Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 483: Maintaining Muscle While Losing Fat, Go-To Travel Foods, Working Out Fasted & MORE

Episode Date: March 31, 2017

Kimera-Quah! In this episode of Quah, sponsored by Kimera Koffee (kimerakoffee.com, code "mindpump" for 10% off), Sal, Adam & Justin answer Pump Head questions about the advantages or disadvantages of working out fasted, whether it is harder to give up coffee, sugar or alcohol, best tips for losing fat while maintaining (or gaining) muscle mass and go to travel foods. Get our newest program, Kettlebells 4 Aesthetics (KB4A), which provides full expert workout programming to sculpt and shape your body using kettlebells. Only $7 at www.mindpumpmedia.com! Get MAPS Prime, MAPS Anywhere, MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance, MAPS Aesthetic, the Butt Builder Blueprint, the Sexy Athlete Mod AND KB4A (The MAPS Super Bundle) packaged together at a substantial DISCOUNT at www.mindpumpmedia.com. Make EVERY workout better with our newest program, MAPS Prime, the only pre-workout you need… it is now available at mindpumpmedia.com Have Sal, Adam & Justin personally train you via video instruction on our YouTube channel, Mind Pump TV. Be sure to Subscribe for updates. Please subscribe, rate and review this show! Each week our favorite reviewers are announced on the show and sent Mind Pump T-shirts! Have questions for Mind Pump? Each Monday on Instagram (@mindpumpradio) look for the QUAH post and input your question there. (Sal, Adam & Justin will answer as many questions as they can) The guys talk about being interviewed by other podcasts / Taking a backseat to the interviewee / Their place in the cube and on trips (1:35) Quah Question #1 - Is there an advantage to eat before working out? (15:33) Quah Question #2 - What's harder for the guys to give up...coffee, sugar or alcohol? (24:05) Quah Question #3 - Best tips to lose fat while maintaining muscle mass? (33:40) Quah Question #4 - What is the guys go to food(s) while traveling? (41:16) Related Links/Products Mentioned (Study mentioned by Sal from his Instagram) @mindpumpsal posted March 28th, 2017 (Study for Dr. Rhonda Patrick's website) Mind Pump 30 Days of Coaching Mind Pump TV (YouTube) People Mentioned: How to do Your 20's - The Travel, Life Hacking, Entrepreneurial and Freedom Loving Podcast by Travis Marziani Dr. Rhonda Patrick @foundmyfitness (Instagram) Dominic D'Agostino @DominicDAgosti2 (Instagram) Dr. Layne Norton @biolayne (Instagram)

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MindPumpMedia.com. You know it! If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind, hop, mind, hop, with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. Do you know what had me laughing for two hours the other day? Well, I was remembering the song that Justin sang at the beginning of the guys podcast.

Oh, I can't have a soul. I don't podcast. Oh, I can't. That was so. I don't. I don't. I can't wait for it to air because I was telling Katrina their day, right? I was like, I'm actually really excited to hear that episode. Actually, this is a great way to get the get the kid to to pressure him to release that song. We'll have all the fans on bar.

We'll have the fans bombard him. Like, bro, you need to step your game up. You're gonna get on this level We'll be posting that shit fast. We've done like four episodes since we fucking he's a great kid to he's got a podcast called I just say that because he's Italian. He's good looking You're so fucking biased. You don't think he's a good kid. He's a great great. He's a great kid I have a way to say how can you say that about him? What do you how do you know what I know? How do you know he doesn't kill you? Little kids and shit. You don't know that?

I'm pretty sure he doesn't do that. Well, you've only met him for a little, I'm pretty sure he doesn't either, but I mean, just come right out and say some, I think he's handsome. We can prove that. At least not. He's handsome, he's intelligent, he's a go-getter, right?

So based on those things, he seems like a good kid. But he's got a podcast called How to Do Your 20s, and he came here, he wanted to interview us, and we're like, sure, we'll be on your your podcast because we like people who are trying to grow their business He's a young guy, you know, he's a go-getter. So let's make sure come on up translation I like to hear myself talk. Yeah, exactly so we got a humble attitude about it, which I really appreciate so he comes in and That's rare and he shares he shares He's making a product and it's made out of like Macadamia nuts and other stuff

It's like a nut butter and that's what it's called something up So we can't remember the song now by the way it's delicious by the way it's delicious So we bring it and we're trying like wow, this is really fucking good. Yeah, so he just goes right into a commercial Well, so here's the thing like I had to I was compelled. I don't think people realize like when we when we do podcasts We just go and there's no prep, we just roll it. He's waiting for like, we're gonna start. So right away, Justin,

start singing a song about this nut butter. Yeah, but it's the most inappropriate song I've ever heard of my cell phone. Totally in left field. Like his girlfriend was in here and everything. I hope he plays it, dude. I hope he plays it. If you just wait for it,

find this podcast and how to do your 20s and pressure him to release the song Poor guy, you what are you saying wants to if he wants it's fine. I'll be will get a copy Don't even don't even try remember it was something It was lines and it was better because it was off the cuff and then we just went right into the part I thought was comical was we must have talked for five minutes before we let him introduce his own show Oh, I know If you ever hit people on here That are so cool your show there's such assholes that take over your interview right that was literally what was going on that whole time

We don't shut the fuck up. Yeah, well that was an example for sure right into a hornet's nest But I'm I'm excited to I'm excited to actually see, because that's the first time I think, well, unless not true, because we did that with Ben. But it was different with Ben, right? There was a different vibe. No, Ben, think about all of our interviews that we've done, right? We've done Ben's interview to us,

we Kyle's interview to us. I was interviewed by myself on Spotify. We had Bren and Shepati, you know. You interviewed us. Yeah, I'm talking to all the ones that we've done together, right? And that one was a different feel than all of them. Yeah. Why?

Well, I thought we dove into something. We dove into a little bit of everything. Well, first of all, I don't think we were sober, but number two, we were on our left, but it's maybe it's true or maybe it's not. Maybe. It was an hour's not. It was an hour studio, that was the second thing. And number three, we used to get messed up when there was another person, like we're not good

at sharing each other, you know what I mean? And, yeah, it is. And, but now we're really good with our chemistry when there's another person in the mix now. So now we're cool. So he came in and we just we just went and it was a good time There was we had a great time, but we didn't stop me and I think we might have talked too much. Yeah Well, that's what I'm interested to hear that because that's what Katrina what happened She was she asked that she's like do you guys talk too much? You know you get ramble like right? She was giving that

I'm like, yeah, that did Katrina And I said we don't ramble. I don't think I said, Sal does that a lot, but I don't really. I didn't catch off because I'm tired of hearing you. You know what's funny? That's my job. You know what's funny? I'm aware enough to know that I have a tendency to, like, I want to do that, but I'm not aware enough to know

if I do it more than add on. I'm serious. No, that's why. Because to me, like, I think you might beat me, but I don't know. I wonder who's the more who's well I think more of the rambler Justin's probably has the best perspective since he sits across from the room trying to get a word in Yeah, it's I'm saying. I mean I just like to who rambles more. I can't do that. He's too political

Yeah, I don't think he's gonna say like cuz I had something to do with this paycheck now I don't think you would see I'm Jesus a fucking wants right now. I mean there's elements there for both you guys Oh, don't be get on a rant and I'll be PC cuz who's harder to get a word in Depends on the topic. Yeah, okay. Yeah, because if it's well Yeah, exactly. Oh, okay. Yeah, because if it's, well, this is interesting because it depends. A lot of times I know if I interject and if I have a thought

and I wanna kind of boom, get my opinion out there and have to do it forcefully, because that's just a survival mechanism I've acquired over two years. I just like, this is what I have to do now. I spear head my way in this conversation. But like, there's a lot of times I don't wanna do that because there's times where Sal, like he's on this,

you see this like momentum building. Like when he's getting on to, he's striking a nerve. He's kind of finding his voice within his train of thought or like kind of going down this entire train of thought. And it's like, I get kind of sucked into it, you know, if it's really engaging. And so I don't wanna fuck that up. And so I'll pull back and then the Keakin Ramble,

but sometimes it's important that he rambles. But if it's not important, it's something I'm not interested in, then I'll fuck it up, right? Same thing with you. Like, you know, it's like a wrench. Yeah, it's like, you know, I can listen, you know, sometimes like personal experience and these's like, you know, I can listen, you know, sometimes like personal experience in these stories and, you know, like I have stories

where I can't even tell the whole damn story. You know, that's my problem, but, you know, Adam is a professional telling stories. Like I'll tell you what, like you got like just endless supply of stories. And so I have to like kind of cut through the fat of it and be like, okay, no, this is a great story. And so I let you like keep going and going and going.

So really what you should pay attention to is when I come in. Yeah. Because that's what tells you if you're rambling. Well, I kind of, I think I kind of do. I think we do, I've gotten better about when you do interject of stopping. I might be, even when I'm in, I have a train of thought I'm going somewhere. You guys have gotten a lot better that by the way, which is thank you. Yeah, I feel like you know what I noticed now because when we have a guest Adam sits right next to me Right. Yeah, so by the way, just you know that's a that's not fair that I have to be the one at all of us

It gets pretty nice. That's why you guys are a little closer than no I feel that I don't like distance for you You fuck maybe have your own seats, but I'm okay with two years. I'm the guy Let's okay back up to when we first got the studio and we're talking about, I'm the one, I'm the one, I'm the one, who wanted like a, his own custom chair, my rhinestone mic, like I'm like, this is mine, he's mine.

You don't want to, that is enough to, I guess, right away, and then I'm the one who has to give his fucking chair up. I'll tell you what, next time we travel somewhere and if you give one of us the master bedroom, don't give you a special. Then you get to sit in your fucking chair. Oh, well, there's.

All right, motherfucker. There's a reason. There's a reason for that. There's a reason for that. Let's talk about that. There's like this unwritten rule. Let's talk about it. That Adam gets the fucking.

Yeah, see why I give him that one, because he sets it up. Thank you. Yeah, there's a unsaid behind the structure of like, we're staying at this house, so I'm like, okay, you get the master bedroom. This is, there's an uns He's behind the structure of like, this is not a mind at this house, so I'm like, okay, you get the mastermind. This is, there's an unsaid rule that goes on in like, when it comes to book, and I've been this friend, right,

where we book trips, and I've been with friends that have way more money than me and can book better trips in places for the me, and I've been with friends that are the complete opposite of that. And none of that matters on who gets the mastermind, what matters is the mother fucker who took the responsibility to get the place book the place pay for the place whatever maybe even if it's coming from the same pot right so it's coming from our money so it's not really like I'm paying for it you guys are paying for

it yeah we evenly pay for it but I did the legwork to make sure that it happened so if you did that I would automatically submit that right away 100% you wouldn't have to say a word if I knew that I think a trip was handled and booked and I didn't have to do it, I would just assume I wrote. I believe it was the second best room, right away. So I got in there and there's a second best room. Where's the second? Yeah, where's the second best room?

I'm going to because I know Sal took care of all these arrangements. He's getting the master back. Throw the backpack on it. You guys don't want me to book the room. Well, exactly, right? So yeah, you're terrible. But it's kind of funny. I love that.

I don't care. Nobody cares. Well, no one does. We never had that in that conversation. nobody gives a sure that's one thing. I'll say this great I'll say this thing right now as big as our egos are we're all cool with someone having a bigger ego at some point You know I'm saying yeah, like it's all good like you I mean it's not I'm not making a dig like nobody cares You have your you have the the master bedroom with the you know the big TV and stuff all the time There's nothing wrong. There's nothing wrong., I love that you called him out on that. I will say this though,

Adam, because you sit next to me when we have a guest, you have to move chairs, you sit right next to me, and then there's this funny, this thing that happens sometimes where he sits forward, so I can't see the guest, so then I move forward,

then he moves forward, but we're in the back. Before you know it, we're sitting like this. I know that too, yeah. I hate this angle. I leaned in. This angle is awful because you have both the arms

and you have the mic that close in your side. So I don't get this eye, like the eye contact, that's important to me when I'm talking to somebody and I'm into a conversation, I gotta look you in the fucking eye. If I gotta look you through a fucking, yeah, that's what I feel like when we're doing it, I feel like I'm like looking through the screen

to see this guy, I don't do well with that. I don't like it at all. So I'm, you know what, I can't wait for us to finish that front room area so we can do some interviews out there. And I do wanna change the way this is set up because we do have a guest and we have more and more guests now. And that's not a fun place for me.

Why? Because it's just, it's not comfortable to interview from this. It's the best one for me though. I don't mind sitting next to you. I know I write and I talk shit about that that doesn't bother No, I like sitting here actually I think I have the best chair though for real of course you cuz I feel like I can look at Justin and then I can look and let's be on I can look back and like where I look is where the like I can make it look like so if I look over here

You're not getting my attention anymore. Well, you I could easily be like no, yeah You have assumed you have a suit this position in position in every place we've been from Doug's house to the other studio, and even when we eat dinner, you assume the head of the table. You know what, that's your mafia genetics. Okay, you're in the back. That's where, yeah, you have the head of the table, head of the room, that's okay, you can sit like that.

That's fine. As long as we're calling it all out. As long as we get the master bedroom and the fucking sunken town. Wow, I'm cool with that. Wow. I love this. This is fun.

Meanwhile, Justin doesn't give a fuck. No, I see. Now you guys realize I really sincerely don't give a fuck. No, 100% you're probably the easiest. Whoa, no, Doug, I think my outfit. Doug has had it. Doug has had to sleep. Doesn't make sense.

Sleep on a fucking toddler's bed before a woman feels. Oh my god, Doug is the most gangster doesn't give a fuck. Yeah, sleeping the kids room. I remember I'm a fucking book. I remember when Breonna first started booking the rooms in the first two rooms that she booked. You know, she you go off of when you first are going to the VRBL you look at it and it says like oh it sleeps eight so we only have four so we have no problem. Yeah, but that's that you know it's bullshit right. It's like it's a bunk bed. Yeah, and they count Queens as two so it's like oh then we get to the house and find out like oh shit Doug In the he's in the garage. Yeah, like this

He's been the biggest trooper when it comes to now of course now that's settled It's been like listen they have there has to be at least four-bed Legit beds and now five right so now that we have the crew with us. So it's just I That I do notice the yeah, and me we end up sharing a bathroom usually you always get your own bathroom Yeah, that's this part of mass bedroom. Yeah, yeah, and then usually we have to share a bathroom And you know one of these days I want you to share a bathroom with Justin just one time come on man one fucking time Is you have that I want you to share about that bad in the morning before in the morning. Oh in the morning It's well, that's my special time. It's why you calm down. Can I just tell you, bro? Well, the good news is I'm always the first one up.

Typically, I'm the first problem. I'm usually the first one to wake up. So I've learned now to go in there real quick. You gotta get it in before the sin. You don't want to go after just the ghost in there. You are the first one up. Doug and I are probably the latest up. I don't know who gets, he's the one I can talk to.

He doesn't go to bed, too, in the morning. Exactly. I'm up till two in the morning, too. I'm just not up with, oh no, we stay up all pretty late. I just wake up early and I'm ready to party. You are an early party. Have I woke up with love music? Yeah, that's right.

You did that in Sacramento, you fucking asshole. I did it. Hence why you're not in the room next to me. Yeah, you lost all of the really just the sleep near me. So can I just tell you that's like part of my signature. Like if I go out with a bunch of people and we're spending the night somewhere, I'm always, I typically in the one

that needs at least a amount of sleep, but when I wake up in the morning, I like to put loud music on and wake everybody up because I think it's like cleaning. Woo, hey guys, get outta here. But I did it once with you guys, and so I turned on the music hell out, nobody got out of the room, so it didn't really work.

So I'm like, this is not that fun. So I turned it down, and then when you fuckers woke up, I got the dirtiest looks from all of you cock suckers, and I was like, well, I'm not going to do that anymore. Doug, our body language said it all. Doug, bring this quaong, because I know these guys have kids to pick up from school. Wee-kaw! Wee-kaw! Today's Kaws being brought to you by Kine-Marikoffee. It's the only coffee that is infused with all natural neutropics for a cleaner, calmer, and more focused buzz without the crash.

Put the Kine-Marik at MindPumpMedia.com and input the discount code MindPumpa Checkout for 10% off. It's the motherfucking car. The English Landage. Queu-cwa. First up is Lindsay is back. Our poll. I'm glad she's back. Yeah, Lindsay is working out,

fasted and making good gains, but is there an advantage to eating before working out? This is, you know, a lot of people have been talking about mail time out. You want time out? So check this out. I just posted this. I'm gonna look it up right now. I just posted this on my Instagram page yesterday,

I think it was yesterday or two days ago. No, it was yesterday. A study was just published in the Journal of Translational Medicine that compared two groups of bodybuilders. So this is what's interesting about it. They took people who were trained, medicine that compared two groups of body builders. So this is what's interesting about it. They took people who were trained,

who had trained for at least five years. And one of the problems I have was studies that are done on things like protein intake and exercise or whatever. Neubis who never trained, of course, their body responds like crazy, right? It's difficult, right? But they picked 34 people with five years of experience,

they split them down the middle. One half, eight, frequently, every two or three hours, the other group limited their food intake to eight hours. So what they did was, is basically intermittent fasting. Like, they ate as much as they wanted or whatever, but they could only eat within this limited time frame. At the end of the study, what they found were, insignificant changes across the board except the group that ate within the eight of the study, what they found were insignificant changes across the board except

the group that ate within the eight-hour period, in other words, they gained the same amount of muscle, same amount of strength, everything was the same, except the group that ate within the eight-hour period got leaner, much leaner, statistically leaner, significantly leaner, than the other group, and the calories and macros were about the same. Now, the study is not perfect. It's a small group. It's 34 people.

It's self-reported. So, and that's the problem with human studies is that they don't lock them in a room and incount every single thing that they put in their mouth. But it is a study that is pointing the same direction of other studies, which is showing that intermittent fasting by itself, independent of calories, it results in fat loss. And this is another study that shows that you don't reduce your muscle mass or strength or performance. So here's what I tell people. I tell people like when it comes to things like meal timing, like it's down the list, right? way down like you know make sure your nails are clip before you were left like that

I mean do that first performance games. I mean I mean literally though like and here's here's though And the reason why I'm like that is because I was the opposite because I I believed all that stuff That I was being fed that like that was like the anabolic window and I needed to do all this stuff And it was like but yet I was missing on sleep. I was pumping my body full of all this shit. Like, you know, all this other stuff going on that I wasn't fixing all the big rocks. And I was so hung up on getting this optimal performance.

It's gonna build more muscle for my body because I was so fixated on that. In reality, like, it's so minuscule as far as what it does for you is in your ultimate goal. Whether it be burning fat and losing body fat or if it's so minuscule as far as what it does for you is in your ultimate goal, whether it be burning fat and losing body fat, or if it's building muscle, either way, it's your ultimate goal. I think if you're a competitor and athlete, you want to optimize it, it's a very specific event in that game. There's a process to that where you can time it be more sensitive to these nutrients that you're consuming.

So that way you're sort of fasted going in and then you eat at a time where it's like, boom, this is where you respond at your ultimate performance. But yeah, this is where I flipped people on their head, though, in the bodybuilding community was, I was the guy who didn't give a shit about that and still competed at the professional level.

And I did that to make a point that you don't have to eat like all structure like this. I would skip like, it was, for me, when I'm, when I'm bulking and I'm building, right? So if I'm building, I'm trying to eat in a caloric surplus. It used to, it was advantageous for me to eat four to six times. I'm a 220, 230 pound guy, training hard, moving a lot. That's a lot of calories if they do.

How many calories would you try to eat when you were gaining? Like 4500. So yeah, so you'd have to eat when you're gaining like 4500 so yeah So you'd have 4500 and 5,000 you're not gonna do that with two meals You're not and it's and it's ridiculous to think you're going to and even three meals is tough to get that many calories do the math on that That's a lot of you know a 1500 calorie meal every meal if you just do it three times. That's fucking a lot So I would eat four six times a day not because there was like this Advantage to it, other than getting those calories in, it was tough to get.

And then when I went to- It's easier in your stomach, it's better. And then when I switched to cutting for a show, I just, I started dropping meals off. And it wasn't like I was worried about like anything. And then- So rather than keeping the same number of meals, you just cut two of them out. Yeah, well, which is smarter. I would strategically do it.

I'd do like one. You know, I'd cut one out, run for a while like that, you know, and then I'd also be slightly increasing my movement. So if I was averaging 15,000 steps a week, which would be a pretty average week for me when I'm training, I would drop one meal, increase my steps by 2,000 steps a day, and that subtle increase in movement and that decrease of dropping the meal off, I would mean it would drop me a good for two weeks. I do that again. Now, you know, that all being said, there is some very interesting science that's coming

out. Dr. Rondra Patrick has talked about this in these mouse models where when they limit their eating to a time, like a feeding window of time, eight hour window. They actually build more muscle and strength and lose more body fat with the same fucking calories. Now, these are animal models, they're mouse models. Some human studies are showing that this may be the case. So in other words, fasting has benefits that, and we know that health benefits, okay.

So there's obvious health benefits, but there may be some performance benefits, fat loss, muscle gain benefits that are independent of the calories and macros. In other words, if all things being equal, all the important things being equal, like Adam saying, when you include, you know, time restricted eating, you seem to have some interesting advantages. Now, from the outside, personally, this makes perfect sense. Like, when you eat food, there is a process of things that your body goes through to digest

and assimilate this food. And it only makes sense to give, that it would be beneficial to give your body a break. You know what I'm saying? Like let your body not have- When we go through the process and then reintroduce it after you've at least been able to process the food and get it down at a certain level.

Well, eating itself is slightly inflammatory. There was another study that showed that super frequent eating where they had people eat eight meals a day with the same macros and same calories, was inflammatory, actually showed rises in inflammatory markers. So again, on your being anecdotal, this is one of these situations where I would,

that was another reason why I liked pushing to six meals, was because I would just start to let my body get adapted to this like frequency of meals, eating it, just enough in time for me to switch and go the total opposite. And I would totally see a huge difference. My body would respond right away because it was so used to getting fed

on this regular time and then I'd go the other direction and then I'd go back the other way. So I was constantly doing this to get my body to respond and I feel like if you're somebody who always eats it, like, say the goes like you're challenging your appetite, too, I mean, at that point, like when you're, I mean, you're getting used to this sort of a schedule, you're taking it away and it seems like you get a lot

of benefit from that, from a metabolism perspective, right? Like, that's challenging. That's what I mean, that's what I mean. That's what I would feel. And like I said, I know this is anecdotal because we're just talking about me and what I've experienced myself. But I've experienced this too with when I teach clients

and I would put them on the same type of regimen where I have you eating consistently just so you could learn about macros, learn about your food, you see all this stuff. Then I also teach you how to use that as a tool to take away from that and then see how your body responds, see how you feel, connect those dots. Like to me, that's the takeaway

because I think there's another side of this coin because we talk about all the benefits of fasting, right? Well, I also see this and we get this on our forum, I see this a lot, where people are like, oh, I love fasting and then now it becomes this every single day, they fast. And not to say that there's anything wrong with that, but I'm just saying you're probably not getting

the same benefits as the guy or girl who intermittently puts it in there and goes back and forth. Well, even besides that, you can fast too much. It can cause a stress response in the body, women in particular. If you're an adrenal fatigue, you probably don't want to be fasted for long periods of time.

So it's not great for everybody, but I think there are ways that people can incorporate some of the concepts and get some benefit from it. But the question is, is working out fasted in advantage or disadvantage? If you're doing a hardcore endurance event, you probably don't want to do it. If you're just lifting weights in the gym,

I don't think it makes a big difference. Yeah. Next question is from Shane Kelly. What's harder to give up? Coffee, sugar, or alcohol? You know what, if you throw cigarettes in there, you have all the fucking legal drugs that people use. I think it was directed towards us personally.

It was. What's harder for us to give up? But, not to go, I mean, this is kind of- The smoking bin hard for you? Well, no, yeah. This is kind of related. Like, it's just not to go, I mean, this is kind of... Smoky, Ben Hart for you. Well, no, yeah. This is all, this is kind of related. Like, if you, it's interesting, you know, I look, I've been looking at this more recently for myself because I have found that I've been consuming

too many stimulants for too long. I've been having too much coffee, too frequently. Now, coffee's very good for you. There's lots of health benefits, but that does contain caffeine and caffeine can be overdone. This is quite individual from one person to the next, but I found with myself I realized I was having too much caffeine and I needed to reduce it But it's funny when you look around

You see people like it's like these legal drugs that we use to augment You know our our reality or to push us to do things that our body may not want to do. I found myself drinking coffee to feel normal. Once I realized, wait a minute. That's a problem. Yeah, I'm not getting a benefit from coffee. I'm just making dependent on it at that point.

Then I said, okay, that's operating at that level. And I'm like, I'm cutting it down. I'm noticing the same thing with coffee. It's just like, there's definitely a point where you start to see like everything sort of levels off and you're not getting that same response like you initially got it's more just like, okay, I have to do this. I'm not super sluggish. Well, I'll walk around. Well, I realize with myself, like sugar and alcohol are not a big deal. I barely have sugar

and I never drink. So I don't care about those. Coffee had become such a regular staple of my morning that when I started thinking about, like, okay, I need to reduce it. I got this like visceral reaction to me like, no, yeah, I got to have my coffee in the morning. And then I said, wait a minute. Why am I reacting so strongly to just a fucking drink? Like I should be able to say, no, I'm not going to just a fucking drink? I should be able to say no, I'm not gonna have any more.

Coffee, and I would say it is definitely the strongest for me as well, because you know, you attach certain things to it. Like yeah, there are some health benefits, but you know, it can get away from you. And really like with coffee, it's like, I feel like I'm productive. And like I associate all these like really positive things with it

versus like sugar for me. Yeah, like flavor, but I've sort of trained myself out of like, I don't have like a response where I see something sugar and I'm like, yeah, like I'm stuff my face, you know, I don't have that. That was maybe when I was a kid, but the alcohol for me, like, I mean, I went through a period where it was like,

yeah, I wasn't like drinking all the time, but I was drinking enough to where I was like, why am I, I was doing that to release a lot of stress, and so I associated it with that, which became like, well, I was just like two drinks to kind of take the edge down, and I was depending on this to provide a sort of response. So I think, you know, that's where they can really start to get problematic. Yeah. I think when you get to the point where you become fearful of eliminating something,

because you're attached to it, that's when you need to disconnect from it. Because you are in a state of, you know, it's a lesser state of addiction. It's kind of, it is. It really is, you know, it might not be crazy addiction, but there's definitely a level of addiction there to where I think about the coffee and I think about cutting it out and it makes me freak out. Like, oh, wait a minute, I can't not have

fucking a little bit. And let me tell you something, can you overduke caffeine and coffee? You better fucking believe it. In fact, I would venture to say that people to drink it regularly daily, probably are at the point where they should probably reduce it. And I'll say this too, there's nothing more often,

uh, excuse me, awesome. Coming off and going right back on. Oh my God, coffee's great when you go off of it for a while and then you drink it. Hello, old man. You're all fucking fire. I put this together. God, I don't even remember.

I mean, one thing I will say with addiction, like, I've been surrounded by addiction since I was a kid. So I've had it in my family. I've seen it. I've seen it around friends and then in adulthood, I've seen it in like really close people to me. And all levels too, from cigarettes, to hard drugs, to marijuana, to coffee, to all these things

I've seen. And yeah, I said something like marijuana, even though it's not considered something that's addictive, but anything that I think that you identify with or attach yourself to or becomes habitual, right, where you can't break away from it, I don't give a fuck if it has chemical properties that are addictive or not, there's psychological properties that you've become like. Of course, so I've seen this firsthand a lot. And it's funny too, because I know, you know, this is something that, and I think we talked

about this in an episode before a little bit where we were kind of going back and forth and I was, and I remember I was challenging you that like, we're on different journeys, you know, you have your journey and you're going on, I have my journey, I'm going on. And I've, like, I've handled like addiction type demons and things like that when I was a kid and seeing it so much that I was so scared of it that now I have this. And I'm, I'm lucky for this. I feel like I'm blessed that I went through that because I'm, I'm very, like I reflect right away. Like if there's something that I'm enjoying, I have this ability to like right away like question it. Like, wow, I really like this, you know, like this

experience is awesome. And then I'm like, wow, this is awesome. Again away like question it. Like, wow, I really like this, you know, like this experience is awesome. And then I'm like, wow, this is awesome again. Like I catch myself doing that really early on. And I go like, ooh, be careful. This is something I can turn into a habit. And I intermittently cycle off all those things. Now, if I'm being completely honest, the hardest for me is actually sugar or artificial sweeteners.

But one, I could, that's not a surprise. I could have told you that. Well, I, I could, I could have told you that. Well, I, I, I had, out of all the ones that I, and, and I, and I do, I, like, right now, I'm, I'm off of that completely and, you know, I switched to iced tea and drink a ton of water, you'll notice I'm drinking way more water than I normally do, and that's like part of that helps me go through that process. So I'm still really good about being aware of it and catching myself like, well, it's a tough one to moderate right But can I it is you reintroduce it like in any sort of level it it becomes this like

Burning thing down your head. Well, let me say this diet coax will will will graph me harder than caffeine any I've done most Dr. I've done huh why? Because I enjoy the taste that is it just the taste that you're super in? Like, I'm asking why. Well, that I'm aware of, because I mean, we're still learning a lot about it to the addictive properties that could be attached to it. It's weird, right?

It's weird how one person will be, like, for me, it's coffee right now. Yeah, definitely coffee for sure. And it's not sugar at all. And then for you, it's like, well, so this is my, I'll tell you my theory on it. Okay, so growing up, I could have, we had fucking cereal for dinner. I had candy all the time.

Like I went through my teens and 20 always having sour patch, hot tamales, candy and like, I ate candy every single day. I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, side that I have attachment to it. I love sugar and the taste of sugar. I'm a carb fanatic, all those things. So I grew up my whole life. Now I'm adult, now I see all the things that it's caused and I have autoimmune issues. And now I've recognized that. So out of all of them, that one I probably have the hardest

time with or takes the most focus for me to do it and be like, no, you set yourself on a path that you're going to completely. Because I'm also this, I also believe in balance too. I actually love the Duet Diet Coke taste. I'd prefer it over a regular Coke, which is why you see me drink the green ones when I drink them, is that I like the cane sugar, but then I like the fact that it's got stevia,

so it's not as like a regular Coke is way too sweet for me. Oh, I see. And then a Diet Coke is that the level of sweetness in it is just right for me. And so I can get caught up in like allowing myself that in the diet a lot, especially when I got in competing. And I became really clean about everything else and measuring.

And then there was no, I was very strict about my macros and calories. So that was like my one thing that I could have. A diet coke was like, oh, so I connected that to, you know, this sweet relief from this. And so that is the hardest. So you think if diet coke was known to reduce muscle gains, do you think you would have ever been as addicted to it

or as connected to it? Absolutely, because I- You still would have. Yes, because I was already, you gotta remember, I didn't start really training and even caring about that until I was 19, 20 years old. By that time, I was already... You were already on it.

I'm already a mess, yeah, I'm already, and at that time, yeah, you could, if you, I mean, obviously if it was like, if you told me like, yeah, for every bite of ice cream you have, you lose one pound of muscle, I mean, if there was numbers like that came out, I would be like, fuck this shit. I was like, I'm like, I'm in a tub. Yeah, I don't care. The there was numbers like that came out, I would be like, fuck this shit. I was like, I'm gonna tub.

Yeah, I don't care. The reason why I'm asking is because both you and I, you know, we wanted to gain weight and gain muscle all the time. Yeah. And so for me, like, I didn't have an issue with sugar, but I definitely didn't avoid it because I'm like, fuck it, it's extra calories.

It's a game weight anyway. That's where we're similar, right? You and I have various, we definitely have a lot of similarities with our insecurities and I think we both connect there. But then there's definitely, we have different paths on that we went and you probably weren't around as much addiction and abuse and stuff that I was around growing up. So that also gave me a different perspective

on all these things that, and I think candy and sugar and things like that, that was never demonized. Like, you know, coke and drugs. Those were all bad, like, so I knew that and then I knew that addiction part of it, but no one ever really like told me as a kid growing up that like, you know, this sugar thing could really hedge you down the wrong path

if you don't pay attention to this now. So that's why I think that's probably the hardest. Israel Grenados, best tips for losing fat while maintaining muscle mass. This, a lot of people have challenged with this, which is watch out for intensity. This question keeps coming up too. It's probably like the third time,

but it's, because it's such like a, a sought after thing. It is because I think guys bulk up and gain a lot of weight. And then they go to cut. And so then they go in these long periods of calorie deficit and lots of cardio. And then they find that they lose lots of weight and then they go to cut. And so then they go in these long periods of calorie deficit and lots of cardio and then they find that they lose lots of muscle and strength when they do this. So, here's a few clear easy tips just for my end.

Number one, don't go into these excessively long, crazy, bulking and cutting periods. So instead of going like three months or four months of bulking and like three months or four months of bulking, and then three months of cutting, where you're gaining lots of... That's just an excuse to feed your addiction. Oh, big time.

Like, you don't wanna just own it. Just own it. If you do it, own it. That's all I say. I'm not gonna tell you don't do that. I'm gonna tell you if you're gonna do that, own it. You're fucking just feeding that, dude. Of course, but if you really focus

on building muscle and staying lean, there is a benefit to bulking in the sense that there is an anabolic benefit, but it doesn't last very long. So you can bulk, but do it for a short period of time and then cut for a short period of time and you'll find that you'll hold onto more muscle. Now you're not gonna get these dramatic weight shifts, so I'm not gonna like gain 20 pounds in three months

doing it this way, but I'm gonna gain lean body man. So more gradual increases and decreases the better, they are going to approach it with that mentality. Yeah, and let's keep that in mind. And it's longer though. Yeah, and this is where, and I love the type to talk about the psychology side of this, right? This is where people really fucking battle right here

is because your goal, right, is to build size, and literally it was talking to a pro body builder yesterday, good friend of mine. I've been training for years and years and years. And he's telling me that he's talking about this new coach that he's with right now, the nutrition plan that they have a meeting, he's like, take breaking it down to me so I'm like,

okay, okay, I get what he's doing, okay, yeah, yeah. And like his perception is like, he went up eight pounds on the scale. So this guy is like really helping, I'm like, whoa dude, like, for as long as you've been in this, like you still, you're connecting like a good plan and a diet just because you saw your scale go up eight pounds, like are you fucking kidding me?

Like your macro flip, you just went from going 300 grams, I mean no grams of carbohydrates to like 350 grams of carbohydrates and like you're probably 30 more. Yeah, your sodium, your carbs just went up, you're probably thirsty more like of duh. You know what I'm saying? Like you didn't just build, you didn't just switch you up and put your carbs just went up, you're probably thirsty more like, of duh, you know what I'm saying? Like you didn't just build, you didn't just switch you up and put your five pounds of muscle on you, but like that's, people's perception of that and they're connected to the scale.

So I'm differentiated. Yeah, so if you're not seeing like, okay, I'm on this maps plan and they tell me I'm gonna build the most muscle doing that. But then three weeks goes by and you've only seen the scale go up a half a pound, but your boy, he's running a bunch of burgers man I get jack he's running that one program and he's got like he's put 12 pounds on this last week But like the people don't even pizza and ham yes and people don't Don't and they and he and if you're somebody like us who wanted to be bigger that guy's filling his shirt out He looks for I used to watch the scale Religiously in fact I used to watch and these these are the games I used to play with myself.

I wouldn't weigh myself until after I ate a big breakfast. That was number one. And number two, before I took a shit, and I'm not even joking, I would weigh myself when I knew I was heaviest. That's the mind fuck you play with yourself when it comes to the scale. I would eat every night until I saw a higher number on the scale before I went to bed. So I used to go like, I'm on gain right now, right? And this is so hard for me to put size on. So before I go to bed, I've never seen 227. So I pushed to, I'm 228, yeah. Then tomorrow I was like, okay, 227.2.

I'm gonna eat till I see that. I used to do shit like that, connect to that. No, it's not effective. If you bulk up for long periods of time and cut for long periods of time, you're just gonna gain lots of body fat when you bulk and you're going to lose muscle. Counterproductive.

Here's the second thing you should do. Train properly. This is probably the most important thing because the most overlooked. It most overlooked because if you train properly, if you have good exercise programming with proper frequency because body parts blitz don't hit this nearly as well as full body retains do.

But if you send the right signal, your body will want to hold on to muscle. In fact, we've had countless messages from people who did maps and a ball at the red program, which is the one that people usually start with, right? I've had countless messages from people who they message me, hey, should I, is it okay if I start cutting while I do this? And I'll say, yeah, no problem. It's gonna be a good routine. It sends a good muscle-building signal.

And they'll not only lose body fat, but they'll gain muscle at the same time, which is something that is supposed to be impossible, which I've seen happen many times. So I know it's bullshit. If you send the right signal, your body will maintain or build muscle while burning body fat.

And if you combine it with shorter periods of cutting and bulking, I mean, now you're in... So I have to add one more piece that I think has been a game changer for almost anybody that I've taught this to is that the way our body utilizes fat as fuel, people don't really have this, have this, like they don't totally fully grasp this. And it's kind of, it's very complex and trying to keep it as simple as possible to understand. This is how I explain

it to people. It's like, we, and I, you've heard me say it on the show many, many times that I'm always trying to do as little as possible to listen to the inviable dose. Right. And so when you decide you're going to make this shift, I'm going to start cutting weight, right? I'm going to start dropping body fat. People always go from one extreme to the other extreme. And that is so not advantageous to your goal. Like what you want to do is just make us, like if you were somebody who was eating all these crazy calories and doing all this stuff and you weren't really training consistently and then you said, hey, I'm going to lose some body fat.

I'm going to cut the other way. Like literally just change a couple things. Just change a couple things and take a walk to start off with. Take them one thing at a time too. Like if it's just the training piece of it's just the trick like you have to like when you just bombard your body with all this new stimulus at once,

how are you gonna understand, you know where your sweet spot is with all these things? 100% and over applied intensity is the number one thing I see with people failing when they're trying to do a goal like this is they Want to lose it and they think that the harder they work the closer and faster They're going to get to this goal and that it couldn't be further from the truth because our bodies don't work that way And if you're in a caloric deficit, which you will need to be if you're going to be burning fat and you're going to be losing weight that's what you will need to be if you're going to be burning fat and you're going to be losing weight. Then you're also at a place right now where your body is like just officially burning fat.

And then if you start to push it really hard while you're in a deficit like that, that's when shit goes like, oh shit, what's going on here? And that's where your body starts freaking out and going like, oh, it starts to be a conserve energy because it's not sure how much more you're going to push it the next day. Oh yeah, you want to get into metabolic damage in a hurry. Just cut your calories, dramatically, keep them down for a long period of time and work out in a hammer yourself.

And then you're gonna get metabolic damage. Well, I think that's the extreme analogy, right? So I know someone's listening, they go like, well that's not me, I don't get crazy, but okay, you may not get crazy like that to create metabolic damage, but on what side of the spectrum are you? Are you way closer to that side? Are you way closer to the guy that barely does

Anything different you're better off being the guy who barely does something different every week barely a little bit more Barely a little bit harder barely a little bit more, you know that guy or girl is gonna see way more than the guy or girl Who's flirting with the beast mode no days off all out, you know go big or go Oh, it's a step. It's a step ladder. Take one, you move up one step at a time and that's how the body progresses. It doesn't progress by jumping off a cliff and landing where you wanna be.

That's how you cause problems. Well, aha, what are your go food? Go two foods. Yeah, what are your go-to foods when traveling? As far as proteins, fats, and carbs are concerned? Did we talk about this with Dom? Did we get, I think we got in this with, maybe in this little bit, and this is where,

this is where I use intermittent fasting a lot. Yeah, I mean, my go to food is no food. Well, I mean, I think it's a great question because I think it's a challenge that I used to have for a very long time was, especially being guys and need a build a build muscle. And if I don't feed my muscles, I'm gonna lose my muscles.

So that mentality, I'm always concerned, like, well, how do I get the optimal fuel when I'm flying and I'm traveling, I'm in a town. Well, how about I don't eat? How about I use that? How about I use this as there? Well, yeah, well, how about since, you know, I'm flying on a plane for four hours,

sitting in an airport for another hour, traveling over here, how about I just decide, I just decide like wait until you get good? Yeah, this is a good day for me to apply some intermittent fasting Well, why why fight it? Well, let's say you are you're ready to eat now like what are some good? You know easy foods you can find aside from having to go to a restaurant and telling them to prepare You know your particular meal like like for me, I went on a long road trip. When do we all go to Washington the first time? It was a while ago, in August maybe.

I, here's what I did. I stopped at grocery stores and I bought for proteins and fats I'd buy cannasardines or tuna fish or they have the salad bars with olives and nuts. I'd have fruit. I mean, there's a lot of things you can eat that are really convenient, that you can find in almost any grocery store.

Jerky. That are also very healthy. Healthy, excuse me, jerky is another good one, although not all jerky is good. Well, not all are very equal. Yeah, nuts are great. My macadamia nuts, I'll just buy some of those and just smash on some of those or some seeds.

Nut butters are pretty good. Just as convenient as fast food restaurants are, so are grocery stores. You walk into a grocery store, you can see almost anything. No. I feel like if that is too much effort, if it's too much effort for you to go into a grocery store, too much effort for you to go to a restaurant. Then you are, just better off fasting. That's how I feel. I feel like, you know, in this, like, oh, I need to go through here, like, to go through

the drive-through because back in the day, I used to think that that was going to lose muscle. But once I got rid of that insecurity, once I broke through that way of thinking, to me, it's way easier. I just, to me, I think I'm, I'm, we're huge fans of, you know, intermittent fasting, but I'm also a huge fan of doing it unstructured. Like, I don't think that it needs to be like this forced thing into your routine.

It's like, Darryl, become a time, and everybody, everyone who's listening to me right now, there's gonna become a time in the next week when actually getting to food is inconvenient. How about you don't fight it? How about you allow that? Because you because you know what we we fucking evolved for Thousands of years this way where it wasn't convenient to eat all the time So you know, why don't you just roll with a bunches and yeah, I usually like, I'm trying to include more water throughout

the day because I feel like I haven't been drinking enough water and I feel like it's affecting the way that I think in my energy levels, all the stuff. I start focusing on that a lot of times, that just turns into an intermittent fasting day. Right. Just because of the fact that that's my focus and it feels like a lot of times when I'm hungry, it's that I'm also, I'm like, to hydrate it, you know, and so that that shapes me to a certain degree. But yeah, I mean, I'm with you on the traveling aspect that makes things a lot more convenient.

Well, it's challenging. It's a challenge. Like, you do have to really plan your way around like getting quality nutrients and stuff, especially on the road. Well, how many times have you to client who comes in and tells you what they ate and it was horrible and you say, well, why did you eat like that?

Well, I was in a meeting all day and this was the only food that they brought to the meeting. Right, yeah. And so, exactly. And like, don't eat. Yeah, just fast. And to me, I don't know. There's so many things that it opens your eyes about yourself when you start paying

Attention to that like do I why am I struggling so much not to eat the donut? You know like why am I having such a hard time not eating that sandwich that like you that gets provided for free Like why do I attach myself so much to food that I feel like I'm gonna die or lose muscle and I feel like the people That I have to speak to the most right here are are the bodybuilding or the super muscle building driven people is like intermittent fasting. I mean, even heard Lane Norton say, like, oh, I'd never do that. Like, why?

That's silly to say that. Like, why would you never do that? There's all kinds of studies that show health benefits behind it. There's tons of time. And if you don't fully agree with it, but you understand that there are potential health benefits for it, why would you not even pursue it at all?

Especially when it fucking actually happens in your life all the fucking time It's easier. It's actually easier. It's proof to me that it does in fact, you know like going through like an intermittent style Fasted protocol that you actually lose muscle prove it. Yeah, no, you doing that right and then you can know what the benefits For the guys that really want to build muscle like I love Shattering paradigms like this with a guy who's like, so he's really day, you know, got to have a caloric surplus all the time and go, Hey, this is what we're new, bro. We're in a fast, you know, we're, you're not going to eat. I'm going to put you on a

deficit for a little bit. And then I'm going to refeed you and then talk to me about how you feel you look in your performances. That's it. Go fucking do that. Coach, and then come back and tell me, when you look at yourself in the mirror, when you get on the scale, when you lift your weights, are you weaker? Do you look like you lost a bunch of muscle or do you feel fucking awesome, but you have to break through that first.

I can't remember the first time I worked out, fasted, and I had a little bit of caffeine. Holy shit, man. Crazy. Oh, dude, I was on fire when I worked out like that. I had the same experience, yeah. I mean, for me, certainly literally my go to foods in traveling. Sorry, I know, for me, literally my go to foods and traveling,

I know you guys hate sardines, but sardines, macadamia nuts, avocados, and fruit. Like those are my life. Avocados are great. Those are like my staple, super easy, grab them at the grocery store, eat them in the parking lot,

throw them away in the garbage, and I'm done. Hey listen, go to mindpumpmedia.com. We got something special for you. You'll like it. 30 days of coaching for how much? Oh, is it five million? No, it's free. It's not five million dollars, Justin. It's actually free. It's five cents of free dollars. It's free. First number. Mine pumpmedia.com. Also, MPTV, mine pump TV on YouTube. There's a new video every single day. Just every damn day. We just hit

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