On Purpose with Jay Shetty - ⁠Lewis Howes: The Scarcity Belief That’s Blocking You from Making Money & How to Feel Rich Even When You’re Broke

Episode Date: March 10, 2025

Have you ever avoided looking at your finances? If money were a person, how would you describe your relationship with it? Today, Jay welcomes back his long time friend, Lewis Howes, a New York Times bestselling author, entrepreneur, keynote speaker, and former professional athlete. He is the host of The School of Greatness podcast, one of the top-ranked business and self-development shows in the world, where he interviews some of the most influential leaders in business, wellness, and personal growth. The conversation highlights key principles for transforming one's financial mindset, including the power of awareness, gratitude, and generosity. Jay and Lewis examine how early experiences with money influence current financial behaviors and emphasize the importance of developing a mindset of abundance rather than scarcity. By recognizing and reshaping these beliefs, financial opportunities can be approached with clarity and confidence. Lewis emphasizes on the distinction between making money easy and chasing easy money. While many seek quick financial success, they explore the pitfalls of short-term thinking and the long-term benefits of building sustainable wealth through skill development, strategic planning, and emotional resilience. The concept of mapping out financial goals is introduced as a way to create structure and direction in money management.   In this interview, you'll learn: How to Identify and Change Your Money Beliefs How to Develop Awareness Around Your Financial Habits How to Shift from a Scarcity Mindset to an Abundance Mindset How to Invest in Yourself to Build Long-Term Financial Success How to Create a Clear Financial Plan for Stability and Growth How to Use Energy, Passion, and Curiosity as Valuable Currency   Financial freedom isn’t just about earning more—it’s about breaking free from limiting beliefs, embracing abundance, and making intentional choices that align with long-term success.    With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty   Join over 750,000 people to receive my most transformative wisdom directly in your inbox every single week with my free newsletter. Subscribe here.   Join Jay for his first ever, On Purpose Live Tour! Tickets are on sale now. Hope to see you there!   What We Discuss: 00:00 Intro 01:06 Awareness Around Money and Finances 06:23 How to Get Out of Debt 09:44 How to Attract Financial Abundance 14:28 Rewire Your Brain to Earn More Money 16:22 The Mindset Habit to Unlock Abundance 20:11 Create an Opportunity to Showcase Your Value 27:08 3 Skills to Create Valuable Connection 33:41 Building a Foundation for Your Dream Career 35:44 Can You Manifest Money? 41:01 What’s Your Relationship with Money? 48:32 Generosity Attracts Abundance 53:10 Lessons from Quick and Easy Money 57:55 Invest in Your Self Growth 01:00:51 Money Cant Solve All Problems   Episode Resources: Lewis Howes | Website Lewis Howes | TikTok Lewis Howes | Instagram  Lewis Howes | Youtube Lewis Howes | Facebook  Lewis Howes | LinkedIn Lewis Howes | X Make Money Easy: Create Financial Freedom and Live a Richer LifeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hi, I'm Bob Pitman, Chairman and CEO of iHeart Media. I'm excited to share my podcast with you, Math and Magic, Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing. Make sure to check out my recent episode with legendary musician and philanthropist, Jewel. I didn't want a million dollars, I wanted a career. I wanted a way to figure out how to do something that I loved for the rest of my life.

Join me as we uncover innovations in data and analytics, the math, and the ever-important creative spark, the magic. Listen to Math & Magic, stories from the frontiers of marketing on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Calling all 9-9ers, now streaming. It's the more better podcast with two episodes of Brooklyn Nine-Nine Fun. Host Stephanie Beatriz and Melissa Fumero welcome former castmates Chelsea Peretti and Joe Lattrullio for one episode each to laugh and swap stories. Like, Andre would always be like, trying something, they're like, do less.

Do less. Do less. Do less all the time. But then some of the biggest things were the biggest hits, like Vindication, remember? Listen to more better with Stephanie and Melissa on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Mi gente hermosa, Wilmer Valderrama. Yo soy Freddy Rodriguez, host of the new podcast,

Dos Amigos. In this series, we candidly reflect on our careers, life, art, and everything in between. And each episode emanates from our very own Speak Easy, and it features us talking about pivotal moments, hilarious agnitodes, and invaluable collaborations that helped us become who we are today. Listen to Dos Amigos Thursdays on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey everyone, it's Jay Shetty, and I'm thrilled to announce my podcast tour. For the first time ever, you can experience on purpose in person. Join me in a city near you for meaningful insightful conversations with surprise guests. It could be a celebrity, top wellness expert or a CEO or business leader. We'll dive into experiences designed to experience

growth, spark learning and build real connections. I can't wait to meet you. There are a limited number of VIP experiences for a private Q and A, intimate meditation, and a meet and greet with photos. Tickets are on sale now. Head to jsheddy.me forward slash tour and get yours today. Irrelevant of whether you have money or not. When you are poor, when you're broke,

when you're struggling financially, it feels really hard to feel abundant and rich. But in order to get out of it, it's not feeling worse about it. It's starting to feel better about me, better about my values, my character, my kindness, my generosity, and seeing how can I add value to others?

How can I get into a richness inside of me to serve and take care of me at the same time? The number one health and wellness podcast. Jay Shetty. Jay Shetty. The one, the only, Jay Shetty. The world in which we're living today doesn't seem to distribute wealth

in a way that allows people to access it. Some people have been set up really badly. They had poor access to education. They didn't really know what jobs were available. People are working really, really hard and not taking that much home. People are coming at it from a place of pain, of desperation, of stress. So everyone already knows that money is stressful. And your first point here is make money easy.

Yes. And so I want to ask you, when someone's coming at money, our relationship with money is already at a place, kind of like finding love. We're desperate for it. We're stressed by it. We're paralyzed by it. We feel the pressure for it. What do you do when you're feeling all of that? What's the first thing you need to do?

Step one is you need awareness. And again, you probably say this so often and people probably heard this so frequently. But if you don't have awareness on your attachment style towards money and how your nervous system is when you receive money or when money leaves you, when you have to pay your bills or give money away. I want people to create just a scenario of awareness around how you feel and how you think when you receive money, when you pay money, when you look at your bank account, when you open your purse or your wallet and just notice, how do I feel? Do I have shallow breathing?

Do I feel relaxed? Do I feel anxious? Do I feel scarce? Do I feel abundant? Just step one is have awareness on how do I feel and how do I think about my money. The money I have, the money that's coming in, and the money that's going out. That's step one. And when you can just have awareness around it, you can start to say, is my relationship the one that I want to be having?

Do I feel really secure around money? If not, okay, what's something I can think about? First, let me think about my money story. The story of my life around money. We grow up as kids and we watch our parents in their relationship. We tend to develop the relationship style of our parents, unless we learn how to heal as a teenager, and have

some type of breakthrough. We're creating some type of attachment style based on what we see with our parents. But think about all the conversations your parents had around money. And if your parents didn't have a secure relationship, if they fought, did they fight about money? Were you involved in the conversation about how expensive things were about your school or sports or programs that they had to pay for that can afford? Did they argue?

Did they have challenges? Did they get divorced? Money is one of the biggest reasons people get divorced. It's one of the biggest arguments in marriage as well. So just notice is my nervous system is my body is my energy or my thoughts stressed out around money. Do I feel scarce or do I feel abundant? That's kind of step one. And then step two is understanding your money story.

Cause when you can reflect on your money story, you can see what your money personality style is today. And for many years, and we can talk about both of us thinking about our past for many years, I didn't understand money growing up. We didn't have a lot growing up. We weren't completely poor, but I wasn't as well off as the other kids in my class. So I always felt a little bit beneath everyone else. And so my belief system was around that. I'm just a little bit under everyone else. Everyone else is doing a little bit better than us. Sure. We have a home and I'm going

to school, but everyone's got rollerblades. I'm in sneakers. People have Nintendo, I don't have one. I'm reading a book. Whatever it is. It was like I was a little bit beneath and that started to shape my story, my personality style. So I felt very insecure around money and when I got it I got really excited but I didn't know what to do with it. So I was also like afraid, I was insecure, and I was just unsure of it and it really started to shape my personality style. Now So I was also like afraid, I was insecure, I was just unsure of it. And it really started to shape my personality style. Now when I was in my teen years, my dad started to make more money and started to teach me a little bit, but I was still like just, I want to be a teenager. I don't want to think about this stuff. It seems confusing. I just

want to have fun. In my twenties, when I got done playing football, I went to go pursue football, got injured, I was on my sister's couch for a year and a half and I had no money. And I just felt like, how am I gonna make this work? How am I gonna make money? I don't know what my skills are, I don't know what my talents are. This is in 2008 when the economy was crashing.

So it kind of felt like it is right now, with inflation going up so much right now and people worried about money in the future I didn't understand and I needed to find money mentors to start teaching me how to learn about how I can receive money and Spend it in a more efficient way and that was kind of the journey of me starting to figure this out But if we don't have the tools or the money knowledge They're always gonna be stuck in our money story as our money personality style.

And so it's getting to understand awareness. How does it feel when I receive money and I spend money? What is the history of the story around money for me? Did my parents fight? Did I feel anxious around money? I used to steal a lot when I was a kid. So I had like some wounds around money. I had people steal a lot when I was a kid. So I had like some wounds around money.

I had people steal from me as well. So I just had all these different wounds that I had to address and get clear on. And I had to learn how to start healing those money wounds. And again, I know this is the place to come to create more wholeness, to be healthier in your life, and to become more healed. And that's what I want for people

is to start to reflect on their money story. Write down some of these things so you have awareness first off on why you think and feel the way you do around money. Yeah. Then you can start to see how your personality style towards money now is either helping you create more abundance or keeping you in scarcity and lack. And from there, we can start to have some breakthroughs. Yeah. Let's talk about all three because as I'm listening to you, I'm thinking that for most of us, when we get aware, we actually realize we don't even want to look at our finances.

No. Right? That's how we all feel because we're so scared and there's been such a fear built around money that it's like, I don't even want to know because I'm so scared. Now, when I get my paycheck, I'm thinking, Oh God, I hope this covers my rent, my groceries, my bills, whatever else I've got to cover. And then that becomes your stress point. And then you're thinking, Oh gosh, I haven't got enough to spend on this thing

that I really wanted to do, or I wanted to do something for my kids or whatever it may be. So now there's stress. And so I think for most people, when you actually get awareness, you start realizing it's stress. And it's never enough. And it's never enough. I'm never making enough.

And also I've got a hundred thousand in student loan debt. I have this other credit card because I wanted to go on a trip or I had a medical expense that would, unexpected that came up. Like so many people are struggling to be figuring out how to get out of debt. They have this weight that's carrying them back,

but they still wanna feel like they're free to live a life of their dreams. They wanna be able to go on a trip with a friend a few times a year. They wanna go to those expensive concerts. They wanna have fun still, but they're unfortunately in a lot of debt. So there's something that's pulling them back

as they're trying to go forward. And they feel like there's no way to break free. They think about the rising costs of eggs, the inflation, how everything is just constant. You can't afford a home anymore. All these things seem impossible to break through, but people want to feel free, but they don't feel emotionally free because of all the baggage they have in their life. And that's what I want people to start to feel is how can you feel emotionally free so that your money can come to you effortlessly

and when it leaves you, it's not a bad thing. And the more we relax, the more we can receive. And so if I'm tight and I'm always anxious or I'm not willing to look at my bank account because I'm afraid of what's in there, how are we able to receive more and spend more freely? And I think for many years I was able to, I learned how to make money, but I didn't learn how to spend money. And so I just hoarded it because I

was afraid to go back being broke on my sister's couch. I didn't want to go be broke again. So I just stashed it away at my bank account and just like, okay, I'm going to just wait for it to grow. So I feel safe. But that was my bank account and just like, okay, I'm gonna just wait for it to grow So I feel safe But that was almost like a prison in a sense emotionally because I didn't feel free to spend it I was still sleeping on friends couches. I had a million dollars in the bank and I was sleeping on friends couches I was sitting in the middle seat the cheapest seat I could on Buses or on planes and I'd always be like man. I'm so uncomfortable the next day Like I'm my back hurts like I'm, I'm so uncomfortable the next day. Like my back hurts.

Like I'm just, I'm not feeling free because I was afraid, I was anxious to lose money. And that is not emotional freedom. That is not healing. And I remember thinking to myself, God, I'm starting to make money. It was like years into my business, I was like, I'm financially free, but I'm still trapped.

What is holding me back? And I realized a lot of it was my money story and my money personality style that I needed to start working on. And I don't know if it's the thing that you ever like, I've arrived and I'm perfect, and now I'm like this Zen master at money. It's a constant back to awareness. It's a constant practice of awareness and breaking through those limitations. Yeah, I think what I'm thinking about when I'm hearing you is if me and you went back

to a place in our life where we really didn't have money, and you think about someone who's in that position, who's listening to us right now and in their head, they're thinking, but how do I become abundant when I don't have? Well, like my natural thing is like, I'm just struggling to pay my next bill. And me and you have both been in those situations. I remember when I was growing up, I grew up in a house where we had just enough. Like that was the language my parents used. We have just enough.

And my parents would often argue about money. I remember I wasn't allowed to buy cool shoes and stuff. I'd have like the knockoff cheapest brand from whatever, which was, I actually didn't have an issue with that. I didn't have an issue with any of it because we had food and that was my normality, but it's really interesting because the amount of times growing up, I started working when I was 14. And I think that gave me a really interesting sense of how hard it was to

make money. Because I started working at 14, I used to get paid two pounds per street that I delivered newspapers. Wow. So imagine there's a hundred houses. It's going to take me like, not per house. No, no, no street per street. So I did five streets and so I'd get 10 pounds at the end of the week. If I did five streets and each street would take me at least an hour, maybe,

I don't know, something like that. And so I'd walk around, I'd pull this thing and I'd deliver it. And I got an understanding of how hard it was to make money. But then that became a story for me going to your point. Making money is hard. Making money is hard. And that there's only a certain amount of money you're allowed to make at this level, like you're a 14 year old.

Then I worked in retail, I stacked shelves at a grocery store. I worked at a store called Morrison's, which is like working at Walmart. And there I remember I got paid like five pounds an hour. And then you get like time and a half if you work the weekends and the evenings. All of this to say that I probably spent my whole life only seeing zero in my bank account because everything that would come in would pay for my phone bill, my car insurance that I paid for, whatever it was that I was taking care of. So I wasn't relying on my parents apart from I lived in their home, obviously.

But I always felt like money came in, money went out. And my story around money was people who have money are doing something bad. So I lived in a home, whenever we went to a friend's home and they had a nice home, my family would always say, oh yeah, but they do dodgy stuff to make money. All the language around money was, people with money are doing bad stuff.

So in my head it was like, oh, if you have money, then you must be doing shady stuff because we don't have money and we're not doing any shady stuff. You must be hurting people to make money. Correct. In some way, exploiting, taking advantage of, whatever. So everything you're saying is so true because then when I got to a point in my life where I was just trying to do good and I had something like 150, 200 million views on content and you had no money. I was four months away from being grown. I met you at this time. And I met you like 150, 200 million views on content.

And you had no money. I was four months away from being grown. I met you at this time. And I met you around this time. I met you this time, yes. And it was really interesting to me because that was the time that I was actually doing this work, which is why this book is so powerful, because I realized that I couldn't, even with 150, 200 million views, it wasn't that that made money because my story and my personality style was anxious.

I felt like it was wrong to make money. Like that's actually what it was. I felt like making money was bad. And so until I got to that. Did you believe you're worthy of making more money? I believed I was worthy, but I believed that you had to be bad to make money. Wow, so you didn't want to be bad, you didn't want to have a lot of money and associate,

I have a lot of money and now I'm bad. Correct. I'm bad and wrong and I'm hurting others in order to help myself. Correct, because good people are poor. Wow. Right, like to be a good person of good character means to not have money.

Wow, and that was based on a belief system that you developed. Over time. Yes. That I didn't even know. Like if you would have told me about this eight years ago, I'd have been like, I don't know, which is why I think these reflections

are so important people. So when you're in that place, taking your story as well taking my story, how do we start to rewrite that story now that we're aware? Well, so powerful that you said that. And I remember this vividly because I met you on Halloween 2017, right? Eight years ago, yeah.

And I said, like, cancel the day. Let's just hang out all day. Yeah, you had a book coming out that day. I had a book that came out that day. Yeah. On Halloween. Yeah. Which is called The Basket of Masculinity.

Anyways, how do we rewire our brain around money to create more abundance? When you have nothing. When you have lack. How do we rewire our brain to create abundance create more abundance? When you have nothing, when you have lack, how do we rewire our brain to create abundance when you have nothing and you don't know how to earn more money? The first thing I think you need to be aware of is that your beliefs dictate your behaviors. So if you believe that money is bad or people who make a lot of money are bad and take advantage of others. And therefore me having lack right now means I'm a good person and I don't want

to become a bad person. Then that belief is going to dictate your behaviors and you're going to stay in lack. You're going to stay in scarcity and you're going to see opportunities that only give you just enough as opposed to opportunities that could create incredible wealth for yourself financially, but also an emotional wealth that you've never had before. So that's one of the things you want to understand is first that your beliefs dictate your behaviors. That's a big one, by the way.

That's huge. Yeah. Like that. I just want to point that out for people. Like that's so huge. Because your belief, your belief got you to a place of, I am impacting hundreds of millions of people from these, these videos that I created with my talents, but I don't know how to make money with them. And I don't know if I actually should because then

I could be bad and wrong or people could perceive me as I did something bad to make this money. Yeah, correct. And I'm a spiritual person. I'm a monk. I've done all these things. I don't want to have that life, but I want to make an impact and I don't want to be poor. So I think a lot of people are struggling with that mindset. Have you ever wished for a change but weren't sure how to make it? Maybe you feel stuck in a job or a place or a relationship. Join me, Emily Tish Sussman, over on She Pivots, where I explore the inspiring pivots of women, dig deeper into the personal reasons behind them, and leave you with the inspiration you need to make your next pivot.

Every Wednesday, I sit down with women like Kamala Harris, Vanessa Hudgens and armchair expert host Monica Padman. This March, we are continuing to uplift women in honor of Women's History Month with episodes from powerhouse Governor Gretchen Whitmer. I fell in love with public policy and that's kind of when I pivoted. Then later we dive into the rise of women's sports to learn how leaders like sports investor

Carolyn Tisch Blodgett and former Gotham FC champion turned coach Michelle Bados are shaping the industry. Come join us and listen to She Pivots on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, y'all, it's your girl, Cheeky's, and I'm back with a brand new season of your favorite podcast, Cheeky's and Chill.

I'll be sharing even more personal stories with you guys. And I know a lot of people are gonna attack me. Why are you gonna go visit your dad? Your mom wouldn't be okay with it. I'm gonna tell you guys right now, I know my mother. And I know my mom had a very forgiving heart. That is my story on plastic surgery. This is my truth.

I think the last time I cried like that was when I lost my mom. Like that, like yelling. I was like, no. I was like, oh, and I thought, what did I do wrong? And as always, you'll get my exclusive take on topics like love, personal growth, health, family ties, and more.

And don't forget, I'll also be dishing out my best advice to you on episodes of Dear Cheekies. So my fiance and I have been together for 10 years. In the first two years of being together, I find out he is cheating on me, not only with women, but also with men. What should I do? Okay, where do I start? That's not love. He doesn't love you enough because if he loved

you he'd be faithful. It's going to be an exciting year and I hope that you can join me. Listen to Cheekies and Chill Season 4 as part of the My Kultura podcast network available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Calling all 9-9ers, now streaming. It's the More Better podcast with two episodes of Brooklyn Nine-Nine Fun. Host Stephanie Beatriz and Melissa Fumero welcome two friends and former castmates. Don't miss Gina Linetti herself, the talented Chelsea Peretti, as she sits down to laugh and swap stories. And the 9-9 nonsense continues in the next episode, as the more better amigas sit down

with Joe Lattrullio, aka Detective Charles Boyle. There'll be more laughs, more conversation, more stories from the set and more, more better. Both episodes are now available. You felt safe enough to fill out a bad idea, right? I mean, that is the key because you're definitely not throwing out good ideas all the time. I mean, that's just not how it works.

Listen to more better with Stephanie and Melissa on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What are the other ones you hear? What are the other, focusing on that belief spirit, what are you hearing from people about their beliefs? That's my belief, and that's very much my history and story, as you said. What other stuff do you hear from people?

The biggest shift that will create abundance in your life is a mindset habit in unlocking wealth for yourself. And of the big lies or one of the big blocks that holds people back from Financial opportunity is that I I cannot be generous with my time My wisdom my knowledge or my secrets to others because if I am They will take it and run with it and I will be left with nothing. So therefore, I'm going to hoard my energy. I'm going to hoard my time, my knowledge, and only keep it to me so that others don't have good ideas or have my help. And from all the different billionaires and millionaires and financial leaders in the world

that I've interviewed, I know you've interviewed a lot of them. There is a question I would always ask individuals who've made incredible amounts of money and that keeps helping them create more wealth year after year. And they all say the same thing. Those who have had a sustainably good heart in the process is that you have to have a generous mindset. So the mindset habit is the first thing

that you have to think about when creating abundance with your money, but also feeling abundant internally. And it's coming with generosity. So if you feel like you're stuck right now, if you feel like you have nothing, this was what you were at eight years ago when I met you. This was where I was at 15 years ago when I was on my sister's couch. I had no money. I was in student loan debt was sleeping on her couch. I didn't think I had no money. I was in student loan debt. I was sleeping on her couch. I didn't think I had any skills. I didn't have a college degree yet. I was like, how am I going to make money if I don't know how to make money and I don't have any talent or skill and I'm in debt? It didn't understand it. It felt impossible. And the thing that

I shifted when I started meeting money mentors is I needed to learn the first habit, which is the mindset habit, which is a habit of generosity and gratitude. So what did that look like then? What was the practical step? What it looks like was how do I meet money people, people that have money, people who have success, people can teach me knowledge. I needed to come with a sense of energy, of curiosity, of possibilities and of joy. I literally wrote a list down of all these different things that I

thought were my talents. I go, how can I make money? I don't have any skills. I played football and now I'm injured. What can I do for people? But I was like, well, I'm really curious. Maybe I can just ask people questions. And never did I think in a million years that I could have a 12 year old podcast, just asking questions and make millions of dollars a year. I never thought that was possible. I was in my early 20s and I was like, you know what? I've got a lot of energy. I've got a lot of passion. So let me bring passion and energy to other people and excitement. And that energy was infectious. And there's a currency that's tied to that energy of passion, joy, excitement, curiosity.

That currency may not look like money, but for those who are older, who have no more passion, joy, excitement, curiosity. That currency may not look like money, but for those who are older, who have no more passion, they're burnt out, they're exhausted, it is the highest form of currency. They want that. They crave that energy. They've burned themselves out for decades. They want to feel young again. They want to feel curious again. They want to feel excited again. And when you come to someone with that energy, you are bringing a different mindset. So the mindset of curiosity, joy, passion, presence, like just connecting with someone and asking them a question is such a valuable currency.

So we have to look into these untapped skills, talents, currencies inside of us that are hidden to others, but inside of us, they can create magic. Yeah. That's one of them. Another one is just being generous with your time, with your resources, with your ideas and helping others succeed. I love that because I didn't even know that then, but I was doing it unconsciously.

Yes, you were. So I really wanted to interview incredible people, but I didn't have a platform at the time when I met you. And so I'd partnered up with NASDAQ. And by the way, just to be really clear with everyone, I didn't get paid to do this. So NASDAQ had something where everyone was using Facebook live and I said, Hey, could I have an hour in the NASDAQ building whenever I have an amazing guest that says yes, so that I can interview them on NASDAQ live and they would put the picture up on the middle of Times Square. On a billboard.

So now I could reach out to people I looked up to. That's the reason why I went on the show. Exactly. I didn't know who you were until I saw, hey, I can get you on a billboard on Times Square. I go, that's value to me right now. I'm being generous and I'm trying to find a way because I don't have anything to offer, but I admire you.

And it was all people I admired. It was yourself. It was Ryan Holliday said yes. Me and Ryan had met maybe once before that, but Ryan came on that show and there were a bunch of other authors. Deepak Chopra came on that show with me and it was all people that I admired, looked up to for a long time. And exactly that, that's how, first of all, we became great friends off of it.

But the point is it's exactly what you're saying that even though I felt I had nothing to offer, I had to find a way to create something, to offer someone a value. I didn't get paid for it, for that show. I didn't get paid to run it. I didn't make any money from it, but it created an opportunity for me to connect with friends, to connect with people that were doing incredible things. And of course, allowed me to showcase my talents, so that then I could show it to other people.

I remember I had Ryan Harwood on the show, who founded PureWow, and he just sold it to Gary Vee. Yeah. That's how I met Gary. So Ryan came on my show and he was just like, Jay, I love you, you're a great interviewer, like you have such great energy, he really liked my passion. And he said, you got to come meet Gary. And I was like, no way, like I love you, you're a great interviewer. Like you have such great energy. He really liked my passion.

And he said, you got to come meet Gary. And I was like, no way, like I love Gary. And so he took me to meet Gary for the first time. We had a meeting in his office and that's how I built my relationship with him. It was all thanks to Ryan. And so when you think about it now, like when I'm, oh, I've never thought about it

until what you're saying. Now when I look back, Ryan's been on the podcast like four times now, whatever. I love his books. So many relationships came out of that. And so I think when you live in a world of I have nothing to offer and I don't have anything, it becomes really hard to create. And most people think when I have nothing, I need to take from someone else. Yes.

I don't have anything, so I can't give anything if I don't have it. So I need someone to give me money right now. Because I'm broke, I'm poor, I'm't give anything if I don't have it. So I need someone to give me money right now because I'm broke, I'm poor, I'm stuck, I'm stressed, I'm anxious, I can't think out of myself. And this first habit is really gratitude and generosity is the gateway to abundance. And it may not mean you're gonna make money right away.

You didn't make money by having me on the show right away. But we became friends, I helped you, you helped me. Over time, we helped each other create more abundance together. Not only financially, which we've done together, but a type of richness that isn't about money. And this book, again, it's a money book, but it's really like it doesn't matter how much money you have if you don't feel like you have a rich life inside of you

That's real. It does not matter How much is in your bank account? How big your net worth is if you don't feel like you have an abundant life if you're stressed if you're overwhelmed if you're anxious If you're constantly in drama that is not abundance a high net worth Does not mean you are free and the goal is for us to feel free Every moment of our lives as often as possible and allow money to be a tool to create incredible opportunities memories moments where you can be generous with it with the people you care about the causes you care about the institutions you care about to serve more people and

about, the causes you care about, the institutions you care about to serve more people and feel good about doing it, not feel bad about doing it. And that's part of this process. Most people, when they lack money, they want to take from others. They want someone to help them. And you need to flip it on its head and say, how can I help others? Even when I have nothing, that is the time to be more generous and in more gratitude and say, thank you for this opportunity. Even if you have to just lie to yourself for a moment and say, I'm stuck. I'm on my sister's couch. I have no money. I'm four months and

four months. I'm going to be out of an apartment and I don't know where the money's coming. Just say, thank you, God. Thank you. You're nervous for this opportunity to learn this opportunity to grow because I'll never be here again. I interview. I don't know if you've had Ken Honda on, but he wrote happy money. Happy. I haven't had him on. It is so cool. I love this approach to this and he's talking similar style about how do you just live a rich life irrelevant of whether you have money or not.

And again, this is what I want people to get to when you are poor, when you're broke, when you're struggling financially, it feels really hard to feel abundant and rich. And we wanna start shifting our thoughts or emotions and our energy on, okay, I know I'm in this financial situation, it doesn't feel good, but in order to get out of it, it's not feeling worse about it. It's starting to feel better about me,

better about my values, my character, my kindness, my generosity and seeing how can I add value to others. And that's the first thing we need to be thinking about. How can I get into a richness inside of me to serve others and take care of me at the same time? And one of the practices or these social experiments or exercises similar to you that Ken has is that whenever money comes to him,

whether it's a check, whether it's a Venmo payment, whatever it might be, he just says, thank you to that money. He looks at that number. If it's a penny, if it's a million dollars, if it's your normal check you get coming in the mail every two weeks, he looks at it and says, thank you, and literally opens his heart and loves that money that comes to him. He says, thank you and literally opens his heart and loves that money that comes to him. He says, thank you. Where do you want to go? Do you want to go into my bank account? Do you want to go to my savings?

Do you want to go to investments? Do you want to go towards paying off debt? Do you want me to give you away? And it may be a weird kind of like exercise, but I love this approach to just being mindful of money when it comes. Say thank you. And then when you pay bills, when you pay off debt, say thank you as well. Thank you for allowing me to pay off this debt. Thank you for paying my cell phone bill so I can call my friends and family that I love.

Thank you for the ability to live a richer life. And when we start to approach money in that way, it doesn't mean money is going to fall from the sky and come to us abundantly. But we're going to start to feel more rich and abundant internally, which that energy is what will attract more opportunities. Those opportunities could lead to millions. This hostess that came to you, she brought that thankful energy, that present energy, that loving, joyful, curious energy, and it created an abundance of opportunities and connection. You've reminded me of two really amazing things

that I love that I want to throw out because they're not us, it's about other people. Last night I was at a premiere of a new show coming out on Hulu called Deli Boys. It's a full South Asian cast, I was really excited to be just at the premiere and just seeing my friends like, you know, do this amazing thing.

And it was fascinating because me and Lilly Singh were together, you know Lilly. And so me and Lilly were together and we're hanging out and this guy said, hey, can I film you for two seconds? He was working at the event. And I believe this is what he does on his own. I don't know his name, but I'll have to find it. And he took a quick swipe of Lily, like one shot,

and she was like, I'm gonna go, Jay, you gotta do this. He took a quick swipe with me. He edited it on the spot and he created this amazing reel of the event, like, and he was doing it with quick, and he was taking like two seconds of our time. And me and Lily both turned around and go, is this what you do? How can we work with you?

And like, you know, because it was such a great skill and he was showcasing his talent, he didn't charge us, he didn't charge us. He didn't ask us or anything. He showed us his talent. And all of a sudden, both of us were like this. A few months ago, I went to a restaurant that I'd never been to with some friends. This wasn't like a fancy restaurant, just, you know, it was a great restaurant, but it wasn't like fancy or anything like that.

restaurant, just, you know, it was a great restaurant, but it wasn't like fancy or anything like that. The lady who was hosting, she had so much energy and so much passion. She was like taking our order. But then when we asked her for recommendations, she knew every detail. And like, she got three job offers at that table. Me and my friend and everyone like, what do you do? What do you want to do? Like, yeah, let's hire you because we just, there was such an energy.

And so what you're saying is so true. Cause I'm now looking back at my own life and thinking about moments where I've had that visceral reaction to someone. And she was like, this is what I want to do. This is my dream. And one of my mates was like, all right, well, let's connect. Like, you know, he thinks she could work with him, but it was again, the same thing you're saying.

It was just energy and passion. Energy, she didn't have any other, she didn't have, it didn't matter about her college degree. We didn't even know her resume. We hadn't even looked at it. It doesn't matter what skill, other skills you have. If you have energy, passion, and a curiosity to care about someone,

you can go so far in that potential relationship. Speaking about, you know, hostess or waiters or waitresses, there were studies that psychologists did around tipping and waiters. And I don't know the exact statistic, I know it was over a certain amount, but I don't know the exact percentage,

but there are three things that you can do as a waiter to make more money. Oh, interesting. Getting higher tips based on psychology and these studies. One is just introducing yourself and saying your name. My name is Louis Howes. What's your name? Thanks for being here today. Saying your name creates a deeper connection. I agree. Making a recommendation of something you said she was making recommendations. Oh, you know, making a recommendation. Hey, I

really recommend this if you're into this or these are the best two options I would recommend. Gets you a higher chance of getting a better tip. And complimenting the person on their food choice. I'll have the burger or the vegan burger. That's a great choice. Those three things will increase your ability to earn more tips. And it's not like you had some other skill.

You just created a connection with someone and you were trying to bring that energy to them. Yeah. And money is an energy and how we think and how we feel will dictate the energy we have towards it. And also you create money through your energy. And so she had a certain energy with you and you're like, man, this is amazing. You're recommending it to millions of people about this person that you just met for the first time. It's like you could create so many opportunities for not only financial abundance, but spiritual abundance by bringing generosity, curiosity,

energy, joy, and love to someone's life. And it doesn't have to take hours. This was five minutes of this person's time. She got three job offers over that night. She could have had a different energy and said, okay, here's your table, sit down. And she would have had nothing, but she could have went to Harvard and had all these other skills. And none of that would have mattered without the energy she brought. People who don't know this story or have forgotten about it, like D-Rock and Gary Vee, like that's

their journey, right? Like D-Rock basically went up to Gary and was like, hey, I'll just edit videos for you for free. And now he's been traveling the world with Gary for the last, God knows how long they've been working together. Yeah, and he's such a great guy and he's awesome. And it's just, but it all came from that, that idea of, hey, I'm just going to edit these videos for you and do this.

And again, going back to what we said before, is like when you have no money, when you're broke, when you feel stressed out, overwhelmed, burnt out, you lost your job, you feel like you need help and you may need help. And the best way to create abundance is to go from helplessness to helpfulness. So instead of saying, I feel helpless, I don't know what to do. You've got to flip it and say how can I be helpful? How can I help myself but by also helping someone else?

How can I shift out of this negative energy into an energy of abundance? Which is so hard to do when you have nothing I remember for a year and a half Feeling trapped on my sister's couch with no money thinking how am I to do this and there's just got to be a decision we say I'm gonna get up and I'm going to get out of this funk, out of this energy and choose and decide to bring energy to someone else without asking for anything in return. And when you do that, you'll start to build momentum. And that's what's going to help you get to the next level.

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I will do anything. Here are my skills. I will edit videos. I will consult. I'll run your social media. Those weren't things I wanted to do in my life, but I needed to create a foundation from which I could then invest that into what I wanted to do. And actually that year, everything I made, I invested into starting this podcast. Yes. So everything I made this year went into launching on purpose because

that's not what I wanted to do. I didn't want to edit other people's videos. I didn't want to launch social media profiles. I didn't want to coach and consult, but I had those skills. And I think this is one of the things sometimes is that we all have skills that are valuable somewhere. And they may not be the skills that you want to do for the rest of your life. But the season of life.

But the season of life. And I think there's something to be said for that because we all want to be paid for what we love doing. But even my life today, there's a lot of things I have to do, and there's a lot of things I love to do, and that's life. Yeah, like you said, the seasonal side of things,

like when I was just getting started making money, this was in 2008, 2009, 2010, I was using LinkedIn as a platform and a tool to meet CEOs, executives, and business leaders. And I was helping them originally with their LinkedIn profile. And it's just saying, hey, how can I help you optimize your profile?

I see that it's missing some things here, I'll do it for free. And I did this to build relationships with them. And through that, they just all wanted to help me and give back to me. And then eventually someone said, hey, I'll pay you for this, this is really helpful. And I was like, oh, I can make money on LinkedIn.

It's not what I wanted to do, but I had a skill to do it right then. So I did that for a few years. And once I had that foundation, I used that money to launch the school of greatness as well, because I had a couple of years of runway now. And I didn't want to do that forever, but I did it for the season. I got skills, I made money, and I created a sense of freedom for myself to do what I really wanted to do later. Yeah, what do you have to say to people

who are saying that you can manifest money? Do you agree with that idea of? It's an interesting story. I was in New York last week, and I said to myself, and I have a lot of these different exercises and games in the book, to just give people as social experiments. I think it's really powerful to give yourself experiment

because I think when you experiment, you allow yourself to explore possibilities. And when you create an experiment for yourself, you allow for the idea of magic to enter your life. So I want you to just, as you're watching or listening, I want you to say, I allow for magic and abundance to manifest in my life. I'm gonna create a possibility that this to manifest in my life. I'm gonna create a possibility

that this can happen in my life. A moment, a synchronicity, someone might call me out of the blue, someone might hand me money randomly. I'm gonna allow for this moment to happen and this magic to happen. So I said to myself, I wanna follow my own practices, right?

And I went to see our friend Mel Robbins in Boston, and I was in New York for a few days. And I just said to myself, money comes to me abundantly and freely in it. I see it everywhere. I just said this to myself every morning when I woke up. And when I went out of the hotel, I said money comes to me abundantly and freely and I see it everywhere. And I'm a magnet for money. I'm a magnet for money. I just kept saying this energy. I'm a magnet from when I was just playful, this social experiment. And when I was at Mel's, a penny dropped on the

floor. Someone was carrying a box and a penny fell on it. I said, oh, look, money comes to me. I see it everywhere. It was a penny. There's a point to this story. And I pick it up and I say, Mel, do you want this? And she goes, no, it's yours. And I go, thank you. I receive. Because when I relax, I receive. And I'm a magnet for money. Even if it was a penny, I could notice it. And I was like, all right, it came to me. See, here's a win. Here's a little win.

Let me do this again. The next day I go to New York City and I'm in the subway. It's freezing right now in New York. It's like 15 degrees. And I just sang this to myself in the subway. And I was like, get off the subway. I go up the stairs and it's fricking filthy in the New York subway, right?

And the stairs are dirty and I see a penny heads up. And I thought to myself, this is filthy. This is dirty. It's not valuable. It's not enough money. I don't need to pick this up. But I was like, no, I'm doing this experiment. Money comes to me abundantly and freely.

I'm a magnet for money and I'm going to manifest money, right? And so I see it's heads up. I pick it up, put it in my pocket and I just say, thank you, money for coming to me. The next day I put it on my bedside table. I don't think anything of it. The next day I wake up and I look at this penny and I said, cause I'm doing this experiment every day. I'm a magnet for money. Money comes from me abundantly and

freely. And I look at it as a reminder. These two pennies, look, this is a reminder, these two pennies. Look, this is a reminder that money came to me. Maybe it's not thousands of dollars or millions of dollars. It's not something that's magically right here, but it's a reminder that something is possible. And I flipped over this one, oh no, I looked at the penny,

because it was heads up, and I noticed something. I go, oh, that's really interesting. It said 1945 on this penny. That's an 80 year old penny. And I go, oh, that's really interesting. It said 1945 on this penny. That's an 80 year old penny. And I go, huh, that's unique. I haven't seen a penny that old in a long time. And I flip it over and I noticed something and I get chills thinking about it. I noticed it's a wheat penny.

I don't know if you know what a wheat penny is. So a wheat penny looks different than a normal penny. It's got like two stocks of wheat on the outside of the penny. It's this old penny. And I look it up and I Google, 1945 wheat penny value. And one just sold, I kid you not, I get chills thinking about it.

One just sold, guess for how much? I have no idea. $4,000. No way. Online. One sold for $4,000. Now, it's all based on the condition and all these different things like, who knows?

Maybe it's worth $20. Maybe it's worth $5,000. Maybe it's worth $100. But the idea is that there was more value inside of that penny than what met the eye originally. And the experiment of, let me be open to possibilities for money to come to me. And what I thought was two pennies might be $2,000.

And all I had to do was be willing to look for it, be willing to pick it up and say, I receive, thank you. If I didn't look for it, if I didn't set that intention, if I didn't see the possibilities in front of me, I may not have received that penny that could have been worth thousands. And it's the same thing in life. We may not see the opportunity in front of us right now.

We may not reach out to the people we already know and say, hey, this is what I'm looking to create in my life. I have these skills, I have these talents. Is there anything that you need right now that I can be of service for you with? And that's for that first year, how you created multiple six figures in that first year when you had nothing was reaching out

to hundreds of people. That was you either setting the intention, seeing that there might be possibilities and doing the work to manifest hundreds of thousands that first six months. So by doing that effort, setting the intention by saying, I'm open to possibilities, I'm open to possibilities. I'm open to receiving opportunities that come to me, but I have to be willing to look for them. I have to be willing to ask for them. I have to be willing to put myself out there and receive and say, yes, thank you.

I will do this work. And that's what I think people need to be thinking about. Can you manifest millions? Yes. If you're willing to set a clear intention, if you're willing to reach out and say, here's what I'm willing to offer and add value in, I want to help you achieve these goals, you're creating more potential to manifest money. Yeah, I love that penny story because I'll tell you a bit about what I do and I do a similar thing and it comes from my tradition.

Do you have a money mantra? No, we don't say something, but I'll tell you about it. Yes. So there's a... So in our tradition, there's a god or a goddess for each aspect of society. Money. And so there is god, as in there's one god, but then there's loads of different gods for different departments of society. Kind of like you have a president or a prime minister

and then you have like the cabinet and that... Who's the money god? So it's a goddess called Lakshmi. Lakshmi. Yeah, Lakshmi means wealth or fortune. It's like luxury almost. Yeah, it's like Lakshmi. Maybe that's where it comes from, who knows?

But Lakshmi is the goddess of fortune or the goddess of wealth. And so you would never ever put your foot on a goddess. So whenever you're walking the streets and you see pennies around, you're never meant to just walk past them. You're actually meant to pick them up and put them to your head. So that's kind of like part of our culture. And so whenever I'm walking around the streets of New York or LA, wherever I am or Subway, I do the same thing.

I'll always pick it up. And it's really funny because someone who's with me would be like, what are you doing? Like, you know, like, why are you doing that? I'm like, because I'm showing respect. I'm actually showing respect to the goddess of fortune. And so that's what it is showing respect. I'm actually showing respect to the goddess of fortune. So good, man. And so that's what it is.

It's like, I'm showing respect to the goddess of fortune by picking it up and usually give that money to charity or whatever it may be. It's not, it's not you trying to keep on it. You may give it away, whatever. But the point is you're saying, I'm not disrespecting the goddess of fortune wherever I see her.

That's beautiful. Because I want to have a respectful relationship with money. I actually really love practices like that because I think it goes back to the point you're making that we have a relationship with everything. Everything. You have a relationship with your body,

you have a relationship with your mind, you have a relationship with your partner, and you have a relationship with money. And so speaking to money and speaking about money is something you have to do if you want to love that thing and you want it to love you back. Right? If you never talk about your partner and you never talk to your partner, how are they going to love you and how are you going to love them? Imagine you're, you know, Roddy for the next month, you never say thank you. You never look her in the eyes. You never speak to her. You avoid her constantly.

Imagine like your relationship's going to suffer. You know, I'm sure you guys will figure it out, but imagine that's a lifetime of a relationship. It cannot survive. And here's a great question that I want everyone to ask themselves and another exercise that I want everyone to think about right now, whether you're watching or listening, I want you to comment on the YouTube below

what opened up for you during this moment. And I'm gonna give you the exercise, Jay. So imagine this door opens and it's a person. And this person is money. It's the idea of money. It's a person that walks in, right? Is money. And could you, as an example,

for people to imagine this as well, what does that person look like when they come in? What would you do? What would you say or not say? Could you share kind of what that would be like for you? Money, a person walks in, they are money. They are the representation of your relationship with money. How would you show up and react?

So in our culture, because it would be Lakshmi walking in, I'll show you a visual of her afterwards. You would actually bow down. Like you'd have that. And that's a sign of respect, not a sign of surrender or subjugation, but a sign of respect. Like you'd bow. You'd offer her whatever she wanted. Like you'd be like, what do you need? Like, what would you like? What would you, would you like a place to sit? Kind of like a guest in your home. Like a generous host. You treat them like a guest in your home. Yeah. Like what would you like? What would you like a place to sit? Kind of like a guest in your home. Like a generous host. You treat them like a guest in your home. Yeah, like, what would you like?

Can I get you something to drink? You know, whatever it may be. Obviously, she's a goddess. She doesn't need anything. But the point is, that's how the hospitality would still be carried through. That's cool. And then you'd thank her as well. Like, you'd start every connection with a god or a goddess with gratitude.

Wow. Like you'd start every connection with a God or a Goddess with gratitude. So that'd be like a genuine appreciation and an ability to share how you feel. Like I think being vulnerable and saying, hey, like, it's been really tough this month. Like, I'm really struggling right now. Like, this is what I'm going through. Like, I need your help. Like a prayer almost of sorts. That's beautiful. And I asked, I've been asking a lot of people this.

And so I love to hear people's responses and be honest in the YouTube comments below of your relationship with money. I asked someone close to me, someone younger, probably in their late twenties, I asked them, you know, if money walked in and you were at a party, how would you respond? And they said, I would run to the bar. I would not make eye contact,

I would gossip behind their back to other people there about money. I would look down at them, but then I would use them and abuse them because I would really need money, and I would ghost them afterwards. And I go, wow. And they were like, yeah, I know, it's really bad.

But they were being honest. So I want people to be honest, like what is your relationship with money? And just imagine That's great. If you were money and someone treated you that way if they wouldn't look at you They avoid you they speak poorly behind your back They would use you and abuse you when they wanted you and then they ghost you when they didn't want to talk to you Do you think money would want to keep showing up in your life if they were a person?

Yeah, if they were a person would they want to be in your life if they were a person. If they were a person, would they want to be in your life? Or they feel, this isn't a good relationship for me. And your show is all about helping people get healed, healthy, and whole. And if you want to create a richer, more abundant life, you have to create a healthy relationship with money in your life. And look at it as if this was a love of my life, not in a worshiping, like I worship it no matter what, but more of like, this is a bit like a person that I love and I want to treat them with care. I want to be a great host. How can I show up? And it doesn't mean it's always going to be perfect, but how can I show up and be generous, be kind, be patient, listen,

be aware and be of service to it. Yeah, I think it makes a huge difference. Huge difference. I'm not saying you haven't had a beautiful, abundant, peaceful life as well with money, but I would bet to say that you've also experienced stress and overwhelm with money, more than having no money.

And a lot of people get blocked because they know that like, oh, more money, more problems is another like money lie, right? Or money like wound that people might have. Like, I don't want to make more money because I see people who do have money, they're constantly stressed, they're not generous with it, they're stingy, they don't even tip at all, they're even more stingy with it, and they have it.

So what's the point of having it if they're not generous? I don't want to be like that. And there can be money traps or money wounds when you have money if you haven't learned how to heal that relationship And so it's learning how to heal the rage relationship so that when you grow your net worth you also increase your self-worth Inside and feel peaceful about it you expand your nervous system your container to receive Abundantly, so it's not scary. It's not stressful about it. You expand your nervous system, your container to receive abundantly. So it's not scary. It's not stressful. You can receive more and you can give more because you know that the more you relax, the more you receive. And when you give, it's going to come back in some way.

I struggled with that. My first six, seven, eight years of making money, I hoarded money because I was afraid to go broke again. And it limited me in certain ways and it made me feel stressful. It made me feel like people were trying to take advantage of me and take my money. It doesn't feel rich having money and living in scarcity still. I'm Kristin Davis, host of the podcast Are You a Charlotte? The incredible Cynthia Nixon joins me this week for a conversation filled with memories, lots of laughs, and even unexpected revelations and stories I didn't even know. Like Cynthia could have been Carrie?

When I first read the script, they asked me to read for Carrie as I think they asked you to read for Carrie. I did not know this. Yes, they asked me to read for Carrie. Wow. Did you? I did. And they were like, yeah, not so much.

How that short hair came to be. So I was blonde, Kim was blonde, Sarah was blonde. You were the only non-blonde. So they came to me and they said, we got too many blondes. Would you dye your hair red? Also, is she a Miranda? People would ask me, are you, how are you like Miranda? And I would always say, we both feel confident

about our brains, but that's kind of where it ends. You can't miss this. Listen to Are You a Charlotte? on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Mi gente hermosa, Wilmer Valderrama. Yo soy Freddy Rodriguez, host of the new podcast Dos Amigos. In this series, we candidly reflect on our careers, life, art, and everything in between.

Each episode emanates from our very own Speak Easy, and it features us talking about pivotal moments, hilarious agnathotes, and then I said the word, yes. That's when I knew, that's when I knew this might just work. And invaluable collaborations that helped us become who we are today. That was one of the rare movies that I saw in the movie theater when I was a kid. And then I got to work with them

and telling how much I loved it. Plus the door stays open for perhaps a third amigo. Listen to Dos Amigos, Thursdays on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Dr. Joy here. You may know me from Therapy for Black Girls, where we're celebrating 400 episodes of the podcast. That's a whole lot of girl me too moments.

For years, we've had deep, thoughtful and inspiring conversations about black women's mental health. And now we're celebrating this milestone in a big way. In this special episode, Peloton Yogi, Chelsea Jackson Roberts, about Black women's mental health. And now we're celebrating this milestone in a big way. In this special episode, Peloton yogi, Chelsea Jackson Roberts, shares how yoga has taught her to stay grounded and present while balancing motherhood and self-care.

I can't control my partner. I can't control my child. I can't control anyone outside the way that I govern myself in this world. And the celebration doesn't stop there. We'll continue this milestone with Dr. Lauren Mims, who joins me to discuss the powerful, yet sometimes challenging transition from girlhood to womanhood for Black fans.

Together, we explore how we navigate this transformative journey with strength and grace. Black girlhood is giggling, it's sisterhood, but it is also, I think, focusing on learning how to cope with really difficult things that are happening. With insights like these, this 400th episode celebration is one for the books. Listen to Therapy for Black Girls on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. There was a beautiful thing that we'd always repeat in the monastery.

It was like, God doesn't see what you give, God sees what you hold back. And so there's not this, you know, because we can sometimes become egotistical about how much we give and it's like, well, you've got one hand behind your back and that's, you just made that point. It's that, it's that pinch. It's that, are you giving where there's a challenge to give? Yeah. Because that's where we're healing.

You can get really egotistical, like, Hey, if you were worth a billion and you signed a million dollar check, like I've, I know people that are making three million in interest a day, like, so you're writing a million dollar check is not the same. This also applies when you have very little. So my parents who didn't make a lot, when they were giving... It felt like a lot. It felt like a lot.

And so like, what we're saying is that this thought of being a giver has to be called to us. You know, my dad was a lot like that too. He had strangers knocking on the door that somehow convinced him to stay with us for like three months in the summer. And he just opened his doors and said, that somehow convinced him to stay with us for like three months in the summer.

Who were, and he just opened his doors and said, yes. Like, okay, and so he was just like, like your parents, like, okay, you need a place to stay for a week, a month, two months, cool, we'll figure it out. We'll feed you, we'll do this. As long as we feel like you're doing something good and we're trying to support you. And I think it's, you don't have to give money to feel rich.

You can be generous with your time, with your resources in other ways, with your food. It's like, you can give in other ways and create a richness of life. And that's the key, is to feel rich and abundant and free. And if you feel that, when you start making money, you're gonna continue to feel free. The biggest trap is when you feel scarce and you start making money

and you still feel trapped. You still don't feel free. That isn't even greater prison in my mind that you're living in scarcity when you have money. I mean, there's so many people right now that have the pressure to save money. Cause we've been talking about making money, but there's this pressure to save money. And how do you find that balance between spending comfortably

if you have the ability versus like saving for your future or your family? Like, how do you think about that version? Well, I think when you can live beneath your means and feel abundant, you've won. So when you live beneath your means and you don't need extra stuff, you've won. I just watched The Count of Monte Cristo the other night. It's an incredible movie of a guy who has nothing. He was born by, you know, back in the, I don't know, 1700s or something, it's a period piece.

He was born of like a clerk, a guy who makes no money. And his friend was born of like some general who had a lot of money or something and this poor kid that grew up friends didn't have anything but he had the world. He had no money, no possessions but he just approached life as like man but here's a piece of string, here's a rock that I can play with like I can just imagine the beauty of the world and he appreciated everything, even though he had no money. And I think in some ways it's so hard to look at that when we see Instagram and TikTok where everyone has things.

That's the hard part, yeah. When you see everyone else having fun with money and going on that trip with their girlfriends or buying that expensive car to show off to their guy friends or getting the nice watches or having the cool shoes and you thinking, Oh, if I could really have money, then I could have these things that would make me feel cool or feel better. But if we can approach life and just be like, man,

life is so good with what I have. That is true wealth. That is true abundance and happiness. And it doesn't mean you shouldn't strive to create more if you want more if you want to have nice shoes or a nice watch cool You've got to learn how to make money and you want to learn how to make money easy not make money hard And that that is a process in developing these skills these talents within you and seeing how you can monetize those skills And I'm not saying don't splurge on certain things if you want to, but you have to understand the consequences. If you're gonna splurge on something to have fun

with friends or go on trips and spend this money that you maybe don't have, just know there might be a consequence to that later. If you have to use a credit card, you have to pay that debt with interest later. So just know there's a cost to splurging or doing spending when you don't have it. I'm a big fan of saving and investing so that you can have freedom in the future and feel rich continually and not needing to buy things to feel richer.

What about this idea of I want to make money quick. Like I just want to make a million dollars in a week. I want to find that hack that solves my money problems. Like what's your take on that? Is that possible? I've got money wounds and it's because I wanted to make easy money in my past. Not make money easy. And I don't know anyone that doesn't want to make easy money.

Like our ego wants it to come to us now and want to find the quick hack or the quick investment that's got a 10X in two months. Sure, there's always outliers that figure out a way to do that. But every time I've tried to do that, I've lost my money. And it's been painful. And I'm like, okay, I think I've learned that lesson,

but there's this new like quick, easy money opportunity. And every time I do it again, I'm like, okay, I think I've learned that lesson, but there's this new, like quick, easy money opportunity. And every time I do it again, I'm like, what was I thinking? You see that others act like there's a way to do it so easy. If you just invest in crypto, if you just invest in this, if you just do this thing, you're going to make quick and easy money. I don't know anyone who's made hundreds of millions, millions or billions who's lived that way. They might have invested and gone all in on one business and created generational wealth,

or maybe they went all in on investing in one main stock that ended up 10 or 20 X-ing over time. But going the quick, make easy money way doesn't usually work and it's painful lessons you have to live afterwards. So I don't know, have you ever made quick easy money? No, no, I haven't for sure. And I probably made mistakes when I had a bad relationship with money. Yeah. I remember one of my mentors in like 2013 told me to invest in crypto. And at the time I thought to myself,

I've only got like, I only, like at that time in my life, I probably had a thousand dollars, right? Saved because I'd just come out. I just started working. I didn't have the money. So I was thinking thousand dollars, what's it going to do? Obviously I was stupid. I didn't know.

That also wouldn't have been quick. It would have taken 10 years. It would have taken 10, 15 years, yeah. That's the thing, it's like, we could always look back and say, oh, our friend told us to invest in this thing 10 years ago. And if I imagine if I did it 10 years, yeah. Just like any stock.

If you invested and wait 10 years, it should go up if the company continues to do well. No, I've never made easy money. And I agree. Well, here's the thing, you actually have made easy money after putting in a decade plus of work, a decade of developing skills, of monetizing your skills, and following the seven habits we talk about in this book, which is, yeah, you can make easy money now.

You can get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to speak for 60 minutes because you've added so much value in the world for the past decade plus and even a decade before that of spiritual practice before you even learned how to make money. So two decades, two decades of how do I develop skills within me to serve people, whether it be one-on-one, one to 10, one to 10,000. How do I develop those skills to serve and give generously? You have followed this mindset perfectly, which is a mindset of generosity and gratitude. And that's all you did for essentially the last two decades.

How can I learn how to become a better human? How can I give generously? And how can I be appreciative and grateful for the life that I have? And you had no money for almost four years as a monk, but I would bet that you lived a beautifully rich life. You didn't need the money to feel rich. You felt provided for. You had nature. You had community. You were learning. You got to be on purpose. You got to serve. And what a beautiful gift to receive.

And you had no money in your bank account, but you were probably one of the richest people that you knew. And that is beautiful. That is abundant. Yeah. And that's something that definitely doesn't change with the financial change. If I have no money right now, how can I get to a place where you were at where I had the richest, most abundant life?

Because I was working on me, I was a giver, I was generous with my time and my energy and my resources, whatever I had. And then how can I start to earn more money, make money easy by feeling effortless internally, expanding my nervous system so that it can receive more and feel safe. That is a rich, abundant life. And that's what we're all really looking for. And me and you both know people who have hundreds of million dollars that they've exited companies and they're not happy.

It doesn't mean having more money equals happiness. You still have to learn how to heal you and have a healthy relationship with yourself and money, even when you have it. When you're looking for a quick fix and a quick win, the problem is the speed at which you win is the speed at which you lose. Yes. Right. So if you think I'll put money into this now, I'll make something in a week.

Chances are, like you said, you lose it immediately. You lose it in a day. You lose it in a day. chances are, like you said, you lose it immediately. You lose it in a day. You lose it in a day. And the reason that happens is because you actually don't know why you're putting your money there. So it goes back to your first point of awareness.

It goes back to something you call the mapping habit, the plan, because what's going on is, you're saying, I want this to happen now, I want this to happen immediately, I want this to happen quickly. So I know zero about this crypto. I know zero about this property. I've had friends literally gamble away their life savings because they heard all

their friends were making money through crypto. I always say, when people say to me, I've got this much money, what should I invest? And I'm like, what do you know about? Invest in that. What do you actually know about? Like what do you actually have experience, knowledge, wisdom in? Because guess what? Because of that, you'll make money on it because you actually know about? Like what do you actually have experience, knowledge, wisdom in? Because guess what? Because of that, you'll make money on it.

Because you actually understand it. Again, it goes back to the point of respect. If we don't respect our audience, it doesn't grow. If you don't respect your community, it doesn't grow. If you don't respect your clients, it doesn't grow. By us saying, I want to make money, but I know nothing about this industry, it means I'm disrespecting the industry. And sure, there may be one person

who had some lucky story that they tell you about, but the truth is most of us are not going to get there. So if you have a little bit of money and you're like, Jay, I've only got $100 to invest. Louis, I've only got $1,000 to invest. And you ask me where to put it, put it in what you know. Put it in yourself, if that's all you know is yourself and your skills.

And I think so many of us are looking for that ticket, but actually that investment in yourself will pay so many dividends. This is, this is, I'm glad you said this because a week ago, someone literally asked me if I have a thousand dollars right now to invest, where should I invest it? And everyone says, put it in crypto, put it in real estate funds, put it in all these things.

Don't listen to any of that. When I had no money, there was two things that I needed to create more of a currency within me, and that was courage and confidence. I lacked the courage to develop certain skills. When I had courage to go all in on learning public speaking or learning how to write, I didn't know those skills. I actually lacked those skills, and I was afraid

to be a failure at those things by trying them But by having the courage to invest my time and energy in a public speaking class in a writing coach I didn't have the skills, but I developed the courage that courage created the actions to create confidence That confidence created a currency Within me of belief that belief dictated my behaviors to start charging more, to go out there and ask for more, to put myself out there in bigger ways. And so if you have $1,000 or $5,000 right now

and you want to figure out where to invest it, invest it in courage to learn new skills that will give you confidence. That will be an incredible currency that you'll have forever. I mean, Lewis, I'm so excited for people to read this book. Honestly, I love this conversation because we're both sitting here as people who, like you said, not finished our money journey either.

We're, you know, I've got so many years left to learn so much more. The reason why I empathize with it is I never ever thought I'd be financially abundant, mentally or physically. And I know you feel the same way. Dude, I was, I thought I would never figure out how to make money. Same.

I really empathize with everyone who's listening going, I'm stuck. I'm trying to figure this out, but I really do believe it starts with this because this is the work you'll have to do whether you make money tomorrow or in 10 years. And no matter how much you make, you're still going to have to do this work. Yes. In this book, because even if you find still going to have to do this work. Yes. In this book. Because even if you find a way to make money, and you become really, really financially successful,

you will never feel free in that financial success without doing this work. And you'll still feel anxious, and you'll still feel stressed, and you'll still feel all of that, right? I tell a story in the book about, I used to live in an apartment building here in you know in LA It's really sad There's a lot of wealthy people in this building that I lived in a lot of celebrities and billionaires I was the poorest person there, which is another another lesson

Which is to put yourself in rooms always be where you can mastermind with people and be around proximity of people who have more so you can learn from them, but I Was on a trip when I came back from a trip driving back into the the valet of my building and there was a tent in the valet like in the driveway and I kind of jokingly said to the valet attendant as I pulled into the building I said someone didn't jump did they kind of like joking and the guy looked at me with like a serious face like yeah it just happened like 30 minutes ago and I was I like, this can't be real. It was like, what? There's billionaires in here, there's millionaires in here,

there's celebrities in here. I was like, why would anyone in this building take their own life? And it was kind of like just this shock to me because I learned later who this person was. Someone did jump off the building right before I came back and he was worth hundreds of millions of dollars net worth.

We just Googled his name and I was just thinking why would someone worth so much money take their life and I don't want to assume what really happened but it doesn't mean having all the money in the world is going to solve all your problems and you're going to feel like you can love and accept yourself, that you have self-worth. So like you said, you may learn how to make a lot of money, but if you haven't learned how to heal your relationship with you, then all the money in the world can't save your life and can't make you feel rich,

can't make you feel abundant, can't make you have beautiful relationships with friends, family, colleagues. And that's where the real wealth comes in life when you have deep, meaningful relationships. And something I want to acknowledge that you do really well is you follow this first habit, the mindset habit so well, which is how can I be generous with my time, my energy, my love for friends,

family, colleagues, your community, this community feels it. Everyone listening and watching right now, feel your generosity, your giving hearts, and your gratitude for them, whether it be individually or collectively, they feel it. And most people, they wanna make more money, but they don't have that generosity, that grateful spirit, and they want the quick fix.

They wanna make easy money quick, not make money easy. And the billionaires that I know you know, and the millionaires that we know we've interviewed, and I'll ask them this question, what do you think the key to creating more financial abundance year after year is for you? Every billionaire or mega millionaire will say giving more. I make more when I give more that year,

whether it be giving more to charities, whether it be giving to people in my life, whether it be giving back to my community, giving back to my employees, my business, finding ways to give more and almost give where it feels a little uncomfortable like, Oh, that was, that was a big check I just wrote. Oh, man, I care about this cause, this charity. I feel safe giving this amount, but what really would make it uncomfortable? Or I go to church every week and I typically give this, but what would make me feel a little uncomfortable? Most of these people say the more they give when it's the most uncomfortable, somehow they just keep earning more. And I'm not saying you should

give all your money away and you're going to earn more back, but having that mindset of generosity and you do this very well, where you give to your community, whenever there's some type of breakdown in the world, you're one of the first people to say, how can we give? How can we rally the troops? You give first, you rally the troops, they let's give back, the fires happened, stuff happened in India a couple of years ago, stuff's always happening, and you say, we're gonna give.

I don't know if that seems something conscious you think about, like, oh, by giving more every year, it helps me make more, but also I feel richer. And when you do that with everyone in your life, whether you're the hostess and you give curiosity, love, passion, fun, playfulness, you're giving something in that moment. If you can write a check for something that is a cause

and you give, it's because you can and you do it generously. It's just gonna make you richer inside and you're creating an energy of abundance to attract more. I think for me, it was watching my parents. So for all the other things I said about just enough and everything, my parents always gave in charity. Our home was always a home where everyone was welcome. My mom would happily cook dinner for everyone, even though, you know,

we didn't have everything. And so my parents had this generous heart at the same time. And they probably felt rich in that generosity. And they did it when we didn't have a lot. Now when I realize how much my parents made and how much they gave in charity, the proportions were pretty off. And I think for me, I just felt so fortunate and I feel so lucky and I feel so grateful that I have been able to find abundance in my life, that I feel

like the only natural reaction to that has to be to give. Yeah. When I came back to LA with the fires and everything, I was just grateful to come back to a home. Yeah. But not everyone I know came back to a home. And so I felt grateful that I had a home and so I was like grateful to come back to a home. But not everyone I know came back to a home. And so I felt grateful that I had a home. And so I was like, okay, what can we do? And so I think it comes from a place of gratitude again.

It comes from a place of seeing my parents be so generous, even though they had nothing to give actually. And it ultimately comes to me because I just feel like there's no better use for it in the long run than that. And I do believe it will come back in its own way. I don't give it because I want it back. I give it because I believe there's a need. But I do deeply believe that it will come back

in its own way and it always has. The book's called Make Money Easy, Create Financial Freedom and Live a Richer Life, Lewis Howes. Lewis, I'm so grateful genuinely for this conversation. It's let me feeling so rich. I've always felt rich in our friendship. And I'm really glad that you wrote about it in this way, because I think there's

lots of great money experts out there who are agreeing really good sound financial advice. Yeah, that's not what this is. And I think we need all of it, but I think this is a deep part because I know for me personally, this has been really deep work and you put it into a book. And so I'm so grateful that people get to access it. Thank you for doing this. Everyone who's been listening or watching, read the book, learn the habits, tag

me and Lewis on Instagram, on TikTok. Let me know what's resonating with you. What's connected with you. I want to hear your stories. I want to hear what skill you invested in. I want you to turn up at your job. Even if you hate it, I want you to turn up to it with all the love that you possibly have.

See whose mind you blow, who gets impressed by what you're doing. Someone's going to be able to shift your life at some point. And it's going to start with you, but just don't underestimate the value of these things that sound simple and they sound like, I've got to figure out something more complex. No, no, no, this is where it starts. And this will mean that at the end of these things that sound simple and they sound like I've got to figure out something more complex.

No, no, no. This is where it starts. And this will mean that at the end of it, you'll be happy. So thank you to Lewis. Thank you to each and every one of you. And yeah, make money easy. Appreciate it, brother. Make money easy. I love you, man.

If you love this episode, you'll love my conversation with Dr. Joe Dispenza on why stress and overthinking negatively impacts your brain and heart and how to change your habits that are on autopilot. Listen to it right now. How many times do we have to forget until we stop forgetting and start remembering? That's the moment of change.

No one cares how many times you fell off a bicycle if you ride the bicycle now, you ride the bike. Hey sis, it's Dr. Joy from Therapy for Black Girls. We've had 400 episodes of conversations, growth, and healing. So we're celebrating. Join us for a special episode with internationally recognized yogi, Chelsea Jackson Roberts, as she shares wisdom on mindfulness, movement, and motherhood.

I waited later to have children and I still have exactly what I knew that I wanted. You don't want to miss this special episode. Listen to Therapy for Black Girls later to have children and I still have exactly what I knew that I wanted. You don't want to miss this special episode. Listen to Therapy for Black Girls on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, listeners. It's Emily Tish-Sussman, host of the podcast She Pivots.

This March, we're honoring Women's History Month with episodes from powerhouse Governor Gretchen Whitmer. I fell in love with public policy and that's kind of when I pivoted. Then later we dive into the rise of women's sports by hearing how sports investor Carolyn Tish-Blojit is shaping the industry. Come join us and listen to She Pivots on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Questlove and every year we do special programming

for Black History Month. So the team and I compiled some clips from the show that are worth revisiting. In part one of the celebration of Black History Month, we're listening Back to Moments with Chris Rock. The greatest comedians in America are in to be black because you had to work these two systems in a world that everybody else has to work on.

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