Murder, Mystery & Makeup - Serial Killers, Cults, & Cannibals: The *TWISTED* Case of Ottis Toole

Episode Date: August 19, 2025

Hi friends, happy Tuesday! I've been putting out episodes of MMM for a while now, but occasionally I come across a story that shakes me to my core. And keeps me up at night. This is one of them. The... story of Ottis Toole (and his literal partner in crime Henry Lee Lucas) involves cannibalism, a cult and even a cameo by Ted Bundy. The horrific actions of Ottis even went on to help inspire the man who created of a TV show we all remember from our youth... America's Most Wanted. The story of Ottis Toole is one you will not forget for a long time to come. Also, I sometimes talk about my Good Reads in the show. So here's the link if you want to check it out. IDK. lol: https://www.goodreads.com/user/show/139701263-bailey ________ FOLLOW ME AROUND Tik Tok: https://bit.ly/3e3jL9v Instagram: http://bit.ly/2nbO4PR Facebook: http://bit.ly/2mdZtK6 Twitter: http://bit.ly/2yT4BLV Pinterest: http://bit.ly/2mVpXnY Youtube: http://bit.ly/1HGw3Og Snapchat: https://bit.ly/3cC0V9d Discord: https://discord.gg/BaileySarian RECOMMEND A STORY HERE: cases4bailey@gmail.com Business Related Emails: bailey@underscoretalent.com Business Related Mail: Bailey Sarian 4400 W. Riverside Dr., Ste 110-300 Burbank, CA 91505 ________ So if your brain’s been playing True Crime: Home Edition lately, go to https://www.nocd.com. . Stop seeing carts going abandoned and turn those sales into $$$. Sign up for your one-dollar-per-month trial and start selling today at https://www.shopify.com/makeup. 

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Hi, friends. How are you today? My name is Bailey Sarian, and today is Monday, which means it's murder, mystery, and makeup Monday. Hi! If you're new here, hi, my name is Bailey Sarian, and on Mondays I sit down, I talk about a true crime story. That's been heavy on my noggin, and I do my makeup at the same time. So, today's story, let me tell you, it's rough, it's real bad. We're talking about this guy. His name's Otis Toole. He was a serial arsonist. murderer and self-proclaimed carnival. Between the early 60s and the early 80s, Otis, he had killed, like, allegedly over 100 people across at least like 26 states in the U.S.
Starting point is 00:00:47 Some of his victims were hitchhikers, teenagers, and sex workers. Others were massage parlor employees, bank tellers, or, like, convenience store workers. This guy, he, he's wild. He, like, dismembered some of his victims and then, like, drove around in his car with the body parts. Yeah. And then at times, he allegedly, like, drink their blood.
Starting point is 00:01:15 So, here we go with that, you know? So Otis, he actually committed many of his gruesome crimes with another notorious serial killer. This is like a crossover episode. His name was Henry Lucas. Did we do an episode on him? I can't remember right now. But Henry Lucas is also like this crazy serial killer,
Starting point is 00:01:38 and him and Otis linked up, and they were like allegedly lovers. On top of all that, there's a cult thrown into the mix. This one's got everything, right? I know. There's a lot going on, baby. And this is just the intro. Now, let's start with Otis, huh? So Otis Elwood, Toul.
Starting point is 00:02:01 He was born March 5th, 1947, and he was raised in Jacksonville, Florida. It was said that his father, not a great guy, he was like an alcoholic, and he ended up leaving the family when Otis was just a kid. But not before causing his son, Otis, significant damage. Now, according to Otis himself, when he was just a kid, but not before causing his son, Otis, significant damage. Now, according to Otis himself, when he was just five years old, his father forced him to have sexual relations with his father's friend. If that wasn't enough, Otis's mother, I guess also, like, abused him. She would dress him up in girls' clothing and then call him Susan.
Starting point is 00:02:46 Yep. So, Mommy wasn't safe. Daddy wasn't safe. And then his older sister, she too wasn't safe because it was said, this is all according to Otis. He said that his older sister started having sex with him before he could even like really understand what was going on. And then I'm laughing because it's just, you know, it's just because it gets worse because everyone's messed up, right? And then Otis's grandma, I guess she had added to all the abuse. So Otis's grandma, it was said that she was a Satanist, and she called Otis the devil's child.
Starting point is 00:03:33 Cute. I don't know, you know, like, I don't know. You know, yep, all right. So instead of like teaching him how to be a kid, I don't know, just be normal, how to play, read, cook, show him love. she instead showed young Otis satanic practices and rituals and introduced him to one of her favorite hobbies grave robbing great so i think um between you and i i think it's safe to say that otis had a rough upbringing right and uh it probably would be surprising if odis grew up to be like quote unquote normal after all these horrible experiences
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Starting point is 00:06:01 life. So if your brain's been playing True Crime Home Edition lately, go to nocd.com. That's nocd.com and get the right help. So it was said that Otis had behavioral and, like, mental issues that were pretty obvious from an early age. He also had epilepsy, which caused him to have, like, some serious seizures. So when Otis was in school, he was diagnosed with intellectual disability because he had an IQ of 75. And, you know, I guess the average IQ score is anywhere from, like, 90 to 100. nine. So he was just a little off, you know? During his childhood, Otis ran away from his home pretty often. And I guess he would just like run away, go find an abandoned house somewhere and just like sleep there. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, probably just a wild guess here. But I'm sure
Starting point is 00:07:00 it was to get away from his psycho family. It's so sad. But when he was alone, this is when he he liked to play with fire, you know, and he would burn things. And soon he just became an arsonist. He would say from a young age, setting fires, sexually aroused him. So Otis ended up dropping out of school in the ninth grade. And this is when he began visiting like local gay bars. And around the same time as a teenager, he became, became a male sex worker and he also, I guess, developed like an obsession with pornography. This is a side note.
Starting point is 00:07:46 I mean, I'm sure we all maybe feel this way, maybe we don't, but I feel so bad for him. Like he really just had a crappy upbringing and he was not set up to be a great guy. You know, it's just really sad. Two things can be right at the same time. He can be a really terrible person and we hate him and we can also feel bad for him.
Starting point is 00:08:03 Like there's nothing wrong with that. Now according to Otis, he comes committed his first murder when he was just 14 years old. So at this age, he was picked up by a traveling salesman. And I guess this traveling salesman got a little forceful with Otis. We don't really know exactly what happened, but what we do know is that some kind of altercation happened. And Otis was able to like take over the guy's car
Starting point is 00:08:32 and somehow get the guy out of the car. He takes over the car, runs the guy over with it. Guess he killed him. Otis would talk about this later in life, but at the time he was never caught for this or like charged. So Otis like kind of just disappeared off the radar between 1966 and 1973. Some people believe that he was drifting around in the southwest, like United States at the time, but that's just what people believe. No one really knows. Then in 1974, he was considered a suspect in a murder case. But before he could be questioned by police, he actually ends up taking off to Boulder, Colorado. In September of 1974, Otis allegedly raided a massage parlor
Starting point is 00:09:22 in Colorado Springs. So he goes into like this massage parlor, allegedly. And he goes in there and he like stabs and he slashed the throat of an employee. Her name was Young. he moved on to Lee's co-worker and like raped her then he stabbed and shot her to death i mean it was aggressive it was it was it was a lot it was aggressive and angry and hate fueled like it was bad because then then on top of that he ends up setting them both on fire yeah my but listen somehow yon lee she ended up surviving oh yeah and you know she was able to call the police and she gave a description of who her attacker was she tells the police that it was this guy like six foot two hundred and ninety five pounds clean-shaven white man and a white pickup truck
Starting point is 00:10:32 And that's really all she knew. But what we know now is that it matched Otis's description. Unfortunately, at the time, like, Otis was, he was never found. The next month in October, 1974, 31-year-old Ellen, she was abducted in Pueblo, Colorado, and she was found, like, shot three times in the head. Her body ended up getting dumped near the Oakland. Oklahoma border. At the time it was unsolved, like there was like kind of, they didn't know, they didn't have any leads on this. But then later on, like homicide detectives would link Otis
Starting point is 00:11:15 to this crime. But at the time, it was just kind of like, well, I don't know. Now, before police could get to him, he had left Boulder and he returned to Jacksonville, Florida in 1975. So while he's back in Florida, he started again working as, you know, a male sex worker. So this part is a little vague in his history because like he ends up meeting a woman and he ends up getting married to her in like January of 1976. She is 25 years older than him and I'm not sure how they met. There's just not much known. But it was said like much later in life, Otis, he gave like interviews, whatever. So much later he said that he married this woman because he needed to or he wanted to hide his true sexuality. So he gets married to some woman. So in 1976 after he
Starting point is 00:12:18 gets married, this is when Otis meets Henry Lee Lucas in a Jacksonville soup kitchen. Now just a few years later, like after this meeting, Henry would become one of like the most notorious American serial killers in history. And we'll probably never find out how many people Henry actually killed. But him and Otis were working together, really. So Henry had reached Jacksonville with like no money and nowhere to stay. So he had learned that there was like a religious mission that offered free food and housing. And that's where he met Otis. The two of them somehow just connected, they started talking, chatting it up. And they really seemed to hit it off because like after meeting for the first time, Otis invited Henry to come back to his place. Now Henry and
Starting point is 00:13:12 Otis, they would become lovers. I think many say because of like based on like mutual attraction. And also they had, um, they had similar stories. They had a lust for killing. They also had like super messed up backgrounds and family history. So they just like really bonded and connected on all that. I mean, both Henry and Otis had been raised by abusive mothers who had forced their sons to dress as girls. Both had suffered sexual trauma before the age of 10. And by the time they met, both of them were already murderers. So they're like, hey, you like that shit? I like that shit too and then they just like made it off and they're perfect for each other so for henry and otis killing was like just a way for them to bond you know they talked about it openly they would compare
Starting point is 00:14:03 notes and they would give they would give each other tips like hey i chopped off the head first and then i went for like the feet and stuff what about you and like i went for the feet and stuff not the head like you know just notes so at this time Otis was living in a fairly small house, but he was sharing the house with like a bunch of people. It was Otis's mom, his stepdad, Otis's wife, Otis's niece and nephew, who were like 11 or 12 years old, and then Otis. So six people. And I guess the family was like quite used to Otis bringing strange men home from the mission to have sexual relations with. It wasn't unusual.
Starting point is 00:14:51 It was normal. But what made it weird and inappropriate was, like, he would bring men back to his home to have sex with him, but also to have sex with his wife and his underage niece. Yeah. You know, Otis was one of those people who, like, what do you call them? When they like to watch, when they like to watch, you know what I'm saying? Mm-hmm. but when Otis brought Henry back to his place it was a little different he wanted Henry like all to himself he didn't want to share
Starting point is 00:15:26 so he told his wife to go to go like live with the neighbors go stay with the neighbors you know so he and Henry could have the main bedroom I guess Otis felt like his wife was in the way and honestly he was getting a little jealous because she was trying to come in between him and Henry you know and Otis he wanted Henry all to himself. Well, according to police records, shortly after Henry and Otis met, they spent their free time drinking and, like, cruise in the highways, looking for quote, unquote, fun. Now, apparently their idea of fun, different than a lot of ours, they like to, like, rob small convenience stores and banks. They stole money, food, beer. And I guess they just really enjoyed, like, terrorizing the staff of wherever they were robbing.
Starting point is 00:16:24 Now, the two of them, they became bolder and more violent over time. Things progressed. Eventually, their crimes became more brutal to the point where, like, if the person that they were robbing or harassing, if that person, like, resisted at all, they would just, like, they didn't think twice. They would just gun them down and then just leave them in, like, a pool of blood. So apparently, Otis and Henry robbed like a small convenience store in western Georgia. I guess Henry had walked to the front counter. He pulled out a 22 caliber handgun and he held it to the temple of the female clerk. He then binds her with like a rope, then drags her to the back of the store while Otis went through the register.
Starting point is 00:17:13 So I guess like the woman, naturally, you know, she's going to, she's screaming. she's screaming and she's struggling and she's trying to get loose and Henry tells her like if she doesn't keep quiet he's going to have to shoot her so I guess at this moment she just obeyed so Henry and Otis were like dividing the money up and that's when Henry noticed that the woman was trying to loosen the ropes again so he Henry casually like walked to the back of the store and he just again doesn't hesitate and he shot her right through the temple. Afterwards, while Henry loaded stolen cases of beer into their car, Otis took this opportunity to have
Starting point is 00:17:55 sexuals with the woman's body. And I guess they did this a lot. Yeah. Otis and Henry seemed to be like competitive with one another. Like they were trying to prove who was, who was more lethal, who was more bad? Just, just not great, these guys. Otis later bragged to police of one such incident. When you're starting your own business, people love to call it a small business, but there's
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Starting point is 00:20:08 highway through Texas, they, Henry and Otis, came across like a teenage couple walking alongside the road. I guess the couple's car had run out of gas and they were on their way to a gas station. So Otis and Henry, they see this couple and they pull over and Otis like steps out of the vehicle and without even hesitation just like shoots the boy nine times in the head and his chest and then rolled his body into a tunnel under the road while Henry dragged the girl into the backseat of the car. So Otis drove the car. They take off and, you know, Henry's in the backseat, like repeatedly raping the girl.
Starting point is 00:20:54 Otis said that watching Henry have sex with like someone else made him angry. These two are just so fucked up. He's getting angry. He's driving the car, Otis. So I guess in a jealous rage, Otis stops the car. He dragged the girl out onto the road and then shot her six times and then just left while they drove back towards Jacksonville. Everyone they came in contact with in their eyes was like a potential victim. Drifters, women with car troubles, hitchhikers, they would all fall victim to this deadly duo.
Starting point is 00:21:34 Usually when they committed a murder, it was like done in a very remote. remote area where, you know, there were no witnesses. And if their car broke down or ran out of gas, Otis, and Henry, they would just, like, steal another one, usually after murdering the driver. And then they would just jump in and be like, it's ours now. The two of them, if they stole a car, they would drive the vehicle to another state, dump it, and then hitchhike to, like, the next location. Henry said that he enjoyed killing women whose cars had broken down on lonely roads, telling police that he considered them, quote, free lunch. What do you even say to that?
Starting point is 00:22:13 What do you even say to that, huh? There was one victim that was found, like, dumped in a field. She was found, like, completely nude. She had been stabbed 35 times in the chest, the neck, arms, and the back. And there were, like, deep cuts that were made along the inside of her arms. and from the middle of her chest to all the way down to the pubic bone. This is on like dark shit, you know?
Starting point is 00:22:42 On top of that, both nipples had been cut off and removed. I would say like this guy's like a truly a psycho, but I feel like psycho isn't even the right word for how dark these guys are. Maybe they really are children of Satan or whatever grandma called them. So according to police who pieced together their trail from like pay slips and discarded vehicles,
Starting point is 00:23:01 they believe that Otis and Henry were responsible for up to four to five murders in each state before moving across state lines. The police believed that on like more than two occasions, the pair committed several murders in a single day. Now, Colt, where does that come in? Let me tell you. Because according to both Otis and Henry, while they were on their murder sprees, they were approached by a stranger who offered them a job.
Starting point is 00:23:35 Now the job was to like deliver stolen cars to various destinations. And I guess Henry wasn't really too interested in this. And he's like, no, I'm good. Like he felt like it would just increase their chances of getting caught by the police. Like they didn't need it. They were doing just fine without it. They said after that the stranger then made another offer. The stranger asked if they,
Starting point is 00:24:00 would be interested in contract killing for his quote unquote organization. The stranger told them that they would be paid $10,000 for each execution. Well, after hearing this, now Henry and Otis they were interested. $10,000. I mean, that's a lot of money, you know, and they figured that since they'd been killing for fun, they might as well just like get paid for it. The stranger said they would be hired on one condition. Otis and Henry had to join the organization's religion. So Henry asked like, okay, what's this religion? You know? And the stranger told him that it was like a group and they called themselves the hand of death. And this group, they worshipped the devil. Now later on, Otis would kind of disagree with some of these meeting details. But apart from like
Starting point is 00:24:55 their differences in their stories, they both swore that they did, in fact, join the hand of death. And also, side note, if you look up the hand of death and you go on like a deep dive trying to find information about it, you don't find anything about it only when it's linked to this story. So, you know, I don't know, fishy. But look, so they end up joining, I guess. Several weeks later, they traveled to Florida to meet the leaders of this cult. They end up meeting in an abandoned warehouse on Miami's waterfront, and the same stranger, whoever that stranger was, the same stranger met them and introduced himself as Dawn. When Don began to talk about the crimes that the two had committed in the past,
Starting point is 00:25:46 Henry became a little suspicious about the situation and asked Don like, how he knew so much about Henry and Otis. He's like, how did you know how many crimes we've done? How do you know about me? And I guess at this point, Don laughed and said that Otis had actually been working for him for years. So what was it a setup? Henry told police years later that at the time,
Starting point is 00:26:11 he felt betrayed by Otis, and he couldn't believe that, like, he had been manipulated by him into joining the cult. So that night in an abandoned spot in the Florida Everglades, Henry was inducted into the Hand of Death. Later, he and Otis were taken deeper into like the Everglades on an airboat. I had to look this up, so I was like, well, it's an airboat, what's a boat with those giant fans on the back of it? I'm laughing because I'm sure everyone knows what an airboat is. I just, I didn't.
Starting point is 00:26:45 That's okay. Anyways, they went on a giant airboat and they get taken. deeper into the Everglades. And they were taken to an island where Henry would undergo, quote, unquote, training. So Don had told them that from now on, Henry had to do everything he was told no matter what. Like he had to obey. And once Henry proved himself, that's when he would officially be one of the members in the cult. So both men were then taken into a tent. And And Henry was told to wait for his assignment. So he's waiting there, like an hour goes by.
Starting point is 00:27:26 Finally, Don comes back and tells him that his target was in the next tent. And that Henry needed to, like, go into that tent and cut that person's throat. But he had to make sure that, like, it was a clean cut because the cult peeps, the cult people, they would need the body later. So, armed with a knife, Henry and Otis went to the next. tent. Otis went in first and he like struck up a conversation with the mail that was inside of the tent. Otis then lured the man to like a nearby beach with the promise of a drink. I guess Otis had like a bottle of whiskey or something with him and he's like, hey, like let's go have a drink and look at the water. He lures him out. Meanwhile, Henry is like waiting in the shadows. And when Otis
Starting point is 00:28:18 hands the man the bottle you know he takes a swig and he like tips his head back that's when henry comes running up grabs the man hair grabs the man's hair and then in one quick swipe he like yeah it was said that henry was congratulated on a quick clean kill again we don't even know like if this story is true or not, where it's coming from or anything, because you can't find any evidence about any of this. Even investigators didn't find anything about this. So could be true, could be made up. But the fact that they had like similar details to the story, it sounds like it wasn't made up, but I don't know. No one knows. But later that night, Henry attended his first Black Mass, during which, like, the man that he had just killed was in cooked and
Starting point is 00:29:13 eaten by everyone in the cult. So there's that. So in the weeks after that, Henry said that he was taught the finer points of kidnapping, arson, murder, and child abduction. He was also taught, like, the best way to prepare a human sacrifice. Around seven weeks later, Henry, I guess, completed his training and was ready to, quote, go to work. So then he and Otis set off on a road trip to the southern states to kidnap children. Yeah, they would kidnap children and these children would either be used as like in sacrificial
Starting point is 00:29:55 ceremonies within the cult or they would be trafficked and sold on the gray market to wealthy families. According to Otis and Henry, they said that they had kidnapped multiple kids from babies to teenagers and they did horrible things. I left all the horrible things they did out. It's just, it's a lot. It's real bad. Police would later like search huge areas of the Florida Everglades by boat and helicopter looking for any kind of evidence they could find of this cult's existence, but they found nothing. They never did. Henry explained this by telling police that the cult was a nationwide conspiracy involving senior police officials and politicians. And they had the power to disappear if they wanted to.
Starting point is 00:30:54 So yeah, they were hard to find, you know? Allegedly after carrying out further tasks for this death cult, Henry was told, like, to just go back home and wait for further instructions. I guess, though, at the time, like, Otis decided to stay back. and he was like, I'll meet up with you later. So Henry left and Otis stayed. Now, if this cult did in fact exist, and if Henry was paid handsomely for the crimes he committed,
Starting point is 00:31:24 there was no evidence of like his newfound wealth, you know, when he returned to Jacksonville. So in May of 1981, Otis's mother, Sarah, she, I guess, had died of old age. and after her death, they took in, like, their niece, Otis's niece and nephew. So they take in the niece and nephew. The niece's name is Becky. And they decide to travel together, the four of them, to California.
Starting point is 00:31:56 During this, like, cross-country road trip, they murdered people along the way. They caused chaos. They just did all the bad things you can think of. they were doing it okay and like a lot of the times the niece and nephew would just be like waiting in the car for them they're like hey we'll be right back and they just be waiting in the car and no i don't know we don't know if they knew what was going on i'm assuming they didn't i don't know but it's fucked up oh and i forgot to mention henry and the niece becky they were involved in like a little love situation. A relationship is what Henry would call it, but she was 12, so I don't think
Starting point is 00:32:42 anyone would call it that. Anyway, during their cross-country road trip, Otis got really sick and ended up having to be hospitalized. And then while he was hospitalized, Henry, he got arrested. He got caught for theft, and he was in like thrown in jail. So the niece and the nephew, they were returned, uh, to their biological mother. This whole thing was just a shit show. I don't know what their plan was with the niece and nephew. Eventually, both of the guys would return to Jacksonville, Florida, like when they got out from the hospital and from jail. And by 1983, the relationship between Otis and Henry, it had begun to fall apart. No one really knows why they fell apart, but they ended up going their own ways. They split up, see you
Starting point is 00:33:37 later, and they just goodbye. Otis was left on his own, but that didn't stop him from doing some wild shit. He ended up getting arrested in June of 1983 after he burned down two houses in Jacksonville, Florida. And while he was in custody, Otis ended up confessing to starting around 40 different fires in the last like two decades. He also confessed to starting a fire in Jacksonville and a Jacksonville boarding house back in January of 1982. And in this fire, it ended up killing like a 65 year old man. His name was George Sonberg. So he tells police that he was responsible for that and Otis ends up signing a confession stating that he and Sonberg actually were in a sexual relationship and after the two had gotten into like a big argument Otis he set his home on fire
Starting point is 00:34:41 and then he said after he started the fire he walked across the street and he just watched He watched and he masturbated twice to the fire. Yeah. It was an interesting detail. I thought I'd just throw in there. I don't know. A few days after Otis's arrest, Henry was arrested for unlawful possession of a firearm in Montauk, County, Texas. Now, once he was arrested, this time he started boasting about like his murderous rampage that he and Otis went on.
Starting point is 00:35:19 I don't know. Maybe he was just like, he was over it. Maybe he was just over it. At first, when, like, word got back to Otis, he denied everything. He denied everything Henry was saying and any involvement. But once he learned that Henry was, like, talking to the cops and taking them on guided tours of, like, where their murder sites were at, I guess he wanted in. And he started, like, backing up Henry's claims. By their count, Henry and Otis had murdered, like, 108 people. including six-year-old Adam Walsh.
Starting point is 00:35:52 Does that sound familiar? It might sound familiar. Adam Walsh was the son of John Walsh. He became famous for hosting America's Most Wanted. It was in October of 1983 when Otis confessed to killing six-year-old Adam Walsh. And according to Otis, he had snatched the child from a Sears parking lot
Starting point is 00:36:16 in 1981. So Otis said that, that after he decapitated the young boy with a machete, I know, Otis drove around with the head in his car for so long that he actually forgot it was still in the car. And then once he realized it was still in the car, he then tossed the head into a canal. Adam Walsh was perhaps like one of the most well-known victims killed by Otis or Henry.
Starting point is 00:36:43 His murder would result in like new child protection laws. plus, you know, his father getting into television and also criminal justice. But it wasn't until 25 years later in December of 2008 and like long after Otis had died that the police announced Otis as Walsh's murderer and ended up closing the case. Now, when they closed the case, like, people wanted to know like how they solved it, but the police, they didn't reveal like any new evidence or DNA evidence. The decision was reached when Otis' name. niece told John Walsh that her uncle confessed to the crime on his deathbed.
Starting point is 00:37:23 So there were many questions about the credibility of Henry's and Otis' confessions. Some of the stories, like the Hand of Death Colt, were just almost like people just, you know, they were a little too incredible to believe. Both Otis and Henry seemed to find a lot of joy in boasting about their wild crimes. So maybe they were just good storytellers. I don't know. Some believe that the police could have just used Henry and Otis to clear up unsolved murders
Starting point is 00:37:55 that neither of them had even been involved in. And that I was like, oh, I could understand that. You know, just to say like this case is closed. It was them who did it. I haven't worn lashes like this in so long. I can't see anybody now. If you want to block out all of your haters, just wear a fat lash.
Starting point is 00:38:15 She won't be able to see him. There was one case specifically that I'm thinking about where they said it was Henry and Otis who did it. But that would mean that Henry would have driven his 13-year-old Ford Station wagon to cover 11,000 miles in one month or around like 370 miles per day to have committed like the crimes police attributed to him. And, you know, apparently this would not be possible. So maybe there is some truth there when it comes to people saying, like, you know, police had just put it on them. Who knows? I don't think we'll ever really know how many victims Otis and Henry had between the two of them. Remember in the intro I mentioned the cannibalism? Well, and that little cult situation. Well, in November of 1983, Texas Rangers taped a phone call between Henry and Otis.
Starting point is 00:39:10 and at this time they were in prison so they were just catching up like old friends and during this call Otis had asked Henry if he remembered the one time Otis wanted to have ribs and if that made him a cannibal. It's like asking for advice. Does that make me a cannibal? Then he asked Henry if he remembered how he, Otis, liked to pour the blood out of his victims. So it was just like an interesting conversation that was caught, I guess. A journalist came out to the prison to interview Otis and, you know, he found it to be quite disturbing. This interviewer asked Otis if it was true that he ate young boys and Otis responded that he had eaten his quote unquote share. He then went on to say how he kidnapped kids, put them in the trunk of his car and like drove them out to his place
Starting point is 00:40:03 where no one would interrupt him. Otis even said that he had his own barbecue sauce. Yeah, he had his own barbecue sauce recipe that he used when cooking and eating people. He provided, like, graphic description of sexually assaulting boys, girls, men, and women, how he, like, killed them,
Starting point is 00:40:25 how he would remove their organs and remove their body parts. He just didn't hold back. Like some twisted gourmet chef, he went on to describe his human cooking ritual, where Otis called the whole experience, quote, damn tasty. When asked, Otis said that he and Henry probably killed and ate at least 150 people. I personally think him and Henry did some messed up stuff. I don't know if I can get behind 150 people because these two were, they were storytellers.
Starting point is 00:41:02 So I think there's some truth in there, but that's just my feeling, you know. They could be telling the truth for all I know. Well, in 1984, Otis was convicted by Florida court for setting a fire that killed 65-year-old George Soneberg in January of 1982. He was sentenced to death for George Sownberg's murder. Otis was indicted a month later for the 1983. three murder of 19-year-old Ada Johnson. But Otis's death sentence was changed to life in prison for two reasons. One, because he gave many unreliable confessions. And two, he had a low IQ. Yeah, he was diagnosed with like a mental impairment. So later in 1991, Otis pled guilty to four
Starting point is 00:41:56 more murders in Florida and received four more life sentences. Another crossover, I didn't expect was that when Otis was at Florida's Ryeford prison. Guess who was next to him in the cell next to him? Yes, you'll never guess. Ted Bundy. Yeah. It's like, well, these characters are just getting together. It's wild. Otis eventually died from liver failure on September 15th in 1996 at the prison. He was buried in a prison cemetery because nobody came to claim his body. Otis Toole claimed to have committed hundreds of murders, but again, the exact number of his victims remains uncertain due to the lack of concrete evidence and the dubious nature of his
Starting point is 00:42:50 confessions. He was convicted of six counts of murder, but law enforcement officials believe that he was most likely responsible for like a lot more. That number is something we probably will never know. Like there's no doubt that the abuses Otis was exposed to from a very young age shaped this freaking monster he became. It seems sex and flesh became like tangled up in the pleasure centers in Otis's brain, you know? It seemed to him a human appeared to have been like nothing more than a body of meat, alive or dead. And no one seems to know what to really believe about Otis.
Starting point is 00:43:34 But what we do know for sure is that whether or not he was born with a twisted mind or his life experience shaped him into this demon, it doesn't change the fact that this guy left a trail of blood and death everywhere he went. This guy was awful. Awful. You know, I left out a lot of the really gruesome. There's so many gruesome, awful details I left out because, look, no. So, yeah, but all we need to know is that these two guys were awful, awful people. And how do you even end that? I don't know. I hope you have a good day today. You make good choices and you be safe out there, please. Please be safe out there. And I'll be seeing you guys later. Goodbye.

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