Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - BONUS: Joe Kudla of Vuori Clothing- Lulu who?

Episode Date: March 6, 2018

In this episode Sal, Adam & Justin speak with Joe Kudla, founder of Vuori a high end activewear, performance clothing company that is taking on Lululemon but doing it with a more masculine feel (Vuori also has awesome women's clothing line, too.) Vuori is now a Mind Pump sponsor and you can get 25% off by going to www.vuoriclothing.com/mindpump. You will love this clothing! Would you like to be coached by Sal, Adam & Justin? You can get 30 days of virtual coaching from them for FREE at www.mindpumpmedia.com. Get our newest program, MAPS Prime Pro, which shows you how to self assess and correct muscle recruitment patterns that cause pain and impede performance and gains. Get it at www.mindpumpmedia.com! Get MAPS Prime, MAPS Anywhere, MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance, MAPS Aesthetic, the Butt Builder Blueprint, the Sexy Athlete Mod AND KB4A (The MAPS Super Bundle) packaged together at a substantial DISCOUNT at www.mindpumpmedia.com. Make EVERY workout better with MAPS Prime, the only pre-workout you need… it is now available at mindpumpmedia.com Also check out Thrive Market! Thrive Market makes purchasing organic, non-GMO affordable. With prices up to 50% off retail, Thrive Market blows away most conventional, non-organic foods. PLUS, they offer a NO RISK way to get started which includes: 1. One FREE month’s membership 2. $20 Off your first three purchases of $49 or more (That’s $60 off total!) 3. Free shipping on orders of $49 or more You insure your car but do you insure YOU? If you don’t, and you are the primary breadwinner, you will likely leave your loved ones facing hardship and struggle if you die (harsh reality). Perhaps you think life insurance is expensive, but if you are fit and healthy, you can qualify for approved rates that are truly inexpensive and affordable. To find out if you qualify for the best rates in the industry, go get a quote at www.HealthIQ.com/mindpump Have Sal, Adam & Justin personally train you via video instruction on our YouTube channel, Mind Pump TV. Be sure to Subscribe for updates. Get your Kimera Koffee at www.kimerakoffee.com, code "mindpump" for 10% off! Get Organifi, certified organic greens, protein, probiotics, etc at www.organifi.com Use the code “mindpump” for 20% off. Go to foursigmatic.com/mindpump and use the discount code “mindpump” for 15% off of your first order of health & energy boosting mushroom products. Add to the incredible brain enhancing effect of Kimera Koffee with www.brain.fm/mindpump 10 Free sessions! Music for the brain for incredible focus, sleep and naps! Also includes 20% if you purchase! Please subscribe, rate and review this show! Each week our favorite reviewers are announced on the show and sent Mind Pump T-shirts! Have questions for Mind Pump? Each Monday on Instagram (@mindpumpmedia) look for the QUAH post and input your question there. (Sal, Adam & Justin will answer as many questions as they can)

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mite, op, mite, op with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. Dude, Sal, we have a sub today. Oh shit, what are you doing? We subbed out the Justin for a much more handsome version. He's got longer hair. He's got more cakes though.

He's got cakes on the list. He's got you on the cakes. No, we have you on because you're like our guy that puts together partnerships, sponsorships, you're helping us find brands that we should probably work with. And you brought this particular company to us, Viori. Yes. What was it all about?

One of the things that I wanted to do this year specifically is align with other companies that I think are doing amazing things in their respective spaces, but that can also add value to our listeners' lives. One of the areas, in one of the categories that we haven't really tapped into yet, is the apparel side, the athletic apparel side. You have, judge, judge, judge, what are these guys? Louis Lemmon.

Yeah, Louis Lemmon, right? Started off as a female focused company, and then transitioned in the menswear. And there's nothing really that focused on the mens market. They do women's clothing too. What's you're talking about like the staple ones that everybody knows, Nike and Reebok and, which is pretty much all just like athletes, I feel like.

Yeah, when you get, you knew like in your 30s and I didn't really wanna wear that anymore in 30s. Well, it's like you need, you want other options aside from Nike and Adidas, right? Well, what I liked about it when you first brought over Super high quality. Yeah, the material is next level, right? So they're using the same or higher quality that Lule is right. Yes. Oh, yeah, so it's very very high quality stuff and it's like

Because Lule kind of made the whole they invented the whole wear workout clothes like all the time market didn't look good, right? Viori, I think, from what I've seen, so what I've seen, because they've sent us some stuff, and I'm wearing it, it's like, it's a whole nother level, and it's got that masculine feel to it, so I feel good, because Lulu never really felt, I know, I didn't really,

it didn't fit with me super, it was good, I liked it, it was great stuff, but it wasn't like, Viori does a better job, I think. There's just something, there's something not all the way there, and I wanted something, I was really, one of the things I'm trying to do with the brands that we align with is find companies that have very similar values, right? And so Joe, I know he's super into ice baths and he lives what we talk about and to have

a founder leading a company like that. And to someone who gets our audience, I think this is going to be something that they're going to really be really excited. Well, I was really excited about what you presented to me just a couple months ago that I hadn't even thought about because honestly, being somebody who kind of looks over a lot of the financials that we're doing, a lot of my concerns is security for us,

and advertising money is now become an income for the company that helps support the business. And so the way my brain was working is like, okay, I want to look for four or five companies that I think align with our message and then that that's just going to be our brands forever. And one of the things I noticed and you had pointed it out right away, it was just like, you know, everybody is doing thrive, everybody is doing organically, everyone's doing forsegmentic, all of like that. It's like, dude, I want to be different than everybody else.

I want to introduce our audience to brands that that we're into that we think are cool and rotate through them. Instead of being stuck with the same brands forever, let's move them through quarterly like that. And I couldn't agree more with you now. I think it's a, I think it's a brilliant strategy. I think our audience will appreciate that. By no means do I think that I'm gonna try

and get into the apparel game and try. Yeah, right. Right. Sal wanted to, you know what I'm saying? You could tell you with his fashion, you know. I mean, he's got a good style, yeah. Yeah. In some point, it circles around and I get,

it's back in style. Well, I mean, here's how we tend to operate when we bring on a sponsor is, you know, well, before Taylor, before we had Taylor, we would talk to someone, but now that we have Taylor, he finds them, talks to them, they go through his tests, if he thinks it matches with us,

then we meet with them, and we're like the final decision makers, right? We meet with the team that runs the company, and this is after we've already decided that we like the product, by the way, because of course we have to like the product, we have to like it, we have to believe in it, Then we get to meet the people. And if we don't like the people, even if the product is awesome, if we don't like the people, it's not going to happen.

If we like the people and we like the product and everything else works, then we're moving forward. So what you're going to hear in this episode is us interviewing the founder of Viori. episode is us interviewing the founder of Viori. Joe is a kudla or kudla? How is it? Is it kudla? Yeah, kudla. KUDLA. Okay, so Joe Kudla is the founder and we're talking to him

in this episode and you're going to hear why we like him and we like his company. The product speaks for themselves, so I don't think I need to sell that that much. Go on their website. Viori clothing, in fact it's spelled, I'm going gonna spell it for you, it's kind of a weird name, V-U-O-R-I clothing.com, go to VioriClothing.com-foreslash-mind-pump

because we did hook up a 20%. No, it's 25%. 25%? 25%? Yeah, a quarter of the price off. 25% off. For Mind Pump. For our listeners only. But check it out, go to the website,

check out the products. They are super high quality, nice looking, workout apparel. And I think you guys are all gonna like it. So, now I think everyone's gonna love it. You guys will enjoy this conversation with Joe. He's definitely our people for sure. Also remember to all month long that the forum is free access with any of our bundles.

So all month long, we are running that special where any bundle you guys purchase, you get automatic free access into our forum that's normally $97 that you're saving on. We're just create, we just created some new bundles. If you haven't been over to the website, make sure you guys go check out mindplummedia.com. There you go. So with any further ado, here we are talking to Joe Kudla, the founder of Yuri. Now Joe, were you, are you podcast listener at all? Or is it like I am?

Okay, you are. So what are your typical podcasts that you would listen to now? Well, lately it's been mind pumped. Boom! But before I've been, you know, Joe Rogan, okay, been listening to him for a long time. He started listening to us and I really stuck. There's no reason for anybody else to ask. Joe's great guys. Joe's great. again, didn't listen to him for a long time. He started listening to us and I really thought he was going to read it.

He's no reason to say anything else to us. Joe's great. Joe's great. Now, but Joe, Tim Ferris, I listened to a lot of entrepreneurial stuff, like how I built this, entrepreneur on fire. Shopify has a series on kind of building econ businesses. And that's super bad.

Oh, off to check out. Is that a good one? Yeah, it's pretty good. They'll have different guests on that have built really cool inspiring companies. And they'll just show you little tricks along the way. It's been new territory for me. So.

Now, before we get into your brand and your company, I'd like to dive into you a little bit in your story because of course, the clothing is awesome. And of course, we're excited about all that. But I'm really interested to what led you in this direction, one, two, because you guys are direct to consumer, right? We're direct to consumer. We started D to C, but since we've kind of

morphed into a nominee channel business, which means we sell to wholesale accounts as well, like REI Nordstrom, and then we have a retail store in Ancenea's in our backyard. Oh nice. So you guys are in REI and Nordstrom now too. Yeah, I did know that. Oh, that's fucking very cool.

So how did this all start? Where did what were you doing before this and what made you go this direction? Yeah, so about 10 years ago I was introduced to yoga. I had really hurt my back playing football on the cross growing up. I was a really active guy, pretty much just constantly moving and developed a lot of pain in my lower back. So a friend suggested I should try yoga and I went to

a couple classes and I started feeling a lot of relief and so I became really devoted to my yoga practice. It was the first kind of, I would say, restorative thing I had ever done for my body. And that was really the aha moment because the first question I asked was like, what does a guy wear to yoga? It's true how long ago was this? Oh man. This was like, you figure that out. I started proud turning 40 in March and I started practicing at 30,

so it'll be about a 10 year. And 10 years ago, because I've done yoga on and off, I don't definitely don't have a practice, but I've done it quite a few times. 10 years ago, it wasn't very common to see a guy take a yoga class. Now today, it's like 30% in a lot of classes.

But before, we were by yourself. It was definitely, yeah. It was not a lot of guys around. Although I am from this little town called Encinitas, I don't know if you guys have been there. I actually managed a 24-feet. It's there a long time ago just for a month. Yeah, yeah, I live right by that, where that 24 hour fitness was.

Oh, okay. Tiny little location. Yep, yep. But, you know, Ensenitas is a unique town, because a lot of guys are into surfing. yoga is a very popular thing there. But, you know, also there's just tons of professional athletes, professional surfers, triathletes, you know,

so it's just a very active, cool, dynamic community. And so, you know, a lot of my friends were into surfing and they were using yoga as a tool to kind of stay in the water and stay flexible and feel good. And, you know, there's just weren't a lot of options. Like, Lou, lemon, obviously, I'll probably say the L word. I'm going to try not to say the L word very much today, but it might slip out. But Lou Lou was really focused on their women's business at the time. And they had a small men's rack in each store, but it didn't really feel like a men's shopping experience and really didn't feel like it was made for me. And so a couple of my friends and I just started planning seeds around this

idea to bring something to life that would really resonate with us in our lifestyle. Now, did you, were you into clothing and fashion style growing up? I mean, so, you know, a lot of people think I've lived nine lives. One of them actually was working as a model. I went to USD and played lacrosse, and the day I graduated, I got in on a plane and flew to Milan, and I spent two and a half years traveling around the world doing runway shows and modeling for the traction brands. So it was crazy, and believe me, I've gotten a ton of shit from pretty much everyone of

my friends for doing that. But a master of the blue steal, huh? I've mastered the blue steal. That's great. That's great. Yeah, it was a crazy experience and one that I definitely, forever grateful for, but definitely was not, I was not cut out to be a male model for the rest of my life. But that was kind of my introduction to fashion

and I always loved the creative side of it. I loved watching people bring products to life, but I didn't like being in front of the camera. I was always thinking I'd find a way to be on the other side of things. So the process of starting a line of clothing just sounds, I don't know anything about it. It's, I feel like it'd be daunting.

It feels like an industry that you enter and there's a huge fail rate. Is any of that true? What does that look like? How do you start your own clothing company? You know, it's funny. That brings back kind of just a memory of trying to raise money to start an apparel brand,

which was next to impossible because it does have such a high failure rate. It's kind of like your buddy saying, like, I'm gonna start a band, we're gonna be the next big thing, and, you know, will you give me some money to support me? It's just a very challenging industry. I think partly because there's no barriers to entry.

I mean, anybody can go and buy some t-shirt blanks, go to a screen printer, print a logo, and say, I have a clothing brand. And I had a couple of failed, I guess, I hate using the word failed, but I had a couple of learning experiences in the apparel business. When I got back from modeling,

I had started a financial consulting and recruiting company. And in San Diego, and it was fairly successful, and I had a little bit extra free time. And I started a couple different brands with some different local artists and designers because I always loved the space. And both of them didn't really ever go anywhere, but I learned a ton about what it takes to make clothes about the manufacturing process and that side of things, which is very complicated. There was a lot more in it than I had anticipated.

But I think that's kind of where I got my start in apparel was just messing around, going to LA on the weekends, and I'd buy a bunch of fabric, and we'd take it down to a local pattern maker, and we'd make up a couple of different patterns, and then we'd take it to the cutter, and I just learned that whole cycle kind of organically made a lot of mistakes along the way. But were you working at the time to support yourself or were you fully invested? Yeah, yeah, I was working. My first job out of the modeling days was at Ernst & Young. I studied accounting in school and I went to work for a big CPA firm

and that was just really a lot of hours. My buddy hated it dude, same exact company too. He comes to me at his school and I remember we lived together and he'd come home and he was just like, dude, this is especially your first few years, right? When you're working at a company like that, you're just like the photocopy guy forever and just long ass hours. It was a grind. I'd never worked so many hours in my life,

but I honestly look back on those days and I would definitely recommend anybody that wants to go into entrepreneurship, starting at a CPA firm is one of the best kind of just bad round. You know, you just sharpen your sword on so many other people's businesses and learning how they do things and what you know what to avoid It's a really valuable experience that I'm super stoked. I did it But you know it lasted two years and I was ready to go but during that time You know we my a girlfriend and I in my early 20s We kind of started this little apparel brand on the side and you know It's just trying to,

trying to figure out what I wanted to do, you know, and I'm always down to test new things. I think that's one of the things that, you know, I would pass along to any entrepreneur is just like, just try new things, like get into it, you know, like feel it out, see if it works for you. Was this your first time attempting to open or start your own business?

Yeah, yeah, that was my first time. Wow. So you're not, you're an anomaly. You'll only because most people entrepreneurs go through several, you know, companies and ideas before the work. Oh, right. Oh, you're saying, Vior is Viori my first. Yes. No, no, Viori would it be my, what would be my fourth? Yes. See, that's more like it. What was your first? So my first was a clothing company called Sammy Joe. It was a women's contemporary line. I didn't know anything about the fashion industry, but I'd just come back from Milan.

I was dating a designer, and she was graduating from school, and it was debating going to work for one of the bigger fashion brands. And she also had this itch to start her own thing. And I was like, let's just do our own thing. We can do this. I had tons of confidence, really ignorant, had no idea what it entailed, but I was like, let's do it, let's get into it. And that was what brought me to L.A. and you know, all the different fabric stores and the die houses and the cutting shops and all that kind of stuff. What's the mental state that, you know, what is it that made you say, like,

let's do that, because like you said, you didn't know, you didn't know that it was going to be a difficult or it can be one of those things that were the odds are really low. Like, what is the mental state that puts you there where you want to go and try these things and put your neck out there? Like, what is it about that? Because entrepreneurs seem to have that in common. How do you quantify that? Like, what do you feel when you do that?

I mean, for me, there's no other way to live. I've always just enjoyed pushing myself. Like, I feel like I wanna go to the top of every mountain and I wanna go to the bottom of the sea and experience it all in between. And, you know, entrepreneurship is just one channel for kind of, you know, experiencing that and living that in your life.

You know, athletics is another one. But, you know, for me, it all started when I was really young. I was raised in a really unique family. My dad was the first licensed acupuncturist in the state of Washington. And my mom studied Native American spirituality and, you know, led vision quests. So I just, I grew up in a really dynamic, interesting family that was just not status quo at all. And so I think that that ingrained within me a sense of just like, get out there and just, you know, don't really...

You different? Yeah, be different or don't subscribe to... Now did you rebel and become like a hardcore conservative like... You know what I'm saying? Like, mom and dad, I'm going to church right now and I don't know. I didn't go that direction, but I definitely, like, I felt a little bit torn because all my buddies, you know, I grew up playing football.

I was a really competitive athlete and, and all my buddies, whenever they'd come over to my house, they'd be like, where's the coke or the Pepsi? And I'd be like, nah, I'm hand, we got tofu and, you know, beans sprouts. Yeah, beans sprouts. So it was like, you know, I always was challenged by that, like feeling like a little bit out of

place. And so I think I rebelled in the sense that, you know, I kind of just wanted to surround myself by people that just had normal American families. And it wasn't until I got to be about 30 years old that I really looked back and really appreciated the way I was brought up and how different my family was, because I think it ingrained within me a sense of like, screw it. Like, get out there and be different. Just be you.

What are some of the do's and don'ts to starting up in a parallel line because we have a, and I don't know how familiar you are with this or not, but, you know, I come from this body builder background in Mins, Fizzica, competed in stuff, which is where they get a lot of these models on magazines. And one of the popular things to do is to build some one of a social media presence and then everybody thinks that building a clothing line

off of that is like, like, it's the natural progression. It's at the natural progression. And I've seen so many fail. I tried three myself over, since I was a kid, I wanted to do it, failed at all of them. In fact, when mine pump started to really explode, I remember that was one of the things that we all debated. And Justin and I both have done a peril a couple of times. And you know,

we looked at the rest of the guys were like, we're not doing a peril. This is not our expertise. Let's do what we do. And it was tough because we had so many people that were asking for that from us And we just had no desire to do it because of how challenging what are some of the things that you learned in your failures And leading up to where you're at now of like the just the the do's and the don'ts man Well, I think I under appreciated how much work Goes into it and how much experience Really helps you know appreciate it how much work goes into it and how much experience really helps. I think it's a double-edged story on one hand. I think that not having had any experience working in the apparel industry was such a blessing because if I had

been working say and design for any name the company, maybe you see like a little corner of the page, whereas for somebody like me who comes at it It's like I kind of a hack and saying like I've never worked in the apparel industry before I didn't know what it took and therefore I took the first step I think if I had just seen that corner of the page I would have said man to do that rest of the page I don't know what like I don't know how to do that and therefore I might feel a little bit limited by that So I think I think you think on that side of things, not having that experience, that ignorance was a blessing

because it helped me to take that first step. But the one thing that I think I see a lot of people that enter the apparel business, where they go wrong is not surrounding themselves with the right people. And my first two brands, I was working alongside people that didn't have experience in the apparel industry. And this, this time I took a different route.

You know, my first partner, who's now our VP of Marketing, came from a brand called Prana before that. She was with Globe and OP. But, you know, she had built, you know, and, and been through a lot of growth with different apparel brands. Our designer that I brought on early had to experience building great brands and designing for some world class brands and surf and athletic. And so I think being surrounded by people that had experience doing it before, it was just

an eye opening experience for me. But it's like that old adage, surround yourself with people that are smarter than you. In this case, I think bringing on people that had built apparel brands before and had experience in branding and experience in design and product development, that was such a difference for us. So I didn't have to make all the common pitfalls

and mistakes that maybe somebody would make that didn't have that. Is there a lot of differences for someone who's doing like a direct to consumer versus trying to do a brick and mortar type of place that you make different decisions based off of? Absolutely. I mean, the wholesale business, the way that the apparel industry used to work was, you

would make a set of samples, you'd take it out to show the wholesale account. Maybe that's, let's use Nordstrom as an example. So you'd have your samples, you'd take it to Nordstrom, you'd say, hey, do you like these? Do you want to buy them? Let's say they give you a purchase order, you would then go back and make that product for them, so you'd ship it to them, call it six months later.

That really, with the advent of the internet is really flipped on its head, and now, you don't want to take that much time in development. You want to bring something to market quicker. So as a D to C brand, you can really develop something, buy inventory, and bring it to market and get feedback really quick, and learn from your customer with a direct relationship, and figure out what works. Like, what do they like?

What do they not like? We had a really, I don't want to say a rocky start. But when we launched our business, we definitely used that interaction with customers to make some big pivots along the way that led to our success. You know, when we, within that first year, we were on a path towards, you know, going out of business is a strong word,

but we were definitely running out of money and we needed to change some things about what we were doing in order to kind of come through and see the other side. What are some of the biggest challenges you've encountered doing this? Well, the biggest challenge, you know, just to kind of follow up on what I was just saying was, really aligning, you know, first of all,

I would say, you know, finding that product market fit, right? And a lot of that comes down to also how you communicate and share what your product is. When we started the business, we knew that there was about six million guys in the United States practicing yoga, right? And we knew Viori would always be a little bit more than a yoga brand, but yoga was a great niche starting point.

And they always say like, you know, find a real sport specific, find a, an end use that's very like, you know, find a real sport specific, find a, an end use that's very clear, very specific and that's a great jumping off point. And so that's what we did, we knew. Well, that's a good point. So find like one, like, okay, here's our, our clothing line, it's for soccer players or whatever, start there and then from there, you can go into,

create that avatar head. I know you said you don't want to bring up the, the L word, but that's what Lulu, I think, did 100%. I'd say probably 80% of the women that I know that where Lulu don't do yoga. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I always say yoga was exploding in the US,

but I'm like, what came first? Was it the practice itself that was gaining popularity? Or was it Lulu lemon became so popular as a fashion statement that they inspired other people to tell you. That's a good discussion is what came first. I don't know if it was, because yoga was nowhere near as popular as it is now. It's such a buzz term now and it's been around forever. I remember being a trainer early on.

It wasn't something that people talked about that much. Not like you do now No, there's definitely a distinct style to that goes around you know the clothing that surrounds it or whatever Yeah, was that your original and that's obviously your original like this is what we're gonna work Yeah, yeah, so to answer your question about our biggest challenge You know we saw this massive market six million guys and just to put it in a perspective There's only four million guys that surf in the United States. And look at how many brands are competing for that quest. Quick silver, billi-ball, rip curl.

The list goes on, there's about 50 of them. With yoga, there was none. Lulu was focused a little bit on the space, but men's was predominantly an afterthought. And so our first, I was... Brilliant, dude. Our first learning experience was, I'd feeling that there was this big untapped market and so when we launched Our website and we started speaking to customers We were really going after that that targeted end use of men's yoga, you know

Is this this finally this this cool product for guys that were interested in yoga and you know We got some traction, but we recognized that it wasn't, we hadn't defined an engine of growth that was gonna propel us forward and lead to, you know, another round of funding to really get out of the gates. And so we knew that we had to pivot.

And so, you know, I hate using that again. Like, it wasn't really a failure or a mistake, but it was definitely, you know, a moment where I was losing a lot of sleep. You could ask my wife, I mean, she was going through it with me, but I was freaked out. I had this vision, this dream for this brand, and I saw it so clearly.

I was like, I know this thing's gonna work. I can see what it looks like 10 years from now. Torment, it was torment. I know exactly what that's like. It was tormenting. And so we started asking people, we were like, guys, okay, you bought the product, it was really simple to reach out to customers, it was about the product,

and we'd ask them, what do you guys use this for? Like, what do you like about it? What do you hate about it? Like, what other products are you wearing? How does it compare? And what was so interesting was like, yoga wasn't the top thing, it wasn't even the second or the third, like yoga was like the fifth thing

that people were buying the product for. Number one was running. Number two, I think was going to the gym. I think number three was chasing your kids around the house or something like that. And I think number four or five was yoga. And so that really opened our eyes and we started to think about ourselves.

You know, I was like, you know, I've been practicing, I've had a 10 year yoga practice practice and a 10-year meditation practice. I was like, okay, this is an opportunity to really learn and learn about myself and look inward. What I recognized was, okay, I am the Viori customer. If somebody was speaking to me and presenting, call it a quote-unquote men's yoga brand, would that be of interest to me? As a guy who's practicing almost daily, and the answer was really no. Like, I love yoga and I love the practice, not only for its physical, but also its spiritual

benefits, but I'm also a surfer, I run, I train, I ski, I just love to live a very diverse, active life. And I think that yoga specific participation was just a little bit limiting for me. So as soon as we started opening the aperture, so to speak, and talking about multiple venues and speaking to the versatility of the gear and allowing the customer to kind of make the decision and figure it out for themselves, we really started to take off. And that's where we defined that engine for growth. We had that recipe that we could take back to the market to go raise another round of capital. And that's when everybody started taking notice of the brand and, you know, some great wholesale partners came along. And, you know, I ordered some strategies you use to get that kind of feedback from your customers?

Because I know that like today with you know, social media, with email marketing, all these types of different options, that's like such a powerful tool that like new businesses really need to pick up on. 100%. I mean now this is the day and age of direct communication with your customers through social media, through email marketing. So we just, I think we used a free, maybe it was survey monkey and it was free.

We had an email database of people that had bought from us in the past. And we literally just created a little survey. We thought about what are the things we want to know about our customers. We sent it out to everybody that had bought from us and we got a representative sample back that gave us enough data to really feel confident that we You know, so we have a lot of entrepreneurs that listen to the show and you're saying now you pivoted in terms of Who the end user was? What does that mean? What does that look like?

Like is it mean your advertising changes? Does it mean? You're the type of apparel. Yeah, what does that mean? What does that look like? Is it mean your advertising changes? Does it mean you're the type of apparel? Yeah, what does that mean? Yeah, so the coolest thing that was really encouraging was that everybody loved the product. So it wasn't a product issue. Like everybody loved the product. It was just the voice. It was the communication that we were using.

So it was really just a matter of changing our advertising to go after, you know, just speaking to guys differently. We didn't even change our audience at all. So it wasn't that we were going after different guys. It was that we were talking to the whole thing. Yeah, we were just talking to them differently. Oh, wow. Whose idea was the tub, the frozen tub getting out, you getting out of that on the website. That was Nicky. That's our VP of marketing. Yeah, yeah. No, I love that. I mean, that was one of the things right away. I can have the fact that you had that, I was like, oh shit, that's crazy.

We're looking for one of those right now. You know on his website, they have the tub and he's cracking out of it. He's getting into it in the morning time. I think your brand speaks to just someone who's into an active lifestyle in general. Yeah, the thing is, I've worn yoga gear for men, like Lululemon stuff, very comfortable, high quality.

It just doesn't, and I'm sure a lot of people can echo this. It doesn't feel masculine, it doesn't feel masculine enough. You know what I mean? It's almost like girls' clothes turn into men's clothes, almost. It's hugging my ass too much. It's gonna be honest. So in your stuff, it's got that yoga feel, I guess,

or the comfort. Well, you're a good... It's very masculine. You were going after men. I mean, you have a women's line too, but you were going after men first, right? That was your intention. We launched as a men's brand.

Women's has come along more recently, but yeah, we launched as a men's brand. Lululemon, they're so smart. If you think about what was happening in the athletic apparel space before Lulu Lemon launched, it was dominated by big box retailers like Dick Sporting Goods, Sports Authority, Sports Shale,

and it was really a race for the bottom with the big brands that we grew up with. As a kid competing, playing sports and football, it's like I wanted to be the next Walter Peyton. He was like my idol. And the Nike's and the underarmers, they were speaking to me, right? But as a guy, his in my 30s, you know,

I'm just, that messaging isn't as relatable. And, you know, the product quality was really an erase for the bottom. They were really in the United States market. We were really, they were competing on price. And then you had a brand like Lulu came in and started working with materials that cost two, three times more, had a much higher degree of comfort, performance, stretch. They just worked better. The construction was so next level and it worked. I mean, they

were charging two, three, four times as much for the product, but it was working. So they really paved the way and created this category. But to your guys' point, it always felt like it was my girlfriend or my wife's brand. It didn't really feel like it was for me. No, no, and people now, where workout clothes now become, it wasn't that long ago, where workout clothes were only worn for if you're home by yourself on the weekend or whatever.

Or you're working out. It's fashionable now. Now it's becoming a fashion. Exactly, and for men, a fashionable workout clothes is just t-shirt and jeans, because we're not, there's really sweats. If you wear sweats all the time, we wear trainers, so we kind of get away with it, but you start to not look,

you know, like, come on, put some jeans on. I mean, take care of yourself. So, but the stuff you guys make is really high quality, and like, you can wear it all the time. It's not just. That was our whole philosophy was built to move installed for life. And it was all about bringing this kind of

new aesthetic, this new perspective to men's performance peril. You know, we're all surfers, we're from the beach and we were living in board shorts and we're in board shorts to the gym. And so we wanted to just bring this more casual West Coast vibe in DNA into men's active. And you know, if you think about a lot of these brands, these men's athletic brands have

been more inspired by urban and street culture, whereas like, Viori is inspired by the beach and our backyard and where we're from. And so it's just a different look and feel. But every material, everything we make is with the best quality materials on the planet. I mean, we're working with the best textile companies, the best factories. You know, we're building products that's made to last. It has a different aesthetic, a different look and feel from everything. It's great, man.

I mean, I grew up in Santa Cruz, and so, you know, I've, you know, very much immersed in surf culture, and like, I would wear brands and stuff, but I always felt like such a poser, because I don't surf. It's just like perfect, because it's finally something that's like, I'm into training, I'm into lifting, I'm into that whole world being active, but yeah, it still has that kind of aesthetic

that's, you know, all these other awesome brands I've worn before. Did you have some moments in the last three, four years that were major pivotal moments for the business where I tell people this all the time, when scaling a business, you tend to have this, you're grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, everything seems the same, then you get this nice little spike

that you did something like just it came together, and then you grind, grind, grind, grind, and then you see another, have you had pivotal moments like that in this? Yeah, absolutely. I think I give a lot of praise to REI for having the vision and foresight to bring us on it early as a partner.

But REI, they were looking at the men's fitness concept and they wanted to experiment with some emerging brands and do something, bring in some product that not everybody had. So they brought in Viori alongside a handful of other emerging brands and some legacy brands and they merchandise this in. I think it was 10 or 11 stores,

and we were excited about it, but also scared. And did well. Yeah, we got data back. We were the number one performing brand in that incubator program. No shit, sitting alongside, you know, some really, you know, top brands that we aspired to, and we, you know, some of our favorite brands,

we were like, wow, we're hanging with these guys, man. That had an exciting. And that was the moment that we were like, okay, we got something. We got something. Like this is gonna work. What does that process look like? How do you even get in front of Aurea to look at your stuff?

Did you just, did you have to like hammer their phones or were they? No, you know, it happened really organically for us. And you know, I believe, you know, this is a little hokey-poky, but I believe that business is just energy. And when you hire and align a team and everybody's swimming in the same direction, everybody

has the same vision, things like this just start to happen. But for us, the way it all went down is our head of marketing came from a brand that sells pretty big at REI, and a friend of hers had left and gone to REI. So we just sent them a package of product. When we first got our first product drop and we just sent them a package of product. When we first got our first product drop and we just sent them some gear and said, I hope you like it, just enjoy it. And we did a lot of that. Sending product out to people that, you know, were up to different things. And we didn't hear anything back. I mean, he obviously gave us a thumbs up and said thanks, but maybe I

think it was a year later, we got a call from the buyer at REI. And it turned out she was, she had connected with that guy and said, hey, I'm looking for something new in men's athletic, where do you know of anything? And he says, matter of fact, he said some of my friends down in Encinitas have launched this really cool brand. I love it. I wear it all the time and you should give them a call.

And that's how it happened. Just goes to show like one of the things about business that's always difficult, I think, to learn for some people is you think of the big things that you could do that seem obvious, but sometimes it's these little chance meetings or, you know, there's a term that they use in sale called always be closing, ABC, always be closing and people, a lot of times people,

I would teach my salespeople that and they would be confused as what that means. What it really means is it's all these little encounters, all these little things that you do that can turn into big things. So treat every encounter like it's a big one. You know, when you get that guest, who you think, oh, this person's not gonna get,

buy whatever, treat them like they will, you never know what it can turn into. It looks like that's what happened with you guys. With that particular. Now are we gonna be the first podcasts that you guys do anything with? Have you done anything with the podcast yet at all? We did one podcast over the phone.

This is my first time in studio. Okay, cool. Who was the other podcast you guys did something with before? Oh gosh. We'll probably wait better than they are, so good to be honest. We're not competitive at all. No, I'm really excited because one of the things, so part of what Taylor represents for us

at the business, and I'm excited, he looks specifically for brands like yours, for brands that really align with the same demographic as ours, something that we need right now, which is a parallel because we've been getting so many people wanting it, but we haven't wanted to just pair with any fucking brand. We'd rather work with somebody who I think aligns with our message. So, I'm really excited. I think you guys are going to be surprised at the response that you see from our community, because I really think that the brand aligns with it. There's a little pent up demand there for sure.

For sure. So, I'm excited to see what it looks like, man. Excellent. So, moving forward, what are some of the future goals Are you guys like what are you looking to do? So we're going to keep focus on doing what we do. You know, it's all about the product in our business. So, you know, we spend a lot of time just product not sees.

We just we make it, we wear it, we test it, we put it through the grind. And it's going to continue to be a product focus brand. But, you know, as far as kind of strategic growth, how we're gonna do it, you know, the e-commerce business has always been a big part of it. It's really what got us out of the gates and it wasn't until we built a customer base that the wholesale guys wanted to come and talk to us.

And so that's one thing that, you know, if anybody's listening, it's in entrepreneurship. It's like, sometimes you gotta build it before they come and that was our case. Like, we had to go out and build the customer base. Nobody wanted this. We were like, we've got this men's athletic apparel brand. We haven't even started thinking about women's yet. You guys, we don't have space for you, not the right time. We built a customer base and then they came knocking. We're going to keep focusing on our direct business.

But now we've got this incredible wholesale business. We're sold in over 650 doors across the country. REIs, one of our larger partners, we just launched a business with Nordstrom. We're excited about that, but we sell across a lot of different outdoor specialty stores, a lot of yoga studios, corpareoga, and yoga works, being two of the bigger ones.

A lot of gyms like Equinox. So we're going to keep focusing on the wholesale business. And what we're really excited about is we have a flagship retail store in Incinitas. And it's really become more of like a community hub. We launched the Viori Active Club, where we're doing bootcamp workouts in yoga classes. We bring in local and emerging artists.

And we do art shows and have great little parties. And it's just become this cool little community hub in Incinitas. And so we're looking to expand our retail footprint with Fiori retail stores. We gotta get down there for one of those. That'd be cool. I love it in the space.

Yeah, it'd be cool to do like a little seminar or something like that for you guys down there. We'd love to have you guys down. Any pieces of apparel that just outperformed that you weren't, it was blew you away, like, oh shit, I did this vest and it was fucking crazy. Anything like that happened? The yoga vest.

Yeah, the yoga vest. I'm cool too, but I started anything to flop that you were excited about, like, is there, I mean, this has got to happen, right? There's gotta be pieces that you put out there and you think are gonna be awesome. And then you're like, what the fuck? Nobody liked it.

Well, I think the biggest, like one of the learnings that I've had along the way is that you got to build a clothing brand in stages. And, you know, especially nowadays, like you only get one message to a customer, right? So for us, when we launched, it was all about the men's short. We were like, we were like, okay, if you go to the gym, you can wear an old cotton t-shirt,

but you got to have something that works as a short. And so we approached the business as a short business first and foremost. And so our core short was kind of, we say one short every sport, but it's our most versatile athletic short. It's built with a cool max liner. So it wicks moisture, keeps you dry and comfortable,

has four-way stretch. It's just a great everyday short, and it transitions really well. So you can throw it on, wear it to a cafe, or go meet a friend for a drink at a bar. And so the course short was really our foundation that we built upon and then the banks. But I guess what I'm saying is, you know, approaching your business almost as an item-driven business at first is smart because when you're looking to acquire customers online, you can't talk to them about 30 pieces of clothes. You got speak to them about why they wanna give you a shot

and you gotta lead with your best. So for us, it was all about the shorts. We were like, we got the banks, which doesn't have a liner, and it goes in and out of the water really well. It's built with antimicrobial properties, four-way stretch. We got the core short and a few others,

and it was like, that was our little staple at the beginning. And then since, I think every once in a while, we get really fired up to bring something new to market that we love, but our customers are just still on our shorts. So we've definitely had those moments where we're like, man, we got this rad new jacket. Jackets haven't done super well.

What's fun now is we're in our fourth year of business, and now we've got this loyal customer base, and they trust us now. So they've tried our shorts, they've maybe tried a top, and now they're moving into jackets and sweats and pants, and so it's really fun now, but it's taken almost four years to get the trust of the customer

to have permission to build a more full rounded collection. And so yeah, there's been a lot of misses along the way for sure. When did you start doing this full time I know when you first started you were working well I was working on the first one but you know with this iteration of V-O-R-E because it's actually the second iteration the first one was a little graphic T line that we called V-O-R-E but um this one I went all in right off the right off the bat um you know that's one thing that the apparel business has so many moving parts, there's so much work to do. And I knew that if it was gonna become what I wanted it

to become, I was gonna have to jump in with two feet. Was that scary? Oh yeah, yeah. It was really scary. Yeah, I asked that because that's such a big. Yeah. Sometimes I feel like that's what makes the difference. You know what I mean, psych? You're trying to be safe.

I remember- I start a business and then it's- 100%. When you jump in full all the way, it's like a change as I remember. I remember when we were first transitioning from- So this started all in Doug's living room then it transitioned into a little three,

four hundred square foot studio and then now the big studio we're in now. And I remember telling these guys before we transitioned here, I was really pushing us to go when we weren in now. And I remember telling these guys, before we transitioned here, I was really pushing us to go when we weren't ready. Because we were waiting, everyone was waiting until we all had nice salaries. Now, dude, like, let's go now and it's scary. Because if it's scary, I know I'll get the best that I've ever, like everyone's comfortable with salaries moving into this project. I feel so, I think there is something to be said about putting

yourself all the way out there like that with that risk where you have to survive, you know? Absolutely. You know, and you gotta be smart about it, you know, you don't wanna jump too quick, but for me, it was like, this is something I'd always wanted to do, it was a moment in time where I had a staffing company that I exited and had enough savings where I could scrape things by and, you know,

wasn't married, didn't have a kid. Were you date, were you with your wife at the time? Were you single? We had started dating about a year in, um, to be worried. So a year after you went, hauling? Yeah. Were you broke? Or were you, uh, just like, that was definitely coming up on

the Taco Bell. Well, that's good. So you met her before you had. Yeah. Okay, see? You know, you got a good one. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. That's good. Well, cool, man. Well, we're excited? You know you got a good one. Yeah, exactly. Exactly, that's good.

Well cool, man, we're excited to work with you guys. I mean, your stuff is very, very, very high quality. Yeah. You know, a peril, it just really is. It's really nice stuff. We have to work out in Tampa. Yeah, we did. We got the samples from Taylor.

I put it on, I'm like, oh, this shit, this is really nice stuff. You're super comfortable. I'm rocking a shirt right now. I mean, it's for sure some of my favorite gear I have now. So we're pumped, man. So we're really, really pumped about the brand. So I can't wait to see what we create

and what we do later on. Yeah, man, thanks for coming on the show. Absolutely. Love what you guys have built with Mind Pump for Super Stoked. And by the way, for any of your listeners that want to try any of our gear, VioriClothing.com slash Mind Pump, there's a special offer.

Perfect. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal isothing.com slash Mind Pump, there's a special offer. Perfect. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbumble at MindPumpMedia.com. The RGB Superbumble includes maps on the ball,, maps performance and maps aesthetic. Nine months of phased, expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam & Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs.

With detailed workout blueprints in over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal Adam & Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a 430-day money-back guarantee and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at MindPumpMedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing MindP Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.