On Purpose with Jay Shetty - Russell Brand: ON How He Nearly Ruined His Career

Episode Date: February 15, 2019

You may think you know Russell Brand - the actor, the comedian, ect... but that’s only a small part of who he truly is.Prepare yourself, today’s conversation gets intimate.Russell opens up about his struggles with addiction, his experience chasing fame, money, sex, and why that’s not something people should aspire to. He shares what has enlightened and led him to a life of sobriety for over 14 years now and the role mentors and spirituality has played in getting him there.He even shares some surprising wisdom from a mutual friend of Puff Daddy, comparing the challenges of life to levels in a video game.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hi, I'm David Eagleman. I have a new podcast called Inner Cosmos on I Heart. I'm going to explore the relationship between our brains and our experiences by tackling unusual questions. Like, can we create new senses for humans? So join me weekly to uncover how your brain steers your behavior, your perception, and your reality. Listen to intercosmos with David Eagleman on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's Debbie Brown, host of the Deeply Well Podcast, where we hold conscious conversations with leaders and radical healers and wellness around topics that are meant to expand and support you on your well-being journey.

Deeply well is your soft place to land, to work on yourself without judgment, to heal, to learn, to grow, to become who you deserve to be. Deeply well with Debbie Brown is available now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts. Namaste. Regardless of the progress you've made in life, I believe we could all benefit from wisdom on handling common problems, making life seem more manageable, now more than ever. I'm Eric Zimmer, host of the One-Dee Feed Podcast, where I interview thought-provoking guests

who offer practical wisdom that you can use to create the life you want. 25 years ago, I was homeless and addicted to heroin. I've made my way through addiction recovery, learned to navigate my clinical depression, and figured out how to build a fulfilling life. The one you feed has over 30 million downloads and was named one of the best podcasts by Apple Podcasts. Oprah Magazine named this is one of 22 podcasts to help you live your best life. You always have the chance to begin again and feed the best of yourself. The trap is the person often thinks they'll act once they feel better.

It's actually the other way around. I have had over 500 conversations with world-renowned experts and yet I'm still striving to be better. Join me on this journey. Listen to the one you feed on the I Heart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Life's like a computer game. You get trapped on different levels and until you can master that level,

you'll be trapped on it. It goes, you obviously was trapped on the drug level, then you get trapped on the sixth level. You've got to transcend these different levels. Now for me, these levels are helped very decross by mentors. When I was a drug addict, I met Chip Summers, and Chip Summers was the first person I met that was clean. He were able to transfer to me, like any good teacher will. Something that was latent within me, but I was not in a position to realize.

Welcome back to On Purpose. I'm so happy that you're here. My name is Jay Shetty, and I'm all about creating a community of purposeful people. People who want to find their purpose and serve others through it. I really hope you're a subscriber by now. Make sure you've rated and reviewed as well. Now today's guest is Russell Brand. Someone who needs no introduction, but as some of you know, Russell and I have been friends for some time and I find him absolutely fascinating.

This conversation is one of my favorites I've had with him, and even though it's a little shorter, it's super powerful. I asked Russell questions he'd never been asked before, especially about his relationship with the media, his honesty which nearly ruined his career and his spirituality. If you find him as fascinating as I do, you will love this episode. Towards the end, it gets pretty deep, so make sure to listen the whole way through. Enjoy the episode. introduction, but last time I did it, he said he really liked it, so I'm going to do it again, because that's always a nice thing to do. So he's an actor, activist, comedian, and someone who I truly believe is an amazing thinker in the realms of philosophy, spirituality, politics, and life.

I'm so excited to dive in to his fascinating life, which I believe he's had one of the most fascinating ones. He is none other than Russell Brand. Russell. Thank you again for that introduction. I wasn't enjoying that. Yeah, well you deserved it. Like I said last time. Thank you for doing this again. It's great to be back with you. Congratulations on your podcast. Thank you. I appreciate that. It was wonderful being on yours. This is the world now. Just people podcasting each other. I suppose ultimately there'll be a time when no human interaction is not subsequently released as a podcast. Yeah, well, I think that's what happened, right?

People had amazing conversations and they thought, I wish we could have shared that with someone. Now. And now they do. But I remember last time we were together, it's actually been just a year since I interviewed you for recovery, which was awesome. I was looking at that the other day, which was beautiful to be with you on the feedback we got for that

live broadcast last year. I think I got over two and a half million people saw it and the amount of energy we had for it was absolutely amazing. I was very impressed. And for a while afterwards, I couldn't do an internet video about going, press like, press, let me see a little heart, a smiley face. But then that couldn't keep up the enthusiasm, Jay. That's why we need you. Well, yeah, I'm not doing it this time because it's not life. So I can't ask for that. But last time we were together, we were in Ireland on a beach because you were shooting a movie and you were kind enough to invite us into your trailer

while you were getting your makeup done and wearing your outfits. Tell us a little bit about that. I was doing a children's film. It was called Four Kids and It. And now, everything I do in my life is weighed up against. Is it going to be as enjoyable to me as doing my daughter's bath time where I get to spend good quality time with them, mucking around, and it's one of my favourite things to do.

So I only really do work if it doesn't get in the way of parenting. I've been like, you know, I've done, had a long period of my life things to do. So I only really do work if it doesn't get in the way of parenting. I've been like, you know, I've done, had a long period of my life where I wasn't a parent and now so parenting, that's it for me, you know, like at this stage, it might be a bit where I get bored of them. I'm considering that as a possibility.

So like doing that film out there, rather than at Swami, a friend and teacher to both of us was kind enough to come visit us in county Wicklow, Ireland, also to do the podcast as usual, having for bid that a conversation should occur without being recorded and subsequently downloaded. So, you know, on the last day I was writing about it if I didn't have to do it because I've written a book on mentorship and rather that Swami is one of the mentors that I write about in that book. And I wrote about that occasion and how strange it was to be in a trailer

with you, a couple of our guys, Sandi Pan, our mutual friend, and Radhanath Swami. And of course, my own father, I'm thinking how unusual that felt those sort of those worlds colliding. And Radhanath Swami telling those stories from the bag of Agi are, you know. And in a sense, those kind of,

those kind of encounters are the monstrative of a new life where my past is coalescing with my future where different groups of my friends are starting to meet. In the past things were quite atomized for me. I was quite insular and solitary and quite I kind of know I'm still quite protective I suppose but in a different way. So now you know if I do make a film, then I'll make a film where I can bring my kids. If I do do podcasts, I try to do it in a way

that doesn't disrupt my connection to my family. So things have changed, and that little experience there of making that kids film, and the encounter that you and I had there in a sense is emblematic of these transitions. Yeah, it was an amazing conversation. and it's fascinating to see that transition. Did you ever, did you always dream of being a father? Was that always a step you wanted to take? Did you want to have children? Yes, I've like almost as soon as I stopped being a child,

I wanted children. I really like children a lot. When I was sort of like 15 or 16, I like, I say something about them. I suppose what it is is that the unstructured connection that they have, which most evidently is observable through play, like where kids play, for me, makes me very, very happy, but you can just invent what your situation is. And my daughter now is just reaching that age where you can that's what she'll do. Oh no Lucy's stuck in the mud. You know, even no Lucy's. Let's get Lucy out of the mud. You hold on my pajamas. You hold my jammers. We have to get Lucy out of the mud but no sooner we've got Lucy out of the mud then she's in a tree. This kid's got no respect

for reality. The way that reality is configured according to material situations. For her, Lucy is always on the press of peace of being stuck in the mud or caught in a tree, and it's how duty to get them back. I feel some of the storylines might be being plagiarized from the Disney version of Winnie the Poe, although the central character Lucy seems to be her own construction unless that has been taken from Ben and Holly, the kid show. Either way, is it kind of hip-hop editorialising of various media into her own imaginary narratives? They say that hip-hop was the first post-modern art form. And now children's play is this wonderful collage of influence

and I want in. Do you still have play yourself? Is there something that you feel because I feel as adults, a lot of people I know, I spoke to the founder of ClassPass, who's a good friend of mine, and she was talking about how, as a CEO, she really believes that one of the things we lose as adults is play. And you just brought that up, and I'm just thinking that reconnection of play in our own lives, is that something that you have a form of? Yes, I have, like firstly, I will say this, that a very good friend of mine, Emma Kenney,

who you should have on your podcast, said that sex is adult play, that in a healthy relationship, your sexuality should have an air of playfulness in it. So that's something that I think about an aspire to. Elsewhere in my life, in my friendships, like I've always enjoyed people. I guess as well, like comedians,

is like people that you can start talking about stuff and you sort of know that what you're talking about is not really real or something, but you're just inhabiting a role. Of course, I'm a performer as well. And a performance requires play. It requires play. Now, from, you know, you and I getting to know each other more,

you have a lot of spirit, you are running deep, know each other more you have a lot of spirit you are running deep you know so you have a kind of a sort of a very what seems to me a very natural monastic, a sage like quality you know. I'm not saying that that doesn't mean the play is accessible to you I'm sure it is but for me coming from the background that I do of a performer and an entertainer play is vital. The tricks, that energy, the energy of none of this is real, don't take this stuff seriously. You know, it's found in a lot of deities that I like, you know, sort of like in Krishna for example, there's a lot of mischief. I like that stuff. Now mischief is a risk because

we live in an orderly material world of regulation. But I suppose the idea of play is you're not hurting no one. Yeah. I wanted to talk to you about a few things today. One of the first things was, and I don't know if you know this, one of the most Google's things is Russell Brown married. And obviously, I know Laura, your wife, she's wonderful and amazing. I hate Googling that. Yeah. Is she making... Who's this person in the bed? Where are these credit card bills coming from? You making sure to check it in with yourself.

But it's so fascinating to me because, and I meant what I said earlier, you've lived an incredibly fascinating life already and you continue to do, but every part of your life has been so well documented by the media. And I use the word well loosely, but your life has been documented by the media. And I use the word well loosely, but your life has been documented by the media. And how is that felt for you? Like, how is that felt from an experiential point of view? I feel like today, the reason why I ask it

is people are listening my audience. People are just struggling with their lives being documented by their own social media profile. Like people are struggling with that, but you've had your life documented by people you don't even know. It can make you feel a kind of distinction and separation from yourself. Like a part of you gets taken away.

In fact, when I first got famous, I was friend and still am friends with Jonathan Ross, the broadcaster, the English broadcaster. And he said, you lose something when you become famous and you never get it back. And what it is is a kind of privacy and a sense of who you are. Now, at the beginning of my life in public, I didn't have any regard for privacy because I didn't, I wasn't that kind of person. I liked being famous, I liked performing, I was single, and so I didn't regard myself in that kind of way.

I'm Danny Shapiro, host of Family Secrets. It's hard to believe we're entering our eighth season. And yet, we're constantly discovering new secrets. The depths of them, the variety of them, continues to be astonishing. I can't wait to share ten incredible stories with you, stories of tenacity, resilience, and the profoundly necessary excavation of long-held family secrets. When I realized this is not just happening to me, this is who and what I am. I needed her to help me. Something was gnawing at me that I couldn't put my finger on,

that I just felt somehow that there was a piece missing. Why not restart? Look at all the things that were going wrong. I hope you'll join me and my extraordinary guests for this new season of Family Secrets. Listen to season eight of Family Secrets on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Not too long ago, in the heart of the Amazon Rainforest, this explorer stumbled upon something that would change his life. I saw it and I saw, oh wow, this is a very unusual situation. It was cacao, the tree that gives us chocolate. But this cacao was unlike anything experts had seen. Or tasted.

I've never wanted us to have a gun fight. I mean, you saw the stacks of cash in our office. Chocolate sort of forms this vortex. It sucks you in. It's like I can be the queen of wild chocolate. We're all lost. It was madness. It was a game changer. People quit their jobs.

They left their lives behind. So they could search for more of this stuff. I wanted to tell their stories, so I followed them deep into the jungle and it wasn't always pretty. Basically, this like disgruntled guy and his family surrounded the building armed with machetes. And we've heard all sorts of things that, you know, somebody got shot over this. Sometimes I think, oh, all days for a damn barn of chocolate. Listen to obsessions, wild chocolate, on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, I'm David Eagleman. I have a new podcast called Inner Cosmos on iHeart. I'm a

neuroscientist and an author at Stanford University, and I've spent my career exploring the three-pound universe in our heads. On my new podcast, I'm going to explore the relationship between our brains and our experiences by tackling unusual questions, so we can better understand our lives and our realities. Like, does time really run in slow motion when you're in a car accident? Or can we create new senses for humans? Or what does dreaming have to do with the rotation of the planet?

So join me weekly to uncover how your brain steers your behavior, your perception and your reality. Listen to intercosmos with David Eagleman on the iHeartRadio app Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. How it feels like is the illusion sometimes become more powerful than the truth but I perhaps everyone experiences that. In a sense, fame is simply an amplification of what we all experience. We all know it's like to be gossiped about. We all know what it's like to have people not like you and then attack you. In fame, you experience these things in amplification. So in a way, it's very alien, but in another way,

it's very ordinary just by degree is different from the normal experience. So that time's just been frustrating because sometimes you want to control your own narrative and you want to control what other people think of you, which obviously is impossible. And so it's times been quite challenging because I've wanted to go, no, that's not what I said. That's not what I meant.

I meant this. And my journey as a person with a public profile has been one of relinquishing that control, accepting the terms of fame, accepting what I'm here now, and trying to renegotiate so that I can be somehow useful in this role. I think you're one of the few people who can probably say that authentically, because I was saying this too early, and I said, I'd bring it up. I was watching the start of your new Netflix show. That's coming on December, so it will have come out by the time this comes out.

But in that show, you start off and you talk about how you realize, you make a great joke about how, actually, why don't you explain it? It's probably better you explain. You make a great joke about how you're out here to send a message, etc. and then also to monetize. Oh, yeah, yeah. I say that it's very difficult to make a living in media if you spend all your time criticizing all media. Yeah. Like I learned that I was using, like if you use your position of fame to attack the way that fame and celebrity functions, then eventually you're going to cut

the head off the serpent. The serpent's going to stop. I mean, in the end, you can't ride that forever. So there was a, it was a surfer curious time because I suppose we've talked about mental health. And in a way, what happened to me is I reached a point of total disillusionment because I reached saturation in terms of my own, in a way, my own expectations of celebrity. They were points in my life where I would have liked to have been as famous as, say, Tom Cruise or as famous as Will Smith or as famous as, you know, I don't know, famous famous people. But like, when I was very close into that world, it found it very something, it made me recoil

and not at ease with myself. Not that I made a deliberate choice to leave, but it's created a kind of spasm in me that I didn't have much control over. Subsequent to that, I experienced a sort of death, a kind of death of what I thought I wanted, even though Jay, I was never, you know, I'm not a bloody idiot. So I knew even when I was little, even when I was really little, I thought I wanted, even though Jay, I was never, you know, I'm not a bloody idiot. So I knew even when I was little, even though I was really little, I thought I want to be famous,

if I'm famous I won't be me anymore, I would have escaped me, but I also knew that definitely wouldn't work as a technique, but then it's still sort of weird when it actually happens. And this same lesson has been taught to me in many ways through drugs or sex or money. Lots of ways.

I know there are people that are more extremely famous, more extremely wealthy, have more sex. I know all of those kind of things, but for me, I suppose I'm like an idiot student of spirituality that's like, well, I just really will check that sex doesn't work again. And then before going in, it definitely doesn't. It definitely doesn't. It definitely doesn't.

It's definitely not the answer. But these things are seductive for a reason. Temptation is not ugly. Temptation is beautiful. Absolutely. And you said you wrote your book, Mentors, which I'm super excited about, because tell us a bit about the few people that are in there and how they've helped you maybe come to terms with some of these things that you just mentioned there. Who are those mentors? What are the topics that vary across that book? Once I met this guy, I was hanging out with puff daddy of all people. And this guy that was mates with puff daddy,

he was called Tracy. He was pretty cool. And he used this metaphor, which I've not used in the book. And I realized that now that perhaps I should have done, he goes, life's like a computer game. You get trapped on different levels.

And until you can master that level, you'll be trapped on it. He goes, you obviously was trapped on the drug level, then you get trapped on the sixth level, you've got to transcend these different levels. Now for me, these levels are overseen or you're helped ferry to cross by mentors. When I was a drug addict, I met Chip Summers and Chip Summers was the first person I met that was clean. He was a worse drug addict than I'd been. He would have been imprisoned for arm robbery and stuff. I was never, never served a custodial sentence.

So when this guy talking about, I don't take drugs anymore. Even though he had, there were lots of things of different. He's an atheist, I'm not an atheist. I was able to somehow download from him or he were able to transfer to me, like any good teacher will, something that was latent within me,

but I was not in a position to realize. So he was the first mentor that I had. I made the decision, this is like, at first I didn't know it was possible. Like you say, you can't be what you can't see. I didn't know it was possible to not be a drug addict. I thought that was the solution. Then I saw people not being a drug addict

and then I was willing to do what he said. In this case, 12-step recovery, which I believe is a good solution for anyone with addiction issues or anyone that wants to change themselves actually. Then I got kind of caught up on other staff, the sexual behaviour, the obsession with fame, pleasure, individualism, and then a series of different mentors, including spirits who devoted spiritual people, such as Radhan Atswami, who we both know, Amar, the great Indian saint. And then people look at more,

what I wanna say, parochial, like Mummint or Jimmy, who's like a very successful producer and manager of a production company who's got four kids, been married a long time, doesn't drink or take drugs like me, hasn't for a long enough I have, who's quite a solid person from a background that I identify with, who's intelligent and lucid.

So I like, I watch this person, and it's a very practical mentorship, it's like, if I'm at the point of a decision, like, I'm gonna do this, do me, I'm thinking of doing this, do not do this. I do what he says instead. So I'm already on a different path now. I'm using a consciousness that is not my own. I'm accessing external consciousness.

So in a way, I know it's bloody simple. It's just following advice. But, you know, we come from similar worlds, similar backgrounds. We don't have mentor traditions in bloody Essex or Wood Green. No one says the right emulate this guy, this person is connected. You have to find them by chance and by circumstance and some of you don't even know that that's what you need. So through my life, once I was switched on to it because of the good fortune of being a drug addict, I became more alert to the possibility of doing it. So I started to look at, I like this guy, I want to emulate him. It could be like a comedian, like Bill Hicks, where I was sadly already dead by the time I'd become a comedian, but I thought, I like how he does that.

And I model myself on that man. And like, what does he do? Of course, when you're constructing your identity, everything is about trying to connect your own essence. So you're not going to, you know, like I'm not from Texas, I'm not, like I don't use anger in the same way as he does. I mean, there's all sorts of distinctions, and I'm like, you know, so, you know,

I look a little bit of Kenneth Williams, a little bit of Richard Pryor, a little bit of Peter Cook. You just copy the people that you admire, and it helps you to become yourself, because the latent energies within you will be realised if you have the external coordinates to follow, but don't get obsessed or fetishised, the external coordinates in which case you're just mim mimicking and you won't engage your own essence.

Yeah, I'm glad you touched on that. What is that difference in your mind on imitation versus emulation? That mimicking versus actually finding yourself through that process? Because I couldn't agree with you more. I genuinely feel that we live in a society whereby the pinnacle of success becomes our validational metric of how we measure ourselves. So right now, for example, Kylie Jennings has become the youngest billionaire in the world at 21. Every 21 year old's going, oh, God, I'm not a billionaire. You know, and it becomes the new pressure. So it becomes the imitation, or you see someone who's

popular on social media by doing a particular activity. You think, oh, I need to imitate that to get that result. What is that difference between it being a search for self versus a sabotage of self? Maharashtra Maharashtra said, discernment is the most important thing, discernment. And then I spoke to Jordan Peterson and he said, judgment. So it's interesting, isn't it, that someone like the Mahareshi would not say kindness, love, compassion, but would say discernment, knowing what path to follow. In terms of mentorship and emulation,

I would say in our connection, it's very difficult not to want to mimic stars or billionaires, but I would say we must become attuned to what is timeless. And economic success is emulating social power. It's the idea of, oh, like, what can we infer from the wealth of Kylie Jenner? Is it Kylie Jenner? Is the, oh, she's powerful, she can do what she wants, she's made something of her life, she's glamorous, she's potent, she's powerful. So the timeless in that is, I suppose, power. The temporal in that is economic success.

It's going to die. It's going to go Kylie Jenner, like all of us will die. The money will die. The globe itself, the entire planet will die. So if you've spent your time festooning and ornamenting your temporary vehicle instead of the timeless which is in continual dialogue with the temporal and external, then you have missed the point. So if I sort of say I like Bill Hicks because Bill Hicks speaks the truth, right? And I so I will speak my truth rather than I'm going to wear these

clothes and put on this accent, then I've, you know, don't learn the wrong lesson. You know, and like a lot of times in my own life, I learn the wrong lesson. I learn, oh, you know, like Hollywood stars, they seem to be above problems and above the filth that I feel contaminated by. I'll become a Hollywood star. Oh, no, the filth has come with me. You know, because I learn the wrong lesson, the real lesson, the real work is done inwardly. I suppose how to make this evaluation, J, would be to, this is what I good mentors, because you can't always trust yourself. I can't always trust myself.

I still am capable of making dumb decisions. I still want to go. I, like you say, with your seed and weed technique, which I adore, are like that I might sort of try and convince myself, that's a seed. And I might be telling her, that's a weed. You're idiot. How can you try and sell that as a seed?

Oh, no, it could be a seed. Because really what you wanted, you know, the power prestige privilege, these things, I like them. Part of me wants it. I want the glory, the adornment, to be garlanded in wonder, to be kissed and loved and licked. But I'm been there now, and it's very temporary. I'm Dr. Romani, and I am back with season two of my podcast, Navigating Narcissism.

Narcissists are everywhere, and their toxic behavior in words can cause serious harm to your mental health. In our first season, we heard from Eileen Charlotte, who was loved by the Tinder Swindler. The worst part is that he can only be guilty for stealing the money from me, but he cannot be guilty for the mental part he did. And that's even way worse than the money he took. But I am here to help. As a licensed psychologist and survivor of narcissistic abuse myself, I know how to identify the narcissists in your life. Each week, you will hear stories from survivors

who have navigated through toxic relationships, gaslighting, love bombing, and the process of their healing from these relationships. Listen to navigating narcissism on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is what it sounds like inside the box card. I'm journalist and I'm Morton in my podcast, City of the Rails. I plunge into the dark world of America's railroads, searching for my daughter Ruby, who ran

off to hop train. I'm just like stuck on this train, not where I'm going to end up, and I jump. Following my daughter, I found a secret city of unforgettable characters, living outside society, off the grid grid and on the edge. I was in love with the lifestyle and the freedom this community. No one understands who we truly are. The rails made me question everything I knew about motherhood, history, and the thing we call the American Dream.

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on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Or cityoftherails.com. I'm Yvonne Gloria. I'm Eva Longoria. I'm Maite Gomes-Rajon. We're so excited to introduce you to our new podcast, Hungry for History. On every episode, we're exploring some of our favorite dishes,

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Listen to Hungary for history with Ivalongoria and Mitegómez Rejón as part of the Micoltura Podcast Network available on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And yeah, it's that confirmation bias, right? We're always trying to find the information that justifies our belief. So if we want to switch and make ourselves, we're, oh no, I am happy doing this because he or she's happy doing it, we find a way. Yes. We find a way.

But what's fascinating about what you've done, I think I've wanted to ask you this since we've been friends and known each other. And I'm glad I get to ask it to you today, because I think it's probably one of the hardest things to do, genuinely. I feel like you're someone who has multiple times reinvented themselves and not reinvented for the sake of branding or marketing, but in bringing out your truth in different ways.

Thanks, that's a good compliment. Right, and I'm saying it, I'm genuinely saying it. I don't think it's been a marketing or branding attempt. I believe it's been an attempt to be authentic in genuine and it's been a marketing or branding attempt. I believe it's been an attempt to be authentic in genuine and it's been a marketing or branding attempt. I believe it's a good compliment. Right, and I mean, I'm saying, I'm genuinely saying it. Like I don't think it's been a marketing or a branding attempt. I believe it's been an attempt to be authentic in genuine at every moment in the way that I've seen it.

But you started off, and we were talking about earlier, you started it off, you know, you were the host, big brother, the digital edition, et cetera, and then everyone knew you as this, you know, eccentric, crazy, wacky individual, you know, charismatic, captivating, and I've heard people who worked with you behind the scenes say he was extremely charming behind the scenes too. And there are parts of that which you've kept, and there's parts of that which you let go. And then we saw Russell Brand, of course, the actor, and then you moved into acting in Hollywood. And I know everyone that I speak to in America about you, absolutely adores you and loves you, for the movies that you made. And then we have you coming back and playing a more activist role. And then

even in politics and now spirituality and philosophy and culture and society. And I feel like that must have been so difficult because I don't think, and you may see it differently, but for my point of view, I never really saw you completely step away to come back. I never really, I see a lot of people, especially celebrities or people who are trying to find their truth and find their way. They kind of go away into hiding and then sometimes emerge in an interview

and don't always make complete sense because they're still trying to make sense of what they're finding. But you almost have kept your personality and who you are, but then engage and explore all these fascinating things. There have been fortune at this J when you put it like that. In a sense, we all have out game, don't we, and our strategies. Some of us are attracted to the more high stakes game where you

could be humiliated, exposed, or attacked or killed. And I think what happened is that even though I in various periods of my life have taken on the tools and a femur of the culture, i.e. I want to be on the TV and dress up and be all famous or I want to go Hollywood or whatever, something in me always knew that these things would pass and are not real. And I've kept a healthy dialogue with that. Perhaps because I'm an addict and an addict has to be aware of pain continually and otherwise the pain will end in self-destruction. So it wasn't a conscious, right?

I better reinvent myself. It was in each case a sort of crisis that felt beyond my control. Like just, oh, well, this isn't working anymore. I can't do that no more. That doesn't seem real anymore. Not even really cognitive. I moved back from America when I fell in love with somebody in England. I got, like, the thing with politics, for example, was I remember, I feel like I asked myself the question, and my mate, Garif, that I was working with a lot of the time and what will happen if I just

start saying what I actually think about politics and then put it on the internet what will happen and then I watched what happened and it felt like I'd always felt that like for a take the very obvious example of I said there's no point voting because the opportunities for change are minimal and I'm only meaning this. I had always felt that. That's why I had never voted. And pretty much everyone I knew felt like I didn't belong to groups of people that were like, well, I'm a Democrat or I'm a conservative. Everyone's just like, well, that's just that thing where everyone pretends that ordinary people can have power while these institutions

protect their own interests. Everyone sort of knew that, whether intellectually or just more viscerally. So I was like talking about it in the same way of through performance, through comedy, because the point of comedy in a sense is revelation. Revelation of what is previously being concealed, that's what it's exciting about comedy

is that it puts you in touch with an ulterior reality. Like, we know we suspect we pray and meditate on in about comedy is that it puts you in touch with an ulterior reality. But we know we suspect we pray and meditate on that whilst we accept the conditions of this conversation that you're embodying that contrast entity and I'm embodying this contrast entity, we both know that they're going to die. We wonder what is the energy that's behind it? Will that energy go? Of what is that energy comprised?

How did we end up speaking this language? All of these questions fizz in visibly through the air, all of these connections are continually being made. And I feel that you can apply this metric, this tool, this analytical device to anything. You can start saying, well, what is politics? Who does it serve? How is it constructed? Why is this system still in place? Why is it not progressed when clearly the technology to change it has evolved? Whose interests have been protected, why these conversations not had, why this information not conveyed, why is that, you know, if you start asking as Christians, things start to peeling away and peeling away, you can ask it of yourself,

you can ask it of someone you love, which is cruel thing to do in a way, or you can ask it of the institutions that are around you. So, in a sense, the thing that's, you know, you shed your skin like a serpent, you know, and you sort of go on. But like behind the energy is the same. My belief is while there might be an essential distinction between you and I that you are some very particular expression of the whole and the divine as everyone is, that we are all somehow in continual communion with something that's bigger than us, bigger than this, how could it not be? How could our little minds understand our reality? How could this be all that there is?

And how did you get into that? Like how did that journey start? So we're talking about all these reinventions, but that particular spiritual curiosity. Yeah, where did that come from? Why did they do drugs? Right, because I think if you start taking drugs, you start thinking, I'm trying to kill this thing, like it's not working for me. And if you take things like hallucinations, the hallucinations will make you physically experienced. Oh no, I'm not me. I remember that feeling being quite young, sort of 16, taking acid, and the sort of the horror, actually, the horror, because I was not, you know, I've to do it if I have a lad, I wasn't around bloody goose. You know, like so, I've just

thinking, oh no, I'm not me. I'm not me. This is not good. Who am I then? You know, and there's no one there to go. That's really beautiful, isn't it? That you're not you because it means that you are everyone and you are everything and all those things you've told yourself and your language and your culture and your gender and your identity are all just biological or social programs that you are exhibiting. I just thought bloody hell whose hands are these and it was scary. So but I suppose as I am getting older

I'm becoming like you know in it like at the end of is it am I right in saying that at the end of the Gita like I drew the nose like I remember like in a sense we know we know we are you awakening yeah re awakening sorry continue continue like I drew a nose like I remember. Like in a sense we know. We know. This is reawakening. Yeah, reawakening. Sorry, continue, continue. Well, like I feel like it unfolds for you. It unfolds for you.

And there are moments in life where you're the trauma, the rupture, the pain of being alive, always will become an opportunity for learning if you're able to do it, if you're able to see it in that way. And sometimes in that pain-based mentality, it's quite difficult to work that trick. It's quite difficult to go, no, what am I supposed to learn here?

What am I supposed to be supposed to be involved here? Now, one thing I like doing on the podcast is trying to extrapolate from incredible people's lives like yourself, some practical lessons in that sphere, because I feel either, if you're watching this or listening to this, you're either on drugs and you've had the same experience, I know plenty of people who feel that way.

So definitely there's that group of individuals. And then there's a group of people that just kind of feel that way just because they've realized, well, I don't want to be this, this can't be all there is. And then there's a group of people who are just like, oh, well actually that's too far from me to even think about, I'm not even there yet. You know, but when

you do make that step and you start having it originally, like you said, you don't have a guru or a sage to tell you, oh, that's a good feeling. You started having these feelings. What's the next thing you do? Like, what do you do from there? Where do you go? Start with the possibility of happiness, I feel. I don't agree with it. Whilst you and I have talked before about asceticism, you know, and denial of pleasure, I feel like the possibility that you can be happy is an interesting thing to invite, because I think a lot of people just think, well, this is life, life is miserable, my mum was beat up by my dad, this isn't me personally, I'm just making this example of, you know, like, I only ever known misery. This like you have to overcome that idea.

Even the fact that the possibility of happiness exists conceptually and your consciousness is the possibility of its realization. Then I feel like you have to accept that you have a problem, i.e. something that you want to alter and change. Then you have to accept that there is a way of doing it. This is where a mentor is useful in hope, in the hope that change is possible. Then you have to be willing to accept help.

And I think that can work with any situation, something as evident chronic and severe as drugs or so seriously into disorder, or something like, oh, don't want my job anymore, or don't want to say those kind of things. Say me if I like, you know, if I think, well, maybe I agree with Jay that I don't like my job anymore, or don't want to say those kind of things. Say me if I like, you know, if I think, maybe I agree with Jay that I don't want to swear,

maybe I think it's bad. Then I, no, I know you don't do it. So I think, is it working for Jay? I'll try that, you know? So that's an example of how something that's a potential for improvement, it could be deployed in my life. And I'll maybe try it out

and I'll be aware of it and see if it works for me. So in a sense, like I'm not too, don't be married to the negative aspects of your self-belief. If you don't like something, you can't, they find you talk to people sometimes and they go, yeah, but I can't change. I'm always like this, life's like this. Or someone I spoke to and I go, yeah, but I don't believe in God in that way. I believe God in relationships. I was, you know, happy. So fuck your belief, excuse my language. If your belief is not working for you, let's try something else.

Let's try something else. If it's working, then crack on. I love that point about the openness to happiness. And funnily enough, my journey into being a monk and that part of denial was because I believed it would make me more happy. So even then, that was still the seed, that was still the focus, the focal point that service was linked to happiness.

That selflessness was linked to happiness. I think about this, Jay, when people say I want to be enlightened, is what they're really saying is I want to be happy and I want pleasure and I want to not feel pain and maybe it's not, you know, awful to not want to suffer. But I feel that if you mask the sincerity of your intentions, then you're less likely to achieve them. Totally. achieve them totally. And also the way that we avoid the likelihood that our journey to happiness or connection or enlightenment or call it what you will

will not be doing what we think is right. It's not going to be what we came up with. Whilst of course all of us I feel carry a kind of barometer that says like you with the not swearing something in you you, I don't want to do that. And you listen to that voice. And something in me says, you know, don't look at porn rust, you know, like it's sort of, it's not like, I'm not responding to some external puritanical force that's saying don't do it. Although there are enough people that have written down, do not object to five sex, it will mess you up. You know, people have obviously discovered that for thousands of years written it down and I've ignored it. But like, when you're in our voice aligns with something like that, then you cover possibility of sort of making a meaningful connection.

Yeah, I love that. I've seen you say that in a video that I saw on your Instagram page recently where you were talking about how do you feel after you've just done the act? Like that's kind of a great reflection process. It's like, for example, masturbation. It's like how you feel after is a great judge of whether you want it in your life or not. Yeah, if you feel great, I think it's some people that feel like it. Yeah, I'm not like it.

Oh, currently, yeah. Like, you know, there's obviously such a thing as mental illness, there are obviously some people that go around doing the most unbelievable things, and it sort of works for them, but I feel like as an optimist, I have to believe that if we were to approach those people with the light

that they would not want to do it, you know, I feel that people would want to cling on to the murder, the pedophilia, if they had a connection to God. 100%. I mean, people are ready to give up lesser things in any fashion material or spiritual energy for higher energy. Me too. What do you think about the thing that Gandhi said ages ago? Obviously, there's no point in India getting rid of the British, then emulating what the British would do in any way, just with Indians in the roles of power. He said, we've got a breakdown out of our country and it's 70,000 villages, they should all be autonomous. And we've got to let go of our love of gadgets and stuff. And he was saying this before we were spending our whole

life staring at screens. He was like, you're we, at some point, you've got to let go of those low, low pressures, those low vibrational pleasures. And that's what I think is, because people haven't been exposed to higher energy, most of all in their life. And I see it everywhere I go, I'm just, I look back and I'm so fortunate that I met someone of really high energy, really early in my life. Right. And that's kind of what I feel like what I'm so fortunate that I met someone of really high energy really early in my life. And that's kind of what I feel like what I'm trying to do is just how can I expose people to great energy early in their life because then there at least no it exists.

And this is a totally different context, but I was speaking to a big media company recently and they were saying how they know that when they make celebrity gossip, et cetera, it gets big views and big likes and big shares. But one of them is a bit more conscious and intentional and pushed a very important piece around mental health and reform and recovery. And when they did that, the views weren't even higher. And she was just saying that actually taking a more high brow attempt at media,

taking a stance, having an opinion that wasn't necessarily diving into our lower desires to just learn about gossip and sex and all the issues, actually brought people into it. And so, it's interesting how we sell people short through what we create. That's a cool point. I mean, like our sort of love of God or truth or purity or whatever we want to call it, it shouldn't just be like supporting a football team. If you're like, this one, this is the one I've happened upon, it's because it actually will work. You have to actually believe.

Like, like I understand empirically with drugs, no Russell, don't take drugs. It won't do what you think it's gonna do. It will temporarily distract you from pain and then the pain will be even worse. It's a harder lesson to learn around sex. It's harder to go, no, don't have sex. You will feel worse afterwards.

It's set, obviously, within my case, in a happy monogamous relationship. And then even more harder to learn, I'll don't go out and try to dawn yourself with sort of glory and you know, expensive garb or care too much about what people say. You sort of keep thinking it will work. And obviously as that example suggests, people do think, no, looking at this video that says we might catch a glimpse up someone's skirt or hear some scintillating bit of tittle tattle, you know, it still kind of works, it's bad, but we are right, we are right. Like, you can't get past hate with more hate, you can't get past lust with more lust, but within love, within some pure consciousness, it must be housing all of it. The time is resting on timelessness. If you can somehow get by it, if you can get by it, it will be more powerful.

That's, I suppose, what faith is. Well said. Yes, really worth thanks. So I'm going to go into, we've got five minutes, I'm going to head to the final five questions that I've been through. Oh go into, we've got five minutes, I'm going to go into the final five questions that I always do. Oh, that's what I do. That's five minutes. Good point, Nick. Exactly. The final five.

And now it's time for the terminal 20. Now, unique item on under the skin. Yeah, so I'm going to go into these five questions. So I actually, for this segment, I went to Google, because I love seeing what... You really trust Google. I don't trust Google. I like knowing what the masses are thinking about right. I'm fast

or temperature taking device. Yeah, it helps me really understand. They're listening to us. Google probably they better be. Yeah, that's why we're wasting our life. Okay, so the question was we've answered this one when I skipped this one. So this one is, is Russell Brand married? That's one of the most Googled. Yes, yes, who am I? Why a flora brand?

Yeah, by Coincidence. Yeah. This is another. What is Russell Brand's IQ? Well, I like to think I'm quite clever. I know, I think people do too. That's a question that people have. If you don't like your test,

it's mostly to do with triangles, isn't it? But there's triangle over there. Now what? Did they? What happened on the Tuesday? So I like to think I've got a higher IQ, but there's quite a lot of daily demonstrations of stupidity. I would have to be honest.

Well, I remember when the Guardian put you in as the fourth most... Oh, yeah, no clever person. Can we play for the rest? You can't get in the world. In plenty of things in the world. That's good wasn't it? Because it was like Thomas Pikty, Naomi Klein, probably like Yannis Verifakis,

that proper like political leader, ecologist. And your number four? Rass. Yeah, it's amazing. Quite right. I love that. Why am I not number one? Yeah, exactly. I thought I had a time. I love it. OK. Yeah, that was the Russell Brander IQ question. I love this bit of the show by the way. Oh good

This is really really tapping into my ego. Thank you. Is Russell Brand vegan? He tries. He's a nice guy I mean like what happens with me is eggs Like you know, but like I try to take them in the kindest way. Yeah, I'd want to do is I reach into the chicken Just before it's ready. No, I don't do that. And like, you know, I sometimes like a little buttery snack. I'm so sorry. I've vegans are definitely right. I'm not arguing that they're I'm not saying what's the point of being vegan.

Vegan's are correct. Are you vegan? I am. Of course you are. Look at your eyes. You're disgusting. I remember when you interviewed the happy pair too. No, I love those men are beautiful man. You've got to be vegan. You can't argue with whether or not you should be vegan. You know, like people don't know, you've got to eat just like some people taking it to extremes. I only eat meat now. What?

I'm only gonna have salad with it. No way. But like for me, you've got to be vegan for the planet for yourself for every reason. The trouble is, you know, eggs, cakes. Yeah, and this general weakness. But I'm heading that way. Perfect to me will be vegan.

Time. And the last one is, what is Russell Roundup to now? Gosh, what is he doing? What I'm doing at the moment is being a father to my daughters, a husband to my wife, and the work has become of secondary importance to me. But the thing that was there in the first place that got me into all that trouble and all of those adventures is still there. It's not gone anywhere. It will need to at some point manifest itself and I'm just trying to prepare myself so that when next time it does it, it doesn't lead to

me sort of being destroyed in some way or causing suffering. I want it to realise itself benevolently and I feel that the only way to do that is to try to avoid making the decision or allowing it to migrate towards the ego. Even things I start with the best intentions, i.e. true. Sometimes the ego gets hold of it, it's very crafty, the ego, isn't it? That's the best thing that we have to try because otherwise we don't even see it. And we would often talk about in the monastery

that when you're not doing anything out the ordinary, it's easy to think your humble. When you're not actually pushing the boundary, like if you sit alone all day, everyone will think their humble, but it's when you go out there and you do something like, oh wow, I've got a big ego, I need to work on that. So it's like, if you don't activate, it's easy to start getting comfortable and think,

oh, I'm quite enlightened, no, no, no, I'm quite realised. But you actually just neutralise it, You're not engaged with the worthy things. Yeah, I like that. Anyway. Awesome, thank you, Russell. And I want people to go in, of course, buy the book Mentors, which I'm fascinated to read. Can't wait to read it. I've got it. Anything you'd like to mention on Mentors?

Just, no, you could do what you want with that. Just buy it and read it and get Mentors. You don't even need to buy it or read it. You could nick it or you could get the information and just get a mentor, and that Netflix thing. Yes, absolutely. By now, that's been gone. Totally.

But I'm going to push that early anyway. Oh yeah. Yeah. Oh, and listen to our podcast under skin, and see how we gracefully steal that last bit where I go. Okay, now, final five questions. I just, I don't know, I just like to go with Google, I guess. We always liked it. So these are the top five yard food suggestions.

Sponsored by you. Yeah, I love it. Thank you Russell, I'm so grateful. Tasey, thank you, man. Thank you for sharing your stories. Cheers, man. Please, thank you for asking. Thank you.

Thank you. I hope you love that episode. I want to say a huge thanks to Russell for being so open and honest and gracious inviting me to his home again to do this interview. I'm sure we're going to do a lot more together. Make sure you're following Russell on YouTube, Facebook and Instagram. We'll put the links into the space as well. And you should also check out his new book called Mentors.

It's brilliant. He talks you through the different mentors he's had in his life, even one that we've shared in meditation and spirituality. Make sure you've subscribed, rated and reviewed. It will make such a difference into other people finding their purpose. Thank you so much. I'm Munga Shatekler and it turns out astrology is way more widespread than any of us want to believe.

You can find in Major League Baseball, International Banks, K-Pop Groups, even the White House. But just when I thought I had a handle on this subject, something completely unbelievable happened to me. Am I whole view on astrology change? Whether you're a skeptic or a believer, give me a few minutes because I think your ideas are about to change too. Listen to Skyline Drive on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

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