Piers Morgan Uncensored - “Anti-Muslim BIGOT!” Mehdi Hasan vs Steve Hilton + Ex Tate Staffer EXCLUSIVE

Episode Date: July 27, 2026

Is social media now the true battleground for modern conflict? From Iran using Lego to troll American adversaries, to Donald Trump using platforms to announce ceasefires and threaten conflict, the digital landscape has become a chaotic front line. In this episode, Piers Morgan dives into how the Iran War is escalating beyond the physical realm, with shifting alliances and high-stakes propaganda wins. He also looks at the massive U-turn by right-wing influencers who are rethinking their stance on Ukraine, and ask whether social media - while entertaining - is distorting our perception of reality. Plus we examine Elon Musk’s approach to his critics and his influence on Western civilization in a heated exchange from The Economist. All the above is discussed with CEO of X Strategies and Trump social media advisor Alex Bruesewitz, Zeteo News founder Mehdi Hasan and Republican candidate for Governor of California Steve Hilton  Piers also exclusively speaks to Mattea Petrescu, the former spokeswoman for Andrew Tate and Tristan Tate, about why she decided to stop working for them. Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent and sponsored by: Mars Men: For a limited time, our listeners get 50% off FOR LIFE, Free Shipping, AND 3 Free Gifts at Mars Men at https://mengotomars.com/. 00:00 Introduction 02:40 Alex Bruesewitz discusses Trump's social media strategy 08:30 – Should Trump be above social media? 10:50 AD: Mars Men: For a limited time, our listeners get 50% off FOR LIFE, Free Shipping, AND 3 Free Gifts at Mars Men at https://mengotomars.com/ 11:50 Laura Loomer’s visit to Ukraine 17:15 Mehdi Hasan and Steve Hilton join  23:15 Steve Hilton on his "Gladiator" campaign vdeo 24:20 Polymarket poll: Who will win the California governor election? https://polymarket.com/event/california-governor-election-2026 26:30 Mehdi: ‘Which Steve Hilton are we voting for?’ 31:45 The Iran War and Trump's social media strategy 33:50 Mehdi Hasan reacts to Steve Hilton's comments on Iran 39:55 The Economist questions Elon Musk about being ‘anti-Muslim’ 47:10 Netanyahu to meet Trump at the White House 52:49 Former Tate staffer Mateea Petrescu joins to discuss brothers’ extradition to the UK 54:30 Mateea on why she no longer defends the Tates Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Now streaming on Disney Plus, the Hulu original series Furious follows FBI agent Alice Black, played by Emmy Rossum, on the hunt for a mysterious and calculating serial killer. Both walk their own paths toward justice, and as their lives start to intertwine, the line between right and wrong begins to blur. New episodes week over week. Watch the Hulu original series Furious, now streaming only on Hulu on Disney Plus. Are you anti-Muslim? I am against. This is the world's richest man who claims to be for free speech, claims to be for debate. But any time he gets even the mildest of questions, he has a total meltdown.

Do you remember when Don Lemon interviewed him in 2024? He almost started crying during the interview and then cancel Don Lemon's show as a punishment. There's no denying that social media is now a battleground in all modern conflicts. The Iranians are scored of propaganda win by routinely using Lego to depict their American adversaries as idiots. The US president has used social media throughout the Iran War to announce and cancel ceasefires, threatened genocide and irritate Katie Perry. Well, this weekend, with the war on hold pending the visit of BB Netanyahu to Washington, D.C., Trump trailed the idea that U.S. forces may soon attack Kag Island.

It's where almost all of Iran's oil is processed. The US now says it could take over the land at any time. Well, pause or no pause, the war seems to be again escalating. The hooties are dragging in Saudi Arabia. Iran has put Ukraine on notice after an apparent drone attack on an Iranian vessel, and Ukraine has scored what seems to be a social media propaganda win of its own. A series of right-wing influencers took to X this weekend to reveal that they've been hoodwinked by Russian propaganda all along and that Ukraine's fight is their fight.

after all. Well, Trump governor, Laura Luma, who previously said that President Zelensky was a Nazi, even traveled to Kiev to apologize to him in person. If you're struggling to keep up with all of this, it's probably time for a periodic reminder that social media while entertaining is not the real world. But do you understand why? Do you think what you're doing is helpful for Western democracy? Maybe some people do love me. And that's probably true. I don't care. The, uh, But the fact that, as you pointed out, a quarter billion people follow me is that I think a lot more people actually like me than don't. And I think a lot more people hate you and the media more than you realize.

Well, there might be nefarious reason lurking behind every hot take which enrages you. And your followers are not always your friends. It's a lesson which may have evaded the world's richest man and most famous social media proprietor. In a few minutes, we'll debate all of this and more with Medelléh and Sama and Steve Hilton. But joining me now is the man that many credit for masterminding the meme presidency of Donald Trump, CEO of X Strategies and Trump advisor, Alex Brousowitz. Well, Alex, welcome to Unsense.

Thank you for having me on, Pierce. It's a pleasure to be with you. So, look, there's no doubt that you and your team have turned the Trump presidency into a memeatastic, ongoing extravaganza, good, bad and ugly, depending on what people think, I guess. But let me just ask you just directly off the top. Between 11.16 a.m. and 5.16 p.m. on Sunday. So this weekend, President Trump posted 43 images on true social,

majority of which appeared to be AI generated. They included Caitlin Collins from CNN as trans-budd-light influencer Dylan Malvaney, a post-depicting late-night talk show host Jimmy Kimmel, Stephen Colbert, Jimmy Fallon, being broke, unemployed, and begging for money, a most surreal of all, an animated tale of aliens at the heart of Washington. Let's take a look. Now, Marjorie Taylor Green responded to all this

by saying people carterfold, gas, groceries, rent, and health care, and this is the weird, embarrassing crap the official White House account is putting out. Does she have a point, Alex? Well, I don't think she has a point, and I also don't think that she's in a really, great position to talk. You know, Marjorie Taylor Green used to be a client of mine, and she liked to push the boundaries on social media as well. And so perhaps she has changed her mind on how she

uses social media. Maybe she's a bit more distinguished than she used to be. But I think that's silly criticism coming from Marjorie. I also want to clear the record here. I don't run any of the White House social media channels. I am not responsible for any of the official President Trump social media accounts. I think the social media team at the White House does a great job, a creative job. And I would much prefer having a White House and a president as transparent as President Trump than the previous guy, Joe Biden, who no one knew what the hell he was thinking. And so the president has a unique imagination, and sometimes he expresses himself on social

media in a unique way like all of us do, Pierce. So just to clarify then, what exactly do you do for President Trump when it comes to online stuff. So my company, we have the fun privilege of helping run social media accounts like at Team Trump on Instagram, on TikTok, also Trump war room on X. These were all

official assets of the Trump 20204 presidential campaign and we use them as offensive promotional tools for the president and his agenda and also many of his endorsed candidates. And so we play a complimentary role from the outside, but we do not work in the government.

But I'm very proud of the social media team in the White House. I think they're very creative. They know how to get views. I think views are very important. And the previous administration, during the president's first term, he didn't have as effective

of an operation to get his message out. And so the American people would only hear the message coming from the media, which oftentimes, most of the time, was quite biased. And so we have a few unique changes. now to get the president's message out. Obviously, at real Donald Trump is paramount,

but the White House is doing a great job, in my opinion. They can be a little bit hot sometimes, but I think they're doing a great job and they have a very talented team over there. You know, I've got no real issue with Trump mocking the late-night hosts. A lot of them to spend their entire time in advanced Trump derangement syndrome.

I felt that for a long time, to their detriment, because the old late-night hosts never used to do that. They never used to reveal their, partisan colors in quite the same way. Where I don't like it, I'll be honest, when when President Trump posts out a meme portraying someone like Caitlin Collins, he's an excellent journalist, yes, she does my old 9 p.m. slot at CNN, she's never been personal about him. And yet there he is mocking her as a probably the most famous transgender person in America. Where's the win there? Because to me, it's sort of, it's really just seems a bit mean, cruel, misogynist, actually.

What do you feel? Well, Pierce, a lot of people online would probably accuse you of doing something called white knighting right now. I'm not going to accuse you of doing that. I don't think you're Caitlin Collins white knight here. I'm not familiar with the meme. I heard the joke that he made at the White House Correspondence dinner. You know, it was a roast. If people are offended by it, you know, that's their own problem.

I don't know, Caitlin. I've never met Caitlin. To say that she's never been personal towards the president, I don't think that's a fair take. To say she's an excellent journalist, that's your opinion. You know, I think she's been, I think that everyone at CNN has been awfully personal and quite disrespectful to the president over the years, but he's a big guy. He's a public figure. He can take it. And so I think it was, I think it's been totally blown out of proportion. I personally don't think Caitlin Collins looks like Dylan Mulvaney. you know, but some people do.

I personally don't, but it's a meme. It's a joke, and I think people will get over it tomorrow. Should the President of the United States just be above all this? I mean, that's the question people ask. You know, I think Trump's a unique political figure. I remember when he first won in 2016, I spoke to him just after the inauguration, and he was saying, my team wanted me to come off Twitter as it was then. What do you think?

I said, absolutely not. It's your authentic platform. It's your voice, right? It's what makes you different. I still believe that. I think he is, by his own boast, probably the most transparent president we've had. He loves talking to journalists,

and that can be good and bad. I just feel like with the meme strategy, some of it is brilliant, and some of it is, I think, crosses a line. Does it matter, though? In the meme world, does that matter? I personally don't think that Americans are going to vote based off.

of a meme that they found offensive. I don't think they're going to vote against him because they found a meme to be offensive. And believe it or not, the president has won two elections already. He won the popular vote. I think he actually won three elections, and he never changed his style. And so people, as you mentioned,

since the beginning of the Trump political era, they said, please, sir, don't be so aggressive on social media. Guess what? He maintained that aggressive posture, and he went on to win multiple elections. And so he's currently in the White House. Is it presidential? I don't know. The president is doing it. So maybe he's redefining what it means to be presidential. I think that a lot of people, you know, in politics, they have a public image that doesn't match their private image.

I think what's so unique about President Trump is he's the same, regardless of who he's with. And he doesn't switch up. You see people in politics in Washington, D.C., who have very strange personal lives. But they go on television, they talk so proper, and they talk about how important. they are and how serious they are. And then you see him getting drunk at a bar and hitting on somebody that's probably not their wife. And so the president is who he is. I think that the American people benefit greatly from that.

And so I personally like the president's social media style. I've learned a lot from the president regarding social media. I think he's the number one influencer in the world. And so, but people have had your opinion on maybe he's coming in too hot for the last 10 years, but I don't think it's going to change anytime. I don't think you'll change for a moment. Summary is almost upon us, and if you're not completely satisfied with your beach body, my condolences, that must be hard for you.

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Let's just move to Laura Luma because she went to Ukraine and performed an extraordinary complete pivot on Ukraine, on President Zelensky. She apologized to his face for the things she called him and for her view of the war and so on and so on. It was a remarkable sort of by somebody who'd never really apologized for anything. in her life. A remarkable admission that she got this completely wrong. And as somebody who actually agrees with what she feels now, I'm all for it. But you said in a post, if an influencer wants to take a sponsored trip to another country, I've no problem with that, want to promote how great the food

is there or how beautiful or foreign city skyline is, amazing, you do you. But if you take that same sponsored trip and then use your platform to push for America to send more arms or weapons to a foreign country or remove tariffs on that nation, That shouldn't be allowed. Now, you know, she's not just any old influencer Laura Luma. She has the ear of the president. So I would say that her pivot is significant. It's not like watching somebody who, you know, influences people about buying handbags.

This is somebody with a direct line to the president who can influence, I believe, what he thinks. So why shouldn't she do this? Well, my tweet wasn't directed at Laura Lumer. I actually did even watch her Zelensky interview. I know it made quite a bit of news. Laura's very good at making news. I'll give her that much. And I consider Laura a friend.

She's been somebody I've known in this space for since I was 19 years old. And so maybe I'll go back and watch the interview. So my tweet wasn't directly focused at her. I've been tweeting about getting foreign influence out of the right-wing media ecosystem online since May. It's been something I've been very passionate about. It's been something I've been focused on. It's been something I've been tracking for well over a year. About a year ago, I watched a bunch of right-wing influencers who have never tweeted about

India in their lives. I'll tweet about in unison why President Trump shouldn't tariff India. They should be tariffing Russia and China. And believe it or not, Pierce, that does not appear organic to me. And so I'm very concerned about what's taking place. I've personally then approached by multiple foreign countries to do influencer-related campaigns on their behalf. And I hold the position of I personally do not do work with foreign governments or foreign companies. And that's going to be a position that I maintain forever. I'm very concerned

about the lack of disclosures in this. Again, I'm not specifically focused on Laura Lumer. I don't think Laura Lumer was compensated by the Ukrainian government for that interview, full transparency. I don't believe that happened. But what's happening is a lot of these influencers are totally switching their views on certain issues and it doesn't appear organic. You know, you have certain influencers who are anti one country, but then they're advocating for a deal that's being funded by another country. None of this stuff makes sense to me because I believe most of this stuff is all paid for propaganda. And I think that to have a healthier country moving forward, we're going to need stronger disclosure laws on social media. And another pivot, by the way, since we're on this

topic, Candace Owens, for example, she was at the embassy opening in Jerusalem. in 2018. She was a big supporter of Israel. And now she's not. And so was that organic? I don't know. But I don't care whether it's Qatar or Israel or Ukraine or Russia, a bunch of influencers just did a field trip to Russia. I'm not a fan of that either. I don't care what country it is. I think there needs to be substantially stronger disclosures. And I think there's actually laws on the books that maybe they're just not being enforced, but they should be enforced. And so I'm totally against foreign influence in the American right-wing media ecosystem and specifically social media influencers. And would that include Tucker Carlson for his visit to interview Putin in Russia and a lot of the

travelogue stuff he did? Yes, certainly. I mean, I don't think that cheerleading for foreign countries as an American media personality is something I like. I watched, I did watch Tucker's Putin interview. I think that came out in 2023 or something. So it was a while ago. And he talked about how great Russia is. Look, I don't think doing advertisements for how great foreign countries are if there's a political angle to it is appropriate, whether it's Russia or Qatar or India or Israel. I think there's a major difference, Pierce, between accepting an invitation to go speak at a foreign event, whether it's the Doha Forum or a forum in Athens, Greece, or in Korea. And I think there's a difference between doing that and then visiting the country and then changing your views about the country and advocating. for that country's interest using your platform. So if you want to go interview a world leader, be my guest.

But if you then go interview the world leader and turn around and say, America must, you know, do this. America must drop sanctions off of XYZ country or remove tariffs off of XYZ country or send weapons to XYZ country. I think that is pushing limits. I don't think that's journalism any longer. I think that's advocacy. I think it's wrong.

Thank you very much indeed for joining me. Thanks, Pierce. Well, joining me now to debate all this and more, two Brits who've taken US politics by storm in very different ways. Medea San, the founder of Zateo News, and Steve Hilton, Republican candidate for governor of California. Well, welcome to both of you. Medea San, everyone's in this meme game right now.

It's the biggest problem with Donald Trump that he's just better at it and has a bigger platform than anybody else. I'm not going to agree with you that he's better at it. Clearly, he's worked out a way to use that platform and that foghorn in a way to get his message across. He's done that for the last decade. He's managed to bypass traditional media by creating that direct relationship with his base while also discrediting the media, attacking them as fake news,

driving down their approval ratings and trust. He's done very well at that. I don't think the kind of posts you mentioned just now to Alex, the kind of 43 posts in the middle of the night, I don't think they do trump any favors at all. I think I'm often glad that we have an unhinged fascist running, trying to run the country, rather than a hinged fascist. I'm glad that Donald Trump isn't the disciplined person his supporters wish he was,

because then we'd be in a lot more trouble those of us who oppose his agenda. Let's be real. His approval ratings are the lowest of any president at this point in their presidency. Part of the reason is because he posts unhinged nonsense. Part of the reason is because he comes across as a crazy person, as a sociopath often. And part of the reason, obviously, is he's failed on his pledges, you know. gas prices are up, inflation's up, et cetera. So I don't quite buy that.

I agree with you, peers, in the sense that he uses it as a weapon, and clearly it's a very powerful weapon for him. But it's a double-edged sword. It's also allowed us to see him posting in the middle of the night, absolutely insane things that his most loyal followers, including Steve, can't defend if you put some of those posts to him. Well, let's ask him. Steve, welcome to Unsensored.

You know, you want to be governor of California. Are you entirely comfortable when you see some of the outpourings from President Trump with these means. Well, great to see you both. I'm struck by a couple of the phrases that you used earlier, peers, in your conversation with Alex. One of them was above it all.

Certainly, everyone has their own style, and that's not my style in this race, because what I'm focusing on is actually what you also mentioned in that conversation, which is the cost of gas and groceries and healthcare, which is higher in California than anywhere else in the country

as a direct result of, 16 years of rule by the Democrats. And that's what I'm fighting to change. And that is 100% my focus on the substance, including, for example, pointing out that my opponent, Javier Bacera, straight after this interview, I'm going to a press conference where we're releasing a whistleblower testimony that exposes really the biggest failure of his entire political career

when he was health secretary under Biden. He basically turned the HHS, the Department of Health and Human Services, into the biggest trial trafficking operation in history as a direct result of the actions that he took. It's a shocking, shocking story, which should be completely disqualifying. So for me, in my race, it is all about the substance

and what we can do to help people with the highest cost of living in America, which is thanks to Democrats' policies here in California. I read an interesting pitch from you, Steve, I think, in the last few days, where you were basically appealing to people who don't like Trump or maybe even hate him and saying, you can still vote for me.

I mean, that's an interesting little tap dance, isn't it? Well, look, just as a facts, peers, which everyone can see the lie of the land in California. There's two competing things going on. You've got a clear majority of Californians who want change, who think the state's going in the wrong direction and want change, primarily because of the cost

and hassle of everything here in California. The numbers saying they want a change of direction, you hover around 60%. At the same time, you see the approval ratings for the president in the White House, almost the inverse of that. So you've got this group of people in California, millions of Californians who would prefer a Democrat president,

but who want change in California. And so the focus of my campaign is saying to those people, I understand that you have strong views about the occupant of the White House, But let's focus on positive, practical things we can do to get gas prices down here in California, to cut your electric bills in half, to cut your taxes. My centerpiece of my tax plan, your first 150 grand tax-free. These are simple positive things that everyone can get behind,

and that's what this campaign is going to be all about. It's obvious that my opponent wants to make it all about national politics. I'm trying to make it about California. So can I respond there? Before I go to Medi, I'm going to come to you and you can respond in full, don't worry. But I just want to make two points to Steve. One is when it comes to the meme game, you're not averse to a bit of meme action yourself. Let's take a look at this.

Please don't do this to me. I'm a nurse. Me and my husband just want to buy a home together. A home in this economy? Everyone can own a home, but only once they get past the machine. Enough is enough. You shouldn't have to fight for your life just to fill your tank, keep the lights on, and put a roof over your family's head. We don't have to live like this.

Enough is enough. Enough is enough. I've got to be honest, I thought that was rather good, albeit the ego is writing very large checks there, Mr. Hilton. I mean, you're portraying yourself as one of the great gladiatorial heroes and the history of movies. Yeah, not my idea, Piers, but definitely. part of our campaign. There's a whole team of people based here in California

who were very engaged in Spencer Pratt's campaign for L.A. Mayor. They weren't working directly for his campaign. It's often a misunderstanding about that. They were supporting him. When Spencer didn't make it into the runoff, those people reached out to us and said, look, we'd love to work for you.

And so now we are working with them and they are part of the campaign. And they're supporting, general message and that's what that message is that we've had enough of all the nonsense in California and the high cost of living. The creative expression of that is in their hands, but I agree with you. I thought that was very effective. Okay, Medi, the latest polymarket numbers on Steve is a $40 million market on polymarket, which is big. They've historically been as accurate, if not more than opinion polls.

And they currently have Steve's opponent with a 93% probability of victory in him just with seven. So notwithstanding the gladiator memes, he's got it all to do in what is historically a difficult state for a Republican to win, obviously. But to Steve's point there,

is it credible to you to be the Republican nominee in one of the biggest states in the fifth largest economy in the world? and basically say, look, I know that bloke in the White House, that you didn't say this, but you may as well have done. I know that bloke's a bit mad in the White House, and you may hate him and think...

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bounce back. OICOS Pro. Feed your strength. Visit OICOS.C.C. for more details. As you do, Medi, that he's a fascist and so on and so on, but vote for me anyway. Well, it's actually the fourth biggest economy in the world now under Gavin Newsom's watch. Steve should be very happy to be living in the fourth biggest economy. It's grown recently under Democratic control. I should add there. I'm a Muslim, so I don't bet, but I think it's fair to say Steve is not going to win this election unless something amazing or dramatic happens in his favor. in the coming months. I feel sorry for Steve, because he, like me, moved to the US,

became a citizen like me, has done very well in the media industry here, but he decided to run for office, unlike me, and he's decided to run for office in California, where he is trailing by 25 points in the polls, and as you say, the odds are against him. Now, I don't buy that you can disconnect yourself from Trump in a place like California, where I think Trump has an even lower approval rating than he does nationally, something like 30%. Steve, I've watched a lot of Steve interviews, and Steve often cites that 60% of California, want a change in direction. They think California is going in the wrong direction.

What he doesn't mention is in that same poll, California would say the country is going in the wrong direction at even higher numbers. And that's the bigger point. Gas prices, for example. Clearly, California has an issue with higher gas prices than the rest of the country. I'm not going to deny that. But the reality is nationwide gas prices are up because of Donald Trump and his ridiculous war in Iran. And everyone knows that. So Steve is stuck in that way. And I think the big problem for Steve, of course, is which Steve is running for office. And I think you put your finger on it there, peers, by pointing out, trying to do this dance where he's like, well, you know, I am also Trump and I'm endorsed by Trump, but I'm also not Trump,

but I'm also different to Trump. And I think people are going to have to work out which Steve Hilton is running for government of California. I knew Steve, as you did, Piers 10, 15 years ago, came on my radar, 20 years ago even, as the compassionate conservative, the moderate conservative. The guy who got the Conservative Party to take climate change seriously, took David Cameron to the Arctic to take pictures with the Huskies, changed the Tory Party motto to a a tree. Is it that Steve Hilton, or is it Steve Hilton now who talks about radical green agenda, climate lunatics, supports the president who says climate change is a Chinese hoax? I listen to Steve Hilton attack lunatic neocons for starting endless wars in the Middle East. Now we have Steve Hilton,

who says the Iran war is great, defense Donald Trump thinks Iran is the right thing to do. So I think people have to really work out which Steve Hilton are they voting for in California, because I'm not sure we're sure. Well, Steve, maybe you could enlighten this. Let's talk about Iran because obviously things like energy prices right now globally, but especially in a state like California, they're ragingly high as a direct consequence of a decision taken by your ultimate leader, Donald Trump, in the White House. I said at the time it began this war.

I thought it was a folly. I thought he could end up being a legacy-defining folly. I didn't think it could end in anything but where we found ourselves now. as a quagmire, which, if anything, I think, is emboldened the Iranian regime, far from dismantling it. They've discovered that by running a little straight of water, they can hold the entire world's energy as a sort of ransom. And by firing off missiles at their Gulf State neighbors, they're causing enormous damage to the business models of their neighbors, too. So this, to me, objectively, looks like it's going extremely badly. Would you defend what's how?

happened here with this war? Well, look, I try and avoid talking about things. I'm running for a particular job now, and I'm focused on the job at hand, rather than having opinions on absolutely everything. But just on the gas prices point, it is obviously the case that gas prices are higher across the country, causing a lot of frustration.

But it's also the case that they're even higher in California. In fact, if you just look at the numbers, just the prices, the effect of Democrat policies gas prices in California is about double the effect of the Iran war. But you're right, that Mehdi's right, that at the outset of this, really driven a lot by my future constituents, as I hope them to be, very strong Iranian-American community, particularly in Los Angeles. There was real excitement about what was happening and the prospect of finally overthrowing

this brutal authoritarian regime. And so absolutely, at that time, I did explain. a hope that this would help overthrow that regime. Of course, that's a different argument than the one that was being made and is being made now about nuclear weapons. That's obviously the initiating factor here. But a lot of that, by the way, was driven by my background. My parents are Hungarian, and there's both my parents, and there's a really strong feeling

among Hungarians. There was a very similar situation, in 1956, the biggest date in Hungarian history, where there was a student revolution against the puppet regime that the social revolution. the Soviets put in there. It's actually started in our hometown with students. And there's this hope that the West, either America or someone, would come in and help them. And there's this phrase that you hear from Hungarians the whole time, nobody came to help us. The Soviet tanks rolled in and crushed the revolution and ended up with another few decades of communist rule. And so there's a human aspect to it, I think, that also I was expressing at the time. I remember very clearly I spoke to A big, big crowd in the San Francisco Bay area, Nauru's, it was the last day of Persian New Year. And there was just this real sense of optimism that this would go in the right way.

But I haven't really, I don't know exactly what's going on. That's not my focus. So I'm not commenting on how we move in the war. Steve, come on. Well, hang on. A couple of weeks ago. Many, you were on. It's okay, I've got it.

Medi, I've got it. I'll let you come in. I'll just want a bit. You say you don't. I don't want to get involved to you, but you did when it started, posts on your ex-account, Trump and Iran. At home, we understand the importance of strength, to terrorists and accountability when it comes to crime.

It's the same principle internationally. And I mean, my point to you would be, very interestingly, you were clearly under the impression the original aim was regime change, as a lot of people were, because that was the music coming out of the White House. Very quickly, when that looked like it was not going to happen, because the ILC remained in tight control of the country. The people weren't uprising at all. The Ayatollah had been killed, but his son took over,

who apparently is even more hardline, and you have the asymmetric stuff going on with Stradiv-Fa-Foomuze and the Gulf State neighbors and so on. You know, when you put it all together, this is my problem with this war. I think that originally, that probably was the aim. But very quickly they realized this isn't happening. And to the Iranian people you've taught,

I'm in Los Angeles now. And I've spoken to a lot of Iranians who live, here. And there was a genuine feeling of hope that there might be a chance to finally get rid of this regime. But that evaporated very quickly. And I bet if you went and talked to the same people that you were just alluding to, they would all feel incredibly disheartened. That actually, far from getting rid of this regime, I honestly believe they've got more leverage now and feel more emboldened, particularly given the constant posting by President Trump of, we're going to annihilate you one minute, we'll do a deal

the next, I can work with these people, they're all crazy lunatics, the constant contradictory posting about this, I think, has led them to conclude he's, you know, he's the emperor with no clothes, he's the boy that cried wolf. That's not good for the United States, it's not

good for anybody. It just means that this regime now, I think, have got their gander up and feel emboldened. Yeah, but it's also not over. I mean, we're in the middle of it, and I think that sense of hope is still there among some people, and I certainly feel it. But as I say, I'm just not focused on, because I don't have the information on what is going

on day by day. But I still have that sense of optimism because it's something that I think was, yeah, I do. I say, do you? I say, do you, well, I'm certainly incredulous on two points. One that you want to be governor of this gigantic state, but have no idea what's happening with the biggest news story in the world on a daily basis. And secondly, you've got hope this is all going to end well. I'd find that slightly important.

You wanted to jump in. No, I just want to say, Pierce, to your point, I don't have any influence over it. I'm focused on the job I'm applying for, and that really has nothing to do with that. That's my point. A couple of things to respond to Steve. A couple of things.

I think he said three or four times I'm focused on the job in California. I mean, Steve Hilton was on Fox Business, Steve. You were on Fox Business two weeks ago. I watched it. You were on Fox business talking specifically about Iran, defending Donald Trump's Iran war strategy. You didn't go on Fox business and say to them

what you said to peers just now. You didn't say I'm focused on California. I don't want to talk about Iran. You've mounted a very vociferous defense of Donald Trump's Iran war strategy. You said Iran will collapse or come to their senses. So you were a big defender of the Iran war two weeks ago. That's exactly what I just said.

But don't say that you're not focused on Iran. You literally want to talk about Iran. I think the point is... So let me just... Let me just finish my other point. Let me just make my other point. On Iran and the people of Iran, of course, we all want the people of Iran to be free, to be secure, to have dignity, to have human rights. But you're supporting a president who, a couple of months ago, threatened genocide against Iran. He said, I'm going to destroy the entire civilization tonight. Did you condemn him for that?

In fact, in the last few days, he said, anytime Iran attacks a ship in the Strait of Hormuz, I will blow up a power plant or a bridge. That is a war crime, Steve. You can't just blow up power plants and bridges, civilian targets, because you don't like the opponent's strategy. That's against all the laws of war. So when you condemn Donald Trump for doing that, if you actually care about the Iranian people, why would you support a war that targets civilian infrastructure? Those are war crimes.

So the point I was just simply making, and is a consistent one, which is that I, as at the start of this, all the way through and now hope, as you do, that it will end with the removal of a regime that has brutally terrorized its people. As to the day by day,

operational conduct and the communication around that conduct. Obviously, that's nothing that is to do with the role of the governor of California, which is 100% my focus. So that's what I mean. But it will be. Steve, my point on that would be that I don't think the two are completely disconnected in the way you would maybe like us to think. I mean, apart from anything else, energy prices can determine whether the next governor of

California has a good first couple of years or a very difficult first couple of years. And so this does have direct impact, unquestionably. And also, this can get a lot worse before it gets better. People like Ben Shapiro, big influences in the conservative movement, have been saying things like this. Let's take a look. I get why people are confused and upset. It feels like things are stalemated, that they're getting broader and more difficult.

Why? Well, because what the American people want is victory. There's this bizarre notion in foreign policy that the American people are deeply worried about the immediate cost of war to the enemy. That the American people, that we can't handle the ugliness of war for even a day,

that every conflict has to be totally antiseptic. And here I'm not even talking about the American willingness to undergo casualties. No one in America wants American casualties. It's tragedy and a horror. We do understand that war does come along with casualties, and we are willing to undergo those casualties He's in pursuit of an end and a victory for America.

Now, Tucker Carlson, who, you know, at one point, was wedded, audologically with Shapiro and pretty much everyone on the right about things like this, said this by way of response. Obviously, this little freak, Shapiro could go volunteer to fight the war himself, but of course he won't. He's got no interest in making any kind of personal sacrifice. None of them do. Israel's finance minister, Brad Gabbardé,

they're having American soldiers fight Netanyahu's wars is the best for us. Smotrish doesn't want to die for Israel, neither does Ben Shapiro, dying for Israel is your job. You know, there is, as you know, now a massive debate raging around Donald Trump about whether to get out of this and take what would be a pretty humiliating loss or to double, treble, quadruple down and really go hard into Iran, possibly with ground forces. I don't think you can want to be governor of California and not have a view about which of those two things would else. ultimately be good for the many millions who live in the state. Of course I don't have a view on that that I'm putting here as part of my campaign for government. I've got views on lots of things, be it, but I'm not paid to have opinions.

I'm running for a job. I'm applying for a job. Now, you mentioned energy prices. It's absolutely right. As I said earlier, that's a huge issue. It's the driving reason. Everything is so expensive in California. But just the other week, we filled up our campaign.

campaign truck in LA, 649, we went to Texas for a couple of events the next day, 349. The Iran war is going on in a world where both of those things are true. Our electric bills in California are more than double the national average. That's a result of the climate fostering of the government in California. It's not doing anything for the climate. It's not helping the environment. What it is is massively increasing costs for working people and small businesses in California.

That's what I'm focused on. We can lower gas prices. My pledge is $3 gas. We can cut electric bills in half in California by changing our policies here. Nothing to do with the Iran war, nothing to do with federal policy. I think one of the problems is that actually, even though we have this constitution that has this beautiful idea of federalism and decentralized power, which I strongly support, the political conversations earlier in California revolves around national politics when we've got the power

to change what happens for daily life here in California right here. And that is 100% what I'm focused on. Okay, Medi, I just want to slightly switch to something that is still involved in all this. The Elon Musk interview, which came out of the weekend with Zanny Minton Beddows from the economist, editor-in-chief there. A lot of newslines were made from this, some about AI and so on and so on. But there was a clip of him. him talking about Muslims. I wanted to play to you, given you're a Muslim.

Are you anti-Muslim? I am... I'm against having... If people are coming to a country with antithetical views, I am against that. I'm against that, you know, I'm against... I'm against rape and murder. murder, I'm against the imposition of rules and laws that are contrary to what we've come to accept in the West.

Now, there's a lot of fallout to that, not least because, as he was saying this, new numbers came out, which show that the murder rate in England has dropped to its lowest in 50 years. So this idea, which people like Elon seem to have convinced themselves have been correct, which is that our motherland is being run over, particularly by Muslims who are raping, pillaging and murdering everybody, is not borne out by statistical evidence. So there's that.

Now, Zani Minter and Beddows, Edison on CBNNBC, it's irresponsible for someone 240 million followers, Elon, to propagate things that are simply not true. And he responded to that huge... number of his followers by saying she is a traitor to the West plain and simple. I mean, that is strong stuff, isn't it? What did you make of all this? I mean, that's an understatement, but it's not strong stuff. It's outrageous, ridiculous, dangerous stuff. He knows perfectly well that he's putting a target on our back. When Elon Musk attacks people, and I've been attacked by

him, you know what happens with his followers. He has a very cultish following like Trump does. It's very dangerous, and it's a ridiculous response, by the way. More than the newslines from that Economist interview was Musk himself and how he handled it. the aftermath and the fallout from the interview. At Volvo, safety is not a feature. It's our purpose. Rigorous crash testing. Decades of learning from real accidents.

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He's more interesting than the interview, because this is the world's richest man who claims to be for free speech, claims to be for debate. But any time he gets even the mildest of questions, he has a total meltdown. First of all, he rarely does interviews. I know he hasn't done an interview with you. You've been desperate to get one. He doesn't do tough interviews. He melts down when he gets semi-tuff questions. Do you remember when Don Lemon interviewed him in 2024?

He almost started crying during the interview and then cancel Don Lemon's show as a punishment for Don asking him questions about his drug use. And now you have the Economist, very sober, mainstream, centrist publication, not woke left at all, as he might say. And he calls this woman the editor of the Economist a traitor, simply for pointing out that he doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to British and London crime stats. The three of us are Brits, two of us are British Americans. We all know here in the US, I'm sure Steve gets asked by Republicans, oh, Britain, it's a hellscape, isn't it? And it's not a hellscape, as we all know. And it's ridiculous that he pushes this bullshit. And on the Muslim line, thank you, Zanny Minton Beddows.

too many journalists ignore the anti-Muslim rhetoric at the heart of the Musk movement and support for the far right. This is a man who funds Tommy Robinson, who supported Rupert Lowe, two of the most anti-Muslim voices in the UK, if not the West. And when he's asked this straight question, are you anti-Muslim? All he has to say is, no, I'm not. All he has to say was, I'm against anti-Muslim prejudice. All he has to say was, oh, I'm against criminals. I'm against extremists. That's all he had to say, peers. But he couldn't do it. Instead, he says, I'm against people who have antithetical views coming into this country. I'm against rape and murder, suggesting Muslims are all guilty of rape and murder.

Can you imagine if somebody asked Elon Musk or anyone prominent? Are you anti-Jewish? And they didn't just say, no. They said, well, I'm against people with different views. I'm against rape and murder. It's an outrageously bigoted things to say by the richest man in the world. I'm glad she asked it. I'm sad that not enough journalists have followed up on that fact.

That Elon Musk, the top donor to the Republican Party and Donald Trump, the richest man in the world, the owner of one of the most influential messaging platform. is an anti-Muslim bigger. And that's not me calling him that. That's him embracing it. Steve Hilton, what did you make of that? I mean, look, you know Britain as well as I do. This weird narrative that Elon and many on the right in America seem to have developed

that we're getting literally invaded and overrun by Muslims. You know that's not true. What do you say to people when they say this to me? So it's interesting. I hadn't actually seen that clip. I was aware of the interview. I hadn't really followed it. But yes, I think that this is a, there's a characterization that actually misses the real problem with what's going on in the UK, I think.

Obviously, I have an interest in that. Don't follow it closely. But there's something I say on the campaign trail, actually, which is that I don't want this state that I love to turn into the country I left. But what I mean by that is what you're seeing, I think, there was a report that someone sent to me, one of the biggest figures in business in California, sent me a research report on what's going on in the UK economically with the inability to build housing, the inability to improve energy infrastructure,

the cost of everything, the bloat and bureaucracy and hassle of doing anything in the UK, which I think has produced, I mean, you'll know in more detail peers, but a sense of an economic stagnation that probably is a really big, big part of why you get all this kind of sentiment. People are just frustrated with what's going on. And this person sent me that report and says, remind you of anywhere. And it does because

that's the way we're heading in California with this bloated bureaucratic government that's making it impossible to do anything. And so in that sense, I think that's the real point, I think. Can I ask a question of Steve? Just on this subject. In May, there was an attack on a mosque in San Diego, three Muslims were murdered. Could have been 100 Muslim school kids murdered in a school nearby. It was two neo-Nazi white supremacists. In the past, you've been very vocal in condemning white nationalist. I remember you condemned the attack on the mosque in New Zealand back in 2019. This time, you're running for governor of California, massive terrorist attack against Muslims in your state. I didn't hear a word from you. I tried to look up what you said about it. I couldn't find

a single posting. No, I was there that day, actually. Forli off, Medi, I was actually there. I was very close by when it happened. And we went and, we went and and spoke to local community leaders. Now, you may not have seen anything. I said, we had a town hall that day, and I spoke about it. I was actually right there. Okay, good, because there's not a single post from you about it

that I could find. So I'm glad to hear that. Yeah, I mean, perhaps, I don't necessarily kind of express every thought on everything all the time, but I definitely agree with you. I mean, that's completely unacceptable. And I was there and said so in that community on that day. Medi, I just want to ask you very quickly.

Netanyahu's due at the White House tomorrow. What should happen here? I mean, Mamdani, the mayor in New York, wants him arrested, but acknowledges he doesn't have the power to do that. What do you think should happen? I'll see an appropriate response to Netanyahu visiting the United States for the first time in months. First time in months, but of course, as you've pointed out on this show,

as I've high, I think he came about eight times in the run up to the Iran war, didn't he? He was the world leader who visited the U.S. most to make the case, including in the situation room. So let's hope he's not here to start another new war or new escalation. Who knows? We've got this Lindsay Graham recording that's out that CNN and the Wall Street Journal have got from a documentary about Graham, where he's talking on the phone with Netanyo. And they're discussing pressuring Trump on war. It's a very bizarre conversation to see United States Senator on a phone call with the Prime Minister of a foreign country

discussing how they're going to pressure a president on foreign policy. I think his role in American politics is malign. I think a lot of Republicans understand that. Did you see the poll, peers, that a plurality of Americans would like to see Netanyahu arrested, including one in three Republicans. So interestingly enough, Mandani actually speaks for more Americans than his critics do. There's also a poll showing that American Jews prefer Zaraan Mamdani to both Donald Trump and Benjamin Netanyahu. So a lot of the noise doesn't really reflect public opinion.

The mayor is right. He can't arrest Netanyahu. He first made that pledge in an interview with me in December 2024. I think he knew he couldn't do it, but it was an aspiration. Look, the ground has moved, Pierce. It doesn't matter whether you want to arrest him or not. Look at the polling. People are anti what this Israeli government is doing, rightly so. They're anti Netanyahu.

Unfortunately, the opposition in Israel is just as bad as Netanyahu. So even if he loses the elections this year, the next guy coming in, Naftali Bennett, or whoever it is, is equally hawkish, equally genocidal. I think the bigger question is, American government going forward, what will our relationship be like with Israel? We're, you know, we're, quote-unquote, integrating our militaries, which a lot of people don't want, but it's happening in Congress.

There's a massive disconnect between Congress, which remains super pro-Israel and the American public, which no longer is. And I think that is a real democratic dysfunction if our people's representatives cannot reflect the will of the people on this very important foreign policy issue. Steve Hilton, I mean, do you think there are legitimate claims that Benjamin Netanyahu and this Israeli government have committed war crimes? Well, look, I thought that the characterization of what happened after October the 7th

as a genocide was just offensive and ridiculous. I said so very clearly, I think that if you look at the situation now, I totally understand the difference between having legitimate criticism of the actions of the Israeli government and being anti-Semitic. Of course, there's a difference there. However, the volume and the intensity of the criticism of Netanyahu and Israel and so on has given rise to a massive wave of anti-Jewish hate in America. And what I see here in California, I was just not long ago at UCLA campus

at the Hill Al Center. We spent half a day there just hearing the stories of students at UCLA, high school students in the Los Angeles area who were frightened to show that, to reveal their faith, who are shut down from having faith-based activities in their high school by the principal.

Something really dark is going, on and I think we have to be honest about that and confront it while having perfectly reasonable legitimate criticism of the actions of Israel. Of course that's true. But what are your criticism? But you're not saying what yours are happening? Do you think there are war crimes in Gaza as every human rights group says? I'm focused on the fact that you've got teenagers in California who don't want to wear a star of David necklace to school because they fear reprisals. I mean, that's completely unacceptable in any country, let alone.

California and America. That's what I'm concerned about. Steve, I want to just end with you to play your clip of Donald Trump at the White House correspondence to know, in which he announced a major scoop. Let's take a look. That's why tonight to show just how much I care about the press. And I want to save your ratings. I'm pleased to announce my intention to, and this is somewhat of a scoop, my to run for a fourth term as President of the United States. I will be doing that. I will be having an official.

In fact, I think I have, I won three times. Now I'm going to do it again. Well, Steve, I guess two questions. One, he says he's won three times. Do you agree with him that he's won three times and not twice? And secondly, should he be allowed to run again? The answer to both of, well, the answer to the first one is, no, I've said that clearly,

Biden won in 2020, but the answer to the second one is also no, not because whether he should or shouldn't, it's in the Constitution. But he's trolling and having a joke with people, and that's what that event is all about. Steve Hilton, really good to have you on sentence. I've got to say, a lot of people ridiculed you when you launched your campaign to be governor of California. Neil, what does this Brit think he's doing coming over here? You've done a very good job, I've got to say.

I've been very impressed. You've run a great campaign. I don't think you're going to win the way the polls are looking. But I take my hat off to you. It's been impressive to watch. Medi, always good to have you and uncensive. Thanks. Thank you, Pais.

Good to be with you. Joining me now is Matea Petrescu, who served as the Head of Communications and Official Spokesperson for Andrew and Tristan Tate when they were in Romania. This is her first television interview. since the new charges were announced, which will result in their extradition to the UK. Well, welcome to Unsensored. Hello, Pierce. Thank you for having me.

So you've spent three years as the kind of spokeswoman for the Tate. It was notable because you were the only sort of high-profile woman in their team. And you defended them vociferously for all that period of time. Now you've turned on them. What was it that changed your mind? What made you realize in your eyes that you were wrong? First of all, I wouldn't say I've turned on them. I have simply left.

I have no desire to turn on anyone. There were different reasons for my leaving. And defending them or defending their public image, I think would be a better use of words was my job. So now I have left the job. I'm no longer, I don't longer have to do that. I no longer have to do that, defend what they've done. But I'm not here to defend or to accuse them.

Right, but why would you go from being so keen to defend them for three years to suddenly not wanting to defend them at all? What happened? There were a few reasons, you know, like in any good divorce, the decision started last year in 2025 in March, I believe. That's when I kind of took the decision. It was a long process, as I said, like with any good divorce. takes a while until you pot the goods and then you figure out what you want to do.

There were a few reasons. First of all, Andrew became more and more unhinged. It was very difficult. He became very difficult to counsel. I would have to do or put out press releases or put out communication in their name and on their behalf and only to be contradicted by their tweets or things that they would put out on the socials. So it became very difficult to mention. It was very, well, throughout the first two years, the relationship was quite close, and there was a lot of communication and a lot of back and forth

and a lot of strategy making. That wasn't happening in the past year. So I felt that my role became quite redundant, first of all, and I felt like my job, my place wasn't there anymore because a lot of times we had to clean a lot of the things that he would do, although he was clearly advised, was clearly advised against doing such things. There are quite a few examples.

For example, there was the, as I was trying to, he asked me to get him into A-list events. And while I was on the phone trying to open doors to A-list events, and that was quite difficult because lately it had become very difficult to get him into places because he was blacklisted pretty much everywhere. He tweeted, I miss human-stained. I miss human trafficking.

That was something that I was, and he even said on your show that his staff deleted his tweet. It's not true. I was his staff and I did not do anything, nor did I ever have access to his ex account. So that was one of the reasons why I decided to leave. The second one was quite personal. It was the fact that I realized that I had been primed

to believe in his innocence. And, you know, like in any echo chamber that you spend a lot of time, my lens started to be very crooked. I would, just because of habit, I would always look for a silver lining or for reasons that would involve a reasonable doubt, would bring over a reasonable doubt

over the allegations that he was presented with or over facts or, and at some point, I realized when the Bree Stern story came out in March last year, that my instinct was to instantly dismiss it and just be like, yeah, right. That didn't happen, of course. And after the fact, I had a little bit of time to reflect, and I realized I can't believe I just dismissed that without even giving it a single second thought.

And that's why I realized that my objectivity was gone. Right. So are you saying now then that you've gone, right, but are you now saying then you don't believe their repeated protestations of innocence and that you do think they're guilty of some of these crimes? No, actually, this is something that I will probably never be able to resolve. This is what I'm carrying with me after having left. I don't think any verdict in court or anything for that matter is going to be able to resolve this matter in my head and within me. whether they're innocent or not. There's evidence on both sides.

I definitely cannot ignore the amount of stories that keep coming out from other women. One definitely cannot ignore his own character witness that he has left his footprint on the internet because Andrew has done himself of huge disservice by being his own worst character witness in the story because of what he says and what he professes and his attitude towards women. However, though, I have been treated with utmost respect.

I have never witnessed anything that was remotely similar to the allegations that he's facing. So these two, there are very hard things to reconcile. I've read the file. I've read the indictment. I've read all of the statements of. all the alleged victims except for the new UK file. So no, I don't say, I can't say, I'm not a judge, I can't say whether they're innocent or not, but what I can present is what I've seen from the inside.

Okay, but I mean, finally, obviously, by refusing to work for them anymore and by saying you don't know whether they're innocent or not, that's a pretty damning sequence of events for somebody who was there, biggest cheerleader and defender for three years. You accept that? Yes, I guess. I mean, if one wants to see it like that, for me, it's just having left the situation that I did not want to deal with anymore. Also, I promised myself... Well, you didn't want to defend them anymore. I always promised myself that I will be there until while the presumption of innocence was present.

The civil trial, the civil case trial was approaching in the UK and I didn't want to jump the boat when a verdict came out. That's not who I am. And then it was, I just wanted out because I didn't want to be faced with exactly the conundrum that you're presenting to me right now. I don't want to be there to decide whether they're innocent or to decide my attitude towards that. Okay, but you were pretty convinced of their innocence before,

so I think we can draw our own conclusions. Matea Petroski, thank you very much. Thank you. Pierce Morgan Unsensored is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask only one simple thing. Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Piers Morgan Unsensored on Spotify and Apple Podcast.

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