Oversharing - Vengeance Is A Lazy Form Of Grief

Episode Date: September 24, 2024

Today on Oversharing, Jordana catches Dr. Naomi up on a traumatic event that happened in her building, and how to let go of vengeful feelings. Our Overshare comes from a Betch who feels guilty over not spending enough quality time with her mother before she passed away. Today’s Betchicist goes out to a listener who wants to avoid talking about money with her family. Dr. Naomi writes an intention for shrugging off external judgement about a bartending job. And we’re feeling triggered by getting ignored in the family group chat and husbands who eat all the candy before we get a chance to have any. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A quick note before we get into the episode, Oversharing is a podcast for entertainment purposes only. It is not a medical podcast and does not constitute medical or psychological advice. Always seek the advice of your physician or mental health professional. Hello and welcome back to Oversharing. I'm Jordana Abraham. And I'm Dr. Naomi Bernstein. We've got a great episode this week.

We've got some heavy stuff, some light stuff. It's a good mix. Our oversharing email is about someone who feels guilty about, their relationship with her mother in her final days before she passed. And then we're talking about a lot of stuff with finances. We're talking about how invasive is it to ask someone a question about things like their mortgage rate or other personal finance information? A listener is a little uncomfortable with the way her in-laws treat money.

We have a question coming up about how to not feel awkward if you or your significant other don't have as cool of a job to talk about as your friends do, how to kind of come to terms with that. I like that one. And then we have some triggers about asking for donations in a family group chat and getting ghosted by all your aunts, uncles and cousins, and then a husband and wife who are fighting over candy. So we're getting in the pre-Hallowing spirit, right? All right. How's it going? I've had an eventful week, I guess, a weird, weird week. I hesitate to like bring this topic up because I feel like I'm always complaining about something or someone or life would be so boring. If we were all just at peace as we try to be all

the time, it would be boring. That's why people kind of crave not being at peace. Being at peace is a little boring, especially for our listeners. Like, I want to be at peace, but you not being at peace is somewhat entertaining. So exciting for you. I mean, that's why we watch Real house right. So my building is like the built the apartment building that I'm living in, which I'm only supposed to be living in until like the end of October. They are, I guess they're losing a lot of money and they're trying to sell the building, whoever the owners or the management company are. And so because of that, they keep cutting random costs and like not telling anyone. Okay. For example. For example,

security. Oh. Okay. So they no longer have a security person. Overnight or not at all ever. At all. It used to, they had it, first they had it like all the time. And then it was like nothing from eight to two. And then it was like nothing until four.

And then they just got rid of it and didn't even tell anyone. And when you signed your lease, it was with the idea that there was a security guard. Yes. Right. Exactly. but it didn't say it in the actual lease, I guess, but that was what I was told. And so because there's no security,

also the packages are like everywhere. There's no one to like take them in. So like someone from the built, like they're like outside, you know what I mean? And this isn't like the best area. Right. Honestly.

Right. And additionally, I had there was this crazy-ish thing with last Wednesday. Last week I was working from home and I heard like a screaming outside of my door in my hallway. and this guy was like scream, I heard screaming and he was like on the phone with the, I went out there and he was like on the phone with the cops and he was like there was a woman on the floor who I guess had like a heart attack

or a stroke in the middle of the hallway. And he was like trying to give her CPR on the phone. Oh my gosh. Which was like very, I mean obviously horrible for her and like very traumatic to watch. And there's no one in this building. Right. So it even it adds like even. an extra layer to. And then they came and they were like, she wasn't breathing. They were like doing

the like a lecture shop. Oh my gosh. Whatever. And there's no, no one sends an email about anything. No one sends an email about the security. I just think it's like totally insane. Yes. And, you know, I had, I've written like angry emails to them before and I like made bike right, this one. And they were basically like, doesn't say there's security in your lease. And maybe it'll come back and maybe it won't. And like, you're, like, you're. leaving anyway. Right. Oh my gosh. And it's just, it was so frustrating and so annoying because there's really nothing you can do. Like, what are we going to do? And it's another one of the, again, again, I'm like, am I finding myself in these scenarios? Because I've been on different rant

about the vivid seats or whatever or like, I think there's always a question almost when you're like speaking to someone in, you know, when there's a exchange of goods for services or something like that. And I think to not question it is crazy and delusional and entitled. And I am always questioning, like, am I being unreasonable or is this like not right? Right. You know what I mean? Do you have that in your head where you're like, am I, am I being an asshole or like should I, is it okay to expect more from these people or these companies or these buildings? And my first thought is always like, what am I going to do to get back. It's not like my

permanent thought. Like I go, I like do usually kind of like, I continue on with my day. It's not like overtaking my life. But I do. That is one of my initial thoughts. And it's definitely not mics.

Right. So I see it as a, as a difference and it makes me feel worse about it. Because I'm like, I, this isn't, everyone doesn't have this reaction. And I wondered,

like, obviously we come from a line of very vindictive women. Yes. It runs. It definitely runs in the family, but you don't really seem to have it. I don't know of that. I definitely inherited that. I don't know if the dominant gene.

The vindictive gene. Yeah. Or if, I don't know, maybe it's like both of my parents, just one of yours. Who knows? But I'm trying to examine this, this urge in me to like get justice or get revenge or or like, I don't know, even the score. or like not be taken advantage of. And I'm wondering like where you put like vindictiveness or vengeance or how do you,

how do you feel like what's the best way to not go there? Yeah. Or is it okay to go there. I don't know. Like I'm fine because like they deserve some sort of like, you know, a consequence. So for the listeners entertainment, what are the things that you're like, what has crossed your mind of how to get back at them? I don't know.

Like I'm like, I'm not going to pay the full rent. Or like, I'm going to try to contact the, like, owner of the building and tell them about all these employees that are being very, like, rude and not helpful and endangering people. I mean, there was like a literal emergency. That's crazy. There was no one there to deal with it. That just happened right after they got rid of the doorman or whatever. That's crazy.

So. And when they replied and I said this in the email, I had Mike say this thing in the email, but there was no one here. He would, and he said they, she was taken to the hospital. hopefully she's okay. They replied with, she died, but like,

by the way, by the way. Oh. Like almost to shame us for bringing that up. Oh, my gosh. Oh,

that's awful. I'm so sorry. And that's how they're like telling you. It's crazy. So I think that also is fueling your like vengeance need. You know,

the fact that they're so callous and that they don't seem to care and they're like, you're leaving anyway. Sounds like who. these people are that you're dealing with are extremely stressed out and like being so just like they're just barely keeping their heads above water. Right. And maybe are going to be out of a job soon because of this financial crisis. Right. So like you being slightly uncomfortable is not, they don't care because

they're like about to lose their building and their job and like somebody did the calculations wrong or something went wrong. They built this building. They thought they were going to make money on it. Now they're like panicking, firing the whatever. security was there. I'm just saying there's a whole other experience on the other side of this of somebody who's extremely stressed out and you're like the collateral damage of that. Damage. Yeah.

Right. Which sucks for them. And mostly that woman, oh my gosh, I can't believe she died. That's awful. That's so traumatic and terrible. And for the guy who was like trying to help her. I know. He was like, I felt so bad for him. He was like, I guess he discovered her and was like,

like really trying everything he could possibly do to like save her. Oh, I don't know. That's awful. And you opened your door and you were like watching. So I heard this, I heard this outside the, like my door. And so I, you know, I went out there to see what was happening. And there was like two guys, I guess, who had happened to meet in the hallway and see this woman on the floor of the hallway. No one knew how long she was there and that she like wasn't breathing.

And it was, yeah, it was crazy. Then the, you know what I mean? Like I went downstairs to make sure they could, the EMTs could even get in the building because there's no one there at the front door. To open the door. Yeah, I mean, there's not much else I could do besides like try to get the elevator ready for them when they got there. And like hold the door open. Yeah.

Yeah. So honestly, my thought is there's a quote, revenge is a lazy form of grief. Interesting. So I think given the fact, if it was just your packages and if it was just like, I'm not getting what I signed up for, like I'm getting the short end of the stick or I'm getting basically like I didn't get the goods and services that I was promised. I think you'd be annoyed. But I think there's a little bit of kind of watching this woman sort of die being involved in it, finding out after the fact that she actually did die. And on top of that, yes, your packages and you didn't get what you thought you were signing up for.

But I think there's like this really uncomfortable feeling of all of it. Probably my hunch is that the idea that like it wasn't just a story that you heard. Like you saw the whole thing. Like you were there. You were involved in it. I think if it was more just like, oh, we signed up with a doorman. Now there's no doorman. and that's annoying,

like I'm, you know, kind of getting stolen from in some regard. I think you might be able to be like, all right, it's a month left, like whatever. But I think the fact that there was this sort of traumatic experience that you are tying to that. Yes, and no acknowledgement of it. Even a response of like, I'm sorry, the building is like any sort of like

concession. And maybe people are afraid to say that because it feels like it allows them to be wrong or something? If you were going to sue them, you could be like, well, he said he was sorry and it was unforeseen. Right. Yeah.

Which is annoying. Yeah, so I think that's part of it. And I think a lot of revenge kind of comes from a lot of what we talk about, whereas there's something happening that you're, that's making you uncomfortable, whether it really is the grief over, I mean, I'm very traumatic to watch this woman lying on the floor

and you're kind of feeling like you're part of it, but obviously whatever happened wasn't a, Not able to really do anything. Right. So that's traumatic. But even if it was just like my packages and I signed up for something that I didn't receive, that makes you really uncomfortable. But again, it's this type of thing, like you said in the beginning, there's nothing I can do about it.

So what then your body and your mind don't tolerate that well. I'm uncomfortable. There's nothing I can do about it. That's not how we live. We don't live in a world of like mostly I'm uncomfortable. There's nothing. I can do about it. I just have to like drop my shoulders, breathe, cry, maybe whatever is happening.

We live in a world of like, well, what can I do about it? I can worry about it. I can write an email. I can get it. I can fantasize about revenge. That's like something that you are doing about it when there's really nothing. Your fantasy for revenge, it's like, you know, the biggest revenge is like, you know, romantic revenge. Like someone cheats and then you're like, oh, how?

am I going to, you know, because right, you're going to write cheater all over his holes or something, right, or tell everyone. Yeah, I don't know. And that probably doesn't even make people feel better. I would imagine. Right. Maybe it does. It just makes you feel like our minds are designed to solve problems. There's a problem. Right. I feel rejected by my boyfriend who cheated on me or I feel taken advantage of by this management company or I feel. grief over watching this woman die in front of me. Am I going to sit for an hour and cry about it? I don't think you're going to do that, knowing you. I probably wouldn't either, like, sit and cry over a woman that I never knew in the middle of a Wednesday when I have worked to do. But I can, like, shoot out an email that maybe feels like a little bit more like I'm

doing something rather than, like, sitting in my feelings. So I do think it's a great topic and it's a perfect example. example of like if you're feeling feelings of revenge, it's probably because you're feeling something else that you are not letting yourself feel. Like maybe somehow you were duped or you should have known or you feel stupid that you sign this person or that you're whatever. Like I honestly, I don't think it's about that you think your packages are going to get stolen. Maybe it is. Right. I don't. I mean, maybe a little bit. It would be nice to have someone. like holding someone there.

Yeah. Look, I get that, but I don't think, I think it's bigger than that for this. It wouldn't be this, right. It wouldn't be sitting with me this long, I think, if it, if it wasn't. But no, that's a very good,

I like that quote about, it's what form of grief? Revenge is a lazy form of grief. Lazy form of grief. Yeah. No, I think that's kind of true because it feels more empowering, even though it's less empowering.

But I mean, there's the concept, of karma, which is almost like, to me is almost like revenge, but you're not doing it. Right. Like the universe is going to take care of it for me. Right. Right. I'm more of a do-it-yourself, gal. But.

Yeah, I could see that because it feels like you, it's very hard. That's the hardest thing. That's what we're doing all the time is sitting in the discomfort of things that we have no control over. And that's like 95% of our life. Because like I always say, we're flying through the universe on a rock, like the size of a speck of dust in this scheme of things. So we don't have control over most of this.

But like we think we do and we want to. And so whenever we're uncomfortable, the first thing we're going to do is go to our mind to give us some whatever solution it can come up with the fastest. And for this one, it's like, okay, I'm going to. going to not pay my full rent or I'm going to write an email. I'm going to get this guy in trouble or whatever. And look, maybe you can. What would you do? What would Dr. Naomi do? What would Dr. Naomi do? W.W. Dan. I would probably do nothing. I would probably do nothing. Maybe I'd write an email. It's like what Mike wrote and just express my displeasure and like

that it's not fair or right because we signed on. I'm sure they, It wasn't in writing, but I'm sure verbally they were like, hi, here's Joe, he's the doorman. Yeah. No, they, yeah, they did. So I get that you were offered something that you're not receiving, but I think if you're leaving in a month, you know, you're going to get a package, keep an eye out for it. Make sure that you, you know, try to get down there and get it ASAP and just, I don't think. And maybe you could just feel bad. Because honestly, whoever's like, this sounds like a shit show on the other side.

Like whoever's dealing with this. Right. It's clearly not a pleasant experience for them. I'm sure I'm not the only person writing you know. I would imagine. I mean, I cannot believe that woman died. That's crazy. That's awful.

Yeah. And just the way they said it, I don't know. The whole thing was like, felt quite true. Yeah. I don't blame you. I don't think you're wrong or bad. I think if you could just step back and know. notice, oh, look what Jordana's mind is doing.

She's trying to control this situation. That's like basically out of your control. Something you're going to do. Right. And I would like to work on that aspect of my personality, especially like before I have children, because I do think like you kind of learn how to deal with conflict from your parents. Yes. Right.

And I would imagine like that's how I learned. Totally. It would be nice to like figure out how to, you know, change that initial. or even if it, I guess it's okay if that's your initial thought. Your initial thought is kind of your initial thought. It's more like what you do after that. Yes, totally. It's very hard.

I mean, I think over time, it'll change by itself slowly, but yes, the initial thought is going to happen. And then if you can just notice it and be like, oh, right, that's my mind trying to control the situation that I have no control over. Maybe I really am sad about watching this woman die or whatever. Maybe I could just sit and feel that and like honor her for a moment and just like really let this be what it really is. But I agree with kids because kids, especially as they get older, there's like that protective instinct for your kids on top of what's already there. So like if somebody.

Right. I exacerbates it. Somebody wrongs your kid. It's almost even the urge for revenge is even more than your someone wronging you. So and that half. I remember even as early as like. probably four. I remember Lila came home and she was like,

these girls said that if I don't wear a dress, I can't play at the dollhouse. And I was like, what? Where? I'll kill them. So it'll happen. So it is good to be aware of that and just check yourself because, yeah,

it could be never ending. If you let your mind run the show, like you'll forever be in battles. because your mind's like always going to battle. Right. And then you kind of lose twice because you're quote unquote harmed by whatever the situation is. And then you sort of,

you're continuing to stay in it. Yes. So that's only really hurting you. The other person isn't there to see you like freaking out. Right. Yes. Or most of the time. Or they respond back with like, she died by the way.

Like that. Okay. Then you get that. Right. Yeah. So I'm glad that you're being introspective. That's all you can really do. And I don't think it's wasted.

The other piece of all this is like the waste of energy. It's really just wasted energy to be fighting. You know, we, it's, I always think about this. You know, they say, I forget what the number is, but like we only use like 2% of our brain or something. You've heard that quote. Like I think it was 10. Yeah.

We only use 10% of our brain capacity. I don't know if that's true, but sure. But I'm sure there is some truth to that in the sense of like Albert Einstein had the same like exact hardware that you and I have. Right. Like somehow he managed to use it differently. And one concept is like we are burning so much mental energy on extraneous stuff, like the pecune details of life of like whether or not I'm going to get a pro rated, you know,

$40 back because there was no doorman for the month of October. You know, like I'm not, you know, I love you. I get it. But like, no, it's fair. Yeah. Well, that's why it's not even about money. Right. It's more about like.

Yes. There should be some. Yes. Fairness. Right. Right. Justice. Yes.

So my point is like, and we all. waste we just right now all the listeners that are out there maybe you're listening to us maybe you're zoning out a little bit but whatever you're probably off in some world thinking about some like minutia of your life where you could be taking all that mental energy and focusing it on whatever it is that you're doing you're the this spreadsheet that you're doing for work or the painting that you're creating for your you know whatever like there's all this energy that we waste on all these little details, like the craving for revenge,

that's just like wasted energy and trying to control what we can't control. So the other thought is like, if you take all that energy that you spend on these other things and you put it into something of whatever it is that you're doing in the moment, you'll be so much more focused

and successful and peaceful and joyful and all the things that we're seeking. So like you said, you lose, lose. You lose because you got kind of screwed, and then you lose again because you're like spinning your wheels on something. You're paying for it over and over and over again. Right. In your mind. All right.

Well, this was good reminder to let things go. Yeah, but that's traumatic. I'm sorry that you went through that, especially the guy in the hallway. Like, I can, I'm sure that the sound of that, like, man's voice probably like is in your mind. Yeah. Yeah. It's hard. I mean, it was a, it was very intense.

And then it was just like, everyone was gone. You're just supposed to go. Right. No explanation until that rude email at the end of the day. Yeah, awful. I'm going to let it. Let it go. The sound of my voice.

Yes. At least for the duration of this recording, I will let it go. Okay. Let's do it. Let's do some emails. Let's deal with your problems because I can be a little bit more objective. Yes, agree. And here, if you guys want to leave,

us a voicemail. You can leave us a voicemail at 646363-6294. Or you can email us at oversharing at fetches.com. Okay, I'll read the first email. Jordana and Dr. Naomi love the podcast, and I love that you guys give such great advice while still keep being heavy topics lighthearted and fun. My mom died a couple years ago and overall I'm at peace with it, but sometimes I'll get an immense amount of guilt for the lack of effort I gave with her before she died. A bit of background is that my mom was an alcoholic, and a couple of years before she died, she'd hit rock bottom.

My dad was unfaithful and wanted a divorce, and then my mom also let go from her 20-year career due to drinking at work. So that makes this more complicated. We had been really close in high school and beginning of college, but I started creating some distance

when the drinking got worse, but still on good terms. She did end up getting sober in her last years of life, though, yay. But by then, her organs were shutting down and she was on transplant lists. So she started to get pretty sick, but also for a while I confused the sickness with still drinking. Ugh.

Well, I just get in a spiral sometimes when I hear lyrics and a song about someone staying days in a hospital waiting room until their loved one died, or even the episode I listened to today about the girl's dad with Parkinson's. Dr. Naomi said something like, Now you have this push to connect and have more intimate moments with him. And when I hear things like that, my heart sinks. I just really didn't do that. Or I'll walk into my mom's favorite store, Coles, L.O.L. So cute. And I feel this wave of guilt.

Like I wish so badly I would have just loaded up my baby and picked up my mom to go wander around her favorite stores or take her to her favorite restaurants. Or instead of just leaving right after we moved her from her beautiful home into a dumpy little rental, I should have stayed over at my mom's house and spent all day and night helping her make it feel homey, watching movies, doing crafts, eating popcorn, etc. What a hard time for her with her life flipped upside down and I just wanted to get out of there. I was pregnant and I didn't have an excuse of a baby to look after yet. Later, after I had the baby, I should have left him with my husband and gone over to do crafts or paint nails, just anything to spend quality time and I just didn't. Even when I knew her health was windling, I didn't really treat it that way at all.

I definitely saw her more often and we texted daily, but I felt so deeply that I should have been more intentional with how I handled her last months on earth. We didn't have deep talks, et cetera. How do I manage the guilt when it comes on so strong? I will say in my mom's last couple of years, I did graduate college, get a big girl job, have my first baby, and it was also COVID. So I definitely had reasons for not leaning in.

But ultimately, I feel like I was just uncomfortable with everything, uncomfortable when she was drinking, but also uncomfortable that I didn't know what to do, even when she was sober. I definitely let being uncomfortable dictate how I handled it. I hadn't even had one person close to me die before this. My mom honestly didn't even share how bad things were. It was my grandma who would pass on certain info.

So for some reason, I just really didn't think that God would have this plan for us. I was kind of forcing myself to be naive, though, and I wish more than anything I could go back and be the best daughter and friend that she deserved during the worst times of her life. And I do recognize that I'm sure she had regrets on not trying to visit me more or be there for me that much postpartum after I had her first grandchild. but I feel so pathetic and selfish in the way I handled it, she ended up dying for crying out loud. Please help.

Sincerely a regretful betch who wishes she could rewind time. Oh, I feel so sad for her. This is really hard. But honestly, I have yet to work with someone dealing with grief that doesn't have guilt. Like, I just feel like guilt and grief kind of go hand in hand. Again, your brain will find something to blame your sadness on or avoid the sadness.

Even if you are the person that was in the hospital day and night at the end of life, there's going to be that feeling of like, but I went down to get a snack at the last minute. And when she passed away, I wasn't there. You know, there's always going to be that way to find the one thing that you're guilty about. I mean, this case, I think there is something to look at here, and she's aware that she was probably in denial, like avoiding the discomfort and setting boundaries. This is complicated.

She's setting boundaries. Right. Yeah, I think there's like that whole other part of it where like you kind of feel like you were wronged by someone. And so that go, whether conscious or not conscious, I think that probably had factored into her decision at that time for just how much she wanted to lean in for someone who had, in some way she probably felt.

burned by. Totally. Totally. And now, and I think this is the way that she's feeling right now, which I know she's going to come out of, and I hope we can start helping her and probably, you know, some therapy would be helpful too. But, you know, this is what people's fear is in setting boundaries a lot of times. Well, what if they die? Like, I think a lot of people have that in the back of my mind. Like, they're older. They're not going to be around forever. Like, you know, how can I, you know, not spend time with this person. and it makes it really hard to set boundaries, which sometimes you need to do.

But that's kind of, if you do the work that we're talking about on here, which is like being able to tolerate uncomfortable emotions, so I say this, I think that she would have felt guilty no matter what, especially in a complicated relationship like that with someone who was an alcoholic and like you said, probably hurt her

and you can't just keep, you know, putting yourself out there, or it takes a very, very well-adjusted, conscious person to tolerate being around an alcoholic a lot, right? That's not easy to keep putting yourself in that situation where you're going to feel disappointed feelings. So I will say that, and I don't think you did anything wrong here, but I will say that there is something to be said for being able to, tolerate those hard emotions and be around that person if they're not being abusive, but like, she probably was triggered a lot by her, especially at the end. Like, you did this to yourself.

Like, that makes me angry. You're leaving me. I feel angry. I don't want to feel that way, so I'm just not going to be around you. Yeah. It is easier. Right. And I think she was even saying, like, even though she was sober at the end, like, the

sort of the symptoms of her illness. maybe, you know, felt similar to the symptoms of her drinking, which was probably, again, conscious or not, a little triggering for her also. Yeah. And couldn't, maybe couldn't even, I mean, a lot of substance addiction is lying and hiding and sneaking around. So maybe she didn't even trust if she was sober or wasn't sober at the end. Right.

Yeah. I thought that she was lying about it. And it's tough because in this kind of situation, it feels like you missed your chance to, like, resolve. Yeah. And she talks about not having deep talks or not like

there's like the quality time aspect and then there's like it almost feels like there's a closure aspect that she didn't feel like she fully got like the chance to like

talk through it maybe. Yes. Yes. Yes. And that is really one of the hardest things to do is I mean you could do it

any of our listeners you could do it right now, right? We're all going to die. Our parents are going to die. Your siblings are going to die, everyone's going to die. So like,

great, what a fun, uplifting episode we have here. But the reason I say it is because it's like you can talk about it. Like everyone's, you know, everyone has that. At least I know I have these people in my life that are like, you know, I won't be around forever or that kind of thing or, you know, you're just like, come on, stop it. Like that's usually the reaction. Like, oh, don't talk like that. but maybe that's the moment

where you can kind of lean in a little bit and be like, is that something you're thinking about? Like, open up a dialogue about it. And I don't think this listener did anything wrong. Most people don't do this. Most people are very uncomfortable with death. They don't want to talk about it. They don't want to talk about someone dying.

They don't want to talk, especially about all the reasons why I've been angry at you for the last, you know, three decades as someone's dying. So, like, these conversations are hard, but, like, we can also do hard things. And, you know, I think she can still have some of these conversations with her mom, and it might be healing, like, in her own way, in a letter, or just talking to her, or kind of expressing some of this how she feels, and it might make her feel a little bit better to kind of, you know, just explore this on her own now that she doesn't have to manage her mom's substance abuse anymore and wonder if she's telling the truth or not telling the truth or,

right, you know, drinking or not drinking. So, but yeah, this is, this is really tough. And I think it really does a lot of the work that we do. So here's the thing. Tolerating, for example, that your packages, I'm just using you as an example. Tolerating that your packages are left unattended without feeling like I need to, you know, think about this all day, ruminate on it, like, do something about it, is the little practice that we can do every day. Or tolerating that, like, it's hot out or it's cold out or, you know, the train is late or these little things if we can. if we can practice on those every day, I can handle this. I can handle this uncomfortable feeling. The more we practice the little things,

then step two or step 12, whatever you want to call it, is like I can handle being around my mom as she's triggering me. Like that's what you're working towards. Like you're practicing the little discomfort so that eventually you can get to the point where you can really be present without being so triggered that you then, you know, have to avoid something deep and meaningful, like an end-of-life conversation. Right.

Maybe she can, you know, use this to learn from it for her next, you know, for anything in the future that comes up. A hundred percent. Or she's, you know, feels on, you know, her discomfort causes her to pull away. Yeah. I totally agree. And you could practice on the little stuff when your baby's, you know, crying and you know that they're fed and you know that they're changed and you know whatever that

instead of going on amazon and looking for a sleepy snuggle suit that costs three hundred dollars to you know just breathe drop your shoulders your baby's fine it's an unpleasant sound you're going to be okay like those are the little bits of practice that you can do then yeah somebody else this is going to happen again right this isn't unfortunately not to be depressing but like, this is going to happen. So it is good to practice on the little stuff and then you can handle the big stuff. But it does lead to that question of boundaries, right? Like a lot of our boundaries are because we get triggered by somebody. Yeah. Well, that's like kind of the, I think the whole point, right? Right. I mean, sometimes there's boundaries because someone's actually being like harmful or

abusive. Right. But sometimes there's boundaries just because someone's like triggering your stuff. Yeah, and sometimes I feel like, and it's funny, I was watching The Sopranos documentary last night. And they were talking about how it was like different than other TV and different than what you see today and how there would just be like a lot of violence, but violence that you didn't really expect in the show. And they were like, I don't think you'd be able to do that today because you'd need like a trigger warning. And a trigger warning sort of takes away the whole discomfort of how you feel and something unexpected happened. and that's life. Like in life, you encounter things

that make you uncomfortable and there's no warning. And you learn and grow from that. That's so interesting. It's true. I've actually never watched, we were just talking about maybe watching The Sopranos.

I've never seen it, but I know it's like iconic. You'd love it. I mean, yeah. I think it's like, I mean, it is kind of violent.

I'll agree with it. It's a little violent for me, but I think like the characters are so well developed. Yes. All right. I'm going to check it out. But that's such an interesting point, like where, you know, you can protect against ever feeling uncomfortable and not having that feeling of that.

I mean, that's probably why the show is great because everyone's like, oh, my gosh. You know, you feel something. Right. Well, that's discomfort. Like, it's being triggered, being feeling uncomfortable in some ways does help you grow if it doesn't totally traumatize you beyond. Yes, yes. Yeah. So I think for this listener, like I feel for you. I get it. Anyone that's out there setting boundaries

with a family member is in this same position. You know, you're not alone in this. And I do think that you can do some of this healing on your own. You can write your mom a letter, all the things that you never got to say because you were avoiding the discomfort of it. You can still have that conversation with her. I mean, obviously, you're not going to hear back, but like you can express that stuff. And I that might be healing as well. I mean, people do that in relationships where they don't feel like they've had closure. Like sometimes you don't get it from the other person. You have to kind of make it for yourself.

Yeah, for sure. But this is so relatable. And I'm glad that you wrote in on this and that you had the courage, that you're having the courage to address it now. So, and keep working. Keep working on the little things. And then down the line, it'll help you be able to tolerate the discomfort of these ultimate, big, huge things that we all avoid. All of us avoid the topic of death. And even we do, so we will move right along.

All right, yes. Let's do our next email, which is a betchaicist. I'll read this. And you, why don't you read this one? Hi, Jordana and Dr. Naomi. I've been meeting to write in for a while, and I'm excited to finally drop you a note. I look forward to the pod every week. Your insights have truly helped me with various aspects of my daily life.

Awesome. I'm reaching out with a dilemma involving my brother and sister-in-law. It seems that discussions about more. money are a significant part of my in-laws family culture. For example, at family gatherings, the conversation often turns to the cost of the meat or the latest deals and discounts. While I appreciate a good thrift myself, I'm feeling quite uncomfortable with the specific financial questions they ask, such as the interest rate on our mortgage, the cost of house renovations, the cost of vacations, and the carrot size of my engagement ring. They even asked

about the cost of our wedding at a welcome event right before the big day. I've shared my discomfort with my husband, but he's hesitant to address it, fearing it might cause conflict. I've attempted to deflect these questions with humor, like suggesting, do you want to help contribute to our mortgage? That's so nice. But the hints don't seem to land. I find these questions invasive and rude, and I'm struggling to find a way to address this issue without escalating the situation. I'd appreciate any advice on how to set boundaries effectively or manage my feelings around these interactions. Thank you for your time and insights.

A betch minding her own money. That's an interesting one, I thought. And I feel like, it's funny because I feel like money is still kind of like a taboo subject. But like those questions feel quite personal. Yes. But like, are they? I don't know. Like I guess.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think there, I think it's constant, which is what's irritating her. I think what the interest rate is on your mortgage, that's kind of like just, it's almost more of like an intellectual, like that one I think is getting a sense of the market. It's not like personal.

Right. Yeah. How much are your renovations, I think, is more like, yes, a little bit more rude. I think asking the price of anything that someone has. Although with a close friend, I might ask that. And maybe they feel like their family. so it's in that realm.

Like if I'm, you know what I mean? Like in the way that you might just, you might talk about sex with a close friend. Right. I wouldn't, I wouldn't ask my husband's aunt about sex. Right, right. Or, you know,

but I, but I might, I might go and talk to my best friend about it. Totally. And ask her about her. You know what I mean? Like we might share that information in the same way.

I might ask her how much she paid for something. Yes. That I wouldn't ask someone who was less close. Yes. And that, I think that is part of, of like the in-law thing, it's almost like if they feel that close where they can talk about that stuff. Like if I had a close friend and she took a trip that looked really good, I might be like,

oh my gosh, that hotel was amazing. Like, was it super expensive or like how much was the trip? Just so I could be like, all right, is this something that's doable or not? And I don't think she'd have a problem telling me that. But right, I wouldn't ask like an extended family member how much their vacation was. So I totally, even with a close. close friend. Sometimes you don't really want to share stuff, but it does feel, I understand, I validate her feeling of feeling like, I don't really want to like share this information. I just don't really feel comfortable sharing it, but it does feel like antagonistic to refuse to share. Yes, I, yes, I really do get it. And I think because she's like marrying in, it's like,

they might have been having some of these conversations that felt comfy for them, but like she doesn't feel comfy. And I do, a lot of these questions are invasive. Like, how much is the wedding, like the day before the wedding or like, how big is your wedding ring or some of this also just seems like a little tacky. Yeah. And like, why do you want to, like, what, are you trying to size me up is kind of the, what it feels like. Um, so like, what are you using this information for? Right. It's not like, are you planning to get engaged? Are you looking to buy a ring for somebody? Like, why are you asking that, you know? Are you, planning a wedding? Like, yeah, it just seems, I totally agree. And it is hard to defer without making

it a little awkward. So I think you're going to have to probably, you have two options. Answer, every question. You have two options. You can just kind of be like, why is this triggering me? And like, do I need to be so private? This is my family. Totally get it if you don't want that option because like they are asking invasive questions or your other option is to once or twice make it slightly uncomfortable and then I think they'll stop asking. I just you know just simply I don't I don't feel comfortable answering that or I'd rather not talk about that and it's going to be awkward and it's like it's like going to be like a record scratch but can I present a third less moral option than yours is to just be like I actually I don't even know I'd have to look right yeah

Yeah, that's true. If you say that enough times, I think the person will be like, well, then they're, then they'll go back and say she doesn't know anything about her finances, which judge, judging either way. Judging how much money you have, how much money you don't have, whether or not you're spending over your, that's the fear, I think, is that people are like talking about you using that or judging that information, right? Well, it's like, why would you ask if you didn't have a thought of it or an opinion

on it if you didn't care? Yes. And it does seem like it's just the. the culture or the climate of their family and she's just in it. I'm sure it's not personal to her if they're talking about how much the meat costs. It's not about her. It's just something that's top of mind for them. But yeah, okay, so you have three options. One is you could just kind of tell a little white lie to just skirt the question. Probably the easiest and most likely outcome. I'm not sure. Yeah. Depend.

I mean, it's also one to pull out when you're like not, when you're the context of the situation would just make it more tougher to have tougher to be like honest. Yeah. Yeah. But look, I really, you're at a table. I really admire. I admire people that can just do the whole. Like, I'd rather not talk about that. Like, I think that's great.

That's your boundary. You're putting it out there. And if that makes them uncomfortable, it's probably because they're, they've become aware that they've asked an intrusive question. and maybe they need to be a little bit uncomfortable in order for them to make a different choice next time. If you keep them comfortable, they're going to keep doing the same thing. Like sometimes you do have to make someone slightly uncomfortable in order to get them to change.

I'd rather not talk about that. Yeah. Yeah, I think if you say that in the right tone, doesn't come off that crazy. Tone, yeah, I agree. You could say that. And I get it. But I am guilty sometimes of, like,

Like, you know, oh my gosh, I picked up barbecue. You wouldn't believe how expensive it was. Yeah, I do that too. I think it's a like, and I think there's, it's definitely, they're not all aggressions are created equally in that way. Yeah. Like I think how much did you pay for your house? How much do you pay for your renovations is like a much, for someone that you're not close

with, I think is a much more invasive question than how much are those jeans you're wearing those look really. I mean, or how much was the hotel? Right. Right. And look, you know, to play devil's advocate, if we all just want to be free from all of this worry, like, okay, who cares? tell them how much it was. I mean, I know she's not going to. I get it. But like in an imaginary world, and I know this isn't realistic,

like what are you, what's triggering you about sharing that information? You're afraid they're going to ask you for money? Are you afraid they're going to, you know, judge how you're spending your money? Okay, it's your life. Like, you can spend on whatever you want. You can go into credit card debt if that's your choice on your wedding. You can, you know, you got it from your parents. Are you ashamed that you got money from your parents for your wedding or that your husband, like, what is your trigger around or anyone's trigger around sharing?

I'm playing devil's advocate. I get that some things are personal. Yeah. There are taboo topics that are like, I totally get where it's like, why are they taboo? Why is sex taboo? Why is money? Right. Someone's going to think I'm a freak.

Someone's going to think I'm a prude. Right. No, it's true. Just be you and whoever, you know, own it. All that being said. Or you can set your boundary. Those are your options. All right, let's do some intentions.

All right, let's do it. I'll read them. Hi, Jordana and Dr. Naomi. Love the pod. Look forward to the new episodes dropping every week. I wanted to write in to see if you can help me with an intention. My boyfriend is a bartender. And any time I tell someone what he does,

I can see them react as if that isn't a suitable job for someone in their mid-30s. It's like the smile leaves their faces and they're left with a weird, oh, that's it, kind of expression. For context, I live in San Francisco where people can be a little obsessed about talking about what tech company they work for or brag about where their partner works. My boyfriend is wonderful at his job, absolutely adored by the people that go there in our neighborhood and is in talks with investors to open up his own bar in the next year or so. not to mention that because his hours are opposite mine,

he happily cooks for us while I work my tech job from home, helps with my dog and around the house, and will run any errands and do anything to help make my busy days less hectic. That said, can you suggest an intention? So when I tell people what he does, I don't get triggered by their visible, judgey reaction. Thanks so much and thanks for doing what you do and creating this great space,

proud girlfriend of a not tech bro. This is fun. I mean, it's funny also that she's like, she feels the need to justify even to us, I think. Yes. Like why the job is better than we might think. And it's like we don't even know her. Right.

Right. So it's interesting. That's the way she even wrote the email. Totally. But this is the society that we live in. Like this is just, I love this email because I think everyone is living a little bit of this to a certain extent of like, we talked about this before.

I don't want the job because I want the job. I want the job because the feeling that I think I'm going to get from this job. I don't want the house because I want the house. I want the house

because I want the feeling that I think I'm going to get when I live in that house. So for her, it's like the feeling that she has right now and that he has sounds great. They share the responsibilities nicely.

They're able to help each other. have a great lifestyle. He has like a, sounds like a great community at work where he feels valued and respected. And so they have all the things that they need. But somehow there's like an object of desire that everyone else has like a more, I'm assuming, just like a job that makes more money. Right. That's what it boils down to. Sounds like it. Right. Or has more prestige, I guess, associated with it. Right. So it's like, I love. the fact that you're questioning this kind of societal norm that like a more prestigious job that makes more money is should be coveted and desired and that should be the you know the goal

whereas what she's experiencing right now like we talk about bird in the hand or two in the bush like right now she has a relationship where like he's happy works well works well for both of them but somehow society makes her feel like they need to crave something more than that. Right. Yeah. And sometimes people like, a lot of the things we do in life, or like you said, you kind of wanted to make you feel a certain way, or you kind of wanted to just, you want to be the kind of person who has this kind of life, I think. You know, why do people, like you said, with the house or with travel, like, why do you travel? Maybe you like seeing places and things and enjoy new cultures.

but also you like seeing yourself as a person who travels. Right. That's just how you've now like integrated that into your who you are. Yes. Yes. Totally agree. It's like almost when you define yourself, like if you were meeting a new person or like on a dating app, it's like, who are you?

And you have to kind of come up with a bunch of words that define that. and then you sort of, you do start to define yourself by that. I'm hardworking or I'm ambitious or I'm, you know, well-traveled or well-read or like whatever those things are. Yeah. Yeah, I wonder even like with your kids, like let's say they weren't your kids, but they were just kids around your neighborhood that you helped raise. Right.

Or like hung out with a lot. Would you get the same sense of like gratification? do you think as if they were, as if you're the mom? From the process or from if they were successful down the line, you're saying? Just from the process, just from like your identity as a mother. But let's say they weren't your kids. All your three of your kids were just like neighborhood kids that you hung out with a lot. Interesting question, because it is, you know, you're sort of, you know, there is a part of it that's kind of like I'm like a narcissistically,

like involved in this. But I guess is it, it's part of your identity a little bit. Yeah. Right. Yeah. But it's true. I mean, it's interesting because like, you know, Lila and Maddie have a friend that lives up the street that's like always at her house. Like she hangs out here all the time.

And I love her and we like all have fun together. And this weekend she was here for like a bunch of the time. And like I really, I do enjoy like spending time with her. And I don't think it's because I'm like mothering her. I think it's like the moment of the process. I get your point. And I agree with what you're saying. There is like an identity piece to like owning this role that you have or like how you can talk about it instead of being like you go to a party. You're like, yeah, there's these bunch of neighborhood kids that like come over all the time. And like that's what I do a lot on the weekends. It's like. Right. That seems much less tied into your who you are. That's a really interesting question. Like is it that there's no socially.

There's not even a name for that, right? Like, right. There's no title for, like, the neighbor that, like, is really nice to all the kids in the neighborhood and, like, does parental type things with them and, like, nurtures them and enriches them. And, like, yeah, and I think we're really tied to those titles. I think they make us feel, like, I don't know, successful or, like, accomplished or, like, again, like, part of your, that you've reached certain milestones and that that's, that's just part of who you are. Like, that's how you would describe yourself, I'm sure. Like, what does it say on a gravestone?

Right. Because, like, wife, sister, mother. Yes. Whatever. Totally. It doesn't say, like, woman who hung out with a neighborhood kids. Right. But it's true.

But you could imagine a world where it could. It's almost like, I think, what it is, it's the same thing as like wanting to be physically attractive. It's like a very quick and easy communication of who I am. Right. Like, oh, do you have kids? Yes. Are you married?

No. Like, where do you, what do you do? You know, what do you do for work? There's like one word answer that can give someone a whole picture of your value. Just like if I show up at the party and I'm well dressed and I look great, it's like a instantaneous, you know, exhibition of my worth. So, bartender for her. feels like that's not, you know, that's not achieving the sense of value from others.

But I'm so glad that you're supportive of him and I'm so glad that it sounds like trying to enjoy the moment, the peace that you have right now. Like it sounds like she's writing in, we can't pay our rent or he's not able to, you know, we're not able to do things. Like it sounds like they're happy. Working well. working well. So like you don't want, and this is I think the mistake that a lot of people make right now is they're forsaking their current peace, which many of us are experiencing right now. Like unless you're

sick or someone you love is sick or you really don't have enough food or shelter or safety, we are peaceful right now. But we, it's almost not enough because the drive to ensure some other more peaceful, more joyful future is like always. Right, to put some other label on ourselves. Yes. That's like more important than, okay, right now it's actually this is it. Like we talked about maybe this is as good as it's going to get.

You living with your boyfriend and he's a bartender and you're, work your tech job and he takes the dog out and does the dishes and then you come home and like enjoy each other's company like whatever your life is right that's pretty good i don't yeah i don't need a house on the water like overlooking a thing or i don't need to be able to say that i work that i own a bar like versus i'm a bartender and i validate that like we do we don't live in our like we do live in a world where other people's judgments do come into place like i validate that like for her to feel like a little like something when she senses a judgment from someone else. Like I think that's most people would feel that.

I don't think that makes her superficial to she even like cares or notices. And it's hard to sort of like to, because that's noise, right? That's the noise of feeling like what others think about your situation. And I think if you live your life based on like what other people are, because it's not even about her. Like she's happy with it. It's really about like her fear of what other. people think of it. But if you live your life like that, then you're living your life for other people. Totally. And I think if she really wasn't happy or there were things that, you know, she wanted that she didn't have, it makes sense.

But and I told like, I'm glad that you said that, that you validate that she's going to feel this way because I think many, many, many people feel that way. Like if they're, it feels better to say what your, the job is and everyone's like, oh, that's amazing. Like that feels better, fine. Totally. In the same way, oh, I went to Harvard. Yes. Feels probably great to say your whole life. Right.

Yes. Yes. Yep. I totally, I do get that. And, you know, I think there is a flip side too where, you know, you'll meet some people who go to Harvard and they'll be like, oh, I went to school in Boston because they like don't want to come off as like pretentious or braggy or whatever. Right. Yeah. So I think you almost get it.

No matter what, which way you go, you're just afraid, oh, I'm going to come off as like a show off or I'm going to be judged. Yeah. Or not good enough. Yeah. So it's a lose lose when you focus too much on that. But you have that little tinge. You're going to have that probably little tinge because that's just sort of how our society is, especially if you live in a little bubble where everyone's kind of a lot of the conversation is around what new up and coming tech company or what big tech company. you're working for you might feel a little left out also of certain conversations. But the intention that I wrote for her is we choose to trust in the happiness and security of now. Right now, you're feeling happy, you're feeling secure, and that's what you're going to trust in. Not a lot of people put their trust in when I get this other thing, I will achieve happiness

and peace. and I will really not let my mind have happiness and peace until I get that other thing. And I promise you, when you get it, if you do not come back to the consciousness of the now, you will find something else that you need to feel that way. So, right. Good luck. Let's do some triggers. All right, moving right along.

I will read the first one. Dear Jordana and Dr. Naomi, my mom and I love listening to you up. and oversharing, particularly the triggered segment. So now I'm writing in with a triggered situation of my own. My parents got divorced when I was eight and I've never been super close with my dad's side of the family. Despite all living in a tiny state, we don't get together that often, mostly just for major holidays, if that. And it has never been expected that any of them except my dad show up for me at things like graduation, sports games, etc. Despite not seeing each other often, for the past six years or so, we've had a yearly family football betting pool where we each put in $150 at the beginning of

NFL season and pick the outcome of each week's games with the winner of each week getting $50. I look forward to this tradition every year as it's the only time we communicate regularly, texting in a big family group chat about the games, congratulating each week's winner and funny banter. I love having what looks like a normal family group chat with all my cousins, aunts, and uncles, as I've never had anything like that growing up as an only child with divorced parents. I admit I don't watch football and don't really have an extra 150 to gamble with, but I do it because of the sense of normalcy and community, it gives me to communicate with them weekly.

Recently, however, I guess I got a bit comfortable in the family group chat and sent a text letting my family know that I'm training to run the New York City Marathon, which is my first marathon and a huge personal accomplishment for me. on a charity's team that does research on various types of cancers and diseases like Parkinson's and ALS. I've raised over $2,000 from friends and my mom's side of the family, which has made me feel very supported, especially as most of my friends are fellow grad students who I do not expect to have extra money to donate. However, my dad's side of the family is very well off, and I know that donating even $20 or $50 would not be a big deal to them. However, after sending the text attached to my family

group chat, nobody responded. So let's pause to read the text. Okay. She writes, Hi, Fam. On an unrelated note, Blank and I are running the New York City Marathon in November. We are running on the Blank team,

which is raising money for research on cancers and neurodegenerative diseases and Parkinson's and ALS. I'm over halfway towards my fundraising goal, but would be so, appreciative of any donations, any amount helps, two hearts and two running emojis. So she writes that on a Saturday at 430 and then she writes the link. And then no responses until Tuesday when someone says, week one winner is blank. Congratulations, blank.

And everyone's congratulating the person. So absolutely no acknowledgement of the text. Yes. 11 people on the chat. no one response okay so you could finish okay

we went through an entire weekend of NFL football which would usually be a very active time in the group chat without a single text also when it came time on Monday to announce that week's winner my cousin's husband

every single person in the family chat sent the text congratulating him with no one acknowledging my text or donating to my charity I felt embarrassed that I said anything to them and wish I could have unsent the text

additionally I feel even more upset with my dad as we are obviously the closest in the chat, as he didn't say anything to make me feel supported nor encourage them to respond or donate. He texted me a day later separately about an unrelated subject and didn't acknowledge my text just sitting there unanswered. I felt like being in a room full of people and everyone getting quiet after you speak. How trigger can I be, or am I at fault for killing the family group chat vibe by asking for donations. Additionally, how can I help from feeling resentful towards them when I see that many of my friends are meeting their marathon charity fundraising goals primarily by reaching out to family members?

Or even more, that their family is coming to watch them run the marathon, which is something I would never dare ask of mine after this situation. How can I just accept that this football betting pool might be the closest we ever get together? Thanks for all you do, hearing crickets in the family group chat. I said, this is quite triggering. I know. This is. This is This is really sad and upsetting. And the dad, not, yeah. I think it's mostly on him almost, like, little backup. So proud of you.

You know, can't wait to watch you. Like, I just donated. Yes. Yeah. Something. He must be setting some kind of a tone there that he wouldn't. Like, I think anyone, you think he did. he purposely didn't do it?

No, I don't think he's trying to be mean. I think he somehow is afraid of like, there's something about this dynamic that also makes him anxious that he wasn't able to jump in and be like, so proud of you. Even if he didn't just donated would be amazing, right? But even if he was just like so proud of you, like can't wait to see how it goes, whatever.

Right. To just leave her hanging. Even if just a way to save her. Yes. even if like it. Yeah. No, that would be very triggering, I think. Also, okay, so along with the lines of what you just said about he doesn't want to

kind of rock the boat or something. I do think it's odd that she's like, I never saw any of these people growing up. Yes. So clearly there's like some dysfunctional family situation there. I would assume if she, I mean, these are her cousins and her aunts uncles. These aren't like the third cousins or like her super extended family. Like maybe there's something else there. Yeah. There's definitely something weird. But then why even do this football thing? Like what's the point? It's just it could be anyone like could be random. Totally. And that's

what makes me even feel worse for her. She's like, I'm not even into football. I don't really want to bet $150 on football. She's not into it. She probably knows she's going to lose the 150 anyway because she doesn't know, like who to pick. And she's just doing it to have a sense of family. And then it's not like she was asking them for like a birthday gift. Like she's not even a hearting of the message. It's crazy. I know. I'm upset for her. I'm actually, I'm triggered for her because one, I feel like it's sad that she's trying so hard to have this sense of family. And they're just like, congratulations to this week's winner. And like, Oh, it's so sad.

Yeah. And maybe it was like, I get, I do feel like if one person had sort of broken the ice to say something, other people would have followed for no other reason than just to feel like you're not being rude. But the fact that no one's, no one started it, her dad really should have stepped up. I totally see. I think she should bring that up to him for sure. Yeah. He totally should have stepped up.

And it's just like, how hard is it? It's a marathon. Like, that's clearly a cool thing. And she's running it. It's not like she's like my friend's sister is running the marathon. It's like she, the person in the chat is doing it. If nothing else, just like, wow, that's impressive. Like even if you can't donate, just acknowledge that that's a big feat.

That's something that somebody has to work hard for. She's raising money for very worthy causes. Like, how do you not respond to that? I don't know. And it does not to fuel her. but it's almost like when you send a message in a big group chat and no one responds, it kind of makes you feel like there's a side chat happening. Right.

That's a good point. I didn't even think of that. I mean, maybe there's not, I don't know, but like are, I mean, what would the, what would the side chat be? Yeah. How could she possibly ask for donations, like so rude? Yeah, it's crazy. It's crazy.

It's like, that's what people. do. It's normal. You can donate great. You don't want to. Don't. But like, at least like the message. Yeah. Like the message. Way to go. So impressive. Like hope it goes great. I don't know. Anything. And then if you don't want to donate, don't donate or donate like 10 bucks. Yeah. It's about the gesture. Yeah. Totally. I would bring this up to your dad. Yeah. And it's, I think the reason why I feel sad for her. Yes. I would bring it up to the dad is like it's almost like she doesn't want to not. She wants to like. She wants to like. cling on to this relationship, but it's literally sounds like it's just about this football thing, which is like, so weird. Yeah. Who cares? I know. Like they're looking, yeah, it felt like they're looking for bodies for like a bed, for like it's about the bad. Yes. Right. Like, don't bring up any of your personal issues or like anything personal about what you're doing or what you're going through. Um, I feel bad, but it, and I get it like you're an only child. Parents or divorce, like, it's hard. It's a hard position. And I could see that craving for more of a

family connection. But I wonder if you can get it like a little bit more of like a one-on-one. Like if there's a cousin or two or an aunt or an uncle that you feel particularly close to, maybe lean in in that way rather than this big mob that just sounds really unsupportive as a whole. Yes, validated. I'd give this Nate. Yeah, I agree. I give this an eight too. This is really triggering. I'm sorry, this happened to you.

All right. I'll read our last, our next trigger. Okay. Hi, Dr. Naomi and Jordana, a huge fan of all things. Bedges, I have a triggered scenario for you. For context, I'm 33 and my husband is 35. We've been married for three years and together for eight. The other day, our neighbor came by and offered us some candies.

I accepted them enthusiastically and put them in our kitchen pantry to enjoy later. Two days later, when I went to the pantry to grab a few, I noticed that they were gone. I asked my husband if he had seen them, and he said he finished them. I was immediately annoyed and asked why he would do such a thing without sharing, and he said he didn't think I would want any, which is wild, because he knows I have a huge sweet tooth. When I called bullshit on that answer, he told me it's because there wasn't enough to share, which is even more wild because it was a large bag with at least 20 plus candies.

I told him he owed me an apology, and he said he wouldn't apologize for such a ridiculous reason, and he didn't know I was so obsessed with candy. How triggered candy. I feel like this could be like two eight-year-olds. Yeah, seriously, like Halloween candy. I totally get that this sounds like two eight-year-olds. I think it's a deeper issue of like him being inconsiderate and the reaction, almost like your...

Marriage seems like it's on the rock a little bit. Like your management's reaction to you having a complaint made it worse. And his reaction, if his reaction, If his reaction was, oh my God, I'm so sorry. I really didn't think you'd want any. Like, I feel really bad. I can run out and get, like, whatever candy you want. Like, I'll go get it for you.

I'm so sorry. Like, I didn't realize it. But him, like, making up an excuse, then, like, changing the excuse to a different excuse, which does sound 20 candies. I don't even if they're an M's, it's not being like, let me save some for her. Yes. Right. Yeah.

This does sound. right back in and tell us what's really happening here. This is the symptom. What is the disease underneath? We need to know. There's more to it. I know there is. Do you ever get couples with like this petty kind of stuff?

Oh, yeah, all the time. It's like, I mean, that's what it is. It's like these symptoms, this irritation. Like I think he might have been feeling like, okay, well, she's not doing this for me. So I'm not going to do this for her or, you know, just a lack of. of thoughtfulness or, yeah, there's something else going on. And his defensive reaction, I think, is... The fact that he ate the candy is, like, not that big of a deal, I think.

I will say, I have this issue that comes up a lot with Jeff. And I think it's just because, like, eats a lot of candy. No, he doesn't really eat sweets. But, like, he'll ask me to, like, get... If I'm going to the grocery store and I'll be like, what do you need? He'll like ask me for one thing and then I forget it. Like more often than I should. Like if he's like asking me for a while,

I'll specifically ask him, what do you want? And then he'll tell me what he wants and then I forget to bring it in. And then as soon as I get back, I'm like, oh my God, I forgot. I did it again. Like it's one of those things where it's like, right, you keep doing this. Like, but you could not do it. Right. You tried.

Like I've told you like a lot of times, like I just asked for that one thing and you forgot it. So, like, I, I could see how it feels like it's a bigger issue, like, subconsciously. I'm, like, forgetting this thing. So, um, I get that sometimes you just have a moment of selfishness and he really wanted the candies and he ate them. But then when he's a little embarrassed that he, like, ate the whole thing too. Yeah, maybe. That's the best case scenario is that he was embarrassed. I think the worst case scenario is that he's just being like a jerk. and like not owning it. So like when I walk in and if he asked me for like avocados

and I forget the avocados, I'm like, oh my God, I'm so sorry. I feel really bad. Like I will go back out right now and get the avocados. Like I feel badly. And like I get why that's so annoying. So I think his reaction to this is a big part of the issue. But yeah, it does sound like two eight-year-olds

fighting over Halloween kids. Time to start labeling your food. I do wonder if any married couples do that. Yeah. I mean, there's like that, that's what I'm saying. Like, I don't, I'm not like, oh, he's the worst. He ate all the candy. Like, I could see a scenario where I, you know, I see something in the pantry.

I don't know, I don't know that anyone else wants it. Right. So I'll put that. If there's leftovers, I would eat the whole thing. Yes. Be like, making sure to save some. But like, if someone was like, oh, I was saving that, you would be like, oh, I'm sorry. All right.

Depends how they came at you, though. Yeah, that's true. If she was like, I don't know. I don't know if she's smart of this. Totally. That's a good point. If she was like freaking out like where like the like I can't believe you ate the candy like screaming at him or saying stuff that was like below the belt, I could see why he'd be like,

you're the like this one's on you. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. I do think that matters. Go talk to your neighbor about it. She'll like to hear about how much you guys love the candies that you're fighting over them. You're getting divorced.

She might be a good. person to vent to. She'll feel really validated how delicious her candies were. So, trigger, the actual triggered. Someone, your neighbor drops off candies. You're really excited to try them. You go to get them. They're gone. Two.

Yeah. It's pretty low. Two, and then his reaction maybe like, if he showed, if he didn't feel any, I don't think he has to be like feeling so horrible, but if he wasn't like, oh, I'm sorry. I didn't know that you wanted it.

Yeah. I could see why if he said, I'm sorry, I didn't know if you wanted any. Like, that would be all he would need to say. Yes, that's it. And that would take, that would be it. If he then came back a couple days later with some candy, that would solve the whole thing and he'd get bonus points. And then it'd be down to a zero, my opinion.

But, yeah. Two or three, bring this up in couples counseling. Yeah, there's more to it. Tell us what else is happening. I want to know the whole scoop. We want to follow up. All right. That's our time.

great work today. Oversharing is produced by Rebecca Steinberg. Editing by Will Maxwell. Guest booking by Ali Friedlander. Be sure to follow us on Instagram and everything's fine. And send your advice emails to oversharing at betches.com or leave us a voicemail at 646363-66-6294. Betches.