Piers Morgan Uncensored - Piers Morgan Uncensored: Usain Bolt on 'Sportswashing'

Episode Date: June 9, 2022

On today's show, Piers speaks to Olympic champion Usain Bolt about the practice of 'sportswashing'. He also chats cost of living crisis and is joined by manager of TikTok phenomenon Binley Mega Chippy. Watch Piers Morgan Uncensored at 8 pm on TalkTV on Sky 526, Virgin Media 627, Freeview 237 and Freesat 217. Listen on DAB+ and app. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm Piers Morgan Unsensored tonight. Three big guests, a Ukraine check. After 100 days of war, this how and when does the suffering stop? Ukraine's ambassador to the UK will be with me. Hero Dark 30, the US Defense Chief, who blitz bin Laden, will be here to talk tough on taking out tyrants. And Beast Lightning, Thunderbolt, Usain, the fastest man in history. He'll be with me, too. You can finally catch up with me now, Pierce.

I am both, and I am uncensored. Well, if one man knows all about sacrifice, mental resilience and winning, it's probably the fastest man in the history of the world. And in my opinion, the greatest athlete of all time. Usain Bolt won eight Olympic gold medals. He holds a world record in the 100 and 200 metres sprints. His blistering 9.58 second finish in 2009 remains unassailed. And his biggest achievement of all, I'm sure he would agree, in his most punishing assignment, was that he won soccer rate as captain in 2009. with me as his manager, and I inspired him to score.

Well, you're saying Bolt returns to the London Stadium on Sunday to lead the World 11 at Soccerate again for UNICEF, and I'm delighted to say. You say, he joins me now. Well, Skipper, I still see you as my skipper. How are you? I'm good, I'm good, Pierce. I'm good. Now, obviously, you don't have your world-class coach with you this time.

So how confident are you that you can win without me? Well, I was planning to give you a call, get some tips just to make sure, keep the energy eye. You know what I mean? I see what to tell the guy. So I just need that energy and I'm sure we'll do well. Do you know what struck me, you said, when I had the pleasure of spending a few days with you on Soccerade? I don't think I've ever seen anyone who tried harder than you should be brilliant at another sport. Obviously, you're the greatest athlete that's ever lived.

but your dedication to football is extraordinary. You really do love the game, don't you? Yeah, definitely. It's a sport that I really loved coming up as a youngster. I watch, as you know, I'm a Manchester United supporter. So I definitely keep abreast of what's going on in the world when I play, I do want to play at my best. A good friend of mine is Cristiana Ronaldo,

obviously at Manchester United again at the moment. and you're very similar characters in the sense that I think at the core of your incredible success, the pair of you, is an almost unbelievable mental strength and resilience that goes with your talent. I mean, do you think that without that you would have achieved anything like the success you've had? No, I definitely think you have to be resilient and never give up. You know, I mean, you have to always want to do more. You have to never be satisfied. I think that's, I agree with you.

I'm like, Kristen is like that. He never gives up. No matter how much goals, he scores, he wants to score more. I was watching him the other day. And he scored two goals and he missed one and he was so upset with himself. You know what I mean? He just always wants to do more and do better. And that's the kind of mindset that gets you to the top and keeps you there.

Yeah, I completely agree. And I think it's a self-fulfilling thing. It's got to come from within, hasn't it? because no one can teach that to people, I don't think. I fully agree with this. You can't teach that. You have to learn that from a young age and just through growing up and wanting something.

You know what I mean? You can't teach us because I've tried to explain to young guys is coming up, which you see have the talent, and they don't really understand, you know what I mean? So for me, I think you have to have that mindset and that drive to want to be the best and just want to be dominant. Could you ever celebrate coming second, do you say, anything?

No, I feel like, no, definitely not, no. That's all you have to say. I'm a sore loser. I knew the answer. But the great champions are all sore losers, aren't they? You don't want to lose? Definitely, definitely. I want to talk to you.

No matter what we're doing. Yeah, sorry, yeah, exactly, yeah. I want to talk to you just about a few things that are bubbling around the news, which I was really curious what your perspective would be on it. The first one is the England football manager, Gareth Southgate, came out a couple of days ago, and he was talking about the Euro's final last year, where a young black player, Bacaya, Saka, actually plays for my team Arsenal, missed a penalty, and so did several other black players. They got abused, racially abused because of it by complete morons.

And Southgate actually said the other day that, you know, it would make him think again in future about whether he would let young black players take penalties in that kind of situation. which I thought was an incredibly dispiriting thing for him to have to admit to. What do you make of that? That's tough to hear. You know what I mean? I didn't hear this comment, but that's tough, you know what I mean? A lot of these guys, they don't understand the pressure.

You know what I mean? Standing in front of so many people in the weight of England on your shoulder taking a penalty is no joke. And for somebody to say they wouldn't give that person a chance, again, to prove themselves. because especially soccer is very young. He's new to it. You know what I mean?

It's hard on the younger ones. It's a learning process, you know what I mean? And he will get better over the year. So that's tough to hear somebody said about a black player. I think he did it from a kind of protective viewpoint. I mean, you didn't want to expose them to abuse. But I don't think you can take that view, can you? No, I think you have to give everybody a chance.

You know, I mean, you have to give that person a chance to be himself, you know what I mean? You learn from your mistakes, and I'm sure you will learn from the pressure, and the more he plays football, the better you get. So I feel like everybody deserves a chance, you know what I mean? You should always give the person the best player the chance to go out and improve himself.

And what advice you say would you give to a young black athlete, sportsman, whatever, who's getting racially abused on social media, whatever it may be? You must have had this, I guess, over the years, because Twitter and so on is full of complete. idiots. But what would your advice be to how to handle that? For me, I stayed away from all social media, all media outlets. I never read the news, pretty much. When I started out young, I went through that a lot. And I figured out if I

don't read the comments, if I don't read the newspaper, if I don't watch the news, then I won't hear. You know what I mean? My friends who are close around me, they understand that. They don't tell me negative things. You know what I mean? So I just stayed away from it. You know, I mean, if you don't read it, if you don't listen to it, you won't hear. So that's what I do. I think that's very good advice. The less you read, the better, right?

And the purer your hate can be without this stuff in your head. I want to turn to the, this whole issue of sport washing. You've got it with the golf stars at the moment, who've decided to play in a Saudi Arabian-funded new tournament. And it's causing a huge furorory. at the center of it really is this question of whether sport stars should have to be careful about countries they align themselves with for sport. I don't think you've ever run competitively in Saudi, but you've certainly done some work there, speeches and so on. What's your view

about this? Is there a line that you wouldn't cross? For me, I think everybody is different. Views are different. In these times now, everything is different. It's hard to to say what's going to offend people, you know what I mean? And it's really tricky right now. I have a team that kind of try to protect me or try to make sure we're on a straight line and to make sure we don't offend anybody as much as we possibly can.

But it's tricky right now with what's going on in the world with everything you know. You have to be very careful with what you say and what you do nowadays. So it's just all about understanding a situation. I mean, I look at it and think there's a lot of hypocrisy amongst the criticism because if you have the Olympics in somewhere like China and then I don't see an issue particularly with golfers

playing in a Saudi-sponsored golf tournament because to me you either take a completely black and white view of human rights records of countries or you don't. Yeah, as I said, it's all about people look at things. You know, I mean, everybody has a different view on everything. This is why I stay away from these things. know I mean? Again, I have my team.

I care for what I say. I just try to stay focused on me and try to do what I need to do to stay positive. What do you think of this issue, you're saying, about trans athletes, which is obviously getting a lot of attention at the moment. A lot of people feel it's unfair for trans athletes to compete against women born

to female biological bodies. You know, we could have a situation where if you wanted to, and you felt this way, you could identify as a woman and compete against women. Do you think that would be fair, reasonable? For me, I always say I'm not the person who makes the rules. You know what I mean?

Even when I was running and they was asked me about drugs and who should be banned, I always say the rules are the rules. I think a lot of rules will be changed in the future and it will be adjusted. So for me, I just go along with the rules as they are now. But do you think when you see what's going on in swimming, for example, Michael Phelps came out and said he didn't think it was fair. Would it be fair for sprinters who've been born males

to then transition and compete against women? Well, that's not for me to answer, you know what I mean? I think, as again, it's a tricky situation. You know what I mean? It's for a discussion and it's not for me to say, you know what I mean? It's up in the year, I would say. but in time, as I said, in times things will change. So just give it time and see where it goes.

But just to clarify, you're not thinking of identifying as a woman any time soon. No. No. No. You've got three kids, you're saying. They've got fantastic names, Olympia Lightning Bolt, Thunderbolt, and St. Leo Bolt. So they've all, I would imagine, got the bolt sprinting gene. Who's the quickest? Well, right now, Lillian.

My daughter is definitely showing that she wants to run. She runs everywhere. She's always on her toes. She walks on her toes like a sprinter. So that's something that I look forward to. My boys are just one, so I'm keeping an eye on them. Do you ever get, I've spoken to racing drivers. Jensen Button told me every time he goes out on a car on a normal road,

there's always some bloke in a Porsche who wants to try it on with him at a traffic light and zoom off. To you is the fastest man to ever live. Do you find that everywhere you go, there's always somebody who wants to try and take you down? And what do you do about it? All the time. It's all the time.

For the older people, I just laugh. But if kids, if they really want to try, I'll race with them sometimes if I have time on my hands. And sometimes I'll let them win. If there's a smaller kid, but if bigger kids, I won't let them win. They've got to learn the hardware you're saying. That's how you learn how to win. Jamaica is going through instinct.

Younger kids... Sorry, go on. For younger kids, it's much more fun to let them win, you know what I mean, because they're really fans and they look up to you, but all the kids understand that it's not always going to be easy to win, you know what I mean? So I have to let them know you have to earn this, you have to earn a win because all the kids will brag. Well, I never let any of my kids beat me at anything.

The problem is that three of them now have got old enough where they beat me at everything. That's the problem. But I think that's the winning mentality I gave them. You've got to enjoy it. Yeah, you've got to enjoy it while at last, you know what I mean? I definitely think I would be that dad also. Yeah, exactly, yeah.

We've just had the platinum jubilee for the queen, are you saying? I'm just curious, what you think about Jamaica? Jamaica looks like it probably is going to head towards independence. How do you feel about that? For me, politics is not my thing. If you follow me throughout the years, I've always stayed away from politics. because politics is all over the pace. You know, they're against one day

and then they're with one day, so for me I'd stay away from it totally. I have no comments on that whatsoever. Have you ever thought of being a diplomat, you say? Just sometimes. I've been trying. I'll be trying here. Best of luck in soccer right. It was a fantastic experience.

It raises a ton of money. Robbie Williams, who set this thing up. It's an amazing event, raises 10, 11, 12 million. And we had a glorious win together. And I'd like to think that my pre-match team talk where I read Churchill quotes to you all, I think that may have been the inspiration. Can you confirm that?

I'm just saying, yes. This is why I said I'll make a call. We'll talk off here. You tell me exactly what to say, and I can say to the guys in the locker room, you know what I mean? But I just want to say to everybody, You know what I mean? Go on UNICEF website, you know what I mean?

Donate, you know what I mean? It's for a good cause. It's for vaccination to fight my nourishment. And it's wonderful, you know what I mean? So just come out in support and just give. All donations are doubled, so it would be great. Well, if you need any last minute tips on how to win, you're saying you know where to come.

Definitely. Best of luck and great to talk to you. All right. All right. After the break, with no end in sight of the bloody war in Ukraine, is the only solution to take out the narcissistic bully at the Kremlin. Former CIA director Leon Panetta, who oversaw the operation to bring down Osama bin Laden, is uncensored next.

Well, we're not more than 100 days into the war in Ukraine and the brutal conflicts in danger of entering a torturous and protracted stalemate. The UK has now warning the conflict could last as long as a decade. So, a pause for thought. Take a look at these five pictures and ask yourself what links them. Afghanistan, Yemen, Libya, Iraq, Syria, all devastating wars which cost thousands of lives, sparked humanitarian disasters, and all too briefly, commanded the entire planet's attention. And then we moved on. So is Ukraine now in danger? It'd be the next that we simply move on from.

It's what happens, isn't it? News moves on, politicians move on, government priorities change, as voters fume about problems closer to home, especially with surging inflation. But there's no end in sight for the Ukrainians. The misery only continues. Vladimir Putin's forces now occupy 20% of the country, and up to 100 Ukrainians are dying every single day. And today the chilling news that two British men and one Moroccan national

be sentenced to death by pro-Russian officials. They were captured fighting with the Ukrainian army in Maripal. So how do we end all this carnage, this genocide? How do we make sure the world doesn't give up on Ukraine, which is exactly what Vladimir Putin wants us to do? Well, I'm joined now by the Ukrainian ambassador to the UK, Vardin Prasika. Welcome, Ambassador. It's great to have you here. Thank you.

I get this awful feeling that the news agenda, which was so Ukraine-dominated, is beginning to move on a bit. You know, people have their own crises at home and so on. And the hell for Ukraine continues. What is your feeling about that? What more can we do to keep Ukraine in people's minds? Frankie speaking, I'm quite blessed here. in this particular capital and this particular nation that is not this process is not that obvious but i agree with you that's nature human nature news nature government's nature to move on

another things because unfortunately where there are so many of them so many tragedies unfolding all over the globe but we're trying to keep up this you know the news about ukraine or knowledge about ukraine open for everybody here and i have very receptive audience here there are many ways that this war can end uh some are not too bad bad for Ukraine, notwithstanding what's already happened, some would be horrendous. What is the worst case scenario as far as you're concerned? Worst is what Putin wants. He wants to reinstate whatever government he wants in Kiev.

He wanted to get all over this territory. He wants to get us back to the stables of post-Soviet republics. Some of them he already has in his tables. Now here's the bigger, bigger prize, the biggest prize, probably out of all the post-Soviet Republic's Ukraine. President Zelensky, who appointed you to your position, only two years ago, must seem a very long time ago now that you were appointed, like I guess every ambassador. But when he was asked about Boris Johnson recently, he was extremely praiseworthy of both the Prime Minister, who's a lot of domestic problems, obviously, but very praiseworthy of him and of the government here in the support that we have given to Ukraine. who have been, along with the UK, the best allies you've had, and who needs to do more? We have natural allies, like, for example, Poland, who understand us so, so closely,

who've been through so many things with Russians over the history. We have our Baltic republics, all of three of them who used to be in the same, in the same camp of Soviet Union, and they don't have to tell them anything, they know everything, and they know the prize. We have the Eastern Europeans who are next to our border that are supporting us, because they remember all this, you know, times when the Soviet Union was coming with the hard hand, you know, reversing what sort of revolutions they had over the years and years. So these people naturalize the people understand.

Obviously, United States, Canada, which is very close to all Ukrainian hearts, there are a couple of nations around the globe. Is Putin the new Hitler, as far as you're concerned? Personally, I believe that he is the closest one we can attribute to Hitler right now in this particular era. And if he prevails in Ukraine, do you have any data? that he will then try and expand and invade other countries and try and, as he sees it, restore the glory of the Soviet Union? Totally. If you feed the shark with hamburger,

it doesn't mean they will have to have hamburger each and every time. Next time they will need cow or something bigger. And Ukraine, in comparison to what he had, transnissaries in Moldova, some places in Georgia, Azerbaijan and Armenia, now he is coming for big and bigger price. And if he has Ukraine, with the biggest by territory in Europe, territory in Europe. They're a huge nation, 40 plus million people. If he has it, what will stop him for the next move in Europe? You think NATO? Well, they have to think.

You must have a lot of family and friends back in Ukraine. It must be a permanent worry for you. How do you deal with that being here in the UK when all this is happening back home? I managed to get my nephews here because their parents, my brother and his wife, they are back in Ukraine. The police officer, she's just working there, has to be there. So we take care of the kids. I have my mom in my mom in law here. So we managed with the kindness being offered to us to bring them here to allow them some safety. Are we doing enough in this country to bring enough Ukrainians in fast enough? You're doing much, but there is always not enough when you have people waiting on the bombardment for months for the visit to appear in your magically in your mailbox. So this is very painful. But we're working with your government trying to resolve this.

When we came on air, two Britons and a Moroccan man captured by Russian forces in Ukraine had been sentenced to death. What is your reaction to that? I had to react today because I was meeting with the family, one of them. I actually met with all of them. There's two of them where I mentioned today. And we are trying to find in answer how these people can be so brave, so patient at the end of the days, so encourages to face this strategy. This women, we are trying to, each and every day, they would receive the telephone call or video message from them in captivity, in the so-called courts. This is very difficult tragedy that people's trash.

But we have now almost 4,000 people, Al-Wa, and we consider your people, your nationals as parts of our armed forces. They are treated the same way. They've been useful for the exchange the same way. They were trying to get them out of there. Finally, Ambassador, President Zelensky will speak at the Cambridge Union tomorrow, and I believe, other universities just quickly tell me about that you know this big gathering that we have Ukrainian sort of students association which are in all of these universities most of those we have very well known everywhere around the globe not just

here so he will talk to the younger generation not just Britain and Ukrainians everybody who is studied there and we hope that he will be able to tell the new generation why this war is relevant why this war between new age and very old post-Soviet society as Russia is now Please tell President Zelensky we're huge admirers of his in this country. Not that he doesn't hear that from everyone, but I think he's a remarkable man doing a remarkable job, and we're all right behind you.

Ambassador, thank you very much indeed for coming in. Thank you. Well, picking up on that now, I'm joined by the man who, as director of the CIA, oversaw the killing of Osama bin Laden, the former US Defense Secretary Leon Panetta. Ms. Panetta, thank you so much for joining Pierce Morganos Sensen. Good to be with you, Pierce.

Just discussing there with the ambassador here in London about the situation in Ukraine, Putin is slowly but surely barreling his way through that country. What more should the world be doing to try and stop him? Well, we're 100 days into this war. We really have been through what I call three stages of the war. The first was a failed invasion by Russia. The world stood up. Ukraine stood up. and were able to essentially stop the Russians from achieving their goal of getting the capital and bringing Ukraine down. The second stage is siege warfare and tremendous destruction

and killing of innocent men, women, and children to try to break the will of the Ukraine people. That failed as well. And the third stage is the one we're in now, which is this war of attrition, with Russia trying to gain territory in the east in order to have leverage, I assume, for negotiations. How long that war of attrition goes on?

No one really knows. It could continue for weeks and months. It could result in negotiation, which is what the world obviously hopes for. Or it could escalate into something worse. The decision as to what happens really rests with Putin and nobody else right now. Henry Kissinger suggested that Ukraine may have to see territory to end the war. The Ukrainians obviously don't want to do that, but is that something which perhaps becomes inevitable the longer this goes on?

I think President Biden was right in saying that that decision has to rest with Ukraine and with Zelensky. They're the ones that are fighting and dying, putting their lives on the line every day in order to defend their country. I think it's up to them to decide what they're going to their what the basis of any possible negotiation should be. I don't think anybody ought to tell them what they should or should not do. They're the ones that have fought for the right to decide what will be on the table should they negotiate. If you'd still been Defense Secretary or even running the CIA, every sinew in my body wants to attack Vladimir Putin,

to take him on, to kick him out of Ukraine, to use the might of the NATO military. the most powerful ever seen. But he's been able to, so far, successfully rattle his nuclear sabre as a kind of warning card to keep people away. How long should we see that kind of threat, where he simply says, if you do anything, proactively here, I will nuke you? Look, I don't think we can be intimidated by Putin.

Putin has sensed weakness on the part of the West for a long time. That's why he went into the Crimea, that's why he went into Syria and Libya, and that's why he attacked this country with a very bold cyber attack against our election systems, because he sensed weakness. I think for the first time the United States and our allies have come together in a unified way to say that Putin will pay a price for his aggression. And by providing the weapons necessary for the Ukrainians, by imposing the the sanctions that are really hitting the Russian economy seriously, and by strengthening our position in the NATO countries. I think the U.S. and our allies have done the right thing in trying to stop Putin. Putin needs to be stopped.

Bullies need to be stopped. And the message that went to Russia is frankly the same message that needs to go to China and North Korea and Iran and other adversaries. We have got to come together as allies in order to stop this kind of aggression. I want to pivot just briefly. It's over 10 years, incredibly, since Osama bin Laden was killed in that remarkable raid.

You were immortalized in a massively successful movie, Zero Dark 30, played by James Gandalfini, who apparently had to write to you before it even aired, apologising for everything, he said, including his wig. So I want to play you a clip and then come for your reaction. I'm about to go look to president in the eye. And what I'd like to know, no,

that's where everyone stands on this thing. Now, very simply, is he there or is he not in there? I've got to say, I thought you came out of that brilliantly, and I don't know you, but if I was you, I would have loved all that. Well, I remember when Gandalfini wrote me a note and said, you know, you probably don't like the way I played this role, but I really admire you. So I called him up. I met him at some events. And he said, you know, he said, I hope you like the way I played it.

I said, look, I said, it's a movie. I'm glad they picked an Italian to play an Italian. That made me feel good. And he came back and he said, you know, he said, they made me. use a lot of four-letter words. And I said, well, you know, that's the one thing you got right. It's actually a great film. I think the best thing imaginable is when someone makes a big movie like that is that it's good. And I think not only was it good, but you had this amazing actor playing you. And as I say, I thought you came out as badass, Mr. Panetta. And that's really

how a former boss of a CIA wants to be, right? Well, it was a, it was a, it was a tremendous experience and I give a lot of credit to both the military and intelligence people for coming together, working together, because that was the most effective way to counterterrorism. Did you still get, just finally, do you still get people thanking you personally when they see you for taking out bin Laden? I think the most rewarding thing that ever happens to me is particularly when a family of those that were killed on 9-11. when members of that family see me and thank me for bringing justice to Ben Laden for what he did to our country.

That's the most rewarding feeling of all. Well, politicians got a lot of a bad rap over time, but that was a stunning moment, I think, for America, for that administration, for you personally. And so, you know, 11 years on now, isn't it? Thank you for what you did for the world. because you took out the worst terrorists in the world, and that's got to be a good feeling. It was very important to send a message to the world that nobody attacks our country and gets away with it.

And I was very proud of that operation. Leon Palletta, great to talk to you. Thank you very much for being on the show. Thank you. Well, school proms mark an emotional right of passage in any teenager's life, but this one's truly jaw-dropping, the graduating class of School 134 in Harkiv, Ukraine,

returned to the side of their bond-out school for prom night, marking their final day at school by waltzing in the rubble. Well, there you have it, Vladimir Putin. The irrepressible spirit of these remarkable Ukrainian people, alive and well through to the next generations, defiantly dancing in the face of your shameful onslaught and inspiration to young people the world over. But as I said, never, ever give in to bullies.

Uncensored next, tonight's Peers pack. They're riled up, ready, and they're coming soon. There they are. What a pack. Welcome back to Peers, Wilburne and food prices are soaring, almost as much as Prime Minister Boris Johnson's popularity is plunging. Now, today the beleaguered PM, freshly voted confidence, has promised help for voters in a shiny new cost of living plan.

That's despite previously arguing that he couldn't afford it. So cynical transaction politics or a much-needed lifeline. I'm joined my tonight's peers back, the former Tory Culture Secretary, John Wittingdale, and talk to your contributor Esther Cracker. Well, welcome to both of you. Stellar panel. John, great to have you, known you a long time. Just to start something a little bit different to Boris.

You were a former Culture Secretary. What do you make of this whole sport-washing debate? The argument being that these golfers who dumped the PGA tour are now being today dumped by the PGA tour for doing this, to do a rival tour backed by the Saudis, that somehow that is utterly reprehensible because of Saudi Arabia's record on human rights. Well, generally, I don't like the idea of sport and politics mixing.

There are exceptions. So, for instance, Margaret Thatcher, where I started my career with, said that we shouldn't send athletes to Moscow Olympics. That's back in 1980. That was because Moscow, Russia, had just invaded Afghanistan. If there were to be an Olympics planned for Moscow, This year, I would say we shouldn't be there because Russia has invaded Ukraine.

But we cannot say that every country where we don't necessarily like every aspect there, we have concerns about their human rights, we can't therefore go to. So, for instance, we did go to the Beijing Olympics, and we have a lot of concerns about the state of human rights in China. And you take advantage to tell them if you are there that there are aspects of their regime, which we profoundly disagree with. And I would hope that people visiting Saudi Arabia or China or countries which do have a poor record, we will make it clear that that is something.

I mean, the argument is that there's an argument that Russian sports people should be banned now from competing. And Wimbledon has in fact already said they're going to do that because the British government has taken a position and sanctions and so on. And that's fine. But then the argument against, say, the Saudi part of this is, well, what about the war in Yemen, which has been driven by the Saudis? What's the difference morally between the two things? Well, I think one of the reasons why we take that view of Russian competitors is that we need to get across to the Russian people that what their government has done in their name is wholly unacceptable.

And it's quite hard because information is obviously censored. They don't see the kind of media that everybody else sees because the Russians control it. So by saying you will not be appearing in the World Cup or in the PGA or whatever, Imboldened or whatever it is. That is one way in which we can get across the message that the whole world is condemning their actions in Ukraine.

Esther, what do you think of it? I mean, it's a moral maze, I think. Where do we draw the line? Because we always know that countries have used sports to try and sanitize their image, right? When the World Cup was held in South Africa, you know, you had Tabo and Becki's regime where I think almost like 13% of the adult population

was HIV positive due to government negligence. But, you know, the whole world celebrated with them. China started rounding up human traffickers and, you know, North Korean defectors, just before the 2008 Olympics because it was a bad look for the world. So we know that countries use sports as a way to sanitise their image.

I have a problem with penalising athletes, though, because I don't think athletes represent their countries. I understand the case for Russia, even though I don't necessarily agree with it, but I just think the line is with athletes. There's a lot of sports journalists at the moment going hard on these golfers, most of whom were towards the end of their careers,

really. Not many of the top-top players have done this leap. but they're earning huge amounts of money, which they say is their job, and they don't really want to get involved in the morality, Phil Mickelson and all these guys. And I'm like, well, fine, go that hard on them, but what about every footballer that goes to Qatar for the World Cup,

which still has an appalling record on homosexuality, for example. We're in Pride Month. And you try doing that in Qatar and see how you get on, these corporations like FIFA and so on. So I think it is a moral maze. Talking of moral maze, it's turned to Boris Johnson. You're still a supporter. Yes?

Really? Shockingly said. I mean, come on. What more's the man got to do to dents your confidence? Look, I supported Boris Johnson when he stood for the leadership of the Conservative Party. He was being Prime Minister for two years and two of the most difficult challenging years that any government has ever had to contend with. I mean, three crises, COVID, the cost of living and Ukraine.

And on those issues, I think the government has a strong record. Well, Ukraine, I'll give him a tick. COVID, I'll give him a tick for the second half and a terrible cross for the first half. And cost of living, I mean, we're now predicted of the worst economy in the Western world by next year after Russia. So the idea that we're doing well on the economy

is for the birds, isn't it? Well, the whole world is suffering. But we're going to be worse in all our European countries. I'm not going to necessarily accept that until we see the figures. But no country is going to find it easy. things like the cost of food, the cost of energy, that is going to affect every single country in the world,

and the government is providing as much support. Do you think Boris will survive now until the next election? Yes. God forbid. God forbid. What does that sentence do to you? It fills me with horror. I do not think, I think there's an element of the Conservative Party that's tone deaf now, and I don't think they want to listen to the public

when we say it is going to be catastrophic if that man... Well, Boris Johnson actually has been listening to you, probably on this show, which, by the way, he's still refusing to come on, about eight years now since he's run into a fringe to avoid me. But on what he said today, he's basically doing a massive U-turn, isn't he, and basically trying to talk the Conservatives. He's been reading my Twitter feed. This is the frustrating thing, because it raises so many questions.

Why now? Why is it when your party almost chucked you out? Are you trying to implement somewhat conservative policies? And they're actually not very conservative if you look at them. Why now? Why did you not do it when we were telling you are infuriating, your base, you have nothing to offer young people, your demographic is slowly, you know, fading because, you know, the conservative, the conservative larger have an older, more age demographic party base. Why, why not when we were telling you to do that? And I just, I'm at the point

where I generally do not think there's any, there's any way that man can come back for me, because I did support Boris, like you, and I think this is too far gone, his track record, and I do understand. You know what's interesting. I do think that the Conservative Party is now split between Boris loyalists, you see him, warts and all, probably. except his downside, but I think there's a good electable upside. A lot of other conservatives were just completely done and can't even look at it. It's very interesting, which is what you saw with his own MPs

and the no-confidence vote, of course. I want to pivot to fish and chips. Are you a fan? Not really. I'm always going to die. I love them. Do you like fish and chips? As a matter of fact, I had fish and chips today. So yes. Well, I'm saying to next,

because chip shops are taking absolute battering as to cost of fuel and food soles. One Humphal Chippy, saved by social media. My panel will stay in comment on this. Well, I have grave concerns about my next story. Yes, if you sign up to study archaeology, you might expect to see bones, right? Just as training crime scene investigators probably expect they may have to look at pictures of crime scenes. Well, apparently not.

Two British universities have decided their courses should carry trigger warnings for their simpering snowflake students. University of York is now alerting aspiring archaeologists that their course occasionally shows images and videos of human remains. Well, yes, that's the point of archaeology. And the University of Exeter now warns fledgling forensic scientists that crime scene pictures may be offensive or traumatic. Well, yes, that's what happens if you want to be a forensic scientist. This is all obviously preposterous. It's like writing may contain nuts, literally on a bag of peanuts. Just wait until they hear about biology.

Well, fish and chips by our local chippy, as we call it, in the UK is the taste of the British summer. But this year, it's the chippies themselves getting battered. Russia's invasion of Ukraine has sent fuel and energy prices soaring, jacking up the cost of both the fishing and the frying.

Prices of cod and haddock are up 75% in a year. Sunflower oil by 60% and flour prices by 40%. TikTok has saved the day for one friar in Coventry, the Binly mega-chippy, has incredibly recognized. up millions of views online after a catchy song about the chippy went viral. It's a little mega chippy, binly mega chippy, binly mega chippy.

Binly mega chippy. It's sort of catchy, I guess. I'm joined now by Frank Nacra, whose family owns the binly mega chimpi. Frank, great to talk to you. Can I just ask you, how tough is it right now to be in your line of work, given these extraordinary escalating prices. Hi, Piers, how you doing? It's a very, very difficult time of year,

and it's with all the rising prices and the war in Ukraine. It's very, very difficult to actually maintain margins and keep the staff on without having to raise prices too much. But we've managed to balance it out really well. I mean, what you've done brilliantly is you've used TikTok to turn yourselves into a global phenomenon? Well, the viral jingle that you've just been listening to, thank you who for have us done it,

but we've obviously benefited in a massive way from it. And obviously, we've set up our own accounts, obviously my account. I'll put in our little TikTok reels and some Instagram and to push it even further to gain more publicity. And obviously it's TV, press and interviews. But yes, it certainly helps.

and helped create a lot of business and for the future as well. If you could have a word with Boris Johnson, the Prime Minister, what would you most want him to do right now for businesses like you? Take the VAT back to 5%. That will be a great help. Yeah, well, good point. We'll put it to him. If you have the gumption to come on the show, I'll ask him.

Frank, good luck to you. I love the jingle. I love the business you're doing. I love the fact you're defying this near recession now and doing a roaring trade and next time I'm up there I'll come and have a nice cotton chips with you. I wish you would. And if I send you a T-shirt, this is all for charity.

We've got something I've designed with me and a supplier. There's a website where you can actually buy all our merchandise, this particular merchandise, and every single penny that we make from that, we'll go to charity. So I get a T-shirt to you and a Mug. Will you actually wear it on your show? I probably wouldn't wear it on the show, I might do it for social media for you,

just to try and capitalize on your TikTok fame. Frank, good to talk to you. Get back to work. Thank you. Thank you very much, Fierce. Take care, yeah? All the best to you. Well, John and Esther, a bit of fun.

Oh, hang on. There's somebody at the door. Who could that be? What? Morgan's mega chippy. Morgan's mega chippy. Oh, my God. It's already had bites today.

I know. Now, John, what you know, You've already had one fisher's ship today. How often do you get stuck into two of them? Also, these are very good. They're local. Are they ealing, right? Okay.

I have a tip, please, Tiz. Just quickly, your reaction. I mean, on a... Tip? No, get out of it. Your tip is that you get to work with me every day. Let me just ask you, on a serious point, the amount these guys are having to pay extra

just in the last six months alone because of inflation, Ukraine, all these things, and post-pandemic. Really tough out there. What did you think of his idea of reducing VAT? Well, I can understand why it would help him, but of course we have already an enormous debt burden, which we accumulated during COVID, and to ask the Chancellor to find a measure which would cost an awful lot of money. I think it's better to target the help on those who really needed. But I do want to say one thing about what Frank was saying, because Frank is struggling, but there is behind the problems Frank facing is facing. What I fear is. it's going to become a global crisis. Because if you look at those parts of the world

that depend on Ukraine for their grain supplies, for their oil supplies, potentially we are looking at a humanitarian catastrophe. I completely agree. I think this is going completely unnoticed by large swades of people. What's going on in Ukraine, the strangle that have on things like flour, oil and stuff like that could be devastating in many parts of the world.

Esther, hey, criticism of eating. I know. I know. I know. I know. fitness fanatics. I hope I've put back your regime. Just by a few weeks. What do you make, though,

of, you've got the fish and ship guy there, just a local business. We were hearing one of the crew, actually, his dad's been working on bishops shops, and three of them have shut down in the last year. I mean, this is devastating. I mean, so many shops on my high street have shut down, and I see it all over the place. You know, and you were saying that

few prices are increasing all over the world. I believe wheat prices in Egypt was gone about 250%. Can you imagine? They're the largest consumers of wheat in the world, and overnight, the price they're paying has gone up 250. The longer the wall goes on, the worst this is going to get. And there's 25 million tons of grain sitting in the

port of Odessa, and they can't get it out because of the Russian blockade. Putin knows all this. So part of his strategy is to put a stranglehold on energy and resources and food because he knows eventually we may have to wilt. But we have to break the gridlock, right? Because we can't just keep funneling money to this war that we don't see an end inside. I think that's a bigger problem as well, because

these problems are just going to keep getting worse and worse of us. what? There's a lot of bad stuff going on out there. Have your fish and chips. And let's just try and enjoy at least that. That's it from me. Whatever you're up to, make sure it's uncensored. Good night. Thank you.