Piers Morgan Uncensored - ‘PROVEN It’s Mossad!’ Trump Says Release FULL Epstein Files

Episode Date: November 17, 2025

Lawmakers could vote as soon as tomorrow on a bill to release the Epstein Files in full - and it now seems certain that it will pass. President Trump has given Republicans the green light to vote for full disclosure, announcing on Truth Social last night that “we have nothing to hide.”So, what changed? Firstly, Democrats have been selectively drip-feeding Epstein’s emails to the media with their own spin. Secondly, it’s becoming increasingly clear that the Epstein Files are a bipartisan outrage. And there’s not been any serious accusations of wrongdoing about the President. If Trump has nothing to hide and has always known that, it’s not unreasonable to ask why this ever became such a mess - as it won’t be going away until we know everything. Joining Piers Morgan to discuss this is The Young Turks’ Cenk Uygur, ‘No Lie’ host Brian Tyler Cohen, Brandon ‘Officer’ Tatum, Daily Wire’s Michael Knowles and former White House press secretary and host of ‘The Rest is Politics US’, Anthony Scaramucci. Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent and supported by: Angel Studios: Uncover the truth behind COVID-19 in Thank You, Dr. Fauci—stream now and join the Angel Guild at https://Angel.com/PIERS. Dupe: Go to https://Dupe.com/PIERS today and find similar products for less. It’s 100% free to use. Stop wasting money on brand names and start saving with https://Dupe.com/PIERS today. Cozy Earth: Luxury shouldn't be out of reach. Go to https://cozyearth.com/PIERS for up to 40% off Cozy Earth’s best-selling temperature-regulating sheets, apparel, and more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Obviously there's the infamous Bubba email, whatever that means. I don't know why people aren't talking about that more. If Donald Trump had blown some guy and they had an email, they would at least leak that email. We know a lot about Bill Clinton's sex life. Do you really think large, blonde man, that's Bubba's type? I don't think so. Somebody else is running our government. Who ran this horrible scheme?

There's no question Epstein was working with Israel. The optics, the gold, the opulence that he surrounds himself in, puts on full display that this guy does not give a flying fuck about the people that he pandered to on the campaign trail, and his priority is solely himself. He's not worried about three months from now or two months from now. He's worried about next week. I think that's the move

until they can come up with another distraction, perhaps killing more people off of the coast of Venezuela. You know, Marjorie Taylor Green has changed her position on so many different things. She just apologized on CNN and says she's sorry for contributing to the rhetoric. That is insane to me. This is why he called her a traitor.

This is why people think that she should. change. This has come down to Israel. Lawmakers could vote as soon as tomorrow on a bill to release the Epstein files in full, and it now seems certain that it will pass. President Trump has given Republicans the green light to vote for full disclosure, announcing on truth social last night that quotes, we have nothing to hide. Only last week, he summoned Lauren Boba to the Situation Room, no less, in a frantic push

to persuade Republicans to vote no. So what's changed? Well, first, Democrats have been selectively drip-feeding Epstein's emails to the media with their own spin. Second, it's becoming increasingly clear that the Epstein files are a bipartisan outrage. Everyone from Michael Wolfe to Larry Summers, Peter Thiel, and even Noam Chomsky, remained in contact with Epstein after his first conviction. One Democrat lawmaker even appeared to be coached through a congressional impeachment hearing by the pedophile, as illustrated by the Washington Post.

Attorney Klein Privilege, yes, I will turn it over. You, as my friend, Mr. Meadows, pointed out, misled this committee even today in a written submission that contradicted your testimony. You have suggested you are going to review that. Did you review, are you going to review it in our next break to correct the record? Yes or no? Yes. Question, you helped out the president's campaign or were involved in the campaign as a representative, as a spokesman, even in your words today. It was your idea for the campaign dating back to 2011. Is that accurate? Yes or no? Yes.

Mr. Weisenberg and other individuals, Ms. Rona, who are those individuals? Are they with the Trump Organization? They are. There are other people that we, should be meeting with. So Alan Weisselberg is the chief financial officer. Uh-huh. You got to quickly give us as many names as you can so we can get to them. Yes, ma'am. As Ms. Rona, what is Ms. Rona's Rana's, Rana Graf is the Mr. Trump's executive assistant. And would she be able to corroborate many of the statements that you've made here? Yes, she was, her office is directly next to his, and she's involved in a lot that went on. Well, one thing missing from the files, and the testimony of the many people involved

is any serious accusations of wrongdoing against the president. Many are now highlighting this vintage Trump interview from 2015 in which he torches the former Prince Andrew and says Epstein could be a political problem for the Clintons. You raised the question of Jeffrey Epstein in your remarks in the Q&A with John. Well, I think he's got a problem. What do you think the problem will be? I don't know, but that island was really a cesspool.

There's no question about it. Just ask Prince Andrew. He'll tell you about it. The island was an absolute cesspool. pool. So, and he's been there for many times. Well, I can't say friends, but I know. You're friendly. You know them. They play at my clubs a lot. I have clubs and everybody likes to play at my clubs. Are you saying there's a political problem for her if she runs the president? It could be a political problem. Look, he could be a political problem. Right now he's Teflon and right now maybe not, but he could end up

being a political problem. Well, if Trump has nothing to hide and has always known that, it's not unreasonable to ask why this ever became such a mess. It may simply be the lot of people, including some of his friends and donors are about to be declared guilty by association. It's very likely that there's no listed VIP clients and no paper trail to Tel Aviv, which means some people will simply never believe they've got the full story anyway. But one thing is very clear, as it has been all along, this won't be going away until we know absolutely everything. Well, to debate, I'm joined by Star Study panel, Czech Yuga, the founder, CEO of the Young Turks, Brian Tyler Cohen, the host of No Lie, Bandae, Battam Tatum, better known as the Officer Tatum, and Michael Knowles host of the Michael

Noe Show on Daily Wire. Plus, Anthony Scaramucci will join us shortly. Okay, Cheng, let me start with you. Donald Trump has flipped around on the Epstein files and their important significance and need to be fully transparent about them for the last few months. I'm trying to scratch my head and work out exactly why, not least because when I interviewed David Boyce recently,

who was the attorney for Virginia Dufray and a number of other victims, and also one of the most eminent criminal lawyers in American modern history, he was crystal clear to me that from everything he's seen in the files, there is no suggestion of any criminal culpability for Trump himself.

So what is going on here? Yeah, so first of all, obviously there was things that were embarrassing there for Donald Trump. And, you know, in your intro, you talked about how there isn't anything that says that Donald Trump actually did something illegal. That's true. And that means we, it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

It just means that we haven't seen the files yet, right? But if you, if it turns out we see the files and we're sure that it's the file, the complete files and it turns out Trump didn't do anything illegal, I wouldn't be overly shocked. This isn't about Trump. I know for the partisans, they think, oh, this is about Trump or Clinton or whoever, right? No, we just want to know who's running our country. So, and my guess is that Trump was hiding it both out of personal embarrassment, and let's get real. I mean, in the email so far already, we see, you know, Epstein saying that he's with Jufri in my house.

In 2011, when Trump claims that he broke off his relationship with Epstein in 2003, obviously there's the infamous Baba email, whatever that means. I don't know why people aren't talking about that more. So, and you've got a lot of really embarrassing stuff for Trump. But on top of that, this is clearly an intelligence agency, and at this point, pretty much proven that it's Mossad. Drop site news has Ehud Barak's emails, where they are conspiring Epstein and the former Prime Minister of Israel are conspiring to get America to bomb Syria and get America to bomb Iran. And Epstein is so powerful. He could set up a meeting with Vladimir Putin for Ehud Barak. He's more powerful than the former Prime Minister of Israel.

This guy was a lot bigger than we realized. look, for the partisans, they'll want to, the Democrats will want to get Trump, and the Trump loyalists will pretend that he did nothing wrong, and it was all the Democrats. But I think that's actually missing the point. The point is, somebody else is running our government. Who ran this horrible scheme to rape American girls and then use the tapes to smear or maybe hold hostage American politicians and powerful people? I mean, the answer seems to be clear. There's no question. Epstein was working with Israel. So why are we not talking about that? And of course, since Trump is a huge client of Israel, has gotten hundreds of millions of dollars from donors who favor Israel,

he's going to want to hide that as well. And why is he giving up now and saying, okay, release the files? Well, number one, he isn't. He could release the files himself right now, so he's lying. He doesn't really want to release the files. And number two, it's because he already lost the vote. So what else is he going to do? Because some portion of MAGA and a huge portion of his voters,

have rebelled and they rightly rebelled. This isn't America at first. This isn't anything that he promised before. Okay. Brandon Tatum, welcome back to Unsenzo. I saw you pulling a few faces there, suggesting you were not entirely in agreement with Schenck's assessment. So what's your response?

Well, I think it's interesting that it always got to be about Israel, which is insane to me. My assessment on the totality of circumstances is that... It's in the email. I don't think this really affects the American people. You know, most people are trying to have a good livable wage and all this of the stuff that we're talking about, housing costs, you name it, insurance, you name it.

And nobody really is thinking about this. I don't know why this is such a major deal. If Trump was implicated whatsoever in any of these files, I think we all agree that the Democrats would have at least hinted to it when he was running for office, so he'll never get in office again. And for someone to think that it's got to be about Israel, then you have to say that both sides are covering for Israel. And I don't think so. I don't think that the Democrats were as in love with Israel as Chank is claiming that Donald Trump is. I don't believe so.

You know, the CIA could be just as involved in this as you claim Assad is. So we don't know. We don't have any evidence to even project this, to be honest. So I would say this, like everybody on this panel, they need to release the information so we can have clarity. But for this to be an ongoing thing, and everybody's just so hyper-focused on this,

this is the determination of whether you like Trump or not. that's asinine to me. Angel Studios are back with a new must-see documentary. It's called Thank You, Dr. Fauci, and you're going to hear a lot more about it over the next few months, award-winning filmmaker. Jenna First digs into the origins

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that I would take issue with, is your... sense that people don't care. This is potentially one of the biggest pedophile scandals in modern American history, and it involves a man who's extremely mysterious, even to this day, seem to have amassed an enormous personal wealth buying one of the biggest homes in Manhattan. No one's quite sure how he got that money. He seems to, I mean, there's a fascinating bit of information on the semaphore site today, Ben Smith's site, in which he talks about something that's on the files that's available now, which is Michael Wolfe had written a 4,000-word piece about Epstein, which he sent to Epstein to try and, as he puts it, induce him to get other friends

to talk to Wolf. And people can have their view about the ethics of that, but this has been Wolf's playbook with a lot of people over the years. But if you read it, the sheer volume, and this is after the conviction that Epstein had for being a pedophile, the sheer volume of rich, famous, powerful people pouring in and out of this Manhattan home is unbelievable. And there are potentially 2,000

girls and young women, many of the girls underage who have been abused here. So I do think it really matters. Let me clarify that if it came across us to me saying, nobody cares. I don't think it's that nobody cares. I think when you talk about the priorities

of the President of the United States and priorities of our country, I'm saying is not as significant. There were a lot of victims, and I think they need to get justice, and how we haven't gotten justice for them this far is insane to me. We should release all the files. But what I'm saying is that the majority of the priority of this country, and the reason why I think that the president isn't as focused on this,

and it's not necessarily just because it's nefarious, it's because there's a lot more things going on in our country that the majority of Americans are filling every day in their pocketbook and all of the above. So that's all I'm saying. I don't want to be insensitive to people who are victimized. by this criminal and evil person who's now dead. So I wanted to make sure that is clear. Okay.

Brian, you know, it's a fast-moving scandal. The former Prince Andrew was sort of hanging on right to the point that there were new leaked emails contradicting his previous statements about how long he'd known Epstein and so on. You know, as Chech pointed out, if what Epstein says in these emails that came out about Trump in the last few days,

is right, then it appears that Donald Trump may have continued his friendship with Epstein passed when he said he did before. So these emails, the sort of the leak, leak, leak emails have been pretty devastating in terms of apparent evidence contradicting a lot of public statements by a lot of very famous people. But ultimately, to me, what really matters is whether any of this activity was criminal. And I am mindful, again, of what David Boyes said to me. which is you'd see nothing criminal against Trump,

but he had seen stuff against at least six and maybe as many as a dozen high-profile men, which he thought warranted criminal prosecution. So this has a long way to go. If this dump comes with all the files released, we could see a flurry of prosecutions against some very famous people. Look, even if Trump didn't do anything illegal,

the reality is that he is the one secreting all of these files, in effect, protecting all of these people who may very well have done something illegal. And that's just as bad in my book, whether you are the one committing these crimes or whether you're the one protecting these people who are committing these crimes. And the reality is that Donald Trump had the ability via Pambandi, because as we all know, she is an appendage of him, to be able to release these files months ago. And in fact, this wouldn't have been surprising considering this administration is filled

with people who stake their entire identities, who predicate their entire brands on this idea that they were gonna release the Epstein files on day one. So it's no surprise when you staff your administration with Dan Bongino and Cash Patel and Pam Bondi and Alina Haba, all of these people who had been beating this drum about releasing these Epstein files, suddenly they hide them.

So if somebody did do something illegal and you have somebody who's protecting those people, in my book, that is just as bad. And I want to clarify a point that I heard previously on this panel, this idea that if there was something bad, something bad in the Epstein files that the Biden administration would have just released it. First of all, the Galane Maxwell prosecution was going until 2022, and then her appeal was going until 2025.

And in a world prior to this one, where the DOJ is completely politicized and weaponized, they're not going to release information on ongoing prosecutions. But that notwithstanding, look, I do believe that this stuff should have been released. And that falls squarely in the lap of one person, and that's Merrick Garland. if you're looking for somebody to defend Merrick Garland and his judicious nature and his overly cautious nature is not going to be me. And frankly, I don't think it's going to be anyone because this guy was focused not on achieving justice without fear of favor. This guy was focused on preventing the optics of politicization. This was as weak and meek an attorney general as I think we've

ever had. So I also think that Merrick Garland should have released this stuff sooner. But look, in a previous world where the separation of church and state between the White House and the DOJ actually mattered, the same world that Republicans used to occupy when they clutch their pearls about Bill Clinton and Loretta Lynch, there wouldn't be a world where Joe Biden can mandate that Merrick Garland released these files. But, you know, we obviously don't live in that world anymore. Okay, Michael Knowles, if I was advising Donald Trump here, I would just say, you know what, you should just get ahead of all this. Order all the files to be released, unredacted,

just get it all out there because it's all going to come out now. However it happens, it's all going to come out. Yes, there's a process now where the House will vote on it. It's likely to vote in favor of releasing. It goes to the Senate. There'll be enormous pressure on the Senate to authorize the release. And then there may be some stuff that's held back

because they'll say, well, we're investigating. But ultimately, I don't think the American, and public are now going to be appeased until they know that every spit and cough and dotted eye is out there. What do you think? This is what it really comes down to, peers. You know, there have been lots of interesting things said on this panel. I'm very curious as to what the Epstein infrastructure represented. There have been many suggestions over the years, reportedly from Alex Acosta, the former U.S. attorney who was Trump's labor nominee when he apparently suggested that Epstein would belong to intelligence, the potential connections to Israel,

the connection to the UK, obviously, with Prince Andrew, whatever. You know, obviously, it's extremely interesting. I'd like to know more about it. We probably never will know much more about it, but I'm interested in it. Obviously, we want justice for the victims. Obviously, we want bad guys to be held to account. All of that is true. But it's simpler. The reason that President Trump initially in 2015 called for scrutiny into Epstein is because he doesn't have anything serious to hide. Yes, I'm sure he turns up in the files. Yes, I'm sure there's some embarrassing stuff in there, but he's got nothing serious to hide. I've got that from pretty highly placed liberal sources, too, as you've mentioned, as well, Pierce. Then the reason he flipped

on it is because he realized rightly that focusing on the Epstein files doesn't really get him anything politically. It's just kind of a distraction from the topics he wants to be talking about, which are crime in Democrat cities and immigration and the economy or whatever else. So I think it was a basic political calculation to say, if we're talking about Epstein, it doesn't really help us. Now, for that very same reason, I think the White House just miscalculated. They thought that not talking about Epstein was going to make the issue go away so they could focus on more important things. Well, actually, it just put even more focus on the Epstein files. So now Trump comes out, he says, all right, whatever, I'm going to lose this vote. The party's in rebellion. Okay, fine, release the files. But I think

it's much more practical than what everyone's suggesting. Well, the only thing I would say about your timeline, I'm not saying you're wrong, but all, If you go back in the last few months, certainly the first months of a year when he got late in, there was this enormous push by his people to say, we're going to release all the files. We're going to be totally transparent. They came on this show, and we're giving it the full.

We're going to get it all out there, blah, blah, blah. And then a weird series of events happened. Elon Musk falls out with Donald Trump and suddenly tweets out of Noah, or posts out of Noah on his ex-platform. In the breaking news, Trump's in the Epstein files. that's why he doesn't want to release them, enjoy your night, Donalds, something like that.

And within a few days, the whole investigation was shut down, the whole idea of releasing them was shut down, and I remember looking at all that, thinking, that is very odd. What is going on here? What is Elon Mast seen or heard? And the fact he set off this bonfire

with this one post, which he then deleted later, but he triggered a series of events at the White House that was a screeching new turn. on their previous attitude and tone towards these files. You know, you don't have to be a conspiracy theorist, Michael, to think it's all a bit weird. Holiday season is here, and I'm probably not alone,

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Go to dupe.com slash peers. It is all a bit weird, of course, but I think that actually kind of proves the more basic political point, which is that releasing the Epstein files was a very good line during the campaign, and I think people cared about it. Don't forget, it was the conservatives back in 2014, 2015, who were calling attention to Epstein. That was initially considered a Democrat scandal. But then, as you see even just from Elon's tweet, the very fact that Trump appears in the files, because he's known Epstein for a very long time, the very fact of that became a major distraction.

It was politically damaging to the White House. And then you just got to think at a basic political calculation, what's the best that comes out of releasing the files? Is it a real knockdown for the Democrats? Is there really going to be justice? Some of what's in the files is actually going to be retracted. Like you saw Virginia Jufrey retract an accusation against Alan Dershowitz and come out and say, say that she never saw Trump do anything improper. So it's this muddy, weird, ugly event, even the real stuff with Epstein, the potential connections to intelligence or whatever. It's

just so, I don't know, murky and obscure. I don't think there's a major political win. And now I think there pretty clearly is. Jay? Yeah, no, this is way simpler. There's nothing murky about this at all. There's two factors here. One is Donald Trump's embarrassment, whether he did something criminal or not. And on that, let's stay there for a second. We're all ignoring the elephant in the room. There's an email that says that Donald Trump blew Bubba. Now, some people think Bubba's Bill Clinton. Some people think it's a horse.

Some people think whatever. Now, I didn't write the email. In fact, when I first saw it online, I didn't even believe it. Well, let me tell me. Do you believe it now? Hang on, hang on. Just to explain to viewers, you might be at the moment shouting at their screen thinking, what? So this is a message reported is

originally from Mark Epstein, Jeffrey Epstein's brother. He is the one who sends this to Jeffrey Epstein. He has since publicly denied that it was referring to Bill Clinton, but has offered no clarification as to who it was referring to. Clinton, of course, had that nickname amongst others. I mean, it could just be a joke between brothers. It could just be a slur. Or it could be something else, I guess.

I have a question, peers. What, sir? I have a question for, Chang. Chank, do you really believe, forget about Trump for a second, do you think that Trump is Bill Clinton's type? Everything, we know a lot about Bill Clinton's sex life. Do you really think large, blonde man, that's Bubba's type? I don't think so.

Yeah. So, guys, this is a classic distraction. That's funny, but I don't know Bubba's Bill Clinton. I don't care if it's Bill Clinton. I'd be surprised if it was Bill Clinton. and I don't know that he actually blew a guy. I don't know. But Mark Epstein denied that it was Bill Clinton,

but didn't deny that Donald Trump actually gave a blowjob. So it's not me. And if you say, hey, look, it's Pepsi's brother. I don't trust them. But hold on, hold on, hold on. Let me finish the thought. Hold on. No, no, no, no, no.

And then Epstein, Jeffrey Epstein, says, well, the Russians would love to get their hands on that picture or something along those lines. So, wait, is that a joke? That doesn't sound like a joke. So, look, I'm not saying he definitely did it, but is it possible if Donald Trump was embarrassed that that would come out? Of course! Okay, but that's only half the equation is, and the less important half of the equation.

The main reason why it never came out, both under Trump and under Democratic administrations, is because it obviously involves intelligence agencies. This is not complicated, and Officer Tatum says, oh, okay, it might be the CIA. I agree. Maybe it's the CIA and Mossad working together. But there's no question. You could look at the four-part series on DropSight News. The former Prime Minister of Israel's emails have been released, and Epstein and him constantly are coordinating about how to push America into a war.

And they're talking about only the benefit of Israel. They never talk about the benefit of America. And Epstein is using almost all of his power to help Israel. That's now an established fact, and that's way more important than Bubba, right? And yet that's another giant elephant in the room, and mainstream media is like, oh, no, no, it involves Israel, so we can't talk about it. Well, that explains everything. That explains why both parties have been covering this up,

because it involves potentially our government or a beloved special allies government. Officer Tatum, look, I don't know the answer to this. But I would say, having read a lot about Jeffrey Epstein now and the circles he mixed in, and the circles he brought to his home and to his island, when you put it all together, it is actually. absolutely not beyond the realms of fantasy. In fact, I would say it heads more to a high likelihood that he was up to his neck and knit with intelligence agencies of some kind,

maybe myriad intelligence agencies. It would absolutely go with his persona and the type of people he was getting around his table on a sort of almost daily basis. So I certainly wouldn't want to bet the bank on him having no attachment to Mossad or CIA or anybody else. Yeah, I wouldn't I wouldn't say that either I have no idea what exactly is involved in this

And nobody does I mean it's a very complicated situation Nobody understands the totality of this Because he was arrested under Donald Trump's first term If I'm not mistaken They had the information there It was we had the White House and everything We could have divulged whatever needs to be divulged

And people are going to argue if they don't get the results they want That they was deleted it was somehow Some nefarious thing that went on Then the Clinton said I mean and then Joe Biden had it forever, you know, and they did nothing. They didn't even mention anything in propriety, any impropriety about Donald Trump. You would think if Donald Trump had blown some guy and they had an email, they would at least leak that email.

They wouldn't say, they wouldn't mention nothing else. They would leak an email by Donald Trump, at least before the election to make him look bad so he'll never get in the office and they can continue to cover this up forever in perpetuity. You know why I think they didn't. Unless Israel ordered them not to. Well, well, I don't know. Hang on, hang on, hang on, hang on. It might be simple than that.

It's crazy to me. It might be simpler than that. My gut feeling... I mean, Biden listened to every single thing Israel said. Hang on. Hang on. My gut feeling about this, Officer Tate is there's the reason actually in the end, neither side has felt compelled to release all these files is I suspect when we see them all, that both sides have a lot of blood.

on their hands, not literally, but in terms of embarrassing revelation, perhaps evidence of alleged criminality and so on. I suspect you'll see this is a proper bipartisan scandal. I only based that on the type of guests that Epstein was having all the time. They were from every part of American high society, Democrat, Republican, you name it. They were trotting down there. So from what I'm gathering, from people who've seen these files, there's a lot of embarrassment to be had for both parties.

which may explain why both parties have been reluctant to put it all out into the public domain. Yeah, I agree with you. I agree with you on that to a certain degree because it does appear to be that way. You know, there's people that have mentioned, obviously, on television and the like, that there are people that may be implicated

that probably did not commit a crime. They have just been accused of committing the crime from victims with no evidence. And so I think there's a risk in that that they don't want to expose people that have not been able to go through justice. But I would argue, as crooked as the Democrats were, you would think that they would float and release things to make sure that Donald Trump would get in an office, and therefore,

they can have the White House again, and no one would ever know that. I do agree with that. I have to say, I have to say, I do agree with that. Brian, just to bring you in here, I mean, you know, they tried to jail him for just about everything. People tried to kill Donald Trump several times in that campaign. The idea that the Democrats with these files in their possession would not have traw them at some stage

for stuff which could be damaging to Trump, if not disqualifying, I think it's for the birds. They must have done. And if they didn't, they're even more useless and incompetent than the polls currently suggest. Well, first of all, let's not conflate they with the Democrats in terms of who tried to assassinate Donald Trump. I didn't say that.

I was very careful. I was very careful. I said they tried to... I heard the hedging language, but I just want to state as well. I'll be Christopher. clear. They, i.e., the left, tried to jail him for absolutely everything. That's uncontestable. And I said, and there were attempts to take his life several times. And they justified the assassination. Right. I'm not pinning that on Democrats, but I'm saying that there was a lot going on in that year

to stop Donald Trump becoming president again, either through imprisonment or through killing him. And the idea that no one on the left in possession of these files would not have trawled them for damaging information, I think, is stretching credulity, isn't it? Unsensit is proudly sponsored by Cozy Earth, which like me delivers next level quality and comfort. If I wasn't hosting this show today, I'd be wearing a pair of their bamboo joggers. Why? Well, they're buttery soft.

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peers, P-I-E-R-S for up to 40% off joggers, pants, shirts, everything. And remember to tell them that I sent you. Cozy Earth built for real life. Again, the files were in the possession of one person, just like they're in the possession of Pam Bonnie right now, who will, of course, bent at the every whim of Donald Trump, they were in the possession of Merrick Garland.

This is a guy who wouldn't even investigate Donald Trump for his efforts to overturn the 2020 election. This is somebody whose entire, entire ethos, his entire raison d'etre in government was just to prevent the optics of politicization. Am I surprised that Merrick Garland didn't leak any of this information in the files? Absolutely not. Again, this guy didn't do, this guy's sole focus was to not do anything political or politicized. So if you're asking why this wasn't leaked, do I think it should have been the

Absolutely. Do I care whether anyone from Larry Summers or Bill Clinton all the way to Donald Trump is implicated in these files? Am I looking to protect any of these people? Absolutely not. I think all of this should have been released. And by the way, so did the people that staffed this very administration, Dan Bongino, Cash Patel, the fact that they now are so silent, the fact that they're perpetuating the same cover-up that they once condemned. I don't disagree. I don't disagree. I don't. I think you're making very... I think you make a perfectly valid point about the hypocrisy on both sides. Michael, you want to respond to that. Yeah, hold on. Brian's whitewashing garland a little bit too much here. He's complimenting him by pretending to insult him. So he's saying, well, you know, the real problem with Merrick Garland. Well, you are, because you're saying the real problem with Merrick Garland is he didn't want to get into the fray of politics. He was so clean. He wanted to remain so above it all. This is the guy who lied about the Biden-D-O-J spying on Catholic parishes, going in, you know, so much perfority, so much deception. And I don't know, he was a complete political hack.

And I think what's important to this conversation is, I don't think it was Merrick Garland's pristine moral standards that prevented him from releasing this. I think that probably, if you think, and one second, one second, Brian, I think Pierce is probably right that if the Democrats don't want to release the files, it's because the files don't look good for them either. If you think Merrick Garland was a political hack, Do you think Pam Bondi is a political hack, Michael?

I think Pam Bondi is doing a very good job as Attorney General. Well, there you go. This woman has engaged in every political prosecution. Donald Trump literally sends his little edicts out into the ether on Truth Social. He posted what was supposed to be a DM to Pam telling her what to do. And the second she read it, she snapped too. I don't think Pam Bondi is lying about. doing a very good job, but that Merrick Garland is a political hack. I wish Merrick Garland was more of a

I'll explain to you the distinction. But the notion that Pam Bondi is just some like figure, is some political figure is a joke. No, here's the distinction. You're saying Pam Bondi has an allegiance to President Trump or she's a conservative or something. Yeah, obviously, of course, she's the attorney general under Republican administration. I guess the difference is I don't think Pam Bondi is lying about the FBI going in and spying on the political enemies of the party in power. Was Pam Bondi lying when she said the father's right? much more of a hack and that they were going to be released. Listen, I've got to bring that...

Was Pam Bondi lying when she said the files were going to be released on her desk? Yeah, I think she was. I'm afraid... I'm afraid... Let me jump in there. I think that what she didn't... What she didn't say that day was ludicrous and is actually one of the reasons why the whole thing spiraled out of control.

Because if you take a camel to the edge of an oasis and don't actually give it a drink, they get angry. A whole fire panel. I'm going to bring in Anthony Scaramucci. White House Press Secretary, host of the rest of politics, U.S. Anthony, great to have you back on Uncensored. How are you? It's nice to be on.

I see a lot of my friends there. Hello, Michael. There's a pretty partisan comment there, Michael. Hello, Brian. Thank. Anthony. I mean, Michael, I love you. You think Pam Bondi is nonpartisan, but Merrick Garland was.

I mean, come on, man. That is such a stretch, my brother. Like Garland. Okay, all right. I'm just saying, you mean, you know, well, let's, let's, let's, let's, let's, Let's get the bubble back on the level, okay? Like when we're leveling the frame the picture, we've got to have the bubble in the middle.

No, she's a partisan, and she's part of the good party. So I agree. Pam Bondi is a Trump family law firm member that happens to also be the Attorney General of the United States. So, I mean, they just got to be honest about it. But go ahead, Pierce. It's your show. It's great to be back on.

It's great to, yeah. I don't want you suddenly commandeering my entire show here, I apologize for that. I just had to call Michael out because I know Michael a long time. I know Michael's moves. I know Michael's moves. Well, let's get back to your moves. This whole Epstein scandal,

it seems to me it's been an ongoing act of self-harm by the Trump administration to take all the media to a place where they were just expecting to be given all the files and be boasting about how transparent you're going to be, finally gets the bottom of all this, and then just to put the drawbridge up and say, nope,

It's all over, no files, no investigation, nothing. And now to be sort of bullied into going along with its release and so on. It's all been handled very badly. And what's been fascinating, I think, to watch on the outside is the way that a lot of the pressure on Trump has not just come from Democrats, but has actually come from within the MAGA base, who were enraged about this and wanted these files released and have been completely incredulous as to why suddenly they weren't being.

I mean, there's a lot there. I guess, I guess, you know, what I said last week in our podcast, his move is to say he wants full disclosure because that gives him coverage with his base. You know, his base believes in him no matter what. And no matter what comes out of the disclosed files, Trump will have a defense that his base would believe. And so I was very surprised that he went in the direction that you're describing. And, of course, on Sunday night, he went in the direction that I thought was the more accurate, offensive. direction for the president because that that's really his only move. I mean, he would have been, he would have lost and he would have showed a fissure in the MAGA

base by that House vote going against them. So, you know, but I will say this, and people could disagree with me on here that really like the president. He looks tired. He looks distracted. And he's obviously worried about something because you don't make the moves that he made, the ones that you're describing, if he's not wearing. about something, but he's going to get forced into this now.

And I believe that they'll go back to Pam Bondi and say that there's an ongoing investigation, a result of which none of this stuff can be divulged at this moment. So I think that's the next move from him is, I want the vote, make it unanimous. But oh, by the way, there's an ongoing investigation, so you'll never see the light of day the documents. But I don't think, Anthony, that's going to fly. I just do not think that will fly either outside of his party or within. in his party. You know, you're seeing a really fascinating schism erupting now in the conservative right in America. A lot of it goes back to Israel. But I also think the Epstein files have been

a major part of this. You know, you've just seen people siding up on either side of this. And I think that a lot of the MAGA base, the real diehard Trumpers, they want this stuff out there. Well, let me just push back for a second for years. I know you have a lot of other people we need to talk to on the show. but I just want to say this because I know him very well. I think that's the move until they can come up with another distraction, perhaps killing more people off of the coast of Venezuela, invading Venezuela, something to do with Ukraine.

He will find a distraction. Remember, Trump is always characterized by incrementalism, and so he's not worried about three months from now or two months from now. He's worried about next week. And so you would be right if he doesn't come up with more, more smoke screens, and I would just tell you that he has a PhD in smoke screening. So I predict he'll find something to distract people from this over the ensuing months. All right, Michael, just bringing you back on that point.

That could well be the case. But I really do think if all they do is kick this can down the road, it's going to get a bigger problem for the Trump administration. I totally agree. And I almost agree with my friend Mr. Scaramucci over there. I think he's just getting it backwards. I think that the entire calculation here was that the Epstein files are a major distraction. And so what has come to be the case, I think indisputably, is that not releasing the files was a distraction.

There are going to be files, however, that will not come out. And even if they did release all the files, there will always be people saying, well, there were more emails. There were files that were destroyed. Of course, that's the case. the Epstein's scandal is really, really bizarre. And so I kind of think of it like the JFK files. You know, in 1992, we were supposed to get those JFK files, and the government just like doesn't release him all.

So either Epstein is who the elites say that he is, which is a weird, rich sex freak, but no connections to any political questions, or he was the super duper triple spy for every government agency in the world. He's James Bond and Jason Bourne, in which case we're never going to find out the full story. Either we know what we know,

you know, we know everything, or we're never going to get the whole story. And so it will serve as a distraction. There's no question about it. The only question is, how do you minimize that distraction? And I agree. I, you know, listen, I hate to say, but I think I agree with everyone here that Trump has to release the files. It helps to reunify the party a little bit. And by the way, if the Democrats win the midterms, which those elections two weeks ago seem to suggest, they're going to subpoena, they're going to have investigations ad nauseum. So better to get ahead of it and not let them put their spin on it. Yeah, that's what I think. I want to bring in the other extraordinary part of the last few weeks,

the remarkable transformation of Marjorie Taylor Green, from MAGA cheerleader and close friend of the president to the woman who's now the sworn enemy of the president, he calls her a traitor, and is now, and really underpinning this, is her conviction that the Epstein files have to be released and that the Trump administration has been blocking it. What do you make of this?

Yeah. Well, there's a connective tissue through all of this. So I'll start with Epstein and get to the split in MAGA. So guys, we keep talking about it like it isn't solved. It's solved. He was working with Israel. He had an Israeli spy and intelligence officer safe with him over and over again for weeks on end. Every email from Mahoud Barak's emails and drop site news shows that Epstein was doing everything could to help Israel. So and why, oh, Trump's uncomfortable. The Democrats are uncomfortable. But yet somehow they don't. release it. Why not? Because the one thing that both parties serve is Israel. Who can, who has

enough power to kill someone inside an American prison and have the videotape not work and the guards be off? Intelligence agencies, obviously, this is already solved. So now the connective tissue. So the reason why Trump's base is upset is because the core of the promise was America first. And now they have Trump get into office. First he says, no, I'm not serving you guys, I'm not releasing the Epstein files. Then he says, okay, nope, I'm going to bomb Iran, and I'm going to do whatever Israel wants. Israel is first. Then it goes way beyond that. Then he goes, okay, I don't care about affordability anymore. Hey, tax cuts for the rich, subsidies for oil companies, and all the things that never put Americans first, the donors first,

whether they're oil companies, pharmaceutical companies, or the Israeli lobby. So Marjorie Taylor-Green comes along and she says what Maga's been saying all along. So now what you guys have to understand is that Trump's voters, in my opinion, and I'm curious what you all think, are in three buckets, right? One is independents who listen to Rogan, Young Turks, Theo Vaughn, Tim Dillon. Those guys just hate the establishment. And they'll vote for anyone who's an actual enemy of the establishment and a populace for the American people. So those guys are already gone. I mean, you see it in the younger voters. Trump used to have an eight-point lead. Now he has a 55-point deficit.

So an independence in the younger gun. Then there's a bucket in the middle, which is true MAGA, the original MAGA, America First, and I disagree with their social issues, et cetera. But that's Marjorie Taylor Green, Tucker Carlson, Tom Massey, et cetera. And then the third bucket is Trump loyalists. The ones who say, oh, yeah, of course, everybody's eating cats and dogs, and Trump couldn't wait to release the Epstein files, and this was all a trick and a chess game and all that. Those guys are hopeless.

Trump could say anything, and they'll believe it. And in fact, the rest of the Trump voters are now looking at them, like, are you guys nuts? Like, wake up to what's going on here. The establishment is screwing us, and it turns out that Trump is part of the establishment. I don't think anyone can argue that Trump has more original pro-Maga positions than Marjorie Taylor Green. In fact, peers, I did a poll on X about this. Marjorie took an 82 to 18 lead against Trump as to the true original MAGA. And then Kat Turd and others, the Trump loyalist, comes.

in, they have tons of votes going for Trump, and then it went back and forth, back and forth all day, 66,000 votes. And at the end, Marjorie Taylor Green wins. Why? Because most of the people that watch online media now realize Trump is just another guy in the establishment, another

elite, and he's doing the same exact thing as all the other corporate Democrats and Republicans. Okay, Brandon, what do you think of that? Because I do think there's some merit to this. I mean, Marjorie Telegreen has been going out there and talking in a way I've never heard her talk before, And it's definitely resonating with people.

I say a lot of people in the MAGA movement who actually agree with her. A lot of people don't. But I don't think Trump calling her a traitor is necessarily going to work in the way he hopes. Well, I disagree on that. If you look at Marty Taylor-Green, she switched.

It's not that she continued in the MAGA way. She continued with America First conservatism. She's completely switched. She was just on television saying that Donald Trump shouldn't deport all these people at one time because it hurt the people. people who are working on her at her company. You know, Marjorie Taylor Green has changed her position on so many different things.

She just apologized on CNN and says she's sorry from contributing to the rhetoric. Marjorie Taylor Green, her whole, the reason she's popular is because she went against the grain. It's because she challenged people on a day-to-day basis. And now she's apologizing to CNN for it. She says Trump has accomplished nothing since he's been in office. He's completely turned on America. That is insane to me. You're talking about the border crisis that we experienced that have been matriculated throughout our society

in so many negative ways, Donald Trump has brought it into that. Ask the people who live on the border. Ask the people who patrol on the border. And then you go off into other aspects. I think he's trying to do his best when it comes to tariffs to bring revenue back into the America economy.

And it's not that easy. Nobody is willing to do it. So Donald Trump is willing to do the hard thing now so we can benefit later. But for Margie Taylor Green to go off the reservation to say all of these different things, this is why he called her a traitor.

This is why people think that she's changed. And I would add to this. And Shane, he laments to this all the time. This has come down to Israel. It's the fact that Marjorie Taylor Green has taken a position on Israel and everybody that loves to hate on Israel

will take her side. And Donald Trump says he's been supportive of Netanyahu he's been supportive of things in Israel. People begin to turn on him because of that. And so it's a two-fold thing. She's turned, all her values have completely changed, which is why Trump thinks she's a traitor. And the people who hate Israel

is going to follow her. And the people who love Israel is going to follow a majority of what Donald Trump says. Brian, let me just play you the apologies she made on. It's America versus Miga. It's America First versus Israel first. Hang on, check. I want to play the clip. And it's about do we control our own government? Okay. Check, I want to control our own government.

Hang on, I want to just play. What do you think? Hang on, guys, please. I want to play the clip that you referenced, I said, Brandon. I want to play the apology that Marjorie Taylor Green May. Let's take a look at this. I would like to say humbly, I'm sorry for taking part in the toxic politics. It's very bad for our country. And it's been something I've thought about a lot, especially since Charlie Kirk was assassinated,

is that we, I'm only responsible for myself and my own words and actions. And I am committed. And I've been working on this a lot lately to put. put down the knives and politics. Now, Brian, are you buying this? I mean, it's been a remarkable kind of damascene conversion. You know, Marjorie Tilly Green, you could argue, and I'm going to interview her after I speak to you guys,

has been one of the most toxic people in the political discourse space in America in the last few years, saying some deeply inflammatory violence-inducing comments on occasion. Are you buying this dramatic U-turn? Do I think it's coming from a place of, true honesty, probably not. I think that she sees that there's some, that there, that it's politically advantageous for her to be able to say this. I think she feels burned because, you know, clearly she wanted to run for U.S. Senate in, uh, in Georgia. And instead, you know, one of the good old boys, Buddy Carter was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was,

was anointed by Donald Trump. So I think she's, uh, she's on a bit of a, a rampage here. But on, on, on the other point, I mean, look, the fact that the fact that she's resonating so much is a testament to the fact that there is a recognition, in Trump's base or on the right more broadly, that all of the things that Trump promised are not coming to fruition. This guy ran for office as some populist champion. He promised lower rent, lower housing, lower groceries,

lower eggs. He promised free IVF ending the Ukraine-Russia war on day one. He promised lower cost. Look what he's done since he's actually been in office. Cost on everything have surged because of this misguided trade war that everybody said was going to raise the cost of everything. The San Francisco Federal Reserve just came out

not done anything for IVF, not done anything for the for the for the Russia-Ukraine war. And what where is his focus? It's on building himself a $350 million ballroom. It's on encrusting the Oval Office in gold. It's on retrofitting Qatari jets at the tune of a billion dollars. It's on buying Christy-Nome, a couple of Gulfstream jets that cost $170 million. It's on hosting great Gatsby parties. It's so obvious where this guy's priorities are.

Again, he ran by by dangling these carrots in front of poor people in America. And once he actually gets power, The optics, the gold, the opulence that he surrounds himself in, puts on full display that this guy does not give a flying fuck about the people that he pandered to on the campaign trail, and his priority is solely himself. And so clearly there's going to be anger in the MAGA base. Clearly, there's going to be anger among Republicans more broadly,

because it could not be more obvious that this guy doesn't give a shit about that. Okay. Anthony, what do you make of the Marjorie Taylor-Green split here with Trump? Because it's getting a lot of attention. it kind of reflects a lot of the splits going on on the conservative right in America and on the Trump support in particular, Epstein and Israel being two of the leading components to this. What do you make of it? You know, it's what Harry Truman said. If you want a friend in Washington by a dog, her interests have now diverged from Donald Trump's.

And so she's speaking out against them, you know. And so I hear what Brian's saying, I don't necessarily say it's disingenuous or ingenious. It's just the nature of politics in the United States. And so he's a lame duck, whether people like it or not, Steve Bannon, et cetera. He's going to be going into those midterm elections weakened. There's a political mortality about Donald Trump that's embedded in the Constitution. So Ram Paul, Massey, Marjorie Taylor Green, Beaulbert, you're going to see more people breaking from Donald Trump as they each try to find their footing in whatever they think, the Philadelphia,

philosophical tenets of the Republican movement or the MAGA movement should be after Trump. And so I think that's the move. And it's really that calculated. It's not necessarily based on principle or anything like that, but it's more pragmatism. And frankly, peers, you and I have been around a long time. This has happened to every other lame duck president as people set themselves up for the next presidential term come 2008. If you were a betting man now, Anthony, because the Democrats are hardly in great shape themselves, polling at record lows, no apparent leader coming through yet,

the most charismatic member of the party actually being a self-declared socialist, many declare him to be a communist, Mamdani in New York. He can't run, obviously, but his ideology is something certainly shared by the likes of AOC and others. So you could argue that the most famous and dynamic

members of a Democratic Party are AOC, Mam Darnie, Bernie Sanders, it's all the far left, right? I don't think that can win a general election. So how is the Democrat set up actually going, or Democratic Party set up, going to stop MAGA continuing just by default if they get pulled too far to the left? You know, listen, I'm going to cite the president, if you don't mind, because whatever you think of him,

and obviously I'm on the other side of him at this point in my life, he's got great political instincts. When Mondani won in New York, Trump is like, okay, that's the signal from the Democratic Party. They're going to go hard left. The country's not ready for that, okay? And even if there's hard left people on this call,

I'm just letting you know the country is not ready for that, does not want that. And if the Democrats don't build a coalition around somebody that will tack to the center, and by the way, you mentioned his electoral success, but you had Mickey in New Jersey, you had Spamberger in Virginia, you did have moderate Democrats that won as well.

And if they go in a moderate direction, they could probably beat the Republicans. But if they don't go in a moderate direction, Pierce, I think they end up losing handily. And they'll be sitting around shaking their heads. But they go after each other in that party in a way that the Republicans don't. You know, whatever happens on the side of the Republicans, they line up together and they keep their mouths shut and they support one person. The Democrats don't like doing that. they did the Republicans, but you've got to say, looking at Marjorie Taylor Green's spat with Trump,

that may be beginning to fragment, although I agree with you about the Democrat. Until there's a primary winner. Until there's a primary winner, again, the... No, I agree with you. Okay. Yeah.

Cheink, I just wanted to mention something before we finish. This is this issue of the kid you tried to assassinate Trump. And these are revelations that Tucker Carter. has mainly brought into the public domain, in which it appears that far from the FBI narrative that was being given to us, that there was no online path for this kid and no real explanation for why he'd done it.

Turns out there was an awful lot of online stuff that they've now unearthed, but it's been bullied out there by Tucker and his investigation. 17 different accounts, many of it very incendiary, very threatening, very dangerous, very dangerous, dangerous, actually, if you read it. What's gone on here?

Again, there was a promise of transparency. There was repeated leaks that there was nothing on this guy online, which in itself sounded so weird for a kid that young. And yet now it turns out the complete opposite is true. Yeah, again, there's a connective tissue here, which is I think we're misunderstanding the whole paradigm here. We're still talking as if it's Democrats versus Republicans, and that there are so-called moderates et cetera

so marjorie taylor greys positions i i totally disagree with tatum they haven't almost haven't changed at all donald trump's positions have changed wildly he said he was anti-war and now he's going to invade venezuela that's mental and that is in america first that is an anti-war etc so what's the connective tissue whoever's the most populous is the one that the people support the most

the people or whoever is the most anti-establishment is the candidate that's going to win. So when you talk about, oh, like the far left, like Mumdani, AOC, et cetera, no, no, no. It is, I don't care where you are on the political spectrum. I care where you are in the spectrum between establishment and populists. So the reason Mom Dani one, and originally the reason AOC one, is because they were anti-status quo, anti-establishment. They were for change, right?

So at this point, though, I guarantee you both the Republican, and I hope the Democrat, the Republican for sure, my God, I'm going to do everything I can to make sure that the Democratic primary as well is won by a person who is deeply, deeply anti-establishment. So right now, the people in power are screwing the average person, and it's super obvious. So Marjorie Taylor Green's saying it on the right. Tucker Carlson is saying it on the right. And the government is covering up a thousand things. So why did they cover up with the shooter's real history?

That's a super fair question. You know, look, before peers, I believe the things the government said. Now, I look back at it and I think, come on, man. So you found two passports in the burning rubble of 9-11 that conveniently proved your case. They were steel melted, but the paper passports didn't melt. And now, why did you hide the, you know, the identity of the Trump shooter? And everything that happened about the Charlie Kirk shooting is deeply, deeply suspicious. Here we go.

And so, no, I don't trust the government. No, no, no. If you say you trust the government, both the American government and the Israeli government, they would never do anything wrong, and you love the donors and you want to kiss their ass, please do that because it'll be so easy to defeat you, and it doesn't matter whether you're on the right or the right.

Let me bring in, let me bring in Michael, we're running out of time, but I do think it stinks this whole thing with Thomas Crooks. You know, this is the attempted assassin at the rally in Butler, Pennsylvania. When you actually get into the weeds of this, this was a guy who was in clear, public visibility, you know, making his thoughts extremely dangerous, extreme thoughts, extremist ideology, admiration for mass violence, spoke openly a political assassination, posted under his real name, was flagged by others who mentioned law enforcement and their replies. But despite that, his account remained active for five years and was only removed the day after the shooting.

why the briefings that there was no online tracking for this guy, when it turned out there was nothing but? I thought Tucker's report on this was terrific. I think it's a disgrace that a guy sitting up in Maine has to release what information we have now gotten rather than the authorities or the establishment media. So I totally agree with that. The whole thing stinks to high heaven. To Cheng's broader kind of point, though,

he's arguing that whoever's the most populous wins this would seem to be undercut by the fact that Joe Biden won 2020 he's the most establishment candidate ever and or maybe you're saying Joe Biden didn't really win which I'm here to listen to you know Brian makes this point that the whole right is fraying because the right has realized that tariffs are inflationary the San Francisco Fed just shot that down this morning and said they're deflationary actually said that they people just realize that Trump likes gold I think people knew that actually for many years before that. So I think really what we're talking all about is, yes, there's massive, massive government corruption, and that's very longstanding, and it's existed under both parties, and both, at least

people within both parties really want to uncover that and they're forces that are stopping it. Totally agree. That is separate from Cheng's broader point, which is that the MAGA coalition is beginning to fray. That's right. But the reason for that is simple, and actually Mr. Mooch got to it, which is, sorry, on the screen, it's over there. Mr. Mooch got to it, which is that President Trump is coming to the end of his second term. And this is not a fight, even primarily over ideas. Part of the reason Marjorie Taylor Green is using Democrat rhetoric on CNN is because Trump hit her and said that she's basically added the tent. What this is about is 2028. And it's going to be a fight for the control of the right that we haven't now had to see in about a decade. And that's going to bring in questions

of conspiracy. It's going to bring in questions of economy, foreign policy, all the rest. To try to overcomplicated, I think, is simple. The race for 2028 is on, and every split within the right-wing coalition comes down to that. Yeah, I've got to leave it there. All I would say is it may seem like the Trump's second term is coming to an M. Michael. In fact, he has over three years left. It just feels like it's already been three years, which is the other part of Trump being president is that every day seems to go on for about a week. But guys, thank you all very much indeed. A really excellent panel. And I appreciate all your time. Thank you.

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