Piers Morgan Uncensored - Piers Morgan Uncensored: Martina Navratilova Exclusive

Episode Date: March 22, 2023

On tonight's episode of Piers Morgan Uncensored, Piers speaks to the legendary female tennis player who speaks about he double cancer diagnosis, Martina Navratilova is on Uncensored. Watch Piers Morgan Uncensored at 8 pm on TalkTV on Sky 522, Virgin Media 606, Freeview 237 and Freesat 217. Listen on DAB+ and the app.  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Good evening from Miami in Florida, where I've just finished a remarkable interview with tennis icon Martina had rattled over about her double cancer diagnosis. So I was in a total panic for three days thinking I may not see next Christmas. Broke cancer and breast cancer. Who has two cancers in the same time? I was never an underachiever, but this is getting ridiculous. We sat down just days after she competed her final course of chemotherapy. She got that bell which said that it's all over, at least for now.

To go through it and then to watch it back and to feel that. I can see you. You know, so when you're going through, you have tears of feeling sorry for yourself. This tear was just happiness. And she talked about the remarkable support she's had from the tennis community, especially Chris Everett, who has self-battled cancer.

You were both treated in the same place. Can't make it up. It just can't, yeah. Your great rival. The parallels are unbelievable. And at the end, I was joined by her beautiful wife, Julia. Would you say all those same things about Julia? It took me a little bit.

I was broken. I'm a house broken. And the two of them talked about their new plans for the future. Ooh. What do you think of that? Why not? Scuba diving, last scuba diving. No, no, scuba diving.

I'm scared of sharks. And the plans that they've had to leave behind. We were waiting for Fonkel to welcome a child home and then we were fighting to Kansas. So here is my world-exclusive interview with Martineana Rattleover. As she said, she's one head of a fighter. Martin, it's great to see you. Nice to see you.

How are you? Well, you know what chemo does to you is you feel so horrible that after you start recovering, you feel better every single day, but you still feel like crap. So that's when you realize how many levels of crap there are until you start feeling semi-normal. So I'm semi-normal now, but the leftovers are still there. It's been a very unpleasant experience for you. It's not your first time that you've had to go through a battle with cancer. cancer. How has it been different if it has this time?

Well, so the first time it happened was 13 years ago and it was DCIS, Dr. Carson Institute, which means it could turn into cancer, but it's kind of pre-cancerous situation, but you still have to do the radiation, et cetera. So it was a shock to the system, but compared to when I got this diagnosis, that was a piece of cake. That was like a non-issue because this one at first when the doctor told me that I had a cancer squamous cell carcinoma in the throat and then he says and by the way we don't know where it's coming from we need to find out it could be the lungs or the liver or the kidneys end of story so I'm think this is Friday afternoon when I

got the news had you gone in for a routine check no no so we found it when I had I noticed that my left lymph node was enlarged and I thought it was from my a shingles shot that I just had vaccine like a week before and I thought it was maybe from that but then a couple weeks when it didn't go down I called the doctor and he ordered a biopsy. Were you feeling after a couple of weeks were you feeling a sense of foreboding about it? No.

Well I sense of foreboding when I asked the doctor what do you think the chances are? He says what 50-50 I'm like I don't like those odds. So that's when I thought because the lymph nodes don't get swirled up for no reason and that so I didn't have a good feeling about it. at that point. So I'm thinking it could be the brain, it could be the pancreas, labor's not a good thing either. Neither is less. So I was in a total panic for three days thinking I may not see next Christmas. Wow. So I had three horrible nights. I'm like, he needed to find out. So Monday morning I'd speak to an oncologist and he says, oh, it's for sure coming from the throat.

And it's P-16, which is extremely treatable and 95% full recovery. So big, big relief. But, you know, So emotionally, it's been up and down because of what the doctor initially told me. When you first had the tests, what was the first cancer detected? The breast cancer or throat cancer? No, the throat cancer. Was the first thing it detected? Yeah, so what they do, they know it's cancer. They know it's in the throat, but they don't know where.

So then you do a PET scan and where you don't eat. And then they give you glucose, and then the cancer sucks the glucose. So that's where they know where the cancer is. So that's when they see exactly where it is in the throat. And my right breast lit up as well. Literally. Literally. Well, the cancer lights up.

It goes red. And this was the other breast to the one that you had. The first one was on the left, lumpectomy, and took out some lymph nodes. And the right one is different cancer, similar area. But this was a real actual real tumor. That was about seven, eight millimeters. So they caught it so early that they did not see it on the mammogram, which I just had. I mean, you're a famously tough athlete.

You don't get to win 59 Grand Slam titles without being a tough cookie. And you'd been through an earlier bout of cancer. But even for you, with your mentality, to be told you've got throat cancer and breast cancer, and it's in the other breast of the one that you had treated last time. Yeah. That is a massive moment in your life to deal with. It was because again, very up and down, right? So I find out it's the throat cancer.

Think I could be dying, but I find out, no, it's very treatable. Then they found the right breast. And when I had the biopsy on the right breast, the doctor was saying, this doesn't look great. And that's when she said that, I'm like, oh, great, I have another cancer. That's when I started crying on the table as she's still poking in there getting some. out of my boob, I'm like, oh great, I have two cancers at the same time that I'm not related, I knew that.

No connection at all. Who does that? Who has two cancers at the same time? I'm like, I was never an underachiever, but this is getting ridiculous. Following in Chris Evers' footsteps, who went through cancer a year before, we ended up being in the same place in New York's, long catering. You were both treated in the same place? You just can't make it up.

You just can't make. Yeah. Your great rival. The parallels are unbelievable with the two of us. That's extraordinary. Because she had ovarian cancer at the start of 2022. Right. So you both end up being treated in the same place.

Same place. Same people, some of the same nurses that were, you know, giving me cisplatin. She was getting some other chemotherapy drug. But same place. We rang the same bell. That's amazing. Yeah. I mean, you know, I mean, she grew up in Fort Odderdale and I live in Boca.

I live in Miami. We both had a place in Aspen. Of course, the careers are always intertwined. And then we follow each other this way. And she was on Saturday Night Live years ago when she retired and did a skit about how competitive we were. And I'm like, this is the kind of competition we don't really want. But I must say, Chris has been Justice Dollward.

She has supported me so much through this as I supported her a year ago. Little did I know that it was going to be reciprocated in this manner. But she's been great. The moment you know you have both cancers, you see you got very emotional. But is that a moment, you know, people talk about their life flashing before them. You said the first time this happened to you that because he was so young and so healthy, you were very positive and came through it. It's probably a bit tougher when you're in your mid-60s.

Exactly. Did you think, my God, this could be it? Yeah, I did. You definitely come face to face with your mortality a lot more when you're 65 than when you're 50 or 55 or whatever I was, 52. So that was, and the bucket list comes into mind with all the things that I want to do. And this may sound really shallow, but this came into my mind's like, okay, which Kikas car do I really want to drive? If I only have like a year. So you were really thinking.

That's what I was thinking about. You might only have a year to look. I totally thought that. Again, when I didn't know where it was coming from, that's a definite possibility. Once that oncologist said, no, it's from your throat and it's very treatable. Then I'm like, okay, so what do we do? So you get into the as a tennis player You have to be in that solution

You have to be in game mode And so that's where I think being a champion athlete comes in pretty handy One of the I mean amazing ironies about this I guess is that after your first bout with cancer You then spent the next few years Telling women get checked get checked Because the first time it had been I think a four year gap from your last Exactly mammogram Mammogram and so you were determined right the other women didn't

fall into that trap of being a bit lazy about it. And actually, it probably helped you get action quicker than you may have done. You're absolutely right. It's probably nothing, but you better find out because if it is something, then you want to catch it as early as possible. So being diligent definitely helps. And as an athlete, when you have an injury, you take care of it right away. You don't wait for it to get better.

You tweeted, this double whammy is serious but fixable. I'm hoping for a favorable outcome. It's going to stink for a while. but I'll fight with all I have got. What were you feeling as you wrote those words? I knew it was going to be hard, but I didn't realize it was going to be as hard as it really was. I love to eat, as you know.

We had dinner together. I love to eat. And eating was the hardest part of this whole treatment. I lost 15 pounds, not because I wanted to, but because I just couldn't get enough food in my body. The radiation, the proton therapy, affects your throat and the mouth and there's a lot going on and it started closing. I couldn't even yawn.

You start yawning and it closes up and it stops the yawn halfway. I couldn't sneeze. It was like because it was so swollen and I only had three weeks of the proton when the normal course is seven weeks but thankfully at Sloan Kettering, Dr. Nancy Lee started this program where you only do three, three weeks. If it resolves then you stop, if it doesn't then you do the seven. And you had to wear this extraordinary mask. I'm going to bring in exhibit one here. So we can reunite you with your mask.

I call her Lucille. Come on Lucille, here we go. Here's the mask, yeah. It even looks like me. It does look like you, yeah? So explain what this is and why you had to use this. So you see all these holes? That's how they tape it.

You're laying on a table. And even for the back, of the head you have a formed cushion that's yours and then and then put this on top and they they they they tape it down with these little pegs so you literally cannot even open your eyes maybe a little bit I could see out of my right eye but most of the time I couldn't just can't move you cannot move because the proton is so specific really to radiate from four different angles so yeah why did you call it Lucille oh so a very good friend of mine had a Harley I sold her my Harley and she

She named the Harley Lucille and she was a really close friend and she died from cancer. So I named Lucille, but Lucille's going to get smashed. I mean like smashed, not drunk, but I'm going to smash her into a thousand pieces. You learned to hate Lucille. Some people make a planter out of him, but I think I'll just smash the heck monitor. You also had chemotherapy at the same time. So were they happening concurrently or did you have to break it up? Yeah, it was at the same time.

So, chemo was week one, week four, week seven of the proton, and proton was every single day for seven weeks. And that was the hard part because the first week is both chemo and radiation at the same time. And when you start feeling lousy, you're not sure if it's from the chemo or the proton. Proton is much more gradual than the effects on the throat are more gradual. So you just hit from all the ends. And I don't think the doctors do a very good job of telling you how it's going to really hit the fan. You know, they tell you, well, this could happen or that could happen, but it's, oh, everybody's different, but they don't really get you ready for how bad it's going to be. Have you ever been through anything like this?

No. The toughest thing you've had to? It's definitely the toughest thing I've ever done. Yeah, I mean, it's still this hard. I still don't feel great, but I feel better every day. After the break, more from my exclusive interview with Martina Rappalo. How do you feel emotional? Emotionally, it's been really weird, so the emotional part was more difficult before I saw.

started the treatment because I still didn't know if they were going to accept me into the program. When the breast cancer showed up, I didn't know if that was going to disqualify me because I knew the seven weeks was going to be brutal. This is a trial thing that you were taking part of the trial. That's hopefully three weeks instead of seven and I knew that would be a massive difference in long term. Forget the seven weeks you're doing it.

When you do it seven weeks and depending on how big the tumor is, it could affect you the rest of your life. So the biggest stress was getting into the treatment, which finally did happen. So emotionally, very up and down beforehand, once the treatment started, the harder part was physical, getting through that. And, of course, that plays on your emotions too. So I did a bit of crying overall,

probably maybe a grand total of 15 minutes. But, you know, it just kind of hits you, and then you're like, okay, you just have to suck it up, and there's always somebody that's worse off than you are, especially when you see kids around there. Well, that's what I was going to ask. I mean, there were children, young kids around you. Yeah. Having treatment which may or may not save their lives.

Right. What was that like to see on a daily basis? Reality check. Reality check. I mean, you know everybody that's there has cancer. You just don't know which one. So cancer is a, is very democratic. Totally doesn't care who you are. We're all kind of in the same boat, but different boats, because some may, they don't know if they're going to be cured. I knew my chances were pretty good. But when you see kids, that's when you really stop feeling sorry for yourself, because the parents go through, the kids may not even know what they're going through,

there were kids that were six, eight months old, toddlers, children, you know, newborns, practically. And they have to put them to sleep to do the treatment so they don't move. That's when you just don't feel sorry for yourself anymore. You say, okay, you just gotta suck it up and deal with it. You had an amazing moment. This was a little video of you, the bell,

being run to think about the end of your treatment. I'll just let you watch it. It's supposed to ring it three times. I did. It was hard not to cry, I tell you. I'm crying, just looking at it again. Because you wait, you just can't wait to ring the bell. And it's still in God's hands, so to speak,

whether you're gonna be 100% or not. But you hope for the best. Yeah, I'm gonna lose it. Yeah, but people were great. They were really phenomenal. It's, I mean, it was wonderfully moving to watch that for me. I can't even imagine for you to go through it and then to watch it back and to feel that. I can see you.

Yeah, because you have, you have, you know, so when you're going through the treatments, you have some feeling sorry for yourself, tears. You pick your music, what do you want to listen to? So usually it was Bob Marley, which was great. It was the best music I didn't listen to. One time I picked Elton John, and then he starts singing, I'm still standing. And I'm like, he sang that to me in Paris during the French Open

in the 80s, went to his concert, and I dedicated this song to Martina, I'm still standing, because he knew that was one of my favorites. So when they're, you know, I'm in this freaking masks, not able to move. And that song came on. I'm like, oh, great. So I can't really cry because I can swallow. I can't move.

So you have tears of feeling sorry for yourself. This tear was just happiness at the end because you've been waiting for seven damn weeks. And yeah, I mean the work is not finished, but the worst part is behind me. And now I know I will just keep feeling better every day. What have they told you about the prognosis going forward now? It's very, very good.

I mean, as far as they know, I'm cancer-free. I still need to deal with the right breast. Probably will have radiation, but that's a couple weeks, and it's like that doesn't even count. And that's more preventative than anything else. And, you know, should be good to go. It's like 99% solvable. So I'll definitely not be missing any of my checkups.

I'll be very diligent about it. But the prognosis is excellent. But you never know, just like, you know, you never know. You mentioned music and your agent Mary had this wonderful idea of getting a lot of your friends from the tennis world to send a song to rally your spirits and they all sent songs with messages. And I want just to go through some of things.

I found it really moving actually. It was amazing. Chris Everett, we talked about, who obviously had just had cancer, herself treated, I didn't know, at the same clinic as you, your great rival. And she sent you, Lean on Me by Bill Withers, which includes a line, I just might have. a problem that you'll understand. We all need someone to lean on. Lean on me when you're

not strong and I'll be your friend. I'll help you carry on. You make me cry again. See, I couldn't make you feel quite emotional. I couldn't even read the stuff. When Mary first sent it to me, I just started crying and I'm crying now. God, I'm such a softy. And I started reading it. I'm like, I cannot listen to the music because I'll definitely be bawling my eyes out. So I just kind of one day at a time, I read a little bit from what everybody wrote because it was so moving Lindsay Davenport what she said Sam Smith Claire Balding Chrisie Claire Boulding sent you something in size so strong

Yeah, by Laby Saffrey something in size so strong I know that I can make it Billy Jean King sent you I will survive by Gloria again thanks a lot for that That's a happy song but yeah it was yeah just Pam Triver both sides now by Joni Mitchell which had the lyrics I've looked at life from both sides now from both sides now from win and lose and still somehow it's life's illusions I recall I really don't know life at all yeah and Sue Barker just I believe in you by I'll divo I know that's like I mean it's total tear-jerkers all of them and and then what they said to me personally outside of the song was just so meaningful that I had to like parse it to myself a little bit at a time because it was so overwhelming

and you don't realize how much you mean to people until they do something like that and that's really special. So the tennis world has been amazing of the support that I've gotten. I hear even Jimmy Conner's said. Jimmy's called me, actually. Jimmy called me.

I mean, the greatest street fighter in tennis history after you, right? What did he say to you, Jim, Thomas? Just that he knew he was, that I was going to kick cancer's butt. See, I got my little bracelet here. I got my, so I bought myself, Julia gave me this one, Cartier.

This one I bought for myself Tough as Nails When I finished treatment That's what I put it on Tough as Nails Tough as Nails And then I have Cancer

Which is from a friend Who passed away a couple years ago But she had a great life And Jimmy says I know you're gonna You know Win this battle So yeah

When you get that kind of support It's like yeah I'm gonna kick the time Did you actually Because of the music choices Did you play the songs? I played them eventually But it took me a while

It took me. I had to do it. I mean, especially, I mean, I don't want a single one out, but because of what Chris Everett had been through herself so recently, because you'd been such great rivals, because you've been treated at the same place. I just felt her choice of lean on me. Because you had been right there for her.

I remember reading your tweets to Chris Ever at the time. And then suddenly you're in this world of pain, physically, emotionally, anything else. She's there. saying lean on me. Well, Chris gave me this little necklace. And I was wearing it for a while. Then I took it off, the place there.

And then when Chris got sick, I put it back on. I'm like, I'm not going to take this off until she gets well. So I never took it off. I finally had to take it off to put the mask on to get the radiation. I had to take this off. So I finally put it back on again today. I mean, we, we, you know, even when we're rivals, we still depended on each other.

We made each other better. and I think we met each other better humans as well and we were always there for each other no matter what that's an amazing thing I mean just for me is a great tennis fan who watch you guys go out of all those years the fact that when it really mattered actually

it wasn't a sport this was life and death there you are again but this time united together yes and I guess we'll go into the sunset together maybe we'll play when we're about 100 years old a lot of tennis players live to be 100 So I'm still planning on that, but we'll see.

But this is a definitely big hiccup. But yeah, if you look at the Hall of Famers or people that really play tennis, tennis has been found to be the one sport that prolongs your life more than any other activity. Was there anything that Chris, I mean, the opening line of Lean on Me, I just might have a problem you'll understand. Was there anything in particular, given what she'd just been through, which really helped you? The mental toughness, of course.

I mean, hers was more of a question whether she, she was going to be okay. I think hers was more dangerous solution-wise. And also she went, I think she had six sessions of it. It was just really beat her up. It beat her up so much that she couldn't even reply. And that's what I knew it was really, really tough. And I knew that she, well, what she went through, that I could ask her a question, I would

get an honest answer. And so we mostly texted, but we also spoke a couple times. And it was just so different. If she hadn't gone through it, it would have been a different situation. Did it help you, do you think? It definitely helped. Every little bit helps. You don't know what puts you over the edge, right?

Just like you don't know when cancer happens, what makes it click the wrong way, just like you don't know what makes it click the right way when you are healing, when you are trying to kill it. And so every little bit helps all that positive energy. So it's why it's so essential to surround yourself with people that give you that energy. When you have these great champions, Chris, Billy Jean and others, is there something about being a great sporting champion, which gives you that little extra reservoir of strength?

I mean, you've so often been trailing in a massive final at Wimbledon and you've got to somehow dig deeper, perhaps more than most people do. Does that trait help when you're fighting something like cancer? Absolutely. I know Chris never gave up playing when she was playing. I mean, Billy Jean, by her own account, had tanked a few matches where she, you know, just screw it. I'm not, I'm not doing it anymore. But Chris and I don't ever recall, I mean, I felt sorry for myself thinking, okay, I'm probably going to lose, but I'm going to keep fighting until the match point is over. And the tennis teaches you that, I think.

And maybe champions have that more than the, you know, player ranked 200, or maybe they just can be any better, even though they're giving everything they have. But you definitely have that mentality that I am not quitting until the match point is finished. And you're always in the solution. So that tennis teaches you that. And that mentality that Chris and I, I don't know if you're born with it or if you learn it later,

but it definitely becomes a habit. Are you planning a long drunken lunch, you two? We will definitely celebrate. Right now I can alcohol, it tastes terrible. I haven't any alcohol for two months during the treatment. I quit. I didn't want to, but then the taste spots change. And I tasted a little tequila the other day.

Oh my God, wine horrible. It's like the worst vinegar you could imagine. Should that all come back? Will you be able? It will come back. It's coming back slowly. But I had never been drunk in my life, but I may get drunk this time, right? I don't know.

This would be a good time to celebrate, I think. But we're definitely getting together. I can see a few of you ladies having a long lunch. We might do something. something, maybe, you know, pot is legal here in Florida, so maybe we'll just walk a joint in honor of Bob Marley and not get drunk. So, but definitely there'll be a lot of laughter and celebrating. What was the Bob Marley song that you have played? Well, they just played all Bob Marley, but could you be loved is my favorite, I think, yeah. Your father, you said, used to say if it doesn't

involve your health, it's not worth poop. It's so true, you said then. This was after your first about cancer because when I was diagnosed the whole world stopped for me everything else became irrelevant having been through that once was it more pronounced this time that that period you said of three days where you just didn't know and your mind is spiraling into all sorts of dark places you know even for someone like you has got that mental strength how hard was that oh it was it was rough those three days I can't ever have him back those were the hardest three days. All your plans basically it's everything stopped. Everything

stops. Everything stopped 13 years ago and it really stopped this time around because it was so much more complex. Even when I found out that it wasn't as bad as it could have been, it's still, you know, then the second cancer shows up a week later. I'm like, oh my God, what am I going to do? So yeah, your priorities really do realign completely and then if you get through it then you really, I really only want to be doing things that I want to want to do rather than things that other people want to do. More after the break from Martina Ratelode. Welcome back to this special edition of Pierce Morgan Uncensored

from Miami and Florida. What are your number one priorities now? What are the things you think right? Staying healthy. Taking care of myself, taking care of my wife, taking care of the kids. Well, kids, that's 21 and 17, but, you know, they're still kids. Well, these are your two daughters, obviously,

Julia's girls, and you call them your daughters. Well, they are. I mean, I raised them. There were, say, six and a half and two and a half when we got together 15 years ago. So, yeah. Very tough for them. And they're great. They were thrown for a loop. Yeah. They both said, I don't know how to process this. Especially when we weren't really sure exactly what was going on. And Julia was white as, why does these curtains? So when we first found out, she was scared. I think she was maybe scared more than I was. because it's always harder for the people that survive you, right? But... It was terrifying for everyone, because everyone's lives are on hold, right? Very much so.

And once you get into solution, then you can kind of get on with it, and Victoria came twice to be with me during the treatment. Julia was there at the beginning, and at the end, middle, I kind of kept to myself, and there was one thing that was with me all the time.

That was Lulu. I think we're going to bring Lulu on before the end, my dog, my little dog's one. So, but it's still a lonely battle, but it's important to surround yourself with people that support you and the family, my family was there for me. There was a lovely moment that Julia decided to surprise you by cutting her hair. Back to the kind of Parisian bob she had when you first met her and fell in love. Because you'd always said how much you love that style.

Yeah, that's true. And she was planning this whole surprise. She wasn't going to face time. You saw it. She was going to just basically turn up. Yeah. And did she manage to keep it a secret? She did, she did, and she's terrible at keeping secrets.

Like, she never buys presents ahead of town because she wants to go to you, like, today. She don't want to wait until a month from now. So she kept her bargain, and I just, I was, like, laughing like crazy because it brought back really good memories when we first got together. When did you first see her with a new style? In New York, yeah, when she came to see me the last week of, which was the hardest week, was the last chemo. What the doctors, also the doctors don't tell you is that chemo is cute. cumulative. So Julia was there for me when it was the worst batch, but she looks so cute. She looks younger and she looks great. Now, of course, I got my haircut too because this chemo doesn't make you lose your hair.

I was kind of hoping actually that I would lose the hair because usually it grows back thicker. Chris's hair is thicker. She lost hair, she had different chemo. And her hair is really cute, short, but really thick. I'm like, why couldn't it? See, the competition comes in again. Now Chris has thicker hair than me. I'm kidding. You've been married since 2014. How important has she been this year for you? Massive, massive.

I mean, yeah, Julia didn't deal with the first cancer that, well, of course, it wasn't as serious, but she was like running away from it. But this time around, she was there all the way, holding my hand when I needed to be held and there physically, and of course, emotionally all the time. It's a bit of a cliche. People say these things they can make you actually cause distance between people in the situation,

or it can bring you closer together. Yeah. What do you feel is happening? It did that. It brought us closer together. The first one, there was some distance. This one brought us close together and this is the one that was really much, much tougher, much more severe and serious. And yeah, we're closer, definitely.

She said that you were talking about adopting a child because the two girls have now got to the age where they've left time. Empty nest syndrome. How far did you got with that? And has this changed anything? I think so. Well, we hired an agency. Julia was devastated when Emma went to live in Europe for the last years in high school. And the emptiness really hit her.

I'm like, go, go. Jude's like, no, come back. So, yeah, I think it was a nice thought for a while. But I think this kind of brought it into sharp focus. you know, I'm not the youngest anymore, and I don't want to be the grandma on the playground, but forget that part. It's just there's just not enough space, I think, for this to happen.

So we're thinking about adopting, but that's definitely put on hold, and I don't think it's going to happen. Do you know? I don't. I think it's just too complicated, and, you know, the energy, you know, you only have so much.

Right now... Would you be sad about that? Yeah, of course. It was a nice idea, nice thought, nice possibility, but you know, going to be a little more realistic. So, I mean, Julia will support whatever, whatever. But, yeah, it's just, I think there's just only so much you can do with your energy. And I don't think it's there for me. You made a powerful speech quite recently actually talking about cancer.

You were telling people, we're not here forever. don't keep things on the back burner. Are you pursuing passion? Cancer dared me to be brave, to be inspirational, to be humbled and to be calm. And that was after your first experience. What's it daring you to be now, do you think? Obviously changed some big priorities,

but what do you feel it's daring you to be now? Well, I think I'm still kind of dealing with the after effects. Like my mouth right now is really dry. I'm still not tasting things. Eating is still really hard. Me who loves to eat. I'm missing all these meals. Great diet plan though.

Great diet plan. Wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. So I'm still dealing with recovery. But overall, I think just really seize those days. You're not going to let, you know, you can't ever have them back again. And I don't want to waste my energy on things that are not productive, that are not meaning. They don't feel your soul and they don't make a difference for not just me but people around and maybe the world at large as well What kind of things are now like I'm not doing that anymore?

Things that you've guilted into Like what like going to a event you know where you have to get all dressed up and it's for some charity or for some person Whatever. No, you know, I'd rather go to dinner with four dear friends and have a great meal and have a great meal and have a great exchange of ideas. You said that last time you had a private pity party, but it didn't last very long. Did you have a private pity party this time? Well, private, yes. Pity, more like really? I mean, two cancers at the same time. Again, who the hell does that? So I had a pity party, but again, you know, being the tennis player that I was, I used to be or somebody's a husband, some people said, oh yeah, but I'm a good husband. It's a good husband. It's a guy.

getting in the solution. So you just stay in that and you have those moments but again they're short-lived. And sometimes it hits me without even thinking yesterday. I was watching TV and I was all of a sudden I start crying. I'm like I really didn't deserve that, you know, what did I do to deserve that? But again it lasts a random thought you had. Yeah but it again lasts about 30 seconds and then you're like I'm so lucky because it could have been so much worse. This cancer 20 years ago it would have been life-changing. They didn't have proton. Then they would, the surgery,

they literally like saw your jaw open to get to the throat. Now they do robotic surgery, so it's much, much easier. So I was lucky. As bad as it was, I still got lucky. I will have full recovery.

What's on the Martina bucket list now? Oh, Galapagos. That's been on that for forever. Why are you so keen together? Well, it's just to see all that life, all that life. I just want to swim. I want to snorkel, I want to scuba dive and see all these seals and tortoises and sharks and, you know, all these creatures.

It's teeming with wildlife and I love wildlife. I've spent six months in Kenya. I love it there. I want to go back to Kenya again. I really feel at home there. When you were going through the most difficult part of this, did you have that kind of throwback at your life? Did you look at your life? Yeah.

And what did you feel about your life to that moment? I could have done more, but I also could have done less. And overall, what a life I've had, how lucky am I? But I'm not planning on leaving any time soon. No, damn right. Damn right. Did you have any big regrets when you were thinking, if I've only got a year to live, I wish I'd done that.

Well, then I would try to figure out what to pack into it if it was finite. Then I would really put the priorities there. But, you know, I love my work. I can't wait to start working. I'm working on the Tennis Channel for the tournament in Miami this next two weeks, and I can't wait to see everybody. I love my work. I mean, it seems to me just having known you a little bit,

but you've led an extraordinary successful life, but a very tough one too. I mean, you've had to come through personally and professionally, but personally a lot of big challenges. But the common theme is you've always come through them. Do you feel like at your core is just a fighter? What was the alternative? Giving up, giving in, stopping. That's just not an option for me.

So, yeah, you get on with it. I think growing up in a communist country, you're tough. You have to be. And you're kind of stoic because you can't feel sorry for yourself because you would just be crying all the time because you don't have any freedom. So, you know, I grabbed that chance when I got it and I was never going to look back.

So no regrets. The only regret I have is that I had to do it, That I really, to pursue my dream, which was to play tennis and be free, I had to leave my country. And I can't ever have those years back with my family. And I hurt them. So that was tough. But regrets, I wish I had gotten a coach earlier.

I would have won more. Probably would have stopped sooner as well. So whatever it is, it's a wash. But quitting is just not in my DNA. That I think is completely true. the break. We're joined by Martina's wife Julia. Here's the final part of my interview with Martina where we're joined by her wife Julia. Well I've been joined by two more ladies, Julia, your love your wife and by Lulu. Lulu's definitely, she's always a lady. She is always a lady.

Incredibly well by it. Lulu was with me through every treatment. In fact, I smuggled her to the hospital because I didn't know they were allowed dogs. I didn't want to ask in case they say no, so she was contraband. And then during one of those treatments, she put her She poked her nose through the doggy bag and the nurses, oh, what a cute dog. So that's when I knew dogs were okay. Do you think she picked up that you were going through something? Well, she's always following me around. So I don't know, I'm not sure because she's always like attached to my left hip.

You found it very comforting to have Lulu there. She is. She is great. She doesn't argue and she follows me everywhere. And she's very well housebroken. So not a problem at all. She can she can hold her pee. For a long time.

Would you say all those same things about Julia or? Julia's... It took me a little bit... That house broken. It took me a little bit longer to train Julia. But she's very supportive. Amazing, amazing. She's been there for me.

Julia, what's it been like for you? Because you've been married since 2014, so nearly 10 years now. And, you know, these are the love of each other's lives. And suddenly, Martina gets it with a double blow, throat cancer and breast cancer. and breast cancer. It's obviously potentially incredibly serious, life changing, potentially life ending. What was it like for you? She said that the first time she had a run with cancer, you were slightly distant from it. You didn't really want to get... You said that.

Yeah, I was. But this time you went completely the opposite way. Well, when your wife is diagnosed with cancer and especially two cancers, it puts life in perspectives and the values and everything just what seems to be important suddenly, not that important and the other way around. It changes your perspective and look at life and really makes you think what's important, who is the most important person for you in your life

and what do they need? And of course, they need support. And Martina needed me. It was about Martina, not about myself. The way to comfort her, make sure she's okay, she's all right, and do things I usually wouldn't do, you know? Like cook.

Like cook. Like, you know, be like nag less and do things for Martina because I'm so used to Martina doing a lot of things to comfort me. What was the hardest moment for you of this whole thing? I think when Martina just found out that she had cancer, but she had to wait like four days or five days before she knew where and what it was. For me, it was really hard because, you know, like you say to somebody, oh, it's going to be all right, darling.

But then you may be lying. Maybe it's not going to be all right. So you don't know. And I am, Martina knows me more like as a heartcore person. I don't easily cry. But she doesn't know that I do cry like behind the closed doors. But for me, it was like really difficult to hold my tears and not show her in her face what I was like really feeling and thinking.

There was a look in Julia's face that I never saw before. Because she was scared. Yeah, it was scared. But yeah, she didn't, there was just a different look and body language that I haven't seen before. Martina said she felt this had actually brought you closer together this whole experience.

Very much so, yes. The, you know, my empty nesting syndrome disappeared. You know, happy girls are gone and having their life and looking out for each other themselves and also for us. And we kind of rebonded, reconnected and revaluate, like revaluation of values happen and importance and what we want to do and what's on a bucket list and where we want to go. So on her bucket list is the Galapagos Islands. And Kenya, I'm sure she said Kenya.

I guess that. I mean, I'm seeing a kind of maybe a renewal of marriage vows in the Galaccaacca. What do you think of that? Why not? Scuba diving? No, scuba diving. I'm scared of sharks. Yeah.

She likes all the stuff you don't like. She's not like normal, right? I'll do a lot for love, but maybe not scuba diving. So what do you think? I'm seeing a scene in the Galapagos with maybe a blue wire on the background. Uh-huh. I don't know. Galapagos tortoises, but then I also have them in my ranch, you know, so I kind of...

People do, they do actually sometimes these kind of things. they do make people want to renew wedding vows. Do you think it's something you might do? I'm not sure. Because I feel like we're renewing them almost every day. Yeah? In the... But you do like symbolic things.

I love symbolic things. I'm half-Russian. It's a good idea. It would be a good excuse to go to the Galapagos, so we have to renew our vows. Exactly. Maybe next year? But then you're supposed to tell me that.

It's supposed to be surprised. I'm telling you so much. Like now already know, I'm going to go to the Galap. Hang on, June. With respect. She proposed you last time. But she did. At the US Open, on the Jumbotron, live on TV.

Live on TV. I think you are all one. Yeah, thank you, Pierce. I'm there. I've got your back, Martina. So then I have to surprise her and do something. But now you just spill the beans. How can't they surprise?

We have to think of something else. We can pretend it's a surprise. Can pretend. Martina is saying that one of the things that probably won't happen now is you probably won't adopt a child as a consequence of all this. Well, life is a thing. is full of surprises you don't know what's happening right like we were waiting for phone call to welcome a child home and then we were fighting to Kansas so today it is not

the first thing I'm thinking about because the first thing I'm thinking about is for Matina to get well and better and stronger and we'll see what happens you know I personally did not put it on a complete like passpont for like no it's not know for me, but I don't know. I literally don't know. It's possible. It's possible. We don't know. Life is full of surprises. Like, who knows? The one thing isn't surprising is how tough she is. She's very tough. What's the alternative, though? She's very tough. Right? She's very tough. It's easy to be brave when you have no other option. Right. Right. I mean, that is my view of life, right? If you get hit with a thing, let's see, well, what else are you going to do? Roll over. Exactly.

But it's still, you know, you've got to do it. It's going to do it, yes. And I have that completely different perspective of life now, because before I would postpone it for tomorrow, for tomorrow, for later, for later, for later. I was like this perfect, you know, Scarlet O'Hara, okay, like tomorrow. Not anymore. I feel young, super young now.

You know why? You got a young haircut. Well, that's another story, but I told the story. I feel young now because tomorrow I'll be a day older, right? So that's it. I'm young now and I want to do things that I can. can and I have energy full and huge humongous appetite for life. Are you proud of the way she's come through this?

So proud. So proud. I'm amazed how like strong she was during this. I'm a total hepochondriac. I'm scared of everything and everything. You know, and any medical procedure, anything, I cry. Needle, needle. Everything. I just always imagine the worst. And Matina, she handled it so with some. strength and positivity I literally don't know how she managed to hold it all together.

What did you think of all the tennis people sending their favorite song to inspire her? I think it's so sweet. I did not send the song for my name. You didn't? No. She sings herself. I sing. I wish. I wish. I cannot make a sound. She's beautiful but she cannot sing. But when she does makes me laugh. When I sing it makes you laugh? When did you hear me sing?

You never heard me singing. Yeah, well, when you don't know, don't. I don't know I'm around. I don't have intruded to something here. Are you sure it wasn't one of the parrots? Maybe it could have been Pushkin. I have a pirate and he sings opera. Really?

Yes. Pushkin, yeah. Incredible. What kind of opera? Pavarotti, that is very. I would put Pavarotti. Oh, Nessendorma or? Nessendorma?

That's exactly what I'm. Is Lulu going to rock him to I will survive? Lulu is a superstar. Well, listen, I wish you both all the very best. Thank you very much. I know it's been a very long few months, right? A life facing few months. Yep.

You've come through it? Yes. Pat myself on the back. Thank you, darling. It's lovely to talk to you. Great to see you, looking so well. Thank you.