NFL Stock Exchange: An NFL Draft Podcast - 203. Midseason 2023 All-Rookie Team

Episode Date: October 24, 2023

Hosts Trevor Sikkema and Connor Rogers give you each of their midseason all-rookie teams from the 2023 NFL Draft. The two give out there award, and bring some context to how each is playing relative to the rest of the class

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It's awesome. Sign up now at youtube.com slash BS, device and content restrictions apply. Local and national games on YouTube TV. NFL Sunday ticket for out-of-market games excludes digital-only games. Welcome to the NFL Stock Exchange podcast. In this episode, we are giving you our mid-season all-rookie teams. Both myself and Connor, we're going to have these full lineups, offense and defense. Give a shout out to as many of these guys as possible. Plus, of course, giving them those awards. We'll give you all sorts of stats, all sorts of PFF data to

let you know how these 2023 rookies are doing compared to the rest of their class. I'm Trevor Sycamore. With me, as always, is Connor Rogers. Let's ring the bell. Welcome to the opening bell of the NFL Stock Exchange Podcast. I'm Trevor Sycamore. That is Connor Rogers joining you guys on a Monday edition of the show. It is not a what matters most, or maybe it is for this show. How rookies are doing kind of matters most for an NFL draft podcast, right? So we are revisiting how the 2023 NFL draft rookies are doing in the form of a mid-season all-rookie team. Connor, I know we're not quite at the mid-season yet,

but we wanted to be first. Ricky Bobby, you're first, you're last. We're the first people to put out a mid-season all-rookie team. We're going to do it here on this show. I got my list, you got yours. We haven't seen each other's lists yet, this is gonna be a fun show it really is and it's a good time before you fall too far behind to do this because you can kind of blink and you're like wow they're like all we've had all these weeks we had all these games i've missed this fifth

rounder is actually playing this first rounder is not um so this is a lot of fun it's it's and it'll be interesting to see where we differ because like all lists like this there's some chalk picks but there was also a couple interesting decisions based on what you're grading are you grading you know amount of snaps combined with play are you just grading the overall play there's really a lot to go through here and And we could do this exercise again at the end of the year. So this is the perfect time to kind of see where everybody's at.

Oh, we definitely will. Admittedly, this is the part of like draft evaluation slash the process that I am bad at. I'm so bad at going back once guys are drafted. I kind of just like appreciate that they're in the league.

And I'm like, oh, yeah, you're doing well. And I don't actually think about how the rookies or second year players and things like that. So y'all have in the comments and y'all have hit us up on social media. You've talked about this before, like, hey, would love a rookie review. So we figured that this would be a great time to do it. We differed very slightly in the way that we had our rosters structured because, you know, as is the show, we didn't plan the show before the show. We did the whole exercise. And then right before we were like, wait, what was your roster spots?

So I have two running backs. You said that you gave it to one running back and then we're differing a little bit in our secondary choices, but it'll make for a good conversation no matter what you want to kick us off. I think quarterback is pretty obvious but uh hey maybe you'll throw me a curveball who you got a quarterback here for this mid-season all rookie team right no surprise that it's cj stroud and here's the thing trevor this one it could have been interesting if anthony richardson didn't get hurt a couple times this year but the bottom line is he did and he's out for the year. And what looked like such a

promising, exciting season filled with explosive plays was unfortunately cut short. And then you go through the list, right? Bryce Young is the other guy that's starting. He's the only rookie besides C.J. Stroud that has over 200 dropbacks we've seen a start from aiden o'connell hell yeah we've seen a start from dorian thompson robinson and we've seen a start from tyson bayesian hell yeah baby shout out to tyson bayesian who got himself a win in his first nfl start and and looked capable what a road it's been from D2 Shepard. So when you look at Stroud, man, and even if you want to say it's a two-man race because only him and Bryce are playing, it just hasn't been close.

We've talked about Stroud a lot on this podcast already. When you look at how he's taking care of the football, when you look at how fast his clock has been in Bobby slow, it's offense, whether it's the quick game, whether it's throwing outside the numbers, whether it's shroud is a good example of guy that has the tools, whether it's,

you know, the quick release, the accuracy, which is really, really important, but the tools are also matching the mental. And he, you know,

not totally shy away from this. He's gotten pretty lucky he has six turnover worthy plays and i believe he has one interception so right good living there's nothing wrong with that and the bottom line is he's still thrown for nine touchdowns the texans have dropped 12 of his passes so he's been a big victim of drops um but trevor i've been i've been really really impressed with how he operates this offense like a pro quarterback at such a young stage of his career. Yeah, and I feel like he's showing that his floor is maybe a lot higher than what we thought, right? Because you and I went into the evaluation process with C.J. Stroud, and it wasn't like he didn't have the flashes.

It's not that he didn't have the ceiling. You're just a little bit worried about the floor. And when you go through your draft evaluation, especially when it comes to quarterbacks who are dealing with pressure, not something that Stroud really dealt with very well at Ohio State, and especially against some opponents that you figure, okay, they're not fielding big-time NFL talent. So what's it like when you're not in that Ohio State bubble? Well, he's played really well. And he hasn't played perfect.

Like you mentioned, he's got six big time throws, six turnover worthy plays. The play under pressure is still not phenomenal, right? 36.9 passing grade under pressure. Four of those turnover worthy plays have come when he has been pressured. And so I think there's been a lot of great praise for CJ Stroud, deservingly so. But I've also, I feel like I haven't heard people talk about the negatives at all and there are some areas that he is still getting better and still improving what i love about stroud though is how fearless he is already when attacking deep down the field on passes that

traveled more than 20 yards 91.6 pff grade now if you are completing a lot of those passes, it's natural that you have a much higher grade because those are the bigger throws. They are further down the field. But the fact that he is not shying away from that at all, that confidence, that is the biggest thing to me why he's having success. It's not that there's not the negative there. It's those positives that give you so much faith that okay we are already going in the right direction with cj stroud whether it's hanging tough in the pocket for an extra second to get to another read whether it's throwing it deep down the field middle of the field sideline whatever it is he uh he's been up to the challenge at least from a confidence perspective and i absolutely

love that so i agree with you i have him as my quarterback for this uh for this little award as well it's interesting right because there's two things that stand out I agree with you. I have him as my quarterback for this little award as well. It's interesting, right? Because there's two things that stand out to me with this one. One, the bar to win this spot was so low. Very low. But CJ Stroud has played really well. Like if there was another player even close to his range, that would be like he's just playing really really well right now i

think he's played above expectations i know you and i really liked him as well like we we thought he was worth that you know top five pick in the draft but i still think he's ahead of where i expected so we'll move to running back and you did you did two running back spots right i have two because i'd like you to start this one okay we're both gonna have devon a chan as as the as the guy right no oh okay all right so i i have i have devon a chan the running back from texas a&m was picked in third round by the uh miami doll is third round right it wasn't the second round now I'm down he was the third he was the third round I know they traded up for him yes let me make sure my man has a 94.7 rushing grade this year which is just insane when he has been on the field he has been an unbelievably productive part of that Miami Dolphins offense. He is a another element of speed that helps that offense

be so unmatched when they are fully healthy. 0.39 missed tackles force per attempt. I believe that's the highest of the rookie group for at least guys that have played a handful of snaps. 12.1 yards per carry average. That is just silly. 15 of his 38 total attempts have gone for first downs. That is just how impactful this player has been. He is a piece in the Miami dolphins offense, but he is the exact piece, right? He is a player who, when we heard his name get announced on draft night, we went, of course he goes to the Miami dolphins.

And we are obviously seeing a lot of fun come through that. So he was my top guy just because when he's been out there, he has just been so explosive and so productive. So he is one of my guys. So who is yours? Who did you get? Now I'm curious. I'm curious if the second guy here for me is the guy who's number one for you

because, man, that'd be pretty wild if I had two guys on the list that didn't even make yours. I still went with Bijan, and I get it. Oh, okay even make yours. I still went with Bijan and I get it. Okay. All right. I still went with Bijan. Now there's, this is one of those ones that you could tell me what,

like four different names. And I'd be like, sure. Yeah. Because in just the snaps he's played, a Chan has been the best running back. Now there are some things to this. I mean,

he plays in most productive, right? Like Mike McDaniel is, in my opinion, the best running back. Now, there are some things to this. I mean, he plays in most productive, right? Like Mike McDaniel is, in my opinion, the best. He's been the best run game orchestrator architect in the NFL for way longer than he's even been coaching with the Dolphins. Like when to put this in perspective, when McDaniel was working under Shanahan and he followed him everywhere, the run game was always McDaniels right behind the scenes like McDaniel did all of that. So it's no surprise that McDaniel gets a

head coaching job. And at the same time, the first time in his life that he gets credit for the entire offense, that the run game is unbelievable. Whether it's Jeff Wilson in 2022, Raheem Mostert this year, a Chan in a couple of games, not taking anything awayChan, who's phenomenal, total game changer in this scheme and could very well be the best running back in this draft. I still wonder a little bit about the longevity thing with him because he's somebody that came into the season banged up and then he plays three big games and now he's on IR, right?

Like it's, and I think that there, you do get more credit at running back than other positions on this list for being healthy. Now we're coming off, of course, a weekend where nobody can even figure out what that was with B. John Robinson. They said he wasn't feeling well. I mean, a total mystery of of kind of why he wasn't playing. But there's no doubt a Chan has been the most impressive in a vacuum in those spots.

But for the longevity of the season, Bijan in a place where because of Arthur Smith, he has to share touches with guys like Tyler Algier, which is infuriating at times. He is handicapped by the pathetic pass game of the Atlanta Falcons. Like Desmond Ritter completely neuters that pass game for them.

I know there's been two games that have been okay, but the rest of them, what the defense can do against guys like Bijan and Drake London and Kyle Pitts because of how limited they are under center at times, I took that into account. We've still seen Bijan have two really impressive games of going over 100 yards.

He catches a couple of passes every single week and does something absolutely insane I want to pull up obviously the missed tackles force as well which is another area where I've been really really impressed with what he's able to do with what he's been given so I totally get it I think that it's really really fair and so Bijan's forced 21 missed tackles, which is a really nice number. Now, A-chan is forcing them at a higher rate per attempt. But once again, my concern remains with A-chan. Can that body hold up as a offense

where you build your run game around him? I hope it does, because I love watching the guy play, and it's unbelievable. But I did give it to bijan by a hair and i i get why a lot of people will probably push back on that well i mean bijan has been i think the most utilized running back of the entire group right i mean when he has 81 carries yeah and then i think he's i mean he's got a handful of receiving snaps as well so i I think he's number one in usage, and his grades are still good. You know, you've got a couple of players who are a little bit higher. Not many.

I mean, A. Chan and McLaughlin. And that's who my RB2 for this award was, is Julio McLaughlin. And I love it. And this is somebody who went undrafted from Youngstown State, who made a name for himself during training camp and during the preseason. Now he's getting carries. And, man, McLaughlin's playing well. I saw how good his grades were and how good his efficiency score was because he's got an 86.7 rushing grade.

I think that that's second only behind A-chan. And I didn't just go off of PFF grades. But if you're grading high, especially at the running back position, I feel like that's an easier one for our data guys to grade because running back production is decently straightforward about how you are successful at your position. So if you're grading really well, there's lower variance, I think when it comes to other positions, you know, like linebacker, I think is one that has a ton of variance. Safety is probably one that has a ton of variance as well.

Some offensive line play, depending on what you think the protection is in the chemistry between the other guys like i think that that can have some variance to it running back not as much so 86.7 russian grade from glockman 0.35 missed tackles force per attempt and i went back and i watched a handful of these dudes keep plays over the the this season and he's great man I love the vision I love the agility I love the contact balance I mean he's in cutback lanes all over the place he's seeing open space before it comes open I was really impressed not just with his production but how he is seeing the field he is a major part of that rotation with veterans like with Samadji Pirine is in that group and then

obviously like giovante williams as well i know they're kind of like getting giovante williams back up but williams super talented back at a unc you draft him in the second round like you want him to be the bell cow and i think mclaughlin's basically like hey i'm playing so well you can't help but get me the football and so i think that that gets a major nod to I'll shout out Tajay Spears as well. Didn't make my list, but somebody who I think is playing better early than I thought that he was going to get the chance to do so. Didn't make my list for for the all rookie team here at running back, but somebody that I wanted to shout out as well. I like that call out for sure.

McLaughlin's story has just been awesome to watch. I mean, it really, really has. I made a joke on our fantasy show at NBC fantasy football happy hour. I called, um, what I think I called Jameer Gibbs, uh, a poor man's Jaleel McLaughlin or something kind of like that, like really in passing. And I don't actually mean it gives us going to have an incredible career. He's coming off an awesome week, it's right it is funny when you take into context mclaughlin's this really small school player afterthought that had to make it out of a rookie tryout and he's really found free agent under i mean and like not all undrafted free agents are the same right like there's guys to get these

nice bonuses and they're a priority and their spot on the roster is a little bit more. The chance is higher. And then you got guys like Jaleel McLaughlin, who nobody expects anything from. And now he's probably one of Sean Payton's. Honestly, if you're telling me like name five Broncos that you think have the longest Sean Payton Broncos tenure. And I might put McLaughlin in there because I think Sean Payton just hates almost everyone else. I mean, he's clearly a Payton guy, right? You bring him in as your draft class. You're already getting him carries in his rookie year as an undrafted dude. Something about undrafted free agent running backs in Denver, right?

Phillip Lindsay as well. I immediately think of Phillip Lindsay. These guys know how to find him in Denver. So, okay, moving on to receiver. You got two receivers, right? I do have two receivers. And was this one hard for you? The second spot, not the first spot, first spot. The first spot was the quickest thing I've ever written in. The second one was definitely difficult for me so much so that I wonder if you're different here. I would think we're different here.

And when I wrote it down, I thought we were going to be different. So the first one is Puka Nakua because Puka Nakua has been one of the best receivers in football. Not one of the best rookie wide receivers in football. Puka Nakua has been one of the best wide receivers in football. He has an 86.5 receiving grade. He's caught 58 of 78 targets. He's at over 752 yards.

His route running, his ability to move the chains, his hands. He's caught five of 11 contested catch opportunities. I just like Pukunuku has been amazing. He's been unbelievable what he's able to do. And after Pukunuku is kind of like Stroud, but with a bigger pool of players to pick from, a really big drop off. But this one I think has gone under the radar

and it's not going to anymore because the quarterback he's playing with now is obsessed with him and it's been that way in the spots we've got to see them together i love what josh downs has done this year let's go baby josh downs is my other receiver on the halfway or midway all rookierookie team downs has only had did you have them top five i can't remember did he track five for you i'll find where i had downs um item four so i love this this is wow this is this is trevor's big win for you oh dude downs is playing that's amazing i mean i did have him with a second round grade um and i had him at wide receiver eight okay i mean i had jordan addison at five behind him but you know don't tell anybody that i'm only

counting the win for having josh downs i picked downs over addison so i mean that's what i would have done pre-draft brother this is a dude that went at pick 79 round three of the draft. And when you watch him play with Gardner Minshew, the ability from the slot, two-way goes. He's now hit some big plays. Downs has caught 33 passes for over 400 yards. He's generated almost 200 yards after the catch. 16 of his catches have gone for a first down. He's caught two touchdowns.

And no surprise here, Trevor, like when you watch him at college, we don't have him credited with a drop that was his fault right now. And that was down to UNC. Remember, and it's funny, you and I have been doing this show long enough together already

that we have gone through, this class is the first class you and I have done the whole phase. What I mean by that is we did summer scouting of these guys. Then we did regular scouting and now we're doing them as rookies. Right. And I remember talking about downs during summer scouting before his final college season.

And I feel like he had a lot of drops that year. And then his final college year, he morphs into this player that doesn't drop anything. And is Mr. Reliable. And he's been somewhat of that for Gardner Minshew. He's he's made some tough catches as well. I just think he's going to have a massive finish to the season with Minshew, because when you look at there and it's nothing against Anthony Richardson, Richardson just plays

a style that is a little bit more. I can hold the ball longer. I could push the ball down the field. Gardner is going to be a little bit more. I can hold the ball longer. I can push the ball down the field. Gardner is going to be a little bit. I don't have those physical gifts. I'm going to drop back and I want to get the ball out with timing and rhythm as much as I can. And Downs fits that so well. So there was a lot of good candidates here.

There was a lot of good candidates here. But Downs for me takes home that second wide receiver spot. Dude, i absolutely love it josh downs if you just count the last three weeks of this season so weeks five six and seven downs is 11th in the nfl in total receiving yards over the last three weeks so we're not talking just like for rookies we're talking about a ton of production just overall. So love the shout out, man. I mean, he's such a good slot receiver. I figured that he was kind of team proof, if you will. Right. I didn't feel like and that's why I had him as wide receiver four in the class, because I felt like no matter where he

went, that team was going to get Josh Downs involved because he's a little bit bigger, stronger, especially at the catch point that a lot of other slot receivers who kind of like have his build, have his role, have his wide receiver usage history like what he had at UNC. So figured that he was going to be able to come in and play right away. So love that shout out there. I'm going to give my wide receiver to a guy who we had a good amount of conversation about before the draft and we said that he really was going to have to kind of reshape how he played in the nfl

and i think he absolutely has and that's rishi rice for the kansas citys. Yep. Rice was somebody who, I remember I was standing next to you on the sidelines at the Senior Bowl and we go, is it me or is Rasheed Rice short? And because SMU had this dude listed at like six feet, 215 pounds, they used him as this sidelineeline X receiver type of player. He shows up at the senior bowl and he's like barely over 200,

barely over six feet tall. And you go, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I'm not drafting a barely over six feet tall X receiver at the NFL level. Like that's just not happening. But then to get the combine, he tests extremely well explosively and athletically. So he really had to go into the pros with a totally different mindset. He had to be this athlete.

He had to be a yards after the catch kind of player. Connor, he absolutely is so far throughout his career. I get it. I know. Patrick Mahomes, it's easy. Whatever. He has been playing really well. And for him to already have great chemistry with Mahomes,

I think is a testament to what he's been able to do and the work that he's put in. 27.7 wide receiver usage percentage. That means that when this dude is on the field they are targeting him 82.1 receiving grade which i think is the second highest behind only puka nakua who is it is obviously um and this is the stat that i love the most from machine rice 7.5 yards after catch per reception average. That's what you needed to start to become at the NFL level. That was your actual skill set. That is where your natural gifts and athletic ability was going to shine the most.

And the Chiefs are putting him in a situation where the average at the target is a lot lower than what it was at SMU. And the yards after catch are up. They're using him in slants in mesh concepts those dig routes these easy things over the middle getting him in space and allowing him to go be an athlete and he's absolutely rewarding him for it so Rasheed Rice big shout out there plenty of other receivers that are playing well though Zay Flowers continues to get better every single week um not to puff my chest too hard but my boy michael wilson baby earning a starting wide receiver spot for the arizona cardinals you heard it here on the podcast first love that they're

being able to feed him i know i get it it was kind of one of the it was probably the easiest wide receiver room to crack a starting row on but he has and he's been rewarding him and um oh who is the one other receiver i want to shout out oh tank dell tank dell was the other one who tank small little dude we wondered is he too small for the nfl level but man the footwork and the ability to stop on a dime you just couldn't teach him and cj stroud becoming a nice little duo there in uh in houston any other receiver that you wanted to shout out that I didn't mention? That was it for me. Rice was my, like if I didn't go with Downs, I was going with Rice.

Okay, all right. Because Rice, I factor in, another thing I factored in was, you know, your situation, what are you doing with the snaps you get? Rice walked into a situation that the Chiefs wanted to make sky more the thing the a lot of the offense is funneled through kelsey you get some mbs uh you got

cadareous tony and rice his snap count has not always been really that impressive this year but what he's done with that snap count has been really, really impressive. So I came really close to aligning with you to a T, but instead I went with downs because I also think rice and downs right now, if you look at how they started the year versus what they've done the last couple of weeks, it's like, Oh man, their numbers are going to be a lot bigger than the week by week average.

So I'm excited to see how they finish the year strong. And that takes us to tight end, where this is another, for me, a runaway. Sam Laporta has not only been the best rookie tight end, Sam Laporta is on his way to being a top five tight end in the NFL. He is now, think of the landscape, right? Kelsey, Andrews, Godddard titan's kind of weird because after that like waller when he's waller and kittle when they're healthy there's a big

drop off like either you're extremely impactful or you're basically replaceable it feels that way quite often yeah where and now you look at Laporta and you're like man as Waller gets older like there's an entryway for Laporta to be a top five tight end in this league maybe he's not there like Hawkinson's really good the point is Laporta is so far advanced for what the normal tight end does as a rookie because you look at Dalton Kincaid Michael Mayer who's had some big games but also was a non-factor to start the year. Luke Musgrave. Right.

Like it's classic rookie tight ends, like just so much inconsistencies here and there. Laporta is a legitimate part of the Lions offense. Oh, 100%. He can win down the field. He can create after the catch. So for me, this was a no brainer in this spot. Yeah, this one was super

easy for me as well this is Laporta all the way 72.2 overall grades first among rookie tight ends 388 snaps also first among tight ends so not only is he grading well he has played the most which for you to continue to have high grades as a rookie while playing so many snaps I mean that's that's really impactful he also has no grade blocking included below a 67.0. So the floor for this guy has been really great. And that's why he's on the field so much. 18 of his 35 catches have come for first downs. And when you watch his tape, that is what you see, man.

Ben Johnson quite literally uses him as a security blanket. It's like, hey, if Jared Goff is rolling out, what we want you to do is go towards the flow of the way that he is rolling out and find the chains, find the first down marker, find some open space and get open. And it's the same thing for a lot of the other shallow routes that he's running. They'll use him in the mesh concepts. They'll use him in quick curls,

things that'll just get him right over the middle. It's like, hey, these are where the two linebackers are. Find the space right in between them. Jared Goff's going to find you. And they're not asking him to do super difficult stuff on a regular basis. And I don't mean that in any way as a slap in the face or a negative. They're using him exactly the way that you would probably want an athletic, versatile tight end to be used in his rookie season. Basically kind of just tell him, hey, we want you and Jared Goff to be best buds, be roommates, have that kind of chemistry. And that's what I think that we are seeing from Laporta. So that one made this one pretty dang easy. I think Kincaid's getting more involved with the Bills offense. You see that Michael Mayer is going to be fine, but nobody has played the amount of snaps and nobody has played

as well as Sam Laporta has for this tight end rookie class. Hey, this time of year, it's all about setting up the checklist, right? It's about getting into the routine and being able to knock off the important things that you got on that list. One of the most, if not the most important things should be securing your family's financial future, starting with life insurance. Fabric by Gerber Life makes it quick, easy, and affordable to protect your family so that you can get back to enjoying life. It was designed by parents for parents to help you get high quality, surprisingly affordable term life insurance policies in less than 10 minutes. We'll be right back. to cover it in less than 10 minutes with no health exam required. Join the thousands of parents who trust Fabric to protect their family. Apply today in just minutes at meetfabric.com slash stock exchange. That is meetfabric, M-E-E-T, fabric.com slash stock exchange.

Policies issued by Western Southern Life Assurance Company, not available in certain states. Prices subject to underwriting and health questions. Who we got as your offensive tackles? We got two offensive tackles here. Who we got? DeJuan Jones was in the no-brainer category for me. Wow.

Wow. What do you mean, wow? No, I'm kidding. No, I have to. Oh, I was like, what happened? I just wanted to spook you. I got nervous. I got nervous there. DeJuan like, what did I happen? I just wanted to spook you. I got nervous. I got nervous there.

DeJuan Jones, what a find he's been for the Browns who, you know, he's had to step in a right tackle. And in classic DeJuan Jones, like his grades and numbers as a pass blocker are in a different stratosphere than every other rookie offensive lineman. And deservingly so when you watch DeJuan Jones he is a big man that is extremely hard to get around or run through so that was a layup one a tackle for me I think the second tackle spot was a little bit of a competition and ultimately I went with Paris Johnson Jr. now Paris Johnson Jr. Now. Paris Johnson Jr., he's playing right tackle. He I know he has not been

particularly great as a run blocker for an Arizona offense that like, let's be fair as well. They're trying to figure out a lot of things this year. But I watch Paris in pass pro and I think he's been pretty good. He's had a few hiccups here and there, but you could see all of the tools and traits he has and that length and athleticism and that with more and more playing time, especially in a year for Arizona where they weren't expecting to be competitive, that he might have a little bit of a runway to settle in.

I think it's all there for him. I really, really do. And the other guy, like you look at this a couple of ways, right? Broderick Jones has played just over 100 snaps and he's played pretty well when he's played, but it's just not enough that he deserved that spot. And then Darnell Wright, you watch him and you see what he could do in the run game,

which shouldn't surprise anyone, but he's gotten murdered in pass pro quite a bit where i i couldn't give him the nod over paris just because he's been a more effective run blocker i'd rather see that that consistent sturdy pass pro so it's it's probably this is probably very you you know, like pick your flavor. But I went with Paris. So DeJuan Jones, I completely agree with you. He's too easy.

It's not like he's lighting the world on fire. But 64.4 overall grade this year. 75.0 pass blocking grade. Hasn't graded as well with run blocking. And that's kind of some of my concerns with him. But really nice. That was his story in college. Yeah. And he's just, he's's i'll get to it in a second 10 pressures allowed on 221 uh pass blocking

snaps his pressure percentage is just 4.6 so those are really solid numbers that's why he's starting already that's why they've got him out there um the the run block the run blocking stuff he's just when he can get you in between the shoulders like i remember there was oh god which game was it oh no i can't even remember there was one game where they asked him to get to the outside and it was a toss play and he's basically like lead blocker and he takes out like three people like takes out he takes out the slot corner he takes out a linebacker and then at the end of the play place like kind of over the safety comes in and he he just makes sure the safety knows like i would have had your ass and he gives him a little anyway he gives him a little shove and you can see him he kind of like does the wide

receiver thing where he like walks a couple of spaces kind of like flexes like he's like yeah i'm him like i'm him and meanwhile goldberg used to do that right basically yeah goldberg used to be like you're next yeah that's what dewan jones is he's just gonna spear the next guy out of nowhere just for the goldberg uh tribute so when he gets you between the shoulders obviously he's a big massive dude he can push a lot of these smaller defenders to the ground but i do feel like the coordination and the balance of like how he lines guys up it's it's it is not as consistent as you kind of want it to be as a pass protector though same story that he had at ohio state man he moves a lot better for a

player of his size of his length and so he's able to stand in front of a lot of these guys or in me at least make life more difficult to get around him because there are a handful of times that watched him i was like all right well he's kind of letting him get around his shoulder at the end there but it's long enough to where quarterback can either escape or get the ball out and so that's still kind of doing your job so So I think him really latching on and dominating those pass blocking reps still is kind of in the tank for him. He's not quite there yet. But, I mean, he's working with what he's gotten as a rookie.

Starting as a rookie offensive tackle is extremely difficult, which brings me to my second guy. I did go with Darnell Wright, but I thought about Darnell Wright. Honestly, I think Broderick Jones has looked the best um he just hasn't played yeah I would agree it's just yeah it would have been a little unfair right because he's played two games I think and also the real test is when the d-line gets film on you what can they take advantage of so I'm not saying Broderick's gonna stink in three games I'm just saying it just it just didn't feel fair to me no but i think that they i think they benched him again right when dan moore got

healthy if i'm remembering that correctly so it's like they're still going with the vetter you know he played when dan moore was out but i don't know how much playing time he's gonna get moving forward but all i have to say the two games that he played i thought his film was the best between him, Darnell Wright, and Paris Johnson. Paris was, of the games that I watched for Paris, he was really up and down for me. Yeah. Darnell Wright was as well, but at least Darnell had some high-impact run-blocking plays. run blocking plays the over aggressiveness for him in the past blocking game right now he's getting taken advantage of man i mean you got defensive ends that are beating him to a spot to the outside shoulder that are um making him feel like that he has to dictate how things are going

or else he's going to lose and then you're able to bait him a little bit hit him with an inside move so definitely a big learning year for darnell right but i would have told you that was going to be the case before the draft started and i had him i think 11 on my board i like him a lot but i understood that this first year was probably going to be a struggle for him you're seeing a lot of those struggles manifest i went with him just because of the sheer amount of snaps that he has played and some of the handful of impact plays, but did want to give Roger Jones a shout out. So I'm glad that you did that as well.

Yeah, it was a tough one tackle too. Honestly, there was a couple of during this exercise where I'm like, yeah, I really don't need a second one here because there's too many unknowns, whether the guy that I like hasn't played enough or the guy that I will put here has been really hot and cold.

Like you said, with Paris, I think that's fair. Him and Wright have been like that. They've been up and down, and that's kind of expected for a rookie tackle. An area I did not feel like we had too many spots was interior offensive line, where did you do three? For interior offensive line? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Me too. And all three of these guys have been incredible for the spot they're thrusted into starting into your offensive line right away.

And for me, it was Peter Skowronski, Steve Avila, and Joe Tippin. And you watch all three of these guys, and I mean, Skowronski is as advertised. You do kind of watch that Tennessee offensive line, and you're like, man, will they just give them a look at tackle instead of left guard? Because there's just such a need for Tennessee.

They're going to trade the Eagles. Oh, man. Good timing on that. By the way, folks, the buyer trade happened like 20 minutes before we started to record the episode. So that's why I bring it up and it's topical yeah it's yes it does feel that way with the vila you know we kind of sit here sometimes

and talk about like damn the rams are better than we thought they would be this year like we expected them to be really really bad well avila also playing left guard is another one of those guys that you look at his tape and you're like, I mean, he's been pretty sturdy overall for them. Yeah. And then Tippman, although he didn't start week one for the Jets at right guard, basically what happened with the Jets was when they lost Dwayne Brown, they flipped back into left tackle.

They kicked ABT from right guard to right tackle and put Tippman at right guard, not center. And Tippman's been their best run blocker for breeze hall their best run blocker so and it's it's not like he's a zero in pass bro he's been honestly fine in pass bro um so those three i i was more than happy to put them on this list i love the film that all three have put out this year yeah i think that skoranski absolutely could maybe should have gotten a shot at tackle you know you watch him play a guard and a lot of the areas in which he is losing right now at guard is he's just not used to the strength of it and you can tell that he's he's this guy who played tackle in college who's now starting on the

interior for the first time in a long time and i think that when you watch him on counter plays and pulling plays he got great athleticism um dude's got a ton of fight in him like he i mean he's just he's a great offensive lineman he's just really only struggling because he's not used to that nfl power yet as an interior offensive lineman um so that stuff i think you get really cleaned up with him i think that he is definitely holding his own and he's showing that um he was that best choice for a top interior player steve veal is an ass kicker man he's awesome i i i love our data collection team at pff they're truly the backbone of everything that we

get to do even here on this show um. I would have Steve Avila's overall grades a little bit higher because I think his overall grade is like a 59.7. What is it? I got it right here, actually. A run blocking grade, 59.1. Pass blocking grade, 58.7. And like, those are like fine for rookie starters.

I think he's played a little bit better than that even. You know, Skronsky's got grades across the board in the mid sixties. And I feel like Avila, maybe not that good, but something in the sixties, just a little bit better. Maybe I'm just looking too harshly on those grades that, that start with a five,

but Avila has been really nice, man. He is somebody who we knew had center guard versatility going into the year. And he, I agree. You couldn't have said it better. He is one of the reasons

why you look at this Rams team. You go, yeah, they're going to suck. And they're not nearly as bad as everybody thought because they're getting a lot of really nice production out of some of their rookie class. And Pukunuku is obviously one of them.

Steve Avila is one of them. And then I'm going to give a shout out certainly to a guy on the defensive side of the ball who's playing well too. Last guy, I thought about Tippman. I almost went with Tippman, but I wanted to give

a hat tip to another player who I think is is a not getting the recognition he deserves and I don't know if he's going to so I'll do it here on this show Jarrett Patterson the center for the Houston Texans the Texans had Scott Questenberry, who could have played center, who got hurt, and Drew Scruggs, who could have played center, and who got hurt. That thrusted Jared Patterson, who is a late-round draft pick. I can't remember. What round did he get drafted in? It was way later than I think anybody expected.

Yeah, sixth round. Pick 201. And this guy was the starting center for this team in week one. He has the Baltimore Ravens. Good f***ing luck. And he's absolutely held his own, man. and this guy was the starting center for this team in week one against the baltimore ravens good in luck and he's absolutely held his own man this is a guy who was a long time player for the notre dame fighting irish former team captain on some good lines center of that offensive line ton of experience i think he's a super smart offensive lineman and he immediately took that to the field as a rookie from week one.

He's not the best center in the world, but the way that he is playing, I just think that it's been unfair how people have talked about the Houston Texans and said, yeah, look at their offensive line. They got nobody starting in the offensive line. They use the offensive line often as a reason to prop up CJ Stroud. And I just feel like at least for the center position, comments like that are doing a disservice to how well Jarrett Patterson is playing. So huge nod to him, 60.1 overall grade, 61.7 run block grade, 56.6 pass blocking grade. Obviously those are lower numbers because it's always tough to stand out when you're a rookie offensive lineman.

But Patterson, to me, has played really well. The game does not look overwhelming to him. You could tell how smart he is with where he needs to get, how he can wall off these defenders in the run game. And then I think he's got great core strength for being able to redirect guys in the passing game, even if he is kind of trying to acclimate to just how strong NFL defensive tackles are playing.

So wanted to shout him out as well. He got my last nod for the all-rookie team along the interior offensive line. There's been a couple guys, too, that have had good games. Like you've seen flashes. I know City So, Sal, Sal. Is it Sal? I hear a lot of people say city so. I thought it was so, and then I looked at my pronunciation guide

from my last year's draft doc, and I had written it now sow. Like I put rhymes in there sometimes. But I feel like I've heard people call it since he's been on the Patriots. So either way, he had a really, really good game this weekend. Anthony Bradford has had to play for Seattle and he's the classic LSU Anthony Bradford where he's looks like one of the best run blockers in all the football and then pass pro is just you know kind of up and down see if they can coach him up there so a lot of guys playing and a lot of interesting shout outs but and you know I'll say this I've been well let me not give this away there's been some disappointments and we're gonna do that at the end of the show right even

though the guys i was gonna talk about are not mine but let's go to the defense okay before we get to the defense this podcast is brought to you by our friends over at prize picks uh this since this is coming out like mid monday night football i will give you more than just this one but for your records the pff prize picks lineup for monday night football is jordan addison and brandon iu combined more than one half touchdowns it's gonna cash and kirk cousins more than 0.5 interception. So if Jordan Addison or Brandon, I you score a touchdown. And then if Kirk Cousins throws an interception,

I think both of those are, well, we have some smart people over at PFF Connor, before we get to mine, do you have any, like in the future since this podcast, you know, they won't be able to bet the money in a football one,

but like in the future for next week. Yeah. So two of mine that I'm looking at, always like to do one more one less i will go with drake london's receiving yards are at 51 and a half okay i will say he is more than that okay which i know i was a little harsh on desmond ritter at the beginning of this pod but i like london's matchup against tennessee all right for obvious reasons and then i will go Saquon Barkley rushing yards at 70 and a half less. That is, you can run on the Jets,

but I don't know. That's a lot of rushing yards against a really good defensive line. I think Saquon won't be completely shut down, but 70 and a half is a name recognition number. So less for Saquon, more for Drake London. Trevor, what do you like? I got burned by Cooper Cup last week because of Puka Nakua.

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up to $100. All right, let's get to defense. Edge rusher, let's get to defense. Edge rusher, let's start with Edge. Who are your two all-rookie edge rushers here midway through the season? So Will Anderson Jr., I mean, he's played, you know, like a top five pick. You love to see

it. He's been really well balanced against the run as a pass rusher. You see the speed to power. You see the explosiveness off the ball. I mean, you look at the um i want to pull up his overall pressures here too he's got 20 or 24 24 he's been consistently disruptive and what i really like about that number with him trevor is that it feels like he has not had a game where he's been blanked yet he hasn't i mean you look at his total

pressures by game week one five week two two four two three eight he devoured the saints completely devoured the saints so he's only getting better he's been a factor in every single game he's played in this year this was an easy easy Number two, you had some options. I went with Tully Tuipilotu, and this is one where it kind of goes back to that balance, right? Unlike Will Anderson, Tuipilotu has had some games where he's been a non-factor as a pass rusher, but he's been somebody that's been able to grade out really highly as

a run defender and he has had some moments as a pass rusher i remember we talked about this on this show the game against the vikings where he had nine total pressures right and he had five against the cowboys he's been a disruptive edge player and this was somebody taken outside the top 50 so a really nice start to tully's career we got the same two in this one um will anderson just he's been so good all around it's an easy choice texans absolutely nearly you know look shout out to the houston texans right now all right i know there's a lot of ball game left. There's still a lot of things to do when it comes to building a winning franchise. But when they traded up the way they did this past draft, you and I talked about it. It's not like we thought that was the wrong decision, but it's a big risk.

Like you got a hit on both of those guys. You were very aggressive to go up and get both of these players they had to hit for you so far it absolutely looks like both of those players are big time hits for you so you're turning your draft capital into really successful football players early on in their career that's huge uh and then tuli pelotu i agree with you man he has been really fun to watch along that Chargers defensive line. Only 68.4 overall grade, but an 83.2 run defense grade. He has 21 pressures.

For the run defense grade, extra context, 1.53 average depth of tackle. That's low, man. Anything around like 1.5 yards. I mean, you are making an impact where the running back, the ball carrier, whoever it is, they're not getting too far past the line scrimmage. 1.5, that's a lot of sense because i didn't really know admittedly i didn't really know what to do with him going into the draft usc had him listed at 290 pounds for two years and then he showed up to the combine and he was 266 like you're a different human you're a completely different football player at 266 than you are at 290. So he was one of those guys who, I liked his tape, versatile edge player, plays a heavy-handed five-tech for you. He had experience standing up.

He kicked his side a little bit to a three-tech. There was a lot of versatility for him in USC's tape. He was one of those players who I admittedly said, it just depends what team he goes to. I don't really have a good feel for him because if somebody wants to use him as a versatile down lineman in an odd front, like USC did sometimes, you ain't going to do that 266.

So can you play more explosive as more of a true edge presence at that lower weight? Looks like he is. Now he's mainly winning with strength but that would kind of make sense if maybe even if he wasn't 290 maybe if he was 280 285 classic bulk and cut you know now you are you've got the muscle now you're faster you've got some of the fat off you so i agree um i think that he is somebody who deserved that shout out as well two honorable mentions your boy bjo jolari okay hasn't had a flash hasn't had a ton of opportunities but a 21.3 pass rush win percentage it's one of the highest amongst the entire group and then byron young is

that other player for the los angeles rams who is playing better than expected. I was pretty big on Byron Young. I was pretty bullish on him. I understood, hey, he's a little bit older, but you can explain that with his football background and why it took him so long to break out while he was in Tennessee. The life background matters. 68.2 overall grade, 383 snaps, most among all rookie edge rushers, including Will Anderson,

has a 71.3 pass rush grade, 27 pressures, and a 9.3 pass rush win percentage. So he's still figuring it out as a pass rusher, but man, he is NFL levels of explosive along the defensive line. So had to shout out both those guys too. All right, let's move over to interior defensive line. Quite a few players in the mix here. I thought two really stood out, though.

I was going to say, I bet we got the same two, though. Jalen Carter and Keanu Benton. Yep, has to be. It has to be. I've seen some really nice play by Kobe Turner on the Rams. Gervin Dexter has had some moments, but man, it's when you look at Carter, who is an elite interior pass rusher already,

like elite. Yes. What he did to Isaiah Wayne on Sunday night football, I kind of gaps gasped and like kind of hid. I was like, Ooh, I was like, and I felt bad when got hurt on the play,

but I mean, it was like watching a wrecking ball go through, you know, drywall. I was like, what? It's like insanity. So the Kool-Aid man. Yeah, I was like, whoa. So, but oh, yeah, the quarterback. Yeah. Jalen Carter is an absolute monster of a pass rusher a monster and then

you look at Keanu Benton he's the same guy at college but he's doing it now in the AFC North where he's a stout run defender he's got some pass rush what a lot of people miss with Benton was he was asked to play plenty of nose in college he played up and down the line of scrimmage but you look at him you're like that's a big nose tackle. I could have him two gap. He could be my fat guy. And then we all got to the senior bowl, Trevor. And we're like, this dude could whoop some ass as a three tech.

He's got pass rush ability. Yep. And Benton's been such a good pick for the Steelers defensive line. He has only gotten better. And I think that's an important part of his scouting report is early on while he was at Wisconsin, he was just the big that's tackle fat guy and the last two years specifically that final year that he was with the badgers um i remember we talked about on the show he said pre-season that year i want to get better as a pass rusher and he did as the year went on he

showed better flashes of pass rusher then he got to the senior bowl and he looked like a better pass rusher than he even was at wisconsin so now he gets to the steelers now not only holding his own in the run defense game but he's showing you flash as a pass rusher so the arrow has just been pointing up over the last year or two for keanu benton to where he's playing really well 82.3 pass rush grade this year 11 pressures 14.3 pass rush win percentage so he's playing really well then yeah i mean carter's an animal 91.3 overall grade 90.3 pass rush grade 29 pressures 21.9 pass rush win percentage it's insane the only guy uh that i really thought about potentially putting in ben's spot would have been khalid't see. But he, yes, I wrote this down.

He hasn't played a ton due to injury, but, but he looks good, dude. He's going to, I think end of the year, this will be close. I think it will be these three guys again at the end of the year. What do you think? That's how good can't see looks. Yeah. I mean, I'm like, damn. Kancy's got some flashes, dude.

He's got him playing next to Vita Vea to give him those single block situations is proving to be everything that the Bucs have wanted it to be. So now he is healthy. Hopefully he's healthy throughout the rest of the season. And we'll see where he ends up at the end of the year. But I agree with you for now. You got to give the nod to Benton to Benton and the obvious Jalen Carter.

So moving on to linebacker, who you got? Yeah, who do you got? All right. All right. I'll start it off. The first one. Very easy. Ivan Pace Jr.?

Hell yeah. Okay. All right. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. I was wondering if you were going to give me a little bit of a scare there. No, Ivan Pace. i know he's it's we're saying we're saying once again here on this podcast uh absolute travesty that this dude um went undrafted it just doesn't it's a joke it's it's these are the these are the ones that you look at and go like i don't play the game of like i could be an nfl gm but how do i don't i don't remember off the top of your head where you had ivan pace but i know you really liked him he's somebody we talked about

on a stock watch show last september i believe i had him 132 and he's not a top what 260 whatever player for the league you had him where 132nd overall okay i had him 118 so and i and i had him so my eye and i had him as a firm like fourth round great like this is this is somebody that you take early parts of day three like this is a difference making player for you at the very least on special teams he has a blitzing specialist like we saw at cincinnati and he is somebody who will play with his hair on fire no reason i get it. He's short. He's small.

Fine. Just have him attack the line of scrimmage, and that's what the Vikings are letting him do. Dude, he has the 88.8 pass rushing grade. We had this at Cincinnati. It was right there for you. It's there. We saw it.

We all saw it. So, yeah, he gets one of those spots for me for how impactful that he has been there um i gave this i gave the second one to jack campbell me too campbell has sort of cooled down i mean he played bad in that ravens game this past weekend but who didn't in a blue uniform right right they didn't play great um but he's got a pretty solid run defense grade and playing starting at off ball linebacker at the NFL level, especially for what it feels like they ask Jack Campbell to do,

which is be a run and chase player, be a backfield player, but also be a guy who's in coverage, right? Because there are some linebackers that can play well in a rookie season because their role is often very line of scrimmage focused. Hey, look at where the ball is going. If the quarterback keeps the ball, you got a green dog blitz, take off, go get him. If the running back go gets it, obviously go tackle the ball carrier.

When you have a lot more well-rounded of responsibilities, a lot of thoughts are going on in your head, a lot of this and that, a lot of possibilities, and it can be overwhelming. So for Campbell to not have the highest grade it's fine and I think he started off the year really well so you still got to give him the nod I still think he he deserves this second spot I agree and he's had his problems but what's crazy is the other guys that have played have really struggled have really really struggled so when you look at it like that he's at least been i think good against the run the struggles and coverage are there but he's the other guy but pace was the clear cut i i think

dorian williams is the only other one that's been okay considered over Campbell, but I feel like it's still Campbell. It's still Campbell's Ward. So for secondary, I did two corners, a nickel, and a safety. And I'll read them all here and spend some more time on certain guys than others. Corner, the guy that I think is going to win Defensive Rookie of the Year is Devin Witherspoon. I mean, what is there left to say?

I guess we'll get there. The other corner spot. Yes. I gave CB1. And there's, like, this isn't biased. The two corners I picked are my one and two corners from the draft. But I gave this to Christian Gonzalez because unfortunately it's not going to be him when we do the show at the end of the year

because he's hurt for the season. But Christian Gonzalez was so, so good for New England before he got hurt. Yeah. Week one starter. He was phenomenal. It is an absolute travesty where he was drafted. And It's a total joke. I didn't really get it. It was wild. I had nobody. I almost was like, did the commanders not know he's still on the board? Right, right, right.

That's the that's the Emmanuel Forbes pick. And I feel like we'll talk about him in a little bit. But like that, we will. That was the one where it was like. OK. Corners getting bumped down the list a little bit how are you picking for was over gonzalez anyways nickel brian branch he's been awesome awesome and then my safety is jordan howden who you and i talked about before the show let's go baby a lot of

safeties aren't playing good for the fifth rounder out of minnesota he's played really really well for the saints witherspoon missed a lot of camp he had the hammy he missed the beginning of the season and he walks onto the field like i'm already one of the best corners in the league the highlight hits against the run i believe he's the top corner by grade for pff right now which is just he's been that overall corner i'm pretty sure that happened today because of his game this weekend and i will yeah he's at least right at the right in the mix at the top um he's been you can keep talking a total attitude changer for this defense and for the secondary. And he's just, he's just, holy smokes.

He is. Yeah, he is. Right. Yeah. And it's a tape test. I believe it. I really believe it. So it's just crazy.

He's so good, man. He is so, so good. I just screamed. I'm good too. Oh man. Yeah. You know, it was all there. Okay. He is so, so good. I just screamed, I'm good, too. Oh, man. Yeah. It was all there. Okay, I'm going to say this.

There were, when Christian Gonzalez was playing really well at the beginning of the season, really like week one and week two, there were people on the timeline who, and I don't really have anybody in mind. I just feel like I saw it a lot who would like quote tweet a good christian gonzalez play and they'd be like cb1 or like this was always the cb1 and i'm like witherspoon hasn't even played yet what do you what are you what are we doing this for yeah so it's tickets why you can and hey you know what people are out here cashing the tickets and gonzalez is phenomenal as well okay i mean him and witherspoon are my one and two here i'm with you every step of the way those

guys are to me the clear one and two corners for this all rookie award um witherspoon's numbers are awesome i mean for a rookie cornerback to be grading in the 80s in coverage grade it's pretty insane he's been targeted 29 times in coverage. Teams are going after him. He's only allowed 14 catches. It's less than 50% completion percentage. He already has seven forced incompletions. Obviously, he's got the highlight plays in the run game as well.

Christian Gonzalez on the flip side, very close as well. 79.3 coverage grade. 66.7% completion percentage allowed allowed so those guys to me were just the clear one and two i do want to shout out julius brents though he for the colts like he's been playing some good football his grades kind of popped for me and i was like oh okay brents and i went back and i watched a handful of uh of his plays from the last couple of games and he is somebody who i really enjoyed you can tell that that anticipation is going to get there for him and he's going to be a really solid player for

him i agree brian branch is the nickel guy um that would get this award i also had jordan howden who man for everybody anybody who doesn't know fifth round pick Minnesota safety, big shrine bowl, standout player. The saints are using him a lot of ways. And he has a 70.2 overall grade, 70.0 coverage grade. When I went back, cause I, I mean,

I was pretty shocked that he was the highest grade in safety and he plays the most. I went back and I watched him and like, they're asking this dude to play robber they're asking this dude to play single high they had him on the line of scrimmage against tight ends and man coverage and i'm like damn you trust this dude a lot and he's been rewarding him clearly so not just the good play but also the versatility for them to be able to trust in him i think is huge and i'll shout out jordan battle as well from cincinnati he gets my

other safety spot here and battle hasn't played nearly as much like you mentioned not a lot of safeties have played a ton so far this season but battle as a downhill strong safety type has played really well especially as a line of scrimmage guy and i figured that's probably where he would thrive at the nfl level and uh you're already seeing some good early return on investments with that so yeah there we go um those are the uh the secondary players um did you have any honorable mention guys you just want to go to a handful of guys that have kind of been a little disappointing i want to go to the disappointments my honorable mentions i sprinkled in throughout okay so i can't see he's definitely the biggest one oh wait wait wait before we get to the uh the disappointments this podcast is brought to you by our friends over at manscaped who has taken a step up

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on than the draft so it can come off as like there's a little bias i'm not trying to be like see i told you like there's plenty of time for these guys to figure it out no i think you are it's fine i think with quentin john, here's my question to you, Trevor. Now you're cashing the tickets. Fine. You got to do it early before it's too late. Don't you think the Chargers

draft a first round wide receiver for the case of, OK, Mike Williams and Keenan Allen, they get banged up when they do. Josh Palmer has been adequate filling in. But now we're going to have a first round talent that can still play when they do Josh Palmer has been adequate filling in but now we're gonna have a first

round talent that can still play when they're healthy but take over when they're not and when we move on from one of them a year or two from now this dude's gonna be great and we got that early punch in the face where Mike Williams goes down for the year yeah and Quentin Johnson's not even a thought in this offense he's not even a thought in this offense. He's not even a thought. And that tells me a lot of what they think of him so far. And there's a lot of time to figure it out. But man, you're there with Justin Herbert in a scenario where you could be a starting wide receiver

and you can't get anything going. The disappointment, because I also have him on my list because I wanted to talk to him or talk about him. The disappointing part for me about Quentin Johnson isn't even necessarily how he is playing. It's that they just don't look his way. Right. I mean, he's got a 13.2 wide receiver usage percentage. That's super low for a player that you drafted that high.

A.60 yards per route run. And to show you, they're not targeting this dude. And I went back and I watched a couple of his games. And I'm like, is it perfect? No. But this isn't the worst wide receiver film that I've ever seen. Like, he's still winning. He's still playing decently well.

They just don't throw him the ball they very clearly trust keenan allen and josh palmer and gerald everett and um and austin eckler out of the backfield like they trust all of those guys to be focal points in the offense before quentin johnston so to me the disappointing part is more them not really giving him opportunities. And maybe that changes as the season goes on. Because, yeah, okay, like, do you look at it and you go like, wow, you know, he didn't separate super well here. It's like, all right, there's a lot of wide receivers that wouldn't have separated well against off coverage cover three when you're just running a go route and you got to do that no matter what like that i just wanted to make sure that we brought him up because i am also disappointed as somebody who is i think higher on him that you were but i don't think the

film is that bad i really don't i just don't think they're prioritizing it so maybe they will as the year goes on we'll see my other one i have two more my next one I'd really like your take specifically on this Cody Mock for the Bucks I just I remember a conversation you and I had about Cody Mock before the draft on this show and we worried about his size and because of his size his play strength and I look at him so far for the Bucs, especially as a run blocker, as a man run blocker, inside zone. And he just doesn't have the play strength to be a starter right now.

He does not. He gets pushed around. Passborough's been hot and cold. It hasn't been an absolute disaster, but he's had some losses. But I just look at Mok and I go, is he kind of this man without a home on an NFL offensive line because of his size?

I think interior is going to be his home. It has to be. I wonder if center is his long-term home. I will say that I think things look different for Cody Mock if Ryan Jensen is playing next one. You know, like, I cannot express how Marpet retiring when he did and then Ryan Jensen basically having a career-ending injury when he did hurt the development

and long-term outlook of this interior offensive line. They were not ready. They were ready. They were prepared to lose Alex Kappa and free agency when that happened, but they were not prepared to lose Ali Marpet. They were not prepared to were ready they were prepared to lose alex kappa and free agency when that happened but they were not prepared to lose ali marpet they were not prepared to lose ryan jensen the whole unit so you know he cody mock is playing next to luke gadecki who is playing at right tackle and playing well as a pass but not really a run blocker and he's playing next to robert hainsey who an experienced center from notre Notre Dame wasn't really picked to be a long-term starter for this team.

So I think the whole offensive line is just really struggling. I think the long-term outlook on Mock is going to be fine, but there's no doubt about it. He's struggling this year. He's kind of like taking his medicine this year in what it's going to take to be an interior offensive lineman in the NFL. Maybe it'll be better for him as time moves on but but that whole group as a whole is not playing well Tyree Wilson uh somebody who I kind of like you I know we joked around about it I was pretty damn low on Tyree Wilson I didn't have him as a top 32 player I think I had him like right outside at 33 um felt like he was getting too much love for simply winning for being big at the college level

and he's tried to win by being big at the nfl level and it don't work like that up here and because of that he's got a 42.3 overall grade, 43.7 pass rush grade. And I think his pass rush win percentage is like 2.8%. It is really, really low. And the handful of pass rush wins that he has had, sometimes they will line him up as like a wide nine stand up rusher and just tell him to sprint at the outside shoulder and get some kind of backwards pressure on the quarterback so he has been you know maybe not i it's it's this is kind of what i thought

tyree wilson was beat and i think a lot of people look at him and go man he's been disappointing and i think compared to the expectations that a lot of people had for tyree wilson going into the class what we have seen so far from him has to be seen as disappointing, especially when you've got a guy in Max Crosby on the other side who is getting all the attention of the offensive line. Slide protections are going his way. Double teams are going his way. All the chip blocks are going his way.

And Wilson should have a lot of one-on-ones, and I think he does. He's just not winning so I think that compared to consensus what people thought of him pre-draft he's been disappointing no doubt there's no doubt about it my last one it's kind of tough to just pile on this guy because I think the public has done enough of that but it has to be Emmanuel Forbes I mean in all honesty, I don't know if there's been a worse first rounder this year in terms of just impact on the game.

Tyree. Yeah. You'd say he's been worse. Yeah. Yeah. But at least, but like you can, like Forbes can ruin a game.

Can Tyree ruin a game at this stage? So, sure, yeah. I know that's really harsh, but I'm honestly asking the question. He covered DJ Moore in that Bears game, and he covered his using it loosely because he lost them all momentum, certainly at the beginning of the game, and that was a major factor of why they were not able to recover um so there's no doubt about it go ahead go ahead i want to hear more about forbes for me

i just think with forbes and all your points but about tyree absolutely stand by the way and he was taken a lot earlier so that i i would say that cranks it up too like if you're taking earlier the you know it's gonna be a little bit more harsh when things don't work out they took forbes over gonzalez that's tough banks like i don't think banks has been all world but he's been better than forbes for the giants he's been benched it's been pretty rough i know ron river Ron Rivera said that he needed a reset. He didn't play recently. And the thing is with Forbes,

like he's a liability against the run. He's a liability in coverage. He's a developmental player that was taken with a top 20 pick. And this defense is bleeding on the back end and they passed up an opportunity to get better this year on that defense uh in that defensive backfield and this is he's got time but this is this was a massive reach at the time it was criticized for being a massive reach at the time and i would say it's gone worse than even people could have predicted so i had him i had him 30th overall on my board um and i had him as a second rounder and i thought about him as a candidate for guys who were being most disappointing and he is certainly disappointing given a lot of the context of where

he was picked and who he was picked over i would definitely agree with you there i didn't hate the tape there are some moments in coverage where you go whoa this dude moves well like he'll flip the hips he'll flip the hips and he'll put his foot in the ground and you'll go holy cow i can see why you had a shit ton of interceptions at mississippi state and you we've even seen at the nfl level he's been able to undercut some of these routes anticipate things really well and i think that part of his game is coming but man the lows have been bad um when he has guessed wrong it's it's like you said like you can sometimes ruin games the dj more plays against him simply he couldn't tackle him like he just didn't have the strength to tackle him and that was a fear right right and ultimately

that's why i had him as like a second round day two player. Take him at the beginning of the second round. Now I know it doesn't always work like this, but in a perfect world, you take this guy in the second round, you bulk him up for a year. You get him, you know, like acclimated in the NFL. You get him some rotational snaps in there. But man, they threw this guy to the wolves. And funny enough, he played his best early on. I think he's more, he struggled as of late, but the, I just wanted to say, I did not hate the tape. I see the moments that if this

guy gets stronger, if he gets better and run defense, those high end play, I mean, like he can still be a takeaway machine at the nfl level there have already been hints that i have seen from him but the consistency is you're right it is really high or really low for him which is which is not great um last guy i had was i i wrote down bryce but it's i really more more wanted to have a conversation about that just because I think a lot of people are going to look at the number one overall pick and how bad he has struggled and how we did not even consider him for the QB in this All-Rookie Award.

And they're going to think that that's a mega disappointment. And I guess part of that is true. But his situation sucks. The O-line sucks. The run game's not what it should be. They've got probably the worst pass-catching unit in the NFL. It's just not great. So with Bryce, the numbers are bad.

37.6 passing grade under pressure is something that I hope would be a little bit better for him, but it's hard when all of those things are going wrong for you so i wanted to bring up bring up rice just to more say he has been disappointing more so because of his mentality than the lack of production like he has been more hesitant than I thought he was going to be. Even with the full context of what I just said, I felt like he would have been a little bit more assertive, calm, more confident in kind of like his own abilities. And that was the part that really kind of I was surprised about early on. The production I always felt like was going to be low because Carolina wasn't going to be very good.

But you could convince me that that might be the area where I'm a little disappointed in Bryce. But ultimately, like we said on What Matters Most a couple of weeks ago, he's fine. He's totally fine. The team's going to get better. He's going to get better. And they're all gonna be

better for it but i knew that we did have to bring him up because a lot of people i know in the comments would have brought it up if we didn't no it's totally fair i really think so and i think that he's the guy that's played right there's there's so many guys in the first round that haven't been needed yet right when you think of think of it, like you look at JSN, who's had a really nice weekend, but for the most of the season, Seattle hasn't needed Jackson Smith and Jigba. When you look at the Jets defensive line,

they haven't needed to lean on Will McDonald yet as much. Like we talked a lot about Broderick Jones. Broderick Jones in very limited playing time looks really good, but that's why this exercise will be fascinating to see. Like, look back at this show and our end of the year one when guys get more, get way more playing time and what they can do with it. And Bryce has gotten playing time, but he has not been put in a great situation either. And you just hope that he doesn't develop any bad habits because of it. And I think so far he's he's avoided that. I haven't seen a lot of things where i'm like oh man they gotta like

they gotta get this right really quick but yeah it's it's all great points um just as a recap let's read let's recap because i feel like we sometimes do a bad job of that i'll recap my mid-season all-rookie team i had cj.J. Stroud at quarterback, Devon Achan at running back, also Jalil McLaughlin at running back. Wide receivers, I had Puka Nakua and Rasheed Rice. Tight end, I had Sam Laporta. Offensive tackles, DeJuan Jones and Darnell Wright. Interior offensive linemen, I went with Steve Avila, Peter Skoronsky, and Jarrett Patterson.

Edge rushers, Tuli Tui-Pelotu and Will Anderson. Defensive tackles, Jalen Carter and Keanu Benton. Linebackers, Ivan Pace and Jack Campbell. Cornerbacks, Devon Witherspoon, Christian Gonzalez, and then the flex nickel spot, Brian Branch. Safety is Jordan Howden and Jordan Battle. Jordan, Jordan connection there at the safeties. Connor, who'd you have?

Quarterback, CJ Stroud. Running back, Bijan Robinson. My wide receivers were Puka Nakua and Josh Downs. My tight end was Sam Laporta. My tackles on the offensive line were DeJuan Jones and Paris Johnson Jr. My interior offensive linemen were Peter Skoronski, Joe Tippman, Steve Avila. On defense, my two edge players, Will Anderson Jr. and Tuli Tuli Palotu. My interior defensive linemen were Jalen Carter and Keanu Benton with that honorable mention of Kalijah can't see my off ball linebackers, Ivan Pace, Jr.

And Jack Campbell, my two corners were Devin Witherspoon and Christian Gonzalez. My nickel was Brian branch. And my only safety was Jordan Howden. Let us know what you thought of our all rookie teams. I didn't realize that we just, we had the same defense. I knew while we were going through the show,

we had the same exact defense. I didn't even defensive players. I didn't realize that we just we had the same defense i do while we were going through the show we had the same exact defense i didn't even defensive players i didn't realize it either until we both like i was thinking about you know like the graphic that the team might make i was like oh like different teams i was like all right well don't do the defense because we're this is the same exact defense so maybe they'll just tweet out the offense but we want to hear from you guys let us know what you thought of our mid-season all-rookie team. Let us know your thoughts on these rookies as well. We would love to hear from you. Best way to do that, in the YouTube comment section for this video, youtube.com backslash at NFL Stock Exchange.

If you guys are listening to your audio only, you can hit us up on Twitter or Instagram as well. Connor J. Rogers, Tampa Bay Trey. That is the way that you can reach us. Connor, anything else before we get out of here? think that covers it i have no idea what we're gonna do in the midweek oh i do it's like i got oh i got an idea okay i got something cooking i think is it a surprise for the listeners like give me from me you need to tell me what we're doing wednesday's pod connor has no idea what. It's just like this reality show.

It's an interesting concept. Honestly, it might be more of a summer thing, but it's definitely an interesting concept. Sit down and don't plan any of the only one person gets to play in the pod and see what happens. That would actually be brilliant summer content. It's I it's probably going to happen next year. You're kind of on to something here.

No, no, no. I got an idea. I thought about it earlier today. I'm not going to I'm not going to talk about June. You're kind of onto something here. No, no, no. I got an idea. I thought about it earlier today. I'm not going to, I'm not going to talk about it on the pod. Cause if you hate it, we're not going to do it. I don't want my feelings to get hurt on camera,

but I think fans of all 32 NFL teams are going to enjoy it. And it has to do with what's upcoming in the draft. So I will leave you with that elite hall of fame teaser if i do oh my god so i am trevor never logging off that is connor rogers thank you guys so much for watching and listening to the nfl saga change podcast we will see you on wednesday on Wednesday.