Piers Morgan Uncensored - “You Just Interviewed a TERRORIST!” Israel’s Occupation of West Bank | With Daniella Weiss

Episode Date: July 16, 2025

Israel’s illegal occupations in the Palestinian West Bank are under intense scrutiny, after a 20-year-old US citizen was brutally beaten to death by settlers while visiting relatives. Violence has surged since October 7th, with Netanyahu’s government expanding its occupation ever since - and the UN estimates that 1,000 Palestinians have been killed. Most countries agree that settlements are illegal - but many religious Israelis believe they have a divine right to be there. Piers Morgan speaks to ‘Godmother’ of the Israeli settler movement Daniella Weiss before discussing all the above and more with author and activist Rabbi Shmuley Boteach, The Young Turks’ Cenk Uygur and Sunday Times columnist and author Matthew Syed. Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent and supported by: Dr Gundry MCT Oil: Watch- Dr. Gundry: Heart Surgeon Begs Americans: “Stop Doing This To Your Blueberries" Find Out here: https://TheHealthyFat.com/Morgan Birch Gold: Text PIERS to 989898 and get your free info kit on gold Incogni: Take your personal data back with Incogni! Get 60% off an annual plan at https://incogni.com/PIERS and use code PIERS at checkout. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You do not have the right to commit war crimes, to commit a genocide, to kill all those children, and then hide, hiding, use as a shield. Oh, everybody's an anti-Semite. When you have a terror regime like the Nazis who do engage in genocide, unless you finish it off completely and defeat the idea of militarism that Hamas can achieve its objectives through military objectives and not diplomatic objectives, then you will never have peace. You cannot bomb it into submission.

They're replacing dead Hamas fighters at a rate of five to one. This is going to come back to haunt you for years. You tell Rabbi Shmuli that he'll burn in hell as well because obviously he's ashamed to Jews, free Palestine. All right. Listen to this. They attacked, attacked, attacked Israel on the 7th of October. They massacred Jews.

What is not clear in what I say? All you want is to take over the West Bank and Gaza. You want them all gone. That's the bottom line. As you said, The audience will judge. Israel's illegal occupations in the Palestinian West Bank are under intense scrutiny after a US citizen

was brutally beaten to death by settlers. A 20-year-old who just opened an ice cream business at home in Florida was attacked on Friday night while visiting relatives and died before reaching hospital. Mike Huckabee, the US ambassador to Israel, normally a fierce advocate for settlers, called a criminal terrorist act. The West Bank is 50 miles from Gaza

and separated by uncompromising Israeli checkpoints, but violence has served since October the 7th. Netanyahu's government has been expanding its occupation ever since, and the UN estimates that 1,000 Palestinians have been killed. Settlements have been a major barrier to peace for decades in the region. Most countries agree they are illegal, but many religious Israelis believe they have a divine right to be there. The current Israeli government is often accused of using the most aggressive settler groups as a proxy force for shrinking the Palestinian state, an issue highlighted in a recent documentary by Louis Thruh.

We do for governments what they cannot do for themselves. Even if you take Netanyahu now, he is very happy what we do here and also about our plans to build Jewish communities in Gaza. He's happy about it, but he cannot say it. He says the opposite. It's not realistic. Good! We will make it realistic!

It's not forcing the government. It's helping the government. Under the Geneva Convention, transferring a civilian population into a conquered terrain, that that's considered a war crime. What I do here is a war crime. According to the UN.

And you're cooperating with a person who committed war crime? Well, I'm interviewing you. It's a light. felony. Well, in a moment, we'll turn to the bigger picture, and Israel strikes today on Syria, as well as the Mossack conspiracies and anti-Semitism claims at the heart of the Epstein Files debate. We'll begin by talking to Daniela Weiss, who you just saw in that Louis Theroux clip, the leader of the settler group, Nahala. Well, welcome to you, Daniela Weiss.

Thank you for joining me on our census. Let me start by asking you, Mrs. Weiss, you're known as the godmother of the Israeli settler movement. is your ultimate ambition for all Palestinians to be removed from the West Bank and Gaza? You ask if it's what I want. It's not ambition. Ambition I put into positive things. I mean, when people have to move for one place to another, it's not a question of ambition. I think there is no choice now, especially after the massacre of the 7th of October, the Gazans finished their chapter of history in Gaza,

and the terrorists themselves will be killed in the attacks of the Israeli army, of Zahal, and those who support them, will have to go to emigrate to other countries. And I think it, as far as people want to live normal life, I think the option to go to other countries and the world is a good option. But it's not a question of ambition. I have an ambition to settle Jews all over the vast areas of the land that was given by God to the Jewish nation. So this is my ambition. And in the midst of things with the

attacks of Arabs in different periods of history, and especially I emphasize now, the last attack, the last massacre on civilian population, that was the end of the history of the Gazans in Gaza. But there are... It doesn't have to do with ambition. Okay, there are two million people living in Gaza. Half of those people are under 18 years of age. More than 20,000 Gaza children have now been killed since October the 7th.

My follow-up question is how many of the innocent Gazans, how many of the Palestinian children, do you think should come to say Israel and to be allowed to settle there? To settle in Israel? Yes. Why? Why? If you're going to tell them...

If you tell them to leave... Well, because if you tell them to leave their home and you say that they should live in other countries, why would Israel not want to provide a home for them? No, no, no. because the conflict between Israel and the Gazans brought this chapter into its end. We don't take any chance anymore. Many soldiers told me, some of them from my own family,

that they were witnessed to so much talk and propaganda against Israel. And I think that there shouldn't be anymore any attack. any connection between the Gaza population and the Jewish state. Let them be in other countries. There's 100 million Egyptians in Egypt, so there will be another half million Gazans in Egypt, and some will be in Indonesia, some in other countries. Okay, but if I suggest that we carve out an area of Israel to put the Palestinians, we just just slice off. No. Let me finish. Let me finish.

We slice off an area of Israel, and all the Israelis who currently live there have to leave and go and live in another country. Are you happy about that? Would you be happy with that? You have some psychological need to slice pieces of the tiny state of Israel? No, no. I'm just saying, what's this need? Listen, Gaza, as you know, Gaza, as you know, is right. Gaza, as you know, well, hang on, let me finish. Gaza, as you know, is a very small territory.

I'm talking about a similar-sized territory. Is what? Gaza is what? I'm talking about, it's a very small territory. Gaza is very small. I know. So I'm talking about taking... Indonesia.

I'm talking, hang on. Africa is big. Let me finish. I'm talking about taking the Ghazan people, the innocent Ghazan people, not Hamas, but innocent Gaza people. And I'm talking about taking a piece of Israel. and removing all the Israelis who currently live there and sending them off to other countries

and then you put the Palestinian people in that space in Israel. How would you feel about that? It's not a question of feeling. It's not going to happen. Why would that be wrong? Why would that be wrong, Mrs. Weiss? Why would that be wrong? Because it failed.

We left Gaza in 2005. and we were promised that Gaza will be Singapore and I didn't believe in it but many Israelis did believe in it and it turned into hell upper hell down lower hell and I think no more experiments we are not a laboratory

we are a nation that wants to live in the land that was given to us to the Jews by God but you actually but you The Arabs, the Gazans, don't want it. So I don't want to be an experiment, a laboratory with experiments on the Jewish people. No. So you've made it clear.

You think it would be... I want to tell you, what is your private name? Sorry, I don't know what I'm talking about, too. My name. What is your name? I want to address you. My name is Piers Morgan. Yes.

Morgan? Can I address you, Morgan? You can call me what you like? My name is Piers Morgan. What are the fruit you eat to stay healthy? It's actually making you fat. According to heart surgeon and nonsense a sponsor, Dr. Steve Gundry, many Americans are making a common mistake with fruit

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That's the healthyfat.com slash Morgan. It's also in the show notes. Don't miss this opportunity to learn how a few simple changes can make a big difference to your health. Visit the healthy fat.com slash Morgan to find out how. peers, please help me what I want to address you normally as two people who speak

call me peers Morgan call me peers okay so I want to tell you you want to proceed with an intelligent dialogue or you are the interviewer

and answering let's continue but if you want to repeat this experiment of putting gazans in Israel, the answer is simple. It will never be. I heard you. I just wonder...

Okay. I just wonder... Hang on. I just want to give you a question. I just wonder, obviously, you're outraged by the idea of Palestinian people taking the place of Israelis in Israel. And I understand that. But what gives you the right to then tell Palestinian people, innocent people, children, who've had nothing to do with Hamas, what gives you the right to uproot... Let me finish, to uproot those people

from their homes and expel them in what would be ethnic cleansing, which is a war crime, as you know. They attacked, attacked Israel on the 7th of October. They massacred Jews on the 7th of October after we evacuated Gaza for their benefit. What is not clear in what I see? Well, what is not clear is that you have also, in going after Hamas in Gaza, massacred

between 70,000 and 100,000 Palestinians. And at what point does that become disproportionate? At what point does the fact that the Israeli government continues to prosecute this war in a way that kills so many children, does this become something which is completely unacceptable? Okay. Not acceptable. So it's a fact.

If they had not, you say that it is not acceptable, I understand that it's not acceptable by you. I think that if the Gazans hadn't started, the Hamas hadn't started the attack, there wouldn't have been a war. And we, for instance, as people were evacuated from Gaza, in the past 20 years, I must say it's kind of an unpleasant confession for me. but this is the truth of the matter, that we haven't dealt with the idea of returning to Gaza, returning to our homes, because we said, okay, there was a contract, we gave it away,

we didn't want it to happen, it happened, and that's it. The gates closed. Yeah, but you have, you actually, but here's the thing, here's the problem, Daniela. you have no right. Israel has no right to just take Gaza, to just take the West Bank, to expel to expel eight, nine million Palestinians. You have no right to do this. You have had no right to occupy Gaza for the last. So what does you suggest? Where do you think you have this right to do all this?

You're furious at the idea of any part of Israel being given up for Palestinians. Fine. Okay. But why would you then think it's fine for you to take over Gaza and the West Bank? May I ask you, why do you repeat the same question three times? You know, I don't see your face, so it's kind of difficult without the gestures. Well, let me simplify it for you. What gives you the right? What gives you the right to think that you can expel millions and millions of Palestinians? Look here. I don't know if you're the viewers, the people who see your program have the patience for a historical summary.

The state of Israel was established in 1948, three days after the Holocaust and three years after the Holocaust. and 2,000 years after the dispersion, after the Romans dispersed the Jewish nation. And then somehow, there is an in-gathering of the Jews in the land of Israel, the biblical land. And the biblical land that we hold to now is very tiny. We tried, according to the partition plan first, to be satisfied with a tiny. tiny piece of land where we have independence. And then when we were small, I would say tiny. And even without Jerusalem, we tried to manage a Jewish independence in the biblical state of Israel.

And we were prevented from living this way. I was born before the state of Israel. So I know all this history from my own flesh and blood and my own family and my father wounded in the War of Independence. So we tried to live in a tiny small, in a tiny land, and the Arabs didn't let us live. So then there was a Six-Day War, and where I live now was liberated, I say liberated, because it's the heart of our homeland, in the Six-Day War. And since then, we tried to live peacefully.

and the Arabs don't let us. So how can you try to change facts? Now, you gave me a chance to relate a tiny summary of history. If you have another way to put it, please go ahead. The problem is yours. I'll put it this way. I'm a guest. Let me put it this way.

The UK government has sanctioned you personally in May of this year. You were described as having been involved in, threatening, perpetrating, promoting and supporting acts of aggression and violence against Palestinian individuals. You've been described as the head of extremist settlers. The vast majority of the international community, including the United Kingdom, consider the settlement illegal under international law. Last year, the UN's top court, the International Court of Justice,

said that Israel's occupation of Palestinian territories is against international war, and Israel should stop settlement activity in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem and end its illegal occupation of those areas and the Gaza Strip as soon as possible. So that's a bit of history for you, which is that you have been seen as the godmother of Israeli extremists who believe that you have a right to all this land, you have a right to settle where you want to, you have a right to expel all the Palestinians and to take over their land.

And I say to you that actually, under international law, you do not have that right. It's actually a crime, what you're doing. And you should stop doing it. So that's my question. My question for you is, why do you continue to break the law? I don't know. You present things in a very journalistic way. Well, that's facts.

You say, do it. Everything I just read you as a fact. Yes. What facts? What facts? I just read you the facts. I can read them again. if you didn't hear them.

You know, Morgan, listen to this. I never hide what I do. I am being interviewed by you and by everyday media people come to this home and to the hills where I establish communities. And I tell what I think and what I do and what I plan. So if there is anything in what is so openly exposed that is. can be considered illegal? Well, you're committing more crimes.

What is illegal in what I do? You're committing war crimes. Why? So you are speaking to me now. You're giving so much time in your program to a person who commits war crimes. Why do you do it? I'm holding you to account.

What's the sense? I'm holding you to account for your war crimes. I'm telling you you should stop your war crimes. I'm telling you have absolutely, you have no right to displace millions of pounds. and kick them out of their homes. You don't have that right. Morgan, you hope that through your program,

you will enhance the chance that I will be put to trial? Is this why you give me so much time in your program? Yeah, I think ultimately you should face a trial, yeah. The ups and downs of the economy can be stressful and worrying. One of the smartest ways to protect your savings is with diversification. and you can start by talking to the experts at Birch Gold Group. Gold's value has surged 40% in the past 12 months, driven by record-breaking central bank purchases.

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lets you take control of your savings today. Text a word peers as P-I-E-R-S to 9-8-9-8. You should. You should. You're breaking the law. And you're inspiring other people to break the law. That's... Okay. What shall I tell you? I don't think it's not on my part to cooperate with a person if you want to do what you said, if I heard you well in the beginning of this program, that you want to give a chance for different people to express the views. Sure. This is journalistic.

This is respectful. I've heard your views. I just don't agree with it. I've heard your views. I don't agree with your views. You want to enhance the chance that I will be put to trial? Well, I am not sure this is journalistic. but I'm with you in your hands now

until this interview is finished. I noticed that you... I noticed that so far you haven't referred to the people of Gaza or the West Bank as Palestinians. Do you believe they're called Palestinians? Palestine was the name was given by Adrian the emperor of Rome who wanted to obliterate

to put an end to the Jewish existence in the world. world. So he gave us a peculiar name to Jerusalem, Ilya capitulina and Israel, Palestinian, and he tried very hard. And indeed, we were dispersed. And somehow, after so many years and so much persecution, we returned and we are a successful nation. Are they Palestinians? So why should I support what, why should I support the distorted idea of Adrian, who failed. And now after the revival of the Jewish state, Arabs from different countries come here

and want to enjoy the treasures, I would say most of them are spiritual, but the treasures of the Holy Land. Right, but just to be clear, you don't believe they're Palestinians. The Jewish success. You will not refer to them as Palestinians, right? I think that Palestinians were invented by Adrian

and that the Arabs that come to Israel today want to get for themselves the success of the Jewish state that was created here after many years of dispersion. And Mrs. Weiss, how do you feel about the fact that over 20,000 Palestinian children

have now been killed since October the 7th in Gaza? I think that the Palestinians, as you said, you see, I said Palestinians, the Gazans and all Arabs around should stop attacking Israel. I just asked you how you thought about 20,000 children being killed by the IDF. So how do you feel about that? I think that the parents should be very careful before they teach the children to hate Jews and to kill Jews. That wasn't my question.

I won the Arabs. Sorry, sorry to be. be persistent, but my question... That was your question. My question was, how do you feel... My question was, how do you feel... How do you personally feel about over 20,000

Palestinian children now being killed since October the 7th in Gaza? How do you feel about that? I think, I think that Arabs, Gazans, or Jordanians, or Syrians, or ever,

should be very, very careful with the way they educate the children. Right now, that wasn't my question. Many of them were many of them, but that was my answer. That was my answer. You don't care?

You have no thoughts about these children at all? You choose your questions. And I answered them the way I believe is right. But just to be clear, you have nothing to say about 20,000 children being killed. Nothing at all. I have a lot to say about everything that happened as a result of the massacre of the 7th of October. I understand you care about Israeli children who died, as do I.

But I'm able to care about both sides of children who've died. Why don't you care seemingly about the Palestinian children who've died? Why can't you express any sympathy or sorrow or empathy with the children who've died in Gaza? Are you able to do that? I warn all Arabs from all sides, from all borders, warn them, stop educating children to hate Jews. Just to be clear, I've now offered you three times. I made myself very clear. You've made yourself very clear.

You asked me five times. I'm going to give you one last. You ask me seven times. Okay. I'm going to give you one last chance to offer some empathy or sympathy or sorrow. about the deaths of 20,000 children in Gaza. Are you capable of doing that? I can tell you that had you cared,

and I don't believe you that you care a tiny bit about one killed person if you do not use the means that you have as a media person to stop educating children to kill, Jews. Okay, you gave you. You gave me seven. You gave me seven. And you know what?

And I still think that you are to blame more than me. You don't care. And all you want is all the Palestinians gone. You can barely even bring yourself to say their name. All you want is to take over the West Bank and Gaza. You don't care how many die in the process. You want them all gone. You don't care, do you?

That's the bottom line. As you said, the audience will judge. Yeah, they will. Daniel O'Weiss. Thank you very much for coming on a censored. I appreciate it. Well, joining me on the panel is author and activist Rabbi Smooley, the founder and CEO of the Young Turks, Czech Yuga,

and the Sunday Times columnist and author Matthew Saeed. Matthew, you were sitting here with me watching that interview. Your thoughts? Well, I thought it was a very illuminating interview and the kind of smiling maternal face of religious fundamentalism in Israel. You asked many times what gave her the right to ship out Palestinians from Gaza and the West Bank, She gave a whole range of answers, but the key one was early in the interview when she said she had a divine right. She believes that that area is promised to the Jews by God.

And because of that, and the fact that she believes she has the absolute truth, she feels that anything is justified in meeting that aspiration. I've written a lot about this conflict and I focused, I think rightly in many ways, on the fundamentalism of Hamas. They also think they've got absolute truth. They think they are justified in killing infidels and killing Jews. But we have to recognize that Israel, yes, it's a liberal democracy. I support it instinctively. It's in a tough neighborhood. But there are within Israel fundamentalists.

And what worries me the most peers is that within the Israeli cabinet, Smotrich, Ben-Gavir, these are fundamentalists, nationalists. They have the ear of Netanyahu. And ever more, I get the sense that they are nudging the administration, administration towards more carnage, more bloodshed. It's obliterating the image of Israel in the wider world. It seems to me with no strategic objective in sight. And it was so interesting to listen to her and to see her implacability.

Yeah, I mean, Chink, I found the constant smirking, the total refusal to offer any personal sorrow or empathy or sympathy with these kids who've been killed. you know, not even to try and phrase it as, you know, unfortunately this is collateral damage in war, nothing. No attempt to offer anything at all. Just an utterly intractable hardline view. All this land belongs to Israel, and we're going to take it, and we don't care.

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That's incogni-in-c-o-g-n-i.com slash peers, P-I-E-R-S. Use code peers when you check out. Yeah. Look, you just interviewed a terrorist. And she's one of the most vicious terrorists of my lifetime. These settlers are lunatic religious fundamentalists that believe in murdering Palestinians for God. It's an absurd interpretation of any religious document. The overwhelming majority of Jews, by the way, do not agree with them.

They don't think that you have to murder Palestinians for God. And so when you asked her that last question, it was actually very interesting what her answer was. You said, do you mind 20,000 children being killed? And she said, as long as they're teaching their children to hate Jews, she seemed to be justifying that we have to kill their children. So think about the absurd logic of that. Since they teach them to hate us, we murdered their children. Gee, I wonder why they hate you. Like, the fact that she can't even see that shows you how painfully stupid this terrorist is.

So I'm done. Like you guys are way too polite to Israel. Israel is a terrorist state. I'm not interested in it. I'm not interested in supporting it. I'm not interested in having them steal more Arab land. And I said to you peers a long time ago that this was never about self-defense. This was about taking Gaza.

Well, I was right. I've been proven right by Netanyahu and their terrorist government. I called them terrorists and I said that they would kill more civilians than Hamas. Are you kidding me? They've now get a load of this fact. Hamas killed 815 civilians on October 7th. Terrible, we've all condemned it a thousand times. Now Israel has killed 870 Palestinians under the age of one.

They have killed more Palestinian babies than Hamas killed civilians on October 7th. And every time it's a justification, no, we talk to God, God told us to steal Arab land, God told us to murder Arab children. What kind of sick state is this? I saw her and smiling, like you said, and smirking, now when I see a lot of these Israeli leaders, I feel like I'm looking at Germans telling us, no, it's okay, we can do this to the Jews. There's going to be no consequences. And there's smugness partly peers has to do with the fact that they think we own America. There's nothing you can do. We control the largest military

in the history of the world. We can get them to do whatever we want because APAC has bought the entire U.S. government. And she's not wrong. She's not wrong. I mean, today Trump is talking about Yeah, you're not going to get the Epstein files. You're not going to get anything. We're occupied. We're all Palestinians now. Rabbi Shmooley, I mean, when you listen to that interview with Daniela Weiss, what did you feel about him?

Pierce, thank you for having me on. And having had a surprisingly civil debate at Oxford University with my brother, Chank, I'm actually going to excuse his hyperbole of calling Jews Nazis and stick to the facts because you were right, Pierce, in your discussion with Daniela, she should have... Stop smearing Jews. No, no, no, no, Chang, Chang, Chang, change, change, change, please. Chang, please don't...

Okay, you're already interrupting me. Just be civil, please. We had a civil debate at Oxford. Let's try to continue. We shook hands afterward, hundreds of thousands of people said how much they enjoyed watching a shake hands. Let's be human a little bit. I'm going to do what you said, Pierce, to stick to the facts.

Number one, Chang just said that Israel killed suddenly more civilians that were killed on October 7th. 45,000 Britons died in the Battle of Britain when the Lufafa and Herman Guring bombed London, Northampton to smithereens. But Churchill killed 700,000 German children. He killed 3 million German civilians. That was terrible. But here's my question to you, Pierce.

Outside of Parliament is a giant statue of Churchill as the greatest statesman in the history of Britain. Was Churchill a war criminal? Yes or no? No, Churchill wasn't a war criminal. And in fact, Matthew, I saw you shaking your head. Okay. Okay, you said facts.

You said facts. Hang on, if you're going to make statements like Churchill. Wait, wait, wait, wait. No, no, no, no. Your number's un-correct about the number of civilians who died. Never mind anything else. Yes, they are. There were four, there were three million German civilians killed by Britain and by the United States.

There were 70,000 Japanese killed on a single day in a Rochima and then Agasaki. Half of them were children, 35,000. Was Harry Truman a war criminal? Was Roosevelt war? If you were prepared to save Pierce, based on facts and based what Chang just said, that the proportion of civilians to combatant deaths determines whether you were a war criminal.

And by the way, Churchill killed five civilians for every one German combatant. The United States and Fallujah killed four civilians and Fallujah and Iraq for every one terrorist Iraqi combatant. So was George W. Bush a war criminal? Was Tony Blair criminal? If you're prepared to at least be consistent and say that, yes, the statute of Churchill killed three million.

Three million. Was Churchill? Okay, do you think that Winston Churchill's a war criminal? It's a yes or no question? The same way you put it to the end? Yes or no? Churchill, well, let me let. Hang on. So Churchill can kill three million. You've asked a question. You've asked a question. Matthew. I think it's a completely coherent and fair question. It's about means and ends. Thank you. Is the means justified to achieve a given end? For what it's worth, I think that that consequentialist approach is legitimate. I think that Truman was justified in the atomic bomb. I say that reluctantly, but I think there would have been many more deaths had the Second World War not been brought to an end in that way.

I know some people will disagree with that position. However, what I can't, if I may just finish, just briefly finish. So you're one of the most fair person that I've ever spoken to on this show. All I'm saying is, let's be clear. Pierce, God weeps for every Palestinian child, the 20,000 children. I don't know if it's 20,000, but even if it is, that's weeps for everyone. One was too many. Every Arab child is the equal of a Jewish child.

But whose responsibility is it? Who builds? I live in a community here in New York, New Jersey. There is no army base near me. Why are the Hamas headquarters in nurseries? Why does Hamas use these children to die so that you will then point the finger? Now, even Hitler did not do that. The German military headquarters were not built in kindergarten.

And let me say one final thing, Pierce, if I may. Pierce, you know what struck me about your interview with Daniele Weiss? You did not once ask her, what do the people of Gaza want? I don't care what Pierce Morgan wants. I don't care what Daniela Weiss wants. I don't care what Chankuey. I don't care what I want. They want Robert Spreeze.

The people of Gaza have not had a have not, don't speak for them. And the same way I won't. They have not had a vote since 2005 when Hamas took the leaders of the PLO, the Palestinian Authority, Mahmwood Abbas, and threw their opponents off the roofs and kill them. Then Hamas abolished all elections. Now, I want the people of Gaza to vote. Do you want to remain in that tiny hovel when you don't have a backyard

where any money that's given to Hamas, if it's rebuilt, will be again, it'll go to tunnels. Remember that the Hamas got triple the martial aid per capita for Palestinian, and they didn't build one bomb shelter, they didn't build one school, they didn't build one university. They just built tunnels and rockets. Ask the people of the supporters. Pierce, let me ask you, why did you ask?

May I say to the rabbi? Forgive me for persisting here. But the rabbi did say, I think legitimately that he had been interrupted and he didn't like it. I was halfway through the point that I was making, if I may say so, when you jumped in. I said that I thought Truman was justified. I apologize. In ending the Pacific War. I think Churchill was justified in trying to end the war in Europe.

What I don't understand, and I think a lot of people who are instinctively pro-Israel, do not understand, aware are the sunlit uplands on the other side of the evisceration of Gaza. I've been told by senior Israeli officials, confidentially, that young Gazans, Palestinians and people across the Middle East are being radicalised, that these dead Hamas fighters are being replaced at a rate of five to one. This isn't going to affect Israel for the next five months or five years, but for the next 50 years. And how on earth is flattening Gaza going to help the protection of Israel

when their funders are in Tehran. I agree. The image. And let me just make one final point. In the medium term, I say to the rabbi, and I say this with great sincerity, the image of Israel, I don't want to superficialize it,

but the brand of Israel, that liberal democracy in a tough neighborhood which sits unconsciously behind Western support and has done since the Second World War has been obliterated, shattered into a million pieces. The next generation of American leaders are going to grow up where the most salient image in their minds

is not going to be the Holocaust, as it is for our generation. It's going to be emaciated, gars and children, dying in their thousands, being starred via a blockade. I say to you, I understand why Israelis and Jews rallied around Netanyahu after October the 7th. Who wouldn't, after an atrocity of that kind? But I believe you've been goaded into an overreaction

that will reverberate through history of great strategic disadvantage to a country I want to do well. I see you... All right, and before I let Rabbi Smirley... Before you respond, Rabbi Shmuring, I just wanted to pick you up on the statistics that you regaled at the start of that,

which I think he said that the British killed 3 million German civilians, including 300,000 children. Is that what you said? A 5 to 1 combatant to civilian... Just to be clear, you said 3 million, of which 300,000 were children.

That's what you said. said, right? Right. Right. The British decimated Colombia, they decimated Hamburg, they decimated in Dresden. In Dresden, they killed 30,000 in one night, etc. Let me finish my point. You were completely wrong. You were wildly exaggerating the number of civilians killed by the British bombing campaigns, the Allied bombing campaigns. It's estimated between 350 and 500,000 German civilians were killed in total by Allied bombing in World War II. And I would also add this. 500,000.

Okay, okay. So I said, I said 700,000. Let me finish my point. Let me finish my point. So it was a sixth of what you said, in fact. But the point, the wider point is we brought in the Geneva Convention at the end of World War II, specifically to address the issues of mass civilian casualties in World War II. The UK signed up to that.

Most countries of the world signed up to Geneva, Israel is a signatory to the Geneva, Israel is a signatory to the Geneva Convention, and yet it breaches regularly the Geneva Convention, including many believe what they're now doing as a government in Gaza. I don't know how you could possibly say. By the way, I don't have the advantage of having researchers behind me or having a laptop. So can you ask you researchers,

how many German children did Churchill kill? That's what I want to know exactly. I've given you your chance to spews statistics. You were completely wrong. How many children? How many children were? How many German children who were totally innocent? No, no, no, one second.

You said that Churchill killed 700,000. And now you said that Israel killed 40 or 50,000. Doesn't that make Churchill a much bigger war criminal than Netanyahu? Yes or no, Pierce? No, he's not a war criminal. Why? Why? He killed 700,000 civilians.

Why? Why aren't you answering my point? You won't answer my point. If Netanyahu is a war criminal for killing 45,000 Palestinians, why is Churchill, whose statute sits outside parliament, not a criminal? for killing eight times that amount of people. Go ahead, please. And by the way, and by the way,

let me just tell you, Pierce, you can say the technology didn't exist because the Americans used the Norden bomb site and only did precision daytime bombing. Mrs. Said will know that. It was Churchill who said, I will not risk a single RAF pilot. I don't care how many Germans die.

I will only do indiscriminate, broad nighttime bombing. Churchill was out to decimate cities to bring the will of the German people. So why? You won't answer me, Pierce. You won't answer. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Okay, well, I'm trying to answer, but all you'll do is propagandized for a bunch of terrorists. So, first of all, peers is absolutely right. We passed those Geneva Convention laws so that we could prevent crimes against humanity, not just what the Germans did to the Jews, the Poles, the Roma, et cetera, but also what the allies did in indiscriminate carpet bombing of civilian populations. So we tried to learn from the Holocaust. We tried to learn from World War II, and we all said never again. These laws should not be broken because at least the terrible situations.

Israel then said, no, we're above the law. We get to break any law we like. And in the case of the Germans, they were killing six million Jews. They killed 13 million overall. We were trying to stop a Holocaust. In this case, Israel is the one doing the genocide and saying, Well, I mean, why are you trying to stop us from killing innocent Palestinians and taking their land? Because in that analogy, you're the Germans.

So the Palestinians, those innocent children didn't do anything, dude. You just call me a Nazi? If you're supporting Israel. I'm a Nazi? Look, they did a Holocaust, which is. And you called other people fundamentalists? You just called me a Nazi? Hey, rabbi.

Can I, this is a sad day for you, Chang, this is a sad day for you. No, it's not. Just for your credibility, take it back. Can I finish my sentence? For your credibility, just take it back. I'm not going to take it back. I'm not going to take it back. This is a sad day for you.

This is, to compare me to the SS of the Nazi. This is a sad day for you. Your credibility will be from Jeng. I want to invite the, I want to invite the view of what you just. I'll never recover. No, no. Listen. Can I finish yourself?

I've been called a Nazi. Can I respond? No. No. No. No. Because I haven't finished the goddamn sentence. You think you own everything. You don't own everything, Rabbi Shmuli. You don't own the American government. You don't own the American people. By the way, when is America going to get? It's this $300 billion back. We gave it to a bunch of criminals to murder children. Okay, you murdered children with our money. Every day you take money out of my tax taxes. I go to work every day, and Israel takes money out of it to murder. murder of Palestinian children. You've murdered 20,000 children already. You're the aggressors. You've already killed, Israel has already killed more babies than Hamas has killed civilians overall. Israel has killed a stadium full of women and children. And you are surprised that we compare you to the Germans. Omar Bartov, an Israeli-American Holocaust expert, just wrote an article in New York

Times saying that now the Israelis are doing the type of genocide that makes saying never again absurd, absurd. Why are they doing the thing that was done to them? The world had tremendous sympathy for all Jews, and I do all decent human beings do. But what Israel is doing is lighting that sympathy on fire and saying, we get to murder, we get to kill, and you can't call us any names. We get to call all Muslims who fight back against us terrorists. We get to attack all of our neighbors. They attack Syria again today. We get to break all the laws. We get to commit war crimes. And I'm tell you right now, just like the Germans, you do not have the right to commit war crimes, to commit a genocide, to kill all those children, and then hide, hiding, use as a shield. Oh, everybody's an anti-Semite, an anti-Semite. You're canceled. You don't get to say it. You've ruined your credibility. No, Israel has ruined its credibility. Israel is now one of the most monstrous states I have ever seen in my lifetime. They commit endless terrorism. They robbed the American people. of our money to rob Palestinians of their land.

That is actually a stone-cold fact. And I was right, Israel is now occupying 75% of Gaza. It was always to steal their land. Okay. And by the way, it is a desecration of Jewish history and Jews overall. Pierce, this is a vast government. I want to bring... I want to bring it to the history of Jews.

Okay, check, I want to bring in Matthew to respond to that. I just can't help thinking, listening to both of you, how different the region in the world would have been if after October the 7th, as the whole of the world reeled against the heinousness of that crime, the sympathy of the global South was with Israel. Polling was very strong for understandable reasons, and I don't want to reduce this to opinion polls, that was a moral atrocity. If Israel had acted proportionately, it's a difficult word in a context like this, but hadn't visited the carnage, had retaliated. the support of the wider world, had gone for a rapprochement an accord with Saudi Arabia. It already had the Abraham Accords. Most moderate Sunni opinion was in favor of more harmony between the Arab world and Israel. Most of these Arab governments are relatively moderate. Just think of that, how Iran would have been isolated, the collateral that Israel could have

brought to bringing peace to the region. And what's happened instead? This overreactual. reaction, the inflamed conversation that we're listening today, ever more entrenched positions. And the thing that I think historians will be most fascinated in is how, as I understand it, good reporting from the New York Times just recently, that in the accord with Saudi Arabia, was scuppered from within the Israeli cabinet by Smotrich and the extremists, who have every incentive to keep this war going because of their really quite horrific objectives. and Netanyahu's personal political interest of obfuscating a trial for corruption. That is what I think is a great tragedy that is unfolding before our eyes

and listening to the entrenched positions of you two. Pierce, I don't see an easy and obvious solution. No, well, I certainly concur with the difficult solution. But no, no, no, wait, I now disagree with Matthew. Don't equate us. Don't equate me with a terrorist. Pierce, Pierce, I have to be able to speak. Pierce, Pierce.

Right, Rabbi Smooley, you're a boss. I can call the Nazi on the show. Okay, okay, thank you very much. Matthew, you're a very fair person, but with all due respect, you're just not realistic. You are a noble idealist. The two most important words that were ever uttered in the Second World War were surprised upon Winston Churchill in Casablanca by Franklin Roosevelt, who didn't even tell him who was his ally, and Churchill had fought the Nazis alone. Those two words were unconditional surrender.

Churchill said, if you insist on unconditional surrender against the Nazis, they're going to fight through the last man. And Churchill was actually secretly negotiating with Heinrich, through Count Bernadote in Switzerland without the Americans even knowing. The American sister-in-conditional surrender, and why? They understood, when you have a terror regime like the Nazis who do engage in genocide, unless you finish them off completely and defeat the idea of militarism that Hamas could achieve its objectives through military objectives and not diplomatic objectives, then you will never have peace.

Hamas has launched six wars against Israel since Israel voluntarily withdrew from Gaza in 2015. Israel uprooted its own citizens. It was almost a civil war because it used the IDF to uproot its citizens. I want to talk fact here. Not what you think, Matthew, not what Chang thinks. And Pierce, not what you think. Just fact. That's a fact. So Chang says Israel wanted it back.

They used their soldiers to uproot their citizens and destroy their houses. And my wife's first cousins were one of those houses, 2005. My children planted the last trees in Gush Katif, and they were cut down by Palestinians right afterward. One second. Let's stick to facts. Number two. So you wanted to steal their land from a long time ago? No, no, no, no, one second.

I did not interrupt you. Pierce, when you say breaking the Geneva Convention, that's not fact at all. Israel withdrew from Gaza. There are 1.9 million Arab-Israeli citizens living under the protection of the IDF who don't even have to serve. Israel does practice apartheid,

but reverse apartheirth of the idea. And not Arabs to the IDF. My sons are fighting right now in Gaza and Lebanon protecting two million Arab Israeli citizens. And let's remember when Iran fired their missiles on Israel, one missile took out an entire Arab family near Nazareth till seven Arabs. My sons are risking their lives for 1.9 million Arab Israeli citizens, which gives lie factually to the utter stupidity and ignorance of what Chank is saying about a genocide. Genocide was a term coined by a Jewish lawyer, survivor of the Holocaust, named Raphael. Lempkin in 1947. It was adopted by the United Nations in 1948, the UN Genocide. Geno's an ethnicity, a nationality. Side is mass murder. It's where you kill a nationality. If Israel wanted

a genocide, the first people it would kill is the 1.9 million Arab citizens who vote, who have 10 members of the Knesset, whose members get up and curse out Israel every day and can't be arrested. They have diplomatic immunity. Israel is the most just, most democratic, and freest nation in the entire Middle East, which is why those Arabs in Israel did not. rise up and revolt after October 7th. Now, Matthew, Matthew, let me tell you one final thing. Can I reply? I wish, you're, Matthew, wait, let me just finish.

You're a very reasonable man. I wish you were right that after watching women have their breasts cut off and being played baseball with it by the terrorists, when those women were raped and shot in the genitals, and Shani Luke was raped and then put on the back of that truck on her father. Israel murdered 20,000 children. I wish, I wish Israel was way worse than Hamas. I wish that Israel could have thought of a proportional response. But, but Matthew, let me put this.

to you. Don't you think the war would end tomorrow? But you have to murder children instead. You were forced into it. Surrendered and released the hostages. Israel would leave Gaza tomorrow. My children are in Gaza. I want them out. I don't want Gaza.

I want the people of Gaza to have a vote. I don't want what Chang says. I don't want what Pierce said. I don't want to. Daniele why said, give the people of Gaza vote. Where do you want to live? Do you want to be displaced to a better country? You had a lot.

You had a long doubt. There was a key. Let Matthew respond. You asked him a question, let him respond. At the beginning of that contribution, you made a substantive and I think reasonable argument. You drew an analogy between the destruction of Hamas and the destruction of the Nazis. I think this is a flawed analogy. Nazism was a nationalist movement within Germany.

It was not intended to be an international movement. Germans' allies in the Second World War, Italy and Japan, it wasn't really an axis. They hated each other. They didn't coordinate effectively. By defeating the Nazis in Germany, they defeated Nazism. Religious fundamentalism crosses national borders. It's an ideology. You can't, please understand, you cannot bomb it into submission.

I mentioned earlier that they're replacing dead Hamas fighters at a rate of five to one. This is going to come back to haunt you for years. The way to do it was to isolate the funders in Iran by having a proportionate response, less than what you've done, retaining global public opinion. These metaphors, and I've heard them from Israeli politicians, they melt under scrutiny. Please think about, by the way, the psychology is completely different between what's happening in the Second World War, German, European psychology, where you could rebuild a democratic country and what's happening in Hamas in Gaza.

Unless we're clear, unless we have clarity over what the objectives are for Israel, Netanyahu's not talked about day one. We have no idea what the plan is, except for Smotris, this idea of ethnic cleansing, which would tarnish Israel's image irredeemably. Yeah, I've got to leave it there. Well, Matthew, we do. I'm going to leave it. We do know.

I've got to say, Israel says they're going to take Gaza. They say Palestinians will never get a state. So we know. I don't know why you're obfuscating for Israel. Israel says we're going to murder the Palestinians until we take Gaza. They say, they say, they say total annihilation. Why do I say the Germans? Because they're talking like the Germans.

I can't believe you didn't hear that. The good thing is, change, change, change, change. We have a thing. We have a thing. We already know. The good thing is, if I may, if I may, the good thing is, if I may, the good thing is, is come out of Smodrich's own mouth, the finance minister, that the plan is to, quote, cleanse Gaza of Palestinians.

It was unequivocal. We all heard it. Smodrich is one guy in the government. And he was in the next day, BB. told him, then I get told he doesn't matter. No one listens to him. And yet the New York Times, New York Times reported that the whole deal to release hostages when the whole deal to release hostages a year ago was abandoned because of Smodrich.

So a guy who doesn't matter managed to do that, which would have prevented 10 to thousands of people being. That's not true. It is true. There were two ceasefires against Smolteridge. And he left the government. I've got to leave with it. Smodrich. Stop funding Israel.

Smodrich is an evil human being. They should not, give us a 300 billion back in Israel. And he is a senior government minister. We didn't send it for war crimes. Who is making it clear what he wants to do. Pierce, Pierce. I've got to leave it there. I've got to leave it there, Rabbi Smirley.

We have run out of time. I'm another best waiting. I'm going to leave it there. You all had a good time to speak. I appreciate the debate. Thank you very much. Matthew was great meeting you. God bless you.

Well, joining me now is the actor and active Jacob Berg, who is part of a second freedom flotilla headed for Garza. Jacob, thank you for joining me on Uncensor. Oh, thanks so much for having me on the show. You know, I'm not a massive fan of these Latillas, as I think you're probably aware. I didn't really see the point of the one that Greta Thunberg embarked on. I'm not really sure what the aim is. If it's to raise awareness about what's happening in Gaza,

I think the whole world is extremely aware of what is happening. And I don't see that anything to happen from the last Latourne, has made a scintilla of difference to the situation. So why do you disagree? Well, I disagree with this because there's been an illegal siege on Gaza by Israel since 2007. It's funny that your guest, Daniela, kind of talked about Israel leaving Gaza. But obviously, we know that they've been stopping and blocking aid. What Israel is doing is completely illegal.

And the foetilla, the goal of the flotilla is to break that siege, to hopefully inspire other people to create a humanitarian corridor to bring much-needed aid to the people of Palestine who are being systematically genocided and the weaponization of starvation of food. And it's going to be very important that we continue on with this because as many times as Israel might stop us, we're going to keep going.

Right. But like I say, the first flotilla with Greta Thunberg, it didn't achieve anything. Well, the ones in the first flotilla appears. This is one that we're about to go on and bark is the 30, And what it is, is it brought a lot of attention to what Israel is doing. But I just don't agree with that. The only one I was even aware of was the Greta Thunberg one.

Well, you should be aware in 2010 that Israel bordered the flotilla and killed ten activists. I'm aware of that, but you're talking about prior to October the 7th then? Yeah, that was, yes, we've been going since 2008, correct. Okay, so I'm talking about what's happened since October the 7th. And I think the reality of the Greta Thumburg flotilla is that, you know, a lot of publicity for Greta Thunberg, as her campaigns tend to do, but it was singularly ineffective. And I just don't...

Well, it wasn't as far as bringing in aid. That's part of it. But the real part of it is to put the highlight, like I said, of the illegal blockade and siege of Gaza by Israel. What we're doing trying to deliver aid is totally legal. We're going in international waters into Palestinian waters. But you're not going to be able to do it, are you? Can I finish Pierce?

It shows the evil. of Israel and how they will do anything to stop us trying to help the people of Palestine. I mean, you would agree that weaponizing starvation is immorally wrong, right? Yes, I would, and I've been very critical about it. And I think the fact that Israel won't allow any international journalists into Gaza is a complete disgrace. I'm just not convinced that these flotillas are anything more than, honestly, if I'm being completely honest, a bit of an ego trip for Greta Thunberg and people such as yourself, Even though I don't question, just to be finished, I don't question your personal motivation.

I think I'll probably agree with you about a lot of it. I'm just not sure that these fatillas are anything other than a PR exercise. Well, you should speak to the people in Gaza because the people at Gaza, this type of flotilla mission gives them a lot of hope. It shows that the world actually cares about them. And we're going to still do everything we can to try and break that siege. The real question is why is Israel intimidated by a. boat filled with peace activists, just trying to bring food and diapers and baby formula to civilians. But you know you won't be able to get that to Gaza?

That's not beside the point. We're trying to break through. If obviously Israel kidnaps us, which they did kidnap Greta, I know you kind of dragged her over the coals saying that it wasn't, but it was by all means of kidnapping. They kidnapped them in international waters, and it just further highlights the crimes of Israel. I actually think that using the word kidnap in the scenario of her simply being taken off and then led away back where she came from. I actually know, to be honest, Jacob, Jacob, Jacob, I actually just felt it was incredibly insulting to the hostages who were actually kidnapped to use a word like kidnapped when Greta Thunberg was given some sweets and a nice drink and had a blanket put rounder and was taken off the fatale

And then taken away. This whole episode holding the Zionist to the Coles and now you're reverting back to Zionist, Hosner. No, no, I don't have a... I don't take science. No, you are. You're talking about the sandwich and the thing and the selfie float and all that.

I see what you're doing here. Well, I saw what happened. I saw the video footage. Yeah. Right. What's your point? She wasn't kidnapped. And it's insulting to hostages who work in.

It was an international war. They came with weapons drawn. They came with weapons drawn. been drawn, Pierce. Okay, maybe you don't believe it to be so, but lawyers and international advocates would disagree with you. You feel comfortable using the word kidnap, knowing what happened to so many hostages. The same way, I wouldn't use the terms hostages for who's left in Gaza. They're all POWs at this point. Right. They're all soldiers in there. Okay. When do you hope to get to Gaza? Right now, we're having a pit stop here in Gallupoli, Italy. We'll be leaving out on Friday.

It should take about a week for us to sail to Gaza. We're going to keep the attention of the world on what we're doing. And so about a week, eight days or so, assuming we don't get intercepted by Israel. Okay. Well, Jake Berger, I wish you safe travel. I hope nothing untoward happens to you guys. That's it? That's all?

Ah? That's it? I don't think you're going to make a shred of difference to what's happening in Gaza whatsoever. No. Well, I mean, honestly, honestly, I don't know why. You totally shifted your tone here. You know, you were being very critical of Danielle

and now you're acting like a Zionist with me. No, no. I'm not a Zionist. And it's despicable the way that you went after Greta, who has more courage and more honesty in her heart than you will ever have. Yeah, I don't agree with that either. But that's fine.

That's your opinion. You're entitled to do it. All right. And you tell Rabbi Shmooley that he'll burn in hell as well because obviously he's a shame to Jews, him and Danielle. Okay. And free Palestine. All right.

Nice to see you, Pierce. Good luck, and I hope it goes safely for you. Thank you for joining me. Pierce Morgan Unsensit is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask only one simple thing. Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Pierce Morgan Unsensored on Spotify and Apple Podcast. And in return, we will continue our mission to inform, irritate and entertain.

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