No Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen - Pete Buttigieg takes down Marjorie Taylor Greene over SOTU antics

Episode Date: February 12, 2023

The Republicans' stunt backfires on them at the State of the Union. Brian sits down in DC with Secretary of Transportation Pete Buttigieg to talk about Sarah Huckabee Sanders’ dystopian response to Biden’s State of the Union speech, Marjorie Taylor Greene screaming in the chamber, what’s being done to rectify issues with the airlines, and an update on infrastructure. And I’m joined by FOX LA anchor Elex Michaelson to discuss how the State of the Union will impact Biden’s re-election prospects, whether DeSantis is right not to fight back against Trump, and his take on the Adam Schiff-Katie Porter race for US Senate.Donate to the "Don't Be A Mitch" fund: https://secure.actblue.com/donate/dontbeamitchShop merch: https://briantylercohen.com/shopYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/briantylercohenTwitter: https://twitter.com/briantylercohenFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/briantylercohenInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/briantylercohenPatreon: https://www.patreon.com/briantylercohenNewsletter: https://www.briantylercohen.com/sign-upWritten by Brian Tyler CohenProduced by Sam GraberRecorded in Los Angeles, CASee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Today we're going to talk about the Republican stunt that backfired on them at the State of the Union. I sit down in Washington, D.C., with Secretary of Transportation, beat Buttigieg, to talk about Sarah Huckabee Sanders' dystopian response to Biden's State of the Union speech, Marjorie Taylor Green screaming in that chamber, what's being done to rectify issues with the airlines, and an update on infrastructure. And I'm joined by Fox L.A. anchor Alex Michelson to discuss how the state of the Union will impact Biden's re-election prospects, whether dissantis is correct not to fight back against Trump and his take on the Adam Schiff, Katie Porter race for the U.S.

West Senate in California. I'm Brian Tyler Cohen, and you're listening to No Lie. So this past week, Biden delivered his state of the union address. He beyond exceeded expectations in the speech, which I think was owed in large part to the fact that yet again, Republicans had spent every waking minute making Biden out to be this senile old man who can't remember his own name. And so when Biden was able to find the podium, it was already a win. But he went on to deliver a really, really strong speech, focusing especially heavily on job creation, on the economy, on the middle class. But there was one moment in particular that wasn't scripted that actually stole the show.

Instead of making the wealthy pay their fair share, some Republicans, some Republicans want Medicare and Social Security to sunset. I'm not saying it's a majority. Let me give you anybody who doubts it. Contact my office. I'll give you a copy. I'll give you a copy. I'll give you a copy. the proposal. That means Congress doesn't vote. Well, I'm glad to see you. I tell you, I enjoy conversion. You know, it means if Congress doesn't keep the programs the way they are, they'd go away.

Other Republicans say, I'm not saying it's a majority of you. I don't even think it's even a significant... But it's being proposed by individuals. I'm not politely not naming them, but it's being proposed by some of you. Look, folks, the idea is that we're not going to be, we're not going to be moved into being threatened to default on the debt if we don't respond. Folks, so folks, as we all apparently, we're all apparently. agree. Social Security and Medicare is off the books now, right? They're not to be fine. All right. We're got unanimity. So Biden was explaining that he'd protect earned benefit programs like Social

Security and Medicare and Medicaid from the very accurate and well-documented attacks by Republicans, which are no secret, and I'll discuss that in a moment, but because Republicans Doth protested too much and made sure to make a big scene because they thought it would be a good way to score an easy shot against Joe Biden, instead Biden forced them to avow those programs and stand up and applaud for them and got everybody on record promising to protect earned benefits.

Was it under duress? You bet. Did he get the win anyway thanks to an unforced error by Republicans? Absolutely. Now, there are those who will say, well, Republicans weren't really going to go after earn benefits anyway. Couple things. First, Biden still scored a win here by being the one dictating the terms of the conversation.

It was him who got those Republicans to stand up and applaud for Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid, which they were clearly doing under duress. They didn't look strong. They looked cornered. They looked like they were reacting because they had to react. And to do it at the hands of a guy who they themselves have branded this, you know, confused old man makes them look even more weak here. So that's the first thing.

But second, Republicans have been vying to eliminate Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid for literal decades. Do not let anyone convince you that history started yesterday and that we don't have actual years and years and years of footage and audio clips from Republicans vowing to dismantle your earned benefits. That's the bad faith bullshit that the media buys into as soon as the Republican says, no, I wouldn't possibly eliminate Social Security. And the press is like, well, there it is. He said he wouldn't. So it must be true. I'll just type that shit out and post an article about it because apparently journalism is just blindly accepting whatever lies these liars say to me. So let's all just agree to have some self-respect here and not play dumb as to how the GOP feels about what they call entitlement programs.

And just to add to that, we have plenty of proof that that's what they stood for. Like there was a great clip of Republican Senator Mike Lee looking absolutely perplexed when Biden accused Republicans of wanting to cut those programs during the state of the unions. speech. The way that Mike Lee's face looked, it was like Biden just claimed that Republicans want to walk into hospitals and pick out babies from the nursery and eat them whole. He looked so outraged. And yet, here is a clip of Mike Lee himself that may just undermine his whole shtick here. It will be my objective to phase out social security. To pull it up by the roots and get rid of it. Um, people who advise me politically always tell me that's dangerous, and I tell them, in that case, it's not worth my running.

And of course, there's plenty more. Ron Johnson, Mitch McConnell. Rick Scott has his plan to sunset all federal legislation after five years. And if it's worth reauthorizing, they'll just bring it back. But let's be honest, you'd be more likely to see Republicans reauthorize food stamps than Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid. So again, if you read the news or hear someone say that Republicans have already come out against cutting those programs, please use like a single ounce of discernment. But the fact that we're even talking about this at all is owed entirely to the Republican Party's biggest problem right now

and that is that they want the attention. Their capital is cashing in on the attention economy. They needed to get up and scream and call Biden a liar and challenge him during his speech because they have every incentive in the world to just appeal to their basest instincts because that's why they're there. It's not to govern.

It's not to pass legislation. to lower cost for their constituents, it is to be more famous. That's it. They're holding Twitter hearings because their tweets aren't getting enough likes and they need someone to blame because their top priority is building a following for themselves. They're holding Hunter Biden dick pick hearings and like the Judiciary Committee because they know it'll get picked up on Fox News and they can cash in for a five-minute cable hit. If you can tell me which part of investigating Twitter or Hunter Biden's penis helps anyone other than those Republicans looking for attention for themselves, I'm all ears.

So, yes, their desperation for attention pretty much left Republicans disarmed when it came to eliminating earned benefits, but it also represents an issue moving forward. Like, on one hand, you have Americans consistently rejecting these loud, extremist Republicans at the ballot box, from Trump to Kerry Lake to Dr. Oz to Herschel Walker. While, on the other hand, every indication shows that it's only getting worse on the right. When Joe Wilson, back in 2009, called Obama a liar, has stated the union speech, it was like this massive scandal. Now it's basically just expected.

There is no moderation in that party anymore. And in fact, what moderates are left have basically been castrated by the extremists, by the Marjorie Telle Greens and Matt Gates's and Jim Jordans. Like, people sometimes criticize my videos if I cover Marjorie Tiller Green, and they ask me why I give her the airtime since that's exactly what she wants.

And the answer is because if they're going to make this extremist the face of that party, then who am I to help them by hiding her? I didn't elect her. I didn't put her on to committees. I didn't make her best buds with the speaker. I didn't make her the face of the GOP. They did.

And if they want to put an extremist front and center, knowing full well that over and over in election after election, voters continue to repudiate those very people, then that's not my problem. It's theirs. Next step is my interview with Pete Buttigieg. So I'm here with the Secretary of Transportation, Pete Buttigieg. Thanks so much for coming on.

Good to be with you. Sarah Huckabee Sanders did the Republican Resort. response to the State of the Union. It was a lot of fear-mongering about some dystopian future, wokeism, critical race theory, blah, blah, blah. What were your thoughts on the pretty stark contrast between what she did and what President Biden did? I think the biggest difference was you heard President Biden talking about things that most Americans are focused on, what it'll take to keep up this extraordinarily low unemployment, how we created hundreds of thousands of manufacturing jobs, an agenda looking forward on things like dealing with junk fees that cable companies or phone

companies or airlines could charge people. And then you go over to the GOP response, and it's wokeism. And she's focused on whether you say Latino or whether you say Latin X. And I'm just thinking they're on two very different pages. But what was most striking to me last night in the chamber there was that you could feel, both on the things that everybody stood up and clapped for and on the things where the congressional Republicans kept their seats, you could feel and see that every single thing he raised has the support of most Americans. And so to me it's just a very clear contrast in terms

of who's more aligned with where most of the country is right now. And by the way, I think that's on purpose. I think the whole trying to shoehorn this idea that the Democrats are only focused on wokeism and Latin X and M&Ms and on and on is on purpose, because if they were actually to point out the reality of the situation, which is that Democrats were focused on job creation and getting the unemployment rate down low and cutting healthcare costs for Americans, that would be too popular. And so instead, they have to create this alternate reality where the Democrats are just out there vying for taking your gas stover.

Yeah, it's true. Look, they have this position. For example, they're against capping insulin at $35 a month. I'm not sure exactly why, but they're against it. I think they know enough about how out of step that is with the American people to not want to spend a lot of time defending that view. So they're talking about M&Ms or whatever the outrage du jour is going to be. And there was a point during the speech where Biden had to turn and reassure the Republicans

that Big Pharma would still make money. Don't worry, they'll be fine. In that chamber, Marjorie Taylor-Green made her presence known every opportunity she could by, you know, screaming or doing what she does. What was the feeling in the room? What was the sense in the room while she was doing what she was doing? I mean, it's unfortunate when somebody decides to seek attention that way. And at the same time, in the room, you could feel that there was like a thousand people in there.

Most of them are there to respectfully hear the president, whether they agree with him or not. And then you got these fringe figures who I think can really embarrass their own caucus. And, you know, it was a real problem for a speaker who I think wanted to demonstrate that there were adults in the room. But you try to remind yourselves that that's just a couple of voices, not most of the room. Did it seem like there was any frustration, even among Republicans with what she was. doing? I think so. I could hear a little bit of squirming. Even from that side. Yeah. And, you know, again, it's, there's a range of opinion in that body. That's normal. That's healthy. That's how it's supposed to work. But there shouldn't be a range in terms of your level of respect for the presidency

or for the process that you're part of. Marjorie Telegreen presided over the House last week. She has this public affection with Kevin McCarthy. She's clearly vying for Trump's vice presidential spot for his effort to become the 2024 Republican nominee. What does it say that Marjorie Taylor Green not only wants to be the face of that party, but that the party seems to want to let her be? It's a worrisome thing to watch because usually when you see that kind of, it's just somewhat we've seen from this representative. It's not just the extreme policy positions. It's an extreme nature. I mean, conspiracy theories, the space laser stuff. It's just something that I think any other leader would want to distance themselves from. But look,

the speaker is working with the slimest of majorities, and maybe he doesn't feel like he can afford to lose even the most disgraced or extreme member of his caucus. I get that, but that's a them problem. And at the end of the day, we think, you know, the best thing to do is to work with us on good policy. Again, every single thing the president mentioned in the state of the union speech, most Americans strongly support. So if I were in the position of any of the Republican congressional leaders, I would be making a list of at least a few of those things that we could work together on, and hopefully we will on at least a few of the items on that unity agenda. Right. There was this exchange between the president and Republicans surrounding Social

Security and Medicare and Medicaid, where their new line is that they don't want to cut these things. Of course, we know that's not true. We know that Rick Scott surfaced this plan where he would sunset all federal legislation after five years. If it's worth authorizing, they would of course do it again, which is effectively a death knell for those earned benefits. But Biden effectively got them to agree under duress that they won't touch those programs. But that wasn't in his prepared remarks. He basically put them on the spot and then got exactly what he wanted. What was the feeling in the room when it became apparent that Biden unilaterally disarmed the Republicans' most dangerous attack in about 60 seconds? It was a pretty amazing moment. It was a pretty amazing moment.

You know, these things are very, very scripted. And usually, even if there's a little bit of a disruption or something in the hall, that that doesn't change anything in terms of the president's remarks. But this president was thinking on his feet and I think saw an opportunity to really make clear that the congressional GOP can either own the position that some of its members have suggested that they would cut or sunset Social Security and Medicare, or they can reject it. getting them on their feet, making clear, or at least saying they make clear, that cuts to Social Security and Medicare are off the table.

If they follow through on that, that's a real achievement. And if they don't follow through on that, then the transparency that moment created will be very important as well. Although, I would say, it's not like the shame of Republicans saying one thing and then turning around and doing another has ever stopped them before, but we'll see what happens on that front. On the infrastructure front, though, Biden announced during the State of the Union a new standard to require that all construction materials used in federal infrastructure projects

are going to be made in America. How does that impact costs? And just as a follow-up to that, why are these infrastructure projects in the United States exorbitantly more expensive than infrastructure projects across the world? Yeah, it's a big and a very important question. And part of what we're working to tackle is not just make sure there's more funding for infrastructure, but that it gets spent effectively. It's been the case in general with big projects, and in particular in the U.S., that the bigger the project, the more likely it is to take too long, cost too much, not come out the way you had in mind. And we've got to do everything we can to fight that. And we've got a lot of brilliant minds here at the DOT who've been working on

identifying each point in the process where something can get delayed, get blocked, or see the costs escalate, and try to stay a step ahead of it. In terms of the Buy America piece, as you know, the president is passionate about making sure we create American jobs. And there have a been a lot of loopholes, waivers, rules that have not been enforced very strongly when it comes to the basic idea we all agree on that is the law, which is when you spend American taxpayer money on things like this, that you ought to be focused on American producers and making sure that it creates American jobs. So what he's directed all of the departments to do, what we've been doing at the DOT, is to tighten up and toughen up the rules on this.

You know, there have been these blanket waivers that just don't require somebody who's building a road or a bridge with federal money to work that hard to source American construction materials. This changes that. There may occasionally be extremely specialized components or things that are more often produced abroad, but often that's precisely because we haven't pushed enough to produce them here at home. So the long-term result of this is not just that we get those products made in America, bought in America, put into American infrastructure, but it actually builds up more of the industry to begin with so that we have that industrial base, we have that expertise, we have those jobs and those companies that can be selling both here and around the world. So on that infrastructure point, can you give a snapshot of our progress there, maybe a few examples of some major infrastructure projects that are underway now? Yeah, here's the way I would put it. The first year we were focused on just getting the bill through and selling this package. and the president signed it toward the end of our first year.

The second year, it was about standing up all the programs that the package created. This third year is when we're getting the money out the door and starting to see construction happen. I was just with the president in Baltimore. We were celebrating the tunnel that's going to be replaced there. It was put in in 1873. It's 150 years old. And people count on it to get to where they're going. In New York, Hudson River Tunnel, 200,000 passengers a day go through there. go through there. If it became unavailable, if it were taken offline, you would feel the economic

consequences everywhere. 1910, that thing was built, and we're finally replacing it. But a lot of smaller projects, too, we're already identifying or moving on 2,700 bridges, 70,000 miles of highway across the U.S. A lot of projects that won't get national news, maybe won't get a presidential visit or a visit even from me, but they're going to make all the difference in the world to the community that's getting that funding, whether it's putting in new medians and crosswalk, to make a street safer for pedestrians, or replacing an airport terminal that needs to be reworked. On airport terminals, there was obviously the whole Southwest debacle recently.

Republicans kind of trained their ire on you for not, I guess, moving to modernize Southwest's equipment. With that said, I don't know the extent to which the Department of Transportation is responsible for mandating that these airlines do have equipment that's able to service their customers. So can you talk about the work that you've done at DOT to rectify that issue and also any changes with the FAA more broadly? Yeah, one dynamic you often see is when a company screws up, there will be some people

politically who try to blame it on the government. We don't run an airline, but we are a watchdog. And so I take very seriously the responsibility our department does have to hold airlines accountable to higher standards, especially on passenger service. As a matter of fact, a lot of the work that we did last year to raise the bar on customer requirements and enforceable standards, things like whether they cover your hotel or your meal or your ground transportation if you get stuck, because we raised the bar on that last year, that's helping us this year deal with the aftermath of the Southwest situation and hold them to a very high standard that wouldn't have been possible

just a year ago before we took these steps. We're taking more steps now, and I'll give you one example that the president mentioned in his speech. It makes no sense that you would have to pay extra to sit with your kids when you're taking a flight. And yet so often, parents in the position of having to negotiate with the gate agent or sometimes you're negotiating with your fellow passengers for something that should be so basic and so automatic. So we're going to make sure that this is a requirement. I'm calling in the airlines to do it anyway, so we don't have to, but we're going to be making sure that this is required. Now, another element, of, you know, what the DOT oversees is, obviously, are roads.

Roadway deaths are, I believe, at a 16-year high. What is the cause of that, first of all, because you would imagine that as cars get safer, as technology becomes more sophisticated, those kind of things would go down. But we're seeing roadway deaths go up now, and what's being done to mitigate that danger? We have a crisis of roadway deaths that has been building for a long time in this country. In the proportions of the loss of life, it's comparable to gun violence, about 40,000 people a year. And I would assume that some degree of responsibility is owed to the fact that we have cell phones now. Absolutely.

Well, technology cuts both ways. On one hand, you have technologies now that can nudge you back into your lane if you drift off, that can let you know how close you are to the car in front of you. But the reason you're drifting out of your lane in the first place because you're on your phone. Well, that's just the thing. There is no car today, even with the most advanced technology, that doesn't require you to be paying attention, hands on the wheel, eyes on the road all the time. And some claims are being made about this technology.

but as great as those technologies are, you still need to be paying attention. There's no good reason to be looking at the screen of your phone or thumbing through your phone when the car is in motion. Put the phone down, let it wait. It'll still be there when you arrive safely and alive at your destination. So distracted driving is an issue. Technology is an issue, but so is the design of the roadways themselves. And we've learned over the years a lot of things about how a road is designed

that can either help or hurt when it comes to safety. That's why we're funding. We put about $800 million on the street just recently to help dozens of communities do construction and hundreds of communities do planning to make their roads safer. If we have safer roads and safer drivers and safer vehicles and safer speeds, and we do more about the post-crash care so that fewer injuries turn fatal, we could dramatically reduce the number of deaths and move towards zero, which has to be our ultimate goal. I want to switch gears back over to the circus element of this. And I do want to ask if you were surprised to see that Mitt Romney had called George Santos an embarrassment during the State of the Union. You know, if I belong to the same caucus or the same party as he did, I guess I would probably have some choice words to it. You know, it's something that reflects poorly on everybody. On the other hand, it's kind of where a lot of what you've seen on the fringes of Congress is leading to.

I mean, in some ways, just a more extreme case of some of the, unfortunately, dishonesty and just fringe nature of some politics, not all, you know, certainly not even most, even on the other side of the aisle. But I certainly get how somebody like Senator Romney, who I disagree with on a lot of things, but also have found we can work with on a lot of things, be as a certain sense of just dignity, I think, about the institution. And if you care about that institution, and he got a guy like Representative Santos there, I got to think that would be maddening. I mean, it's maddening enough as an American, and I guess he just couldn't take it anymore. At the same time, I mean, it is the natural progression of a party that's fully embraced Donald Trump to then have recruited somebody like George Santos who basically traffics exclusively in lying. So not the biggest surprise, but with that said, I know that we live in this perpetual cycle of hell

and that lying is commonplace in government. But which George Santos lie actually shocked you? Like, which one left you saying, even in this atmosphere? Again, I mean, on some level, I hate to say it, but this is more a matter of degree than it is a change in kind. It's just the ultimate kind of apotheosis where things have been headed in a certain corner of that caucus for a long time.

I guess the fact that it's not completely clear whether George Santos is, in fact, his real name. Just kind of sums it all up. I guess that's like the ultimate, like, well, do we even know if that's his real name? But do we actually really even know if that's his real name? Does this guy really exist? Yeah, yeah. What I think is especially funny about that is that he, that he, that he, here's the thing.

When you need to have a new name, that doesn't exactly bode well for what happened in the past. So the fact that he had to change his name from, you know, whether it was Anthony to Volder, and then turned into George Santos. The fact that you have to change your identity is usually a red flag on two. itself. But for me, it's the, it's the dog thing. It's raising, raising money for the homeless veterans dog and then that homeless veteran not getting those funds for the dog. But that's just me. In any case, we'll leave it there. I'll stop subjecting you to the, to the insanity that is the George Santos saga. So, Secretary Pete, thank you so much for taking the time.

I appreciate it. Good to be with you. Okay, now we've got the anchor at Fox L.A. and the host of California's biggest statewide political show the issue is. Also, the issue is podcast, Alex Michelson. Thanks for coming back on. Well, you know, I know on the week that you traveled to Washington to sit down with Pete Buttigieg, this is clearly the highlight of your week. This is it. So it means a lot that you also included the Transportation Secretary on my episode. Yeah. So thank you for having me. He thanks you as well. How is that? What was that like? Tell us about traveling to Washington, seeing him, sitting down with him? What his energy was like? What was that like for you? You know, it was, it was great and it was

interesting because, which I think is like a common phenomenon now, which is that we see people online. I mean, I've interviewed Pete three, four times at this point. And so you kind of feel like you already know the person because you've seen them so many times, but I realize like at some point a few minutes after meeting him that we had never actually met in person. And, but it was great. I mean, you know, a lot of everybody's relationships because we've spoken so much and done so many interviews with people, like, they are pretty much the same, you know. So I guess that's the benefit of being able to jump on all these Zoom calls. But yeah, it was great. It was a very fast trip, 24 hours in Washington, but got to go to the Department of Transportation, which was

right on par with the White House. Almost as good. Almost as good. And iconic. I mean, there are a lot of tales about all the history at the Department of Transportation, right? I'll tell you what was interesting is they did have some folks there for the video version of the interview that were able to help out very, very nicely with lights and everything like that. And I was wondering like how big the infrastructure that they had for like their media department is. And they were like, it's not, it's not very big. And it's because like the last Department of Transportation Secretary was like Elaine Chow. And so they've never had to build this up. I mean, all of a sudden they have a superstar in Pete Buttigieg. That's the DOT Secretary.

and it's difficult for them to have to keep up with that. Right. Are there, like, cars on display there or trains? Is it, like, walking into the Air and Space Museum? What is it? Is there any transportation at the Department of Transportation? There is not. It's a really new building, so it's, like, very sleek and shiny, but it looks like

an office building. It's not steeped in history the same way that when you walk into the White House it is, and you're like, oh, things have happened in this place. It's like, wow, there are good meetings happening. in this place. D-O-T. Here we go. All right.

All right. So let's talk about the story of the week, which I'm sure that you've been speaking about as well, and that is the State of the Union. So first off, did Biden meet, exceed, or underperform expectations at State of the Union? He definitely exceeded expectations. I think most Republicans would admit, if they were being honest, that he exceeded expectations. I think in part because of some of his challenges in recent years, the expectations weren't that high. He doesn't walk into it with the way that somebody would expect a Barack Obama performance or a Bill Clinton performance.

And by the way, that's on Republicans. Republicans have done a great job lowering the bar to the point that all Biden has to do is like show up and say his name and then he wins. And which was a huge thing for when George W. Bush was president, Democrats made the same mistake with him. And so if you remember the debates against Al Gore, he, you know, basically overperformed by putting a sentence together. So, but Biden didn't just look adequate. He was strong. And I think he did a lot of very smart things. It was a reminder of why Joe Biden won, which is why, which is that he has an extraordinary ability to appeal to middle class white voters.

in a way that almost nobody in the party currently does. And everything that he did, especially at the beginning, the first 30, 40 minutes of the speech, was all bipartisan stuff that was supported by Republicans that 70% of the country agrees on or more. And so he looked, especially at the beginning of the speech, like a classy adult in the room who was serious about solving problems and later in the speech made some of the other folks in the room look unserious and not serious and not that focused on solving problems. Yeah. And one of those moments, of course, was the whole Social Security Medicare moment.

But, you know, we hear so much from Republicans about how Joe Biden is too old, too senile. This moment right here with the whole Social Security thing, that wasn't scripted. You know, I followed along with the transcript of what we were hearing just to see if that moment was in there. It wasn't in there. This was a bunch of Republicans trying to object to him saying that they want to cut earned benefits like Social Security Medicare. He put them on the spot, basically making them vow not to cut them. That was a sharp moment for him. Like I don't know most people in that situation being able to do what he did on the stage that he was on with the speed with which he did it.

does this make it harder for Republicans to make that senility argument? Well, I would be surprised if during the prep for this, there was not, when they heckle, here's what you do, preparation. So that may not have been totally completely 100% off the top of his head in that moment. And that may have been a trap that they said to do that. But maybe he came up with that completely. Yeah. I mean, look, yelling, I welcome conversion.

I mean, it was... No matter what, it turned out to be a pretty good moment for him. And then you see later in the week, like Rick Scott, the Florida senator, who was one of the people who made that sort of argument, others, Ron Johnson, Mike Lee have made similar arguments about this concept of sunseting Social Security Medicare. Going back to Mitch McConnell, he's made that argument for years, even though now he's pretty much firmly in the anti-Rick Scott. And they're trying to make some arguments but what Joe Biden said in 1975, which is a little harder to make than the argument of what Rick Scott said this week. But the point being, it worked for him. I mean, in a moment, you know, you think about the State of the Union.

And 20 years ago, when we were younger, then there were fewer channels and you didn't have as many distractions on a cell phone. And, you know, basically people watch the broadcast. TV networks. And in prime time, the only thing on every broadcast TV network was the State of the Union. And so people watched it. Democrats watched it. Republicans watched it. There was nothing else on. You sat there and you could see that the speech would drive numbers in a much more dramatic way because people weren't as tribalized back then. Now, you know, the State of the Union is not going to get the kind of ratings that it did back then. A lot of

people especially on the right who don't like the president. And by the way, same thing happened with Trump, you know, on the left, just will tune out. And they have so many other options and things to do. So in today's world, you hope to get a viral moment that transcends just the live broadcast that can live on on a lot of different platforms that people can ingest pretty quickly and people get a sense of what happened. That was a viral moment. That was a moment that was good TV. It was good reality show. It was something that makes sense on Twitter, on Instagram real or Snapchat, or whatever place you're looking at other than probably true social. And so that's a really effective sort of 21st century moment for a 20th century politician.

But you know, the irony of all of this is that they handed that to him. All they had to do was not heckle him. All they had to do was shut up. Just like sit down and shut up, which is what you're supposed to do and then they wouldn't have hinted him the gift of that viral moment where now everybody left right and center are looking at this this one clip from the state of the union where he basically put him on the spot got them to vow not to touch something that they've been vying to eliminate for years and years and years and at least a few have a few have but like you know now it's going to be that much i i think this is effectively off the table and a bunch of republicans are saying look this was off the table anyway but you know you have these people who've been vying for

entitlement reform to cut earned benefits for, I mean, as long as I can remember, as long as we've been like following this stuff. In fairness, though, that is not the majority of the, of the Republican caucus, just the same way that when Republicans say, oh, Democrats are for defund the police because there's a few members that say that when the majority and the people in charge aren't. I mean, Rick Scott, who had made that play to, and argued that, you know, made pretty aggressive play to try to defeat Mitch McConnell as a majority leader or now minority leader and was roundly defeated. Yeah.

Although, you know, I would argue. I would push back and say Rick Scott was not just like one errant senator. He was the guy in charge of retaking the Senate for the Republican Party. And so, you know, when you're handed a platform like that, what you say matters. Sure. And those positions are representative of the party. And clearly, you know, objectively, he did a really bad job. Yeah.

They didn't take back the Senate. And then when he tried to get control, he lost pretty embarrassingly and was just kind of showed up by the president this week on national TV. Alex, you are firmly in the Mitch McConnell camp over here. Mitch McConnell is an amazing tactician. I mean, just the way that Nancy Pelosi is an amazing tactician. I know you and your followers do not like what he has done with that. And there's certainly an argument of whether he's responsibly used that platform, but he is very good at what he does. I don't think that there's anybody on the left who denies the effectiveness, however depraved it may be, the effectiveness of Mitch McConnell.

And by the way, Nancy Pelosi gets the same respect on the right. I mean, they can't help but admit that she's really good at her job. Well, the counterpart for Nancy Pelosi, Kevin McCarthy, had given his blessing this past month, basically, for Marjorie Telle Green to come into his ranks. She's doing her best to become the face of that party. she spent all of the state of the union effectively screaming at Joe Biden. Does this make McCarthy's life more difficult or at this point does it just not matter? I mean, Kevin McCarthy has so many problems within his conference anyway. Well, having her support makes his life easier.

Without it, without it, he would not be the speaker. But is it negated now by the difficulty of trying to contain a woman like Margie Tiller-Green who just embarrasses herself in her conference every time she opens her mouth? Well, you can't contain her. But the alternative would be he wouldn't be speaker without her. Yeah. But is it helpful for the party writ large? Is it helpful for the idea of expanding the majority?

Is it helpful for the idea of winning the Senate? Is it helpful for the idea of a Republican presidency? No. And it really, I mean, that right there kind of puts on full display like what a terrible devil's bargain Kevin McCarthy had to make. All of this, he basically, he basically did his best to sink the prospects of that party for the future. all to like consolidate power just for himself for this one what may be two year term like this fleeting moment might not even be that yeah because he he had to agree that one person can call a vote to get him out of there so um there's never been a speaker with less power than him yeah

um that being said what's his other play if you're him how else do you get the job right you don't you don't so i mean that's the that's the thing but but it goes i mean there are people with, I mean, look, the people in that party have agency. And if they didn't want to basically empower the most deluded crazies in that party, there are other options to go to. Kevin McCarthy's not the only person in the Republican conference. Now, the option would have been to team with the Democrats and to nominate a moderate Republican speaker and give the Democrats more power and control in committees and try to have the center of the Congress, um, box out the extremes on both sides and have a more moderate Congress.

And instead, you have someone like Marjorie Telle Green who basically has consolidated all of the power because of her outsized influence, not with just Kevin McCarthy, but the fact that she's the only person who's going to continue taking hostages. She and Matt Gates and the House Freedom Caucus, like those are the people who are empowered now. Okay, so more broadly, taking a step back and looking at this from a 30,000 foot view, do you think that the state of the union has any impact on Biden's 2020? re-election prospects.

Before the speech, my answer was going to be no. After the speech, I think it does. Why? I think it helps him. Because Biden's biggest challenge is the fact that he is old. He didn't seem. He didn't read as old in that speech. And the question that most Americans are going to have to have, and we've never gone through

this because we've never had a president this old, is, is this guy losing it? and can this guy handle being in the job? Which, by the way, fair question to ask if somebody is 81 going on 82 and hoping to be the president when they're 86. And when you watched him, he was in charge. He was in control. He looked and sounded like the president. He looked like somebody who was very aware of where he was and what he was doing.

And so I think that that as sort of the opening image of the Biden 2024 campaign, which clearly this was and clearly finish the job is at least what they're trying out as a slogan. And I think it went well. He looked good. And so I think when, you know, the American that isn't paying that close of attention but probably sees that viral clip somewhere and it kind of makes him look like he's showing up everybody and looks like he's the, you know, the, I think it helps him.

Yeah. Look at that. Go from cheering on Mitch McConnell to jump in the Joe Biden train. We're just giving honest, straightforward analysis. I'm not cheering on anybody. Okay. Well, the flip side of the Joe Biden re-election is the Trump DeSantis feud happening right now. Sure. Are you enjoying that? Well, I'm probably enjoying it more than Ron DeSantis is because this past week, Trump took to Truth Social and basically implied that Ron DeSantis was a pedophobic. which, you know, was... Why has pedophile become just the natural go-to for everybody?

At what point in our culture did pedophile just become the end-all be all? You know, since Elon took over Twitter and mentions have been, you know, flooded with Elon's fanboys and reply guys, I mean, even me just called a pedophile or a groomer every day. It is just the go-to... I don't understand it. It's just what they landed on. And now everyone is a pedophile. Right.

Like, it's just, it's, but anyway, Trump jumped on board and called Ronda Santis a pedophile, which is ironic too because Ronda Santis's press secretary, Christina Pushaugh, also has a raft of old tweets calling this person a pedophile, this person a groomer. Well, also. Now she's going to have to contend with these accusations for her own boss. For Trump, who literally used to hang out with Jeffrey Epstein. Yeah, yeah. And who we know, like. young women and would party with young women

and had all the this sorted history with the Miss America pageant to land on this is your lane it doesn't really doesn't really make sense but the projection is a big part of his brand and so you know in a way it kind of does work perfectly Desantis's response to this was basically

you know channeling Jeb Bush was very well I don't I don't waste my time arguing with Republicans every other Republican had tried this approach, this like, I'm going to take the high road, I'm not going to stoop to his level, I'm not going to get in the mud with Donald Trump, and every single one in the 2016 Republican primary lost.

I mean, everybody who tried that approach was taken out by him. So what are your thoughts on this? What are your thoughts on, I guess, DeSantis is the way that DeSantis chose to respond to this and the feud more broadly as we head into 2024. Well, Ron DeSantis isn't running yet. And so why would he engage with Trump now and just make him pile on more? I think Ron DeSantis is holding his fire and waiting until he's all in, which I think is probably the smart strategy.

If Ron DeSantis put out a super emotional or snarky thing back to Trump, then that becomes a bigger story. I mean, he's not even in the race yet. So why do that? There'll be plenty of time for that. I don't think most people are paying that close of attention to it yet. We're more than a year away from primaries. So I think he is doing the smart thing by not pouring more fuel on that fire. But just to play devil's advocate here, do you think that for those people who are paying attention right now,

because it's just the Republican primary voters who you have to appeal to at this point? And those people, you know, I could argue that those people are still a little bit more engaged than the normal American who's going to hopefully show up for the general election. If people are making their decisions right now and the eyes are on Ron. DeSantis, whether he wants them on him or not, and people are making that decision and deciding, like, where am I going to throw my support behind as we head into this general? Isn't this an important moment for Ron DeSantis to, like, shit or get off the pot? I don't think so. Okay.

I don't think, yeah. I mean, I think he's, look, I mean, think about what would happen if he would have done that, done what you're suggesting, right? Then it becomes a huge thing. DeSantis takes on Trump and then Trump's going to get all angry and he's going to put out more stuff and all the rest of it's like nobody's paying that close of attention right now desantis isn't a declared candidate yet he doesn't have any infrastructure in place to help him which comes with being a candidate all of the team and all the rest of it oh and by the way he's got an actual job to do

being florida governor is a real job trump is just hanging out at mara lago and playing golf all day that's true look those those books aren't going to ban themselves yeah okay so let's let's switch to what I think will be a more serious race, and that is the California Senate race. Right now, the two major declared candidates are Adam Schiff and Katie Porter. What's your take on how this is going to shake out? Because we're in kind of like an interesting moment

where both of these candidates are popular. I mean, they both... Certainly with your audience. Certainly with my audience. But, I mean, look, with a lot of Californians, like Katie Porter and Adam Schiff are no pushovers. And... Yeah.

No, this will probably be the most... interesting, closest, and most important race in California in decades. You've got two major national figures who are fundraising powerhouses, who have huge audiences in social media, who are cable news stars, and who are beloved by large swaths of the Democratic electorate, including many of the folks that listen to the No Lie podcast. And these seats don't open up that much. Feinstein's been in this seat for 30 years. Barbara Boxer was in the seat for 25 years or something like that, maybe 24. And so, you know, in California, we basically have a Democratic state. No Republican is one statewide

since 2006. So whatever Democrat emerges, whether they emerge out of the primary or the general, because in California there's a top two system where it could be Democrat versus Democrat or could be Democrat versus Republican, depending on how that all shakes out. That person's going to have huge, huge amount of power. And so it's going to be fascinating to see. Adam Schiff launched his campaign on our show, the issue is. And he is, you know, trying to claim that, you know, he's been in the center of the debates. He is more popular with the Democratic Caucus.

Nancy Pelosi already endorsed him. He's had 40 members or former or current members of Congress. Congress who have endorsed him. Katie Porter is more of a populist in the mold of Elizabeth Warren, who has already endorsed her. She's made so far stuff a little bit more about economic populism, unions, that sort of thing. She brought Lorena Gonzalez, who's one of the top union people in the whole state as her guest to the state of the union.

Schiff has leaned in a little bit more on the fight for democracy and his role on the impeachment. We expect Barbara Lee to enter the race in the next few weeks. She's no pushover either, an icon in the civil rights movement in California, an extraordinary personality who's got an amazing life story, African-American woman, Northern California, which by the way has mostly been represented statewide, with the exception of Alex Padilla, who was appointed. The senators have been from the Bay Area. Most of our statewide elected officials have been from the Bay Area. They have a lot of organizing power in the Bay Area. So it's going to be fascinating. It's going to be expensive, which is part of the reason that they are already running.

I mean, Katie Porter announced a week and a half after being sworn in. Diane Feinstein, the current senator, hasn't even said that she's retiring yet, although clearly everybody assumes she's going to be retiring because the fact that she's 89. But it is going to be something, and I'm excited to cover it more. I think the part that I'm also excited about is California, like New York, was actually, one of, one of the more disappointing states in this past cycle. And, uh, and I think that a lot of this attention in having a big race that people, people can finally get excited about will help drive people to the polls in a state that is otherwise kind of taken for granted, as opposed to

all of the success that we had in places like Michigan, places like, uh, you know, Arizona and Nevada. And part of the challenge in California, just from a strictly partisan thing, which I personally think is better for democracy, but is worse as if you're a partisan, is we have an independent redistricting process here where it is not done in a partisan way through the legislature and the congressional district lines are more fair. They're designed to be more competitive as compared to some states, many Republican states, some Democratic states too, where the legislatures draw these really weird districts in order to just make it easier for their partisan advantages. And so there are a lot of close congressional races in California. You think of it as this deeply blue state,

and it is statewide. A Democrat is going to win the Senate race. We're not at risk of losing that. But these House races, especially Katie Porter's, which will now open up because she's running, you know, Democrats are in real danger of losing that seat. Shiff's seat is about as safe Democratic as it gets. Same with Barbara Lee's. So there will be fresh blood in that. But even those races, I mean, Adam Schiff's district, I think there's already six or seven candidates that have announced for that, including Ben Savage from The Boy Meets World. And who knows if we get Corey Matthews in the house, that would be something. But a lot of sort of big names, local politics, not the names of Adam Schiff or Katie Porter that are going to be competing for that because those seats don't open up that much. People end up in those congressional seats for 30, 40 years.

Well, let me ask you this. What do you think happens to those, you know, the loser out of this? race. Like, let's say, you know, whether it's Adam Schiff or Katie Porter or Barbara Lee, we're going to lose two of them out of Congress. And then where do those people go from there? Do you think that, and this is something I had asked Adam Schiff during our interview a week or two ago. So I was lucky, lucky enough to get him just after your. Yeah. Staying. Get in line, baby. Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, this idea of if it becomes clear that one is the runaway favorite, do the other two drop out and run again for their own respective

house seats? Well, it has to become clear very early in terms of filing. People have asked like, well, if they lose the primary, can they run in the general? And that's not the way that it works here based off of the way the system is. I think they'll be fine. Well, first up, Barbara Lee probably would retire. I mean, she's, you know, in her late 70s. And Katie Porter and Adam Schiff are big stars.

I mean, I would imagine that either one of them could get jobs within the administration if there's a Democratic administration. Katie Porter, the vibe I get from her, just being around her, I think if she wins this Senate race, I wouldn't be surprised if she runs for president one day because she's got that vibe. And Adam Schiff, who knows?

I mean, I could see him being a secretary or an ambassador or something. I mean, they're really powerhouse politicians who are incredibly smart and insightful and have been really good at doing what they do well. I know they both are polarizing figures on the right. There's a lot of people that especially hate Adam Schiff on the right, but Adam Schiff has been very effective in his party at doing what he does. Want to go on record and make your prediction now for what's going to happen? No, not only because I think it's stupid to make a prediction. I honestly have no idea, which is what makes it so interesting.

I mean, it is very rare, certainly in our state, to have a race where you honestly don't know how it's going to end. I honestly don't know how it's going to end, which is why it'll be so fun to cover. So let's switch gears a little bit to your show. This past week, you had a number of really interesting interviews, including George Clooney. Can you talk a little bit about what you talked about this past week? So George Clooney is doing something really interesting that I think could be a model for. for the whole country, which is why I think it's worth talking about here.

He teamed with the L.A. Unified School District, which is one of the largest in the country, and also where 80% of the kids live below the poverty line. 80% live below the poverty line. And he started this academy, a magnet academy in downtown Los Angeles, that is a public-private partnership where kids are trained to work in the entertainment industry, not necessarily as actors or writers or directors, but all of the quote unquote below the line jobs, all the technical jobs, the graphics supervisor, the grips, the editors, there are 60,000 of those jobs open in L.A. alone. And a lot of these people don't even know that they exist or don't have the technical skills to do it. So he teamed not only with the labor unions and NABED and all

the rest of them are a part of it, but he teamed with CAA and Paramount. and my parent company, Fox and Disney and Netflix and all of them and brought them all together to help mentor these kids who would never get an experience like this and totally completely transform their lives. And this idea is something I was with him when he was with the Secretary of Education, Miguel Cardona, with the second gentleman, Doug Emhoff.

And both of them see this model as a potential national model, not only for the entertainment industry, but why not do this for nurses? Why not do this for different trade guilds? Why not do this for other industries where you get people trained in public school at no cost to them to really be ready for the jobs that are available? Will I.M. is doing something really interesting from the Black Eyed Peas.

He's also partnering with the LAUSD to help sponsor in every middle school in the whole district, the biggest district in the country. a robotics program to help them learn robotics and coding and building and all that to help prepare for the jobs of the future. And so are there lessons that can be learned on how we can help all of our kids and bring industry into it? I think that's really fascinating. So we'll have that George Clooney's story debuts on our, we have a Super Bowl broadcast this weekend. But next week on the issue is we'll do a full deep dive with Clooney into that.

And where will we be able to check that? out. So I've got a YouTube page, YouTube.com slash Alex Michelson. Also, the issue is podcast. Just search for the issue is. The issue is also streams on Tobey. If anybody gets that, that's a totally free service. And then you can watch in California, in Los Angeles, at least, it airs on Friday nights at 1030 on Fox 11. Alex, who you root in for in the Super Bowl? This will already, we'll already have an answer to this for when most people listen, but who you root in for this weekend. Well, you know, the point spread right now is only one and a half. So it's supposed to be one the closest ever. Some $16 billion are being bet on this. I'm not betting because I don't,

I don't have it. Just like the Senate race, I could see it going either way. I think the Eagles probably have a better team, but I like the Chiefs more. I like Patrick Mahomes, so I'm rooting for him. I think the Eagles are going to win, but I wouldn't be surprised if Mahomes pulled it out, and I hope he does. Yeah, that sounds good. I think I can agree with that one. I don't really have a dog in this fight. Football ended when the Giants were kicked out. Yeah. See, when are you going to like become a real L.A. guy and jump on the Rams bad wagon or even the Chargers? I mean, can you be like one of the few Charger fans? They need some help here in terms of that. If it was once the Giants are out, I would rather

just not watch football. Well, I have at least a little bit of. Then you haven't been watching for a while. A little bit of. No, exactly. I haven't seen a whole. I guess you don't watch a lot of playoffs then. I haven't seen a playoff game in about 10 years. Not 11 or 12 years. So, all right. Well, Alex, thank you, as always, for coming on. It's so great chatting with you. Great chatting with you, too, Brian.

And congrats on the trip to Washington. Very cool. Thanks again to Alex. One quick favor, if you have friends or family who listen to podcasts, but don't listen to this one, please consider recommending this one. Word of mouth is the single best way for me to get new listeners, and I would really appreciate it.

Okay, that's it for this episode. Talk to you next week. You've been listening to No Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen, produced by Sam Graber, music by Wellesie, interviews captured and edited for YouTube and Facebook by Nicholas Nicotera, and recorded in Los Angeles, California. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe on your preferred podcast app. Feel free to leave a five-star rating and a review, and check out Brian Tyler Cohen.com for links to all of my other channels.