Piers Morgan Uncensored - "Put Down The Dunkin' For a Second" Feminism Debate Gets PERSONAL! Feat Andrew Wilson

Episode Date: April 11, 2025

Go to https://ExpressVPN.com/Piers and find out how you can get 4 months of ExpressVPN free John Oliver stirred controversy this week by hosting a special on what he calls a right-wing obsession with trans athletes in women’s sports. JK Rowling told him to “read the effing room” and shared a post which slammed his 45-minute special for claiming there’s basically no advantage for male athletes and that men almost never beat women. On that same night, the UK Women's Pool Championship Final was contested by two people who were born as men. So who is obsessed? And who is right? For a debate that gets personal, Piers Morgan hosts feminist writer and the co-founder of Justice for Women Julie Bindel, The Crucible host Andrew Wilson, journalist Emily Austin and trans rights advocate Stassia Underwood. Uncensored is proudly independent and supported by: Jacked Up Fitness: Go to https://GetJackedUp.com and use code PIERS at checkout to save 10% off your entire purchase American Hartford Gold: Protect your wealth with precious metals! Call American Hartford Gold today & get up to $15,000 in free silver on your 1st order! Call 866-692-2474 or Text PIERS to 65532, or Click the link below: https://offers.americanhartfordgold.com/piers-morgan/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You're just a shock, it's not psychic ability. You're just pathetic. Nobody's going to listen to you. You're an aggressive, insecure man. I'm going to tell you what's going to happen. This is going to go. Well, this is going to go viral, and a lot of people are going to take me seriously, and all they're going to remember is that I told you that you couldn't put down the Dunkin' Donuts long enough to make an argument.

You all are fairly stupid, and everything that's being said is, it's like a comedy show being fed off. You think you can change your sex. How can you ever call anybody stupid? John Oliver stirred controversy this week by hosting a special on what he calls a right-wing obsession with trans athletes in women's sport. He took aim at Fox News for this. Even as the market crashed in the wake of Trump's tariffs, Fox News spent a lot of time on this. A women's fencer is defending her decision to take a knee to protest her trans opponent despite getting disqualified for her forfeit. A female fencer who's devoted years of her life to the sport was just disqualified.

This is the civil rights issue of the hour, women's sports. Here's the story that everybody's going to be interested in. A female fencer stands up for fairness in women's sports. Wait, that's the story that everyone is going to be interested in. Are you sure about that? The story about fencing and not the one that's caused the stock ticket in the corner of your screen? To go bright red like an inflamed hemorrhoid? What is almost comically ironic, of course,

is that Mr. Oliver was himself dedicating a large chunk of his once-a-week show to talking about the same issue. Hmm. Well, J.K. Rowling told him to read the effing room and shared a post which slammed his 45-minute special for claiming there's basically no advantage for male athletes and that men almost never beat women. On that same night, the UK Women's Pool Championship Final

was contested by two people who were born as men, not women. So who is obsessed and who is right? Well, we'll debate that and we'll debate this too. A lot of these men, these podcast hosts on the right, that like to think of themselves of these big masculine men and what am I getting out of it? I can tell you this. There's that feminism.

All right. I believe I'm a woman who's true. Yeah, there's the feminism. Oh, I'm sorry. Did you want to speak over a man? Inside of society, right this second, right? Masculinity is not only punished, but also women on the right,

covert feminists on the right, are constantly and consistently talking about how they need to have privilege in society. Their version of masculinity is men who take care of us, men who protect us, men who do all of this. Those are all duties that men have towards women. Great. What are the duties that women have towards men? Well, that became a breakout moment from our adolescence debate, and Andrew Wilson's chilling warning, of course, about the dangers of covert feminism.

We have a panel of feminist, covert and otherwise, to debate. The co-founder of Justice for Women, an author of Lesbian, Where Are We Now, Julie Bindle, the trans rights advocate. Stasia Underwood, the sports journalist and political commentator Emily Austin, and the host of the crucible, Andrew Wilson. Well, welcome to all of you. Julie Bindle, let me start with you with this whole issue of trans athletes in women's sport. I've been talking about this as you have for many years, and we've reached a point where the current president of the United States has basically announced a total ban on any trans athletes competing in women's sport,

including the upcoming global events happening in the United States, which is great. But it seems to me utterly astonishing that we have John Oliver, who's a fellow Brit, who is on American television, and for 45 minutes, seriously trying to argue that people who are born biological males have no advantage over biological females when it comes to sport. How can this still be happening?

It's utterly ludicrous. Either we have women's sports or we don't. Either we recognise that sports are segregated for good reason or we don't and we put everybody in together and then see what happens. Which is like the bad old days when girls and women wouldn't come forward to compete or they wouldn't join tournaments. Even if you look at something like poker, which Oliver was joking about, how can this be an issue? How can poker even be discriminatory? There's no strength involved. But the sexist environment of poker tournaments and what men would call joking and teasing and the like

put many women off competing. And so let's just see what happens if we then decide that there should be no single-sex sports and that women's sports were ridiculous to start with because that's what he's arguing. Yeah, Stassier. Look, as I've repeatedly made clear about my own position, which often gets completely misconstrued,

as I think does Julie's, as I think does J.K. Rowling and everybody else. My position is I absolutely respect people who are trans. I respect people who are trans as rights to fairness and equality and safety. I want trans people that have the same fairness, equality and safety, that I enjoy, or that my daughter enjoys, for example. So let's be clear about that. nothing that I'm about to say is what some people try and frame it as is transphobic, right?

I'm not remotely transphobic. I am fully supportive of trans people's rights to lead the same life as the rest of us. However, and it's a big however, when it erodes, when the battle for trans rights to fairness, equality in particular, but also safety, when that erodes clearly women's rights to fairness and equality and safety, I have a big problem with that. And no place is this more glaring than in the sporting arena where you see time and again now, biological men who identify as trans,

who were pretty unsuccessful competing against other biological men, and suddenly they're winning against women or taking Olympic places from women, etc., etc., and I think the UN came up with nearly 900. I mean, John Oliver tried to ridicule this, but nearly 900 medals around the world, I think in the last year, went to trans athletes in women's sport. This cannot be right.

It's not fair. It's not equal. As we saw in the Paris Olympics, in the boxing ring, where you had boxers competing who were banned from the world championships because they had reportedly male chromosomes, and you had women boxers quitting after 40 seconds because they'd never been hit so hard,

genuinely fearing they might. might get killed in the ring. When it comes to this, we are now reaching, to me, a not just an unfair and unequal place in this debate, but a dangerous place in this debate. What do you say to that? I think it's difficult. I think that there's a lot of emphasis being put on trans people in sports specifically. I made it very clear. Like, I am not here to spit facts or spew anything in terms of, like, statistics or anything that I have my lived experience as a trans person.

I just, I feel that there's so much attention being put on to this specific subject because what you guys really want underlying is the eradication of trans people and them to not be involved in any system. No. No. See there, look. Don't look, but say, look, Stassie. That is the dumbest argument I've ever heard in my life.

Right. It's ludicrous. Where have you got that from? What a bad representation of a trans person to speak out for others? I'm more so referring to the right. I have seen certain things that you've said in other interviews, peers with like my friend Wassam and other trans individuals. Yeah.

I just feel that the emphasis that is being. And what was transphobic? What have I ever said? that could be remotely construed as transphobic or trans-hating or wanting to get rid of trans people. Ever. I challenge you right now. Tell me. I haven't really directed that at you just from sitting here.

I'm more so. I'm just here to say that I feel that the issue that's being pressed is because it's a... You just directed it at him. What are you talking? You directed it at him. I think that the issue that is being put on trans athletes is a way to eradicate trans people. But this is, with respect, this is ridiculous. Here's, can I interject for a moment?

In the 1960s and 70s, when feminists that came before me set up women shelters, rape crisis centers, hospital wards, prison wings for women, recognizing that some men, not all, but a sizable minority are a threat to women, because sexual violence and harassment is a threat. We weren't told by men, not all of them were pleased, but largely they understood. We weren't told by men you're trying to erase and eradicate men. The vast majority of men understood why we needed to do this. All we're doing is saying men,

and you can call them trans women if you like, but men have no place in women's prisons, domestic violent shelters, and sports. Well, wait a second. Hang on. Okay. Emily, you want to do... Yeah, Andrew, I'm going to come to you.

Andrew, I'll come to you one moment. Just let Emily jump in on what you're about to say, I think, to Stasia. Making America healthy again is all the rage, and many people are inspired to put their fitness first again. That's why I'm excited to be working with Don and a team at Jacked Up Fitness, which is an amazing American company.

Last week, they installed their flagship jacked-up Power Rack Pro for none other than RFK Jr. And his team at the Department of Health HQ. And I'm next to come into my house to set up my power rack pro, and I can't wait to flex these guns. It has everything you need for a full-body workout at home. There's a cable crossover system integrated with 200-pound weight stacks, and the Smith machine is set up for hundreds of exercises. Basically, everything that you can do at the gym.

If you're new to all this, the Get Jacked Up program offers full-body video workouts, led by celebrity trainers like Kim Lyons and Clark Bartram. Just press play and follow along. Join me. Go to getjacked up.com and sign up for free. Order your Power Rack Pro and save 10% with promo code peers. No more excuses. I just think it's so infuriating because ultimately I know many trans people

and I spoke into them about playing in women's sports, et cetera. And the biggest issue they face is that they just want to be accepted. Now, if I was a trans woman and I just wanted to be accepted, I'm going to do the exact opposite of what you're doing. You want to paint all of these labels on you. You want to play identity politics. You want to play the victim, but you want it to be treated as if you're any superior. That's not equality. You're receiving special treatment that does not make you equal but makes you superior to others is not looking to be included.

It's actually making people detest your cause. It's making people think that you are a moron. And the way that you're trying to represent the trans community as a whole by just denying that there's a threat and being delusional about it is not helping the trans people. You're making people look here from the outside and say, wow, they are out of touch with reality. I think that the verbiage that you use in this statement is very clear on where you stand on trans issues. I'm going to go back to my original point. You guys trying to take out trans people as a way to eradicate trans people from public. But we're not.

We're trying to eradicate lunatics like themselves. Stasia, nobody has said that. And this is what happens. If you don't mind me saying, what happens, the way that trans activists let themselves down, in my opinion, and you can respond to this, is that you try and shut down perfectly legitimate, in fact, urgently important debate

by saying that anyone who dares to question this is transphobic and wants to get rid of trans people. I don't think anyone so far on this panel has said they want to get rid of trans people or anything like it. And yet you keep saying you people all want to get rid of trans people. Why do you believe that? Where have you got that from? You cite my interviews with some of your friends. But where have I said anything remotely that could be construed as transphobic?

I don't get it. I think the verbiage that was being used, it's very clear you guys stand on all trans issues. What do you mean? What do you mean? So what is the same thing for the trans people about our playing sports? What's the solution for them? We're just supposed to kick them out all entirely. Let me give you the solution.

Let me give you the solution. The solution's very straightforward. Almost all of them competed against biological men like themselves before. But they did it far less successfully. So you either go back, trans women athletes either compete against their biological sex or you create an entirely new category. for trans athletes. What you don't do is allow them to destroy the integrity of women's sport, which is what is happening. So it's very straightforward how you solve this. I don't want trans

people to be banned from playing sport. I just want them to be banned like I did with the dopers when they were cheating in sport. I want them to be banned from utilizing an unfair advantage. It's simple as that. Can I ask her question? Would you think it's fair if Novak Djokovic, identified as a woman and then played Serena Williams in a tennis set, do you think that that would be fair to Serena Williams, who worked her whole life, to become a star tennis player, just to get swept by Novak, who's the number one men's tennis player?

I just want to know if you think that that's fair. I just think that the question is ridiculous, because though that there are, why is it ridiculous? That's not ridiculous at all. I see how it's trying to be framed. I just, I'm going to keep going back to my original point. excessive attention on wanting to remove trans people from sports and have them play in their biological sex, which makes no sense because even in John Oliver's interview.

Or in their own category? In his, the category that would make sense to me. Or in their own category? There's not enough of them to create a category. Like, the percentile is so small. Actually, there are. Actually, there are, there are, there actually are an increasingly large number of trans athletes around the world, actually.

It's not true. Andrew, you'll be waiting very patiently. Thank you. This seems to me, this whole debate so far highlights the way this debate has been framed now for years, which is that any attempt to question what is obviously grotesquely unfair and unequal and indeed unsafe is branded transphobic, even when there's no evidence to suggest that the people saying it are transphobic. Well, it's not just that. I mean, basically everybody in this panel is wrong. So to start with, this person says, this person says, well, you know, the thing is, is you just want to erase transgender people altogether, Pierce, and then says, I wasn't saying that. Pierce, I wasn't saying that you want to erase trans people, not use specifically when clearly that's what you were saying.

At least get behind the statements that you're making. The turf starts out by saying, well, I've been here reinforcing women's rights this entire time, right? And then the turf says right on top of that, well, but, you know, poker is very misogynistic. She can't wait to dunk on men. Very first thing she does is dunk on men in order to somehow elevate women, right? You're all insane. The truth is that the only reason that this happens to begin with is because women vote for it. They vote for it.

They vote blue. They vote left. They vote in the same politicians who get behind all of this stuff. You're the deciding vote, right? And you have empowered women to do that as much as possible. for the political process to do that. All of you are responsible for this. Every last one of you.

Really glad that you're so powerful. Emily as well? Yeah. Leave me out of this one. I'm good. Well, we'll see. Well, that's what Andrew kept saying all of you. Do you include Emily, Andrew, or not? Well, I just assumed it.

I just assumed it. But this is the truth. The truth is we begin, we begin with these crazy, these crazy ideas, right? under patriarchal rule, under men, this would never have happened, right? If you look at how men vote, they vote against this nonsense. And it's fathers who are on the front lines against it. It's women who are trying to transition the children, not men.

Give me a case example of where male fathers are trying to transition their kids. It doesn't exist. It's a female-only phenomenon. Literally a female-only phenomenon. Yeah, show me one. Show me one male father who's fighting in the courts to transition their son to a girl. No, where. I made a podcast series about this.

I see men on TikTok that are diseased. I interviewed quite a few fathers that are pushing for this. But the point is that this is something that benefits men. And it's men that are the ones that are saying they're women. They are all of a sudden the oppressed and feminists like me are the oppressor. And that they want that they're too weak and pathetic to fight and play against other men. And what do they do? They come and beat.

up on women. Do you vote left, ma'am? I don't know what vote left means. Do you vote for the left-wing party of your nation? Do you vote for Democrats? Do you vote for what would you be considered the Democrats of your nation? No, I wouldn't have voted for the Democrats. I would not have voted for the disgrace of that party, and I also wouldn't have voted for Trump. But the point is, I believe in, I believe in, very quickly, very quickly, very quickly, we live in a different context here. What I'm saying to you is this. It's very simple. If you look at the voting patterns of women in both the UK and the United States, they're usually the deciding vote when it comes to degeneracy. That includes what it includes

on the trans issue. So here you are. It's the very thing that you push for for empowerment of women that is now causing your very problem. You have to now convince women. Men are already there. Men have already said, nope, we don't want this. We never wanted it. It's garbage. To be women. Yeah, apart from the women who are claiming to be men, which now it's almost equalized. Remember that part? Right? This phenomenon, though, is categorically rejected by men and reinforced by women. And turfs like you did everything that you could possibly do in order to push that.

You did everything you could do to push that. And now you get to reap the whirlwind. So I don't care if women in their sports teams are getting their teeth kicked in. I don't care. Reap what you sow. As you as you sow, so shall. how you reap. You seem a nice person. You seem like a lovely person. I'm sorry that you have to deal with the consequences of your own actions. Pierce Morgan Unsensored is now proudly independent. If you like

the show, we ask for only one thing. Subscribe on YouTube and follow Pierce Morgan Unsensored on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. Now let's get straight to the point. Support for today's show comes from a business focused on a critical issue. Prosperity. U.S. national debt is at crisis levels. inflation has made life more expensive for everybody, and a stock market is precarious. It's enough to make anyone's financial future feel grim. So what is the solution? Well, a simple one is to opt out of the chaos and invest in something solid and reliable, physical, gold and silver.

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free silver when you make your first purchase and mention my name, Peers. So, make the smart move. Call or text peers, that's P-I-E-R-S-2655-3-2. That's 866-692-2474, or text peers to 655-3-2. All the details are in the description. Now on with the show. On the subject of it, because Andrew made a lot of news on social media with his debate with Tommy Leran last week after accusing her of being a covert feminist. Let's remind people of that clip which went viral.

Most men are born to be protectors and providers. I can't imagine my dad saying, you know what, to my mom, you know what, I'm not going to be a protector and a provider unless you do this. That's not how real men operate. Real men are protectors and providers, and they marry women who hopefully have some virtue, but also bring a lot to the table as well that are great mothers, great wives, caretakers of the home. There's nothing wrong with being a traditional wife and mother. So, Emily, what do you say? Are you a covert feminist like Tommy? Did you agree with Andrew's assessment?

I'm not a covert feminist. I am very outwardly... You know, the word feminism has been hijacked by, like, the woke left who uses it as an excuse for psychotic women and liberals to scream on the streets. We want equal rights when we have equal rights. I'm more so an empowered woman who encourages other women to, you know, be independent, work hard, chase your dreams. And that doesn't come at the expense of being fashions.

It doesn't come at the expense of now as a feminist you need to eradicate all men. I don't think everything is so black or white. Listening to that debate, they spoke a bit about gender roles, and here's my take on that. If you're going to have gender role expectations for your man, that's a personal choice. Emily Austin has high expectations of her man. He has to be working hard. He should be successful. He should pay attention to how I feel.

There should be certain gender roles. He has to provide for the family, not solely, but he should be. be providing for his family. These are gender rules. As a woman, I learned how to cook, I know how to clean. My grandmother always tells me, my mother tells me, Emily, you're going to be a good wife, you're going to be loyal, you're going to be supportive, you're going to act like a lady.

Now, there are many women who don't want to play into the gender roles, which is fine, but then don't expect your man to go out and become masculine. I think it's equal. Like set the expectation and then date people who meet your expectation. But in terms of covert feminism, first of all, it's such a silly, term. Either you support women or you don't. And I'm not talking about the trans argument right now. That's a separate one.

Not only is it not not a silly term. It is true that most of the political pundant women on the right are covert feminist. And I'll just ask you the same exact question I asked on me. Because the word feminism that hijacked. Let me finish the question. Let me finish the question. No, I'm talking about all the way back to first wave feminism.

Okay, you are feminist and I'll explain by asking you the same question. If it is men's duty in society to procure, refine, protect resources which then men and women or I'm sorry women and children are the primary beneficiaries of which they are what's societal duty which is equal to that to women have what is it women we're going to have children men will never understand the burden of carrying a child so you have a duty to reproduce wait so you have women have a duty to reproduce okay great so that's the one duty that's on par great so that's one duty that's on par with that I totally agree are they Or is it the case that in every single nation in the West,

we are under reproductive rates in every single one of them. In every single nation in the West, we are lower than where we need to be for reproduction. So it seems that men are fulfilling their social duty, and women are not. And the problem with the right is that the right doesn't ever address this. And right-wing females never address this. Instead, they say it's equal.

Work and motherhood are equal. They're not equal. not only are they not equal, but let me give you another example here. As you dive into this, try to understand that what you do is you actually hamstring women. By telling women they should go and be girl boss babes and go to college starting in their 20s, they actually destroyed their prime reproductive years. They destroy them by having families later. It's the primary cause.

Hang on. Hang on. Listen, it's the primary cause for the reproduction crisis. It's the primary cause of the reproduction crisis in the West. is that with women defer families until they're in their 30s. Why do you think the average age of marriage is 32 in the United States? I think it just got raised to 33. Yes, you're going to have way less kids. Okay, part of girl bossing is when you say career women are right on par with mothers.

They're not, and societies should be glorifying one, not socially shaming the other, but you shouldn't give them the same elevation you get to mothers and matrons of families. That is pure covert feminism. Okay. I'm going to answer you with the following. I don't believe in the glorification, and especially I see it amongst Gen Ziers, of not having children.

I actually think it's disgraceful, and I don't think it's a flex at all to brag about not wanting to repopulate. It just shows me that you're so insecure that you're going to be a bad parent, that you're not doing it. On the other hand, I'll ask you a question in return. Would you prefer a child growing up in a damaged family

with a mother who clearly wasn't ready to raise a child and raise potentially what could be you know, a deranged child who grows up to be a serial killer or a murderer or how about this, just a really bad person, rather than wait a few more years until she's ready to have her kid and then raise a munch. What do you prefer? Well, so here's what we can see when we break this down. What we see when we break this down is the abuse happens in the public school, where you're a hundred times more likely to be assayed than you are if you're in a Catholic church. We see that

if it is the case that you're a single mother, you are a single mother, especially by choice, that is usually the selection of stepfather but leads to the abuse of the children. We also can see via the stats that you're completely just insane here. You are actually, if you stay inside of a family where you mom and dad don't even like each other, your outcomes are still better, still better than if you, the girl boss goes, I just don't feel fulfilled. I don't feel fulfilled. And so I need to go and date the neighbor down the road or whatever, right?

The truth is, is that regardless of your fulfillment, children are, the duty. The next generation is the duty and women have a duty to keep the family intact as well. They're responsible for most of the divorces. They file for the most amount of divorces, not because of abuse, but because of irreconcilable differences. And when asked, I don't feel fulfilled. And it's like, that's not how we run a society. It's literally a death sentence for our whole society. Look at what's going on in the UK. It's a death sentence for him. Okay. Let me bring in Stasia, who's been grimacing throughout that. Stassia, why are you? you so outraged by what do you say

I'm not outraged I just think that you all are fairly stupid and everything that's being said is ridiculous and it's just like a comedy show you think you can change your sex how can you ever call anybody stupid how can you ever call anybody stupid

yeah she should sit that one out hey I'm not I'm not I'm just sitting back watching the shit show happen I'm here for it all right Julie You were not... Well, hang on, hang on, I want to get Julie to respond to Andrew.

Oh, I zoned out and I thought I'd woken up in the 1950s in some TARDIS. You can't take him seriously. It's ridiculous. Oh, you mean in the 1950s, you mean in the 1950s when we had intact families where 95% of women were getting married as virgins, where families weren't being broken up, where crime was extremely low, where he only needed one income to support an entire household, where mental illness was at an all-time low like that in 1950s. I'm sorry that I make a reference to a time.

Are you married? Are you married? How do you make a marriage with many children? Is your wife happy? You married with children? Oh, she's, she's static. No, I'm 23. I'm a boss lady girl, which seems to be driving you crazy.

Working, making money, waiting for the right guy to belong. The only thing you have, you have no arguments, you just try to assault me personally. You can try, but the truth is it's that I've read. reproduced. I am married. I do have the life. I asked you if you're married. No, you didn't. You were making a passive, aggressive feminist. Wait, how did I solve? My wife must be miserable. Andrew. Your wife must be miserable. To be fair, Andrew, Andrew is practicing what he preaches. I want to, I want to bring in another clip from a debate between Megan Kelly and Matt Walsh on the similar theme. Let's watch a little clip from this. Again, having said that I like

the guy, I'm getting a little tired of his nonstop judgment. of women who make different choices than the ones he wants us to make. Sorry, Matt, you're not our Jesus. We don't answer to you. Like, live your life the way you want to live it. And stop judging everybody who makes a different choice. I'm sick of it. And she went on to say this about young men not wanting to marry career women.

Let's take the listen to this. We're now telling young, conservative, amazing women that they're not attractive if they also work. if they choose to, let's say, do what I'm doing and what you're doing, and, like, get their voice out there. But I'll stick with me just because I think conservatives listening to this will like the thought of another Megan Kelly voice up and coming. Now, Matt Walsh responded by saying,

men are generally not attracted to ambitious career. Well, hang on going to be. I don't want to read a clip from Matt Walsh, or a quote. He said, men are generally not attracted to ambitious career-driven women, and women's first priority should be children and looking after the home. So, Emily, what do you think of that? If you've ever felt like you're being watched online, it's unfortunately because you are hundreds of companies,

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Now, on with the show. I think the beauty about free will is you make a choice who you want to spend your life with. Like I know many men are okay with, you know, a woman who works, and I know many men are not. And that's the great part is you choose who you want to partner with. So if you want a woman to be home and have five, six, seven, eight children, which is a beautiful choice to make in life, then go for it. If you want a woman who can do both work and have children when she's ready, two or three children, then go for that type of woman. If you want a woman who's never home and going to be on the road all the time, and trust me, there are many beta men who would love that, then go for that.

Nobody is forcing you to be with a woman that doesn't cater to your need. The same way no one's forcing any women to be with a guy like Andrew Tate that's going to beat you and make you miserable. We have choices, and we need to make calculated wise choices as to what personally is best for you. The Andrew Tate fallacy is moving over to... to Andrew Tate, it's evil and a representation of men who believe in a patriarchal system. Here's the truth. The truth of the matter is, is that we should be doing for society what is socially good for society. If we can't reproduce our society, that's a really bad social ill for society.

When you have propaganda that is telling women to go get useless degrees in psychology and sociology. Yeah, that's great. It's such a lot. It's nice. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. There's Andrew quickly. Is Megan Kelly a covert feminist, then? Not covert. Overt. She's an overt feminist. Covert's out for Megan Kelly. Megan Kelly came out and said women should be prioritizing career over family.

That's what Matt Walsh's issue was with her. And he's absolutely right. The guy struck it out of the ballpark. Socially, in society, we should be moving women into a familial role. It's not to say that women can't work. Nobody's saying women can't work. We're just saying that if you're going to glorify things in society, it should be the mother in the intact home. the wife and the caretaker at home. Not the girl boss. That's insane. And it's a societal death sentence. Walsh knows it. Everybody knows this at this point. If you can't reproduce your own nation, you don't have a nation. Do you know how... Okay, Julie, you wanted to jump in there.

I mean, do you know how insecure and pathetic you sound? You can't take you seriously. Eat another donut lady. I'll just finish. I get that you reckon that you're some big shock jock and I know that you're desperately trying to be relevant, but you sound so insecure and so pathetic. You are irrelevant. Do you have an argument? Can you put the Duncan down for a second and give me an argument? Do you have an argument? Or is it just Andrew Bad? Sorry, I haven't heard one from you. Yes, I've given you multiple arguments for the social fabric of all of society and how we can improve it, what we need to be doing, what we need to be moving towards. I gave you all the stats. I gave you argument after argument. Can you give me a single argument?

You are the Oracle. You know all about the universe and what's going to progress humankind. You're just a shock, jock, mate. It's not psychic ability. You're just pathetic. Nobody's going to listen to you. You're an aggressive, insecure man. I'm going to tell you what's going to happen.

We're not taking you seriously. Well, this is going to go viral, and a lot of people are going to take me seriously, and all they're going to remember is that I told you that you couldn't put down the Dunkin' Donuts long enough to make an argument. Now, can you make one or not? Oh, you know, this is. Schoolboy tactic. By the way, a real man doesn't speak down to a woman the way you do.

I don't care what you think a real man is. You're actually very feminine if you ask me. You're a very feminine man. And nobody cares what you think real men are. You're pathetic, mate. Yeah. And how you, you think that you're such a big boy by slating, bringing in personal, personal insults about women's appearance.

I'm sorry. Wow, I feel for you when you're, you're going to be able. you when you go out into the big wide world from behind your matcher one day when i go out in the big wide world i hope people will take me as seriously as they do women who make zero arguments wait why are you on keros morgan shouldn't you go be working right now making money for your family to support how do you have time to making a ton of money what are you talking about i don't have a husband i'm 23 years old i'm not married with kids yet but it seems like you should go be working right now to fulfill your gender role as a big strong man i am working right now

Oh, we get to work. Let me ask for a living. You're not being paid to be here? Yes, lady. I'm going to get paid a lot of money ultimately to be here. You have no idea what you're talking about. If you saw my bank account what I make doing stuff like this, it would make you weep. Oh, show us your bank account to make yourself feel more secure.

Hey, the only thing you could think of was to try to assault my bank account, lady. That's it. The only thing you can think of is you don't work enough. You don't work enough. You don't work enough. It's ridiculous. Let me play. I want to play Emily. I want to play Emily a clip. This has gone viral too. It's had 120 million views. There's a woman who suggests she's about to leave her husband because he doesn't do enough domestic chores. Let's take a look.

If you do not participate in an equitable way in your home. And so what does that look like? What does it look like to change these dynamics? But we need to really assess in our homes what the work looks like. Because in most homes, the data supports this. women do a disproportionate amount of the work. They just do. They do more of the cooking and the cleaning and the laundry and the childcare while also working full time. And men have more time for things like their hobbies, like golf, for example, or just working out, running a marathon, right?

And so we need to have hard conversations about what our time looks like, what our labor in the home looks like, what is invisible labor. We have to talk about these things. And when we don't, the alternative is that you no longer have a marriage or you don't have a happy one at least. And so I share this story because I don't think I'm alone in this experience. And I want people to know that there's hope and that if you have a willing and able partner, you can change this. You can absolutely change this.

I mean, Emily, I would personally, I would travel continents to avoid a lady like that. But what's your view of what she's saying? To me, her rant, take away the gender for a moment. because I actually believe women are a lot messier than men, just in terms of our makeup, our clothing, the abundance of clothing that we have. I think we definitely purchase more accessories than men. And I think we also, like I said,

there are gender roles, I believe in, should be responsible for most of the cleaning. Then on the other hand, if you're marrying a slob, A, you should know who you're getting into a household with. But B, if you're in a happy marriage and you have a sense of communication, why not just sit your partner down and be like, hey, I don't mind cleaning up after you,

but when you throw your filthy socks on the bathroom sink or you leave your wet towel and we have mold, you know, I'd appreciate if you could not do this. But I don't think it gets to an extent where, like, divorce is justifiable unless your husband is like a hoarding pig that's unbearable to live with. I think she's being a little bit dramatic here.

And we all can acknowledge women are a bit messier than men. And it should be just like looking after one another. It's not a big deal to clean up after your partner and that could go both ways. Not everything is so black or white. Andrew? Well, I mean, first of all, stay-at-home moms are mostly nowadays parking their kids in public school for most of the day. Oftentimes, the kids are taking buses from the city to the school and buses home.

They're not even driving them, okay? Not even driving them. And they have fully furnished lunch, even breakfast at most of these public schools, right? They don't even have to send them with a lunch anymore. They have all day to do household chores while men are working, right? No, women do not do a disproportionate amount of work in comparison to, men, that's absurd, no labor statistics supports that, even if we were to take

household chores and put it on the table against a man's work doesn't even come close even with children, especially because you're parking them most of the time in a public school for most of the day. This lady who's making this TikTok, totally insane, completely disconnected from reality,

has no idea how this actually works. She's that totally insane. You're going to make a choice to marry a girl who is going to cook and clean and do everything, and me as a woman, I'm going to make a choice to hire a housekeeper one day so that I don't have to cook and clean because that's my choice. The problem is you're too obsessed with other people's choices.

Live and let live. Like, take a step back and recognize not everyone has to be as extreme as you are. Like, yes, women should cook and live until it comes to the transgender. If they're not perfect. I do live and let live until it comes to the transgender. I don't care if you're transgender. I don't care if you're transgender.

I don't understand. Go for it. I'm not marrying a transgender. Let them go play their sports. Let them live and let live. Absolutely. Live and let live. You people contradict yourself so much.

That's their superiority. No, I think you're just stupid because I'm explaining myself and making sense. The explanation makes no. They should live and live and live. They should not participate in sports. Let's say the boundary. Let's Stassia talk. Stasi, you wanted to say something.

You're just all walking contradictions. It's crazy that you can even say something like that. something like that. You guys are all fighting with each other about live and let live. And we're having an entire conversation about trans people and their ability or lack of ability to be in sports. So it's just, it's wild to watch him with the cigarette. I think he's all pompous. And you over there acting like, it's just ridiculous. Hey, I'm the only one here who is consistent. I said, I don't care if you people go in and beat the tar out of women. I don't care. Go do it. They voted for it. I think they need a taste of their own medicine. I think it's,

It's good for them. And maybe some of this madness will stop if they actually have to take accountability and deal with the consequences of their own voting. You're actually insane. You're in. I want to make it very clear. I don't care that you're transgender. I genuinely don't care if today you're a woman. Tomorrow you're a man.

The next day you want to identify as a cat or a dog. I really don't. Like, it's not my issue. But when you make it my issue, when you want to play in my sport, I was a tennis player my whole life. If a man came along who identified as a woman, who I will respect as a woman, I will respect your pronouns, but you want to now eradicate women's sports, now it's my problem, too. As long as it's not my problem and you will do you, live exactly. Thank you. Just live and let live, man. We'll just be hippies in a community together.

I want to end by asking Julie. Okay, I want to end by asking Julie because, Julie, you've been talking about feminism for decades. We're now in a place, a strange place, I think, where women have, more freedom to do all the things that maybe previous generations of women did not have freedom to do. And many, including me, actually, think that's a very good step forward. The only downside to this is that birth rates around the world are beginning to plummet, to dangerously low levels. And Elon Musk keeps warning that if they carry on like this, it's going to be a very, very serious problem for the future of the planet.

So let me just ask you, Julie, when you look at the progress that feminism has made, You can see so many ways that women's rights have been promoted in a better way. But are you concerned about the dropping birth rates and the fact that women no longer, because so many more are going out to work and everything else, and prioritising work perhaps over family, that birth rates ultimately are obviously going to reduce and that ultimately that could be a very self-defeating thing for the planet? We need to pay attention to the fact that many women,

women when they have children have no support, no childcare, feckless fathers who leave, if they're there in the first place, where there is very little maternity leave, hardly any financial security, particularly if that woman is in an abusive relationship and can't rely on that second wage coming into the home. So have a look at what will make it more attractive and feasible for women to have babies. And also have a look at the women who are choosing not to have babies. because they don't want to be hitched to and trapped with a man who, quite frankly, isn't the love of her life because of his behaviour and because of his shortcomings.

That's what we need to be doing. Okay, Stacey, I want to ask you a final question. Emily, I'll come to you and Andrew for a final word in a minute, but Stacey, it just struck me as a question I wanted to ask you. How do you feel about drug cheats in sport? When people are caught doping to enhance their performance, How do you feel about that? Obviously, you know how I feel about that.

You're baiting me to twist this around on the trans issue. I've no idea how you feel about it. I've never asked you. I've never asked you before. Obviously, I'm not. Obviously, I'm not in support of people taking drug enhancements to do better in sports. But why? Why are you not in support of that, given it just gives them an unfair advantage,

which you want for trans athletes? What's the difference? Exactly what you're trying to do, and I'm not. walking into it. You know, like, it's very clear where my stances with trans people, I don't support, I just think that you're trying to walk me into something and it's not, it's not going to work for me. So you don't support the enhancement of performance to illegal drugs. Okay. That's good. We're halfway there, I think. Emily. Yeah. Pierce, I just want to bring up a point that, and personally, I don't know the stats. I'd be very curious.

into looking into it, but I think it would be remiss to not mention the fact that many, many women, personally, I know a bunch, but I want to see the stats on it, are trying to have kids that are doing rounds of IVF, spending all of their money that they've saved up trying to have a kid, are infertile, are having miscarriages, never got their period. I think we also have a really serious health crisis going on, at least in the United States. I can't speak about the UK that Bobby Kennedy is very well aware of about hormones and the foods that are making it a lot harder for women to have children because I know many, many women who would love to have a big, beautiful family, but can't even conceive their first child.

So I don't know if it's necessarily everyone making a decision to not have kids, rather a health problem. And I'd advise everyone to look into that, too. It's totally absurd. So first of all, the reason they need IVF and things like this, because they defer families until they're in their 30s, right? It's not healthy for women to start having babies in their 30s, not a great idea. Yes. Yeah, not only is it true. I have a 24-year-old friend who can't get pregnant. I can statistically prove it. The exception doesn't make the rule.

The truth of the matter is you can even look at infant mortality rates. And in the United States, we have some of the highest in the world, and that is correlated directly to the fact that women are aged now, age out of their 20s when they're having children. You can even see this in other nations as well. Back over to the turf's argument, she says, well, wait a second. We should really be deferring to women and incentivizing women for more stuff that women want. We do this all the time. We defer to everything that is that they want.

By the way, you have free tuition. You do get all sorts of free health care. And by the way, it's the poor people who have the most amount of children, not the middle class or the rich who do family planning. So this idea that you're just going to give the idea that you're just going to give women money or some type of support in this way and that's going to be what moves them towards children's not true. Usually it's things like religion, religiosity. You're going to your key component to traditionalism, your idea of community has nothing to do with family leave. It has nothing to do with that. Never has the birth rates been dropping like this, like a rock, especially since the 1900s, right?

But even in the 1800s. But now in the sense, birth control especially, and women's liberation, the sexual revolution, it has dropped so drastically. We can't even reproduce the population. These aren't answers. You're not answering any problems. none it's just because of men like you okay yeah it's men because of men like me I know it's men like me the ones who actually reproduce it's because of men like me who actually reproduce I get it

that makes sense so what do you suggest should women just start like can you can you reproduce do you even have a uterus to reproduce do you even have a uterus to reproduce but anyway what were you saying I'm sorry no I just don't understand what do you think is a solution Women should just like kind of settle in their young 20s and just start popping out babies even if they haven't necessarily met someone that's compatible for them yet or vice versa. I thought you weren't an anti-natalist language popping out babies. Oh, they're slave to the stove popping out babies. No, I think that from a societal view, we can have the language. I've got to go.

I'm really late. I've got to go. I'm answering your question. Sorry, everyone. All right. You know what, Julie, Julie, I'm actually, everyone's going to go because we've reached the end of the panel. The only sadness for me is we can't all go and have a drink together because I think we'd all get on great over a few pints

in a nice English pub, but maybe we'll leave that a treat for another time. Thank you all very much indeed for joining Unsensitive. Pierce Morgan Unsensitive is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask only one simple thing. Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Pierce Morgan Unsensit on Spotify and Apple Podcast. And in return, we will continue our mission to influence. We'll do it all for free.

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