Piers Morgan Uncensored - Piers Morgan's Coverage of Israel-Palestine - Two Years On From October 7

Episode Date: August 19, 2025

Almost two years on from Hamas' attack on October 7, the war in Gaza rages on, with tens of thousands killed, hostages still in captivity and starvation blighting the strip - here's a reminder of how Piers Morgan has been covering it all. Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent and supported by: Pique: Get 20% off your order plus a FREE frother & glass beaker with this exclusive link: https://piquelife.com/PIERS Oxford Natural: To watch their full stories, scan the QR code on your screen or visit https://oxfordnatural.com/piers/ to get 70% off your first order when you use code PIERS. Beam: Visit https://shopbeam.com/PIERS and use code PIERS to get our exclusive discount of up to 40% off. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Almost two years on from Hamas' devastating attack on October the 7th, the war in Gaza rages on with tens of thousands killed, hostages still in captivity, and starvation spreading across the street. Conflicts in Israel and its neighbours, Iran, Lebanon and Syria, have narrowly avoided escalation so far, but the region remains on a knife edge. Here's how we've been covering it. We'll begin by talking to Daniela Weiss,

the leader of the settler group, Nahala. Well, welcome to you, Daniela Weiss. Thank you for joining me on the sensitive. Let me start by asking you, Mrs. Weiss. You're known as the godmother of the Israeli settler movement. Is your ultimate ambition for all Palestinians to be removed from the West Bank and Gaza? You ask if it's what I want? It's not ambition.

Ambition I put into positive things. I mean, when people have to move for one place to another, it's not a question of ambition. I think there is no choice now, especially after the massacre of the 7th of October. The Gazans finished their chapter of history in Gaza, and they will have the third. The terrorists themselves will be killed in the attacks of the Israeli army, of Tzahal, and those who support them will have to go to emigrate to other countries. And I think it, as far as people want to live normal life, I think the option to go to other countries and the world is a,

good option, but it's not a question of ambition. I have an ambition to settle Jews all over the vast areas of the land that was given by God to the Jewish nation. So this is my ambition. Okay, but if I suggest that we carve out an area of Israel to put the Palestinians, we just slice off. No. No, let me finish. Let me finish. We slice off an area of Israel and all the Israelis who currently live there

have to leave and go and live in another country. Are you happy about that? Would you be happy with that? You have some psychological need to slice pieces of the tiny state of Israel? No, no. I'm just saying, what's this need? Listen, Gaza, as you know,

Gaza, as you know, well, hang on, let me finish. Gaza, as you know, is a very, very small territory. I'm talking about a similar-sized territory. Is what? Gaza is what? I'm talking about, it's a very small territory. Gaza is what? Gaza is very small. And I know. So I'm talking about taking Indonesia. I'm talking, hang on, I'm talking about taking the Gaza people, the innocent Ghazan people, not Hamas, but innocent Ghazan people. And I'm talking about taking, taking a piece of Israel and removing all the Israelis who currently live there,

and sending them off to other countries, and then you put the Palestinian people in that space in Israel. How would you feel about that? It's not a question of feel. It's not going to happen. Right. You're trying some kind of absurd exercise. Why would that be wrong, Mrs. Weiss?

Why would that be wrong? Because it failed. We left Gaza in 2005, and we were promised that Gaza will be. be Singapore. And I didn't believe in it, but many Israelis did believe in it. And it turned into hell, upper hell, lower hell, hell. And I think no more experiments. We are not a laboratory. We are a nation that wants to live in the land that was given to us, to the Jews, by God. But you actually, but you, the Arabs, the Gazans, don't want it.

So I don't want to be an experiment, a laboratory with experiments on the Jewish people. I just wonder, obviously, you're outraged by the idea of Palestinian people taking the place of Israelis in Israel. And I understand that. But what gives you the right to then tell Palestinian people, innocent people, children, who've had nothing to do with Hamas? What gives you the right to upward?

Let me finish. to uproot those people from their homes and expel them in what would be ethnic cleansing, which is a war crime, as you know. They attacked, attacked, attacked Israel on the 7th of October. They massacred Jews on the 7th of October after we evacuated Gaza for their benefit.

What is not clear in what I say? If there is anything in what is so openly exposed that can be considered illegal? Well, you're committing more crimes. What is illegal in what I do? You're committing war crimes. Why? So you are speaking to me now.

You're giving so much time in your program to a person who commits war crimes. Why do you do it? I'm holding you to account. What's the sense? I'm holding you to account for your war crimes. I'm telling you you should stop your war crimes. I'm telling you you have absolutely,

you have no right to displace millions of Palestinians and kick them out of their homes. You don't have that right. Morgan, you hope that through your program you will enhance the chance that I will be put to trial? Is this why you give me so much time in your program? Yeah, I think ultimately you should face a trial, yeah.

You just interviewed a terrorist, and she's one of the most vicious terrorists, of my lifetime. These settlers are lunatic religious fundamentalists that believe in murdering Palestinians for God. It's an absurd interpretation of any religious document. The overwhelming majority of Jews, by the way, do not

agree with them. They don't think that you have to murder Palestinians for God. And so when you asked her that last question, it was actually very interesting what her answer was. You said, do you mind 20,000 children being killed? And she said, as long as they're teaching their children to hate Jews, she seemed to be justifying that we have to kill their children. So think about the absurd logic of that.

Since they teach them to hate us, we murdered their children. Gee, I wonder why they hate you. Pears is absolutely right. We pass those Geneva Convention laws so that we could prevent crimes against humanity, not just what the Germans did to the Jews, the Poles, the Roma, etc. but also what the allies did in indiscriminate carpet bombing of civilian populations. So we tried to learn from the Holocaust. We tried to learn from World War II. And we all said never again.

These laws should not be broken because at least the terrible situations. Israel then said, no, we're above the law. We get to break any law we like. And in the case of the Germans, they were killing six million Jews. They killed 13 million overall. We were trying to stop a Holocaust. In this case, Israel is the one doing the genocide and saying, well, I mean, why are you trying to stop us from killing innocent Palestinians and taking their land? Because in that analogy, you're the Germans.

So the Palestinians, those innocent children didn't do anything, dude. You just call me a Nazi? If you're supporting Israel. I'm a Nazi? Look, they did a Holocaust, which is... And you call other people? The current terrorist state of Israel? You just called me a Nazi?

Hey, rabbi, can I... This is a sad day for you, Chang, this is a sad day for you, Chang, this is a sad day for you. No, it's not. Just for your credibility, take it back. Can I finish my sentence? For your credibility, just take it back. I'm not going to take it back. I'm not going to take it back.

This is a sad day for you. To compare me to the SS of the Nazi, this is a sad day for you. Your credibility from Jang. I want to invite the... I want to invite the view. I'll never recover. No, no, no, listen. Pierce, may I answer?

Pierce, now that I've been called a Nazi, can I respond? No. No, no. Because I haven't finished the goddamn sentence. You think you own everything. Go ahead. You don't own everything, Rabbi Shmooley. You don't own the American government.

You don't own the American people. By the way, when is America going to get it? It's this $300 billion back. We gave it to a bunch of criminals to murder children. Okay, you murdered children with our money. Every day you take money out of money. my tax taxes. I go to work every day and then Israel takes money out of it to murder Palestinian children. You've murdered 20,000 children already. You're the aggressors. You've already killed,

Israel has already killed more babies than Hamas has killed civilians overall. Israel has killed a stadium full of women and children. And you are surprised that we compare you to the Germans. Omar Bartov, an Israeli-American Holocaust expert, just wrote an article in New York Times saying that now the Israelis are doing the type of genocide that makes saying never again absurd, absurd. Why are they doing the thing that was done to them? The world had tremendous sympathy for all Jews, and I do all decent human beings do.

But what Israel is doing is lighting that sympathy on fire and saying we get to murder, we get to kill, and you can't call us any names. We get to call all Muslims who fight back against us terrorists. We get to attack all of our neighbors. They attack Syria again today. We get to break all the laws. We get to commit war crimes.

And I'm telling you right now, just like the Germans, you do not have the right to commit war crimes, to commit a genocide, to kill all those children, and then hide, hide and use as a shield. Oh, everybody's an anti-Semite, an anti-Semite. You're canceled. You don't get to say it. You've ruined your credibility. No, Israel has ruined its credibility.

Israel is now one of the most monstrous states I have ever seen in my lifetime. They commit endless terrorism. They robbed the American people of our money to rob Palestinians of their land. That is actually a stone cold fact. And I was right, Israel is now occupying 75% of Gaza. It was always to steal their land. There's a lot going on with the global economy. It's entirely reasonable to wonder what the effect will be on your savings.

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Consider diversifying a portion of your savings into gold. That way, if the FEC can't stay ahead of the curve, at least you can stay ahead for yourself. Had anything prepared you for what you encountered in Gaza? Do you know, Gaza is an extremely different. place to go into. I've been there now multiple times since the start of this war. I remember, you know, the first time going in there, you know, we arrived at about six o'clock and there was an airstrike at a residential house and we walked in to the morgue.

And I remember opening up the body bags because the other extended family were there to identify the bodies. And you know, when you just open up body bags and it's organs of children, missing heads, missing limbs, 80% body burns. And, you know, there were family members coming in picking up pieces of an arm and identifying the body just by the ring. And, you know, that was literally the first 30 minutes I was in Gaza. And instantly, you know that this is something that's, you'd never be prepared for something like that.

Had you ever come across anything like this? Not to this scale. Not to this scale. The level of destruction, you know, we would drive, you know, we would drive from the European Hospital to NASA Hospital. And there would be about four buildings standing. And it was just rubble. And people were living in and amongst this rubble.

You know, it was really, and you know, the drones, constantly overhead. Every day, children are coming in, injured, killed, burnt alive. And that's constant. And, you know, there's always the risk that you could be killed as well. I mean, it sounds extraordinary. When you say that children are coming in every day, literally all the time. Yeah.

You know, the second time that I was there, I was there a few days into the sea, a few days before the ceasefire broke. And we would actually see children come in with gunshot wounds to the neck and head. They'd been sniped. second head. We saw last year in June, children that had been starved to death, children that coming and starving to death in June last year. So forget about, you know, this Gaza humanitarian foundation now and the starvation that you see. We were seeing that in June last year. And, you know, to go back nine months later and still see children starving to death, that's what really hits

home is when you see that how prolonged and sustained this campaign of violence and, and violence against children. It's been, yeah, it's quite difficult. I've been saying for a few months now that what is happening now is beyond, to me, any kind of proportionate response. And it seems to be never-ending. And that's why this has to end.

But going back to October the 7th, notwithstanding, obviously you're the son of a Garzaan refugee, and of course that will inform how you view things. But none of this would be happening in the way it's been happening without what Hamas did that day. So what do you feel about what Hamas inflicted on its own people by doing what it did? So look, I think the framing of that is a little bit problematic.

Like what Hamas did to its own people, what's been going on is it didn't start on October the 7th. It's been 75 years. And I can detest to that because I was ethnically cleansed out of cars and so was my family, you know. So it didn't start on October the 7th. What do I think about October 7th? Horrific.

You know, taking of women. and children as hostages, killing innocent people. As a Palestinian, I know how much that hurts. So all I have is nothing but sympathy for the people who suffered on October the 7th. But at the same time, you know, people started this story on October the 7th. And for me, growing up in poverty,

growing up without running water in the house, growing up watching, you know, us have to give up our savings all the time to support family back in Gaza and back, I think. For me, it never started on October the 7th. For me, it started every day when I was being bullied at school. It started when I had to move from city to city because my dad never got a permanent job.

Those are the kind of things where, you know, I look at it and I was just, there was a lot of emotions on October the 7th, you know, as a Palestinian. Did any part of you feel it was justified? I've heard some people categorize what they did as resistance, which is a justification for what happened. I don't think you can do that. I mean, to me, it was an appalling

terrorist attack. And the reason I framed the question the way I did was that when it later turned out that Hamas had this huge tunnel system, where they all hid. But the civilians were left to be under the reigning bombs from Israel, which were inevitably going to come, given the scale of what Hamas did. That's what I meant by the way I phrased the question, which is how much do Palestinian people, when they look back on that, how much do they blame Hamas for inevitably bringing you're bringing this on the? Yeah. I mean, look, before Hamas, it was the PLO. Right. You know, and before the PLO it was the Egyptians and before then it was somebody else. Look, at the end of the day, the root causes the problem, the root causes the occupation, the root causes inequality, the root cause is that I don't have the right to return to my home, that my father doesn't have the right to return, that my grandfather is buried in Gaza, my dad's never been able to go

see him. You know, when we talk about the root causes, when we talk about, you know, you what Hamas did on October the 7th. This is just a cycle. And the cycle always comes back to, instead of looking at the symptoms, I don't want to look at the symptoms. I want to look at the causes. The causes is an inequality, is a lack of justice. And I just want justice for the Palestinian people.

And I don't want that justice to be violence and killing of innocent Israelis. You want the same human rights? I just want the same human rights. Well, join me now is Mike Golun, the Minister for Social Equality in Benjamin Netanyahu's government. Welcome to you, Ms. Goelan. You were listening to that,

but you were grimacing and pulling faces. What was your issue with what you heard? No one wants to see children died, children hurt. No one wants that, let alone the Israeli people who suffered what they did. But for them to say that we are doing it in order to hurt specifically innocent civilians is an absolute lie.

I can tell you. But I hear this. With respect, Minister, I hear this from a lot of Israeli government members, ambassadors, lawyers and so on. And my point is always the same is that even if we accept that nobody in the IDF has ever deliberately targeted a child, which is contradicted by a lot of witnesses. But even if you accept that premise, you have to also agree that 20,000 children may be many more. That's just the ones that we believe is the number have been killed as you've gone after Hamas.

And it's a staggering number of children, innocent kids who've been. killed here and just on a human level well surely surely you must accept that this has now gone on long enough first of all on a human level i can tell you not 100 percent one million percent that we take no pleasure whatsoever not in seeing anyone innocence in gaza who died let alone our holy and hero soldiers and are innocent people but let's put some things in perspective and And I would like to answer that, you know, as much as I can. When you see videos and when you see pictures, which I'm sure you get a mass of them, okay? You have to remember those videos and pictures don't come from the moon, right?

They are coming from people who take videos there. Everyone has mobile phones, smartphones. So obviously, some of those videos could be reflected to one side. I suggest, I really do suggest, you see some of the videos of the horrors that happened on October 7th. I saw them. Of the horrors that have been happening in one second. One second. Oh, I saw the 40-minute video.

You saw the 40-minute video of the horrors? Yes. If you saw that, if you did saw that, and let me just tell you that it's just a part. It's just a part of what we could have shown because the majority was horrible. If you saw that, you can't stay calm in yourself and relax about what Israel and the Jewish nation have to endure for the last 75 years. We have women that are being slaughtered and raped in the most brutal way. I'm as the Minister for Social Equality and the Advancement of Women, I just heard the person that you interviewed mocking about it and laughing about it.

What he was laughing about. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. You asked him, you must have mischaracterize it. You must have mischaracterize it. Okay. The point he was making, and he's an extremely courageous doctor who risked his own life several times now to go and work in hospitals in Gaza as the bombs are dropping. So I won't have you attacking him on a personal law. I wish you would have told you that Israel has suggested more than 100 incubators to the Shifa hospitals and to the authorities of Hamas, and they refused it.

I wish he would have told you that many hospitals, Mr. Morgan, one second, I wish he would have told you that many hospitals underground have facilities of terror. I wish you would have told you that schools and places of humanitarian aid, which, by the way, we, the country that have massacred in her holiday, has been given over 70,000 8 trucks. Do you hear that? You know what? I'm sorry. He's talking about a hospital.

Let me respond. What country does that? A country that has a woman being chopped off into pieces and babies being chopped off into pieces, men beheaded. Elderly people are being kidnapped. Do you know what we had to watch? He's talking about what the gossans are being through, but what about the Jewish nation that has been,

that have buses been blowing up for the last 70 years? Yes, okay. His heart was broken. We are wounded. Our ministers are wounded from the sights we saw. I wanted to tell you before, and you stopped me. As the Minister for Social Equality and the Advancement of Women, what I saw, that women have endured, your eyes and your mind could never comprehend. The fact is that we have children in Gaza today that the interview before was talking about that are being raised on Mink. They are being raised of killing Jews from the second they are born. This is what they say. And you know what? If you don't believe me, you can talk with the hostages that came back from captivity.

And what are you telling? Are they telling us? What would you do with them? The Palestinians. With who? The Palestinians. What would you do with them? Well, first of all, this is not an issue now with the Palestinians.

This is not an issue with the terror regime of Hamas. In my idea, in my idea, in my idea, in my idea, Hamas is all. What would you do with it? I don't know. Would you like to accept them while we eliminate the terror of Hamas? Would England accept them? Well, let me read you. Or maybe another Arab country.

Let me remind you of some of the things that you've said yourself, all right? During an October 24-24 rally in support of Jewish settlements in Gaza, you said there should be another Nakhba, referring to the 1948 Palestinian displacement of hundreds of thousands of people. You also said, I am personally proud of the ruins of Gaza and that every baby, even 80 years from now, will tell their grandchildren what the Jews did. That was in February, you said this.

You want explicit violence against Hamas, Palestinians in February 2024. Hamas, absolutely. Absolutely. We want to eliminate every terrorist of Hamas. Let me tell you that. Hang, I'm finished yet. I haven't finished. Sorry, when we say Mr. Morgan. I haven't finished yet.

In December 2020, you said, I don't care about Gaza. I literally don't care at all. I mean, and I could go on reading these stuff you've had. So my point is, you say that Smodrich and Ben-Givir, they're the right-wingers. It's sounding pretty right-wing

yourself. I'm a right-winger as well. right-winger as well. Absolutely. Would you say you're an extremist? That doesn't mean I take any pleasure, any pleasure of an innocent Arab man or woman or child in Gaza suffering. If you're stressed about back taxes, miss the April deadline or your books are a mess, well, don't wait. The IRS is cracking down.

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So don't wait for the next IRS letter. Call 800-958-1000 or visit t-nusa.com slash peers. That's tnusa.com slash peers for expert help on your tax. Well, I'm joined by Israeli Ambassador to the UK, Zippy Hotovelli. Ambassador, welcome back to Uncensored. Good evening, Pierce. Incredibly damning comments from two former Prime Ministers of Israel and a former Deputy Chief of Staff of the Israeli Army.

When you hear what they have to say, surely it gives you pause for thought, doesn't it? Well, it's quite obvious for someone like you that understands politics. that those people are coming from the opposition. Their job, in their opinion, is to fight whatever the government is doing. I think it's very anti-patriotic not to support Israel's war when we are fighting the most justified war in the world against a terror group that committed the worst atrocities at the 7th of October.

Just today, we remember 600 days that we still have 58 hostages in captivity. And I'm afraid to say, nowadays in Israel, you can't find even one leader that will say he's willing to live with Hamas on its doorstep. So if those people have any criticism, they should offer a plan how Hamas will be removed from the Gaza Strip from controlling the doorstep of Israel, not committing the 7th of October again. I didn't get to hear that not from European leaders that are criticizing Israel and not from those opposition former leaders. So I must say that in the end of the day, Israel has a serious threat on its security. You will agree with that.

No one wants to see people being massacred in their homes like we've seen at the 7th of October. And in order to do that, the aims of the war are still relevant. We want to bring back our hostages and we want to make sure Hamas won't control the Gaza Street. Every leader in the world, in the Western world, agrees on those two aims. With respect to Ambassador, you clearly don't achieve it with the way that you're trying to achieve it. All you're achieving at the moment is making Israel more and more of a global pariah. When only a few days ago, you have two doctors in Gaza who have 10 children and nine of them are killed in a bombardment by your forces, that doesn't make people feel, oh, this is all going great.

It makes people think that you're waging a systematic destruction, not just of property and of land, but also of children. And that's what's happening. The percentage of children, the percentage of children that you're killing compared to the percentage of your killing of Hamas terrorist, what is it? Do you know? Do you know how many children you've killed? Answer me that one question. Do you know how many Hamas terrorists you've killed and how many children you've killed? You know there's two numbers. I know the numbers that came from the IDF. I know the numbers that came from a very, very established thing time. Give me the two numbers. Wait a second. We killed 30,000. We kill 30,000 terrorists in phase one of the war. Since the war is back, I don't have the numbers. But let me tell you one thing. And how many children have you killed? We never target civilians.

So this question is irrelevant. How many children have you killed? Pierce, Israel is not killing children. Israel is not killing children. Hamas is using them as human children. Israel is killing children every single day. Pierce, this is a blood label you're putting on Israel. You know it's not true.

No, it's not actually. And what you're trying to do is be very weird. easily with your words. No, I'm not. The truth is, the truth is, you are killing a lot of children. You would argue your... Hang on, let me finish. Because Hamas is using them as human shields, and you know that.

Let me finish. My question to you, you are killing a lot of children on a daily basis. That is indisputable. My interesting question for you is, how come you know exactly how many Hamas terrorists you've killed, but you have no idea how many children you've killed? Pierce, I will give you the answer, because when you're accusing a country of killing children, It sounds to all the people that are listening to us as if Israel wakes up in the morning and says, oh, let's kill innocent people now.

This is not what Israel is doing. Israel is killing a lot of children. And my question is, how come you know how many terrorists you've killed? Are you familiar with the international law? Answer my question. Answer my question. Because the international humanitarian law says very clearly, as long as you're targeting civilian targets, you're allowed to attack hospitals. So answer my question.

No, but you're not answering my question. Israel is not deliberately killing children. And this accusation is a fake thing that you keep on saying again and again when you know we're a democratic country cares about human life. I just ask you a simple question. And at the same time, Hamas is deliberately using the children as human children. And you know that. I don't do.

I don't deny anything you say about Hamas. They're everything you say they are probably worse. I despise Hamas. They are a despicable terrorist organization. So help us win this war if you're so despising Hamas. You're offering to surrender. You're not offering to win. No, I'm asking you.

Okay, I'm asking you this question for a purpose. I'm curious why you know, you say you know, exactly how many Hamas terrorists have been killed, but you have no idea how many children have been killed. Why is it you know one number, but not the other? Great leaders need great sleep. If you're tossing and turning all night, then running on fumes all day,

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That's shopbeam.com slash peers. You have come to the conclusion that what Israel's doing is indefensible. And I thought it was fascinating and shocking watching you grill the Israeli ambassador who simply cannot tell you or even ballpark how many kids. they have killed in this whole thing. Yeah, look, I mean, I think what Israel, you know, to your broader question of where does this all end up going, there's almost two kind of simultaneous wars, in a sense, that are going on. There's the actual, you know, control of power, in which case Israel's done phenomenally well over the last couple of years.

I mean, Israel still has the support of the most powerful governments in the world, damn near unconditionally, if not purely unconditionally. they've been very successful in terms of taking out Hezbollah leaders. They've been very successful in terms of destroying the Gaza Strip. They've been successful in getting the regime change that they've wanted for many years in Syria. However, simultaneously, while that's going on, global opinion has drastically changed of Israel to a degree that would have been unimaginable just a few years ago. And despite whatever arguments might be made for whether this meets a genocide or doesn't meet a genocide or whether, you know, as two former Israeli prime ministers who have come out recently

and said that war crimes are being committed, wherever you fall on that, the fact is that the debate is now over whether Israel is committing a genocide or not. And that is something that all of us should take a step back and appreciate how profound it is. Especially amongst young people, in the future, I don't believe Israel will ever be viewed the same as it was by my parents' generation. And so what does that mean? You know, as you mentioned earlier, Pierce, that's right. This is a big part of how wars end is when public support evaporates. We will see where all of this goes, but it is a very dangerous situation.

And it is certainly profound to the degree that it has changed the impression of Israel on the global stage. Nobody understands what Israel's goal is here, other than flattening Gaza and kicking... No, as Mondritch has said, it is to take... over and clear out Gaza of all the Palestinians. That is genocide, isn't it? I mean, you're a lawyer. You tell me. Israel's war aims have been clear from the outset, which is the destruction

of Hamas. They haven't done that. And the return of the hostages. Well, because the war's not over yet. You haven't done either of those things. All you're doing is killing more and more civilians and you've been starving them. Well, but who's you? Forgive me. I'm here as a lawyer. The Israeli government and you're here to defend it, right? No, I'm here to defend the rule of law and the weaponization

of international law, which has been consistent throughout this process. The propaganda that we're discussing right now, which is clearly what has shifted your position and perspective on this, is deep be dangerous. Calling Israel a committer of genocide or saying that it is starving children. Well, actually, the people are alleging

that Israel's committing war crimes are two former Israeli prime ministers. Who have their own political agendas here, let's be. Well, of course, how convenient. The two former prime ministers of the country have said that you are committing as a government, not you, but the government is committing war crimes. And you dismiss it as just a bit of internal politics.

Well, no, it's a very serious matter that the misinformation that I would like to be able to come on to address is now also being propagated by two very sore individuals. Prime Minister Olmert, because he also served the prison sentence, and has had his entire proposed peace framework, that of essentially creating a Palestinian state in East Jerusalem and the West Bank, turned upside down by the realization,

and he hasn't had, unfortunately, the temerity after the 7th of October to recognize the risk that he would have put Israel to in light of the Hamas taking. And when you see, as we saw, and when you see, Natasha, I was answering the previous question. Okay, let me just, on the point. On the point of legality, actually it's very productive. On the point of legality, only last week the Israeli government announced new settlements, 22 settlements. Well, no, can we pull to Gaza first?

Hang on. Hang on. On the West Bank, 22 settlements, which the international community views as illegal, they announced 22 new settlements. As a lawyer, given your adherence to the point of law, presumably you would condemn that. Well, this is exactly why we need to be clear about how international law applies and why the notion of these so-called illegal settlements

is a mis-lawful. It's not a legal term, it's a political term, and it is part and parcel of a misapplication of international law to the status of the territory. These blood liables, occupation, ethnic cleansing, a lowlandish, apartheid and genocide, are all part and parcel with the propaganda, which I would like to be able to come on to,

because all of the evidence goes in completely the opposite direction. In terms of Israel's compliance with the laws of armed conflict, and the amount of steps that Israel takes, unprecedented in the history of armed conflict. And military commanders will tell you... Actually, that's just a load of bullshit. I'm sorry, it just is. Which other army sends warnings...

Which other war in recent times? Have you had half the population is under 18, and you've killed 20,000 kids? Those figures are Hamas figures that you are constantly... Give me an example of where this morality has been played out elsewhere. I was explaining earlier that the Hamas figures are inflated, that there are internal inconsistencies. How convenient for you? You don't know what the figures are, so how do you know?

Because there have been independent studies. How do you know how many figures are inflated or otherwise? You don't know how many are being killed. Because we know Hamas lies. It is an internationally prescribed terrorist organization. Well, I think you're lying, because you say on one hand, I don't know how many children have been killed. But on the other hand, and there's a blood libel, if you say we've killed any of them, but on the other hand...

That's not what I said, no. But on the other hand, you know all about the ratios, and you know how humane the Israeli forces are being, but you don't know how many of their killing. Because even on Hamas figures, which we know to be false, which do not make distinctions between civilians and... You don't know their fools? We do, because there has been...

How do you know their fools? You don't know how many have been killed? Because Hamas has even itself revised those figures down and acknowledged that they are false, and the UN is still touting... How many children has Israel killed? If we go back to the question... Well, can you ask my question? If you go back to the ratio question...

Do you know my question? No, but I can tell you the ratio even on the basis of Hamas figures. You can tell me the ratio without... But how do you know if you don't know how many of dying? I can tell you how many of the basis of the false Hamas figures. You've no idea how many have been killed, but you can tell me the ratio. I can tell you the ratio. You're a smart lawyer.

Do you not understand how ridiculous that sounds? If we were in a courtroom now, you would be demolished by a fellow lawyer. They would say, what are you talking about? Well, here's, this is not how courtroom etiquette is. conducted, I'm afraid. Actually, some of my favorite lawyers conduct them exactly like this. I would be permitted to finish a sentence. The reason we can say that the ratio before the ceasefire was one to one or 1.5 to 1 is on the basis even of Hamas figures. Well, 1 to 1 or 5 to 1, which one was it? 1 to 1 to 1.5 to 1 at different points in that period. What right does the IDF have to restrict

journalists doing their job? In every other war I've ever been involved in, including sending my daily mirror journalists to cover the Iraq war in Baghdad, where they rang me at midnight to ask if they should leave or stay in a hotel, the Baghdad Hilton, I think it was called, before shock and or arrived. So huge responsibility on my shoulders then about the lives of my journalists, but they were prepared to risk them to report the truth to the wider world. Israel has decided no journalists from outside can go in for three reasons. And make that assessment themselves. Yes. What right does Israel have to do that? For three reasons. Will you allow me to finish? Well, there are no reasons. Well, you've just asked me. It's done of your business whether the journalists view their safety

as being at risk. I'm sorry, you haven't heard the reasons yet. The first, of course, is the safety of the journalist. And I appreciate you don't accept that. The second is the same. I think it's a load of nonsense. The second is the idea you're doing is that some quaint concern for the safety of journalists is bullshit. That was reason number one. Uster bullshit. Reason number two is the ability. Is the ability of IDF soldiers to be able to conduct this war against Hamas without... Oh, without the journalists getting in the way? No, without...

Actually, by the way, they've killed more journalists in Palestinian journalists than in any war in modern history. Hamas members wearing press vests are not journalists. And reason number three... So none of them are journalists. And reason number three... So just to be clear, none of the Palestinian journalists

who've been killed are actually journalists. I said Hamas members. Are they're all Hamas members? Those that are... Every single dead Palestinian journalist is a member of Hamas. Is that your position? Listen, I appreciate Pierce this is a...

That is also bullshit. But risk-representing every... Well, joining me now in the studio is Hussam Zomlett. He's the Palestinian ambassador to the UK. It's been a regular guest on Uncensor. Welcome back to you, Ambassador. From day one, we say it very clearly that we wholeheartedly reject the targeting of civilians. But we added from all sides.

We have civilians. Our civilians have been killed all along for 77 years. not only kill, oppressed, rounded without trial or charge, their land being stolen, their houses being demolished, they live under complete apartheid regime as per international reports and assessments, whereby you are not born unless Israel agrees, you are not dead unless Israel issues your death certificate, you cannot love or marry unless Israel agrees, complete and utter system of segregation whereby you are treated under martial law. why an Israeli illegal settler from Brooklyn

will come and be under the Israeli civil law. What we try to say is balance it here. And the 7th of October was one day in the history of the conflict, but the proceeding 400 days has really dented our humanity. And the previous 77 years has also been as atrocious on the Palestinian people. What we try to do and say at that moment, yes, what happened on the 7th of October should be subjected to also Palestinian discussion. We also need to discuss. We realize that a people under occupation, as per international law, it is our right to resist via military arms.

Military means, I mean armed resistance. International law gives you that option, of course, targeting only military targets. Right. You know, it gives you. But even that. But there wasn't resistance. But even that, exactly. Hang on, hang on one second.

That, what we saw on October 7th was not resistance. That was a mass terror attack on civilian population. And any targeting of civilian? Let's be clear about that. 3,000 Hamas terrorists came over the border in wave after wave, and they attacked and murdered and did other terrible things to as many civilians as they could get their hands on. They kidnap babies, Holocaust survivors.

They murdered hundreds of people at a music festival. In other words, nothing that they did that they can be categorized as legitimate resistance or military action. Do you agree? I hear you, but you need to hear me. Would you agree with me? That's the 7th of October. But you agree with me?

Targeting civilians is absolutely utterly rejected. And we the Palestinian people must always, always return the moral high grounds. Our issue, the heart of our cause, is that we as civilians, defenseless, have been targeted for 100 years, so we better not do it ourselves. And we better stick to the one thing that we're calling for, which is international law. But on the 6th of October appears, the UN and other international organizations declared it was the deadliest year for Palestinian children in the West Bank, not even in Gaza. You didn't bring me here. The world was not all over the place to discuss the murder of Palestinian.

That's true. And the West Bank. I accept that. That is our issue. That's number one. I accept that. That is our issue. And since the 7th of October, you have been wanting me to condemn.

We have no issues with condemnation. We have been doing that all along. But the Israeli ambassador was sitting here, Pierce, last week. And all that conversation, still you did not ask her to condemn. So what is it about Palestinians? Do you, all the mainstream media, see Israeli Jewish life to be more of value? you than Palestinian lives. That's a question. And that's why I, as a representative of the Palestinian people, my people, I refuse wholeheartedly that our children is less of a human being

that there's. I agree. And I tell you, one Palestinian child for us, one Palestinian child for us, is worth the world. When it comes to the hostages, even if you don't believe Netanyahu that it makes any difference, in other words, his bigger plan for Gaza is not related to the hostages. Even if you believe that, why not call his bluff? Why not just demand and have every other Palestinian leader demand that Hamas release all remaining hostages tomorrow and call their bluff? Even if you don't believe it will make any difference, why not do that? At least show the humanity you say that you're not getting from Israel. Let those remaining hostages go home. Today, the Security Council, the 10 non-permanent members proposed a Security Council resolution

that includes the calling for two things. The immediate and permanent cessation of hostilities, cessation of the genocide, the mass murder and destruction, permanent ceasefire, and the release of all hostages. We go over that. You think Netanya will accept it? And read my lips, the U.S. will veto this. They are not interested, peers.

This isn't about the hostages. Ask the families of the hostages. They are only taking all this as a pretext, including the hostages. They saw in that an opportunity to annihilate Gaza. Listen to me. My grandfather and father was born in a village, beautiful one, called Simpsom. Sim. In what Israel has become, in 48 Palestine, it was completely and utterly demolished,

decimated Simpson. And they grew some trees, so we don't even... relate to or discover where our homes was. My generation, that's my grandfather and father. Myself, I was born in Rafah, a huge city in Gaza, a city home to 172,000 people. I was born there, I lived there all of my life, it's where I love and I grew up.

It's my city, it's gone, decimated. The only hope I have now is that my children are not going to face the same faith. This is Israel's DNA people. Israel's the innocence it was established is to annihilate us wherever we are. So we left our original homes. We were unable, not allowed to return to our original homes and farms and towns. And even the place of refugee ship we took, like Raffa, is destroyed.

My kids, I'm fearing now. And I want to discuss with you the future, more than the past. The past is dreadful. And the present is more dreadful. We should spend some time discussing the future, discussing what kind of Palestine we're after, what kind of a state we are going to build? What is the relationship between this state

and all of its neighbors and the rest of the world? But my biggest fear now is that my three children will face the same faith. They will also go, perhaps live in a West Bank city, say Janine or Toil Karim or El Khalil, and they will be faced with the same faith. Three generations on. That city will be destroyed again.

decimated again. And guess what? I hear you. It is happening in the West Bank. 50,000 people have been displaced from Janine and Tohker. It's happening. And I think it's just in Gaza.

You're discussing with me, Hamas. No, no. No, no. Hamas is not in the West Bank. I know. Trump's literally ignited a ferocious firestorm of debate with this Gaza Riviera plan.

As with so many things that Trump does, the immediate response I would have is, well, what does he was? really want here. And I suspect what he really wants is for the leaders of Arab countries in the Middle East to step up and come up with a workable plan that actually gets things sorted because Trump's right. Nothing else has worked. Yeah. Trump is not right about one thing here. His plan is obviously assonine. We all can acknowledge that. It has no chance of success. It's ridiculous. But more importantly, why is he doing it? Can we be honest?

I know in mainstream media and cable news, you can't say this? Can we say this here? It's obviously because of his donors, right? I mean, Miriam Adelson gave him, that Adelson family over three elections gave him $337 million. Heretz reported that she wanted portions of the West Bank and Gaza Strip annexed. So why is Trump saying we're going to own it? He's trying to trick MAGA into thinking after we let the Israelis slaughter more Palestinians as they try to push 2 million people out of their homes and their homeland. And after we finance that slaughter, which we're definitely going to finance, because Trump, and to be fair to Trump, almost all the Democrats,

all Washington is owned by Israel. Netanyahu dog-walked Trump around the park, made him look like a waiter as he was putting his chair in. So we're going to pay for all that slaughter. And then Trump goes, oh, don't worry, because we're going to own it later. We're not going to own anything. You think Israel's going to give it back to us? No, they're going to steal that land.

This was never about self-defense. We were right all along. It was always about the theft of Palestinian land. We told you so. All right. Back to you. Your response. I think that there's a really important point to be made here,

which is that no Palestinians have been allowed to flee this war zone. Because, of course, Israel was not going to let in civilians from Gaza who may have Hamas members hiding amongst them. But also, Egypt did not allow almost a single Palestinian to exit the Gaza Strip. Trump has been very clear that what he imagines here, rightly or wrongly, is the voluntary resettlement of Palestinians who wish to leave Gaza. Now, I know a lot of Palestinians who would rather live in the rubble than leave their homeland, and I respect that. But 40% of Gazans before this war were either employed by Hamas, by the public sector, or by UNRWA, or by jobs in Israel. None of those streams of revenue are going to exist now. And so the question I think we need to be asking is this.

Does the international community owe it to the people of Gaza to, to be. continue subsidizing their living in Gaza under Hamas rule, because that is essentially what has been happening until now. Now, of course, I do not support any sort of forceful removal of anybody from their homeland. But I don't think that's what Trump is imagining. It was very clear from the press conference that there's going to be this meeting in Riyadh between the Saudis, between the Jordanians, and between the Egyptians, all of whom have done nothing to to help the Palestinians forever. And so I think this question becomes,

who owes who, what? And that's really what Trump is trying to introduce here is a new path forward. I'm tired of him. Israel first. Israel first. Give them $300 billion. Pay for their genocides.

Get out of there. America first and let these poor people, Palestinians go. The number one problem is Israel. And their infinite greed for land, land, land and slaughter. So just to be clear, everybody knows that. Just to be clear, Chang, because you're going a bit further.

than you had before. Just to be clear, you think October the 7th was an inevitable consequence of the way the Palestinian people have been treated. Guys, I hate October 7th. When Hamas does violence,

they do so much damage to the Palestinians and the Muslims. But two things can be true at the same time. You could have something awful and then you could use your brain to figure out, hey, why did that happen? And does anyone think

that any American wouldn't fight back If they were occupied and humiliated and their land stolen and their families bullied and harassed and humiliated for 57 straight years, of course we would fight back. Of course, any set of human beings would fight back. But when Israel oppresses them and uses their might of their giant military to crush them, that's not terrorism. But if Palestinians fight back, terrorist.

It's absurd. It's propaganda. It's both terrorism. Okay. So, yes, the Hamas doing terrorism is despicable. and when Israel does 60 times the terrorism of Hamas, we should call them what they are, a terrorist state, and we should stop funding them. Don't send our taxpayer money to go fund terrorist government of Israel.

All right, Bati, your response. I just want to talk about this idea of Israel owning the United States government because it seems to me that people who make that argument want to have it both ways. On the one hand, we give Israel exorbitant amounts of money, and on the other hand, somehow they, control us through the money that we give them. And it's never been clear to me, like, what do they use for that control? So people will say APEC, but APEC spends about $3 million on local races in America,

on congressional races. It's not a lot of money. Number one donor in this campaign cycle. The power that the Israel lobby actually has among the American people is the fact that Americans are supportive of Israel. It's like the way that the NRA was popular. when it was because Americans like their guns. These lobbyists are, they are powerful to the extent

that they reflect views that the American people already have. And I think that's a really important point to point out here because you cannot take an unpopular view and just use money in order to push it. And nothing has proven that like this last election cycle. That's what the drug companies do. Take Nikki Haley. Nikki Haley outspent

Donald Trump two to one. Kamala Harris outspent Donald Trump two to one. Money in politics has been revealed to be nothing compared to the will of the American people. This is an amazing thing. I mean, I was as a lefty, I was really against Citizens United. And it turns out actually, the American electorate has a very clear idea of what it wants. If you look at Donald Trump's cabinet, every single person in that cabinet, which is, by the way, the most diverse ideological cabinet in American history. No, it's not. They all have a very similar view of what it means to be America First.

There's only one thing that they all share, and they all seem to think that having a pro-Israel point of view is very much inherent in the America First ideology because Israel is a good ally. Israel brings a lot to the table. We get a lot more bang for our buck. In fact, I think Israel should stop taking aid from the United States because I think Israel has paid a much higher price for that aid in terms of its sovereignty. It has been bad for Israel to take all this money because it means that the Americans can tell them what to do. And they shouldn't accept that. They should be sovereign nations. I'll just make one more quick point.

Sovereignty is not something you can give somebody. It's not a gift you can give to another nation. I feel for the Palestinian people. But the idea that somehow Israel, which wanted sovereignty through winning wars owes them something in the form of a sovereign state. This is just ridiculous. This doesn't actually make any sense. Shank, you said who should rebuild Gaza? You said the Arab nations should rebuild Gaza

in exchange for the two-state solution. But what Trump is about to do is get a deal in which they rebuild Gaza without actually having to have a two-state solution. So he's actually sort of a little bit ahead of the game in the way that he often turns out to be. Okay, let me bring in... No.

Do you know how often? unrealistic. That is, you think Saturday Arabia is going to pay for Israel to occupy Gaza? Nobody's going to pay. No, I don't think Israel wants to occupy Gaza at all. They're not that biggest sucker. If Israel wanted to occupy Gaza, it would be occupying Gaza right now. It clearly doesn't want to be occupying Gaza. Yeah, none of them will do that. Why, Shank, according to you, why is Israel not currently occupying Gaza if they want it so badly? Because they're waiting for America to give them permission. They were waiting for this election. That's why they supported Trump. So Kamala Harris and Joe Biden were terrible on this issue. They gave Israel everything they

wanted. But Netanyahu made a deal with Trump and that became obvious to me that the reason for that was just Trump was going to give them even more, which is just to let them grab this land in Gaza, which is going to cause a massive conflict. And guess who's going to pay for it? We're all going to pay for it. Okay. Let me bring in... Come on, you know the donors control things. The drug companies are deeply unpopular and they win every time in Congress. All right. Let me bring in... our Congress and so does Israel. Pierce Morgan Unscensored is proudly independent.

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