Piers Morgan Uncensored - ‘Why Don’t You Move To Iran Or Venzuela?’ Roger Waters vs Piers Morgan

Episode Date: January 16, 2026

Venezuela has more oil than any other country in the world - but 80% of its people are living in poverty. It’s a democracy, at least in name, but the man who won the last election with 68% of the vote is facing jail and living in exile in Spain. The popular socialist patriotism of Hugo Chavez, whether you personally liked it or not, has been wrecked by the corruption and incompetence of the man he trusted to replace him - Nicolas Maduro. Maduro still has some supporters - and one of the most prominent among them is the legendary Pink Floyd musician Roger Waters, who joins Piers Morgan to discuss Venezuela, Iran, Trump... and those comments he made about Ozzy Osbourne. Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent and supported by: Melania: Step inside 20 days before history is made - watch MELANIA, only in theaters January 30; get your tickets now! Oxford Natural: To watch their full stories, scan the QR code on your screen or visit https://oxfordnatural.com/piers/ to get 70% off your first order when you use code PIERS. Mando: Control Body Odor ANYWHERE with @shop.mando and get 20% off + free shipping with promo code PIERS at https://shopmando.com! #mandopod Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Roger, welcome back to Unsensitive. Maduro, there aren't many people out there flying the flag with this despot. It's an invasion. The kidnapping of Nicholas Maduro. They made up the daft story about him being a drug dealer, which is absolute errant nonsense. I believe in human rights for all my brothers and sisters.

Do you support the protesters in Iran at the moment? Here we go. You support the protesters and you support the regime. Yes, of course. Here's grow up. The Iranians do not want regime change. You might think Donald Trump's a jolly good chap. He was always a real scumbag. You rail a lot about America, but you live in America.

Why do you act on the point of principle? I'm going to live in Iran or Venezuela. Here, darling, maybe I will. It may well be that Donald and his cabal will make that decision for me. You don't regret the things you said about Ozzy Oswald and the hurt that caused his family. Oh, shut up.

If you've listened to, watched or read anything much about Venezuela in the past few weeks, and the chances are that you have, you will be aware of some common themes. Venezuela has more oil than any other country in the world, but 80% of its people live in poverty. It's run by a proudly leftist regime, but only a tiny cabal of cronies get rich, while the working class is shattered by hyperinflation,

empty shops, and medicine shortages. It's a democracy, at least in name. but the man who won the last election was 68% of the vote, is facing jail and living in exile in Spain. The popular socialist patronism of Hugo Chavez, whether you personally liked it or not, has been wrecked by the corruption and incompetence of the man he trusted to replace him, Nicholas Maduro.

The reason these are common themes is because they're borne out by facts, not least the fact the late million Venezuelans have fled the country as refugees. But not everybody agrees with these facts. Maduro still has some supporters, and one of his most prominent supporters, is the legendary Pink Floyd musician, Roger Waters. He joins me on Uncensure.

Roger, welcome back to Unsense. Thank you, Pearce. Nicholas Maduro. There aren't many people out there flying the flag with this despot. Why do you support him? There are many people out here flying the flag of Nicholas Maduro.

I support him because he's the duly democratically elected leader of a country that represents all the principles of Bolivari and Chavez revolutionary process. So he represents the people of Venezuela who live a completely different way of life than in the United States where I live or in England where you live. But it is one that I admire

because it's based upon socialist principles and the idea of equal human human rights. rights for all people. I don't want to make a long speech, but that's why. On the point about him being a democratically elected... Yeah, well, on the point about the democratically elected part of the equation, as you know, I think 60% of the countries around the world believe that the last election was rigged, that he banned his main opponent from even running, that he claimed victory when he hadn't won, that he stayed in office when he shouldn't have done.

That's the antithesis of democracy. It's the kind of thing you see in Russia. Now, you're talking about, if you're right about this, and I'm not, I don't know whether you are right about the 60% or not, but that would be 60% of the leaders of the governments of countries around the world, not the countries, if the countries are the people who live in those countries. It's a bit like other things that we're going to get on to later, probably, like Gaza. Most of the people all over the world

despise the genocide that's going on in Palestine. So we can go to that later if you want, but what I'm saying is that what we tend to see is the propaganda put out by the governments of the other countries in the world. So what we hear is what the American government and the English government and the French government and the EU and the blah, blah, blah,

have to say. about the Bolivarian revolution. Okay, not necessarily the people. There are good people everywhere. But Roger, if it's been so great in Venezuela, why have eight million Venezuelans left the country under Maduro? Because of the US sanctions, obviously,

because since 2001. Don't forget, there was a coup organized by the United States, probably by Eleanor Abrams, if I remember, to depose Hugo Chavez when he was first elected. as the president of Venezuela back in 1990. So they tried to depose him in a coup d'etat in 2002,

which didn't work because the people of Venezuela said, are you joking? Which is exactly what they're saying now. They said it in 2019, where the American government and the rest of the West tried to impose Guido on them in a coup, and they're saying it again now. And the reason that people are leaving

is because it's very difficult to live in a country that which has had shocking and appalling sanctions imposed upon it by a very, very powerful foreign empire, namely the United States of America. But it's also true. That's only my theory. Well, sure. But it's also true that Madeira's presidency has been marred not just by economic crisis,

but by political repression, widespread accusations of corruption and drug trafficking. as I said, 8 million people left. But while he was in power, Medeuro's regime was accused of widespread crimes against humanity by the United Nations, included extrajudicial killings and torture techniques such as electric shock, sexual violence,

and as fictiation as part of a plan, they said the UN orchestrated at the highest levels of the government to repress dissent. I mean, why would you align yourself to a regime like that? Pierce, I've talked to you before. We did a show once. I think in London a couple of years ago, I think. So I understand where you're coming from

because I understand that you believe the mainstream media in the West. So you could have read any... Excuse me, I haven't finished. No, you could have read any and all of this in the pages of the New York Times. But it was the United Nations. Well, you talked, excuse me,

you talked about drug trafficking. There is no mention of Venezuela in any of the reports from the deal. even in the United States of America, to link Venezuela or Maduro to any drug trafficking. So this is a new story that's been cooked up very, very recently in order to support the latest attacks upon that country. Anyway, you know, to go into the detail is you and me is nonsense. We have different opinions about these things. And we don't need to need, really, to air those different opinions.

My position is this. I believe in human rights for all my brothers and sisters. I believe for human rights for my brothers and sisters equal under international law. In Venezuela and the United States of America and England, where I come from, where we don't have them anymore because England is now a fascist state, witness the criminalizing of Palestine Act, and so on. I believe in equal human rights for Pakistan.

Palestinians, Israelis, the people of Iran, which is now a big question mark. It looks as if they're, I don't know what it looks as if. I don't want to start guessing about the future of it. But that's my platform. The universal declaration of human rights. I understand. I'm curious about your platform in this sense. Is that my understanding is that for all your support of someone like Maduro and his regime,

you have a very different view of the Iranian regime. You think they're a bad thing? No, of course not. It's none of my business. I'm not an Iranian. Why don't we let the Iranians figure out what kind of government they want? We absolutely know one thing.

We know they don't want the Shah's son back. Here's the least popular... Sorry, I've obviously... We know they do not want... Excuse me. We know the Iranians do not want regime change. We've seen... that what's happened over the last week, I believe,

in a lot of Iran, and there have been a lot of deaths. But I'm doing my research. It takes a while. You have to get into it. You have to go to the right places. You have supported the protests. What do you mean? Oh, you mean the wearing of the Hajib thing.

I do support. I support the right of women to dress how they want anywhere in the world. I do, yeah. I do not agree with the... Do you support the protesters in Iran at the moment? Well, if it was the shopkeepers who went, oh my God, inflation's going through the roof, let's do something about it.

Of course I do. Why shouldn't they say? And so did the government. The government sent the police out to protect those grocers, those business owners, those ordinary working people in Iran. Okay. And they were attacked by gangs,

of armed thugs who murdered, we believe. We don't know. The truth isn't all out. But armed thugs, probably organized by MI6 and the CIA, murdered thousands of people. So just to be clear, you support the protesters and you support the regime.

Yes, of course. I would love regimes where people could protest, like the good woman who was just murdered in Minneapolis, and the government could govern for the benefit of the people. I live in the United States where the government does not govern for the benefit of the people. It governs for the benefit of the oligoths and the very rich, and everyone knows it. Right. So I can't support the current...

Sorry, go on. Well, my view of the Iranian regime, and tell me where you disagree with this characterization, is that for 47 years, since they topple the Shah, and I'm not saying by any means the Shah regime was perfect. But certainly by comparison to what we see today, Iranians had a much better quality of life under the Shah than they do under this regime. And that this regime has been one of the most repressive

and degrading regimes on the Iranian people of any regime in the world. And that is by common consent of every international organization you care to think of. Piers, darling, darling, please. I disagree. But why wouldn't we ask Iranians to answer that question? I have asked Iranians.

Because they've answered the question. Excuse me, I'm not talking about the M-E-K. I'm not talking about Rudy Giuliani in the United States. I'm talking about actual Iranians. So actually, there are 80 million of them. The Iranian people are absolutely united to defend Iran against the influence of the empire of the United States of America. I promise you that is true.

Why are so many Iranian people taking to the streets to protest against their own regime? Here we go again. For the cameras, before the ceremony, before history is made, every detail is chosen. From Amazon MGM studios comes Melania. This new film takes you inside the 20 days leading up to the 2025 presidential inauguration

through the eyes of the First Lady herself, where fashion isn't just style, it's strategy. witnessed the image to finding decisions made behind closed doors, a celebration of duty and glamour. Melania, only in theatres, January 30. They're not they were protesting against inflation

and against the devaluation of the rye or whatever the currency is called. And they stopped protesting the minute anybody started talking about regime change or re-imposed. Excuse me, Well, they haven't stopped protesting. The Shah's family.

Where are you getting this from? Well, I'm not there. I'm not there. No, you're not there. But were you getting your information? No, but I have lots of friends who are there because I have, I'm quite, I'm philosophically quite close to the people of Iran, all right? And the mass of the people, this is what you keep not understanding, is the mass of the people

are absolutely solidly. opposed to the foreign interference. And this, of course, includes all of the sanctions against Iran that have caused the massive inflation and the devaluation. But why do you think Iran has been sanctioned? Because it's the last country on the list that Paul Wolfowitz told Wesley Clark about back whenever it was in the Pentagon

of the countries that the United States want to destroy so that they can take over the world. And it's the last one standing. They've destroyed the other six. There were seven on the list. In fact, the reason Iran's been sanctioned. Hang on, Roger. The reason Iran's been sanctioned is because it is unarguable

that it has been a major sponsor of terror organizations all through the Middle East. From the hooties, the hooties, to Hezbollah, to Hamas. Well, it's true. It's not a Palestine action. It's nonsense. Anyway, one man's terrorism is another man's freedom. Well, let me ask you that.

So do you think, do you think, let me ask you first, then, because it's important to what I just said. Of course, that only applies if you view Hamas, Hezbollah and the Houthis as terror groups, do you? Da-da-da, here we go. peers grow up, this is an absurd conversation. It's like you,

what you're trying to do is drag this conversation into one about the meaning of the word terrorist and who is and who isn't. Well, anybody with an IQ above room temperature knows that that's a meaningless conversation and that the word terrorist is a blight on our language because it doesn't mean anything significant. It means whatever the person using it wants it to mean.

So if you drop bombs on people and murder hundreds of thousands of people and you're on the right side of whoever's opinion is, you are not a terrorist. But if you kill a few people somewhere else, you are. So it's just a question of where you stand in the political and the global political spectrum. Sure. So just to be clear where you stand. That's why the word should,

either be defined properly as to what it. For instance, I believe terrorists, mean to try to accomplish political ends by acts of violence that involve murder. Am I right? Is that it? Yeah, pretty much, yeah. I mean, yeah, okay. Well, then anybody, you know,

so to call Hamas terrorists, but not to call the Israelis terrorists, is absurd, obviously. I mean, are Israel not murdering? Hundreds of, excuse me. At some stage, I have to ask you a question. So on October the 7th, 2023, did Hamas commit an act of terrorism? Oh, God. Not again. Not again.

Well, did they or not? I'm not going. Do you know what's good about me having this conversation with you now in hindsight? Because we had this conversation when we spoke last. And I said the word Zaka to you, and you went, well, did you find out who Zaka are, as I asked you to when we had a conversation before? Did you? Who are they? Roger, with respect, I just asked you whether Hamas. Excuse me. No, will you. You see, this is nonsense. If you want to interview me, we'll do that for a show of your own. You're on my show. I'm asking you questions. I'm simply curious whether you believe what Hamas did on October the 7th. was an act of terrorism.

You know, well, October the 7th is a very complex. On some level, it's very simple, i.e. it was an act of resistance by an occupied people. The armed wing, okay, the armed wing of an occupied people. That's what it was. So it wasn't terrorism as an act of resistance? Well, I'm not going to get involved in your terms. terrorism story. What I am, I mean, who murdered most of the people? The Israelis did,

have you seen the piles of bombed out cars destroyed by hellfire missiles? Thousands and thousands of them. You think the Israelis kill most of the people who died on over the 7th? Yes, I do. Yes. What a load of nonsense. Honestly, Roger. Seriously. Well, isn't that interesting that you should say that. Look at the evidence peers. You've never even heard of Zaka. Where do you get your evidence from? Where do you get your evidence from? Really curious. Reading.

We had this, Pierce, we had this conversation. I'm looking at your worldview, Roger. Roger, look, you don't need to do this. You're a very wealthy, successful, talented musician, made a fortune as a member of Pink Floyd. You don't need to say all these things. I'm just having you on to try and get to understand where this comes from.

You think Nicholas Maduro that most people think was a disgusting tyrant of Venezuela is a good guy. You can't seem to make your mind up whether the regime in Iran is a good or bad thing, but you think the only reason people are protesting is because of the economy, which is nonsense. You think that what Hamas did in October the 7th was an act of resistance

and won't call them terrorists and so on. So you're an outlier, as you know, with how conventional thinking is on these things. You know, you're perfectly entitled to be. But when you say these things, you know, I look at you, for example, You rail a lot about America and about Donald Trump, but you live in America, right? I mean, there's an inconsistency there.

Why live somewhere if you hate it so much or hate the leader so much? Why do you act on a point of principle, get off your backside and go and live in Iran or Venezuela? Live under one of these regimes that you think aren't too bad. Peers, peers, do stop. Do stop. Maybe I will. But to answer your question about me being successful in rock and roll and blah, yes, I am very. and blah, blah, blah, and all of that.

Why do I do all of this? Because I believe, I hope you're listening, I believe in right and wrong. I have a moral compass. Excuse me, let me finish. I have a moral compass which I allow to guide my actions. And also, I read a lot. And I don't just read the New York Times

or the Sunday Telegraph. I read, I get information for, And I have a lot of friends. I have a network of people all over the world who also, like me, believe in equal human rights for all their brothers and sisters all over the world, irrespective of their religion or their race or their nationality or ethnicity or anything. And that is a fundamental thing that drives me in what I do. That's why I'm talking to you now today. Much as I adore you, obviously, I'm still, that is why I'm here. Because I, to some extent, am a voice for the voiceless.

And I get told this by the voiceless millions of times every year in responses to the activities that I engage in my activism in support. Nicholas Maduro is not the voiceless and nor are Hamas and nor are the Iranian regime. So although it suits you to say, I only stand up for the voiceless, actually, it sounds to me like you like to stand up for terror groups and call them resistance. You like to stand up for dictators

and say they're just massively misunderstood guys. You like to stand up for one of the world's worst regimes in Iran and pretend that the only reason people there are protesting is because of the economy, and that's because of sanctions put on it by other countries wrongly because they don't prop up any terror groups. So when I look at your worldview, I don't see a guy with all due respect, Roger, who's standing up for the voiceless and powerless.

I see somebody trying to prop up terrorists and powerful dictatorships and regimes. Today's show is sponsored by Oxford Natural, makers of the optimum day and optimum night all natural supplements. Thousands of Brits and Americans are already taking them with incredible results. Optimum day boosts your energy and supports weight loss throughout the day. optimum night helps you relax and get deep, refreshing sleep. They have countless success stories, including from some very familiar faces. England legend Michael Owen, we lost £40.

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Shopman.com. Please support our show and tell them that we send ship. Mando's got you covered. That's because you're a guy who's trying to prop up the evil Western Empire that is trying to take over the whole world using war as its main. way of doing that. That is why the West is insisting on remaining at a state of perpetual war with anybody with whom it disapproves in the country. This includes Iran and Venezuela. There are only two and the Palestinians and so on and so

forth. So you believe in that as being a reasonable system for the world to proceed? No I don't. Excuse me. I don't. I don't. Excuse me. I don't. Well, why don't you ever say anything on your program to stop it? I literally led. I literally, excuse me. Roger, with respect, you're wrong. In 2003, it's edited to a Daily Mirror. I led a relentless campaign against the Iraq war, for example.

So you're wrong in your characterization that all I like is war. I don't. Complete opposite. Okay, so you've given me one example. Bravo. Good for you, Pierce. Thank you. I'm glad you did.

That was the correct thing. to do. And in hindsight, you are now in a huge majority of people who, because they know the lie that was told about weapons of mass distraction, back in March of 2003 when the United States invaded Iraq and destroyed that country, killing over a million Iraqis, by the way, and leaving it devastating. I agree. Okay, which is, well, they are trying to do the same thing now by trying to encourage a war with Iran, and maybe even they will try and start a war with Iran. They've also invaded the sovereign country of Venezuela. It's an invasion, the kidnapping of Nicolas Maduro. They made up the daft story about him being a drug dealer, which is absolute

errant nonsense, as everybody knows. And then they invaded the country and whisked him off to knew what's going to happen next, nobody knows. Trump doesn't know. He spends his time staring out of the French windows at what might be a boring one day. So what do you think of Donald Trump? What do you think of Donald Trump? He's demented.

He's demented. He's obviously very evil, but now he's demented as well as being very evil. He was always a real scumbag. Everything he's ever done is awful in every way. So we can, you know, you can disagree. You might think Donald Trump's, you know, jolly good chap, Maga, Maca, Maca, all that crap.

None of which he believes, all he believes is in lining his pockets and the pockets of Gerard Kushner and, you know, and maybe some of his other children, and his friends Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg and all the rest of the oligarchs, who are all in the same cabal. But again, Roger, if you feel this way, why do you live in America? I don't understand why you live there?

I think I moved out of England, at least partially, when I did, which was at the turn of the millennium, because I couldn't stand the, funnily enough, the political atmosphere there, because it's more hidden, it's a bit more under the surface. There are wonderful people there. I see that my friend Naomi Winborn Adreasy is starting, I think she's starting a new party. She's certainly standing for something because I got an email from her last night. So the fact that people like her and Jeremy Corbyn are still involved in politics, maybe I would try and move back. But don't forget, if I come back to England,

why do you want to live in America given how much you hate Donald Trump? You think he's evil, he's demented, he's waging all these wars as you put it. Why wouldn't you just leave the country? I don't get it. Because, okay, can I answer? I don't think the American people are evil.

I think, as my mother did as well, I never forget, she said to me, you know, darling, the American people are a people good and true. As I've written in a poem, I think, good neighbours to rebuild the bond. There is a feeling amongst the idea of some of those settler colonists who were the, you know, Let's not talk about the genocide of the Native Americans because that's central to all of this conversation. But anyway, they would help you rebuild the bar. And those people still exist, but they're not, they have no voice. America is not a democracy.

You can buy the presidency. Donald Trump did. And he buys it from APAC money and from oligarchal money and from donor money. The fact that you're allowed to pour millions and millions into politics makes it impossible for it to be democratic, not to mention the electrical. So you live in an undemocratic country run by an evil, demented person. Again, I simply ask you, why are you still there?

Well, I've looked at alternatives, I promise you. Portugal is a possibility. I very much like some of the islands in the Caribbean and the governments that they have as well. I do follow what people think. It may be that my residency in the United States may not last for the rest of my life. It may well be that Donald and his cabal

will make that decision for me because he is pretty erratic and he's got ice. He could send masked men around to shoot me in the head, my car window like he does to people who disagree with him. So I agree with you. Pierce, we live in a really dangerous, totally effed-up world.

I couldn't agree with you more. And to find somewhere good to live is difficult. But we still have to clamber around the eyes that were given us by Karl Marx. and others in the late 19th in the early, or in the middle 19th century, and try and find ways forward in the future that is not what we've got now, because what we've got now is destroying the planet that we live on.

Okay. Do you give Trump any credit? Do you give Trump any credit for getting to a ceasefire in Gaza? No, of course not. I don't give him any credit for any. There's no ceasefire. A ceasefire in Gaza. There's no ceasefire.

They're murdering them as fast as they could go. There was never any ceasefire. November the 17th was a huge disaster in the Security Council. And mainly because, and I've said this to my Russian friends, because neither Russia nor China vetoed it. So we now have to get our heads around the idea that, oh, maybe they're not anti-imperialist. And so Mirshon, so Mier-Shon.

And so Meersheimer may be right in some of his contentions that we live in a realistic world and that everybody's out for themselves. And they don't really care about people, particularly people in other countries or people who are... Do you think Russia's... And they may be right. Has Russia been justified in its war in Ukraine? That's a very difficult question. When they invaded, I thought it was wrong.

obviously, as we've said before, and as I said in various dissertations to the Security Council in the United Nations, no less, I think I said that I deplore the invasion of Ukraine, but it was not unprovoked. It was provoked beyond all measure. And what do you feel now today? What do you feel to know? I feel that they should have made peace in February 22. When it was offered to them, the Ukrainians, I mean, and Boris Johnson went in and said, no, you can't, we don't want peace. I mean, and if you think I'm wrong, just read the history and see what actually happened

and read the Minsk Accords and see, because there was a civil war going on in Ukraine when Russia started what they called their special military operation. Everybody knows all this, who knows anything about it. But it's suppressed by the Western media. So what is your view of Vladimir Putin? Has Vladimir Putin been mischaracterized, do you think? You know, what's interesting is how careful Putin's been all the way through. And also, anybody who studied the war in the Ukraine would agree with this.

And a lot of people watching this and commenting on it say, You know, if the West manages to get rid of Putin, they should be careful what they wish for because it's very likely that the much harder line faction in Russian political society, one of them might take over, and then you will see something completely different. Because Putin has conducted the special military operation with his gloves off. he really has tried not to hurt civilians and so on and so far. What? Who knows if they get rid of Putin?

Because Putin, see, you know nothing, Pierce. Vladimir Putin has tried really hard not to hurt civilians, is it? Did you really just say that? I thought you hated war. I thought you hated war, Roger. Vladimir Putin illegally invaded a sovereign, that's what. Vladimir Putin illegally invaded a sovereign democratic country and started bombing the shit out of it.

Why? Why would you on any level try to excuse or defend it? Why didn't they make peace in 22 three weeks after the war started? Why did the war start? Why didn't? You know the answer to that, or maybe you still haven't read anything. I've no idea. If you haven't read the history, then you haven't read the history.

So you may never know. Right. I've read a lot of history. We all know it wasn't because, we all know it wasn't because Putin wants to invade Europe and take over the whole of Western Europe. He wants to invade Romania and Poland and France and England and Germany and extend Russia to the, which is the story that they've been trying to sell you in the mainstream. That's absolute arrant nonsense. Yeah, I mean, he only took Crimea, then he tried to take Georgia, then he's taken the southeast of Ukraine. It's not like you've got a pattern of seizing stuff. The people of Crimea asked...

The people of Crimea asked to join the Russian Federation. Of course. And you believe that. 98% of them. Of course I do. In a referendum run by the Russians, which you apparently think was a credible referendum. All right, please.

Let me end with... Listen, I'm glad you had me on. Let me tell you why I'm glad you had me on. Let me tell you why I'm... Okay. If I may. You may. And I do thank you for it.

I do thank you for it. Because I believe in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, because I have empathy for all my brothers and sisters in Venezuela and in Palestine and in Israel and in Iran and blah blah all over the world, I'm very grateful to you for allowing my sensible voice to be heard somewhere and I count you as part of the mainstream media in the mainstream media. media. Just as I was very glad years and years ago when Tucker Colesman had me on Fox News because he knew I supported the release of Julian Assange, which I did. And he let, and he did an interview with me and we talked about that. And eventually Julian Assange was released. And I'm glad to have been part of that movement. And I was, soddily, for year after year after year. All the time he was banged up in Belmarsh and whatever. Because Julian Assange is a great journalist and a great teller of the truth and believes, like I do, in universal human rights. So thank you for allowing me to be part of him and part of all those of us, and we are millions strong, who believe in equal human rights

for all our brothers and sisters from the river to the sea, from all rivers to all seas. Okay, and you've referenced the word empathy, empathy a few times. And I do want to end with something, which was quite personal to me, because it involved a friend of mine, which was that after Ozzy Osbourne, your fellow rock star, died. Yeah, yeah. Well, after he died, you told the Independent, Ozzy Osbourne, who just died, bless him in his whatever, that state he was in his whole life, we'll never know.

Although he was all over the TV for hundreds of years with his idiocy and nonsense. The music, I've no idea, I couldn't give a fuck. care about Black Sabbath. I never did. I have no interested bite of the heads of chickens, whatever they do. I couldn't care less, you know. Do you think that was empathetic? Listen, A, I didn't speak to the Independent. I assume you're talking about the independent newspaper

into the United Kingdom. Are you? What are you talking about when you say the... Talking with the Independent Inc. That's who you were talking to. Ah, okay. When you say The Independent on television, when you're talking to Karen, the widow of Said Oz, I was born. You say it sounds as if I was talking to news, but... Sharon, not Karen. The comments that you...

Sharon, that's what I said, wasn't it? Sorry, I apologise, Sharon. I apologize. Getting your name wrong. Yeah, Independent Inc. is a podcast that a guy called Mr. Fish, that's his professional name, and he's an illustrator and cartoonist. He does... He does all the drawings for... Yeah, but this is all irrelevant.

I don't understand why... Excuse me. When Ozzy Osbourne has just died, why would you trash him like that? If you're Mr. Empathy. I haven't finished. Excuse me. My mouth finished. So those comments, I'm not denying that I said them,

came in the middle of a long interview. You still said that. The Independent Inc. It makes no difference where you said them. Hang on. In the middle of an hour and a half long interview. So what? And we were smiling.

Well, I mean, do I have to like every rock group there ever was in the world? Do you have to trash him in such a personal way? Excuse me. So soon after he died. I want to play you a clip from when Sharon came on my show because it really upset him. Oh, I've seen it. Well, let me play it again, the remind our viewers. Let's take a look.

No, I don't want to see it. I'm not interested in it. You're going to it. I'm not. Because he's really insignificant. but I just thought with anybody that passes that has a family, you don't do that. That's true, isn't it? If you're really empathetic, you don't do that to someone, to a family when they've lost someone they love like that? Obviously, I had no idea that Sharon Osborne would be watching a podcast by a very well-known and respected cartoonist.

Would you like to apologise then for the hurt you caused her? Yeah, of course I will. If I, if I, if I, of course, not that I have any time for Sharon Osborne. She's a raging Zionist. And in consequence, she's like, she's not in my very, and she's all accused me of all kinds of things. She's constantly accused, because she's part of the Israeli lobby. Would you like to apologize to the Osborne family for the way that you trashed Ozzy Osbourne in that entity?

Not really. No, not really. To Jack. She did want her to know. Listen, Jack. Well, Jack, you know, Jack Osport. If he wants to have a chat, I'll have a chat with him. Jack Osborne lost his dad, and I won't be nasty to him.

Well, you know, yeah, I'm sorry you lost your dad, Jack. But this is like you have conversations about things and about people in Iraq. What do you think? Well, not a lot. I was honest, I said I didn't like Black Sabbath. But that's not, I think, I've listened to some of it since. And the music is perfectly kind of except it was all the kind of histrionics of,

I don't like people who bite the heads off bats. I just don't. I think it's disgusting. And I've said that again. Now, I know he's dead and he can't come back and go, yeah, I'm sorry, I bit the heads of bats, if he ever did. Who knows whether he did or not? I don't want to talk about.

So you don't regret the things. you said about Ozzy Osbourne and the hurt that caused his family. Piers, I regret nothing in life, except that I haven't been more successful in getting people to understand how important it is that we, as a human race, recognize and empathise with all our brothers and sisters all over the world and make certain that they have equal human rights, one with another, under international law. The Osborne family, you know, no, I'm not that interested in. No, that's fine.

So you're big on empathy right to the point it's a grieving family, and then he couldn't give a share. Roger Waters, thank you very much. Depend? Well done. Peers Morgan Unsencent is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask only one simple thing.

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