Oversharing - How Can I Be Less Of A Gossip?

Episode Date: June 17, 2025

As the school year winds down, Dr. Naomi gets all sentimental about her daughter making “core female friendships” and she and Jordana unpack why having your girl gang matters. In the Overshare, one single Betch has officially had it with the relationship interrogations at every brunch, wedding, and wine night and is looking for a polite way to say: mind your business. Then a Betchicist voicemail dives into the post-divorce awkward Olympics, as one listener tries to figure out if her mom and ex-stepdad can be in the same room without it turning into a Real Housewives reunion brawl. Dr. Naomi sets an intention for those catch-up convos that take a hard left into passive-aggressive hell and another listener spirals when her friend announces she's having another baby... with a husband who might actually be the final boss of red flags. And to top it all off: the last Triggered tackles the crime of being asked to chip in for a Bachelorette party you aren't even invited to. The audacity! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A quick note before we get into the episode, Oversharing is a podcast for entertainment purposes only. It is not a medical podcast and does not constitute medical or psychological advice. Always seek the advice of your physician or mental health professional. Hello and welcome back to Oversharing. I'm Jordana Abraham. And I am Dr. Naomi Bernstein. Great to be back with you.

How's it going? It's going good. So school is officially out. It's fully summer. Over. Kids are home over. Everybody's, you know, home for the summer doing different things. But it was really kind of a cool parenting moment.

So Lila, as you know, is in seventh grade. She's about to go into eighth. And for whatever reason this year, she made a lot of eighth grade friends. Okay. Who are now leaving and they're going to high school. She'll see them in a year. In a year, I guess. Yeah.

So, but it's funny because she, the end of the year is coming up and she's like, I'm like, it's summer. Everyone's like, it's summer last day of school. And she's like sad almost like what people have like when there, it's the last day of summer camp or something. Yeah. And so she was like really sad leading up to the end of school. And she likes school, right? That's kind of nice.

Yeah. I mean, this year she actually really like school because she made these really good friends who were like kind of the best friends. who were like kind of the best friends that she's had, I think, like thus far in her life, like really felt this connection and they had so much fun together. How did she make them? How do you make a different friend in a different grade? Band. She's in band.

That makes sense. So they mix ages. Like I was in a lot of sports, so I had a lot. I could relate because, but I was on the other side. I had a lot of younger friends. So like I played volleyball. I played basketball and softball. And like a lot, I, you know, I was friends with a lot of the young.

girls on the team. And then I left and they were devastated. If you're listening. Of course. We're all devastated. I'm sure. But so she's on the end where she's stuck in middle school. All these girls are going to high school.

Meanwhile, one of them literally lives like across the street, not across. I mean like up on our same street like cat a corner. And, you know, she's 13. She's like adolescent. She's like, you know, crying like they're moving to Africa. You know. So she's. really sad, but the cool part of it was on the last day of school, she came home with like 50

notes, like little notes that these, like these two girls that she's really good friends with wrote her or tried, I guess, to write her like a note a day for the whole summer or whatever it was. Like, yeah, it was really, really sweet. These just like affirmations. and like sweet little notes and we're not going to forget about you and like just funny things. That's so sweet. So sweet. And some of them were longish. Is there a reason she can't see them over the summer?

She can see them over the summer. I think this might have just been like. For next, she's anticipating for next year. Next year. Yeah. Yes. And not having any friends like on the daily at school. Yeah.

And they're all like feeling bad about, you know, that this is going to be their last time. like being in that room together and doing those things together and having those laughs with those teachers and those spaces. And I think they're just like teenagers. So they're a little bit like melodramatic. Yeah. Melodramatic. Right. But I did feel like the fact that she at 13 was capable of like making such deep female friendships and like having such deep connections. I was kind of like, you're going to be okay. Like all those parental fears of like, almost,

I made it all about me. It made me feel really accomplished. Like I think, not even, I mean, accomplished maybe, but more so I think as a parent, I get a lot of my fears are around like my children being lonely

or like not finding a community or a group or being like bullied or rejected or like the same fear as you have for yourself, but like you kind of end up having them for your kids, like wanting them to have a community and feel included. And I think the biggest fear for, I mean, obviously health concerns, but like the biggest fear for a parent is like your child feeling like lonely. Well, mentally, yeah, I think mentally that's probably the biggest risk, right?

Totally. So I just felt like, and I even said this to her, I'm like, if, I mean, this is going to speak to one of the emails that we are going to read, you know, in a few seconds here. But like, even if you never find a partner, even if you never are able to have kids, even if you never get your dream job. Like, there is a peace and a security and knowing that you are capable of making like these really genuine deep human connections. And it's almost like a safety blanket for the rest of your life. So yes, it wasn't like accomplished. It was more, I mean, maybe a little bit of like, oh, she's like a good kid and she's able to express feelings and feel that.

But it was more like, if you can find people, you're going to be okay, whether, however your life turns out. Yeah, and I think that's the number one indicator of happiness, isn't it? Like social connections, I think I've read somewhere. So that makes a lot of sense to me. I'm not surprised that Leila has made some deep friendships. I feel like that's kind of when you, like in terms of depth. middle school is when you would start to have those. I remember, I mean, I have friends that I'm still friends with that I was in like sixth grade home ec with. Totally. And it's the kind of,

I feel like it's the age where like you actually would connect with someone based on like a vibe. Right. As opposed to earlier. Maybe it's like you're just doing the same thing or you're like adjacently. And you're like, right. Right. You both like have the same style or something. Yeah. And people don't talk about like the importance of cultivating. these strong friendships and like learning how to be a good friend early on as no I've never heard anyone discuss that as like a major life skill totally and there's so much to it like even at that age keeping secrets like someone tells you something in confidence like right around seventh eighth grade it's very tempting to talk shit and and you know kind of feel like oh I can get this

person to be really interested in what I'm saying. If I tell this person's secret, a lot of it about who you have a crush on or what's going on at home or whatever. So she does do a good job of earning people's trust and being a good listener. Like middle school starts, people start having like real problems, you know, like stuff that's going on at home and just being able to listen and say, you know, kind of a supportive statement or, but yeah, as a parent, it almost made me, it made me able to back off of like, oh, is she, how are her grades? Is she doing well in school? Like, is she, you know, brushing her hair in the morning? Like, whatever these, you know, like making herself presentable when she shows up to school or like the little things. Like, is she going to

get in the top band or it's like, shh, she's going to have friends and she's going to be fine. Like, just shush about all of that. None of it really matters. I love that. Yeah. I'm so happy. for her. Yeah, me too. It was very cute. She was like got home and started reading all her letters and crying. And I'm like, you could walk up the street and see your friend right now.

Like, why are you crying? And maybe she'll meet some new younger friends next year and forget all about these people. Yeah, I have a feeling. That's probably what's going to happen. I remember. Do they have like a little yearbooks that you sign? Yes. So, yeah.

I remember like those messages you'd get that were like, I don't know. Hags, which is like, have a great summer, right? Hags. The funny thing is her, like, best friend from elementary school, you know, who was like her best friend, like third, fourth, fifth grade in her yearbook, her, like, old best friend just wrote, her, like, old best friend just wrote hags. And she's like, what have we come to? Wow. Now we're at hags. That's the middle school version of the happy, you know, you look, you send someone a happy birthday text and the last time you texted them was on their birthday last year. That's hacks for the yearbook. Yes. Yeah. So it's just crazy how watching like having gone through it

and now like watching it from the outside. Remembering like being in that like middle school body. Totally. It is cool. Like I still have friends from middle school. I know that you do too. It's like a time when you really start to have connections that could last a lifetime. So it's sweet. Yeah. And no one knows you like those people. I've seen you. Oh,

yeah. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. I found some old artifacts of yours from middle school. Like, I'm sure they're very embarrassing. Just like you're developing your sense of humor. You know,

you kind of have to straddle that line between like we talked about in the last episode, like how to be funny without being too mean. Yeah. I think I definitely needed a lot of. work at that at that age. No, that's great. Did you, it's funny, like, because you, I feel like you, the common teenage trope, I guess she's like a tween or I don't know, she's technically a teenager. It's like, you don't know what it's like or you don't like, you're like out of touch with like what, but do you feel like you actually kind of do know what it's like? Like you're talking about,

like being in that, you know, remembering that version of yourself or coming, kind of coming out of it as an outsider, but do you feel like you do know what it's like? You know, I think it is such a different world. Even like, for example, some of it is similar, like what we just talked about, but even like, I didn't have a cell phone in middle school. So she has all these relationships where they're literally just like texting and maybe they have a phone call while they play a video game or they just texting. each other. I'm like, why don't you could walk there? Why don't you just hang out? And that's when

she'll be like, you don't understand. That's not how people, you know, like, that's when I get the you don't get it thing is when I'm like, just go over there and see if she wants to hang out. She's like, that's crazy. I'm not just going to like show up at her house. Right. You're like the parent giving the red, like, just take your resume and knock on to every door and hand them your resume. Like, that's how you'll get a job. Just go up to an office building. and say, I'm here to apply. Yes, exactly that. So when it comes to the tech where I'm like,

why can't you people hang out in person instead of just interacting over text messages, I still don't get it. You truly don't know what it's like. But still good milestone. I'm impressed. Okay. Let's get into it.

Guys, if you want to leave us a voicemail, you can leave us a number, a voicemail at 646-363-6. 294 or you can email us at oversharing at betches.com. And if you would like to be a subscriber, we love our subscribers and we're really, really honored for anyone who, you know, pays a little bit more, especially when the internet is free. But we have such a great subscriber community. And you also get two bonus episodes a month, add free and a day early. And also, if you want to get even more involved, you want to kick it up notch. You can join one of Dr. Naomi's therapy groups.

Yeah, please reach out. Naomi Bernstein. You'll find out all the info. You can reach out to me straight through the website and get connected with one of my therapy groups. I hope, I mean, all the listeners, it's funny because a lot of group members are from our oversharing community. And I'm not just saying this. I literally, really, really, really like all of the members of my group. I think there's just something special about this community, people that are interested in being introspective and learning and growing. And of course, that little mindfulness meditation piece that just makes for the perfect recipe and great little community.

Totally. I think the listeners of this podcast are just like so introspective, so self-aware. Like even our, our listener that we had on our subscription episode from last month talking about like an update from an issue with her mom, I was just like, you are like so grounded. I was like so impressed. Well, it's funny because it's like you think people are listening because they like need therapy, but they're already just amazingly, you know, like you said, grounded and introspective and mature.

And a lot of the people in my groups, I'm like, you could be running this. Like I could just go get a drink of water and come back and everything would be great. So yeah, really great community. So if you want to meet some kind of people similar to. yourself, but maybe different in terms of life circumstance. Come join us. Naomi Bernstein.com. Check it out. All right. I'll read our first email. Let's do it. Hi, Jordana and Dr. Naomi, huge fan of you up and over sharing. Your advice is always calming and eye-opening to hear all points of view to a story. Recently, I've been getting triggered when friends and family harp on my

dating life. I'm almost 31 and most of my friends are married or in a serious relationship at this point, except me. On a day-to-day basis, I'm okay with this. I've achieved a lot on my own. I own my own home. I and career, fill my time with things and people that make me happy. I go on dates here and there, but I haven't been able to find my match yet. I'm not too negative about it, but overall, it is a goal of mine to settle down and find my man. Important also to note that I don't think I want children, so I'm not stressed on a timeline. What totally puts me off and dampens my attitude on this is the constant questioning I get from friends and family about this. Some of my very good friends who I see weekly will ask me every time if I'm seeing someone. I'm tired of this conversation,

and I can't stand the looks of pity when I answer that I'm not. I mostly don't understand how after being friends for 20 years, why they have to fill a gap in conversation with this question. I never answer in a peppy manner that would insinuate that I'm interested in chatting about it with them further so I cannot understand why they are, A, so bothered by my being single, and B, not getting the hint that I'm not interested in chatting about it. Even when I have gone on dates and decided to open up about it, they invalidate my reasons for not being into a guy.

and I never complain about being single. I definitely do bottle it in, but I don't feel safe opening up about dating and whatnot around them when I'm constantly invalidated for my feelings. They definitely center their mindset around not being successful until you are married, so I don't really care to hear their advice on this topic anyway. I would understand if I betched about being single all the time, but trust that I never bring it up. Like I said, I'm mainly okay about this on a day-to-day basis, and I find that I only get down about it, when I'm pressed about it by others. I feel like they're uncomfortable in me being okay that I'm single and they can't fathom it.

I am not a confrontational person, but how can I get them to back off and trust that I will come to them when there's someone in my life? Thanks for all that you do, a bothered batch. All right. Great question. I think a lot of people feel this way. Yes. People that are single and dating or single and not dating and just irritated one way or the

other about how others around. them are handling this. What have you heard on you up or what's your perspective from doing a dating podcast around this? I mean, I could give my perspective even personally. So I mean, to play the devil's advocate here, I don't think anyone is asking these questions to like make you uncomfortable or make you feel bad about yourself. I think they do genuinely want an update on your life. And dating is like for most, for not, I don't know what to say most, for many people is like a big part of that or having an update about what's going on in your life is a big part of that. I don't think we should just only tell each other like positive things that we're going through.

Like I do think we should be like we're at the level of friendship where like we don't need to avoid any uncomfortable topics. We can like talk through them. And I can understand why also. I can understand why you don't want to be asked about something, especially if it comes off it's being asked in a judgmental way or if it's making the person feel bad about themselves. all this, but I don't always know that, like, that's obvious or the intention of the person asking. Yeah, I agree with that. I like the idea of just, I think she might have to come out and say,

kind of like, I don't really enjoy talking about that. I'll let you know if anything happens. Because otherwise, how are they going to know? It's, it's almost like I do think, I could see what might be irritating about this. Because this, I mean, with this listener, it doesn't sound like it's something she's going through. And she seems like she's okay about it. It's, people not making her feel like it's okay that makes her not okay. Right. And I do think that's kind of what she was saying. Like I'm not necessarily upset about it, but like I am around a lot of people who are in this position. Like, don't you think it would make me uncomfortable to be like singled out as like being asked this? Right. I think part of it and I know

it doesn't maybe feel great is almost what we were just talking about about how you develop friendships like in middle school and a lot of the topic when you're first kind of like having these close friendships is like, who do you have a crush on? Who are you dating? Like, because it's just kind of juicy and interesting. And it's like, I think people that are partnered find it like kind of entertaining to talk about other people's dating life when they're in like a pretty stable monogamous thing. So I see how that also might feel kind of annoying. Like my struggle or this thing it's hard for me is not here for your entertainment. And I think people just generally really like, and it is kind of this evolutionary tribal thing,

like people just really do like to talk about interpersonal relationships, a lot of people. Right. I mean, especially me, which is why. I said also, I'm like, I'm like a dating and relationship enthusiast. Like, it's not, it isn't even like, I just love talking about. any of it anyway. Right, right. Yeah. So I think, and I do think even like in, like I said, in our evolution, we were kind of tribal and there was a lot of almost like gossip, like gossip and talking about like who's mating with who and who is, you know, maybe sharing food with the other

tribe and not telling anybody, like talking about other people, I think is very wired. it into us in terms of survival. Because it's interesting, we're going to talk about it in another segment, but like almost if you don't participate in it, then people think you're sketchy or if you do participate in it, it like builds trust somehow. So bringing it back to this topic and dating. And I think people, if she was talking about maybe a drama that she had with her sibling or if she was talking about an argument that she had with her mother, like, I

I think that would be something that people would probably be following up on and asking about too, because that is also kind of, or even her boss or whatever. Like that's kind of an interesting interpersonal thing. And knowing that she's dating is like an easy one for other people to kind of be like, so what's the. Right. What's going on with that? It doesn't seem quite as heavy.

And I mean, I get asked about like where I'm at with like fertility stuff and that kind of thing. all the time by people with like, I was just going to ask you that too. Like, it's the same thing. Like, if you don't want to talk about it, it's probably on you to be like,

I really don't want to talk about that. Yeah. No, that is true. I guess with the fertility stuff, it's more like, I don't want to say like, out of my hands or more like medical

or more like obviously bad. Like I think like, I think the listeners annoyed because her friends are equating being single with a worse life. Yes. Like not being. There's a problem in your life and have you fixed it yet? Right.

Whereas like with the fertility stuff, it's like, yes, I am not like, I think I'm pretty clear, like this is not, I find this to be a problem. I'm not like, yeah, like I'm having a great time doing all this stuff for so long. It's been going, like, it's been, you know, because you could phrase dating as like, yeah, I'm like going out and meeting all these people. I'm like having great sex. I'm doing whatever it is. Like, like, I think like the pity is more like warrant, like more like, like, like, I

you don't have to hide it as much. Like, it's okay for someone to feel bad that you're trying to do something and you can't. And if she was trying to date and it's not working out for her, like, yeah, maybe there is a little bit of a pity there. And it doesn't mean that I think there's this notion of like pity is horrible, like being pitied is horrible. It's like, it's okay if someone feels bad for you. Like if, and I guess maybe she's saying like, I'm okay with it. But she does. And I think part of the insecurity comes from like she does want to meet someone.

And I think having, I think the only way out of it is almost like through it. And for her, I think if her friends are bringing that up to just, because she's saying she's kind of just like changing the subject or answering curtly and then moving on, I do think like to have her friends understand where she's coming from and to have a stronger friendship, it would be better to say like, yeah, like I'm having a tough time of it. And like honestly, like whenever I get asked this, I always feel so anxious or insecure or like I'm being like pitied or something and it makes me feel really bad. Like I'm like pretty. And she could say like, like, I'm like, and she could say like, like, exactly what she said to us, like day to day, I'm okay. But sometimes I do feel like a little left behind because all, you know, all of you guys are already married. And I think that's like a more real conversation, a more honest conversation. I think the idea of like, I'm only talking about the positive things going on in my life isn't like a real friendship. Right. Yeah. I think if you pick like one or two people that this feels like this is really coming up with or they've had this happen a few times and have that conversation. I think you'll feel better and I think they'll back off. But it does sound like because of her being feeling judged by like, oh, well, why'd you stop dating that guy just because he fill in the blank? Right. Like you're never going to meet anyone.

If you don't give someone, you should have given that guy a change. Like when she hears those things, it makes her feel judged. So I do think she sounds like she doesn't really have anyone that she can open up to about the moments. like we say, like life is just moments. You might have 90% of your moments where you're like, this is great. I'm happy.

I have a great job. I have great friends. Like everything's fine. But there's those 10% moments where you feel lonely or you wish you had someone to go to the thing with or whatever it is. Like I do think it would be helpful to have somebody that you can open up to in those circumstances to kind of process it through. Because if you're just stuffing, if you're dealing with that all alone,

you're stuffing it down. then when someone like pokes that wound, it feels really painful and, you know, really kind of like, oh, they must see only that, that 10% of me. Right. That's really lonely sometimes or they only see that 10% of me. Or they think I'm not doing well. Yeah. Right.

It feels bad to be pitied in that way of like, there's a difference between like, I'm struggling and I, you know, I'm going through. and like let's talk it out and like I think my I used to have this with my dad where he would be like I think when I was like 26 he'd be like I just really wish you could meet someone right and I'd be like what part of like my life did you think does not seem like I'm like doing well and happy and I have all these friends and like it's almost like I get like I'm like a little insulted that you think that I need this especially when you're divorce right well that's probably where it comes from is he you know, he probably is kind of like, I'm lonely. I don't want you to be lonely. And I think that's where

I get why it's annoying and frustrating, but I think it comes from like coming full circle back to like loneliness is kind of the thing that we are all trying to avoid by all the people like I'm avoiding, you know, I hate to think of my kids that way. Your dad hates to think of you that way. So I don't know that maybe it's about finding a partner, but I do think it is really helpful if you have some kind of a community or, you know, you can kind of be like, I'm actually not lonely that often, you know, like I'm lonely every now and then, but even people that are married are lonely. Right. You know, so I think the idea of like, I, you have a community.

Yeah. And I, I agree. Like, you don't need to be partnered to be happy. There is like more of like a security feeling in it. And I think that's what they, they want for her is like the security of like, you have this person that is like going to always be there. And I think they're asking because they, they love you and they want you to feel like safe and secure in this relationship. So I don't, I get why it kind of feels like almost like I have to be married or in a relationship for people

to think I'm happy. I just think you need to, they want to know that you're safe and secure, which is, again, we've talked about this before. I wish there was more of a space for like, community. And some people do have that where they're like, I have my church. I go every twice a week and we have potluck things and we're doing this together. And we're doing that together. And I think if it felt like that, maybe they'd back off and be like, okay, you have like a place that's not going anywhere that you can always feel like you can show up and be heard and not be lonely. But yeah, it's, I do think this is common. And I, I probably fall into this too with people either in our family or friends of mine that are single where it's kind of like I don't know what you want need.

Yeah. Do you want me to pretend that it's not part of your life at all and not ask about it at all? Or do you want, I mean, I usually do err on the side of like, I'm going to wait for you to offer an opening and then kind of come in. But I think it is like you said, similar to any struggle you're having where this might be one of these things where it's like if you're having a day where you're being triggered, someone asking you is just going to be triggering. Right. I agree. I think it is the way it's asked, the day, the timing of when it's asked. And I think she should be just open about like,

that's a, you know, it's a little bit of a sensitive subject for me. And I think that makes it less like, because I think if you're like, I don't want to talk about that, the person worries more, almost. Like I think you just say like, I'm feeling a little sensitive about that topic. It was honestly like today. I just like can't talk about it today. I'll let you know. Or if anything's going on, I'll let you know for sure.

Yeah. Or even the bigger pick. Like I do think if it's a close friend, what you said originally, which is like sometimes I feel like you can't fathom the idea that I could be okay without a partner and I am. And this is how it makes me feel. I'm not saying you're doing it on purpose. I'm sure you're not.

But when that's like the thing that you're constantly checking up on, it just feels like you you don't believe me that I might be able to be happy before I meet my person. And that's the part that feels maybe more upsetting even than the check-in itself. It's like the judgment maybe behind the check-in. Right. Yeah. I think it's worth having that with closer friends. Yeah.

But it's okay. I like this idea of you have to let people know what works and what doesn't work. They're just trying to be there for you in whatever way they can. So yeah, just let people know if you don't want to talk about it. Like I've got emails of people who are like, no one ever asks. You're asking. Right. Yes. Yeah, that is true. Let's do a betcha sis. This one is a voicemail. Let's roll the tape. Hi, Dr. Naomi and Jordana. I love listening to your show. and I'm calling in with a new dilemma that I have for you guys. I just recently got engaged, and I have a lot of weird family dynamics going on that I would love your input on.

So my stepdad and my mom have been divorced for about five years. They had a really good relationship for the first few years, and then recently my stepdad has decided to completely cut ties with my mom and the rest of my family while trying to. to maintain a relationship with me because he's been in my life since I was about eight years old and I'm 30 now. So I think he didn't want to cut ties with me, but he did cut ties with everybody else. And so because of that, the rest of my family thinks it would be extremely awkward to invite him to my wedding. He's not, he's gone farther than just cutting people off. Like he literally was like, I don't want to talk to any of you ever again. So I understand why it would make for an awkward day if he was there and if he potentially brought his girlfriend.

So I'm in a weird spot where I feel like if I don't invite him, I'm cutting off my relationship with him completely. But if I do invite him, I'll just know that there'll be an awkward day for the people that I love the most. So I would love your input. Thank you. I feel like we've dealt with these like so many times. Like I can think of so many times when Like this has been the exact debate. Totally. So I relate. I feel her pain.

Yeah. I mean, it's tough. I guess part of it was like, would it be helpful to get more context about like, is someone wrong to the other person? Has someone been like, because they're full no contact.

I don't ever want to speak to you again does feel like there's something dramatic that happened. Right. But it could also just be people's like personality style. So I think this. is a tough one. What do you think? I do think this is a tough one. What I would do is I sometimes I think the best way to, I don't want to call it a test, but I guess it is a little bit of a test to go to your stepdad and have a frank conversation with him and just say, this is what I'm dealing with. I would love to

invite you. I know you're not speaking to X, Y, and Z. They're all going to be there. I'm really fearful that this is going to be awkward. I want you to know that I would love to honor you by having you come. And if everything else was a non-issue, you would definitely be getting an invitation. And I don't know how to proceed, especially because this is like a, this is a paternal figure. This is like a fatherly figure. This isn't a sibling where you're kind of on the. the level, you could go to him as like, I'm struggling, I'm your stepchild, I need help figuring this out and kind of put it on him and see how he handles it. And I think it does say a lot if he's kind of like, look, I know that you're in a bad situation. I really feel for you.

I want, you know, you to prioritize yourself and kind of do whatever makes you feel comfortable. and I support you almost would make me want to invite him more, even though he's kind of giving you the green light, not to invite him. It shows like there's like a care for you and what you need. And it is your wedding and your day with your partner. So I think whoever really deserves to be there are the people that are not going to make you feel terrible about it and are going to be supportive of your decision.

Yeah. I think you can honor him by saying, I would love for you to be there, but these are all the reasons why I'm nervous. See if he backs out. You know, even if it's not, yeah, even if it's not a test necessarily, but just kind of like, I'm going to put this on, you guys made this mess. I'm going to put it back on you to help me clean it up. Right. Yeah. Because I think that's the part that gets lost in a lot of these things, that you're sort of like the innocent child having nothing to do with this and are sort of like collateral damage.

Yeah. So, and then you're expecting. to like clean it up and just make the decision and take care of everyone else's emotions. And I will say, I think in these situations, the people, the parental figures, I know we're all adults here, like you're an adult, they're adults, but like the parental figures that can do the thing where they're like, I'm not going to make my emotions the center of attention here. And I'm not going to force you to like caretake my emotions. I'm going to go to my therapist for that.

I'm going to go to my friends for that. I'm going to like handle that on my own without needing you to do it for me. Those are the ones that end up, I think, having the better relationship anyway, whether it's being demonstrated at the wedding or it's demonstrated because you guys get lunch once a week and you have phone calls and text each other and have a closeness because you don't have to be afraid of, you know, who's getting mad and who's, you know, upset with you. I agree. I think that's very good advice. He clearly handled the dysfunctional family or two in your day. No, I think that's great advice. I didn't think of that. And like, again, it is a little bit of a test of him. But also, like, I mean, I think he has, you know what I mean? As much as you don't have anything to do with it and like the wedding shouldn't really have anything to do with it, when you do cut out someone's parent and someone's like, especially like when it's like their biological.

parent, I do think you are in a way, like, sort of, I don't say you like deserve to not be invited to these things, but it does like, it would put a, like if that was a priority for you, it's like being able to be together at family functions. That might not be your outlook towards your ex and her whole family. Yes. He was putting their relationship at risk by making that decision. You know, It's almost like if even if like if I was really mad at Mike about something and I decided that I didn't want to be around Mike and I wasn't going to speak to him again, I would have to be aware that there was going to be damaged to our relationship. Right. As a result of that, it's not independent. Like it's going to affect us.

So that might be something else you can say in that conversation. You know, like, yes, would I love for you to be there, but you're not speaking to any of them. you not willing to like make amends or get back to the way that things were before is really putting me in a tough position. And it's going to change our relationship. I totally agree with you on that. Okay. I think you provided an excellent phrasing of what you should say to the stepdad though. Yeah. And she also can say what you said. She can add in like, I'm sorry, but like you're taking a hard stand on this and it is like kind of forcing my hand if that's the direction she does choose to go, which is to not have him there.

If he doesn't, especially if he doesn't back out on his own. Right. Which, I mean, like, that's the other part of it is like she might be dealing with someone who's not emotionally mature enough to say that or is not, in which case, I think the second part is sort of like the more. Yeah. And this is why I kind of need to do that regardless. Yeah.

And he has the option of, it sounds like he does have the power to be like, okay, I'll call your mother. I'll tell her, you know, I'll try to. smooth things over. It's so important for me to be there that I'm willing to do this thing to make it happen for you. Right. Because he does sound like he's the one that's like towing the line. All right. Let's do some intentions. I'll read this. Okay. Hi, Jordana and Dr. Naomi. I love you both so much and really appreciate everything you do. Love you too. I am writing in need of an intention for some friendships dynamics I'm struggling with. I have two lifelong family friends my age. Over the

years, we've ended up spending less and less time together. We have so much history, but live in different places, so we end up seeing each other a couple of times a year. The most recent time we spent together, I left feeling like such a gossipy mean girl. It starts off as catching up, but the tone quickly becomes catty, and I find myself getting reeled into talking about everyone we mutually know in a negative way. I tried to turn the conversation off of certain topics, but very quickly the tone changes. And their parents end up getting involved too. I'm sure they're probably talking the same way about me when I'm not around. The whole thing leaves me with such a deep dread and being ashamed of myself for getting involved in the gossip. Cutting the friendships entirely

isn't really an option because of how deep it runs in our families. So I was hoping for an intention to catch myself when the gossip starts and to be the person who leads the conversation in a positive way. Thanks so much, Bechin Wieners. Okay. What do you think? this is tough, tough situation. This is like what I was talking about around like it's in our DNA kind of to have to navigate this in a very, yes, and not only to talk shit, but to navigate how to handle other people talking shit. So it's almost like if you, if you're either in or you're out, like you're either involved or you're like,

you're like almost seen as kind of the enemy in a lot of ways. You don't want to ostracize yourself. Yes. So that's the fear, I think, is that people will then think, okay, well, you're not in this. Or are you going to go and tell other people what we're saying? Can I trust you? Are you in the in group here? Or are you kind of like the nark of the group?

Right. It's hard to navigate. Yeah. holier than thou because you don't want to. But I do think there's ways to, I've done this a lot. Like I definitely have been in these groups and I think people, they don't love it. Like I have this dynamic and personally and a lot of friendships where it's like

someone will say something about someone and then I'll kind of be the one that's like, oh, well, maybe they were just like going through a, a hard time or, you know, I don't think that they, I think they looked kind of pretty in that picture or, you know, whatever the thing is. And sometimes it does feel like people are, they don't, they don't make them feel close to me in that moment. And they don't feel like I'm home team and that I'm not connecting with them. And even a, you kind of just have to deal with it. Yeah. It's funny. I feel like even on the phone with you the other day, And Brooks comes in and he's telling a story about, I think he's like baseball team.

Yeah. And he was like, and the umpire was like, or like the ref was like such an idiot. And you were like, that's not how we talk about. The empire. He was probably like. Right. Yeah, he might love me a lot more and feel more connected if I was kind of like, yeah, that umpire was such a jerk.

And you shouldn't, you shouldn't have been forced to go back to third. Like he'd probably feel like mom's got my back. Yeah. You know, and I've had this with my kids. actually now that you bring it up too where they're kind of like do you even have my back on this like why are you defending this umpire i've had that with mike too yeah well i'm like on a rant about someone i'm like going on a rant and he'll be like well maybe she didn't mean it that way or like it sounds like maybe you know that was we're a little sensitive about this topic or

something yes and you do feel like uh are we on the same team like what's right what's going on. I think, yeah. The fear is it is probably going to cause a moment of disconnection between you and this group, which doesn't feel good. So I could see why you don't want to do it. But I like the idea of doing it. I think if you, I know it feels like this dynamic is so ingrained in your friendship

that almost like what would the friendship be without it? And I don't, you know, I don't think they're bad people for it. I do think sometimes that becomes the way that people connect because you used to know the same people and like you don't live in the same space so you don't really maybe have that much to talk about. So I don't think it makes them bad people. But if you don't want to do it and it feels like icky to you, I think you could just

start by being a little like contrarian around it. And eventually maybe they will stop doing it because they're not going to get what they're looking for from you. Right. And I think there's, you know, there's people like that too. where if you have, sometimes if you're like in the mood to rant about something, there's people that you're like, all right, I know this person's going to be down. Yes.

And then there's other people where you don't, where you're not like, oh, like that person sucks, but you're like, that person's not going to be like a fun person to. Totally. Really. Even like celebrities. Do you know what I mean? Like if you want to like talk about a certain celebrity scandal, there's certain people who are going to be like giving you all their opinion.

And these are like, almost safer. We've talked about this. How it's like safer to be like gossiping about the real housewives. and it is about your next door neighbor. But there are certain people who like, and I think that's like it, like you said, it's a social thing. Like I love to do that with reality TV.

I love to like judge and talk. And it does, like, no one's like, don't say that about Ramona Singer. Like no one says that about those people. So that feels like a safer outlet for that. Yeah. It is very true. And I think the part that she's going to have to deal with

is that there is going to be a disconnect. Like even my own kids, if they, like if, if Brooks went to Jeff about the umpire, he would be like, yeah, that call was terrible.

Like, that guy doesn't know what he's doing. Like, and he would scratch that itch with Jeff. So like a lot of times they will. Maybe he was testing you out because like he knew you were on the phone and he's kind of like, all right.

I think Jojo's going to like be on my side. She's going to talk shit about the empire with me. Always down. Yeah. Yeah, always down. So like even my kids will go to Jeff when they want to talk shit more than they will come to me. It's going to be hard, but it's going to be a disconnection.

I mean, the intention that I wrote for her is this feels important to me and may not be well received, but I can handle it. Like there's going to be that awkward moment. It's not going to feel amazing, but like you're not going to die from it. And I don't think they're going to end the friendship because you're pointing out like a positive. thing or I don't think that, you know, she, whatever. Especially if you don't, yeah, especially if you're not coming off as judgmental of them. I think when you're feeling, when they feel like a judgment from you is maybe when they'd

outgroup like this person's judging us, like get her, you know what I mean? Like there's a real lack of closeness there. But I think exactly like you said, like say something positive or be like, yeah, I don't really see it. Yeah. Is kind of like a very neutral way to back out. Totally. I wouldn't go into it. You guys are being so mean. Like, I can't be around this.

Like, I don't think that's the way to do it. But just like not giving them what they're looking for is probably a more subtle way to just be like, I'm going to see the positive in this person. And if they were listening, which I think is kind of a nice way to handle yourself, you know, like if this person was listening, how would I want to come off in this conversation? And I don't have to be like that person that's like, I'm. storming out of here. I can't handle this. But you could just be like, I don't know. I thought her, you know, eyelashes looked pretty there or whatever. Or I didn't notice that. Yeah, I didn't notice that. Yeah, exactly. I like that. And I think the intention is good. And you can use that for a lot. Like, this feels important to me and may not be well received, but I can handle it. She could use this for the, for the betches. She could use the betchesist listener with the,

with the dad could say this too. Yes. Yes. Totally. You can handle other people not feeling super close or connected to you in that moment. Feel scary, but you can do it. Let's do some triggers. I'll read the first one. Let's do it. Hi, Jordana and Dr. Naomi, love the oversharing podcast. As I am an avid listener, I'm writing to see how triggered I can be.

I have a best friend who is like a soul sister to me. Let's call her Shelley. Is she 65 years old? Okay. She complains about her husband a lot and how he doesn't help around. the house, etc. They have a two-year-old daughter and he can't even stay home with the baby when she needs a loan time. He has to go to his mom's house and hang out there for help. Shelly complains about him and has contemplated divorce a few times. But then she also realizes

in states she won't ever leave him. I have offered ways and advice on how to navigate and manage the marriage. For example, healthy communication tools, etc. It seems to me they struggle with healthy communication and repair. Fast forward to today. She is now 13 weeks pregnant with baby number two. This is going to be a huge undertaking with an unsupportive partner, mentally and physically. And I can only imagine what a strain this may put on the marriage. But yet she chooses to stay and have another baby. I know I can protect my peace and keep a healthy distance, but how triggered can I be? Any advice on how to handle the situation would be greatly appreciated.

Sincerely, a confused mom mint, betch. It is really hard. I think when there's someone close to you that's going through something that they talk about a lot and then they keep making choices that keep them stuck in that same dynamic. It's really hard to sit back and watch it. Like watching a, you know, car accident happened in slow motion. You're like, no. Right. Yeah. I think it's like, I think what she could say to their friend is it's like, are you, are we saying, are we having this conversation again so that you can vent or are we having this conversation again because we're looking for a solution to the

issues that you're talking about yeah and sometimes i mean here's the thing sometimes people do just want to vent and i think that that's okay to a friend yeah if they can handle it i work with people on this too where i do think and this listener is at this point where i think she's this new baby is like the strong that broke the camels back for her. Like I think she probably has been like a little bit overwhelmed with this like repetitive venting about the same thing that she's not doing anything to change. And I think for friends, sometimes that can be really draining and exhausting when you're

venting to someone repetitively about the same exact thing. It can be hard because they love you and they feel hopeless and helpless and helpless. that anything is going to change and there's nothing they can say. So I do think you're right. Sometimes it is helpful to the person who you're venting to to just say, I'm just venting about this. I'm really not going to do anything. So you don't have to spin your wheels like trying to help me figure out what to do.

I just need to speak this out loud. And it sounds like she does do that. It sounds like she says, but she also realizes in state she won't ever leave him. So it does sound like she's kind of saying that. without saying that. It just sounds like the, I mean, I think to be, I don't think this is that triggering of a situation.

I think if you're feeling triggered by someone else's like personal life, I do think that's like, a little much. Right. Do you know what I mean? Like, I, like, I'll call you, you'll give me advice. But like, if I don't take the advice or if I do the thing that's like not what you said, not that you wouldn't care, but I think you would be like, okay, like, that's not my life, right? Right. Although that's why I think that she is more overwhelmed by this friend

complaining than she's maybe letting off because it seems like maybe the triggering part is like, I spend a lot of my time listening to you complain about this thing and now you're digging yourself in deeper and I'm only going to have to be listening to this seemingly more and more intensely. So my hunch is that the trigger is that she's getting a little bit worn down by being there for her in this way. And so it feels triggering because it's almost like if you have a friend that's in like an abusive relationship and they just keep calling you and telling you how they like have been abused or they're, you know, what the boyfriend said to them most recently or the partner said this or he did, she did that. And you're kind of trying to say, hey, I think

you should get out of this. This isn't healthy for you. And they're just like, nope, I'm just going to stay and I'm going to keep calling and like kind of in some ways like torturing you. Right. With my life that you have no control over, it can feel really hard. So the advice is more for if you find yourself being on the other side of this. Like if you are the person that keeps calling someone and like not aware that you are ruminating repeatedly about the same problems, not doing anything about it. And that's fine. In some ways, that's what friends are for.

But I do think it's the nice thing to do to be like, I know I keep saying the same thing. I know I'm not changing. I just need to get this out of my system. So like don't feel like. And also like, and I'm okay. Like yeah, I'm okay. Like I'm not.

If I wasn't okay, I would leave. And the other thing is I meet a lot of people that they want a second kid, whether they're going to stay in the relationship or not. Right. Like they want, you know, to have two brothers or two sisters or a brother and they want their kid to have a sibling with the same dad. So they're like not doing it because they're happy in the relationship. They're doing it because they want a sibling for their kid.

And she still might end up leaving or not or whatever. Yeah. I think that all makes a lot of sense. I would also say to the person writing in, to me, this is like a, whenever I've said someone said to someone who keeps telling me the same issue over and over again, I usually say, have you thought about talking to a therapist about this? Right. That to me is like the key word for we keeps having the same conversation.

Yeah. Maybe there's a professional that could help you like untangle this in a way that I cannot. I don't like even think that needs to be said, but I think that's sort of what's implied. Right. Yeah. I think if you hear that, that probably is like a good sign of like, I, I can't keep doing this or I can't be this person as much as you need me to be this person. Like, you need a professional to be in this role. Yeah. Or a lot of times I'll, I'll say, sometimes I'll say things like it sounds like you're really not ready to do anything about this yet. That's a good. Well, that's a very therapisty thing to say. Right.

Right. Like you're, you just want to talk about this right now. You're not really ready to change anything. And it sometimes gets them to kind of be like, yeah, you're right. Like I'm not. Right. Or you know what? Yes, I am or whatever. I agree. And again, this friend isn't like in danger. It sounds like the husband's not that good of taking care of the kids on her own, but on his own. But like this doesn't sound like a dangerous. Yes. Completely crazy situation. I think a lot of people would probably tell this same. story. I don't think this is like so insane. Another thought like in what she could say, not that she needs to be her friend's therapist, but she could kind of help her shift her mindset of like, this is who you're married to. You said you're not ending the relationship. So maybe the only option for you is to accept this about this person and like figure out how to be happy within it and stop, stop like the more you. write the narrative of he's not capable and he's not a good father. Like I kind of felt like this in the beginning when we first had young kids where like

if Jeff was alone with them, he would take them to his moms and it like annoyed me. And then I'm like, why do I care? Like, okay. Right. I still go get to get my nails done and like go out to dinner with my friends. If you want to take them to your moms and get help, okay. Right. And that's why it doesn't seem like, again, she's not saying he's like abusive or just

sounds like they're having kind of fairly status quo. Again, I don't know the details, but it sounds like this is a common trope for new parents that I've seen. So again, I think that's good advice. I would give this a, I'd give this a three and a half on the triggered scale. Yeah. I'm going to give it a three to. This isn't really your problem. She wants to have another kid. you know, I think if you're really feeling, like you said, I think if you're really feeling triggered by this is because maybe you need to start setting some boundaries around listening to this or just encouraging her that continuing to bitch about him isn't helping her feel better because it just doesn't sound like it is.

Yeah. And maybe encouraging her to be like, this is the person you're married. He does let you have time to yourself, it sounds like he is taking the kids so she can do things. He's just bringing them to his mom's. Okay. I agree. Like change your mindset around it unless you're, you know, if you're not going to do anything, because that's the only option you have. I think that's very good advice. And good luck. Let's do another one. All right. Let's do one more. I will read this. Hi, Jordana and Dr. Naomi. I love hearing the grounded and well thought out advice you both give week after week. Thank you.

I have a triggered scenario that I was hoping to get your take on. This summer I'm traveling for a family member's wedding. Up until today, there's been little communication about what the schedule will look like leading up to the wedding day, and that includes whether or not she'll be having a bachelorette party. I wouldn't say the bride and I are close, but I love hanging out with her when we get the chance. Therefore, I have no expectation of being invited to her bachelorette party.

Now for the part I'm struggling with. I received a message from another family member today saying, that the bride's best friend reached out to them asking if they'd be willing to help fund the bride's expenses for the bachelorette. The message ended with a quote, no pressure, anything is appreciated note, and a request to forward the message along to me since she didn't have my number and since my socials are private. A little bit of background. For the past couple years, I've been struggling with the fact that I get the bride a Christmas present every year and have never received one in return. I actually had to reach out to her last year to ask if she received the gift I said since she

didn't acknowledge it or say thank you. I'll continue to get her Christmas presents because I enjoy doing so, but it does sting knowing that the relationship isn't exactly reciprocal. So this indirect request to help fund a bachelorette party that I'm not invited to is off-putting. I know the best friend said no pressure, but I wouldn't be surprised if she shares with the bride who chipped in. So here are my questions. Is it normal to outsource? funding for a bachelor's party to people who aren't invited? Can I be annoyed by the fact that I wasn't reached out to directly by the best friend to financially support? She could have asked for my number instead of asking for the message to be forwarded. How much should my struggle with Christmas

factor into my feelings about sending money for the bachelorette knowing there likely won't be acknowledgement or reciprocation? Or should I just brush it off and not feel obligated like the best friend set. How triggered can I be? Thank you both so much, an uninvited but obligated batch. Okay. There's a lot to unpack here. Yeah. Let's start with the Christmas gifts. Okay. Because that seems to be like the thing that's got her the most hung up about all of it. I actually think by not getting you a Christmas gift, this person is saying like, I am not really looking to get into the game of buying each other Christmas. gifts every year.

I mean, they're not saying thank you. It was kind of rude. But, like, I kind of, like, feel that. She's like, we're not in the Christmas gift. Like, you're not, she's not close enough to be invited to the bachelor's at party. We're not in the Christmas gift, like, thing. We're not going to just keep doing this, like, forever. Like, there's a lot of gifts to get for everyone.

We're not on that level. Or I don't feel like I want to, like, make this in every year thing. Because what else are you supposed to do? Just like, I find, again, I'm not a. Christian person. I don't, before, before Mike, I never celebrated Christmas. But to me, that does seem like kind of the craziest part of Christmas is that like, there's just like these reciprocal transactional back and forth gifts.

And the way she's talking about it makes it sound very transactional where she's like, I'm not getting anything in return. I haven't gotten a gift back. It's like she's not giving because she wants her. She says like, I'm giving. Well, she actually says I'm giving because I enjoy doing it. So it's like, that's why you're doing it. If that's truly why you're doing it, you wouldn't expect anything back.

Yeah, I agree. I think for some people, adding another person in addition to like their close, you know, friends and family feels like, you know, an obligation on her end that she doesn't want to. She never made that deal and she doesn't want to be in it. Right. Maybe that's why she's not even sending the thank you, which I agree is rude, but that might be like doubling down on. Please stop doing this. I don't want to have to do it back. And I don't want to feel like shamed. into doing it back. I agree. And like, well, I've gotten birthday gifts before sometimes from some people where I'm like, I don't have to get you a birthday gift too?

Like, I just like, I didn't really want to be signing up that we're like in the gift exchange. Yeah, especially, I mean, we've discussed this before. It's gift giving is not really my love language.

So to me, like getting a gift would just feel like, now I owe you one. I have to think of a whole stupid thing to give you for. Mm-hmm. No birthday gifts for Jordana going forward. No birthday gifts for me. I'll be looking out.

I'm like the Grinch. The Bachelorette thing, I think, is a totally separate thing that I would feel triggered about being asked to pay for someone. I'd be triggered to be asked to pay for the bride's bachelorette, to pay for the bride on her bachelorette. I don't think you should have to do that either. I think, like, we're only there because, like, she's assembled everyone. I don't think you should pay for the bride.

And I definitely think it's crazy to ask someone who's not even invited to pay for the bride. That part's triggering. That part's like not inviting someone to the wedding and asking them for a wedding gift. Like crazy. I just don't. That part, I think is crazy. I think this person didn't ask it to be forwarded to you and didn't ask you herself because she also knows that it seems rude. But probably maybe the bride told her to ask you or gave you her a list of someone, but she knows that it was weird. That's why she didn't ask you herself because I would feel so weird asking someone who wasn't invited on a trip to pay for someone on the trip. Oh my gosh.

Yeah, that's, that's pretty nervy. I've never heard of that. I don't know if you've ever heard of that. I have not. I could see like the people who are at the Bachelorette maybe pay for the bride's dinners or drinks while they're there. I've heard of that. But like.

Yeah. Or if you were invited and you couldn't make it, I've contributed, I've contributed to like buying a round of drinks. Right. Because I didn't go on the Bachelorette, but I was invited. Invited. Not invited. It's almost like the only way you even know the bachelor's party is happening, not almost. The only way she knows this bachelor's up party is even happening is because they want her to pay for it and not attend. I find that. That part's very triggering. I could totally see. And I ultimately think, you know, this is coming to a head in a way where you definitely can just ignore it. not contribute. If she tells the bride that you didn't contribute and the bride is in some way upset with you,

that is her problem. Yes, this was never a real, like, friend, if that's the case. She can call us or she can ask a hundred people. I asked this friend of mine who wasn't invited to my bachelorette to contribute and she ignored the message. How rude. like nobody is going to tell her she's right on that she knows that's i think she knows that would be crazy to even ask i can't imagine anyone contribute maybe like the bride's grandma but like right i was

going to say like if it's a generation like if the mom wants to contribute or an aunt that's like i don't really feel comfortable getting drunk with all these young girls like i'm invited but i'm going to politely bow out and send some money to help something like that I could see, but I even wondered, as I'm reading this, if maybe she, like, missed the invitation or something. Right. She was invited, but she didn't see it. She'd probably be in the group text about the planning, I would assume, of something.

I would imagine. And she's saying she's not expecting to be. I mean, I don't know. This is crazy. But all that being said, I think she's lucky that the message got forwarded to her because she doesn't have to say no to someone's face. I would just completely ignore this. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Completely ignore it. And stop sending Christmas presents. I know it makes you feel good, but I think somehow it doesn't make her feel good or she's not appreciating you and the way that she should. I would pick someone else that you have in your life and give all of that gift giving energy to somebody else. Yeah. And I can understand doing it like one year without for knowing that she's never recipient. but if you continue to give the gifts non-recipricated, I think that's a little bit on you. Yeah, non-recipricated and non-acknowledged. Like, I don't know. I know people say that a gift should just be given with a whole heart and you shouldn't

expect. But like, I think the right thing to do when you receive a gift is say thank you. Like, maybe that's an unpopular opinion for some people. From our teacher episode. Yes. But, like, I do think it's nice and expected that if someone, gives you something that they thought of, that they took time and money to get, you should acknowledge receipt. And if you don't, like, I find that rude. Unless you're in a no thank you

alliance, like some of our. Yes. But even the no thank you alliance is like a no thank you note. But like, if you sent me something, I would be like, hey, got the massage card. Thanks so much. You know, like, yeah, you should always acknowledge. Five seconds. I think, you know, getting out a pen and a paper and finding a stamp in a mailbox is different than like, so sweet, so thoughtful. Thank you. It takes two seconds. Speaking of which, I received the thank you from Lila's bat mitzvah this week. Oh, did you? It was lovely.

You've taught her well. Oh, good. I didn't read them. I was a little, like she just wrote them and sent them and I didn't read them over. I think she had a script. It was standard. No, I felt scripted. I told her.

It's okay. No, I mean. I did tell her. He had so many to write. Write a thoughtful note. It was sweet. I mean, like, it was, I don't, I think when you're, I think you can, I actually don't agree that she needs to write a thoughtful note.

There's so, there's like, there's like a lot of people. And I think it's like, right. I think it's nice to write a thoughtful note like when you're writing one card to one person. Right. When you're writing so many, I feel like it's very hard for it to come off. So, okay, just quickly, I know we're, we're short on time. We've been here a while, but I will say this about the thank you notes. I tried to get her to do them like two a day.

So that way, they wouldn't feel overwhelming where she wasn't like sitting down in one shot and writing like 15 thank you notes where she could just thoughtfully write one or two. But I guess being like a 13 year old, she just kept, I mean, it was March. And here we are like the end of May, almost June. And it is June. sorry, that was March. Here we are June. And you're just getting like a not so thought. Like my point to her was either write them immediately and just get them out. But if you're going to take three months, now they have to be thoughtful. I see what you're saying in terms of the time. But I was, I don't think I've been like anxiously checking the mail every day to see if I received my thank you

note. But like I could if I never got one, I would never have noticed. Right. And here's the other part about that is like I do wonder if like words of affirmation are just mine and maybe your love language. And so you're like the note has to be thoughtful and sweet. And maybe like that's almost saying like and you have to give a gift to something you might not need to give a gift for. And that's someone else is. Maybe that's not her way of expressing, you know, gratitude. Yeah. Well, she's like she expressed it in any other way. You know, like what other way. She said thank you when I handed it to her. Yeah. now she's in for it. Oh, no, I didn't mean to get her in trouble.

No, I'm just kidding. I won't say anything. I want, now I want 50 notes like she got from her classmates. Yes. See, now she knows what a thoughtful note looks like. But that was maybe after she wrote you her notes. So maybe now she has a good model for what a nice, genuine thank you note looks like. No, it was lovely.

Don't let her know I narked on her. I won't. All right. We did it. I give this one. I think the Christmas thing, not triggering this thing, six. Yeah, I give it.

I think the rational number is a six. It's tweaking me. Like I want to give it a seven. It is very balzy. Yeah. It's like something about it is rubbing me the wrong way. But I'll go with the six. Let's put the difference.

We'll do a six and a half. Six and a half. The Christmas thing, that's on you. First year you do it. You keep doing it after that. It's nice goodness of your heart. But I don't know. I wouldn't keep.

going at that. There's someone else out there that'll appreciate it. Yes. All right, that's our time. Great work today. Betches.