Piers Morgan Uncensored - “That’s a DUDE!” Trans High Jumper Wins in California + Leaked Report Says Khelif Is MALE

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

Critics are demanding boxer Imane Khelif is stripped of her Olympic gold medal after a leaked medical report appeared to confirm the female boxing champion is a biological man. Meanwhile, 16-year-old student athlete AB Hernandez, who is biologically male, tied for first place in the high jump and triple jump at the track-and-field Championships in California. President Trump’s executive order to ban transgender athletes in women’s sport felt like a full stop on a long and exhausting debate, with a number of major sporting bodies all over the world using the move to announce their own bans. But clearly the work is not yet done. To discuss this, Piers Morgan is joined by ‘Tomi Lahren is Fearless’ on Outkick host Tomi Lahren, ‘The Gender GP’ Dr Helen Webberley and transgender activist and athlete Sara Weiss. Preorder Piers new book ‘Woke is Dead’: https://lnk.to/wokeisdead Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We are categorizing what is femininity. Suddenly, everybody wanted to be on the transgender train, and then everything had to be changed. Women's rights had to be destroyed. The learning over the last 20 years is that male and female categorization doesn't work. The fact that you have somebody on this panel that is advocating for the ability to debilitate young boys, do you realize how sick that sounds? Critics are demanding the boxer Imman Khalif is stripped of her,

Olympic gold medal after a leaked medical report appeared to confirm that the female boxing champion is in fact a biological male. Well, J.K. Rowling called the finding of victory for women. Elsewhere this weekend, quite the opposite. 16-year-old student athlete A.B. Hernandez, who's biologically male, tied for first place in the high jump and triple jump of a track and field championships in California. President Trump's executive order to ban transgender athletes in women's sport, felt like a full stop on a long and exhausting debate. A number of major sporting bodies all over the world used the cover of Trump's move to announce our own bands.

Clearly the work is not yet finished. Here's to debate the implications around both stories. Trans rights advocate Dr. Helen Weberley, aka the gender GP, Sarah Weiss, the trans pickleball player and author of Not Born This Way. And the host of Tommy Leran is fearless on outkick Tommy Laird. Welcome to all of you.

Tommy Lairn, I am clutching here. lab report, which was sensationally published in the last 48 hours, which confirmed what I and many others, you included, had concluded with our own eyes at the Paris Olympics, where Imam Khalif was looking like a man, boxing like a man, and beating up women in the ring so badly that one, an Italian female boxer, quit after 43 seconds and said she'd never been hit that hard in her life and feared for her life. So it was bleedingly obvious there was something wrong here, particularly when we knew that Imman Khalif had been banned from the previous year's world championships after reportedly failing a sex test. And this is the result that got leaked.

Now, this is pretty unambiguous. Chromosome analysis reveals male carriotype. That's it. It looks like Imman Khalif is a biological male. Your thought? Yeah, Pierce, the science doesn't lie. It's great to have that clarification, though none of us really needed it. I think it was abundantly obvious to those of us with eyes that watched any of this. We knew exactly what was happening here. But you'll recall, peers, sports journalists, especially here in the United States, they called for people like you and me and Outkick and other outlets that were honest about this to be sued up, down, right, left, center. Oh my gosh. How dare you misgender this person? You guys are so evil. It's so awful. Well, where's the apology? because as we suspected, the biology test came out, and guess what? 100% we got our answer. That's a dude. And we need to be very clear about all of this. There is no place for men in women's sports.

If you are a man who thinks he is a woman, that's fine. You can dress up. You can wear makeup. Live your life. I don't care. Until you infringe on women and girls. Then we're going to put our foot down. Finally, here in the U.S., we have a president that's doing something about it.

And I hope California, I know we're going to get to this with 80s. B. Hernandez. I hope California loses all of its federal funding. Enough is enough. I completely agree. Dr. Webley, I know you do not completely agree. So let me start by just asking you this question. Why, out of interest, why do we separate the sexes in the Olympics? It's a historical thing, isn't it? You know, that we have male and female categories. But why do we do it? We're learning over the last 20 years is that male and female categorization doesn't work. What do you mean it doesn't work?

Because not everybody fits into a very simple male, female category. And that's why we're having discussions like this. It's not that easy. But this is the problem with the whole debate. They actually do, because the vast majority of human beings fit into the category of male or female. I have to say something. Well, no, hang on.

I'm going to come to you, Sarah, and I will, I promise you. The vast majority, you say, and that's the vast majority. And that's the difficulty. It's only in the last two or three years, there's suddenly half the world went, actually, I'm transgender. Before that, everyone lived quite happily as male or female, with a few people identifying it who were leading perfectly good lives,

and there was no problem. Suddenly, everybody wanted to be on the transgender train. And then everything had to be changed. Women's rights had to be destroyed. Women's rights to fairness, equality, safety, had to be completely ignored and eradicated at the altar of transgender activism. And I have nothing against transgender people.

I've said from day one, if you're transgender, that's absolutely fine by me. I hope you have the exact same human rights as me. In every regard to human rights to safety, equality, all of it. But that's not what's happening. And in women's sport, unfortunately, this absurd obsession with allowing transgender athletes to compete in women's sport has seriously damaged the integrity of women's sport,

the fairness, the equality, and as we saw it at the Olympics, the safety. We now know that in mind, Caliph was a bloke. Well, Imman Khalif is not transgender, so I don't really know why we are being on internet. You don't know what you don't know what Imman Khalif is. All we know from this leaked lab report is that Amman Khalif tested positive for male chromosomes.

So last time I chate, that makes you male. Well, I don't know how that came into your possession. Well, it's here. It was leaked, yeah. Have you seen yours? Do you know what your chromosomes are? I'm a man, yes, I am a male. And by the way, if I took you on at Pickleball with enough training, I would win.

You know why? That's why we separate the sexes. And I'm sure you're great at Pickleball. But I also know that, for example, when the American women's football team, soccer, as you so shamefully call it, but when the women's soccer team with Megan Rapino, that towering force of equality, when she was leading that team, they were the best women's soccer team in history. and they played, I think it was the Dallas under 15 men's team, and they lost about 7-1, right?

Which just kind of suggested to me that my theory, that the reason we separate the sex is is because males have a biological advantage is actually why the transgender debate in women's sport is also obviously wrong. Let me bring in you here, Sarah, because you are a semi-pro pickleball player. Pickleball, I know, is a very fast-growing sport,

and I have great respect for all Pickable players. But the bottom line with all sports of this nature is that if somebody like LeBron James decided to take up Pickleball and really worked hard at it for a year, he would hammer you into oblivion. And there'd be nothing you could do about it. Well, I'm so glad that you brought all this stuff up.

And the first thing that I do want to mention, it was mentioned that it was obvious that Amen Khalif was a male. Yes. And I think that is part of the most harmful part of this, is that we are categorizing what is femininity. And then we're putting it out there like propaganda. No, male biology.

If somebody doesn't look feminine enough. No, no, no. It's not about femininity. It's about identifying male biology when we see it with our own eyes. Identify things with lab reports all you want. But if we are putting out this propaganda that you have to look a specific way and if it's obvious that you look masculine, then you're going to go under a microscope of people who do not like the fact.

Hang on, Sarah. No, it's when you look that way and it's already known that you, the year before, failed a sex test, which meant you were banned from the world championships. Well, you might say that about it. It's the two things going together. It's like, oh, hang on, this person was banned for testing positive, apparently for male chromosomes,

queue the lab report, which now confirms that. and is now competing in women's sport in the Olympics in a boxing ring where her women opponents are quitting after 40 seconds because they've never been hit that hard. I'm putting all these three things together and I'm saying this is wrong. Why aren't you?

Now the problem though is that if you're putting that out and sure there might be certain things that say hey well what about the accusations that she's a male and stuff the fact that there are many lesbians women or women who do not look feminine enough. Yes, I'm not denying you. It's nothing to do with the way she looks. I'm sorry, sorry.

I don't care how she looks. She can be eight foot tall for all I care with a long scraggly beard. It has nothing to do with it. It's the fact that she's a biological male. That is the problem, which gives her a natural... And let me bring in Dr. Weberley. You know as a doctor that men have a biological advantage.

Muscle mass, lung capacity, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's why we separate the sexist. Otherwise, in the Olympics, women wouldn't win any gold medals or silver or bronze. Not true. Actually, women would win. I've got a good idea for you. I think I've read a survey that said women might win two medals in the entire Olympics if they made it gender neutral, which would be a disgrace.

Now, Dr. Webbley, why he was a doctor trying to ignore biology? I haven't been able to speak yet, so I don't know why I'm being... Feel free, far away. Thank you. I've got a really good idea, right? There's a load of debate about puberty blockers and gender affirming care amongst transgender people worldwide. If we let transgender young people,

transgender feminine young people, have access to the puberty blockers and gender affirming hormones that they are asking to have, then they wouldn't build that muscle mass. They wouldn't have increased skeletal size, and they wouldn't have the advantage. What age are you going to do this? Well, you usually get puberty blockers when puberty starts.

That's what age you're going to do this to kids? Well, I just answered when puberty starts. Give me an age. Well, puberty starts between the age of around about 8 to 11. You're going to give 8-year-olds drugs to try and resolve this problem. Have you learned nothing from the whole Tavistock Clinic? Well, I don't think it's funny. I'm a father of four kids, including a 13-year-old girl.

I don't think any of this is funny. The fact that your solution is to drug is to block puberty for 8-year-old kids. Really? I'm a mother of five children and I believe that every single child deserves the right to live their best life. Absolutely fine. As Tommy said, nobody has a problem.

You can live as a dog or a cat as far as I'm concerned. It's fine. No, I don't think I'd let my children do that. Well, actually, there are kids at school called furries who go as a cat. We've had this argument time and time again. My solution, by the way, my solution is I would absolutely respect their right

to be a little furry cat. and I would give them a little litter tray outside the thing where they could go and urinate and I give them cat food. And trust me, after two days, they're back being girls again. Tommy, Tommy, the answer, Tommy, hang on, Sarah. Hang on, they're not talking once. Tommy, the answer apparently is to give puberty blockers to eight-year-olds.

So my question. That's called child abuse. And the fact that you have, the fact that you have somebody on this panel that is advocating for the ability to debilitate young boys so that they have gender delusion so that their body is now being mutilated, their actual biology is being changed irreversibly so that they compete against little girls. That's really the solution here. Let's debilitate boys so they don't have an advantage. Let's make sure that they don't have better muscle capacity and lung capacity. Let's make sure that they're just debilitated. Why don't we just break their

arms and their legs while we're at it so that they can compete against the little girls. Do you realize how sick that sounds? That's abuse. Yeah, I'm afraid it is. And Sora, I know you're keen to get into this debate. So on Saturday, A.B. Hernandez wins gold in the girls'

high jump and triple jump, the California high school track and field championships. The problem is, A.B. Hernandez is a biological male, right? So that means a girl has been deprived of winning two gold medals. How can that be fair?

How is that right? How is any of this not just completely insane? And why would you as a trans person not see that and then think the obvious solution to this is that either you compete against your biological sex as most trans athletes have done for many years before they suddenly put their hand up and say, I want to compete against women?

And then they're much more successful, which says it all. Or you have your own. category. What is wrong with having a trans category? What is wrong with that? There's so much to unpack here. I mean not really. Tell me exactly how many

trans athletes have gone and made a career out of sports who are making a living out of sports as a pro athlete. It just doesn't exist. And the whole argument that you are all using that it's massive where the United Nations are dominating. The United

Nation. Hang on. To all the people who are dominating and You asked me a question, I'm replying. The United Nations had a report recently. It said 900 medals last year around the world were deprived from female athletes because biological males who were trans athletes competing in women's sport won the medals. It's much more prevalent. It's much more prevalent than the trans world would like people to think.

And now you've got people like A.B. Hernandez, who's being supported all over the place by a woke left who didn't. get the memo from Trump's win that people are sick of this garbage. How terrible is it that a trans woman is doing well? It's terrible that a biological male, it's terrible that a biological male has an unfair physical advantage that allows the trans athlete, in this case, A.B. Hammondis to win gold medals in two state events. With such an advantage.

It is shame, it is an absolute. What she did not. Sarah, it is an absolute disgrace, and you know it. In your heart, you know it. This trans nonsense in sport has to stop. My question for you, why don't you just have... Why is it nonsense? Why don't you...

Because you've got unfair advantage. It's like cheating with drugs. It's the same thing. It's like when all the cyclists... Then why do we celebrate it in males? Sorry? Why do we celebrate biological advantages in males? Why?

When do you ever see a trans... man do well in sport. Many times. Go on. Name one. Name one in the boxing. You guys just aren't focused on it. They're males. You ever see a trans male boxer do well?

Yes. Go on. Where? Name me an Olympic gold medal. I don't have my source in front of me. Name me the last time a trans male won Olympic gold against a bloke. How many trans people in general are winning Olympic medals? More and more and more.

That's the problem. So I say, have your own pickleball trans category. I don't care. I want you to be enjoying your sport. I want you to be great at your sport. I want you to live your life, live your dream. I just don't want you trashing women's rights. What's wrong with that?

Women's rights are my rights. Well, they're not really when it comes to sport, are they? No, you're not. If you're not a woman, then they're not your rights. That's on you, but I will fight every day. You're taking women's rights away. Why would you? Why do you care about your rights?

Because they enjoy the sports that they love. Right. Why do you care about your rights so much, but not women's rights? I do. You don't. I am a woman. So I care about my rights as a woman. But you have a superior advantage to actual biological females.

You know it and I know it. My biology is much more female than it is male. And we can go on about science, but I'm not here to talk about science. I want you to get to know trans people before you try and demonize them. Don't demonize trans people. I know trans people. Caitlin Jenna is a good friend of mine. Caitlin Jenner won Olympic gold as a decathlete for the United States as a male,

because Caitlin was born a biological male. Caitlin now is a trans woman celebrated around the world, and she absolutely understands she has a superior biology, so she does not think it's fair. Why is she wrong, and you're right? I'm not saying I'm wrong or right. I can only tell you my experience. But what I can say is that if you truly believe that going through male puberty is something that gives you such a massive advantage,

then why are you fighting so hard to take away the rights of anyone who wants to go through puberty blockers, which is safe and reversible and make the decision amongst themselves? No, it's not. That's a lie. That is a lie. That is a lie. Not only are you advocating for child abuse, but what this is, peers, this is not only gender dysphoria and delusion. This is pure narcissism.

It's a group of people that have decided that they are special cases, that they are sacred cows, that they get to do whatever the hell they want. They get to trample over everybody else, and we have to concede to them because they feel that they are special. You can be special or you can be equal, but you cannot be both. If you want to live your life as a female, whatever, but not when you're trampling on the rights of women. Period. This is narcissism. This is saying, look at me.

I'm more important. All those other girls can get over it. It's just a few girls that are being left in the dust. Oh, well, just a few examples. If there's one woman who's being disadvantaged, if there is one woman that's being disadvantaged, that's too many. And peers, it really, really burns my ass

when I hear people say, oh, it's just a few examples. Those girls can just get over it. How about the one trans person? How about they get over it and compete against the boys? How about that? Yeah. You talk about having separate division. for trans people.

Yes. Okay? Well, it's pretty split down the middle between people who support trans people and people who do not. And here's the opportunity

you have to create a league where trans people aren't allowed, go for it. And there's an opportunity to create needs where we accept all. I think in your case, you should either compete against male pickable players

or compete in a... But you are not everybody. Or you compete in a trans. And I do agree that there are many who agree with you and there are many who agree with me that there is no threat. I don't know why you want to be...

Sarah, why do you want to be a cheat? I mean, seriously, why do you want to be a cheat? That's what you're doing. You're cheating. Cheating? No. That's very disrespectful. You know what, Dr. Weber?

It's really, it really isn't. It cuts to the heart of the debate. It is cheating. It is knowingly using a superior biology from birth to beat women who are born with female bodies. It is cheating. I'm not a science. It's time to call it out for what it is. And Dr. Webby, the idea you're a doctor and don't think that this is about science is breathtaking to me. Breath taking. Of course it's about science. Human being. I'm a doctor.

I'm a human being. I'm a compassionate person. What's that got to do with it? Why aren't you compassionate to women who are losing gold medals to men? I don't understand why you have this, this huge thing where we have to not, not, not One single woman must be affected by these terrible trans people. What about inclusion? We are living in a world where we want everybody. Oh, we's got nothing to do with inclusion. This is where the trouble starts.

It has everything to do. What's inclusive about women losing to men of boxing? What's inclusive about that? Very clearly that in this panel we have three women and we have one man. You've been very clear about that. Well, you have two women here, one man and one two. trans woman. That's what you have. We have three women and we have one man.

We have two biological males and two biological females. You could call it anything you like, but we have two biological males and two biological females. That's what we have on this panel. You know, Pierce, you opened this up saying if you trained hard enough, you could beat me easily. Yeah. So how do you see me? Am I a male or am I a female? Because if you think you can easily beat me because you're a male and I'm female.

Well, I happen to be very good at pickleball. So that's a different matter altogether. You kind of tattled on yourself. there. I'm just saying. No, it's a good point. And I take that one. But Dr. Webberley, I just find it baffling that a doctor thinks this is all about feelings and compassion. It's not. It's not about trans rights to fairness, equality, and safety. I want them to have fairness, safety, and equality. What I don't want, and Tommy doesn't want, is an erosion of women's rights to those three same things. And that is what's happening in sport. And that's why this is wrong. And I call you a

Can I ask? Sarah, I purely call you a cheat because you all know that this is fundamentally unfair. And I don't understand why you, I don't understand why you want to bring mockery. I don't know why you want to expose the trans community to mockery and abuse and calls of cheat and so on when you could just have your own category. When you could just have your own category. You could have your own category. You guys are the one doing that. Or you could compete against your biological sex. Then no one would complain.

I do. I compete against everyone and I have a blast and it's a ball. The only people who have a problem are the people who are talking about and have nothing to do with sports, let alone pickleball. Yeah. If LeBron James, my football community, except and loves to. Sarah, if LeBron James wanted to play basketball as a woman, would you be happy with that if he suddenly was in the American women's national team? Yes or no. I think it'd be hilarious. I'd be so curious and fascinated and I would take part in. destroy every record ever set by an actual woman? Would you respect his right to compete as a woman in the American women's national basketball team? Yes or no? Do I want to compete with LeBron James? No, no.

Would it be right for LeBron James to compete in the women's team if he identified as a woman? Yes or no. Right and wrong is going to be relative to what you compare it to. Just say right or wrong. Would you be right or wrong? No, it's not a simple black and gray and white. It really is. And you can't answer it.

Because everything in this world that we live is not binary. So you're not saying it would be wrong for LeBron James to compete as a woman. No, I'm not saying it would be wrong. You're not saying that? No. hilarious. Dr. Weberley, would it be wrong for LeBron James to compete in the women's national team for America if you wanted to? He's not a woman.

He doesn't live as a woman. He doesn't identify as a woman. So if you're not a biological woman, you shouldn't be allowed to. Is that your position now? So what is this biological woman that's just sub-nearer arisen? Because I went to meditical... Biological woman is a woman born with biological chromosomes, which says she's a woman.

Not difficult. You should know that, you're a doctor. And there are many, many people... You can keep saying, because you're a doctor, you ought to know this. It's just not bright. What are you a doctor in? You know chromosomes... What are you a doctor in?

We said at the beginning that it is not two categories, male and female. And chromosomes do not fit into two categories. Hormones don't fit into two categories. reproductive organs, external genitals, do not fit into two categories, and nor just gender identity. Now, this person you're speaking about, I don't follow American sports. Well, LeBron James is six foot eight.

He's probably one of the three greatest male basketball players in history. If he was to put his hand up and say, I'm now transgender and want to compete in the women's game, would you be happy with that? Yes or no? If the rules say that transgender women are equal and invited into that sport category and this person properly identifies as a woman rather than just one of your made-up kind of things which I feel that this is, then yes, if the rules say that trans-women are included in this.

Well, Sarah and Dr. Weberley, you have just ruined women's basketball irrevocably for the rest of time. Because LeBron James would break every record in women's basketball, never to be beaten by a woman, and that you think is equality, fairness, and everything else. What a load of old coblers, ironically. Thank you all very much indeed. Nice to talk to you all. Pierce Morgan Unsensit is proudly independent.

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