NFL Stock Exchange: An NFL Draft Podcast - 103. Re-Ordering The Top 20 Picks From 2022 NFL Draft

Episode Date: October 27, 2022

Hosts Trevor Sikkema and Connor Rogers re-order the players who were selected in the Top 20 of the 2022 NFL draft and re-order where they would take them today based off their pre-draft big boards and their current performances.

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I got it this year. It's awesome. Sign up now at youtube.com slash BS, device and content restrictions apply. Local and national games on YouTube TV. NFL Sunday ticket for out-of-market games excludes digital-only games. Welcome to the NFL Stock Exchange podcast. In this episode, redoing the top 20 in a fun way. Connor and I are looking at the players who were the top 20 picks from the 2022 NFL draft,

and we're reordering where we would put them today in a big board. So team needs, team context, that's not in the equation. Just a pure big board based off of not only what we thought of them pre-draft, but also with a couple of games now, about six or seven games under their belt and how they look in the NFL. So it's going to be great to see where the shaking up is, where we each have different players. It's going to be a pretty different list when it's all said and done.

I'm Trevor Sycamore. With me, as always, is Connor Rogers. Let's ring the bell. Welcome to the opening bell of the NFL Stock Exchange Podcast. I'm Trevor Sycamore. That is Connor Rogers. Got an exciting episode for you. As we know, now Thursdays are wildcard episodes where anything could happen. And today, we had a good idea where we want to look at this rookie class. We want to do it in a creative way.

So what Connor and I are going to do for you here today is we're going to go through the top 20 picks of this past NFL draft and reorder it without team needs into it. Just kind of a big board of where we would draft these players seven games in. So it's a little bit of a check on what we thought of them pre-draft and including what we have already seen from them as pros. I think there's a lot more giving credit than there is punishing guys, but we'll see. Connor, I'm excited for this little exercise. It's going to give us a good look at some of the guys

who were picked at the top of last year's class. Me too. It's kind of a unique way to do a rookie reaction show instead of just saying, oh, this rookie's actually played well in week four. It's a big picture of the top 20. So if a player that you think should have went in the top 20 they don't qualify for this unfortunately it's only the players that went in the top 20 reshuffling some overreactions some instant reactions i think it's going to be a lot

of fun and you and i will go back and forth and in chunks of five until it gets the end yeah i i can already see people now when tarik woolen isn isn't on either of our lists. It's always Tariq Woolen. They're just going to be like, where's Tariq Woolen? But it's only the players that were picked in the top 20. We had to cut it somewhere. So maybe at the end of the show, we might talk about some guys that weren't in the top 20 that we would say would probably, we would put up in that 20 at this point, but wanted to keep it organized.

So we'll go from descending order. We'll start at 20 where we will work our way up to number one. Of course, we've got to keep the element of surprise to keep you guys listening to the podcast. But I figure, Connor, a good way to do this is just to remind people who went in those top 20 picks and where they went, the teams that selected them. Number one overall, of course, Trayvon Walker.

Number two for the Detroit Lions, it was Aidan Hutchinson. For the Jags, of course, picking number one overall with Walker Houston Texans at three they went Derek Stingley uh Jets at four went Sauce Garner Giants at five Kayvon Thibodeau Panthers at six Iki Ikuonu Giants again at seven they took Evan Neal Falcons at eight they took Drake London uh Seattle Seahawks at nine they took Charles Cross Jets again at number, they took Drake London. Seattle Seahawks at nine, they took Charles Cross. Jets again at number 10, they took Garrett Wilson. Saints at 11, Chris Olave. Lions at 12, again, they took Jameson Williams. Interesting to see where he's going to be on this list

because he hasn't played yet, but we both love them. Eagles at 13, they went Jordan Davis. Ravens at 14, Kyle Hamilton. Texans at 15, Kenyon Green. Commanders at 16, Jahan Dotson. 17, Chargers, Zion Johnson. 18, is 16 Jahan Dotson. 17 Chargers Zion Johnson. 18 Titans Traylon Burks. 19 is the Saints again with Trevor Penning.

And then 20, Pittsburgh Steelers. We're sneaking a quarterback in here. We're getting Kenny Pickett. He just makes the last cutoff there. So we will be reordering those 20 players. And like I said, it's not like whoever we're going to have at number one overall. It's not like we're saying, oh, the Jags whoever we're gonna have at number one overall it's not like we're saying oh the jags should have taken this player at number one overall because we're not taking team needs and context into it essentially we're revising the big board if you

will revising the rankings of what we thought of these players just with a little splash of NFL experience in there. So, Connor, I'll let you start. We'll go 20 to 16 to get the first five out there. So 20 for me was Trevor Penning. I don't think anyone will be very surprised by that. 19, Kenyon Green. 18, Traylon Burks. 17, Kyle Hamilton. 16, Kenny Pickett okay all right uh so funny enough i have i have trevor

penning at 20 i have kenny green at 19 there we go works at 18 i have kenny pickett at 17 and then i have zion johnson at 16 so okay i have ham Hamilton a lot higher. Where was it? Where was Hamilton pre-draft for you? Eighth. Okay. He was fourth for me. So I think maybe I'm a, well, we're going to naturally do that.

I'm hoping that he's going to be right. I've got, I've got to do that too. So, well, I think we'll, there will be plenty of back and forth here. Trevor Penning.

We haven't seen yet. We saw him in the preseason. We saw him during training camp. But he's been battling with a pretty bad case of turf toe, so he has not played at all this season. It makes sense that he's number 20. He was a lot lower on my personal big board. That's what it comes down to.

And I know that he was lower on yours as well. We were kind of lower on him than the consensus was. Kenyon Green, I think, has been playing okay yeah um so but not better than like a zion johnson was so i gotta have him all the way down here i mean i'll i'll let you take over though because you were you were listing them off uh what are your thoughts on these guys that you got here on the first group yeah i think it's it's self-explanatory on the bottom three right penning was a guy viewed as not a first-round player, and he's been hurt. So he fell one spot.

He went 19th. He's 20th here. Kenyon Green, I don't think – Kenyon Green had a late start to the summer, and I think he has not been great. I think he has particularly struggled in pass pro. But, I mean, once again, it's not the end of the world. Burks getting hurt. It felt like Burks was starting to turn the corner a little bit,

and then he got hurt. So that was disappointing after he had an up-and-down camp. And then I think the one people want to hear about probably is Kyle Hamilton at 17. It's just tough to draft a safety in the top 20. And I don't think he can really cover, honestly. He's somebody that needs to play close to the line of scrimmage. Looks good as a blitzer. Really good as a blitzer. Looks good downhill. I just have significant concerns about any coverage ability with him. And that's been the issue with him i know ravens fans are very disappointed so far

and it seems like he's gotten better in october than he was in september and i still think he could be a good player in this league but i mean trevor there was a time where we we talked about kyle hamilton as a elite talent one of the best talents of the draft all these things and that's where i ranked him yeah i just think i just think his coverage problems that i saw on tape at times in college are it's not going to get easier in the nfl you know i am not going to be nearly as hard on kyle hamilton he's not going to be ranked he's not going to be ranked fourth again for me i i did bring him down a little bit i can understand why he's a little bit lower actually when i did my first i'll say rough draft of this exercise i did have hamilton closer to 15 i think

originally had him at 14 but then went back looked at my pre-draft rankings um all right well you can hear my dog that's that's guarding the apartment from nobody who's probably breaking in. No, I thought that Kyle Hamilton could be a player who had a ton of versatility, but I always figured that the coverage was going to be the thing that took the longest for him. And when you look at his snap counts, hold on, let me find it here um 42 snaps in the box 41 snaps a slot corner and then 82 snaps of free safety so defensive back is so difficult to play anyways they're using him in so many different areas it was he was going to struggle. He was always going to struggle during this time period

of where are we going to use him best, where can we get the best out of him. Okay, can you hear him really loud? I keep talking while you go check on the dog. Bingo. Yeah, you should do that. I keep talking while Trevor goes and checks on the dog. I think with Kyle Hamilton, part of the problem problem and once again this is like early reaction so this isn't

if Kyle Hamilton was dead last on this list of 20 you kind of sit there and go what's going on for a guy that a lot of people viewed as one of the best players in the draft I think that I agree with Trevor the usage is you know there was kind of a narrative around him or maybe a mirage that he was this unicorn safety, and I just don't think that was true in a sense of you're going to have him play traditional free safety, roam around, or be an eraser with, you know, various skill talent in the slot. I just think that him playing in the box and living downhill and playing fast north and south and and obviously

being a weapon as a blitzer and not giving a lot of ground as a run defender are things that he's really good at and ways he can make impact plays if you ask him to get out in space and run with shiftier slots or even run the seam with some of the more gifted physical athletic straight line tight ends, he's going to find himself in trouble at times. And any young safety would, but I think it's obviously been highlighted for him because of how highly he was regarded. Connor, I agree completely with everything that you said. Blind.

That's amazing. Shooting blind. No, I appreciate you uh i appreciate you doing that there's no problem at all i've got my little pup here with me obviously as people wanted to know and look he's the star of the show he wants to get on the podcast he won he wanted it yeah he wanted to get his draft takes out and i can't blame him for it so do i do so do i here on this show not a fan of kyle hamilton no clearly not a fan of Kyle Hamilton. I mean, I'll get to some other thoughts that I have on Kyle Hamilton when I bring him up a little bit higher on this list.

But versatility is something that I figured would be what we love in a scouting report and also something that we punish him for, if you will, his rookie season, because that's just kind of what always happens. We love to praise versatility. But then when you get to the NFL, it's tougher to stay that versatile. You've got to learn a lot of different things. That's right.

We'll get to that at some point. Let's go 15 to 11. Who you got 15 to 11 so we can talk about these guys next? Yeah, so 15 to 11. And for Kenny Pickett at 16, for me, I mean, we've barely gotten to see him play. I think the numbers look worse than

how he's played personally uh he's had some really bad luck interceptions i think it's a hard part of the schedule i was shocked they decided to insert him when they did um so kenny pickett's a big tbd 15 for me johan dotson 14 for me evan neal 13 for me derrick stingley 12 12 jameson williams okay because jameson williams hasn't played so i left him exactly where he got drafted there's nothing to say i still really like jameson williams and think he's actually exactly what the lions need which is a really good sign and then 11 i'm just kidding 11 trayvon walker which that might sound bad because he went number one i think i had trayvvon Walker 20th in the draft, so he's actually played better than I expected to be fair to Trayvon Walker.

I had him 20th. Wow. Okay, now we're getting into some difference. This is good. This is good here. 15, I have Jahan Dotson, so I wondered if we were just going to stay shot for shot the whole time. 14, I have Jordan Davis.

Jordan Davis is basically exactly kind of what i thought that he was going to be honestly could probably have him a little bit higher on this list i think he finished 11th or 12th on my big board so i could have him a little bit higher but there's some other guys that i had a little lower than jordan davis specifically the wide receivers that are already showing out that i think have been fantastic that i have above him i've got garrett wilson at 13 i know gar 13. I know Garrett Wilson was below Jordan Davis on my initial big board. So I've got him one spot above Davis. And then I got Chris Olave at 12.

I've got Drake London at 11. So I just go boom, boom, boom. I go to those top three wide receivers right there. And I think that it's, that's not a slight on any of these guys at all whatsoever. I know people might look at that and be like, dude, Drake got drafted eight overall. You know, you're, you're putting him a little bit lower but i've got to stay true to kind of where i had them in my rankings as well and versus some of the other players that are a

little bit higher i think this is pretty fair for them so i've got those three wide receivers right there it sounds like you're a little bit higher dude dig into evan neal being a little bit further down and then i'll have you get into derrick stingley as well that's somebody that i want to have a conversation about so i had evan neal as the fourth overall player in the draft man you got him this far down and as the second ranked offensive tackle for me behind icky okay i mean i'm not worried in a sense but i I don't, I think any Giants fan will tell you it was not a good, smooth start for Evan Neal. I think he's had significant balance issues, especially in pass protection, where he was not a strength of that offensive line. Now,

Andrew Thomas has been superb for the Giants. And I think, you know, it's hard to say that one tackle playing so well covers for the other because they're on oppositeants. And I think, you know, it's hard to say that one tackle playing so well covers for the other because they're on opposite sides. But I think that more so is the Giants line isn't a disaster and it usually is. So they're seeing returns. And I don't think Neal's been terrible. I actually think he's played his best football for the Giants in October. But I thought over summer and transitioning into September, there were significant balance issues once again in pass pro where he just didn't look comfortable. He was getting beat. He was giving up pressure. So I don't know. I don't know if I expected him to be an absolute dominant force from day one, but I did expect him to be better than what he's shown.

Now the positives are, I think they have a really good staff there that they're going to get the best out of him. And playing tackle as a rookie in the NFL is a brutal, brutal way to be thrown to the fire for anybody. It's hard for me to be too hard on Evan Neal. I had him as my number five overall prospect because I look on the other side of the offensive line and i see

the example of what evan neal could be right andrew thomas andrew thomas struggled early on in his rookie in his rookie season and now he is the highest graded offensive tackle that we have pff he's playing like one of the best offensive tackles in the nfl so i didn't have neil this low but it has been i mean it's been disappointing well i mean disappointing may be the wrong word he hasn't been great i think that that's probably just the way that you put it whether you want to say that's disappointing or not i think to your point it's really difficult to come in and play offensive tackle in the nfl right away especially as a rookie right out of the gate no matter how talented you are so i didn't have him quite this low he's in this next group of players that we're going with.

What about Stingley? What about Stingley? You got Stingley. What was he? 12. Is that where you had him? He was 13th. Okay.

Keep in mind. I had Stingley 17th on my big board. Okay. Okay. There we go. Therein lies the major difference. This is improvement. What I don't understand when I watch Stingley is the Texans took Stingley third overall.

Oh, brother. Don't get me started the texans are in tampa two and cover three all the time well like i don't this isn't really about derrick stingley i i feel like i could not put him higher than this because i don't you drafted derrick stingley with a top three pick when you draft a corner to do that i'm assuming you're gonna give plenty of man looks that you're expecting this guy to be in a racer at the next level that creates mismatches for the other 10 guys in the defense. Cough, cough. That's what the Jets do at sauce gardener quite a bit.

Jets have transitioned from a ton of zone to plenty more man wrinkled in and we'll get there. They don't, Stingley doesn't really get the opportunity to do this so i like that he he's been really stingy uh in the red zone he's given up his yards and catches against some good players that's fine it's not really a panic with me but i just i can't justify him being ahead all these other guys with what they ask him to do we i have the stats up here real quick for Stingley. It's insane. 51.9 coverage grade this year, 42 targets, 28 catches allowed, 22 first downs allowed.

And this is the part that really, you know, irks people who wish that they were using Stingley a little bit differently. 54.8% open target percentage. Only reason it's over 50 percent is because they're having him play off right he's playing a lot of zone stuff he's not allowed to hate is that he hated at lsu it's everybody knew it it's so silly so it's funny where you say like i can't bring him any higher because of that i had stingley as my number one overall player in last year's class and i'm not gonna fault him too much for yeah not being able to

play well in a system that he shouldn't even be running it's you know look lovey smith he's been around the game a long time he's a well-respected head coach obviously a tampa two guy more zone coverage guy at heart i'm not saying he's i'm not i'm not out here saying that lovey smith's a bad coach but you you need to you need to play to the strengths of your players, right? Like you said with Sauce Garner, when you have a certain trend of what you're doing and then you get a guy who gives you an ability that nobody else does that can change your defense for the better,

guess what you got to start doing? Guess what? It's your job as a coach to do something different, to change it to what is most advantageous. And the Texans just haven't really done that with Stingley. Why not take Thibodeau at that point then, if this is who you are? That was what was weird about it. It's like, did you make this pick thinking that Lovie Smith

just wasn't going to be the coach very long? It kind of feels that way. Lovie's never been, I feel like Lovie has never been that kind of coach to run a defense that gets the most out of singly going through overall dude a little strange it's perplexing didn't they say they'd play him in man a lot i'm pretty sure lovey came out after the draft and he was like yeah we we i think he called stingley after they drafted him and said i hope you're ready to guard the other team's number one receiver and stingley was like hell yeah brother and then it's it was a well-known

thing in the scouting community before the draft that stingley you can see the demeanor and how locked in he was when they were not only playing well but when he was asked to go out there and run all day in the hip pocket and man coverage compared to when they asked not only playing well, but when he was asked to go out there and run all day in the hip pocket in man coverage compared to when they asked him to play zone. Everybody knew it. And everybody knew if you take him with a top 15 pick, you better be a team that caters to his strengths so he stays locked in.

And I'm not saying he hasn't been locked in. Right. I bumped him up four spots. Appreciate you bumping him up, getting it a little closer to what I had, which is number freaking overall, but number one overall. But yeah, you know, when I do prospect interviews with a lot of these guys, like, for example, I think of Devon Witherspoon, who I just got to sit down with, who is the corner from Illinois.

And he talked about how much fun he has when a man coverage call gets called in and he knows that it's him on an island and like that's the stuff he lives for that's what gives him the most pride that's what's going to get the dog out of him on every single play and i feel like stingley is that same way and they're just not really allowing him to be as valuable as as he can possibly be for a pick where number three overall is high that is high to select the corner but you pick that kind of whatever now we're we're going in circles i still have yet to talk about we'll get there get to him and i can go back in circles about it last one what did you even have as what what do you mean

the end of this the end of this section i had your finish yeah i did i had okay john so long john dotson at 15 um and you could pick out one of these players and we could talk about where they are in my life john dawson's at 15 i had jordan davis at 14 and then i had the three wide receivers i go garrett wilson yeah and then i go drake london so the one i drastically disagree with is jordan davis but the other counter argument is that they don't he doesn't play enough snaps i just think he's awesome oh so you got him a lot higher where where did you have jordan davis in my top 10 in this exercise yeah yeah on my final big board i had him 12th i think i had him like 11 so i'm honestly probably lower on him than i should be jordan davis should probably be higher on this list now that I'm even looking at it.

It happens. But it was hard to put him above the receivers because all the receivers are doing exactly what they should be. Yeah, I was very high on the receivers. You know, and you haven't even named the receivers yet. What did you think of me having Trayvon Walker at 11? Yeah, I think... You have him higher.

I have him a lot higher on this list um versus my big board i should probably have him lower especially because he's kind of what we thought he was going to be he's a stout i don't think he's rushing at all the pass rush win rate is below 10%. I think it's like seven and a half. But the flashes and the high points of him are nuts. They're alien-like. And I really do think it's just time. Like time is the only thing that's going to be in the way between him becoming a true all-around edge player that you can count on on every single down

in every single situation is he ever going to be a pass rusher like miles garrett or von miller or those or nick bosa no i don't think he's ever going to be that but i do feel like he's going to become one of those players that is known as one of the best in the game at having all-around ability he's not a specialist one way or yeah i mean like cam jordan cam jordan actually immediately came to my mind as well but i don't want it i didn't want it to sound like i was praising guys like nick posa and von miller and them and then just be like oh he's lesser he's like a cam no i think it's the type of player though cam jordan's a heavier it's a different kind of player. Yeah. So in the way Cam Jordan is known as a guy who is an all around edge player, a fantastic pass rusher, a guy who could be good in run defense as well.

I don't know if Trayvon Walker is going to be this double digit sack guy every year, but like somewhere between seven to nine sacks a season and somebody who's going to give you their own run defense as well with the freaky length and athleticism. I have him a lot higher on this list. I think I had him 14th on my big board. Okay. And I have him way higher just because I've already seen him.

I've already seen those flashes of athletic ability be too much for NFL tackles which has been great to see so that's where I got him all right 10 through 6 for me this is where I knock out the receivers Drake London at 10 Zion Johnson at 9 maybe that's a surprise I have Zion I had Zion at 16 I think Zion's I think Zion's struggled in pass protection but I think he's been good as a run blocker which is what we thought that he would be. I just wonder if he's ever going to be a fantastic pass blocker. We'll see.

I also look at, though, who he's played with since Slater got hurt. Right? Not Slater, but they've had right tackle problems, too. They've had so many problems on the offensive line where I try to evaluate in a nutshell. This guy doesn't have a ton of help on that line. That's fair. And he's put into a bad spot and yeah I don't know so Zion at nine hey go off king Garrett Wilson at eight okay uh Chris Alabe at seven wow okay Jordan Davis at six so the wide

receiver stuff's like a a very obvious overreaction by me I'm not saying I'm doing it for the show I'm just saying it's easier for wide receivers to produce early and they have. That's why they got the bump here. If I went back and did the draft today again, would I take Chris Alave over Garrett Wilson and Drake London? No, I wouldn't. But for this exercise, I'm saying that Chris Alave absolutely deserves the bump for what he's done, how consistently he gets he looks awesome so drake and garrett wilson are victims of offenses that don't throw the football and to their credit it's kind of shocking they still drake london still has over 300 yards and so does garrett wilson they actually have one they're one yard apart so hell of a show today between Marvel and the classic fire trucks.

Somebody tweeted at us and was like, who? There we go. Marvel literally hears the sirens. I don't know. Oh, no. It's, yeah. All right. So, congrats to everybody for already hitting bingo 30 minutes into the show.

No, but I think where it's unfair for Drake London and Garrett Wilson is that their offenses don't throw the football efficiently right now. And now Chris Alave has dealt with some crap since Jameis Winston got hurt. There's no doubt about that. So credit to him for getting through it. But I think all three of those wide receivers have flashed like you had hoped. That's why they are this high for me. The fact that they are all in the top ten is very impressive. But Jordan Davis at six is probably the conversation I think you'd want to have here.

Yeah, I mean, well, I kind of highlighted, I mean, Jordan Davis is playing as well as you could want him to. Yeah, he looks great. And he's on a great defense. And the Eagles, because of the luxury they are in, which credit to them that they've built this themselves, they have a great roster and a great defense where Jordan Davis doesn't have to come in and be Superman right away. He can handle a work share that they think is manageable for him as a rookie in the NFL

and how they get the highest effectiveness out of him with that snap count. So I don't hold that against him. And I know Eagles fans are clamoring for more of him, and it's probably time to take some of the training wheels off and let him go a little more. But Jordan Davis has been a total mammoth and a complete difference maker when he is on the football field. Yep. No, he's been he's been great. What do you got? I've got I got Evan Neal at 10.

I had him at number five overall on the big board. So I can't be I can't be too low on him because I do still believe he's's fantastic right a career is not made in seven games i know he struggled a lot but i do believe in him and i still believe in the talent i get jameson williams number nine i i think i had him at eight on the big board i can i can stop guessing and i can actually just look it up like like like a like a real podcast this is a professional podcast but um if you're still listening right now i jameson i jameson is set um kyle hamilton i have at eight simply because of what we talked about before you are asking him to do so much i still believe in the high-end talent that he has i believe he could be a single high guy for you of course his best stuff is going to come at the line of

scrimmage because he's an alien with his length and he can tackle so that was always going to be his best place early on i believe he still has that potential ability to be a good slot defender to be a guy who could play on the back end for you as a single high safety but yes right now those two things are a work in progress a little bit of a struggle you like what he's doing in the box a little bit better i get icky equino number seven okay i had icky third i think out of cross neil and equino but they were basically all right next to each other in the top seven on the big board and then number six i have charles cross charles cross is my top rated offensive tackle he's been able to come in and though he has struggled in run blocking a little bit again that's what we expected of him that's what the profile said pass protection he's looked really nice hasn't looked elite but he's looked really nice and especially for a rookie when you

put that context into it him coming in right away but i think he has been as advertised of what you would want of an offensive tackle i mean i i love love what I've seen from Kross and Icky. Love what I've seen. I don't know if we'll transition there yet, but I think it's all fair takes. I actually think, like, you had Kross tackle one. I think you should even take that and run with it higher. I think he should be in your top five.

I think he's been great. I think that's something to stand on. I think he's been awesome. All it's i think that's something to stand on i think he's been awesome so all right uh top five top five we're gonna have some some similar players in here five for me is aiden hutchinson four is k von tibideau okay three is charles cross okay all right two is icky aquanu and number one is sauce gardener of course yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah of course with a beaming smile on my face if you're listening audio only number one is sauce gardener trevor you say that through the smile they didn't need they didn't need you yeah i mean pride and joy of gangrene sauce gardener trevor who do you got here five i have aiden

hutchinson um and i'm gonna be honest we did this we did this exercise for it's just football in the interest football show and we only did this with the top five and so i had i still had trayvon walker obviously in my top five because he was drafting the top five and we were restricting it to the top five so i have walker at number four in all honesty i should should at least have Walker and Cross flipped, given where I had them on the big board. So I should at least have Charles Cross at four and Trayvon Walker at six.

Flip them right now. Charles Cross is at four. Yeah, yeah. It's our podcast. We can do what we want. Literally, whatever we want. I'm putting Cross at four because I got to stay true to my big board.

I can't really go back on it too hard i had sure if i'm walking outside of the top 10 and even though i've liked what i've seen um and i've liked him a little bit more than aiden i'll put him at six so i got charles cross at number four i came on tibu he's my number one edge rusher at number three i have derrick singly jr at number two he was my number one overall prospect i can't get in a situation where oh he's disappointing from what I've seen from him. He's playing a position, we've already talked about it, where this isn't what he was supposed to be doing. So I cannot fault him too much for that.

And then Sauce Garner, without a question. Number one on this big board, I knew that we would have the same list. When you look at Sauce's stats so far this year, they're incredible. This is a rookie corner doing this. 88.4 coverage grade, which is nuts. He's been targeted 40 times. He's only allowed 17 catches, and yet he's got 10 forced incompletions. Just a 51.1 quarterback rating when targeted.

He's the truth, man. He's unbelievable. Congrats to the Jets. Congrats to you. He's been absolutely fantastic, and he deserves to be number one on a rankings list. Yeah, he was my seventh overall player in the draft, and he bumps up to number one here. I just, it's been impressive, and to see him do that against Cortland Sutton, I mean, it won them the game, by the way.

He literally won them the game. So we're at that point with Sauce. Icky at two for me. Yeah, talk to me about Icky. I think Icky had a slow start. Icky's two for me. Yeah, talk to me about Icky. I think Icky had a slow start. Icky's October has been insane. Icky looks so good in October. He hasn't allowed a sack, I think, since week two.

But more importantly, he's been consistent in pass pro in October. I thought he looked so good run blocking against both the 49ers and the Bucs. He's incredibly athletic getting to the second level. We're seeing that bully ball. And I mean, part of this too is that Icky was my top player in the draft, like you with Stingley. It's funny we both had our top players from the draft as number two in this exercise.

You just have so much belief in their talent that when you see the flashes that they've both shown this year, you go, yeah, they're going to model that more consistently and they're going to be the players that we expected them to be maybe the most interesting one for us in this is hutch because we never really talk about hutch and you and i both had correct me if i'm wrong had tibideau over him yes and some people listening to this might go well hutchinson has four and a half sacks tibideau only has one why do you guys still have Thibodeau over him? Thibodeau, I think, has actually looked like the more consistent pass rusher.

Not just sacks. Dude, without a doubt. I've got their numbers up right here. Hutchinson, 60.0 pass rush grade compared to Thibodeau's, which is 69. Hutchinson has 19 pressures. Thibodeau only has nine, but there's been some snap count there. Oh, I'm also grading. Sorry, sorry.

I should have said this. I forgot this is what the stipulation I have on this. This is Thibodeau since week five. So when he's been fully healthy the last three games, the last three weeks, this is what we're judging him off of. Pass rush win rate for Hutchinsoninson it's just 11.1 for tibideau it is 16.1 that's jarring that's that's like borderline mediocre to very good difference right yeah so that's the that's the major difference for me is tibideau is a better

pass rusher and it took a while for aiden to kind of figure it out in college football they were moving him around a lot. And this last year, he absolutely went crazy. And you love to see it. And I'm absolutely not taking that away from him. But I'll also say he, I think this past game was rushing a lot more from a two-point stance. And that seemed to be what he was most comfortable with when he was at Michigan. So I am very curious to see if they continue to allow him to be a two-point stance rusher

for the rest of the season and how much that pass rush win rate is going to go up because i think it is for him playing a more natural comfortable stance and position so uh right now it's it's still easy for me to say i'd take tibideau over aiden hutchinson but i would like to see what a full year of him as a two-point guy ends up yielding no doubt no doubt and you just look at those defenses right now i mean aiden's kind of out there and with a unit that they just they can't get it right they cannot get it right and you look at what wink has done with the giants and kt has talent next to him dexter lawrence is really freaking good, man. Dude, Dexter Lawrence is playing so well this year. Like, that stuff matters.

So, I mean, that really, really does matter. One note on me for the top five as well. Charles Cross was my ninth overall player. Gets bumped up to three here. Ooh, love it, love it. Yeah, coaching, it goes a long way. I look, I look at Seattle and I'm just so impressed. Not just him, but Abe Lucas too. The task of starting two rookie tackles,

I think is up there with some of the hardest tasks we've seen coaches have to deal with in the NFL this year. And Seattle's doing it and winning and scoring a lot of points. It means something. That's means something that's true it's true let's talk about we'll we'll get into some of the guys who were not in the top 20 that maybe could have got a shout out could have been in that group if we were expanding our stipulations here for this exercise but connor while you look that up we get a new sponsor for today's podcast bro throw b-r-o-t-h-r-o spelled exactly how you think it is have you ever bet on sports with your friends that's basically what this is bro throw

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Start betting on Bro Throw. The way that I explain it to people who ask about it, it's as if Connor and I were sitting on a couch. Classic. Just goes, hey, bet you five bucks the Jets win. Connor goes, all right, bet you five bucks they they don't or other way around probably in this scenario but that's it that's literally what it is you just had it you are doing you are doing that with people all across the country so it's a really cool concept go check it out prothrow.com backslash pff and you guys

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but is there anybody that really stands out that you'd say, okay, if we open this all up to just my top 20 from the entire class, some guys who would sneak in there. Ooh, that's a good question. Top 20 from my ranking. So I was going to go all the way deep and go Tariq Wollin, who was not in my top 20. Right.

I mean, we would probably put Tariq Wollin here in the top 20. I think you have to for as well as he's playing at a at a big uh well i mean i had linderbaum fifth overall and i think he's been phenomenal for the ravens oh you had him at five yeah i had him at five and i i think that man he he's been excellent would you put brie saul in there top 20 now yeah brie saul kenneth, Damian Pierce, right? Like, if they were available in this exercise that we're doing here. It's a good question. Probably. I mean, I had him at 30.

So... That's pretty close, you know? He was... I know it's taboo for running backs to be in a top 32 on a big board in this era of draft analysis. This is safe space. This is safe space for had him at 30 so yeah i mean and the dude was one of the best running backs in football before he got

hurt so absolutely i'm trying to think of some deep cut deeper cuts here in the top 20 abraham lucas been playing really well let me look at my big yeah oh i probably that was a miss for me i probably put uh well yeah it was a miss for me too i didn't think you had the strength profile i got scared of like oh you pack 12 competition which i don't try i don't i try not to do a lot but beyond just scouting the helmet if you will there is something to conference brand of football and for the pack 12 specifically some offensive linemen i'm not saying all of them i'm not saying all of them, I'm not saying all of them, but sometimes Pac-12 offensive linemen can be a little bit lighter in the pants, don't exactly have the strength to anchor when they get to the NFL. They struggle with that against guys who are of starting caliber.

So I do think that that goes into it. I had George Karloftis at number 12 on my big board. Okay. Item 28th. I mean, he's been good. He's been good. He's been fine, right? I think I would probably have him back end of the 20, back end of the teens here.

18, 19, 20, something like that. George Pickens, I had at number 16. George Pickens has been good. I'd probably find a way to weasel him in there to make sure that I got the victory lap. Pickett taking shots to him has shown how good he is i mean trubisky was kind of hesitant to do that with him so i don't know if there's anybody else i'd put in there no i think that outside of somebody who would just be like vaulted up like a tariq woolen yeah absolutely i mean there's some that... That's about it.

No, that sums it up pretty well. I mean, I think back to... Man, I'm just looking at my board. I have not looked at my rankings, honestly, since the draft. So I'm just looking at some of these. Obviously, there's plenty that you miss on and some you hit on. Did I have Quay Walker, 74th? I cannot believe he went in the top 25 picks. I mean... Where did i have quay

i was not item 52 dude he went in the first round i was 22nd so speaking of 22nd i had devin lloyd at 22nd who's been taller good transition right there connor appreciate it good setup that was that was a good lob um i think i'd probably get devin lloyd in there now that i'm looking at it where did i have devin lloyd were you way lower on him than me no i had him 13th oh okay so he would be in there for you then he'd be in the top 20 for you i don't know how i missed that one yeah well he's up there he's definitely up there it's a fun exercise because it keeps you in touch with you know what is it early yeah like is this a purposely dramatic show filled with hyperbole at times to an extent of course of course yeah i mean it's a we're trying to make a show like it's. But it is very important to...

Because if we did the show at the end of September, Icky didn't have a good September. If you look at things like... There's plenty of guys that start to turn... Kayvon Thibodeau didn't play. But then you give them October and it's like, oh man, starting to turn the corner. So what will it look like for...

Maybe they do adjust with Stingley and Stingley gets to play more men and has more opportunities to take the ball. Things like that. Your lips to God's ears, I hope. Just play the man in man coverage. We need divine intervention here. No, we got to pray about it.

We got to pray about it. We got to manifest. And one day, Lovey's going to walk into the facility, and he's like, I had a revelation. I listened to the NFL Stock Exchange. I had a dream last night while I was listening to the nfl stock exchange going to bed as i do every night big shout out lovey huge sex addict for the pod oh man and he's like i gotta play i gotta play stingley and man coverage these guys really convinced me so i don't know it's it's fun to

look back on it it's fun to like you said look back on the big board i haven't looked back on the big board since this summer since you know maybe middle of the summer when i was looking back at some draft classes and looking at some numbers of where i had them versus my board so this is a good exercise to kind of dive back into it and it is funny as i was talking out loud i was like you know what probably gonna actually have this guy a little time you just remember what your stance was and what you thought of these players going into the draft and so um this is fun to do i enjoyed this this is good stuff nothing makes me laugh like us spending not days not weeks but literally months to make these boards and do these evaluations and then as soon as the draft ends

you're like i don't care about this like It's unreal. I keep them. Do you keep all of them? Oh, yeah. Okay. Which was interesting for me because I used to keep them on my BR drive. And even before I left BR, we were migrating. So I had to save all these things. And it kind of made me regret.

Not that I still couldn't do this. I'm just honestly too lazy to do it. I wish I made a printout binder for every year I did the draft. Like I shouldn't, but also I hate clutter and like things I don't need seven binders or whatever, just laying around this apartment. So that's part of it too.

I like, I find opening up the Google Sheet and being like, okay, here it all is. It's a tricky one. So speaking of keeping things, on a Google Drive, I actually just pulled it up right now to make sure that I still have it. I have the first mock draft that I ever wrote that's amazing i do not 2012

i have incredible i have an entire first round mock draft here and um this is something that we should incorporate on the show at some point i i would like to at least make it half of an episode okay like one day when we're doing a mailbag we can open up with the mock draft maybe yeah maybe next thursday maybe we'll do a mailbag episode uh maybe we'll do a we do need to do a mid-season like big board update show we do i think november is a good time for that okay i see traditionally when i've always updated the summer one. Yeah. Right. November. Like to redo the stock exchange board. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Or, or just like our own, like talk to the people about like our own top fifties, like how much things are changing. And yeah, maybe we could, I guess, update the show big board as well. I think that that would be a good exercise into doing that. Dude, I can't wait to see Michael Floyd and Bruceyd and bruce ervin and quentin coppels in 2012 mock draft brother i'm just scrolling through it now it's it's beautiful and people might be listening like i'll read it off i can't i need you guys to come back to the pod

need to tease tease it tease a little bit sneaky good draft with some horrible picks littered in. Oh, dude. Like, it's great. You got the Trent Richardson at three. I don't want to give away that show. We'll save it all for that show because I cannot wait. That's the most excited I've been to read a mock draft in years is your 2012 mock draft. I'm so glad you still have that.

And it's going to shame the shit out of me. You know what the best part about it is, Connor? I have blurbs for every one of them. I cannot wait. I cannot wait. I have an intro. I have blurbs. This was, you got to realize,

I, at this point in my life, I had just decided that I wanted to do this for a living. Yeah. I had just decided that I wanted to do this for a living. Yeah. Like I had just decided that I wanted to go to broadcasting school, that I wanted to pursue this as a career. So I had loved and listened and followed the NFL draft for years and years and years. But this is the first time when I went, OK, let me see if I can do this. Like, let's have some fun doing this.

So that's really funny because that was the first year I ever did anything with the draft as well i remember i was writing for a site that no longer exists anymore i think it was called jets draft it was straight to the point straight to the point no bs involved it was something like that and it was like a sub site of a network at the time right like whoever whatever network ran those sites so because of that this is like the age of like bloggers actually getting some access, not much. I was a college kid, same year. Maybe. Let me make sure. I got on the Mel Kiper conference call that he does.

Oh, yes. With media. And mind you, I'm like in my dumpy, dumpy apartment in albany like on the phone i can't even imagine what cell phone i had back then i did not have an iphone whatever cell phone i had back then like waiting it was a flip phone probably was to ask mel kiper you get to ask him stuff? Yes. I got a question. And I remember, so it was the 2013 draft. So I was a junior in college. And I asked him about Jamie Collins. Because Jamie Collins played for Southern Miss,

who did not win a game that year. So I was like, and like back then, the draft landscape was totally different. Now you go on the internet and you could Twitter search a player, and there is somebody that is posting clips of that player, even if they're a D3 player. Like that's where the draft covers. Back then, like I cared about, number one,

being on a conference call that Mel Kiper was answering media questions. I'm just some idiot college kid. I'm sure there was actual real writers on the call. And I'm like, I got to ask how you evaluate Jamie Collins, like on a winless Southern Miss team, small school player. Great question. And he ate it up. Like he went full Mel, like 8 million facts

and why Jamie Collins was great and all these things. And yeah, dude, it's cool talking about it. We never do this, talking about our roads into this space. It's wild to think 10 years later, we're sitting here. I don't ever take it for granted, obviously. It's no it's crazy now you know i mean now you're better than mel kuiper it's crazy dude no mel's mel's now mel is absolutely the godfather the unnecessary hate it is let me make something very clear it is not cool to hate on mel kuiper i cannot express that enough for the draft takes for the internet that likes to dunk on Mel.

I mean, we all have our bad takes. Don't get me wrong. You do have better hair than him now, though. Thank you. You know, I think that his hair is iconic, but as is yours. I mean, this is the hair podcast, dude. You know.

We know that. Come on, look at that flow. Get out. We did sell out. We did both get haircuts after all of our big... All our big chest pumping all summer oh we gotta get it we gotta get out of here before we do we gotta talk to you about our friends over at no house advantage you're changing the game i offer the most dynamic fantasy platform available today you pick who you play in pickup contest versus

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We've always made this clear. Yeah, of course. Right, right, right. Crypto bros, get back in the comments. I want to see 60 comments on this video before it uh before it hits two hours in that's what i want pump up the algorithm how do they all start all those comments i didn't know about this at the time no they're always all of all of them start out with like you know i was pretty skeptical about crypto initially oh no it's so's it. That's it every time.

Oh, my God. Hey, it gets me. And then now all my money's gone because I invested in it. Well, hey, hey, hey, hey, we're coming back. We're coming back. I don't have anything in crypto. Christ. Christ.

That's what I needed. I need crypto to tank and then we'll get in on it and then we'll be rich and then we'll just take the podcast and just, you know, elevate it to a whole different level. Then it could truly be the NFL stock exchange podcast. Appreciate everybody listening. Appreciate everybody getting in on the exercise. Of course, we would love to hear from you. Let us know your thoughts on our revised big board rankings that we had here

on the show. Let us know what you liked. Let us know why we're frauds, anything at Tampa Bay tray at Connor J Rogers on Twitter. You can also hit us up on Instagram as well. That's it for us this week, but we're going to be back on a Monday morning to give you everything on what matters most from what we're going to see in the NFL in week eight. For Connor Rogers, I'm Trevor Sykema. We'll see you then. Thank you.