Nightcap - Nightcap - Hour 1: Jamal Crawford, Mark Jackson, Luka’s Lakers debut

Episode Date: February 16, 2025

Shannon Sharpe and Chad “Ochocinco” Johnson recap the top stories from the NBA season so far. Topics include former NBA-er Jamal Crawford joins the show to discuss Luka Doncic joining LeBron James and the Lakers after being traded for Anthony Davis, former NBA star and head coach Mark Jackson joins Unc and Ocho to give his input on the Luka/AD trade, Luka’s Lakers debut vs. the Utah Jazz and much more!03:55 - Guest star Jamal Crawford Discussing Luka Trade26:49 - Head Coach Mark Jackson talking about Luka Trade57:46 - Luka Debuts in Laker vs Jazz game(Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Volume #ClubSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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In the fall of 1986, Ronald Reagan found himself at the center of a massive scandal that looked like it might bring down his presidency. It became known as the Iran-Contra affair. The things that happened were so bizarre and insane, I can't begin to tell you. Please do.

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to learn more. Boost Mobile network together with our roaming partners covers 99% of the U.S. population. 5G speed not available in all areas. Without any further ado, we're now joined by three-time sixth man of the year. On April 9th, 2019, he became the oldest player in NBA history to score 50 points in a game. And he's also the first and only player thus far to score at least 50 points for four different franchises. And he's the newest analyst. He's going to be calling game for NBC next season.

The one, the only, Jamal Crawford. Jamal, how you doing, bro? I'm good. Thanks for having me, bro. I'm just, we got to say, we got to handle it. We'll deal with it. All right. The trade that happened last night.

Luka, a superstar beyond superstar, a global superstar. In his absolute, he's not even hit his prime yet, Jamal. He's 25 years of age. He's a five-time first-team All-NBA player, and they trade him for Anthony Davis and a first-round pick in, I think, 2029 and Max Christie. And in return, the Lakers get Luka, they get Max Kleber, and they get Markeith Morris, who was on the 2020 Lakers team that won the championship. So Lakers receive Luka, Max Kleber, Markeith Morris, who was on the 2020 Laker team that won the championship. So Lakers receive Luka, Maxie Kleber, Markeith Morris.

The Mavs get Anthony Davis, Max Christie, and a 20-29 first-round pick. Also, the Jazz receive Jalen Husser, a Scarafino, a 20-25 second-round pick, a 20-25 second-round pick via the Clippers. Jamal, when you heard this trade, I thought it was bull jive. I thought somebody had got hacked because there ain't no way the Mavs are trading Luka. But lo and behold, it is absolutely true. Luka Doncic is on the move. Anthony Davis is going to the Mavericks.

What is your assessment of the trade? Why do you think this trade happened? I'm with you, Uncle. I thought it was bull jive at first, too. I thought there ain't no way Luton's being traded. Like you said, all things accolade,

he ain't even reached his final yet. And if I'm a young NBA star, I'm not comfortable anywhere. Because if Luton can be traded

at this stage in this corner, where he's at, where he was going, anybody can be traded there. I said last year on Shaq's podcast, I said,

if I'm a Laker, I'm looking at trade every day. And people thought I was crazy. I said said LeBron is still your best player right now you gotta have better pieces to compliment him yes they wanted the bubble yes LeBron is still looking like he's LeBron so with that being said

I gotta get pieces I didn't know Luke was on the table when that happened who knew but if I'm LA I gotta take that beer I have to because now you're coming for the now and the future as LeBron says you know what I'm in L.A., I've got to take that beer. I have to because now you're coming for the now and the future. As LeBron says, you know what? I'm going to wear it down. I'm going to hang it up.

And the other idea is one, two, three, four years. You never need it. You have a bonafide superstar who has now reached his prime who other people want to play with. Nika is backstopping. So we know he's going to bring the Hollywood lights. He's going to fix Hollywood. Dang Hollywood. On the other side of Dallas, it's a perfect complement to Kyrie.

Obviously, it makes you more moved. They didn't trust the fact that they were going to have to give Luke almost $400 million. Whatever's going on with the college scene is really loud right now because now we're looking like, you know what? How do you trade me like this? How do you do stuff that we don't know about? You know,

I also, I mean, I'm curious. I'm thinking ahead a little bit. I'm thinking ahead a little bit. I'm thinking ahead a little bit. Obviously, it had to be something internally for them to trade such a great pair like that. Like both of you said, it's not even in its prime. So I'm looking forward to obviously the future because Kyrie can opt out in the summer. And what are the chances of Kyrie actually joining LeBron again? I'm assuming LeBron comes back next year as well.

And you have Luka, Kyrie actually joining LeBron again. I'm assuming LeBron comes back next year as well. And you have Luka, Kyrie, and LeBron. So for me, I think obviously that could have been an election. But Kyrie and Galvin have some type of faith. Like, you know what? I could have easily been Luka. Like I'm saying, my contract's up next year. They chose to stick with me. And if you look at how

Jason Pierce speaks about Kyrie, he's always speaking globally. He does everything you want. You pair with AD, that'd be a Kyrie another way. Kyrie's back to who speaks about Kyle. He's always speaking lowly. He does everything you want. You're playing with AD, that'd be a Kyle another way. Kyle's got to be the point guard. He's still in this prime. He's still doing numbers. He still makes it look easy.

You got AD. You got a bunch of money, possibly, with other moves being made. If I'm Kyle, I'm like, you know what? They stuck with me. And also, they believe they have nobody else want to be here for multiple years on the contract.

So you don't predict that type of stuff. Okay, I'm looking at it. And I've said this, everybody knows this is not right now. I called, I gave Luka the name Baby Bird because I thought he was that special. He was the closest white player I had ever seen to Larry Bird. Everybody knew Larry Bird was my favorite. But I always questioned. I said, he looked like he's out of shape.

I said, he looks like he's unconditioned. He looked like he doesn't take his training and his condition seriously, his training seriously. And he has some habits that, you know, if you look at Rick Carlisle, you got Luka. Guys don't normally say, nah, I'm good, and leave a superstar player that's only 22 years of age, Jamal. So there was something,

there was some things that was going on that wasn't being talked about. But if you know the game and you see, you're like, something ain't adding up. And then plus, Luka is scheduled, he was the first player that was going to be able to get the super max. Five years, $345 million. So basically $69 million

a year. Jamal, if a guy's unconditioned, he doesn't take his training serious, he doesn't take conditioning serious, and there's some other things going around, if I give him $69 million, Jamal, and he might have some power that we need to rustle

away from him. And if you hear listening to Nico says, he says something about culture. When I hear that, Jamal, I don't know about you, but my ears perk up. The culture means there's something behind the scenes that he's not happy with.

And like we all know, the one question in all the sports in life period, if you're an entertainer, are you better than your father? And Lincoln is better than his father, so that's why I'm shocked this happened. Even with all that going on, he's tuned, too. He can learn and mature.

He can learn to see how to really work the professionals. JP, he's got one of the best point guards ever. So that's the shocking, generally speaking, part of it is that he's not 28, 29, and not going to leave the spot. He's still not even in the spot. And so I will quit, and that's why this is such a shock. Guys like that, they don't be trying, hey, you don't build on this stuff until you get it out. We can soak them back because it's that good. The fact is, 22, all the bigs are finals.

All the finals are Olympics. Because you're 45, Jamal. 45, I'm sorry. The fact is, 25, still is a 25. Yes. It's still eligible for that, too. So that's great. But here's the thing, Jamal, and I tell Ocho this all the time

when we talk about it. They'll tolerate you until they can replace you. Once they got a deal that says, you know what? We can win right now. I like Kyrie and AD in the pick and roll. AD has never really had a guy this dynamic in the pick and roll. Rondo.

And you remember when he had Rondo in New Orleans? The numbers that AD put up? Well, Kyrie is a very similar point guard in the pick and roll. But for them to trade a 25-year-old that's five times first-team All-NBA, it tells me everything I need to know. I don't need to hear nothing else. They can say this or they can say that, but you know it had to be bad, Jamal, because everything that you said is absolutely true.

Because you say, you know what? His production is better than his problems. But they say, no, hell it ain't. His problems supersede his production. I have a question. You know, both of you could probably answer it better than I can. Obviously, I don't really understand how or the intricacy on why he's not eligible for the five-year, 345 Supermax. He got traded.

So simply because he got traded, it's in the contract letting you know once you get traded somewhere else, you're no longer eligible. You'd only get a four-year debt because he was almost like a bird, almost a bird situation. That was the team that drafted him. He had been this many times the first team all-NBA player. So therefore, a la Jasonason tatum a la jb so guys that have been there for particular what is it what is it like five like five what five

six years uh jamal yeah and then you're a first team all in you have to be a first team you have to be one of the uh all nba selections uh right last year too yes so he's done that so he was eligible five years 345 so think about that he would have been eligible to get another contract that was probably

going to be north of 400 million at the age of 30 I think that was an aha moment I think that's for real I think they were more scared if they gave

him that money and they couldn't do nothing with him at that point. He runs the organization totally versus right now. Like, you know, it's kind of lost since we've seen where this is going. And I think that might be part of it.

And they've, because here's the thing, Jamal, they believe that a lot of these injuries, these knick-knack injuries, is because of his condition. It's because of his training. It's because of his diet. It's because of a lot of things behind the scenes. We say this with Joel Embiid. We say this with Zion Williamson. Not to say injuries don't happen, but I believe, the Mavericks believed, a lot of these injuries are self-induced. You're not taking care of your body. It's being reported

at one point he weighed 270, 265, whatever the case may be. But Jamal, you know this. You played this game down there. You played it two decades. When somebody moves a player like this, we've never seen it. That would be like they moving Magic Johnson in his prime. They're moving Larry Bird, Michael Jordan in their prime.

25-year-olds don't get moved unless the behavior is so egregious, they say we just can't control it. 25 year old don't get moved unless the behavior is so egregious they say we just can't control it we see

what okay Maul your eyes and your ears are still even if you're not playing your eyes and ears are still

with the NBA do you know have you heard anything what the issue might be where this where it came to a head where they just had to get rid of him i mean let's just let's just take a step back and think about

when they went to the phone right lucas had a celebration beer my only guy that's so quick so you can't speculate that they're having to step behind the scenes that was just like you know what he's not changing what we want to to be. And if we get in this contact, it may be worse at this point. So sometimes the best way to see a person is not look. Because if you look, they don't get on their best behavior. So sometimes you guys say, let me just see how we move with that. Let me see if we got a check now. And this is with anybody, right?

Let me see if they are diligent with their professionalism. You watch them now just as much as you watch them tell it now. But going back to how this happened so fast, let's go back and think a little bit. Nico Harrison was Colby's vet. Rob Malik was Colby's editor. So you know they had a friendship and relationship and all type of conversations they had. So that's why

I'm likely to move so fast. And not get out. But here's the thing. This is what we know. Young athletes that hurt become old athletes that get hurt. And the worst thing you can have is an old guy that's got you owing $200 million, you owe $300 million.

Because I just read a thing the other day where they said Joel Embiid has made $125 million for the games that he's missed. You want that on Luca? You want Luca's salary? $345 million? And here he is. And they believe that those injuries,

a lot of those have been exacerbated by his condition. And you remember he was nursing a knee injury last year in the game, in the championship game. I mean, excuse me, in the NBA Finals. And leading up to the Finals, we're like, well, how long can he go on that look? So now, you hear culture,

you see a guy that has no interest in playing any level of defense not at all uh uh let me say something something got something got to give away you know everybody's gonna have flaws when you think about nba players hell even nfl players everybody has their strengths his strengths and his identity is on the offensive side of the ball so you know what you don't get from the defensive side of the end, but he's so great at what he's doing offensively. Hell, you got to take that.

So how do you like Mr. Luke? You are as athletic as anybody. How do you like him? I just don't. Here's the thing. LeBron is at an age he can't play consistent defense. Luka doesn't play any defense. You traded your two best defenders, your wing defenders,

Max Christie on ball and AD, your help defender on ball, can defend one through five. He's tremendous in the pick and roll. He's great at weak side help. Look, you got guys that can score, but who can they stop? Look, I understand. This is what the Lakers, and I've studied the Lakers, and I know the Lakers. This is what the Lakers, and I studied the Lakers, and I know the Lakers.

This is what the Lakers do. They got Will, because they love superstars. In LA, you got to have them. You cannot get them. You cannot survive as the Lakers without superstars. So they go get Will, and then they follow that up with Kareem, and they go get Shaq,

and they go get LeBron, and now they go get Shaq. And they go get LeBron. And now they go get Luka. You've got to have that if you're going to be LA. If you're going to be the Lakers. You look at the Dodgers. That's what they do. You see Shohei. You see Mookie.

That's what they do in order for you to survive out here. That's why they went and traded for Matthew Stafford, don't you? You've got to have a star. You've got to have stars. Aaron Donald. You got to have stars to survive out here if you want to win because there's too much going on in L.A. We got beaches. We got salmon.

We got rooftops. You got so much going on. And if you don't win, they're not coming to see you. But I'm telling you, I don't care. See, that's the notion that people make, Jamal, and you know this. A lot of times people say, well, as long as I'm doing my job, you shouldn't care about, no, no, no, no, no. It doesn't work like that because see, your job is being a professional. That's your job. How you conduct yourself while you're doing your job, that's called being a pro

and say, we don't like the pro. We love the professional because he's given us 29, 32, 34, nine and nine. We know what he can do, but that pro eventually will catch up with us. His behavior and the way he does things that say, nah,

we got to nip this in the bud. We got to break his plate at 25 because he's going to become unk. Bro, we let him get two years into $60 and $70 million contract. Hey, that joker might come in. Hey, he might come into the game drinking a beer. He might come to the game and smoking on hookah. Because we know Luka loves hookah now, Jamal. He loves hookah.

Luka loves hookah. And when you sit back and look at it, Rick Carlisle left. He refused a contract extension. He had Luka at 22-23. What don't you know would walk away from LeBron, walk away from a Magic Johnson, Larry Bird? That's what Luka's a comparison is. I'm not saying he's not won a championship.

He hasn't won an MVP, but that's what he is in today's turn. Ain't no coach walking away from that. Coaches might get fired, but coaches, because they know how hard it is to get one of those guys. Those guys, you don't, those guys like Luka, they don't come out in the draft every year. A LeBron, a Magic, a Bird, they don't come. So if I every year. Or LeBron, a magic bird, they don't come. So if I get one, I will keep this joke as long as I can.

As long as they'll have me, I'll stay. And that's why this is so shocking. Like, we have never, ever seen this. And it's so open-ended, and it was so shocking. All we can do is speculate. We don't wish nothing bad on nobody, but we got to figure it out. Like, that's our job to figure it out and educate people or give them

a little bit of insight on why this happened who knows if it's you know how they found his body would be fine like all that stuff

plays a part what's gonna happen is where he's going and where Anthony Davis is going and how the culture is going to change we're gonna see

in the next year or two how things lined up and we'll have our answer in the future I also think I think now he just lost $117 million Ocho, basically one year

it cost him $117 million now if that don't get your attention, it should have your undivided attention, now I don't know who makes $117 million a year, maybe some CEOs, maybe Cristiano Ronaldo,

maybe Mbappe, maybe some of them, but ain't a whole lot of players making $117 million in salary, Jamal. Ain't no one going to attack you. Just think about it. You could have been

in Texas, no state income tax. It's 13.5% in California. i don't know if you notice anything so 40 million they're gonna take 13 and a half percent that's 10 so they're gonna take four million to know three so they're gonna take by six million from you right there ocho on 40 hey hey listen let's say he missed out on 117, right? Whatever he missed out. Let's say he gets his stuff together. His stuff together. Gets on the right track.

Is it a possibility he can recoup that money on the back end in the next deal? It all depends. He's a big enough superstar that he can have deals outside because he projects. That's one thing. He projects globally. Right.

So, yeah, he can make that money. But you can't make up what you missed. It's kind of like time. Because, yeah, let's just say for the sake of argument, Ocho, he signs this deal with the Lakers. So, 117 minus 345. So, he gets 228. 228. 228.

228 cup money. Jamal, you remember with Boogie? Boogie missed out on what? 200 million? By getting traded to the Pelicans. And then he gets injured. Never saw

him pay that again. See, that's the thing, Ocho. You see, we're under the assumption, and we hope, we knock on wood, that nothing happens. But when you're continuously overweight, you put stress on your body, your body ain't used to that. Your body ain't used to being trying to go up and down that court on a nightly basis, Jamal. You know, at least two nights a week, sometimes three nights a week. When you meant to be 220, all of a sudden you're trying to play at 260. Something got to give, Ocho. Something got to give.

Made for This Mountain is a podcast that exists to empower listeners to rise above their struggles, break free from the chains of trauma, and silence the negative voices that have kept them small. Through raw conversations, real stories, and actionable guidance, you can learn to face the mountain that is in front of you. You will never be able to change or grow through the thing that you refuse to identify. The thing that you refuse to say, hey, this is my mountain. This is the struggle. This is the thing that's in front of me. You can't make that mountain move without

actually diving into that. May is Mental Health Awareness Month, a time to conquer the things that once felt impossible and step boldly into the best version of yourself to awaken the unstoppable strength that's inside of us all. So tune into the podcast, focus on your emotional well-being, and climb your personal mountain. Because it's impossible for you to be the most authentic you. It's impossible for you to love you fully if all you're doing is living to please people. Your mountain is that. Listen to Made for This Mountain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on good company,

the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. It's this idea that there are so many stories out there. And if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing,

technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In the fall of 1986, Ronald Reagan found himself at the center of a massive scandal that looked like it might bring down his presidency. Did you make a mistake in sending arms to Tehran, sir? No. It became known as the Iran-Contra affair.

And I'm not taking any more questions in just a second. I'm going to ask... I'm Leon Nafok, co-creator of Slow Burn. In my podcast, Fiasco, Iran Contra, you'll hear all the unbelievable details of a scandal that captivated the nation nearly 40 years ago, but which few of us still remember today. The things that happened were so bizarre and insane,

I can't begin to tell you. Please do. To hear the whole story, listen to Fiasco, Iran Contra on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee.

Your hands can't hit what your eyes can't see. Muhammad Ali was never afraid to express himself loudly and boldly and stays true to form in Ali and Me, an eight-part Audible original. Guided by his own words, this series explores Ali's life and legacy through never-before-heard audio recordings and discussions with those who

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Listen to Ali and Me, now on Audible. You got a Ferrari and you keep hauling logs on top of it, and you see what happened to it. That's like, oh, Chuck, Chuck, he gonna play me when I'm going to hit you in the coat. You can't play me. Hold on, you got to understand, I've been going five for 180 on McDonald's and cheeseburgers and fries and a Coke. So, you know, having to deal with you at my age

with the skill set with never having any injuries, that's easy work. Yeah, see, you was doing it at 25. They fries and stuff. Listen, listen, listen. Age ain't nothing but a number. The man created that. I know.

I'm 50 and 40 now. I know age ain't nothing but a number. I know that. Whenever you're ready, I'm here. That's all they got to say. They say that cool work from this time. They ain't working on me. Let me ask right. Whenever you're ready, I'm here. That's all they got to say. You see that cool work from this time? They ain't working on me. Let me ask you a question,

Jamal. Who do you think won the trade? I think Dallas won the immediate future. But as we get farther, I think the Lakers won the future.

And the reason being is, let's help with it. And as you know, like we've seen sometimes when we stand in his fault, and he's played in games over the last few years, but he's going to have a help with it. And as you know, like we've seen sometimes when he's there, and it's his fault. And he's played in games over the last few years, but he's going to have

a different workload now. Like you said, he's going to be involved in picking roles a lot with Kyrie. Luke Hill, that's a great transition for LeBron to make it

as a future superstar whenever LeBron decides he's had enough. Because you've got to have that role. So I think both sides have to learn it. It's just so weird.

The weirdness of it means everything. Because I just, who would have to end just so weird. The weirdest of them is everything. Because I just... Who would have guessed? Would you imagine doing something like that? No. Or being between Joe and him?

This is shocking. That's why I said, don't say something else. I think there's going to be more than that. I think it's going to be a shocking break that happens over this next time period.

I promise you. I think something's going to happen. And if you look at what Minnesota gave up to get Rudy Gobert. Yeah. Dallas didn't want but one first round pick.

I don't say give me 27. Give me 29. I want to pick swap in between and give me what you gave me. Yeah. Yes. That's how I got to be

because this dude is each generation. Luke is so good at fouls and balls. Luke would figure out a game the whole time he got it. When he's playing at times, he's not even playing against you. He's playing against your coach. Tim Jekyll got that quality. LeBron as well.

I'll get you on that. I'll expose him over there. Like, he's one of those dudes. The games, I've always said, he looks like he's got a hair comb on. Like he looks like a shop bear or something. He saw that piece with his binning that is crazy, but bad thing in the other way, you don't see. I can't wait to see it.

Three times sixth man of the year, the oldest man in NBA history to have a 50-point game, the only man in NBA history to have at least 50 with four different franchises, the one, the only, Jamal Crawford. Good luck next year in calling games on NBC. Jamal, congratulations. John, well done.

Hey, really appreciate you stopping by to offer some insight into this big trade. Appreciate y'all. Thank y'all. Give a shout out to my guy, the John T. Murray. We hope you see the team victory. We're rooting for them. Yeah, thank you.

All right, baby. That's all. Now we're joined by a former NBA Rookie of the Year, All-Star, former Warriors head coach, Mark Jackson. Mark, talk to us, bro. How you doing? Everybody's great, bro. We cannot complain, huh?

Huh? Hey, turn your camera on, Mark. He's trying to pull a shadow sharp audio on me how do I do that what do you say uh there you go

there you go coach what's up man you good what's up what's up, man? You good? What's up? What's up, man? You good? Happy prom for y'all.

Appreciate it, Mark. Mark, let's get into this trade, bro. It came out of nowhere. Normally, trades like this, it had to be a special type of relationship because you had to sit on it. Because prior to it dropping, there was no win, AD getting traded, nothing about Luca getting traded, and then boom, you're trading a 25-year-old, five-time first-team All-NBA player that hasn't even reached his prime yet for Anthony Davis, a first-round pick, and Max Christie.

Talk to us about the trade. You coached this game. You played this game. Talk to us. How does a deal like this happen? Well, we don't know the truth of everything. That's first and foremost. This is an incredible deal that was pulled off by Dallas Mavericks

and the Los Angeles Lakers, primarily Nico Harrison and Rob Palenka. It is, in my time of playing basketball, following basketball, coaching basketball, it is the most shocking trade pulled off without anybody leaking it, not anybody knowing anything about it. And then everybody that got wind of it thought it was a fluke. We thought it was a fluke. I got phone calls in a minute span saying, this can't be real. Can you confirm it?

I'm like, I don't know. I can't confirm it or not. It's shocking. Like you said, a 25-year-old guy, five-time first-team All-NBA, generational talent. One thing I would have done if I was Nico Harrison and Dallas Maverick,

I'm not minimizing it to Los Angeles Lakers and that one phone call. I am opening up the bidding for Luka Doncic, letting everybody know. Everybody's well aware of what he brings to the table. I am opening up the bidding for Luka Doncic, letting everybody know. Everybody's well aware of what he brings to the table. I got him assured.

Now, the best deal may be Anthony Davis and the deal they got from the Lakers. I doubt it. At least I would have made sure the Lakers opened their first-round

picks in. But at the end of the day, you can't underestimate he got an elite first-gallon Hall of Famer in Anthony Davis whose only concern is staying healthy. When he's on the floor, he's a dominant basketball player.

And I believe it helps both teams. The Lakers continue to add by adding a big. Both teams have a legitimate chance of winning it all. The Lakers, because they have two guys that can control a basketball game at all times on the offensive end. Dallas Mavericks, because they have a legit big man that prefers, from his own words, to play the powerful position. Now he has two young, athletic, energetic bigs to protect him.

And then you have a guy like Kyrie Irving, who's a special, special generational talent in his own right that can do some similar things as Luka and can carry them on the offensive end, create an offense for himself and his teammates. Heck, my former lead assistant, things as Luka and can carry them on the offense and create an offense for himself and his teammates. My former lead assistant, Pete Myers, who played for the Chicago Bulls,

the brilliant basketball mindset, a Hall of Fame, General Madigan once said to him, do not make a trade that can cost you your job. And that's what Nico Harrison did. But I give him credit because so many guys willing to just cruise along

I can win 20 games 30 games I could go to the lottery time and time I could be bad not got any excuse he swung for the fences and the only gamble

I think he gave up that home run talent but Anthony Davis has got to stay healthy and they'll be good for you know the foreseeable future Hey Coach

listen for someone who played the game for a long time, for someone who coached the game as well, as a coach, and you think about it, I just want you to put your GM hat on for a quick minute. What can a player do to the magnitude and where it's that egregious to trade somebody that young, that's's that spectacular and brings that much to a team especially from an offensive standpoint you got to talk to me just give just give me some give me some type of better context or context on what could a player do behind the scenes that could warrant such a trade for someone that's what makes it shocking to me i think that's a great

question and what i don't like is all of a sudden stuff come out that didn't come out all along. So let's be fair to him. But at the end of the day, the things we know about, he can be a better conditioned athlete. He can be better committed on the defensive end. He can have a better competitive fight and spirit defensively, not every fifth possession, every 10th possession. I could show you 50 clips of Luka Doncic more than capable of defending and having game plan discipline on the defensive end of the floor. I can show you 200 clips where he lays down, points the finger and blames somebody else. I would say to my ownership or my management that's interested in trading for Luka Doncic

because of those reasons, I would tell him personally, that's on me. He's interesting in trading for Luca, trading Luca Dots because of those reasons, I would tell him personally, that's on me. He's been in this league six years. I got to do a better job of bringing that out of him and holding him accountable, defending at a higher level, competing at a higher level, being a better leader.

And that, that would be on me. What about, go ahead, Ocho. Well, hold on. Well,

hold on. I'm, I'm, I'm confused. Now you think about what Luca is able to do from the, from the standpoint Well, hold on. Well, hold on. I'm confused. Now, you think about what Luka is able to do from the offensive standpoint, right? And one of the gripes, one of the issues that he may have is his lack of ability to play defense. But if he is a little bit better on defense, Coach, wouldn't that take away from his offensive potential? That sounds like a receiver that didn't want to block when it wasn't his chance.

That's what I'm talking about, Jack. That's what I'm talking about't want to block when it wasn't his chance. That's not my chance. That's not my chance. Get it. Get it back. Just because you're not going to you on this play doesn't give you a license to chill.

You still have the responsibility. And my job as a coach is to hold you accountable to that because it's not about you. It's about us. And other guys are watching. If I allow you to do that,

and because they're rolling one day, I allow them to do that. I'm not saying I'm holding you to the same standard. I'd like that in the ideal world. We all have kids, and that's not how it works. But I'm going to hold you to a standard. But I will not accept

in losing. I'm not going to... But I will not accept in winning. I'm not going to accept in losing. I got to say to you... Oh! You heard that before, Chuck? Have you heard that saying before, Chuck? I heard it. I heard it. I heard it because guys are watching. I can't now yell at you because, no, I've been doing this for five years.

Now you got a problem with it? See? You never accepted it. Hey, you never accepted anything in the win. You wasn't at a loss. But here's the thing, okay? Jack, you said it's your job to hold him accountable for a little bit more for the defensive end.

Are you holding yourself accountable for his unconditioned, his training, his eating? Absolutely. Guess what? I got to go see him in the offseason. I got to take a flight and go spend some time with him. I got to send one of my assistants, my player development coach, go spend some time with him.

I got to send a chef with him. I'm going to put you in a position to be successful. I don't want you to just chase down being a five-time all NBA team player

or generational talent. I want you to have the jewelry at the end of the day. I want you to be in that special room with those special guys that you deserve to be in. Don't just be in there

with just all, everybody else. You should, he should be, he's good enough and great enough to be in a room with just a handful of else. He's good enough and great enough to be in a room with just a handful of guys. He's that

special of a talent, and I'm cheating him if I fall short of holding him accountable and putting him in position to take away those credit. Jack, you can't... I tell my kids this. I can't want something from you more than you want it for yourself. And

you got kids, and you know they've got to want it for themselves as more than you want it for yourself. And you got kids, and you know they've got to want it for themselves as much as you want it for them. If Luka doesn't want what you want for him, it's not going to work. It just won't. That's true. But he is so special and so great. You can't convince

me he don't want it. You just can't. He's so special and so great. You average a 40 point triple double in in in in the playoffs you are the best play on in the eastern conference i mean the western conference finals you're the best player in the he he is a special special talent i'm not asking him i'm going to tell him i'm going to push the right button i'm not asking you something that i believe you can't do i'm not asking you to protect the rim and block shots. I'm not asking you to be a lockdown defender. I'm not asking you to

be 200 pounds. Let's meet somewhere in the middle where now it's acceptable. I'm not asking you... I just don't want you to point the finger to a guy wide open in the corner and you just stand there and you know that's your man and that's your responsibility. Everybody in the arena

knows that's your fault. That shit burned. That shit upset you. I'm not saying it hasn't happened to me in 17 years of playing basketball and in all these years of playing basketball. I got exposed at times on the defense, but I got upset about it. And I reacted to it and responded to it and held myself accountable. Listen, Cole, one more question. One more question. I'm thinking about the mental part of it, right? The mental part, as far as Luka's concerned. How is he going to react? How is he going to, is the trade, this is a wake-up call. Is he going to fold? Now, two things can happen. Most of the time, you think you're a player, you sit on top of the world, you feel like you're invincible, you know, you're making good money, you're one of the best players in the NBA. Now, all of a sudden, you get that call.

Oh, yeah, you've been traded to the Los Angeles Lakers. Now, what Luka are we going to get from this point going forward? Are we getting the pissed off Luka? Or are we getting the Luka that's going to fall under the pressure? We don't know that Luka that you're talking about falling under the pressure. All he's done in six years has been great. He's been a generational talent.

He's been special. What just happened? He got late. Exactly. Now, getting traded can do something to your mental now. It can do something to your mental. I'm talking about a different kind of pressure. Pressure playing and being comfortable in Dallas, knowing you're that guy, is different. I agree with you

with certain dudes, because I don't care where you put Tom Brady. He's Tom Brady in New England. He's Tom Brady in Tampa Bay. Luka Doncic, we're not going to cheat his talent and his level of greatness. He's a special talent.

I believe it'll elevate him conditionally-wise and fight defensively because he's got a guy in the locker room that's a hero of him that he looks up to. Now, LeBron James

certainly has his flaws at times, but one thing he does is take Kevin's body, and he's an all-time great. He's a special talent that if you just hang around, you've got testimonies from teammates, coaches. He's going to make you better. And Luka Doncic will be a better conditioned athlete

and a better defender, competitively speaking, because of being around LeBron James. That's one thing LeBron James will bring to the table, without a doubt. But you know what, Jack? I had a guy to tell me one time, he said, they'll tolerate you until they can replace you. Profession, Luka is a professional basketball player. It seems to me Nico Harrison had a problem with him being a pro,

which was how he conducted himself in being a professional basketball player. You don't – it had to get to a point, Mark, and you know this. Having played – Mark, you played, what, 17 years? Yeah. You played 17 years. You coached in this league in order for you to trade a generational talent because we've never seen it happen before. At 25, the behavior behind the scenes, it had to be egregious.

There's no other way around it, Jack. There's no other way. You're right. That 25-year-old generational talent, we've never seen him before unless he asked to be traded. That's a different ballgame. This guy didn't ask to be traded. He said he couldn't spend his life on the Dallas Mavericks.

So there is clearly something that made them pull the trigger and make the trade and pick up the phone and call Los Angeles. Like, I don't know what it is. That'll come out at some point. It'll come out. If it don't come out, they'll watch it. It'll come out in the reds. Yeah, he's too great of a player that you just decide

to pick up the phone. No, I can handle the... Think about it. When it's lack of defensive intensity for 48 minutes and it's lack of conditioning overall,

the dude was still a five-time first-team All-NBA player in six years. Yep. So, I'm going to live with some of that and try to make him better.

I'm not just going to pick up the phone on a random day and call the Los Angeles Lakers. So it's something that push the button to make them make this call. But Jack, my my internal raised where Rick Carlisle wouldn't sign the contract extension. You know how hard it is to get a generational player. They don't fall on trees. And a lot of coaches never get an opportunity to coach a generational talent. Rick Carlisle didn't accept the contract extension, and he had a 22, 23-year-old Luka. That should have raised the antenna.

But what really raised my antenna when I heard Nico Harrison say, culture. When you hear that, Jack, I know your antenna raised too. Because we see this with Zion. We believe his conditioning plays a role in his injuries. We see that with Joel Embiid. We believe his conditioning plays a role in his injuries. They believe, I believe it is my estimation, and I'm just looking at this from a distance.

I believe the Mavericks believe that Luka's condition or lack thereof, his training, his eating habits, play a role in those injuries. And I got to give you $70 million this summer for next summer for five years? Oh, no, Jack. I can't do that. Oh, I can do it. Oh, no. Oh, I can do it.

And you would do it too. The guy that's the top five player in the world. No question about his ability. The thing I got a problem with is we compared him, Joel Embiid and Zion Williamson, two guys that have a tough time staying on the floor. That's not Luka's issue. He plays hurt.

He plays hobbled. 100%. He doesn't take care of his body. That's conditioned physically. He doesn't come in shape his body. That's conditioned physically. He doesn't come in shape and camp, but he plays. He loves to play. Those other two guys have missed a substantial amount of game.

I think culture is the conditioning. It's how we act on the bus. It's how we act on the plane. It's how we act in the locker room. We don't know that story. I'll give you an example. Jimmy Butler. Report come out. Jimmy Butler had the plane waiting for an hour while

everybody was waiting for him. Are you kidding me? That's not on Jimmy Butler. That's on me. I'm not waiting an hour for nobody. That's what happened? That's what happened. The plane is taken off. We're leaving Jimmy Butler. Wait for Jimmy Butler and you're setting yourself up for disaster.

You're setting yourself up for a culture that allows that. No, we're going to set the tone right away when we're leaving this guy. And if he shows up to the game, he shows up to the game, we'll handle it then. What kind of president are you sitting with Luka? When you know he's out of shape, when you know he's not conditioned properly, when you know he's not conditioned properly, when you know he's not training properly.

The dude is averaging 30 and 9. He's the best player on the floor every night. So you got to find other ways to push the button to get him to respond. You got to pull him into office by yourself and talk to him. You got to pull him into office with Kyrie Irving. You got to pull him into office with the GM. You got to pull him into office with Kyrie Irving. You got to pull him in office with the GM. You got to pull him in office with ownership.

Bring in some former greats. Bring in Dirk Navisti. Whatever trick you got to do to push the button. No, whatever. We work every day. Whatever the trick is you got to do to push the button, your job, my job is to find that button and push it. Because he is great.

And he's an all-time great. But I want to put him in that special room that he deserves to be in. I'm not, like, this guy's view had to talk up to is great. And he's an all-time great. But I want to put him in that special room that he deserves to be in. I'm not, like, there's guys you had to talk up to be great. When he walked into this, he was great. You don't have to hype him up and talk him up. He's great from day one. So now, let's get you into that special room.

And it's something that you deserve. And you're cheating yourself. Forget about me. You're cheating yourself if you don't put yourself in the best possible position to get there. Does he want to be in that room? You want him in that room. Does he want to be in there?

Because if he wanted to be in that, Jack, all the grades that you mentioned, that's in the handful of guys. Did any coach had to hold their hand? Jordan, Colbert, LeBron,

Bird, Magic, Kareem, give me some more, Elijah Juan, the handful of guys that's in that room, did they have to be spoon-fed? Hey, Jack, you think the culture and where he comes from is a little bit different as opposed to all the guys that aren't just named

and they're pros to the game of basketball? Maybe that might be the issue. He might have something to do with it, but the dude was a pro at 13 years old. He's been a pro since he's been 13 years old. He's a special talent. And I agree with you with those guys that you named. But there's some guys, and I don't have them off the top of my head, but some guys had to be pushed along.

Some guys didn't love basketball, and they're not special enough. Jim Duncan didn't touch the basketball until he got into high school, I believe his junior year. He was a swim dude. He was an elite swimmer. Special role. Jim Dunley didn't touch the basketball until he got into high school, I believe his junior year. He was a swim dude. He was an elite swimmer. Made for This Mountain is a podcast that exists to empower listeners to rise above their struggles, break free from the chains of trauma, and silence the negative voices that have kept them small.

Through raw conversations, real stories, and actionable guidance, you can learn to face the mountain that is in front of you. You will never be able to change or grow through the thing that you refuse to identify the thing that you refuse to say hey this is my mountain this is the struggle this is the thing that's in front of me you can't make that mountain move without actually diving into that may is mental health awareness month a time to conquer the things that once felt impossible and step boldly into the best version of yourself to awaken the unstoppable strength that's inside of us all. So tune into the podcast, focus on your emotional well-being, and climb your personal mountain. Because it's impossible for you to be the most authentic you.

It's impossible for you to love you fully if all you're doing is living to please people. Your mountain is that. Listen to Made for This Mountain on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on good company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen.

What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. It's this idea that there are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In the fall of 1986, Ronald Reagan found himself at the center of a massive scandal that looked like it might bring down his presidency. Did you make a mistake in sending arms to Tehran, sir?

No. It became known as the Iran-Contra affair. And I'm not taking any more questions in just a second. I'm going to ask Attorney General. I'm Leon Nafok, co-creator of Slow Burn. In my podcast, Fiasco, Iran Contra, you'll hear all the unbelievable details of a scandal that captivated the nation nearly 40 years ago, but which few of us still remember today.

The things that happened were so bizarre and insane, I can't begin to tell you. Please do. To hear the whole story, listen to Fiasco, Iran Contra on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee, your hands can't hit what your eyes can't see. Muhammad Ali was never afraid to express himself loudly and boldly and stays true to form in Ali and Me, an eight-part Audible original. Guided by his own words, this series explores Ali's life and legacy

through never-before-heard audio recordings and discussions with those who knew him best. Muhammad had this real sense of his own personal values and principles, things he believed in, his own sense of conviction. Those convictions never wavered. Hosted by Muhammad's wife, Lani Ali, and his close friend, award-winning broadcaster, John Ramsey, Ali and Me goes beyond the boxing ring to delve deeply into Ali's extraordinary life through conversations

with Billy Crystal, Mike Tyson, Rosie Perez, Common, Will Smith, and Bob Costas. It created a North Star for me of how I want to be in the world, you know. As a child, as a young person, he gave credence to my audacity.

There's no debate that this is the greatest global sports figure of our lifetime. Listen to Ali and Me, now on Audible. It's great enough to get in that room, and I believe he's going to get there. And I believe putting on purple and gold and having a new challenge in his life is going to get him there. But he also has to have coaches,

management, ownership, leadership in that locker room that holds him accountable and has the same voice as the people that's trying to pour into his life instead of high-fiving him and hugging him and giving him that when he won a ballgame. So let's talk about you won the game, but how about the defensive stop that you gave up on that almost cost us the game?

So we can have that conversation too. Got to surround himself with people that are not yes-ing him, but hold him accountable and push buttons and inspire him to win it as bad as we want it. Short, long-term, who do you believe won the trade? Short, long-term, i love ad to the math carry in the pick and roll great help defender can defend one through five tremendous in the pick and roll can help with weak side defense the lakers got a little lax on defense lebron can't

sit in the chair anymore at 40 luca we talked about that doesn't really want to play uh austin people attack him because they can't uh the Lakers got substantially weaker on the defensive end. They set themselves up for the next 10 years, though. You can't take that away from them. I think both teams are in position to win a championship. You're the Lakers. Your next move is your best move. They got to find a big to clean up some of the mess

and protect the weakness that they have on the defensive side of the floor. Protect the rim. Play the mess and protect the weakness that they have on the defensive side of the floor. Protect the rim, play the pick and roll, hold the fork down a little bit as dribble penetration affects you. And I like what the Dallas... I think both teams have helped themselves because I can't undersell how great Anthony

Davis is, and clearly I already raved enough about Luke the Doctor. It's going to be interesting to see how this thing all plays out. And I think the Lakers cannot be judged on just winning a championship or not winning a championship this year. They got a generational talent, which is hard to find that puts them in position

for after LeBron James leaves. But let me ask you a question. Let's just say, and I'm hoping, hey, you know I root for the Lakers. I'm hoping Luca like, man, I just cost myself $117 million.

Everybody believes I can be special. I am special. Let me do what it takes in order to be in that room that Mark Jackson keeps talking around. There's only a handful of guys in there. There are only a handful of guys that deserve to be mentioned of being in there. I mean, some guys can peep in the room, but there are some guys that are sitting at the table

in the room. Let me get on my conditioning. Let me hire me a chef. Look, I'm not saying Michael Jordan smokes more cigars than anybody. And stand up with that and bust them up, Mark.

Some guys drink. Some guys can do that. But the one thing you know about MJ, he came in in shape. LeBron loves his wine. And a Kenyan gets a cigar. But you know, he don't cheat the process. And the one thing about those guys that are in that room, they didn't cheat the process.

You're right. Tim Duncan didn't play basketball until high school. But Pop, he was coachable. Pop got on him to coach everybody else. Tim Duncan, when he stepped on that floor, you know what you're going to get. But you also knew he was a pro off the court. He was going to come in in shape.

He was going to be conditioned. And he was going to be ready to go. And he didn't have no ticky-tack injuries. It points the finger directly to the player. They got to want it. And I believe that he's going to be in that room because his talent tells me that he's going to be in that room. I believe he wants it.

I believe this situation will enhance his desire to prove people wrong. And I believe that if you are a general manager, ownership, or coach, or superstar player playing alongside him, you also have the responsibility to hold him accountable and to deliver the message to him when he's falling short from that.

And I believe he's got to be able to be man enough to empower those people to do exactly that. Because at the end of the day, I know they want what's best for me. If they want what's best for me, then it's going to be what's best for this team,

and ultimately, I'm going to be in that room. What he doesn't want to do is what you talk about, put his head peeking in that room, and then he gets most kindly. No, he deserves to be in that room constantly because his talent tells us. Let's talk about the other trade that happened today. De'Aaron Fox going to the San Antonio Spurs, Zach Levine going to the Sacramento Kings. It seems now, it seems now,

guys will sign that first extension, get that guaranteed money, and then after that, they're on the hunt. You see D. Fox, he's on his way to San Antonio. He wants to play with Wembley. Nice squad there.

You see Zach Levine. Zach has been, reports that Zach Levine has wanted to get out of Chicago for an extended period of time. He's reunited with DeMar DeRozan in Sacramento. You have to like Sacramento with Malik Monk, DeMar DeRozan, Zach Levine, DeMontis Sabonis.

They got a nice squad. Keegan Murray. They got a nice squad. What I like about Sacramento is Aaron Fox obviously displayed his willingness to be traded. He let his feelings be known, and they made a trade, but they didn't surrender the season. If they went and got a guy that could help them immediately, a 25-point score on Zach Levine, that's proven.

That's comfortable playing alongside of DeMar DeRozan. So they have criminal play, great versatility, great youth, incredible fan base. Then you have Sabonis and Keegan Murray. They have talent that still should put them in the mix. Playoff time in the Western Conference and still an exciting future moving forward, whether Zach Levine opts in or opts out at the end of the year. De'Aaron Fox goes to a situation where he's playing with a generational talent in Wembley and fits his skill set where he can be creative on the perimeter, play and pick and roll with him, at times be aggressive as a scorer, at times be aggressive as a facilitator.

It's an ideal situation. One thing you touched on that I still try to figure out as I spend time by myself today. These dudes are turning down $300 million. Like, give me my money. Give me my money. And we'll figure out anything else. $300 million. I don't care how much you made.

This is real money. Yes. Get your money and then find the right situation. Don't leave money on the table. I played with a guy that gave back $500,000 in order to be a free agent at the end of the year. Never recouped. And that was back in 1989, 1990.

Never got back that $500,000. You can't make it back. We're talking about now $200,000, $300,000,000? Are you kidding me? Get your paper, young fella. And I don't want to underestimate this because unfortunately

I don't know a lot about this and Shannon you don't know a lot about this but my guy Chad Ochoa-Single

knows enough about it that's news it can be frustrating at times at times I watch don't talk about Jack don't

I watch this and I've seen the frustration I've seen I've seen it running routes and playing you know it was tough at times and I've seen the frustration. I've seen it, running routes and playing for, you know, it was tough at times. And I was thrilled and happy when you got a chance to win and be on the right situation.

You deserved it. So it can be frustrating and one of the excellent times, but get your money. One thing about my guy, he got his money, and he keeps his money. I'm watching you. Jack, let me ask you this we see these things about zion and in zion has had and they even worded his contract that he has to be a certain weight he has to have his body percentage down and we've never seen it look he reminds you of a more explosive charles barkley and barkley like he

had malone he had those other guys and he said said, Moses Malone, rest his soul, said, Charles, you fat and you lazy. You got two things. You young, you fat, and you lazy. You got two things working against you. And Barkley says, you know what? He got 10 pounds off in like two weeks. And then he got another 10 pounds off in a month.

And before you know it, Charles was turning himself into an MVP, one of the better power forwards that ever played a game. We see this with Joel Embiid. When you get a guy Embiid size, and people don't realize this, the bigger you are, the bigger that frame is, the more weight it can hold, Jack. You're seven foot two. Oh, you could easily be 400, maybe even five. And when you get hurt during the season now you can't condition and so guess what you're still eating but you're not practicing you're not playing and so guess what you might be 295 300 next thing you know you're 310 you're 320 you're 330 you're 340 you're 350 now you go back out there you 350 and you try to run up and down that court, and you jump up, your knees go out, your feet, your ankles, your hips. What do you say to that,

Jack? Part of it, I blame organizations that allowed them to be this way coming in. I'm trying to be your friend and your boy and all lovey-dovey when you come in instead of saying, okay, these are the problems that we foresee. This is what we have to do to put you in a position to succeed from day one. I don't care what your bone structure is, what your body fat is. I know what it should be. They co-signed a lot of that stuff initially with Zion Williams, saying he was heavy boned and, you know, he can only get down to a certain amount of weight.

No. He's an incredible young man. He's an incredible talent. And you look at his body now, it's different than when he came in. So he certainly has a desire to get better. I think the biggest thing for him, you compare him to Charles Barkley, and the bodies were similar. But Charles Barkley from day one had a jumper.

He was shooting threes back in 87, 88, 89. So he was a skilled, overweight performer on the basketball floor who had range. Zion Williamson, if you're playing against him, you can dare him to shoot the jumper.

Now, can he hit it? Yeah, once in a while. And I'm saying this respectfully because he's a great player, but he has a floor that can be exposed on the defensive side of the floor if you're going against him,

especially in a playoff series. So he's got to spend time to enhance and protect that side of the floor if you're going against him, especially in a playoff series. So he's got to spend time to enhance and protect that side of the floor and his range because if he puts his head down, he gets anywhere he wants. So now if you add

a decent jumper to that, he's a nightmare for anybody to protect. We're talking about elite players that have opportunity to make their imprint on this game.

And it should hurt them when they don't because they're not in the best shape they could possibly be in. I still never understand. Rudy Gobert got traded for four first-round picks. Luka Doncic got traded for Anthony Davis and one first-round pick.

I don't know who did. Hey, Nico Collins must know something we don't. Nico Harris. Nico Harris, excuse me. Rob Pelinka says, thank you. Just imagine if you were sitting at home and got a call. You're interested in Luca?

Heck yeah. Hell yeah. So you don't even have to work. You can win executive of the year just because you picked up the phone. Hey, what, what's that you, what's that you out front you want for luca okay whatever you

need hey jack whatever you need what you need who you know who you we're talking about we're talking about a guy that's after lebron he's gonna still be playing i don't get i don't care how much time you give lebron luca doctors will still be your franchise player when lebron exits the building and that's what you need if you're a Lakers. You got to have franchise players. They started with Will, with Kareem, Shaq, LeBron, and now they got Luka. So they just continue this stream of getting elite, multi-talented, great players to keep this thing for the Lakers going.

Jack, we got to get you out of here on that one. Thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate your insight and talking about this trade and the other trades Darren Fox going to the Spurs Zach Levine going to Sacramento Kings we'll see you down the road I appreciate you bro thanks for having me

Ocho Luka Doncic made his debut for the Lakers has not played since he injured that calf muscle on Christmas Day. The Lakers defeat the Jazz 132-113. Luka was warming up. Excuse me. LeBron was warming up with Luka's T-shirt.

They placed a 77 T-shirt on all the chairs within the stadium. And the pregame, LeBron told Luka, Luka, be your F-ing self. Don't fit in, fit the F out. The Lakers have won six straight, 12 out of 14 overall. LeBron James had 24 points, eight assists, seven rebounds. Austin Reeves, 22 points, nine rebounds, four assists. Assist, Rui. Hachimura, 21 points, six rebounds. Luka, limited action, 14 points, five rebounds, four assists. Assist, Rui. Hachimura, 21.6 rebounds.

Luka, limited action, 14 points, five rebounds, four assists. And Godwin, the two-way player, has 17 points. The Lakers, the last game before the All-Star break, is Wednesday against this very Utah Jazz team they defeated tonight up in Utah before the All-Star break. Let's continue right quick, Ojo. According to Sean, the Hornets exploring disputing the Lakers' failed physical on

Williams. The Charlotte Hornets have been in contact with the NBA as they explore options to dispute the Lakers' failed physical assessment on Mark Williams. Sources tell ESPN, Williams-Dalton Connect trade was next Saturday, and now the Hornets weigh avenues to challenge. We'll talk about that a little later.

Oh, Joe, I like what I saw. I don't know if you like what you saw with Luka. Now, look, it's only one game. It's a very, very small sample size. I like what they got. Obviously, Luka's going to start kind of staggering because you want one of those guys to be on the court pretty much at all times. But even if you don't have him on the court,

you still have a primary ball handle in Austin Reeves. So, obviously, LeBron can handle the ball. Luka can handle the ball. But when both of those guys are off the court, if they are off the court, you still have Austin Reeves, who can handle the ball, who's playing extremely well. And so I like what I saw. And it's going to be a lot of staggering. So when Luka goes off the court, who's played extremely well. And so I like what I saw. And it's going to be a lot of staggering.

So when Luka goes off the court, LeBron is on. LeBron's off the court, Luka's on. Or if both of those guys are off the court, as I said, Austin Reeves is on. But I like the way they moved the ball. And if you know Luka, Luka can get hot and give you 20, 25 points on the corner. But he doesn't have to worry about facilitating because a lot of times when Luka was on the court before he got Kyrie, if Luka went on a hot streak, he still had to worry about getting other people involved.

He don't have to worry about that. He has LeBron. He has Austin Reeves. But I like what I saw. And Hayes, Jackson Hayes, is the happiest guy because all he's going to do is get lobbed up now. He ain't got to work, but that's all he did anyway. But he's going to average probably about 14 points a game, getting six to seven lobbed dunks a game.

So I like what I saw early on, although it's a very, very small sample size. Now, listen, even though it's a small sample size, you can tell that the future is going to be very bright for the Lakers. Now, I know people don't want to get too happy. They are playing the Utah Jazz, but obviously, you understand how dynamic, you know, LeBron and Luka are playing together, even though the sample size is small, especially with the IQ that Luka has, especially

with the IQ that LeBron has as well. The spacing, obviously, with Luka and LeBron on the court was awesome. You can tell that Reeves is going to be able to eat as long as well as everybody else. So, listen, I'm excited for the Lakers. I don't think, I

still don't think it's enough to be able to compete and contend for a title. I still think they need another piece. I could be wrong. You can tell me. You would know better than I can. I still think there would be you would need another piece to add to them,

to that puzzle, to be able to challenge out there in the West. They need a big. The only big they have is Jackson Hayes, and I don't think that's enough. You only want to play Jackson Hayes somewhere between,

you know, 14, 20 minutes a night. He's not a guy that you're going to run out there and play 25, 30 minutes, 35 minutes a night. That's not what he is. That's not, he's not been that player

in his NBA career. So you probably need another big. That's not what he is. That's not. He's not been that player in his NBA career. So you probably need another big. That's why they tried to trade for the Williams kid. But as I was reading earlier, Ocho, he failed a physical. Go ahead. And I have a question. When it comes to failing a physical, is it Duke

has injuries or does he actually have an injury right now to where he couldn't pass it? Well, you know what happens. You know what happens when they bring you in there, they test you out. They start pulling on your joints and your shoulders and your knees and twist your ankle. Are you okay?

They give you MRI. They give you all that other stuff. But here's a guy that's been, you know, he kind of has an injury history. Okay. So, I don't know what... Why y'all so anxious to get up on him? If he's so good, y'all should welcome him back. Right, right.

Well, clearly, clearly there's more to what's going on. It's like, hey, we thought we had another shooter. We know what Dalton was. Yeah, he's kind of cooled off a lot. Early on, he was really letting it fly. Had some big games shooting the three ball for the Lakers, can put the ball on the floor, can finish at the rim. I know the Lakers really like him,

but sometimes you have to give up something to get something, and they realized they needed a big. Luka likes playing with very athletic bigs because he can get into the paint. He can dish a lot of lob dunks. Go look at Lively. Go look at Daniel Gafford. Look at the guys that he's played with. Guys get a lot of easy baskets because, hey, he's going to get into the paint

because he can change speeds. He's really herky-jerky. Yeah. But right now, I think that's the thing they're missing. They're getting better at shooting the ball from outside. Gabe Benson is getting better at shooting the three ball. He's finally getting his legs back. Last year was a wash year for him,

and he's finally starting to shoot like the Gabe Benson that we saw his last year in Miami when he really let the ball fly, helped that team get to the NBA Finals but ended up losing to the Nuggets. Austin Reeves has been on a tear lately. He's been unbelievable. He's just getting better and better and better every year. Would I be surprised eventually if he's not an all-star? I can see it happening.

Now, it's going to be hard because he has Luka and he has LeBron on his team. But here's the thing, Ocho. He's going to be getting the third-best defender. You've got to give one of your best defenders, especially with the wing, he's got to guard Luka. He's got to guard LeBron. So now, it's kind of like

that third receiver. If you've got two dogs outside, that third receiver's like, man, hey, y'all give me the third or fourth corner. Oh, I'm definitely going to eat now. Rui is another guy that's going to get big because both LeBron, because they're

big guards, can see over the defense. So they can penetrate, skip pass, hammer pass, over the top. It really doesn't matter to them and we know they both can score. Luka has the third highest scoring average in NBA history at almost 29 points a game

behind Jordan, behind Will. When it comes to the playoffs, he has the second highest scoring average behind only Michael Jordan. So that just lets you know what a proficient guy he is at scoring the basketball. And so you look at a guy

that's averaging basically 29, 8, and 8, which is crazy. And he won't be 26 until the 28th of this month. So the Lakers have someone to win LeBron to finally decides if and when that's going to be because this is going to take a lot of pressure off LeBron Ocho

because he's not going to have the workload of having to bring the ball up the court he's not going to have the workload of trying to have to facilitate for everybody else Luka is going to take a lot of pressure off LeBron I can see LeBron now play another two to three years.

Right. You know, what you're saying, when you talk about Luka taking some of the pressure off LeBron, obviously, Luka and some of the pressure is taking off him as well. He's as efficient as he is. He has a squad around him where he doesn't have to do all the work.

He has he has hella athletes, a lot of players around him with length. And I think he's going to be going to be a great addition. I think they just need a big. They need a big. And if they get a big now, I'm not sure how many how many viable options out there that can come in. And and you can plug and play and make a difference right now. Now, they're not a whole.

Well, you can't trade for anybody. So anybody is going to be basically street free agents. Or maybe somebody get cut and you're able to bring them in like that. But I know they were looking at... If they get cut, there's not much they can do for you. But no, but Luka and LeBron can bring it out of them because everybody ain't got a Luka and LeBron.

But, you know, maybe they were looking at Valanchunas. They looked at Walker Kessler, who's on the Utah Jazz, but seemingly the Jazz wanted more than what the Lakers were willing to part ways with. The only guys out there available, I think of JaVale McGee, I think of Alex Lynn, Dwight Howard. Don't know what... How old is Dwight? Probably a year younger than LeBron.

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Listen to Ali and Me, now on Audible. Okay So I'm thinking He came straight out Of high school also So he should probably Be a year younger A year younger

Than LeBron But you're only Asking Can And Dwight Keeps himself In great shape Yeah

The question is Can he I believe he can give you 20 minutes a night He and Jackson Hayes Alternating You know There's gonna be Sometimes they go With a small lineup um yeah the question is can i believe he can give you 20 minutes a night he and jackson hayes alternating you know they're gonna be sometimes they go with a small lineup right um but the question is can those guys between the two of them can they give you 20 24 minutes a night i believe they can um but they definitely need another big they are jackson hayes is not nearly enough um like

i said you don't want to play him a ton of minutes. He's an energy guy. He's going to block some shots. He'll challenge some stuff at the rim. But he's a good role player. And the thing is, you don't have to run plays for him because you got enough scoring. You don't need other guys that you have to run plays for.

You got Luka. You got LeBron. You got Austin Reeves that can score. You got Rui. You got four guys that can score. Now you need bigs. I ain't got to run no plays for you. Get it off the rim. Footbacks, lobs. Can you

rebound? Can you challenge stuff at the rim? Because when you give up Anthony Davis, you give up one of the premier defensive players and one of the premier defensive players, but he's one of the best two-way players also that's in the game. But you gave that up because he was your last line of defense. He did a lot of covering up. Anthony Davis is like makeup.

All the... That's your fault. The blemishes that you have, he could cover it up. And so that's what you need. So can Jackson Avery block shots? Yeah. We know Dwight. We know JaVale McGee can challenge shots. We don't know how much tread they got.

But look, you're not going to get a Jokic. So stop looking at something like that. Right. So you just have to basically hope that one of these guys that they're able to secure can give you valuable minutes because Luka and LeBron is going to give you plenty. Now, obviously, I don't know how basketball works to the extent that you plenty. Now, when, now, I obviously don't know, I don't know how basketball works to the extent that you do. During this,

during this break, during this all-star break, isn't that the time you want to already have a big coming in at that point so you can hit the ground running when you come out of the all-star break and having a big,

you know, to go, to go with everybody else? Yeah, I mean, the question is, is that Rob is, is probably scouring,

they're looking at, but like I said, there's not a whole lot out there. It's not like you've got a cream of the crop plucking the litter. Yeah. So you only got a handful of guys out there. JaVale McGee has familiarity with the Lakers. Dwight Howard has familiarity with the Lakers. I don't believe anybody else is going to get cut or get on –

oh, excuse me, I say cut, a buyout. I don't really see any buyouts happening. I think Alex Lynn is available. He's another big, like I said, you're not going to get somebody that's a double-double machine. Most of the guys are going to have an older, JaVale McGee is a little

older, Dwight Howell is a little older. JaVale probably can give you I would say somewhere 15, 16 minutes a night. Dwight Howard a little older. JaVale probably can give you I would say somewhere 15, 16 minutes a night. Dwight maybe a little more, 16 to 18 minutes a night. But maybe that's all you need. It doesn't matter that they don't give you much on the offensive end of the ball.

No, you got, if you don't, if LeBron James, that average is 25, Luka, that's averaging 28, Austin Reeves, that's averaging 20, Rued, that's averaging 16. If Reed that's averaging 20. Rued that's averaging 16. If that's not enough with the day, and considering your bench, Dave Vincent

can continue to get better and better. I like this Goodwin kid that I saw. Goodwin, Godwin. The kid that I saw tonight that came off the bench. He's a scorer. You can tell when he gets the ball in his hands, he's looking to get to the basket. He's looking to put the ball in the basket. So I like what I saw with him.

I don't want to get too carried away. Like I said, Utah wasn't playing any defense tonight. But if you look at him, I followed him the last couple of games. He can put the ball in the basket. And he can put the ball in the basket at an elite clip. Vando's not going to give you much on the offensive end, but he's a defensive guy. Benny Smith, he's streaky.

He can get hot. He can hit you about three or four threes in a game. But you're looking for him to defend at an elite level on the defensive end. So, Vando, Fannie Smith, those are your defensive guys. Jackson Hayes is a guy that can challenge at the rim. Gabe Vinson, he's another defensive guy. So, look, when you got Austin Reeves, guys are going to go at Austin Reeves. They're going to attack him.

Guys are going to attack Luka. They know LeBron cannot exert that kind of defensive energy on a nightly basis. Yeah, yeah. So somebody's going to have to defend. Somebody. But you're going to have to defend those guys also because you got three guys that can put the ball in the basket

at an elite level. Like I said, I love the way Austin Reeves has gotten better, better, better, better. We know what LeBron is. We know what Luke is. The question is, can they add another piece, which I believe will be a big, that can give them enough offense, which you don't need much. Can you give us eight points again?

But what we need is defense. Can you rebound? Can you defend? Can you challenge? Can you clog the paint? And I believe if they get that, I think we need is defense. Can you rebound? Can you defend? Can you challenge? Can you clog the paint? And I believe if they get that, I think they'll be okay. But this, like I said, they tried to rescind this trade. I'm not sure.

Look, the guy has had some injuries. I mean, he's a big guy. Oh, Joe, he give you 16 points. I think he's almost a double-double. But he's injured. And most times, every once in a while, if they really want a guy, I remember I think it was last year, maybe a year and a half ago, the Warriors, they traded for Gary Payton II.

He was injured. He failed a physical. But they really liked him because they had had him before. Helped him with it. Right. And so they knew they would get it and say, you know what? We'll go ahead. Don't even worry about it. Yes, he failed. We'll work with him. We'll let him take it. Because here's the thing, I'm not trading for a guy that's going to, he's injured

and I got to wait. No, bro, I need you to go. And I think that's what happened with Anthony Davis. Because Anthony was, AD was hurt and he was like, okay. And he came, maybe came back a little bit too soon. And so now he tweaked that

adductor and now he's going to be out extended time. And I just saw they lost Daniel Gafford tonight. So two of them three bigs they lost. Now, go ahead. You know, it's funny. When I think about it,

do you think Anthony Davis' injury history played a part in them letting him go and not really, not really, I don't want to say not caring, but understanding that they could get Luka and had no problem letting Anthony Davis go simply because of his injury history? If Anthony Davis was 100% healthy

and played all the games like A.C. Green, you're not passing up an opportunity to get Luka Doncic. 25 years of age, averaging 29 points a game, eight rebounds, nine assists. You're not giving that up. There's never been a trade like this before, Ocho. There's never been a trade like this. Not at—first of all— Is there a trade comparable?

Is there a football trade comparable to the Anthony Luka Doncic trade or is nothing even close no because what happens if you go back and look at the trade

if you say what about Kareem Kareem wanted to be out he wanted to leave and come to LA actually Kareem really wanted to go to New York

but he ended up going to the Lakers. With that being said, Luka is 25 and he didn't ask to be traded. Anthony Davis asked to be traded. Guys have asked in their prime to be traded.

Luka is 25, five-time first-team All-NBA, led the league in scoring, rookie of the Year. They didn't ask, and they moved it. There's not a whole lot. If you really think about it, there's not a whole lot of guys that you're probably not going to move in for.

You're not going to move in for Yoke. You're not going to move in for Shea. I don't know if they'll move in for Jason Tatum because they like that mesh that, that mesh. But other than that, if the Nico Collins would have took that to the warriors, if they give us KD, maybe,

or Steph Curry, Steph is not going anywhere. Okay. Steph is not going anywhere. No, Steph is not going there. Joe Lickum is not, Joe Lickum is not going,

doing that, that deal. But, but we talked about it. What the owners said is like going to, Joe Lickum is not going to do that deal. But we talked about it. What the owners said is like, okay, we're going to pull some of this power back. Y'all got too much. Where y'all want to go and who y'all want and yelling and knowing all the screaming. That said shockwave. Because you heard all the players talking like hey

lets us know everybody is touchable you know it lets us know everybody's touchable but we still don't know exactly what happened we still don't know exactly what happened where you're getting off a player that's been putting up the numbers he's been putting up as consistently as he has despite despite the injury and not playing since December, something else is going on behind closed doors, especially for a player that's eligible for a super max, five year through 45, whatever the numbers may have been. If you're that good, if you're that good, how do you let someone go like that?

What is going on behind closed doors where you let them go, knowing that you're not going to be able to replace that type of productivity. Right. You're not going to. I mean, you can get something for them, but it just is not the same. Luka Doncic did something with their line to get five years, $345, $350 million. That's $70 million a year. Normally, if somebody's getting that kind of money, you don't want to have any questions.

I don't want no injury history. I don't want a guy that I have to motivate to do what he needs to do. One. Second, that's a lot of money. Oh, Joe. And so, what a lot of the players are thinking, well, to keep somebody from getting that Super

Max contract, if I trade him, now I save. Somebody else has to deal with that. But still, even if you save, that means they still can't get to Supermax once you get traded. Because now, that original team doesn't have the bird rights.

I have a question. If you think of a player that's that good, a player that's that dynamic, now I'm not even speaking Lucas, you know, in this sense. A player that's that good, a player that's that dynamic, now I'm not even speaking Lucas, you know, in this sense, a player that's that great, right?

With every great player, aren't there some type of issues internally? No, no, I don't think. Think about some of the stories. Think about some of the stories. As great as Kobe was, as great as Michael Jordan was, do you think everything was always perfect?

Well, there was no injury. All before, because I think what was going on and the issues they had with Luka, it had nothing to do with what he does on the court. I think the thing was, is that the one thing, no matter what you thought, they were too driven, they were too motivated, they were too motivated,

but came in shape, and basketball was the end-all be-all. Right. And so, if you're investing that kind of money, you need basketball to be the end-all be-all. Now, like I said, plus, Ocho,

I need to wrestle some of this power back, because Luka is so powerful in that organization. If I give him this money, he's damn near the owner. You think it made it worse? And so that seems to me... Excuse me, excuse me. I hate to cut you off. Do you see the kind of money NBA players make?

Yeah, for sure. Even if he didn't get the Super max, he's still making fucking money. Yeah. My bad, my bad. God dog it. My bad. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

He's making F you money. Yes. You know, all the players, you know, in the NBA are making F you money. So now NBA owner trying to find a way to, you know, we're going to pull and take some of this power back. Well, it's too late now. It's too late now. It's too late based on the kind of money they're making.

Everything is guaranteed. Yes. Everything is guaranteed. So there's really nothing they can do. But here's the thing though, Ocho. The players are going to be on their best behavior

because 350, now you go down to 229. Don't do me like that. I've just said that's what... $229,000? What is it that I can't do with $229,000 that I can do with $350,000? I can do just about the same thing. That's the same thing that you said with the NFL players.

What can I do with $75 million that I can do with $50,000? That's a big... Think about it. And you leave Texas with no state income tax to go to California where there's a 13% tax rate. Right. Luca is a global star. Yes, sir.

And you gave him up and put him in the biggest market for the next decade. This is the Lakers. This is what they always do. This is what they've always done. Go back and look at the Lakers history. It started out when they got Will, and then they got Kareem. They got Bob McAdoo. They got Shaq.

They got LeBron. They got Anthony Davis. And now they got Luka. This is what they do. Right. So, people shouldn't be surprised. The only thing that, I think the only thing the NBA

owners are upset about, bro, you ain't opened it up. Do you know what Luka would have commanded? If everyone had a chance to get it. He didn't go there and went for four first-round picks. Four. Did you know when Luka Doncic,

a 25-year-old global international superstar, would have went for? So that means Nico Collins and Rob Plinker had some where they were in cahoots behind closed doors, obviously not letting anybody know what they were going to do simply because it's the Lakers.

Where else would you want to go but the Lakers? They have to make a splash. They have to have a superstar. But the Lakers ain't had the best. I bet you, I guarantee you, if they had opened this thing up, Lakers wouldn't have come close to the best package. Oh, absolutely. But Rob Lincoln was Kobe's agent.

Nico Collins was at Nike. Worked with Kobe. Worked with Joel. Worked with LeBron. You see? With now, hopefully people will understand. It's all about relationships. I keep telling y'all, oh, it ain't about this, it's about that.

No, it's not. Rob and Nico had a relationship. I like that. I like this. It's just, I like this. You know, you know, it's funny.

You know what I do like? I like also is we need to be a little bit more, and I'm asking for this. I'm asking for this. We need a little bit, be a little bit more active on the basketball end because now that football season is over, guess where I'm going to be at? Watching the game.

Courtside. Oh, I'm not watching the game at home. I'm going to use some of this nightcap money, but I'm going to sittside. Oh, I'm not watching the game at home. I'm going to use some of this nightcap money, but I'm going to say courtside. No. I'm ready. I'm saving my money. Where you going? I'm saving.

Oh, now you want to save. I'm preaching you about saving all that cash. I ain't got no big change. I ain't got no big 84. I stopped on that cap lot. I ain't got that. I ain't have five bracelets. Wait a minute.

Hold on. Hold on. I had to prepare myself for live shows. We have a tour coming up. So that's my stuff, vicinity for the tour. Now I can put that, I put that away

and that's not coming out again until April when it's time to go on said tour. Now, listen, you have to understand. Now, Pat Riley and I have a relationship. Mickey Harrison and I have a relationship. I have a relationship with Bam Matabayo. I'm going to sit courtside next to the Lakers. Not next to the Lakers.

Next to the Heat bench. That's only $1,500. That's just... All right, no disrespect to anybody in the chat. I'm not saying it's a drop in the bucket. But $1,500, that's feasible for me for the rest of the season after All-Star break. Oh.

Where I can get a better end of the game. Watching it up close. Being able to talk it so I can sound like you. So I can sound like Steven. So I can sound like Malika Andrews. You know, so I can sound like... Perkins. Yeah.

Huh? All right. Give me three weeks. Watch how I sound out here. But yeah, I like what the Lakers have done. I like LeBron. But like I said, I can see LeBron playing two or three years. But the simple fact, the workload that he will.

The question is his mind, like you said, because he's LeBron James. And he's been great since he stepped foot in the NBA. And if there's any point in time that he can't be great, he'll walk away. Just like Tom Brady. Tom Brady great. See, people are like, well, Tom, look at Tom's numbers. But, Tom, when you are a great player, you only get compared to a younger self. You don't get compared to the other players.

Aaron Rodgers. Right. When you look at Aaron Rodgers' numbers, they weren't that bad, but you're comparing Aaron to the young Aaron when he was throwing 45 touchdowns with four picks. He was 38 touchdowns with three picks. He was this and that. That MVP, when you're great,

it's hard for you to be anything other than great. Right. And now all of a sudden people look at it like, damn, I'm a reg. It's hard. It's hard. It's just like when some people have a large sum of money and all of a sudden they don't have that no more, Ojo. They don't know how to behave like i had all this money i've had millions hundreds of millions billions and now i just got you a billionaire and all of a sudden all you got is 200 million dollars

bitch 200 million me and you? Like, sign me up! But not when you've had billions. That's a whole different ballgame. The Made for This Mountain podcast exists to empower listeners to rise above their inner struggles and face the mountain in front of them. So during Mental Health Awareness Month, tune into the podcast, focus on your emotional well-being, and then climb that mountain. You will never be able to change or grow

through the thing that you refuse to identify, the thing that you refuse to say, hey, this is my mountain, this is the struggle. Listen to Made for This Mountain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on good company. The podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators

shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi. We dive into the competitive world of streaming. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. There are so many stories out there. And if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. guests. In the fall of 1986, Ronald Reagan found himself at the center of a massive scandal that looked like it might bring down his presidency. It became known as the Iran-Contra affair. The things that happened were so bizarre and insane, I can't begin to tell you. Please do.

To hear the whole story, listen to Fiasco, Iran Contra on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You're listening to an iHeart Podcast.