On Purpose with Jay Shetty - Payal Kadakia ON: Imposter Syndrome, Ambition, & How to Succeed While Staying True to Your Passion

Episode Date: February 14, 2022

Do you want to meditate daily with me? Go to go.calm.com/onpurpose to get 40% off a Calm Premium Membership. Experience the Daily Jay. Only on CalmJay Shetty sits down with Payal Kadakia to talk about pursuing passion and overcoming limitations. Success is achieved when you know what your passion is, you learn how to develop that passion, and recognize the hurdles you have to overcome. Success is when you find a solution to solve your problem and then find ways to scale it so others having similar problems can solve theirs too.Payal is a Mother, Artist and Entrepreneur. The first company she founded, ClassPass, is the leading fitness and wellness membership company with members logging more than 100 million hours of workouts across 30,000 partner studios in over 30 countries. An MIT graduate, Choreographer and Philanthropist, Payal continues to serve as mentor and investor to other artists and female founded companies, championing the South Asian community throughout North America.Want to be a Jay Shetty Certified Life Coach? Get the Digital Guide and Workbook from Jay Shetty https://jayshettypurpose.com/fb-getting-started-as-a-life-coach-podcast/What to Listen For:00:00 Intro03:37 Something in your life that brings so much joy05:51 Will you fight to dance?10:37 The best ideas come out from your own struggles18:17 How to know when you aren’t in the right environment23:15 Learning how to lead with a vision29:52 Despite the success, you still need to learn and grow35:38 The effective ways to set goals43:00 Build a support structure around your ambition49:58 Payal on Final FiveEpisode ResourcesPayal Kadakia | WebsitePayal Kadakia | InstagramPayal Kadakia | LinkedInPayal Kadakia | TwitterLife Pass: Drop Your Limits Rise To Your PotentialSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I'm Jay Shetty and on my podcast on purpose, I've had the honor to sit down with some of the most incredible hearts and minds on the planet. Oprah, Kobe Bryant, Kevin Hart, Louis Hamilton, and many, many more. On this podcast, you get to hear the raw real-life stories behind their journeys and the tools they used, the books they read, and the people that made a difference in their lives so that they can make a difference in hours. Listen to on purpose with Jay Shetty on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Join the journey soon. What if you could tell the whole truth about your life, including all those tender and visible things we don't usually talk about?

I'm Megan Devine. Host of the podcast, it's okay that you're not okay. Look everyone's at least a little bit not okay these days, and all those things we don't usually talk about, maybe we should. This season, I'm joined by stellar guests like Abbermote, Rachel Cargol, and so many more. It's okay that you're not okay.

New episodes each and every Monday, available on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. The world of chocolate has been turned upside down. A very unusual situation. You saw the stacks of cash in her office. Chocolate comes from the cacountry, and recently, Variety's cacao, thought to have been lost centuries ago,

were re-discovered in the Amazon. There is no chocolate on earth like this. Now some chocolate makers are racing deep into the jungle. To find the next game-changing chocolate, and I'm coming along. Okay, that was a very large crack it up. Listen to obsessions wild chocolate. On the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

It wasn't do good work because the world is telling me to do good work. It was, I like to put my heart into things. It was the only way I knew how to operate. And I think that came from the basis of dance. It was how do I do everything with that love? How do I choreograph my life and give dance into everything I'm doing because it adds joy to it to everyone around.

Hey everyone, welcome back to On Purpose, The number one health podcast in the world, thanks to each and every single one of you who come here every week to listen, learn and grow. Now today's guest has been a guest on the podcast before. There's very few people who have been on the podcast twice. She is going to be one of them. She is one of my dearest friends. Me and Radee consider her a family here in LA. She's the one who's made us feel so at home and made this place feel like home.

But beyond all of that, she is the founder of ClassPass and the author of this incredible new book called Life Pass, drop your limits, rise to your potential. Her name is Pyle Cadacier and you need to go and grab this book We're gonna put the link at the top of the comments So while you're listening to this interview make sure you go and grab a copy. This is launch day. Bye. Oh, welcome Thank you so much for having me Jay Thank you for being here because I remember when I sat down with you Can you believe it's been three years since our first interview? Wow? Years 2019 was when we launched the podcast. You were one of the first guests in the first six months. It's been three years now. You've got your amazing

new book out. Yep. Which I was fortunate enough to read before. Yes. I want to start off and I said this yesterday when we were doing our summit conversation, but you know what I love about you is that no one would know how mighty you are because you never try and make people in your personal life feel that way or understand that like what I value about you the most is your humility, your groundedness, your sincerity because it's so endearing. Then when you realize that you're a powerhouse, it's like wow wow, that combination is so beautiful. So I feel like you represent the modern entrepreneur

in the most amazing way. And I want everyone who's listening today to connect to that. Yes, Pylis built incredible business and like all of this amazing life, but it's like the heart with which you've done it and how you've protected that heart is what I value in you. So I wanted to start with that because I really appreciate that.

I have to tell you. And I have to say, I give that credit to my parents because I think when you've seen people struggle and go through something, and then when you then have the gift to be able to give to others because of the hard work of other people, I think you just are so grateful for the journey, and I'm never, think you just are so grateful for the journey and I'm never ever would take any of this for granted.

I love it. I know I'm tiering thinking about it. It's beautiful when you're okay. You can just start going on, I'm crying. It's your, it's your, it's your thinking of your parents, does that and your parents are amazing and you know, I've had the fortune of spending time with them

and it's, it's so beautiful to see your love for them in connection, you know, they're so proud of course. But let's dive in. Last time we were here, we actually talked about the journey of like building class bus. We talked about SAR, which I want to talk about today as well. Pyle founded her own dance company, SAR Dance Company. I've seen them perform at least three times now, and it was absolutely incredible. Both coast. Yeah, both coast. But let's start with the discovery of purpose. Yes. Because you were on a certain path, and then at one point you veered away, I want you to help us understand when did

you first understand even internally, even if it wasn't in these words, what purpose was, and that you wanted to live for something deeper. So I really believe for me, it started when I was close to four or five years old. And I know most people do not discover purpose and passion at that age, but for me, and this is a very, very interesting dynamic, because most people would never think a moment like this is how you found it.

But I went to a party, like a family friends party with my parents, and they asked me to dance. And I got onto the dance floor and started performing. And of course, like it's nice to have everyone looking at you and all of that, but it wasn't about that for me. It was this feeling that there was something inside of me that I gave to others, right?

There was magic created between the audience and me in that moment. And I didn't obviously know it at the time, so I talk about this in obviously in a hindsight way, because when you're five years old, you're not thinking about this stuff. But in that moment, I felt something sort of come out of me that honestly, nothing else could compare to.

And I think when you have something in your life that brings you so much joy, brings you so much happiness It's really hard to find anything else that's going to compare to it And I know we'll get into it whether that's things like money and all of that and I tried to hang on to that feeling Right, and I really believe my life has been a fight to hang on to that feeling and then with class pass It was to share that feeling with others so they could have it in their life as well. Yeah, that's so beautiful.

There's an amazing ancient text in India and diverse reads, when you protect your purpose, your purpose protects you. And I love it because you often think of your purpose as something you have to find or create. And actually the wisdom reminds us it's something you have to protect. You already have it. Yes. Can you tell us because last time we talked about the whole journey, what I'm more fascinated in is having taken this journey to build a business, to grow, to take your passion into this bigger industry, how did you have to protect

your purpose? Because I think that's something that people don't think about a lot. I mean, the whole time my life, I truly believe I fought to dance. I 100% believe that my life, even now, it's not easy. And why do I say that? It's because society has its own expectations of me.

I have you have identity issues where you're like, wait, can I be doing that? I'm this person, I'm that person. But I have learned to take away a lot of those things and say, but no, my heart isn't this. And this is what I love. And I love what you just said about, it's already inside of you. Because when I think about the journey of me being corporate America, right? And I think a lot of people, you're in your job, you're kind of going through the motions of it, you don't necessarily, I don't know, you don't love what you do, but you're in it, right?

Because you have to pay the bills, et cetera. For me, I had this thing that I was doing on the side, right? But it was fulfilling me. And the more I started doing it, the more it gave back to me, right? So that whole protection side that you were just talking about, I truly believe, and I talk about this in the book and the synchronicity of the world helping me through when I was questioning it, as long as I found the time to dance, I felt like the universe was giving me signs, whether it was, you know, I talked about the story where it saw it ended up on the cover of the art section of the New York Times. And it was a moment when everyone was telling me to go to business school, right?

And that seemed like the right path in everyone else's sense of the world. And here I was getting this sign from the world telling me I was on the right path by following what I loved. And all those moments helped me to just continue to hang on. And I do believe those things happen because it was like a sign from the universe saying keep going in this direction because the world wants you to do this and to me that is protection. Yeah, that's such a wonderful way of looking at it and you know the times I've seen you dance, it truly is the most magical experience. Like seeing someone in

their element and you just fully immersed, you're fully absorbed. I love that you just said you had to fight to dance. Yeah. Because I think we think that purpose should just flow. And we think sometimes that the word synchronicity, as you used, means it just kind of happens. Right. But you said you had to fight. Tell us about how we learn to fight for what we care about. Because I think that's not often spoken about.

We think that if you care about something, it should just magically manifest, but you're fighting, I love that. I mean, in anything in your life, you need to know what your priorities are. They cannot be set by other people, right? And that comes down to everything with your professional career, your personal life, your family, right?

People are always asking, oh, how do you juggle this and that? It's because I know what is important to me, and that doesn't come from anyone else. And once I know it's important, those are the things going in my schedule, and I don't feel guilty about it. It's usually the guilt, right?

When I even say I fought to dance, it was because once again, it was everyone wanted me to do other things, but the more I thrived in doing it, and obviously the more I built a system to really say, it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks, what matters is what I do and what I want to give to the world. I learn to prioritize and make sure that I put a plan against doing the things I loved, and I think we forget that. We forget that it's supposed to be our priorities that come first, right?

We put everyone else's priorities first, and it's not selfish to do that by any means. Our true purpose in the world is to do that thing that we were put on earth to do. That's actually the best thing you could do, right? In the world to be selfless. And that's what I really want people to understand. And, you know, I always felt through my journey, I know there were moments when I was working so hard

and people may have been like, hey, Pyle, like, you know, you've been MIA for so long, like you missed this and you missed that. But I woke up every day and I knew even though I had maybe no customers at the time, I knew that I was trying to solve a problem. And obviously, once I did, it all made sense. But in my heart, I knew I was on a mission, right? We forget what that feels like to be on a mission, but there is nothing that feels comparable when you're on that mission to make an impact in the world. And I think that's truly like the heart

of all of this for me. I love that you use that phrase there because I think when you talk to any real, successful entrepreneurs, they all were trying to solve a problem. They weren't trying to build a billion-dollar company. They weren't trying to build a company on the front of Forbes. They weren't trying to build a company that gets acquired. I think we hear those terms so much now. And it's like almost like people set themselves up for failure because they start a company to exit. Or they start

a company to sell it. Right. Whereas whenever I've talked to you for years, you've always talked about this idea of solving a problem. Can you walk us through how that is a amazing way to unlock your potential? Because I think it's something we don't consider. I actually had a conversation just like this. I was back in London during Christmas.

Right. And I was driving to an event and I met someone and he was saying to me that I think, you know, I just need to make more money. Like, how do I make more money? And I appreciate that. Right. A lot of us need to make more money and find new ways to make more money. Of course.

We all have responsibilities. One hundred percent. And I said to him, I said, well, let's ask this question differently. I said, what if you ask the question, what problem can I solve? And I said, I'm sure you're going to come up with way more ways to make money than if you think, how can I make money? Right. Because when you ask the question, how can I make money, then you only think of those things.

Walk us through how you really focus on a problem and how to problem solve as an MIT dancing CEO. There's so many parts to that. Let me, I'll start a little bit with the beginning of how my idea of what problem came to me, right? And I think what's really interesting is through my life, I was living many identities. So I was Indian, I was American,

I was this dancer girl in the middle of a business world. I never felt like I could fit in. And when I met the career field of entrepreneurship, which was 10 years ago, this was not something that most people were doing at the time, I actually saw it as just a way to be free, right? I saw it as a way to impact the world and solve a problem. I didn't see it as the fame or having

this many people in my team or any of that. And I actually think, to be honest, and I spend a little bit of time, my first few years, because you kind of get thrown into this incubator world of tech startup momentum, and you start doing things for brand, and you start doing things to raise money, and to get press, then you forget about that main point. And I had to go back to that.

And so the reason I found my problem was because I faced it, right? And I think that is such a great way to find a problem to solve in the world. It's what are you struggling with? And most of the times, I think the best ideas come out of your own struggles. I mean, Uber did that, Airbnb did that, and it really did. I went to go find a ballet class, and it sounds so simple. I couldn't find it. So I decided to solve that problem, right. And there was obviously more to that.

This wasn't just, okay, let's solve it with tech. This was really for me, I had been fighting to dance my whole life. I wanted to take this fight to other people. So that kind of, in a way, goes a deeper level than what the what is. It goes down to the why. That we always talk about it. There's one layer deeper to that why. But I think when you have a problem to solve in the world,

the reason it's so important is because how do you know when you've solved it? And if you are just going out there to build a company, how do you measure your impact, right? When you talk about purpose and all of that, and it's not that you need to be able to measure it, like doing good is doing good, right? If it's two people, one person, it doesn't matter.

If it's a hundred, it's great that you're giving. But I think for me, when I realized people were going to class because of our product, and even yesterday, I was talking to someone and they were like, oh my God, I just want to tell you, I found all these new studios in Los Angeles because of class fast. I'm like, this story never gets old to me

because I know how impactful going to one class is for one person. And I think you have to really be bought in to the solution that you're solving for, because it can't feel like, okay, I checked it off and I'm done. And I think that's where some people get stuck, too. It's not a one and done. It's a journey, and it's a constant journey that keeps going forward. But the other side of this a little bit in the foundational thing.

So yeah, I had a great education that helped me learn to problem solve from MIT and I worked at a consulting firm. So I did have the mindset. But you know what? I think of the success behind my company truly comes from my creativity. It does not come from the fact that I had all these skills in this experience. I obviously that set me up very well and it gave me a great network. But the true magic came from my hustle, came from my discipline, it came from everything

else that I cared about and I felt made me see this problem in a different way, in a unique way than anyone else was looking at it. And that's really, I think, what people have to think about when they're going up to solve a problem is, what's that unique problem only you can solve? Right? And we were talking about this I think yesterday, but it's also then what do you have the expertise to do? Yeah.

I knew what classes felt, like what tech person in the world combined with someone who loved class was ever going to come together to be able to solve this problem. And I say this now, obviously, with a lot of confidence, but obviously when I was going through it, I felt embarrassed for parts of me, right? Like, oh, do I not know tech enough? Okay, wait, do I, you know, how am I gonna do that?

Oh no, like, should I hide my downside? All of that, you know, but you learn that the more you do something, that is so in line with what your purpose is, all that stuff goes away. Yeah, I really appreciate what you said, because when you're building something truly focusing on how this helps one person. Yes. One case study, one user, and when you can take

one person on a journey from A to Z, that journey helps you help a hundred people, a thousand people, a million people, a billion people. If you can't get that to work for one person, you're not going to be able to scale it. And I think often we think, no, but I want to help a million people. And I want my company to have a hundred thousand customers. And it doesn't start there. It starts with that one use case, that one person. This is actually the biggest mistake that entrepreneurs make today is they go in trying to solve for these big data numbers And they forget that data doesn't do your thinking for you, right?

And the magic of especially lifestyle brands and companies the magic happens in the customer to customer interaction And how someone feels from your product and how they like it and enjoy it. Like you said, it's everything from coming to the website to purchasing it, you know, and everyone gets kind of caught up on like launch day. But you know what, you launch every day as a founder of especially of a consumer company, you launch every single day because someone new is finding you. And I think that's a shift in the mindset

that a lot of people need to have. And I love that. I mean, it's so true. I think some people, they forget that it's not even doing it for one, they raise all this money, and they build all this momentum. But they haven't proven the fact that it works for one person.

I'm Danny Shapiro, host of Family Secrets. It's hard to believe we're entering our eighth season. And yet, we're constantly discovering new secrets. The depths of them, the variety of them continues to be astonishing. I can't wait to share ten incredible stories with you, stories of tenacity, resilience, and the profoundly necessary excavation of long-held family secrets. When I realized this is not just happening to me, this is who and what I am. I needed her to help me.

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Narcissists are everywhere and their toxic behavior and words can cause serious harm to your mental health. In our first season, we heard from Eileen Charlotte, who was loved by the Tinder Swindler. The worst part is that he can only be guilty for stealing the money from me, but he cannot be guilty for the mental part he did. And that's even way worse than the money you took. But I am here to help. As a licensed psychologist and survivor of narcissistic abuse myself,

I know how to identify the narcissists in your life. Each week, you will hear stories from survivors who have navigated through toxic relationships, gaslighting, love bombing, and the process of their healing from these relationships. Listen to navigating narcissism on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Jay Shetty, and on my podcast on purpose, I've had the honor to sit down with some of

the most incredible hearts and minds on the planet. Opro. the most incredible hearts and minds on the planet. Oprah, everything that has happened to you can also be a strength builder for you if you allow it. Kobe Bryant. The results don't really matter. It's the figuring out that matters. Kevin Haw. It's not about us as a generation at this point.

It's about us trying our best to create change. Lourdes Hamilton, that's for me being taken that moment for yourself each day, being kind to yourself, because I think for a long time I wasn't kind to myself. And many, many more. If you're attached to knowing,

you don't have a capacity to learn. On this podcast, you get to hear the raw, real-life stories behind their journeys and the tools they used, the books they read and the people that made a difference in their lives so that they can make a difference in hours. Listen to on purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeart Radio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Join the journey soon. Yeah. Well said, tell us about what you just brought up there because we've talked about this as

well. And it's interesting for me asking you this because now when I talk about having lived as among, people are like, oh yeah Jay, Jay talks about that and there'll be some people would be like, oh, well He's talking about it because it sounds cool. And I'm like I actually was embarrassed When I went back into the workplace to tell people I'd lived as a monk Interesting because they didn't have so it wasn't that I was put some some people say and I know no one listens to the podcast But some people say well, oh Jay does that because it makes him Sound like he's done something amazing in his life, and I'm like no no no no actually when I first came back in the workplace

I was insecure about it right because it was like your three years behind right like I'm 26 years old in a 21-year-old graduate position Right, because you didn't do the path everyone else was doing I didn't do the path And so actually I was scared of sharing my experience because I saw it as a weakness. I thought if people know I've been among, that they're gonna be able to use that against me because then I haven't had the experience they've had.

And so I've experienced that imposter syndrome too. And even now when I'm in media, sometimes it's the other way around where I'm sitting in a table and I'm like, why am I at this table? So imposter syndrome's always there. Absolutely. And you're saying that you had it,

of course there is confidence now, but there's also that insecurity still today. Of course. And it was there then walk us through how you dealt with it then. Like when you were like, I'm a dancer, but here I have to be a CEO. And of course, women on truepreneurs

and female entrepreneurs, like that whole journey is added to this whole journey of you as an individual. How did you handle it then of what were the mistakes you made? That's what I was going to start with. Well, let me tell you all the ways I did it wrong. Because to be honest, I think for the first half of my life, most of what I did with a lot of these identity issues that I think we all face is

I just separated them. Put like Indian pile in one place, put American pile here, put dancer pile here, business pile here, and I built my own worlds, right? So like they were all just very separate. And you know, because I was type A, I was like, let me succeed at being all of them, right? That was sort of my way of learning how to do well and build skill. Great. So that was what I originally did.

I think for me, a few threads started happening. The Indian American one sort of came together with dance, and as I started feeling like I had an environment to succeed in, and that was thriving, it helped me be both sides of who I was. And I think people underestimate their environments that they're in, and they are sometimes put in environments that do not serve them and their authenticity,

and you really need to question it. You do not need to stay in place that is trying to suppress you. And I mean, I always think about this. I'm sure there are people who I worked with in corporate America when I literally was probably quiet. I was like, I tried to like disappear in the room, who were probably like, that girl,

but that built that company, you know, because I wasn't in the right environment, you know? And it really depends on where you are. I think for business and sort of creative dancer pile, what happened originally, like I remember when I went to go to fundraise. I would like show up in these business suits and I'm a petite human being.

So I always felt uncomfortable. I always felt like I was like drowning in the clothes and didn't feel like, you know, I could be, you know, tiny but mighty birds, I feel like I can be sometimes. And I remember never feeling great in those meetings, because I almost like overrehearsed like data, I overrehearsed like all the finance numbers and all the things that actually didn't matter at all. And I started to realize, and this took me a minute, I remember actually this conversation,

I was sitting with someone in my Techstars company, group who was another CEO, and he's like, pile, you've clearly succeeded in your life. You have a formula, a pattern of success in your life. What is yours? Like follow that if this is not working. And as he asked me that, I broke it down to wait. So I know how to succeed in dance, right?

I've been able to like get the right job. And what do I do? It's like I go and study, I rehearse, I try and find a way for it to connect to me and authenticity with storytelling. And I realized I was missing that whole side of it from pitching my company, because I was walking in like a robot. Like, how was anyone going to like me? I didn't like me.

And I think that's really when I realized I needed to be the full version of who I was. And so I started walking into those rooms and I would be wearing my leggings instead of wearing a business suit. And I think people were like, you are the right person. And by the way, MIT was never going to leave me, right? Like, Bane was never going to leave me. I still had that credibility. I needed to wear that in a way that made me feel confident. And over time, I just stopped seeing any of the differences. And I think that's really the most important thing I would tell people is at some point,

you just have to actually embrace all those things that make you different and know that your journey set you up to be that successful in that moment to do whatever you are going to do going forward. Yeah, that's so powerful, like what you've just said, because the challenge is that we only attract the right people into our lives when we don't hide parts of ourselves, because if you hide parts of yourselves, you're only attracting what they find attractive is parts that you haven't hidden. And it can be really uncomfortable

to not hide parts of yourself because chances are most people aren't going to vibe with you but the right people are. And I think that's what you're waiting for. And I think it's really scary to go into a room and have the, there's a brilliant book I read recently called The Courage to Be Disliked. And I was like, that's really what you need.

We all need the courage to be able to walk into a room and be okay with that this person may not vibe with me. But there will be someone who will. And walk us through what do you think? I want to hear this because I think your dance experience is just, it's what gravitated me towards you. So that's another perfect example of what we're just saying. When I first discovered you on Instagram,

it was like, I would just show you posting, and I was like, wow, this is amazing. Like, who's this American Indian girl? Indian American girl, who's posting these girl woman? Who's posting these incredible, like, very classical, timeless work of art pictures of dance with Sardance Company. And I was just like, this is just, I've never seen something like this before. Tell me about what you think dance taught you about life. Oh, yeah. Because I think you

lived the way you dance. Yeah. And I hope to, I mean, I always say, like, I hope I'm choreographing through life, you know, and I used to always I mean, I always say, I hope I'm choreographing through life, and I used to always feel- Of that. When I was walking through the streets of New York, I just felt like I was dancing, and when you meet the burst-ed starbucks, I feel like you give that energy if you feel like that, and I do feel like it's an enlightenment and it's a-

This is why you need a musical. This is why- This is why, Pyle, if you direct musicals or theater productions, please reach out because when you said that, all I visualized you was doing a musical where you're singing and dancing and walking into the bridge. As an aside, and this is actually a really funny story, is when I was younger, literally like five years old, my parents would take long drives, right?

My sister would be like looking out the window and I would put headphones on and listen to Bollywood tracks and literally see people dancing in the mountains in my head. I have been choreographing since I was so young in my head. I don't know why, but probably watching too many Bollywood films when I was younger. I just, I don't know, I just saw the world that way. I just saw that's how people work together. So as an aside, but going back to what dances taught me, I think to start with that, I have to go back to Ushanti, who is my dance teacher, who literally taught me, obviously not just how to dance,

but she taught me how to show up to life, right? In India, we talk about Guruji's, right? A lot, and it's someone who bestows knowledge upon you, you respect them because the one thing that's indestructible is knowledge, right? She, of course, was teaching me steps, you know, and at the time I didn't necessarily appreciate everything. I was like, oh, yeah, I want to go and have fun with my friends But she was teaching me about where I had come from, right? The women of India my ancestors

Which made me feel much more stronger in who I was even though once again, I didn't know it at the time But she also, you know, she expected us to be on time, right? She expected us to practice. She expected us to have our hair up. And I know it sounds a little forced and it can, you know, to some people are like, oh, wow, like that, she's so strict. But I am so glad I had her in my life. And even today, she is one of the first people I call to be like, hey, I'm dealing with this.

What should I do? Because she will give me the toughest, but the best advice, right? She, and she even the other day, I think I sent her a dance video. And she's like, you know, I'm not going to praise you. So if you're sending something to me, I'm going to give you real feedback. And I love that, you know, because it keeps me growing

and everything that I do. And I think as I grew up and started dancing more, so college is sort of this other time that happened in my life when, once again, like I'm a tiny person, I'm the baby of my family. I didn't know what it meant to be a leader, right? I had never taken on that role. And I think in anything in our lives, right? People don't realize you can take a leadership role in the smallest thing. It could be literally planning a family vacation, right? It's really just about

learning how you work and how you lead with like a vision, right? And so for me, even at college, it probably started with choreograp. And so for me, even a college, it probably started with choreographing 40-person dance shows. And how do you organize people like that and think about communicating and getting everyone to move in the same way? There is no difference between that and running a team. And then by the time I started saw,

and I was building confidence because I was good at executing these shows and these performances, and people were gravitating towards it because they were like, wow, you're really good at what you do and which helped me build confidence even though once again this was a side thing I did my whole life. And so at the time I was building SAW and started putting down money towards doing big shows in New York City and seeing Indian celebrities want to come to it, seeing a sell out shows, you know, the week before, seeing my ability to, you know, find a stage manager and a lighting designer when I didn't know that world

at all, like I was in the business world, I didn't have any idea, and I was in the middle of New York City. To see a lot of that just made me believe in my ability to execute. And I think we forget how important execution is and the confidence it gives you, right? So you can have an idea. But if you've never really completed something in your life, you don't know, right?

And you know, in the smallest form, like class passed to me, literally started with a 100 person dance show because that was the first thing I ever did. That was sort of my own with a vision. And I got people to come and band against. And you know what, some of those people who came to that first show of mine became my investors in class fast. And I think everything is connected,

because my other point on this is I always did good work, right, because I was always doing what I loved, right? It wasn't do good work, because the world is telling me to do good work. It was, I like to put my heart into things. It was the only way I knew how to operate and I think that came from the basis of dance. It was, how do I do everything with that love?

How do I choreograph my life and give dance into everything I'm doing? Because it adds joy to it to everyone around. Yeah, I think that point that you made is so important because you were doing everything you did with love, care, and attention. So people, when they saw you, whether you were dancing or whether you were in a meeting, they could trust pile dustings with love, care, and attention.

And that's why the people who came to your dance show became your investors. The problem is we see everything is disconnected. We think, well, that's what I love and that's what I hate. Or that's what I really want to do and that's not what I want to do. But actually, when you approach even things you don't want to do, with love, care, and attention,

people take note. And then that starts to be called a connection, like the fact that you used what you learned in dance to choreograph teams, just that idea, if anyone's listening to that right now, you may be going to a job every day that you don't like, but I promise you there's a skill in your personal life that you love that you can apply there,

or there's a skill in that workplace that you can apply to your personal life, and all of a sudden it becomes meaningful. I spent years working at Accenture, which was not my purpose or not my passion. However, when I look back on it, I see it as some of the best training I ever received because I learned so many invaluable skills

that I would never have learned anywhere else. You can either look at that experience and negate it and think, oh, well, that was a waste of time. Or you can go, well, what's the one thing I got there that actually helps me build what I'm building, which is your journey. I mean, let's dive into when you're choreographing life, which I just love,

even just that is just such a beautiful thought. Mentors is not something that you left just for dance as well. Mentorship is something what I saw in you, you've constantly chosen to be humble and want to learn from everyone around you. How did you, as you became more successful, remain grounded to one advice? When I think so many people, as their career grows, they almost think, well, now people should come to me for advice. How did you keep that balance? Because I've seen you do it.

But I think it's quite surprising to a lot of people in general, not about you, but in general. I think as human beings, we can constantly grow. And maybe this is deep rude for me in the way I was taught with Ushanti, with I will never be and be able to know all the knowledge of even dance in my life, right? And I think when you think about that and learning a skill that could

literally be a lifelong learning journey, all of this can be even entrepreneurship. Like, class pass was a journey. My business journey, everything gets me one step further. And I think the power of it is keeping myself growing with teachers, right? I mean, that's the basis of class passes. We should never in our lives ever be at a place where we want to stop growing and learning.

I think the second we do, we get bored and we get sad. And what's the journey, right? It becomes meaningless. And what are you gonna do sitting there at the top by yourself? Anyway, what is that? You know, there's always more to do. And really, there's always more to give.

Right, and I think that's really where it comes from. But I think obviously there are times in my life, and I actually have to balance it right now because a lot of people do want my advice, which is why I wrote my book, because I felt like that was a responsible way for me to do it. But at the same time, I have to also limit that

to be able to say, I want to grow too. And I think that's a really interesting thing to even think about at this point in my life is, you know, what's going to inspire me, what's going to help me grow. And I'm constantly thinking about that. What friends do I want to spend time with, right? What mentors do I need because I'm going through like a shift right now, you know, I'm very, very conscious and self-aware of where I am, and I think that really adds to it. But at the end of the day,

I would never want someone to ever feel like they are the smartest person in the world. I mean, I don't like working with people like that to be honest, let's just like, not my way of working, but there are people. And I think a lot of times, sadly, that actually comes from insecurity, right? Yeah, it's a defense mechanism? It's a defense mechanism.

It's a defense mechanism. And so I think when you truly are confident in a way, you don't have to prove anything. Yeah. And I think that's what people have to remember. It's not about acting like you're smart. Yeah. It's truly about just being able to live and be

without society making you feel like you're insecure, so let me act a certain way because it comes across unnatural. Hi, I'm David Eagleman. I have a new podcast called Inner Cosmos on I Heart. I'm a neuroscientist and an author at Stanford University and I've spent my career exploring the three-pound universe in our heads. On my new podcast, I'm going to explore the relationship between our brains and our experiences by tackling unusual questions so we can better understand our lives and our realities,

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at this table because we have something to offer. The smartest people in the world ask more questions than they talk. Yeah. Like they're actually thinking about like, oh well, what can I learn from this person or how can I learn from this person? And so when you go into somewhere, we think confidence means talking the most. And confidence actually means being confident to say, I don't know and let me ask the most.

And so if you're sitting here listening to this going, well, Jay, if I was in an environment with mentors and people, I wouldn't know what to say, ask questions, right? Like asking questions is the safest way to learn. One of the things I love about this book pile is, not only is it your story, but it's so practical, and I just wanna hold up some things to some people so you can see that.

You know, there's these beautiful moments in this book that you take this opportunity to make things really practical in asking people to reflect. And I love that because often these books, when they're written by entrepreneurs, it's like, here's my story and here's how I do. And yours doesn't do that. Yours continues to give people systems and frameworks.

A lot of checkpoints and advice on top of, you know, the stories and especially the constraints I've been through, but at the end of the day, we all face roadblocks in our lives. And I really believe in you know this about me. Like, you can take any of them away if you just try. And if you put a plan together, right? My whole system has been really about thinking about what the plan is, right? So if I don't have enough money, okay, what is my plan to have enough money, right? It's not about giving up on the dream.

It's about planning for it. Yeah, and let's dive into that. When you're writing this book, I remember we talked about the word constrain so a lot. Yeah. And limits it is the word. Are constraints real? No. I mean, that's really what I want people to see is that you can find a way through

across any tree that's fallen in the forest, right? Especially if you know you're true North, it's really about finding your way through it. It is not about stopping at the tree and then stopping going to where you want to go. And I think that's really what people need to see is how do I maneuver my way to not lose track of where I want to go. And they don't exist. They really don't. And you can really find a way to work through it.

You need to do a lot of self-reflection, understand how you work, and then go and do it. Action, right, is really the best way to move forward. Yeah, and what are the biggest mistakes you think when we make plans? Because I love this topic. Yeah. Because I was sharing with everyone recently when I was on the today's show for the beginning of the year, I was saying to everyone that we need to shift from goal setting to growth setting. So we keep setting these big goals.

I want to do this, I want to be this. But it's like the growth, like what skills do I need? What's my plan? What's my approach? Like that's what you should be focused on. It's like saying, I want to do a podcast with pile. And you can have that as a goal, but it's like, well, have we thought about what we need to build a podcast?

Start. Yeah. So walk us through, what, have we thought about what we need to build, a pod star, we need to start. Yeah. So walk us through, what are the mistakes we make when we create plans, or do we even create plans? Because I'm not sure we do. I think we just set these, this guy's time. This is a great, am I the whole, why are there?

I know the whole book explains this. Well, the whole last third of this book is the Life Pass Method, which is my, I call it goal setting method, but really, what it comes down to is these itty bitty goals, which are so minute that they do not feel big at all. But like you said, it's about getting started. And the way I've thought about it and it helps to solve a lot of the problems is

I first start with you reflecting because you need to know where you are today before you start setting goals. And a lot of times we start setting goals without really taking stock of where we are today. So that's sort of mistake one, right? Yes. Then the second one is I go into a dream mode, right? Which is what do I wanna do and be in a year? But that is not about check marks.

Like I'm gonna run a marathon and buy a house and all these big things, like you just said, I like to anchor them in words, in feelings. How do I wanna feel in a year? I love that. Because that's something I can, you know I can really put intention behind, right? And put into my body, I can go back to and feel like am I going towards that or not. Where, you know, running, like, is that a running a marathon is just a checkmark in our life. Then the next part

of it to me, and this is because I'm super analytical and, like, love time, I think people really need to think about where they spend their time. So this whole next part of that focusing. You cannot set goals in every aspect of your life all the time. It's never going to work, right? You're never going to be able to make an impact in every aspect of your life. You're probably going to end up failing and then being able to feel like you can't do anything.

So my structure and the third step is really all about focusing in on three to five areas of your life that you can focus on, right? And so that might be like, okay, my family, some friends, and work, right? And you get to the point once you're there. And then the like the last part of this, and this is I think what I feel like I've done really well throughout my life, is I know how to set the goal, right? Because it's all, it's not even a goal, like you said, it's really about the action you need to take to get to where you want to go. And pretend you want to go and learn tennis, right? A lot of people would be like, yeah, I'm going to play tennis.

Then the whole year we'll go by and they'll never sign up. It literally comes down to maybe it's take one hour to get on to the internet and search for three instructors near you. Find reviews on them. Sign up for one class. Even if you don't go to the class in that three-month period that you're doing this exercise, you're still making progress because you at least are getting closer to doing that first class, right? Because until you actually go and show up to that first lesson, you haven't gotten anywhere in your goal. And I think that's what people forget.

And there's a lot of mistakes you, you know, people don't share their goals. I think you should always be so proud of what you want to do. You'd be so surprised how much your friends and family will support you if they know what you really want to accomplish in your life. So it's, I mean, I have a lot of that. I know, I know. That's, yeah, it was a loaded question. No, it's fine, but it's, it is. But like you said, I do think people make a lot of mistakes here and it's really like

I said, and this is, you this is one way of thinking about it. It really comes down to having a practice for yourself of how do I look inward, focus myself, and then set goals and feel the confidence of I said these goals I did it. Okay, great, let's set bigger goals next time, right? You can only get to the bigger goal if you start with a smaller step and fulfill that.

When you have a dream and it feels really big, the question is, what's the smallest thing I can do right now? Like what's the first thing and that's what you just broke down? It was like, I want to play tennis every day or every this year, but it's like, let me just find an instructor. That's very achievable. Right. Right.

And I think that's the point that I remember sitting down with a friend once and he really wanted to direct theater shows. And I was like, that's a big goal. And we literally just broke it down to the tiniest thing he could do today. So that's, and it's literally like with something like that, I think I have it in my book.

It's like, even watch three, three plays. Yes, yes. Right? Like I know it's weird, but it's like watching three plays. And actually it's funny, right? I think you've talked about this a lot. Sometimes people think like watching stuff that we enjoy, it's part of your goals too, right?

So a lot of times when we'd be like, oh, that's like leisure time. I don't have time to watch the plays, but no, you just put it as a part of your plan towards your goals. So in a way, sometimes doing these processes of setting goals makes you also realize the reason you're inclined to watch that movie, it's because you need inspiration right now in your goals. So in a way, sometimes doing these processes of setting goals makes you also realize, like, the reason you're inclined to watch that movie, it's because you need

inspiration right now in your life. And that is still, like, fulfilling. It is not about you being, like, lazy, right? And I think that's, I never feel lazy even when I'm, like, chilling. I think we talk about this a lot. It's, like, sometimes we need that time, right? And that's, like, a part of scheduled time in a way that I know I need to replenish. I never think of it as I'm being lazy. I mean, our times are so busy, but I think we have to think about what we need, not just professionally and not just to like in obligation of other people. It's also what we need to keep moving forward. Yes, definitely, definitely. And that's what I find so fascinating about what you just said is that we get lost in just how big it is and it feels so heavy.

Yeah. And it feels so far and it feels so out of reach that we just give up. Right. And I'll give an example of something right now. So I'm at a stage where we're growing and I really want to be a good leader and that's something that's new to me in this world of work. If I was a leader in the monastery, it was different to being a leader here. And so my goal is to read a chapter a day of this book that I've been reading called The Culture Code, which is just a phenomenal book about that. And I've been doing that. When I was reading your book,

I was feeling like I was growing in so many entrepreneurial ways. I was sitting here reading life pass when you sent it to me in advance. And I was like, oh wow, like this is what I need to do with people. And this is what I need to do with time. And so your goal right now,

if you have a passion, is just read life pass. Like literally, like no genuinely, that can be as simple as it is. Like you may say, I've got a passion, I have a goal, just read life pass. Like literally, like no genuine, that can be as simple as it is. Like you may say, I've got a passion, I have a goal, I want to build it into something real. And when we say something real, it could be, it doesn't have to be a billion dollar company. It can mean something that takes care of me

and my family, right? Like it can be that. Yeah. But then apply what you're learning here and your goal right now could just be, I'm gonna read a chapter of this book a day. I'm gonna read a chapter a week. I'm gonna read a chapter a month and and you break that down like that You're going to start seeing these mindsets get into your psychology and that's really what we're talking about

Yes, right is that it's psychological change exactly. It's about creating a habit of doing this right? It's not about doing this once It's nothing's going to happen if you know we all we always talk about that You can't do something once, it's about building a practice of out. How you also can trust yourself, right? How do you get into a place where this becomes about you being excited about it.

No goal setting list should be a to-do list, right? Nothing in your life should feel like a to-do list. It should feel exciting like it's moving you forward, but you're the only person who can tell yourself that. Yeah, let's talk a bit about Zane. Oh. It was his second birthday. Yeah, that's what we got.

Literally last weekend. Well, baby, I know. And he's so grown up. I mean, he is so grown up. Watching him grow over the last two years. Yeah. You've had, you know, because of the pandemic, it's great that he's having a little day.

You've had lots of good time. Yeah. And I felt like the last three months, he grew even more, because I didn't see him because I was in London. And I was just like, what? How's he so tall? But let's talk about what you're learning through motherhood because I think that that's a new chapter in your life. It's a new chapter, a new space, a new move for you. And it's like

that requires different growth. And what are you learning personally from other hood that you think you didn't learn from other things? I mean, nothing prepares you for motherhood until you become a mother. And obviously, there was a lot of changes that happened because COVID happened right when he was born. But I think outside of that, what I've had to really just be conscious of once again, my time, which I always was,

but even more so, I think it was easier when, you know, I would feel guilty or not feel guilty about like going on an event or something. It's really hard when you're like, oh, I just want to spend time with my baby, you know. So there's hard times, but I love what I do. I think it's made it more important for me to love the work I do, right? Because I will always be an ambitious woman. And I want to, you know, I really think it's so important for women to know they can always be ambitious at any point in their life.

You have to build a support structure around that is another thing I've learned, right? Like this is, you know, me and Nick talking, Nick is my husband. You know, it's me and him talking about like what support structure do I need, right? Like we have this book coming out, it was that's why like my family is here, everyone, because I'm like, what you need support in order

to do these things in our lives. And I think a lot of time, especially as women, we don't always know how to ask for help. And a baby is a 24 or seven job, and they're great, but you need to be able to also know how to take care of yourself, do the things that you still love, or you will be completely just doing one thing the whole time.

And I think that it's obviously you have to figure out your choice of that. And then the last time. And I think that it's obviously, you have to figure out your choice of that. And then the last thing is, I think a lot of it comes down to also figuring out with expectations of society. I do think like there's a lot of things that still happen to mothers, feeling like you should be doing this and not.

And maybe that's a blessing in COVID is I just wasn't around society that much. So I think I just got to develop my own bond with my son in my way. I, you know, I wasn't around anyone else to be like, is this the right way or wrong way? And I think, you know, I get, I feel like a kid with him. I think that's like my favorite, favorite thing is you just play with him, you know? And it's just, it's just really beautiful to experience the world through his eyes, you

know? It's beautiful to watch you guys together. Like I love seeing Zane like, want to run away to you all the time. But it's like, what I think is really healthy is, you know, I was on, I was on Chelsea Handlers podcast last week. And she does the segment where she invites people on from our audience to talk through their challenges. And someone came on and they were just being an honest mom, like,

just being honest and saying, look, I love my kid. But I'm really struggling to find time for myself. I feel like I'm losing myself, like I'm losing my identity. And I was just like, I was so happy to hear that honesty and that vulnerability. And even what you were saying today, it's like, I still have to have my, like I still have to find the way because I love

my child, but I still have me. And, you know, when I see Zayn and it's like, he loves music. And he loves dancing. And it's like, he loves music. And he loves dancing. And it's like, he obviously, when he watches you, is being inspired. And the other day, I think I had Saur rehearsal and he came into my studio.

And then my mom was like, what was mama doing in the, and he calls in my office? And he starts dancing. He's like, and I'm like, I'm really happy because I didn't grow up with that, right? I didn't grow up with someone being creative always around me and thinking like, oh, you know, and I'm like, I'm really happy because I didn't grow up with that, right? I didn't grow up with someone being creative always around me and thinking like that's a way to live. And I was thinking about that.

Like I want him to feel like he could be anything in his life, right? And not force him to sort of live by a certain standard or a certain path. And I think that's really beautiful. And I think in general for women. And I obviously, I think that's really beautiful. And, you know, I think in general for women. And, you know, and I, I obviously, I think these last two years were personally

actually harder for me because I had to work through these things. And I haven't had to work myself out of expectations and out of sort of structures. The world didn't so long. Like I started class past 10 years ago, I was in it. And I remember going back to, and I actually, in a weird way, like as I was writing this book, it all was coming back to me,

to where I was 10 years ago to be like, wow, I need to break these boundaries again on expectations. And I hadn't gone through that in a while. So just kind of going back to that, going back to a sense of the center, right? Because I was on such a strong momentum, my whole life, and then I had a kid, and I just realized

I had to rethink so much and re-center, right? And so in a weird way my own book even helped me. You know, I think that's like the beauty of these books is when you're writing them, they they give back to you. And I remember moments especially in the past, you know, few years where I was like, wow, I remember the feeling of where I was 10 years ago. And sometimes I feel like I am right back there and I have to I'm going through all of this again. And I think that's why it's so important to realize this is a muscle. To work through constraints, it is not, and it's a mindset, right? It is not about, okay, I'm going to do it once and it's gone. You have to constantly work through it. And if you really care enough, which is what we started

with, then you will, you will find a way. I love it. And that's, and that's why I think this is a book that people can read again and again and again because like you said, as soon as you finish something or complete something, it's incredible how the constraints just come rushing back to your next phase of life. Right. And we keep putting new limits wherever we get to. And that's why when you're saying to us to drop your limits and rise to your particular, like that's something that we're going to do again and again and again.

And so whether you're someone at the start of your journey, or whether you're someone who's had some success and achievement and then you're trying to find your way, you know, this book, Life Pass, will actually help you in all areas of that because it's the same thing we keep going through again and again and again. Now, pile, you are amazing. I'm so grateful. I am hoping that each and every single person goes and grabs a copy of life pass. It's available right now. We will put the link in the comments. Go and order your copy, order one for a friend. I also think it's just so one of the things that I loved when I moved

here is that we've built such a beautiful community of South Asians in LA who've connected with each other just through genuine friendship and family. And I feel so grateful to have that feeling because it's always nice being around people who share that culture and share that heritage with you even though we grew up in different countries. And to see you doing so well and to see you sharing your story. And I know that it just comes from a place of wanting to help people. Yeah. And that's, and that's why I'm recommending this book so much is because I know that in your

heart, it's like you only wrote it to help people. Like that's the only reason I know that this journey of writing this book is hard. Yeah. Writing your book is not easy. And you had a baby at the same time. Yeah. And it's like you, and you're doing so many other things. And so I know that you brought this book

only to help people. To give, yeah, 100%. I just want people the same way with class pass. It's an extension of that, right? It is an extension of the vision of class pass with helping people fight through anything in their life to live their dream. And I feel like I have done that.

And I feel like I'm still doing that. And I never want anything to stand in anyone's way. I love that. Pyle, these are your final five, which are our rapid-fire rounds, so you have to answer in one word or one sentence maximum. Okay, all right. Pyle, these are your final five. Question number one, what is the best advice you have received?

Best advice to bet on myself. What is the worst advice you have received? To stop dancing. I can't believe anyone ever said that. That's amazing. Alright, third question. How would you define your current purpose? To create timeless things. Oh, I love that. That's beautiful. Alright, question number four. What is something you used to value that you no longer value. I used, I know this sounds funny because it's a sense of home. Like, I think I've learned to not value, I don't know, I don't value things. Like, I just value, I value like dance so much, especially in COVID.

And I know now I'm not doing a one sentence, but I think COVID just made me realize how much it's not necessarily about, you know, the environment, it's about having like the space to do what you love. I love that. And fifth and final question, if you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be? Don't ever sit at your desk for eight hours. Mm, move, dance, let play, do something.

I love that. Everyone piled cadacuid the book's name is Life Pass, go grab your copies. Make sure you tag me and pile on Instagram. Make sure you go and follow her if you don't already. And let us know what resonated, what connected. This was a phenomenal episode. And I can't wait to see what you do next, pile.

I'm so excited and grateful to have you in our life. And I know that this is just the beginning of a new chapter so thank you so much. What if you could tell the whole truth about your life including all those tender invisible things we don't usually talk about. I'm Megan Devine. Host of the podcast, it's okay that you're not okay. Look everyone's at least a little bit not okay these days, and all those things we don't usually talk about, maybe we should. This season I'm joined by Stellar Gas like Abbermote, Rachel Cargol, and so many more.

It's okay that you're not okay. New episodes each and every Monday, available on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you listen not okay. New episodes each and every Monday available on the iHeart Radio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. When my daughter ran off to hop trains, I was terrified I'd never see her again. So I followed her into the train yard. This is what it sounds like inside the box car. And into the city of the rails. There I found a surprising world so brutal and beautiful that it changed me. But the rails. There I found a surprising world, so brutal and beautiful, that it changed me. But the rails do that to everyone.

There is another world out there. And if you want to play with the devil, you're going to find them there in the rail yard. Undenail Morton. Come with me to find out what waits for us and the city of the rails. Listen to City of the Rails, and the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast,

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