Oscars Outsider - Buddy 2 Backstabber | Summer House, The Valley, Cannes + RHORI

Episode Date: April 28, 2026

Scamanda is getting messy — and the more you look at it, the harder it is to pin down what’s actually going on.We get into the shifting dynamics at the center of that story, how quickly perceptions can flip, and why this one feels different from the usual Bravo drama. From there, we move into The Valley, RHORI, and some early Cannes thoughts, breaking down the moments, character beats, and production choices that stood out this week.What starts as a conversation about one storyline turns into a broader look at how these shows construct tension, loyalty, and narrative — and how quickly all of that can unravel.If you’ve been following any of this, we want to hear your take.#Scamanda #Bravo #RHORI #TheValley #Cannes #SummerHouse

There have been numerous leaks of audio from the reunion. And so Andy has said that he's like really pissed about this. Bravo said they're launching an investigation. And they found the leaker. But apparently it was figured out not by someone at Bravo, but it is someone whose name you know. And I want you to take some guesses. I want you to guess who,

who solved the mystery of the leader. Oh, who cracked the case. Okay, yeah, right, right. Tintin. It is not Tintin. Okay. But it's a performer. It's a bravo liberty.

It's a performer. Okay. Damn. You can ask me questions to clarify. Let's narrow it down. Yes, no questions. But wait. But did somebody not on the Summerhouse cast, you said, or did I misinterpret that?

It is someone that is not on the Summer House. Was it Jacks? It was not Jacks. think you need to ask some questions to narrow things down. Okay. Man or woman? Woman. Kristen?

Detective Doty? Nope. Okay. Is it somebody currently on a real housewife's show? It is not someone currently on Bravo. Okay. Not currently on a Bravo show. Stassie?

It is not sassy. Man, I give up. I haven't used all my guesses. Okay. I'll give you a hint. They have an Oscar. What? Hello and welcome to Bravo Outsider Podcast.

I am your host, Craig, Midwinter, and it has been ages since we have been in your ears. You will notice I have been working on the beard since we last spoke. Yeah. I've been working on growing up my hair since some asshole in the comments on Spotify called me a skinny stavro. Salchius, I think. It's been really hard for me too. It hit at a bad moment because I have been like a little more aware of my hair loss lately because where I'm living right now in this house, the guy just changed the showerhead in

the shower a couple days ago. And I don't know where the hell he got this new shower head, but it has one setting and that setting is like prison riot control. So every time I put my head in the shower, it feels. like the hairs are just getting ripped right into their follicles. I can feel my scalp just peeling off. Well, speaking of lack of hair, the reason I was hiding was because I have shaved my beard for the first time in like 15 years. So, yeah, I surprised myself.

I didn't realize there was a cop under there, but. I just thought you're good Philadelphia Flyers fan, Gritty Mode. That's what I interpreted. No, but the Flyers have been fun to cheer for, I have to say. And I'll just say I, as everybody who's watching the video version of this episode is seeing this version of Craig for the first time. And you look like a diplomat in Zaris, Russia. And I'm here for it. Yeah.

So I want to first start off by welcoming all the new viewers and listeners that we've got. So the reason we're coming back a little bit earlier than we had intended was because we're just randomly blowing up on Spotify for some reason. We cracked the top 10 podcasts within the TV and film category. We've got over 300,000 people have tuned in within the last month. Despite being on pause. Yeah, despite being on pause. So I think the message that we're getting here is our audience wants us to shut up more. They just want less of us.

That's the feedback. Well, today we are going to be talking about the latest episode of the Valley, which I thought was fantastic. really love the valley and I can't wait to dive into that. But also, anyone who's in tune with the Bravo universe knows that there is a scandal that is dominating the discourse. And Dylan has no idea. He has been completely living under a rock and has no idea what we're talking about or even what show it's associated with. So we're going to catch him up to speed on that. And then since the episodes that were blowing up on Spotify were our Oscar episodes. We thought we would dive into

a little bit of the preseason for the next Oscars because you guys can't get enough of it. We're going to talk about the Cannes official selection and maybe even talk about the taglines for the brand new Real Housewives of Rhode Island season one that is that is airing right now. So let's dive in. Dylan, where should we start? I mean, we should definitely start with reality TV. I feel like I should just kind of present. to anybody who's like new to the show, the idea that we had like Bravo Outsider was very reality

TV focused, but always with like a cinematic lens, you know, but then we, we did kind of the Oscars race shows as like a kind of a spin-off split show. But I think this is, this is a sign that we should try to kind of merge the two into one and see how that works. But we should definitely start with our, with our roots with Bravo shows. Okay. Well, we talked about the, there is a scandal dominating the Bravo universe. The scandal all set the stage. It takes place within the summer house universe. And so if you are unaware, Kyle and-

Does it actually do with Erica Kirk? No, it does not. But you are correct that she is part of the summer house- Extended universe, right? Yeah. Got my hopes up there. So Kyle and Amanda have been going through a divorce, or they announce that they are seeking a divorce.

or I don't know what the stage of that is at, but it recently came to light that Amanda and West have been hooking up. And so people are up in arms because obviously the storyline surrounding West's romantic interests have all been focused towards Sierra, who is, by all accounts, close friends with Amanda and Sierra was unknowing about this. And so that is kind of like what is. what is dominating conversation. And I'm interested to hear your like gut reaction to that news and, you know, how you think that this is or and how you think that this stacks up against, you know,

past scandals. I guess scandival is kind of like the big one, but any other parallels that you might, you might see. So, um, do we have clarity on the question of is, was the divorce announced? to because of this relationship with West, or is this like not related? Is the relationship with West apparently something that happened after the separation? So the separation is not as a result of this. Okay. But there are questions up the air as to when this started.

And the edit, so one of the things that I think is interesting about this is this kind of broke at about the same point within the summer house season as Scandival did within that season of Vanderpump rules. So this is, this has colored the edit for sure because they were definitely in the process of editing. And one of the things that's really fun about this current season of Summerhouse is looking for those nuggets.

And there are a lot of little moments where you just kind of pause and you would be rereading them. And so I think that that is one of the things that's really interesting about this, this scandal. Yeah. I like that. So, I mean, not having clarity on when it started, take some potential juice out of it. But there's definitely a lot of juice there, especially if, like you said, the editors now have time to react to how they're showing them interacting, because I'm sure that's really fun to try to read between the lines of every interaction. I do like the idea of those two characters being involved in something a little seedy together,

Because I feel like they're both people who like to present themselves as kind of good guys. And so I like the idea of them getting drawn together into something a little disreputable. I suppose the angle of like the friendship between like Wes and Kyle is probably got to be a big thing here too. You know, if it is just a case of like they separated and then West made his move. after. That's not the juiciest of a fruit here. Like that's not like, I could understand how that would be like a violation of brocode or whatever. But it's not, it wouldn't be that surprising that like, you know, she started a relationship with, with her friend, who is her ex's friend, who is her coworker, you know, people do that very often in real life. That's just a normal thing. But, um, but the idea

that these seeds have been planted for a long time is what gives it like extra intrigue for me. Yeah, so it's interesting that you focus on Kyle because when this first broke, that was kind of what my thought was too. And I was like, oh, this doesn't feel all that interesting. But as this has kind of developed in real time, I would say that Kyle is a minor character in this. The main character is, well, Sierra is probably our Ariana here. She is our hero. And I want to say, like, I think that. Wait, were they actually in a relationship?

at that point? Because I haven't watched Summer House in a while, but the last time I watched it, they absolutely were like, were barely even friends anymore at that point. Right. So, um, they were becoming friends again. This whole season, there is a lot of like

Sierra and West kind of approaching a new something, maybe not romantic, but trying to figure out like how they kind of relate to each other, whether that's romantically, whether that is like as friends, whether that's as enemies.

And so it's one of the most juicy, like, pieces of the summer house season so far. But since, like, since Sierra and West broke up, there's been numerous times where Jesse has kind of implied that he would be interested in Sierra. And West has, like, constantly, like, been put off by, by that and, like, said, no, like, you know, she's off, off limits, that sort of thing. So Sierra is the figure that is kind of the betrayed one. And I think that she's like way more exciting to root for than Ariana was. I just, I really like Sierra and how she approaches things.

And the way that she like presents herself like both like vulnerably, I think is way more, way more interesting. So she's she's a lot more exciting to root. for and I'm excited about her, you know, the opportunities that might come about like from this. I think the other thing is like we talk about the hero. We got to talk about the villains. And Wes and Amanda are way more boring villains than Tom Sandoval. And like, I don't consider Raquel a villain, but she was obviously characterized that way.

So I think that like Tom and Raquel are way more interesting villains than. I don't know, man. I like the idea of West being a villain. I feel like that makes him a lot more interesting to me. Like I always, I think I always was a little like on the shelf about West. Like I couldn't. He always seemed to be putting so much effort into being Mr. Good Guy.

Like Mr. Like, oh, I'll clean up the party after everybody's gone to bed. You know, I'll be, I'll be there to help you through your feelings. I'll, you know, I'll be the nice guy who, who's there to talk to anybody and will be respectful towards everybody. And to a point where it almost felt pathologic, like he was like so focused on playing this role that it felt like it was hiding some other force in his character that we weren't fully glimpsing.

I think Tom Sandoval had a similar dynamic too. You can make the comparison. Yeah, yeah, I could see that. Despite them having a lot of other differences, though at the same time. But I could imagine. if he gets put into a position or has been put into a position where he has to be the villain, he has to be seen as the guy who screwed up, who betrayed the trust of people around him, that could make his whole personality, his whole shtick, the way he presents himself, come off a lot more interesting.

So I like the, the more I'm thinking about it, I'm like the idea of a West heel turn. That sounds cool. I think, like, I have never really bought into what West was selling. So it's not as surprising to me. that he has like made a heel turn. I think I said this on the record on the podcast of his first season that I didn't like buy his shit. And then on the reunion is where he had his like initial kind of like heel turn. And I think like since he has kind of added that complexity, I have enjoyed, I've enjoyed him on on this show.

But I think what's interesting to me about the villain dynamic here is actually Amanda because she is like this is a, huge fumbling of the bag because her narrative this season was set up to be like the victim of Kyle's like not caring about their relationship or never listening because she has always been you know a victim of him like putting himself first and like going out and partying when she says that she has a problem with that and like always talking down to her and we had that at the beginning of this this season for sure because that's just like Kyle's relationship But to have this like this misstep come up where she has, she has betrayed her friend Sierra has turned her into this villain.

And so she is no longer going to, you know, reap the rewards of being, you know, of breaking free of Kyle, who, you know, now is more sympathetic by proxy. Maybe West is the rewards. That's the reward that she's reading right now. Yeah, there you go. But this has been like really fun to watch.

watch break. Like there's just a lot of nuggets that keep, you know, dropping. The reunion this week was recorded and there have been numerous leaks of audio from the reunion. So someone had been like recording various conversations about it and like release them via a Instagram account or TikTok account or something via like some other. vlogger. And so Bravo, like Andy has said that he's like really pissed about this. Bravo said they're

launching an investigation and they found the leaker. So they haven't said who the leaker was. It wasn't the, it wasn't someone on the cast. So we won't know. But apparently it was figured out not by someone

at Bravo, but it is someone whose name you know and I want you to take some guesses. Tintin. It is not Tintin. Okay. But it's a performer. It's a bravoleberti.

It's a performer. Okay. Damn. You can ask me questions to clarify it. Let's narrow it down. Okay. Yes, no questions. But wait.

But did somebody not on the Summerhouse cast, you said, or did I misinterpret that? It is someone that is not on the Summer House. but was in proximity enough to have been able to record. Oh, who the leaker is? Are you asking who the leaker is? Oh, okay, the leaker is an associate person recorded. Wait, now I'm confused. I want you to guess who, who solved the mystery of the,

oh, who solved the, who cracked the case. Okay, yeah, right, right. Yeah, that's why I was thinking detectives. I want to say Hercules Poirot, but that's too, too much in the belt of detectives. And it's just because I'm looking at you right now and you look like him. was it was it jacks it was not jacks i think you need to ask some questions to narrow things down okay um man or woman woman christian detective doughty nope okay um is it somebody currently on a real

housewife's show it is not someone currently on a bravo okay not currently on a bravo show stassy It is not sassy. Man, I give up. I haven't used all my guesses. It is not someone that you... Okay, I'll give you a hint. They have an Oscar. What?

Okay, hold on. Wait, what? That should make it easy in theory, but now I'm like, hold up. Emma Stone? She loves Brownstones. There's not Emma Stone, but you're on the right path. Okay. She has a Oscar.

Okay. What a bum. Only one? Shit, man. I, yeah, I feel like I'm going to be kicking myself because the Oscar thing should be a dead giveaway. But who the hell would that be? I don't know, man. You got to tell me.

You got to tell me. Jennifer Lawrence. Okay. Wait, what's her connection? She's, I guess, a big Bravo fan. And I don't know how she figured it out. that according to report, she was the one that solved the mystery of the leaker. Yeah, maybe I should have got, because Emma Stone is also a big bravo fan,

but, you know, they're, uh, they're friends those two. Um, and I should have made the connection there. Damn. Yeah. Yeah, I guess I was thinking about somebody who won an Oscar recently. Uh, just kidding. She, she should have had a nomination for Die by Love. I'll just say that.

So I think you are mostly up to speed on the scandal now. The broad strokes. The broad strokes. So I guess the kind of other events that have been surrounding this is that Sierra did like a big interview with Glamour magazine on the day it was released. Amanda and West appeared at a New York Yankees game on the JumboTron. This really like kind of phony public appearance which took the window of the sale. So just further like making them. leading into the villain role.

Their joint statement was heavily criticized and apparently in the leaked audio. Amanda jokingly says that it was chat GPT that wrote it, which got people obviously fired up. But yeah, and Amanda lost some sort of brand deal. Sierra's obviously doing dancing with the stars for the next season. And yeah, that's where things are at. Although there was like an Instagram post that showed Amanda and West leaving the reunion taping that I thought was like really great. I can't remember who posted it.

If I come across it before I finish editing this, I'll put a little note. But it's got Amanda and she in my mind's eye, I don't know if this is true, was like being like wheeled out covered in a blanket. it like she's Vicki Gunblson or something like that. Just like really great stuff here. So that's that's you're up to speed now. All right. So to be clear, we're midseason right now. Is that where we are in the show?

We're late season. Late season. We're in the last like two or three episodes. Okay. All right. I got to claw out a little bit further from underneath my rock and start catching these. I watched the latest episode of the Valley and you were absolutely right that I have not been following the bravo world at all.

My head's been in other things. and I'm just, you're dragging me back into it right now. But I did watch this latest episode of The Valley, which like you, I love the show. It's amazing. It's depressing. It's well filmed. So, yeah, let's dive into that for sure. Okay. Let's dive into the Valley. Let's talk about that cinematic lens. What's it out to you from how this was presented? I'll put a pin in a couple shots that I really liked.

one, I don't know if this was on your radar, but there's a moment where Luke is in the dive bar and he's kind of, he's framing his struggles that he's had to endure as a kind of martyrdom, a kind of a silent martyrdom alongside Christian's struggles through her pregnancy and postpartum. And there's a dartboard behind his head. No, that's not at the dive bar. It happens at his garage. Sorry, it's in his garage. Yeah, yeah.

It's in his garage. Similar conversation. You know, that's kind of the topic he's going on about. is that his suffering, his sacrifices have not been as noticed. And he looks like a medieval saint, right? It's got the halo. The halo framing his head is the way like those old religious paintings would show, it would show saints.

And I feel like he's discussing himself as a martyr in that scene. I love that bit. Really good stuff. And a shot that I just love just because it's really beautiful is, when Schwartz is doing singles night with the ladies at the Belmont classic location for

the Vanderverse when he's out talking with the girl on the street we got a hell of a shot there we've got a hell of a shot backlit by the city backlit by the hills behind them just just gorgeous camera work right there

yeah I want to dive into both of the things that you're talking about but that was definitely my favorite shot of this episode. It almost feels like a set. It feels like there's like a painted on backdrop there. And for anyone that has context on these shows, this geography, like you said, is something that really resonates. Like, even if you've never been to L.A., but you've been watching Vanderpump

Rules, this geography is something that you know and understand in West Hollywood. it and the fact that we get a call out from shorts about the geography and like pointing like right over there is where I I fell in love like yeah it just like really anchors him within this world and I just thought it was like a fantastic but to get back to the garage scene with with Luke I thought that this was a really interesting scene as well and um one of the really interesting but I should I should lead off actually by saying that I don't think that Luke's argument about about him like being a martyr holds any water whatsoever, especially compared to what we are seeing Kristen going through.

Like honestly, he's just gotta suck it up and like it's part of being a new parent. And sure like you can have frustrations, but you just, you just kind of gotta deal with it bro. Like what your wife is going through is way more important than the fact that you've only been able to get out fishing. like twice since having a two month old like give give me a break um but anyways so i think that the way that they are presenting his feelings is really interesting because we have him talking about how he's feeling like he's losing a part of himself and like how he's really struggling to like

cling on to the person he was before becoming a parent which is definitely something that I felt as a parent, like you really go through a process of like finding yourself again. But the fact that he's in his garage with all his, his artifacts of the person that this identity that he holds really close. And what he's doing is he's got all these curtains that he's got to go and like put up in order to hide it because Kristen would like him like to hide it. So it doesn't look like the garage. I think it's a really interesting manifestation of his feelings where it's like I've had this huge identity and it all of a sudden had to be like compacted into this one tiny bots and now I have to completely cover that up entirely. And that stuff is still there, but it's just it's behind a curtain for now. And honestly, you got a two month old bro.

You do have to, you do have to like put some things aside. There's something that is like way more important in your life right now than going out and fishing. And I'm sorry, I don't think that that's like a piping hot take. But yeah, I do like how this is communicated to us. Yeah. And if he did, you know, cover up all these relics of his identity or how he sees his identity interpreted through his past life, he would not be able to see himself as a martyr. There would not be that dark board behind him that gives him that martyrdom,

which depends on him remaining in contact. with who he saw himself as before, which is a sentiment that Kristen kind of shares from her own angle, which is why I appreciate the callback to Yoso and Metroposa, where she makes a reference to wanting to be just a drunken, drifting butterfly in her youth. So for us in the audience, too, that little reference helps us understand what she's going through as well.

Now they kind of rhyme. when Luke and Kristen are going through, kind of rhyming, obviously, I guess. But in both cases, we have those little indications where we see how it makes sense we're able to enter their head if we have that point of reference where they romanticize part of their past.

Schwartz, too, is romanticizing part of his past. That's such a huge part of this show, right? Like, the value is so much about, like, people leaving behind the youthful stage of their adulthood and lurching towards the middle age and having to kind of sift through the corpses of past lives and and try to see what they can potentially still hold on to and who are they if they can't hold on to any of this. Yeah, you mentioned what was like my favorite line from

this when when we get the call back to the Mariposa line from from Kristen. I love that we are still carrying this like this through line metaphor that she's bringing that through because butterflies are such a symbol of transformation and yeah, like her biggest struggle right now is like dealing with the transformation that she's undergone and trying to like figure out who she is and not feeling comfortable in her new body. So I really like this that she's latched on to this, this metaphor that we've had that is carried through since Vanderpump rules. There's another few scenes within the valley that I really liked. So the, I really like the cigar bar scene that we got. I just,

The vibes are terrible in that cigar barf. The vibes are so awful. They are so awful and it is so perfect how terrible it is. And there's a treatment of this scene where we've got like they must have brought in a fog machine or something in order to do this because they are piping in smoke as soon as Danny enters the room. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like how we get up a corner or something. Yeah. Yeah.

It's just it's just amazing. And there's, I guess, another rhyming moment where Danny is framing himself as a victim of his own actions being like the supposed attack on him that was coming from Janet and Jason. But yeah, I just liked how how this was shot as this like smoky, awful place that I would not want to be. Way too brightly lit too. Like, it's way too brightly lit to have that kind of, like, like, backroom with the guys kind of cozy ambience. Just there's in a table in the middle of a brightly lit room. It felt like the physical manifestation of a toxic guys group chat. Like, just like, if that, like, you know, that locker room type toxic conversation were to be a physical location, it would be that cigar bar.

Yeah. another like location that I thought was really interesting, especially since we got it kind of contrasted with this cigar bar scene. We've got that really like male-coded cigar bar scene. But then we've got the Mani Petty, which is not an activity that has traditionally been like cis male-coded. But they do this within a location where there's like hammers on the wall and stuff like that. They need to like put this veneer on the manny-peddy salon in order to like have these these men feel comfortable going and and doing that activity.

So I really like that. Yeah. It's like what a wine bottle is like, this is wine for dudes. Bucque terroir. Fuck that shit. Shug the bottle. Sports grip. Yeah.

I also, to get back to the Belmont, I want to know, like, are you team summer or team Natalie? I don't know. I feel like I like Natalie more, but I think Summer got a raw deal there because they totally, like, encourage her to come out. They invited her and Lala's just being really rough with her, which I kind of get from Lala's perspective. She's like, what the hell is the girl from the nail bar doing here? It's like, yeah, because they're like, come on down, come on out. Maybe they didn't think she'd actually do it. You invited her down.

I think they're both, they're both kind of cool. Natalie's got some good personality. I like her and she gets more time with Schwartz and gets the best lines out of him too, which is the most important part because Schwartz is, is on fire. He is, he is killing it as his, his depressive,

dopey. What is, I think Lala calls him a basket hound, slightly, slightly mashing the name of the dog. And his flirtation with Natalie gives us so amazing moments. I love that we actually smash cut from Lala being like, I think of shorts like a basket hound,

the shorts standing out front with Natalie being like, yeah, I've had sex that last like two or three hours. And it's not fun. Nobody wants that. Just masterful pickup lines. Absolutely. A king of his craft. We had basket hounds.

We had shit too hair. We had the whole kennel club. I think that it's really interesting that, like, summer was being characterized as the weird one here when Natalie definitely gave much weirder vibes. We got a confessional from Tom that was fantastic where, like, he's first getting to know Natalie. And he's like, oh, Natalie is, you know, I see it. I see it. just like a complete loss for words. I just love it.

And that's the vibe that she gave off. I don't know if you played like the Sims, but if you ever had like a bunch of like custom content downloaded on the Sims that was made by the community, the game it like picks and chooses everything that it can and when it generates random Sims. And that's the vibe that she gets off. Just like a bunch of shit that just doesn't really go together. She's got braids that look like she just came back from an all-inclusive. of resort and I yeah

I don't know her vibes were like weird maybe perfect for for Schwartz because like Wallace said he loves the little weirdos yeah but and also he's like the most scatter shot too like he is yeah his half ass attempts of picking up are being like you sound like an oracle

do you do voiceover and then he's like he and then we see them outside and he's I think he's quoting Kung Fu Panda I think I had to look that up I didn't know what he was quoting when he's like, that's why they call it. It's a gift.

That's why they call it the present to which she replies, I think you have ADHD. At least Kung Fu Band is a little more like recent than Jerry McGuire. But yeah, I thought the scene at the Belmont was great because the vibe that I got from Tom Schwartz was that he was more interested in some. than he was Natalie. But the way that this like awkward energy was captured was, was perfect because like I feel like tons of people have been in a situation where you've got someone that you're like talking to and like you're not necessarily

viving with too much. And then someone that you like really wanted to get to know shows up and you have to like juggle that situation socially where. Yeah. And then add in that external pressure where you've got someone. like two friends, mutual friends, pushing one of those people on. It's just like such an awkward situation.

And it just, it reads through the screen. It breathes so well. I really like that. Yeah, he's juggling these two girls like one's a cigarette and one's a lollipop. And he doesn't know which one to put in his mouth at this moment. I've never seen somebody do that before in my life in a bar, putting a cigarette behind their ear,

then putting a lollipop in their mouth and switching back and forth between them. more completely unique Tom Schwartz behavior. The one other scene from the Valley that I wanted to talk about was the scene that we got at Kyle Chan. Love to get an appearance from Kyle Chan here. BFF with Tom Sandival. They need to bring them back. Team Sandy. But I did like this.

We got a classic cinematic token of this engagement ring. This is something that throughout. art has, I mean, and real life is this huge symbol. And so there's so much weight in this item. And for her to come and kind of reset this as a necklace, I thought was just like really loaded. And I love the conversation that they have, Lala and Michelle have about, you know, moving on. And Kyle's comment about, you know, when you set this in a necklace, you should, rotate it so that it doesn't remind you. I just really thought that this was such a like a loaded scene.

I love it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Did you have anything else on, on the valley that you wanted to talk about? Not really.

I'd just like to say that I once again really appreciate how raw and visible Kristen's emotions are. I like her showing up to the lunch and just not even being able to like fake it. And, and just how vulnerable she comes off. Like just how her, her sadness is like, she can't even muster the effort to conceal it.

Makes it so much easier for us to read her as a viewer and so much easier for us to empathize with her and enter her perspective. So I just really appreciate that visibility of emotion that we get from her. Yeah. Oh, also, I guess we didn't really talk about Jesse here, but we did get a moment where he's like giving Schwartz permission to pursue things with Michelle, which I guess is. have more ammo, which he nakedly says it's because it'll give me more ammo, which is, of course, what he would say because he's just, he reads everything in the most evil vile way possible. Totally. Yeah. I mean, he said that he got bit by a squirrel and was worried about having rabies, but I feel like that might be an improvement. Okay. So I mentioned that there is a new show on Bravo that's Real Housewives of Rhode Island. I'm not up to date on this, but I've, I think there's like, five episodes now and I'm on

episode three. Drama is great. That's my review so far. The drama is great but it is so hard to follow. Do you remember on like season one of Salt Lake City? I don't know if you watch season one of Salt Lake City but when we were first introduced to

Meredith Marks and Lisa Barlow, it was like impossible to tell them apart. They looked like so similar. This show is like that times 10. All the women like basically look the same. everyone on the cast has someone that looks exactly like someone else. And then there's also one or maybe two women that look exactly like Dolores Catan,

Dolores Catania. Put a little Latin flare on it. Cadania. Catania. There we go. There's like two or three women that look exactly like Dolores. And Dolores is also a friend of, which makes it super confusing. The intro for this show is,

great when they're reading their taglines because it almost seems like satire because there's like it seems like it's the same woman coming out again and again and again like same different taglines. It's fantastic. But we've got the taglines here and let's give them some ratings. Yeah, let's do it. It's good to have them coming in fresh. Like we did with New York, you know, you don't know these people yet. So you just got to judge them based on what they say without how it lines up to their personality. Okay. So you're not going to be able to guess who these people are, but I'll get you to rate them. Yeah. The first one we got is from cast member Kelsey Swanson.

Who needs a sugar daddy when my life is this sweet? Pretty weak. Pretty weak. I'm sure there's going to be something in the season that references her partner being, being, you know, older and richer or something. But I think the pun there is a very basic entry-level pun. Yeah, I agree. I give that a C.

Yeah, that's a C. Okay. The next one we've got is Rula. whose tagline is, I have a blessed life and I'm a loyal wife. I mean, it's bad on the face of it, but it has a simplicity that kind of sings.

I like that it rhymes. And I like that it's like, it's not even trying to be like ironic or caddy. It's just like so just straight up and simplistic. It's kind of charming me. I'll give it a B plus. Yeah, I think this is probably B minus for me. Her husband, like, has an affair within this.

So that's, I guess, what the loyalty angle is. Yeah. Okay. So next we have Alicia, who's, why settle for just a slice when you can have the whole damn pie? Is, so I don't know if this character has something to do with pizza. But I seem so. Otherwise, it's just like, it's weird to do a, to do a arc pie. I guess it could be, yeah, I guess it could be actual dessert pie and not pizza pie.

You know what? Yeah, it's just, I also want, I kind of want to be charmed by its simplicity as it was by the previous one, but it's too simple. It's too lame. I'll give it that just to see. Okay. Yeah. I think this one is, is pretty lame.

I think her, I don't know if this is the girl or not, but one of their grandparents had a Rhode Island bakery. that is known for pizza chips or something like that. Okay. I don't know. I, I, um, okay,

we got Ashley, my life is like a rom-com. When I'm not crying, I'm laughing. I don't know, man. These are, these are feeling a little too simple.

You got to overthink it to the point where it gets awkward to get a really good one there. This is not overthought enough. So there's context on this one. She was on the bachelor. and apparently was famous for crying a lot. So that's where the crying thing is going on. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Sure.

It's still a C for me. Yeah. Give me a good one. Come on. Rosie's is I used to report the news, but now I'm the headline. Man, where's the complexity? Where's the extra twist? Where's the irony? Where's the very forced pun?

These are very, very simple puns, man. All of these. So obviously a former TV report. reporter or something. Yeah. But yeah, I can't, I still can't go higher than C. These are like all like this. You know, why have a slice when you could have the pie used to report that these

news now I'm the headline. They're all kind of in the same genre and they're all pretty straightforward. These all seem like chat GPT, to be honest. Like they seem like they're generated by AI and an old model. Like I feel like new versions can do better than these so far. But let's keep going. I'm not trying to be mean. I just mean what I say.

Hmm. Okay. So maybe I'm just grasping here because I really want to like one of these. But I do like that the using mean in two different ways is like a different poetic device than like just a pun. Like we're using a we're using a word not into two like senses of the same noun. But we're twisting a twisting a word from like adjective to verb in the same sentence for a very. classic housewife sentiment. You know, like you think I'm a bitch, but I'm just telling it like it is.

Like that's one of the most classic categories of taglines. Still simple. And maybe I'm forcing it a bit. But because it has a different poetic device than the other ones do than just a straight up pun, I'll give it as a higher rating. Let's go B minus. Okay. B minus for Joe Allen.

And there's one more. It's Liz. And hers is, in the ocean state, I dispense the weed and the truth. Okay. here we go. I like it. So I literally never heard ocean state said before, but I'm going to assume that's Rhode Island's slogan. And yeah, dispens of the weed and the truth. I'm not sure why it starts with in the ocean state. Is it because we're supposed to connect weed to being like a pun with like seaweed? Is that why she's saying? Oh, I didn't even think about that. Because otherwise, why else is she saying in the ocean stage to start off with? So if it's a very awkward, a tip that a pun, which I choose to assume it is, huge marks added for that.

Dispense the weed and the truth is like a fun reversal of like, you know, after we get to, I dispense the weed. I'm like, where's it going to go from here? And the fact that it gets like righteous instead of like just silly is cool. Hey, let's give this a day. We finally got a good one. This is the best of the bunch. I'd still put this like maybe B plus. A minus territory, but yeah, this is definitely the best of the bond. I think like in isolation,

these are all pretty bad. But I think with the fact that going into this show and not like knowing these women, not being able to like tell them apart and just seemingly having the same like woman coming on the screen dispensing AI generated like bad housewife taglines over and over again makes the intro like very funny to me. So I, I appreciate that. element. Yeah, that's pretty great, actually, especially since a lot of them are kind of similar. Yeah, exactly. Okay, so for the audience that joined us for our Oscars coverage, I wanted to dive into Cairns. They have announced their selection for the 79th festival this year. And it's, is it Park Chanwup that is the jury president this year? Okay. So, yeah, I, I,

I'm interested. Have you taken a look at the films that have been selected here? I have. I have taken a look. I think this is a pretty stacked roster. I think more so than last year, at least on the face of it. I mean, you never know, but you never know how the actual films are going to turn out. But there's a lot of big names in terms of the European award circuits, and including a number that we haven't really seen a film from for a while, you know, like Pavelpon. Lavlakowski, Christian Mengju, James Gray, which was a kind of late edition. I think they just recently announced that the new James Gray movie will, in fact, Bietkan, it wasn't clear before. So in addition to some people, like, you know, you could expect to see a new Hero Kazu Koreida

or a new El Moldivar movie. We've got some other guys, that Russian guy, what's his name, Andrei Zvignezzav or something? he's to another guy. Like some of these guys haven't actually had a new movie in six, seven, eight years. So that adds to the intrigue for me. I think there is a lot of,

a lot of big filmmakers coming out. And definitely like when I remember when I saw the lineup for last year's kind and I was like, you're expecting me to get stoked about Eddington. Like it felt a lot thinner compared to my reaction to this one. I don't know. What's your reaction? Yeah.

I thought it was interesting that there is like almost zero Hollywood presence here. That's true. Very, last year I think they had the mission of possible had. They're not doing like the classic. Like let's just throw in one or two big Hollywood titles for the buzz. And there's like you said,

there's a big European presence. I think like Spain has like three films that are in here. and, you know, there's a lot of East Asian presence as well. So I think that that's really interesting. I think like the East Asian presence, that's like something that has been like building. It feels like kind of the decade has been, you know, kind of re-centering the film's world's gravity around East Asia. And so. New Hamaguchi, too.

Hamaguchi, Coriata, yeah. It's been a few years. since there's been a Hamaguchi. Though you say that there are a few Japanese and Koreans. Are there any Chinese movies, though? Oh, yeah. Let me, I'm going to take a look right now. Pause for Google.

At least not in competition. In competition, it looks like there's no Chinese movies. Last year, resurrection, I believe, was in competition. But this year, it doesn't look like it, though there is that there is, you know, a couple Japanese, a couple Korean from big name filmmakers. Mm-hmm. Yep, it doesn't look like we're really getting much Chinese. But you are right, at least in terms of Japan and Korea,

that there are like some heavy hitters are well represented here. So I'm interested to know what you think about this, like what this means, not necessarily within the context of the Oscar race, but if you've got thoughts on that, but about like kind of what this means for the identity for Kans. Is this marking like a shift, do you think? So the fact that there's no big Hollywood titles,

as you pointed out, is something that I personally like. It feels like they're confident enough in this roster of, like I said, a lot of big filmmakers from places like Spain and France and Poland and Russia, as well as Japan and Korea, that they're not trying to draw more attention in by being like, here's the Odyssey or, I don't know,

Avengers 6 or whatever the hell. that's that's great i mean i feel i'm i do think that kind should kind of stick to that that identity like these aren't by no means uh necessarily niche movies a lot of these movies have big budgets and have big stars um but i i'm the kind of guy who is like i don't i don't really want to see like uh jerry seinfeld in a b suit showing up to promote b movie like you did that one year like i feel like there were other venues for that to happen that's cool but there are venues for that and and the Cannes Film Festival is maybe not the one for it. Like I do like it kind of stick into its, stick into its roots as like a showcase of European, especially, but also international,

more generally, art house film. Are any of these films, films that you think might be big players within the award season or any that you're really stoked about seeing what it's going to mean from the horse race perspective? Yeah, it's interesting. interesting because I think as recently as like, I don't know, six or seven years ago, it would have been stupid to even suggest that what happens at Cannes could affect the Hollywood Awards race because they were just completely two different ecosystems. Now that seems like there is a lot of overlap between the two ecosystems. You know, we just, just this recent Oscars ended a three-year streak of the Palm Door winner being nominated for Best Picture.

culminating with Anora becoming the second movie to win both the Palm Door and Best Picture Parasite being the first not too long ago, which isn't to say that this past Oscars was not very con-heavy. You know, we had sentimental value and the Secret Agent both Best Picture nominees, which were both awarded films at Cannes and as well as

Sarat and the Palm Door winner. It was just an accident also being well represented. So there definitely was a big influence or big overlap at least. between what happened at Cannes and what happened at the Oscars, which didn't used to be the case at all. What forces are driving that this kind of feeling that the European film festival circuit and the Hollywood Award Circuit are starting to overlap.

I'm not too sure. I think the cynical answer is just that neon releasing is getting really good at buying the heavy hitters out of the award secret and then marketing them as potential award winners stateside. but in terms of what's going on this year, you know, I think the, the Pavel Pavlovsky movie, Fatherland is one that I could imagine

being an Oscars player. I think he hasn't made a movie since Cold War, which was at least seven or eight years ago, I think. I don't think Cold War was up for best picture, but it was like in conversations, I remember, and it was, It was a movie that was like seen by a lot of people in North America. And I think in the current era, it would have been a Best Picture nominee because it had that kind of that kind of buzz and clout.

It has Sandra Heller in it as well, who is somebody who is definitely making more and more of our presence in Hollywood. She's in Project Hale Mary, which is the first blockbuster of the year. And she's also going to be in Digger, the Tom Cruise movie, the director. by Alejandro Gonzalez and Yari too coming out later this year. She's the female lead in that. So I think Hollywood viewers are getting more and more familiar with Sandra Hewler. And that is probably going to help Fatherland get more eyeballs in America on it. So that's why I could kind of see that as being something that that is embraced by critics in the West and becomes at least a best picture nominee.

Yeah, I don't know. What about you? Do you any of these titles strike you as ones that could end up in the best picture race? I think that you tap like Fatherland as kind of the big one that I think we might see. But I wouldn't be too surprised to see sheep in the box make a push. Like depending on how it's received just like is that is that the Corrieta? Which one's that? Yeah.

Yeah. And it's like it's about a guy that substitutes his, uh, his dead son with, uh, with a robot. And so I think that there is potential for this idea of like AI replacement being something that really resonates with people right now. And so I could see, you know, people kind of getting behind this film a little bit just thematically. And obviously Coriata being kind of the visionary behind it is something that's going to help. whether that segment of the audience that is looking for a AI replacement story, whether they, you know, rally behind sheep in the box or Toy Story 5 is remain to be seen, but could be an interesting parallel. The first ever con AI film festival was just two days ago, by the way. I don't know if you checked out the winners for the first ever con AI film festival. Yeah, definitely have not, but. Oh, it's great. Yeah. The top prize.

went to the dark night in the style of a Wes Anderson movie. I'm just making that happen. Obviously, I don't give a shit about that. Was that actually a thing that happened? There was an AI con two days ago, yes. There is people who organized an AI film festival and obviously ostentatiously held it in Khan. Oh, my God. That is.

We are in the darkest timeline. Yeah. You know, I will say, though, for like all these, big name filmmakers, some of whom have Palm Doors on their resume already that are going to be showing up this year. I'm almost more interested in the one who isn't, which is Ruben Oslund, whose new movie, the entertainment system was widely expected to premiere at Khan this year. He has this new movie that's been in post-production for a while. It's, I think, Keanu Reeves stars in it, an English-language movie. And Ruben Oslund has won the Palm Door twice for the square.

and triangle of sadness. Triangle of Sadness was also a best picture nominee, of course, a couple years ago. And he wants to be the first filmmaker to have three Palm Door winners. Nobody's ever won three. There's a few different filmmakers who've won two. And he wants to be the first filmmaker, win three. Like, he's literally just said that. He's open about it.

And because potentially, because prospering, is more complicated than he expected, which is the reason he's given. He hasn't been able to have the movie ready for con this year, even though it was widely expected to. And he has just said that he's now not going to release it until Khan next year. He's going to sit on it for a year rather than release it at another festival because he wants that third palm door so bad.

And I almost wonder if he's kind of fibbing about post-production taking too long and he's more just intimidated by the lineup this year. And he's thinking, Maybe the lineup will be weaker last year and I'll insert it then. Valid concern. Yeah. But I just think it's funny to have a filmmaker out there who's so nakedly hungry for it. Who just wants the palm door bad.

Yeah. Oh, yeah, there's honorary palms that are going to Peter Jackson and Barbara Streisand, which I guess is like probably the most Western presence that we've got here or North American presence. in the cons lineup. I mean, it should be pointed out the new James Gray movie,

like I mentioned, Paper Tigers, which is a crime drama is going to be in competition and could potentially be a front runner. But James Gray is in that weird position where he's a Hollywood filmmaker, but his movies tend to be pretty ignored in America,

even though in France he's viewed as one of the great American filmmakers. Correctly, I think. I love James Gray. But it is weird to have like a Hollywood crime drama with, I think Adam Driver and Scarlett Johansson are heading the cast that probably has a realistic chance at a Palm Door, and I would say probably no chance at the Oscar, because James Gray movies don't get that kind of attention in America for whatever

reason. Like his last movie was Armageddon time, which was nowhere near the awards races that year. So yeah, that's a Hollywood presence, but it's the kind of Hollywood presence that it's like they just seem to like in France and don't like that much in America. for whatever cultural reasons. Yeah, I mean, I think the fact that we have had such a streak of Palm Door winners being in the best picture race, it would definitely give that film. Who knows? Yeah, if it actually won the Palm Door, yeah, in that case, it would be kind of hard to

ignore, I guess, like you said, because that's kind of been the case recently. Though James Gray has never, has never won a Palm Door before, but who knows? like I said, they like him a lot in France. And you just never know what's going to come out and be the surprise hit. Like, if you look at the Nakan films that ended up being in the Oscars race, like sentimental value you maybe could have predicted. You know, Yocom Trear movies have kind of had some penetration in America before, you know, the worst person in the world was in like awards buzz and stuff.

So there's like some precedent for that. It wasn't super shocking that a Yolkum Truer movie with like some English language dialogue. and El Fanning in it would end up being in the erase, though it was maybe surprising to what extent it was with the number of nominations it had. But beyond that, who would have expected the secret agent and Sarat to be players before they'd premiered?

Like, those were not, I don't think, on anybody's award season's radar. It was just an accident maybe because Jafar Panophani is kind of that guy with a big reputation. But it just goes to show you don't know like which relatively unheralded filmmakers work might end up penetrating. Well, I'm excited to see how it all plays out. And often at cons, we get a little bit of like some bidding war, so we know which distributors

are trying to back which films. And that gives us a little bit of an idea of what the landscape could potentially look like. So I'm interested to see what kind of signals we get. And now I'm wondering, because since I've been talking about Fatherland as the that I think has the most chance of being an awards contender. I'm wondering if that has any kind of deals in place.

I think it's a movie maybe. Is it Mooby? Okay. I am literally Googling right now because I'm curious if I can see anything. Because yeah, wouldn't be surprised if there already was some sort of distribution deal in place.

The Match Factory owns international sales rights. Mooby will distribute it in North America. Yeah, you're right. Yeah. movie will distribute in North America. Okay, so movie's kind of, you know, more of a lightweight newcomer compared to neon in A24, but they did the substance two years ago and the substance was the best picture nominee. So they're, you know, they've gotten their feet wet in terms of having an actual Oscars contender. That's a, that's a big pickup for them, I think, that could

potentially, and, you know, you got to expect that movie probably doesn't have a huge roster of a bunch of movies since they aren't such a big distribution for us. They're, they only just started very recently doing like theatrical exclusive distribution. So you would think that they'd put all their weight behind that movie because like, you know, what else are they going to put it behind? Yeah, totally. And the entertainment system, which is the Rubin Oslozlin movie, I know already has a deal in place with A24, despite again, apparently not coming out this year, not coming out until

2027 because because Austin wants it so bad and and I can't wait for that movie to come out because it just sounds like such a Ruben Oslin premise. I don't know if you've heard what it is, but it's like takes place on like an overseas flight where the the in-flight entertainment system goes down. Oh no, I have not heard about this. Yeah.

Yeah. And man, it would be it would be so crazy if those characters, um, phony skin of liberal respectability would start to crack and reveal the egotistical impulses beneath, but that would be too much to hope for, I'm sure.

I'm going to make him from a Rupert-Huslin movie. Yeah, I don't like the guy. The guys are like, but yeah, there's a Faradhi movie too. Yeah, there's things that we haven't even talked about. So we will see.

We'll have to circle back once the festival is in full swing or has concluded. For sure. All right. Well, I think that about does it. Do you have anything else before we wrap things up, Dylan?

No, no, I don't think I do. I'll just say thanks for listening to everybody. And if you want to read some of my writings about movies, look for me on Substack. My name is Dylan, D-Y-L-A-N-Fergus-N. It's just my name. I write very occasionally about film. It is a free substack.

So, you know, feel free to hop on over there and subscribe if that kind of thing interests you. The thing that I've got up right now is about Project Hail Mary. Awesome. And I'm Craig Midwinter. Don't look for me. Just hit subscribe here if you're watching on YouTube or on Spotify or wherever else. Again, thank you to all our new listeners.

Be sure to leave us a comment. Tell your friends, it helps us out a ton. If you want to check out our Instagram, it's at Bravo Outsider. We post clips there very occasionally. But you can get a vibe for some of our. old shows. And be sure to check out Craig's latest op-eds in the New York Times. He's writing as Thomas Friedman. Until next week, good night, baby. You are loved.