Mysterious Universe - 35.24 - MU Podcast - (AI) - Artificial Insemination and the Human Zoo

Episode Date: June 19, 2026

What does one do when one finds oneself nose to absence of nose with those who claim they are on a mighty quest to save that which they themselves have admittingly destroyed? Fortuitously encountering you, along their journey for Sur-thrival and deemed lucky you scoop-up-able simply for being in their path. Like so much wildlife in some sort of unannounced breeding program that you remain ignorantly unaware of the role that you play concerning their “cosmic” visions for some grand design or even just a simple curiosity. Thank you for joining us as we ponder the peculiar puzzle that is the genetic interest and undertaking of the exceptionally icky. Is this Woo Woo just trying to get its Freak on? Or is this something much more disturbing? For our Plus+ extension, we cover Anita Moorjani's Dying to Be Me, one of the most remarkable and widely discussed near-death experience accounts of the modern era. We follow her journey from a multicultural upbringing in Hong Kong, through years of fear, people-pleasing, and a devastating battle with lymphoma, to the extraordinary experience she reported during a 2006 coma and the unexpected recovery that followed. Along the way, we explore identity, mortality, and the idea that sometimes the hardest thing in life is simply being yourself. Intruders: The Incredible Visitations at Copley Woods Cryobiology, Embryo Transfer, and Artificial Insemination in Ex Situ Animal Conservation Programs KPBS Public Media Video - Artificial Insemination Yields Rhino Embryo At Zoo's Safari Park Dying to Be Me: My Journey from Cancer, to Near Death, to True Healing LinksPlus+ ExtensionThe extension of the show is EXCLUSIVE to Plus+ Members. To join. click HERE.Links Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. Oh, Mysterious Universe, season number 35, episode 24. What is required to create life? And Joe, for that matter, what is life? Why? Whatever it is, it's obviously privy to the go forth and multiply mantra, as that's what life seems to do best.

make more of that sweet, sweet life. We are told that for any species of any merit to survive long term, it must overcome insurmountable odds through these tireless obstacles, reaching the brink of destruction, though able to turn it back before it was too late, this type of thing. One possible route of exploration is that of community, compassionhip, loyalty, agreement, self-actualization, and trust. If that sounds super gay, then perhaps,

you'd be more interested in following the bat-shit whim of one whose do-what-thou-wilt model of reality is yielded at their disposal for their reasons, with regard only for what you can offer their grand mission. No matter what they telepathically told you while sexually assaulting your sovereignty, you deserve better. So what does one do when one finds oneself nose to absence of knows with those who claim that they are on a mighty quest to save that which they themselves have admittedly destroyed, fortuitously encountering you along their journey for surthrival and deemed you scoop upable simply for being in their path. Like so much wildlife in some sort of unannounced breeding program that you remain

ignorantly unaware of the role that you play concerning their cosmic visions for the grand design or even simple curiosity. You may very well, therefore, find yourself to be a hostage to your subjectively beneficial captors. And what is it all for? Literally, what is the meaning of this? Thank you for joining us as we ponder this peculiar puzzle, the one that is the genetic interest and undertaking of the exceptionally icky.

Is this woo-woo just trying to get its freak on? Or is this something much, much more disturbing? I am your alien hybridization proof host, Brandon Thomas, and with me as always is the man who eats hot dogs for the shape, not the flavor. It's mostly the flavor, but also the shape. You have me intrigued. That was quite the intro. I know you showed me the book beforehand, but I don't know really what it's about, so I'm looking forward to this. Well, Eat It Joe's Hodgden is who's hanging out with me today.

And yes, what we are going to be discussing here is something pretty cool. This is something very interesting, but before we get to that, we are bounding up to our break here. I just wanted to remind everybody that next Friday is going to be our last free show for about a week. We're going to take a little bit of a break here. It's a brief but well-deserved break, I would say, as well, Joe. Then we're going to be back and better than ever for plus on Tuesday, July 7th. That's 7-7, Joe. Nice.

And then that'd be July 10th for all you free former barnacles that sign up before then, offering you far more greatness in the meantime, of course. See, I'll pay it forward. Oh, yeah. Nice that was. Anyway, so yes. And before we get to our topic here, which is crazy, it's absolutely crazy. It is definitely one chapter of Bud Hopkins's intruders, which is just an incredible book. And I've actually got three copies of this book serendipitously. Of course, the guy sent me one. It came in my pack. I don't know if you got an intruders. I'm sure you did. I had one from a long time ago that I already had. Now, my favorite copy, though, is the one that I'm going to be linking for all of you to enjoy as well. This one holds a special place in my heart. There's a dear friend of all of ours, actually, who went ahead and decided that he was done playing the game of life and moved on himself. Robbie Graham, amazing author of Silver Screen Saucers. He had a publishing house called August Night Press, and he republished two of Bud Hopkins's books, Missing Time, and then Intruders. Now, these are the copy I'm holding now and therefore the one of them would be linking in the show description,

which was the first one that popped up, by the way. That was really nice to see. Are going to be the August night press versions that Robbie Graham reprinted. Now, Fun fact, Joe, he consulted me on the cover when he was reprinting these things. It was Robbie and I were good buddies. And he sent me two different covers that he was looking at from missing time. He did not pick the one that I chose, but still very sweet to be considered. That's awesome.

And we miss you, Robbie. Rest in Power, Buddy. But we are going to be covering intruders by Bud Hopkins, which again he republished so I'm going to be linking his copy his daughter and why still get a chunk of that I think or whoever he invested with with his partnership in August night press either way intruders but Hopkins have you ever read it I have not holy shit this one kept me up Mary too because I whenever I read the copy when Robbie sent it to me because I hadn't before he did and when he sent it to me I read it and I was like holy shit it scared

the hell out of me I told Mary about this too it's just unsettling dude and we're going to go through a few things that are going to touch on the tip of what Bud Hopkins could do with his writing in this today. But it creeped me out so much, Mary read it and said the same thing. We both just couldn't sleep, honestly. It was just uncomfortable feelings around. You look out at the yard at night in the dark and you're just like, there's just something unsettling after getting that information in your head. I can imagine. I can't wait. How was your week, though? It's been incredible, man. Honestly, it's been this, really, because it's a fun topic that We're going to go over today with a lot of ancillary things as well.

So a lot of research for this one, which was, it's all fun, though time-consuming. So a lot of the week was that. But then also, it's been beautiful weather. I got a new mower. I got a new zero-turn mower, which I'm just obsessed with. I did the five-hour oil change on that thing. When you get a new mower, I didn't know this, but when you get a new one, they put sacrificial oil in it. So that it's not, that's oil for everybody else.

So after five hours, you've got to change the fuel, or, the, the oil filter and then put new oil in it and drain everything out. Weird. Yeah. So I ran it for about five and a half hours and then did that. So I learned how to change the oil on this new mower and it was actually really cool. It was a lot of fun. Oh yeah. Getting your hands dirty. Yeah, I mentioned it on a Tuesday show, but we went down and saw a bucket list band that I've been wanting to see for well over a decade called Britt Floyd, and they obviously cover Pink Floyd. It is Rolling Stone called them the world's premier Pink Floyd experience.

Talk, yeah. I cannot disagree. It was incredible down in beautiful Napa Valley, got to hear some of the best Floyd tunes if you're into Pink Floyd, and they just did a bang-up job. I mean, the visuals, everything. It was great. And just a real chill crowd, obviously, because it was mostly old people. There was one dude that was a bit too schnappard that had to get taken out.

But other than that, everybody was just chilling, enjoying the music. It was great. Beautiful weather. We really laughed our asses off this because we're, early 40s and we go to see Robert Plant, you know, and it's a sit-down deal. There's no mosh pit. And we were so pumped about that. We were just both like, man, it's nice because there's not shitheads that are all drunk and throwing stuff and you're not getting hit with piss. This is awesome. No, it was probably the most respectful chill concert I've ever been to.

And I'm like, I could deal with this. If this is the only band I ever had to see for the rest of my life, it would, I'd be fine with that. How great is that? But yeah, then we came back to, came back home. and it's 108 degrees. I was telling you that, I think, on the last show. But, yeah, oh, my God, it's so hot. I've just been soaking up the sun, getting a bit too much sun, you might say. But it's nice. It's supposed to chill off the rest of the week.

So I'll take it as it comes. We look good. Your tan looks nice and even there. It's working on it. I mean, dude, I got the flip-flop tan on my foot now. I mean, I got the line. Yeah, it's summer's in full force, even though it hasn't started yet. Yeah, well, it looks like you're well in your way for your hot girl summer here.

Do you have any new ink plans? Do you update to Tramp? anything? Uh, nah, not yet. You never know though. Let her fade. I love that. Uh, well, before we get into it, what do you have coming up on plus for our plus members? Yes, for our wonderful plus members. Uh, we're going to be going into a book my wife sent my way. It's from 2022 by Anita Morjani. Oh shit. Am I getting their last name right? Let me see Morjani. Anita Morjani. It's called Dying to be me. It's about, uh, it's an NDE, but it's way

more than that. She goes into kind of her cultural context being brought up as a Hindu in a more westernized area in Hong Kong. And yeah, she was basically dying from cancer and has this NDE and then she woke up healed. So,

it's a wild tale. But it's a really good story. God, I love that kind of shit. It's because what is that? Is it that they got into her subconscious so much and just said, hey, you're not interested in doing that anymore? And she's like, yeah, I'm not interested in doing that. almost like a Jedi mind trick,

doing the, lending to the mind over matter sort of ideal. Reverse psychology type of thing. Yeah, like you're healthy, meaning that they don't even say the word sick.

Like you're not sick anymore. They don't even say that. They just say, wow, you're the perfect health. And she's like, you know what I am the perfect health? And then that other version of,

like the cancer in this sense, is incongruent with her harmony, mentally, in her state. Yeah. So therefore it just dissolves away because it can't exist in the same place with this beaming ball of light.

And yeah, and obviously the NDE is incredible too, but the whole, the reason it's the first, like, half of the book, at least, is her cultural context for how she sees something like an NDE, because she was, she had all these different influences like Catholic, Hindu, just a mishmash of different things. And so her perspective on it was a little bit different, I guess, than a lot of, like, Western stories. But it was also, I mean, the fact that she came out of it healed and she's still alive to the, this day and this was back in 2006 when it happened it's crazy that is awesome i cannot wait for that okay so sign up in the links below guys we will definitely see you down there and plus is the first show that we are back from our vacation on the seventh so sign up for plus if you just miss us that

much you can you can come here the new stuff for anybody else okay joe so what are your thoughts on the alleged alien hybridization program uh it wouldn't surprise me if that was a real thing um i mean you have people that come out and say oh they've been among us for you know ever basically why they would, if that's a thing, why they would want to do that is probably up for debate, but maybe you'll get into some of that. I don't know. What do you think about it? We just may. We just may. And I think a lot about it. At the deepest start, I think it's a huge si-op on a very deep, deep, deep level. And we're going to get more into my personal opinions about this as we go forth. But let's set up a little bit of context for why I feel the way that I do,

especially after having done the research. And I read intruders a long time ago. And guys, the only thing that we are going to cover in this is chapter seven. That's it. Wow. But we're going to get to that here in just a second. So it's not even the whole thing. So before we get to the outer space shit or whatever that is, let's kick it off here on Earth before we reach out and touch someone that never consented to being touched at all. The topic that we've got today are just going to be some sexually explicit and highly strange abduction cases from the research of Bud Hopkins. But first, Joe, what do you think about when I say AI? Dumb.

I like the word association. Now, let me be more specific. Thank you. What is another way of perceiving the same thing that has been given the same arc-on-him, I mean, acronym, the same acronym as AI. So obviously, what do we think of when we think of that? Artificial intelligence. Correct. But in this case, we're going to be talking about a different kind of AI, and that AI is artificial insemination.

Now, artificial insemination or AI in wild animals is an advanced conservation technique that's used to preserve genetic diversity and facilitate breeding without the need to transport animals between facilities. Set another way, you could say to artificially induce semen to a nation, artificial insemination. It is okay to get a little bit ahead of me on this one, but we have a lot to talk about here before we get there. I feel like this episode is going to need the clown horn sound effect. At some point, yeah, yeah, you're going to want to break that out. So just keep it handy and in your head as we go through this, okay? Now, AI relies on precise hormone tracking, semen cryopreservation, and specialized non-surgical or laparoscopic delivery directly into

the reproductive tract. Now there's an article length that, for those who wish to investigate that further on cryobiology and embryo transfer and programs like that, so if you guys want to check that out, it's linked, but let's move on.

Because wild animals cannot be bred exactly like livestock, pay attention here. The process requires highly specialized veterinary protocols. You've got hormone synchronization. You've got females who are given hormonal treatments to track and induce ovulation

to ensure that insemination occurs when the egg is viable. So obviously right there, hormone synchronization. We got to know when it's the best time to do this, so you're tracked, monitored, and observed. And then you've got, of course, semen collection. Seamen is typically gathered from males using electro-ejaculation joe, or artificial vaginas. Often, while the animal is under anesthesia,

or immobilized. You know that I look this up. The artificial vagina business is valued an estimated $150 million. Wow. This encompasses two distinct industries. Joe, would you like to guess the two industries? Porn? Uh, silicone?

I don't know. Specialized medical and agricultural equipment. That's right. Like veterinary semen collectors and lab-grown tissue for anatomical reconstruction. and you have the little considered multi-billion dollar adult novelties and robotic sector as well. Now, let's come back to the notion of lab-grown tissue for anatomical reconstruction. Joe, would this imply that they could grow another you from a jizz of you? I don't see it being impossible now.

Am I reading that, right? We talked about cloning before, but, I mean, it's a little different, but yeah. So if you've ever donated sperm, was there some? something in the agreement that you signed before you delivered stating that they could do whatever they want to your sploosh. I would have no idea. Perhaps make a clone of you? Or do they hand a few tosses of your sample over to aliens for whatever, whatever?

Or what are they doing with the umbilical cord or the placenta? I mean, that's got tons of stem cells and whatnot in it. That has to do with the seed, and I highly recommend you guys look into that. Moving on here, though, from another source, and this one's a little bit more specific in my line of questioning here, the artificial vagina and male masturbatory sector is a major pillar of the global adult entertainment market, and that's valued it over $2 billion annually. That's a lot of sad, lonely people. I mean, we judge not, but wow.

And you think if they could just do some sort of dating app where they paired the people who bought vaginas with the people who bought dildos that also are not lesbians, they could really have something sweet going on here. Oh, I remember back in the day when they first started doing that and they'd have like molds of popular porn stars. Sure. You can have Jenna Jameson's vagina and it's like, okay. Oof. When I worked in the beer business and they had yeast from a vagina of a model that everybody was very excited.

They brewed beer with yeast. I remember that. Yeah. The flyer went around and it didn't even, nobody even tasted it. They just saw a picture of the chicken was like, yeah, yeah. I mean, that's right along the line of making coffee out of cat, turds, you know, that type of coffee. You know that?

There were monkey turds, but monkeys are a real thing, though. That's a, because of the way it passes through their digestive track, I think. We should look that up, but I do agree with you that I don't know that I would be looking at their poo going, you know what, that's still good. I'm going to make some liquid out of that. Waste not want not, you know what I mean? Who's the first guy to figure that out, though, seriously? That's what I'm saying.

You've got the guy over there. Maybe it was a dare or something. They're like, oh, fuck Randy will do it. And then they brew these things up. And then they're like giggling the whole time. And he's like, guys, this is the best goddamn coffee I've ever had. You've got to try it. And then he convinces them to, and actually it's a banger.

So who knows? It's like the stevo of the culinary world. Yeah, like your brother, you'd push him down the homemade ramps first. Do you know what I mean? Oh, yeah. They'd have to test it for me, bud. Yeah. And we're going to the emergency room.

Now, as a fast-growing subset of the broader $40-plus billion dollar global sex toy market, it continues to expand, giggedy, at a steady compound annual growth rate of about 8%, Joe, just so that the nerds are happy. about that. Fun fact there. We need those specific statistics, thank you. Yeah, but how about that? Electrojoculation?

Wow. Or elect jojoculation. I've got two new ones for the list there. We can get them out. Premature ejoculation. There you go. Seamen preservation, on the other hand, is collected. The collected semen is either chilled for immediate use or cryopreserved or frozen

in liquid nitrogen, allowing genetic material to be banked for decades, or simply the spank bank, because it's affectionately known around the office. Insemination methods depend on the species. I promise we're getting to UFO, guys. This is very important, though. The semen is deposited using non-surgical trans cervical methods. Non-surgical trans-servical methods. Turkey baster.

Oof. Yes, pretty much a turkey buster. Kind of. And we're going to get to that there's a variety of turkey baster. basters. Laproscopic surgery or hydraulic restraints that eliminate the need for dangerous anesthesia. Oh, we'll just tie you down and stick it in here real nice and easy like. We won't even need to put you down.

How great is that? Won't even feel it. Now, I looked it up here, laparoscopic surgery for those who do not know, because we don't assume things here, are also known as minimally invasive or keyhole surgeries, and it's a technique that allows surgeons to operate on the abdomen and pelvis without making large incisions. and that may come up later. There is, though, for your linking pleasure, a K-PBS public media video

titled Artificial Insemination Yields Rhino Embryo at Zoo's Safari Park. And shit, I didn't... Okay, I would say... Here, let me do this. Pause the video at one minute and 45 seconds for what, in my opinion, is the best single-moment image of that event. Joe, I didn't have it here, so I'm just going to show you.

But you guys take a look. What am I looking at? Okay. Do you see what's going on there? Okay. In the picture, you have a lady here. You have now an entire crowd out the window, by the way. And guys look this up.

It's down in the video links. Go to one minute, 45 seconds. That's the pause image Joe is enjoying here. They had an audience for this? Oh, yeah, absolutely. This is a monumental event. Now you had the young lady here, and do you see her eyes looking up and gazed? Yeah, okay.

And in wonder, as she is watching the semen come down this tube and into what her hand has plunged the tube into? Oh, God. Okay, now I see it. One minute, 45 seconds, guys, and you, too, can enjoy what artificial inseminating of a rhino looks like. It's a very team effort. I will say teamwork makes the dream work on that. Here are some key applications to ensure the greatest success of this whole business here. Wildlife experts and leading conservation centers rely on AI to make.

maintain populations of threatened and endangered species. Isn't, is that what we're made to think that we are, right? Aren't we told that humanity is always in some sort of inevitable peril and therefore must trust the science to get us through the next time that we must trust the science yet again, Joe? I don't know, because it seems like it depends on who you ask, because there's over eight, what, eight or nine billion of us now, apparently, and it just seems to keep going up, so I'm not too worried about it. I don't know.

I don't know if those numbers are right. What do you think about the population number? numbers. Again, depends on who you ask. There's some people that think there's way less, and there's actually some people in the alternative media will say that think it's actually way the fuck more, which is, and there's good points on both sides. But how to know, I mean, I'm sure we could ballpark it, but like there's so, so much open area in the world, especially in the U.S., in Africa and places like that. And then it seems to be, you know, concentrated in certain big city areas.

So it would be easier to keep track of how many people are there. But really, like to know how many people are on earth at any given point, it's kind of ballparking. Well, and you've got to be very specific because you're not talking to underground dums where alleged trafficking is happening in slavery centers and Dulce base and all that kind of stuff where there's heaps of... Or maybe people living under the ocean or in the ocean or whatever. And personnel, you got breakaway civilizations.

You got all kinds of stuff going on. So you could be right that the population. could be more. I don't know that that number though being tossed around is for the reason that they're tossing it around. It's not like a mark of achievement. It's usually shown that we need to do something about it. And you look at the guidestones and stuff, right? Right. That's why it depends on who you ask. If you ask Bill Gates, he'd have a much different idea on that than other people, I'm sure. Bill Gates's clone that's running around now, whichever one that is, I don't know how many generations he is in now, but that one is definitely on board with the program. He saw what

happened to the other ones. Good old bitch tits bill. That's right. Genetic diversity is very important in this as well because AI allows scientists across geographically isolated populations. And this is quite a successful and seemingly scalable model, wouldn't you say, in some events? Mm-hmm. And for example, the Smithsonian National Zoo is successfully used frozen sperm to impregnate endangered cemeter horned oxes, which is just a cool name, without the use of anesthesia. You could be overcoming physical or behavioral barriers, which this one is conjecture in my mind, because AI is the primary option for animals that are sexually incompatible,

meaning that they don't get along with one another, or that they're physically incapable of banging. And I thought that this was nature's way of telling you not to do that. Isn't it, is it koalas or pandas, I think? God damn you. Oh, sorry. It's one, two, three. That's okay.

Three points down, bud. Three points down. Okay, here. All right. I'll shut up. No, no, no. Don't shut up. Just it's fucking brilliant where you are.

And yes, it is pandas and we're almost there. Hang on. Fucking brilliant. Hey y'all, it's Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. Ever order furniture online and wonder what if? Like, what if it doesn't hold up? That sofa was four days old. You should have ordered from Wayfair.

With Wayfair, there's no what if. Just style you love and quality you can trust. Visit Wayfair.ca. Wayfair, every style, every home. Now, there's a lack of synchrony, which I'd never heard of this before, but synchrony refers to the simultaneous occurrence, development, or coordination of two or more events, actions, or processes in time. time. There's another reason you would do this is because the simultaneous occurrence of those animals or creatures being in the same place, same time together doesn't jive or the development

of those two creatures. You know how they'll freeze sperm from the last living, surviving, whatever, because there's no one around to bang him right now. And then they'll hang on to it for when it is viable later. Or you can coordinate events with this. You could say, man, we really need some sperm now and this is an event where we could take action for processes in time. So the reason that we even talk about synchrony when it applies to artificial insemination from our perspective, how we're as humans using it is just very interesting. It could also suffer from physical injuries that prevent mating, which is again, I think nature's way of saying, don't do it.

Global collaboration efforts as well, to Joe's point, organizations like the Cincinnati Zoo have successfully used AI to breed big cats such as jaguars and oscillots, helping maintain the gene pool for species threatened. by habitat loss, which humanity is the greatest cause of, we might add. Now, to offer a breeding program side quest for those interested, pandas. And I was going to move on and say that's all, but if you'd like to talk about it, let's go for it, Dave. What do you got? Oh, I just remember hearing something a while ago that they have trouble mating on their own, which is odd.

Like, how do we have them still, if that's the case, before modern AI, um, How have they survived? I mean, you really go down the rabbit hole of pandas. There's some people that think they were just a lab creation or something. And I don't know. No way to know. Who knows? But apparently they don't really survive too well on their own in the wild, which like you said, is kind of nature's way of saying, eh, maybe you shouldn't exist.

Yes. And to that point, you know what else doesn't survive well in the wild? Shih Tzu's, which are hand-bred, hand-bred designer dogs that were bred for a specific reason down a lot of lines. and engineered to be that way. And this is Owen Benjamin's point about pandas. He uses that, that's his analogy, is that Shih Tzu's are basically what pandas are. They're designer animals that China allegedly bred,

because they have a patent on it. You can't have a patent on something unless you own it or created it. A patent on pandas? They have a patent on pandas, yes. Huh. And there was no records of any pandas in any ancient Chinese literature before the late 1800s. No one saw them.

Yes, and all of it was... They are kind of big, duffy creatures. If you ever watch videos of them, they look like they have one brain cell up there. They're re-fucking tarted. They ovulate one time a year, and they don't even want to bang that one time a year. And so it is very hard to get these things to survive. They only eat bamboo.

They can't eat anything else, and it's horrible for them. That's so weird. This is the thing. They were definitely an experiment, or again, if we go with the glitches in the Matrix kind of a thing, it's just one of these glitchy matrix things that showed up. And they're really weird, too, because you had to be like an ambassador. China will lend them out, but only if you sign a whole bunch of weird shit. But there's all this protocol when even dealing with pandas in general.

Yeah. So anyway. Yeah, it seems like some deleted code that wasn't supposed to be here and they kept it going anyway. Or people figuring out how to fuck with code. And that may be what genetics are anyway. It's because what do they call it? They call it the gene code, right? Yeah.

So it could literally be code. I also found age to be interesting in some of the cases that we're about to talk about. So let's scoop up some context about age range in general before we move on. Now, when asked about humans, the optimal age for artificial insemination, specifically intrauterine insemination, or IUI, is the age range of between 25 and 35 years old for humans. During this window, egg quality and ovarian reserve are typically at their peak, offering the highest chance of success per cycle. That's if you consider your test subjects to be human.

For most primates, the optimal artificial insemination or AI range is 10 to 20 years old. Peak fertility generally spans during this window after early growth and before reproductive deterioration. However, the exact age range depends highly on the species, which definitely has to do with life expectancy, time dilation compensations needed for that accounting, all sorts of things. Now, linked again, guys, is August night's press version of Bud Hopkins intruders. And you can find heaps of these copies everywhere. Like I said, I linked Robbie Graham's, because he has hold a very dear special place in my heart. But Hopkins released this book in 1987.

I highly recommend it, guys. If you've never, if this is like just one of those, and if you've read a lot of folks who have written on the topics of UFOs, but Hopkins's writing is just there's something. to it. He's very honest. They are detailed and just the way that he portrays things will make you feel something. Now, if that's

what you're after, do it. If you're not interested in that whatsoever and that hits a little too close to home, probably just do something other than Bud. Is he still with us? He is not 2011. Yeah, he moved on in 2011. Now, Bud Hopkins and Tritters, the incredible visitations at Copley Woods

his 1987 is a seminal, put-intended work on the alien reproductive obsession concerning the abduction phenomena. In it, Bud Hopkins and his research suggests that the extraterrestrial intelligence is systematically abducting humans across generations to harvest reproductive material and to create alien human hybrids for evolutionary survival. You don't really hear modern reports of that anymore, do you? And I remember, I don't know if it was. the boys or not, but somebody brought that up, that it's interesting you don't really hear

recent accounts of people being jacked or whatever, you know, for their fluids, which some people suggest they've either figured it out or brought the program to a close because they did what they needed to do and now it's on to the next step or whatever. But they got better at making sure folks didn't remember. Oh, that do. Because if you think about it, that would be the technology to improve, not get what you need, move on. Because they don't ever get what they need to move on, do they? They won't more. So, unless you stop them.

And so they don't have a reason to be stopped. I think what got better is their ability to cloak themselves, their ability to then insert ideals within culture, to then become mainstream so that they could move about more freely. And I think also there's some things going on in the realm in general that our eyes or the realm itself or something are becoming more apparent and visible, a veil, if you want to say, It's just his inning. It's probably the way to say it. The apocalypse, right?

There you go. Yeah. Great. Revealing. Unvealing. So this work mainly focuses on the Copley Woods, located right on the rural outskirts of Indianapolis, Indiana. You've ever been there?

No. I've been to Indiana, but not near Indianapolis. Okay. The major star of the book is Kathy Davis, who has a tale that deserves its own episode, and this Joe is not that episode. Though, for you read ahead types, the work is linked, and I highly recommend.

linked and I highly recommend it. I really do. It's just an awesome work. Now, the reason we mention it here is that chapter seven of that work is titled Other Women, Other Men. And it contains a few stories outside of the main character's arc, though relevant and therefore gratefully included. Now, in the work, Bud writes, quote, I cannot attempt to do justice to the mystery and the pain and the confusion that I've heard from so many different people whose accounts are at heart, so very similar. So Joe, what is the difference between contact and abduction? Isn't that the difference between type 3 and type 4 or something like that? Or contact, you might, it's almost like the time slip thing where you have, you talk to them or

interact some way, abduction, you're on a craft or whatever, usually a stainless steel medical table from what we've heard. I think it's got to do with the difference of folks who think that school is a prison or school is liberating. It's a choice. I think contact has to do with your personal relationship, and that usually has to do with however you got interacted, but it's also got to do with your paradigm, your RES. Do you think they were demons? Therefore, was it scary? Were they yelling, stop screaming or do not be afraid, you know? And then therefore, it's this whole different thing. Abduction in my mind means that you are taken without consent. Contact, folks are pumped for.

Contact in my mind is CE5. Those are the dudes standing out there in the field with their arms out meditating wishing the motherfucker would come up and pick them up and probe them. Yeah. Abductions are folks going about their business. They didn't want anything to do with this and they're selected and then therefore plucked like an apple from an orchard. Maybe that apple didn't want to get plucked, but they don't care about the apple, do they? They were ready to eat it. Well, and the other interesting thing about that is, you know, we've talked about how it seems to follow family lineages too. And a lot of times those family lineages have something to do with the military at some point. And, oh, I had all these experiences.

So did my dad. Oh, shit. And my grandpa. He saw UFOs or whatever. What else is important in family lineage is? Genetics. Farming, breeding stock. Yeah. Stuff like that. Oh, man, this is my prized rooster. He farmed, fathered all of this stuff. Did you know also roosters is no big deal if they interbreed? Meaning that the rooster can bang his sister, his mom, his grandma, his aunt, his, I think the egg makes it a secondary thing, but for some reason, genetically, you actually want to hang onto that rooster, let it bang as much as you can. Huh. Cock of the Walk.

I have no idea. I have no idea. So there's a little fun fact for you. But Bud writes that each abduction presents a special and discreet mystery, and to some extent, at least each is a personal tragedy. A few months after the emotional moments he lived through with Kathy, Bud received a letter from a woman in upstate New York. He notes that most of the letters or phone calls he receives are from the

these stable, articulate individuals who almost always begin with an apology. There's probably nothing to this story, but, or I hope I'm not wasting your time, but when I was about seven years old, I had a strange experience and I've never been able to get it out of my mind. You know, those type of things change. And they never talk about it until something, you know, prompts them to remember. And then, oh, it's 2026 now. I feel like I can tell this story. Exactly. one woman wrote with the hope that but or anybody could help her lay a rest a particular dread that she'd been carrying around. I'm 40 years old, she said, and otherwise a normally happy wife and mother.

But I've had to sleep every night in my life with a hundred watt light on in my room ever since a recurring childhood dream about some small gray-skinned figures and so on and so on. Now, he writes that some letters very rarely come from obvious psychotics who he feels are generally easy to identify. Occasionally, though, but would receive letters from those he believed to be normal people who have had genuine UFO experiences and abductions, but who have been too overwhelmed to handle those experiences with any degree of harmony, grace, or calm. The letter he received in June 1985 from a young woman named Andrea, who fell into that category, She seemed like a sane person who's very on edge, a woman who had been through devastating experiences, but who was trying desperately to hang on and find out what happened to her. He noted that the letter had a powerful pleading quality.

She wanted, nay, needed help immediately. Andre had read his book, Missing Time, which is another wonderful book. I cannot recommend enough. And wanted to tell him about the several dreams that she remembered from her. childhood, which closely echoed incidents reported in the book. I'm telling you, man, you would have, if Bud was still alive, you would have written to him in the day there about your work. He would have loved your work because she considered hers dreams only. She didn't think that they were anything other than that. Reading the book, though, she had other questions

about it. She still only referred to him as dreams, though. Bud, though passed on in 2011. He was born in 1931, man. He had a good run. He wrote great work. Oh yeah, that's a great run. Yeah. Now, Bud called her and he made arrangements to meet her. And he felt that she was just sad and honest and deeply frightened, so very sincere. She just kept saying over and over again, please believe me, I'm telling the truth.

You've got to believe me. You know, this is very sincere. He in fact felt that everything that she had told him seemed very plausible. And firmly within the patterns of the UFO phenomena as he'd come to recognize him. Andri had never been hypnotically regressed, but she remembered several childhood encounters as well as one very vivid recent incident, which was the pretext for her letter to bud. And it was about six weeks before she wrote him that she, quote, dreamed that she awoke in her bedroom with a small gray-skinned figure standing right beside her bed. What year was this that she experienced it? This is 1987.

Oh, okay. Right in that window of time of... 85, 85, 85, because he wrote the book in 87. That's what was on my mind. She wrote him in 85. Two years later, he writes intruders, which is about somebody else, by the way, he just happened to include these stories

and because of what was going, it's a threat. You have to. Yeah. The man that she was living with asleep next to her was completely dulled out. She was unable to move to alert him in any way. And Joe, would you consider that, like,

sleep partner aliasis? Sounds about right, yeah. Andrea was floated out of her bed across the field behind her apartment and right up into a UFO. And she's framing this as just a dream, though. Just dream, of course. Yeah, it's just a dream. Then as she sat paralyzed on a table, the small gray-skinned figure pressed a long needle up into her nostril, causing her pain as it broke through the top of her nasal cavity.

Oh, just checking for those antibodies, baby. You're checking for VEADS. Your PCR. Her memory ends there. But she woke up in the morning with blood in her nightgown and the bedclothes that she wore from a noseblee that she had suffered at some point during the night. Now, again, you could have a noseblee dream of something grabbing you and puncturing your nose right, but then now it makes you think the other way around. All those things that made you think, oh, well, that was from a dream I had. Maybe it was the other way around, dude.

Andrea also told Bud about a long, straight scar that had been on her chest ever since childhood. And she recalled being very young, perhaps six years old, lying on a table in a small round room lit by an eye. odd pinkish light, six years old. Her memory of this was not absolutely clear, but she remembered a small man doing something to her chest. Those and other detailed recollections suggested to Bud and others in a woo-woo community of that of the standard UFO abduction experience. Though she found it more comfortable to refer to them always as dreams.

That's got to be a thing, right? People have these weird dreams like this and just write it off as that, so then therefore Sounds like her particular coping mechanism. Right. Right. Have you ever had a dream that you've been abducted? Not that I recall, but I've definitely had weird dreams and I woke up the bloody nose. I used to get bloody noses quite a bit as a kid.

What? Yeah, and probably just from picking my nose. But I actually did as an adult for a bit too. And I think it was just because of the tendency around here to have like zero humidity. Oh, okay. So during the summer, you know, it's a real, well dry if I blew my nose too hard to get a bloody nose. But I haven't had one in years, so. Okay.

But maybe aliens plugging up something in your nose, maybe? Can't roll it out? Not that I recall, but maybe I should get a, what are they called, hypnotic regression and see what's going on there. Oh, if you are a good hypnotic regression therapist, write us in in the email. I'm very curious to, if you'd be interested in hypnotically regression, Joe, you guys just heard it. And you're up to know. If you can do it over Zoom, that'd be awesome. Yes.

And without recourse, Stance Prejudice, all the good things. No attachments. Now, in keeping with her desire for immediate help and Bud's belief in the Buddy System, he put her in touch with a young woman about her age, who was also an abductee

whose case had already been investigated. Now, what he means by the Buddy System is putting experiences in contact with other experiencers to trauma bond so that they don't feel so alone, which I think is awesome. Kind of what you're doing by sharing your story, and then it makes people feel like

they can share theirs. Yeah, yeah. He's that good of a researcher. like, oh, this is important, so we're going to do it. Now, Louise, as we shall call her, spoke to Andrea on the phone, and a few days later, she and Bud made the nearly three-hour drive up to Andrea's upstate home. Bud describes her as small, slender, pretty young woman who is obviously suffering from acute anxiety. They both tried to calm her and to assure that she was safe and that she could seek some kind

of therapeutic help. And Bud notes that, quote, it was clear to them that for Andrea to be able to finally talk to people who took her account seriously was of definite benefit, like we're saying here, and she was noticeably calmer when they left than when they had gotten there. Andrea is somewhat shy, so the gentleman Bud Hopkins left the room for a few minutes to give Louise a chance to talk to her woman to woman, and also so that she could examine this scar that Andrea had been going on about. It was horizontal in about two inches long, located just below her left bosom.

In the course of their investigation, Andrea mentioned that in her recent, quote, dream, a little gray-skinned man with shiny black eyes also had done something to her back, something that caused pain right along her spinal column. And here you're thinking, spinal tap. Louise asked her to hold up her blouse so that she could take a look

and was surprised to see a thin red cut that ran for an estimated three and a half inches straight down the center of her back. It was faint but still visible as if it was a recent wound that it almost healed. This cut of which Andrea had been unaware was, of course, a new and unexpected piece of evidence that Bud felt helped support the accuracy of the other accounts. He's also been digressing in this chapter from the Copley Woods Affair and Kathy Davis's various UFO experiences for a very important reason.

This is to suggest to the reader that some of the other abduction cases that he's looked into that also harken upon this same theme of genetic experimentation. Bud writes, quote, when I first began investigating the Kathy Davis case, I assumed it was a mere, more or less one-of-a-kind incident. But these later accounts effectively established it for me as, quote, all too typical. The gross thing that happened to Kathy, and if you guys have ever read the book, you know what I'm talking about here.

Very typical in his opinion. During his first phone conversation with Andrea, he brought up the subject of her physical health, and he queried about any anomalies, any odd unsolved medical opportunities in disguise. He'd mentioned heart and respiration and other items deliberately involving pregnancy, but, man, he didn't go right there. They talked a little bit before you got there. But when mentioned, Andrea quickly announced that something odd had happened to her when she was 13 years old. Bud, I got pregnant, she said.

but I hadn't had anything to do with the boy at the time. I didn't even know much about six. I was only 13. I just dreamed this man was in my room and I was having sex with him. And Joe, does it sound like anything you've ever heard before? From UFO encounters or just in general? In general. It's all on the table here, baby.

Yeah. I mean, people have those kind of dreams all the time. But not usually at 13, I wouldn't think. I would hope not. In folklore and mythology, sleeping with an incubus, nocturnal visitations by a male demon believed to prey on sleeping women. And throughout history, these encounters have been associated with three main outcomes. Are you ready for the outcomes?

Number one, sleep paralysis and nightmares. Scientifically, these experiences are often attributed to sleep paralysis or specific sleep cycle parisomnias, which is a cool word. You wake up unable to move, accompanied by intense hallucinations and feeling of heavy pressure on your chest. And the haint is another one of these things as well. Have you ever heard of the haint? No. So a haint is a regionally, it's regionally a southern U.S. an appellation term for a ghost or a restless spirit. It's rooted in African-American, specifically ghula in European folklore.

Haints believed to be malicious or mischievous souls. trapped between the living world and the afterlife. Lore and protections. Have you ever heard of painting your roof, the outside of your porch, the ceiling of it there? Have you ever heard of painting that blue? I don't think so. Okay. In the south we have this thing,

to where hornets and things, they won't build on nest on a porch that's painted blue. And the theory goes is that they think it's the sky, so why would they build a nest in the sky? When you paint your roof this color, it doesn't, they will not build any nests there whatsoever, wasp, and anything won't. Interesting. Now, guess what the color of blue is called? Haint?

Haint blue. Hmm. It's a very specific pale blue green color traditionally painted on the ceilings of southern porches, originating with the Goua or Gichi, the color is meant to mimic the sky or water, thereby tricking spirits and preventing them from entering the home. which also happens to keep wastes from making nests, which are little demons anyway, right? Yeah. They only take, they'll sting indiscriminately because they can keep living.

Had quite a problem with them, this year in particular. Paint blue, Bubba. I'm telling you, that whole trim, that easement all the way around your house, especially your porches. And it's beautiful, actually. It's a dope color. Just the roof part of it. Just paint that.

Yeah, it's way better than whatever damn color you got, I promise. Now, there are also something that the third type here is bottle trees in old African spiritual tradition where, Lowbalt blue glass bottles are placed on the branches of trees in the yard. Have you seen those? The bottle trees with all the bottles hanging on them? That's what these are. The belief is that a haint will be drawn into the bottle where the morning sun will then destroy it.

It gets trapped in the bottle and then the sun heats up and destroys the thing. Genius. So whenever you see those blue bottles out there, leave them alone, guys. Little Zima bottles. Yeah. Yes, exactly. There you go. Another thing called the veil.

And according to Southern folklore, people who are born in call. Do you know what that is? No. It's with a piece of the ambionic sack covering their face or head. Gross. Yeah, if you're born like that, Southern says that you possess the ability to physically see haints. Hmm. Isn't that fun?

Any stories of that? We could look some up, I'm sure. You guys, write us in if you are encull and you can see weird shit dancing around that other folks can't. Like a haint. Back to the AI implications here. Supernatural consequences. If we're going medieval on it, it was believed that repeated encounters would drain a person's life force resulting in deteriorating health, severe mental anguish, or even death. Do you hear that, ladies.

Don't have sex with these things. Maybe. Do what you want. Live your life. Nobody's here to tell you what to do. The third implication is why I bring this into our conversation, Joe. Pregnancy. Mythological accounts from medieval Europe suggest that these unions could result in the birth of a demonic or half-human

offspring. For example, the legendary magician Merlin was said to have been fathered by an incubus. Did you know that? I did not. But that sounds a lot like the story of the watchers from the Bible coming down and meeting with human women. Guess what they do. Imagine the taunting young Merlin must have endured there. Oh, your mom thugs dreams. Instead of a waterhead baby, they call him a wet dream baby. You know how cruel kids can be. Oh, yeah. But, I mean, shout out to all the incubus fathered daywalk and half-breed children out there. I mean, even members of the band, I'm sure that they've fathered a couple kids. Yeah, and if you're one of those, email us.

Yeah, if you're an incubus child, email us. We're very curious. Now, Andrea continues, he was real funny-looking. And he didn't have any hair in his head, and he had real funny eyes, not like mine. But asks if it felt like normal sex. and if they touched one another. No, she said, I couldn't touch him. I could move.

Which is implication one on the list. By the way, gang, again, if we're paying attention here, sleep paralysis and nightmares. She said, quote, I just felt something in me, something sharp. And then my vagina felt like it was on fire, that my stomach was going to explode. And I felt like I was flooded. Gross. And in the morning, yeah, I know. And in the morning, my underpants were all wet and my bed was all wet.

I felt all the burning. And this is a crazy descriptive book, by the way, and I may have offered that up earlier on in the thing. But, yeah, some authors hold back. Bud of Hopkins just hopped right over that notion and just gives it as it is. It's pretty, it's painting the picture, yeah. Andrea said, quote,

after a while my stomach started to grow. My mother took me to the gynecologist, and I was pregnant. And I couldn't believe it. My father was furious and asked who did it to me because he wanted to get even. And I told him that it was a weird man from my dream with funny eyes and a big head.

And you know, bud, the gynecologist said, I was still a virgin. I still had my haman. The situation was resolved when Andrea had an abortion. Joe, does any of this sound familiar or remind you of anything else? I wonder where they took that embryo or fetus, whatever it was. But notes here that the year was 1971 and no one suspected anything but all-to-normal misadventure. How, how, how.

So undoubtedly the fetus was not examined. Of course. When this unfortunate incident occurred, Andre was only 13-year-old child. Bud points out that obviously neither her physician nor her parents would have felt a strong need to preserve much information about this unhappy situation. Great question, Joe. I mean, it makes sense. But that's what we're told at least, right? That's what we're told.

And Andrea was hesitant to bring the subject up to either of her parents or to her former now relocated physician. She didn't even want to tell them about it. And that's the thing, too. The physician was relocated. Do they move doctors after they get someone in like this? Or do you think it could be part of it all somehow? Some MIB in there at the memory erasure stick. Okay, Doc, come in here real quick.

Yeah, I mean, or even like how messed up stuff happens with certain church denominations. But instead of stopping anything, they just move the priest from another place to the atrocities continue elsewhere. Mm-hmm. Perhaps. But what Bud finds to be most significant. in this context is the similarity of Andrea's description to Kathy's 1977 impregnation experience. This was the encounter that happened one night when Katie was driving out in the boonies or the sticks or the holler, whatever you want to call it out in the country. She was with her two friends, Dorothy and Roberta.

Then this could be found in the book, page 113 to 117 guys, but briefly to touch on it here. Inside of a UFO, Kathy described laying down with her legs elevated while something finger-thick was put. into her vagina and into her uterus. Hmm, pencil dick. Andrea felt that the probe penetrating her was long and hard and obviously of a diameter thin enough not to tear her hymen. Sneaky fuck tarts, this is what you're saying here. Which if we remember back on the insemination methods,

it depends on the species, but the semen is deposited using non-surgical trans cervical methods. Lapproscopic, right? So a keyhole surgery. technique that allows surgeons to operate the abdomen and pelvis without making large incisions. So it's one of these type of things that they're using here. Something we use is this where we got the idea.

High tech turkey bastin right there. Exactly. And perhaps also to retain hymonds. This is a sentence I never thought I would say. And why? If it was ETs or whatever, why would they care about that? To be sneakier? To be sneakier.

Absolutely. Because, and we're going to get there, actually. Kathy reported feeling extreme discomfort from the waist down burning sensation. Again, she was eight years old when this. happened, okay? And if we remember that Andrea felt that her vagina was flooded and on fire, she was 13 at the time of hers. And if we remember

the optimal age range, if one was thinking that they were engaging in a primate, AI, or artificial insemination, those ranges are from 10 years old to 20 years old. So if you're being considered a primate, they're well within their window with these eight to, oh, a little under with the 8 year old,

I guess, but we can prep her up a bit. We can go ahead and monitor her cycle. Right, because you said for humans, it's 25 to 35, right? Right. When you're looking at it from a human lens, if you're talking about humans and you're considering us that, you're going to wait until we're 25 to 35. If you consider us primates, you scoop us up starting to 10 years old.

Well, the sweet spot is 10 to 20. Some people eat fruit a little before it's right, won't they? Yeah. Fuck, what a way to put it. God damn, Joe. Now, both Kathy and Andrea sensed that they were paralyzed and unable to move throughout the entire part of their experiences. Each recall the presence of a man with, quote, big eyes and

gray skin, ostensibly responsible for the operation. Neither woman reports anything that can remotely be described as erotic or pleasurable or sensual. Very clinical. Yes. Yeah. The way to both accounts suggest a straight medical procedure and artificial insemination, the purpose of which we can only guess, which we will speculate while they hear,

but the basic difference between these two situations lies in the fact that the fetus and Andrea's case was aborted, remember? by a physician before it could be removed by UFO occupants during a second abduction. I wonder if she had any further contact with these beings. It might actually. But we're going to move on. They might be mad that, you know, you took their experiment away. Actually, don't, I think, get to it in that. I think that's pretty much it for Andrea's story.

But that is a great question. Because, yes, does she continue to be monitored? Is she, where is she now kind of a thing? Like, could we talk to her? Could we be like, hey, Andrea, we read you in Bud's book, Big Fan, what's up? You know, how are you? Have you, you know, can you give us an update here? The third related account that's come to Bud's attention in 1985, again, guys, he released

the book in 87, so these were fresh on his mind when he was writing that thing. An artist friend of his had introduced him to one of their closest friends who was a psychotherapist. Now, we're going to call her Susan, and she had a classic missing time encounter as a young woman in 1953 when she was a college student. in Australia. Her memory jumps from the recollection of a huge light, almost filling her field of vision, but beneath which she could see the form of two

booted feet, which is adorable. Then to a moment sometimes later, when she arrived at a youth hostel feeling confused and frightened and unable to recall what had happened to her in the meantime. Bud met her at a small dinner party given by Bud's artist's friend,

Jane. Now, Jane had read missing time and was struck by the similarity between the story that Susan had told her years before about the light. Thus, she planned that evening for Bud and her to meet. That's sweet of her, right? Though Susan had not read Missing Time, Jane had told her its thesis, and it obviously started bold memories, and she agreed.

After drinks had been handed around, the requisite period of small talk had run its course, the Amy of Weather reports and whatnots, Susan began to tell Bud her story in detail. And he writes that she looked as tense as can be, And as she arrived at the point of her account when she first saw the huge light, she suddenly burst into tears, jumped up, and fled the room. I don't think you do this if it didn't happen.

You know, these are, you got to be really good. And especially to Fool Bud Hopkins, I would think you have to get pretty early on the morning there. There's definitely some kind of like trigger going on there. But then you start thinking, like, it was that a, I don't know, some psychological response to like, you know, childhood abuse or something or a man. there's an account I heard and I don't like saying I'm not going to say who it was but I don't like saying that when they were saying the account what I thought of was one of those that it was that type of situation because what happened was so and not to say that reactions are rational but the reaction made me feel like it was phrased as that escaped as that because the reality was so much darker. And one of the methods that they did to prevent this alien that was coming through the window, okay, that they knew was coming phasing through walls and doors.

Yeah. They leaned a guitar up against the door so they could hear it if it opened. That's odd. Didn't that hurt your stomach a little bit? Because they knew that the physical opening of the door would make the guitar fall, hit the ground, and then make them wake up so that they wouldn't be abused. That doesn't sound like an alien story. Just put some bells on it.

Oh, sweet. If you're that, yeah, bells. I mean, I guess just again, desperate, you know? But you could write off a guitar, just lean the guitar against the door. If you're taping bells deliberately to a door to somebody abusing you, they would notice that. Oh, yeah, okay, good point.

You see what I mean? So, but as I was hearing the account, I was just like, why would, if they're coming in through the, because it was very certain that they were coming in through doors and windows, or, I mean, walls and went and ceilings, never through the door. But to do that, that's a different thing, isn't it? Yeah, that's pretty odd. We're here to, we're here for all that too.

Now, she returned a few minutes later, having composed herself, and finished her account. When Buda inquired about other earlier events so that she might connect with those that she told him about in another incident that happened when she was about 16 living in Vermont, she'd been driving one night alone on a country lane when she stopped her car and got out to watch a strange darting light. Now, she's not sure how long she was out of the car,

but by now the sighting had ended. But she said that she remembered getting home late that night. far later than she should have. And this meeting with Susan and her husband has led to be an extended exploration of those experiences, both of which have turned out to be, in Bud's assessment, UFO abductions. They conducted 11 hypnotic regression sessions, which helped to fill in the two complex encounters and two other previously unremembered experiences in fascinating detail. Susan was 16 years old when she stopped her car to watch the strange darting light.

After the first few moments of wonder and surprise, she began to sense a kind of communication between herself and the UFO, as if it was aware that she was aware of it. Then, to her utter surprise, she felt herself rising vertically off the road, floating upwards in a gradually curving trajectory until she came to rest on her back on a table inside the UFO. How bizarre!

So you're just standing there staring at something, all of a sudden you're floated up at an arc and now you're in a, you don't remember entering it, you're just now on a table. Yeah, and that brings up the whole, like, are some of these an astral abduction or something, you know? Yes, did they eat her body up, which that's what it would feel like if that would have happened. Are they just really good at getting you out of your body? You know, if you're not, like Vera could sit there and just pop right out, right? But I haven't, you get stuck in the head is what you said, you floated up, your feet floated up.

But maybe they're just really great at snatching your body out, separating the two. She was relaxed and unafraid, which is a familiar detail by now, as a physical operation of some sort was begun. And she describes two occupants in the ship, slightly different from one another, both in appearance and function. Which you hear this as well. You'll hear, like in the Pascagoula case, it was a chick and three clawed armed robots that floated around, like this chick and then her little squat or her little automaton's, whatever. The Nortics hang out with grays. Yeah, her gray tarrage. There you go.

Extrateresteroage. Suddenly, as soon as its hypnotic account became vividly physical, as she described feeling two small clips being attached to her labia, spreading them apart, and then a thin probe moving up into her. She could not move, but she could sense the probe at or in her cervix, apparently snipping or cutting. Ugh. Yeah, oof.

There was no pain, only an odd sense of discomfort. She does not recall feeling any uterine contractions, but she somehow knows what the thin, double-bladed tool look like, and afterwards she made a sketch of it. Susan recalled this operation during a hypnotic session but himself conducted when she made a visit to New York in 1985. And a few days later, she reported two significant pieces of information, which I'm sure, man, you go to hypnotic session or anything,

like a psychedelic experience, you get what's called integration after. You have time to think about it. Time for your body and nervous system to adjust to the new information, and you would probably start to allow new things to flow in and remember. This abduction experience occurred in 1949 when she was dating a Vermont boy, with whom she still occasionally corresponds. She decided to call him and ask him if he remembered her telling him about her UFO sighting that summer. He said he didn't remember her mentioning that,

but he did remind her of a UFO sighting that they made together that summer. which he discovered that she'd completely forgotten about, another apparent non-accident of memory on this. As he describes the circumstances of this incident and what they saw together, some of the details began to come back to Susan's conscious memory. But most significantly, Susan told Bud that after her friend talked about this forgotten UFO sighting,

she had a dream about a thin probe being pressed up into her vagina, an experience that seemed entirely new and different from earlier, the one that she hypnotically recalled with the snipping operation. So because of this new dream's possible symbolic content, Bud felt that it was important to know of Susan at 16, and her friend, who was two years older, had been actually banging that summer if they had sexual intercourse. And he said the answer from a very honest, very liberated,

very self-aware psychotherapist was an unequivocal, no. She had no reason to lie to him either. So Bud writes that the content of the dream was apparently not erotically connected with her boyfriend at all. Instead, it seemed to have been triggered by her memory of their shared UFO sighting. So when he said it, it triggered, just like the guy that said that he got the mantis thing when he saw it on TV 30 years later. Yeah. Susan was a virgin at the time and remained so for a number of years after. Like 13-year-old Andrea, she was using tampons. So she could have easily been penetrated by a probe thin enough to remove a tiny

fetus without tearing the hymen. That's to answer your question from earlier. Bud knew that the time they both witnessed a UFO, it was possible that Susan had been abducted along with her boyfriend and artificially inseminated during the encounter. If she subsequently

missed a period or two, she would not have been alarmed in the slightest since there would have been no reason to believe she was pregnant. So that's the other thing. They like picking up virgins because they can't write it off as somebody else's baby. Very sneaky. Anybody else's sloppy seconds according to them.

That's fucked up. So Joe, how many relationships do you think that this nonsense is ruined? Probably more than we'd ever hear about. But it is really creepy that they're going full Epstein with all this. Oh, dude. Then it makes you look at things like the Epstein situation and go, what were they actually doing? This is what we're here. This is what we're here, Joe.

This is what we're here. This connects to something much bigger, and you're absolutely right. So, evidently, many adolescent girls experience menstrual irregularity during the early post-puberty years. And if you're a species that knew that, one could be tempted to use it as a cover for nefarious shit. Indeed. Three more hypnotic sessions in the spring of 1986 confirmed Bud's suspicions. There were in fact two 1949 abductions,

the one that they had previously explored in which Susan was taken alone, and another in which her and her boyfriend were simultaneously abducted. Now, in August of 1986, Bud finally met and interviewed Al, the man who had been with Susan during their shared 1949 experience in Vermont,

which, I'm just going to point out here, when typed out, looks like AI. Oh, three successive hypnosis sessions revealed the details of an abduction that took place while the two young people were on a hike out in these mountains. A number of those details, such as Al's recollection of what seemed to be a jointed metallic section of the UFO's landing gear, precisely repeated the description Bud had heard earlier from Susan. She had associated their dual abduction with this same Griffin Lake shelter that they were out and their accounts of how the experience began and ended.

and when they were standing, when they first saw the craft coming down and so forth, all of it dovetailed perfectly. Their recollections diverged somewhat once they described what happened inside the craft. And so this is where they were apparently separated and dealt with separately. And this isn't... Did the dude say anything about, or did he not remember? This is him under hypnotic regression. He remembered seeing the UFO not being taken under it until three hypnotic recessions with Bud.

So Al agreed to meet Bud because of Susan. And said, yeah, I'll sit down and talk about it and said that's when they found that Al said, apparently they dealt with them separately. And this has been reported as far back as Betty and Barney Hill case because that's what happened with them. Yeah. Got to keep him separated. Divide and conquer, right? As the offspring once said, yes. But again makes a point that details from this experience were not passed from Susan to Al in advance of his hypnosis,

nor in any of the reproduction focus accounts that we've been examining have the women exchanged information. None of these chicks knew each other. None of them talked about this. They've never met or spoken to one another. Neither Kathy, Andrea, nor Susan have ever had a miscarriage. Apart from Andrea's experience as a 13-year-old, none has had an abortion. Kathy and Susan each have two children while Andrea the youngest is childless. Andrea recalled her impregnation as a dream, quote,

but both Katie and Susan only discovered that their gyneological experiences when they underwent hypnosis. So they didn't know anything about it until they underwent hypnosis. Andrea has it as a dream, but her mind phrases it as a dream because she didn't want to deal with it, probably. In fact, it's important to state that all three women have had either bad dreams or normal recollections of having been shown at later times, tiny offspring

whose appearance suggests that they are something other than completely human and that they are in fact hybrids, partly human and partly Bud writes, what we must call for want of a better term, alien. In the book, also I'll say that he's got a little sketch that was made out by Kathy of her kid that she saw.

Dude, it's creepy. It's this spindly, the hair is nasty. It's like a doll with hair that's been all pulled out, but the head's real fucking big. eyes are weird. It's sort of lanky and malnutrition. Yeah, it's just, it needs sun. It needs just something.

That is another weird part of these cases is that they sometimes later will show they'll bring them back and be like, this is your child that we created out of high, you know, what's the point of that then, too? If they were trying to be sneaky in the first place, you know, in these phantom pregnancies where they, they swear they're pregnant. Then one day they just aren't anymore. and then like two years later they bring him back on the ship or whatever

and they're like look this is your child what the fuck is the point of that it's so weird there are narratives that say that it's because they need us to interact and I heard this thing a long time ago that if you take let's just say humans and put them in a cage one of them can live with a teddy bear

with milk coming out of it longer than one where you take the milk and just put it in steel mesh so they need comfort you need support you need support you need comfort you need something to warm up next to and and if you think about it from that way then the robot or the gray-skinned whatever the hell they are are the mesh in this instance and they don't have the soft warm touch for a variety of reasons not a great outside manner from what

we've heard that's what it is so they need like surrogates basically to be able to raise them in a better environment and that's been allegedly one of the big problems with this is that they need other humans which could be why people get abducted and never come back They're just basically made to be like a, what do they call those moms that? A nanny? Like a nanny mom. There you go. Yeah, like a nanny that'll nurse and take care of kids.

Oh, a night nurse? Is that what is it? No. I don't know. There's a word. Somebody's screaming it. It's an occupation, actually, where you just take care of children. But not like to the capacity of a daycare.

It's much more intimate. It's like you've raised them and all that kind of shit. Anyway. But it admits that it's unthinkable and unbelievable, yet that's the direction. the evidence points. An ongoing systematic breeding experiment must be considered one of the central purposes for UFO abductions. Do we need to go back over the artificial insemination procedures in mainstream science that we know are going on? So one more for this one and then we're going to cut it. Okay, guys. Which again, check the links down below. There's plenty of stuff down there.

Check out Bud Hopkins Intruder's phenomenal book. And if you guys got anything else out of this work, Write it in. I'm just very curious about your thoughts on it. So I just appreciate it. In 1985, Bud met a young woman named Pam, who had had an interesting missing time experience when she was a teenager. While driving California with her mother and older sister, Pam and her older sister recalled that their car had somehow overheated and otherwise broken down and that their mom had left them inside the car there while she went to go get help on foot. from then on their recollections get hazy, but under hypnosis, Pam described a low, silver-gray vehicle arriving at some point, and she is inside, around space. Her memories then become those of a typical UFO abduction.

The only reason we're discussing it here is it's because of its relationship to the pattern that we've already been considering. Now, Pam was born in 1957, but describes her as divorced and childless. She is a slender and very attractive dancer And her profession apparently taking precedence Over any thoughts of marriage and family She's a strong, independent woman that don't need no man But she probably gets skipped up and abducted

But says that whenever he interviews somebody Who has a reason to believe that she is an abductee He always makes it a point to ask about the person's dream life Especially any reoccurring dreams from childhood That may have any bearing on the subject of UFOs Pam told him that in 1980 she was living in New Mexico with her husband at the time

and she had a series of nightmares including a reoccurring dream of a silver train coming down to get her to pick her up and to take her away. They lived on the edge of a golf course rather far from houses and that isolation was a reason

that she felt nervous all the time. The fear bud sensed in her voice when she talked about that house in her dream of the big silver train that made him feel the very same way that he did with everyone else, that she may have well been abducted in 1980 at that location as well. Later in the interview, he inquired about her health, asking the usual cover questions and bringing it to the subject of pregnancy. Had she ever had any unusual

experiences, you know, down there? Her answer was immediate. She had had an odd thing happen during the time that her and her husband lived in the house by the golf course. For both personal and career reasons she was practicing birth control. She missed a period and inexplicably found herself pregnant. Both urinalysis and blood tests were positive and at that point she chose to have an abortion. When she went to the clinic for the operation, she had been pregnant for about two months and afterwards the doctor came back to her with a worried look. He had found no fetal tissue. No sign that she'd been pregnant. Not knowing what to make of the unusual situation, he insisted that she go back to her gynecologist for more testing and examination, suggesting that

perhaps she had a tubial pregnancy. Do you know what that is? A tubal pregnancy. I've heard it, but I couldn't describe it. I don't have a vagina, so I looked it up. A tubal pregnancy is the most common type of ectopic pregnancy, and it occurs when a fertilized egg implants and begins to grow outside of the uterus where it's not supposed to be, usually within a fallopian tube, because the fallopian tubes cannot stretch to support the developing pregnancy, though, it's a medical emergency that cannot continue to term. Sounds painful, too. I don't have fallopians, but it sounds painful. Oh, it does. And then it makes you think that maybe some of these are intentionally planted there

and tubial so that they don't make it to the uterus, so that either way, if they are messing with this stuff, it wouldn't go to term, or it would be something that would be found out and then pulled. But it sounds like they're pretty on their shirt. shit and they don't kind of leave any open tabs, if you will. Right. Except for an Andrea's case, they just weren't able to get back. She got it out of her before they could come back for the second abduction. Huh.

That's bizarre. Now, Pam told by the doctor's demeanor made her quite uneasy. So she did as he suggested, and all tests were negative. She was just not pregnant anymore. Yet there was no sign that she had had a miscarriage. We were all very aware, of course, that odd things happened during pregnancies, which can also be another right-off for this. People as well as animals have false pregnancies.

Actually, it's far more uncommon in farm animals. Bud notes, quote, yet physicians claim that urinalysis and blood tests, when paired and properly administered, cannot be wrong. Pam evidently missed two periods, and only later after her abortion, did she have normal menstruations. Her situation seen besides Kathy's, Andrea's, and Susan's, is at the very least highly suggestive. but he adds, as we shall see, there are even more profound similarities.

And that's where we are going to cut it on this one, guys. Now I am. So far, though, we've been dealing with this topic from one side as it relates to the female sex. Though those that brag that they drag a dong to get it on have been far from exempt show. And on Tuesday's Plus show, we're going to hear it from the boys as we continue our clapback exploration of this freaky, ass woo-woo. It's a bit of a cock block I know, but we're not going to edge you for too long here. Sign up in the links below for Tuesday's show because it's full of guy strangeness, if you want to go with the pun there. You're not going to want to miss it, so sign up in that

link below guys and check it out because there's still so much more craziness. And we save the craziest shit. I mean, it's sad and weird with the chicks. And because it's so young, and there's so many implications that you and I also still have to talk about on this, but the dudes are funnier. I would say. say, honestly. Still traumatic as shit, but lighter. And so we're going to do that in the Tuesday show. Sign up, guys. But before we cap this and get to the extension, tell us what you're going to be talking about on that bad bojo, if you don't mind. Yes, dying to be me by Anita Morjani buddy. And again, she's, she goes through this whole, her kind of life story, really, but it's

interesting. It's not a boring life story. And then it gets to the, the culmination, the, the NDE that came about from her crazy cancer that was just gone. after the NDE and we'll see what she has to say about all of that coming up in plus. I have a wonderful idea for a cookbook series if you're ready for it. I'm going to toss this out to the universe. You guys can do what's right by us if you do strike big with this. Okay, a cookbook series, okay? But what you do is you take experiencers, you tell their story,

and then they give you their grandma's chocolate chip cookie recipe. Oh, nice. Yeah. So they tell you their freaky woo-woo, and then they're like, and now you're going to take one cup flour, two cups of sugar. You know, shit like that after they're like. And then the alien probe me with this finger-sized thing, but don't worry, it didn't break my hymen. And so... One cup of chocolate chips.

Yeah, exactly. That's the way to do it. All right. And then you could do every genre, right? It goes pretty normal, all that good stuff. Okay, well, banger, looking forward to the extension. So let's get to this damn thing, guys. Thank you all so much for hanging out.

And thank you, of course, everyone on Plus. We're looking forward to seeing you on the other side of this for everybody else. We're going to see you next week for our last Friday show before the break. but we will be back then on July 10th for all of you. So this is a great time to go ahead and sign up in Plus because we got way more stuff over there. It's going to tide you over. Looking forward to seeing you in this extension for everybody else.

We'll see you next week. Extension, glad to have you here.