Oversharing - How Do I Help My Adult Daughter Be More Independent?

Episode Date: June 30, 2026

This week on Oversharing, Jordana spirals over a very relatable parenting dilemma: did Ronnie the dog have the time of his life at daycare, or is he secretly devastated and unable to tell her? Then, Dr. Naomi and Jordana help an emailer navigate her 19-year-old daughter’s fear of driving and the fine line between support and enabling. This week’s Betchesist writes in after discovering her entire branch of the family was left off a cousin’s wedding guest list, sparking a conversation about family loyalty, boundaries, and wedding politics. Dr. Naomi’s Intention is for a mom struggling with baby monitor obsession. Plus, two Triggered emailers weigh in on couples who put friends on speakerphone without warning and a husband who insists on using the bathroom closest to his wife’s home office. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A quick note before we get into the episode, Oversharing is a podcast for entertainment purposes only. It is not a medical podcast and does not constitute medical or psychological advice. Always seek the advice of your physician or mental health professional. Hello, welcome back to Oversharing. I'm Jordana Abraham. And I am Dr. Naomi Bernstein. How does it go? This kind of brings me to my topic.

If you can hear my dog crying in the background. Yes. I think the hardest part of having a dog is I just like don't know what he's thinking. we had a bunch of people over on Saturday and a lot of them had like little kids and like most I would say like there were probably like 15 kids. It's like Mike's friends and my friends and their kids. Oh wow. 15 kids. Probably about 15 kids all four and under. So like a lot of like four. So because we had little kids, we decided to send Ron to this like daycare. He's not aggressive with kids but he does not know his size and sometimes he'll like jump on them or like them. Again, you know, we'd, talked about this in previous. A little bit of a nibbling. He's a little, little nibbler. Not to like little kids, but like, yeah, he will, he sometimes does do like a little for attention. He'll try to get your attention. Yes. So we didn't really want up to deal with like the liability of that and just being so many kids. So we brought him to this like daycare. He does not get like getting in the car. Like he won't get in

the car because I think he's afraid he's going to the vet or the groomer or like may anywhere we take, honestly anywhere we take him. He gets like. like very anxious. I think he has like he's sort of developed this like weird like a little bit of an agoraphobia of like being away from his home, which is nice because he doesn't try to run away. So like if the door is ever open, he's he's like just kind of sitting there. Or, you know, if I walk out, he'll walk out with me and then walk, if I walk back in, he'll walk back in with me. Like I actually had an interesting thing where I was taking him on a walk. He like sat down and he like would not go home. He was like, he was he would not like,

keep walking. And he was sitting there and I was like trying to pull the leash and he was just like sitting there and he wasn't. I was kind of like, at first I was waiting it out. It was like five minutes, 10 minutes. And then I was like, I have things to do. Like I need to get out of here. And he's 80 pounds. So I'm not like picking him up. So I was like, let me try this. I took him off. I like, I dropped the leash. I kept the leash on him in case I needed to like run and grab it. I dropped the leash and I just like was like, Byron and I walked home. And then he like looked at me and he got up and he followed me.

And he walked home too. Oh my gosh. Which was nice. I'm like, I've done that now a couple times. It's like a little dangerous, I think, but I'm kind of like,

this is the only way to get you to move. I can't just sit here all day. And I, you know, I'm like looking back every five seconds to make sure he's actually following me. But I don't know, he like really doesn't like to be away from our house.

And whenever he goes somewhere, he comes back and he's like sleeping all day and he's like sad. And I'm like, did you have a great time there and you're sad? You're not there. Are you like mad at me? It's just very hard with a dog to not know. I wish I could be like if he was a kid. I'd be like, how was your time there? Like he spent a night at this.

It's like not even like a facility. It's like this woman's house who like dog sits. Okay. She has another dog. So like he can play. with the dog and then they don't, they don't crate them, which he, you know, he doesn't like crates or he doesn't like to be. So he sleeps on his, you bring his dog bed. He sleeps in another room with the other dog on his dog bed. I'm just like, I stick so hard because he comes back and I'm just

like, I have no idea how your day was. And now you're kind of like, you look just like sad. I'm not sure if you're sad that I like sent you away or if you're sad that you're home and you're not there anymore. It's just very, it's, I don't know, it's a tricky thing. thing. And I think that's the saddest part about having a dog is he can never just be like, yeah, like, I was really homesick. Yeah. I don't know. Right. Or you can twist it and you'd be like, he had so much fun. He misses this other dog that he just got to hang out with for a day and a half. And he had such a blast that he's just like exhausted and tired out and missing his friend. Yeah. Or he's traumatized and like so depressed. And maybe the other dog was, I was like, I was like,

Like, is the other dog mean to you? Right. Was the woman who was taking care of you could. It's like so much, I don't know. It's just like a very, I mean, obviously with my kids, like, it's the same. They can't speak yet either. But he feels like, it feels like having like an eight year old boy that just can't like speak to me and won't. And I don't know.

I just like don't know what to do with him. That is really hard. Well, it feels like probably if this has happened before in a day or two, he'll be back to himself and you'll forget all about it. He will, I'm sure. But then I'm like, I don't know how to think about these daycare things. Like, should I bring him more often so he gets to like it? Should I bring him less often? So he because he doesn't like it or because he, it's just like, I just don't know.

It's hard to like guide your behavior with just like vibes. Totally. And then you get, this is what I get when we came. to New York when we came to stay with you and we had the dog sitter and they take pictures and we're like, send more pictures. And then they just send these like pictures of the dog and you're like, I don't know. They look, they're like sitting on the couch. They look kind of sad or like they're like pictures of them like moving and they like, you can't, they're blurry because they're like jumping up or something and you're like, I don't know what to make of this. Are you having, and don't,

you wish you could go home and be like, Penny, look, you're like, how was your week? How was, yes, was that how to go? Or you get the interpretation from the sitter, which is like, I've had so many. We've talked about them on here. The whole gap. You've had quite experience. If you were listener of the show, yeah, you've heard about this. If not, go back, listen to the episodes about our dog sitter experiences.

But then you get like the overly animated, like, we're having the best time. And they're so happy. I'm like, well, I don't know. How do you know they're so happy? Like so then you get that dog sitter and then you get the dog sitter that doesn't say much at all. Or the one who complains about them. Yes. All at all, I can validate this idea of not knowing.

And but yeah, I think it probably is good to, you know, do that every so often. We have a question coming up here about baby monitors. It might be, this is in this. woman's house. So I don't know how she would feel about like a camera of some sort in their doggy area. So you can maybe pop in every now and then and see what it looks like. She sends pictures too. It was funny. When my picture up, she was like, oh, he was great. It's like it's probably got to get his barking under control. It's like, oh. So he was barking a lot, I guess. That's like the only indication. Right. That was a little data point that you got there. That is really hard. I mean,

look, you've got to do what you've got to do, right? You had these kids over. If you didn't send him and you had Ronnie in the house and one of the kids got knocked over and bumped their head or got a scratch, we'd be sitting here talking about that. Yeah. Or even like there's also like food out. So sometimes he'll like if you try. I don't want him to like any as a sensitive stomach.

So I'm just kind of like. So we'd be having a different conversation. If it wasn't about whether or not he was happy over the weekend, it would be about the fact that he shit all over some rug that you have. And I think you just have to chalk it up to, I wouldn't be pushing him, like sending him just to send him, you know. I think if you could keep sending him to the same place, consistency in that, that would probably be a good idea.

Maybe that's what we need to do, you know, because like I think probably like you, I'm like, you go, I sent him like once and then I'm like, oh, he didn't, I'm not sure if he like really liked it. He seems sad now. So I'm going to try a different place, but it's like maybe he just needs to go to the same place over and over again to feel like he knows what to expect. And he's home and he likes everything. Yeah, unless you get some major red flags, I would like pick a place and keep sending him to that same place unless something happens that you think is really bad.

I do think videos are probably better than like still photos when it comes to a dog. But I will do the thing where I'm like, are the ears up or the ears down? Is the tail up? Right. How's the tail down? Like, yeah. But that's just crazy. craziness. And he's just like an anxious dog. I'm like, how did I make such an anxious dog? He's like,

why are you so anxious? Things are great. Yeah. The part of it is the leaving the house. Like, you know those people. I'm sure we have lots of listeners. And it does help, I think sometimes when you're single, like I was like this when I was single. And my dog Ralph was like my buddy and I literally took him everywhere. Right. When you just, you take your dog everywhere. You get in the car, you take your dog. You go to the store, you take your dog. Like you just go wherever you go, you take your dog. Right. And it makes them comfortable around people and it makes them just comfortable in the world. My dogs now are not like that. They get, I don't know if they get anxious, but they get like all jittery and intense when we take them in the car because they're like, what the fuck? Where are we going? Like, they don't know,

you know? And they have each other at least. Yeah. Yeah. But that doesn't, I don't, I don't, I don't think they calm each other, really. They don't seem like a calming force for one. That's annoying. That's annoying. There's no way to know until you get. Right. That's no way to know unless you get the other one to know if it calms the other. But if it doesn't, then it's like, oh, now I just have two dogs. Two dogs that do not calm each other.

They do not seem like calming influences on one another. I'm not going to suggest this because you have two babies. So you're not going to go to get ice cream and take two babies and two dogs. Like I don't think that's a realistic thing for you at this point. Yeah, it would take a lot. Maybe when he's older, but yeah, he's just, he's got some. He's got some social anxiety. I do think if you're trying to avoid this,

I think you can try to do the thing where you just take your dog more places. Right. I think people start off. It's the same thing, almost like what I say sometimes with like breastfeeding, which I'm a big advocate of, but like you start off the beginning phase of life with like the mom does most of the feedings and then that just sets the tone. It's the tone.

Yeah. I think in puppy life, sometimes you're like, well, they don't have their shots so they can't go places. And then you just kind of get in this habit routine of like they don't have their shots so they can't go outside and they can't go places. And then that kind of sometimes takes on a life of its own. Right. And then they don't go places.

And then you just get in that habit. So but now you're now you're swamped to figure out something to do with him. He'll be okay. Give it, give it a couple of days. he'll readjust again. I'm sure he will, but it's like, I don't know, I just feel like it's like every time he goes away. It's like, he's like weird. It's probably his sleep too.

Like he's not. I'm sure he can't. Right. But then I'm like, oh, like if you drop, like let's say he's an eight-year-old boy. Let's say you drop Brooks off at like a random person's house and was like, oh, play with their son and you're going to sleep in the room with him. Right. Well, that literally just happened. Maddie came back from two days at a volleyball camp and she came back and she was kind of like a bit of a crank because she probably was up all night.

with her friends, didn't get enough sleep. We picked her up. It was Father's Day. And I was like, can you can you say happy Father's Day? Like she was exhausted. She was cranky, you know. So I think anytime sleep's disrupted and they're in a new environment, they just have to get back and readjust. I'm sure he's fine. I won't take him to a therapist. A dog psychic. I'm sure there are dog therapists or somewhere. I wouldn't be shocked. All right. Let's get into our emails. If you have a voicemail, you can leave us a voice. We have a voicemail at 646363626294. There's a voicemail at the end of this episode.

Or you can email us at oversharing at betches.com. If you want to subscribe to this podcast, you get two bonus episodes a month. We get a little more personal and you get all the episodes ad free and a day early. Or you can join one of Dr. Naomi's groups. How do they do that? Yeah, Naomi Bernstein.com. We have lots of challenges that we do all together as a group, strength and number. So yeah, Naomi Bernstein.com.

And if you are looking for couples therapy or individual therapy, I do have some openings there too. So come fill out a form Naomi Bernstein.com. I look forward to hearing from you. When you're a mid-sized business, you need every competitive advantage you can get. Like an AI solution that works for you, not against you. SAP Grow is built with AI embedded at its core, working across every system. And it's ready to go from day one so you can hit the ground running.

Bring it with SAP Grow. AI Cloud ERP for any size business. All right. Let's do some emails. I'll read our first overshare. Hi, Dr. Naomi and Jordana. I'm a big fan of your show and love your sister dynamic. Every episode offers something relatable that has helped me in my personal life.

Love that. Thank you both so much for what you do. I'm writing in to ask for help regarding a dilemma with my 19-year-old daughter. She is an amazing person, but I'm struggling to guide her towards independence, specifically when it comes to getting her driver's license. Currently, she relies on friends, her boyfriend, and me for rides. Since she takes classes online, she feels she has no immediate need to drive. I've explained that I can only drive her during my limited free time, but it hasn't changed her perspective. I want her to be independent and have the freedom to go where she wants without relying on others.

I have tried everything from bribes to ultimatums, but she only becomes angry and frustrated. She eventually admitted she is scared of getting into an accident, though I've pointed out that being a P.P. A.k.a. Passenger princess carries the same risks. It's also important to note that she has struggled with anxiety in the past, particularly during COVID and in high school and has sought help through therapy. How can I help my daughter embrace this step towards independence without pushing her away by causing her further distress? She means the world to me and I want her to have every opportunity to grow. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I don't want to drive my daughter away, Betch. What do you think?

Yeah, this is a great question. We talk a lot about babies, right? And the idea of sleep training and self-soothing and tolerating the uncomfortable sound of babies crying and this sort of thing. And this just goes to show that it's kind of never ending, this idea of tolerating. this idea of tolerating our kids' discomfort when it's in their best interest and hours, because she has to drive her around, to allow our kids to be uncomfortable in so many ways. When I hear this, I think the first thing that comes to my mind is like a systematic desensitization. And I get it.

Driving is scary. And I'm sure somewhere along the line she saw me, I don't know if she experienced an accident or even just seeing. you can see, I don't know if you've ever watched one of those movies where it's like two people are driving in a car and it's like they're just chatting and all of a sudden it's like in a movie. All of a sudden like, bam, accident. Like even that is kind of can be like a traumatic feeling. Yeah, for sure. And to me, it's like if she doesn't mind driving in a car, but she minds driving a car, it is probably more about like her fear of doing something wrong or being in control, not feeling confident in her driving ability. because like I would have that too.

Like I, again, like no fear flying in an airplane. No fear when Mike's driving. I do get a little anxious sometimes when I'm driving. You know, it's more on you. You're the one who has to like make sure you're not in the accident. So I don't think it's like a fear of car accidents in general. It's probably a fear of her doing something wrong to lead to the car accident. And that's why I think, and I don't know exactly what this might.

mom has tried, but what I think would be helpful is to see if she can just start, you know, when I say systematic desensitization, starting really small, like, you know, just let's go to an empty parking lot and let's just drive in a straight line and stop and then turn around and drive in a straight line and stop. And let's just start really, really small until you feel comfortable that you can do that. And then let's go to really like a not busy residential neighborhood. Residential neighborhood and just drive around your own neighborhood with no intersections, no stoplights, no, you know, and then gradually move up and up. And even if you have to, I mean, she's not doing it at all right now. So if you can just do that, even if it takes six months

to just drive around the neighborhood of just driving around. around the neighborhood and driving to one single place. Okay, we're just going to drive to this grocery store and back. And every time you're going to be the one that goes to drive to the grocery store. And that's going to be your job and you're just going to drive to this one place. And then you kind of get used to doing that. So that's what I would start doing versus making it like exactly wherever she wants to go is where she's going to drive.

If her boyfriend lives in a place where she has to get on a highway to start with that, I don't know what they're trying. but I would start. Well, she doesn't have a license. I wonder if she has a permit. Right. Yeah. That might be the hard part.

It's just getting her to agree to get the learner's permit, getting her to agree to just start like going to a parking lot and driving, you know, just getting behind the wheel. Yeah. And I think she needs to be a little more open to doing things that make her uncomfortable. I mean, in my mind, like the hard-ass way to go about this is to be like, I'm not driving you.

I'm going to drive you for the next two months, and then I'm not going to drive you anymore. So you have two months. I'm happy to practice with you. I'm happy to do whatever you want to help facilitate you driving. But in two months, I'm not going to drive you anywhere. So whatever happens after that is up to you. I mean, she's an adult. She's 19.

Technically, she's an adult. So it's like now it's up to her. She can ask her boyfriend to drive her more places. She can ask her friends to drive them more places, but eventually... Probably what's going to happen, but yeah. Which, I mean, then it's, whatever, then it's not your problem anymore. Yeah, I agree with that. If I were the therapist working with this family, we would sit and we would say, okay,

you got two weeks to get the learner's permit, and then I'll continue to drive you. And then you have a week and then we're going to make a plan to go to the parking lot. You kind of keep like pushing that. And as long as you keep to these benchmarks where then we're going to go to the parking lot for two weeks, and then we're going to drive in the neighborhood for two weeks. This is what you need to do in order for me to continue to drive you places. We're going to meet these benchmarks. So instead of just like, you've got to go get a license, we're going to do these little

benchmarks. And that way, I'm going to keep meeting you where you're at. I'm going to keep helping you as long as you keep helping yourself. But I do think she probably needs a little tough love here other than just, come on. Why don't you do it? Right. Yeah. And I do think that if she is the kind of person who's just like not doing it, maybe she's, her mom has done a little bit, has done a lot for her throughout her life, possibly. I don't want to generalize. But I would imagine there's like a little bit of a lack of independence there. I don't know what the relationship is like with the boyfriend, but there might be something there too. If he's just willing to drive her, I mean, by 19, you got to go places. If he's,

if he's just driving her everywhere she ever has to go, that's got to be draining on him at some point as well. It's a great way to teach independence. I think obviously everyone would rather other people do everything for them to an extent. Like I think some people, but yeah. Yeah. Like in your ideal world, you know, you don't have to lift a finger ever. Right.

I mean, there's a harshness of it of like, if I don't do this, no one's going to do it. And maybe she'd rather sit home than go get a license. Yeah. And then you know, if that's what it gets down to, then you know it's really bordering on like pathological. And maybe at that point you need medication or you need like psychiatric intervention or really getting back into, you know, more intensive psychotherapy around it. If she's really choosing to stay home right now, it's not affecting her that much because she's going where she needs to go. There's only one way to tell. Great question.

I like to see how when we talk, because we're going to talk in a little bit, you know, I think in our intention segment about, you know, allowing babies to self-sooth. So I really do like to see that this is not just about the four-month-old baby, that this thread continues throughout the parenting life cycle. So I like these questions. So thanks. Keep writing in. Hey, y'all.

It's Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. Ever order furniture online and wonder, What if? Like, what if it doesn't hold up? That sofa was four days old. You should have ordered from Wayfair. With Wayfair, there's no what if. Just style you love and quality you can trust. Visit Wayfair. Every style, every home. Yes. Okay. Let's do a betraces. Do you want to read this one? Hi, Dr. Naomi and Jordana. I recently found out that my family were the only family members not invited to my cousin's wedding. And I'm not sure if I should say something or not. For some context, my mom and her sibling,

have a very interesting dynamic and some don't speak to each other and it's kind of ambiguous as to why. My grandparents on that side are all gone so it is what it is. The cousins, however, have always gotten along. I've kept up with my cousins and I've seen them at family events and it's all been good. We live far away from each other so we really only see them at weddings now that our grandparents are gone. A few years ago, one of my cousins got married and my sister and I were invited, but my parents weren't, even though my mom assumed she would be. I think this was because of an issue my cousin had with my mom that I don't know the details to. It was explained to me that she wasn't invited because my cousin didn't want to have to worry about an encounter on her special day. I understood,

never pushed it, and I've always been pro. You can invite whoever you want to your wedding. For this wedding, my date and I made our own plans and traveled in for the wedding on our own. My sister had just had a baby and in order for her to go would need someone to watch the baby since it was a child-free wedding. Her solution to this was to bring my mom, who was not invited to the wedding, to stay in the hotel room with the baby so she could go. The week before the wedding, I got a call from my cousin worried that my mom was going to crash. I assured her that she was just there to watch the baby, but I had nothing to do with this plan. incidentally, I guess my mom had used her name to book the room on the wedding block at the hotel. My sister and I went and there was no drama at the wedding and I think all was fine.

I didn't agree with the way my sister and mom handled things. I felt caught in the middle, but I didn't know what to do. Fast forward to now and I have another cousin getting married. This cousin is the previous cousin's brother. When saved the dates were sent out, my mom messaged me asking if I got one. I hadn't. Apparently, my aunt, who lives closer to the couple, had received hers and was asking my mom about it. I knew this couple was going to have a smallish wedding, so I thought, maybe they're just inviting local family.

A week ago, my uncle, who lives nowhere close to this cousin, messaged me asking if he was going to see me there at the end of the month. This is when I googled their wedding website and through their RSVP link discovered that my family was the only one not invited. I was hurt because even though my mom had some issues with my cousin, I didn't think I would get roped into that, especially because I'm pretty sure my mom was in the wrong. So my question is, should I ask one of my cousins if I was just a casualty in not being invited because of the loophole my mom found for my other cousin's wedding or just let it go? Maybe there was another reason that I don't know about. I'm still on the team of invite whoever you want. So I understand there are probably reasons they didn't invite us. I would more just like to know if it was something I did.

I don't want to make it awkward for my cousins and put them in a tough spot if I don't have to. Thanks for any help or advice left out of the family. So nice to see other dysfunctional families. Yes. emails. The thing that strikes me, this isn't her question, but it just strikes me that like some families just don't talk about what. Right.

is happening. Like the fact that she has no idea why the cousin and her mom don't get along and she's just like, okay. I've learned this, you know, through Mike, some families just like don't really talk about everything and analyze it and discuss, you know, the different psychological reasons behind why everyone is doing whatever they're doing. Yeah, this is, that struck me. Yeah. I think that's an interesting part of this. It doesn't seem like they're a highly communicative family. Right. But in some ways, it's kind of nice. Everyone's not bringing each other into all the drama. It seems. like all the drama is like siloed. You two have an issue that's between the two of you, which is actually in some ways beautiful because it doesn't pull this like,

you have to take my side and you don't go to the wedding because I'm not invited to the wedding. Like love all of that, which is nice because I can't imagine like our mom not being invited to a wedding of her sibling and we were invited and her being like, okay, I'll watch the baby. Yeah. I can't imagine that at all. I mean, something that also struck me, here in the email was that she said that like they really only see each other at like these like weddings right the cousins get along I've kept up with my cousins and I've seen them at family events and it's been good so it seems like she says so we live far away from each other

so we really only see them at weddings now that our grandparents are gone so like it is an interesting thing with family because you probably wouldn't have this with friends right like you wouldn't just invite a friend that you don't really speak to or see to your wedding. But they're like your cousins. So you're like, oh, I'm going to invite like my family to the wedding. I'm going to invite my cousins. But it's like, that's not really that strong of a relationship if you're only seeing each other at these weddings. I'm assuming they don't talk regularly because she doesn't really mention that they have like a close relationship or like she feels really like she just they get along.

But as in like they have no. To me, that means like we have no beef with each other. So it's interesting to me. I could see like it feels weird to be like, it's my cousin's wedding and my cousin didn't invite me on principle of like it's my cousin's wedding. But it also doesn't really sound like they have a relationship. I think the advice would be if you value your relationship with this cousin and you feel a closeness to her or him in this case, I think on the next one. and you felt closeness to him, you would call him and say, hey, what's going on? Like, are we okay? Like, I noticed that, you know, so and so, all these people got invited and I wasn't invited. Like, are you upset with me? Did I do something? And my sister wasn't invited and obviously my mom wasn't

invited, but. My hunch is that they thought it was passive aggressive that your mom basically came as close to the wedding as she could without coming to the wedding, booked the room under her name, into the room block, almost felt like a veiled threat that she was going to come to the wedding without coming. Nothing happened, but like I think that they maybe didn't want to deal with that again. So this time just decided not to invite any of you guys. And you feel kind of like a casualty to the way that your mom handled not being. invited to the wedding, which was like to squeeze her way into the hotel room block, which I could see

if it was like, I don't know, but if the wedding was like at the hotel or something, that's really awkward where you're like at the breakfast buffet the next morning or something. Right. And then they probably are like, oh, if we invite her, the mom's going to be there again. Right. Taking care of the baby. Like, or why wouldn't she be? And I don't know. It's tough exactly to give like full advice, not knowing what your full relationship is with these cousins, if you only see them at their weddings, what the fight was about, what your mom did,

why they might be worried she's going to stir up drama. It sounds like her hunches that her mom was wrong, so I'm assuming her mom is like, perhaps somewhat immature. And so, I don't know. I think it's tough, but I think I agree with you. It's like I would evaluate my individual relationship

with this cousin. Is this the only time? Have you not spoken to him? other than at your last cousin's wedding. Right. Because like I would just think about like, is it worth it? Like are you trying to build a closer relationship with this person? Or is it like I feel weird not being invited to my first cousin's wedding?

Right. I do think there is kind of this societal taboo thing around like you're saying with a friend, if you haven't spoken to them in two years since the last family event or, you know. Friendship, the last mutual friend's wedding. Right. You probably wouldn't think twice about not inviting them. But with family, it's almost like, I don't, I don't know how to describe it, but it's almost like a bad look or something. Like if you have first cousins and they're not at your wedding, like it's almost kind of like, oh, why don't you invite your cousins or so. Yeah, it's like a big statement, like that your family isn't at your wedding. Even if you have almost no relationship with them, it feels like a bigger. deal for them not to be invited. Just culturally, I think you're everywhere, probably, like family wedding. Family is invited to weddings. It's just like what you do. But in this case, and I could see why she's upset because she's like, I didn't do anything. So why didn't I get

invited? So I see why she's upset. Her question is, do I say something? You kind of know the, I don't want to say we know everything, but like, we kind of know the. We kind of know the. answer. So like, do you need to hear it? Maybe. Maybe you want to advocate for yourself or maybe you feel like you need to say your truth about your mom. Here's another sticky point, right? Within the family, you might need to say, yeah, I don't love the way my mom handled that. So now you're like breaking away from your loyalty with your mom to be able to say, hey, I don't like the way she handled that. so I don't want to be lumped in with that. And I feel like you're lumping me in with that.

And that kind of hurts. Like I would be able to just come to this wedding. I'm not asking her to babysit. I don't have kids yet. Like I would just come celebrate you. And I'm not really a part of that. And I actually disagree with the way that was handled. So maybe you feel like you need to say your piece about that because you're just being

lumped into this whole thing. And that doesn't feel good. So if you feel like you need to say that, then maybe you call him up and you say that. If it's not worth it to you and you don't really care, then maybe you don't say anything. Yeah. And I think if you want to go to the wedding,

because it feels weird to not go to your cousin's wedding, I don't know if that's a good enough reason to like try to get an invited to the wedding. Personally. I do feel like it's kind of like, just because you happen to be of the same bloodline does not mean that like, we need to put on the show for the rest of it. If she likes her cousin a lot, she feels close to him or his sister. She feels like she wants to be closer.

I think that's another part of it. Even if they're not close, if she's like, I would like to like maintain have a, have a closer relationship. I think that's a reason to do it. If she's just kind of like, I want to go to this wedding. Yeah. My hunch is that she disagrees with the way the other. wedding was handled. And now she's being lumped into it. And that's what's bugging her.

That's my hunch. I could be wrong. Well, in that case, send a text. Yeah. Say you didn't agree with it. Say, but also say, again, unless you want to be close, say you understand that didn't invite anyone from this side of the family. This time, that's okay. Just want you to know that like, I didn't agree with how she did that last time. Tough situation, but I'm glad you're writing in. There's so many of these sticky family things that it brings up like loyalty things. And do you want to kind of throw your mom and your sister under the bus? But is it worth it?

Because you're not even that close. I get it. Well, this doesn't sound like a family that's really intent on loyalty because they invited the daughters and not the moms. And the mom seemed fine enough that she wasn't invited that she came and babysat, which I can't imagine happening in our family. Yes, for sure. That is definitely unique. I think. Rees knows a thing or two about great combinations.

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or just treating yourself, nothing else is Rees. All right, let's do some intentions. This one's a voicemont. Now, let's roll the tape. Hi, Jordana and Dr. Naomi. I'm calling in seeking an intention that has to do with my baby monitor. I'm staring at it right now as I speak to you guys.

And I have a two and a half year old daughter and a four-month-old daughter. And we have it set up so there are cameras in both of their little rooms. And I can toggle back and forth to my heart's delight, which I think is becoming kind of a problem for me. day my husband asked, oh, what did you do when the girls napped this afternoon? And that's when it hit me that I pretty much just sat and watched the baby monitor the entire time that they napped. I don't know. It just sucks me in and I'm just hyper aware of it and I want to be making sure that they're both asleep, especially with the four-month-old when, you know, sometimes I can hop in really fast to stick the binkie back in her mouth and help her connect sleep cycles or I can

help her sort of self-soothe in ways that my two and a half field doesn't need. But otherwise, I'm just checking this monitor, I think, or I know way too much. And I'm getting a little obsessed about it. And I carry it around with me. If I'm going to the garage to grab our laundry, I carry it with me back into the house. I carry it with me into the bathroom. I carry it with me to the kitchen when I'm washing my hands. I carry it all around with me in case I'm going to miss something, any little movement or moment with them.

And it's just getting to be too much. And I'm wondering if you could offer me an intention because I want to actually be able to take a break when both of the girls are napping at the same time, which in and of itself is a miracle, as I'm sure you are living right now too, Jordana. And I want to actually be able to feel like I have a break. And right now when I'm watching the monitor like a hawk the whole time that they're asleep, it doesn't really feel like a break. Thank you so much for your help.

I really appreciate it. All right. Yeah, I think this is pretty common. Do you have this? Yes and no, I think. I definitely like, yeah, when they're napping, at the same time, which is rare. I will have the monitor with me

in case one of them wakes up and I'll have it in my... But like what I do, which, I mean, I just kind of like put it down and I turn up the volume. I'm not like watching them sleep, but like I'm, if I can hear them crying in the monitor,

then I'll go in. Which I think is fine. Well, it sounds like this is more, like not just crying. This is like, she lost her binky. I see her like looking for it. Looking around for it.

Yeah. Almost I want to get ahead of what I hear is like, yeah, like there, she's about to wake up or she's her sleep cycles interrupted. I'm going to stop it before. Yeah. No, I don't do that. I totally get what she's saying. It's like hard to take a break even when they're napping because you're kind of like, this feeling of like any second they could need me.

They could need me. And what if I'm not there? And what if I'm, you know, enjoying a TV show? I could hear them screaming, but I can't hear if they're, like, in distress. Yeah. Or like, you know, or even just uncomfortable. Let's say they're, you know, or they're just like disturbed. But usually, like, what I, like, I don't think I have this issue.

It might be because of my Zoloft. Yeah, that helps. That it does help, I think, with, like, intrusive thoughts about that. And I've been on that since they were born. But I, my feeling is, and I don't put, like, that breathing. I don't put that breathing shit on them that detects of like the breathing rhythm is I was warned against that before they were born so I don't use that. And I just have the volume on loud and I'm kind of like if someone's very upset, I will hear them. Yes.

And so like I do carry the monitor with me like if I'm leaving the room, which I think is, I think that's fine. But I think it's more like you don't need to watch them. But yeah, what she's saying is like if she's like if you're going, it sounds like. like her laundry's in her basement. So if she's going downstairs to like change the laundry, she's bringing the monitor with her downstairs to change the laundry instead of being like, okay, I'm going to go downstairs to change the laundry. It's going to take me five minutes to change the laundry. And I can understand her train of thought of like, let's say I go down and I leave the monitor up here and the second I go down, they start crying. Then they're five minutes.

They have five minutes where they're crying and no one's there and they're going to be uncomfortable or they're going to be upset and they're never going to, you know, you know, they're just going to feel like I've abandoned them for those five minutes. Different strokes for different folks. And we can do again like a graduated like a, you know, systematic desensitization to this. But I do think, and this is the same thing of like sleep training, right? Like a you're doing a systematic desensitization for the baby and you're doing systematic desensitization for yourself. Learning to tolerate, although I don't think you need to listen to it, is the best way that

we've dealt with sleep training for the parents. You know, and I've said this in here before. It's like my baby slept through the night when I turned off the baby monitor. I didn't hear them crying, so therefore they kind of figured it out. Yeah. They were in the room down the hall. So like if they were crying, if there was enough distress that I was hearing them through the wall, I would get up.

But I wasn't hearing them through an electronic device right into my ear when they were going like, eh, that wasn't enough distress to wake me up that I had to go in and sue. So it really helped with sleep training. Like sleep training is very hard when you're having it. There are little sounds of being like electronically transmitted right directly into your ear on like top volume, which is I think what a lot of parents are doing, which makes it hard to allow them to self-soothe and it makes it very hard for you to tolerate. Because it's like literally amplifying the sound and putting it right into your head as you're walking around your house. I mean, I get, if you have a huge house and you're going to be spending a lot of time in a place where you literally won't hear them in like the basement or something.

Yeah. If I were going to go do like a workout, I would definitely be like have it on blast or something. Fine. Right. Yeah. Or if you're going to go do a 45 minute workout and a place where you wouldn't hear them if they were crying loudly, bring the monitor. But I do think it's good if you're going to go change the laundry for five months. minutes, it's actually probably good for them to have those five minutes if they happen to start crying in those five minutes, which the chances are that they probably won't. But if they did, and she knows it, which is why she's writing it. And it's good for them to have a mother that has a break because she's a better version of her. I think that part to me, I think was the part that helped me the most is like this realization that like a mother who can sleep better herself and a mother

who has a break when her children don't need anything from her, which they don't, shows up as a more well-rested, more excited, happier person to be around, which is also, which is way better for them in the long run. Yeah. So I do think what she's asking for, what she knows that she needs is permission to, I think what you're doing sounds great. Leave the monitor in a central location with the volume turned all the way up. so that if they're crying, you'll hear it.

But if you want to go to the bathroom, go to the bathroom and leave the monitor where it is. And if they're crying for five minutes, you know, and here's the other thing that I used to like to do that I recommend to parents, which is before you put them down, you can kind of do the triple check, you know, like, okay, the room temperature, I checked the room temperature, I check the diaper, I check that they're fed, like all the things so that you You know, before you leave the room, the room is whatever it is, 72 degrees, the diaper is dry, they just had their food, there's no blankets in the crib, everything's safe and sound so that

if you leave the room and they are crying for five minutes, what possibly is it going to be? They're uncomfortable. They're a little, they want you. Okay, you'll be there when you're finished going to the bathroom. You'll be there when you're finished changing the laundry. And it's actually probably good for them if they lost their binky or whatever it is that they're crying about that they can see, okay, either they'll learn to start to feel around at some point and find their binky and pop it back in. Oh, my God, that's amazing. They wouldn't have learned to do that if you keep coming back in and putting it back in for them. That's a beautiful skill that they just learned to do because you went to the bathroom and didn't bring the monitor.

Or you could go in at every Twitch and then at 19 years old, you can be driving them around everywhere because they don't want to get their license. Yes. Yes. One thing will lead to the axed, right? Yes. But I validate it, right? It is very hard, especially at four months, it's very hard to see them uncomfortable.

I think the hardest part about this is that when they, we all know that tired babies are cranky babies. So you really want them to sleep. And if they sleep better at their nap, they sleep better at night. So it serves them and it serves you also. So this whole idea of like getting them to get through the nap well, if you get them to sleep, like if you get them through that hump where they're about to wake up and you think they're about to wake up and you pop that binkie in before they wake up, you're like, okay, I save the nap. And now you save the nap and now they get a good nap and then they're back on the sleep cycle and then they can sleep well. And I get the whole reasoning behind it.

But I think in the long run, it's going to be better that you can, you know, let them learn really to self-soothe. But I think part of it is just recognizing that urge, again, through the whole parenting life cycle, recognizing that urge, recognizing that urge to jump in and self-soothe when it's probably best to let them handle it. So my intention is just about what to do when you notice that urge of you want to grab the monitor and take it in the bathroom with you. Or you want to grab that monitor and take it down into the laundry room with you. So my intention is notice the urge. Breathe into it like almost find it in your body. So notice the urge. Breathe into it.

Thank it. This is, this belongs. I care about my baby. I'm a good mom. This is my maternal instincts coming here. There's nothing wrong with me. I'm not an anxious mess or anything like that. There's nothing wrong.

This belongs. So notice the urge. Breathe into it. Thank it. And then distract away from it. So then go, you know, do something fun. Read a book, you know, go to the bathroom. Go do your, you know, whatever you're going to do.

Something fun for yourself. Take a little nap. Yeah, take a nap, do a meditation. Yes, whatever you're going to do. So it's normal. Notice it. Breathe into it. Thank it.

You're a good person. You're a good mom. This is all here. There are moments when you're going to need this, right? Like at some point, something bad is going to be happening or your baby's going to be crawling towards an electric socket with a fork. Great. That's when you need this.

Not now. All right. Let's do some triggers. I'll read our first one. Dear Jordana and Dr. DeNan, Dr. Naomi, huge fan of the pod and love you both. Thank you for all you do. I have a triggered situation. I'd like your take on one of my best friends, let's call her Kelly, moved in with her

long-term boyfriend last month. I've gotten to know her boyfriend Matt over the years and like him a lot. Kelly and I have known each other since college and been single and spent years listening to each other bitch and moan about men, dating, situationships, bad texts, confusing behavior, etc. The issue is that now every time I call Kelly, she puts me on speakerphone. without telling me. I usually don't realize this until Matt suddenly chimes in from the kitchen with an opinion or a laugh, and she turns to him mid-conversation and asks, what do you think, Matt? And I'm sorry,

but I did not ask Matt for his opinion. I also did not consent to Matt hearing my sex story from last night in graphic detail while he unloads the dishwasher. What's bothering me at most is that I feel like it changes Kelly's responses too. Historically, she was much more of a listener and empathizer and our conversations had very girls complaining about men together energy. Now she seems to have become Esther Perel overnight and starts giving me thoughtful advice about attachment dynamics. What I want from a situation ship, whether this relationship is serving me, etc.

And to be clear, the advice itself is not bad, but sometimes I'm not calling for an analysis of my emotional patterns. Sometimes I simply want my friend to say, oh, boys suck and that would annoy me too. I feel like if Matt wasn't lurking over her shoulder, that's how she'd respond. I've always told my friends, I completely understand that serious couples discuss each other's lives and friends' lives privately afterwards and they're free to share my business with their partners. That doesn't bother me. What bothers me is feeling like their live reactions and advice are being filtered through the presence of their partner in real time without me knowing it. It makes me tell stories differently and feel more guarded because suddenly I'm no longer talking to my friend. I'm seemingly asking a successful couple for help with my single girl problems. So my questions are one. How triggered am I allowed to be when Matt unexpectedly chimes in from the kitchen.

Two, is this worth discussing with Kelly directly or do I simply need to start every phone call with am I on speakerphone? Thanks, triggered by couples speakerphone culture. Yeah, great question. Definitely triggering. Valid. Yeah. This is really irritating.

For sure. I mean, I think this should be a thing. And I do this all the time. I'm like, hi, you're on speaker. Yes. That's, I think, common courtesy. especially if someone starts telling you a story. Yes.

I do this. I mean, I have this problem with my like old enough to understand children. Because people, I will pick up the phone and I'm in the car with my kids. And I will often be like, hi, you're on speaker.

I'm in the car with the kids. Like that is often the way that I pick up the phone these days. And if someone chooses to keep going, then great. They don't mind. Right. Yeah, everyone should be like, it's like basically your phone's being tapped. It's when you're on to be your phone.

Like, it should be like a legal requirement or something. Yes. I think that part is triggering. I think his opinions when she didn't ask for them are triggering because it probably makes her feel like this like sad single girl that they're trying to like help out. Yeah. It feels very like holier than now or like, you know, I know what this. And it sounds like she's just, she's just what she wants from the situation is just

validation. She doesn't want advice. I'm assuming. It's kind of what she's saying. Totally. And I think if she wanted advice, she would ask for it. So I think it's definitely worth a conversation, not on speakerphone. You could even do it via text, I think.

Or you could call her and be like, hey, are you alone? I just wanted to talk to you about something that's kind of been bothering me lately. Yeah, I think that's totally reasonable. I don't think there's any way. I mean, there is a way. But I think she's just probably aloof. She might think, oh, she would want like a male. perspective on this or she probably thinks you like it. She probably, it's probably like fun for her

in some way to definitely. She's probably like, oh, like we can help out. Like here's a fun. And I don't think single people really don't like being like used for their like single life stories, single gal like like like drama. And I think there's a piece of this too. Just to say I'm totally triggering. I'm going to I got you. We're going to give you a good. score on this. Don't worry. Don't worry. But I think that she wants you to feel close to her partner.

So she's kind of like, we're all going to be friends. And that's a way for you to feel close to him and him to feel close to you is if we're all like up in it together. And that's not really your priority is feeling this like sense of intimacy with her partner. That's like between the two of them that she wants him to be close to her friends. that's like fine for you if it happens, fine for you if it doesn't, but that's not a priority for you. In fact, it's like detracting for what's going on for you. So I think she's just aloof.

So I do think if you have this conversation, I really hope that you'll get nothing less than, oh my God, yeah, you're right. I could see how you feel that way. I won't do that anymore. And I think she could start the conversation, a little compliment sandwich. I love Matt because she does. She said she like really likes him. I and I also have no issue with you telling him like stories I've told you or like what's going on with my dating life. Like Dave, if I'm dating anyone, I don't need you to like keep secrets from him. But I feel like it's kind of lacking like when you tell him it feels like not an intimate conversation with my friend. And also like sometimes you give advice and sometimes I don't really want advice. I just kind of want a vent. But I'll let you know if I do want his advice or your advice. And sometimes I might. And sometimes maybe you would want. like a male perspective on it. The other part of this that I do think is interesting to discuss is when you have two best friends or like a really tight friendship and then someone gets in a relationship, right? And now your time after work where you're like hanging out eating dinner where you used

to just like chat on the phone now they're sharing space with this other person. So now your options are, I'm hanging out with Matt. Do I pick up the phone and now kind of go in the other room and talk to my best friend? And now Matt's cleaning dishes and we're not spending time together. Or do I just say, okay, I'm not going to answer this call right now because I'm hanging out with Matt. So I think what ends up happening is I see why this can happen because she's, kind of like, oh, I want to just like hang out with everybody. Like I want to take this call from my best friend and I want to hang out with Matt so I don't have to pick because otherwise she

kind of has to be like, okay, Matt, I know we were hanging out. Now I'm going to go in the bedroom and talk to my friend and now you're just kind of cleaning dishes and doing your own thing. And we're no longer hanging out right now. So another option that this listener might be okay with is like, I don't need you to even like leave the room to talk to me. Like it doesn't need you. to be private, it just doesn't need to be on speaker and he doesn't need to be like in the conversation. It doesn't necessarily need to be like privately in another room. Like he can't hear it, but he doesn't need to be like all up in it. Active participant. Yes. Yeah. So you might say that too. Like I don't need this to be private. Like we need to leave the room to have this

conversation either because then she might feel like, well, if Matt and I are like hanging out for the night, now I can't even take your call, which I think sometimes is what happens, where now the friendship starts to feel like a little distant because now she's not going to pick up the phone because they've just had dinner and they're like cleaning up from dinner and maybe they're chit-chatting. And now she feels like she has to pick between her friend and Matt. And now I do think that tends to happen sometimes, which is another reason why I think this dynamic happens because she's like, okay, now I don't have to decide between my best friend and my boyfriend. I'd give it a six and a half. It's a tough spot. Yeah, I definitely. I agree with that, especially because

even if she's being told, like, if she was like, you're on speaker, that's still kind of triggering because she's like, I don't, I didn't sign up to talk to Matt about this. But the fact that she's like not even being told half the time and then he's just chiming in. It's like, whoa. Yeah. He was just listening to that. Right. That's not like a conversation. would say to anyone something you're telling your like best friend. Yeah, about sexual experience that you had the night before. Yeah, that's rude. Maybe seven.

We'll give it a seven. I think it sounds like the conversation could be easily rectified though. It could be easily rectified with a conversation rather. And look, it might be an issue. Again, I think this is there, you might also then have to tolerate that there might be moments where she's not as available, which is fun. I'm sure she'd rather that. Let's do one more.

This is a short one, short and sweet. This is the shortest triggered, but it's a fun one. There are four bathrooms in this house, and my husband insists on taking dumps in the one that's two feet away from where I work from home. How triggered can I be? Love you both, a betch that's over this shit. I think that's a little triggering. I would be, is it also very close to where he works from home?

Yeah. I mean, there must be a reason why he's picking that bathroom. I don't think he's doing it just to piss you off. I would hope not. But yeah, I've been trying to think because I do think I've actually thought, I think this is one of those things no one really talks about. But I've thought about this too. And like you're working from home with your partner.

Let's say you're on the same floor. The other bathroom is like upstairs. Right. Are you like going out of your way on the chance that they come in right after there? Or should you just use the bathroom that's closest to you? Yeah. I'm going to pick the camp of like, it's a bathroom. He can use it.

I think you can kindly request a courtesy flush, which works wonders. What? Double flush? As soon as it hits the bowl, flush it down and it should solve a lot of the problems. I never even see that. Yeah. Courtesy flush. As soon as don't let it linger.

As soon as it drops in, flush it down. And then if you want to take your time to see. if there's a second, you know, wave. I've never heard of that. You can do that. Is that weird? I've never heard of that. That's very smart. Wow. That might be the biggest thing I've learned from this podcast. Yeah. I would say request a courtesy flush or be like, hey, you're going number two. Could you use the upstairs bathroom? Yeah, I guess I guess you can. It's funny because, you know,

in I've talked about how in our groups, we do a lot of work on like tolerating discomfort. And we, you know, have done some things on like the low hanging fruit, like just little discomforts like, you know, my my ice coffees. There's no ice. The ice is melted or I'm hot or, you know, there's sweat dripping down my back and just learning how to first tolerate small discomforts. This is one of them, right? So if we can learn how to tolerate, if we're talking about the discomforts, you know, the discomforts, of the life cycle from small discomforts like the odor of of feces to like death and grief and loss you would put this in the in the range of small discomforts I agree but it also does seem like one

that's pretty like easily remedied like there's like a very I can understand I feel like it's it's nice to practice comfort with discomfort when like there's not much you can do about it. But this seems like she could just ask like, could she use the upstairs bathroom? I prefer that. Well, the practicing of discomfort is kind of like the idea is that you practice when you, maybe there is something you could do about it, but you're choosing to practice it. Like almost I have a pet peeve where like, and even Jeff and I get it. into this because we'll be like sitting and waiting to pick up one of the kids and they're not

coming out for 10 minutes and he'll like sit with the engine on with the air conditioner on. I'm not talking if it's 100 degrees. Fine. Put the air conditioner on. But like it's like a little toasty and he'll like run the car and sit with the air conditioner on instead of turning the car off and open the windows. And like you're a little hot. Like just deal with it.

You're a little hot. turn the car off, open the windows, and like, okay, maybe there's like a bead of sweat that appears on your brow. Just deal with it. It's a small discomfort. You can handle it. Yes, could you turn the car on and could you turn on the air conditioning and be like optimally comfortable? Sure. But could you also not waste gas and like burn fossil fuels into the atmosphere?

Yeah, you could also do that. could your husband not have to take the extra like five minutes like think about it walk up the stairs use the other bathroom walk yeah i mean there's all these little right he could be oncoming he should be more uncomfortable i just think it's well like his comfort at the expense of hers but i see what you're saying i totally i do agree the general idea of i think just i think the bigger picture of it is i'm uncomfortable and my most people very first thought is I'm uncomfortable, what do I do about it? Who do I tell to change?

How do I change it? How do I change my environment to make it better? Instead of what I work on with patients in my groups is I'm uncomfortable, my first thought being like, I can handle that. I'm uncomfortable. I can handle that instead of I'm uncomfortable, how do I change it? How do I fix it? What do I do?

What do I need to change to make it better? I think if we can just get in the habit of that a little bit more, then we can work our way up the ladder towards like acceptance of this is my partner. He's imperfect. She's imperfect. This is my mother-in-law. This is my child that I have that I thought was going to be different than the child that I dreamt to have. Or this is the house or this is the lifestyle or this is the, you know, we can work. our way up the ladder towards I'm uncomfortable. My house is smaller than I thought it would be,

you know, my neighborhood isn't what I wanted. We work our way up the ladder starting from I don't prefer the smell of shit when I'm working to, you know, I can't fit all my clothes in this closet. He's doing you a huge favor. Yes. He is helping train you for the adversities of life. Yeah, I'm sure Jeff feels the same way. So step one, then you move, then you move to the wood. It's a hop, skip, and a jump from moving to the woods. Yes. So unfortunately, I'm going to give it a two.

I'll do it a three and a half. I could, I would be like, I would have a little, little talk. And you could throw in a courtesy flush. Just tell them. As soon as it comes out, flush it down. I think that will solve a lot of the problems. I'm going to try that. I've never heard of that before.

All right. That's all we've got for you. If you take one thing away, it's the courtesy flush from this episode. All right. That's our time. Great work today. Betches.