Piers Morgan Uncensored - Piers Morgan Uncensored: Arthur Edwards, Katie Nicholl, Bonnie Greer & more...

Episode Date: May 30, 2022

On today's show, Piers talk Queens Platinum Jubilee Celebration with guests Katie Nicholl, Arthur Edwards, Bonnie Greer and much more. Watch Piers Morgan Uncensored at 8 pm on TalkTV on Sky 526, Virgin Media 627, Freeview 237 and Freesat 217. Listen on DAB+ and app. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Good evening on Pierce Morgan, uncensored. Tonight cop cowardice in the Texas school shooting. Could and should law enforcement have prevented a tragedy. And are Harry and Megham plotting to steal the Jubilee limelight with a Royal Exclusive? The first is my brain dumb. There's a test for you. Try reading this headline out loud without feeling like you've landed on another planet. Stella Creasy, J.K. Rowling is wrong.

Women can have a penis. Then there's this one. from Stella Creasy's Labour MP colleague, Annalise Dodds. Steliquese is wrong. A woman can't have a penis. And finally this one. Labor MPs at war over whether a woman can be born with a penis. Well, my apologies for repeatedly using the P word,

but it's rather significant here when you're talking about women, because I wasn't aware that they had one. We've got to this ridiculously absurd stage in a gender debate, a civil war erupting between two British female MPs, from the same Labour Party over something that we already all know but he answered to. Who can blame them for their confusion

when their own leader, Sequeer Stama, can't even answer the question at all. A woman can have a penis. Nick, I'm not. I don't think we can conduct this debate with, you know... Sorry, I've offended you in something.

No, no, no, it's just... Who's not asking you for Pythagoras' theorem? He's just... saying, what's a woman? Can a woman have a penis? This is all so insane. A woman is an adult female who does not have a penis. I can't even believe I have to say that on air. This is not something that should be debated. It's a biological fact. You can't refute basic scientific sexual physiology. I mean, you can scream and you can bully and try to cancel people. But ultimately, facts are facts. Science is science.

Now, gender is a different matter. In a free society, you can identify, frankly, as whatever you please. That doesn't mean the rest of us have to buy into it, or that society has to change all the rules to suit your latest identity, whim, and fancy. Like the debate over what a woman is, gender self-identity is also going completely bonkers. British police forces are now allowing suspects to choose from 67 genders.

When imagine being the guy, sorry, woman, sorry, person who has to make the bar charts for crime statistics. Meanwhile, prison officers are told to use whatever personal pronouns, inmates decide they want to be called. And not to be outwoked, the British Civil Service is ordering workers to recognise 100 genders, while also paying them to attend gender neutral book clubs and celebrate non-binary awareness week. By the way, of those hundred genders, they include the following, omni gender. Pangender, two-spirit, demi-gender, grey gender, gender void. And my favourite, gender outlaw, for the love of God.

The only void is between the ears of the people who come up with this nonsense. And the only thing needs to be outlawed is this time-wasting, absurdist nonsense at the heart of our government. I support, respect and protect trans rights, always have done. But women MPs insisting that women have penises and authorities officially recognising gender outlaws as a gender. There's nothing but damage those rights by making a cruel mockery of trans people who actually go through the long, difficult process of transitioning.

And it's got to stop. Well, almost a week on from the horrific Texas school massacre and there's no sign of any consensus in the embittered debate over gun rights. But as more grim details emerge, is a rare agreement developing about one thing. The gutless Evaldi police failed these children. We now know that 90s,

19 armed police officers were inside Rob Elementary School during the 78 minutes. The shooter, Salvador Ramos, unleashed his hellish murderous rampage. That's one officer for each of the children who were killed. Eight desperate calls. Eight were made at 9-1-1 by kids inside the classroom on their cell phones before the police finally went in. It's better than I read it than you listen to it. Then if I had herself and whispered, she's in room one. 12. At 1210, she called back in room 12, advisor, multiple dead. At approximately 1243 and 1247,

she asked 911 to please send the police now. At 1246, she said she could not, that she could hear the police next door. At 1250 shots are fired. They can be heard over the 911 call. And at 1251 is very loud and sounds like the officers are moving children out of the room. Isn't this unbelievable? Kids in the classroom who'd seen some of their fellow students being murdered were calling 911 to tell the police who were standing outside with guns what was going on.

And for minute after minute after minute, those police did nothing until it was all too late. We've been told that they were waiting for keys for tactical equipment, for orders from their boss. We were also told in their apparent defence that apparently they could have been shot at and killed. Well, yes, they could, but that's actually their duty. It's literally what they signed up for

to protect the public. After the Columbine High School massacre in 1999 where 13 people were shot dead as police waited outside for an hour, cops were ordered after that to prioritise the safety of people under threat, not themselves. Police and Nivalde were briefed on this as recently as much, They were specifically told.

Officers' first priority is to move in and confront the attacker. But they didn't. Not one of those armed police chose to confront the shooter before it was too late. As a result of their shocking collective cowardice, 19 children and two teachers are now dead. Shame on them. We'll bring out the bunting. Ready to Victoria sponge. Cover everything in the union flag.

It's almost platinum jubilee street party season. But no, not if the fun police have their way. Fifteen million Brits are preparing to celebrate 70 years of the Queen's reign this weekend with a mammoth, four-day traditional best of British street party. But Killjoy councils are reportedly warning the six weeks notice is required for a road closure. So the multitude of neighbourhoods you missed or didn't even know about the deadline will be holding street parties which are now going to be deemed illegal. They're quite literally replacing our bunting with red tape.

We don't have a land of hope and glory become a land of nope and boring. Come on. We've had dismal summers of life under COVID lockdowns, unable to hug our loved ones, and where finger food was frankly unthinkable. This is the perfect time for a massive party, a rare moment of national unity in respect of our greatest and longest-serving monarch.

Once again, I turn to my late great friend, cricket legend, Shane Warren, for the best response to party-pooping claptrap. And in this politically correct day and age, we've just got to be a little bit careful, but sometimes just say get stuff to the fun police. Exactly. My message to the British people is ignore these pen-pushing jobs worth. Get out there and celebrate our queen like you've never done before.

I regret to say I have a trigger warning. The following clip contains scenes of unbridled masculinity. I know... Those are your pilots. Anything happens to never forgive yourself. No turning back now. Any fun yet? I know, workies.

I know. All that raging testosterone. It's all so toxic, isn't it? Problematic, primitive, arrestable even. Well, it's also turned out to be staggeringly popular. Yes, the long-awaited sequel to Top Gun has racked up box-off its sales of more than $248 million in this opening weekend, smashing post-pandemic records and easily becoming the biggest hit of Tom Cruise's already stellar Hollywood career. How can this have happened?

After all, it's a jet fuel, balls-out, supersonic rampage in which cocksure guys drink, fight, disobey orders, ride motorbikes without helmets, bond over fixing engines, bottle up their feelings, bail out their mates, play macho, topless beach volleyball, get the hot girls, and kill all the bad guys. And even bravely sticks two fingers up for China by refusing to remove the Taiwan flag from Maverick's jacket. This is a movie for people like me who regularly moan they don't make movies like that anymore

when I watch the great man-celebrating films of the 70s and the 80s, and we're loving it. I took two of my sons to see Top Gun Maverick on Friday. It was the best escape is fun. I've had at the movies since 1986 when I was 21 and I went to see the first top gun movie at the cinema 10 times in three weeks. The main reason I loved it,

because I came out feeling better than I went in. What was that the last time I happened at a cinema? And I also felt proud to be a man and of masculinity, rather than ashamed of it as the feminizes constantly want us to feel. Don't get me wrong, some men are awful. But, spoiler alert, so are some women. And some forms of masculinity, are toxic, undeniably.

But Maverick reminds us, as the box office sales prove, that sometimes good old-fashioned, non-toxic, chest-beating, masculinity is just what everybody wants and needs. Well, talking about your happy comeback, so don't come much bigger or more redemptive than that of the Queen's favourite jockey, Lester Piggett, who died yesterday at the age of 86. The undisputed king of horse racing spent a year behind bars

for tax fraud in 1987. before getting back in Masaddled in 1990 and winning the Breeders' Cup in America, days later, age 55. Over a career that spanned 46 years, he wrote 4,493 winners, was a champion jockey 11 times, and he won a record 30 classics, including nine derbies. He was, quite simply, the greatest flat-race jockey that's ever been. And if I were a betting man, I'd say we'd never see the likes of Lester Pickett again. Unsense's the next of abandoned Royal duties, but will Harry and Meghan try and steal the royal limelight

from the Queen at the Platinum Jubilee? We'll be discussing that with Royal photographer Arthur Edwards, he's written them an open letter. Welcome back to Piers Morgan Unsensor with the Queen's Platinum Jubilee, just days away now. Some have warned Harry and Meghan, the Duke and Duchess of Netflix, to put their own agenda aside for a moment,

and let Her Majesty have her big moment. Royal photographer Arthur Edwards, who's been photographing the Queen for nearly 40 years, has written an open letter in tonight's, Sun newspaper urging the couple not to steal the limelight. And last night, a new documentary showed previously unseen footage from the Royal Family's home videos, giving insight into why the Queen is, in my view, the greatest monarch in our history.

I remember my own lifelong commitment made in 1947 at the age of 21. I declare before you all that my whole life, whether it be long or short, shall be devoted to your service and to the service of our great imperial family to which we all belong. I know that your support will be unfailingly given. God help me to make good my vow, and God bless all of you who are willing to share in it. Although that vow was made in my salad days when I was green in judgment, I do not regret, attract one word of it.

Well, I'm joined now by the Sun's Royal Editor of Vanity Fair, Katie Nicol, along with playwright novelist Bonnie Greer. Well, welcome to all of you. Arthur, great to have you here. I feel like in Platinum Jubilee Weeks, it's like almost like having the Queen paid me a visit. So welcome.

Thanks, Judith. You've written a piece about Megan and Harry. I'm going to come to a moment. I want to start, though, by talking about this remarkable BBC documentary last night because I honestly think it was the best royal documentary I've ever watched. And me too, I thought it was fantastic.

And the king, I mean, the way he was playing with his grandchildren. I mean, that man was always considered like to be a stutterer and didn't want the job, but my God, he came across as a fantastic and, of course, the Duke of Edinburgh, you know, absolutely the slide on the Royal Yacht

with the kids, I mean, it was unbelievable and the Queen shot under that footage of itself. Well, that was the great thing, wasn't it, Katie? was that this footage was raw footage taken by the royals of themselves. These were family home videos, which we've never really seen. And you've got to really see them as a family. I think it dispelled so many of the myths about the Queen, actually.

She's so often seen, certainly in those early days, of a mother who was quite aloof. Well, she was full of love for her children. There was nothing staged for the cameras. And it was wonderful to see her and the young Princess Margaret interacting and playing. And obviously they... I love Margaret and the Queen together interacting,

even when they were very young. and then teenagers and then a bit later. Real little festian. They're a very close, sort of quite misdivorous relationship with each other, right? Yeah, and I think you've got to see that dynamic of what they called we four. The Queen Mother and the King

and these two young daughters enjoying the most wonderful life. I think you're right about it being the best Royal Documentary. I mean, people might remember Elizabeth R and the Royal Family. Probably not. I thought the power of this was the simplicity of the home footage

and then the Queen now, narrating. the rating back over her own life. And then the pictures of Charles and Anne is totts, you know. You're amazing. And I mean, I work a lot with Prince Charles. And now I think about him like that, you know, and it was just brilliant. And there was a great moment when they played a clip about her view of the platinum jubilee.

Let's listen to this. I don't know that anyone had invented the term platinum for a 70th anniversary when I was born. You weren't expected to be around that long. Typically dry. Now, Bonnie Greer, before we get to probably slightly more, in century territory with the royals. Let's talk about the queen for a moment because I don't really care

whether you're pro monarchy, anti-monarchy in the world. You cannot but have respect for this woman who for 70 years has been on the throne, barely put a foot wrong in that entire time and does exemplify the very things she talked about when she was 21,

duty and service. Well, you know, believe it or not, good evening, everybody. Believe it or not, my family, family was royalist. My mother certainly was. So I grew up with enormous respect for her. And what you may

not have noticed, no one said it, the queen's changed her accent. She's talked to the way she did as a child. She's got less posh. I agree. So exactly, that's my point. But my next point is that times have changed and we need

to change too because she certainly has. Well, I think that's a very good point. And Arthur, I think the whole future of the monarchy when the queen, sadly the day comes when she's eventually not with us, is it going to be a very, very crucial one. Not just for Britain, but for the world, isn't it? Yes, indeed. And Prince Charles has got a tough job, in fact, to keep it online and going. And of course, you know, many of the countries that where the queen is head of state will pull out. I mean, I think certainly Australia will, maybe New Zealand, perhaps Canada, but it's going to be

a change. But the Prince of Wales will cope with that. He said when we left Barbados, last year when they gave up the queen. He said, well, it's what they want, and that's fair enough. So there will be changes, and the Prince of Wales has already thinking about that. I think he'll be a much better king than some people seem to think. Oh, I think so, too. He's a lovely man. And, of course, he's tireless.

And if you think of very much, he's a visionary. You know, when he was 25 years ago talking about organic food and people were calling him crazy. And every store you're going to now has got organic food and complementary medicine and everybody takes something. sort of complementary medicine. And so, you know, he's a visionary. I followed him. And when I started doing this job,

I didn't care less about what I was doing, just get pictures of anything. But I slowly listening to him, the way he's presented these speeches and where he asked the people in Brazil and Malaysia not to rip up the rainforests. And almost, and, you know, the plastic in the sea, he fights

for that. Yeah, he does, and he's been ahead of his time a number of these things. Katie, we're going to see on the balcony on Thursday morning, the trooping of the colour, a streamlined royal line-up. You're not going to have Ari and Megan or Andrew or the others who've been into dodgy territory in the last few years. You're going to have the main players. The Queen, and you have Charles and Camilla, and then you have

Kate and William. And that is the... That's the line of succession right there. But don't forget, you're going to have the Duke of Kent, the Gloucesters, the Wessex, Princess Anne, Timor-Rin. It's really about the main event, isn't it? It is, but it's interesting, Pears, because when you think back to the diamond, and you'll remember the... this as well, it was very much about the streamlined royal family. It was just the Queen, the Cambridge's, Charles and Camilla. So I think this is very important to the Queen that

she is having an opportunity to thank those that those that she calls my substitutes, the people who have stood in. Well, the ones who've actually done the hard graft. They put the hours in. The workers, if you count the number of duties, these are the ones who put the yards in. Two who won't be on the balcony but are coming in are Megan and Harry. You've written a pretty robust and direct letter to them in tonight's son, in which you basically plead with them not to try and steal the limelight from the Queen. Yeah, because if they publish a picture

when the Queen meets Lilibet, that will wipe everything else out. You know, that's what I'm thinking. You know, everyone is talking to the editor tonight and saying, that picture will just scream in and everything the Queen's are trying to achieve with doing her very best to make appearances and it would just go to pieces.

And I just hope she doesn't turn up with a photographer to do that and put it out. I don't think the Queen would allow it anyway. How damaging have they been those two with their antics? I mean, I have a view that people know, but what do you think? Well, the opera at Winfrey interview was the thing that turned me off them immediately because some of the lies in that that were told, some of the untruth and misleading statements, certainly about Arch's colour, Arch's skin, you know.

I mean, when that remark was made, it wasn't even engaged, there wasn't even talking about him in a child. But the way it came across in the interview, it looked like it had been discussed while she was pregnant. Of course it wasn't. And talking to people of mixed race, they say to me, they discuss if they were having a baby with a colour. If they're a Chinese couple, I know, a lady married to a Chinese lady.

They discuss it when they have my eyes. I think it all depends on the context. We've never been told the context. Bonnie, I know that you're a supporter of Meghan and Harry. My views are well known. Arthur shares those views about this. I felt from that interview onwards, They've been on a very strange journey where for a couple that left the country for privacy,

they've never stopped doing media stuff. For a couple who trashed the monarchy in the institution, they keep using their royal titles to commercially benefit themselves to the tune of tens of millions of dollars. So I'm pretty cynical about what they've done. Do you think I'm wrong? Well, no, you're not wrong to be, if you want to be cynical. But I think what we're forgetting here is that this family is probably one of the most resilient PR exercises of at least the 20th century. Remember, they pulled off one of the biggest brand coups of the 20th century by changing their name from a German name to the name of their residents.

They also pulled off another coup when around the funeral of the princes of Wales. I mean, they've been changing all the time while giving people the illusion that they haven't. I mean, they're absolutely brilliant, and this will be handled too. I mean, I don't know why people are freaking out so much about this. This family exists and survives because they can adapt. And it's too bad that the people who support them

don't know how to do that themselves. Yeah, I mean, I think, Arthur, if you go back over your time covering the rules, four decades. There have been a lot of big royal scandals. I mean, we feel like because of social media, the Megan and Harry Antics and Prince Andrew and so on have been really big. But there have been,

as we know, from that documentary last night, the abdication of a king over a love affair. I know. Probably dwarfs any of its stuff. That's right. And they went on to live in America, but they never dumped on the royal family, not once. They... They never did. There were a fair few cashing ins of being...

We are now with American... I hate to say this for Bonning here, but we are with American women now, two for two. We've had two of them. Come here. Hang out. Let me say something. No, they didn't come. They got married into the royal family. And it's true. That family,

Edward, I mean, sorry, the Duke of Windsor and the Duchess of Windsor, cashed in. It is not even a comparison to where Megan and Harry are doing nothing. But the point we were making was not about cashing in. They were paid to go to nightclubs. They had all kinds of things. You know, come on the road.

I don't be with what they never did, Arthur said, which is true, they never attacked the royal family in public. And I would have no problem with Megan and Harry. If Megan and Harry gave up their titles and just lived off being Megan and Harry's celebrities and stopped attacking the institution. You're forgetting one thing. This guy gave up the crown.

Yeah. He didn't have, that was the coup of the after right there. So he already attacked the royal family, okay? That was done and probably done for all time, okay? So we didn't have to do anything else. Listen, Bonnie, you're making good points, and I don't dispute them. Thank you. Katie, I mean, this goes back to my point to Arthur.

We have gone through, you know, centuries of royal scandal. Imagine if social media had been around with Henry VIII. Debting his wives. I mean, it's all relative. It's all relative. But I think it's the way the queen has weathered these storms. I mean, look at the death of Diana and the way that almost, you know, saw the tide really nearly turn against the queen.

She rained that back in. I spoke to someone for my new book who said to me... Excellent book, by the way. The new royals. Very good read. This was so important. He said to me, the Queen has the most remarkable capacity for forgiveness. And I think that's what you're going to see with the Sussex.

She wants this, Julie, about her family. Bonnie come in? I've met the Queen a couple of times. And I'll tell you one occasion I met her, which I thought was extraordinary. This was the reopening of Windsor Castle. Okay, this place to burn down. There were people in there smoking. Now, if that was my house, I would have said, hold it, cut it out.

My place has already burned down. You people are lighting up cigarettes. That was when we were allowed. You know, people were allowed to do that. She walks in, she walks around. You know, you can't talk to her. You have to be taken over to her. And then she deigns to speak.

Walking through people smoke, everything, cool as a cucumber. I wouldn't worry about her at all. I mean, nothing flusters the queen. I don't think so. I don't think so. I wanted to show your pictures of Stonehenge, which they lit up with eight pictures, images beamed onto Stonehenge of the Queen through the years.

I thought this was a wonderful idea, didn't you? I do, I did too. I've had a printmaid today, one of my favorite pictures of the Queen. I'm going to put up in my window of my house tonight. You know, I'm so excited about it everywhere, you know, it's... What's your favourite memory of the Queen personally? Oh, personally. Well, when she gave me my MBA,

when she said, I can't believe I'm giving you this. She said, does she give it to me? And then she said that long you've been coming down here to photograph me. I said, then it was 20 years ago. I said, 27 years, ma'am. She said, well, let's have our picture taken together. Oh, that was really lovely. And that really was moving.

I never forgotten that. And funny, as I walked away, Prince Andrew come up to me. He said, oh, what did you get? I said, the NBA. He said, what did that stand for? I said, much bigger expensive. Arthur, it's a privilege to have you. You're one of the all-time great royal photographers.

And you still do it. And I won't ask you how old you are, but I know, and it's amazing the energy and drive you still have for your craft. I love it. It's a nice job, a nice people. I work with lovely people. Royal tours are always the most fun with Arthur. Of course.

Everything's more fun with Arthur. Katie, thank you very much. The new Royals is out now. Queen Elizabeth's Legacy. In November. In November. It's coming out. You got it first.

In November. First early copy. Okay, cool. And Bonnie Greer, thank you very much indeed. That was quite civilised for us, I thought. No comment from Bonnie. She's not agreeing her otherwise. I didn't know.

No, I, no, it was civilized because at the end of the day, they're going to come anyway. So that's that. You know, I mean, that's that. And it'll all be over. Bonnie, great to see you. Come back soon. Thank you, peers.

Thank you. Take care of yourself. Unsense the next new testimony is shed light on the police response to the Texas school massacre. Should they have done more? Well, there's fresh scrutiny for police in Nivalde, Texas, as a 911 dispatch. appears to confirm officers were told the gunman was in a room full of victims as they stood outside. Well, Lydia Morales, along with her mother, Monica, cared for many of the victims of their daycare centre when they were just toddlers.

They'd not set up a memorial, 21 chairs with each of the names of each of the children and the two teachers who were killed on a white piece of paper. And Lydia joins me now. Lydia, thank you so much for joining me. I really appreciate it. I can't even imagine what it must be like for all of you connected with this school and these poor. children who were murdered. You had, I think, over 10 of these kids come through your daycare center. When you first heard what had happened, what were your feelings? I was really in shock. I didn't think this could happen, especially to a small community.

When we actually heard what was going on, we locked down our daycare center just to ensure the safety just because there was a lot of commotion going on, especially because our daycare is. actually located by, if I'm not mistaken, it's Dalton Elementary. So there was just a lot of quotient at that time. And so, you know, just for safety protocol, we locked down our daycare center and hoping that we kept the safety for everybody. It must have been agonizing for you to discover that so many of the children who'd been at your daycare center had actually been killed.

Yes, it was. And I also know, Lydia, that it's hard to think that these families are not going to be able to hold these, that they're not going to be able to hold their child ever again. Yeah, I mean, it's an incomprehensible atrocity. It's not a tragedy because a tragedy implies somehow this, you know, this was accidental or something. This is a deliberate annihilation of young children by an 18-year-old who just decided to destroy their lives. I know that you were also, personally close to Mrs. Garcia, one of the two teachers who died. She actually taught you. So this is very personal for you, isn't it? Yes, it is. She actually did. She was my third grade teacher here at the school right behind me, Robb Elementary.

I was here probably when I was like 10 as well, so a good 12 years ago, I walked these same halls that the tragedy took place. Lydia, what is your feeling? There's a huge debate raging now about guns, about mental health, about all sorts of issues which may have contributed to this. What is the feeling, do you think, of the community about what's happened here? I think a lot of it needs to change, at least with the gun violence, it needs to change, and mental health needs to be taken seriously, and not just as a walk-in talk thing.

It needs to be where you need to sit down with that person, talk about what's going on with them, Talk about their past history, especially even now more so with the tragedy that took place here. I mean, there's always been a debate after all of these massacres in America about gun control, you know, taking some guns away from certain types of people. It does seem strange to us here in the UK, for example, that an 18-year-old can't buy a beer until they're 21, but they can buy a semi-automatic rifle. Do you think that something like that ought to change, that kids, young people, teenagers,

should not be able to get these kind of guns? I do believe something does need to change because, like you were saying, how your laws are different from here from the United States. I mean, here, I mean, they could buy a beer at 21, but they could buy legal guns and stuff at 18 years old. It just doesn't seem right. Especially, I've been now more so that this,

tragedy took place that involved, you know, guns taking the life of 21 people. You've done this wonderful little tribute of these chairs. What was it that made you want to do that in particular? We just wanted to show our support for the community, especially during this tragic time, especially for the families. I notice right now, too, we have more people putting out bears, they're putting flowers, they're putting the little rocks that have messages and stuff, in hopes that with all this stuff, we will be able to give it to their families as a reminder that we're all here together in Evaldi

and we're standing strong for one another. And Lydia, is there anger amongst the local community about the way the police conducted themselves? There's a big debate now that there were 19 police with guns in the school and they didn't go in for over an hour? Okay. Can you repeat that? I just wondered what your view is of the debate about the failure of the police to go into the classroom,

given they were in the school for over an hour. I do believe there is some anger around the community, but at the same time, you know, everybody's trying to hold together, at least to be strong for the families of these lives that were taken. Yeah, I completely understand. Lydia, thank you so much for joining me. it's just unbearable to think what has happened there and the fact that you knew 10 of these children

who'd come through your day center, the fact you used to be taught by one of the teachers who died, it must be particularly unbearable for you. And I'm incredibly grateful to you for taking the time to talk to us tonight. Thank you. Beyond comprehension, but I'm joined now by Chris Grohlneck. He's a retired police officer,

an active shooter prevention expert, and Fox Nation host Tommy Lehrer. Welcome to both of you. Let me start with you, Chris, if I may. You're a specialist in this very kind of scenario. You know, I wrote a column for the New York Post yesterday, just really just lambasting what happened here as, I'm afraid, cowardice. I mean, the idea that 19 armed police were in that school

for over an hour and didn't go into that classroom is to me unconscionable. Yeah, thank you for having me, Pearson. Hello, Tommy. Great to see you again. For this tragedy, I wish we weren't speaking about this. However, what we've seen is we've spent about $10 million since Sandy Hook on training approximately 140,000 police on response tactics of how to respond to an active shooter.

And we see after a similar pulse, Parkland, Yuvaldi, and there's several others, they're not responding appropriately. And there's no excuse for this one. And I have, you know, I'm not just speaking out of a... Out of my mouth, I've been in an active shooter in real time as a policeman where somebody just decides they're going to start shooting at you and they attack you and you have no call so you have to react. This is different. These are children. I don't really speak about children, but there's a message to be evangelized here and that is we have to change a lot, not just a binary choice of guns or mental health.

We have to evaluate the whole spectrum and decide who we're talking to. Right. I mean, I think Tommy, you know, you and I have talked about guns before. I don't want to re-legislate that debate. What strikes me about this particular two-week period? You've had the mass shooting in Buffalo. Ten black people were murdered by a white supremacist in a supermarket. You've now had 19 children annihilated in their classroom exactly the same as what happened in Sandy Hook 10 years ago.

And we know nothing got changed. And it's not as simple as saying, take all the guns away. there are too many guns in America to do that. And also there is a constitutional right, which I know a lot of Americans feel strongly about, about their right to bear arms. And we just don't have that kind of issue here. So I'm not going to legislate that with you.

I'm just curious, you know, what can be done here? The normal response from the pro-gun lobby is, well, you need to have more guns so that good guys with guns can stop it. But we had 19, supposedly good guys with guns, in the school hallway, doing nothing. So that can't be the answer. Well, I think that we have to look at this situation apart from other situations where law enforcement did fail here.

And I am a big advocate and supporter of law enforcement, but we have to take a look at the situation. There's going to be an investigation. And the people of that community and the people of the world deserve to know what happened, what lapsing communication occurred there, and what went so wrong. Back to the discussion about guns, what we do to address this issue. It is an issue of mental health as well, and I'll speak to that in a moment. But I would also say this. When we're talking about our constitutional rights, making law-abiding citizens helpless and outgun does not make evil people any less harmful. So that is a discussion that needs to be had. But also mental health. When you look at individuals like this, there is a common thread in pattern. These individuals are on social media platforms on different chat rooms, torturing animals, abusing animals, talking about violence, talking about how they want to harm people. Why is there not a mechanism to report this? The world is watching these individuals promised to do harm and nothing is done and nothing has said. I mean, I agree.

And here's I would also say, I would say, look, I agree there are a number of things at play here. Mental health is clearly a massive problem. These are evil, twisted people. And they all seem to be getting younger and younger. And it's incredibly worrying. I know that the Sandy Hook shoot, for example, and this shooter both had a weird obsession with Call of Duty, which is a video game where you play a lone shooter, right? Is there no connection between that and mental illness

and the ready availability of guns? I'm sure there is a connection. There are lots of things going on here, but I think the rest of the world looks at these incidents in America happening at time and time again and just wonders whether anything will actually be done about guns themselves. And what do you think the answer is?

I mean, when I asked the lady earlier, you know, this guy, I couldn't buy a beer until he was 21. Americans accept that. They accept that. They accept regulation when they drive cars, which can be dangerous. But why was he able to get a semi-automatic rifle? Matt, Matt, just interject on one thing, Pierce, because I do think it's a simple question.

Okay, Chris, yeah. I apologize. So we know that 100% of active shooters and mass killers share a common trait out of a number of common traits. The problem with that benchmark is, me and you share. at least one of those traits. Maybe we've been wronged in our whole life. Maybe we had whatever the problem is. So if we throw that metric out

and we look at one statistic that the FBI has put out in 21 years, 47.3% of active shooters telegraphed that they're going to be active shooters. And yet they still legally purchased firearms. That's where I tell you, I am agreeing that there has to get a conversation. I think if I could jump in, Chris,

I think the lack of proper red flag spotting You know, every single time stuff comes out about these shootings. You think, well, why didn't that get picked up? Why wasn't that shown on their background check when they go and get these guns legally? Tommy, you wanted to answer before Chris stepped in there. When I agree with Chris wholeheartedly, we also need to address some of the cultural issues that we have in the United States of America. And it's not just gun culture. It's also a culture of fatherlessness.

It's a culture of young people falling through the cracks. And I'm glad that Chris is talking about some of these traits because you don't see young women doing this. You see young men doing this, young men who were incredibly angry, young men who often share that common threat of not having fathers or parents in the household that are raising them correctly. So we're going to have to address a whole litany of issues. It's not just the gun. I know it's easy to go after the weapon, but there are millions of Americans who own firearms and who own what they call assault weapons. And they don't go out and they don't become mass shooters. They use them for home defense and protection.

So there's bigger issues to be discussed here besides just the weapon. important issues that are a little bit more challenging, and that's why I feel that so many fail to address them. I think it is a very complex issue in America. You know, when Britain got rid of its guns after the Dun Blame Massacre in the 90s, we were not a gun culture country. Most people in Britain did not have a gun to start with.

So it was a much easier thing to do and a much easier thing for all sides of the political divide to agree with. So it's very complicated in America. I completely accept that. Listen, got to leave it there. Chris, Tommy, thank you both very much indeed for joining us. Thank you both.

Thank you. And since the next, British police allow criminals to self-identify their gender. Why? Discussing that next. They're able to identify as various different types of gender, and it's very important to allow them to do that, not to assume that they identify as male or female. The problem with this, the flip side of this, is that the police are increasingly investigating people

for what are referred to as non-crime hate incidents, often involving misgendering a trans person or declining to use a trans person's preferred gender pronouns, a thought crime referred to as dead naming. And the Free Speech Union is increasingly contacted by people who are being investigated by the police for allegedly having committed a non-crime. Someone has complained about something they've said or done,

which doesn't meet the threshold of being a criminal offence, but the police feel obliged to investigate it anyway, and when they've concluded their investigation, they record it as a non-crime. And that can show up if you apply for a job working with vulnerable people and someone does an enhanced criminal record check, that can show up on your criminal record, the fact that you haven't committed a crime. And you may think that this can't be going on at scale.

I think, Toby, I think the thing is, I think you can identify as what the hell you're like. What you can't do is question biology, as far as I'm concerned. You're born a man or woman. It's just a biological fact. But secondly, on gender self-identity, there's our hundred agendas for the British Civil Service, many of which sound utterly ridiculous. Now, you can call yourself what you like.

I don't care. But the moment that government bodies start to say these terms have to be used, I just think they've lost the plot. Society doesn't have to change completely to come around to the whims and fancies of people who decide they want to be called. you know, gender, whatever.

It's like, I don't think that's right in a society. Yeah, I mean, I think that the real difficulty with the civil service embracing gender ideology to the extent that it has is that it's effectively taking sides in what is a politically contentious ongoing public debate. You know, there is an ongoing debate between trans rights activists and gender-critical feminists about things like, should women be admitted, should trans women be admitted to women's prisons

should they be able to participate in women's sports, should be referred to women and mothers as birthing people. And yet, this debate has far from been resolved, but it's as though the civil service has decided they're on the side of the trans rights activists and woe betide any employee who dissent from their agenda. If you try and defy it, you are somehow the problem. Toby, I've got to leave it there.

Great conversation. Please come back again because this is not going to go away. The better than it's going to get worse. So I look forward to speaking to you about it again as we deteriorate down. into a further woke abyss. Thank you for joining me, Toby Young. Thanks, Pierce.

Well, we started with women's anatomy and we're going to end with it. If we go about cornflakes, how about some raspberry-flavored uterus-shaped period crunch? Feminine care brand Intaminor has created the dyed, red, womb-themed cereal to encourage families

to discuss menstruation at the breakfast table. What a cracking idea. Nothing I'd like to do more in the morning with my children than eat some serial uteruses. Good night, everybody. Remember, keep it uncensored.