No Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen - Supreme Court pulls absurd stunt for Trump

Episode Date: June 23, 2024

Today we’re gonna talk about the Supreme Court pushing Trump’s immunity ruling to the final week of decisions this term and the impacts of doing so. And Brian interviews former federal prosecutor and current candidate for the House, Will Rollins, about the sentence he expects to see for Trump and some surprise good news in his own race for Congress.Support Will Rollins: https://willrollinsforcongress.com/Shop merch: https://briantylercohen.com/shopYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/briantylercohenTwitter: https://twitter.com/briantylercohenFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/briantylercohenInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/briantylercohenPatreon: https://www.patreon.com/briantylercohenNewsletter: https://www.briantylercohen.com/sign-upWritten by Brian Tyler CohenProduced by Sam GraberRecorded in Los Angeles, CASee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Today we're going to talk about the Supreme Court pushing Trump's immunity decision to the final week of decisions and the impacts in doing so. And I interview former federal prosecutor and current candidate for the House, Will Rollins, about the sentence he expects to see for Trump and some surprise good news in his own race for Congress. I'm Brian Tyler Cohen, and you're listening to No Lie. This past week, Thursday and Friday, the Supreme Court released a handful of rulings. We were all bracing for ruling on the presidential immunity case where the Supreme Court, corruptly decided to take up this case to determine the very difficult issue of whether or not a president has immunity to commit criminal acts while in office. In other words, the Supreme Court decided that they needed to take a swing at whether or not a president is a king. Not that they would leave the issue alone because it was correctly decided by a trial court and an appeals court.

No, they apparently felt it was necessary for them to weigh in on this issue too. And yet, as of this past week, they opted not to rule on it, meaning that we'll get an answer this week, the final days of the term. And in the immediate aftermath of no ruling on immunity, there was a predictable uproar, considering, as I mentioned before, it is bad enough that they took this case in the first place, much less that they've waited so long to release this ruling. And yet, that's the part that I think everybody's missing.

The whole point of the Supreme Court taking up this case in the first place, which, again, is a case that did not need further adjudication, is because it would hand-trump the delay that he was so desperate for. And so, by design, there would be no way for them to release a ruling sooner because the whole point from day one was delay. This is the culmination of that strategy. And the final step of that strategy will be if the Supreme Court decides not to rule for or against Trump, but rather if they take a third option and they remand it back to the trial court for further proceedings. And this way, Judge Chutkin will have to preside over a bunch of useless technical questions whose only purpose is to burn up time,

all of which, of course, serves Trump's ultimate goal. to ensure that he doesn't stand trial for his crimes before the election with the hope that he wins in November and then pardons himself, which I'm sure this Supreme Court will find some excuse to allow because if Samuel Alito wants to sleep in the same bed as Martha Ann or if Clarence Thomas in the same bed as Ginny, then they'll make sure to figure out a way. And granted, I don't know if a remand to the trial court for further proceedings

is what's going to happen, but it certainly is my guess, and would all but ensure that Trump doesn't stand trial before the election. With that said, if the Supreme Court shows even a modicum of integrity and makes what would apparently be the very courageous decision to declare that a president is not, in fact, a king in this country, nor is he above the law, then it is possible that this case could go to trial before November. Judge Chutkin promised Trump 88 days of prep time before, of course, it was taken out of her hands. So if the Supreme Court rules at the last week of June that Trump loses the appeal, we could see Judge Chutkin get this thing to trial at the end of civilization. September or the beginning of October. He could literally be on trial on Election Day or even be convicted again by Election Day. In fact, on the off chance that the Supreme Court opts to rule correctly and ends this national embarrassment that is the consideration of Trump's

absolute immunity. I totally believe that Judge Shutkin would have a predicate to ignore her previous promise of 88 days lead time before trial because while that was made in good faith, Trump's actions since then have not been. He has given himself months and months. and months of unnecessary and misguided delay, that he ostensibly could be using, by the way, to prepare for this trial. The 88 days that Chutkin gave was an offer that was done in good faith, but my contention here is that Trump surrendered his right to good faith

when he squandered away with absurd dilatory tactics like the one he's employing right now. So my hope would be that Judge Chutkin now gives zero leeway to Trump and instead recognizes the urgency, the importance of getting this thing to trial immediately considering every day it's not on trial is another day that Trump will seek to delay it and another day of justice denied to the American people

who deserve to know whether they will be casting their ballot for a two-time convicted felon as opposed to simply a one-time convicted felon and I recognize that most of us who hear that understand that one conviction is normally enough but for a lot of folks this DC case will be especially telling and so voters deserve to know what the verdict is before they head to the polls in November.

So all eyes will turn to the Supreme Court this week But remember, this is worth repeating I know I've said this before, I'm going to say it again At the end of the day, it is not on the judges to save us It's not on attorneys or prosecutors or even other politicians What happens in November is on us And on our ability to reach our circles of people And get them all involved.

I'm not asking everybody to do everything But I am asking you to do something And even if it only feels like it'll matter on the margins, the smallest of margins, the margins are exactly where these races are won. Next up is my interview with Will Rollins. But first, a reminder that my new book, Shameless, is now available for pre-order. I'm really proud of the way it turned out. It's got a ton of useful tips to keep you engaged.

It gives a full explanation of how we got here and more importantly, how we get out of this mess. So if you haven't yet pre-ordered and you want to support the work that I do, please make sure to place your pre-order. I'll put the link in the show notes of this episode, or, You can go to Brian Tyler Cohen.com slash book. Okay, here's my interview with Will Rollins. Now we've got former federal prosecutor and current Democratic candidate for Congress's 41st congressional district, Will Rollins.

Will, thanks for coming back on. Great to be back. Thanks, Brian. So right up top, we are just a couple of weeks out from Trump's sentencing in New York and his criminal trial there. I mentioned that you were a prosecutor. Based on your experience, do you think that Donald Trump is more likely to get a prison sentence or a sentence of probation when it's finally handed down on July 11th?

I mean, I think you've got to look at his behavior during the trial and his willingness to accept responsibility because, you know, he had an interview with a probation officer recently and in federal sentencings, right, the judge has to consider a variety of factors. It's similar in New York State Court. And one of those considerations is whether the person is remorseful, whether the person actually has respect for the law, whether the person actually won't recidivate, commit additional crimes. And the judge can also consider whether they're currently charged with additional crimes. And if you look at all of those factors in this particular case, you've got still outstanding criminal cases pending against him involving incredibly serious criminal conduct, the theft of classified national security information pending in Florida right now, obviously the attempt to overthrow the entire United States government.

And then you've got the seriousness of the offense in New York, which, you know, the right is trying to act like it's not a big deal. and maybe in other business fraud context, that kind of a crime would really qualify as the Class E felony, the lowest, the quote, lowest degree of felony that there is. But you have to look at the unique facts and circumstances in that particular case. And in his case, that fraud related to an attempt to suppress information from the American people days before a presidential election. And it's also just not fair for the American people and other candidates, running for federal office or state office to have a competitor cheat that system. We have campaign finance disclosure rules for a reason because we believe voters are entitled to know certain information about candidates and how money, more importantly, how money is being spent in the system so that it is not corrupted by foreign adversaries or special interest groups above what those limits are. And that to me is really what the crux of this case is.

And I think because there has been no remorsefulness, because there have been attacks on the judge, his family, the rule of law, witnesses in the case, violation of court orders, contempt, all of that really in a normal criminal case. And I just say take Donald Trump out of it. Think about it as if it were a governor, right? A governor who was facing these charges in either political party, that person's going to be getting a prison sentence. Okay. A slightly different issue, but still related to Trump, you know, is the issue of his mental state. And that's kind of surged into the national spotlight lately. He convened a group of business leaders recently to kind of shore up their support.

And instead, he left them even less likely to support him because he wasn't able to basically keep one thought in his head at a time. And then, of course, we have the stuff that we all can see from him claiming that Nikki Haley was in charge of the Capitol on January 6th, that Jeb Bush got us involved in the war in the Middle East, that you need ID to buy bread, that he was the person to discover that U.S. spells us, and, you know, the list goes on and on. So where do you stand in terms of Trump's mental state and how it'll impact a second term? I think it's a testament to how bad it's gotten that all of some of the richest people in the United States got into one room, begging for an excuse to support this guy because they want their taxes to go down, and they left alarmed.

And that tells you how bad it's gotten. Because even folks who are on Wall Street understand that if you have an unstable person in the Oval Office with access to the nuclear codes, if you have somebody who's willing to ignite armed conflict around the globe, who's going to dredge up conflict, who's going to be someone who doesn't support NATO, our strongest post-World War II alliance, one of the greatest military alliances in the history of humankind that's brought in peace and prosperity to the United States and Western Europe. Europe, that can have a dramatic market effect. So even Wall Street is recognizing that this guy is not good for their bottom line. And they should because under this administration, there are record highs in the stock market. And I think that that's a testament to just how bad it's gotten.

Right. I mean, the one thing that the market does not like, does not appreciate, does not respond well to is volatility. That is basically what Donald Trump is promising from, you know, from the small stuff to going out there and promising to eliminate the Constitution and to be a dictator. That will not, I can promise you, if you have these millionaires and billionaires who, to your exact point are walking in that room looking for any excuse to get the tax cut that they so desperately want for even them to recognize how bad his instability would be on the market, it kind of is a blinking red light for the rest of us. Will, what does it say that right-wing media then needs to rely on deceptive practices like

cheap fakes and poorly cropped videos and snippets of videos to basically carry water for Trump then. Lack of moral courage among journalists, unfortunately. And I think it just tells you how much we need people with honor to be in all different positions in leadership in the United States, including leaders of major networks, leaders of some of these tech companies, leaders of people who, you know, the character of leadership that really revolves around the idea of communicating fact, of divisiveness for the sake of just getting clicks, right, and generating more revenue and helping to fund a political party. And I think that it is terrifying that we're in a moment

where we've got people at some of the top watched cable networks in this country who are trying to create a narrative that is misleading to their own viewership. And we saw this with the Dominion lawsuit, right? But unfortunately, even with Dominion getting a huge judgment against Fox News, the network is continuing to push misleading information that is really aimed at fueling the fire of the base so that they can sell more ads on TV. And I think that's just a lack of integrity and moral leadership. And it reinforces why it's so important that everybody who cares about the future of this republic, whether you're in journalism, whether you're in politics, law enforcement, you step up and do the right thing and honor your profession, honor the

constitution and make sure that this democracy continues in 2024. It also shows contempt for their own audience. I mean, these are people who have people who tune in because ostensibly, purportedly, they trust these folks on right-wing media. So, like, you know, these right-wing media hosts may claim that they hate the Democrats, but really, at this point, there's no one that they're showing more contempt for than their own viewers. Okay, so let's move over to your race now because we've got a lot of news as far as that

race is concerned. This is California's 41st congressional district. A very close swing seat. You're running against Republican Ken Calvert. Talk about a huge endorsement first off that you just secured and why that one is so impactful. Yeah, so we just got endorsed by the Palm Springs Police Officers Union, which was huge. I'm in a purple district. It's a 50-50 voter registration, evenly split right down the middle, 90,000 independents. Of course, my career was in federal law enforcement before I ran, worked as a federal prosecutor on cases involved. involving MS-13, the Sinaloa cartel ultimately prosecuted some of the people who attacked the U.S. Capitol on January 6th, worked alongside Republicans and Democrats in that job. And so it was a huge deal for us to

get the support of a police union in this race. And this is a union that had previously endorsed Calvert in 2022, but we did a lot of hard work to get out there, even when folks, you know, may have supported my opponent in the past or traditionally might endorse people in one political party, I don't care about that. I mean, as a candidate, I want to make sure I'm in the rooms where maybe people don't agree with me. Maybe they previously voted or supported Ken Calvert, but they're actually looking for a change. And I think with this police union supporting us, it's been just a tremendous lift for our campaign

and a signal to voters that this district is going to flip. Will, what does it do to folks who want to, like, accuse you of being the usual radical, communist, Marxist, leftist, Democrat when you then say that you. you were the one who actually prosecuted the very cartels that everybody else says that Democrats are embracing with open arms. Yeah, it's a reminder that when the GOP tells you that they're tough on crime, you've got to look at their records too, right? Because there are a lot of us on the Democratic side of the aisle who are in the middle, reasonable people who believe in funding federal law enforcement, but I'm running against a guy who believes that we should

defund the FBI, who has said that the FBI has been infiltrated by rot. And most people in Riverside County think that the FBI actually should be investigating terrorism, should be investigating bank robberies, should be investigating cartels. And when you've got a member of Congress who's voting to cut funding from those federal agencies, as Calvert did at McCarthy's direction when he was still Speaker of the House, one of his last acts, and also voted to cut funding from border patrol, it just tells you that this narrative that's being spun by some of the right-wing organizations that we were just talking about is so false. And I'm thrilled to have the support of a law enforcement union that recognizes what my career has meant to protecting

our communities and also drawing the contrast between somebody who actually worked in law enforcement and somebody who has completely sold his soul in service of one man and in violation of his oath of office. Sold his soul to one man who also just so happens to be a convicted felon to add insult to injury there. So it is Pride Month right now. You are running to represent your district that would include Palm Springs, California, which of course, has a huge LGBT population. Talk about Ken Calvert's past as it relates to the LGBT population. And also, explain to me how the hell then they are still represented by a guy like this. Yeah, it's pretty unbelievable. Calvert started his career in the early 1990s by

outing Mark Takano. Mark was not out to his family. They were running in a competitive congressional election in the early 90s. Calvert sent out homophobic mailers across the district and ultimately beat Ticano by just a few hundred votes. Tocano, of course, went on to become the first openly gay man ever elected to Congress from California. Calbert then went on to vote against letting us serve in the military, voted against letting us adopt kid, voted against the Matthew Shepard and James Bird Jr. Hate Crimes Bill. And he now, unfortunately, represents one of the gayest cities in the United States.

And if I'm elected, I'll be the first outperson ever from law enforcement to serve in the U.S. House of representatives. And I'm really proud of being able to do that because I grew up, you know, wanting to enlist in the military after 9-11, don't ask, don't tell was still in place, had to find a different path into national security and ultimately got that job, which I had loved and wanted to stay in for a long time until people like Calvert voted to decertify the last election and got me into this race. So I'm really looking forward to kicking his butt in November. Second part of that question, how is this guy still in office? How do you represent one of the gay cities in California in the country and still managed to stay in Congress.

It's unbelievable. And I think even, you know, setting aside the way that the district lines have changed recently and now the dynamics in our community and in Palm Springs, since 1992, his net worth has gone up by $20 million in Congress. He's somebody who has been ranked at the top of the list of most corrupt members of Congress by nonpartisan ethics watchdogs. His own Republican colleagues tried to keep him off the Appropriations Committee when he eventually got onto it. And that tells you just how red this district used to be and how dramatically it's changed to now where we've got this 50-50 split in registration. And so when I'm out there talking to voters, I'm talking about banning members of Congress from trading stock and using their position to benefit themselves and their own real estate investments. I'm talking about a lifetime ban on lobbying by former members of Congress.

I'm talking about ending citizens united, so we get dark money out of politics. And that has resonated with voters across party lines. I don't really know how to wrap my head around being one of the most corrupt members of Congress in this Congress. I don't know what you actually have to do to be considered one of the most corrupt when the baseline is like is the Congress that we're seeing right now. What's it like when you're on the campaign trail talking to folks in Palm Springs, for example, do most of them not know who Ken Calvert is?

like how is it broken down in terms of when you talk to folks out there, when they find out that they're being represented by a corrupt homophobe? Well, one of the advantages of losing, which I did in 2022, is that you actually get a chance to know where the Democrats are who did not vote, who did not know what had happened to their congressional district. And so the reason it's become so competitive in 2024 is we had a four-point race in the midterms. But I had people coming up to me after that election and saying, hey, I didn't even know we had a chance to beat Ken Calvert until I saw CNN counting your name on the ticker for a full week after the election. And that kind of earned media, you can't buy that,

right? And so that has put us on the map in a way that's very, very exciting, especially for people not just in Palm Springs, who were represented by Raul Ruiz for a long time, who was a great representative for the Coachella Valley and then suddenly woke up one morning to find themselves in Ken Calvert's district, but places like Corona, Lake Elson, or Meneffi, who have been represented by him for three decades and are really craving change. And I've seen even Republican city council members who have come up to me and said, you know what, thank you so much for making this guy work. He never even answered my calls because we were in such a red district that he took the seat for granted and he wasn't working, you know? Well, I know that we have one last piece of good news here

and that is the polling that came out recently. So can you talk about that? Yeah. So this was a great poll we had. come out in May, it shows us with a one-point lead cold open head-to-head against Calvert, which means before voters know anything about either one, before they're given additional information in the poll, we've got a one-point lead among likely voters, which means that our messaging is sinking in, which means that even though I've still only got 50 to 60 percent name ID in this district, I'm leading him among likely voters with more room to grow. And he's got almost 80 to 90% name ID and is behind the challenger. And that tells us.

us that come November, if we can get the resources that we need to communicate with voters, we are going to flip this seat. And I think we're going to be able to do it by a six-point margin. And are you able to say how that one-point advantage for you changes at the end of, you know, at the end of the voters knowing who you are and knowing who he is? Yeah, the lead grows. We have a several-point lead. The more information voters get about both candidates. And I think when they see the contrast of somebody who worked in law enforcement versus somebody who, again, ranked at the top of the list of one of the most corrupt members. And, you know, Fox News did a seven-minute documentary in the mid-2000s about his use of earmarks

to benefit his own personal real estate investments. And when you tell voters about what his real record is, it almost becomes this nonpartisan issue. It's like, okay, well, I might not always vote for Democrats, or I might have previously voted for Calvert or I might have previously even voted for Donald Trump. But now that I'm educated about what my member of Congress has actually done since he was first elected, I'm going to go with the new guy because 32 years of corruption is enough. And we've seen that in our polling. And it's really promising for November. I got two questions to finish off here. How can we help your campaign both financially and non-financially? And why is it important for those who are looking to donate to donate early as opposed to later?

So you can go to will Rollins for Congress.com. There is a donate link on our website. You can also sign up to volunteer. If you're in Southern California, we need your help knocking doors. This is one of the seats that could decide the entire control of the U.S. House of Representatives. We only need four more, and this is one of the ones we can flip in Southern California. It's a great pickup opportunity for our party. And the more that we can raise earlier in this race, the better able we are to communicate with those undecided voters and people in the western part of my district.

those cities in Southern California and Riverside County like Corona, Lake Elsinore, Menafee, which is part of the L.A. Media Market. And what we saw in the last campaign is I beat him by 20 points in the Coachella Valley, where we were actually able to communicate with voters. But on the western part, which is the L.A. medium market, one of the most expensive in the entire country, I had lower name IDs. So the more we can raise, the more likely it is we can communicate. We can get our GOTV program, continuing to go up and running and knock on the doors of those Democrats who didn't show up in 2022. And just more broadly, just for folks watching, it's also important to get these, these things going early because the quicker that Will can define his opponent, Ken Calvert,

means that Ken Calvert won't be able to define Will. And I think that's especially important because Republicans really thrive in an environment where they're able to misdefine Democrats that they're running against. So again, we'll put the link right here on this screen and also in the post description of this video. If you're listening on the podcast, we'll put it in the show notes of this episode. Will, thank you so much for taking the time and best luck in the campaign trail. Thanks so much, Brian. Really appreciate it. Thanks again to Will. That's it for this episode. Talk to you next week. You've been listening to No Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen. Produced by Sam Graber, music by Wellsey, and interviews edited for YouTube

by Nicholas Nicotera. If you want to support the show, please subscribe on your preferred podcast app and leave a five-star rating in a review. And as always, you can find me at Brian Tyler Cohen on all of my other channels, or you can go to Brian Tyler Cohen.com to learn more. Thank you.