Piers Morgan Uncensored - “I Want To Apologize” Novak Djokovic & Piers Morgan Finally Meet | On Covid Row, Sinner & More

Episode Date: November 11, 2025

ExpressVPN: Right now you can get an extra four months of ExpressVPN for free. Just scan the QR code on the screen, or go to https://ExpressVPN.com/PIERS and get four extra months for free. Piers Morgan didn’t exactly shy away from publicly criticising Novak Djokovic over his stance on Covid vaccines, even tweeting “good” when the tennis great was banned from Australia over it. And now, for the first time, the pair come face-to-face to relay what was really going on inside their heads during that tumultuous time - and of course to discuss the highs and lows of Novak’s illustrious career as what many perceive to be the greatest ever tennis player. He opens up about how he’s felt watching Sinner and Alcaraz’s ascent into stardom plus he gives his insight into Sinner’s doping ban. And does he think he can win another Grand Slam?  But maybe most compellingly… does HE believe he’s the greatest of all time? BUBS Naturals: Live Better Longer with BUBS Naturals. For A limited time get 20% Off your entire order with code PIERS at https://Bubsnaturals.com  Oxford Natural: To watch their full stories, scan the QR code on your screen or visit https://oxfordnatural.com/piers/ to get 70% off your first order when you use code PIERS. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm going to start by making an apology. Tennis star Novak Djokovic. He had a hearing overnight to decide whether he will stay and play the Australian Open. The world number one has been booted out of Australia. Deportation marks the end of his Australian open hopes. If I want to go to America, I have to take a test and show my vaccination status. That's it. So he shouldn't be allowed to play, right?

It stops you from dying. I mean, that's the whole point of the vaccine. He's also a role model who will have definitely deterred a lot of people who perhaps should have a dad. said, it speaks volumes about the person that you are. I'm just saying I'm not like that. It's part of you also thinking, I'm not sure I can compete against these guys at this level now. To your point, yes, I do have more doubts that I can win slams, particularly against

these two guys. I just stared at the wall for 20 or 30 minutes, and that's the first time I felt really empty. I just want to re-game. the love and you know passion for the sport because I lost it. Have you one day played your son at tennis in a... I mean that's a dream. In a professional game.

You wouldn't let him win, would you? I would kick his... On On Sinner, is there a cloud over him about the drugs thing? That cloud will follow him as the cloud of COVID will follow me. You should ask him. I only interviewed goats. I expected worse. This is not against you and this...

Against you and this, you're kind of like intelligently hiding. Novak, we meet at last. At last. I've never met you. I've talked about you quite a lot. And I'm going to start by making an apology. And it's for this, is I was very censorious about you over the COVID scandal that you got caught up in. And in a nutshell, you got thrown out of Australia over what?

seemed to be on the face of it from what the media were being told and what was being reported was you trying to bend the rules of getting into playing Australian open without having taken the COVID vaccine. And I was actually quite censorious about a lot of people at the time. And I've since apologized to some people for being too tough on them because once it became clear that if you had the vaccine it made no difference to whether you could then transmit the virus, clearly at that point for me it becomes a personal choice if the if the potential danger is irrelevant compared to whether you have the jab or not and so I have on that basis said like I believe the vaccines were important I think they saved a lot of lives I had lots of people in

my life at the time who were going through a terrible time with COVID one of my co-workers on the morning show I was doing a husband was in a coma from COVID he sadly died a friend of mine and say goodbye to her mother on FaceTime, who was in a care home and died from COVID and so on. I knew lots of people. So it felt quite personal. It felt quite visceral to me. But I was too censorious. And when more information emerged about your situation, the fact you'd had COVID several weeks before you went to Australia,

the fact that you hadn't actually done anything wrong on the form filling, the fact that in the end it became a political decision to throw you out based on likely public anger. they didn't take action. When I look back on that and reflect on that, I would like to say, I'm sorry for the intemperate language I used against you, because I didn't know you. I took what I was reading and hearing at face value. It turned out to be more complicated. And yeah, I'm sorry for over-regging the rhetorical souffle. I appreciate that very much. Let me get that off my chest. Your honesty, thank you so much. It was difficult. times and you know state of emergency globally I understand you know we've been through we've

been through hell globally all of us on this planet and you know the only thing I would add not to really dig deeper into this this whole situation on the COVID and vaccination is that I was never a proponent of anti-vax or pro-vax I was always freedom of choice so and that was misinterpreted you know I was proclaimed to be you know one side or the other side or so forth it's either black or white and I said you know it doesn't need to be that way as an athlete as someone that you know takes care of the integrity of the body and and understanding of obviously doing my research and understanding that I not a threat to anybody and I don't need to do it myself and I've been through two times two or three times I had COVID in like a year year and a half so I had all

all the antibodies, et cetera. So anyway, long story short, good to see you here. Good to finally meet you. And I appreciate and I respect the fact that what you said. It speaks volumes about the person that you are. So I really respect that. And I was looking forward to speak to you even before you were slamming me for some time. But check what I'd said about you.

Yeah. I have been very nice about you as well. Right, you have. On that particular issue, I went too far. I would say on the nice side that as we sit here, I've made it very clear publicly. To me, I've spent this morning with Cristiana Ronaldo, who I know you know, and we'll come to him a little later because there are a few things you have in common. But he's to me the greatest football player that's ever lived.

You to me are now indisputably the greatest tennis player that's ever lived. And I've said that, and I'll say it to your face. I hope we can move on from a slightly negative way this had to start because I felt compelled to say that because I think it's important to be intellectually honest. And when the narrative around the efficacy of whether the vaccine could stop you infecting people changed, I realized I'd been just too censorious. But on the positive note, as you sit here, do you feel yourself that you're the best tennis player that's ever played? I've been asked this question quite a bit, particularly lately in the last several years, because obviously there's a lot of stats that people play with and they do comparisons between Nadal Fether and myself, primarily because of our numbers, of Grand Slam's won,

tournaments won, weeks, and the number one of the world, etc. But my answer is quite consistent when it comes to overall general discussion on the greatest of all time and I'm gonna say it again which is I'm not going to say whether I'm the greatest or not because that's it's not my position to say that and I would say that that would be very disrespectful towards the generations that have paved the way for me Nadal Feather and all the others it's so hard to compare errors you know our has gone through quite a transformation in the last 50 years.

We just see the records. I mean, in terms of technology, in terms of equipment, in terms of the balls, the surfaces, in terms of the fitness, in terms of the staff of the team of people that is around the player, it has become so much more professional. Not just not because of the fact that it wasn't 30, 40, 50 years ago, But it just, the times are changing and the science, the sports science is improving,

so people have more access to the data to information and hence why everyone gets more cautious and more, I would say, interested in understanding of what it takes in every single aspect of your life, how you can get an edge or a slight percentage of improvement so you can better your performance, your recovery, et cetera. So the likes of Borg, Rod Lever, John McEnroe, those people that have created a history of the tennis that we enjoy today. What people say when they argue that you're the best is that if you take all surfaces and you compare your record to anybody in history, yes, you won the most grand slams, but actually you won on everything. consistently. That is what makes you unusual. Most of the others, you could say on certain

services they're stronger, on others they're not as strong. And obviously, same applies to you to a degree, but you've won consistently on all surfaces. Well, I think the modern tennis required me to do so. And going back to 80s, you had three out of four grandsons played on grass. and now the grass is the, you know, least played surfaced on. And I mean, it's one months a year and it used to be, you know, predominant surface on the tour. So the game has evolved a lot. You used to have 90% of the players only up to maybe 90s or maybe even late 90s, early 2000s, that would play serving volley.

And they would, you know, switch from wooden records to graphic, graphet records. and then obviously move into a more lighter and refined materials. And which with this kind of materials, you would be able to, you know, play from the baseline with more control, with more accuracy, with more precision. That wasn't the case with more robust materials like wood or graph it, because, you know, it allowed you to serve well with good, but then you know you didn't have many players playing with a lot of spin

Bjorn Borg was the first one that stayed the state back and he hasn't he can't he would come in but he would stay back quite a lot and so that would confuse a lot of the players and I mean hence his incredible career and and achievements and I think you know we would probably be sitting down today and talking about Borg being the greatest if he kept going he he retired when he was 26 yeah incredibly young won 11 Grand Slam's in that point which I mean Alcarus is is kind of on the way to do something like that so it's again I I don't feel really comfortable I appreciate the fact that you're

bringing this forward to me but I never felt really comfortable to talk about myself about being as being the greatest because I consider myself as a great student of the game and I respect the history of the game I respect all of the grades so I just and then some of those greats were my coaches like Boris Becker for example that I consider as part of my family so I I just feel more comfortable leaving that discussion to others and of course a great honor and privilege to be part of that discussion but the bottom line Novak is you've won 24 grand slams and that is more than any player in history the stats that's true the stats don't lie that that is true

that shows a remarkable longevity and especially with Federer and Nadal snapping around that but ultimately you prevailed and you all had long careers. That's why for me in the end, you're the top dog. You may not feel comfortable, but a little, I appreciate it. Coming from you, I know you were a fan of tennis and sports, so I appreciate it. What does it take? In terms of sacrifice, I read somewhere recently you were talking about you've got two kids, they're getting older, I've got four kids, I know what that's like when they get to a certain one. When they start playing sport and you want to be there, you want to be there. You want to always.

watch them have their journey on life and there starts to be that thing and a Christiana was talking about it as a slight sort of feeling when you just start to have your I guess your desire to be somewhere used to be single-mindedly right on the court and winning and then it starts to be slightly conflicted with your family and wanting to be there for them and you you were talking about that entering your head for the first time talk about that for a moment it's interesting I had that discussion with some of my family members the recent days as well because I'm going through some form of a transition myself you know and trying to enter this this

last chapter of however long is going to last for me in my career with the the peace of mind where I'll be able to still maintain that hunger and the competitiveness on the court but yet you know, deal with some realities that at this moment are, you know, not easy for me to accept, you know, being the dominant player for most of my career for over 20 years and now being dominated by particularly Alkaras and Sinner in the last couple years. What is that like? I mean, for two young whippersnappers to come up. Look, I mean, I knew it was going to happen eventually that, you know, the guys will come and they'll,

you know they'll start to dominate and you're gonna think someone will form a new rivalry that is you know coming after the big three or the big four that have dominated a sport for over 20 years and I think it's a natural progress and evolution in in sport in general so Ciner and Alcaras I think they're great for our sport I mean their rivalry their matches and they played one of the most epic matches of old time in the finals of Roland Garros this year which was incredible just just to watch and and I was I was reflecting on that actually when I was at Wimbledon they asked me whether I watched it and I said that I didn't want to watch it because I lost semi-finals against Sinner and Roland Garrison I went back home and when I'm done with the tournament I just want to switch off I want I don't want to see any tennis at least for a few days I want to be unless my my son wants to play and then that's different obviously but my son and my wife particularly or also my daughter to some extent, but particularly my son and my wife, they're big tennis so they love to watch tennis. They love to watch the finals of big tournaments, grand slams.

So I was somehow trying to drag them out of the house and I did that and I said, let's go walk me, you know, have lunch, have a walk and they were like, they didn't want to confront me but they were like, we really want to watch this match. And I said, okay, you know what, you can watch a set, you know, let's just go and then, and I thought that the match will be over by then. I kind of planned my time outside for like, couple of hours, I thought it's going to be like two and a half hours. And they kept going. They went for five and something hours. So we went back and we ended up watching for two hours. ExpressVPN is the simple way to protect your privacy online. In the US, internet providers

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That's expressvpn.com slash peers. What were you feeling watching them? You know, honestly, honestly, no, I was feeling various things. First, I was feeling like a refusal to watch. I was like I was kind of forced to watch because just because my family wants me to watch. And then, right. And so then I was, and then I, but that went away. quickly because then I was really, you know, when I watch tennis, which is I assume for

Cristiano when he watches football, you see it with a different eyes than a regular football or tennis fan. And then I was very analytical at the beginning. I was like, you know, trying to understand the game and what they're tactically doing to each other. And then I entered the phase of admiration. And I was, I haven't felt that too many times in my life. when I was watching someone else play.

I felt a couple of times when I watched Feather and Nadal face each other. So just maybe four or five matches in my life that I watched and I said, wow, this is an astronomical level of tennis. It's amazing. So that's what I felt. But are you also, it's part of you also thinking, I'm not sure I can compete against these guys at this level now.

Or is part of you thinking, actually, maybe I can't, but I'm determined I'm going to. Yeah. But what's the mindset. That's what I was saying, like in terms of transition, you know, mentally because, you know, I'm aware of what's happening. You know, I mean, I'm aware that these guys are my best level now, their best level now, they're better. Okay. That's the reality. I mean, I, for most of my career, you know, the visualization practice, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the.

techniques that you know brought me to the level of the mental strength and self-believe and the achievements that you know I have always believed in things that are almost impossible to achieve and I knew that the message that I tell myself or the signal that I give to myself the words that I'm telling myself internally and what I verbalize is sent out to the universe and it comes back in the same way that you send it. So I was always trying to be very cautious and it's not always possible to be very positive and optimistic obviously, but I was trained from the young age to think greatly about myself and to nurture the self-confidence because that's

going to eventually, whether it's sport or anything else in life, bring you the rewards and allow you to chase your dream. And basically, don't you know not not settle for any boundaries you know and I my childhood was you know boundaries all over the place you know there's come from a country that was war torn sanctions embargo tennis zero tradition of tennis in our country so you know most expensive sport you know the scarcity and poverty of my family and all the other families in our country most of the families and so I picked the most expensive sport and it's and so 99% of 99% of the people were obviously laughing at us.

And when at us, I'm saying us because primarily my father and I, my father, you know, I... And it's all you were wasting money. You know, both of my parents have done, you know, I cannot never repay them for what they've done for me enough. But my father believed very often times more than I believe in myself. So that's why I say us. But, you know, so going back to the point, yes, I, I. understand the power of the thoughts but at the same time there's a biology

there's there are things that are happening and I'm you know 38 going into 39 and the wear and tear is real and I I believe that to some extent I'm a Superman that can never injure himself that can never be weak etc but you know I got the slap from from reality the last couple of years and and it's not like I'm paying the price but I'm just getting to know this this new chapter I have two I have two words for you yeah Tiger Woods the Tiger Woods absolutely peerless golfer number one in the world right thing went through very different trajectory to your story but he went through a lot of stuff which meant he

plunged to number 1100 in the world and there's a brilliant video I think Nike did it it's a mash-up video of everyone writing him off he's finished he's done he'll never win again oh a tiger was the laughing at him right and then he wins the Masters in 2019 against all expectations he takes all the young pups down do you think like you know next year the year after

suddenly at Wimbledon I think I've done that already last well no you have 23 yeah but 24 actually Olympic Games but you think there could be a few years perhaps where you don't win and then you win again and is that in your makeup to do that so to your point

Yes, I do have more doubts that I can win slams, particularly against these two guys. But at the same time, I know that while I'm still active and when I enter on the court, you know, I don't care who is across the net. I always believe I'm better and I believe that I deserve to win and I'm going to do everything I can do to win. So bottom line is that one. You know, I'm nurturing still the winner's mentality. And I just hope, and this is one of my primary goals, is to maintain the body in shape that is... If I can be reassuring, you're not in bad shape.

I'm not in a bad shape. I'm not being funny, but if you want to know what an out-of-shaped body looks like, Exhibit 1 is staring you in the... No, no, you're right. I expected worse. You're right. I have a, my pinned tweet on my ex account is Cristiano from the last interview saying, yeah, I can see you have good abdominals, yeah, and I say thank you.

And it's had 200 million views. So 200 million people think Christiana Ronaldo said to me my abs were great. I'll take it. I'm not going to spice up you. I don't know if it's US or UK studio. And I think your glass table is quite high, so you're kind of like intelligently hiding. You don't want to display on the TV. It's pretty good.

I'll have you know, I've only played one pro tennis player on television. It was Serena Williams. Check the video. That's all I'll say. Okay. At one stage, she screams, oh God, you're good. About my tennis, I isn't aware. Wow.

And it is quite something. Do you listen to that before you do your interviews? I just watched it this morning before I knew I'm seeing here. That's great. It sounds like a good motivation. I think you should watch it. Praise. It could get you going.

But see, I find your mind, because I think your mindset is very, very similar to Ronaldo. I think the pair of you have, I would say, I would add Michael Jordan, Pete Tiger Woods. There are certain people in certain sports who I think exhibit just the most ferocious mental strength and resilience, which I think you have to have to be the best of what you do. And I think in your case, the really interesting thing for me is where that comes from. You know, in Ronaldo's case, he was just hungry, literally physically hungry. He tells a story of queuing up behind a McDonald's just to get free burgers because he was so hungry when he was at the Lisbon Academy. In your case, I think it was born.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you talk about coming from a war-torn country. You were in Belgrade as the NATO bombs were crashing down for month after month after month. I've read that you can't even listen or hear fireworks without this giving you a slightly traumatic PTSD. SD. To go through that when you're a young guy as you were, just take me back there for a moment. What are your most vivid memories of that time? Actually, it's interesting. I didn't know about Cristiano's experience of waiting in line, literally being hungry. I have something similar. I was, I think, I could have been six, seven years of age. and we, you know, we had two wars in 90s.

We had the Yugoslavian breakout war, and then we had the bombings in 99. So between the start of the 90s, of 91, when the war started, and end of 90s, we had embargo, I think maybe four or five years, maybe even more. So, you know, obviously nothing comes in, it comes out of the country,

and obviously, you know, the poverty level was extremely high. And we were waiting in line for, for one loaf of bread that us family of seven or eight were sharing that day and so those experiences life experiences were very real and and that made it that made my journey even even more special in a sense that I appreciate life and everything that life has and God has granted me with much more because of my upbringing so So I normally don't like to reflect on that with a great sense of, how can I say, not sadness, but in a sense, I don't want to whine about it or complain about it because I believe that,

you know, everyone wears a cross on his or hers back that is, that he or she is meant to wear. So my journey is my unique personal journey that I had to go through. and made me who I am. So I'm very grateful for that. Was it easy? No, absolutely wasn't easy. But that was essential, integral part of who I am as a person. And that is probably the foundation of my mental strength and resilience. Because when you are, you know, in doubt of what tomorrow brings, not just for yourself, but for your entire family and for your city, for your country,

and whether you will be able to survive the next day, facing a match point in Grand Slam is not that hard. You know, there's a great quote from a cricket player called Keith Miller, who was an Australian in the 50s and 60s. Great all-rounder, swashbuckling character, big party guy as well. And he flew in the Second World War in the Royal Australian Air Force, a few bombers, I think. And when he came back, he was captaining Australia in a game, I think he gets England.

And the press asked him after the first difficult day for Australia, they were struggling. They said, you must be feeling the pressure, Mr Miller. And he famously said, pressure. He said, let me tell you what pressure is, mate. Pressure's having a mesher smit up your ass, not a game of cricket. Right. I mean, that's really what you're getting at, right? Pressure for you is not a match point against Federer.

It's whether you're going to actually survive bombs coming over your head. Right. So it's a matter of perspective. I agree with that. And I think it puts things in perspective when someone says that. But nevertheless, I still feel that pressure that we experience as athletes or your experience in your work or someone else in their work is real. And sometimes it can help to put things in perspective, but a lot of times it doesn't.

So what do I mean by that? I think it's important to understand that, you know, what you're going through is a real experience and that you not being able to overcome certain tasks and challenges and folding under pressure, you know, doesn't make you weak. It makes you a human being that goes through the experience. So Jordan, for example, there was one of my sporting idols that you mentioned, one of the obviously goats of the big global sports. He, you know, he said that people remember his, the shots that he made. People remember his titles, successes. At the joy for him, I quoted the fact, he said they never talk about the three thousand shots. They never talk about those shots that he missed. And in one of my favorite quotes of him, he says, I missed and I missed and I missed or I failed, I failed, I failed, and that's why I succeeded.

So a lot of the times people have this fantasy of the great sporting champions and athletes and the icons of being the faultless, you know, demigods that can do it all. It's absolutely not like that. I mean, I failed so many times in my career. Actually, I almost have a 50% success rate at the Grand Slam finals, a bit more than that but almost you've lost nearly so which is not that great when you think about it I played many Grand Slam finals and I won 24 but I lost I don't know how many at the moment but anyway quite a quite a lot so the point is that you need to go

through that experience because and this is very consistent across all the fields of life all the successful people always say you learn always much more from your failures than from your wins So in sports what I see and what I notice, particularly with men, is that there is this a little bit of a dogmatic and stigmatic mindset about emotions. You know, vulnerability makes you weak. You cannot show your tears. You cannot show your weakness because then, you know, you are the prey. you know I disagree with that I I believed for most of my career for first part of my

career that that is the way to go but then soon I realized that you know you can't suppress the emotions forever eventually they'll start breaking your body your mind or whatever so eventually you have to address it all the things that you put under the carpet so so basically this is a little bit more philosophical in that sense but you know when you're entering on the court for me i'm not a tennis player novak jokovic i'm a novak jokovic person who has to deal with all the other things that are happening in my private life that people don't know about or should not know about but i know about them and and i am a human being that you know i i feel affected in my heart

and in my brain and i feel here's a hard question because i totally agree right i had to run a newspaper but newsroom of 400 journalists aged in my early 30s. And often you'd have all sorts of terrible stuff to deal with in your life. And you got to walk out, you've got to exude an air of invincibility of super confidence, because otherwise the act doesn't play as the leader, right? So I totally get that part of it.

But did you play better when you were fueled by difficult things going on in your life or when you were really happy? A lot of people say like musicians, that they're albums when they're, when they're happy are terrible, but when they're tormented, they're great. Artists, you know, painters, same thing. If you're honest, when have you played your greatest tennis at times of difficulty in your life

or at times of happiness? I would say both. Right. I would say both. I respect it and I understand your point and their point. And it's true that I have experienced, you know, when I was experiencing a lot of adversity, and some difficult moments in my life, that's when I draw this strength

and turn it and convert it into fuel that then helps me perform my best tennis, which you can say that it was a kind of a storyline of most of my junior days and kind of coming into the professional tennis and kind of winning the first bunch of slams in that kind of emotion of like hunger and needing to prove everybody wrong and like being upset with the childhood that I had

and needing to like just, you know, prove to myself and others that I am, you know, the best and I can be the best and I can live these dreams from, you know, coming from that kind of environment and circumstances. But I also, I mean, I think that it just depends, it's quite relative and individual, so it just depends where you draw your strength. from mostly. So I think that kind of mentality helps to, at least in my case, to certain extent. And then you get fed up with that. You know, like I don't want to be drawing things from, let's say, somewhat of a negative emotion just because somebody hates me or said something or whatever, so I'm going to prove him or them or whatever wrong. Even though that is also

a fuel, still it remains at times. But it's more really a constructive energy, I would say. It's more like, okay, at least at this point in my life in the last five years, it's like, okay, I have achieved great things in this sport. You know, probably around post-COVID time is when I entered this last phase of my career that I didn't know how and still don't know how long that's going to last. But, you know, how am I going to feel about, you know, my career playing tennis and how am I going to balance it with family life? Because you mentioned the fatherhood, that's something that's extremely important to me.

So there's a lot of sacrifice that you have to do. And I don't want to miss out on the greatest things of my family, the most important dates. I don't want my kids to, you know, not remember me for being there. and you know I think a lot of us fathers that are traveling for our work understand this very emotional. Christian I was talking about it. So that's when I realized that I have to, you know, reconstruct the way I'm thinking and reinvent myself in a sense and draw the fuel and motivation from other things.

When was the moment if you look back so far? So sorry to interrupt, but for me, one of the things that I want to say is, one of the greatest motivations is to have both of my children be old enough to experience their daddy winning grandslams and being there. And I have been so blessed and fortunate to experience that multiple times now. So that for me is not a fuel or motivation that comes from a negative place in contrary. So I feel like you can do. You can have both. It just depends where you are in your phase in life. When was the utopia moment for you in your playing career to do? In other words, if I could let you relive one match, one game, one set, whatever it may be,

a period of your career, if I could let you relive it because at that moment, you felt like you were playing at the highest level you've ever played at. What would it be? Beginning of 2015 to mid-2016. And what's that feeling- Those 18 months. We were actually reflecting on that last night with my team. What's that feeling like?

Because you're unbeatable, right? No one can beat you. It's invincible. Pretty much like that, literally. Oh, Superman. It's just, it's a great, it's a great feeling. I mean, it's a great feeling. It's honestly, you're on the clouds.

I mean, you're just like anything you do, you know, turns to gold or anything you touch. I mean, it just, and I, you know, not many athletes may be experienced that for so long. No. You know, so I'm, I'm, look, I'm blessed, you know. Could any other player, I mean, let's park the goat debate, because that's over a whole career. But do you think in that period, any other player in history could have beaten you? No. Right.

No. No. No. At that time, no. I mean, but again, you can, what if, you know, you can maybe comparisons and whatever. I suspect that's true. Some amazing players, whatever, of today or 50 years ago. But I just, when you were in your prime.

and then you you enter this zone that is often mentioned in the psychology of the sport where champions are talking about you know being in the zone the most difficult place or state of mind to achieve but easiest to lose and I've stayed there for 18 months so I yeah it was I can tell you even as you remembering it's the greatest surfing glow yeah it's like the greatest surfing wave ever you're a massive wave and it never stopped for 18 months exactly and then eventually it crashes down eventually it crashes down that I had the search look

it's it's it's the cycle of life you know I like the analogy of the waves actually for life you know it goes up and down up and down getting older hits you like a freight train or so people tell me stiff joints gym recovery dragging on, loose skin. Aging is cruel, but it doesn't have to win. Today's show is sponsored by Bubbs Natural's collagen peptides. Collagen is the body's glue, but it starts fading from your mid-20s. Bubbs can restore it, delivering stronger joints, healthier hair and nails,

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There was a British Prime Minister, Jim Callaghan in the 70s, and he said that being Prime Minister, that early on it's like you're in a stormy ocean and you're being crashed by wave after wave after wave. And eventually you realize it's always like that. And so you learn to ride the waves and navigate the ways. I imagine, I've never been in this position,

but I imagine being an elite sportsman at the highest level. That's what it's like. Weathering the storm constantly. And when you are riding the wave or invincibility or, you know, because at that period I had, I think, almost 20 or 19 finals in a row. And, you know, dominating in all surfaces and all tournaments. There was no tournament that I didn't play that I was not in the finals. So that's also quite dangerous place to be in mentally and emotionally, if you know what I mean?

Because you're like, I mean, I can play every week. I don't get tired. I'm fine. I'm great. Nobody can beat me and so forth. So your ego grows, you know, and then the natural cycle of the waves has come to the point of decline. and then and then it hits you harder than ever right and that's when I actually had the the most made the biggest injury in my career which was my elbow and I operated I went out of the

tour for almost a year and so forth so that was a big you know slap in my face like oh wow okay go from invincible and then you're not going to invincible but even when I before that big injury Injury was coming slowly, step by step, and I was kind of masking it, and, you know, you take tablets and painkillers, and you're like, no, I just keep going. I will not address it now. Your body sends your signals. You stop those signals, and that's, it's a vicious cycle on the highest level of sport, and I'm sure that the athletes who play on the highest level understand this, because this is, this is, it's super dangerous place to be in because the more you delay, proper addressing of the injury the worse it gets. And I remember particularly one point in Wimbledon that was my always childhood dream tournament to play on and to win. 2016, I held, I won my first Roland Garrison, I held all four slams at the

same time. And I was one of the few, you know, few, very few players in history that managed to do that. And I never, and I was telling all of the people around me you know my wife and parents and everybody that were like you know maybe you should take some way take a little break and then come back and then like you know because you achieved it all and then it's like no no I mean don't worry about motivation I have no issue with that I'm never going to experience something that I have read or heard other athletes experiencing that they said well you know

it comes to the point where you just feel empty you don't tell you have any but I was like what is this like I'm never going to and I experienced that and I experienced it a few weeks later for the first time ever it was a a court won in Wimbledon third round I was playing Sam Quarry and I think it was third or fourth set it was a rain interruption we had two rain interruptions the first one my team joined me and we talked and I had a little stretch with my physio we went back and I kept going and I I was two sets to love down I won the third set and it gained the momentum and I felt better about being on the court.

Another rain in delay. I go back to the isolated room and the stadium and my team comes and I'm like, guys, you just have to leave me alone. I just want to be by myself. And they're like, you don't need, you know, maybe we talk. No, I just don't want to talk. And I let the bags, everything. I didn't want to drink.

I just stared at the wall for 20 or 30 minutes. And that's the first time I felt really empty. And that's when I realized that all the stress and tension and excitement and anticipation, all the strong emotions I was feeling for whatever years coming to that moment, you know, my brain has had enough. And I just needed to reset. And so you need to reset. And I had to do it many times in my career where you just have to... Did you win that match? I lost that match.

I lost that match. And then I had a break and then I came back and I skipped some tournaments and came back, played finals of the US Open. And then that's the year when Andy Murray ended up as the year end number one and he beat me in O2 Arena in the World Tour Finals. And after that match, even though I kind of lost huge gap of the points that I had as an advantage over him. And, you know, I thought, everybody thought, you know, it's going to be a piece of cake, you know, finishing his number one. But he, you know, he was red hot on some streak of four or five tournaments one in a row. And I didn't care about whether I'm going to finish number one or not.

That's the kind of a stage or a condition that I had at the moment. I was state of mind. I just want to regain the love and, you know, passion for the sport because I lost it. So that was the case. Extraordinary insight into what has gone on with you. There's a great line. You said, when I was 12, my father sat me, my mother and two younger brothers down at the table. He left a $10 bill on the table and said, this is a $1.000.

all we got. Wow. What a moment. It's like $10 sitting there. Right. That's it. It was actually 10 Deutschmarks at the time. Probably less than that. At the time it was something like $10 or whatever. Right. Yeah. I remember. I remember very vividly how that happened and when it happened and so because it was one of the one of the turning points of my life. And I understood the message behind it for my father, which was, okay, I need you to man up. I need you to mature earlier than you're supposed to. I need you to maybe take the role of the kind of a second father of the home and take care of your brothers. You really felt love. I did feel that. I did feel that. And that helped me with my tennis actually. I mean, I always had discipline and I was so in love with tennis

and so passionate about it and very lucky to encounter certain coaches and mentors and people that were very knowledgeable about sport and life in general. So I had the very good guidance. And then at home, I mean, because of the circumstances that we were all going through in our country, you know, there was a lot of tension. You know, my father, he was, you know, it was a matter of survival. You know, my mother, she was trying to, you know, navigate everyone, clean, cook. prepare all of us, the three boys plus the father and father was trying to figure out the way how we can survive as a family. And so it was tough.

It was tough. It was real life. But when I look back to it now, I'm actually grateful that we went through that experience because it makes you appreciative of everything else that you have right now, because you come from that. How much are you worth now? Do you know? Approximately.

Give me a ballpark. I don't like to talk about it, Pierce. I don't like. Can I guess? I'm north of one million. Well, I reckon you're probably, if I was a guessing man, I'd say at least three to four hundred million. Maybe. Maybe, maybe more.

You know, I never, you know, we live in a very materialistic society nowadays and I, Money, the reason I'm not, this is not against you and this, but I'm just, I'm just saying I'm not like that. I'd never, I don't, I don't like and I, you know, my team and my agent, you know, we don't, I don't want to give all the information to Forbes, for example, what, you know, how much I'm worth or what the investments are. You know, it's, it's none of their business. Like, why should I disclose that? For what I mean? You know what I mean? Like, there are things that are disclosed with price money, obviously, that people know about or, you know. contracts but other things no. Does money I mean just given that scene at the

family table 10 dollars money is important yeah money is important money what does money bring you I mean it brings it the obvious but does it is it the security that money brings you that you can take care of your family I presume you're taking care of your family money is very important and it does bring security no doubt about it and it is absolutely you know one of the driving forces of the society of today and you know you you cannot neglect the importance of the money but money you know if money is the only thing you're thinking about I mean at least in my case in my experience obviously

I'm an athlete so for me it's kind of a meritocracy model if I you know if I win a tennis match or win a tournament I get rewarded I get sponsorship deals etc but also you know it's it's a lot about the mentality it's a lot about the brand that you want to create around yourself. I have, and I don't like, again, I don't like to talk about this too much, but I did refuse a lot of the big brands and big paychecks in my career because I cannot represent something that I don't believe in. And I feel like I've always tried to play a long game.

What was the biggest one you turned down? I cannot name brands, I'm sorry, but, you know, it's actually one of the, it's probably the most famous. drink in the world. So it was Pepsi? Or Coke? No comment. It's 50-50 shot. It's one of them.

But what was, without naming which one it was there, but how much was the deal you rejected? I'm curious. It was a long time ago, so it was, it was pretty good. A few million. It was pretty good. A bit more than that. Tens of millions?

Not tens, but... A lot. That, you know, given where you were, the family, yeah. To reject that kind of that kind of. of money right takes a lot of moral fiber it's just it's it's the integrity that I care about it's protecting what is you know valuable to you in your life it's as simple as that if I if I don't don't drink something and I don't drink and my

kids don't drink it you know Ronaldo you mentioned that's the famous video remember when he removed yeah it was a Gatorade or Coca-Cola and put the water and he did drink water yeah I respect that a lot. I respect that a lot. It takes a lot of courage. You know, you're a similar to him in many ways because his father went to war for Portugal. Yeah. And that it caused him a lot of issues with alcohol and stuff and caused him to die very young. He never really saw Christiana become the superstar he became. He died just before that happened. And when I first interviewed Christiana, he got quite emotional about his dad. Yeah, yeah. But you know, you both come from a kind

of war-torn upbringing of no money. I mean, it's interesting. He was talking about his son, who's now playing for Portugal under 16s, I think, and saying the one thing he can't give him is actual hunger. It's the one thing you can't give people. If you're a successful person with plenty of money, you can't give your kids hunger. Yeah, that's difficult. You just have to hope it's driven from within,

but it's never probably going to be as intense as when you're sharing a loaf of bread between eight people. Or he's doing the same. His son or my son in this, in this, scenario or circumstances that I mean we we can give our kids as we do everything best that you can imagine this planet but yeah I our kids have to find a source they have to find that source whatever the source is wherever and whatever it is and again going back to that question of whether you can only draw strength from a negative emotion I don't think it's the only source

you can also draw it from a lot of positive things. Yes. It just depends how wired you are. And these are some things you can't control. And I'm learning that as a young father. Like we all want to not control our children, but control the environment that they grow up in so they can have the healthiest possible environment.

They can have a healthy surrounding. But you know, you need to let go. It's their journey, it's their life. And so my son, my son, son he's he's just turning 11 in a few days time and he seems like he's choosing to play tennis so he's he's he's I I feel excited is he good I feel excited and frightened and has he got has he got some good genes in him you know well I don't know I don't know who's he's got the best I would hope he has no back he's he's he's good he's I mean he's good but I look I want to be

his father. I don't want to be his coach. But would you mind if he chose professional tennis as his career? With all the, not mine. With all the comparisons that would come his way? If that's the, I am slowly trying to introduce the world of tennis and sports and all of these things to him. And I can't throw everything at him at once. You know, I'm picking and choosing the right moments. And so if this is the journey that he chooses to have, I'm going to be one million percent behind him, supporting him every step of the way in whatever shape or form. But he's going to have, like Ronaldo's son,

a big mountain to climb, mostly because of other people. Right. But if that's the way, yeah, let's go. Let's go. What part did a... Wait, did Cristiano say that he would like to live to play with his son? I didn't ask that exact question, but he just, he said his son's very talented.

He's playing for the Portuguese national team at representative level. He just, he just knows he can't give him that one thing he had. And so in the end, that hunger has to come from within for children. And his son is what, 16? Yeah, he's about 15, 16. He's very talented player. No, it's quite realistic. I mean, if, you know, Cristiano keeps going for, which it looks like he's going to keep going. They could play together. And you know what? He'd still want to score more goals. Because LeBron. Yeah. Like LeBron. His fun, yeah. Because LeBron James, he lived that.

Have you one day played your son at tennis in a, in a match? I mean, that's a dream. In a professional game. That's a dream. You wouldn't let him. You wouldn't let him win, would you? To play against him? Yes. Oh, no, I don't want, no. I wouldn't want that. You wouldn't let him beat you. I never let him. I never. I never let him. I never. I never. Of course I wouldn't let him beat. I would kick his... What part did aliens play in you meeting your wife? There's a reason I'm asking that in a very specific way. Because you told Hello magazine in 2023,

us getting together was like science fiction. You haven't explained what you mean. So we'd be dating it's Jolena, yeah? Yeah. You were 18, you married several years later. You married young, you met young. What was the science fiction? That's funny.

Now I understand where the phrase of the question comes from. I don't recall saying there was a science. I don't even know why I said that. What do I say that? Why did I say that? Do you feel magical? Okay, so the way, right, what it did, but, you know, I believe in destiny for sure. So she used to play tennis, but we never met through tennis while she was playing it.

but she dated one tennis player that is a friend of mine from early days. And it was funny because the first time I heard about her was when that friend who was in the same tennis club as me played a match for in the tennis, regional tennis league, and we won an important match. He took out his jersey and underneath the jersey had the white shirt written, Yelena I love you really this is for you and we're like oh my god that's so lame Who is like why would you do that and then who is this Yelena and it was her and then and then she showed up afterwards and so forth and then we've known each other through obviously common friends for about you know

four or five years and actually one of my best friends uh has been her friend and they went to school together. So, you know, we were in a kind of similar same company. And then, yeah, and then we started dating when I went to live in Monte Carlo where. And she's, she's, yeah, she did. You know, just to make it clear. You steal your best mates.

Don't put me on the spot here. She was, she went to study in Italy and then we started, we started to date. So she's basically the, yeah, the only serious, like, long, serious relationship I ever had. It's amazing. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah.

I mean, I had, you know, obviously some few months relationships here and there, but I, she's the only, yeah. Truly the love of your life. Truly the love of my life. Yeah. What happened to your mate? Is he still your mate? Is he still your friend? I really have.

He's, uh, he's good. You don't make jokes like. He moved on. He moved on. He has his family. You don't make jokes like. She swapped me for a better player. He actually never spoke about.

Really? No, I think we are both very uncomfortable. We still remain made, so it's good. Listen, I've got friends who went out with my sister, a few of them, and it's still uncomfortable 40 years later, even though she's been very happily married for nearly 30 years. I saw you on Nick Curios' YouTube channel, talking about Christiana being a role model and so on,

but also referencing that you use biohackers like Gary Brecker, who I've interviewed actually, that scientific part of maintaining your form, your physique, your fitness, your health and so on, you're quite into that, aren't you, I think? You see your body like a kind of temple and you want to protect it at all costs, right? Do you feel with AI, because I do, that what's going to happen, before we fully transition to robots, we're going to have, Elon Musk is kind of hinted at this, We're going to have part robot.

Like you could have a problem with a part of your body and it'll be robotically enhanced. And you'll start to become like half human, half robot. And could that, I mean, could we have Novak Djokovic in 20 years still competing, but you're half robot? With robotic arms and everything. It could happen. I don't want to think about that scenario, to be honest. I'm not, look, I feel like AI helps for sure to a certain extent, but this whole thing with robots and chips installed in people, I'm completely against that. Have you seen the human, his optimist humanoid robots? Have you seen them?

I haven't, no. So they dance like Michael Jackson. Right. They shoot at cars like policeman. I mean, it's... What happens if you lose control over them? Well, so this is what everybody's afraid. Well, so this is the thing. So I did the last interview with Professor Stephen Hawking before he died. And I said, what's the biggest threat to mankind? He said, when artificial intelligence learns to self-design, in other words, think for itself, it's all over. Because they'll look at us and go, well, these are a complete way.

And they are obviously far more advanced than we are. Yeah. They would just get rid of us all. Then we have robots competing at Wimbledon. Would you like to see that? I don't know. I mean, you'd have a robot doing this interview. Well, sometimes when you know, see Sina and Alka is playing nowadays, it seems like...

They're the robots. On Sinha, is there a cloud over him about the drugs thing? Is it a case of the top players get treated at a different level in relation to that kind of thing to lesser players who are not as important? I mean, look, that cloud will follow him as the cloud of COVID will follow me for the rest of of his or my career in this case so it's just something that it was so major and that when it happens it just you know over the time it will fade but I don't think it will disappear so there's always going to be you know certain group of people that will always try to bring that forward do you believe him look I've known Janik since he was probably 14 13 14 years

because his first coach, I know first but first like serious coach that was working with him in those crucial years was my coach as well Ricardo Piati and I used to train quite a bit at Piatis Academy in Italy and I was practicing with Ciner a lot of the times when he was a junior and you know I liked him actually a lot because he's always skinny as I was and tall and grew up skiing grew up on the mountains so very similar story to mine and he always came across very genuine very nice very quiet you know had his own you know world and he didn't really you know care too much about the the lights of the society so to say but just he would just want it to be the best

player he can be and I like that I liked that his mentality so when this happened I was I was shocked honestly I so I I do think that he didn't do it on purpose but the way the whole case was handled is so many red flags if he'd be number 500 in the world that's I think he'd been banned that's exactly isn't that the reality there is the lack of transparency the inconsistency the convenience of you know the ban coming you know between the slam so he doesn't miss out the other. It's just, it's so, it was very, very odd.

And so I really don't like how the case was being handled. And you could hear so many other players, both male and female, who had some similar situations coming in, you know, coming out in the media and complaining that it was a preferable treatment. I think that was inarguable, yeah. Yeah. So, so I think essentially, I mean, I want to believe, And knowing and my history with him, I think, you know, he didn't do it on purpose.

But of course, he is responsible because those are the rules. You are responsible when something like this happens. And so when you see someone for something very similar or same being banned for years and then he's banned for provisional or whatever, three months or whatever it was, it's just, it's not right. And his name doesn't help, does it? And he's number one in the world. No, he's got...

No, no. Oh, right. Sinner. I mean, if he calls sinner. No, look, I mean, it's not easy for him, obviously. And I do have, you know, sense of empathy and compassion for him because, and I think he has handled the storm in the media that keeps on coming back every once in a while. He's handling that very well and very maturely and very steadily and I, kudos to him for that.

But it's definitely not easy. And in the midst of all of that, he's still dominating. He's still playing incredible winning slams, winning things. So I think it's interesting. You should interview him. You should ask him, you know, he should share some of that thought process and how he has maybe used that as a fuel. It will be interesting to hear.

I only interview goats. Okay. Fair enough. That's why you're sitting here. Fair enough. You've got the goat slot. Fair enough, sir. No, back, it's been fascinating talking to you.

It was really enjoyable. Yeah, you've been great to talk to it. Credibly open. I mean, my last question was just going to be when you have to retire at some stage. How would you like to be remembered? Wow, that's a good question. One of the people that has helped me a lot with my mental strength and one of the greatest sports psychologists ever to live, Dr.

Jim Laird who worked with a lot of the champions and number ones in the world and both men and women tennis world he's one of his main questions is what would you want to have on your tombstone yes it's a great question and so it makes you makes you wonder you know makes you ask yourself like you know how do you want to be remembered i i would love i mean obviously the achievements and the results and the crowns and titles is something that I am very proud of. I cannot neglect that. I'm very proud of it. I've worked my ass off for my entire life to get to the point where I am and to be in this discussion.

So I take the great pride with that. But I do believe my tennis father, as I like to call him, passed away. passed away a bit more than a month ago and I was at his funeral. It was the first funeral that I was ever present on. And never, I was never, because of tennis and because of also my avoidance of the emotions and of the sadness, I did not go to the funeral of my great-grandfather that I was very close to. and this was the first funeral that I was present on and my biggest takeaway from that other than incredible sadness and emotions that I felt is is the human connection connections

that he has left behind and established throughout his life and his career how he touched people's hearts who were not just there on that funeral but who were also in the tennis club, which was post-funeral little event that was created in his honor. The way people talked about him, it was not about tennis and what he has achieved as a player or as a coach or who he has coached and et cetera. It was about who he was as a person, how he conducted himself with people, how he changed the lives of the young people or anybody who he was coming close to and that's how I want to be remembered I want to be so imagine a tombstone yeah and it says here lies Novak Djogovic what do you

want it to say the the man who touched people's hearts that's great I think I want to cry right now I think I've I think I realized what I want on my tombstone I love thank you thank you for that I love that you helped me come to that realization. I'm here to help. You know about Novo. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Great into it. Thank you. Thank you very much. Amazing. Amazing. Piers Morgan Unscensored is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask only one simple thing.

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