Part Of The Problem - Brian McWilliams

Episode Date: July 13, 2024

Dave Smith brings you the latest in politics! On this episode of Part Of The Problem, Dave is joined by the host of the Lions of Liberty podcast Brian McWilliams! Dave and Brian discuss the failures in communication from the Libertarian Party that led to the state of things today.Follow Brian Here https://x.com/BrianMcWilliamsSupport Our SponsorsLumen - https://www.lumen.me/problem for 15% off your LumenSheath - https://sheathunderwear.com use promo code PROBLEM20Entera Skincare - https://www.enteraskincare.com/ Use promo code problem for 10% OffGet your tickets to Porch Tour Herehttps://porchtour.comFind Run Your Mouth here:Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@robbiethefire2577/streamsItunes - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/run-your-mouth-podcast/id1211469807Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/show/4ka50RAKTxFTxbtyPP8AHmPart Of The Problem is available for early pre release on GaS Digital Network every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Sign-up with code POTP to get access to the archives, bonus content and more! https://gasdigital.comFollow the show on social media:Twitter: https://twitter.com/ComicDaveSmithhttps://twitter.com/RobbieTheFirehttps://www.instagram.com/bmackayisrightInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/theproblemdavesmith/https://www.instagram.com/robbiethefire/https://www.instagram.com/bmackayisrightSubscribe On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/DSmithcomicSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening to the Gas Digital Network. Look at who we're funding right now. Every single one of these problems are a result of government being way too big. You're listening to Part of the Problem on the Gas Digital Network. Here's your host, Dave Smith. What's up, everybody? Welcome to a brand new episode of Part of the Problem. I am Dave Smith. Very excited for today's episode. Before we get started, I am, as I record this tomorrow morning, but as you hear this, this morning,

perhaps, on my way out to Austin, hope to see a bunch of you guys at the Comedy Mothership this week, and then I am touring for the rest of the year. So go to comicdavesmith.com if you want to get tickets. I'm coming all over the place. All right. Very happy to be joined today by, I believe, the first time, is this the first time we've had you on, Brian? First time, man. I know, crazy, yeah. I was trying my best to avoid it, but eventually I couldn't fight it. Brian McWilliams, he is, of course, a longtime host of the Lions of Liberty podcast, and he is the communications director for the Libertarian Party and a longtime friend. How are you, sir?

I'm pretty good, man. Thanks for having me on. I'm excited to be on this show because you're teasing this massive announcement coming on Monday, which I have to presume. So I saw Luis Gomez also, Luis J. Gomez also tweeted out this announcement about you and part of the problem in Gas Digital, which makes me think it must be the addition of a female co-host that he can sexually molest or intimidate. Well, you're close. Rob is transitioning.

And so there will be I didn't we don't need to save it for Monday, guys. Rob. Well, I was trying to save it. It's your show. Roberta Bernstein will be going. But now we do have a big announcement. In fact, after this show, I will be recording the announcement because I'm going to be gone and we're supposed to be announcing it. But But yep, major announcement on the future of part of the problem. I am quitting. I've done what I need to do. We got Joe Biden over the finish line and now we move on to, to bigger tasks. So, but let me ask you, and we'll talk a bunch about the libertarian party and stuff. But I'm just curious, just as a person existing in the world, because it's all everyone's been talking about for the

last couple of weeks now. What do you what's your take on all this post first presidential debate fallout and the media switching on a dime? And now, man, I mean, I was just looking at more of it this morning. Man, the knives are out for Joe Biden. It's amazing how quickly everything changes. I mean, what's awesome to me is seeing people like George Clooney, right? Clooney just had this massive fundraiser, raised $30 million for Joe Biden, and now is like, get out, Joe. New York Times, get out, Joe. You're done. You're toast. There is no allegiance. It makes you really see clearly that these people will cycle you through. You mean nothing. And Joe Biden, like the puppets falling off the strings,

right? That's what it is. They had him on the puppetry. They propped the man up when he shouldn't have been. They got him into office and he was a loyal soldier. And now he's not going along with the plan. So clearly they're looking at the puppet, the puppets. You know, it's like you got a little marionette here. The puppets talking on its own, like a creepy Twilight Zone episode. And it's time to replace him. So, I mean, in the wake of this, I'm excited to see what happened tonight. Like we're talking Thursday. He's going to talk at the NATO summit. I think that's going to be the definitive moment. If he collapses, if he if he has a flub, if he looks like the Joe Biden we know he is, I think then you're going to see the pressure mount to the point where he has to get out.

But I don't know if you saw, he just had this letter, open letter to the DNC and congressional members that are Democrats essentially saying, I am going to poison pill you. Like, I'm not leaving. I'm going to take you all down with me. You're hypocrites. You're undermining democracy. If you take me out, you're everything that you said you weren't. So, I mean, that's what's interesting to me is Joe Biden essentially saying, look, I'm taking you all down with me. Yeah, that it's so fascinating. And part of it is because you get a little bit of a window into like the actual power plays. Like, how does this how does this really go down when different factions have staunchly different desires? And so to the point you made for anybody who hasn't followed it. So George Clooney is known for being like close friends with Barack Obama.

And it was reported that he contacted Obama, like he got Obama's approval to write this op ed saying that Joe Biden needs to step down. So already, first off, he was just at a fundraiser for him, as you mentioned. Now he's calling for him to step down. But the bigger implication there is like, oh, Obama is, you know, pulling out the big guns against him. And you realize that, look, the the business interests that, you know, like the real power centers in America, the military industrial complex and Wall Street and big pharma and all of this, they don't want Trump in, but they don't care if Joe Biden's they just want whoever will beat Donald Trump. And so as soon as they see Biden's. They just want whoever will beat Donald Trump.

And so as soon as they see Biden's not going to be able to beat Donald Trump, the knives are out. However, to your point, Biden has clearly signaled he's going to fight this thing. And it does make you wonder, even for a man who has lost, who has fallen from the level of mediocre intelligence that Joe Biden started at. The guy has been around for 40 plus years. What type of dirt does he have on other? But, you know, like what you would imagine to survive in that world, you must be doing what you can to protect yourself. And so, man, that adds an interesting wrinkle into all of this. Oh, absolutely. You know, it's funny just speaking of like, who's got the dirt on who I'm looking at. This is tangential, but you see Alex Soros, George Soros, his son is now engaged to Huma Abedin, famous, you know, wiener mistress

and Hillary Clinton aid for a long time. I'm wondering who's got the keys to the sex dungeon in Epstein Island in that relationship. Like that one of them has the keys for sure, because there's no way they end up together. He's marrying this like worn out ex-Wiener lady. Anyway, but yeah, I mean, Biden's got he must have so much dirt. He must have so much power. I mean, like you said, 40 years in there. It's not just how much dirt he has on people, I think, but it's also how many different relationships are tied into the business dealings, because I 100 percent believe he's corrupt. I mean, there's zero question in my mind. So again, if he's saying, I'm going to blow the DNC up, I'm going to take you down. How much communication, how much backdoor dealing, how many

different insider stock trading tips, now that they're not allowed to trade stocks anymore, but how many tips is he going to release? And I guess the question is, will he remember? I mean, there's also that question. He might just, he can just make stuff up and people will be like, all right. Well, the thing is that Biden is fighting a losing fight. It's a fight that you can't win. Now, could he bring other people down with him? Theoretically, sure. But the problem is that like once like the whole if you go back and read the emperor's

new clothes, the whole game is you have to be denying it. Like once a conversation has started about is the emperor wearing clothes or not, you've already lost. The whole point is that everyone has to be in lockstep denial. And so once we're having this conversation now, every senior moment he has is under the microscope. And also just who look, forget even let's just say he wasn't senile. Who could survive the story being that for the months leading up to election day, everyone was questioning whether you were even fit to serve. Yeah. Everyone in your own political party questioning whether can we get anyone else in? We're so desperate for it to be anyone else other than you. It's just this is the kiss of death. But it's going to be

fun. I will say if you follow Joe Biden's entire career, this is the send off he deserves. Absolutely, man. It's reap what you sow time like I'm enjoying every second of it. And also, it's funny, too. Like you said, they're going to magnify everything no matter what, even if the media now if they want him to stay in the race because they were so complicit in hiding it all this time and you saw those op-eds like oh we didn't know oh how are we supposed they fooled us too now they have to go extra hard to maintain any credibility on really amplifying every little screw-up he makes yeah no that's a great point it's the same i made the comparison before but it's like harvey weinstein in before, but it's like Harvey Weinstein in Hollywood.

It's like, well, at the next Oscars, they all got to be talking about Me Too and all this shit. Like they got to go really, really hard. And so you're, yeah, you're right about that. It's a weird. I'll be great at the Oscars. Everybody goes up and next time,

instead of the Me Too, everybody's really harping on like elder abuse and recognizing Parkinson's early on every speech yeah yeah i mean that might be it um there's so all right so how long have you been a member of the libertarian party i think for a while right yeah well i mean honestly i i wasn't a member until you know there was a time when you joined i joined tom joined i mean pete quinonia's uh joined we all kind of joined up at the same time and it was to move the you know move mrs caucus forward to kind of get involved take the party which we did and so i've been down there basically as long

as you um because i mean mark claire who used to be at the lions of liberty with you um current current florida man former line of liberty florida man former libertarian mark clare he was he i believe had been in longer so then i was i wasn't sure if you had been or not so you joined around the time i did yeah i joined around the time you did yeah exactly i think john odermatt may have been in a little bit earlier because he was working in pennsylvania to try to boost some candidates up in the party but yeah it was yeah was, yeah, 2018. So it is wild. I'm sure you've taken stock of this as I have, that, you know, 2018 was like not that long ago,

but it is amazing what a different world we are living in in 2024 compared to 2018. You know, and 2018 felt pretty nuts, but this is before COVID before Biden, before any of this stuff. Um, it's kind of like watching now the state of politics with, with Bobby Kennedy running this year with all the stuff that's happening with, uh, of course, chase Oliver being the libertarian nominee. What's I don't know, just broad strokes, themes like how do you feel about how things have changed where we are now? Well, not great. Not great. I mean, and by the way, I will tell you, best decision you ever made was not running.

I have a loudly defended decision not to run. Not only just well, because honestly, look at this way, man. What once Kennedy entered the race and I've talked to Angel about this, once kennedy got in the race you running would have been a waste of time and talent period because you could move the bar forward as far as like getting messaging out there but he's taking so many votes off the table that would normally go to say a libertarian candidate it would have been a waste of your time i would rather you if you ever have ever have an interest keep your powder dry so that you actually have a decent run at it where you don't have this competition pulling it off to the sides. Well, I'll say I'll say this, and this is kind of in some ways against my interest to say this or I shouldn't say against my interest, but against like say like the narrative that would be easier for me, because what's going to happen is that, uh, chase Oliver is going to get a very low vote total. Um, and it would be like, uh, the easiest thing for me would be to take that and

go, see, this is why you can't run woke libertarians because look how much of a disaster it is or blah. But the truth is that had wrecked and walled one, it would have been the same situation. And then other, you know, won, it would have been the same situation. And then other, you know, woke libertarians would have said, see, this is why you can't run a guy like that. The truth is that once RFK joined in, whoever the libertarian nominee was, was going to get a much lower vote total than Gary Johnson. And I think even then, then Joe Jorgensen and it would have been right. This is not the reason I didn't run, but it would have been right for anyone to say, see proof that this is a failure. And so that is the obstacle when you've got another,

another third party in there, just the way it is. And that's what the Mises caucus haters. And there's many of them out there that are, they're allowed on Twitter. That's what they'll say after chase fails. They'll say, well, this is because of failure in leadership. But anyway, That's what they'll say after Chase fails. They'll say, well, this is because of failure in leadership. But anyway, to your question earlier. Yeah, things are horrible, man. It's unbelievably more difficult to get any messaging out. I think we've gotten crazier. We've gotten so much more polarized. I mean, I do blame social media for a lot of that government censorship. I blame for a lot of it. The polarization of Facebook and the way the algorithms are set up. I blame for a lot of it. But yeah, things have gotten definitively worse. And what drives me crazy is that things have

gotten so much worse observably. Like I live in L.A., right? It's a garbage shithole, right? And it used to be a little bit worse. But the homelessness problem, the cost of living, the immigration issues, these are so profound. And every Angeleno can see them on the street corners. And yet the bar is not really moving that much. That's what's kind of driving me most insane about this, because if you see things observably and we're talking like in the UK, labor just had this massive victory, overwhelming victory despite crime and violence. In France, these idiots are in the street. These leftist morons are in the street cheering. And granted, some of them were very hot in the videos I saw.

Really prime, gorgeous pieces of ass. But they're in the streets loudly saying that they've defeated fascism. And it's like you just got gamed by a coup of elites, right? I mean, literally, you had elites in France drop 200 candidates out to consolidate power by finding a few candidates and manipulate your process, and you're out there cheering it on, despite the fact that you have 100,000, you know, not 100,000, whatever, 50,000 immigrants coming in, you know, fighting-age men from Africa that are not acculturating, that are on every street corner, that are causing homelessness and crime and violence. And yet these people are voting the same way. That's what's driving me insane about the

overarching narrative of politics is it doesn't seem to matter how bad things get. People still are voting the same way. Yeah. All right, guys, let's take a moment and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is sheath underwear dot com, the underwear of legends. I love sheath underwear dot com. I've sheathunderwear.com. I've been telling you about them for over three years now. They have been a fiercely loyal sponsor of this podcast, and I'm very grateful to them for that. And I also love that it's just a genuinely great product.

I wear the underwear every single day. It's the most comfortable pair of boxer briefs you will ever own. So if you want to support a loyal sponsor of this show and get the best pair of boxer briefs you're ever going to own while you're at it, go on over to sheathunderwear.com. Make sure to use the promo code problem 20 so you get 20% off your next order. That's sheathunderwear.com, promo code problem 20 for 20% off your next order. All right, let's get back into the show. problem 20 for 20% off your next order. All right, let's get back into the show. You know, one of the things that's interesting in our libertarian world about this is that libertarians, I should say, probably emphasize theory more than any other group of politically active people. I mean, even like there's socialists

and stuff like that who emphasize their own theory. Obviously, we think their theory is wildly flawed, but even they are not committed in the way that libertarians are to like not break these principles and stand up for this way of thinking. And one of the things that's been kind of eye-opening to me that I've learned a lot from in the liberty movement

over the last few years is how much the gap of what theory does not cover. And it makes you wonder, you know, like can this old, the kind of Ron Paul coalition ever be really recreated under these? Like, for example, you have some there were some people in the Libertarian Party who there's been a lot of people who split off in different directions. But there are people who went and are supporting Biden now. One of the guys in the classical liberal caucus who was like the anti-mesis guy is now supporting Biden. And to me, it's like, look, I can understand an argument for supporting Chase.

I can understand an argument for supporting Trump. I can understand an argument for supporting RFK. There's no conceivable argument I could I could get for. Let's support the deep state candidate. Like, let's support the establishment candidate. And there is something where even though a lot of those people and us, we would agree on guns and taxes and money and foreign policy and not all of them. But with a lot of them, you're still like, wait, what are you missing here? That you would actually like, like how much have you internalized this propaganda that you actually think you're supposed to be on the side of the CIA? Like, that's who you would fall down on this? Like, were you, you're celebrating that like Trump was framed for treason or Trump was kicked off of Twitter or something like that? You're like,

do you, how much have you been duped by this? It's not even a question of like whether you're like the things we used to all think we used to all think the question was, how pure of a libertarian are you? How radical of a libertarian are you? The more pressing question in 2024 is like, do you get it? Do you get it at all? If there if there was like a right winger who might be really bad on a lot of different policies like that, I completely I'm more likely to be aligned with you than I am to be aligned with a libertarian who would go to Biden after a libertarian who would say, yeah, look, I don't believe in mask mandates, but I do think you should wear a mask. I don't believe in vaccine mandates, but I do think you should get the vaccine. I'm more aligned with that right winger. Even if even if in theory, me and you probably

have more common ground, if that makes sense. No, absolutely. Well, I mean, it's like you're saying, it's been astounding to see that that shift. And I'm trying to figure out what the base cause of that is. I mean, I don't know if it's just a it comes down to those base issues that people have of like, you know, LGBTQ stuff or anti-racism. Like, remember, we took the plank out about anti-bigotry. That apparently was such a big schism in the party that, you know, the classic liberal caucus that you're talking about. I'm not going to say the guy's name. I know exactly you're talking about and I hate him so much.

I don't want to promote him. But that drove people insane to the point where, to your point, there is no overlap. They abandoned all the basic philosophy and underpinnings of libertarianism. But that kind of ties into something that I've been thinking about that the party needs to do, right? And it's because, as you said, there's people that all we really want is core values of like hate the state, shrink the government, you know, reign in the deep state. These are basic core aspects like personal, personal property values, making sure people have the most freedom possible.

If we can get people to buy into those core concepts, to your point, I don't really care about a lot of the other fringe stuff they might believe. Like, I really want to, as a goal, create what I call shitty libertarians. Like, that's really my goal with the party. And I know it sounds ridiculous, but I really want to create shitty libertarians for a couple of different reasons, because, number one, I think it's the only way we're going to have power. If you think about this, you need people in mass like look at the Democrats and who votes for them. They believe in a couple of core issues and they let them get away with murder. They let them get away with abusing them, with power plays, with swapping candidates out, with inflationary processes, with denying,

you know, everything possible that's scummy on the underside of things. They ignore because they're fighting for, quote, women's rights or anti-racist rights, whatever it might be. These people are helpful idiots. Now, I'm not saying libertarians need to be idiots. We want to get higher quality people than that. But really, I just want people that check in to vote, that believe in reigning in the state, that believe in some core principles and believe in an overarching vision of what we can deliver. But you have to promise something to do that, right? You have to give people a concept to believe in that says your life's going to be better under libertarianism. And that's one thing that we don't do right now. And I think that we lose so many people based on that fact

who are driven out by the people that do understand the philosophy far too well. I mean, think about the number of libertarians who are just they've read every book. They're just, you know, these purist assholes who cannot get on board like you and me. We see eye to eye on the border issue, right? How the welfare state and the border issue, they can't go and sit. I remember talking about this. In fact, I remember me and you did, what was this show? Libertarians Drinking Liquor in their living room or whatever. And we were all just, this was, must've been in 2016 or 2017 or something like that. And it was like, it was when I was first really starting to turn on the

immigration issue. And we were like talking it through and it was like, it was like this interesting conversation. It's like, all right, guys, like we're libertarians and we hate the government here. Like, does anyone else notice that the biggest statists amongst us seem to love this plan of like unfettered immigration? Like that's kind of weird. Do we have to cheer on their plans? You know what I i mean like just like on a very basic level shouldn't we be against this then yeah exactly man but it's like but it's stuff like that yeah we have so many like how much pushback do you get every time you do an episode talking about the border issue from you know principled libertarians they are in fact while they're useful

in some aspects i'm sorry holding the party back like they are absolutely holding the party back because you can't expand on issues and that dyed-in-the-wool philosophical quote-unquote based aspect is good in some things but it's really going to limit you to uh you know autists and one to three percent of the vote and that's what we got well i'll tell you you know because i am because i'm as a libertarian you know know, I'm essentially a daywalker. Like I'm I'm half autist, too. You know what I mean? But then I can go mix it up with the normals. And so I'm there's a reason why. And this was even back when I was planning on running, I intentionally picked this fight.

And part of it, I will say 50 percent of it is because I'm one of you. And I actually, it irks me that I think those libertarians are getting the theory wrong. Like, I don't think open borders are deduced from libertarian principles. And I don't think, I don't think like you can do whatever you want on public property is deduced from libertarian principles. Whatever. I've done, you know, several done several shows on this topic. But the other reason why I was just when I was like, I guess I'm going to have to lead this charge. I was like, look, we got to like have this out right now, because, again, if you're just thinking about like the coalition that libertarians could theoretically put together, I think unlike in the Ron Paul days, when Ron Paul was running for

president in 2008, it's like, okay, well, this is, we live in a different world than 2008. And in Ron Paul's coalition, I think you could have some open borders people and some more, you know, immigration restrictionist type people all be in the same, you know, what we really care about is this damn war and this, the economy that just crashed and like all these things. what we really care about is this damn war and this, the economy that just crashed and like all these things today, if your starting point is like, I'm for open borders. And also I think in San Francisco or Los Angeles, that that is the homeless people's right to take a shit on the sidewalk. If that's your starting point, there's just no coalition to be had. Your coalition is, I don't even know. Listen, even when you say the one percent or something like that, it's not as if Gary Johnson or Joe Jorgensen were ever saying

that out loud. If they said that out loud, I don't even think they could put that coalition together. You know, so it's like your your coalition is 36 people on Twitter, man. If you're seriously going to look the American people and look, even if I think the theory is wrong, even if you thought the theory was correct, there's just kind of like this is reality. If you look any American in the face right now and tell them my plan is to immediately open the borders. Good luck. I mean, amongst Democrats. Good luck. Good luck with that. The number one issue in America is its economy and its immigration. That's it. So, yeah, it's a non-starter.

It's a non-starter to begin with. But, you know, to the point of how do you reach people, right? So you think about it this way. And this is what I was kind of teasing a little bit when we were chatting before the show and what we're working on with the Libertarian Party messaging. You need to have those core issues, right? But explain them. So we do. You know, immigration is fine. You can't have a welfare state when you have that. But on top of it, I think you need to have this kind of religious fervor, right? You know, like I'm saying, can't have a welfare state when you have that. But on top of it, I think you need to have this kind of religious fervor. Like, you know, I'm saying you need to promise people more, for example, parental rights. Right. Those are under attack, especially in California.

They're trying to break people up, the LGBTQ stuff, the trans stuff, taking your kids out of the home. If you don't use personal pronouns, there is a war in the family. Why does that exist? OK, well, the party, we're going to promise to give you that family back. We're going to promise to give you community back. We're going to what I mean by that is like you. There's a war on just community interactions. Now there's a war on an understanding of truth, promising that we're going to weigh in, you know, rein in the deep state, rein in censorship so you can actually understand the world around you. These are issues that people, I think, don't realize that are going through the intellectual cycle at any given time,

but you're seeing it play out in line in different ways. You're seeing it play out in the realities of how people interact, of where they understand the world and how they're realizing the lies are coming through. But as I mentioned, the problem, and I want to get your take on this, why do you think we're realizing this? So many people you talk to, especially after COVID, realize you've been lied to but continuously vote the same way i mean what what's your take on that because you asked me mine earlier i'm curious to hear what your take on this well i mean you know there's probably a different answer for different groups but the general theme is that like people are under spells

and they really are like you know the you know, you know, like in the matrix, when Neo is offered the blue pill or the red pill, and then he chooses the red pill and then we get a whole movie. I just think there's a lot of people who take the blue pill when they're given that offer. And then they go back to sleep and don't remember ever being offered the pill or whatever. And that's, I think like, that's, what's brilliant about that movie. There's something to that, that like people choose to like, I w I know I just saw that. I would like to take the pill where I unsee it and go back and wake up as normal because it's just for most people who aren't like obsessed with this stuff, the way we are there, they're like, this is just too much. If, if, if this is all bullshit, then I got to devote my

whole life to like understanding what this bullshit is. But if it's not, I get to go back to just all the shit that I cared about doing. And so I really do think now that being said, I have over the last four years or so, I have been flabbergasted by the ability of people to do this. And nothing to me was, was clearer than during covid where you're like, dude, this is wrecking your life. This is wrecking your family's life. This is wrecking your city. This is wrecking. And so many millions of Americans would still just be like, yep, but it makes me feel better. Like I bought into it and I'd rather not admit i was wrong yeah exactly well okay so perfect exactly so tying into that that's why i am changing the philosophy of how the party is rolling out because like you said nobody wants to admit they're wrong and everything we do right as libertarians from a party perspective even from what we do it's always complaining bitching we're going to take this down we're going to tear it down you've been lied to you're a moron this is not effective i mean you know telling somebody they're a moron

never works it will never work even if they're clearly wrong and you know how many twitter debates have you on how many of i want that you never they never are like you know what you're right man yeah i'm gonna i'm gonna join up tomorrow it doesn't happen so i stopped doing them for that reason i mean not like uh i'll still do debates and stuff but i'm'm not doing debates with like random LP members anymore because it's like it doesn't matter. It doesn't I've proven that it doesn't matter how dominantly I win or how much your case collapses. It's like you're just I'm just going to make a lifelong enemy out of you. And you're talking to people in the LP, not just random everyday schlubs off the street that don't even understand anything. Yeah. So, you know, so I think, okay, how are you going to do this? You have to take what people

want and then you have to say, all right, we have to change the narrative here to say, you're not wrong. You're not stupid. Here's what we're going to do. We're going to add on on top of it, right? You have to make a guarantee. And this is what we're bad at too. We never will put it like a balls on the table and be like, we're going to promise to make your life better because, you know, intellectually, we don't like to be liars. We're logical people. We're critical thinkers. Everything we do is kind of based in reality, right? Austrian economics. That's what we believe in is telling the truth and analyzing the marketplace as it exists. But what we need to do and has to be done is to say, OK, what in our philosophy can we promise that can be extended

into the future? You know, and it's easy to do that with like the Federal Reserve, with monetary value, with, you know, different monetary measures, you know, Bitcoin in case the society collapses and our dollar's worth nothing. Ending the war state, like there's so many things we can promise that can be better, but we've been either too pussified to do it or too, I don't know, philosophically based to do it where we feel like we're lying to people, but you have to do it. And on top of that, like we're talking about, people are, they take the pill and they don't

want to look back. I think you need to build, and I'm putting this in, you can call them parables if you want, but they are basically stories that people can read and remember. And one of them, I'll tell you, was inspired by a debate that you did with Moldbug. And the concept of this, this parable is called, you know, the stability of a million strings. And I remember before you guys were talking about like a basalt pillar, and he was arguing that you have to have government to keep that pillar up, right? Because people are pushing on both sides. I don't know if you remember this, but I stuck in my mind. I think his argument was like, once the pillar is up,

it's fine to have no government. But when the pillar is all the way down, you need government force to push it back up. It wasn't much of an argument. It was more of just a metaphor. But there was a lot thrown at me in that debate. But yes, I think that's an accurate representation of his point.

Close enough, close enough. But I took that and I'm like, OK, I wrote a parable about it, which is the parable of a million strings. But the concept is you can have no more stability. And this applies to the marketplace. Right. This is what the metaphor for you can have no greater stability than a pillar that is held up by a million different chains pulling on every single direction at all times, which is the marketplace. million different chains pulling on every single direction at all times, which is the marketplace, right? As soon as you start adjusting that and letting different people pull different ways, then you completely fuck the system. So it's like, you know, giving people simple stuff to remember in that parable manner to inspire them, to let them know that like, this is the way and like diversification of risk, I think is something we don't really harp about enough because our entire financial system is on the verge of collapse. Our military system, our entire world order is on the verge

of collapse because we don't diversify risk anymore. We're in these massive conglomerated groups of states and economies and financial systems. And it's like, you know, giving people this belief that we can make the world better and safer is what we don't do well enough. And it has to be addressed. All right, guys, let's take a moment and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is Interis Skin Care. Their founder, Nick Andrews, is a biomedical engineer by training and a former pharmaceutical industry maven and an enjoyer of martial arts. He often found his skin worn and in bad shape after contact with the mats, as well as his sparring partners. Moreover, the few products out there that worked well had side effects, and he wasn't willing to

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routine. Use the promo code PROBLEM for 10% off at checkout. That's promo code PROBLEM for 10% off at enteraskincare.com. Enteraskincare.com, promocom promo code problem for 10% off. All right, let's get back into the show. I also think that there's, you know, for whatever reason, the libertarianism as a philosophy attracts a lot of weirdos. And we and you know, I don't like I don't begrudge them. I love libertarians. Like, that's cool. You're into the same philosophy I'm into, you know, I don't like I don't begrudge them. I love libertarians like that's cool. You're into the same philosophy I'm into, you know. But there is something where weirdos have a tough time reaching normal people. And there's no even like and it doesn't seem, you know, Jordan Peterson had this thing back

in the day that I always thought was was very wise. You've probably heard it, but where he would say like, well, okay, so like the communists claim that they're motivated by helping the poor. It's like, okay, that's your claim. And then there's something very Austrian about this that he goes, well, let's, you know, it's kind of like demonstrated preference.

Well, okay, let's examine that versus what you actually do. Are you motivated by helping the poor or are you motivated by hurting the rich? Well, what did you actually do. Are you motivated by helping the poor or are you motivated by hurting the rich? Well, what did communism actually do? What did the communists actually do when given power? And then you kind of, and the libertarian version of that is that it's like, hey, are you actually motivated by spreading these ideas, by seeing them implemented, by helping people, or are you motivated by feeling like you're superior to everybody else

because you get a perfect A+, 100 plus five bonus points on your non-aggression principle test that you give yourself? And one example that I saw, and this guy, his name was Mark, I believe. I just had a brief interaction with him like months ago, where basically it was something like he was going like, hey, you know, like libertarians, I'm on board with like this whole program and I'm a member of the LP, but I open borders is crazy to me, man. Like you got to have, and then he's just flooded with a bunch of people like, then get out. You're not a real libertarian. And then I chimed in and I was like, just so you know, dude, you don't have to go anywhere because like so many of the best

libertarian thinkers also rejected open borders. And like a lot of people in the party do. And like, so you don't have to like leave anywhere. And he was like, OK, cool. Thanks. I appreciate that. And it's like this weird thing where, look, man, it's not even it's not even that they would go have the common sense to go, okay, hey, this is a guy who's with us on everything else has an issue with one issue. Let's try to keep this guy around. We can't, we'll never get anywhere if we kick everybody out who's like not perfect on every single issue. And then it was also the aspect that it's not like any of these people were trying to convince them. It's not like any of them were going like, well, listen, let me break this down for you. You see like, which,

okay. Like try, try at least to make an argument. Oh, the real problem here is the welfare. The real problem isn't the, whatever the libertarian argument would be, but no one's even trying to convince them. They're just trying to pat themselves on the back. Like I'm completely pure and you're not. And that, that whole thing is like cancer. It's like, got to get removed. If you ever want to grow in any meaningful way, you have to abandon this idea that, that you have to abandon the fact that your, your primary motivator is feeling really good about yourself. Cause that's actually pretty stupid. It makes no sense to feel really good about yourself. Cause you, what believe in a theory theory like, OK, even if it's the correct theory, so what? You got to do something

before you can feel really good about yourself over it. Well, that's the thing, right? It's like, again, going back to I want to create shitty libertarians. I'm sick of these principal people who will who all they do is attack. All they do is want to control. Like, I mean, look, dude, we were both at the convention. You see what happens there. You see these people that fight tooth and nail over this like tiny fiefdom. Right. And it's a tiny fiefdom that these people, they hold sway over this party and it's all they care about. You know, it's granted autistic focus, but it's all they care about and being right in that little space. And they don't give a shit about actually impacting anybody. They don't give a shit about really impacting the world as long as they

maintain their values. Like Jacob Hornberger, former Mises caucus darling. What happened to that guy is crazy. And he is like the he is like the poster child. And, you know, Jacob's a nice enough guy, but poster child for irrelevance and attacking the party consistently now, vocally attacking the party on Twitter and in speeches and anything he can do to tear down the current leadership because he wants to be mired in irrelevance and principle. And it's and this is predominant in the party. I just if we can if we can sub half the people out for people that just have some rationality, like I said, a base belief in freedom, liberty, reigning in the government that otherwise don't give a shit,

we will be so much more powerful, so much more likable, so much more. The growth is exponentially possible, especially now. I mean, you have polls of like 60 percent of the population wants a third party desperately. They see the corruption and they're like, OK, let me look at the Libertarian Party and have some asshole call me a fucking libtard because I disagree with, party desperately they see the corruption and they're like okay let me look at the libertarian party and have some asshole call me a fucking libtard because i disagree with you know the philosophy in one base point into your position not convince me in any way not make any rational argument that's going to make me think twice about looking at this party it's just going to piss me off yeah and and it's like yeah man it's unbelievable i mean personally you know from obviously like

i'm a little biased and coming from my own perspective on this but it would be something where like i to like the amount of p and look it was a minority in the party for sure but the people who just like still to this day but just just hate my guts, like within the libertarian party. And it's like, dude, listen, even if everything you say is true, you're like, okay, so let's just say you're right. And I'm wrong. So I'm, I'm bad on immigration and I'm bad on, uh, people jerking off in playgrounds or something like that or whatever. Like, okay. But like, I'm good on everything else. Like even by your own standards, like I'm good on everything else. And oh, like, okay, but like, I'm good on everything else. Like even by your own standards, like I'm good on everything else. And oh, hey, I get on big shows and I say it in a compelling way.

And 90% of the time, 99% of the time that I'm ever on like big platforms, I'm almost never talking about immigration or homeless junkies shooting up on the street. Like that rarely comes up. But so like, even that it's like, but the passion that they hate me with and many people in the Mises caucus, it's like, yeah, again, it's revealing. It's like, okay, so what you really care about is this fiefdom. Now, by the way, with the Jacob Hornberger stuff is I'm sure most of my audience isn't like super aware of this, but he, I know he would accuse me if I said this of being like, oh, you're just ad hominem. You're not like not responding to the arguments, but I mean, the arguments are so deranged. There's nothing to respond to. Like, it's like, oh, you're just ad hominem. You're not like not responding to the arguments. But I mean, the arguments are so deranged.

There's nothing to respond to. Like it's like there is nothing. It's simply that people who are single, who don't have kids, a lot of them did not do well through COVID. And that's really my explanation to it. It's like, oh, man, dude, like solitary confinement was not good for people who did not have anybody in solitary. Well, I guess it wouldn't be solitary then, but who didn't have other people with them is not good for them. Anyway, I want to one of the things that you mentioned in there that I think is really worth expounding on is the idea of stories, the idea of things that are going to sell to like potentially could sell to a large group of people. And there is it's another thing that I think libertarians have to grapple with that.

Look, the Declaration of Independence is like the most beautiful document ever written. And I doubt you'd find too many libertarians who would have like a major problem with the Declaration of Independence. But there's a reason why it's not a treatise on Austrian economics. You know what I mean? There's a reason why they're not getting up there and go, you know, you know, we've I mean, obviously, they didn't know this at the time, but like, we've figured out that value is subjective and something, you know what I mean? It's like, look, is it actually self-evident that God thinks we have inalienable rights? Probably not. OK, and I say this to somebody who does believe in God. Is it self-evident? No, you'd probably have to make an argument there.

It's probably not just pretty obvious if you look at human, but it doesn't matter. That's how it starts off with that declaration. Cause that's something people can like that tugs at your insides that like, you know, it's something that like pulls at your heart. And this is another thing that I think is really missing from libertarians understanding of how to interact with people. OK, you're correct in theory. OK, so now what? Well, that's pretty useless unless you can do something with it. And how do you do something with it? Well, you have to have something compelling to say to people and you have to think about what actually moves them. And most of the time, it's not the same thing that moves liberty twitter well and also look you're coming from a position of we have no power right remind me let's let's all acknowledge that we have no power the only power we have might be thanks to angela mccardle getting donald trump to commit to

freeing ross ulbrich and to putting libertarian his cabinet. That's the closest we've come to power ever. So, you know, let's think about that. When you have no power, your power is in manipulation. Your power is an inspiration. Your power is in storytelling and putting a little seed in people that can grow. I mean, like you're saying, you have to make a philosophical jump. You have to make a belief jump to say, we're going to promise you this and we're going to deliver it. And you have to say it vociferously. You have to make a belief jump to say, we're going to promise you this and we're going to deliver it. And you have to say it vociferously. You have to say it with conviction. And that's like what what the website reflects now, what our what our entire premise has to be is to convince people that regardless of what they might see, right, that behind the scenes, this is happening.

This is the future. This is the way. The Democrats do this all the time. Look at what the Democrats promise, depending on what they deliver. It's pure trash. And yet people double, triple down. They will vote for Democrat. They will never say. The GOP, same thing.

We're going to return to the old days and you're going to have a wife in the kitchen and one car. Bullshit. None of that's going to happen. You're still going to have guineas on your block. It's just going to happen. None of that's gonna happen. You're still gonna have guineas on your block. It's just gonna happen. None of this, it's all bullshit promises,

but they put it in a way that is inspirational. And yeah, libertarian philosophy does not, I mean, nothing about our philosophy is promissory. Nothing about it is, if you think about it, inspirational. Like I was saying before, it's all very cut and dry. It's all tear it down. And people can't handle the shock mentally that this is another you know problem with not to keep bragging on hornberger but i used to be and you actually convinced me to be an anarchist but

you know there's believing in anarchy and saying we need to be anarchist and then there's vocalizing hey if we take power we are going to instantaneously tear everything down you've ever known fucking retarded no one is going to believe it libertarians don't even want that i don't want that i'm sorry yeah i don't want my society to collapse on me you know instantly tomorrow we all talk about mashing the button but it's not a good idea to mash the button you have the buttons imaginary anyway it's all made mash the button. And the button is imaginary anyway. It's all made up. The button doesn't exist. Exactly. Exactly. So it's like you have to have this idea. But then also on a secondary level, we have to promise people a better future. But I do think there's something also to the concept of, look, what does happen if society collapses? Because all these

other these different parties, they don't promise that, you know, they're just saying, look, things are going to go on forever. We keep spending money. We change this and that. But the American empire is going to continue. I think there's something to be said for the Libertarian Party taking the tact of this shit is not going to last. It's going to collapse. And we're trying to set you up to succeed when it fails. You ask me who who's going to build the roads. Guess what? You're going to have to figure that out once society collapses, once the empire is completely in ruins, which is infinitely possible. And here we're going to give you the tools to succeed on your own. We're going to teach you how to do this. We're going to teach you how to govern. We're going to teach you how to think. We're going to give you the opportunity to have guns and grow

your own fucking food and raise your children where you don't have to depend on the government for these things because it may not be there. Yeah, it's been it's been interesting. I'm sure you've switching gears a little bit here. But, you know, we kind of talked about like how much has changed in the last few years. Obviously, we mentioned Mark Clare before, but he's certainly not the only one. There's been a lot of people who have come into the movement, who have left the movement. I mean, certainly, like, I know a lot of people who found me during COVID and then kind of like came into the libertarian world through that because, you know, libertarians were good or at least the good ones were not for the party

platform perspective. No, not necessarily. But that was yes yes, yes. The old guard was not good on it. But, um, what do you make of say, like the people, and I'm not even saying this describes Mark necessarily, but the people who have kind of moved to the hard right from who were in our world before that? before, I think that there is there's two ways that COVID can break people's brains. And one of them is to force people to the hard right during COVID. You know, the Libertarian Party was not strong on it. I mean, they weren't people like us were, but we don't have power. It's going back to my point about power. These people, I think, went harder to the right because during COVID, they had a crisis where they didn't have a job. They're they're having their their livelihood taken away and they feel completely powerless to change it. And they go, OK, the Libertarian Party is not going to do anything to help me right now. Maybe going with a hardcore GOP version is what has to be done to protect my freedoms and protect my liberties. And that's why I'm going to pivot to that position.

And maybe I'm sacrificing some of my my previously held beliefs here, but I'm looking at what works when the rubber hits the road. And I think that's a lot of it, especially when you're in that isolated version. You know, some people went left and they said, you got to get vaccinated so I can go live my life. Other people went right and said, why is we got to kill the people who want me to be vaccinated? Yeah, but but I mean, that that to me, it makes a lot of sense. It's just, especially like burnout is so high in the libertarian world, uh, in general, because of the frustration of, of not being able to actually move the needle in any meaningful fashion. Yeah. Yeah. No, I would. I mean, that is a struggle of the hard, right. Also, it's not as if they're, uh, they're moving the needle much more, but yeah, I get, I get your point. It's been interesting to kind of watch. I also do think there's something, um, you know, if we're talking about the idea of something that could really catch fire,

that could win a lot of people over that has a potential to be a big movement. I do think there's something on, I've noticed this dynamic for a long time, but there's something on the hard right where people get, um, they get further and further into their own world i guess you could call it an echo chamber or something like that but where they do lose sense of the broader culture that you live in and what is feasibly possible within this you know like it's like you mentioned before like this idea of like you know like the trad con thing is very popular today and i do understand it as a response to the woke left. It's almost like guaranteed that this would happen.

By the way, who's leading that? Is it women or men? I don't know. I mean, honestly, the feminists, they've ruined everything for themselves. I can't even think that women. Yeah, they're all women. All the trad con influence I see are all women it's not it's there is something about like hardcore trad con women where they'll be saying something to you

and even if it's like a good point you're like okay good point could we take this point to the kitchen what are we doing what are we doing out here with points this is kind of the man's world um but well i remember um what okay i remember talking to uh christopher cantwell in i think it was 2017 yes it was 2017 because it was he torched cantwell no i think it was post i think it was i think it was immediately after like two weeks after or something like that and i remember talking to him it might have been a few weeks before. I really, I'm not sure, but it was right around that time. Like he was, he was had left. He was not a libertarian anymore. Um, but I remember he said to me at one point and like, I was just, just kind of like starting to build my career for myself. I think I'd done Rogan for the first time and I'd done like some

other big shows, but I didn't have nearly as many, you know, like the following that I have now. But he said to me at one point that he was like, he goes, you know, I really feel bad for you, Dave, because, you know, you're in a tough position here because you're a Jew, but, you know, you're a fairly honest one. And when the ethno state comes, I'm not sure what's going to happen with you. But like, if I have anything to say about it, you'll be cool, like you'll be allowed in or something like that. And I remember saying to him that I said, you know, a tempered version of this. But I was like, are you out of your fucking mind? Like, what world are you living? You think you're about to achieve your ethnostate? And I mean, I think I said, like, Chris, the way I can see it, I'm setting up a pretty nice career for myself.

And you are certainly going to end up dead or in jail. Like that seems to be more. But he genuinely believed when he was saying it to me that it's like, no, dude, this, they've bought so much into their own little world that they don't recognize how much, dude, none of this will ever play with like broadly with Americans. It's just not going to happen. Like, what do you think? You think we're going to live in a Catholic theocracy? Why would Catholicism win that? What world are you living in? Like, it's just this is also it's as ridiculous as when libertarians think we're going to be in an anarchist society like tomorrow, you know, like, oh, my God, libertarians wake up if we can make things a little bit less worse

in the next 20 years. That's phenomenal. That's way better than we're on pace to do right now. Right. Exactly. That's like, I mean, everyone needs to wake up. Everyone needs to wake up. I mean, like, well, the good news is for the first time, right, we've got Javier Millay, which some people still are still attacking for whatever else. But it's like kind of that same thing of like, look, guys, can you just shut the fuck up and just let the man work a little bit? And let's just see how this plays out, because if he's successful and yeah, I'm not a fan of him saying he wants to join NATO, but if he's successful economically with what he's doing, we have now a case study to point to for the first time in

history since the founding of America to say, look, we can we can unfuck this thing. We can unfuck the system if we just give him a chance. So please stop tearing him down. But yeah, to your point, people get in their delusional psycho states. They I mean, I don't know how people get to belief systems that they that they get to without any sort of check on reality. I mean, it really boggles my mind how people can achieve that, because it's like we're saying, like looking around when observably you can see where the culture is moving, how the power players interact, what the corporate media can do to destroy you, take you out. And especially now with the whole deplatforming thing, if you were going to have an ethnostate, if you had any buddy behind that, that they thought, I mean, look what happened to Marie Le Pen. She doesn't want an ethnostate, but as close as you're going to get in our modern society of getting an ethnostate was Marie Le Pen. And they completely undercut her by dropping 200 candidates out. There's zero possibility of it. undercut her by dropping 200 candidates out. There's zero possibility of it.

Well, it's I feel the same way about some of the people in the Free State Project, which, by the way, still to this day, I think the Free State Project is a great idea. And I think there's been like tangible successes from it. And I totally support anybody who wants to go participate in. And I think it's like like a great strategy to embark on. But I will hear a lot of people up there in New Hampshire talking about how they're only a few years away from seceding from the union. And you're like, dude, listen, like you guys got to be honest with yourselves here. Do you not listen? Even if you take over the state, which you haven't already. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, it's not as if you've taken over a state. You have influence in that state, but there's still a lot of Democrats up there in New Hampshire. And like, actually, Nikki Haley did pretty good in her primary in New Hampshire. Yeah. Yeah. But it's like, dude, do you not realize where we're at as a national government right now? If you think there is any chance that under current situations or anything close to current situations, they'd allow you. Do you know what they would do before they'd allow any state in this union to secede right now?

If you're curious, just take a look at the last time a group of states tried to secede and they were willing to fight a war over it. And they're going to have to reinstate slavery just to free the blacks to take out New Hampshire. Right, exactly. We will fight you with our army of conscripted black people, New Hampshire. Now, we will be doing most of this fighting in the summer. I'll grant you that. But anyway, yeah, it is just it's hard, especially I do think I think you're really on to something there. And this is true for for dissidents across the political spectrum that it's hard when you're losing so bad to not retreat to a fantasy. You know, it's hard to not retreat to some fantasy where you're going to be the goddamn hero and fuck all these guys up. But if you actually want to be the hero and fuck all these guys up. It's going to, the first step is dealing with

reality. Yeah. But that's the irony, right? The irony is we're shitting on people that are living in the libertarian fantasy world. And meanwhile, I'm on your pitching. Like I'm pitching a brand new libertarian fantasy world and I need you guys to buy in. I need, I need, I need the mass population to buy into my new libertarian fantasy. Well, you know, you can look, you can manifest things into reality, but they have to have a basis in reality in order to do it. All right, guys, let's take a moment and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is Lumen. Lumen is the world's first handheld metabolic coach. It's a device that measures your metabolism through your breath. And on the app, it lets you know if you're burning fat or carbs and gives you tailored

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a bunch of benefits, including easier weight management, improved energy levels, better fitness results, better sleep, et cetera. Lumen gives you recommendations to improve your metabolic health. It also tracks your cycle as well as the onset of menopause so you can keep up your energy and stave off cravings. So if you want to take the next step in improving your health, go to Lumen dot me slash problem to get 15 percent off your Lumen. That's L-U-M-E-N dot me slash problem for 15 percent off your purchase. Big thank you to Lumen for sponsoring this episode. Let's get back into it. Let me ask you, as we're coming up toward the end of our time here, into it. Let me ask you, as we're coming up toward the end of our time here, what there's obviously been a big split within the Libertarian Party over the presidential elections. I understand you are you know what I mean? Like you have a job at the party. So maybe there's like some things

you you shouldn't say or can't say, but get paid well well so don't worry okay so there you're all right so fuck it um so there's you're not risking too much uh you're just a communications director what is what is talking about stuff i have to do with that job um but so obviously there are there are some people in the party who are supporting chase oliver there are uh this kind of i don't know how to say it i don't want to upset anyone but this kind of, I don't know how to say it. I don't want to upset anyone, but this kind of open secret deal that's being made with Donald Trump. There's one, was it in Colorado? I think they're getting behind Bobby Kennedy. This is bizarre. I've never seen anything like this happen before in the Libertarian Party.

What are your thoughts on all of it? Or who do you think libertarians should support? Should they support anyone? I don't know. What do you think? I mean, look, I actually I do endorse. Well, look, if you if you believe in Chase, if you believe in his message, you believe in libertarian philosophy, vote for Chase. You know, go for it. You know, Angela's premise is that Donald Trump is going to be a better option. He's going to, as we said, closest to power we're ever going to get is probably with the Donald Trump presidency. If he lives up to his promises and who knows if he will or not. But you know what? He made the promises. If we can get a libertarian in his cabinet, that's unbelievable. Chase Oliver, I think, has I mean, he provides a problematic candidate.

You know this. You know, you yourself said I'm distancing myself from the party because of this, which is fine. But it's one of those things where the purists and again, this is the problem with the purists. Why want shitty libertarians? You've got purists that are so outraged by Chase Oliver, who is on 95 percent of things that libertarians care about, probably spot on. I mean, to a T, probably spot on with you. But that 5% of, you know, one of our hot butt issues, which is trans and what you do with the kids. And of course, COVID, where he was not explicitly saying to get your vaccinations, but is taking photos with Pfizer. You know, I mean, those are things that obviously are going to piss a lot of people off.

Well, the thing, by the way, can I just and please don't lose your train of thought. I just want to say this before I forget it. I think the the celebrating when Donald Trump got kicked off of Twitter might be the worst one for me because it's just it's it's again, it's not that the distinction is even theory. It's like blue pill, red pill shit. It's like, oh, do you not see what's going on here you're you're cheering on the thing that will destroy us like the only hope we have is to have some degree of freedom on the internet to be able to talk about this stuff and without that it's over and like oh you you so don't get it that you think this is a win because what the racist man is gone

or something like that but anyway i'm sorry continue well it's like well just you know it's kind of like lou rockwell before he went off the deep end with israel um you know he had that they did he go what do you mean off the deep end with israel not not lou rockwell sorry not walter block um walter block sorry walter i apologize yes emperor goody emperor baddie. There is a lot to that when you have the Biden administration, all the evils of that administration, the overarching authoritarianism, lawfare, their immigration stuff, everything about the Biden administration is an affront to libertarianism in every possible way. So, yes, I endorse us supporting Donald Trump in states where it could be a swing state. You can cast your vote for Chase and that might make you feel good inside.

And look, I will do everything we're doing, everything we can to try to support Chase, you know, where it's going to be good for everybody. Right. And it's not a hot button issue. Right. But at the end of the day, like we were talking about earlier, Kennedy is taking so many votes away that it's going to be up to you to decide if you want to vote on your philosophy, go for chase. If you want to try to sway the, you know, the, the measure of freedom back towards some modicum of normalcy, I'm sorry, but you have to look at Donald Trump and go, this is a reasonable option here because the other option is psychotic. You know, we're over. America's done. I mean, Kamala Harris, I don't think I'm being too hyperbolic here. Kamala Harris is going to take over the presidency if Biden wins. There's no chance that doesn't happen.

She'll probably take it over before November. But yeah, it's likely. But 100 percent certainty Kamala Harris will be president if Joe Biden is reelected. No, I'll say this the way the way I look at it. And this is kind of the closest, I guess I'd say to or whatever. I mean, this is just honestly where I'm at. Look, if my choice is in 2008 is I can vote for Barack Obama or I can vote for John McCain or I can vote for Ron Paul or something like that. Let's say you're in the Republican primary still. There's like 100 billion times out of 100 billion times I'm voting for Ron Paul because I don't care. There's first of all, there's this huge movement with a ton of enthusiasm behind him. He's drawing gigantic crowds. He's breaking fundraising records. He's opening up the minds of the next generation in a way that nobody else is. And also, he is actually the

answer to saving the republic. Like he's the only shot we have to actually save this thing. It's sure disaster with either of the other two. And we save the republic with this guy. And he's the greatest human being in the world. Just easy, easy decision for me. That's not the world we live in anymore. And right now the corporate media is trying their best to demonize this project 2025, uh, uh, stuff, which is like, you know, it's the things that they're even picking out of it are like, it's all these kind of like hot button issues that just honestly, you know, the abortion pill or something like that, like that's what you're supposed to vote on. Look, if the choice was between Project 2025 and there's plenty of shit in there that I disagree with, but if the choice was between that

or the choice was W.E.F., central bank, digital currency, eat bugs, own nothing and be happy. If that's the choice, I'd pick Project 2025 100 billion times out of 100 billion times. Now, by the way, I don't even think Donald Trump's going to implement any of it. I think the choice is more likely between Trump's last term and the fear of what all this other stuff might be. But there's really no question that like, if I'm getting in the game of voting, I'm not even considering Chase Oliver because it's not like any of those things that I mentioned with the Ron Paul campaign are there. There's no movement being created out of this guy's candidacy. This isn't opening up people's minds. I'll open up more people's minds by talking on my podcast than by supporting this guy for president. It's just like complete. None of that's

there. I don't trust the guy. I don't think he showed good character. He doesn't seem to get it on any level. You know what I mean? Like if you were like if you were not against the covid insanity and instead you were saying like, hey, I had Thanksgiving, by the way, Thanksgiving. This is November of 2020. OK, you've had March, April, May, June, July, August, September, October. You're in November now. And you were still bragging about how you're having masks indoors at your dinner. I don't care where you are on guns. I don't care. It's meaningless to me. I don't care if you understand Austrian economics at this point, which I've never seen him demonstrate that he does. But regardless of

that, I'm just saying it's like that's not even on the radar to me. The question is, do I actually want to invest the time to go down and cast a ballot for Donald Trump or not? I live in a blue state. He's not going to win it anyway. I'm not like particularly motivated to do that. But that's that's where I'm at, is that that's the only decision to be made. Well, I mean, as I said, we sent out a recent email. I wrote it's like the party is still the party. So, look, I would say if you're in a blue state, go out, cast a vote, support the party because the ballot access is always a fight anyway. You want to maintain that public presence. But to your point about Chase, not creating a movement. He frustrated the living shit out of me because all of his campaign stuff during Pride Month is happening.

But he's going to gay pride parades and almost exclusively. That was where Chase Oliver could be found. Let me ask you, who's going to be voting libertarian at a gay pride parade? Is there one person you're going to talk to that's going to change their mind and decide to vote libertarian instead of voting for the Biden-Harris ticket? No. You're wasting your time. You're wasting campaign fund. You're wasting money. It just doesn't make any sense. So to your point, look, vote for the party. You're not voting for Chase. Vote for the party. Go in your state and vote, you know, if it doesn't matter. And I said, I'm in California. I'm going to vote for Chase Oliver. I'm voting for the party go in your state and vote you know if it doesn't matter and i said

i'm in california i'm gonna vote for chase oliver i'm voting for libertarian party in california well you don't if you don't live here uh god god bless you man you use your own decisions yeah make your own choices yeah no listen i i i get where you're coming from all right well brian i really enjoyed this man we got to do it again thanks so much. Thanks so much for coming on, brother. A pleasure, sir. Awesome to see you as always. You too, brother. All right, guys.

Thanks for listening. Catch you next time. Peace.