NFL Stock Exchange: An NFL Draft Podcast - 207. Top Prospects At Every Position In 2024 NFL Draft

Episode Date: November 7, 2023

Hosts Trevor Sikkema and Connor Rogers give you their updated top prospects for each position in the upcoming 2024 NFL Draft

This episode is brought to you by our good friends at NFL Sunday Ticket on YouTube TV. I'm sure by now you've all got back into your Sunday routines, but they could be even better. With NFL Sunday Ticket and YouTube TV, you get the most live NFL games all in one place, every game, every Sunday. And you can even watch up to four different games at once with MultiView, one of my favorite inventions of this decade. It's exactly what you need to catch all the action. Make your Sundays more magical. And also, YouTube TV is great. I got it this year.

It's awesome. Sign up now at youtube.com slash BS, device and content restrictions apply. Local and national games on YouTube TV. NFL Sunday ticket for out-of-market games excludes digital-only games. Welcome to the NFL Stock Exchange Podcast. In this episode, we are giving you updates on the number one player that we have at every single position in the 2024 NFL draft. Of course, you guys know how this podcast goes. We won't just talk about that one player. We'll talk about the

other players who might be close in that conversation. Sometimes it's two, sometimes it's three, sometimes it's four. Sometimes there's a lot of guys to talk about that could be that number one player at each spot. I'm Trevor Sycamore. With me as always is Connor Rogers. Let's ring the bell. Welcome to the opening bell of the NFL Stock Exchange Podcast. I'm Trevor Sikama. That is Connor Rogers. Joining you guys on a Monday edition of the show. And today, we've got a fun NFL Draft-centric topic. I feel like outside of mock drafts, we haven't really done

a lot of NFL draft centric topics to kick off the week, but today we are, and it's a good one. We are revisiting a lot of the takes that we had over the summer, and we are giving you our top player at every single position as it stands today. You know how this podcast works too, just because we're telling you who's at number one, we're probably going to tell you who's at two and three within that conversation. So it's going to be a really great look at some of the thoughts that we had over the summer.

What has changed so far this college football season? Connor, I'm excited for it, man, because you and I, obviously, we do this show twice a week, but we're still in the weeds with our day jobs, if you will. We don't get to have a lot of conversations about like, oh, I changed this guy to number one, or he overtook this position. Right before we started this podcast, you told me,

you were like, hey, along the offensive line, two out of three offensive line positions, I got a new guy sitting at number one. So I'm excited to get this one going, just to hear what updates you have on yours. Me too. And right back at you. And it's that time of year, right?

I look at it where I do a big preseason, big board, mock draft, all of that. And you and I do our top fives all throughout the summer. And it's really cool because I feel like a lot of people are not doing that. We really set a baseline of top fives, podcast by podcast by podcast. And then while you, beingff's lead nfl draft analyst i feel like are constantly updating and expanding all throughout the early parts of the nfl season november is a big pivot point for me like i really start to flip things around and move some people around because for nbc sports you know know, really September and October are really big fantasy. Right. A lot of times of the year for me, we do this show. So I'm always doing the

draft, always doing the draft, but actually writing it out and releasing things. November is another pivot point. And then you get to the new year and it's just all draft all the time publicly. But this is fun, Trevor, because we get to pull back the curtain on a lot of stuff we've been working on privately with our process and things that change because of how guys have played this season or because of how guys have not lived up to expectations throughout the season and some people get hurt and there's so much that goes on throughout this process and this is probably the most fluid part of the process besides the combine because right you know not hitting thresholds on testing can can really really hurt you to an extent and yeah the volume of change isn't that high then compared to now so this is a massive point of the entire draft cycle no i think that november and

december are the big ones like i'm going through and doing a lot of rechecks right now at the beginning of november but i would say beginning of december and really middle of december after we get through those championship weeks kind of when bowl season starts bowl games are fun and obviously if you play really well in a bowl like it matters especially college football playoff new year six bowls that does matter in your scouting report but a lot of the tape has already happened so yeah we really get to dive into this class i think full for a second time once december rolls around but this is almost a mini update that we get to keep uh with the people i thought about being diabolical given everything that has happened with caleb williams and how usc has struggled and how

they're out of the college football race and he's kind of come under fire as a prospect i thought about being diabolical and starting on defense, reversing it. I thought the same thing. I was like, right. But everything that I know about the YouTube and an audio algorithm is we got to hit people with what they want at the beginning. So for those of you that stick around for the entire show, we absolutely love you, but we will give people what they want and we will start out with quarterbacks.

So, Connor, the big question. For the last month, like I said, Caleb Williams, maybe not seen so much like Superman like he was during the summer and even just a couple weeks into the season. Is he still your QB1? Who is your top player at the quarterback position right now? He is, but he doesn't sit alone. And I hate the only position group that I have a true tie, and I'll get into all of it in a second, is the one we start with.

This is the only one that I don't have somebody at the top sitting there by himself. And what I'll say is, while Caleb Williams is still the 1A to Drake May's 1B, the way it's been trending is not good for Caleb Williams, and it is good. It's more positive for Drake May. And I've been honest about this on this podcast. You and I talked about the quarterback class on an entire show,

what, two weeks ago? It wasn't very long ago. Maybe uh right yeah something like that they're all bleeding it was pretty recently because i mean all the summer notes are there like this isn't one of those things where it's like well you love this guy over the summer what happened it's like well no you could listen to everything over the summer he hasn't gotten better at any of the things that i wanted to see him get better at over the summer and that was playing in structure playing with timing playing with rhythm not always out athleting the opposition in the Pac-12 and Caleb is still an immensely talented prospect I don't want anyone to lose sight of this it's the reason he's still the 1A. But I think the perception of him

and of how he's coming into the league is a lot different than it would have been from what everybody built him up to be this summer, right? A lot of people made him this bona fide, surrender the franchise for kind of prospect. I thought the hype had exceeded what we saw with Trevor Lawrence. I really, really thought that. I thought this was the closest that maybe we'd seen since Andrew Luck, or at least tied with Lawrence. And I don't think he's got better this year. I don't think it's been a bad year for him as a college quarterback.

I don't think it's been a good year for him as that prospect that is put on this pedestal that is very rare. I think he is more in the mold of a lot of the guys that we've seen come out that hover around the top five over the last couple of years or so. And he still has as much talent as anyone like talent alone. He has it all, but he cannot go into a situation and be Superman. Like you said, Trevor. And maybe it's unfair. I don't want to lose sight of how talented he is and just move him in the thinking of like, oh, you might be bored with him. No, I'm not bored with him. He's not better at some point in the NFL, play in structure for the defense to be thrown off by you out of structure. Because if you are always playing what seems to be out of structure,

well, the defense can play to that. Then it doesn't have the same threat that it would if you are carving them up with a plan and playing within an offense and then you're moving to that plan b c and d of the rep so and for drake may i see a quarterback that i think the same could be said for michael pennix that i think can really play within a well-designed offense and thrive right away with that so that's how i I landed on this. Yes. Caleb Williams is still the one a, but it has not been trending in the right direction. Yeah. Certainly the middle of the

year for Caleb Williams, at least to this point was really bad. Like the Notre Dame stretch, the Arizona stretch. And then was it, was it Utah state? I can't remember what the other game was, but he basically, actually I can, I can look it up right now in probably two seconds because I had the tab up. Yeah, so this was Colorado, Arizona, and Notre Dame. These three games. He threw eight turnover-worthy plays, zero big-time throws.

Those were three of the worst games that he's ever had in his career since. And he fumbles all the time. Yeah, I mean, the fumbles are also something that, right, we don't talk about enough. Since then, Utah, Cal, and Washington, which just happened this past weekend, he has thrown 11 big time throws in just those three games and three turnover worthy plays still. So an 11 to 3 ratio is a lot better than a 0 to 8 ratio so you know I think that middle part of the year was really detrimental for him at least from a perception standpoint and you know going back to

what you said about what we thought of him over the summer he's not only not getting better now he's also getting punished right because he was doing this stuff last year he wasn't putting the ball in harm's way as much as he was this year. He is doing that more this year. So I do want to be clear about that. But even when he put the ball in harm's way, even when he held onto the ball for three, four, five seconds, whatever, he wasn't really getting punished for it last year. He was always seeming to find the open player, the right play, all of that. And like, I hate to say this, but like, that is what Mahomes

does, right? That's what Mahomes does at the NFL level. Now Mahomes plays brilliantly within structure as well. That's why he's the greatest quarterback in the game right now. But being able to always find the answer when those plays continue to go on are what floor you. And I'm going to be honest, I watched before this weekend so before this weekend happened I watched Caleb Williams last two games and I watched Drake Mays last two games I'd still take Caleb Caleb is still my quarterback one and I think that people I think having these guys close and even preferring Drake, like if you prefer Drake, I get it. He's extremely talented. He is in that mold of Justin Herbert.

You mentioned him, like what we're seeing from CJ Stroud, like just these big arm pocket passers who have had a ton of success early in their careers in the league. We're seeing Justin Herbert ascend to a crazy level now. So if you're in that mold of quarterback, especially with those two guys going off, Herbert and Stroud, how well they could play, it's easy to say, to say oh this is the next guy in line he's clearly kind of QB1

but May is not perfect either you know far from it and I think that that's what that's just what I want people to remember when they have this conversation is it's not like oh you either take the boom or bust of Caleb Williams, or you take the guy who is going to be a sure thing, no question about it, Drake May. It's not exactly that conversation. Drake May has plenty of throws that he throws off platform where you go, dude, what are you doing? He's got plenty of throws that he misses accuracy-wise as well. He's got wonderful, incredible throws, NFL-layered throws, no question about it.

But I watched every snap of these guys back-to-back on their two most recent games, and I still came away watching Caleb, even within structure, have elite arm talent throw from crazy arm angles and just put the ball in a pinpoint location a lot of times to the sideline dude even this past week against Washington he would have some throws where he would be looking to the right and we've seen quarterbacks before and we we compliment them on this when they do this if you look to the right and you are leading a safety one way like that

is a common part of playing quarterback but he's looking to the very last second and then turning his body and almost just with faith and timing launching it to a point that he knows only his receiver can get it and he's barely even looked at the receiver or the coverage at that point is that also risky? Sure. But there were at least two throws that I know in my head that he completed with almost unseen accuracy that I just go, dude, nobody else is doing this. Right. Like not even Drake is doing this. So yes, it is very fair to say May has a higher ceiling or sorry it has a higher floor than what we have

seen from caleb williams because the decision making within structure how long he holds onto the ball the fumbles are a problem you mentioned it those things lower your floor they are more catastrophic and he's smaller he's he's much smaller he is smaller but it's not like we're not talking about bryce young small no no he's not too small to play quarterback he's smaller. He's much smaller. He is smaller, but it's not like, we're not talking about Bryce Young's small. No, no. He's not too small to play quarterback. Dude's got a cannon of an arm still. And he can hit it with distance and velocity, all that kinds of good stuff. So because of what Caleb Williams has even shown me within structure, it's almost like, I kind of put it to somebody this way caleb's mistakes are more egregious but i almost like that better because i simply have to say to

him dude just don't throw it in a triple coverage like i know just don't and i know that yeah i know he does right now i wonder how much of that is just this USC Lincoln Riley type of... Well, we know our defense can't stop a nosebleed. And he's just got to make something happen. Clearly, he knows he has to make something happen on basically every single drive. If they have one three and out, the game might be over. But I watch those things,

and Caleb Williams' mistakes are more egregious, but I almost like that better because it's just, you just say, hey, here's an obvious, when the defense has one, two, three players around your one wide receiver, don't throw it over there. And he goes, oh, okay, yeah, I can do that. And so I still have Caleb at one um i can't wait to hear what people have to say in the comments uh if y'all have cooled on caleb williams if you're out on him what you thought about drake may when you have watched these guys but it's very close i think these players are very close pick one pick two in the draft whatever the order ends up being both might be really good man i hope both are really good like they both might be really freaking good man. I hope both are really good. Like, they both might be really freaking good because they have so much talent, the both of them, since being very, very young starters at the college level. That's my thoughts, though.

I still have Caleb at one because I basically went back to watch Drake May to remind myself that he is not a sure thing. Like, oh, yeah, no question about it. He makes dumb decisions too and not just and not just some of the mistakes which every quarterback makes but like there's accuracy issues at times like there's just straight he's missing he's overthrowing guys he's missing dudes the ball placement's not there it's not like he's hitting every single throw and as long as people are going into a conversation about Caleb Williams versus

Drake may knowing that may is not a perfect quarterback. Then I think you could have the right discourse about who you might prefer given floor versus ceiling versus in structure versus out of structure, because that's the conversation that you want to have. That's what I tried to have in my mind when I went over this and I ended up coming away with Caleb Williams as my number one guy. Did you have anything else you want to move on to running back? No, I mean, we see it pretty much the same.

I just I couldn't move off of him from being that 1A guy. I just think it's it's become a really interesting conversation between the two. All right. And I don't think a lot of people viewed it that way this summer. I don't think they do. No, right. I mean, dude, I mean, we did it. We did a show a couple of weeks ago like how many nfl quarterbacks you take over williams and then he decided to have the three worst games of his career you know old takes true i'm sorry

charlotte lawrence i take it back i still say i took it back immediately after i wait i don't think i put jalen hurts in there did i did you put jalen hurts in there i did god i was wrong if i didn't maybe i had we each had one different one i know you had Hurts in there? I did. God, I was wrong if I didn't. We each had one different one. I know you had Lawrence in there. I think it was Hurts. Yeah. Yeah, I messed up there. Dude, Hurts is...

I was just watching him against the Cowboys. God, Hurts is awesome. Anyways, running back. Let's move on to running back. Who do you have as RB1 in this class? Because I recently, if people haven't seen the big board lately, put a new guy at RB1. So I'm wondering who you got there now.

I'm excited to hear you talk about him because I noticed that as well. This is another one that it's definitely going to be right down to the wire with everybody because I think this group is really close between about five players. But I still have my summer RB1 as my current RB1, because since he's been back from injury, he's been awesome. And that's Travion Henderson. Oh, man, I thought we were going to get a new name. He's looked so good.

I did a film breakdown for him on NBC's YouTube channel. It's just his explosiveness you can't teach. With him, you either have this or you don't. A lot of running backs simply don't. When the ball is in his hands, it's pure rocket fuel

on any given touch. He's only got 90 attempts this year. He's graded out really, really highly. He's got almost 600 rushing yards already. I think he's averaging about six and a half yards of carry. Yeah. 3.6 yards after contact per attempt. 16 of the 90 attempts have been explosive runs.

He's forced 18 missed tackles but I think what Travion is I like most player unlike most players I don't need him to be a missed tackles forced machine because most guys are not that explosive that they have to make somebody miss at the second level he can just outrun most of the guys but when he can't I've seen him stiff arm I've seen him juke guys I've seen him lower the shoulder I think he can run both a finesse game and a power game and I think he could run any kind of scheme and he's somebody to me that when they get him involved in the pass game as well in space he's a big time explosive playmaker so Travion Henderson it's a little frustrating that last year he was really, it was kind of a lost year with the foot injury that he played through.

This year he's already missed some time. But when he is healthy, he is a legitimate difference maker in a class of running backs right now. Like honestly, Trevor, if I was writing out a top 50 today, I don't know if I'd have one in the top 50. I really, really don't. I think I have one. Who is your number one? The guy who I have at one, Jonathan Brooks from Texas. He's had an awesome year.

Dude, I don't know. I mean, Texas recruiting, elite, okay? Running back. Running back, just elite. Obviously, so he is draft eligible. He is a redshirt sophomore. But the first two years that he was at Texas, he was behind B. John Robinson and Roshon Johnson both of those years.

So you never really saw or heard anything from him. But if you guys kind of like tuned out Texas to the running back position because you were like, okay, all right, we had B. John last year. There's no way they're going to have another really good running back. Dude, Jonathan Brooks is awesome. Okay. I know I've talked about him a little bit on this show because we did him on a stock up and I love them. Okay. He checks the size boxes right off the bat, six feet tall, 207 pounds. That's really good size for him. He right now, if he would have had one more yard in the Houston game, and if he would have had two more yards in the BYU game, he would explosive. He's got really good north to south speed. He also has a pretty dang high missed tackles forced average,

whether that is making guys truly miss in open space or bouncing off contact. He's got a 4.0 yards after contact per attempt average, and then a.37 missed tackles forced per attempt average. Remember,.44 is that number that we always judge as kind of like an elite number. That was Javante Williams a couple of years ago, Bijan Robinson last year, Travis Etienne when he was coming through Clemson. That's some of the best numbers that we have when you get into the.4 range. He's at.37, so he's getting to that point. He's gotten even more as the year has gone on. what I really like about him and the reason why I think I do have him in my top 50 and I'd be

comfortable having in my top 50 is because for you to have value as a running back, what do you need? You have to be able to catch the football. You have to be a receiver. There are too many really good players who can take the ball out of the backfield and run forward. Know what the, even knowing what the blocking assignment is, even making guys miss, there are too many athletes at the running back position who are good enough at just toting the rock for you to not be able to separate in what you could do in the passing game. Over the last three games with Jonathan Brooks, 80.4, 89.2, and 85.0 receiving grade. He has, I think, over 120 yards receiving over the course of the last three

games. He only has two dropped passes this entire season on 27 total targets. And those two drop passes came in the very first two games of the season. So he has not had a drop pass since. So the receiving grade is getting better. The usage is getting better. He's a natural hands catcher, at least from what I've seen so far. far and of course he checks a lot of the boxes that you would want as a ball carrier too so that's why I have him RB1 and if like I said you've been sleeping on Texas because they just had Bijan and Roshan and you felt like okay there's no way they're gonna have somebody else you better pay attention to him because I really do think that he could be the first running back off the board if he declares as just a one-year starter and a redshirt sophomore.

He's been a beast. And honestly, with guys like that, choose your own life to all of them, whatever they do, good for them. But running backs is the position they should go when they can. Now, the NIL absolutely makes life a little bit different these days where, say, you can make a really nice amount of money as a running back with nil for another year and then you're going to go to the nfl and you're on that let's be real you're under contract for

at least four years plus franchise tags as a running back it's it's a total mess of a situation maybe things do change at the college level but typically you don't want to come into the league with three like even i don't even know if you want two full years of being a workhorse in college anymore with how much injuries are at this state. So I'm curious to see what he does, but yeah, he's definitely caught my eye, Trevor. You've talked about him a lot. He's had a magnificent season in terms of the numbers that he's put up. And I'm not just talking about the yards, every single advanced number of him as a runner, he's been incredible as well. And the tape doesn't lie when you look at what he can create for himself. So that takes us to wide receiver. And I mean, let's be real. I think everybody expects this one to be boring as fun as this class is. And this class is awesome. It's

deep. It's got talent at the top. It's got multiple guys that are going to go in the first round. I think multiple guys that are going to go in the top round. I think multiple guys that are going to go in the top 15. Marvin Harrison Jr., to me, is still the cream of the crop in this class. The size, the speed. One thing from watching his tape consistently this year, there's been a lot left out on the field. That is not his fault. There's routes that he's winning that could be massive touchdowns that the ball might be thrown short the ball might not be thrown at all it might just hang up there and he's got to go back and

field it like a punt I mean Marvin is still the player that we all loved out of the summer and a really really special explosive size speed talent I don't know what he's bad at. It's tough to say that because everybody's like, oh, so he's just perfect every play. I don't mean to say that he's perfect every play, but when you talk about scouting, I don't know what you would realistically want from this guy outside of maybe sticking an extra inch or two or 20 extra pounds on him and calling him Calvin

Johnson Jr. That's about it. What else could you want from him? He's dropped a few passes this year. And that's as far as I can go. drop passes man right i'm i know i know and he's also got the best tracking i've seen dude i mean in a long time explosive jumps explosive out of his releases complex releases great releases understands leverage against cornerbacks understands coverage and knows how to find the soft spots in the zone can stop on a dime for a player who's six foot four has legit long speed he's been better at yards after the catch this year because he's had opportunities to do it and he's shown okay i do have more of this long speed from what he had last year unbelievable catch radius has the spectacular catchability and i think that he's just got

reliable hands overall and he plays hard what does he do i where where is the weakness no i i don't know where it is so he's he was my number one overall player from the summer and that has not changed by the way so i think i'm going to do two different boards this year um i think i'm going to do what will probably be referred to as the main big board which will take positional importance into account because i think that that's more of a true big board, especially like if you're operating as a team. And then I think I'm going to do just a talent big board. Like how good are you at your position?

Like basically how much of your spider graph, radar graph is filled when it comes to production, athletic ability, potential, all that stuff. And so I think I'm going to do two different boards this year. And if I, if I do Marvin Harrison jr. Is going to be number one. There's just, there's just not, I don't know what he does that isn't either straight up good.

Like I'm not even talking about like average, like I'm talking about good, great elite. I don't know what he does that's worse than good at this point i think he's a good run blocker right sure and i mean i mean it i really do i think he plays hard i think that the efforts there i mean who would who would be your two because i i think everybody knew that we were going to say marvin harrison and i feel like there's a handful of players. I am pretty confident in mine. Okay. We might differ here.

Mine would be Malik Neighbors. Yeah, mine is Malik Neighbors, and I'm not. I thought you were going to say Keon Coleman. No, and I know I love Coleman, and I am pretty comfortable right now with it being tier one is Marvin. He's in a tier by himself. I would tell you that I'm pretty comfortable either having Malik neighbors in tier two by himself, or no, I don't think that's fair. I'd probably have Malik neighbors in a tier with Romo Dunze and

Keenan Coleman. Same. But I'd very comfortably have Malik neighbors at the top of that second tier. I just, it almost makes you wonder. I actually might lean to your original point. I don't think he's in the same tier as Rome or, but those guys are so talented and so good. It, I don't know if that's the right way to say it. I don't,

I actually, I don't know which way is the right way to say it, but no matter what, whether it's, whether it's neighbors in a tier of his, his own or at the top of that tier definitive number two he is my definitive number two yeah the movement skills how he can change direction while still accelerating the smoothness the hand-eye coordination the spectacular catch ability the separation ability

nobody separates better in this class than malik neighbor says i mean maybe marvin but he is right up there with the best separators of any receiver in this class i think neighbors is a little smoother separating than marvin i think so too he's a little smaller so obviously that helps sure but sure yeah neighbors neighbors would be my two and then I'd probably have, you're flipping a coin, Keon or Odunze for me. Yeah, I mean, and then you get into a tier that's Emeka Igbuka, A.D. Mitchell, who's just been on a touchdown tear lately, and Xavier Leguette and Xavier Worthy, the two Xaviers. I would throw them probably in that tier three as well.

So that would be the group for me and how I would have them. I still really like Troy Franklin a lot, too. Yeah, I mean, Franklin is. Franklin's been a big riser this year for sure. All right, let's move to tight end, which. Is it fair to say this has the most undisputed top. Player at the position group. Yeah, I mean, in Brock Bowersers we just went over a position that had a

pretty big undisputed but i would say that the gap between gap though marvin harrison jr and malik neighbors is smaller than brock bowers and i think i'd have marv marvel stay number one on my big board i think i'd have neighbors in my top 10 players brock bowers will be in my top 10 players. Brock Bowers will be in my top 10 players and I won't have another tight end at least in the top 25. Yeah, I would definitely agree with that. And that's probably being conservative. I haven't watched all of Jadamian Sanders' stuff this year. Me too.

But he's probably the next dude, right? I still think so. I don't think this looks like a great... I didn't love this class over the summer. This is a big, to me, day three tight end class. Yeah. You might have tight end four going in on day three. You easily could.

I think Cade Stover could be a third round pick. Stover's really done well for himself. Sanders hasn't had the... And to be fair, in this Texas offense, there's a lot of really good mouths to feed. But let's talk about Bowers, because that's what this is about. And this doesn't have to be the longest one,

because there's more interesting guys to talk about, because Brock has been a top-ten prospect since the summer, and almost a near-NFL top 10 prospect since the summer and almost a near NFL ready prospect since the summer. I just think Trevor, he is such a unique receiving threat at the position. And there'll probably be some people that listen to Brock Bowers, you know, discourse this off season or even now. And they go, well, I was told all these things about Kyle Pitts. And I don't agree with that at all. I don't. Yeah, I mean, you're right.

You're right to get ahead of it. Because it's going to bother me a lot. It really is. I think Pitts was an incredible size and athleticism prospect, ball of clay that you look at and go, an NFL offense this guy should be all world and he probably still can be we don't we don't know yet Bowers is all world right now like what he is doing at the tight end position in college and what he does after the catch and how he is in contested catch situations and how you can scheme up like George Kittle plays to him, right? You can do all of the Kyle Shanahan tight end style manufactured touches to him.

This dude is a different cat, man. He really, really is. He's going to come in and he's going to be a force, in my opinion. Yeah, he'd have been. I mean, he'd have been a second round pick if he could have declared it as a true freshman. Right. He was incredible from the jump. He'd have been a second-round pick if he could have declared it as a true freshman. Right. He was incredible from the jump. He'd have been a second-round pick.

He'd have been an absolute first-round pick last year if he could have declared. And he's very clearly going to be a top 15 pick in this upcoming draft. And you're right, man. I think that this year was shaping up to be even one of his most impressive seasons yet. He's only played in, what did he get? One, two, three, four, five, six, seven. So he's played in seven games. Obviously that seventh one was cut a little short

because he suffered the ankle injury. So call it six and a half maybe. Dude, he's already at 400 yards after the catch, which he had 482 all of last year. Yeah, if he didn't miss these couple weeks. And he's got 213 yards after contact. He had 277 all of last year. Like we were in for best year yet,

most productive year yet of Brock Bowers. He was probably going to get over 1,000 yards receiving. He was probably going to get over a thousand yards receiving. He was definitely going to get over 500 yards after the catch. Shoot, man, he might have even gotten over 300, 400 yards after contact. I think so. He like, think of how good he was the first two years and then realize how much bigger and stronger he got. So I think, so I think the big question is, is people out there, which I'm just thinking of this now, we need to be better doing this.

Brock Bowers is a tight end for university, Georgia. I know a lot of people. Sorry, everyone in the weeds. Well, I want to try to be better. Cause I know there's a lot of people who start to tune into our channel

kind of around this time of year. And I want to be obviously welcoming to our, to our new listeners and watchers. No, if you weren't here over the summer, hit, hit the door. Yeah, kick rocks. Beat it.

Just kidding. Scram. We'll welcome you two days before the draft. I need to feed my children. I don't have kids. So where do you take them? Like, do you have reservations about, obviously it's the context to say the class matters, right? Oh, you know, it matters, you know, who's on the board, blah, blah, blah.

But you talked about having Brock Bowers in your top 10, top five of a big board. Yeah, I had him third overall over the summer board. I mean, I think I might have him, I think I have him five now. That's where he would be for me now. Yeah, I think I have him five now. That's where he would be for me now. I think I have him five now. Are you comfortable taking a tight end in the top ten? Knowing that he's Mark Bowers?

Yes, because I think he is a game changing, pass catching weapon. He is playing the same amount of receiving snaps as a receiver to me in my offense now now this question is interesting right because it also depends where i am if i think my coach is a big dummy that looks at everything so black and white and since he's not listed as not if you're the gm of the team yeah you'd be surprised at the nfl level and it also could be

the offensive coordinator right plenty of coaches don't call plays so that can't figure out like hey if he's listed tight end he can do receiver things consistently i can't believe we have to say this on the podcast in 2023 then no and it's also, you know, depending on where, where my team is at, because in this draft at the top, you can get a really exciting quarterback prospect. You can get a game changing wide receiver. You can get a cornerstone tackle. You can get a difference making pass rusher. Like those things are always going to matter more than everything else in the NFL, in my opinion. And I've seen a lot of shit run defenses that are going to matter more than everything else in the nfl in my opinion and i've seen a lot of shit run defenses that are going to need johnny newton with a top 15 pick

sure right no i get it i get it i just you you at least saying that you would entertain the idea you know depending on the situation i think is is i mean here's the exercise right here's the exercise right now okay you pull up good old tankthon on NFL, and we're recording this right now during Sunday Night Football, so sorry if it's not perfect. But, like, yeah, we stink. Wow. Peel back to Burton. We absolutely stink.

People are going to be like, why didn't you release this on Sunday night? Here you go. Right now. I look at a team that jumps out to me, and I've used this team as an example before right now. Tennessee is probably jumping for joy, what they've seen with Will Levis so far.

And I know it hasn't been perfect, but sign me up for what we've seen from Will Levis. If I am that organization, I am going to do everything in my power moving forward to set up Will Levis for success. If Tennessee's hovering right around 10, I'm taking Brock Bowers.

Hell yeah, I'm taking Brock Bowers. And they might need a tackle, but I think both the tackles are gone by then. But this is kind of where I'm going, Trevor, right? Like teams that believe in their quarterback of the future and might miss the Marvin Harrison, Malik Nabors window. Yeah, I'm thinking about Brock Bowers.

I think there's a lot of teams that are in and around the top 10 that would love to have brock bowers in the team it's it's a complex question because i think a lot of these these teams also have like quarterback needs so i mean new england tackle needs like new england would take would take brock bowers in a heartbeat tampa should take brock bowers in a heartbeat um tennessee obviously like that's another one that i think they would absolutely love washington indianapolis like all those teams have offensive line problems and when i say would take them in a heartbeat i mean i'm not saying over a quarterback or an offensive lineman i'm

saying the talented player like would they consider brock bowers yes all of them would consider brock bowers within their draft position wherever they are top 15 top 10 um but they'll probably have either quarterback needs or trench needs which might supersede taking a player like brock bowers i wanted to say this before we move on to offensive line in the three seasons that brock bowers has played which includes his true freshman season his first year he has never recorded a pass blocking grade or a run blocking grade for a full season below 70. Either one. He has all three years, he has had a pass blocking and run blocking season grade above 70 for both of those categories. This dude not only is an incredible receiver,

he blocks his ass off. He is absolutely part of your offensive game plan, whether he has the ball or whether he doesn't, which I think is really important. Before we get to offensive line, got to remind people that this time of year is all about setting up the routine and the checklist. Well, the most important part of that routine and that checklist should always be securing your family's financial future, starting with life insurance. Fabric by Gerber Life makes it quick and easy and affordable to protect your family so you can get back to just enjoying life. It was designed by parents for parents to help you get a high quality, surprisingly affordable term life insurance policy in just less than 10 minutes. Fabric has flexible policies that fit your family's budget

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Price is subject to underwriting and health questions. All right, offensive tackle. Are we switching it up? We're getting spicy? We're not. We're not, but. No, we're not. We need the clicks.

Come on. I know, I know. Almost did it for the clicks, but refrained. It's still a loop of shotter. I don't know. Jordan Morgan, give him a shout out. kingsley samatea come on right up like let's just just get crazy just full potential just base it off just nothing but how big are you do you move well

all right it's it's olufashanu and where's he play he plays for the university of penn state they go by the nittany lions in case you really case you're in like i don't know i don't even know where to go with this i was gonna say a random country but every country watches college football at this point it feels like almost for reaching that point man it's you know what though it is interesting i think joe alt's a hell of a football player. And I think Joe Walt's a better run blocker than Olu Fashanu. I really do. I just think that, and I just think that Fashanu is not only the most gifted tackle in the class. Like if I was building a tackle in a lab and going all the way from his, the movement of his lower body, specifically how light his feet are,

to how he's built his upper body. He's got it all. But he really has the tape now as a tackle on an island in pass pro that's very, very impressive. And there's a premium on that. You look at how athletic defensive linemen are in today's NFL. I mean, we're sitting here, right? there's a premium on that. You look at how athletic defensive linemen are in today's NFL. Like look at, I mean, we're sitting here,

right? Think of the quarterbacks that played today because of injury or some of its guys not performing, but a lot of injury. I mean, Jaron Hall started a game and didn't get to finish the game. Yeah. And who did Josh jobs?

Better, better called Dobbs. I mean, seriously, like it is ridiculous at this point. Did you hear he didn't know anyone's name at that point? No, he didn't know the plays. He didn't know anybody's name.

He didn't know where he was. His pet's heads are falling off. Yeah. Like, this dude just walked into the stadium and won an NFL football game. This is the worst case scenario for all people who play in the NFL who look at normal average people and say, yeah, you couldn't play. Josh Jobs walked in off the street. No, I know that he played. Josh Jobs is single-handedly ruining the theory

that coaches always try to sell us on their podiums when a guy gets brought in well he doesn't know the playbook yet like we can't suit him up as the number two yeah i mean he's gonna need a couple weeks here like the same thing with aiden o'connell aiden o'connell plays today and he he looked he looked like the best quarterback that has played in a Raiders uniform this year. I know. Plain and simple. I know. Plain and simple. So I'm with you.

So I got there somehow by talking about how you need a guy to protect your quarterback so you're not out there having Tommy DeVito just doing whatever he's doing. But, I mean, tough spot for Tommy DeVito, man. I feel for him. Um, it's just that Fashanu is a really, really gifted pass protector and the type of athlete at this position. That is the NFL is going to need to find as many as they can as these edge rushers become for, I mean,

they're testing like running backs out here, these edge rushers. So that's where I land on Fashanu. But I would, if I was a team that walked away with joe alt in the top 10 i'd be i'd be really really happy about it i think i think there's three i think there's three guys to consider with the top tackle spot now the the player that i have at one is a clear cut one to me um but i genuinely think that olufashanu

joe alt and talize Fuaga are all three offensive tackles that you take in the top 12, top 10, whatever you want to say. I think these are starting caliber, long-term offensive tackle players for a future NFL team. Now, I agree with you. I have Olu at number one.

I went back and I watched Olu's game against Ohio State. And I was nervous because I watched a lot of people say, and I watched Olu's game against Ohio State. And I was nervous because I watched a lot of people say, now I watched the game live, but I saw a lot of people say like, man, he got exposed. JT Tuimaloa really hit him with power. And there were certainly two or three plays that, yeah,

he wasn't really expecting the power and he got knocked back a little bit but it was not as bad as I thought it was going to be it really wasn't there were a couple of plays that he got knocked back into the pocket but there were explanations for it like on one play Michael Hall looked like he was about to do a TE stunt and he was just going to go straight into him, but it was a really great fake. And so you could tell Olu is, rightfully so, he had really good football IQ to see the tackle coming in and he was going to brace for him and completely neutralize him.

Well, it ended up being a fake. And then all of a sudden, the other player was right in his chest and knocked him back a little bit. And it took him an extra foot or two to recover from it. But the thing is, he recovers basically every time. You know, there were a couple of plays where, yeah, he got pushed back a little bit from power. But basically every time he was able to stretch his feet out, put his heels in the dirt, and completely redirect the defensive lineman's movement up, upwards, and get them to stop moving.

And so it was like, he did his job on the play. So even, I came away from that Ohio State game saying, if that's the worst game you're going to point out to me about Olufesanu I'm drafting that guy in the top five right like you don't you don't realize what you're doing when people were like what JT did to him and I'm like this is this is what we have to go it became me reliving all over again sauce Gardner during his rookie year like somebody would catch a 15 yard out against him and everybody like oh god his ass it's like all right like this is how good we think he is already right right so yeah olu is olu's definitely become one of those guys that if he ever gets beat

you know you you show to your grandkids one day so i like i like all three of those players but even after watching olu's quote-unquote worst game yeah we're chilling we're chilling with him we're big chilling at number one uh interior offensive line i have these guys split because i actually have a different player each for guard and for center me too i i did it i did it i recently did a pretty big deep dive into the interior offensive line class i hadn't really been able to do that at that scale since this summer. So I was able to watch a handful of different guys, but you can go, you can go both of them at one time.

Like who do you got to guard? Who do you got to center? And you can talk about them there. So my guard one was my guard two over the summer. And the best part is he doesn't even play guard for his team right now. And that's Troy Fountain now of Washington. He'll play, he'll kick inside i think at the next level he's awesome i loved him over the summer he he jumped uh cooper bb

for me who's had a really nice season as well i just think fat now at least at least gives you some versatility like he might have that abt and i think it's gonna happen to skaransky like that pathway where you're like ah we're in a pinch like he's got to play tackle and then he's fine and the staff's like why did we overthink this anyway but he's gonna he's gonna start out at guard and then uh for center cedric van pran from georgia okay who is just this iron man every year of you know reliability and consistency and uh this was a position group over the summer like zach frazier from west virginia i think was my top center but van pran was number two and it was kind of all up in the air i saw a little bit of something from all

these guys but what what van pran's been able to do in the sec now for a couple years at a really really high level and the consistency of his tape I would say makes me the most comfortable with him at this position. Yeah. I, so for mine, um, it's funny because I don't know if I'm kind of like cheating a little bit here because my top guard is Graham Barton who plays left tackle for Duke

right now. And you're at the same route I don't think he's going to be able to play tackle at the next well sorry what I should say is I don't think they're going to let him start off at tackle at the next level I see Barton sort of like UC Fountain now which I agree with these are players who are probably gonna have a home on the interior, but they can play tackle in a pinch. Like Fontenot, he does basically everything that you would want him to do, except he's short and he's got small arms. And those two things, unfortunately, are killers because you're even seeing now at the college level, there are edge rushers who can consistently win with length.

You're getting a long arm where he can't get his arms on you and he can't flip but dude the hands are lightning quick this is fountain now i'm talking about which is washington's left tackle i mean the hands are lightning quick the footwork is lightning he's got great the base is wonderful he's got great core strength i mean he he can mirror some of the fastest edge rushers in the Pac-12. He just happens to be 6'3", maybe 6'3 1⁄2". He's not 6'6". You kind of need to be to be an offensive tackle. He's got shorter arms.

I mean, that's the story. So Barton's kind of the same way. Barton's a little bit taller. Barton is 6'5". But I still think Barton is a little bit short with length. A lot of where he gets in trouble comes from lack of length when defensive linemen can really long arm and kind of create that space. But because of the power that he has, that base that he has,

the grip strength, which is just so imposing from Graham Barton, I think he's going to be a fantastic plus athlete type of guard at the next level. And then at center, I actually have fat now at center. Interesting. Dude, so there is a projection here that is a big unknown. Because in order to play center, you have to certainly have high football IQ. You have to be able to get to the line of scrimmage, point things out, notice where the defense is, be a good communicator to the defense around you, to your quarterback behind you. You have to be able to see the whole

picture of the front seven. There's a lot of communication and identification that is required to be a great center. But in terms of the size profile and the athletic ability profile, dude, Fontenot is to a T what you would want as a center. The hands are so fast where I could see him snapping the football and boom, his hands are back up immediately. That nose tackle, even if we have a zero technique

or one technique that is right on him, I believe he's got the hands to fire back inside, get him up quick. He's got the foot to fire back inside, get him up quick. He's got the footwork to be able to readjust, to find his base. I think that he could be pretty brilliant as a center. So I actually have him moving all the way to center, which he has not played in college, so it is a projection. Ultimately, I think that he would be a starting guard as well.

But that is where I kind of see this with the interior offensive line right now. I got two other guys that I want to shout out really quick, but I wanted to give you a chance if you wanted to say anything else about either Barton or Fount now. No, listen, Barton as well, he's at the top of my list with guards as well. I'm with you. I think he's going to kick inside, but I think he also has that flexibility once again

where is it always going to be perfect to tackle with him? No, but do I think he can survive at tackle for you if you need him to while he's going to thrive for you at guard he fits that billing and I think the Fountainhead discussion from you at center is something I hadn't thought of but it's really really interesting and kind of speaks to how versatile of a player he is because of how complete a player he is on the offensive line dude I just watched the way he plays left tackle, and I'm like, okay, being able to play on the edge is probably more valuable. But if he doesn't get the chance to play on the edge,

if you put him at center, I think he could have pro bowl potential as a center because of his athletic ability. The two guys that I want to shout out before we move on to the defense side of things. Christian Hayes from UConnon grading very well this year this dude can move he is their guard starting guard right now but i think he can be a starting guard or a starting center at the next level because of how explosive he is off the snap just needs to get a little bit stronger but that movement skills i i gravitate towards guys who are plus movers in the trenches. And I think that he is a guy to invest in.

Then the other one, a guy we just watched recently, Jackson Powers Johnson, the center from Oregon. Yeah, he's popped. He has also been playing some really good ball as of late. It's a little high-waisted. I think that he also plays with a little too high of pad level. When he gets in trouble, it's because he loses that natural leverage. So he needs to get the pad level under control. I don't know if it's just a lack of flexibility that's always going to be there from him being more high waisted and it's just tougher for him to sit. But I think that he has

the power and the movement skills to play at both center or guard at the next level. So he is another really versatile offensive lineman who I like the power profile. I like how he can be finishing as a blocker. I like the way that he moves. And he's just graded out really, really well this year. So if we can fix that pad level problem that he has, if guys really getting underneath him with him currently playing his center, I think we've got a starting caliber NFL offensive lineman.

So keep an eye out for him as you guys are watching those West coast oregon games i know they're going to play in a lot of big ones kind of down the stretch this season i like that you brought up haynes i had him as center four over summer um once i saw that that listed height and weight and watched him play i was like yeah this is a guy that it makes sense for him for a long-term home at center and i thought the tape was phenomenal when i watched him over the summer so i like to hear that you know he's he's obviously stacking together really good seasons here once again want to move over to the defense yeah let's do it okay so interior d line could be a little quicker on this one at johnny newton who i've talked a lot about on this podcast yeah tape breakdown of him on mbc's youtube um i mean with Newton right now, he's winning at a 17.5% pass rush win rate.

Really good stuff for an interior D-line. If you wanted to see an interior D-line take over games, Penn State and Wisconsin, I would watch those two games. I mean, he was unblockable, truly unblockable in these games. He's been a reliable run defender. He could stack and shed. He's got good vision. I think he gets off the ball when the defensive scheme

allows him to get off the ball and attack. I just think he's got great hands. I love the motor he plays with. He's going to test well. He played some running back in high school. This dude has really figured out every aspect of playing the position. And he could play 5-tech tech, three tech, shade nose. I mean, he could really do it all.

Yeah, I think he might be the only first-round interior defensive lineman. He is for definitely as I see it right now. Leonard Taylor from Miami, I think, might be that next guy in there. I like Jenkins' floor better still. Certainly, Jenkins has a higher floor. I haven't checked his pass rush numbers lately. Yeah, it hasn't turned the corner like we hoped. Right, so I think he might just be that kind of a player.

Do you draft a guy who's going to have a limited pass rush ceiling in the first round? It feels like it's more of maybe a second round kind of a play. But there's a lot of really nice day to interior defensive lineman. Even if there aren't a lot of first rounders like Dante Corleone from Cincinnati, um, Mackay Wingo from LSU, Ruka Roro from Clemson,

McKinley Jackson, Texas. Yeah. I mean, to Vondre sweat from Texas, dude is a house, absolute mountain of a man. Like all of these guys,

I think are going to be day two defensive linemen somewhere I just don't know if we're going to get any one other than Illinois's Johnny Newton so what about edge rusher who do you have as uh as edge one in this class layout to lots of man like this dude just dominates and here's the thing with lots of I don't think he's as explosive as chop Robinson I don't think he could do all the freaky stuff that Dallas Turner can do in a defense I don't think he has the heavyweight hands that verse has but he is such a well-rounded player that can win in a million different ways I still think he's a good athlete. It's not like

I look at him and go, ah, but he's not a good athlete. Like I, I still think he's a good athlete when he stands up and gets after it. And we've talked about the toolbox that Latu has, the UCLA pass rusher. We've talked about his background. He had a medical retirement. Washington wouldn't clear him. He gets, you him. He starts a new career at UCLA here. And we loved his tape so much over the summer, Trevor, and he's only built on that. I mean, the 23.2% pass rush win rate. He's got double-digit sacks.

He is just affecting. And it's so consistent every single week. I think that's what stands out to me, is that you look he's got two games with double digit pressures he's got plenty of games where he just hovers right around you know four six nine like it's really hard to shut this dude out it really really is it makes me laugh one of the games that he only had one pressure well it was against nc central where he only had nine pass rush snaps I'm assuming UCLA was just you know winning big that game so yeah he's he's such a well-rounded player that is technically sound you could tell he's worked on so many different moves and he's somebody that uh plays as hard as anyone in the country in my opinion I think he plays as hard as anyone in the country, in my opinion. I think he plays as hard as anyone in the country.

I mean, five of his last six games, he has over 20% pass or swing percentage in five out of the six. And the one that he doesn't was a 19.2. So it was right there. It's just been complete dominance from him. He's an artist at how he gets beyond offensive tackles. I thought that his battles against Talisa Fuaga was really good. I thought that you were really watching two future NFL players. And that's one of the games that I watched Fuaga play and a handful of reps that I watched from him. I was like, okay, this guy could hang at the NFL level. I watched Fuaga

against Jonah Ellis as well. And Jonah Ellis basically has beaten every other Pac-12 offensive lineman in the country, but he couldn't really get by Fouaga. So that's another testament to how good that the Oregon State right tackle is playing. But I agree. I think it's Latu at number one for me. He's just too damn productive. And like you said, I think all three guys who are after him, Dallas Turner from Alabama, Jared verse from Florida state,

chop Robinson for Penn state. All three of those guys are probably more explosive than a lot to is a lot to gets the quarterback faster. He gets to quarterback more regularly. And that matters. That part of it absolutely matters for me. I don't have a good determining order for the other three. I think the other three are kind of in the same bucket, in the same tier. With Latu very clearly above the three of them, if you ask me.

But that's kind of how I have that rounded out as well. I'm with you. Yeah. Can we talk about prize picks? Yes, let's talk about prize picks. We got to talk about our friends over prize picks. So this podcast is coming out in the middle of Monday Night Football. So you won't be able to bet what we are about to say to you.

But we thought that it would be a fun exercise because we're recording this on Sunday night to actually pick a three-leg entry for you for prize picks and see if it hits midway through the podcast while we're doing it. So Connor has prize picks pulled up for Monday Night Football this upcoming week which features your new york jets versus the chargers right it's just chargers that's right what do we got light of the century what's the entries hit me with it what do we what are we

rolling with let's go breeze hall over 19 more than 19 and a half receiving yards. I don't think that's a lot to ask. All right, I'm going to look it up. On the surface level, I like it. Brees Hall more than 19 and a half receiving yards against the Chargers defense. Let's see what he's gotten so far. Let's see what the receiving stats are. What is it?

You said 19? Yes. All right, he's hit that two weeks in a row easily with great ease. Yeah. He hit 54 against the Eagles and 76 against the Giants. Yeah. Okay. And it's his backfield now. All right. We're locking it in. Let's take Justin Herbert more than eight and a half rushing yards the Jets the Jets defense and pass rush for as good as it is they uh you know they get a little too sugar high sometimes sure and quarterbacks can run because of it a lot of quarterbacks have done this to them so at eight and a half Justin Herbert could do that in one you just need one play I was gonna say yeah he just needs one play to do it so Justin Herbert more than eight and a half rushing yards okay

let's look for something just absolutely just on hinge we gotta win 25 times the money do we do uh Cameron Dicker more than one and a half field goals yes yeah yeah yeah 100 percent Cameron Dicker more than one and a half field goals Brees Hall more than 19 and a half receiving yards Justin Herbert more than what is eight and a half rushing yards yep and then Cameron Dicker over one and a half field goals is that what it is more than one and a half field goals for Cameron Dicker you absolutely love it I mean this is how this is how the Kings get rich. You know, just come to the comment section where all three of these bad boys hit and know that you got to listen to us next week and you'd be absolutely.

The fantasy fiesta. The fantasy fiesta. My goodness. Hey, it's not just football either. With basketball season here, you can now pick combo projections across both football and basketball from the special leagues. A league created specifically for combo picks that includes two or more players from different sports leagues.

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I'm very curious whether we're actually going to hit this since we're recording it before monday night football i got faith i got faith good luck i get faith who you got is linebacker one it's still barrett carter but i think this group is another one similar to where were we that i said this running back that it is very wide open in my eyes. I still love the athlete that Carter is. I actually think his teammate Jeremiah Trotter Trotter might be having the better college season this year. He's been phenomenal for that Clemson defense.

And I still like my guy from summer, Junior Colson on Michigan. I really do. But I still lean Carter because of the athlete he is, how many different things he could do for the middle of the defense, and the fact that I haven't seen yet. And linebackers is definitely one. I will be honest that when we get the nitty-gritty super tape grind of December, January, February, and March,

I feel like I find linebackers throughout that process more than a lot of other positions over the years, because there's just things you see while watching them individually from other programs. The defense could be bad, but like this guy was held back because of this, or he's always covering up for this guy. So I'm hoping some lesser knowns kind of jump out during that process but i would still go with barrett carter today so i have a new

linebacker one i put texas a&m linebacker edger and cooper at linebacker one last who was on no notes who is on the no notes right we talked about it on the on the last episode and the reason why i have him at number one is because quite frankly there's not another player who i think has the full package of coverage ability that would overtake what kind of athlete and run defender edgar and cooper is if you look at his pff grade i talked about this in the no notes segment he has like an elite coverage grade right now but it's not the coverage grade that you automatically go to like it's not the fred warner levante david bobby wagner type of like coverage where you're dropping back into a deep zone and you're floating

from left to right you're reading the the quarterback's eyes, all that. It's more of he's defending a shallow zone, like in the flat or in the backfield or something. And he's able to trigger downhill once the ball goes there. So he's able to recover very quickly. He's able to make the tackle very soon after the catch is made. And so that helps his coverage grade because that's his guy. And his guy doesn't get many yards after the catch. But at six foot three, 230 pounds, 34 inch arms, which are

extremely impressive when he's attacking the pocket and getting off blocks, this dude can move. Now I've been told that Cade York, who is the true freshman linebacker who is next to Edgerton Cooper, York is actually the one who makes all the calls and plays a lot more in coverage. So it allows Cooper to just play downhill fast and free. There are a lot of linebackers that can do that. And I would often tell you that drafting those types of linebackers really high isn't the best return on investment because there's a lot of athletes at the linebackers really high isn't the best return on investment because there's a lot of athletes

at the linebacker level but because of how limited in size it feels like jeremiah trotter jr is and because it just doesn't feel like carter has been making a lot of strides and plays in coverage. I don't really think either of those players are good enough at that premium part of playing the position coverage that overtakes what Cooper is as an athlete. So I'm trying to kind of like rope in why I think he's linebacker one, where I compared him to Kenneth Murray in the no notes segment. Right. That's kind of the way I see him. I would draft Edger and Cooper somewhere, probably like early second round. I'd be cool with that. Like you were just drafting a really good athlete who you just want to be a seaball get ball type of a player. But if you draft him, if you draft Edger and Cooper at like 15th overall, you're going to ask him to drop in coverage. And he just doesn't do a lot of that. I don't know if he's really capable of it. It's just not what he's asked to do. And right now

he's playing better than he ever has in his life. And it's because he's playing a lot more free and a lot more downhill. So if he ends up developing into a big time coverage player, it would be a massive projection. So ultimately that's kind of where I have those three guys, the two linebackers from Clemson and Trotter Jr. and Barrett Carter. But I do have Edger and Cooper above both of those guys, simply because it's an athlete's game at the pro level, and Cooper is not going to be short on athleticism. So size and athleticism production for what we're seeing this year,

I feel like that's probably the most impactful of the group. So I got him at the top. Yeah, it's not the sexiest group so far this year. Right. I think it's where we kind of, you know, came to our conclusion there. For corner, now I do have a new number one corner in this spot. So I had Kalen King over the summer, and I still like Kalen King. I know he didn't have a great game against Ohio State,

but my number one corner right now is Cooper Dejean. And I just look at Cooper Dejean and just think there's no way this guy won't be a good NFL player. It'll be on special teams. It'll be at corner. He'll play sometimes in safety looks. He's got size, right? He's got athleticism. He's got size right he's got athleticism he's got balls here's the thing cooper dejean for me he's got size he's got athleticism he's got ball skills

and he could tackle if you have those four things like you're the chances of you not being a good NFL player just feel really low. Right. Really low. So I love Cooper DeGene, man. I think he's awesome. He's awesome. He even got in on an offensive snap for Iowa recently,

which is good when you look at some of the... What did they put him in? Receiver? They ran a reverse. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They ran to end around with him um it's just yeah and you see what he does on punt returns like the dude is he's really really impressive and they're and i like this corner class or i really do like nate wiggins has been awesome this year uh i like tj tampa a lot yeah cool it kool-aid is still that is still one of those

dudes early kaylin king's still one of those dudes early so it's this was a tougher one i i i'm glad you brought all of those names up i still have kool-aid mckintry as as my cb1 i had cb1 going into the year he just he's so good at the position. The only big time knock I have on Kool-Aid McKinstry is he doesn't have like a ton of big time plays because he's not super aggressive to go get interceptions. He's just a shutdown corner. He's just really comfortable playing in press man coverage. He's really comfortable with his back to the ball.

He's got 18 forced incompletions over the last two years. It's kind of how joey porter jr was uh i think they're during they're different but i think porter was the same way in college where he like he had a lot of breakups he could shut down his side of the field but i he was not in my this like aggressive, going to make a ton of big plays on the ball kind of player. Right, right. He should, yeah. And that's, McKintry just does his job and he does it really well. And sometimes you want a higher ceiling out of players.

Like I think Nate Wiggins has better ball skills. So to me, I've got Nate Wiggins as CB2 behind. Yeah, Nate Wiggins is big here. Behind Kool-Aid McKintry, but then I have Cooper DeGene as CB3 kind of right there. It's kind of a lot of in the same conversation. But I'm just a sucker for having a corner where you could just say, okay, yep, go on the outside, do your thing,

and they're just going to be able to cover receivers week in and week out. It's just such a valuable tool. It's such a difficult position to play. So McKinstry and his experience in press man coverage gets the nod for me as CB1. But like I mentioned, I moved Wiggins up to CB2. I do have Dijon at CB3, and I think he can play corner in the NFL. I absolutely believe that he can can I wish he played more press like more true press man in college because Iowa just doesn't ask him to do that no they don't he plays a lot of off coverage he plays a lot of off quarters a lot of off cover three and it's good for him

because he's got really good instincts so he can still make plays on the ball and we've seen over the last couple of years but when you are six foot two 207 pounds i also want to see what you're like at the line of scrimmage like hand fighting guys off the line and bumping them in their releases and seeing how you could stay in the hip pocket can you really stop on that dime like i feel like you can i just don't have a lot of proof of that so i think you could play a corner i wonder if i'm gonna have him at safety when it's all said and done just because dude I feel like he's got I feel like he's got Jesse Bates type of potential like as an over the middle type of defender where it just feels like every single week I'm watching Jesse Bates make an interception or make a massive play breaking up the ball getting there when the

receiver's getting there over the middle and I I selfishly kind of feel like dajean can be that type of a player so is that the area where he has an even bigger impact than potentially a corner i'm not sure but um i got no problem with you putting him at cb1 man he is he's a really good player he's a really good football player yeah all right we'll close it out with the safeties. Yep. I didn't do a kicker for this show. I'm sorry, Trevor. No, we already got.

No K1. We already got Cameron Dicker. Shout out. Yeah, that's enough for one day. I have not watched. You know, now that you mentioned that as PFF's lead draft analyst, I think I might have to watch kickers this year. You absolutely do.

I've never watched kickers before. I watch like when one, well, they go to the senior bowl, which doesn't say much. It's not like we're out there like focusing on the kickers. I watch specialists. I do 300 usually now every year. So I watch some specialists. I do 300 usually now every year. So I watch some specialists, but kicker kicker sucks to evaluate from our side of things because far kick

accurate. There are, there are two parts of being a kicker that are really important. How far you kick the football, obviously like accuracy is important, but I feel like I don't even need to say that. Because if you, if you have no accuracy as a kicker,

we're not going to judge you anyways. It's the things that you judge are how far can you kick the football? And will you crumble under pressure? That's the second one is. And the second one, you will never know that NFL GMs never know this. It is, it is the most fickle part of this entire sport so yeah i'm gonna you you guys are gonna go along with me in this journey to to me scouting kickers

for the first time this year for pfo safety i have no reason to move off my number one guy from the summer in tyler newbin it's just every time I watch Tyler Newben make a play and he had an interception against Illinois I'm like why aren't you in the NFL and it's probably the answer is probably the NFL's fault to be honest with you it's probably the NFL's fault so Tyler Newben goes back to school he's got excellent range great hands I think he plays with attitude when he comes up to the line of scrimmage. I love Tyler Newben. Good size, ball skills, tackles, smart.

He can play really any kind of coverage scheme that you want him to, and he can do it confidently. Tyler Newben's a baller, man. He'll go pick 36, and he'll just start for nine years in the NFL. I'm sticking with Cam Kitchens for now, but it's close. I mean, you started this podcast with a 1A, 1B. I might end this podcast with a 1A, 1B for Cam Kitchens at Miami. And then, of course, the guy that you mentioned there, Tyler Newbin. Is Kalen Bullock your three?

Let me look. He would be my three still, even though he does not. I still have him at four. Okay. Actually, this is the only group that one through four didn't move for me. I still like Rod Moore. Oh, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He didn't move for me. I still like Rod Moore. Oh, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He missed some time for me earlier this year. But like, yeah, that's been the issue. But like, he's been back now. But like, you know, it's not like that did enough where I'm like, yeah, I got to drop Rob Rod Moore that much. Vengeance has been playing well this year, not as well as he did last year, but he had a lot of big-time interceptions last year. So, that really raised his grades a lot.

But I still think, like, it's been – he's a pretty high-floor player, and he's also a really versatile player. I'm trying to pull up his snap count right now because I feel like it's been pretty diverse this year. Yeah, I mean, he's played 76 snaps in the box, 81 snaps as a slot corner, 279 snaps as a free safety. So he primarily plays that free safety role, which is what he's best at. But he's going to end the year over 100 snaps at strong safety,

over 100 snaps at slot corner, and then probably over 400 snaps if he plays the whole year and he's healthy the whole year. He's probably going to have over 400 snaps at free safety. So he's just a super versatile defender. And I think he's got the athleticism, the size, the ball hawking ability to be that type of versatile safety player that you would want on the back end. So I think he's a little bit more athletic than Tyler Newben. And that's why I give him the edge.

But Newben sees the field so well. Yeah, he's got a little better vision, I think. He does, he does. And that is really, really important. So I wonder if I kind of revisit that because that's an extremely important trait for me. I think it should be for everybody when they're evaluating the safety position

is you have so much space as a true back-end defender that you have to calculate, honestly, in real time. You have to be able to calculate your positioning in, okay, this receiver's coming here. I am this close to this defender. If he releases the ball at this time, this is as far as I could get. Is that enough to make a play on the ball or make the pack tackle? So you're almost in calculus class in your head, every single snap. And for the guys that can do that sort of math very quickly on how to

navigate space and where to position themselves to make the best play on the football, it's an extremely valuable tool. And Tyler Newman does do that very well, but so going with Kim Kinshans, there we go. Those are our top players at every single position.

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manscaped.com. That's 20% off and free shipping with the promo code PFF at manscaped.com. I can promise you've never seen a ball trimmer look like a spaceship before. Well, now you can. Get yours from our friends over at manscaped.com. Connor, any surprises from the list? Anybody, I don't know, maybe you wanted to shout out that you didn't get a chance to shout out? Maybe not within the top three, just somebody that's caught your eye, anything like that? Honestly, while you were doing the ad,

it came across my timeline, a tweet from Samuel L. Jackson, who said, at what point do we start the Rams coaching conversation? Samuel L. Jackson? Yeah, like the actual Samuel L. Jackson, not like a parody account. I just thought that was interesting. Social media manager that's logged into the wrong account. Right? Like, I just thought it was so, I was like, what?

I was like, number one, I don't think, I think Sean McVay is pretty comfortable. Didn't he start, he started Brett ripping today. I was, yeah, I was going to say, this is, this is not the week. This was, this is not the week to do that. Like, I mean, respect to Sam L. Jackson. So I want to be honest with you. That's what really, really caught my eye. Outside of that, there's been surprises this

year but none of them have been like like meteoric in that way right like the the rise up where i'm like this guy's number one now like how did this how did we get here i you know and maybe that'll happen but i just know i don't i don't really have somebody like that uh i think it's cool that latu it showed last year was far from a fluke if anything like he right when you and i watched latu over the summer and we were both like whoa like whoa yeah so he's really really good i mean i have one okay j. Jaden Daniels from LSU. Who we talked about a lot on the quarterback show. I watched Jaden at Arizona State.

And Jaden was not a passer at Arizona State. No. He was a run first quarterback. With a big arm. He was clearly there for his athletic ability. Right. And he could pass it deep down the field. He has gotten better every single year that he has played football.

He is. And, and that is such a important part of his scouting profile, because I think a lot of people are going to watch Jaden Daniels and whether it's preconceived notions or, or just maybe the fact that he's not a finished perfect product right now. And they're going to say like, ah, nah, he's not an NFL QB. I used to look at Jaden Daniels and think that he was just a really good college quarterback. Now I look at him and think, okay, he, he has truly gotten better every single year.

He became a better rusher over the two years that he was at Arizona State. He became a much safer, more risk-averse quarterback last year at LSU. And this year, he is taking his game to the next level with more big- time throws than he has ever thrown in his career. He is, I mean, he throws a slot fade ball and a go fade ball about as good as anybody in the country does right now. And I hope that he can play next week and beyond. I know he got knocked out of that Alabama game, which really sucked because they were just going blow for blow that Alabama game.

And he was the one who was orchestrating those Tigers points runs. And man, I just think the dual threat ability that he has, I think a lot of us, myself included, we're just thinking that Jalen Daniels, Jaden Daniels was this college quarterback and you didn't really have to take him seriously when we thought about scouting. I think you do. I think you really do. His play this year is worthy of being a Heisman Trophy finalist so far to this point, and it is worthy of you really turning on the tape and seriously considering what he could be at the NFL

because if you haven't done that yet, I bet it'll impress you more than you think. I'm with you. A lot of what you said in the beginning of that just reminded me of Jalen Hurts' process so much. I went back and looked at Hurts' numbers from Alabama those three years

and then obviously how he finished at Oklahoma. He had a wild road as a quarterback prospect where we talked a lot about Daniels on this show a couple weeks ago and yeah, I'm more and more impressed every single time

I watch him it's just it's all there talent wise it really really is there we go he might sneak in the first round Trevor I'll leave the show on that that's what I'm saying

I really think I really think he's going to sneak in the first round. Speaking of the first round, I got a mock draft out right now over at PFF.com. It is my 2.0 mock draft. I don't know if we're going to break that down for Wednesday's show or if it's going to be too far removed. Maybe we'll do something else. We're getting into fix-your-team territory,

especially since one team officially, yeah, fired their head coach and general manager. But I still want to give it a little bit of time. We're going to get to it. I want to get to anywhere from six to eight teams that we get to fix, I think, over the course of December and January. But I want to get it more solidified of where we think that this team is going to pick in the draft because it's a big part of the exercise that we do.

So we are planning on the teams that we're going to get to the raiders are gonna be one of them but um we'll see what we get to on wednesday we would love to hear what you guys think about this current show the names that we talked about at the very top of this uh this is uh position group class and then all the names that we also mentioned we would love to hear from you guys too even if it's just one position you don't have to give us every single position. If you feel super passionately about like, man, I got Malik neighbors, wide receiver one, or, you know, like you've got Joel offensive tackle one sound off in the comments. We would love to hear from you. This is an awesome, cool scouting community where we really get to hear a lot of different point of views. It's not just a group to group thing. Connor and I think that we're

pretty good at this and we have a lot of fun doing it, but the beauty of the scouting process, especially from our side of things as fans, as media is that we've all got some different opinions and we all could see prospects very differently. So when we do episodes like this, we'd love to hear from you guys. Let us know what you think. Best way to do that. YouTube.com backslash at NFL stock exchange. If your audio only hit us up on X and also Instagram at Connor G Rogers at Tampa Bay trade. That is where you can do that. Connor,

you got anything else before we get out of here? No, I think you covered it pretty well. I'm excited to get into your mock draft. You know, that's a, it's a good idea for the midweek show. Talk about some of the thought process there.

And it's, this is the moment where it really feels like draft season, where we have that the summer notes and then the notes off of a couple months of play to build off of it and now guys start to jump up and down like that's the beauty of the draft I think that's what a lot of people miss is this is such a process a fluid process that it's you know it's awesome that it's awesome I'm glad we ended on Jaden Daniels, right? It's awesome for a guy that was almost written off as an NFL player or was probably viewed as he might have to switch positions or whatever it may be.

And now he's a legitimate borderline round one quarterback prospect. That's what makes the draft what it is. Yeah, it is. There are different seasons within draft season, and we're reaching a fun one, man. The excitement for it is just going up and up and up. And as fans of teams kind of start to turn the page from the regular season to draft season as their team, unfortunately, isn't doing great in the win-loss column,

I think y'all are going to realize this draft class is something to get really excited about. And we're going to be here with you every step of the way. I'm Trevor Sycamore. That is Connor Rogers. Thank you guys so much for listening to the NFL Stock Exchange podcast. See you on Wednesday. Thank you.