NFL Stock Exchange: An NFL Draft Podcast - 270. Early Thoughts on 1st & 2nd Year QBs in NFL

Episode Date: September 12, 2024

0:00 - Intro 3:05 - Jayden Daniels 9:30 - Caleb Williams 15:45 - Bo Nix 27:25 - Anthony Richardson 38:38 - Bryce Young 50:00 - Will Levis 55:20 - CJ Stroud

Welcome to the NFL Stock Exchange podcast. In this episode, we're talking about quarterbacks, some of the rookies that made their debut in the NFL this past weekend, as well as keeping tabs on some of the second-year players to see how they started their sophomore seasons in the NFL. So CJ Stroup, Bryce Young, Will Levis, Anthony Richardson, Bo Nix, Caleb Williams, Jaden Daniels. We're talking about all of them.

I'm Trevor Sycamore. With me, as always, is Connor Rogers. Let's ring the bell. Welcome to the opening bell of the NFL Stock Exchange Podcast. Trevor Sikama, Connor Rogers here with you guys to talk a little quarterback series. The season has just begun. Why not overreact to quarterback performances with one week in the books? All right. Okay.

We're not going to overreact too much, but it is fun to react to how these quarterbacks are playing, especially the rookie quarterbacks. But we're also going to get into the second year quarterbacks, Anthony Richardson, CJ Stroud, Bryce Young, Will Levis. How did they play in their week one matchups as well as we kind of look forward to what they could be in their second year. So a little bit of a, you know, a little bit of a quarterback emphasis show, which I'm very excited about. Connor, how you doing my friend?

I'm good, man. This will be fun. We, you know, we don't get to do a lot of open format shows that are so NFL centric like this. I feel like we're always looking forward to players that'll hopefully be in the NFL one day but we've dived into the rookie tape. You do all this build up, right? All these rankings, valuations, mock drafts. The players finally go to teams. You'd like to at least enjoy the beginning of their

career. So, and and there's a lot, you know, everybody has questions right now because it was as expected, a lot of struggles for the rookie class and then you get to see some of not all but the second year guys, you know, maybe take some positive steps or things they still need to work on. So this is a really good format for us to get to do that. We don't often get to talk about. It is funny.

Like we do talk so much about these players as prospects, and then they get drafted to the NFL and someone's just like, all right, next class. Like we're talking about the next class. It really is. We're moving on. And, you know know i only pay attention to it if it confirms my priors you know then i act like it didn't happen if not i never existed if a player i liked catches one touchdown in week one of their nfl career we're good here i was actually good

don't need to watch anything else that's it and. And if they're trash, well, I never saw any of it. You never heard from it. I didn't have time to get to them. It wasn't on my board. Of course not. No, no, no, no, no. Bryce Young, never heard of him. Not on my board at all whatsoever.

We're going to check in with all those second-year quarterbacks, and it's going to be a good time. But let's do the rookies first. Let's talk about the rookies first. Who do you want to talk about? We got Bo Nix. We got Jayden Daniels. We got Caleb Williams.

Where do you want to start with this one? Is there one that was more compelling than others when you watch the tape? Probably Jaden Daniels, maybe. All right, let's talk about it. Because he, it's interesting with Jaden Daniels. I feel like there are going to be growing pains, like with all these guys, but they're more unique, I feel like, than the other guys. Where with Jaden, he's dropped into an NFL field

and he's still the same electric runner that he was on the college level that he can always fall back on, whether it's trying to convert on third down, what he could do in the red zone or the goal line, but also a passing offense that is going to go through growing pains and needs work. And a guy that I saw on tape is, you know, when the rush comes,

it's so fascinating to me, guys, that are so gifted that in a way they can actually form some habits because they're so gifted that they might have to break in the NFL. They might not. Lamar is kind of the outlier because Lamar could just run away from everybody all the time. It feels like where with Jaden, it feels like you could do that a lot. But in this game, I did see a few times where he dropped his head at the rush and just go into escape mode.

But if he had just held on a second or two longer, there's someone open, usually in the middle of the field where you could just throw it. And in this day and age, you don't even get hit anymore when that happens. And if you do get hit, it's 15 yards. So it's just a totally different era in terms of, you know, hitting quarterbacks after they throw the ball. So he was an interesting watch because a lot of the past game production was in garbage time. Like the Bucks really ran away with this game.

A lot of that was on the commander's defense, which is not very good, especially on the back end. Baker had a field day, throws four touchdowns. But with Daniels as a whole, I saw some of the things that made him a really promising prospect. But I think right away there was the things that you look at and go, that's going to be such a focus for their coaching staff, is getting him to throw the middle of the field, trust the middle of the field more, get the ball out when things are hot right away,

and not always be looking to run away and make the big play because the way teams are going to have to defend him, there are going to be guys open because of how gifted of a runner he is. Honestly, full context included, I was super impressed with Jaden Daniels. I was really encouraged by this first game from him. It's a tough test going up against Todd Bowles on the road that starts the season and Bowles is going to pressure you. There's no doubt about it. And Washington's offensive line,

they were okay. They weren't as bad as some people were thinking that they could be in this game going up against a aggressive Bowles defense, but they certainly pressured Daniels. Now, I think the main takeaway for him as a passer is something that you mentioned. When he had to move off of his spot, and especially when he had to get outside the tackles, he did not in any way keep his eyes down the field. The ball was here immediately. And there were a couple of times when if he still had that passing mentality, there were guys that were coming at him while he was still behind the line of scrimmage where he could have just kind of popped it over their head and you get a couple of yards there.

So those plays did exist. But dude, you talk about Lamar being basically the only quarterback who can sort of get away from people. Jaden's not far behind he's really not he can win the corner in a in wild fashion against NFL Defenders obviously as a Bucks fan myself I'm watching every snap of this game when he takes off to run I'm almost like holding my breath because I don't like is he about to run 40 50 yards on him or what like that's sort of the speed in which he was running it made you feel like this dude is a threat not just for a first down but a touchdown all the time when he was able to tuck it run so you don't want to coach that part out of him no

so make you special right exactly but you do need to sort of get his eyes to remain downfield you mentioned hitting over the middle of the field i also also thought, you know, McLaurin specifically, a lot of people talked about McLaurin's lack of production in this game. And some people kind of were blaming Kingsbury for it. There were definitely opportunities and even throws that Jaden made to McLaurin that were not accurate because he just doesn't have the speed down yet. Regular season speed is a lot different than practice and preseason speed. And I think that Jaden was learning that on the fly in Tampa Bay. But man, again, all things considered, you wanted to see a player who, we've talked about this before on this podcast.

When do you start a high first round rookie quarterback? And the way that I feel is you start them when they are comfortable enough and confident enough to fail and then take those failures as learning lessons, not as like hits to their ego and their confidence. And I felt like Jaden's, I feel like Jaden's at that point right now where he's going to be learning. And it's not this man.

Am I good enough to play in this league? Because the handful of plays that he had against Tampa, there's no way he makes those if he's hesitant about whether or not he could play in this league. So I actually was pretty impressed with Jaden, albeit through a day that you know it wasn't perfect and you know it could get better. I thought it was a good start for him.

Yeah, right? You have to evaluate these things on a curve where, I mean, these guys are in their first NFL game and they've had such little time to marinate because of the way training camp and the preseason is now that if a lot of their college warts are still there out of the gate in the NFL, that's not shocking at all,

or even if they're amplified. But yeah, I think he's one of those guys where if he starts to commit to a few more quicker throws and still keeps that rushing element, then he's going to be that much harder to defend. I did laugh on one of the runs he had. He just like nose dives like a helicopter crashing instead of sliding he like rolled forward it was it was a good run and he knew he was not he's like i'm not getting tackled which is a good sign no need to get tackled in the middle of the field but instead of sliding he just did like a somersault it's like it's like the it's like the new black ops 6 animation where you're just like you're just diving off of the second floor of the building it really kill it was on some assassin's creed nonsense it really was but it made me laugh at

least because it's just so typically him you want to move to caleb williams because he's caleb williams and he was the number one pick and i think this one maybe this performance will be more scrutinized in a weird way because he'd never gotten garbage time opportunity like Jaden did. They did win the game despite getting really no production through the air. Full transparency, Trevor, I'll keep this one quick before I toss to you. I just thought he looked kind of jittery in this where he was,

he was aiming the ball a little bit more than we're used to rather than throwing the ball. Noticeably, that's a really good way to put it. It felt like there was just times where he was just aiming it because jitters are your first game and i want to give the titans credit for this too when watching caleb something i noticed with tennessee and this might seem simple but they still deserve credit for it they were so prepared for him to spin out of the pocket or do his turn his back to the defense and roll out of the pocket that it felt like when they were coached to when he does that, there was always a defender at the second level of the field that that was their green light to go at him. Where like as soon as he turned to the back of the defense, they almost always seem to have a defender that I wouldn't say is spying him, but just kind of sitting in zone.

And what they were almost coached to do that where Caleb's used to the pack, the rest in peace, the pack, he do that, get away from the crashing defensive line in ridiculous fashion. And then he just had 20 yards east to west that he could just kind of hang out and then flick the ball down the field. Tennessee was like, we are never allowing you to do this. Whenever he does that, somebody better get their ass up to him. By the time his back is, by the time he does another 180 and is facing the defense, somebody's bearing down on him that he has to make a decision. So that's what he's going to have to deal with at the NFL. And I thought it was really good coaching and it made it, it made it tough for him to make those spectacular plays.

Yeah. We were watching USC Caleb Williams trying to play in the NFL this past week. And I actually think that this game was the perfect game and for what Caleb Williams needed. And I'll get to that in a second, but I agree with you. I think that Caleb's inconsistencies showed up more this

past game not because i think they were new but because college defenses really didn't make him pay for it right there were there were too many throws that we saw this past week where the footwork was was not aligned with where the throwing motion was releasing the ball. You mentioned it was almost just like he was forcing it more than he was actually naturally throwing. It made me think of, you know how when you play cornhole, or wait, do you guys call it cornhole or do you call it bags? Cornhole. Okay, all right, all right, all right. So Midwest people are the only people that call it bags. I was going to say, I was wondering what the regional differences are.

It is bags in the Midwestwest renner calls it bags like when we would go when we would go tailgating when we all used to still live in cincinnati whatever he'd be like all right who's bringing bags i'm like bags of what i've definitely heard that but you're right it has to be a regional thing i feel like the northeast and the south clearly call it cornhole yeah comment on the show do you call it cornhole or do you call it bags let's start a war and and no and state where you're from and your height and weight yeah actually yes please do that we actually need you to do that that would be hilarious if the comments were flooded with that um what college you went to no no no don't get people too much

because now they won't do it now your linkedin's ruined your linkedin's ruined oh no you know okay so back to my analogy you know how in cornhole and you're playing it and it's like when you watch the pros when you watch like you know sometimes they'll be on espn at the ocho and you'll like see them have cornhole on they don't miss it's it's the same throw every single time but for me a very recreational cornhole player you know sometimes i might be you know the arm might come across the body a little bit sometimes i'm like i'm forcing it a little bit like it's almost like i'm trying to stop in the follow-through because like one throw went good like that so i'm trying to do it again i don't know so launch angle so that kind

of felt like when i was watching caleb williams i was like really spot on i feel like he's playing cornhole right now the arm angle was different each time you know the release point felt a little different each time it just it was not repeatable and again that worked at usc it's not really going to work at the nfl level and i think you saw a couple of passes that were going to keenan allen that could have been a little bit more accurate where that was the case. Now, I don't know how much of that is necessarily Keenan versus Caleb, but that was sort of my conclusion there and how he was playing. And when you look at the statistics, he left a lot of meat on the bone. 14 for 29, only 93 passing yards, only had 15 rushing yards.

So he was really figuring things out. And the reason why I still say that this was the perfect game for caleb williams connor is because he played like crap and his team won the game yeah when's the last time that's ever happened in his career probably never probably peewee football right because i want to have like a fever or something because I guarantee he was the star of his high school football team. And we certainly saw whether it was at Oklahoma or USC, if he didn't put up 50, they weren't going to win. So Caleb had the opportunity this past weekend to sit in his locker after the game, exhale and go, we still won. We still won the game. And that's why I actually think this was the perfect way

to kick off Caleb Williams career because he needed this. You talk about bad habits that you develop. He needed this. He needed this mentally to understand, Hey, the playing field is more even here than it was in college football. I don't have to be this crazy Superman, which is what we all talked about during the draft process. So I thought it was just what the doctor ordered for Caleb Williams in this game, despite what the stats will tell you. Right. He didn't turn the ball over. They tried to get him a little comfortable with some screens and the commanders did the same thing with Jaden Daniels. Brian Robinson made some really nice plays in the past game. And that's how you want to get a guy settled in.

And that's not going to beat within one game. It's going to take some time. The last rookie to start a game was Bo Nix. He had 42 pass attempts, 51 dropbacks. So he by far led the group, not only of the rookies. Jayden Daniels had 34 dropbacks. Caleb Williams had 33. But even the second-year quarterbacks, Stroud and Bryce Young and Will Levis all had 38.

And Anthony Richardson had 24. Bo Nix had 51 dropbacks, Trevor. I think Nix was top five, maybe even top three in total dropbacks. The only one off the top of my head that I can remember that had more is Deshaun Watson at 56. Oh, my goodness. Yeah, a lot of pass game for the young but experienced quarterback, but not an offense that really pushed the ball down the field.

A offense that threw, he had uh it I want to make sure they're right he had five scrambles I was making sure I wasn't screens that watching Knicks was interesting they had him cutting the field in half it felt like almost every other play he was constantly rolling cutting the field in half I thought I think at times that helps it's something when you know a young quarterback is really struggling or you want to simplify things it can really really help especially if they're athletic there was times in this game that i thought they did it so much that the opposition they basically were cutting themselves short a player like they would have

a player go to the back backside and the defense would just ignore them because they're like no nicks isn't throwing this all the way across the field the play is cut in half right so then they were then they were playing man down and it ended up actually hurting the offense so i found that really interesting i'm not calling it egregious that they they did this i just thought they did it so many times that against a defense like Seattle that it's Mike McDonald, they're going to play with a lot of team speed.

They're going to throw a lot of different things at you that it started to hurt them in this game. And specifically him. It felt like it was also just, you know, it was a big time Mike McDaniel respect game, in my opinion. McDonald, yes. McDonald, sorry. YeahDaniel respect game, in my opinion. McDonald's, yes. McDonald's, sorry.

Yeah, respect game for how well he game-planned what Bo Nix was going to do. There were a couple of throws that were very uncharacteristic of what we saw from Bo Nix at Oregon, which— I agree. Like, inaccurate throws that he never missed in college? Not even that, but even just some of the attempts. I'm like— Oh, the interception

at the goal like yeah maybe peyton's telling him like hey just just take a chance at it like the sudden the sudden interception at the pylon he's kind of fading away from pressure when he threw that ball i wonder if he was trying to throw that ball mostly out of bounds and say like, Hey, either my receiver gets it or nobody does. Yeah. And he just threw it short. Yeah.

I wonder if that's what he was thinking, because there were too many of those throws. And when I say too many, I mean like probably three or four that I watched throughout the game where I said, Oregon, Bo Nix doesn't throw that ball. Is Peyton just sort of telling him to throw it?

The mistakes were a little perplexing there for Bo Nix. I will tell you this, though. As I went back and I watched all of his throws, he did not have enough respect for NFL safeties. He did not think that Julian Love or Rayshawn Jenkins could get to spots that they absolutely got to and either broke up passes, got into throwing windows, or were able to intercept outright.

He did not have enough respect for them because there was a specific play. Oh, it was the interception at the sideline. The vaunted Adam Archuleta. Oh, no. Before the ball was the interception at the sideline the the vaunted adam archuleta oh no before the ball was even out of his hands it was that play where if you watch the sideline all 22 angle the it looks like pre-snap the secondary looks like they could either be in cover two or they could be in quarters right and it ends up being cover two and as nix is watching this play develop there is a deep post and then there is a crosser underneath yes

it's a common concept in the nfl and ray sean jenkins mid-play points and yells something out to Julian Love to let him know, I've got the deep post. Don't follow it. Don't fall for it. Stay where you are. I've got this because he's coming into my zone. And there was zero hesitation from Julian Love to stay where he was and then go immediately start to undercut where that crosser was. And Nix, he shouldn't have thrown the ball in a couple of ways. But I think he was like, okay, in college, the safeties either aren't good enough or don't communicate well enough where this deep post is going to take that safety on that side of the field. There's no way they're going to come back underneath this

route. And he threw it as if that wasn't going to happen. It absolutely did. And it ended up getting intercepted. So to me, a big takeaway for Bo Nix, which, hey, you know what? I like the rushing touchdown at the end of the game. He showed, you know, the dude's never going to quit. I think that he's only going to get better in the NFL. But to me, it starts with the next couple of weeks. Man, you got to watch this tape and you got to understand nfl safeties are built different like these dudes are different and you have to respect them a lot more than he respected them when he was playing the seahawks but uh again hat tip to mike mcdonald got it right that it does it's really trippy one's an offensive mastermind the other is a defensive mastermind yeah people are gonna be like oh it's not spelled the same yeah i know but i you say it the same it was an audio medium they're both mikey mack i'm not writing a book

no it's yeah it's tricky it's definitely trippy also by the way on that play what did they do they cut the field in half it's like and i i get i'm kind of feeding a fed horse here but like it's it's just that you're it's second and ten the depth of the pocket's insane it's like a 12-yard drop back he doesn't have the strongest arm in the world right and you cut the field in half and what did seattle do well they had literally three defenders there because of what you said yes they had the linebacker uh flowing way, the safety that's going to undercut it, and another corner undercutting it? Yeah.

Yeah, because it was the underneath corner in cover two. Yeah. There's three defenders there, but the one that's the most egregious that he missed is the safety because he just did not respect that Julian Love would ever be there. And it feels like mid-release, he sees Love, that safety coming down. Because otherwise, he would throw this ball over the two underneath defenders.

But he ends up throwing it in front of the receiver to the underneath defenders. So there's just nowhere to put the football. No. There's just nowhere to put the football. It was a tough day for Knicks. Watching this, and full transparency, I wasn't the biggest Bo Knicks guy, and everybody's piling on him now. When I watched this offense, I came away more looking at it like,

it doesn't feel like he had much of a chance, to be honest with you. I didn't think the line was very good. I thought Mike Mc—I just almost did it. Mike McDonald, that's crazy. What are you doing? Your toxins are wearing off on me. Oh, man. I thought Mike McDonald had a great game plan.

I'm just making you a worse football analyst one show at a time, baby. You love to say it. That's what a partnership is all about. I thought he coached circles around Peyton, and I didn't think the Broncos line was very good. It's funny. Bo had a really bad day, but one or two throws he had that were really good.

It just seemed to go through. I think it was Cortland Sutton, like a basketball hoop, which how many times do you see that? That's just when it rains, it pours. Yeah, it was. It was, I, it was just, it was a bad day for everyone on the Broncos offense. It was not a good day.

It was the third and six in the second quarter. I'm pretty sure it's Sutton just cutting across the middle of the field. And it's a throw that would have a first down by almost 10 yards. And it's not perfect, but it just you don't see throws like that. Just go through Sutton's hands like a basketball hoop. That just kind of shows the kind of day Knicks had, which is a really, really rough one. A really rough day for that offense. They have somebody very tough this week. I feel like. I feel like they don't catch a break.

The Broncos? Oh my God. Yeah. Oh yeah. Well, you get fed to TJ Watt game two. What the hell? Oh, great. Good. Lovely. You love to see that. So we'll throw up a prayer for Bo Nix. You want to talk about the second-year quarterbacks here?

I do, but I have devastating news before we move on. Devastating? Devastating. Per Adam Schefter of ESPN, Broncos are placing running back Audrick Estime on injured reserve due to an ankle injury. Come on. Estime will now miss at least four weeks. That stinks.

Wouldn't he have one carry? Man. It's bad. I'll pour some out on this pod right now. This is a tough day for addicts everywhere. This is a tough day. Yeah. But we'll rally, you know?

Prayer circle. Minor setback, major comeback. You know? That's all it is. The Argic Estimate Rookie of the the odds are guesstimate rookie of the year slip still cashes oh yeah he comes off our ir in fact get in on it now right by low the odds are gonna be at plus 50 000 that's the theme of life always by low yeah it's true uh speaking of betting well it's touchdowns tutties take it into the house

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I want to talk about Anthony Richardson because I think he's one of my three favorite players in the NFL. Gator great. People forget. People do forget this. And you know what? They shouldn't. Because Florida fans need things to hold on to right now.

Yeah. And Anthony Richardson's success is definitely. That's all we have. they shouldn't because florida fans need things to hold on to right yeah yeah anthony richardson's success is that's all we have except for when we start to think about anthony richardson it just brings us down a dark road once again knowing that we only had him for one year and we should have had him for another that's fair but it all leads to dark eat arby's this doesn't seem personal at all. No, they're going to do great this weekend.

They're definitely going to be Texas A&M. Everything. Everything's fine. Yeah. Wow. What does this feel like for you? Connor Wegman against. Crash.

That's what it feels like. But you can't lose. The only way you lose is if A&M wins six nothing and Wegman has a bad game, but Florida still loses. Right? Yeah, I have to have something to hang my hat on this game, right? Wegman's either got to ball out or Florida bounces back. You need Wegman to ball out and Florida wins in a shootout.

Then you're playing with house money for the rest of the year. Graham Mertz comes back. It's just a five touchdown for five touchdown duel. They look like the future of the NFL. Oh, goodness. So Anthony Richardson. Yeah. Was this not the most Cam Newton game of all time? Hmm. He's

nine of 19 for 212 yards. Damn. Alec Pierce is just running under bombs like they're12 yards. Damn. Alec Pierce is just running under bombs like they're punts. Jeez. It was the best throw of the week, by the way, the touchdown. It was the best throw of the week. Dude, that's one of the best throws I've ever seen.

I agree. That's one of the best throws I've ever seen. I know you were trying to be kind and didn't want to be too hyperbolic there. But the man slips, slips is flat-footed it's 70 yards in the air and straight under alec pierce's hands it's really unbelievable honestly just unbelievable he he could just do the reason he's one of my favorite players in the nfl is because you just truly never know what the hell is going to happen when the ball is snapped he can tuck it and run he can throw it a mile the ball could be air mailed it's it's absolute chaos at all times but richardson is kind of putting the whole theory to test here about sometimes you just draft the freakiest human being and just figure it out and you deal with the shortcomings because they're so different than everyone else that the highs, the splash plays can win you the game. And I know they lost, but they easily could have won this game.

And no coincidence, CJ Stroud was on the other side of things. Yeah, big part of it, obviously. I just think that he was such a fascinating evaluation because I look back at that, right? And I had him as QB3. I thought he was justifiably a top five pick. And we're going to talk about Bryce Young on this show. And just talk about two totally different pathways of evaluating quarterbacks where there was so many things from a mental perspective and command perspective that made Bryce such a good prospect at the time.

But Richardson being so physically gifted, not just as a runner, but as a thrower on big plays, not with consistency. It's just totally different dynamics of evaluating, and that's why I'm so obsessed with the two pathways they're going down right now. It's unfortunate. I hope it improves for Bryce, but it's just very interesting to evaluate. Yeah.

No, there's no doubt. Look, the notes that I have on him after watching his game, the flashes of top-tier quarterback play is tier one stuff. Right. You can even take out the 70 yard bomb to Alec Pierce. The, what did he, who did he rip it to?

Who was that one over the middle? Who was the second touchdown? Second touchdown. Who was that? I forget, but it's, it wasn't, it wasn't like it was because he's filling in for Josh Downs.

Yes, okay. So you watch that throw. I can't remember if it's the linebacker or if it's a safety that's sort of like down a little bit in a robber role. But he rips this ball so fast. That defender was like, I'm good. There's no way he's hitting this throw. And then he did. He actually can't believe the ball's not like through his chest.

The way the defender reacts. Yes. He sees it coming and he thinks he has time to stick out his hands. Yes. And the ball just goes right through. It looks like it's thrown 120 miles an hour and those are the things that when you talk about these prospects and when we talk about tools and who you can get excited about and and potential ceiling like that's the stuff that we're

talking about of people go why was anthony richardson drafted in the top five he was never consistent he wasn't a long-term starter why did you get your percentage what'd you say completion percentage he was throwing our faces about him all the time that throw is why anthony richardson goes in the top ten yeah because who gives a if you're nine to nineteen when you make throws like that seriously you're right you are right and you know i thought in particular what actually was the biggest takeaway for me, outside of the big arm, which we already knew he had. Connor, his fundamentals in this game looked night and day better than what it was in the preseason. You remember when he played in the preseason? Yeah, he was all over the place. He was like, oh boy, what's happening here?

I was legitimately worried. I thought we were going to have to retire. I'm not going to retire. I'll get this thing rolling. No misses can hurt me. I was really worried for the preseason because his fundamentals were all over the place. His footwork was terrible. His follow through was not consistent.

And I was like, oh boy, are we regressing to what he was like when he was at Florida? Because it seemed like he was really taking some positive steps before he got hurt last year with the Colts. Against the Texans, I mean, he's got beautiful pocket movement. The feet were light. They were always pointed towards the target. His shoulders were square. Dude, I thought he had fantastic fundamentals against the Texans. And that was the most encouraging thing for me. So I really did love that part about him. He is still reading defenses post-snap.

There was a play in particular, I believe it was the first third down that he faced in the game, where he's throwing the ball to the outside and it was an A.D. Mitchell throw. It was one of those throws that he faced in the game where he's throwing the ball to the outside and it was an A.D. Mitchell throw. It was one of those throws that he didn't end up connecting with Mitchell. And it is an outside comeback, like a very quick comeback, just past the sticks for him to throw to very quickly. Jalen Petrie is up at the second level, the safety for the Texans. And he is, the second the ball is snapped, Richardson looks to his right where he knows he is going with the football. Petrie immediately starts sprinting towards the flat to try to cut off this ball.

And the only reason why he didn't is because Richardson threw it at a million miles an hour. But what was happening in the area that Petrie was then vacating was there was a wide open slant that was right there that was within Richardson's cone of vision, but he wasn't really the primary on that play. And I hate getting a little too nitpicky with this because some people will look at the tape

and they'll be like, well, that guy on the backside was wide open. Why didn't you throw it to him? And they could be not even in the progression at all whatsoever. I have to stop you right there. And I'm so glad you just said this and i want you to get back to this as soon as possible but we are now living in a world i don't know why i didn't notice this until this week the nitpicking of tape now and it's it's not because it's so readily

available but partially i constantly see that trevor this guy's wide open it's so readily available, but partially. I constantly see that, Trevor. This guy's wide open. It's a screen grab. It could be like the fourth look. Right. The guy's not even a part of the... It's out of control right now. It's out of control. I'd get right back into it, but I'm glad you said that.

It needs to be really illuminated, because it's really insane how often I see that. Especially for young quarterbacks. They're not seeing the field like peyton manning right and obviously like i didn't i didn't play quarterback at any level or any high level or any low level or whatever so this is just sort of like what i've learned by watching the game and scouting and all this kinds of stuff so you know there is a difference between being able to recognize things pre-snap and also like a guy just not being involved in the play right for richardson and this one specifically again maybe it was something where steichen was saying 80s wanted to come back just throw the ball to him like that's

like maybe it is that simple but there is a player that is in his cone of vision. Shout out to Madden 2007 for the vision cone. The vision cone. Great idea in theory. In theory. Ended up being terrible. It didn't work out quite. I was trying to sign all of these really fast quarterbacks to be mobile,

and the cone of vision was a needle. You throw the ball into the stands that kid had to branch out of a barn um but he's just got to get better at i think recognizing those little things of going off script a little bit and it's it's a balanced i think that he'll get but i i honestly was very encouraged by richardson's day they didn't win the ball game but he showed high-end flashes of what he could be as a franchise quarterback and i thought that he played very very well i connor i don't know if touch is ever really going to be a big part of his game i just don't say no you know it's just something where like you know for for a couple of years now i think we've watched the tape and we've been like

well you know if he cleans up the fundamentals or you know he'll get that in time i don't know if that's ever going to be the case you are just simply going to have frustrating touch pass misses with Richardson in his career. I mean, you hope that the good just outweighs the bad when it comes to that. If he starts throwing with a little bit more touch, he's going to be basically Josh Allen? Well, that's the ceiling because Josh has transformed himself into it.

Josh, I never thought in a million years he would throw with any touch. And he still has his moments, but he can now. Right, he can now. He's also one of the greatest runners at the quarterback position that we've ever seen. It's a totally different way than Lamar and Vicks of the world and guys like that. It's just unique running style. that we've ever seen. Just totally different way than Lamar and Vicks of the world and guys like that.

It's just unique running style. But yeah, good stuff on Richardson. A very fun player to watch, a very unique player to watch. And where do you wanna go next? There's so many, what a wild group of players here. Anthony Richardson, Will Levis, Bryce Young, and CJ Stroud. Well, you brought up Bryce sort of in how you are sort of like comparing and contrasting sort of where their careers have gone. So let's do

Bryce next. Bad, right? I mean, like there's no way around it with Bryce. And I'll say at the very top here, the Carolina Panthers are not a good football team. They weren't a good football team last year. They made some additions, which I liked this offseason, but they are not a good football team right now. They just lost maybe their best player. And they just lost their best player in Derrick Brown, which I am worrisome for this Panthers team, which shout out to Panthers fans who are listening. This is your safe haven.

This can be your home. We will talk NFL draft for you throughout the entire year year however long that you want to rock with us anytime that your team on the field might be hurting you you know come on in we'll welcome you in there's refreshments in the back we're all hanging out it's a good time a little pool party hopefully you brought your trunks we're going to talk nfl draft it's going to be a good time um bryce young 13 for 30 in this game 161 yards two interceptions final score 47 to 10 and uh somehow it was worse than the score even indicated and really was i i want to i want to have you kick it off but i don't know how you felt i thought the film was even worse than watching it live which i agree sucks to say but what would you think about bryce i think he's still playing with no confidence

yeah i think that when things go bad with him they unravel to a point of no return. Like you look at, I think the second drop back of the game and the pressure is not too bad. But instead of stepping into a clean pocket, because he could step up against the rush, the interior protection is fine. The edge rushers are kind of rushing wide, but he has no confidence. So he doesn't step up into the play. He kind of throws off his back foot. No, not kind of. He completely does. There's no lower body in this throw.

And he just air mails what should have been a completion over the guy's head to, you know, that would have been about a 30 yard completion. He just air mails it. Yeah. And it's the second play of the game but i think it really encapsulates where he's at that there's just no confidence for him and he still gets hit on this play it's ironic to me it almost feels like he's not confident enough to step him to the rush maybe because he doesn't want to get hit or he doesn't trust the line whatever it is but if he stepped

him to the rush not only would he have been able to get off a more accurate throw but he wouldn't have got hit and instead he gets hit and that's just to me Trevor kind of tells the whole story right now that when there's opportunities there something mentally or physically or both fails Bryce Young and the team's not good enough to miss on their opportunities yeah right even even his rushing touchdown was not confident i mean he he he's trying to like juke almost a defender in the open field like he's he's like falling over before he even gets to the end zone it's kind of like a miracle that he scored that and he just like not not even that rushing touchdown was confident from him now obviously like it's not like there weren't any good in the game he had a third and 17 rip and I think it was the third quarter that was a really nice throw to the outside of the sideline it's like all right

okay that's a really nice throw there for you Bryce but the big issue with him right now is how poorly he's playing and it's you have to go back to sort of his scouting report and none of his strengths are showing up and all of his weaknesses are getting multiplied. I'm glad that you brought up the differences between Anthony Richardson and Bryce Young because Richardson is also not perfect now. Richardson is missing throws that he shouldn't miss, yet he's still able to give you those monster plays because he is that physically gifted. Bryce doesn't have that.

So if Bryce doesn't win with anticipation and confidence and clutch factor and all of that, he can't win at all. That's the issue, is that the floor for Bryce Young is so low that as we are seeing all of these second-year quarterbacks sort of grow, where Bryce might be growing from is so much lower because his floor is lower as a player. It's really hard to watch and I hate watching it because this was a brilliant player at Alabama now was he a perfect player no took a lot of sacks that were his fault at Alabama still that we needed to get cleaned up uh there

were times when he wasn't able to challenge the field especially over the middle of the field the way he needed to and we certainly saw that against the Saints he just he he did not see defenders over the middle of the field that first interception that he threw should have never threw that football there's too many defenders who are right there should have never thrown it but I don't think he can see over the line of scrimmage over the middle between the numbers so you're sort of having a trust and anytime that you're blindly trusting and you get burned for it too many times with like Chinky Yaz over the last year it's going to be tough to continue to want to do that. So it's not going to get better for him until he's able to start

playing better. And that's why at the very beginning of when we started to talk about Bryce, I wanted to say the team's not good. Like the team is bad. You also have a guy who was a first time play caller last year at Canales who doesn't exactly have years and years of expertise and examples to be able to lean on. He's figuring it out too. And that's, I'm going to be honest with you,

a disaster right now. I would love for them to be the best thing for one another and get the most out of one another. But right now, with things going not good and you just lost Derek Brown for the season, you just lost your best player for the season, we're almost on panic watch here for the Panthers. How could you not be?

It was embarrassing. They were so bad in this game that Jake Hayner got a snap. Another second year quarterback. Or not a snap, he had a drop back. Yeah, now we're going to analyze Jake Hainer. 55.4 passing grade. No, but in all seriousness, I feel bad because I'm trying to figure out what you hold on to right now as a Panthers fan.

I guess what you hold on to is that it is one week. And I know people say, well, no, it's not. It's an extension of last season. You got to be fair to Canales and say this is one week but I just what you nailed it what made Bryce great was throwing with anticipation and being accurate and timing and he has no confidence to the point of all the things that made him great are now also a problem all of a sudden he doesn't look accurate at all at all and he's not do you think we'll ever see a quarterback his size ever go in the top three in our lives again because i i honestly don't know i don't think a team would do that and i think that people you know they'll bring up kyler murray naturally when you talk about bryce young but kyler even with them being of similar stature,

Kyler had so much better of an arm. Like, Kyler's 50 times the runner. He is 50 times the runner, for sure. But, like, even just arm strength. But you're right. Kyler's arm is significantly better than Bryce's. Yeah, his arm's nuclear. And Kyler is also a first-round for the major league baseball draft like that's a level of athlete we're talking about that will probably not come around i don't want to get i

don't want to get beyond hyperbolic with bryce he's got he's got the i but i will say these next five or six weeks are really really important they're really important for him because they have a veteran behind him and andy dalton and i don't think they're really going to make the switch because if bryce is not playing well then this team very well might be one in five, oh, and six, whatever. And you're probably just going to roll with Bryce for the rest of the season. It doesn't matter at that point, but we will revisit this, I think a month from now. And I hope the conversation that we're having is a lot different because if it's not different a month from now, when the draft order gets to start being more solidified

and we do our next mock draft and everything, you might be thinking about quarterback for Carolina no matter what. There's no way around it. Panthers fans will be thinking it. Then why wouldn't the draft? I don't want to get there yet. No, we're not there yet, but that was our takeaways from this game, and I really hope they could flush it and put some good stuff some good stuff out there i want to go levis or stroud uh i

actually do want to go levis next but before we get to him gotta remind the people this episode sponsored by our friends over at better help as an adult you make time to do you make time to learn new things as often as you like or was that something that you feel like you know you just don't do anymore kids they're always're always learning. They're always growing. But adults, sometimes we just lose that curiosity, right? Therapy can be a great way to allow you to reconnect with your sense of wonder because going back to school, if you will, that can come at any age. I've been doing personal therapy for over a year and a half, and it's been wonderful for me. It eventually started off with something I kind of needed help getting through, something I needed

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Cause I actually, this might be sacrilegious to say, I don't think Levis and Anthony Richardson are that far apart. Levis has the nuclear plays that we got to get rid of. You know, people talk about the one handed backflip throw that turned immediately into a surrender Cobra for a pick six. Dude, that wasn't even his only backhanded flip of the game. The other one just didn't get intercepted. So he's a wild man and we've got to

get rid of those just nuclear bad plays. But a lot of the same things that you talk about with Anthony Richardson and sort of where he is in his progression of his talent, the big arm, you know, being a great runner, a great running threat as well, being a fearless player, you know, how he can attack deep down the field. Like Levis brings a lot of those things to the table. And I want to be very clear, Richardson, even in his current form, not just like overall talent, like who'd you rather take? Richardson in his current form is still above where Levis is. But after watching Levis, they're not as far off as I thought that they were for both kind of having this sort of same archetype. So I don't know.

What did you think of Levis' day versus Chicago? Well, it's obviously brutal that his one big turnover like that was in the fashion it was. Gets memed into oblivion. He gets memed into oblivion. It loses them the game the bears offense has nothing going it was really the only way they could lose because you're right it wasn't extraordinary from levis he still has his misses he is a he's a very dangerous runner um dude and he's tough as that's what i who that's what i mean when he decides to run not

only does he have good build-up speed, he just turns into a fullback. He's jacked. He's really big. So that's the scariest part of his game to me right now. The touchdown throw is even kind of risky when you watch it. When you look at it on tape. No, it 100% was. You're like, man, there are some DBs in the league that they might grab that,

but could have picked it off with one hand. Right, but at the end of the day, it's a touchdown throw for him. It's the roller coaster that is Levis. I think my number one concern with him, because I know he could throw the heck out of the football, even though it's not always accurate like Richardson. I know he can be a tough-nosed, hard-nosed runner that can keep drives alive

and affect the red zone that way he just looks a little jumpy in the pocket yes that's my number one because people will just talk about the turnover and him being out of control and I that's always you know going to be the highlight worthy stuff or low light worthy stuff both ways but just like I'm talking about the consistency. He's a little out of control in the pocket. Like when he starts to feel the rush or see the rush, it's like, it's, you know, he's jumping around and he's somebody that mechanically really can't start

to lose himself like that. He doesn't have arm strength to hit any throw off platform, but he, when he's mechanically off the ball is going to fly or be under three, it just can go a couple of different ways. So that was the number one thing for me with him. Trev is that he's, he's just got to become a little bit more composed in the pocket and feel the rush.

It's all he truly watching. Will Levis just feels like somebody that's over caffeinated, right? Like he's got the jitters. That's what it's like. And sometimes the pre-workout high leads to sick plays. And other times it's like, dude, just dialworkout high leads to sick plays and other times it's like dude just dial it down from an 11 to an 8 and you will be fine that's kind of what it's like watching yeah put down the total war or the you know the whatever they're calling it these days like

jack 3d jack 3d then what is it like the beast you know like whatever the pre-workout is lose your mind become the wolf and you're like dude why i just wanted 100 milligrams of caffeine to wake me up it's been a long day i need a pre-workout sponsorship for this show so i can read any ad just in this voice you're gonna have ryan just like put in the flames and the explosions like as the as the we both turn into transformers but it's just but it's just like highlights of will levis but it's just like flames everywhere on the tape you know that's yeah that's what we need here look to wrap levis up here all I'm saying is I'm still very intrigued. He has to, if he can hone in his game and control himself just a little bit,

just eliminate the catastrophically bad plays, get those completely out of your mind that we're not even attempting those. And then like you said, the footwork, like just calm down a little bit. If we can hone in on that, I think this guy's got talent, man. He does. I'm still very intrigued by Will Levis, even after watching his performance, albeit a bad one, against Chicago's defense.

I think that there is room for him to grow and continue to be a starting quarterback in this league. Well, I think CJ Stroud is the perfect transition because he's already doing all the things we're talking about, right? When Stroud drops back, number one, everything just looks flawless with him mechanically in his drops all the time. And it's one, two, check down. Or, you know, one, two one two oh i could throw it deep or one two

okay let me shuffle and reset the pocket a little bit and now find the uh the kind of extended route right the improvisation it's and everything mechanically is always the same everything's the same with stroud that it's kind of the perfect guy to finish this conversation with because we talked about the highs of Richardson being enough that the Colts can win any game, even dealing with his lows. We talked about how Bryce is playing with no confidence. And because of that, what made him a good prospect is now all of a sudden magically gone. Levis is really the same guy he was in college, but he's so talented, but he needs to crank down the caffeine rush from an 11 to an eight. Stroud is just, it's like this, it's like this. And even

with, you know, I know he had some turnovers called back as a penalties, but on a snap by snap basis, the larger majority of him is just so much the same guy and the rhythm of throwing the ball and the IQ is off the charts in terms of operating the offense and different route concepts and understanding what windows he has against different coverages. Stroud is, he deserves all the hype and more. He is mentally and physically just so wildly impressive. It's, it's, it's really so i was trying to find a compare something to compare it to i don't i don't really know where to go with it because as a pure pocket passer he's he has those best moments of what golf has had in ben johnson's offense but i think he's

better as a quarterback just in terms of overall talent oh i would agree yeah so it's it's it's a very hard one to come up with a he he when he's at his best it's what makes Joe Burrow so great and I know Burrow has had a tough week one as he always does but that's what it's like but he might be more he might have a bigger he's a bigger arm I would I would agree completely look yeah CJ shroud's already a top 10 quarterback in the league oh it's right in ink he is I I already fully believe that he's a top 10 quarterback in this league and even his game against the Colts like wasn't his best game and i'm sitting here watching the first and second quarter i'm like dude he's giving you everything he's going through

reads he's giving you off platform throws he's giving you really good pocket management with field everybody catches the ball he spreads the ball around dude he can throw to any receiver he's got great touch he's got a big arm like obviously like the deep throw was under thrown and like i get i get all that stuff but cj stroud in this game against the colts showed you everything that you would want from a franchise caliber quarterback and to go back to the scouting part of this and kind of how we talked about him pre-draft stroud as a pocket passer as a pure passer if you will was the best in that class with bryce young and with anthony richardson and with will levis will, was the best in that class with Bryce Young and with Anthony Richardson and with Will Levis. He had the best passing film. There's no doubt about it.

The big area that I was worried about with Stroud, and it's funny that you brought up Goff, is how he plays under pressure. Because I feel like Jared Goff was sort of the floor for CJ Stroud. Because Goff is a very good pocket passer. He's a very good passer when things are clean. But when you pressure him, he doesn't like it. He unravels a little bit. The passing grade goes way down. The efficiency goes way down.

And that was Stroud at Ohio State. And so it was like, okay, is that player enough for me to draft over what I thought was an assassin's mentality with Bryce Young or just like the overall traits of Anthony Richardson and I ended up having Stroud as QB2 in that class and still a top 10 player but I was worried about how he played under pressure and you go back to that Georgia game the final game of his Buckeye career where he had his best performance under pressure and and throughout all draft draft season, we were like, okay, well, is that the real C.J. Stroud moving forward? Or is the last two years of evidence the real C.J. Stroud moving forward?

And, you know, sure enough, how he played against Georgia ended up being how he hit the ground running in the NFL. And now we are just seeing one of the best quarterbacks in the NFL and somebody that I think gives you a chance to win every single week and somebody who I think is going to take the Texans to the playoffs. And we'll see what happens in January later this season. But I'm unbelievably impressed by Stroud. And I just Houston's just got an absolute gem at quarterback now. Yeah, they got they got it all right.

You saw how the Pat, the threat of the pass with their three wide receivers opened up the run game for Mixon. Mixon had an incredible day. And what Bobby Slowick can do calling this offense. And they got a leader, a leader of men in D'Amico Ryans to be the front man for this entire operation. Texans are just in a really good place. And it shows how good I think Steichen and the Colts are

that this was a hell of a game and how neck and neck these teams are and how far this division has come because of the young passers in it. There we go. Some quarterback talks, some first-year guys, some second-year guys. Let us know what you thought of any of these players and then give us some Drake May thoughts, some Michael Penix thoughts. If you think that these guys should be in the game, obviously Kirk Cousins didn't look too mobile in week one.

Maybe they drafted Michael Penick. Maybe they were onto something. Maybe they're onto something here with this. Do you get credit? If you give somebody a billion dollars, a billion dollar mistake, do you get credit for also getting their replacement in the same off season? It's a fair question,

right? I think we should bring this up and talk about it later you know if kirk cousins finally if he actually can't run anymore right because it's to the point where like he's not just not mobile like aaron rogers like was not mobile for the jets but like at least they're calling play action for this dude they weren't even calling play rogers doesn't need his legs to throw no i know but like the kirk cousins does they didn't even dude it was and yeah so we're gonna dig into that a little bit more of what that could potentially mean for the atlanta falcons and maybe where their mentality was at when draft weekend came around

depending on how cousins played but let us know what you thought of these quarterbacks whether there's second year guys the first year guys whether we're overreacting underreacting whatever you want to say we would love to hear from you in the comments youtube.com backslash at nfl stock you change let us know if you call it bags let us know if you call it cornhole the height and weight don't include your college because then it's too much to type and then your linkedin's out there to get your comment but yeah you can also know if you're lightweight what pre-workout your preferred pre-workout oh it's too good we need a sponsor we do need that the people will rejoice when that actually finally happens i'll be incredible i'll start every show shooting a little dry uh no i don't know i don't know if i scooping never never kids don't do that do not do that kids

now we're a bad influence podcast no now we got to put the e for explicit next to the podcast great thanks a lot um look if you're audio only hit us up on uh instagram and uh twitter as well at tam bay tray at connor j rogers we're sort of kind of going along with this format where the Monday show is going to be a little bit more prospect-centric of the week, and then the Wednesday show, we're going to kind of talk about things around the NFL, look at the draft order as it continues to update

some draft outlooks for a lot of these teams, some team needs, things like that. And then Monday show is going to be a lot more of just that prospect shout-out. Hey, since Monday's show, which I appreciate everybody watching the first Monday show, we absolutely love it. We got a bunch of comments on like, yo, you got to check this dude out. I got a bunch of DMS about that. Keep that stuff coming all season long. I'm telling you the best way for us to really have a finger on the pulse of like guys that you are super excited about,

that we should take a look at that should be in the mock draft simulator that you can draft is when you guys comment on the show in the YouTube channel. It's the best way to do that. Also helps the algorithm of the show, obviously. So we would very much appreciate that stuff. Connor, got anything else before we get out of here? No, man. Fun week. It's good to be back on twice a week. We love it. We appreciate all the support. As we always say, let us know what you guys want to see. We'll be all over both the stock watches for everything going on in college football more nfl stuff it's only one weekend so we're a little bit of ways

away from fixing teams and some of your favorite franchises but we'll play all the hits yep we will play all the hits we promise as long as you guys let us know you know what you think the hits are i'm trevor sigma that's connor rogers thank you guys so much for watching and listening to the nfl stock exchange podcast we'll see you guys next week. Bye.