Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2893: The 5 Best Forms of Cardio Ranked From Worst to Best (The Results Will Surprise You)

Episode Date: July 3, 2026

MAPS Upper Lower: https://mapsupperlower.com Code: LAUNCH for 40% off. Includes male and female programs, workout videos, exercise demos, coaching videos and live coaching with Cole. In this episode the guys break down the top 5 ways to do cardio ranked from worst to best — running, HIIT, steady state, walking, and playing. Sal shares his return to jiu jitsu after nearly 20 years away, his brother-in-law going easy on him, and why he expects to drop 10-15 pounds of muscle doing it. They also get into California pressuring utility companies to issue contracts to LGBT-certified businesses and the certification process, a new study linking diabetes to a 60% higher risk of dementia and why strength training is the best prevention, Sal doing the Organifi parasite cleanse wrong, Sal's grandfather drinking gasoline to kill a tapeworm in Sicily, and Adam having a dream about Doug running a bunk bed rental business out of his six-car garage. Then they answer questions from Instagram on step-ups vs squats, strength training for a 13-year-old soccer player, whether you should stop heavy barbell lifts after 40, and the wildest gym stories from their careers as trainers. SPONSORS Troscriptions (Calm supplement): https://troscriptions.com/MINDPUMP Code: MINDPUMP for 10% off your first order. Medical grade supplements. Calm discussed on air — Sal used it to fall asleep after jiu jitsu training. Organifi (natural parasite cleanse): https://organifi.com/mindpump Code: MINDPUMP for 20% off. Two-product protocol: parasite cleanse and gut healing formula. Day 1-3 and day 4-7 instructions available on the Organifi website. Our Place (non-toxic cookware): https://fromourplace.com Code: MINDPUMP for 10% off sitewide. Always Pan replaces eight pieces of cookware, titanium nonstick, forever chemical free, 100-day trial with free returns, free shipping on orders over $135. LINKS Mind Pump Store: https://mindpumpstore.com Maps Fitness Products: https://mapsfitnessproducts.com Instagram: @mindpumpmedia 0:00 - Intro 2:22 - Top 5 forms of cardio ranked from worst to best 3:29 - Ranked #5 (worst): Running — why most people have lost the skill and get injured 9:50 - Ranked #4: HIIT — great data, appropriate for maybe 10% of people 12:35 - Ranked #3: Steady state — safe, appropriate, easy to abuse 13:54 - Ranked #2: Walking — longevity data is undeniable and anyone can do it 18:40 - Ranked #1 (best): Playing — why Sal put jiu jitsu back on the schedule after 20 years 23:22 - Sal's first night back at jiu jitsu — what worked, what didn't, and what's next 42:58 - Diabetes linked to 60% higher dementia risk and why strength training is the best prevention 44:39 - Organifi parasite cleanse — how to do the protocol correctly (Sal was doing it wrong) 48:49 - Sal's grandfather drank gasoline to kill a tapeworm in Sicily — it worked 53:09 - Adam's dream about Doug's bunk bed rental business in his six-car garage 58:21 - Q&A: Are step-ups a good substitute for squats? 1:01:12 - Q&A: Best program for a 13-year-old training for soccer season 1:04:34 - Q&A: Should you stop heavy barbell lifts after 40? 1:10:16 - Q&A: Craziest gym stories from working as trainers

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We're going to talk about and break down the top four ways people do cardio, and we're going to rank them in order, but we'll explain the rankings, so don't get your panties in a bunch. We'll start with the worst one. Try not to sell.

Let's get to it. Sorry, Justin. Yeah. So I wrote down kind of... Wait a second. No, no, no, you've got to add one here. What? Am I missing one?

And the first one should be ranked. Because you rank... So number one would be the worst. The worst. Okay. So there should be a... Is there one higher than that? Yeah.

That's worse? Yeah. Straight running. Uh, well, we could put that in either one of the... I'm trying to describe the form of cardio. That's different than one and two. You could do hit running and you could do hit steady state. Running.

Oh, I don't think when people here hit, they interpret that as like going for a run. Okay. All right. We can put running at the top. Let's do that. Yeah. And I actually saw, I think that's the number one thing that people do. So let me do this again.

It's the top five ways. Yeah. Sorry, I just saw the list and I'm like, that's, you got to put that in there. No, let's do that. Let's do that. Because I like everything you got on there, but I also would completely categorize running from two and three differently. Okay. All right.

All right. So let's start with that, though. So number one's the worst. Now, real quick, everybody, again, this is why I said don't get your panties in a bunch, because people are going to hear this. And what they're going to hear is that form of cardio sucks or doesn't produce endurance. It's not going to be good. Or you can't lose fat this way. Right.

No, that's not what we're doing. We're coming from a coaching and training perspective and how each of these applies to most people. So we're trying to talk to the average person listening right now. Not only that, but we also are thinking. about long term. That's right. So it's not just getting these to lose body fat

or get in shape, but it's also maintaining shape for the rest of your life. Of course. So you have to factor that in this formula. It's not just like this is the only way to lose weight or get in shape. It's also what will maintain that.

We'll explain ourselves. Because here's a deal. You're a runner and you're listening right now and you love running. You do a good job running. Like don't worry about what we're about to say. We're talking to the average person. Now here's why running is at the top.

start with this because running to me is an interesting one. There are a few things that the human body actually is designed or evolved, whatever you want to believe, to do really well, physically. Okay? So we get our butts kicked pretty much in the animal kingdom with anything physical. There's only a couple things that we do exceptionally well. One of them is run for distance. We're actually built to run for distance. We have really big knee joints. We have these massive Achilles tendons. We stand upright. We have these huge glutes. We're actually exceptionally good. Or should I say we're designed or evolved to be exceptionally good at running. But here's why running's at the top of the list in terms of it being the worst. Nobody can run. Everybody's lost

the skill of running. This is a skill. So if you stop doing something when you're 12, because you stop playing on the playground, you stop running, and then you decide I'm going to pick up running to get in shape and you're 30 or 40, you don't. have the skill of running and what people do with running is they don't think I'm going to regain this skill. What they think is I'm going to run until I'm tired. I'm going to go work out. Or they think it's just it's injury city. Or they think so that running is how I'm going to get good at running. Like just running until I'm tired. Right, right. In other words, like someone might hear what you're saying and go like, well, yeah, that's why I'm running is because I know I'm not good at it.

I'm going to get good at it by running. And so not understanding that biomechanically, they're terrible. In other words, that's like saying, you're terrible at squating, so I'm saying keep doing more terrible squats. Right. Like you have to learn to get good at the squat and you need to break that down. Well, let me put it differently.

We're going to get efficient at bad patterns. Yes. The thing is you're going to create bad patterns. You think you're going to work your way out of bad patterns, but what you're doing is reinforcing those bad patterns and becoming efficient with it. Let me give you a different example that I think people understand. You've never golf before.

You've never golfed in your entire life. You go and you hire a golf coach who's going to teach you how to hit a golf club. And he goes, all right, let's see what you do. And you just start swinging as hard as you can, as fast as you can. What do you think he's going to tell you?

Yeah, slow down. Yeah, relax. We've got to get your technique down before you really swing the club. If you just keep swinging as hard as you can, you'll never get better at swinging the club. And you'll probably hurt yourself. This is what happens with running.

And you, by the way, that instructor, what he'll do after he allows you to do that, he'll start to break down every bit of it. The way your wrists are, where your head is, position, the way your feet are positioned, the way you follow through on the swing. Same thing with the way.

running. It's like go ahead and go for a run and then a coach would go, okay, now let me show you how your heel, your foot is striking. Let me tell you how your right foot is internally rotated a little bit. Let me show you how you're hunched over when you're doing this. Let me show you how you're like not pulling through as you're like they will break down all the things that you're not doing and then work on those things and slowly do it and not to fatigue. My favorite, one of my favorite stories to tell on the podcast was when I had this huge epiphany around running. And it was years ago. I was in the foothills here in the San Jose area, and I was hiking, and people love to run in the

foothills here in California. It's usually sunny. So people were just passing me by running while I'm hiking. And as a coach or as a trainer, and if you're a trainer listening, you know what I'm talking about, you can't help but see biomechanics. I can't help but see pronated ankles or supinated ankles or hip dysfunction or, you know, overarched back or just, I can see what's happening. And everybody's running by, I was looking at them going, oh, my God, there's an injury,

there's an injury, there's some pain. They could just all look bad. And then this dude ran by me. And he, like a gazelle, he was like floating. It looked beautiful. And I could tell he knows how to run. And then it dawned on me. That's why everybody gets hurt running.

Nobody treats it like a skill. Everybody treats it as a way to get tired. And this is why among all forms of exercise, general forms of exercise, running ranks the top for injury. It causes the most injuries of all forms of exercise. I'm running through this right now with my youngest. and just trying to, you know, build up his skill of running and, you know, adapting to that. And it was great having Kula on the show because, like, there is an entire progression and process you have to go through just to get adapted to the ground forces to get your body in the right position, you know, to get that coordination, get the rhythmic response.

And, like, all these things, like, play in such a factor to how smooth these mechanics work together so your energy is more efficient as you run. Speaking of that, is that live when this is going right now? I'll have to double check out. Because it would be good to know because since you brought this up as like our topic today, because that is a great episode where you have. I recommend that to everybody. Somebody who is breaking that down, that there's an absolute science and approach to learning how to run properly.

And it's so important. And it's why this is ranked as the worst for us right here. Because it's very high on the skill list. Yep. It's assumed. The thing is that everybody is. assumes they just know how to do it right. That's right.

Yeah, it will be live. Oh, so that's great. So if you haven't already listened to that. It'll be episode 2890. Right. So if this strikes a chord or curious about that episode, yeah, Kulo goes into running. So that's really good. Next up on the list, second worst, is high intensity interval training.

Again, people are going to yell up in arms. So first let me describe it. High intensity interval training can be done in a number of different ways, but I'll use one example on a stationary bike, okay, just very basic. You cruise and then you sprint for, let's say, 20 seconds, as hard as you can, then you cruise and slow down to your heart rate comes down, and then you attempt it again. So you do sets of high intensity application. Now, you can do this with weights, you could do this with different forms of cardio, you could do this with running, you could do this with swimming. But essentially, that's the protocol. Now, here's what the data

shows. The data shows, it builds great stamina. It builds great athletics. It builds great athletics. It burns more body fat in shorter periods of time. And so you're constantly getting it sold as to why this is such a great form of cardio. In fact, data specialists, these are people that really understand data but don't have lots of experience training, regular people, will constantly consistently rank hit cardio at the top. Because the data shows it's amazing. Now here's the real world. If you ask me, of all the clients I trained over the 20 plus years that I trained clients, how many of them? hit cardio was appropriate for, I'll tell you maybe 10%.

A handful. Maybe 10% of the most. I know. It's just not appropriate for most people because most people are managing the amount of stress that their body can handle. And I'd rather take that stress and apply towards something like strength training than hit cardio. Yeah, there's a lot of prerequisites involved with kind of building them up to that ability. Like at least just like, you know, having the joint stability is a huge one that I think.

People overlook all those types of things. Like we've got to build up the strength to get everything to perform at an optimal level before we crank the notch to add more intensity and add that kind of acceleration. Well, what percentage of your clients that you guys trained were you not also managing some sort of chronic pain or imbalances too? Everybody. Like almost every client. Everybody. You are along with their fat loss goal or their building muscle goal or their longevity goal. you are also managing chronic low back pain, knee issues, a post-surgery situation,

and then balance from left to right somewhere. And so, and if that's the case, if I'm working on that along with their primary fat loss or whatever goals, and hit is just not a go-to tour to this person. There's other things, which, by the way, it's not bad. And I utilize it, and it's been utilized and can be good based off. for the data, but when you go to the next three that we have going on, they're just better. Yeah. They're just better.

And they're also more realistic to maintain like long term. That's right. That's right. 100%. So now, if you're fit and healthy and you move well or you're an athlete and it's programmed properly, hit cardio is amazing. Yep. But most people don't fall into that category.

Most people fall in the category. I'm trying to get fit. I'm trying to be consistent. I have lots of other stress to deal with. And so adding hit cardio just becomes inappropriate. Next up is steady state. This is the traditional form of cardio. You get an elliptical and you go for 30 minutes.

It doesn't require a lot of skill. It is good for health. It's a healthy form of cardio. It's not going to give you tons of endurance benefits. It's not going to give you tons of calorie burning benefits. But it is appropriate form of cardio for most people. Most people could do this form of cardio and not suffer from injuries or overuse issues. Now this can be abused.

People tend to abuse steady-state cardio by saying this is the way I'm going to work out to lose fat. But we've talked ad nauseum on the podcast about how strength training is a better way to do that. I mean, and what's your favorite way of study? Justin teases my elliptical.

I like elliptical. I can't help it. You know what it is? It's a low risk. It's a low risk, low injury, upright. I mean, you're gliding. Yeah, yeah. Moving those shoulders.

Nice of the shoulders. I like how they put the arm things like it makes a difference. Yeah. You know what I mean? All right. Next up, this is this close to the best, second best, walking. Walking.

Now I know it's not technically, again, people are going to be up in arms. Walking's cardio? Yeah, yeah. You're not going to get tons of endurance walking. Okay, I know that. But walking is so appropriate. Yeah. For everybody.

Everybody can still walk without hurting themselves. Walking is interesting because it's simultaneously activity, which more activity is generally good. So if you look at the data, moving more is generally better unless it gets too extreme. But it's also simultaneously a recovery or recuperating or rejuvenating form of activity. In other words, I could take a client where we're managing stress and strength training once or twice a week is like, we're teetering it because you also got kids. You also got a job.

You know, your diet isn't great. Your sleep is a little off. I can almost always add walking and it not tip them over. That's right. Yeah, in some cases that actually reduces stress. Where running and hit could tip that person. Always. That's right.

That's right. Someone who's teetering right on there, this is already, their stress bucket is already really full, pushing them into hit or running, tips them over or overflows that bucket. Walking actually takes away from that bucket. It often does. It's also a easy form of exercise to implement into your everyday life. You don't need to change in a workout clothes. You don't need to go to the gym.

Yeah. You can stay in typically what you're wearing unless you're wearing heels or something like that. And you can be like, I'm going to go for a 10 minute walk. In fact, I'm going to do a 10 minute walk after breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Boom, 30 minutes. Well, you can build it into your lifestyle.

That's right. Which now makes it something that people can maintain forever. That's right. All of a sudden you, I can't tell you how many clients that this was the tool that we used. And what happens after you've helped them build habits around this, they now become the person who just gets up a half hour earlier before work. and they do a stroll.

Or they become the person who every time they eat, they just take 10 minutes and take a walk. Or every night right before bed. It's like these are things that's like it doesn't, like you said, it doesn't require them changing. They don't go to a gym. You're not getting all sweaty.

It's not super intense. It's like the barrier to entry is very easy for people and manageable and maintainable for a very long time. And so this becomes one of the best. And for anybody scoffing right now like I did as an early trainer. When people told me I walked, I thought, oh God, that's not exercise. The data is clear.

here, walking has amazing longevity benefits. Yeah. You know, you walk up to eight to 10,000 steps a day. This is where you get kind of the peak of the all-cause mortality drops, you know, insulin sensitivity improves, digestion improves. There's almost such a low injury rate. It's just a wonderful form of activity. You know, I have examples in my own family.

It's really interesting for me now to be at the age that I'm at. This puts my, you know, aunts and uncles, uh, now in their 70s, you know, 70s and 80s and stuff like that, approaching that age. And obviously, I'm 45 years old, so I've seen them my whole life. And then I've seen them when they were my age or younger. And now I've seen them into advanced age. And my two that are probably the healthiest, they don't work out. They never have worked out.

They've never been to work out people. But they are major walkers. They love to go to San Francisco and walk the city. They, every day, every week is centered around and just these long, nice strolls to the two of them together. And, you know, they're modest about the way they eat, but they don't track anything. They're not into, like, dieting or into that. They don't drink. They don't smoke.

And they walk. And I tell you, they look, move and act 20 years younger than the other side of my family. And the other side of my family is attempting. exercise and done dieting and done stuff like that and just on and off the wagon and abuse themselves and it's one extreme to the other extreme type of deal. And I look at the difference of it's just been really interesting to watch being in this profession as long as I have, scoffing at something like walking in my early years as a personal trainer and then seeing just how beneficial it can be when it truly is a part of your lifestyle consistently and how much it can

encounter all the other things. Like, again, they're not big exercise. They don't go out and lift weights. Like, you know, I'd love to see them do that. I can't imagine if they actually train train once or twice a week in addition to that. I mean, how good they would probably be. But the fact that they, they look and move 20 years younger than their peers on my other side of my family is wild to see the difference. That's awesome. Last, or should I say the best former cardio is playing. It now is a broad category. In this, a broad category. In this, playing with your kids, throwing a frisbee, going on a hike, going on a swim, jet skiing, swim, you know, just things you enjoy doing that require you to move.

This is the best, of course, be appropriate with it. Don't go play, you know, tackle football with your buddies after you haven't played it for 10 years or whatever. But this is fun. It's enjoyable. It builds community. And in my experience, in my experience, the healthiest people that have ever known, who were older played. They did things.

They liked to cycle because they didn't do it to go work out. They loved it. They loved to go skiing or surfing because it's not work. It's not. It's fun. And I think that's the one of the biggest barriers with even working out or doing cardio in general is the fact that like it just sounds like a task. Like I got to go do this thing.

You know, like playing and being involved in something that's like super active. But you really enjoy it. You get lost in it. And it just time passes. And it's like, wow, I moved so much. You don't even account for that type of move. I don't even know if I would have thought or had the awareness to add this to the list until becoming a father. I think becoming a father has changed my outlook more on this than ever.

I think that. Yeah, go run after a four-year-old or five-round. Yeah. And I definitely don't do it thinking I need to do cardio. And that's why, yesterday, I don't know if you even saw the video I posted on our story. we just got max a big wheel. And so he's found a big wheel. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So he's got a big wheel. You know they're so sick. Yeah, they're cool. They're even better now. They're like so much nicer, you know. The ones we had a plastic wheel. Yeah, he has like a good front rubber wheel, but back to a plastic wheel. Oh, wow.

Yeah, so it grips more going forward. You can power slide. Yeah, yeah. So his is, uh, if you look at my video on my story yesterday, you can, you can actually see the one that I got, no, I got a better one that, Doug. It's cool. It's really cool. Um, anyways.

But, I mean, we're getting him to go fast, running and chasing him and stuff like that. It's just I think that, of course, I'm aware that I'm creating movement and activity and burning calories and all those things. But just the connection with your kid. And I see a lot of dads my age that have kids that just you're tired. You had a long day at work and you don't want to move and you sit on the couch or you sit on your phone. And it's like, not only is that not good for you health. you health-wise and activity-wise, it just can't be that great for you,

relationship-wise, with your kid. And so when I think of talking to people that are our age, that you're encouraging play, it's like, that's the direction I encourage. And then, oh, by the way, it'll keep you healthier and fitter. But it's like, do it for your kid, do it for them to stay connected. I had a client years ago,

she was probably, I would say, in her mid-60s. I was a pretty early trainer. And at that time, I was, I wasn't the greatest trainer or should I say I wasn't the most aware or smartest trainer. I considered workouts to be workouts. Everything else was not workouts.

And I remember talking to her, she hired me because she'd never done strength training before. She got great benefits from strength training. But I remember talking to her and be like, hey, what do you do for exercise? She's like, I dance. I'm like, what do you mean you dance? She used to love salsa dancing

and dancing with her partner and she would do this several times a week. And I got to tell you, man, for someone who didn't quote unquote workout. She was fit. She was fit. And she responded really well to strength training because she didn't have, like you take the typical 65 year old who doesn't dance or play or whatever. There's all kinds of imbalances and movement. Not to say that I didn't have to correct some things with her, but it was a different, it was different altogether. It was because she was just,

she loved to dance. And it was just the fun thing that she did. And so that's the category of playing. I think that's the best. Have you ever, have you ever seen Katrina's dad before? No. Oh yeah. So he's in his late 70s. And salsa dances four nights of the week. Yeah, dude. Drinks, smokes. But I'm telling you, like, you would think he, you would think, I mean, he dates people that are half his age. Okay.

Because he is like this, I mean, he is super. He like salsa dances. Like, he doesn't like, kind of. He like, he's like, you know what? He's very serious about it. And it's like hours of. Justin made a good point. When you do something, when you're playing and you love it, you lose.

track of time, his track of intensity. Oh, he's, hours. Yeah. Hours and into it and just, and it's crazy how, considering he is not a healthy person,

how actually fit and healthy it's kind of kept him. It's been probably the thing that has kept him going as well as it's kept him because of that. Well, I'll tell you why that one came up on the list because I had, yesterday I went back to Jiu-Jitsu. So it was my first day back. Oh,

that was yesterday. It was last night. Oh, shit. So this was my first time back. And I think, I want to say it's almost 20 years. So the last big tournament I did, I think was 2006. And then I really didn't do much after.

So it's got to be at least 18 to 20 years that I've done any kind of jiu-jitsu or grappling. So I went back yesterday over here, San Jose. Shout out to Claudia Frances School. Great place. And boy, let me just explain what it felt like. Okay. I knew what I wanted to do.

like I knew what my body I knew what I wanted my body to do and what it should feel like big disconnect between what my body would actually do it was like it just wasn't obeying it was very strange was it class you were doing it was a class yeah yeah I did a nogee class

and I only I pretty much only went against my brother-in-law who's he's a brown belt now oh okay and so and we went easy so you didn't know somebody there at least yeah dude and we went easy and my ego now at my age I'm like way less so even if I went against the people I'm okay with like totally going easy and you know we did the warm-ups which includes like

mat work and and you know I'll tell you what I will say this I move better than I thought I would okay so I'm actually happy but also when I'm in there rolling and grappling and it's starting to come back to me like what it should feel like and how I should move and then the way my body's moving is not like I expected to well you have a couple things working against you in that too not just the fact that you've been out of for what how many years Almost 20. So almost 20 years you've been out of it. But you're also 30 pounds difference or probably about 25 to 30 pounds of more muscle.

I mean, this is like me playing basketball. This is why I finally had to just like hang it up and be like, I can't do this unless I'm willing to commit to going all the way back down and weight and putting it all the work to like. Because like my brain goes like I can move like this like it's like and I kept hurting myself because I'm like I can't, I can't move my new body the way I used to move my 187 pound body. You know, say it's like so different.

So it's going to be interesting to listen to your, your process through that because that was a tough pill for me to swallow. It was like accepting that I probably need to go down quite a bit of weight to still, if I wanted to move like I used to move. Yeah. Well, it reminds, or accepting you're never going to move like that again. No, no, I'm fine. No, I'm committed.

I'm committed to doing it. It's the healthiest they ever was with fitness because it took my focus off of trying to be jacked and trying to build all the time. You know, weight lift, weight training could also be, quote, unquote, playing for me, but there's a connection to it that moves it away from that and turns it into obsession. Yeah, I'm interested in it too because of like there has to be, like, there's a flow to it, right? Totally.

So it's a totally different like shift in mindset as opposed to like when you're working out and like how you're navigating through all that again and being loose when you need to be loose and then coming in tight. Totally. Yeah. I would think there's a bit of flow for you though in working out though, too. There is. But what he's saying is,

uh, Jiu-jitsu's interesting. Uh, they call it like combat sports for nerds because it's very cerebral. Mm-hmm. And it's very not natural. What I mean by that is like,

any, any idiot could throw a punch. Not, not saying they could throw a good punch, but you, you get a big dude who throws a haymaker, like, and he connects. You're going to sleep.

Yep. There's no accidental submission or position on the ground. It's like learning how to swim. Mm-hmm. So like, you go on the ground. If you've never grappled, you're a baby. And I don't,

I mean that seriously. For real. Like you, there's a great video of Gordon, I think, is his last name. I can't remember his first name. He's one of the world's best jujitsu. What's his name, Dylan? Ryan Gordon, one of the best jujitsu fighters. Did we have on the show a long time ago?

No, we had on the show. No, Gary Tonin. Oh, that's who we had. So Gordon is one of the world's best, if not the world's best, grappler, some people would say. I think he weighs like 210, kind of a jacked jujitsu guy. but there's a video of him rolling with Thor, what's his lap Thor?

Oh, hapthor? Yeah, the, the, who's, how big is hapthor? Can you look up the size? He's like, six, eight, right? Yeah, and like 300 pounds. He's huge. No, more than that, dude. Well, I mean, it's like, yeah, he's 300 plus.

He's, he's a, I mean, he's a mutant. He's like the biggest human being. Six nine. Oh, six nine. Four hundred and five. Oh, four hundred and he's, he's a muscular 450. Yeah. He's a giant, exceptionally strong.

human being. Yeah. And there's a video of him rolling with Gordon. And so he outweighs Gordon by twice as much. He's easily eight times stronger than Gordon. And he can, and you can see how, because of the technique and because, you know, Hapthor doesn't know, he's never done it. Yeah.

He can just roll him up. He pulls him on his back. He gets on top. And you can tell, Abthor's like, lost. He's like, the physics don't even make sense. He's lost. And it's like, and again, Gordon is the best in the world. So if you're like a regular, you know, jiu jitzzi guy.

still get killed by that guy. Be careful. Don't go up to have Thor and be like, I can beat you up. But to see that is like, that's what Jiu-Jitsu is all about. That's funny. You just brought that up. I actually had a, I totally forgot I wanted to ask you guys. I mean, this is a good, good time to ask you because we're talking about weight classes and this and that.

What level, and it was on my mind too because the UFC fighters happened, okay? So what level does like the world class fighter, weight class matter and not matter? In other words, like, okay, can Sal, do Sal feel confident that even if you're a pro boxer, but you're a flyweight? You're not a champion. You're just a flyweight boxer. I could hang with you. Oh, I see. Right?

Because you're 225-pound guy, right? And this guy's 135 pounds, right? So at what weight class does it like all of a sudden, like it doesn't matter? So I'll tell you this. If we're talking about world class fighter? Yeah. Because it's, okay, we're not talking about like the typical gym. Well, no, no, not world, because that's, you're right.

World class, you could be a flyweight. Yeah. Did you guys see? Because grappling is a different ballgame. Grappling is not, uh, boxing or, or, because boxing size makes more of a difference than grappling. Size always makes a difference. Mm-hmm.

But, like, there's a video of Larry Wheels. Larry Wheels is grappling against a 150 pound, like super small deal. Oh, did he do that? And he gets submitted like a bunch of times. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And Larry Wheels is like, he's, like, he's, He's really humbled and pissed off.

Yeah, yeah. And Larry Wheels is very strong. Very strong. He squats 900 pounds. He's very, very strong. Yeah. Insane. So, yeah, jiu-jitsu is like that.

But so, and they have tournament. It's the only full contact, quote-unquote, fighting sport where they have unlimited categories in tournaments. So they have weight classes, and then they have what's called open class. Yeah. It doesn't matter what size you are, you can compete. And it's not the biggest guy that wins often. Oftentimes it's like a 180-pound guy or 160-pound guy.

Yeah. Marcelo Garcia. used to win that. You could, Doug, look up Marcello Garcia and how much his weight was. And he was just, just crushing people back in the day. Yeah, I feel like that's probably the main martial art. I would say, you know, weight classes, like, less.

Yeah. Yeah, 180 to 185 pounds. And that guy right there would win unlimited all the time against 250-pound dudes, 206-pound dudes. Yeah, that's wild. And he would submit them. Yeah. It's just pretty crazy.

Yeah, that's wild. But for me, it's like, again, it's like the, I'm going back for sure. I'm going to do it. I did no ghee last night, which is, I guess, easier if you're stronger. Going back to ghee, they'll tie you up and then you're just like you're sitting there like a,

like a dumb ass, but I'm going to start doing both. I'm going to go super easy. And I'm going to let the muscle fall off my heart. Yeah, I'm excited for you. If that's the direction it's going to go, I'm going to let you go. How many days a week?

What I'm probably going to start with is two days a week of Jiu-Jitsu, and I'm only going to lift one day a week. Oh, wow. Well, yeah, dude, you can't. Listen No, I know You ain't gonna do It's conflicting

Bro, you're wrestling Like hard with grown men You ain't gonna live How was it super fatiguing for you last night? Or did you not? Because we went kind of easy Yeah It wasn't like crazy fatigue

Actually I was like I said I feel not bad about my condition I was I was expecting much worse Yeah yeah But we weren't going like super It was funny too Yeah but still you even know too Like when you're so deconditioned

From us like how like minimal it takes to like feel like exhausted. Yeah. If you're going to assess yourself in terms of like mobility practices you should probably now focus on. I will. What would,

what does that look like? So what I need first is just general flexibility first. So I need flexibility. My hips will get flexible pretty quickly. My quads are really tight. I need to work on flexibility there and I need to work on rotational flexibility because that's what I could feel today.

I could feel that when I would twist. Yeah. Like I can tell like my neck and my thoracic Yeah. That's what I noticed the little stint that I, yeah, tried it out. It was like, oh, my God, like so much hip rotation and hip emphasis that I had to work on. Yeah.

It's going to be fun, dude. And if the, I'm probably, my body weight's probably going to go down to, I don't know, probably 205 to 10. I'd say probably at least 10 to 15 pounds of muscle is what I expect. But whatever happens happens. Okay. And I'm going to do. I'm going to start running, like sprinting. Okay.

So, sorry. Well, my son. You have the bodybuilds at him. Remember the combined weight of us? Teaching it. Yeah, you guys can't lose all my weight, dog? You're going to take the muscle, bro? I'm heavy-raigned out too, so we'll see how that goes.

That's a guy I'm exciting. I tell you what, I was going against my brother-in-law, I was going against him the whole time. And back when I used to train 20 years ago or whatever, you know, I used to kick his butt, right? I used to submit him all the time or whatever. Now, this time, he was very kind to me. Because he's a brown belt now. And he was very kind to me. And afterwards, I texted him.

I'm like, bro, thanks for not giving me payback. Cranking on me. Well, I imagine, I imagine. He wants me to go back. That's why. Yeah, yeah. He wants you to get more on his level probably. So it's competitive again, where he probably knows right now.

It's like it's not even fair. Yeah, yeah. He can't brag about it yet. We're back in the days, you guys were probably closer at level, right? Well, no, I was really, I was decent. I'm, okay, when I say decent, I mean, like, club level, good. I wasn't like state level or like, you else or whatever. Because let me tell you, guys would come in.

This is the greatest experience ever for an athlete. You guys have all experienced this. I only experienced the jihitsu. I'll never forget, dude, we had these guys come in from Brazil. They were all like world class. So they were like world, world class. And I'll never, I was at this point, I was like the peak of my jiu jitzy career. And I could hang with black belts.

I was like pretty good. And this dude, bro, he tapped me out so easily. Like, so easily. It was. it was crazy. Like at one point, I'm laughing. Yeah. And he's laughing with me.

And I'm like, is this, like, are you just messing with me? He's like, yeah, yeah, I messed with you. You know what you're going to do. This sucks, bro. This sucks so bad. Just toying with you. It also makes you feel real confident, though. I'll tell you this, when you do a lot of, like, combat sports, you have a confidence

when you walk around in the real world because you know how to fight. Yeah, those seem to be some of the most, the toughest dudes tend to be the most humble and less likely to fight. Yeah. There's no reason to. Totally. Yeah, yeah. I got to tell you this, though, after training really hard, this was at night.

So I don't know if you guys ever experienced this, but this is common, right? You work out real hard, especially in a way that-drenaline going like crazy. Hard to go to sleep. Yeah. Hard, so I took prescriptions calm. Oh, yeah. Wow. So good.

It works so well, dude. I slept fine. Because I came home and that was kind of buzzing. Did you do just the calm? I did just the calm. I didn't go hard with the sleep stuff. Because that'll knock me that way. Because I'll do the calm with the sleep stuff.

and you, I'll put me in a coma. No, I do the call. So calm you could take during the day too. And the ingredients in calm are so, I mean, they're backed by data and you can feel it. Like if you take calm, give it about 30 minutes and you'll feel your body. We do that about like one to two hours before sleep. That's what I did. Yeah.

Yeah, I took it when I came home, showered, did whatever. And then I just kind of started feeling. Yeah. It reminds me of like a similar feeling I get from like a, like, a, when you're When I take my magnesium or when I take camomile, it has this kind of just chill effect. It's not like a, but then you stack that with the sleep. Oh, well, you're going nine-nine. And then it's like, don't drive 30 minutes to 45 minutes.

No, if you do those two, don't go drive a car. Yeah. Because it puts you out. Operate heavy machinery. Yeah, that's the sleep one. Anyway, I got to tell you about this new certification they have in California. What is, what is you laughing? What is it?

Justin knows. There's a new certificate. It's a gay certification. Talk about this. A gay certification? A gay certification, dude. Oh, wow. Okay, wait.

Stop. Hold on. Come on. Come on. Stop it. Give me the backstory of how this came to be. And then we got to break this down. So California, of course it's in California,

is pressuring public utility companies to issue $633 million in contracts. Wow. To LGBT-owned businesses. However, the must-pass gay certification program. Stop, stop there, dude. This is real? Yes, dude. Please tell me.

Did you, tell me you Googled what the story. certification was. Yeah, I did. You did. Come on. So Doug can look it up to you because we could. We make this a challenge. One of us has to go through this.

So listen. Doug is for sure going to do this. If we save money? Yeah. So first, how much money do we say? What does that in tail? It really depends on what you have to do to prove.

They have to watch you throw baseball. No, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry, too. I'm sorry, guys. Did you pick your five, your top five favorite movies? Yeah, yeah.

Your favorite musicals. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You have an outfit quiz, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. Dude, no, that's, that's, no, there's actual. So obviously if you're married, so if you're same-sex married, that qualifies.

Obviously. Okay. Then they'll, you can send them, like, your, like, social media profile evidence. So I don't know what that. What? Are you serious? Yeah, I don't know what that looks like. What does that even mean?

I don't know what's in there, bro, but that, there's that. Then there's another one. I guess you could have, what does that say? Submit. How much do we save, Doug? I do not know. It's getting contracts. I don't think you're saving anything.

Because Doug is the only person that's not married. So you might have to take one for the team here. All righty. Then I think another one is you could have people write letters for you. Which, listen, I don't know any dude who doesn't have friends that would be like, for sure, I'll write letters to your gay, dude. He's super gay, bro. So gay.

You have no idea. Yeah. You guys don't even know. Yeah. Those are the three that I looked up and then I saw. That is hilarious. The business has to be at least 51% LGBT-owned. What does that mean, by the way?

If you have a two partners. This is not going to be abused at all. That means two of us have to be. Yeah, dude. Oh, there you're inside their gay certification program. How do you qualify, Doug? Look at up. Pictures of sizzling.

Oh, my gosh. What are we talking about here? Stop, dude. And you ever watch that. what baseball game was that? There's these two baseball players. They're going for the ball and they just slide and scissor each other like super hard. I'm sure they made memes of that.

Oh, they were. Yeah, one of the memes was like... They could never plan that again. That was impossible. I saw a movie, but it's like, after this they went out and bought a Subaru together. Does it say, Doug? I'm trying to find this. Click requirements.

Ownership. At least, okay, at least 51% of the business must be owned by one. or more. How does that work 51%? So if you have two partners... That's right. Yeah. So one has to have at least 51%.

So Doug has to be full gay, just has to be constantly. So here's a deal. I get 51% of the company now, right? I did a gay thing once. Does I give me the 1%? So... What if you're like in the furry stuff?

So there's a declaration of sexual identity gender identity supporting documents, letters from an organization, or affidavits from personal or professional. like this is so it's kind of like honor system a lot of this is not going to get abused at all yeah not at all so and this is this is basically money right they're just getting money for their business well my so my understanding is that they will get contracts um utility contracts in california so i mean your your company will get paid obviously you'll get a contract that somebody else won't get

because you're gay so it's not a discount on pgne or something no no it's really getting contracts. If you're, they're required, like as a certain percentage of the contracts we put out, this many has to be in this program that have to be LGBT. Got it. Which to me, guys, everybody, like, this is plainly discriminatory. This is absurd. It's plainly discriminatory.

It makes no sense. To give somebody something simply because of skin color or sexual orientation or gender is plainly discriminatory. Now, I know what they're trying to do. they're trying to correct, but they're, you know, they're trying to, they're trying to overcorrect or say, oh, well, these people don't get it type of deal. No. But, you know.

It creates more divide. I got to say this, you guys. This is how, let me tell you, let me explain to everybody how business works. You know what business cares about? Money. Profit. Money. Mm-hmm.

Like, if you're doing a good job and you sell a good product, you got a good business or whatever, 99% of people will do business with you because you do good business. Now, is this, is this, like, on the ballot, or is this past? No, they're actually pressuring them to do this. So this is like official. This isn't like one of it. Because sometimes you get like headlines like this and it's just all clickbait, alarm and stuff. But this is like really going down.

Yeah. The lawmakers are pressuring them. And this was on a polymarket, which is like a. Because it's already got a certification number. The general order certification 156. It's already got it. I mean, it looks pretty legit. I mean.

Wow. Yeah. Wow. I just want to make a challenge out of this. You guys. But, you know. There's also potentially people that could take advantage of this. Yeah.

You think? Because, like, how do you, I mean, I don't know. Hey, write me a letter, dude. I mean, I need some money for money. Just a lot of AI images. I mean, if we were in the electrical contract business, I'd definitely have you guys doing. Why would you have, why don't you do it? Because that's not my part of the business.

Plus, you'd be better at it. I'm CEO. You're marketing. You'd be better at it. I'll just send a picture of you sitting on the couch. You know, sometimes you sit on the couch. You know, he does that? Take a picture of your toe-knest, dude.

You know exactly what I'm talking about. We're recovered, dude. Yeah. You're exactly what I'm talking. Where you get all relaxed? It's comfortable, though. It's comfortable. You sit kind of seductively a little bit.

Yeah, dude, like that. Like, what are you doing, bro? Stop it. That's perfect. That's too far. Make a whole Instagram account with that and then we're covered. Anyway, all right. All right, enough of that.

I want to change subject. So, you guys know that there's a connection between diabetes and dementia? Yeah. So there's a new, this, this just came out in science news. and they listed some of the ways that they're connected. So diabetes itself increases your risk of dementia by 60%. And this probably has to do with just your brain's inability to utilize energy, sugar. So the brain is 2% of your body weight, but it uses 20% of your body's energy.

And so the brain cells lose their ability to use glucose properly. And this is why, one of the reasons why, people with dementia or Alzheimer's often have improvements and symptoms when they go into ketogenic diet is because you're taking them away from using, you know, sugar and using ketones because their brains have lost the ability to an extent to process that. So by the way, this is also why one of the best forms of exercise for, to prevent dementia and Alzheimer's is string training. And the data is clear on this. Well, that's because of the muscle building and the storage, right? That's right, because the insulin sensitivity. Right, because it becomes a great storage vessel for carbohydrates. And muscles are very insulin sensitive.

It's actually the most effective way to improve insulin sensitivity is to build some muscle. It makes a huge difference. Yeah, I mean, our buddy Max Lugivir, right, in his book, I covered a lot of that. Eating strategies, obviously, with all that. But yeah, for avoiding dementia. I mean, this is something I've been passionate about. my grandma had like dementia real bad. Really?

Yeah. And so it's like kind of in the family. And I'm very conscious of it. Always trying to stress better habits, you know, with my mom. Because she's starting to kind of, you know, there's signs of that potentially being there. So, you know, to strength train and then to eat, you know, make these better decisions. So, you know, she utilizes glucose a lot better. Oh, gosh.

That's a tough one. Doug, you just pulled up organifies parasite cleanse. I didn't realize that. I wasn't doing the full protocol here. What were you doing? I was just taking it in the morning time, the pills, but I guess they have a full-on stack that goes with it. I wasn't aware of that.

I just thought I thought I was doing the right thing. Well, I did too, and I think I made a mistake as well. Oh, okay. So there's very specific instructions on how to use this. So days one through three and then four through seven. Right, correct. So one through three, what are you doing? So there's two different products.

There's a capsule and there's some liquid you take. And so on day one through three, you're taking one. One capsule in the morning on empty stomach with four milliliters of the liquid. And then you're doing the exact same thing before bed. Days four through seven, you're doing two of those capsules in the morning with eight millimeters of the liquid. And then you're doing exactly the same thing before bed. Oh, wow.

So I've been doing two and eight millimeters, milliliters twice a day. And I didn't realize that. So the bottle's not super clear, just so everybody knows. You should look at these instructions. You can find it on your work. Is it on the Organify website? It's on the Organify website. Now, why, how long I've been using it?

Two days. I just started. You have noticed anything? Not, not as a view. So you guys know what a Herksheimer effect is, right? Yeah. Okay, so when you... It's part of the die off.

This doesn't happen to everybody, but when you kill a bunch of parasites, and or... It feels so good right afterwards. It releases a bunch of toxins as the parasites die. And so sometimes people doing a parasite glands feel worse initially. Yeah. And that's called a herximate. timer effect.

It can also happen with treating Cibor. Yeah, I remember when you told me that to be ready for that. So like, don't quit it just because you don't, because a lot of people, I'm sure don't know that.

And then they start taking it. They're like, oh, these make me feel terrible, so I don't want to take them anymore. That's why I haven't started mine yet just because we have vacation like next week. And I was like, I didn't know,

like, you know, if I was going to have that kind of response or not, but I definitely is a hirksheimer effect? Because it's not, so I've known a few people have done these protocols and only one kind of had a herx. Do you think,

Do you think, is that more of a genetic thing? Or is it how bad it is? That's why they feel that way. I don't know. That's a good question. It could be because your detox pathways aren't so great because you have to detox all that. Right.

So that's a good question. Yeah, 10 to 50% of individuals feel that. So that's not a huge. So one out of 10 or so, we'll go through it. Okay. The product they have for parasites is legit. Yeah. I mean, you can go the pharmaceutical route,

which is, I mean, you're nuking. stuff, but you could totally start with this. And what I like about this natural one is you just do it once a year. Might as well go through once a year and go and do the whole thing. Yeah. But I was talking to, what's his name who runs organic? Drew? Yeah.

Drew is like, dude, you got to see the pictures. People are mailing in. Oh, God. They really get people mailing in pictures? People, not mail in, email. Yeah, yeah. People are emailing them pictures of the stuff that's coming up. Oh, God.

That's so gross. It's like a before and after pictures. And there's specific things you can see. Now there's obviously. This is like white like. There's specifically like parasites that you see like white, you know, white strands. Yeah.

And then there's like, we'll look like smaller kind of like, like almost like it looks like an empty capsule, I think. I mean, if you want to Google it. Like what's the most common like parasites right now that people are, are dealing with like in our, yeah,

I wonder. Oh, just because you hear about like, yeah, like in the south and like that hookworm was like very pervasive everywhere. Yeah, dude. I wonder what it is now. What are you,

what are you seeing common? Oh, Doug's looking up. Yeah, so I was looking for that last one I was looking at. You just did take common right there. Yeah, there we go. So, let me, so I can't see this very well, but whipworm, tapeworm, my eyes, roundworm, giardia, hookworm, and coquilia, is that how you say? I don't know how you say it.

Coquitia, maybe. Yeah, those are the main ones, I guess. Yeah. Well, that was game changer for me. That was the thing that was causing all my gut issues. Did I ever tell you guys the time my grandfather, the story he tells me, he told me before he passed away, he's told a story all the time. He, uh, of when he got rid of, uh, his tapeworm.

No. Bro, it's the worst thing. Yeah. Let me hear it. So he lived very poor in Sicily and then gets married to my grandma. They have, he's got no way to support his family. He had a connection in Venezuela, of all places. took a boat to Venezuela, lived in this little shack

with a bunch of other men, and worked, I think it was a tire shop or something like that and would send money back. But it was like, I mean, he tells stories. He's like, Sally goes, there were cockroaches all over the floor where we slept. It was like really, really crazy, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And he said that he had thought he had, I don't remember why he thought he had a parasite. I think he was because he was losing weight and he was eating and he couldn't figure out what's going on. So I don't know how legit. Is my grandfather story, everybody? I would not, don't do this, but he said he drank some gasoline. What?

Wow. Yeah, dude. He said, I gotta get to see out. And he said, it came out. Oh, my God. It came out. And then he felt it coming out and he had to pull it up. Like, vomiting you that out.

No, no. Google that, is there any, is there any connection? I think it'll kill a person, too. Of course. Gasoline is, I wonder if it was like an old time, old strategy. I have no idea why he tells it. Look up gasoline. He loves telling that story.

Gasoline and Parasiccline. he would tell that story. He would tell that story. time. We were just like, oh, no, no, I don't want to hear that. Oh, my God. Yeah. Let's see. Oh, boy. Was historically used as a folk remedy. Wow. He was telling the truth. Yeah, bro. Sometimes I hear stories from my older relatives. And it was like, no way. No way. Look at that. It sounds like you're just poisoned yourself. He drank gasoline, bro. Wow. Wow. Wow. Hardcore. There you go, dude. So, there you go. It was legit.

It was real. That's crazy. That is so crazy. That's so crazy. I told you guys about, he's got so many stories. I told you about how when we were kids, we would marvel and my grandfather's ability to inhale boiling, boiling hot. Oh, food, yeah. Pasta or beans.

Yeah, I remember. Like, I mean, scalding. Like, you put your finger in there, it would melt your finger. Yeah. And he would hold the bowl with the fork and a spoon. How does that not burn your inside? Three times.

Just adapted to him. He would just, like, three scoops. He would, boom, boom. Probably built up scar tissue all the way down his throat and mouth. No. It's actually a sad. story. Because when we were kids, we would laugh about it and he would love to do it in front of everybody to kind of... No, I mean, you've told the story before or why, because he just, you had to

eat or he said he wouldn't get your food in the lines. He had to scarf... When he was a boy, like 10, 11, he had to go off, sometimes for two days, three days to try to make money to bring back to his family. Yeah. And sometimes he'd had sneak on top of a train or whatever. And he'd find work on these farms, and he'd be working with grown men. Yeah. Which, you know, God knows what else happened. He's a 10-year-old kid. The owner would feel... feed the workers and they'd bring out a pot of beans. And he's like, if I didn't eat, I had no food because everybody else would eat the food. So I learned how to eat the food when it was so hot that nobody else could.

So that was how he learned. Yeah, yeah. Isn't that crazy? But I mean, to Justin's point, what I was saying was that, like, how did you do that? Like, that's how he did it. But what it allowed him to do it is probably, he probably built up scar tissue. I would, I think you would, you would, you would burn your mouth and throw it enough times that it would build up scarring and then you would be able to handle that.

Right? I mean, that's logically the only way that. Sounds painful either way. Yeah, yeah. I'm sure it was. I'm sure it was. I have no idea. They made him different back then, you guys.

Yeah. He would be like, sometimes I wake up, I don't have a shoes because of my brother taking. Sometimes I have a shoes. What's crazy about that is 10 years old. That's wild. 10, bro. Wow.

I saw a picture of him when he was, it was 11-year-old kid. My grandmother had this picture of this boy covered in, looked like soot and really tattered looking clothes. and having a stick with two baskets of look like potatoes maybe. And when I was a kid, I remember I saw the pen. I'm like, no, nah. Who's this poor kid? She's like, that's your grandfather.

I'm like, what? She's like, that's a picture of your grandfather. Like, oh, man, he's like a child. That's crazy. I know, so crazy. I tell you guys, I had a dream about Doug last night. Another one? Wait, are you trying to get your certification?

Yeah, yeah. I'm planting the seed right now. I'm going to write my lawyer. No, it wasn't that kind of dream. Was that kind of dream? You know, for the audience, this may not be as funny as it was ended up being for me. Because if you don't know, Doug and I's relationship, like, you guys know. One of the things about Doug is he'll let you tell him stuff, even though in his head he already disagrees or doesn't like it.

But he'll let you keep doing that until he's had enough. And I always know when I've had enough because it's like, Adam, I don't want that. I don't want to. But he'll let you. He's so kind about it. Yes, he's so kind about it. it. Like, he could have stopped. He could have shut it down way earlier, you know what I'm saying? And so... I'm so happy telling me what to do. Yeah, yeah. I'll just keep listening to him,

though I totally disagree. Like, he's just like, he'll do that, right? And of course, he's, he's remodeling his house right now. And so I have lots of opinions, right? Because you love it. Yeah, yeah, right? So you should do this. You should do that? You should do this? And of course, Doug always, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not his head. You know what I'm saying? And I'll keep pushing. You know, my personality, right? I'll keep pushing and keep pushing it. Did you do it? Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like, hey, you do you do, keep pushing that direction. You do? You do it. until finally he goes, Adam, I don't want to do that. You know what I'm saying?

I'm doing this, right? So that sets the table for why this dream would even kind of happen like that. So I have this dream and I'm just, I keep trying to egg, dug on about his garage. And you guys, have you guys seen this place? No, I haven't seen you. Just pictures. Yeah, so he's got a really nice garage. Like, I'm very jealous.

I have garage envy, right? So he's got like a garage that could fit like six plus cars inside it. So it's really big. And so, of course, I have all kinds of. opinions on what he should do with his garage. That's what's happening in the dream is I'm telling him like, he's constantly like, and he's going through this like, where I can tell he's like, listen to me.

And then finally, Adam, I don't, I don't want to do that. And then he takes me over to the garage. And then he opens the garage. And there's this huge, again, this is this huge like six, eight car garage. And it's, the whole outside is completely lined with bunk beds. And I'm like, and he's, and he's, I can see what he's doing.

He's like, and you know how you also. if you, the audience says no, like Doug's very undercover about stuff, right? We always tease him about. He's like, you know, he's always doing something that we don't know about or he's got some, something he's working on. Yeah, exactly, some hobby or some, some tax strategy he's got. We don't know about Doug's doing, right? And so he's, and it's kind of one of those moments where he's like, unveiling it to me,

right? And I'm like, what is this? And he's like, I'm going to rent all these beds out. Yeah, yeah. for 200 bucks a month. It's like super low, like cheap. But there's like, imagine there's, like,

it's like 30, you know what I'm saying? That are in here. And he's, and he's breaking the math down to me and calculating how it covers the mortgage plus and over some. And so that's what's happening in the garage. Wow. And I'm like, you know what me?

I get mad because he didn't let me in on the investment idea. You know what I'm saying? Like, damn, that is a good idea. So that was exactly what I want. It was 30 people living in my garage. It was so never would happen. But I have no.

idea where that came from or why it was, but it felt so real. It felt so real because I'd been over his place so many times. And it is like me typically trying to do that. I've already felt that energy from him and me trying to tell him what to do with its house and implement him to tell me like, Adam, that's not what I'm going to do this, you know? And so it was just like that. And then he opens the garage door and there's bunk beds lined all the way around. I'm like, what is this? It's like, listen, I'm going to rent these out. I can still park cars in there, too. You're doing the math in your head. Yeah. He's, he's, oh, my God. He's, he's, he's, oh, my Oh, that's like 10-brand.

Yeah, he's, then he calculates it out to me, and I'm just like, oh, my God, it's brilliant. And then I'm mad like, he doesn't let me in. Like, why did you tell me? What did you tell me? We could have went in on this together. Oh, my God. I want to help you.

Yes, dude. How is the remodel going, Doug? It was going. It's a slower than anticipated process. It isn't always, it always is with remodeled. Yeah. Just expect that. But it's starting to take form, which is exciting.

And you're already staying there and everything. Oh, no, I'm not. No, no. No, no. There's no floors or anything. Oh, wow. Oh, yeah. No, he's not staying there.

You can't stay in there. How long until you go stay there? That's a great question. I don't know the answer. I mean, it's looking more like August, September. I mean, if all goes well. Yeah. Have you made your neighbors?

I have, some of them, yeah. Nice people. Oh, I don't think I asked you that if you've met your neighbors. I've met like three different neighbors so far. All right, dude. That's exciting, man. Our place cookware is made with intention, completely free of forever.

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and checkout. Get 10% off. Back to the show. First question is from Chris Jones WMXC are step-ups a good substitute for squads. No. No. Different exercise.

Yeah, different. Good, great exercise. It's a great movement. Underrated. Yeah. I think it's super underrated. I think it's extremely functional. It's not like this huge muscle builder, but it's great for stability.

It's great for balance. Lots of carryover into the regular world. Step-ups for me as a trainer were a staple exercise on my clients. I'm glad you said that and brought this up because. we actually don't talk about step-ups a lot. Not that much. And the irony of that is, I actually did it with almost all of my clients.

It was one of my staple exercise. I programmed it all the time. Yeah. So that's it. In fact, we should probably do a little more talking about how valuable step-ups are because we don't talk about them. Yeah, I know that about all of us. Is that that is a step-ups were a staple exercise for clients.

And so it is an important movement that you should do. I think it just gets overshadowed often. by like the big muscle builder. Yeah, people are trying to build muscle and it's not something you bring in that conversation very often. No, no. But hey, look, I tell you what,

it's a great, there's two different ways you could use this if you are into muscle building. So if you're someone like to squat heavy, train hard, it's a great way to warm up the body. It is a great way to do that because the stability involved,

the depth that you start from. So you can do step-ups, then go to your barbell squats. It's also a great finisher for people who want more of a pump. You can make it glute, focused, you can make more quad-focused, depending on where you place your foot. But functionally speaking, it's like, I mean, it's easily a top, for me,

huge functional value. For me, like, of all the leg exercises I had my clients do, it's top five in terms of frequency of how much I use. Well, another reason why that is, is the ability to regress and progress it is really nice. You could take a client who is really deconditioned and you could put them on a tiny little step up to a balance. and then they can go up, you know, a couple weeks later to double that, step up to a balance.

And then you just keep progressing that client, then eventually load it. And then it's like, I mean, there's a, it's a very nice exercise to, but somebody who can, who can squat is like barbell back. Like, the reason why I would do that with a lot of clients is those clients also couldn't do a barbell back squat, right? And so this was a good progression to get them strong enough to where we could go do

barbell back squats. I wouldn't call it a substitute for that, though. No, you would, you would, you're very different. No, very different movement. Next question is from Karen E. Itzo. My 13-year-old son will be training for his soccer season this summer twice and wants to incorporate strength training. What program would be best for him to start with? Great question.

And so if he's in season, not very much. So if he's doing a lot of practice, like one day a week, a few lifts is perfectly fine. Off season, so long as he can perform the lifts properly. MAPS anabolic would be good. Or if he's just getting started, brand new, never done it before. He could use our suspension trainer program, MAP suspension. He could use, you know, even if he gets experienced power lift. Here's the thing about kids.

There's this misconception with strength training in kids and how it may be dangerous or whatever. A lot of the, first off, a lot of the strength gains that kids get from strength training are neuromuscular, which is good. It's very good. Neuromuscular strength gains are great. And they also build muscle. And it also improves their athletic performance. The challenge is with athletes, with young athletes, because a lot of the teenage kids that start strength training are also athletes at the same time,

is not overdoing it and placing too much emphasis on it because it takes away from the practice of those. Yeah, and emphasizing that properoceptive ability and, you know, strength in different planes, you know, just so. too like it better places them because their body's going to be in all kinds with sports especially is going to expose a lot of like rotation a lot of like lateral movement a lot of things that you know within you know the gym setting you can strengthen those um those those particular planes of motion so that way at least like your uh joints don't take on all the force and you can your muscles can get involved and react uh you know and adapt appropriately but yeah like sims For kids, like what I've found, it's, I usually lean more towards the 15 programs, to be honest.

Oh, 15 performance. Yeah. Just because of the amount of volume, like I've, like to really just focus in on, you know, one skill at a time and then kind of move to the next. And they see that strength gain. It really helps to kind of prepare them and then get them, you know, like get those wins in and see that progression. and they're already moving around so much with their sport and their practice to begin with. I love that minimalist approach.

I would go to the same. You know, to be honest, the 13-year-old part is the least important part of the question. Because how I would start somebody, whether they're 13 or 40, is at what level, skill level they are at training. And if this person is, if this 13-year-old has never lifted weight, it's never done anything, then a minimalist approach is a no-brainer, one or two lifts, get proficient at them, get good, practice the lifts. That's the advice. It's the end season or out of season is the most important piece of this of like how much would

we allow them to do that or not do that because they're already doing so much and just throwing a bunch of weight training on top of somebody who's, you know, playing sport five days a week is a lot. And so, and you're risking injury more than anything else. Yeah. But they're a 40 year old that's never lifted weights before, you're going to regress them the same way you would, a 13-year-old. They're going to do something that is very entry-level starter or a 15 minimalist type of program and then progress them. But the soccer, how much they're playing in season, out season, is really dictates like how much programming this person should or shouldn't have.

Next question is from Shall We Fitness. What do you guys think about all these influencers pushing the narrative that you have to drop heavy barbell lifts after 40. That's a thing? I know stupid. Yeah, who's saying that? So here's the category of people that need to be careful with heavy lifting. There's two categories.

One, the person that doesn't have good technique or control. Two, the advanced lifter who's really strong. Yeah. Where getting stronger is not worth the risk. Yeah, the benefits are minimal at that. That's right. So if you have good technique, good form, you're not a lot of, the category of like you're hitting crazy numbers like go for it uh but like you're starting to get

really really strong and you know for yourself you've been lifting for three years like man this is a like a heavy weight for me pushing more strength sometimes isn't worth the risk and there's other ways to improve without always adding weight to the bar and then back to what i said earlier like if you're if you don't have good technique or control you have no business going heavier you got to work on that first yeah when we get asked about uh a general question like this influencers saying this thing and a general statement like that, I'd always like to see a clip of what you're referring to. Who are they pointing to? Because I could also, if I was playing devil's advocate and I was trying to support this argument, I could also support it to kind of the angle that

Sal was starting to go. I've let go of a lot of really heavy barbell deadlifting and squatting. It just doesn't serve me. I'm not trying to build any more than I've built. I don't have to move that much weight, you know, 225 to 315 on the bar when I'm deadlifting or squat and there's plenty of weight to sustain my strength in my legs and the look that I like. And so pushing those numbers much higher is what I would consider really heavy. So I consider what I'm lifting very moderate or even light. So it's relative to what your strength abilities are and have you worked up to that. So I'd be really interesting to see the, this clip of someone saying that because I can get behind that my own advice to myself is like

Adam, Adam, let go of, you know, chasing the 400 plus pound squat. Let go of being over 500 pounds squat. I don't need to do that. It's, at my age, you know what I should do more of? More mobility work and more stuff like that. And so I haven't earned the right to even be pushing those types of numbers. And so I could see giving that advice to myself.

But then I would never want to discourage somebody. who is just getting into strength trading, even if they're in their 40s, because heavy to them could be 185. That's the thing is relative. That's what I mean. So that's why I want to see a clip of what are we talking about. Just because you're 40.

Generalizing this, just, I wouldn't put a general statement out there like that. Because even when we're looking at like programming for 40 plus, for instance, we're looking at risk, reward and like what we could get in terms of like strength and something like, so if I'm just shifting my focus of just the dead left to now trap our dead left,

you know, because of I've trained for so long to the point where I built up, you know, all this strength where like my joints are actually getting impacted a bit more. Like that's where I'm going to start shifting more into the less risk. But it's like it all determines like the person, what their experiences. To make it less speculative, I'll say this. If you just started strength training now and you're consistent, for the first couple years, just get stronger.

Just get stronger. For the first couple years, getting stronger is what's going to give you the best everything. Which, by the way, requires heavy lifting on the barbell. That's right. That's what I mean. Relative to you. That's what I mean, it's less speculative because what's heavy for one is not so heavy for another. But for a good two years, your goal should just be get strong. Get strong and be balanced and be appropriate.

Don't be stupid. But just get strong. That'll give you the best everything. After that, then you can start to play the game of like risk versus reward. But you got a good couple of years of strength. I mean, did you see the, this is why I wanted to see it. Did you see the clip that Doug pulled right there? Of course, that guy would say, stop.

I mean, look at him. He's definitely lifted heavy lifting for a decade. For decades. You know what I'm saying? And now he's saying, don't do that. Well, okay, yeah, that makes sense because you've, for 30 years, you've probably lifted heavy and built a tremendous amount of muscle. That's right.

And so you could cut your weight in half after 40 and not barbell back squat and still have a great physique and be strong in all those things. But I tell you right now, he certainly didn't get there. not heavy lifting. That's right. So you've worked your way up to that. So you got to be, so there's nuanced to a statement like that. And so instead of us just hammering it one way saying I disagree, it's like, well,

I can make the case for why that guy would say that or why I would say that. But I wouldn't just say general advice like that to people who are, because somebody who is 39, 40 and they're just getting into a barbell lifting and they see a clip like that and they're like, oh, shoot, you know, should I not put any more weight on the bar? because, or should I stop doing this barbell back squatting, even though I'm getting stronger and it's feeling right? It feels, it's like, no, it's like, that's, keep going. But yeah, if you put on that much muscle and you're, you're in your 40s and you're already lifting three, 400 plus pounds in these lifts, like, yeah, there's not a lot of reward anymore for you after 40 and that much muscle.

Next question is from Preacherman Joe. Do you have any crazy gym stories or experiences you witnessed working as a trainer? There's so many. Oh, my God. So many. So many. Which is like our old episodes. I didn't say what direction do you want to go.

So I have a few that pop up. So I can, I'll let me pick the first. So first one was the gnarliest, uh, injury I'd ever seen in my entire life. Was managing the 24 in Hillsdale. And there was a dude lifting. And, uh, he unracked one side of the incline without the other one. And so the barbell flipped. he blocked it with his forearm

and I've never seen this until then and since broke his arm and his bone was sticking out Oh Have you ever seen someone broken arm sticking out? I have one time I've seen a leg like that

I've never seen an arm Bro it was sticking out And it was yeah I was sticking out of his forearm Yeah And blood was going And we're like Call the Nambulets right away

Dude and like What do I do? I'll never forget that Because that was I'll give you my We can make a whole episode, obviously, of hours of this conversation because we've been in the industry for so long. Jims are entertaining. Yeah, I'll give you, I'll give you the last one I remember when I was still working in the gyms.

I don't know if I've actually told this story or told you guys a story. There was this heavy set lady. She was probably 300 plus pounds, at least, maybe like 350 plus. And she was on like some sort of crystal meth. or something crazy. Like super, super. So she was high in the gym. Very, very high in the gym.

And she was doing all kinds of weird movements in their size and talking out loud and everything like that. And I remember we had we had actually called the police because we were trying to get her to stop using the equipment the way she was doing it. We had the, we had the hammer straight chest press machine that was facing the mirror, which was like, if you can imagine, the mirror is only about, I don't know, four, three, three feet from the, from the machine. so you can see yourself.

Yeah. And she was holding the handles, and she was walking her feet up the mirror. While holding it. Yeah. Three hundred soap, walking her feet up the mirror while she's just doing weird stuff like that. And so the...

Meth is a hell of a dream. Yeah, cops. She's strong. Fire department showed up and was trying to get her to come over so they could kind of assess her. And she was, like, running away from them. And they're like trying to chase her through the gym. She runs into the wet area.

And then she jumps into the sauna. Oh, yeah. like trying to get her to come out. She starts taking all her clothes off. Oh my God. And then they're like, they're like, they're like standing around. No, none of them want to get wet and get in there. You know what I'm saying? And try and try and try and then when they step towards the, the spa, the jacuzzi as if they were going to get in her water. She would go underwater. And she was in the jacuzzi. Yeah, she was in the jacuzzi. Oh, did I say that's on? Yeah, I meant jacuzzi. And she'd get in the jacuzzi. And she'd get in the jacuzzi. So she'd dive underneath and hold her breath for a while. And then she popped back

going. And so, yeah, it took a really long time before these guys finally. How do you get someone like that out? I can't remember how they finally got her to. I think they finally just coerced her to come out and that they just needed, they just wanted to check on her and see if she's okay. Lifeguard. But she was obviously very, very high.

But the things that she was doing for her size, I was like, whoa. Yeah. So I don't know what kind of drug that she, I never found out. I was on, I was your things about PCP.

Yeah. She was on something that was unique that I had never seen before. And I'd seen people on Crystal Meth. I said it's Crystal Meth, but it was something probably like PCV because the stuff that she was doing was like, whoa, I can't believe she's doing that. You're like, this is not human.

Yeah. And I remember when it was happening that we, you couldn't help but watch for a little bit. You know, when at first, you're like, oh, that's wild, yeah. It's like, that's not good. It's dangerous. And then when it got to the point,

what obviously the Koshka call, when she started walking up the mirror and suspending them herself like that, I was like, oh, God, we got to get this lady out of here. Like, and so, yeah. You know, you know this story. I mean, I was there when this happened and we all reviewed the footage of it later.

But I was actually walking on my way out. I just finished up training clients and all that. The shotgun guy? The shotgun guy. He comes in. Yeah, yeah. He comes in and I think he was wearing a coat and was like very, you know, angry looking looking up over.

Was he looking for his wife? He was looking for his wife. Oh, my God. Because she was supposedly there with either gym partner or another trainer. I don't remember which. But he was looking over and then he pulls his gun out. And that's when I was like opening the door. And I look back and I'm like, oh, God.

Like, like hustle out of there. And then just like, I'm out. I'll see you later. Tell me what happened. It's just like pointing it around. And then finally they convinced him to leave. I guess he called cops and everything. He was really calm.

I was in my office. And by the time I had seen him, he had already walked in. And he actually had the shotgun resting on his shoulder. and he was talking to my front desk girl. And I look up from my... What the fuck? There's a dude to the front desk with a shotgun over his shoulder.

And I see him talking to my... You're like, what do I do, wrestle it out? Actually, get shocked. Yeah, like, I mean, it would have been probably scarier or if he was, like, pointing it at someone or he looked already. He actually looked really calm,

but he was, like, asking for... So-and-so, he's, like, asking the front desk girl. And she's like, I can't just give you someone's personal information like that. And he was trying to get her to give up if she was... Dude, that's terrifying. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I didn't realize it was...

happened. And I came back and then we started watching the film in there. It was like, you could see. I just kind of looked at him like, oh, yeah. He eventually just walked out on his own. Like, we didn't have to throw him out or anything like that. I think we ended up telling him like, she's not here, dude. Sorry, she's not here. And we had it at the Sunnyvale location

before they redid it. This is Club 506, shout out. There was this big, he was probably in his 40s, so I'm like 20 at the time. Biker. It was like big biker dude. Big white dude. Braids. You know, like ponytail type of deal.

And he's walking around in the wet area. So back at the old Sunnyvale, you could see the pool from the front desk. There was like a window and you kind of look in there. And he was angry and threatening people. So he might have been, I don't know if he was on drugs. Didn't seem like it,

but he was like threatening people. So people came out. One of the things that sucks about being a manager in a gym is you got to deal with the stuff. So you can't just be like, call the manager. Like, oh crap, that's me. So he was like threatening people.

And members were coming out. Like, there's a guy in there who's like, threatening and he's aggressive and whatever. I'm like, oh man, I got to deal with this. So I look in the window and he's this big dude, big biker dude. So I'm like, oh, this sucks. So I walk in there and I'm like, let me assess it before I call the police. I'm like, hey, man, what's going on?

And he started kind of yelling at me. And I don't know where I came up with this idea. It's one of those most brilliant things ever done my head. This is right? He told me to step outside. Bro, my whole staff saw this. They just thought I was the smartest dude ever. So he's talking to me getting all like aggressive.

And I'm like, look, man. I said, do you want to step outside with me? Do you want to handle this outside? He's like, yeah, I do. I said, after you. So I do this. He walks out the front door and I lock it. And he turns around, he looks at me through the front door.

And he figures out I locked the door. And then I waved at him. And I called God, blow him a kiss. Yeah, dude. And my staff was like, that was the smartest thing ever. I was, thank God he walked out for it. We had another guy that was, went naked. So they co-ed dry sauna.

This was Salinas when I ran. The first club I ever ran. This is like week two. So this is like a great. introduction to be a manager. The people come out. I was like, there's a dude that's naked. So it's co-ed.

He's like, there's a guy that's just naked in there in the sauna. Yeah. So I'm like, oh, what do I do? I'm like, what do I do? So I walk over there. I look through the window and there's a dude just standing. No one's in there but him. And he's just standing there buck naked.

And I'm looking at him and I go to open the door and he starts to pee. Wow. He's just standing there while he's starting to pee. And so I was like, I just walked out, called the cop. Like, do what am I going to do? What am I going to do? I heard of this guy? little little Asian guy, the swimmer that I had to address that guy.

So I get a complaint for, like, to your point, the manager, right? This is the Speedo guy that was doing curls in front of the media? No, no, no, not that guy. Although that guy was, I remember that story, too. This guy, so I get, I get someone come up to me like, Adam, can you come talk to this guy? He's, he's about his attire. I said, his tire, what's wrong was tire? He's like, well, he's swimming in the, in the pool, and I don't think he's wearing appropriate attire.

And I'm like, so I'm like, what is? he wearing jeans or something like whatever so I come walking out there and he's at this point he's at the end of the pool and he's getting he's coming towards me you know he's got his he's got his cap on goggles he looks pretty legit to me and I kneel down I squat down to see him coming as he gets closer I start to notice and I can just see butt cheeks he's got a thong he's wearing a thong and an older guy you know what I'm sitting away from a pop up hey man I said hey can I can I talk to you for a second you got to them cheeks up yeah I said hey you know can I get you to maybe put on a different outfit or something like that.

I said some of the members would come up to me and complain about your swim attire. So he looked confused as if it was totally appropriate and okay. And so he was nice. It was a real easy handle. So it was just like. I'm so much faster in these, though. The things that people think are appropriate, you know?

I told you guys about the, sometimes you'll find like poop and the bathroom on the floor or something like that. Isn't that an uncommon thing in gyms? It's pretty gross. Yeah. But one time. Some people like waffles stomping. Stop.

I know. One time I was running the club and bad timing. It was bad timing because we're about to shut down, about to shut the books down. It's probably like 11, maybe 10.30. My porter had just left. So where the next porter is going to show up, I don't know, like an hour later. Okay? Because otherwise I remember comes out.

I was like, dude, somebody dropped me to poop in the shower. And I'm like, oh, because the porter left. I'm like, I got to deal with it. Dude, I'm the manager. So I took my sales guy who was about to go home. Like, you're not leaving, Chris. I need your help. So we'll be, so we go in there in the shower and there's just a poop next to the drain.

And I'm like, again, I'm a kid, dude, I'm like 20. So I'm like, what do I do? Like, how do I get like rid of this? Like, do I just like wall it off? I'm not going to wait. Grab this thing. So I had the brilliant 20-year-old Sal idea of I'm going to get the hose and blast it down the drain. Yes.

That's logical, right? You blast it out of the wall. So, Chris is steady over here. Oh, God. You bless it. Listen, listen. He's standing over there. And I just started spraying this thing down.

Like, you know, get it all down. And then I made a wall of cake, pours it to come clean it. And I look at Chris. I'm like, oh, man, I'm sorry, bro. You got speckles. A little bit. Get a little of schmutzry here.

Oh, bro. That's gross. I'm sorry, bro. You got speckles on me. I don't know if dad's. He was so bad. Oh, that's nasty. I don't know if that's grosser.

The guy I had to throw out of the jacuzzi for shaving. Yeah. Oh, yeah. He would rinse his raisins. Yeah, just someone, again, someone comes out to me. Adam, can you come talk? to this member, they're, they're shaving in the jacuzzi. And I'm like, they're shaving in the jacuzzi.

Didn't even make, they didn't even make logical sense to me. Like, what it? And I come when, and this guy's by himself in the jacuzzi. And he's rinsing his blade off as he's sitting in their hot tub. And shaving his beard. I'm just like, his hairs are floating. It's like, he's hygiene maximum. What?

The things that people would do and just think that it's okay and appropriate, like, what? Have you had to kick out, like, masturbators out of the shower? Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's a problem. Yeah. That's way more common than it should be. It's so, you know, what's-

Fortunately common. What sucks about it is, what do you do? How do you catch the person? So I've had reports, and then you go in there. It's always so many coming up to tell you about it. And you're like, and you can't do anything because what are you going to do? You got to catch him in the act type of deal. Yeah.

Well, I caught someone. I had a member tell me, and I'm like, oh, God, okay. So I walk in there and there's, and he obviously stopped, but he obviously just stopped because he was still aroused. Yeah. So I see him. He sees me. he turns around real quick.

So I'm like, so I'm talking to his back. I'm like, hey, when you're done showering, I need you come to the front desk and tackle me. Yeah, yeah. So then he comes up. He's like,

hey, what's up, man? I'm like, I knew you were doing the shower. What's so? You impressed? I wasn't doing anything. I'm like, you were doing something,

dude. I can tell you. I'm going to cancel your memory shift. So you can complain to the corporate office, bro. Oh, that was the worst. Oh, boy. I don't do that.

We got a lot of stories. Look, if you like the show, and I know you love it now, come check us out on Instagram. It's Mind Pump Media. We'll see you there. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy,

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