Piers Morgan Uncensored - Was Eurovision A Propaganda Tool For Israel?

Episode Date: May 14, 2024

While it’s supposed to be a unifying celebration of music, the Eurovision Song Contest practically never manages to stay apolitical; and this year was no exception. An unprecedented level of disruption and protest was directed at the Israeli entry Eden Golan over the weekend, as global anger at Israel’s actions in Gaza continues to grow. To discuss this year’s contest, Piers brings comedian James Barr, Israeli writer and activist Hen Mazzig, Novara Media host Michael Walker and Drag Queen Crystal onto the show. The debate gets heated when Crystal calls Eden Golan ‘a propaganda tool for the Israeli government’ and Hen claims no British person can call for the exclusion of Israel without becoming a hypocrite. YouTube: @PiersMorganUncensored X: @PiersUncensored TikTok: @piersmorganuncensored Insta: @piersmorganuncensored Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Eurovision Song Contest means many different things to many people. To me, it generally means sitting in the dark room and ignoring social media to prevent my head from literally exploding. But for reasons it will always baffle me, it's one of the biggest TV events in the entire world with hundreds of billions of deluded viewers. This year it was overshadowed, like so many things are, by protests about the Israel-Hamas War. And leading the charge was a charming non-binary Gothic witch, there was, not mine, called Bambi Thug. The Irish entry was ordered to remove pro-Palestine slogans from their costume, but didn't hold back in media interviews before and after the main event. Fuck the TV, I don't even care anymore.

Fuck them. The thing that makes this as a contestant, the community behind it, the love and the power and the support of all of us is what makes me change. And the world has spoken. The queeries are very. The queers are coming. The queers are coming. I see.

Well, thousands of pro-Palestine demonstrators picketed the event in Malmo, demanding that Israel's act be removed from the competition and calling for a boycott. Personally, I would boycott Eurovision in its entirety, albeit probably for very different reasons. Well, Gunn-Tunberg was, of course, there and removed by police. That seems to be her full-time job these days,

annoying people are getting arrested. Meanwhile, Israel's entry, a 20-year-old single named Eden Golan was loudly booed and heckled by the audience in the arena after being shunned by many of her fellow contestants in the build-up to the show. Whatever your views on this Israel-Hamas war, it should surely be self-evident that it's ridiculous to blame it on a 20-year-old woman, simply trying to perform at a song contest. And to the palpable fury of those who campaigned against her,

it spectacularly backfired. Once votes from a viewing public across Europe and the world were added to the total, Israel surged up leaderboard. More countries gave Israel the maximum 12 points from public votes than any other entry and Monsonger's narration number seven in the entire world on iTunes.

Israel's supporters say it's emphatic proof of a silent majority. Critics say it shows Eurovision has no moral compass. One thing is certain, it lays bare one of the most startling hypocrisies of this protest movement. Many of the BeKine Brigade were furious

that the pro-Palestine Dutch entry was kicked out of the competition even though he allegedly verbally abused a female producer. Bambi Thug, then performed a satanic imagery, wearing an X-rated bikini in the colours of a trans pride flag, which she'd earlier waved on camera. And many of the Eurovision superfans who called for a boycott are very stridently pro-LGB. And the other letters, of course, I can never remember. The irony, of course, is that Israel is pretty much the only place in the Middle East where gay people have any rights at all. I've got a pretty good idea about how a

Bambi Thug concert would go down in Gaza. It definitely wouldn't be. winning any public votes. Well, joining me now, comedian James Barrow, so he was moved to tears by Eurovision this weekend. Well, as was I had I watched it. The thought of it reduced me to tears. Israeli writer and activist Hem Mazik, host of Navarra Live, Michael Walker,

and the drag artist Crystal, who boycotted Eurovision over Israel's inclusion. All right, well, thanks all of you for joining me. James Barre, you reduced to tears. You said, I keep thinking of all the artists, delegations, production and people working by the scenes who spent their lives. building up to this moment only to be thrown to the walls by the EBU not taking appropriate action.

You know, so this was over the Eibu now disqualifying Israel when the lyrics of the song were originally deemed political. Here's what I don't get about this. Why should Israel not be allowed to compete in Eurovision? Because they've murdered over 33,000 people. Well, they were the subject of a terror attack. But they've murdered 33. At what point do we, they've lost the moral high ground peers. This isn't okay. Right. But. Just to be clear, a country that suffered a massive terror attack should not be allowed to have a contest at the Eurovision Song Contest.

I'm saying that if you murder 33,000 people... What about October the 7th? October the 7th is horrendous, awful. Why should that country not be allowed to perform in a Eurovision Song Contest? Because they have murdered... There's nuance here that you're missing. They've murdered 33,000 more people. You can't just excuse that by, oh, well, there was a terror attack.

There's a line in the sand. You have to draw it. Ukraine for responding to Russia, invading them. I think it's a completely different conversation. Would you ban Ukraine? Peir, you're trying to equate two different things. I'm asking you, Ukraine have killed a lot of Russians responding to the illegal invasion of Ukraine. Should they be banned by your criteria?

I mean, they haven't killed. Well, hang on, I will come to you. This is a good point. They haven't killed that many children. It's a completely different conversation. They have killed a lot of people. But, Pears, it's not as simple as that. And you know it is not simple as that.

It's not. Look, there's a moral line on this thing is a little huge. And there is a lot of hypocrisy, but this is quite a difficult thing to just answer. And a question like that is not helpful. It's divisive for no reason. All right, Hen, I think there's a lot of hypocrisy generally about all this. But I just think fundamentally, why would Israel be banned? I don't understand.

I mean, that's the level of the dehumanization that we have reached to. I mean, a British person would sit here and tell you that because of the actions of Israel, they should be banned from everywhere. I mean, a British person, have you looked at your history? Have you looked at what your country has done throughout the world? the world. And we illegally invaded Iraq? Well, I know that, I agree. Should we be banned then? Probably.

But you didn't call for it? You didn't call for a boycott? I didn't call for a boycott. Come over, so you were born with? Actually, you born then? Was I bought when? 2003. Yes, I was, thank you, though. I'm glad you think I looked so young. You were young, right? This isn't about me. But I oppose the Iraq war, for example, as editor of a daily mirror, and I don't

remember anyone calling for the UK to be banned because of the invasion of Iraq. Right, but that's what the dehumanization of Israel and Israelis has gone to, that a 20-year-old girl has been held in her hotel room. This Bambi Thug is demanding that she would be moved from the room that she's at because she doesn't want to see her in her presence. A European girl asking a Jewish girl to live to a different room

because she doesn't want to see her. We know when that happened less in Europe. And you have mob of tens of thousands of people sitting out, chanting outside her hotel room. You had helicopters around her. For what? For going to a music festival, to singing at a music festival.

And then they're putting out the kaffir, and they're upset that Israel and Israelis are trying to do. triggered by that. Of course, the last time that people came with the kaffir to a music festival was on October 7th. Right. And we know exactly what happened there. And several hundred innocent young people were butchered by a mass terrorist. All right, Michael, I'll be bringing you in. You wanted to jump in earlier. What did you think of this? Well, I found your line of questioning, why should they be banned because they've been subjected to a terrorist attack. I mean,

no one's claiming that's why they should be banned. People are saying they should be banned because they are fighting what now looks to many people like a genocide war, right? You've got 13,000 kids who have been killed. Now, the argument, you seem to be making there was why are we bringing politics into Eurovision. You know, we didn't kick out Britain during the Iraq War. Now, I was too young to have an opinion on it then. Probably I would have agreed if people had said we should have done that then. But what we do have is a very recent example of us saying Russia can't engage in this competition. Such a false equivalence. Well, it's not a false equivalence. And the reason I said this,

actually, I think there's a stronger case, there's a stronger case for kicking out Israel than there is for Russia. The reason I say this is very specific. Israel has killed more civilians by quite a considerable degree in six months in Gaza. According to you, the UN says that the numbers are false. Today they came out and said, fog of war, they can't tell if the numbers are right. There are two different sets of numbers going around at the moment. So one is how many people have been identified, so sort of names, social security numbers. Now, if you're looking at names and social security numbers, it's 8,000 kids, 5,000 women, right? Now, the UN said... That's identified immediately, right? After every attack, they know exactly that the exact same number of... Hang on, hang on.

Look, I'm moderated at this. Here's what I would say. Let's not quibble about how many thousands of civilians. A lot of civilians have been killed in Israel's response to a terror attack. Now, the Russia illegal invasion of Ukraine, to me, the idea that that is not as bad, given they illegally invaded a sovereign democratic country and have ravaged large parts of it, stolen a third of Ukraine, killed countless civilians in the process. Why would you somehow think that that is morally,

less disagreeable than what Israel's been doing responding to a terror attack. Well, so both are absolutely terrible, right? Russia's invasion of Ukraine was a war of aggression. It was illegal. They have killed, less civilians than Israel have killed, but they have killed a lot of soldiers, and those weren't people who wanted to go fight the Russians, right? I don't think actually provoking a war with a country and then killing a lot of their soldiers. Why is what Israel has done worse? Okay, well, the reason, well, I'll put it this way, because I think You said it was worse. I'm curious why. I'm saying there is more reason why they should be kicked out.

Because I think the biggest evil and why so many people right now are incredibly passionate that Israel shouldn't be engaging in these kinds of competitions is because people, people don't care that much about politics. They don't like to see women and children bombed, right? They don't like to see people kicked out of their homes time after time after time. But they're not as bothered by seeing innocent Ukrainians killed. Well, the issue with Ukraine, right, was that our government was pretty much in line with a fairly moral position. Right. So most people on the left thought that Russia's, there were some exceptions, but most people on the left thought Russia's invasion of Ukraine was completely outrageous. And then what did our government do? They put sanctions on the Russian regime, right? Now, most people on the left, and actually the general population, more generally, if you look at polling, it's much more representative than who votes in Eurovision contests, right? People are incredibly outraged at what Israel is doing because they are seeing civilians being killed. They're seeing...

Well, you outraged, Barks over the seven. Yes. What did you tweet about it? So my position on October the 7th is, I think... What did you tweet about it? Well, I tweeted very early on that Palestinians have a right to self-defense, which they do. Well, hang on.

What did you tweet about the terror attack? I can't remember exactly. Anything? Well, I tweeted that they shouldn't have killed the civilians, right? What did you tweet about the October the 7th terror attack? Well, okay. This isn't particularly... I'm just curious.

Well, I don't really understand the line of questioning. If you're asking me, what you're asking me? I'm just wondering. I'm just wondering. You're saying that everybody was outraged by Israel's response. Okay, a lot of people are. I get it. But were you as outraged by what happened October the 7th?

And if so, you're in a public platform. You're well known. You have a lot of followers. What did you tell your followers about it? So I think the ultimate route of what is going on. Well, I don't, I'm going to ask the question as I want to answer it. Okay. You're not going to ask the question.

I'm going to say what I think about this particular issue, which you're asking me about. First of all, answer my question. So what is the question? What did you say publicly about October the 7th terror attack? So first of all, I said something along lines of Palestinians have a right to resistance. That was your response? Yes. So you thought it was justice.

Okay. Can you let me finish a sentence? I'm stunned by what I was heard. It's because you're not letting me finish a sentence. You think there's 1,200 people. Bouchered, raped, burned, alive, babies being kidnapped, Holocaust victims being kidnapped. You think that's somehow justified? No, you haven't let me finish the sentence. You said that your first response was to say

Palestinian... Can you please let me finish a sentence? This seems a little bit pointless, okay? I have a very coherent position if you would like to listen to it. I could have expressed it in about 20 seconds, but you kept into... You said that was your response? Okay, you didn't let me finish the sentence. Okay, Palestinians do have a right to resistance. That's enshrined in the UN, sort of an international law, they don't have a right to target and kill civilians. So the moment it became clear that they had targeted and killed civilians, I condemned that.

I think you shouldn't. Was it a terror attack? I don't think any cause. Yes, I think it was a terror attack. Okay. I amass a terrorist organization? I think pretty much. I mean, there are levels of it.

All right, okay. Fair enough. Fair enough. The bar is so low that we would accept even that. Well, let me look. We're going to lose Crystal. Let me bring in Crystal, who is a drag artist. Sadly, not in your costume.

Unerite's Crystal. A little disappointing for people like me that love a good drag queen. But you boycotted Eurovision over Israel's inclusion. Why? You know, for the reasons that have already been outlined, I'm outraged by Israel's behavior in Palestine. And I think that when you are killing innocent civilians,

you shouldn't get to promote a cultural message. So just to be clear, every country in the world that kills innocent civilians should be banned from Eurovision. Who could qualify? I think we are in a very serious. specific situation this year because... Well, no, hang on. I'm just taking your criteria. If killing innocent civilians is your position, that's fine.

I respect it. But how many countries in Europe do you think have killed innocent civilians in the last 20 years who by that criteria should be banned from Eurovision? We're seeing mass, mass casualties on a scale that is pretty unprecedented in modern history. So I think it's justified. Okay, I mean, you've presumed be, are you aware of the Iraq war? Are you aware of the Afghanistan war? Are you aware of what's happened in Syria? I am, curious.

Are you aware of what's happening in the U.S. I mean, actually, actually, far bigger death tolls have been seen in all over the world now in the last 20 years. It just never got this attention, which does come back to one sentiment the Jewish people feel, which is they get singled out. And it's actually hard not to conclude that when you hear people just airbrush all these other conflicts like they never happened. Uh-huh. I mean, you just said that I did that,

but I didn't do that. Well, by all means, correct me if I'm wrong. I wasn't living in the UK during the Iraq war. I hadn't even heard of Eurovision. So frankly, I don't have, I don't know, I don't have a position on the UK. But as an artist, as an artist, targeting a young 20-year-old woman

who's living her dream, representing her country, I would, I would, I would say that anyone who targeted, would, would you like me to answer? I would, I would say that anyone who targeted her personally is, I think that was, that's a mistake. I do see, however, that she was representing her national broadcaster and essentially there is a propaganda tool for the Israeli government singing a song. Well, talking propaganda tools, Olli Alexander, the UK's contestant. You managed to get no points in the public vote, which is quite an achievement, actually, although from what I hear, he's dreadful. and Bambi Thug,

they've supported the Queers for Palestine movement, which is such a touching movement, given that actually if you were openly queer in Palestine, and that's would have you thrown off a roof. What is the Queers for Palestine movement all about? Well, I don't think that the right to life, I don't think the right to queer liberation is not more important than the right to life.

And I think that's just a reasonable position to hold. You know, if you're queer right now in Palestine, you're not going to die because you're going to be thrown off a roof. You're going to die because of an Israeli bomb. Did you ever care about that before? I think this is a disingenuous line of questioning to say that we're suddenly caring about queer people in Palestine when those people are being caught up right now.

You didn't care about them being persecuted before Israel responded to the terror attack. What? No, I didn't say that. Gay people being killed, left, right and center in Palestine. Yeah, and I condemn any government. Have you? Have you said anything about gay people? First I do.

You go on television programs like this and publicly express your outreach. Did you put out of a television program when I'm given the opportunity to do so? Did you put out of competitions? Frankly, no one asked for my, no one asked for my views on Iran's treatment of gays or Russia's treatment of gays.

But now they're scared to discuss my boycott. No, I think, I mean, I'll defend what Chris was saying there. I'm the same. You know, sometimes you forget to tweet things and others you don't. But ultimately, we're not. We're not that narcissistic that we think that queer rights are more important than the actual lives of people. People's lives are more important. I was horrified.

What did you tweet? I don't remember exactly what I tweeted, but I was absolutely disgusted. Do you remember the kind of general context of what you're doing? Well, the context would have been how disgusted I was. It was awful. I have friends that work in the music industry. It was at a music festival peers. It was horrendous and so upsetting.

But it's really hard to talk about it because as soon as you say anything, you're thrown under a bus by someone. I'm serious. I'm serious point, James. Lots of ridiculous conversations about the war in Iraq. Like, of course we should have been told we can be in Eurovision because of that. Here's my point. Once you bring politics into these things, where do you stop? Politics was always in your vision.

And I think that's the lie here. I think the EBU is so entrenched with national broadcasters who are entrenched with public. I think the whole thing's a lot of crap. I wouldn't watch Eurovision if you literally held a gun to my head, ironically. And of course, a lot of politics is in play in there. But if you're going to start singling out countries, for elimination and boycotts and treat young women like that. No one should be treated like that.

No one. Because all of it, but it wasn't just... You were crying over the fact that wasn't a boycott that young woman. That's not exactly what I said. Don't shake crocodile tears now. I was crying about all of the people that are working for that event who are unfortunately beheld by the decision that the EU didn't make and therefore look bad as well. You weren't crying for her.

You were crying for the fact she wasn't boycott. I genuinely do feel very sorry. You were the bad. As soon as you're very obsessed with what people tweet on any particular day, What did you tweet when Russia were kicked out of the Eurovision? I think it was completely justified. You think it was completely justified? So you are happy with politics being brought into Eurovision.

No, no. Here's my point about the Russia. That's political, right? I agree that it was good that they were picked down, but that was illegal. I think if you illegally invade a sovereign democratic country in Europe, absolutely you should be banned. What about if you illegally occupied in sport? What about it? Illegally occupied, Gaza. What about it?

Legally occupied, though. Stop with this. Come on. Everything is just, you love to throw in facts that are just wrong. So, everyone, it's all false. And we have a gay British guy, a drag queen, being out here advocating for Hamas. Okay, not supporting Hamas. Okay, that is not what I've said.

I have never once said that. Making the case for them. I don't care that. Sure, you condemn Hamas. But at the end of the day, all you care about you said that, and the drag queen said that both of you, that all you care about is what people tell you to care about, right? That's not what we said. You said, why didn't you speak about Iran?

Why didn't you speak about gay people being killed in Iran? I have spoken about that. I've actually spoken about that a lot. I've spoken about gay people being thrown off roofs a lot. A Palestinian gay person that was beheaded in the West Bank. Two years ago, why didn't you talk about all of this? Let's bring this back to you. All you're doing is just feeding into a very popular to be anti-Israel.

That's what it is. I am not anti-Israel. I want to bring it back to the death of civilians. I think you made a really important point there where the reason that you think it was sort of justifiable for Russia to be kicked out of the Eurovision song contest was they had, you know, it was a war of aggression. That's one of the ultimate war crimes. Now, another really important war crime is occupying someone else's territory and settling

your people there, moving in your people. Now, whatever sophistry you might try and employ, I think you're going to struggle to deny that the West Bank is under Israeli occupation. So there's Hamas in the West Bank? You say that there's Hamas in the West Bank? No, so it's Gaza, right? We're talking about Gaza.

Don't confuse. Don't conflate. Speak about each area and specifically. We're speaking about Hamas attacking from Gaza. Not about the West Bank. Leave the West Bank, please. Speak about Gaza. Maybe it's you guys who should leave the West Bank.

Right. Okay. It is, if we're talking about international law, which I think it's very important. We need a framework. It is important. As to how we can understand the world and how we can hold people to account.

Now, you're absolutely right. Russia did conduct a war of aggression against Ukraine. That was against international law. Israel has also been conducting an illegal occupation for 57 years. In a different area. It doesn't matter, right?

It doesn't matter what area you're committing your international war crime, right? Wait, so there is a Palestinian state it's in the West Bank in Gaza? I'm talking about it. I'm saying it's unconfircial. Michael, but Michael. But Michael, here's my response to it.

Here's my response. the UK broke international law with the illegal invasion of Iraq. That was 2003. That's a much shorter time period, the one you're talking about. It's not a shorter time period. This is important, because I'm not talking about something that happened 57 years ago. I'm talking about something that's been happening for 57 years. So Israel is still expanding settlements in the West Bank.

I wanted to clarify that. And for the record, I've been challenging them about the expansion of settlements, I think it's completely indefensible, right? I think the issue whether they're committing war crimes and their response to the October 7th attack has yet to be... But expanding settlements isn't. war crime as well, right? I believe the expanded settlements are completely wrong. But it's a war crime. Well, I'm not a lawyer, but I think it's completely wrong. But I do think that we need to focus

back on this, which is Israel is being punished in this debate because of its response to a terrorist attack. Russia illegally invaded Ukraine. There was no provocation from Ukraine whatsoever. I mean, there were political posturings, but nothing that warranted an illegal invasion of their country. Right. So to me, there are completely different things. And I just want to wonder how far you take it. If you start to say, as Crystal said, that actually if you kill innocent people, you shouldn't be allowed to compete in Eurovision, okay, well, that's pretty much most countries in Europe would have blood on their hands, the ones who took part in the illegal evasion of Iraq, France, Germany, you know, and so on and so on. So my point is, once you fly

this moral halo over an event like that, there is rank hypocrisy. But I don't understand how you can both make that argument and then also back Russia being expelled. Either you have a non-political Eurovision or you have a political Eurovision. I think if you're having a political Eurovision... Because I see a moral distinction. Israel has been breaking international law for 57 years. Yeah, but that's... You're talking...

Is the UK break international law? I think the war in Iraq was illegal. So you think now... Does the UK has any issues at all? So the issue here, I think... Is there any issues with international law? Is it continuous? So I'm not aware of the UK.

I mean, I'm happy to be talking about... I'm not aware of the UK currently breaking international law. I think we have done in the recent past. I think Israel is currently breaking international law. And they have been for 57 years. And you don't think any of the countries in the Eurovision in Europe are not engaging in any violation of international law, in Darfur, in Africa, in Asia, anywhere around the world.

You think there's no engagement at all? All those countries are perfect. There's only one country that has an issue. And it happens to be the Jewish state. I don't think any country is perfect, actually. And I think America's broken international law. Well, I mean, I think the more in Iraq was illegal. So America is hosting the next World Cup, for example, right, with Mexico and Canada.

Should that be boycotted? We're going back to the same issue, which is, is it happening? We are, yeah. We're saying how far do you fly the moral flag? Is it happening right now? Right? So Israel has continuously been breaking the international world by expanding settlements. Did you start hearing about the last eight months or did it start before?

Did you, did you advocate for Palestinians before? So I advocate for people following international law. And as I keep saying, Israel, I'm sure if we'll measure your tweets, you have been heavily focused on Palestine, right? In the last many years you've been doing this war? I mean, heavily focused on. So to pretend that it's about the war that is happening right now,

to pretend that it's about the occupation in the West Bank, it's not about that. It's not about that. And you're saying, well, if you tweeted about it before October... Right, but I'm saying your interest has not started because of the war. You're saying because there's a war right now, that's why you think it should be bad. Did you support the BDS movement before October?

Yeah, I support the BDS movement. Exactly. So you supported boycotting Israel long before the war that is happening right now. Okay. So what, so when, how is that making any sense? Okay. Because you're saying you care about it because of the war, right? Do you want me to explain? Do you want me to explain?

So I think lots of people have this question. Why do progressives and young people care so much about Israel and Palestine, right? Relatively small part of the world. Now I would say the reason is, one, that Israel is heavily backed by, for example, our government. So people feel implicated somewhat different to what's going on in Sudan and Darfur, where our government sort of opposes the leaders in Sudan. Is there other countries you support, the UK support? Or is it just a...

Let me finish it. No, just say, but make sure that you include all the facts. Okay, well, I think this would be simpler if you let me finish my sentence. No, but you can say your sentence. The point is that we're talking about a single standard. I'm going to explain. I'm going to explain why. Before October the 7th, you're quite right, lots of people cared about the Israel-Palestine issue.

The reason is they think that our government, and I think this is true, has given Israel pretty much unconditional support to continuously break international law in expanding settlements in the West Bank. And one reason why people find this so sort of objectionable is because it's done on the basis of ethnicity. We rightly have a big taboo when it comes to racism

and kicking people out of their homes because of their ethnicity and replacing them with people of another ethnicity. Now that's been taboo for a long period of time. What ethnicity are you talking about? Jewish and non-Jewish. Jewish is an ethnicity. I don't know what you want to call it.

It's a basis of citizenship. And Palestinians are not an ethnicity as well. They're not Arabs? Well, it doesn't... Is it Jews versus... Tell me your world of the race science here. I'll try to understand. Well, no, I'm talking about Israeli law.

So the issue is with Jews, right? No, the issue is, with the fact, I'm explaining how the colonization of the West Bank works. Where did the Jews come from? Well, this is a completely separate question. No, it is important. We're talking about ethnic cleansing and replacing population with other ethnicity.

You're talking about Jews and ethnicity. We're placing Arabs, right? Tell me why the Jews came from. You might be talking about 2,000 years ago. Where did the Jews came from? It doesn't make a difference. Because it doesn't make a difference where anyone came from. You're talking about liberating the land.

I'm with you. You're talking about liberating the land of Palestine. So you think when you pick a Palestinian out of their home and replace them with a Jew, that's liberation. No, I'm asking you. You're talking about liberating the land from Jews, right, from the ethnicity of Jews. You say the Jews replaced Palestinians. And fine, who is the original? Who is the original in the West Bank with Jews?

It's completely irrelevant. Right. It's completely irrelevant. We'll move you slightly off topic, which is the, there is an. question about the double standards of this, right? I mean, you raised it about Russia and so on. And, James, I mean, where is this line going forward? It's been a huge kerfuffle here, right?

I feel very sorry for this young female singer who had a big night ruined. But you have to feel sorry for all of the other performers who've also had their dreams ruined too because everybody has been affected by this. Everyone is affected by this. People in Israel, people in Gaza. People around the world are all affected by this,

no matter what side you're on. By Eurovision. You're trying to both sides, wherever you're at. By Eurovision? No, by the situation. And the boycott thing, like, everyone is entitled to boycott something if they wish to. That's totally fine. The targeting a young woman like that?

We've condemned that, Pais. We don't need to keep coming back to it. That's obviously awful. You shouldn't target anybody. On a separate issue, what about the fact that some of these people putting their halos on, right? Bambi Thug, who put on what many thought was a satanic performance, involving a lot of spells, black magic, dark clob. clothing, satanic symbols, voodoo dolls.

Do you believe in all of this? I just think it's odd given there's such a very young audience watching around the world. Kids, right? You never watched the Disney film? Don't we have the Finland contestant, right? I mean, I only caught up with this on social media, thank God. But imagine watching this with your kids with the Finland contestant who just basically strips naked, right? On a show televised around the world to literally millions of kids watching this.

I mean, is that right? I don't think that's entirely true. I'd like to see the actual statistics on how many children were watching. Because in mainland Europe, this is after 9 p.m. Millions of kids watching. This song was also a lot later. Do you know what time kids are going to bed in Spain, Italy? I think it's ridiculous.

Literally 10 o'clock. People have seen Disney films, right? Well, men get their dicks out? Like that? No. And it was mostly covered, wasn't it? No, not really. No?

I think it pretty much was. No. And also, there was a terrible, by the way, an absolutely appalling piece of misgendering. I don't know if you noticed it. It came from a very surprising source. Let's take a look. The 68 Eurovision song contest.

What a worthy winner. People make mistakes all the time. I thought it was a non-binary they then. Yes, they are non-binary. Graham Norton, who's gay, he called that person name. I'm sure Graham made a mistake. It happens, but it's when it's a deliberate attack. Should he be banned from ever hosting again?

I mean, what a stupid question. Of course. Wow, I would be. I'd be cancelled. You would have done it. You're like, you're screaming away. Misgendering is the most thing in the world? Because you'd have gone in there and you'd have deliberately misgendered.

You know what my new rule is? I honestly have a new rule. If there's only one of you looking at me, I can't call you a plural. That's your new rule? Has to be. But you, I mean, you use the correct pronouns earlier. If it's you looking at me and you demand to be called they,

I demand to be called my pronouns, hot, hotter, hottest. I'm afraid those don't fit. Am I going to have that? No, I'm afraid not. Okay, final point to you, Michael. I know we've got to wrap this up. But just on that point, never mind the Israel component of this, has Eurovision just become pretty unpleasant fare for kids?

I'm not a Eurovision expert. I'm a similar position to you, so I don't know how much has changed over the years. I do think it's absurd. I saw Olli Alexander's performance. I thought it wasn't quite as good as George Michael's situation in a toilet. He was terrible.

What's he doing? UK contested. I think it was amazing. I got no idea if it's got rude than it used to be. If it was amazing, this is what your vision has always been. Bucks fizz with the skirts being ripped off,

Poland with the butter churning. This is part of Eurovision. Some idiot, in a urinal, representing my country. Why don't you answer them, peers? I couldn't do worse than him. Why don't you enter it? He got literally no public votes. Just wear the same suit.

He literally got the infamous new plan. The entire world went, what is this crap? You may as well be having that crap. Anyway, on that bomb shop, great to see you all. I give you your own. Thank you very much. I think we're all agreed. Eurovision's become an absolute way to time. The one way to solve all this problem is to cancel it.

Just get rid of it. Eurovision. Problem solved. Can we cancel your show first? Absolutely not. We cancel you, though. Thank you to my panel. Appreciate it.