiness to me and water retention happening from it. And then I could easily, because I was tracking, compare, oh, what did that, you know, big old turkey sandwich feel like and look, how did I look and feel afterwards versus when I had that, you know, chicken thighs and white rice, oh, there was a clear difference. And so if you've never really evaluated,

that before, you know, pay attention to that and then really let that be the driver of what carbohydrates you choose. Yeah, self-experimenting with that, super valuable. Very, very valuable. I think everybody should really go through a period of at least a little bit of restriction so you can kind of pinpoint how each of those carbs kind of feel and affect you in a certain way. Totally.

For me, this is different from person to person, but the easiest to digest carbs for me, buckwheat, then goes sweet potato or white potato and rice is kind of a tie in fruit. but like buckwheat for whatever reason if I eat buckwheat, it's like I eat air. That's how it feels in my digestion. That's incredible. Lastly, don't drink carbs. So there's a lot of, you know,

sweetened drinks. And this is just, it's not empty. I know people say it's empty calories. I get what they're trying to communicate. It's like, why drink calories when you can eat calories? When you can eat calories. Now, is there value in drinking carbohydrates? Sometimes for people who have really long, hard workouts,

it can definitely help quite a bit. You're going to go play pickup basketball for three hours and you don't want to bunk. Having carbohydrates while you're playing can definitely help. If you're a runner, it could help. If you're going to go out and lift weights and you're going to be in the gym for two hours and you're doing a crazy volume workout,

it can definitely help. Otherwise, like, stay away from drinking carbohydrates. It's way better to eat them. Drinking carbohydrates produces almost no satiety. If anything, it stimulates appetite. So it typically kills people to do that. that. I agree.

Anyway, I got to talk to you guys about, I'm going to make a prediction right now because I did, I went down the rabbit hole on research on some compound, on a compound or a class of compounds that I believe over the next five to 10 years will be touted as one of the biggest breakthroughs in longevity for health. What? Okay. Compounds? Like class of, class of medications.

Of medications. So these are, these are known as PDE5 inhibitors, otherwise known as bone or pill. Villagra, Sayalis. I've been reading a lot about that. So these medications, who've been around now for a long time, I think, Doug,

how long is Viagas? Has it been around for 20 years already? Oh, probably longer. Yeah, see when Viagra first hit the market because it's been around, maybe 30? At least.

Okay, so it's been around for a little while. Because it was, I can, that was the first one. I can remember in high school when I was in high school, okay, seeing it at the gym were on the floor and stuff like that,

not knowing, like what? 1998. So it's the benefit, like, you know, avoiding blood clotting and sort of thinning it out. Well, so here's how they work. So, and what's cool, what's interesting, sometimes Western medicine stumbles upon like a legit, like,

breakthrough. And when I say stumble, it's because it's literally what happens. All of a sudden there's a boner. They were investigating compounds that would prevent an enzyme or inhibit an enzyme that degrades what's called, what's known as nitric oxide. So nitric oxide has a lot of functions of the body. but one of which is to dilate your blood vessels. It relaxes your blood vessels and opens them up.

And so they, scientists are like, hey, if we can boost nitric oxide by inhibiting this enzyme called PDE5, then this should lower blood pressure. Because what they were trying to do is find a blood pressure medication. And so when they did the studies on it, it lowered blood pressure a little bit.

It wasn't like a significant amount. So it really wouldn't probably have been a blockbuster for blood pressure at all. but one of the side effects was the subjects had erections. And they would report back like, man, I'm getting these great erections. And it was like, oh, Eureka, this is going to be a bazillion dollar product. And it became one, right? So Niagara hits the market and it becomes one of those popular medications of all time. Well, it turns out that boosting nitric oxide has a lot more benefit than just being able to give you, you know, better erections.

matrix oxide has lots of health benefits. So I looked up the data on this and it's actually pretty wild. Is there a correlation with like clogged arteries and blood clotting and things like that? Yes. So when you look at the data and they're going to start, they're starting to do controlled trials. So these are all like lots of people using them. Here's what we notice when people use them type of deal. Controlled trials are going to give us much better, more clear data.

but it's becoming quite clear, right? What we're seeing in the data is a 30 to 40% reduction in all-caused mortality from major cardiovascular events, including stroke. 30-40%. Wow. Okay. We're also seeing improvements in things like Alzheimer's. There may be some anti-cancer effects. Sal, is this the reason why there has been a major loosening up around, like, so it wasn't that long ago that, like, that was like you had to get a prescription for the doctor.

Yeah, you can go online and get it super easy now. You just like fill out a form and they'll send it to you. Yeah. Is that part of why the restrictions have gotten loose? No, it's because the demand's high, but also because they're very safe. So they've been around for so long now. That's what I mean. Oh.

Is that like, we've figured out like, wow, these are pretty damn safe. In fact, there's a lot of benefits, you know? There's other benefits to it. And so we're like loosening up the regulation around. Yeah, because they're pretty darn safe. We now have like decades of people using them. Yeah. And we're finding like.

Lots of positive benefits. Yeah, and they're pretty darn safe. Like one of the potential, you know, negatives would be like dizziness or dropping blood pressure or, you know, something like that. And then there's a joke, you know, if you have an erection longer than four hours, you know, seek your doctor. Yeah. Pretty rare. But, but yeah, it's wild. It neuroprotective effects, maybe some anti-cancer effects.

Check this out. It may raise testosterone. It may raise testosterone. It seems to boost muscle protein synthesis. build muscle? Oh. Improve athletic performance and endurance. It seems pretty logical that a compound that is going to improve how your blood flows through your body.

Yep. It's going to flow more freely, right? Would impact a lot of different things. Of course, cardiovascular stuff. Yeah, what would have been hard of the recovery process? Of course, boners, of course. So just a random question. Do you know, is there a correlation or connection?

to people that have like clogged arteries and have a problem with erection? Is that a common sign of effect? Oh, wow. Yes. Oh, improve. It also helps with diabetes. So here's what's interesting.

Here's where the data will get interesting. What we're looking at, when you're looking at men who are treating erectile dysfunction, oftentimes, not every time, but oftentimes what you're looking at are a higher percentage of men with hypertension, heart disease, and diabetes. So all three of those will dramatically increase your odds of having erectile dysfunction. My point with that is

maybe the benefits go to the people who are unhealthy. In other words, someone who's healthy, I don't know if they'll get health benefits from taking it. I see what you're saying. So you've got a bunch of people with bad blood flow. Right. This is why 40% of them show such

it's like one... They've all got bad blood flow issues, which is why they can't get erections. Right. And so is the third 30 to 40% relegated to that group of people. Right. Or is this general hop to everybody?

Would we benefit? Is there any benefits? Yeah. It would be cool. Are there to search in studies, though? Like, because it would be really cool to see studies on regular people. Yeah, like if you're a healthy guy without erectile dysfunction issues, will you get this health benefit from taking it? I mean, I would imagine you still would get performance benefits from it.

It seems, it seems that way. It seems to boost protein synthesis. It seems to improve recovery. There's studies where they induce, they'll put people through. Well, the recovery makes sense. More blood flow. more oxygen, more nutrients, better recovery.

It does. I mean, that's, that seems logical to me. Well, I know this, I know anecdotally, um, bodybuilders and athletes have been using since Fyra came out.

They've been using it and they like it because of the better pumps and the better I didn't realize how quickly they're using it. I said for sure it was that many years old, but I was in high school in 98. It was right out the gates. It was, yeah. So right out the gates they were using it like that.

It was, the gym I was going, you got a credit bodybuilders. like the best experimenters. Like, they're like, hey, they know the immediate application. Yeah, blood flow, muscle. I'm so curious to like the first bodybuilder on the forum, though, who figured it out. Like, did you take it, though, originally to have better sex?

And then all of a sudden, you just happen to get your worry. You went, yeah, that was the best work. Is that how it went down? Or, you know, because some of them. Or you took it to have sex and your wife turns you down. I'm more of the gym. Some of them are bodybuilder nerds like you that probably understood the science, you know. that they're like, wait a second.

If it improves that, that makes sense that it would also improve. Well, every pre-workout promises to boost nitric oxide. That's like the point. The point is it improves blood flow. PD5 inhibitors for sure do. That's like they will raise nitric oxide guaranteed. So I think it's really interesting. So I think what we're going to see in the next five to ten years is this is going to be recommended probably to most men over 40 at a low dose.

Wasn't there a study recently that there's an uptick in strokes? Generally speaking? Generally. I think so. I think so. Isn't this the same thing that actually, so the all cause mortality, the health benefits, the blood flow stuff? Isn't this also very similar to what is happening inside the sauna? Oh yeah.

Yeah, no, no, absolutely. There's more that's happening in a sauna than this, by the way. Well, there's more. But I mean, that's probably- You are exercising your vascular system in the sauna. You are 100% exercise. They are dilating. They're opening.

Your blood pressure is going up to try to pump more blood. sure you're exercising your vascular system. Yeah. Probably, I mean, it feels like this is the generic pill way to do that. That would be the ideal way. That's the more natural way to create that, right? That's right. But similar to why the benefits are, right?

Yeah. No, no, that's good. And even when you alternate like cold plunge to hot, you're making your blood vessels exercise. Constrict and dilate, constrict and dilate by going back and forth. But I just think it's really interesting. The data on this is fascinating. Because now they're recommending it, they're starting.

it, they're starting to recommend it to men at low doses for some of these reasons. This is going to be interesting to see, like, what that daily multivitamin looks like, you know, it's going to have that. All this stuff. Viagrin creatine combo. Oh, look at that. Doug brought up the stroke trend going up. You know where it went up the most?

Where? Young adults. Young adults, yeah. Why? I don't know what happened six years ago. Yeah, it's weird. You're right. Oh, oh.

Yeah, you can speculate. Yeah, dude. you know, some intervention that was forced. Yes. But by the way, boosting. So hopefully it helps with that, though. Tret will trip off this. If you get sick and let's say you get a virus like COVID.

Yeah. PD5 inhibitors are probably beneficial to prevent some of the big. Yeah. Isn't there some protocols to help with some of the spike proteins that might still be in the body? So PDE5. Is this some people on the internet who would call? call themselves experts, but this is not like, this isn't that mainstream. Yeah.

But they will say if you have long COVID taking a PD5 inhibitor will help. Hmm. Because it helps a blood flow. Blood flow. Yeah. Yeah. I know. Pretty wild, right?

Wow. That is wild, dude. Anyway, I got to, I want to bring up a super underrated exercise that I've been doing that I used to make fun of. What? I brought up a couple times on the podcast, but, uh, that you made fun of? And now you're, I used to make fun of it back in the day, uh, sidebends. Oh.

We just, we just talked about that. We did it? Well, no, I've been doing them. That's why I talked about it. So I used to make fun of them because... Just like the hip thrust. Look at you, man. I know, dude.

Where are you taking a cell? I feel like... Wait, sidebbing... Are you putting his work out together? No. Hip thrust, sidebids? Sidebends are not... Wasn't it like a girl...

There come dog peas next, dude. Nice. So... In my gym. Was it really? So sidebends, I used to make fun of because they were, like, people doing them for their obliques. It's a terrible oblique exercise. Yeah.

Yeah. But it was. works your QL really well. It does. It really works a QL really well. And I want to say so many people hurt their backs, deadlifting and squatting, because their QL is what goes out. Sure. It's the QL that goes out. And a side bend works it directly. So I started doing them. Yeah. Because if I squat and deadlift and I start to lift heavy, I start to feel a little bit of tightness in my low back. And it's my QL. Doing it two times, that pain's gone completely. I wonder, I wonder if that would be better or so I, Dr. Gabriel Lyon did a video with a friend of hers.

I wish I could shout her out because I choose the one that was. Well, how about or a lunge with a distraction? So like having like a cable distraction that's pulling you left or right while you're in the lunch position. Something like that. I think, I mean, next level would be. That's it. Bent press, windmill, that's like next level. I know.

But for your very simplistic, like, hey, let's address this. It's simple. Anybody can do it. You don't need great mobility to do it. I can't contest that. You know how people do them when they do them wrong though? You know how people do them wrong? What?

They'll hold two dumbbells. So they'll do sidebands. Like you have one weight. What do you do? It's countering the other one. There's no, you might as well have holding the weight. You have to hold one one hand. Yeah.

And even like a suitcase carries great, but it's still like an isometric. Focus, which you're not really getting that. Dude, Justin, I'm telling you, dude, it would be my right side would feel a little tight. And so I started doing side bends. And it progressed on. I progressed on. I got up to 80-pound dumbbells and I get that gone. It's gone.

Do you have like a specific like music? No, I don't. No, I don't. Instance. Stop, right. I'm just, I'm just, I'm going to picture this.

Hey, it's been a while since I've shot it out a movie on here and saw Guy Ritchie just came out with a new movie. Oh, you texted us last time. Yes. And I'm not often I do that, right? I only do that one. It's like a really, a really good one. And I was trying to go down the rabbit hole with Katrina of like, man,

when was the last time I was. watch a guy Richie that I didn't like. I know. So I guess if you don't like his stuff, then maybe ignore this. But if you like his stuff, I thought this was one of his better ones. It's like action packed. I love the action. I think it's the way he tells a story too.

What's the movie called? It's called In the Grey. Okay. Yeah, in the gray. Jake Joan Hall is the main character in it. He's got a few good characters, though, of good actors in it. So good acting. And yeah, very typical kind of plot theme that he would put together, shot the way he would. I think there's

something about the way he shoots and writes. I'm trying to think of one of the other movies I've watched for him. The gentleman. Like, cinematography. Give a pull up the list. Wasn't there one on a train that was done by me? No, I thought it was Guy Ritchie. Okay, so that's his style.

It is his style. It is his style. I totally thought that was Guy Ritchie who did that film too, but it wasn't. The Bulletin is what you're thinking of. But it is a similar kind of like style like that. Oh, okay. In the Grey, Fountain of Youth.

Those are all the movies right there? Have you seen The Covenant? No. I haven't seen any of those. The Gentleman. Have you seen The Gentleman? Yep. You ever see that gentleman?

I've seen none of those. Yeah. Rath a man. Those are all. Okay. And you like them all? Yeah. There's more than that, though.

Hey, Doug, I want you to bring up the typical bag of pretzels because I want to compare it to crisp power. I want to look at the macros and compare it. All right, check this out. A 50 grams serving of salted pretzels, delicious. Everybody likes pretzels. It tastes good. Sure.

About 190 calories to 200 calories. 40 grams of carbohydrates, 5 grams of protein, 1 and 1.5 grams of fat. That's a normal price. That's just pretzel. Pretzels, right? Chris Power. Doug, read the... There are 190 calories too, right?

No, 210 maybe? It depends on the bag. So this is an exact same, 50 grams serving. It's 210 calories. It's got, let's see, carbs. We've got 15 grams, but the protein is 25 grams. Wow. It's flipped right there.

28 grams of... 28 grams of carbohydrates and you're eating pretzels. No, 15. No, no, 28 grams of protein. Protein, sorry. 15 grams of carbs. There's 28 grams of protein and you're eating pretzels. It's cool because it's...

And they taste like... Well, they literally... Because it's... That one's too... Some of their other bags are one... So it's like 190 to 210. So it's basically the same thing. Calorie-wise.

They literally flipped it on its head. They took a carb food. They made it a protein food. Yeah, made it a protein-heavy carb left. And still tastes like pretzels, which is... That's kind of wild when you think about that. Yeah, you can't tell. If you ate these...

You took a carb food, you made it a protein food, but then it... If somebody ate this, they would just... They would think they're eating pretzels that are... you know, like cheese flavor or flame and flavor, don't you guys notice the fascinating part that I find really... Which is why they're blowing up, by the way. What I find super interesting is how satiating they are.

Because of the protein. Yes. You eat a bag of that, that's true. That trips me out. I mean, a bag that small of regular pretzels, I will feel unsatisfied. Totally. Same calories.

Not only have, like, those, whatever, those, like, versions of, they're, like, at least this big. Yeah. Like, you've seen those, like, pretzels? Did you say they're coming out with a new bag? Yeah. So this is 50 grams, which is 1.75 ounces. They have bags now that are seven ounces.

It's like big shareable bags, basically. Yeah. I mean shareable. So when this airs, they can go to the link that we're going to provide. Oh, it's live already. Yeah, they have a variety pack you can get at large bags. Oh, cool. That's awesome.

Oh, I can't wait, dude. Dude, I got to tell you guys, I had such a great experience last night with my five-year-old son. It was just, you know, sometimes everyone has those experiences where you just like, you reflect back. You're like, man, that was so good. That really turned out so well. So I come home from work and he's so excited to show me a gem that he has. He has a gem. But it's like one of those plastic.

It's like a plastic gem, you know, fake gem or whatever. And he's psyched about it. Yeah. Now, I didn't know that he thought it was real and that he was going to sell it and make money. That's what he thought. He thought he had an actual gem. And the reason why this started is a couple days ago. I was on a walk with him.

And he was asking me random questions. How much money is, you know, is gold. worth? How much is a gem worth? And I remember telling them, you know, we're really small gem could be worth like, you know, tens of thousands of dollars or whatever. So I come home, he's got this plastic thing and he's like, look, I got a gem. It's a real gem. Like, now it's a plastic one. It's plastic. He's like, what do you mean? Like, well, it's not real. He's like, it's not worth any money. I'm like, no. So he's pissed off. So he's walking around the house and he's like, I'm not going to have any money. I'm not rich. I have nothing.

Why are you the only one with money? He's doing this whole thing. Why are you the only one with money? Why don't I have any money? So I'm like, listen, I say, buddy, you are rich. You have a family. You're healthy. But I want money. You have money.

And I don't have. So he's doing this whole thing. So I'm listening to him. And it just occurs to me because I'm like, what do I say to my kid? Because he's acting entitled and stuff, you know? What do I say, you know? Yeah. And then it occurs to me.

We have these kids that we sponsor through World Vision. This is when I texted you guys yesterday. Yeah, yeah. And we have a bunch of them. And I did it with the kids. And every once in a while, we'll go on and we'll check on how these kids are doing or whatever. And so I'm like, hey, it's kind of distracted. I'm like, hey, you guys want to check out the kids that were helping?

Oh, this is how it started. Because I said to him, you know, some kids don't even have a toy to play with. And he's like, what do you mean? Like some kids don't even have a single toy. Yeah. And he's like, really? I'm like, yeah. And some kids have like one pair of clothes.

He's like, no pajamas? I'm like, no. They have the same pair of clothes and that's all they have. And some kids don't have money. So I'm talking about this. made me think of these kids that we sponsor. So, like, hey, you want to check out those kids? So we're looking at the pictures of these kids.

And every once in a while, they'll have a picture like holding a soccer ball. One kid had a picture of a soccer ball he made. So it was like, you could tell it was like plastic bottles that was wrapped with twine or whatever. Like, look, he made his own soccer ball. So my son's like, oh, my gosh. And then we clicked on the picture and it allows you to offer them like one-time gifts of money. So I said, hey, you want to see if we can give this kid an extra gift? so he could buy an extra toy.

Bro, his face lit up so big. We go through, and I made it a thing. I made it like, we got to see if it works. I knew it would go through, but I'm like, let's see if it goes through. So I click on it, do the credit card. I hit the button and the little spinning things happening. I'm like, all right, let's see if it goes through.

As soon as it says it went through, he gets up and he starts cheering. And so we're doing this for a while. And we're just doing this. And he's so excited about all these kids. And it totally flipped his whole vision or understanding of money and what he has versus what other kids have, it was so great.

And he remembered the kid's names. He brought him up today to my wife. She texted me. She's like, does there a kid named success? We have this one kid named success. That's great. Is there a kid named success? Arellia, yeah, yeah, yeah.

He's one of the kids that came up. So we've been teaching, right? That's been this last year trying to teach the save vest and thing like that. And it's been, I'd say, it's going okay. one of the things though that has done really well is like earning money to get his toys like Legos and some of that So now when he wants things

It's no you know we went we're past that four or five age where it's like mommy and daddy just buy it to buy it type of deal Now it's like I'm surprised how patient your son is with that Yeah he's crazy he does a good job he does he'll he'll work off like well let's say there's a hundred dollar Lego And cleaning the toilets is ten dollars a toilet or something like that like I mean he'll you'll clean it ten times and over the course of weeks to build it up to get it and stuff and he keeps track. And so we this has been going on and it's been working and doing and going well. And we're learning the value of money and chores and all the stuff like that. And so his birthday is coming up. So he's we're less than a month out from his birthday. And so now like we're talking about birthday and you know and and Lego just

released a whole new line of Star Wars Legos. And so there's a whole new line. And so he's like going bananas of like, oh my God. gosh, there's all these new ones. And so he's, I want that one and this one. And he's like, and so every night, he's like finding another one. And he's telling Katrina, he's laying in bed. This is the other night. And he's like, man, mommy, he's like, I want all these, these Legos.

Like, I'm going to have to do a lot of work to get all these Legos right. And she starts laughing. She goes, no, hon, this is, this is for your birthday. You don't have to, you don't have to work for those ones for your birthday. And he was like, really? He thought he was going to have to, every Lego that he got for his birthday. He thought he was going to have to do George. off.

He thought he had to work him off and do the chores for it. I was like, I don't know why you totally should have told that. Well, we could have worked that in. Every birthday you got it. Yeah, we could have worked that in. You could have worked that in. Probably got away for at least five. Just be alive for another year.

It doesn't earn nothing. You got to work. You like size when he gets a new big present. Yeah. How much of that time? He's like, man, this is going to be like six months of chores for this one. We should have ran with that. Actually, I was thinking about your son because I knew that you guys are coming up

around this. this age, I've meant to ask you, because we haven't talked about it a long time, because I remember when Katrina and I went to this face, are you guys still on the camera? We do. You are. We still have the camera. Do you talk about that? Is that a, is that a, you'd be 16 having a camera? No, I don't think so. But you know why we have the camera. You know what the benefit is? Well, there's all kinds of benefits. I know. Well, because here's the big benefit. I'll say right now. He'll sometimes, we'll put him to bed and he'll come up 30 minutes later, or he'll come up early in the morning.

Yeah. And so it's like a little warning system that, oh, he's coming up. Get dressed, you know, whatever. So that's how we're... Yeah, dude. So that's why I'm cool. I don't want to be surprised at the door. No, that's because this is right around the...

This is right around. You guys are right at the time where I started... And I'm sure he is at a point, right? He can open all the doors. He can do everything on his own. And I'm like, hey, hon. I'm like, is that more for him or for you? Actually, the other night, he was mad.

because Jessica put him to bed and he wanted her to sit by his door and she said no. So she goes up and she has the camera watching him and he's in his room and he knows she's watching. Of course. So he starts talking bad about her. Oh, what?

Yeah, dude. Yes, he does. Psychological warfare. Bro. And he does it in a way to where he, it's like, oh, he's just, is he really talking to us? Like my mom, he's so mean. Yes, dude.

Oh, my God. She's so mean. That's so good. She won't listen to me. gets me to bed. You gotta give him some credit. Bro. And she's watching it.

She's like shaking her head. And she's like, this little shit. Man, I'm laughing. I'm laughing. I'm trying to laugh because it's kind of hurting her feelings.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like, oh my God. You got to give it to them, you know what I'm saying? That's just it. See, they start to have learned so much.

Like that, when it got to a point where Max was like talking to the camera. Mommy, would you refill my water? Yeah, yeah. Okay. This is not a butler service

that we've created now. I'm like, this needs to go. you say so. I know, dude. Oh, it's great, dude. And I wanted to talk about Juv's red light for stretch marks. We had people message us on what they can do for stretch marks or for loose skin or stretch marks in particular. Red light

therapy. Why people are getting at me? Huh? I don't know. You got them on your glutes. You got all the stretch marks out of glutes. I saw that once. I'm just kidding. I never seen your glutes. I've seen Adam, but I've never seen yours. Adam's mooned me before. You never moved at once. You know why? He's insecure about the stretch marks. That's it. You made that one comment.

That's so super insecure. I don't know if he's just pumpkin size me. Anyway, no, it's one of the only things that has data supporting that it reduces the way they look. It actually helps. Have they done studies?

Yep. Red light therapy works. For stretch marks, it definitely helps. It helps prevent them too. So for people who are if you're pregnant or losing weight or whatever because there's shrink marks too which kind of look like stretch marks yeah um red light therapy uh works for sure it does it helps i mean yeah Courtney i don't mean to like roll her under the bus or anything here but yeah it was like after being pregnant the second time it's like it's funny because the the one piercing she had for her like belly

button like it left like a mark you know because of you know obviously the belly stretching so far and then like once we got partnered up with a juve like was like adamantly using it worked yeah for sure right yeah the color the discoloration all that kind of went away so i i had i have stretch marks on my shoulders and under my arms which i used to be very proud of by the way as a kid i remember you're proud of that oh you too oh 100% i showed it off yeah too like i was rowing especially i want more you know but anyway doing the jew they're they're gone they don't really have any anymore i have a couple like you can see a little bit here yeah but the jews got rid of that i wonder if that played a role of mine

That's interesting. I never thought about that. Because yours looked less too? Oh, way, you can, they were bad. They were like this. Oh, yeah, I had them on my shoulders. And it was totally like a bragging thing. It was like it was cauliflower for the years. Colour ear for body, but yeah, yeah.

That's what it was. Yeah, check this thing out. Did you guys know in Brazil? Tell me my chest hasn't grown. Let me show you. Did you guys, I think it's in Brazil. Maybe it may be somewhere else, but I think it's in Brazil that some men are getting plastic surgery to give themselves cauliflower ear?

Stop it. Doug, look it up. Bro, you know how funny that is? That's like, I would never want that false signal. No, dude. Some dude calls your bluff. Yes, dude. Because the guy, hey, the guy who decides to fight the guy would call for her, you know.

What do we call that? You know, you know, he's calling valor? That's like the stolen valor version of the jih Tzu. And like I said, you, the guy who decides to pick a fight with you, you know is going to be a bad ass. You see, he sees the signal and he still wants him. So you're going to get your ass wolves. It's like you pull out a knife. You better be ready to use it.

Yeah. Someone calls your bluff. Yes. Yeah. No, dude, no, Doug, you have to Google plastic surgery to create the appearance of colorful ears to that. I actually saw some posts on this. No.

Now it's become a thing, right? No, it totally is. I mean, that's the whole neck tattoo thing as well, you know? Oh, man. That's what looked tough. Yeah. That's really crazy, though. That's like, because you, that takes hours and hours and hours of rolling on the mat and

getting your ears messed up to get that. It's not like you can't go take a jih tchitoo class for. a year. There you go. Men are paying to give themselves cauliflower ear. Let me find yourself out here. Now are they doing it through plastic surgery? Oh, that was on vice news. Are they, or they just like, beating their ears up? Yeah.

You know, I just get a buddy. You know, I, not everybody gets it. I did jiu-suito for six years. I did judo for two years. And I have a tiny bit on my left ear, but you can't tell. Yeah. Did you try, because you know you can prevent it, right? I mean, what do you wear? You wear

a head gear? Well, no. Like, draining. it. It's from guys not draining it. Even if you drain your ears over and over again, some guys get it. You know, even in rugby they had issues with that and like I, it was funny because all the guys that played my position they would tape, like electrical tape,

like it'd tape your ears like that and I thought about that. But I was like, I'm not going to be, it's not like my full-time career or anything, so I didn't do that. But yeah, a lot of guys actually would get call for. Yeah. So this is actually in Russia. Oh, in Russia? And there's like actually a wait list for this. It's like super

popular. I don't know why got kicked off of that page. Why would you want to display that you could fight and if you don't? If someone calls that bluff, bro. That's what I'm saying. That's not good, dude. I mean, you're really banking on

nobody wants to call that bluff. Right? That's like pulling out a fake gun. I hope they believe it's real. It's like wearing a tapout shirt. Oh, back in the day. Yeah, it's pretty similar. When I first heard, you Dude, you fight?

Dude, there's so that curve of when you get into something where when you first, I don't know if you guys do this, but when I would first get into something, like, when I first got into jihitsu, I was like wearing jiu-s stuff all the time. But then when I got good, I stopped doing it. It was like when I first started doing it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I'm making money, too. So you first start making money, you like, let everybody know, and then you start making a lot.

You're like, oh, yeah, I want nobody to know. Yeah, I want nobody to know. Totally. That's funny. Justin, I want to hear your pirate fact. You got a pirate fact? He was saying this all fair. I'm pretty sure you already know because, like, just the random facts, like, you usually are pretty privy to this.

But, like, so I heard that actually some of the pirates, they put, like, they would cover one eye with their eye patch. Oh, yeah. During the day. But then at night, they would shift it over. No, it wasn't at night. It was to go below deck. Was it? Yeah.

So they could see in the dark? So the reason why pirates. So, yeah, but they never have to adjust their eyes. The reason why pirates wore a patch is not because they lost an eye. It's so they could be, if they go above deck and below deck and just switch. Yeah, so above deck it's bright.

Yeah, yeah. Below deck, you switch and now you can see real well in the night. That's really the origin of the... You can Google it, Doug, maybe confirm it. That's the origin of the pirate patch? I believe so.

This is what I heard the podcast. That's really fascinating. I know. If you guys lost an eye, would you get a fake eye or would you wear a patch? I've thought about this. I get a fake eye. Really?

Yeah, I get a patch. Really? Yeah, dude? You'd be like, what's his face? Huh? What's the guy Texas guy? Oh,

the senator. No, I would probably do fake eye. Really? I would do a fake eye. I'd wear a patch. It'd be cool. The technology on it's so good that like you,

your fake eye would be probably indistinguishable of your real eye. I don't know. Patch would be like, I just feel like, you know, it's like colorflower would just be like pop eye and just. Not really.

You're saying, Calvire you got through fighting and you could have just got your eye poked out. Yeah. It's like there's nothing cool about that. Yeah, it came up because Jessica's dad has a,

he was born with one, with like without one eye and he has a glass eye. He's a glass eye. And I told her. I told you guys my story at summer camp, right? No. I swear I told you.

Yeah, you told the podcast. I'll tell it again. You poke some of his eye out? No, it wasn't. It was, it was, it was like. Oh, yeah,

the kid without the, oh. The kid, like, pranked us. Yeah, in a sense. And so it was me and my brother were in this cabin and like this kid,

you know, he was a funny. What I love more than anything is, anybody has a disability and they're still like, they poke it out and funny about it, you know, and they're like very,

you know, not insecure as like he literally like put his glass eyes in his mouth and then like the first time I even met the kid he like turns like no eyes just eye sockets and then opens his mouth like wow like almost like beetle juice Oh my good.

Instant friends. I was like wow! Yeah exactly I was dying laughing and we were best friends after that. Yeah, dude. I went to school with a girl who was missing an arm at the elbow and for Halloween, she dressed up as a shark victim.

It was amazing. So good. Like she made it look like it was like, you know, bloody. And she's like, I love people. And I'm like, I love people. I got, dude. That's so great. Yeah.

That's totally. That's how you, that's, that's how you, that's, that's how you go with it. Turn it into charisma. Did you see? Did you look at, Doug, did you look at that spider that Justin and I were talking about? I did look it up earlier. Pull it up on the things. Oh, I don't know.

You got to see this thing. What was the name of again? It's sort of the O. Yeah. I'll take a look here. Yeah, I mean, you could probably put giant tree spider in, and then, oh, and then I, giant tree spider, oh, and I bet a pop. Omothamous? I didn't even know it was a thing, and I saw a pop up.

Where's it found? In Malaysia, I believe. Oh. Yeah, so it's a large tarantula-like spider. Some of them look like they almost had the, like, the blue. How big is that? It's huge. Where is it?

Coloring. You got to do it with something next to it. Yeah, well, you see it one on this guy's hand. Yeah, I'm just Where is that located? Malaysia. Malaysia. Yeah, Malaysia.

It's far away from here. Yeah. Thank goodness. I was like, is this coming into the States? You know what's worse? Because that's gross. Ghibs. But you know what's worse than that?

You've ever seen the videos where it looks like a, it almost looks like a furry ball and then someone touches it and it's bazillions of spiders. Going everywhere? That's the worst. Well, yeah. Some of these tarantias, they'll have all their little babies on their back. Yeah.

And so you kind of like. poke at them and then it's an explosion of spires over there. Oh, God. Have you guys ever... There's tarantulas up in the hills over here if you go hiking. Yeah, I've seen them sometimes. Yeah.

On the paths or whatever. October's when you'll see them. October's when they breed and so you'll see them, that's when they come out and you sort of see them all over the place is in October. Have you ever captured one? See, I knew you guys did. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we used to let them crawl on us and stuff like that.

Trenchersers... You would really let it crawl on you? Yeah, yeah. Almost everything is a cute, dude. They don't, they don't jump. They don't, they just, and they're slow. Trantulas are not scary to me. Little spiders, way more scared to those.

Way more. Like a little black spider. Yeah. That I'm not sure if it's a black widow or not. Like that'll freak me out. You're like kind of shiny. Yes. Like a shiny black spider is way more creepy to me than a big furry trachula.

Big furry trachulas, they're slow. They're scared of you. They try to shoot hairs at you. That's their defense, right? That's like what they do. And they're, yeah, they're not scary to me. I've never seen one. I've never seen one jump.

They just crawl slow and they're furry. They're not, I don't find them. My brother is the jumping one. He's going to hate me saying this, but he's like, I don't know if he's better about this, but probably not. He's been, he's like he does not like spiders, like at all. Like it'll freak him out. Yeah. And to the point where, as this was a grown adult, this was a long time ago, but we were adults at this point.

And he was riding his mountain bike. We're at the park, big family function. And he was riding and he saw a spider on his handlebar. and he just, he just jumped, as a grown man, he jumped off his bike. He jumped off and rolled in the dirt. There was a spider on the handleline. It was so funny to see that. Rolled it right into a bunch of other spiders.

Imagine like riding behind him and see that. I don't know. Like, trying to figure out of a moment like that, though, when I had my window kind of open and I was driving and all of a sudden, this huge, like, wasp just like flew in, like, right on my arm, like right on my, like, shoulder right here. And I was just like, ah, hit. it and literally like swerve I almost went in a ditch and then came right back I wonder how many

accidents happened oh my god probably quite a few came out nowhere did I did I share it with you guys I meant to share this uh with you guys I you guys I think I've talked to Doug about it for sure maybe Justin have you seen the mosquito thing that I have in my backyard the mosquito trap things that I have they're like commercial use I have to go through all these like red tapes to get it so that actually you got a black market I do I got I got it brought it out of state to get like California can't buy it Um, so why can't you get it here? It's,

it's California. They want the GMO ones to buy it. Come on, dude. It's so, yeah, it's serious. It's ridiculous. I'll, I'll send it over to you guys sort of before I forget. But I, so we used to have a guy who, who, who, who, who, who did our backyard

stuff. We actually, we lost him just recently. This is the reason why I'm telling the story. Wait, he died? No, not like that. Oh, okay. He no longer worked for the company. I think you moved out of state or something.

And he used to go through all the loophole because you had to have a license to get it and order it and put it back there and it's made for commercial use and one of these little buckets covers an acre worth of coverage and I have just a half acre a lot and I've got five of these suckers in there right it's this overkill for it and all and so I have to get it I finally get it I just put it together and so I'm like you know why are these so effective so I went down like this stuff is sick bro it's okay so it's a it's like it's like it looks like a speaker and it you it has a mesh tape thing that basically you this is the thing that you pay for,

that you wrap around this thing that's floating on the water. And the mosquito comes, and it's attracted to whatever, I forget, whatever is on this. So it wants whatever's on it. And it makes this like real conducive area for it to land.

And it wants to lay its eggs. And when it lands, it'll land and the water will, and what's on the mesh, will touch its leg, and then it contaminates all the water in there. And then it lays its larvae in there. And once it's contaminated its skin,

anywhere that it goes and flies, say it flies inside of an old tire and lands. It contaminates everything. It keeps contaminating everything. And so, and it kills the larvae off and then anything else. And so then other mosquitoes that find that other areas. The typhoid Mary of a mosquito. Bro, it is. Wow.

It is fascinating how well it works. I told you that. So do you see no mosquitoes now? None. And I have a creek behind me. So I'm in, like, behind me is like a forest and a creek. Maybe it's... We'll talk off there.

I need to get one of those. Maybe it's fan in California because it, then it contaminates the creek. I'm sure it does. Oh, my God. Oh, dude. Oh, my God. Oh, that's messed up, bro. Doug's shaking his head, bro.

He's shaking his head, but you know, he's ordered. He'll be the first one to order. He's looking it up right now. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I couldn't believe how, how effective it was. We had our neighbors come over. Both of us have pools. And I never see them out at their...

I never hear them in their pool. they have kids and everything like that and when they came over they're like um we hear you guys always in your pool and we never go in our backyard they're the mosquitoes are just so bad and i'm like we have none they're like how do you have none that i showed it to them they're like what and i'm like yeah we've none we have no mosquitoes in our backyard whatsoever they're like it is so bad we don't even use our they don't even go in their backyard you know they're about to launch a bunch of GMO mosquitoes so it made me think of this and i brought it up because i saw that they're in google what did google have to do Maybe like many...

Did you see that, Justin? I saw it. I saw a video of a helicopter dropping more ticks. I saw Google. Google is something to do with Google and release. How does Google have anything to do with mosquitoes? How arrogant are we? We just think that's going to be a good idea and maybe nothing will happen.

Nobody's voting for this. I don't know. I mean, I don't like mosquitoes either, but it is Google. Why is Google doing it? See, Google plans to release over three? Why Google, though? I don't know. Why does the tech company get to release mosquitoes?

Why is Bill Gates, like, involved in anything health-related? Well, that's not Bill Gates. Yeah, that's not Bill Gates. I know. He's also not the same thing. Yeah, dude. I don't know how I feel about this. Yeah, 32 million laboratory-bred mosquitoes to California and Florida.

Google's debug project. Yeah. How could that go wrong? How do they review this properly? Meanwhile, I can't use my mosquito killer. F off, bro. No, definitely. Stop.

Maybe because they don't want you to kill the freaking... It's right, Justin. I told you, they want you to kill the GMO. They want you to get bit. None of those would be in my backyard. No, dude. Don't they have a... That's for damn sure.

Don't they have a bug-killing machine like you can buy now that shoots little lasers at bugs? Oh, yeah, Doug? No, that's illegal in California also, too. Oh, wow. You looked them all up. Yes.

You can't use lasers even? You cannot use the electrical ones that pop them and zap them? It's inhumane. What's up with this tier? It's inhumane. It's inhumane. That's not what you're shut up.

Well, they're not human. Yes, it is. It says inhumane. Well, I don't know if that's exactly the verbiage they use, but that's why. It's cruel or something. Yeah, it's cruel, right? So you have to shoot them with lasers? Dude, you can die instantly.

They're freaking frying with a magnifying glass. Now all those traps are lights that attract them and then in there there's bait that they eat or get trapped. They have to gently be put to sleep. Yes, yes. Remember the old school ones? Pop pop, pop, pop. Yeah, yeah.

You can't get those anymore. You can't get that. No. Those are inhumane? I don't know if they used inhumane. So this one, look at this device uses a laser to shoot down 30 mosquitoes per second. Lightar guided.

That's so sick. I want one so bad. Yeah. I just want to watch it. Can they call that defense system that's like, you know, for missiles that's like that? Dude, that is, I haven't heard of your own

Iron dome or something like that. I haven't heard of that. And you can't buy that here, huh? Well, I don't know. I didn't know that's what you're talking about. That's what I'm talking about. I haven't seen that. I would, I'll buy that just for...

The only downside, it's only six meter kill zone. Well, I mean, Adam is like, you know, half acre. An acre. You've got the mass. I've got a five-acre coverage. You're doing mosquito genocide. We have one of those for wasps, because honestly, dude, why do wasps exist? Yeah, I don't write them about it.

I don't like them. They serve no value. Why do wasps exist, Doug? Do they do something for them? Let me tell you why. Bees are cool, dude. Bees, you know, there's a place for you. We need bees, right?

We'd have a complete collapse without bees, right? Yeah, we need bees. But wasp, they don't pollinate? I always wondered about that, because I'm always fighting them. They're the ultimate ecosystem balancers. They serve three critical functions. They provide billions of dollars in natural pest control by hunter, by hunting garden destroying insects. They are vital pollinators.

Okay, so they pollinate, bro. They don't pollinate. They act as food for birds and other wildlife. Doug has a fig tree. What do they pollinate? Trees, including figs. And they feed birds, bro. We can't get rid of them.

Do you guys like figs? I'm not a big pig. Doug just planted a fig tree. No, I didn't. Oh, it was already there? No, I don't have a fig tree. What? I contemplated it.

Oh. But Sal doesn't like him, so I decided to. Oh, that's like that. This guy's gone to influence you. He's gone full garden. I know. Like, big time. Yeah.

Old Italian man garden. Well, did Doug tell you how you organized it all? Yes. AI, he's got like. I was so fascinated with that. Yeah, tell, tell them about it, Doug. Yeah, so I have two planner boxes. They're raised boxes.

They're four feet by 16 feet. two feet high. And I had a bunch of vegetables and fruits I wanted to plant. So what I did is I went to Clawed. I put in the dimensions of the box, the orientation of the box to the sun, all the plants I wanted to add. And it spit me out graphic showing exactly where I needed the plant, which companion plants work well, which ones don't work well with each other, which should get more sun,

which you get less sun. Yeah. And that's how I did it. I know you're surprised because of his Google skills, like how he'd be able to do that. I know. I was so impressed. I'm probably the world's worst Googler. You know?

I mean, at least everybody believes that. Maybe you're just a clod guy. But he got, I thought it was so cool. I mean, even, he was touring me on his thing.

Like, even like there's certain things that he planted that they tell you not to plant next to another thing because it would, which you wouldn't know unless you were told.

That's awesome. Yeah. You could have just done it, you could just had my dad come over. He would have figured it out for you. Yeah. Well, Sicilian.

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go to cede.com forward slash mind pump. Use the code 25 mind pump. Get 25% off your first month's order of their daily symbiotic. Back to the show. Our first caller is Jesse from Florida. Hi, Jesse. How you doing, Jesse?

Hello. Hi, thanks for having me on. You got it. How can we help you? So I'll just read my email to stay on track. So I am a 39-year-old mom, pediatric ICU nurse who started working out about six years ago.

I've lost nearly 100-pound strength training and recently have been running anabolic advanced, which has pushed me to lifting heavier. My current two to four rep maxes are squats, 250, deadlift 280, bench 150, shoulder press, 125. After being about stuck at the same weight for about a year, I hired a coach several months back to kind of get me over that plateau. During that time, my dad had a serious accident. I spent two months in the ICU with him, and that is when I had found your guys as podcast. which has kind of completely shifted how I started thinking about training. Up until a month of half ago, my coach had me eating 1,500 calories,

lifting six days a week, doing 20 to 30 minutes of cardio after every session. So I initially lost weight and transitioned like my training from hit CrossFit style to more heavier lifting. But I feel like I've swung like too far the wrong direction now. I'm trying to increase my calories, but the fear of gaining weight is very real. But at the same time, I started getting shoulder pain, elbow pain that I've never had before, hair loss as well. So a little bit more about my lifestyle. In addition to being a PICU nurse, I also work for a medical device company.

Have to travel frequently. If there's a critically ill child somewhere, I fly and provide bedside support to the nurses at bedside. So can travel at any moment, but just kind of wondering where I should go with my training now. I paused anabolic last week and kind of just did a cardio week just because my upper body, like my shoulders and elbows were hurting so bad. So just kind of don't know where to go and what to do now. Yeah, thanks for calling in. I just wanted just to clarify the initial period of six years of strength training and losing 100 pounds.

You did that on your own? Yes. That's exceptional. Wow. You did a phenomenal job and you're really strong. Do you know how strong you are? No, I don't feel strong. Randomly, people will come up in the gym and be like,

do you, did you miscalculate your math? Like, are you going to be able to lift that? And I'm like, yeah, it's fine. Like, and they're like, oh, yeah, you're fine. Jess, you're stronger than most women. You're probably in the top five. I'm not sure I can do 224 for 12 right now. That's, uh, yeah.

That's a serious squad. It's a serious deadlift. That's impressive. Yeah, you're really, really strong. And here's where things went wrong. And I think you know this. Um, you, you worked with a coach. and you had a bad coach.

You cut your calories way down because you were doing everything great. You cut your calories way down, increased your activity too much, the result of which was a stress response, which looks like pain, hair falling out, I don't feel good, that kind of stuff.

On top of it, you don't have a low stress lifestyle. So I've worked with medical professionals, and I've worked with nurses, and you are in one of the more difficult parts of nursing and pediatric. That's very difficult, very emotionally. Taxing. And you know this. I don't need to tell you this, but just for people listening,

it's a very difficult job what you do. Moving forward, what you want to do, Jesse, is you want to focus on building your metabolism, not on cutting things. Cutting things with your stress and exercise is a recipe for disaster. Now, I get the fear of gaining weight. And a little bit might happen through the reverse diet process, but you're not going to go. You're not going to blow up. That's not going to happen.

That would only happen if you stopped strength training. You ate tons of garbage and you did it for a while. But you've already built your metabolism pretty well, especially considering where you came from. With that strength, you're doing great. I don't think MAPS anabolic advanced is appropriate for you. I think traditional MAPS Anabolic would be good. muscle mommy might be good one of our MAPS 15 style programs would be good

with your daily activity and stress and then what you want to do is you want to slowly reverse diet are you still tracking yes so I've gotten myself up to like 1,700 calories but I'm not gonna lie every couple days I'll be like oh no I've been eating too much and I cut back to way too way too low yeah prior to getting my coach I was like at 2100

but I haven't been there in a bit Yeah, still too low. So considering what you're doing, your strength, your activity, the steps, it's still really low. Yeah. And so what your body is really is trying to hold on to body fat because the nutrients that you're taking are still, you know, barely meeting the demand. And so your body's like, I'm not getting rid of this stored energy. And what's cool, here's some good news, the fact that you're so strong at so low of calories with as much work that you're doing tells me that you're You actually have really good genetics.

You've got really good muscle. If we feed you properly, you're going to build a metabolism. That's going to surprise you. But you got to move up and you probably got to get closer to 3,000 calories before we attempt to cut. And I'm pretty confident if we do it right, you're not going to see a lot of weight gain on the scale. You're just going to feel really strong and lots of energy is what's probably going to look like. I mean, I'd love to see you either in our muscle mommy group or taking on one of our coaches to take you through this process. I think you're a great candidate for somebody like that.

Either one, if you want to do it on your own and you just would like the community, I think the Musul Mommy group's awesome because we have so many women that are reversed dieting going through this. I think you'd be great, and it'd be a great inspiration for a lot of women, considering where you've already come from.

I think you'd be great. Or if you're open to getting coached by one of our trainers, I'd love for one of them to take you through this if you're open to it. How long did you work with your last coach? Like six, seven months. Oh, gosh. Okay.

I never. Yeah. So the reverse. I kind of, I mean, I think halfway through that, I realized I had found you guys and I was like, oh, okay, well, I'll just keep going. But I knew that I wasn't going the right way. Again, I'm going to give you some more encouraging news. You have a really resilient body. Like, phenomenally so. I think if we work with it, you're going to blow yourself away. I would say if you worked with one of our coaches, the reverse diet process will take you about six to nine months.

Through that, you're just going to feel really good. There may be some short cuts in between. that period? You'll feel good physically, but psychologically it'll be difficult. It'll be hard to eat more. But that'll set you up for a cut. And then when you get your metabolic rate where we want it and then we do the cut,

it's going to feel way different. Then you'll go down to 2,100 calories and just start losing body fat. Yeah. I was working at like the, I guess the concierge thing where it's like once a month because I feel like I'm pretty,

like I'm displained. Like I get up in the morning and I do like what I'm supposed to do. Yeah. But yeah. So I'm not opposed to. Yeah, you're a great candidate for that. You're somebody who's like you get it.

And it sounds like you're the type of person that if we gave you the instruction, go do this, this and this, you would follow through. So I think you'd be a great candidate for concierge. Have you talked to somebody about one of our coaches about concierge? How did you know about that? I just from listening to you guys and Googling, yeah. Oh, cool. So, no, I haven't talked to anybody.

Okay, let me have someone call you and they'll set you up with that. And you're going to get a program with that, but I think Muscle Mommy would be a good program for you or one of our MAPS 15 programs. But once you meet with the coach, they'll have longer time to talk with you and determine what would be the best option. Great. Sounds good. Thank you guys. I appreciate it. You're doing really well.

And you're really strong, Jesse. That's like, crazy. That's like really good strength. So good job. Thank you. You got it. Those are crazy numbers. Dude, 225 for 12?

At that low calorie. I don't think you could do that. I can do it, but it sucks. I can do it 25 for 12. It's exhausting. I'm going to have you do a video of that when we get out of here. After Adam does it. No, I admit it.

I admit it. I don't know if I can do that right now. I can do it, it'll suck. That's it. I mean, 225 for 12 is legit. But did she say she deadlifts 235 for 12? Yes. That's crazy. Both those are crazy.

If that's, and that 135 for 6 bench, she's not just strong. She's like one of the strongest. Yeah, yeah. Those are like, I heard she, powerlifting numbers. Now, imagine, yeah, fueling her. It is. She'll really take off. Dude, you know what makes me so frustrated.

I know you guys feel the same thing. crappy coaches it makes me so mad here you have a coach who took a woman who lost 100 pounds and it's strong she was eating 2100 calories

and what do they do 1500 calories increased activity let's make it feel how stupid how crappy of a coach are you if that's just what you hit every time

makes me so upset two buttons our next caller is Augie from Alabama what's up Augie what's happening dude hey guys how you guys doing good man how can we help you good um yeah so my question is i've been listening to a lot of your podcast regarding you know the

the hybrid training space trying to find the best solution i think i ran into the problem that a lot of people do where they over train um so i just purchased the ppl program from you guys and i've been running that about three days a week to start phase two but i want to uh prepare for like running being the priority towards the end of summer um So I wanted some help with the structure, like how I'm doing the PPO right now and running like 10 miles a week max, how can I, what should I then do next when I make the priority running, but still want to strength train about two, three times a week if possible. Just so I can prepare my body for hopefully doing some races at the end of fall. Is it 10 miles broken up or is it straight 10 miles? Yeah, no, no.

It's broken up. So I'm doing like two easy days of maybe two and a half miles of three and then I'll do one day where I'll maybe. BPL level forward, too. It's not bad. No, you're good. So just to clarify, your goal is performance-based. Yeah. But right now, I think my, going into summer, I was like, you know what, which strength trained, hopefully lose a little bit of weight, try to tone up a little bit, and then really hit the running as fall gets closer. Good. No, great attitude. I was going to say, because if you were going to tell me,

a new program after this. Yeah, if you're going to tell me, I want to get shredded and I want to get good at racing. No. Okay. After listening to all the episodes, you guys have to prioritize. But it's just hard because I think for me, the running is more of like a mental like. Oh, I get it. Like I love it. And so the hard part about it, right, doing interrules, I just enjoy it. Good.

So that's been challenging to prioritize one. But that's my goal heading into the fall to hopefully lean out and maybe be a little bit more effective running. No, you're great, bro. So when you're done with this little season of what you're doing, because I think what you're doing is fine, especially if you feel good, you get stronger. Yeah, it's good. losing strength, you feel good, keep going. When you're ready to make the transition to running,

one day a week, full body is plenty. 45-minute workout, compound lifts, and then focus on your running, focus on what's helping you with your performance, and fuel yourself. You don't want to cut your calories while trying to get better at running. That'll be very difficult.

What do you think? Like a single day from Maps performance would be good for him? Yeah, you can do that. Or you could do Maps 15. You can do that. I like giving them Maps performance because then he could pull from the mobility days.

to complement is running. Yeah, that's good. So I would, I would, I would, we'll send you mass performance if you don't have it. And then when, when you scale down to one day, week, just pick one of the days of the three foundation days. And then what you can use, uh, the mobility days as a way to compliment the running and the training. So if there's other things that you want to do, you have time, uh, throw some of those mobility

days in there also. That'll be good for you for active recovery. Yep. Okay. Great. Um, and then another just random one. I looked on your site regarding, you know, the company you guys work with for peptides, just trying to get more information.

Apparently, they don't service in Alabama. Do you guys have anyone within this area that you would recommend? I don't know anybody. But you did check with them and they don't service? Yeah, yeah. I set up like a schedule like consultation and they're just like, we don't service out of them. But just curious. Yeah, no, unfortunately, I don't know of anybody with, you know, FDA.

That's the hard part is you could go gray market and find somebody. who will send to Alabama, but then, like, I don't think any of us want to recommend you, like, a great market company. Yeah. So, you know what you would do is you would do a search for longevity clinics in your area. Okay. And you might, like Little Rock might have one or something like that or two. And then I would call them and say, hey, can I do it telemedicine? Can I do telemedicine? And then you might be able to, you know, not Little Rock. Sorry, that's a different statement. Birmingham? Yeah. Sorry. But you would be able to find someone in a larger city and see if they do telemedicine.

Okay. Great. Yep. That's it. man. Well, perfect, man. Thank you guys so much. I appreciate it. You got it right on. He's got a good attitude. He's going to be fine. Yeah, I know. I mean, when he said he's breaking up the 10 miles, I'm like, oh, that's not bad at all. Especially when his goal, because his goal's performance, when people mess up as they do aesthetic plus performance goal. And then you got to like, yeah, you got to pick one. Yeah, he's segmenting it out. I think it's smart. And yeah, he can just easily transition into that and time it perfectly. And PBL is a

solid program to do that with because it's not a really high volume. That's right. That's nice moderate volume. Yeah. So it works perfect with somebody who's running 10 miles a week. Our next caller is Kaleen from New York. Hi, Kailene. How you doing? Hello. Hi, hi. How can we help you?

So first, I'd just like to say thank you for having me on the show. Like, this is like a dream come true. Like, I've been a fan for, like, a really long time now. Thank you. So I'm honored to be here. Thank you so much. Right. So I've been on my fitness journey for about, like, six months now.

And I'm working with a virtual trainer through the conference. company kickoff. And his name is Nico and he's actually the one that introduced me to you guys. Oh, cool. That's great. So shout out Nico.

So, like, I really want to talk to Adam specifically because I really can connect with your struggles and addiction because I've recently just, I'm coming off of THC I'm like 30 days in right now.

I'm actually going through a medical detox. And because I was diagnosed with cannabinoid hyper-emesis syndrome. Oh, that's where you vomit like crazy. That's rough. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's been a little wild. So my question there is, was there a point in your sobriety when you knew you wanted to quit, but your mind kept negotiating with you and what made it easier?

Oh, wow. I have a very high tolerance for pain. So, like, just having CHS doesn't really deter me from, like, wanting to go back. Yeah, I'd say I had that for almost three years where I was aware of what I needed to do and then I wouldn't do it. And then I knew it was a problem and I'd go back. And so I played that game for a really long time. I'll tell you for me, what was a major motivator was my son, was knowing. that at one point, I may have to have this conversation with him. And what I didn't want to have

have to have is that your dad still struggles with it. I'd much rather have the conversation of this was something I struggled with. And this is how I got over it. And so he was a big motivating factor for me. Probably one of the hardest things I had was that I didn't have a lot of negative symptoms. That was the other thing too was, and I don't know where you're at in the journey with like other things. Like I, things didn't come crashing down on me. You know a lot of addicts. It takes. the bottom of the barrel before they start to come out of that, right? Where they lose their job or their fiance breaks up with them or something, or they get in an accident.

They need something like tragic to kind of wake them up. That hadn't happened to me. And so that was part of why I kept wrestling going back and forth was because I didn't have anything that was kind of like life was good. I felt good. No, it wasn't interfering with anything. And so that was probably the biggest challenge in why I kept talking myself back out of it. But then I kind of flipped that and went, you know what?

like it's only a matter time before this does do something in my life that either ruins my relationship affects my work or does something and you know what the fact that i've gotten away with this for three years and it hasn't i felt blessed and so it was just like it's time and then and i knew that i was going to suffer coming off of it and i knew that i needed to because that was going to be the thing that made me feel off i was like i need to feel awful because something tragic didn't happen to me this is going to be my thing and that's going to be my story is that i'm going to go through that. I'm going to overcome it and then I'm never going to look back. And so that was kind of the self-talk that that I had. And I watched a lot of stuff of other people. I didn't know I was going to do

that. I was drawn to other stories of people going through it and listening to that. I think that gave me empathy for them. It also helped me have solace. It was a big part of me getting through the whole process and then never looked back. But my son was a big, a big motivator for me for sure. Yeah, and I can relate to what you said about like nothing really tragic has happened because that that's the same with me. Like I still have my career. I'm a youth hockey coach. You know, I'm in a relationship, but life is good, really. Yeah.

But that was helpful. And then I guess like a follow-up question that I have about that is like, how do you like pace yourself? Because like I'm very much a person that like if I set my mind to something, Like I want to go all gas, no brakes. And I'm learning that in fitness and in sobriety, like that's, it's kind of making it tougher. Well, which one are we talking? Because I feel like there's two different conversations there. Like with the fitness thing, if you don't pace yourself, you won't see the results that you want to see.

And that's the whole point of me going to the gym and doing those things. And so if you're a full throttle on that and you're not going to see results. But for me on the sobriety side, like I needed to go full throttle. I felt like I had to go like all or nothing. Like there's none of this. What I had done in the past those three years was the tapering game of like, oh, I'll taper down. I'll head that way. And then I justified going back up because I couldn't get good night's sleep.

And then it was like I kept playing that. So for me, I had to go all in on the sobriety thing and cut and go that for me. That for me was the only way. But when it comes to working out and training and diet and stuff like that, like you need small wins. So like, and I still do this to this day. Like I'm not all on or all off on On training. That's like hey, it's like hey this week I'm going to set a goal for myself I want to make sure I get to the gym two times or three times or hey I just want to make sure that I you know my steps have been low

6,000 steps I want to try to average 8,000 this week and so I give myself like weekly small easy wins and I stack them when it comes to health and fitness It's just that's how I approach that so they're kind of different for me like for sobriety stuff I needed to rip the bandaid off and go all in on that and and and in white knuckle it. With fitness, it's different. That approach, I don't think is a healthy approach. Like, I think stacking small wins and building momentum and making sure you have a healthy balance of stress and everything else that's going in your life because going all in on that and full threat on that, either one ends up you falling off the wagon really hard or two,

your body revolts because you have other stress in your life. You're not feeding yourself properly. You're not sleeping properly. So two different conversations for me. Right. Okay. Kaleen, can I ask you a question if you don't mind? Absolutely.

So my friend Ben Bueno, he runs a rehab facility. He's a really good guy, really, really good guy. And I had a conversation with him recently about this because I can self-medicate as well. Now, I've never gone so far to where I felt like it was like I, you know, I'd have to go through crazy withdrawal or anything like that. But I do know my tendency, which is to reach for something to kind of self-medicate. And he asked me a question. I thought that was so powerful. He asked me what it, what's the driving force or what do I think this is making me better at?

Or what am I medicating? And for me, it wasn't like I was medicating pain or anxiety. I thought it made me better. So I thought it made me happier when I'm with my kids or when I'm doing things that I don't want to do and it will give me energy or, you know, makes it easier to be present because my mind. wants to wander type of deal. And that actually helped me a lot because then he asked me, well, is that true? Does it really make you better? And I had to think about that for a second.

I don't think it does. I just think it, I just think I like it. So my question for you is, what, have you examined what it is that, that leads you towards or led you toward self-medicating? I think I just, I kind of, I kind of just like it. And I know that I have like a pull to it. And I like the way it feels, but I'm slowly, like, realizing that it was becoming a problem because I was, I was just doing it so much. And, yeah, I mean, I do have a decent amount of, like, anxiety and stress that I'm working through.

But I think that's a good point is to, like, really ask myself, like, why. Yeah. Yeah, so you actually said something really interesting because you said, I like it. And usually that means because it takes me out of something I don't like. Right. And you mentioned anxiety and stress. So it's really difficult to, because self-medicating kind of works a little bit, right? Until it doesn't work, right?

Until it gets so bad that maybe it causes more anxiety or in your case you had a pretty extreme reaction with hypermesis. but you have to find other ways to help yourself with those feelings that you don't like to be in. Because otherwise it's going to feel like such a big contrast that the self-medicating option is always going to feel like a good potential option. Have you found anything like that, like when you're feeling uncomfortable in your own skin or whatever, like alternative ways to help yourself through those things? Um, not really. Mostly just like self-talk and trying to remind myself that like what I think is not true. Okay. That's a great start.

Um, so what I would do is try to develop, uh, other habits that can replace the one that you've become accustomed to. Um, because it gets real uncomfortable over time. I don't need to tell you this. You know this. Like,

just over time, it's just real uncomfortable. And so, um, see if you can find other ways. And then in the data, when you look at sobriety or success, there's two factors that seem to always come up. One is a transcendent aspect. And so belief in a higher power or God, that's one. The other one is to bring it to light with other people. Because when you do it by yourself, you eventually lose.

But when you include other people, and you want to find people that give you grace, by the way, because you might stumble. but when you do it with other people, in the data, it shows it makes a big difference with being able to keep you on that track. Yeah, I'm actually, I'm working with an addiction recovery coach that I found on YouTube. His name is Dr. Frank, and he's been great so far. That's awesome.

That's phenomenal. And has exercise helped with all of this? It has, but, like, I guess that also leads me into my next question about fitness is, Like, how do I be comfortable with being in a bulk? Like, I've always been on the smaller side. I've never really, like, consistently trained like this because, like, I've always been a natural, like, athlete.

So I didn't really, that never really hindered my, like, abilities in sports. I was, I played Division III lacrosse and ice hockey. So, yeah, I'm just, like, really, even before, like, coming off the weed, like I'm really, I was really struggling with, like, eating a lot of calories. And my trainer, like, kind of says, like, if you don't eat, then you're not going to see gains. But it's, it's hard for me to eat a lot of calories. So, and by the way, this might also be a side effect of coming off the THE. I appetite drops a little bit.

So, but so. Small steps. You're an athlete, so I'm going to speak to you in a way that I think you understand. How do you get comfortable with the pain? the strenuous training, the, I'm pushing myself to the limit in a game. How do you get comfortable with that as an athlete? I don't know. I guess I've never really thought about it.

It's just, it's all drive, like, to succeed and just, just grit in mental toughness, which I think I have. You do, but you probably developed it. In other words, exposure therapy. So it's uncomfortable, but you keep. doing it enough and you start to get comfortable with it being uncomfortable. So that's going to happen with bulking. So it's going to be uncomfortable for a while.

But the more you do it, the longer you do it, the longer you connect it to the gains and the feeling good and this is working, then the less uncomfortable it becomes. You got to get used to it. Set weekly goals and build on it. Whatever, like, whatever that calorie amount or a meal, like it could be that as simple as that. Like, for example, I know when I'm getting back to hitting my protein take, it's like, oh, I need to make sure I get up and have that 40 grams of Greek yogurt first thing in the morning because I know if I don't do that consistently, I'm playing the ketchup game all the time.

So set like a meal goal somewhere in your day. Something that you, right now you go a certain amount of time and you know you don't eat and you probably should. Set a small goal that is a good high protein, good calories, two, 300 calorie meal that you're like, I'm going to just, that's going to be my thing now. I just always eat that, you know, high protein Greek yoga at that time or whatever the thing is for you. and start with that and just and build on it and like Sal said there you'll have a time when you're building on it it'll get uncomfortable uh and you'll probably have some days where you miss and you're not so good then get right back on the horse just like you would as an athlete and get back to being consistent again before you know it becomes a habit becomes something that you do on a regular

basis and you become more comfortable with it but that's what I meant by like small goals like set like a small goal don't try and jump someone who's even though I want to get you to 23 200 200 calories, I don't take somebody who's at 1,500, 5,500 right there. It's just like, we do it through this, through small 200 calorie increments, and we go, hey, this is what we're going to do. Just like, at this part of your day, you eat that. And then, like, just become consistent with that. Pair it with something else that you always do.

You'll get used to it. Mm-hmm. And then we build on it slowly. Okay. That's helpful. Okay. Yeah. You're doing good.

Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, you're doing really good. You want to get back on here in, like, 40, 50 days? I'd like to put you in our private forum, too, if you're not already in there. So you can reach you. Yeah, I would love that. Yeah, yeah.

Adam, I just, I just want you to know that, like, your YouTube on video where I don't know his last name, but I know his first name is Doug. Yeah. That interview that you did with him, like, I go back and watch that, like, any time I feel in low and, like, it just, it hikes me up. That makes me feel good. Thank you. Awesome.

I'm glad that helps. Yeah, stay connected to us. I'm going to put you in the private forum. And we'll get you on again. Let's get you on again. Yeah. You need help. that you just reach out to us you're going through anything like that let us know and then we'll

stay in touch absolutely thank you so much okay thank you thank you thank you bye yeah I got to tell you I just your process and how you went through that and talked about it I respect so much and you could see the impact it's had on other people and I'm sure that probably strengthens you as well to see yeah no you never know like a like a lot of people didn't watch that Doug boff's interview I don't know how many you know it didn't reach like millions of people it reached people yeah Yeah, yeah. I think that's what I noticed from it was the thousands that did watch it were most... Well, I just want to add, when somebody listens to you for a long time and you sound, you know, like they look up to you, the vulnerability and honesty is so powerful. And, you know, you've already got that authority with someone like her. And then she hears that you went through something like that. That's got real impact. So, great job.

Yeah, she's doing a good job, though. I mean, it sounds like she's got there. I had never... I'd never heard of that. Yeah, so it's more common now because cannabis, is much more common. It's repeated, uncontrollable vomiting. Okay, so explain to me because I'm so unfamiliar how does it get to that point? Is it when you come off of it? You get it or it's why you're taking it?

So she's taking it and she's still vomiting and still doing it. Well, that's probably what led her to go. Sure. They have a problem. Yeah, it's the cannabinoid system. It gets all wacky and you get this. Hypermesis is, I didn't want to ask her or put her on the spot, but how high a level is do you probably have to get up to the air?

I don't know, I don't know, but probably a lot of regular use. and then coming off probably made it worse for a while. But that's nasty, bro. So hypermeases, this is like a clinical term for you can't stop vomiting. Like you're just constantly nauseous and vomiting. And is anything else caused that

or is it directly connected to cannabis? Oh, no, it's a cannabis condition. Interesting. It is listed. That is so wild to me as much as I've been around cannabis that I have never heard any kind of symptoms like that.

It's more common now than it has been. And it's common enough to where they have a term for it. Yeah. But it's crazy. And so they'll put you on antinidinodging medication. It's just really big. I mean, I see the thing that she connects with me with, which was, I think, one of the hardest part is when you, believe it or not, is when you haven't had something tragic. And she even said, like, even the throwing up doesn't stop her.

Yeah. You know, it's like, but that's because she has a job. She has a relationship. She has everything going for her. And so that was the thing that made it difficult to get off for, you know. You're managing it. Yeah, exactly. You know, but I think the flip was, you know what?

Like, I should be grateful that. Yeah. Let's not wait. Yeah. let's let's because eventually some shit will happen right so it's like that's that to me was the big motivator right our next caller is Vanessa from the UK hi Vanessa oh I'm so happy to see you guys how are you good how can we help you yeah um okay so I'm just gonna read from my email um things I've changed a little bit since I wrote you um but it might be easier this way so first of all I just

wanted to say a huge thank you for all the content you've been putting out I only discovered you guys a few months ago and must have listened to over 80 hours of your podcast since. As a 38-year-old woman, I never thought I'd be anywhere near your target audience, but I'm constantly amazed at how kind, empathetic, compassionate, and supportive you are of everyone on their health and fitness journey. Thank you. So, yeah, so okay, so just a little bit about me. I'm your typical type A overachiever type of person.

I have a long history of yo-yo dieting and disordered eating and over-exercising. all of it came to a head in 2020 when I was running 21 kilometers a day. I know strength training six days a week, eating 1,200 calories, binging on Saturdays, fasting for 38 hours, rinse and repeat. I got some help and spent the last six years doing some deep work, healing my relationship with food, myself, my parents, et cetera, et cetera. But I did gain quite a bit of weight in the process, all the while still going to the gym regularly. So last fall, I was feeling pretty uncomfortable in my body and I decided to hire a coach to see if I could lose some weight in a healthy and sustainable way. I'm 5'9 and was probably around 168 pounds at that point.

My coach put me on three gym sessions a week, upper, lower, full body, 12,000 steps, one 30-minute cardio session and 1,600 calories. I lost some weight, but after a few months I was getting really grumpy and really weak, so we up to 2,000 calories. I kept losing weight. I upped my steps considerably averaging about 26,000 steps. I got really hungry, so we upped my intake to 2,200 cows and then added another 30-minute cardio session and an extra gym session.

I was hungry again, so we bumped to 2,300, and that's where I was a month ago when I wrote this email, and I was still consistently hungry, and since then I'm now at 2,500 calories, which feels more sustainable. So I did realize that I was getting into the overdoing it spiral with my steps. I do live in Europe, so you sneeze and hit 10,000 steps. That's like not a problem. But I was starting to notice that I always wanted to beat last week's average. So I've deliberately brought my steps down to 18,000.

And we have removed the extra 30-minute cardio session. My problem has never been compliance. It's always overdoing it. So now I'm at 139 pounds. And since writing this email about six weeks ago, the Hume pod has said I've gone down from 17.7% body fat to 17.2% body fat with no real muscle gain. I don't know how accurate the pot is. 17% feels pretty low to me compared to what I look like.

But I feel like the trend is probably correct. So my question has slightly changed since writing this email. I'm seeing some progress in the gym, but it's very slow. I'm happy generally with how my body looks now, but my butt has become considerably flatter, so the added gym session was glute-focused. It's been six weeks since adding it, and my butt is no rounder. I'm eating 170 grams of protein, 75 grams of fat, and the rest is carbs, most of it from whole foods. And then the other part of it is I'm also worried about lowering my steps more because I don't want to eat less food.

So in terms of body recomp, building my butt, staying lean and mostly sustainability, what would you suggest I do differently? We're right there. You're doing really good. You've come a long way. Yes. And I really appreciate how you're identifying things. Like you said, oh, it's spiraling again with my steps.

Like that's a massive step. And I think you're moving in the right direction. I'll tell you what needs to happen. You might not like it. But this is what's going to need to happen. You're going to need to gain weight and your body fat percentage is going to need to go up. Right. That butt shows up around like 20%, 21%.

That's where it sits. It's really hard, if not almost impossible, to build muscle as a female in the teens of body fat percentage. It just doesn't want to. And you're going to need to gain weight. At 5'9 with strength and muscle and the look that you want, which would make you uncomfortable if you weighed yourself, will probably be closer to 150 pounds. just so you know. Yeah.

Okay. Okay. So, so, but you're moving. But you'll look the way you want. You're moving in the right direction, Vanessa. Yeah. So what I, so here's the answer. It's going to be very difficult. You got to take your hands off the control.

So stop tracking your steps. Now don't trick yourself because you can also do this. Sometimes people like, I'm not tracking my steps, but I'm tracking how far I'm walking. And I'm keeping literally stop trying, like really work on not paying attention to how much you're walking. And then what you're going to pay attention to is do I enjoy walking and do I need to walk? Do I need to walk to this place? Okay.

So you don't want to play that game either where you're like, oh, I think I'll walk extra or I'll go over there or I'll take the okay. So take your eyes off the scale, take your eyes off the body fat percentage and take your eyes off of the steps. I would, I would, and you're going to probably have to eat more, which is a good sign. This tells me your metabolism wants to be really healthy. Yeah. So I'd increase the calories again. and then what you're going to focus on, because you have laser focus,

which we can use, is I want you to say, how strong can I get? How, like, how strong can I actually get? How strong can I get my hip thrust, my deadlift, and my squat? That's what's going to build your butt,

and that's what's going to build your body. Okay. And what would you say is like an average, like, progressive overload? I'm just thinking, like, I've been doing kind of the same hip thrusts, weight for like or squats or hip thrust for like six to eight weeks and it's not and i am going to failure you know and i'm like oh my god like what it'll happen when you when you increase your calories

and and stop pushing the steps you're going to see your strength go up i would also not go to failure you want to stop about one or two reps short uh failure uh over does it especially when you do it consistently. And so people don't get better progress with that. We see trends where it tends to move in the opposite direction. So I would reduce the intensity a little bit. I'm not saying don't work out hard, but don't go to failure. I mean, I love to send you a program so we, so we have a better idea of exactly what you're doing. Because right now we're kind of like guessing where you're at where I love to put you on muscle mommy. I think that's a that's a butt focused program. It's very butt focused. We know the volume that's in it. We progressively overload you

in there. So you just got to follow it the way it's laid out. Listen to Sal's advice. You're really close in my opinion. Like the fact that you're already at the calories you're at, at the low body fat is actually a good place. It's like, and you're saying your appetite's still there, which is awesome, which means 200 more calories, lay off the steps a little bit more, and we should see this nice start to move in the right direction. But you're...

And then when it plateaus, you bump your calories again. You have a good coach. I like what your coach is doing with you. Yeah. And so I would communicate to the coach and I would say, hey, I'd like to just get strong. How did you find your coach, by the way? Give him some love. Yeah, I think he's very, he's young and he's, I think I was really, okay, so how about this?

I was really happy to get a coach because I think it allowed me to stay accountable. And also it was really empowering for me because I was the one to advocate for myself. And when we were at 1600, I was like, this is not sustainable. And I know what not sustainable is. And I was like I can't. So I did feel like I had to kind of advocate for myself quite a bit. And a lot of the time when I was like, ooh, I'm feeling like really short-tempered and grumpy and weak. And he was like, no, you've got this.

Keep going. And I was like, oh, I don't think that's right. Sounds like you did a really good job. Yeah. Yeah. So in a way, I'm happy I did it because it allowed me to, it allowed me to kind of empower myself and go, actually, you know, getting a coach made me realize that I can do it. I can empower myself and I don't need to give my power away to somebody else to tell me what to do. Well, this gives me some clarity then.

So you've listened to a lot of our episodes. It sounds like you've kind of had some. Don't. You want a new coach? You want to work with a coach that we hired that's going to help move you in the right direction? They don't have to advocate. I'll have somebody call you. But you're moving in the right direction.

What it's going to look like is a bump in calories, reduction in steps, different programming, and you'll see the strength gains. You'll see what you're looking for, for sure. It's going to feel a little uncomfortable because calories are going to keep going up. You're going to feel like you're building, which might be like, oh, my God, am I getting bigger? but if you focus on the strength, that's going to really move you in the right direction. Okay, okay. And this sounds like maybe a little vein or a little,

I mean, I'm sure you get, you've had so many colors like me of like, oh, I don't want to game fat or anything. But I think, Adam, you were saying that at, like, let's say 150, I would look the way I want to look. That's right. Yes. And does that mean that I'm still going to fit in the close that I currently have?

Probably not. Probably your ass will be busting out of them, you know? So, I mean, is that a problem? I mean, is that a problem or what? You're going to look good. You're going to look good. But with, like, more shape to your thighs and hamstring come bigger gene sizes. And so, yeah, it'll look different.

Don't get hung up on that stuff. You'll look like you, you're tall. You're 5'9. So you easily could be 150. You could be 160, 165 and be banging. So it's like you, it's not a number on the scale. You can absolutely have what you want. And, you know, it's been a common theme.

I feel like on a show lately where we've been telling people like, build into the body you want. Don't try and cut into the body you want. Cutting into the body you want is not going to give you what you want. Building into the body you want, it will. And you'll be eating more than you've ever ate. You'll be at a healthy body fat percentage. Great energy, great mood, hormones. Hormones balance.

You'll have the shape. You'll have it all. You will. 150 pounds at 21% body fat will look more. more sculpted. Okay. So that's the thing about body fat. I mean, yes, you can go too high with body fat, but low 20s is low.

When you have muscle, you look sculpted. You've got good shape. Yeah. And it's the look that you're probably aiming for that you're afraid to go towards because it means you might need to gain some way to go up in terms of, you know, body fat percentage. But I'm telling you, at 20, 22% body fat with more muscle, you're going to look in the mirror and be like, whoa, this looks great.

Yeah. No, you're going to do great. I mean, the fact that you're already advocating for yourself to get this far and where you came from and you're, you're in a good spot. We're close. We get just a little bit of tweaks, calorie-wise, lay off the steps a tiny bit. We'll set you up the programming. I'll have a coach call you and you can determine if you want to work with one of ours, but we hired them ourselves, so we know they're good. Okay.

That sounds great. Oh, thank you guys so much. I really appreciate all of what you do. You got it. I'm excited for you. Yeah, great job. Thank you so much. All right.

All right. All right. All right. Great day you guys. Take care. Bye. Oh, I'm so glad I mentioned the coach because I thought it was him or her or I guess it is a guy. But she's like, no, I had to tell him. Yeah, she's calling all the audibles. Good for her. Good for her.

You're like, imagine your client. A client tells a coach, I feel like garbage. I'm tired. No, no, you're fine. Yeah, yeah. What? Yeah. Oh, I've heard of it. No, I need to bump my calories.

And then she bumps and then she sees more better. Yeah, dude. Good for her, though. Good for her. I know. Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. No, she's, I mean, she's really close. She was what she had 2400 is.

she was at calorie-wise. She's in a healthy place. But you're right. Her body's responding well. 17% body fat is just so lean. It's just so lean. It's hard. And when her main focus,

her goal is to build a butt, like it's going to be. And at 5-9, 139 is very petite. Like she can... No, no. You actually, I said 150 to be comfortable. You're right.

161-C-5. 20% body fat looks amazing at that height. Yes. If you like Mind Pump, come find us on Instagram. It's Mind Pump. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build

and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbundle at Mind Pumpmedia.com. The RGB Superbundle includes MAPS Anabolic, Maps Performance, and Maps Aesthetic, nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam, and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels, and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal, Adam, and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price.

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