Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 881: P90X & Beachbody Review, the Truth About Designer Steroids & Prohormones, the Importance of Exercise Order & MORE

Episode Date: October 17, 2018

Organifi Quah! iTunes & Facebook Review Winners! In this episode of Quah, sponsored by Organifi (organifi.com/mindpump, code "mindpump" for 20% off), Sal, Adam & Justin answer Pump Head questions about their opinion on P90x and Beachbody programs, the importance of exercise order in MAPS programs, the truth about designer steroids and prohormones and how much they think the human psyche affects weight loss. Being a good father and going deep about suicide. (5:54) The lessons you learn by teaching rather than just learning. (8:35) Shout out to “Dynamic” Danny Matranga. (12:00) The value of being an effective communicator. (14:25) Sal testing his ever raging testosterone levels using Everly Well & the importance of getting your levels checked. (17:35) Organifi updates. (28:35) Adam the professional faller & the shit that guys do. (29:45) The Mysterious Fall of Shredz and Joey Swoll’s new partnership with Conor McGregor. (36:44) The grueling, yet satisfying nature of manual labor. (42:34) Sugar Shock: Do you know how much sugar your children are consuming? (44:47) The recipe for disaster and social pressures of behaviors learned from childhood. (46:58) #Quah question #1 – What is your opinion on P90x and Beachbody programs? (57:35) #Quah question #2 - How important is the exercise order in MAPS programs? (1:15:33) #Quah question #3 – Can you talk about designer steroids and prohormones? (1:23:53) #Quah question #4 - How much does the human psyche affect weight loss? (1:33:54) People Mentioned: Larry Hagner (@thedadedge)  Instagram Daniel Matranga | CSCS | BSc. (@dynamic.danny)  Instagram Stan "Rhino" Efferding (@stanefferding)  Instagram Dr. Stephen Cabral (@stephencabral)  Instagram Joey Swoll (@joeyswoll)  Instagram Conor McGregor Official (@thenotoriousmma)  Instagram Mike Matthews (@muscleforlifefitness)  Instagram Ben Pakulski ® | Official (@bpakfitness)  Instagram Dr. Jordan Shallow D.C (@the_muscle_doc)  Instagram Links/Products Mentioned: Everly Well **Code “mindpump” for 15% off any test** Organifi **Code “mindpump” for 20% off** Leave a Review and win a FREE T-SHIRT! October Promotion: MAPS Aesthetic ½ off!! **Code “BLACK50” at checkout** The Good Dad Project: When a Father Commits Suicide Mind Pump Episode 865: Stan Efferding: The World's Strongest Bodybuilder Mind Pump Episode 875: Stephen Cabral The Notorious Conor McGregor joins Ryse Supplements Sugar Shock Vertical Meals PRx Performance **Code “mindpump” 5% off plus free MAPS Prime on orders of $500 or more** Joovv MAPS Fitness Products Mind Pump Free Resources Mike Matthews: Muscle for Life Coaching Ben Pakulski Programs Jordan Shallow Online Coaching

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, with your hosts. Salta Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. In this episode... The... The Soda. The Mind Pump. Let's call it Soda. For the first 53 minutes, we have our introductory conversation. First, we talk about Adam's interview on the dad edge podcast. That one went really, really deep.

Apparently. Yeah, since we actually just did this podcast, my phone's been blowing up. You asked at the beginning of this podcast if I had heard anything yet and it had just gone live. And so I'm actually already starting to get a ton of messages. So it sounds like a lot of people, it served a lot of people, not just people that have dealt with suicide, but just with their relationship, even with their parents and stuff like that. So good episode.

Good episode. Nice. Then we talked about the value of talking and teaching for growth. We know a lot about talking. Then we talked about my ever rising testosterone levels. Yeah. You're getting higher.

You're raging. And the value of regular hormone testing, now we are sponsored by Everly Well, they do have hormone tests that you can do at home. You don't need a prescription, yet, ordered online comes to your house. Very easy to do. The testosterone level test that I did

was saliva tested, free testosterone. If you go to EverlyWell.com and use the code MindPump, you'll get 15% off any test. I also talked about my new love for stand effortings, vertical meals. I've been, you know, that monster mash. Yeah, that order like, he's got, he's got me and Sal on him. I'm eating them all the time, they're really good.

We are affiliated with vertical meals. If you go to MindPumpMedia.com, ForthslashVertical, you can check out some of those vertical meals. And then we talked about Organify in particular Doug spitting out his green juice. I don't remember what happened. Sorry, Doug.

That was something Justin said that made him laugh. But it was laughing, so we just sprayed it all over his computer. But Organify does make organic supplements. They are one of our other sponsors. If you go to organifi.com, forward slash mine pump, use the code mine pump, you'll get 20% off your entire order.

Then we talk about Adam's great fall. Another one of those falls, huh? Was it in slow motion? Was it slow again? It felt like it. For sure, because I'm holding on to the TV. You're a slow follower. Then we talk about the new supplement company

that Conor McGregor apparently is one. Conor. Why? And partnering with Joey Swoll, the, some people refer to him as the intellectual of the supplement. Absolutely. Absolutely.

Absolutely. Then we talk about Justin's blisters on his hands. He did a little bit of manual work. You guys are speculating it's something else. Yeah, it's true. Justin's blisters on his hands. He did a little bit of manual work. You guys are speculating it's something else. Yeah, it is true. It's not. We talked about sugar consumption and teaching kids how to make better food choices.

Then we get into the questions. Now the first question was, when is our opinion on programs like P90X and the other beach body programs, we got really honest. Yeah, in that part of this episode. Kind of went off. That's it.

This is a little suit box hour. Next question, this person wants to know, when going through a maps program or any other program because this applies to all of them, how important is it to do the exercises in the order that they're listed? Is that part of the programming or you just mix them up if your gym's busy and the squat back's not available

Can you go start with your curls and eventually move your way through how important is exercise order next question was This person wants to know more about designer steroids and pro hormones These are believe or not steroids that were available over the counter I think some are available now over the counter. They were the rejected ones. Are they safe, are they effective? Should you buy them or should you not? And the final question, how much do we think the human psyche affects weight loss? Like what percentage of a person's success has to do with their psyche? It starts in the mind. Also, I want to remind everybody, this month maps aesthetic. This is our bodybuilder

physique competitor and bikini competitor inspired program. It's really a program designed around maximizing aesthetics. What are aesthetics? Well, it's what makes it look good. Muscle definition. It had now. This is one of our programs that actually has a lot of flexibility. You get to pick and choose the areas of your body that you want to really, really focus on because, of course, some people might need more shoulder development, some people might need more back development, more glute development. So you get to determine what are ideal aesthetics for yourself, plug those into maps aesthetic,

and you've got yourself a great program. Well, that program is half off. 50% off all month long. Here's how you get it. Go to mapsblack.com and use the code black50 that's BLACK and the number 50 no space for 50% off. We also have other maps programs that you can look at. You can find all those at mapsfitinistproducts.com.

T-shirt time! And this T-shirt time. Oh, here it is. Bring them on. We had a ton of reviews on Facebook, again, outweighing iTunes by four to one. Good job, guys. So we'll start out with the iTunes winners.

We have Courtney B126, Robert Blackwell IV, G G Mac 4TJS. And on Facebook, we have Katie Inxter, Sandra Grumit or Grume, Darren Markhart, John Lankway, Savannah Valencia, Corey Adams, Nico Sidorakis. All of you are winners. So the name I just read to iTunes at mindpumpmedia.com, send your shirt size, your shipping address,

and we'll get that right out to you. I told Katrina last night that it looks like me with a child, people like that more than they like photos of her. With a child? She was, she's still been the record breaker for like, if I post any glimpses, if you see the right. Oh, I see everybody loses their mind Yeah, oh, they're she's alive. She's a real thing. Yeah, right. She's not your girlfriend from Canada. Yeah, my super model

The glamour shot you keeping your wallet. I like to keep her Bro, I like seeing you with the kid too. Oh, you know why though. Did you you know why? You like truth why very fast has nothing to do with you know wanting to see you fucking, you know why? Because I, why? It has nothing to do with, you know, wanting to see you fucking, you know, shuffling everybody, none of that stuff. You see, you want to see me suffer. No, I know. Yes.

I've known you now for over three and a half years, I think you'd make an exceptional father and there's not enough exceptional fathers in the world. So it would be, you would, whatever child chooses to be your, your child would be blessed. Well, speaking of, of, of fatherhood, I gotta give a shout out to Larry Hagner over at the Good Dad Project.

He just posted the very, very serious interview with me. It was literally titled, you know, the suicide, like it was all about my father's suicide. So those that are listening right now, it's a very heavy one. I don't recommend it for everybody. If you don't have somebody who is contemplating that or has, you've dealt with it in your life,

I wouldn't listen to it. But if you're somebody who has dealt with that or has contemplated it yourself, I think it was a pretty, have you got any messages? It literally just went up this one. Yeah, so we'll see. Was that hard?

You've processed it. Yeah, it's like Katrina always, you know what you? Is that hard? You've processed it. Yeah, Katrina always, you know what's funny? Katrina told me the day she's always like critiquing the fuck out of me. She listens to all the interviews. And she's like, I think we need to, we need to like condense your story.

And I'm like, yeah, I agree with you. I said, sometimes I feel like, and I don't know if it's the, the interviewers that are interviewing me that don't know where to take me, but I think I have such a, a big wide story that to try and tell it all,

I just kind of glaze over things. And she's like, you know, I hear almost every interview, somehow someone figures out or finds out the suicide thing and then they just kind of like go over it. And you're so non-chalant about how you talk about it, that it's like, that was, so I think you should almost not talk about it unless somebody who's wanting specifically to talk about it.

Yeah. So I'm trying to condense my story into just like my fitness journey and like pick it up at like 20 years old. You just gotta keep telling it. The more you tell it, the more- Refine, yeah. The more effective it'll be and the more- It's funny how that works, right? It is.

You know, talking is a form of thinking and a form of learning. So it's writing. And so this is why if you want a kid to really learn something, one of the most effective things you could do is have them teach it. Exactly. You have a child teach it. First off, it gives them a sense of purpose and responsibility because they're teaching other kids, but it also forces them to learn what they're talking about at greater depth. It's great that you just said that because this is exactly what I said to our said, you know, there's so many, so many more lessons that I learned from 20 on where when I got

into the real workforce and had to work with others that really taught me that. And it was a strength of mine later on. At that time, I selfishly was doing it because what I picked up on really quick was anytime I would learn something from somebody, if I would go and teach it to everybody else, like it would only make me better at whatever it was I was teaching. And so I was like that in fitness.

And in fitness, it's different. Like we're in a very competitive type of industry and space when you think about it. When you put a group of 15 to 20 trainers in one facility, it's like we're all fishing from the same pond. And to go tell the other guy what bait everybody is using or this is the best bait that everyone's catching is kind of like, it's kind of counterproductive you would think because it's like, oh god.

And so you have the natural way of doing it. It is the natural way. And so there's this very, there's a scarcity mindset within most you would think because it's like, oh, God, and so you have the natural way. It is the natural way. And so there's this very, there's a scarcity mindset within most, I think, gyms. I think you, you have the elite trainers aren't going and telling the bottom feeders, oh, like you should say this or you should do that or don't do this, don't do that. They're, they're mostly concerned and confining, refining their skills and being better and better at it.

But that, I wasn't like that. I was so naive and I was so humbled coming in that I was 20 years old. Everybody was older, everybody was smarter, everybody was more experienced. I fucking knew that. I wasn't trying to pretend like I wasn't. So I was eager to learn from everybody.

Everybody that I learned from, as soon as I learned a little bit of something that I was like, oh, that stuck or that worked. I then was teaching somebody else oh try I did this and so you're a share that really it really sharpened my own skills Yeah, I'm a big share sharpened my own skills and then it and it also made me this this in ended up making me this great leader because I wasn't afraid to do that I think more people in in our, if they understood that, I think they would see themselves accelerate much faster. If you have, this is why talking helps so much when you have a challenge or a problem.

How often, how many times have you talked to somebody and you have an issue or a challenge and they don't give you any advice, they're just listening to you. And at the end of it, you're like, I know what I need to do. Well, you're best therapist. That's what they do. Yeah. Exactly. They just ask the questions, you know, because taught what happens when you when we think

or when we feel things in our minds, sometimes it's not organized because it's surrounded by emotions and feelings. But when you write writing things down is also very effective. But when you're writing things out or you're talking about it, you have to organize your thoughts and you have to identify truly how you feel about certain thoughts. And so it allows you to move through the process of processing what is going on. And this is why teaching is so effective.

Well, and then the feedback, right? Even if it's just body language or like expressions, like I, I just pick up on that immediately. Like, people, I'm just like, look, I'm reading this. I'm saying things. Like, oh my God, it's going nowhere. It's going nowhere. I'm banded. You know, like it, but it, but it's great because it does. It refines it every single time. And you get to the point, you know, where you need to go. Well, this is what made this is what made the, the podcasting and the, especially YouTube podcasting

Not so much because I have you guys But I was telling I was telling this to Danny. So Danny my man Trigger is a man Trigger or my Tringer Maintrager. Okay. Yeah, it's like it to Penga. That's fast Yeah, my friend. Yeah, yes, yes, yes, yeah, I bet Sal had a crush. He did know he did know No, yes, I was actually impressed with that. He reminds me of myself in one way. He's old for his age. He's a lot like he is.

He's not one way. He's a lot like he is. There's a little, I like him. That's why I like him a lot. I'm really excited. He's going to be featured in our YouTube real soon here. So shout out to Danny. Danny is on Instagram.

He's dynamic Danny. Really proud of this kid. Is that my pump, Danny yet? No, he was my pump, Danny. Danny is on Instagram. He's dynamic. Danny. Really proud of this. You know, my pump. Danny, he was my pump. Danny and he any any switch. Yeah, switched out there. Uh, whatever. That was probably a dumb move. Danny. But uh, come on, Danny. Oh, Danny. No, he was, uh, he's, he's been trying to move away from just training privately to more the, the virtual world. And he's been doing a hell of a job doing that and I've been watching him. I have an exceptional trainer.

Yeah, really? Dude, do you know, I had him rattle off his certs. I think he's up to 33. It's insane. Well, he's been on a tear lately just getting educated. I love it. What I like about him is he's able to communicate what he learned very well.

Cause I've known trainers with a million certs who couldn't teach shit. Cause it was very hard for them to communicate what he learned very well because I've known trainers with a million search who couldn't teach shit because It's very hard for them to convey what they learn in effective ways He does a very good job Communicating which is one of the main reasons why he's on our channel. I'm gonna give I'm gonna give mine pumps I'm credit for helping him out with that though. Yeah, I heard him I heard him talk on his Instagram story the day And I thought it was an incredible point that he made He's just I think it's important that you have the ability

to talk at a higher level and understand at a higher level because there are times where you're going to communicate to doctors and engineers and I think it's a trainer, it's important that you can talk on that level or else you're gonna have a really tough time training clients like that, that expect that or want that. But they're really the minority. You know, there may be 3% of my clients were the doctors and the engineers, the majority

of the world out there, they don't want to learn all that stuff, they don't want to know that detail. You got to remember what the goal of communication is. You're trying to effectively convey a message and a feeling and or a feeling, right? And so, if you talk super abstractly or real complicated lots of words or complicated words, you're not accomplishing your goal of communicating to a lot of people. You're just sounding, maybe they think you're smart, maybe they think you're pompous, but you're not really effective. Here's a thing. You're always communicating think you're smart, maybe they think you're pompous, but you're not really effective.

Here's a thing, you're always communicating when you're talking. It's what you're communicating that's important. Is your goal to communicate your ideas to the person or is your goal to communicate to someone that you know a lot of words? Yeah. And so if your goal is to communicate you know a lot of words, well then congratulations, that's what you're accomplishing

when you sit there and talk about things in a super highly technical level. But if you actually want someone to understand the information and the ideas and the emotions and the feelings, well, then you need to, an effective communicator is like a chameleon and it knows how to adjust how they say certain things depending on their audience. That's what makes somebody an effective communicator. That's also what makes someone an extremely effective salesperson. And I went through, you know,

about towards the end of my career, most of my clients were doctors and surgeons and, you know, scientists and engineers, just the location of my facility. And then those of the people I started to attract as they started referring people. And you better believe my conversations changed. And I loved it, challenged me.

But it was at a much much different level of you know when I'm communicating you know scapular retraction to a surgeon I'm talking very very technically they understand that when I'm talking to the average person it makes no sense to do that whatsoever at all. Which is a majority of the people you're speaking most especially when you're on like a platform like this or you to this was a challenge for me. I remember when we first started you to the insecurities that I had while speaking on the to the camera was I'm what's in my mind is not that what was in my mind was my peers and academia is going to rip me apart if I don't say this correctly. I don't.

I sound like you know what you're saying. Right, I want to make sure that I'm credible. I'm on this big, you're going to become a meme on somebody's pay. Right. And so it took me a while to have the zero fucks attitude about it. Like I don't give a fuck about those five people, you know.

And they really, and the unfortunate part is those are the five that are more likely to comment, right? Cause they want to feel special, right? Or they're butt hurt? Or their butt hurt. Their butt hurt. I caught you here. Right. I'm not inaccurate.

Right. Or they don't have a channel. And so they want to feel like they're important, right? So do something like that. But in reality, the, you know, the 250,000 people that watched it, you know, got a lot out of it. I believe you were searching for the term tibial tuberosity. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I get people the term tibial tuberosity. Yeah.

The attachment of a... I mean, I get people that critique when I refer to like an angle that my elbow is at. That's more like a 15 degree angle, not a 30. It's like, these are the same guys. Oh, wow. These are the same guys. They're doing geometry now.

Yeah, that's great. These are the same clowns who will comment on a picture of a like supermodel and we'll say something like, her nose is too pointing. Yeah. Yeah. listen, bro. How do the fingers... If she walked in your room right now, you'd jizz in your pants. Yeah, you should, you should.

Dude, speaking of jizzing your pants, whoa, it nice transit. You say so much for that one, sir. Can I say something right now? Yeah, please do. I'm gonna test my testosterone again, because... Is it through the roof, bro?

I think I'm in steroid levels of natural. No, you're not. Through... So here's what's going on here. I don't know, I'm going to call, get the every well tested out again. Oh, yeah, that's the only way to test it out again. That's the only way to know. So here, you know, I've talked about this in past podcasts.

If you haven't listened, just give your quick rundown. Tested my testosterone. I was within the normal, just give you a quick rundown, tested my testosterone. I was within the normal, I was in the middle of the normal range. Now, when you first, in the everyday well test that you took the very first one, which one are you, what kid are you? Just testosterone.

Just a pure test. The second one I did was. Men's health. Men's health, which includes testosterone has DHA, cortisol, and estradiol. So I took one in my testosterone levels were in the middle, which is theoretically fine, but the tests are so easy to take.

You're just at home, you do them with saliva, they're accurate, they test free testosterone, which is what you wanna register. You don't really, total testosterone doesn't matter as much as free testosterone, because that's what your body actually uses. So I did the test first time, I'm in the middle, and I'm thinking to myself, I'm like,

I feel like normally my testosterone level's higher than that. And I wasn't sure. Am I just identifying with this because I'm trying to be like this super-dued or whatever? But I'm thinking about, I'm like, let me see what happens if I change a few things. And the two things that I changed were, I reduced my cannabis consumption.

So I was using it every night, and I know that high doses of cannabinoids can cause a reduction testosterone in animal models. So I brought that way down to like two nights a week instead of you know six nights a week or seven nights a week. And then the other thing I did was is I my gut health was much better and so I was able to increase my calories and eat more carbohydrates. And so I tested it again, and that's when I had the men's health test, and my testosterone level's doubled. So not only did they didn't just go up,

I went from the middle to slightly out of range of the top. It was crazy how much you jumped. And I felt I could feel it. I was like, this feels like my whole... You were above normal, weren't you? Yeah, you were in the like crazy range. Yeah, I wasn't crazy, but it's like a bump.

See, I needed testing in, because like the first one I screwed up I brushed my teeth fucked up my whole results second one I was in the middle But I need to do it again because dude ever since like I've been getting better sleep like again I haven't I haven't like when I got back from Scotland I stopped taking the edibles as much and then I've been working out more consistently like like with that Purex downstairs and just been lifting weights like I'm feeling it. I've been working out more consistently like with that Purex downstairs and then just been lifting weights. I'm feeling it.

I'm feeling a lot more energy and drive lately. See, that's my point in the point I'm about to get to. So I took that test, it's much higher. And what I've done now is I've, you know, we had Stan Effording on the show recently and he talked about his vertical meals, which are super convenient, right? They come to your house.

It's body building. I like in those. I like them. I fucking, I just spent $300 on, I got 20 some more of them. I'm gonna let you win for it. I'm ordering all the breakfast. So I definitely, the breakfast is way better

than I would have anticipated. I would never, ever think, because when I make eggs and reheat them, they're just bleh. But the breakfast with the sweet potatoes, the eggs a little bit of cheese on it, where it's money for me. It's not bad.

The breakfast is the hardest thing. I'm notorious for waking up, cup of coffee, I'm on my way to work, and then I like, it's not bad, it's good quality. They're not super cheap, but that's okay. You did well, Stan, you did well, sir. So what I've done now is I'm continuing to ramp up my calories.

I weighed like 202 pounds, which is heavy for me. You know, heavier for me than I have been in the last maybe come where you're sitting. I'm feeling strong. Oh snap. And my libido is silly. It's a full snap. My libido is silly right now.

It's like at a control silly. I feel like my old self. It's really nice. Now we were at a wedding. I'll tell you this. So we were at a wedding. This would some Jessica this. So we were at a wedding, this, Jessica's friend, Jessek got married, Jessen Paula. So it was a-

You did like a bathroom sex story? No, no, no, no, no. It was almost- You went to a lesbian wedding. I did. I did my second, second lesbian wedding. It's a second time. I've been to one. That was fun. Yeah, it was great. It was a great ceremony.

Everybody that are super nice. Of course, lots of lesbian and gay people, which is whatever, doesn't matter. Good people or bad people, doesn't matter. We had a great time. Everybody had a lot of fun. But like I said, my libido's been through the roof and we were drinking and I'm just,

I'm looking at my girl and I'm like, she's like, are you tired? And I'm like, yeah, I kind of want to go home. I know what I want to do. I want to go home and have crazy sex. I have crazy, crazy buzzed sex So we do tell her this you keep it under cover. I'm kind of like you know, I'm like the lesbian wedding Yeah, you really did no

That's not what it was Don't lie bro I'm just being honest. I just spit out his organ That's like I love when commercials make themselves. Yeah, he's drinking the green juice, spills it out. So we get home and we have just, and I won't go into details because it's way too personal. Wow, it was usually due. It was insane, insane, insane fact.

So when, when, when, when Dr. Cabral was here, didn't he say, didn't he recommend that we do the men's health one for a certain reason? I couldn't, I believe he was saying that we should have, you want to check multiple markers with it. Did I think it's just more information and it's gonna be more, here's my advice. He said something that I wanted to, I gotta go back and watch that video because he did bring something up. Here's my advice, dude. My advice is, because you, because the thing about testosterone levels is you don't know unless you test them. So number one, number one, I think it's important for men,

especially if you're young to test your testosterone so that you know if it's going down as you age, because it's hard to know. I felt, mine was in the normal range, when I first tested it, but I know how I normally feel and I thought maybe that's low for me But there's no way for me to know no, that's how to get back to that prime, you know peak No, this is a testosterone. This is a very good point and I wish that I would have taken this in my mid-20s for that

Exactly even when I felt normal and finally I do not think this is just a test for somebody who is Only not feeling good. Like, you should take this now so you know where your normal levels are because I know where I'm at right now. So I have now got myself back up into the very low normal range, but I still know that I'm not sure where I know what it's like to feel like when I have when I when you're when you're in a good brain. Yeah, when I'm in when I'm in my normal range, right? Which that unfortunately, I don't have a number because I never did that. And I regret that because it's like,

you could go see a doctor, if I would go see a doctor right now, and he could, depending on who the doctor is, might say, hey, you're fine. You're totally fine. You don't need to take any sort of testosterone. You're in the low to normal range. You're still normal, so you're healthy and fine,

and yada yada, and leave me alone. But I know I'm not, I can tell by my energy levels throughout the day, my motivation to work out, my libido, it's very obvious to me that I'm not where I was before. See, that's what I'm about to say. I think, you know, made me really think about this, because I'm gonna do another test,

because I feel like I brought it up to another level, or at least maintain the high level. I just feel really good. Part of it, again, a nutrition, I think, plays a big role, because now my calories are higher. But I think a great strategy for a man, and women can do this as well, and women are more interested in

what's, like, their estrogen and progesterone balance. That's what's more important for them. But for men, I think it's important that you test yourself, maybe three times or four times, maybe even as much as six times a year, only, and not maybe not every year, but as you go through different phases of your training and different phases of your diet,

to know how each of those affects your most important, anabolic hormone level. You know what I'm saying? So like, if you're really, really serious about your fitness, and they're inexpensive, the tests are not expensive, and they're done at home, so it's super convenient.

And because of this, I think it would be a wise strategy where let's say you go into a strength cycle. Okay, let me test my testosterone three weeks into the strength cycle, see how that affects it. Cool. Okay, now I'm gonna change this variable with my diet or my sleep, let's test my testosterone again, two months later or three months later. Cool, that affects it. Cool. Okay, now I'm going to change this variable with my diet or my sleep. Let's test my testosterone again, you know, two months later or three months later. Cool, that's where that is.

Oh, I'm under a lot of stress right now. Shit's going to let's see where my test, and you can see where you get a broad picture, and you might even be able to put this on a graph for yourself of your fluctuating testosterone levels and take notes on what's happening in your life and what you're eating and how your sleep is and how you're training is, I think that'll give you a really good picture of what's effective. You talk about that just for giving yourself feedback with your training and stuff like that. I can tell you too, I see a major importance in it for communication with your partner.

I mean, I have a girl that has a very high sex drive and typically I would be also and then I go through this down trend and if I wasn't taking that and I wasn't able to communicate that tour, it would definitely cause, I mean, it still causes ripples in the relationship, even knowing it.

And so if you're a man and you're going through low-test Australian levels like that and maybe not may not know it because you got stress at work, you got all this shit going on. And then on top of that, you have a wife or a partner who now is wanting sex and you're just not in the mood or whatever. I mean, that's really, that's, that can put strain on a relationship if you can't communicate why. Of course, because they may be thinking, is he not into me?

Exactly what I think. I don't care. And Katrina will testify to this, because she knew, and she goes, thank God I knew that, because I still felt that way. It's hard, as a woman, she says, to not feel, if you don't want me,

to not think it has something to do with myself. You know what it is, it's the, because I've had these conversations, but Jessica's like Katrina, in the sense that she's got a very high, you know, high drive. And we've had this conversations before and she'll say, you know, part of the problem is the belief and stereotype that men always want to have sex all the time, that they're these walking, you know, you know, sex factories or whatever. And if they say no, and if they turn it to see, but, but, you know, it's not always true, right?

If you're really stressed out, if you, and this is, it happens more as you get older, just because there's more life shit. I'm not even talking about declining testosterone or that stuff. It can just be that you're fucking stressed out. It could be that maybe you are angry at your partner. It could be that your mind is on other things. You get the runs.

And so that's right. And so this is the only things that made Justin not only that. That's still the stuff. I'm at the flu and I'm horny. Yeah, it's scary. But it is. A little bit.

But you know what I mean? It's a little bit of that. And so it's important to communicate. If your testosterone levels are low, then you can show your partner so that they don't think like, okay, cool, it's not that, it has nothing to do with me. Testosterone's actually low, let's work on trying to get that higher or whatever. Yeah, you kind of glazed over Doug Spittin' out the organifying organified commercial, but I wanted to take a quick moment just to tell people that we're having trouble in the last week.

So I get a report every single week on, you know, or canify sales and this and that. I'm always watching the numbers and we had this huge decline this last week for some reason. I thought, what the fuck is going on? And then I see on our forum a bunch of people, I guess, had a hard time with our code. Yeah, our code was down and I don't know how many days. Did they fix it? It is fixed now.

Doug said it's already up and running back and running, but I don't know if that was a 24, 48 hour or even a week long. We were making too much commission. You should have offered a second of them down. So it's fine now. So if you had a problem trying to put in the mind, just so people know too, I get a lot of DMs

regarding any of the products or things that we talk about, because I know we don't push real heavy on the advertising, you don't see it on our social media, we don't drive to codes, it's always mind-pump. Like mind-pump is always the code for any products. If you're buying a product that we've talked about, it's just mind-pump and it's usually no space.

Right. Because it's just mind-pump. Right, right. I want to ask you now that we're on the podcast. I've wanted to ask you so bad when I first saw you hobbling in. Oh my god. The front door. It's such a dick.

Yeah. Adam, I'm doing the, I was at the front this morning and I was going to hobbling. I was going through and picking questions for this episode and I was in front of the red light. And I looked through, it's hard to see because the red light, the, you know, the jive light, so bright. So I'm looking through and I see this shadow and I'm like, it's got to see because the red light, the, you know, the Juve light, so bright, right? So I'm looking through, and I see this shadow, and I'm like, it's gotta be Adam, cause he's kinda tall. Like, but that doesn't, he's not walking like Adam.

Like, who the fuck walks like that? It was, it was Adam, and I'm like, what happened, bro? It's like, I fell down the stairs. What? What? He's telling me that happened, dude. Jesus Christ.

You fall so much. I feel like our fucking friend Lane Northern right now. Oh, injuries every three months. What's what happened, dude? I fucking toy or what? So, okay, so last night, big game last night, chiefs first of Patriots, what an incredible game for those that watch that game.

Chiefs are 5 and 0 going in this game and they beat the Patriots already. They're playing the Patriots again. Wow. And ended up being a 40 to 43 ending in just an incredible game. So anyways, the reason why I bring that up is earlier in the day, I'm watching my football. And so this year, I haven't promised I'm getting to the ankle rolling. I know everyone's like, what the fuck are you talking about with football and stuff? Well,

I've decided to break the cable chain and go to streaming everything. And so the one knock I have on streaming is when you're doing live sports, especially like the red zone channel where there's multiple streams coming in, it's shit. It sucks, especially if you have a three story fucking place like I do where the Wi-Fi is down below and I'm all the way upstairs watching it on the TV above. The reception just keeps it too choppy. It's too choppy. And so all morning long I'm bitching and complaining and Katrina's trying to figure it out with me and we're calling fucking, you know, our internet fucking service and asking them what we can do to make it better and I'm just I'm grouchy. Like that's my thing. Like football is like my football seasons,

my time to fall with my free. Yeah, so so I get so mad about it. I'm like, fuck this and I'm just, I'm grouchy. Like that's my thing, like football is like my, football season is my time to bond with my, yeah, so, so I get so mad about it. I'm like, fuck this, I'm gonna take the TV all the way downstairs. I got a big fucking, you know. You just carried it down. Yeah, I got this, I got this big fucking TV that I just bought.

I got 100% pictures. And I'm upstairs and I'm like, we are not, not watching the, the game tonight, the night game game the chiefs and Patriots and not having good reception Like we were gonna solve this issue So I bring the TV down the stairs and I have like again three flights of stairs and I'm on the last flight and I'm I think I'm on the bottoms of the And I'm not on the bottom steps. So I'm one, you're ready to just walk flat. Yes.

And I miss, and I'm holding the TV, which is why I rolled it so bad because there's no way I'm dropping this brand new TV. And if I was, if I didn't have a TV in my hand, I would have stumbled, got myself together, but instead, I'm so worried about balancing the TV that I missed the step and I completely roll the ankle all the way over. Is it swollen?

Yeah, it's swollen and bruised today. It's not, I mean, dude, I'm a basketball player. So I've rolled my ankles probably a hundred times in my life. It's not like a level three sprain. It's probably like a level one TV. Probably fall a lot. Fuck off. I'm serious.

Since I've known you. It's a professional hauler. Yes, since we've had mine, but hey, every time you've fallen, it's been a minor injury. So maybe because you have practiced long. Yeah, well, and if you don't include the Achilles, that was definitely not mine. Cause you fell off the stairs,

you fell off the ladder, yeah. Which is, that was my, that was my, did a number on you. That was my favorite. Man, and you know it's crazy, is I don't feel like Shaqille and Neon you. That was my favorite. That, you know, it's crazy. I don't feel like Shaqille on you on that. I don't consider myself somebody clumsy, clumsy at all.

But again, this is just, you know, it's always a situation and an asshole move on my part. I mean, I remember when I was, fell off the ladder. It was like, I'm standing on the top wrong and I'm trying to lift this fucking thing above my head. Like, you know, any, any logical man would have seen that been like, that's not a good idea, you know? Well, no, it's just, it's like fucking, it's what guys do.

That's why we always hurt ourselves. Well, Justin posted that picture of the, did you see that with the guy had a ladder? And it's on top of these home-side pockets. It was like a 20-foot ladder, and it was balancing on four buckets. What is it about? And he's like, change the light bulb.

It's so funny, because on the way here, I was listening to you. I was listening to the intro of one of our latest episodes and we had just quietly mentioned the time, and we don't need to get into detail. I'm like, in trouble. But we quietly mentioned the time we four by four to the car that we had.

We're entering that up. And I was dying in the car. I don't know if anybody really picked up. I don't think so. We really get any mentions of that. I'm thinking about it. So here's a story and I'm not going to go in a detail again. We're kind of assholes. We're not going to get ourselves in trouble. But we were somewhere on a business trip. Right. And we were in a big rental car. Biggles suburban. I wasn't going to go that far just now, but that's fine. What do you mean? It's better that way, isn't it?

That's not like we borrowed somebody's. We were at a big at suburban. And randomly, we're just fucking, in a driving in a parking lot, randomly, you know, I don't know who came up with the idea. No, it was because it was one of those long parking lots. And if you didn't make the right turn into the right one you got you had like 10 minutes to get back. Yeah, you didn't want that that long but you

had to you would have to turn back around and it was like another 30 seconds. You had to do a three-point turn and Adam's just like you know I don't remember who said it like just drive over and all of us were excited. You just do it. Just fucking drive over. And so we all just and we fucking just started driving over. Fucking curb junk. the moon and so we all just and we fucking just started driving over fucking curb John mediums and fucking grass and bottom down the fucking car Yeah, and we're doing all and I'm thinking of myself like we're a bunch of grown. Yeah, that was like a teenager move We're not kids, dude. We're in our late 30s

What the fuck are we doing and I'm thinking about it's like, you know, this is the shit that it was fun though It is this is the shit that guys do social constructs get me to do that. That's right Yeah, that's a biological I know Did I tell you guys the last time I fucking egg the house? Did I tell you guys about this? You were older or do I was like 30? Okay, I was like I don't know why I did it you know, it's where you at least with other kids I was with other men like did it, you know, we're at least with other kids. I was with other men. Like an old man?

Yeah, dude, we're all the same. And we're all laughing and joking and fucking, you know, making jokes and talking about, oh, remember we used to egg, I was like, you wanna fucking egg in house? We're all in a fucking house. Could you imagine the embarrassment of getting caught as a third-smacked pumpkin snack?

Yeah. As a 30-year-old man. You know it's egg in a house. Yeah, but if you're really clever, which I think you are, if it were to happen, you happen you would play out did you see those little fucking kids just We're right away and for sure I didn't adult would totally believe you like they would not think some 30 year old man It's throwing fucking eggs into I'm pretty still think we can do things like vandalism What the fuck am I doing?

Step it so listen listen listen listen listen listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, listen, After the strange fall of shreds out of nowhere. Yeah, very mysterious right the mysterious fall of Shred you know, they're still around I don't know if they are in Europe, and dude I was I was trolling them hard on their website and like talking to relatives. Yeah, but it's a totally different People my theory on that is that they've built up so other so many supplements that they're just like selling it all off Yeah, it's like they stand fire sale They I'm looking we're looking at their site right now and for her. Yeah, and they just stand for everything I just find branching in who acids for women

Branch me to ask for it's so those that don't know the backstory on on shreds shreds was started by Arvin Joey Swole and then what's his name? Magic, Mike, Mike's situation. Mike the situation. So those are the three main guys that really real stable group of guys. Right. Yeah. I wasn't going to do a jab at that.

I will. So the three of them started shreds, shreds, blew up to be a multi-million dollar company and worldwide and just crap, crap supplements, brilliant marketing, and then eventually kind of supplements, brilliant marketing, and then eventually kind of crashed, at least over here in the US, it might still be doing things overseas.

And Joey had bodyguards going into these fitness expos. That was pretty cool. So Joey Swoll has broken off and he broke off, and I talked about this on the show, at least a year, maybe two years ago, and I put it out there, I was like, oh, check this out. And I said, this guy is now doing a rise supplements, RYSE.

Yeah. Let's just create something to spell it wrong. That's the same thing. Fuck. So, literally looks like they have... Carb Z. Carb Y. Carb Z copied the same formula as shreds just rebranded it. And now what I saw today that blue or yesterday

blew my mind I tagged the boys and it is they have obviously Joe's got some money because he was able to get Connor McGregor as one of the front man which this literally pains me. I don't think he has the money in the sense that he's paying them a lot. I don't think he has the money in the sense that he's paying him a lot. I think McGregor has ownership. McGregor is the kind of guy he wants a piece of the profits.

So I wouldn't be surprised if McGregor has shares in the company or has a kind of profit sharing. And I'm sure he'll make a bunch of money from it too, which also pains. I, McGregor can sell anything. The guy's a sweet soldier. Superstar. He sold out of his whiskey before. Well, nonetheless, I am a big Conor McGregor can sell anything. The guys are sweet sold out of his whiskey before. Well, nonetheless, I am a big Conor McGregor fan

and I'm completely disappointed in his decision. That was a decision. Decision to go with this company. I just, I think it's crazy that, and you know what, it's going to explode. I've already watched it on social media. There is still so much. Quadruple already in size.

So, you know, it's wow. I mean, it's done better, right? I mean, it should just been boner pills. And if Joey gets to hear this, like, this is not, this is not hate on you, man. I got, here's a deal. Like, well, let's look at the supplements. Maybe they're better than, no, they're not already. Oh, you did. Yeah. I already did my, before I talk shit, I did my homework on them. They literally, it looks like a carbon copy of what shreds is done. Really? And this is kind of, this, this Ponzi scheme is very, very common in this space. Like, it's a hustle.

Yeah, you, you build something up and then you can, oh, wait a minute, they have the boon stack. Yeah, oh shit. Look at the notorious stack. What's the notorious, I want to see what the notorious, notorious stack is, is gotta be. I know, but I want to see what, isn't it? You know what I mean? I want to see what's going on. So there's

There's protein. Let's go through all the difference So it's a protein. What else is in there? We work out at the top there Doug. There you go First time on the internet Branch in amino acid 230 so BCAA's which we've already found out by now everybody knows by now that it they don't do shit for you As far as taking if you eat adequate protein, you might as well. And if you're taking a protein product,

just take your dollars and stuff them in the garbage. Protein, protein powder, BCA's, pre workout, and then I don't know what the other one is. Yeah, I can't see what else. Just those three. There's way more than that. There's got to be, it looks like there's seven bottle emanates. You know, here's the thing about supplements. And this, this got me a bunch when I was a kid. When I was a kid, if I saw a supplement stat, okay, so BCAAs, hold on, time

released fat burner, okay, that's obviously garbage, testosterone booster. Yeah. Okay, I keep going. Vita focus, it's a multivitamin. That's always a great way to throw in something extra and get yourself a look at that and have a little pop up. Their marketing is brilliant. And their packaging looks good. You know what I mean? No, it's, I mean, that's what I mean shreds did a great job of this. So they literally he's gonna do exactly what he did there. And don't fuck. This just goes to show you the power of media and how you can take someone as big as Conor McGregor, attach it to something and by default, you're gonna see this company rot literally, you know, rise up. So this is a time tested formula for selling lots of product

is creating these mega stacks. I can't wait till this dies. Like, we're not. I thought it did, but it won't. It won't because it's too, it'll, it'll blow up too fast before people even hear this podcast. Right. So it's just unfortunate that we still, we still live in this time, but I believe this

time is dying. So those people that are using this formula where they just, you know, switch and bait, or bait and switch on products like this. And though, I mean, if they were run this one on the ground, then turn around and do it all over again. I know. Well, let's keep going. Crazy. Yeah. Just what's up with your, what's up with you, your hands? Dude, I have blisters like all over my hands. Heavy masturbation. Yep. That's what I, that's what I recently thought.

A big time weekend for me. No. I did manual labor all weekend. One of my neighbors was like doing everything outside. He was making everybody look bad. His place looks amazing. I hate those people. You know what I mean?

Like the landscaping, the tree trimming, the digging, of whatever the fuck. So I was like, well, I can't be the house on the block that looks like shit. So I was outside literally for a Saturday, Sunday, just constantly, just digging, digging all this like excess amount of leaves and everything that I've fallen for.

That's like tier three years, it just stacked everywhere. It was grueling. I forgot how fucking grueling it is, like doing all that shit. Oh man. God, you know what? The thing about manual labor is it sucks But it also when you're done. Oh, it's rewarding a sense of pride. Yeah, you know what I mean?

Like yes, I did yeah I have to do something manual once every five years I figured after I do once every five years I feel manly. Yeah, if I don't if I do it more than that that's your qualification Yeah, if I do it more than that. I'm like this just Yeah. If I do it more than that, I'm like, this just sucks. I just can't have somebody right next to me like showing me up. Yeah. Do your boys help you when you do all that? Uh, loosely.

Like sometimes like, they'll start with good intention and like, they sneak out and they're doing something inside. I'm like, hey, what the hell, where'd everybody go? And then, but actually my oldest will come later and he actually probably sticks with me the closest and keeps helping contributing. I would be afraid where you live, I haven't been your house yet,

but I know you live near the woods and you have all these leafstack. Aren't you afraid you're gonna scoop out like spiders? Oh, there was a lot of that. Oh, yeah, lots of spiders, critters, like mice. Like I found this whole like, the community of mice in the stump.

And I was like, oh shit, that's what they're all coming from because they would go and steal chicken food all the time. Oh really? So what did you, do you have to put poison there? I mean, I put traps. The ones where you snap them, you snap their neck. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, there you go.

Poor, poor little mice. Dude, I wanted to give you guys, I wanted to get, sorry, to change subject. I wanted to give you guys a random stat that I had read the day. The thought was crazy. Did you know that according to the USDA, that the average kid under 12 consumes 49 pounds of sugar per year? Wow. Pounds.

49 pounds of sugar. The averaged under 12 under 12 wow that's That's alarming dude that sucks man. Can you can you even visualize what 49 pounds of sugar looks like and to think that it's all Probably in their beverages. Yeah, I was I was around I don't want to give to me a detail I was gonna call anybody out, but I was around you know some people that I know and I don't want to give to me details. I don't want to call anybody out, but I was around some people that I know. And one of the people that I know,

he himself is quite overweight. He definitely obese. Two kids and his boy is, I don't know how old he is, he's maybe 11. And the boy himself is obese. The daughter is a little bit overweight, but the boy himself is obese. The daughter is a little bit overweight, but the boy is definitely obese. And we were all eating and stuff.

And I'm watching how this kid or these kids are eating. And it's just, there's no structure whatsoever. So it's all about, I mean, this kid at this age was eating three, I think two or three full plates of food and probably drink four full sodas, you know, the whole time. And then, you know, and it's like, yeah.

You got, you know, in this world that we live in where this stuff is so available and so plentiful and so palatable, your kids are not gonna make it out successfully if you don't give them as even boundaries. They're not smart enough to know. They don't know, I mean at that age. At your job, they don't know what addiction is. No. You don't know what I mean, I mean, I felt the first level of addiction when I talk about

the pain killer addiction that I went through and that was in my fucking mid to late 20s before I even knew what that feeling of being addicted to something felt like. And now I look at things like even sugar for me. And there's no doubt in my mind that my body has this addiction to it. That's 100% no doubt. So I was reading another article, and I don't remember specifically what it said,

but because what they've done, if they've gone through them, they've tried to calculate why kids are getting so obese, and they're saying, okay, initially it was, oh, kids were way more active when we were younger, that's one of the main reasons. But when they calculate out the estimated calories, they find that it's not due to activity, it's due to food.

Now, I do have an argument against that because you know how they calculate calories. And I read another recent article that says that kids are significantly weaker today than they were before in terms of strength. And we know what happens when you lose strength. Your metabolism slows down. So they're less active for sure. Kids are not outside playing like they used to. But they also have less muscle. Which means they're not doing the right type of activities. Their metabolism is much slower, because what kids traditionally do

when they go outside and play is run, climb, climb things, pull themselves up on monkey bars, push themselves off of things. It's lots of body weight resistance type stuff that happens naturally. Kids don't go outside and do long distance running. They just don't, they'll do running in between things, but they're doing lots of climbing, pushing, whatever.

Kids just have more muscle and more strength back then, and their metabolism's a faster. So when you combine the fact that the kids, that they're inactive as fuck, they're sitting down, you know, out their computer on their iPad or on their phone, a lot of the time, if not most of the time, then on top of that, you throw, you know,

the fact that they're eating more calories and the food is hyper-palatable, which is gonna encourage that, and the food quality is probably not that great. What a recipe for disaster. And the kids that grow up that way, the odds that they'll become adults, that will be obese, is overwhelmingly high.

It's something like an obese kid has got like something like an 85% chance of being an obese adult. Like a very small percentage of these people will lose weight as an adult and then change their health. It's like they are done. Their trajectory has been cemented. There's very few things a kid can do

that will guarantee that give them an 85% chance of being anything. And one of them is, if your kid is obese and they develop these bad habits as a kid, then they become solidified as a behavior. And we all know this. Think of all the kids, all the things you did as kids, that was hard to break as an adult.

Like behaviors that you had as a child, that were hard to break as an adult. Maybe you had an abusive household, lots of fighting, how hard is it to break as an adult when you have your own relationships, for example, right? Very difficult. Well, the behaviors you learn as a kid with your nutrition and your activity level

are that, and then you can add more on top of that because those are fundamental behaviors. You're guaranteed. And they're not shamed by a lot of people too, so that's the other thing. I mean, it's one thing. Social pressures are hard to grow. You grow up in an abusive home

and you're already as a kid and you're already setting yourself up for a very high percentage that you will follow in the same path. But that's not even socially accepted. And so there's that. There's other outside. Yeah, there's other outside things that are gonna affect it.

But you talk about food that we justify because we need food to live. It's not shamed if you have an ice cream cone or if you eat a little bit bigger serving or you decide you're not gonna go out and exercise that day. So talk about an even more challenging thing that a kid is going to have to deal with as an adult. Well, it's tough because it's like,

you use the word shame and people will use the word shame in a way to make it because there's bullying, right? And there's negative and there's things that can actually make the problem worse. Like a kid, you know, being picked on for it or being ridiculed or just relegated the fact that they're obese and that's it, that's all the importance. That'll probably make things worse.

But I think what you're referring to, Adam, is the social pressures of behaviors that we have found and deemed to be normal. Well, behaviors that help promote health and promote, right? And behaviors that make you bad or unhealthy, I should say, or a detriment to society we tend to look down upon. So it's like this, look, if you saw a kid smoking cigarettes, nobody would get upset with society saying, hey, you shouldn't be smoking.

But for some reason, when kids are eating a particular way, and I know it's touchy, but it's like nobody wants to say anything at all. We're super afraid to let the kid know. Probably not a good thing for you, buddy. That's probably not good for you. And I agree we need to communicate it in a good way. Right, right. In a second way. You can't tell a kid put the cookie down so it'll make you way. Right, right. In a second way.

You can't tell a kid put the cookie down so it'll make you fat. No, no, no, no. No, you make the kid feel terrible about themselves and then now their best friend is food. And that's what's going to, you know. Right, it's just the lack of education and communication. That's all it is.

It's a lack of understanding on the parents part of what they're really setting them up. Because I guarantee you that 90% of the parents that are listening right now now that might have a child that struggles with being overweight. I don't think any of them, I think if any of them really understood what they were setting their kids up for, I think there would be more effort put into educating themselves

to then educate and help them. You know why it's hard? It's hard because when you have a family, if you want your kids to eat differently, you have to eat differently. That's why it's hard? It's hard because when you have a family, if you want your kids to eat differently, you have to eat differently. That's why it's hard. Because parents, they can consciously, and I think that they consciously make themselves ignorant.

A lot of them, I honestly do. I think they consciously ignore things. Because if they, if you really sat down with them and said, hey, do you think that's a good thing that your kid is eating that way and has all these risk factors that increase their odds of having, you know, decreasing the quality of life. And adulthood, do you think that's a good thing? Most parents would be like, no, I think you're right, and I need to do this.

The reason why they don't, because they know they have to do it for themselves in order to make it truly effective. And people are really fucking, they don't want it. It's a very, and look, I have empathy. It's a tough thing to change. But God damn it, man, if it doesn't motivate you for your kids, you know, I don't want to. It's a very, and look, I have empathy. It's a tough thing to change, but God damn, man. If it doesn't motivate you for your kids, you know, I don't know. It's a whole instant thing. Like we just want to instantly make them feel better.

A lot of times like his parents, you want to, you know, your kid to be happy and like have a good day and like all this kind of stuff where they just don't want to be uncomfortable. You don't want to go through that process of now, the kids even more upset. Because they didn't get that immediate thing that they really wanted at the time. And sometimes it's like, well, I just don't want to deal with this. And that becomes a perpetual thing that's like, now you're feeding into that.

That need and you're not delaying the gratification, teaching along the way and getting them set up for, you know, success in their nutrition and just making better decisions. Yep, yeah, connected to how it makes them and you feel, include yourself in the conversation. So you're talking to your kid and you say, you know, kid says, hey, you know, mom or dad, why, how come there's no more potato chips? And you say, well, you know, mom or dad, why, how come there's no more potato chips? And you say, well, you know, the reason why I don't buy those anymore, or I'm not buying those anymore

and be very like clear, the reason why I'm not buying those anymore is because they make us not feel as good, it's not really good for our brain health and our physical health. And I want to start to really feel better and have more energy for myself. And, you know, because I care about my family, I want everybody to feel better really feel better and have more energy for myself. And, you know, because I care about my family, I want everybody to feel better, so I'm just

not going to buy them anymore. We're not going to have them. And that's it. That's the conversation. You're going to get some pushback or whatever. Don't talk about being fat, don't talk about your worthless or whatever. Just say, sorry, kid, I don't, you know, I'm not buying them anymore. It's just not good for everybody, so we're not going to have them.

And that's it. The scary part is that, you know, we have two major things that I see going on that are going to continue to compound and I think is gonna be a major discussion in the next 10 to 15 years. And that's the nutrition and kids combined with this, you know, gaming addiction and phone addiction that we have happening right now.

What is scary combination? Yeah. These are very scary combination. Yeah, these are very scary combination. And we really haven't seen them together in children ever before in history. 20, go back 20 years and this wasn't a combined problem and the food is accelerated, right? So the food, everything is feeding into impulse. Yeah, and it's really, and I don't think we're gonna wake up

until we see a whole generation of really fucked up people from not giving a shit about that. That's just how we are as humans. There's a lot of people that are listening to that, I don't give a fuck aren't gonna put the effort into it, or there's a lot of people that don't listen to this show that really have, that are just completely oblivious to it. And what's going to happen is 15 years,

we're gonna fast forward 15 years, and there's gonna be a lot of parents that allowed their kids to just fucking consume the iPad and drink sodas and eat candy, and we're gonna see a lot of shit happen, and then you're gonna hear everybody. We're so worried. We're so worried.

We're so worried about how their kids feel. Oh, I want my kids to feel good all the time in this, that, and the other. Your state of mind is not as good as it can be if your body's in physical poor physical health. If you're not moving appropriately improperly and enough frequently enough, and if you're feeding yourself terribly,

you can have all the most positive reinforcement. You could have all the great, you could study hard to us, you're not gonna be performing in the best way you possibly can, and your physical health definitely affects your mental health. We know inflammation is connected to anxiety and then connected to depression, and that's an

inflammatory state that your kid is in, and that's the state of mind that they're gonna develop their mind in. This is a very important thing to understand. Like, if I take a fit and healthy adult, and they then go on a two year spree of eating terribly and not exercising, they're gonna know the contrast. They didn't develop their mind in the state of mind

of poor health, or in that state of poor health, I should say. Now, when you take a kid, all they know from childhood up is this poor state of health. You know, hard it's gonna be as an adult for them to treat their potential, mental issues like depression and anxiety. It's gonna be very hard. They don't know what it's like.

This is how I've always been. This is what's normal for me. Very difficult to change those behaviors at that point. So, it's's very very important. This Quas brought to you by Organify. For those days you fall short on getting your organic veggies or whole food nutrition, Organify fills the gap with laboratory tested certified organic super foods to help give your health the performance the added edge.

Try Organify totally risk free for 60 Days by Going to Organify.com That's O-R-G-A-N-I-F-I.com and use a coupon code MindPump for 20% off at checkout. First up, C-Oreness. What is your opinion on P90X and Beach Body Pants? Oh, did you think this question? Did you think this question C-Oreness? You don't want? Just to Ornus. You know what?

Just to stir the pot. Well, they are the top selling, probably top selling, you know, fitness programs. Commercial fitness. Let's, let's product. And I'm going to be, here's a great way to put it. We, we see them, right? And we see the amount of the pie that they own.

All of it. And we realize that's that's part of what made us realize that we, we really wanted to go into the program space because if that's what's leading the space is P90X and Beachbody programs, there's a fuck ton of opportunity to help a ton of people, to help a ton of people with really. To help a ton of people with really legit, good programming, because when I see P90X and I see Beachbody programs, what I see is a brilliant marketer that is really, really good at internet marketing, and also has somewhat of a fitness background

or is no somebody who's in fitness and put them together. I mean, let's just go down the board. The household names of anything, the reason why you know about it is because they're brilliant at marketing. People that really pay attention in our technicians in the space that are like personal trainers and see clients day in and day out

are fucking terrible marketers. And so that kind of information just has not made it mainstream. And so that's why we're just like on this mission to bring you guys people that have quality information because they're just not good at that shit. Yeah, it's so I'm not familiar with all the programs, but I'm familiar with a few of them. I've had clients who've come to me through the years and say, oh, here's a program that I was following before and this is what I've done in the past. And it's basically what they're catering to

is the intensity mentality and the variety mentality. So we're gonna give you a bunch of different things and exercises, make it really intense. It's gonna look really cool, it's gonna be good music. And people like to buy that. But the programming is terrible. It's absolute garbage. And it's really, it's a, what they know is terrible. It's absolute garbage. And it's really, it's, what they know is exercises.

That's what they know, but they don't even know exercises. They don't even know good exercises. Yeah, they don't even know like really good technique and how to teach them. It's literally watch this video, do this movement. It's going to beat you up and make you really sore. What they did, what they did was they marketed to our insecurities. The fact that us as humans like to be put in boxes we'd like to be categorized it's just like the dating websites you see now right there's farmers dot com

there's blacks dot com there's whites dot com it's like there's asians dot it's that we've separated all these categories and that the beach body is done this for fitness it's like the cowboy workout like the hip hop urban workout it like, what do you think they're fucking doing? You know what I'm saying? They're like, there's a workout that should be different for cowboys and urban people. What the fuck is that? Like that's literally a marketing strategy.

It's a marketing strategy. It's a marketing strategy because they know that when you see that, you're going to identify with one or the other more so and has nothing to do with your results. And it's all about fun. Like, oh, you know, our videos are fun. It's new music.

It's different. You know, like P90X, you know, they valued the whole muscle confusion thing. So every workout is totally different. It's super intense and it's all fast and it's terrible. The programming is terrible. If you follow these programs consistently, you're going to move a lot. You'll probably burn a lot of calories because you're moving a lot. Risk of injury is going to be high, you're not going to create good favorable recruitment

patterns, you're probably not going to build a significant amount of muscle or metabolism. If you're in any state of HPA access dysfunction, you're probably going to make yourself worse because they're all in dangerous phase. The addiction of that. It does, it's just, it's really. Well, on the debate, it's someone's gonna tell you, this is the argument that you're going to hear, well, Sal, what about the hundreds, maybe thousands

of testimonies that I've seen in regards to these programs. And here's the deal. If you are completely out of shape, you don't eat well, and you follow any structured program, any structured program. No, none of them nothing. Right, and you eat well for you follow any structured program, any structured program. No, not in the nothing. Right.

And you eat well for 90 days, you are going to see results and some people more than others. And when you're marketing to millions of people, it's really not hard to find a few hundred or even a thousand that saw great results from it. These programs are the processed food of fitness programming. Yeah. 100%. 100%. So like processed foods, you Yeah, that's what it is. 100%.

So processed foods, highly palatable processed foods, most of the money that goes into making these foods, goes into making them... The packaging. The packaging and how palatable they are. And they look at everything from the smell, the crunch, the taste, the feel, how it sounds in the box when you shake it,

how many are in the box, how the wrapping is, and colors, and what's going to sell more of their products. Very, very little goes into the actual nutritional value and potential health benefits of their food, very, very little. So with programs like P90X and Beachbody, most of the money goes into the marketing and the packaging and how good it looks in terms of when you open it and it looks really nice and it looks really clean and it looks really, really fun. Very, very little if any of the money goes to programming.

And I know the time that they spend on programming is literally around, oh, let's make this as fun and as difficult as possible. I don't see really, really good instructors and trainers and coaches doing their programming. And if they are, they're not doing it with a lot of integrity. You won't find a single good personal trainer with a lot of experience who is gonna come out and say, oh, these are great fitness programs.

I don't know any. I don't know a single personal trainer that's been personal training for more than 10 years that is teaching their clients beach body or P90X as a program. No. It's absurd. Now that being said, there's a lot to learn from them, right? There's a lot to learn in terms of how they market them, how they're able to get them in so many people's hands. Well, let's be honest, we, they're used as an example with our marketing team. When we sit down every month, we meet with our marketing team and we go over everything

that's going on within behind the scenes of Mind Pump and, and this is a constant battle back and forth because they've proven the model of online digital programs and have made a fucktine of money doing that. So of course, our marketing team looks at it and says, well, let's look to somebody who's done this really well and they're trying to get us to do things similar and there's a lot of pushback that comes from us that listen. We respect that they're doing this, a lot of these things really well from a marketing standpoint,

but they're an example of why we got into this space because we see that there's lots of opportunity to truly help people the right way. And so we have to, we have to teter back and forth between, okay, well, we got to compete with them. So part of the things we're not doing a Zoom course. Right. That's why I put my foot down.

It's funny because when we, I remember when we first, you know, started selling the first maps program, we all looked at the market for fitness programs. And I was talking to some fellow podcasters, and I won't say who they are, but they were asking me about creating fitness programs that they could start to sell and monetize. And one of their concerns was they said that the space is flooded. You know, they said it's saturated.

There's so many fitness programs out there. How can we possibly create a program that people will want to buy and that will do well? And one of my points was, yes, it is a saturated market. If you just look at the surface and see how many people are offering fitness programs, but it is a totally not saturated market, it's dry when you consider all the ones that are programmed well. When you're talking about programs that are programmed well, that are done by coaches who understand how to train the human body and how to work with people, that understand

all the variables and factors that need to be put into a program to make it work well, you're super limited. There's very, very few that are really good. You know, you have starting strength, which is a great foundational strength program. That one's decent programming. Mike Matthews, he's got some decent programming. He's got some decent programming with his programming. Yeah, then you have the powerlifting and Olympic lifting type programs, which in those fields, you have to create good programming

because you've got a bunch of competitive athletes and they'll tell you right away that sucked, didn't get me stronger. But when it comes to fitness, general fitness, general muscle building, general fat loss, Ben Pax got some good programming, but that's it, like I can't think of a lot. The vast majority of the programs that are out there

are pure shit and garbage. Every program I've ever seen in the magazine, like shape or muscle infiction or fitness or whatever, all the programs I've seen on the body building websites, the fitness websites, I've seen there the body building websites, the fitness websites. I've seen there's a lot of them that are out there and I go and I buy them and I read them and I can tell right away if somebody who's coached and trained lots of everyday people has written it, written it, or if it hasn't been, and the, you know, either, here's

the two things I'll find. The vast majority of the programs that we've looked through, we look at and we go, well, it's obvious this person's never worked with a lot of people. Even if it's clinically accurate, right? Like I've seen programs out there, you get like a real scientific, like clinical approach to it, but you could tell they have never trained anybody

in their life. Well, that's what I'm saying, because it's either 80% or 90% are, this person's never trained anybody. They're just putting together a bunch of exercises to make their goal is just to make a hard workout. Or there's a small percentage where you can see and you say, okay, this person wrote a decent program,

but it's for a very specific percentage of the population and their competitive, whatever, competitive bodybuilder, competitive power lifter, competitive Olympic lifter. There aren't very many that are out there that you look at and say, wow, this person has trained a lot of everyday people who are average, who wanna become more fit,

build more muscle, burn more body fat, super, super rare. And here's the thing, it's kind of hard to do because there's so many variables and factors I could do a whole podcast episode and all the things you need to consider when you're writing a program for the masses. And the second thing is, you also have to consider you want your program to just sell a lot

and a good program isn't always the most flashy one. You know what I mean? It's not always the most sexy one with a bunch of random movements and jumping and shit that I can show in my commercial for my program to make it look like it's exciting because most programs that are effective have squats, deadlifts, bench press, overhead prep,

like these foundational kind of exercises. So I can understand why it's difficult. But, gee. Well, it's also, this problem is also perpetuated by the people within our space and our industry and I, you know, I'll quote one of our good friends and I'm gonna continue to give him shit about this because I remember the first time that I was Explained to him what how mind pump plan to monetize and I said there's great opportunity for programs and he kind of Scoffed at it and said that it that said that programming is like ice cream flavors.

And I was just like ice cream flavors. How the fuck is programming like ice cream flavors? And it's not like that at all. That's the problem with the space is everybody thinks it's just to just random ice cream flavors and tasting them all and trying them all is a great thing. Like no, it's absolutely wrong. And that's how all these fitness professionals are treating it. It's like, I'm going to become a trainer.

I know what I'm talking about. Now I'm going to throw all these creative workouts. Like, no, that's not what's effective. And that was where we saw lots of opportunity. Now, I think where we see good programs, and there's probably more, it'll be even more than what Sal named is, because when you name like a Ben Pekolsky or you name starting strength, like these guys did, they're targeting a very niche group.

If you want to be a bodybuilder, I think Ben Pekolsky is writing incredible programs. I think, and if you want to be a strength athlete, I think like Jordan Shallow, if you want to be a power lifter, like Jordan Shallow is putting out incredible material. They're speaking to a very narrow group and they are fucking incredible at programming.

What you don't see is you don't see somebody who is trying to program for the masses and then be able to do that really, really well. The way they treat the masses is they just need to move more. They just need to move more and burn more calories and they need to eat better. If they do that- It's a lot of mentality.

It is. There's a lot of things that these people should to eat better. If they do that, it is. And it's like, there's a lot of things that these people should be taught. Colle reason calories that. Yes. I would say it took me about, honestly, to be quite honest, it took me close to 10 years

of training and think about all the people that I've trained over 10 years, right? Cause I've been doing this for a long time. It probably took me 10 years to get to the point where I could write, I could really program really well. Took me a long time. It takes that much experience. Yeah. Of working in, why does it take that much experience? Because people are so different. It just took me that many people of training for me to learn over and over again. Okay, this applies to these types of people. This doesn't always apply to these people. To the point where now I can train someone and nine out of 10 times, maybe 10 out of 10 times,

but definitely nine out of 10 times, I can take up through a workout and have a very good idea of what exercise for the first two years of my life. I was training, I had to literally write out every single one of my clients workouts the night before and I had to sit and study, you know, and like figure it out and see what was like most applicable and most appropriate. That took me a long time

to refine. And then on top of that, like, okay, now let's let's eliminate like the fact that I have to live and die off of this workout plan, I have scheduled for them, I have to create flexibility, I have to be adaptable. And, adaptable. And so it's just literally just time and hours and variables and seeing how this all plays out. That's huge. Well, to add to you guys this point too, along these lines, I'll give you a tangible example of where P90X fails at this.

Over the course of the entire time that I was training clients, if I were to categorize with the majority, or the majority of them probably fell between the ages of 30 and 55. And that's probably just because it costs X amount of dollars to have a personal trainer in the first plot, so you have to probably be in a pretty stable place.

And in that age group of 30 to 55, most of them were, you know, high stress jobs, overweight, had children, had all these things going on, had a bunch of, you know, had a per-cross syndrome, battled lower-cross syndrome, had some sort of an injury in their life. Like, this is people. This is a average person. This is the average fucking person. This is like 90% of the people that I train. P90X has plyometrics inside there. They have ice skaters.

Okay, ice people don't even know how to get off the ground. I could count on one hand how many people in my career that I have trained and showed them how to do ice skaters. That weren't a specific athlete. Like I mean, for sure that that's a great athletic move for a lot of people and there's a lot of carryover for my athletes that I trained, which was a very small percentage, which is probably 1% of the people I trained.

But then outside of the athletes, there was probably five people in my entire career that I taught ice skaters to. Now, that's such a challenging movement that you're doing explosive that just has no business. That person has no business doing that. It's not even the risk injury, although that's high. It's the fact that if you can't move that way, you're just going to creak back. You're not. You're not.

You're not. You're not a generate force. It's a waste of time. It's a wash. It's so much more you learn. You'll get the same benefit by sitting and running in place. That's it. The real benefit you're getting from them

is they're hard, they're hard, and you're burning calories. And that might help you lean out and lose body fat. But when I think about, if I'm doing this body a good service, I would not be doing the body a good service. So that's the problem with a lot of these programs is they're not taking into consideration

the masses that are probably taking this program and going through it, you're really not doing them. No, it's all about the instructor performing it. Yeah, you can perform that. Well, great. Good on you. Like, look at your general audience. They hire models and actresses and fitness people to perform all this shit. And they don't have anybody in front of them that's like your average person that would just be like falling all over themselves

and like, it would be a clusterfuck. I would like to have, I would like to watch a video of the average people doing P90X workouts. You know what I mean? I'd like to watch those videos. Actually, I wouldn't. It would be very difficult to watch

because I would see so many problems and issues. It reminds me of when I used to walk by, and I was a part of a gym that had a large, what they called, group X class, which was your aerobics type classes, and they taught kickboxing and boxing, and a zoom-ba, and all these things. And I'd walk by and I'd see a classroom full of 50 to 60 people

following a fit instructor, sometimes fit instructor in the front that was teaching all these random moves and I see all these people doing it horribly because they have all these poor mechanics, which is normal as fuck. Okay, it's not add, I got bad mechanics. I don't belong in those classes. Even with all my experience, I know jumping around and spinning around back and forth and moving really fast and bouncing is not ideal for my body.

In fact, I should be addressing the breakdowns. If I'm going to really improve my overall life, if I'm going to eliminate the low chronic back pain that I have, if I'm gonna get rid of my aching knees, if I'm gonna get rid of my forward head and upper cross syndrome and along the way I want to lose body fat and build muscle, that is not the path. That's not the path for me, that is not the path.

That's not the path for me, nor is it the path for 80% of the population that's probably purchasing those programs. Next question is from Nike and Addy. When going through a MAPS program, how important is it to do foundational exercises in order? I like to mix them up if I'm waiting for a machine to open. You know, it's interesting. We get, I get this question relatively often where people ask me,

because the gyms tend to be busy. So if the workout starts off with a barbell squat and all the squat racks are taken, they want to know if they can go start with something else. You know, the order that you do your exercises is part of your programming. It is a factor that will help determine how well your body progresses, adapts, gets stronger, you know, builds muscle, burns body fat, all that

stuff. It's a factor. So what you want to do when you look at your workout, and the reason why we call it programming, if you know anything about programming a computer, when you program a computer, if I take any of that program and remove it and insert it in another line of the programming, like if I take the end of the programming and put it towards the front, it changes the whole thing. The program is no longer the same program, even though it has the same formulas or whatever in that, right? So it's the same thing with your workout. We write them in a particular order

because that's how they're effective. If you mix up the order, it changes the way that the workout works. Now this doesn't mean that you always have to do a particular formula. In fact, we encourage people, once they've learned their bodies and once they've gone through the programs

that we've written, the way we've written them, to mix things up to kind of, because there's individual variants all over the place, right? Everybody's a little different. And you may find that a particular order works better for you than another order. But go through the way we've written it first and try it out for yourself. But, you know, just to give you kind of some basic advice when it comes to order of operation when it comes to exercises, generally, when it comes to exercises, generally speaking, generally, not always, but generally speaking, you want to start your

workouts with the big compound movements first, and then you want to move down the ladder to the smaller isolation type exercises, generally speaking. And you want to start of all your compound movements, start with the heaviest ones Typically first so your workouts usually going to start with if you're gonna do all the foundational movements that you know We like to talk about like squats and overhead presses and bench presses Either going to start with a deadlift or a squat now. Why is it important to start with those Versus starting with the isolation managing your energy appropriately appropriately and it's about you know performing a high skill exercise to the best of your ability and not being under fatigue. So I mean these are very important factors because you know the the risk versus reward here that it's very high risk and so we want to make sure that we put the most attention.

While we're the freshest and youest and our focus is the freshest it could be at that point. That's right. And also these big gross motor movements are the ones that are gonna send the loudest adaptation signal, building muscle burn body fat, strengthening signal. And so you wanna do those most important exercises first in your workout. And studies

have confirmed by the way what you do in the beginning of your workout is where your body is going to adapt the most. So what I mean by that is like they've done studies that compared you know cardio before a workout before weights and weights before cardio. And to see which types of adaptations people get with all things being equal. And what they find is when people do cardio in the beginning, that they're going to build more endurance for the cardio than they will for strength for the weights. And when they do weights first, they're going to build more weights, excuse me, more strength for the weights and less endurance

because the weights was done first. So when you're doing an exercise like a deadlift, and let's say down the line, later on you're gonna do in that workout, a dumbbell pullover, which is more of an isolation exercise for your back, and a deadlift is more of a compound, big gross motor movement with a lot of back activity. You're going, if you do the deadlift first, that's the exercise that's gonna send the loudest signal anyway.

And so you want it to be in the beginning. You want it to be in the beginning of the workout and you want the isolation workouts at the end because those signals, although they are important, aren't going to give you as much of a bang for your buck. Now that being said, are there times when it's appropriate to do the isolation exercises first? Absolutely. Especially when you're trying to correct a muscle imbalance or you're trying to feel a muscle work in a

compound movement. So again, another example would be, you know, if I have an issue feeling my pecs, when I bench press, a bench press is considered a gross motor movement, a big compound movement, then it may be a good idea to sometimes do flies. First, get the pecs fatigued, feel myself connected them, feel the pump of my pecs, then go bench press. Now when I bench press, I can position myself and move in a way where I'm gonna hit my pecs a little bit more. But as far as order is concerned, that's important.

It's all important. Just like how many reps you do is important. Just like, well, I think it's really important when it comes to the things that you just said right now, which is the compound lifts. Like, you don't wanna be doing cable, tricep push downs and bicep curls, and then going over later on and doing dead lifts,

it's just, it's not gonna serve you as well. I mean, you being able to, because it's inevitable if your arms are all pumped and tight and fatigue, when you go to do a deadlift, it will hinder it a little bit. How much it depends on, there's gonna be an individual variance, but let's just say it keeps you

from lifting 50 more pounds on your deadlift than you could. Well, that's 50 more pounds that you're gonna get way more adaptation or way more strength gains from that deadlift that you would have gotten had you done the deadlift first. So I think it's really important when we talk about the compound lifts first

and then moving over to your isolation type exercises unless you're doing something specific like you're saying so then it does matter. But I mean, it's also okay that if this happens every once in a while I'll work out because as a trainer, I remember working in a packed gym at 5 p.m. at night, and I know I wanted to get my client to do squats first, and then I just didn't have the capability,

and so I'd have to improvise. So I don't think it's going to kill you if you do that ever once, but I think there's a, it is ideal to try and follow the program. Something that we suggest to everybody is try and follow the program. Something that we suggest to everybody is try and follow the program to an absolute T through at least one time so you can learn all of the basics

and learn the programming. And then from there, manipulate and play with. And you'll start to piece that together yourself, the why we did put a lot of these movements in the order that we did. Yeah, it's to the untrained eye or someone without experience, it looks like the same. Like, what's the difference? I'm doing all the exercises in the workout. You know, it's the difference.

I'm still moving, I'm still sweating. It makes a difference. It's much more complex than it looks on the surface. And all these things determine the effectiveness of your workout. And if you want to just go in the gym and sweat and burn calories, which a lot of people, it's like we talked about earlier in regards to the beach body programs, you don't need programming to do that. You can just fucking move.

You can literally stand in place, jump and spin and wave your arms around and grab dumbbells every once in a while and kick your legs. And that's going to be the same thing. You're just burning lots of calories. But if you have a specific goal, if you want to, you know, speed up your metabolism, if you wanna build muscle in the most appropriate way possible, if you wanna burn body fat in a way that's maintainable and manageable over a long period of time,

then how you do your workout and the order you do your workout and the exercises that are chosen and the reps and the tempo and all these things play a role. And so when you enroll in a program like maps, any of the mass programs, we wrote them considering all these specific things. And so follow them like they're laid out, you know, try them out. As you get good at these things, you start to learn your body, start playing with fact with with individual You know factors within the workout to see how you feel by changing things up next question is cane 74 I'd like to hear you talk about designer steroids and pro hormones. Oh pro hormones. That was a huge market for a while

It was you guys are counter stuff you guys remember when Andrew standing down? Bro, yeah, Mark McWire, bro. Mark McWire, that was. I made that popular. I believe it was him who made that so popular because when he blew up and he said it was the address. Yes. Yes. Me.

Have you got those kind of results, Kim? Dude, but I remember being a young kid who was also into watching baseball at that time and also just kind of really working out and Going holy shit. I mean he must have sold millions of that yoked. Oh, dude. Oh my god Skinny to jack if you look maybe Doug can pull up Mark McMoghoyers rookie year and and then what he looked like five years later. Hey, man, how's it going? They can say, go just like, dude, they went ham. Huge difference.

They added like 60 pounds. It's like a 60 plus pound. It's maybe more. It's because I'm taking, so when the market first started... Rub a notion on me. When it first started kicking in, there was some laws that were passed that said that if things occurred in nature, they could be sold as a supplement unless they were specifically prohibited by by government. Wow, look at the difference there.

That's like a 30 pound difference. More than that probably. Yeah, you could probably do Mark McGuire before and after steroids and get a more contrast. Because he got literally jacked. It looked like his arms were going to explode. Yeah. So, you know, when this market first started, there was a law or something in that past that said that, like I said, you know, if something that occurred in nature, you could sell it over the counter. So the first

pro hormone that was really sold was DHEA, which you could still buy over the counter. Now, DHEA is a pro hormone in the sense that your body takes DHA and through different conversion, you know, through different conversions, it can turn it into testosterone, it could also be turned into estrogen and other hormones. And so, you know, when I was, here's, I here I am, I'm this kid, I'm taking supplements and I'm looking at the market and I know that DHA is a hormone, but I also know that steroids build lots of muscle, and that's why bodybuilders are so big, so I'm fucking excited, like, oh shit, DHA, it's a hormone,

I can buy a hormone over the counter, so of course I bought it and I took it. Now we all know that if you take a bunch of DHA, you're not gonna build more muscles, it's not gonna do anything for you, unless you're an older person who maybe has low levels of DHA, not gonna to do anything for you. Then the next one that came out was Andrew Stenadown, which is the one that Mark McGuire

said he took, which is bullshit. He was obviously on a shit ton of anabolic steroids. Now, Andrew Stenadown was special because Andrew Stenadown was one step away from testosterone. It needed one enzymatic conversion to turn into testosterone. And so everybody was like, this is gonna be the real one. And I remember buying it. I remember buying bottles of the shit

and taking a ton of it. And what I got from it was nothing except for a little bit of gynecomastia. Yeah, little bitch-dini. Because your body will convert it to testosterone or estrogen. And the one it's gonna lean to is actually gonna be more towards estrogen if you take a shit ton of it,

especially if your testosterone levels are already high, like 18 year old, or 19 year old sales testosterone where the levels were when I took it, did nothing for me. And so for a while, the pro hormone market was full of these hormones that needed to be converted in the body to be turned into something that was

effective. And then the fucking supplement marketers and companies got real fucking smart. Yeah. What they did is they went and they studied abandoned steroids by pharmaceutical companies that didn't, that kind of passed through the loop holes in the law that would allow you to sell them over the counter. So what they literally did is they went and studied, you know, like which hormones were being studied by pharmaceutical companies that got abandoned in 1964, 1970, whatever, 19, whatever, 80, whatever, and they're active, they're actually active

like testosterone, but these pharmaceutical companies abandoned them because of the side effects and shit like that. There's even tumors in all the rats. Keep that in mind. You have anabolic steroids like deball and anadral, which for sure, if you take high doses over long periods of time, can cause things like liver cancer, not good for you at all. Those pharmaceutical companies sold, they abandoned the other ones that supplement companies

picked up on. So just to give you an idea of the safety profile of some of these. This was the hustle for well over a decade. Dude, dude, it was big time. It was a, and it was a, you know, talking about, I think it was this episode where I talked about the whole Ponzi scheme where they would, they would find this, they would find this uh, steroid or this, you know, abandoned, or this abandoned steroid that is on the black market and they say, okay, we disapprove of this,

they would pick it up, they would turn it into a supplement. And because it wasn't already listed as an illegal drug, this is how they could get away with it legally. This is what this is what this is what the term designer steroids or pro hormones came from. And then what they would do is they would, they would self a tons of them because you would take it as a kid and you would see a difference they fucking work. Yeah, you would feel a difference. You would definitely put some

size on or get the side effects from it like South saying and I remember even kids getting like acne and so that and it would be like, oh shit, it's working. That wouldn't slow you down from doing it. It would be like, it must be like the real thing. So you would take it and then eventually it would get big enough. They'd sell millions of it. Word would get out. Then they would come down, crack down on it. They would ban it. Then what happens after they first ban it, then the price goes double and it becomes under the counter. Right. So then you've got to go on e-bam by it. Right. Or you go into your local, you know, locked up in the back cap. Yeah, your local max muscle, G and C type of place,

and you say, hey, you still got that, Andrew, Andrew won that freaking, and yeah, I got a few left under here. Super test, finally. Yeah, then they were hustling. There was a lot of big supplement stores

that got cracked for this, that were selling all the stuff that was illegal. So I went, I went ham on the stuff. Now remember, I was a kid, you know, of course, everybody knows my story why I started working out and, and because these things were effective

and because I was super into supplements, I became, I studied all of them. There was one that converted in your body and was turned into bold and known, which is the anabolic steroid, equipoise. There was one that's called, the most powerful one, I remember this, I remember when one testosterone came out. One testosterone is an anabolic steroid. It's a derivative of DHT.

So it's very androgenic, but it's also anabolic. And it made you strong as shit. And I remember buying this stuff and taking it and I gained like 10 pounds and like two weeks. It was in, I was holding hell of water, but I was strong as hell. I was like, wow, what is this stuff? You know, Gazbari had his halodrawl 50, I but I was strong as hell. I was like, wow, what is this stuff?

Gospari had his halodrawl 50, I think it was called or whatever. Hopefully we'll have him on the show. I'd love to ask him about that, which was another one. But here's the thing, they weren't safer than steroids. Many times they were worse for you. Right. And because there's anabolic steroids,

they shut your testosterone levels down. And then there's nothing that's over the counter that's really effective at post-cycle therapy. So you'd have all these kids go on these designer steroids, then they'd go off of them, and then they'd go through like two or three months of feeling like shit being depressed, to testosterone levels are low,

that no libido, they're losing muscle like crazy, and they can't get their hands on what, bodybuilders will do for post-cycle therapy like HCG which is prescription only No, the decks are clomid which are prescription only a remadex which is prescription only which are what you want to use As part of your post-cycle therapy, which isn't a pure perfect cure anyway. It's still difficult But now with these kids, they don't even access to that so they take this stuff and then for post-cycle therapy What are they taking?

Erbil test boosters and shit? It's a fucking nightmare, it was a total nightmare. And my advice on the designer steroids, because you know what's funny, is they're starting to do this again. They're starting to find loopholes again and get kind of crafty with it with the internet. My advice is this-

Well, this is what reminds me of- It's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it My advice is that this is what reminds me of a song. So this is what reminds me of instead of this being as popular, I'm seeing the same, you know, that's the new hustle is the Psalms and that the same thing is what makes me weary about that. Like, man, I just I don't feel good about using something that just hasn't been

around long enough for us to see the side effects. The benefits of the advantages of the designer steroids were that they were over the counter, so you're not breaking the law, okay? And you're not dealing with the black market, because steroids in the black market notoriously are fake or under-dosed, or you're not getting what you're paying for and all that stuff.

That being said, if you get your hands on real, like testosterone, and you have your hands on a designer steroid. Real testosterone is going to give you less side effects and probably be safer for you than the designer steroids that you'll find over the counter. Now word of caution, first of all, I don't advise anybody to do that, so that's not advice I'm giving anybody who's listening. But if you do do something like that, you do decide to break the law, you do decide to put your health in your own hands in terms of risk and all that stuff.

Make sure you understand what to do when you go off, because that is not a fun place to be when you, I experienced this myself. I would do cycles of this, like I said, methyl master draw was one of them, and another one was one testosterone and halodraw. And then I go off, and it's like you just want to go back on them real quick, because you just went through this period of building muscle, feeling amazing, then you go off of them, and it's like everything you gain just gone, because your testosterone's in the tank, and you feel like garbage, and you don't even want to work out anymore, because why am I working out?

It sucks, I can't even get a good pump. And so it's just terrible, like on and off type cycle, and you do that enough, and I'm sure you can, you can probably increase your risk of permanently lowering your testosterone levels, which we know. We know a lot of guys like that, right? Yeah. Yeah. Next question is from Amanda Kamila. How much do you think the human psyche affects weight loss? Do you think someone who is body positive has an easier time achieving their goals and someone who hates their body? Wow, do I ever.

I think this is something that I'm really passionate about speaking about to not only clients, but even on the show. I mean, I think this is a point that we try and drive home so much to people that took me a very long time to figure that to really put this piece together, you know? We've shared before like giving clients programs and giving them the diet and saying follow this and then them not seeing results and then you as a trainer going like,

oh, they're just fucking lazy or they're not doing this and then like blaming it on the clients and then just going through one after another like that before realizing like, wow, I'm spending my time on the wrong things. I'm putting my energy and effort into these exercises and these crafty diets. Meanwhile, this person has a lot of stuff going on. You know, via human psyche and that needs to be addressed first before I'm ever going

to give this person long-term results. And even if I got them to their weight loss, quote unquote, goal, it's probably inevitable that they're going to gain it all back. Plus some, if they haven't addressed their psychological issues that got them to that place in the first place. So to me, this is everything. I think that you, you, you, for, you first have to shift your mindset before you really go after this. Otherwise, what ends up happening is the poor self-image that you have ends up driving poor behaviors

that a lot of times end up setting you back even further. Well, and you can only be negative about things for so long. You know, you can only hate yourself for so long. Like it's before you just want to, you want to cram in what feels good. And this is where this like ebb and flow things starts to happen where we go, you know, with clients, I'll get, you know, like amazing progress, but they're still driven by, you know, what's wrong with their body. And they're just still pressing themselves to the limits. And then they feel like they get there and then, oh, God, we're relaxed.

I want to feel good again. I want to feel good again. And it's this quest to like feel good again, because that was the end goal for them was to get to a certain place where they felt like, well, I'm going to feel happy there, instead of like addressing the real psychology there and like confronting that in the beginning.

And yes, it might seem like a slower process and it might seem like something that's just more work. But as you're going through that process, it's you learn to love yourself, you learn to appreciate the work that you're putting on your body and that stays, that lasts. Yeah, if you were to look at a pie chart of the important things that will affect someone's

real success, when I say real success, I mean permanent, okay? I don't mean I lost 30 pounds and gained it back. That's not successful. That's easy. I can have anybody do that. Real success is, has this person now fundamentally changed how they behave and treat themselves and eat and move and all those other things.

And if you look at a pie chart of the most important factors that will determine their success, it's 100% their psyche, it's 100%. All of it, all of it revolves around that. Because what we're dealing with are human behaviors. And human behaviors take a long time to really change, because you have to understand why they are where they're at in the first place. And if you talk to any trainer who's been training

for someone, or who's been training people for 10 years or longer, you know, what is most of your job and where do you find most of your success, they'll tell you, I feel like a therapist most of the time. And it's true. Your job as a trainer, your goal as a personal trainer, should be to help your client develop a good relationship with their body, with exercise and nutrition. If you can get to the, that's the point that you want them to get to because

that was what's going to drive them to have a long term forever success, not the short term right now success, and then I bounce back. And this takes a long time, and it's a slow process, and everybody's a little bit different. You know, when talking about hating your body, and Justin's talking about people just wanna do what feels good, when you talk to somebody

who is motivated by hating themselves, like they look in the mirror like, ugh, I'm disgusting. I need to go beat myself up. I need to go work out because I ate that pizza, and I can't believe I have terrible discipline. When you ask them about their nutrition and stuff, the way they'll respond is something like,

they'll say things like, oh, I can't eat that. Oh, I can't do that anymore. I can't do that. And it's as if they've separated themselves into two people. The, they're, they're,. They're tyrannical trainers self that's telling them, you can't do that. And then they're poor oppressed self, which is like, okay, I won't eat that cupcake, okay, I won't do that.

But you can only last like that for so long. At some point, you will identify with the person that's being oppressed, which is why people will say things like, I can't, I want to, but I can't, I can't, I can't, I can't. And eventually they rebel. And what happens when you rebel? You, the needle swings in the opposite direction. You go hard.

You go hard, it's not, you know, oh, I'm eating better and I'll have the occasional cookie. It's, I've been eating a particular way. I can eat cookies, I can eat cookies. I'm gonna need a whole package of cookies. Fuck it, I'm going off. I can't do this to myself anymore. I just want, how many times have you heard this?

I just want to enjoy life. I, of course, they're saying that because the whole process that they've, that they've motivated themselves by is a hate punishment. Fucking sucks. Life sucks. You're not gonna, no way you're gonna be successful

long-term in that way. Of course, eventually at some point, you're gonna want to enjoy life because who wants to be in that constant state of Self-hate all the time. So we have to do is flip that on yourself. You have to flip that and realize that I'm taking care of myself. So when I don't eat that cookie for example, it's not because I can't It's because I don't want to. Now I may crave it, I may appreciate that it tastes good, I may know that I'm gonna enjoy eating it, but that doesn't mean I want to, because I'm also weighing the other things

that come along with that cookie. Well, it's not gonna make me feel good, may affect my digestion poorly, it's calories I don't need, it's sugar that's gonna make me hungry or need more food. So the reality is I acknowledge the taste, I acknowledge the craving, but I don't want that cookie.

Way more empowering, way more powerful, and way more of a long-term strategy. And the same is true for working out. When people say, oh, I have to work out on Monday. I gotta do my workout, you know? Like again, like they're being forced or oppressed into it. I realize the reason why you're doing this because you really want to create that relationship with your with exercise and you'll find that you'll make time for it.

Imagine if, look it, if you're listening right now and you're having trouble with your, you know, you're going up and down and body weight and you're inactive and active, think about it this way. If you enjoyed eating in a healthy way and you really enjoyed your workouts where you really wanted to do them, do you think you'd have this trouble? Of course not.

So the key is to find how to get yourself to that point. Now I do wanna say this about body positive. Body positive is, I think it's been warped a little bit. Yeah, that's a little bit. The reality is you can be objective about your body. You can look in the mirror and be like, wow, okay. I have a lot of body fat.

My movement patterns aren't good. I haven't been treating myself well. It doesn't mean your self image is bad. There's a difference between having a lot of fat and you are fat. Right, right. You're not fat. You're not fat.

But yes, you do have a lot of fat. There's nothing wrong with acknowledging that. I think that's the mistake that people room for improvement there. Right, there's a lot of fucking, we used to, the positive way we used to say is, you have a lot of stored energy. You have a plenty of stored energy there

that we need to use. I mean, that's, but I think this whole body positive thing is changing this like, oh, like embrace it and it's okay to have all this stuff like, yeah, okay. I get the direction because maybe the shaming had gone one way and I think that's unhealthy about also, but there's also another side of being a realist and going like, listen, you haven't been serving yourself,

you haven't been loving yourself because you do have an excess of 50, 60, 100 plus pounds of body fat on you do have an excess of 50, 60, 100 plus pounds of body fat on you. Doesn't mean that you are fat. Just means you have lots of fat, lots of stored energy on you that you should be using. That's it. And again, you can separate yourself image from your body image.

Just remember, it doesn't make you less of a human. It doesn't mean you deserve less love or you deserve less respect or less dignity, especially from yourself It's very important to have self empathy, but but that with self empathy comes responsibility If you're truly being empathetic to yourself and you're looking in the mirror You're saying oh man, you know what? I haven't been taking care of myself and I know I haven't been taking care of myself and I understand what's happened and These have been difficult times for me or this has been something I haven't been taking care of myself and I understand what's happened. And these have been difficult times for me or this has been something I haven't paid attention to.

But, you know, and again, in the light of being empathetic with yourself, you can say to yourself, but starting today, I'm gonna take care of myself. I'm gonna take care of myself in the truest sense. I'm gonna take care of myself as if I were taking care of someone that I truly cared about. And then watch and see how that moves you and directs you throughout your life.

You will make mistakes, you will stumble just like, you know, I take care of my children, I love them. Do you think I'm perfect every single day as a parent? Of course not. But what's driving me is the fact that I care about them. So I know that the decisions that I'll make are eventually are ultimately going to be better than they are worse. And that's how you have to treat yourself and understand that that's the most important thing and that it's a slow fucking process. So again, if you're empathetic with

yourself and you know where you're at, you can say to yourself realistically, okay, I'm, you know, my body's 50 pounds overweight, haven't been taking care of myself, I'm gonna start taking care of myself today, but I also know how I've been living before. So moving forward, what's realistic for me to do right now? Like what's something that I know I can do right now and really take care of myself right now and do consistently? And that may mean I'm gonna just eat a serving of vegetables every day, or that may mean

I'm not sitting as much. Yeah, I'm gonna do a 10 minute walk every day. That may mean I'm gonna drink one less glass of soda and replace that with water. And you do that over a slowly, over a period of time, again, motivated by self-care, and you will achieve long term forever success. And remember, remind yourself, that's what you want. You want to have a better quality of life.

You don't just want to be thinner. And with that, if you go to MindPumpFree.com, you can check out some of our free guides. We have quite a few of them. I think there's 11 or 12 on there now. That's close to 15. Is it really? Okay, so some of them are like how to work on your midsection, how to develop your better squat, how to work on your shoulders, your arms, legs, lots of free guides, get them all, they cost nothing, again, it's at MindPumpFree.com.

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