Pod Save America - "Ginni Leaked It!" (Live at The Chicago Theatre!")

Episode Date: May 6, 2022

Guest host Alyssa Mastromonaco joins Jon, Jon and Dan live in Chicago! Democrats look for ways to protect abortion access as the midterms approach. This week's Ohio primary strengthens Trump’s position as kingmaker in the GOP. Michigan State Senator Mallory McMorrow joins to talk about confronting Republican extremism head-on. And the show ends with a game and a few shots of Chicago’s hometown hooch. Special thanks to MSG Entertainment and The Chicago Theatre! With our constitutionally protected right to abortion under attack, abortion funds are working nonstop to make sure people can still access (and afford) abortion.Visit votesaveamerica.com/roe to learn more, donate, and take action. For a transcript of this episode, please email [e-mail] and include the name of the podcast.

What's up, Chicago? Chicago! Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau. I'm Alyssa Mastromonaco. I'm Jon Lovett. I'm Dan Pfeiffer. Also joining us here tonight, Michigan State Senator Mallory McMorrow. So here's the thing. Tommy has COVID. He's not here. He's fine.

He's fine. He's fine. Pray for Tommy. But the, the, here's my question. If we had, what'd you say?

Oh, I'm sorry. It's like, I thought it was a compliment for me. Hold on a second. Hold on a second. I don't know if this is your first time at this show. If you want to shout something, you can try it.

You better be confident. You better be articulate. But I'll tell you, if you interrupt me again to praise one of them, you're out. That's one. Second, here was my question. If we had said Tommy sent in a video message and then played two seconds of the Madison Cawthorn video. Applaud if you know the video.

It would have worked. Pretty close. It would have worked. I think it would have worked. We weren't sure. We weren't sure if you'd get it. Otherwise, it's kind of horrifying just to say that. We're coming in fresh.

All right. Let's get to the news. And let's get pissed off about it. This week, Politico obtained a draft Supreme Court decision written by Justice Samuel Alito that would overturn Roe v. Wade and Planned Parenthood v. Casey, thereby ending the constitutional right to an abortion in America. Chief Justice John Roberts confirmed the authenticity of the draft,

but said that it doesn't represent the court's final position and that he's directed the Supreme Court Marshal, that's still a thing, to investigate the leak. The final decision in Dobbs v. Jackson women's health will likely come sometime in June, and if it reflects the leaked draft, abortion would be protected in only 22 states. Republicans reacted to the story by throwing a shit fit over the leak itself,

with assholes like Ron DeSantis calling the leak the real insurrection, while President Biden and Democrats around the country have vowed to take whatever action they can to protect abortion access. So I just want to start with everyone's reactions to the news and to Alito's draft opinion. Alyssa, you want to start with everyone's reactions to the news and to Alito's draft opinion. Alyssa, you want to start? Well, my reaction was one of, I was shocked, but not shocked, if that makes sense. I couldn't believe that it was happening, but thought it was going to happen. I don't think that, I mean, if I'm being

honest, I didn't think that it would go so far. I expected Roe would be eroded. I didn't think that Justice Alito would dig so deep down into the darkest parts of his soul as to, you know, be like, you know what? Fuck it. Ro, never should have happened. Let me write an essay telling you why. I was really mad less at him and more at all of the people who have called Aaron and I hysterical when we've been saying this was going to happen for almost 200 episodes. We are news witches, but we did not want to be right about this. So I was, I mean, honestly, like physically I was sick because I know what it means to so many people for this to happen. I mean, for me, I had shock, but for a lot of people who heard that they had terror

and panic. And so, yeah yeah that's how i felt love it i felt the opposite that shocks me zero i i would say like when it first when we first saw it it was very shocking to see but but as alissa said we've been talking about this for months we were planning for June to have a plan ready in the event of a ruling because we knew there were really only two outcomes ahead of us. And we actually still don't know which outcome is ahead of us technically. They were going to either heavily restrict access to abortion and access to reproductive care, or they were going to overturn Roe, both as a horrible outcome, both immediately empowers a

lot of states to put in place laws, in many cases they've already passed, right? It looks the same in many regards, but it was shocking to see it. I think it is the difference in seeing a draft ruling, it is the difference between someone saying, hey, we're going to crash and like pulling your face back off of the airbag. It was like, we were seeing it. This is the text. This could be the text we see in just a matter of weeks. And I think it's one thing to know it's coming. But I think a lot of people suddenly felt the emotions of how real it's going to be, not just for them, but for people everywhere. Very much agree with that. Like you can know something's coming and still have it feel

horrible when it happens. Because we knew this was possible when Anthony Kennedy resigned, was replaced by Brett Kavanaugh. We knew it was probable when Ruth Bader Ginsburg passed away, and was replaced by Amy Coney Barrett. But to read it in its full and to have it written out like that really, I think, helps flesh out just how horrific this is. And in that opinion, Alito, who seems like a real piece of work, he has his footnote where he lists all these cases to try to explain, to show that, look, this is not unusual for us to overturn long-standing precedent. We've overturned all these cases. But in almost all the ones he cites, he's talking about Plessy v. Ferguson, Loving v. Regina, all cases that were overturned for the purpose of giving people more rights. rights. And what is happening here is the first time this has happened in recent memory is that the Supreme Court is taking a constitutional right away from millions and millions of people.

And to understand that is to think about in terms of what is really happening here and just how a big and important deal this is and what a turning point this is, sort of a hinge point in our history. Yeah. It also was striking how emboldened this majority on the Supreme Court feels. The Supreme Court, people could argue, is the most institutionalist of the three institutions that govern us. And usually they have careful language, even though they're trying to have a political end with one opinion or the other. But Sam Alito, in this opinion, it was just mask off. He let his freak flag fly. Let his freak flag fly.

Full, as the strict scrutiny ladies say, full Trollito. Yeah, let's not forget, Sam Alito heckled Barack Obama at the State of the Union. That's right. Yeah, it's like he's like, you know, one expert, he burned witches in the 1600s, thinks abortion should never be allowed. You turn the page, you have to expect to see one of those phrenology maps with different parts of women's brains that show

where they shouldn't be allowed to make certain decisions. That's the intellectual level. He made a eugenics argument. He had a eugenics footnote in there. That was crazy. Citing Clarence Thomas. Citing Clarence Thomas, yeah. That's it. So Alyssa, what does an America without the protections of Roe and Casey look like?

Like what happens next? Should this be the opinion that we get in June? So this question solidifies my place here as being not fun at all tonight. So what will happen? So the interesting thing is I think a couple years ago, in theory, if we thought about if Roe were overturned, you could be like, well, there won't be abortion. But the Republican legislatures of so many states have shown us it is not just that it would be illegal,

like that it would be illegal, but they would try to criminalize it in a way that, like the Louisiana House today, a bill passed through the House that would put women who had abortions in prison. And, you know, before they had been like, we're only going to send the doctors to prison who perform the abortions. And now they're like, no, we're sending you bitches too. And so I think that a world without Roe is a world of terror, a world of women who have to pay. First of all, abortion should be fucking free. But they would have to pay so much more.

This is not going down to your clinic. This is now, when you think about it, it is a network of people who will have to help these women get abortions. There are organizations who are going to have to help with the logistics. There are, the fact that this country has come to a place where every problem needs to be solved with a GoFundMe, like when you think about it, go back in time and watch Dirty Dancing, okay? Dr. Hausman, the first GoFundMe for abortion. And that's basically what we will be back to. You know, you'll have a lot of great people who are raising the money. You have a lot of good people who are going to be implementing and trying to help women get where

they need to go. But like the truth is, that's not enough. They'll have to take time off of work. They may have to find childcare. I mean, it is so, it is a world of barbary and chaos. That is what the world without Roe will be. Yeah, and look, a lot of people have made the point that in the short term, you know, obviously the burden falls disproportionately on people who are poorer. It divides along clients of class and race.

People with means will still be able to seek out abortions, seek out reproductive care. But in the long run, if we think they're going to stop at just the states that are currently banning abortion, that's, we should think again. If there is a Republican Congress after 2022, and then there is a Republican president after 2024. The idea that they won't try to do a national ban on abortion, that they won't try to introduce a fetal personhood bill. Which means, by the way, for those who don't know, that they're going to try and get rid of IVF because that is a whole other story. IUDs are technically inducing abortions. Certain kinds of birth control,

like all the people on television who are like, oh, the Handmaid's Tale's examples are so extra. They are not extra. They're prescient. Miscarriages. Miscarriages. If your body cannot have the baby through a miscarriage, you will need abortion care for that.

That will not be allowed. So the fact that there will need abortion care for that. That will not be allowed. So the fact that there will not be exceptions for rape, for incest, for the life and health of the mother, this is now what some of these states, this is what happened in Louisiana today. This is going to start happening in all these states all over the country. But John, Mitch McConnell told us he was committed to the filibuster. So obviously. Right. No, I know. Well, yeah. And fortunately, Kirsten Sinema and Joe Manchin will be able to say, well, we upheld the filibuster. We did it. Mitch told us. Mitch

promised that he would hold it. Yeah. So let's talk about what can be done to protect abortion access and reproductive health care right now, or particularly either between now and the decision and then right after the decision comes out. Dan, can you walk through a couple things, what the White House's options are, what Congress's options are, and then what the fight looks like in the states? Sure. I think the White House would be the first to admit that the federal government executive branch has very limited tools of what they can do here. You know, they are reportedly exploring trying to use, whether they can access Medicaid funds or other funding sources to provide funding for people

who have to travel to get abortions or seek other reproductive care. But there's questions about whether that is allowed. And they also know that Republican attorney generals will immediately sue to stop that. And that question will be decided by

Sam Alito and his friends. Stop that. And that question will be decided by Sam Alito and his friends. Congress is going to this way. The Senate, Senator Schumer has pledged that in the coming days or weeks, they are going to try to pass a federal law that would essentially codify Roe to create a federal right to access abortion. The problem with that is twofold. One, it is subject to a filibuster. But even if we were to get over the filibuster, there are not currently 50 Democratic votes for it. Joe Manchin and Senator Bob Casey of Pennsylvania do not yet support it. And even if we were to pass it, a lot of legal experts are very skeptical that this Supreme Court would allow

such a law to stand. It was certainly if you were to pass that law, it would be an absolute game changer, even for a short period of time in which it was in place before it was enjoined or stopped. But I think it's very important that the Democrats are pushing this to be very clear-eyed and honest with the American public about what the prospects are here. And we don't sort of rerun some of the plays of the last year where we get everyone's expectations up without a path to success. Now, the ruling of this court is that abortion is a question for the states. So that means that what happens in the election this fall is going to determine what access to

abortion people have. And what that means is if we elect Democratic governors and Democratic legislatures in states, they can pass laws like there are in a lot of blue states guaranteeing access to abortion. They can make abortion legal in those states and people have access there. They can serve as a bulwark against worse laws, right? Like in Louisiana, they're passing, as you mentioned, this incredibly cruel and idiotic and terrible law. That's going to be happening all over this country. In many states, the Republican candidates for governor have already said that they would support a total ban with no exceptions were they to become.

So even if there is a law in the books now that has some exceptions, Republicans will try to pass laws with no exceptions. Democrats can stop that. It's incredibly important that we elect Democratic attorney generals and prosecutors because they are the ones who are going to decide how these laws are prosecuted. In Michigan, the attorney general who was up for reelection this year, Dana Nessel, has already said that she is not going to enforce Michigan's law. And so she is running against a big lie-believing MAGA extremist. And so the difference for, and Michigan is one of the states

where as soon as Roe v. Wade is overturned, a law will go into place. And so the difference for, and Michigan is one of the states where as soon as Roe v. Wade is overturned, a law will go into place. And so in every one of these states, so if we elect Stacey Abrams, that's going to make a difference for people in Georgia. We reelect Governor Whitmer and Dana Esselstyn, that's going to make people in Michigan. Wisconsin, all across the country, Pennsylvania, that's going to matter. And so it is unsatisfying because it does not get at the bigger issue and it is halting progress, but it can make a real difference in people's lives if we win those races. Can I say one thing I would like to see? Now, look, this is a little pie in the sky, but I think if I say it loud enough and often

enough, it might manifest. I would like the FDA to take the abortion pills off of the REMS list. For anyone who doesn't know what the REMS list is, it means risk evaluation mitigation strategy. And the two abortion pills, which are 99.6% effective and have a 0.4% rate of major complication, are on the same restriction list as opioids and antipsychotics. And so if they took those off of that list, it would help so many people have access to the pills. So FDA, if you're listening. Love it. You heard Dan talk about how important the midterms are going to be with regard to like a lot of these races in the States protecting abortion access.

What do we know about the politics of abortion rights as we head into the midterms? How should Democratic candidates handle this issue as they campaign between now and November? Yeah. This is, what this draft ruling has done is taken a divisive issue and made it a simple unifying issue for the whole country. There are few issues in this country where you can find 70% support. There are few issues where you can find barstool bros and Howard Stern and us and a huge swath of the country united behind a position as this one. There is no state in this country

where doing this is popular. There is no place in America, I don't care how red it is, that believes contraception should be illegal, that believes couples that are struggling to have children should be denied access to medical care. There is nowhere in this country that supports it. I don't care where you go.

I don't care where you're running. And so we were heading into a midterms where we all were aware of how terrible the headwinds were against us. But I feel like this can change that, not just because this is one of the most important issues facing the country, but it also exposes just how dangerous this movement is that we are facing in a larger way. And it's up to us now to

make sure that as many people understand the stakes as humanly possible, no matter what ruling ends up coming, no matter what happens in the next few weeks, this is the defining issue as we head into the midterms. And if we can do that, we can make that case. I don't think that there is a, I don't think if we can do that, I we can make that case, I don't think that there is a, I don't think, if we can do that, I don't think they stand a chance. Yeah, I mean, and like,

in case you don't believe the polls, in case you think this is just like democratic wish casting from activists and organizers, like, listen to how the Republicans are reacting. I think that's very telling. Like, Mitch McConnell basically said, I don't want to talk about the opinion, I want to talk about the leak. A lot of them don't want to talk about the opinion themselves. They won this

big victory, but they don't like to brag about it. There's one interesting example. Adam Laxalt, who's running for governor in Nevada, he released this statement. And the first paragraph says, this is a long-sought victory for conservatives, blah, blah, blah. And then in the end of his statement it says, but by the way, abortion is a settled issue here in Nevada because Nevada has the right to protect abortion there. So he knows he had to say that it was a victory, but he does not want to. It's not easy for Republicans, this ruling. Josh Hawley and Tucker Carlson, they're not talking about what a victory this is.

They're saying, why are Democrats afraid of democracy? Why are they so afraid of it going back to the states? They're talking about the leak. Sean Hannity made a point of saying, and just to be clear, this doesn't make abortion illegal. This just gives it back to the states. They are aware of how, I mean, these are, they have caught the car, you know, and look, the other thing is- They built the States. They are aware of how, I mean, these are, they have caught the car,

you know, and look, the other thing is- They built the car. They built it, and then they caught it. They built it, they sent it down there, they caught it. We'll figure it out.

Someone's the dog, right? They're also the dog. And I'm feeling kind of a twinge of regret because I think Chuck Schumer also used this analogy. Oh, no. Are you in front of a gas station? Am I in front of a gas station right now decrying the price of gasoline?

And what we're going to do to take on the gougers? I will say, by the way, in addition to the polling on abortion, which has looked very favorable to people who want to protect abortion access, there was a morning consult poll out this week. Americans want term limits for Supreme Court justices by a margin of 66% to 21. And favor expanding the court now by 55 to 36, which I was not expecting. I mean, this is why this is such a dangerous thing for democracy. The reason this, the road week we have returned, is that there are four justices on that court appointed by two people who got less votes than their opponent.

Yes. And these people are going to be on this court for decades, right? Absent expanding the court or term limits or one of the above. And this is, like, we are in a situation where the overwhelming majority of this country believes that this should be a decision made with a doctor, not litigated by a state legislator or a court. And that support for the issue has been consistent and growing over a period of time. But you have this court who is like frozen in amber from a different period in American politics.

And the dissonance between what the American people want and what this court wants is very scary. Because this will give you a very scary perspective. Is that when Amy Coney Barrett and Brett Kavanaugh are the age that Ruth Bader Ginsburg was when she passed away, my daughter will be in her mid-30s. She turns four in two weeks. Man, if just RBG, you just had to keep your soul inside of your body for two more fucking months. Just reach up and grab it as it floated away and just bring it back in.

You were so close. You were just grabbing on the sides of that bathtub, holding on to being alive. Fucking RPG. Jesus Christ, you gambled and we lost. I'm sorry, but sometimes it gets to me. But anyway, I'll leave you guys with this. If you want to look forward...

I'm saying we should look forward. And Democrats should feel confident as we go into this election on this issue. Data for Progress did ask a question just today. Our tests are negative, but our hearts are optimistic. If Roe is overturned, are you more or less likely to vote for a pro-choice candidate? 49% said more likely, only 20% said less likely. So this is great. So there should be a litmus test.

This should be a litmus test. There should be a litmus test. So last question on this before we move on. A number of legal analysts, including our own Leah Littman and Melissa Murray from Cricket's Strict Scrutiny podcast, have pointed out that based on Alito's opinion, abortion is not the only right at risk. What else should we be concerned about based on what we read in that draft opinion? Well, I mean, it's like if we go back and, you know, like Gorsuch and Kavanaugh and old Amy, they all said in their confirmation hearings, like, Roe is precedent. Casey is precedent on precedent. So, right. They're lying. So, the thing is, is that if it's really not, if, like, precedent isn't anything, then I guess we could go back to, like, when the people with

powdered wigs, you know, defined all this stuff that we're basing everything on. Everything is on the table if it was not enumerated back in the day. Yeah. I mean, they're not being shy about this. Totally. At the confirmation hearing for Justice, for Kentucky Brown Jackson,

John Cornyn said in that hearing that he thinks that gay marriage should be a question for the states. Right. Not that he has an opinion on it. Mike Braun, who is a real person who is an actual senator from an actual state named Indiana, said that he thought the court. I worked in the Senate. You can be both.

Said that the court should revisit whether interracial marriage should be a question for the states. Greg Abbott today said that he was considering having Texas bring a case that would challenge universal right to public education. What? So, and one thing about, you know, obviously every justice who is going to vote to overturn Roe had to hide their views when they were in their confirmation hearings. But they all went into those confirmation hearings with a plan to say whatever they needed to say, but without outright lying in most cases, to get on the court so that they can do this. Amy Coney Barrett is pretty clear about her philosophy. And what she said about Roe, I think actually you can step back and apply to a lot of a lot of other potential rulings which is oh there are things like that

that are such precedents you never even think about them and what she was really saying there is don't worry i'll overturn fucking anything i'm i am out there i am an extremist i am out there i am a radical i am cuckoo bananas i i seem nice. I'm probably wonderful interpersonally. I'll destroy your whole fucking world. My philosophy is terrible. But don't worry, because some of these precedents are so set in stone, they're never even questioned, so they'll never even come to me. So don't worry too much about it. But a lot of people heard that. A lot of people heard that a lot of people heard that greg abbott heard that and they're going to start bringing they're going to

start testing the fences like the raptors that they are i mean that's what the conservatives are saying about because people are pointing out that in alito in his opinion was like there are plenty of rights that aren't that don't have a long record in history like and he brings up oberger fell and he brings up some of these in contraception decision in Griswold and some other ones and then he said but these are not like we're only dealing with abortion here and that's that that's the moral question at the moment so conservatives are pointing that see he's just talking about abortion well then why did he bring up all those other cases he's planting little seeds here and there for people to find and to challenge and they will challenge them just imagine Samuel Alito in his little dorm room

scrawling in his little fucking notebooks, turn that music down! All right. Same guy. So before we move on, I know that a lot of you are probably wondering how you can help between now and we get to a final decision. So the first and most important thing you can do

is donate to your local abortion fund. They're the ones who know your state's law the best. They've been helping people overcome barriers to get abortions for years. They're the experts. They've been preparing for this moment. And we are very lucky to have a couple of them here with us tonight. Joining us to talk about their incredible work supporting Chicago and seeking an abortion is Megan Jiafo, Executive Director of the Chicago Abortion Fund.

Megan, come on out. Hi. Is it on? Am I talking? Okay, hello. Hi. Thanks so much for having me. Thanks for coming.

I'm excited to talk to Chicago tonight. So yeah, I'm really good at funding abortion, not so good at public speaking. So bear with me. Doesn't stop Dan. Okay. Are there any abortion fund supporters in the house tonight? I'm really excited to represent not just the Chicago Abortion Fund, but abortion funds around the country. Chicago Abortion Fund is really proud to be a founding member of the National

Network of Abortion Funds, which is a member organization of over 80 abortion funds around the country who have been helping people navigate post-war realities for decades. All of those barriers that were listed earlier, money for appointments, time off of work, child care, gas money, hotel stays, People at abortion funds are experts at helping connect people to the care they want, need, and deserve. At CAF, we support people in Chicago, Illinois, and around the region by providing financial, emotional, and logistical support and doing really whatever it takes to get people to their appointment and get it paid for. Since July of 2019, we've been able to support 100% of our

callers with rising numbers every year. And for context, in 2018, we supported less than 200 people. In 2021, we supported close to 3,000. And yeah. And this week, we've already heard from over 100 people seeking support accessing their abortion, and this is with Roe. So as you can imagine, it's been a really busy week for abortion funds and for the Chicago Abortion Fund. I'd like to share a letter I sent out to supporters of CAF last night to reground in the work that we do and to get them ready for what's to come. Dear friends, we've known this moment was coming, but nothing about it is easy. It's fitting that the leak of this news, the news that this right-wing court will soon completely strip people of their bodily autonomy, occurred the week of Mother's Day. I am a mama whose abortions made my children's

lives possible. And I'm here because my mother had an abortion shortly before she became pregnant with me. She died when I was young. I didn't know she had an abortion until I was into my 20s, until I was years past my own abortions, which I figured out absent of any emotional support with hefty doses of shame, sadness, and isolation. No one in my community talked about abortion openly and honestly. There was euphemism after euphemism, A woman's right. Pro-choice. Reproductive health care. I needed and people having abortions now need more. I wish I had heard a simple message. Abortion is okay. Abortion is common. Abortion is health care. Abortion is necessary. I wish I had heard my mother say I chose abortion because I simply was not ready to parent when I became pregnant and that is okay.

I have twin seven-year-olds. And last week on the way to school in the car line, one of them said to the other, Hey, did you know mom got pregnant before she had us? She made herself unpregnant and then got pregnant with us. I was proud and a little sad at the same time. I did make myself un-pregnant with the support of a provider at an independent clinic. I became pregnant again when I was ready to parent and had my two sweet babies who have grown up in this movement with zero stigma attached to the word abortion. People across this

country are navigating abortion alone this week, and they do not know where their families and communities stand. They're managing social media news feeds filled with vitriol or support or a mix, but so many are in those waiting rooms alone with only clinic staff, clinic escorts, or abortion fund workers like our incredible team to hold them down. Knowing this, I have two asks of you today. One, say abortion. Support abortion access by saying the word out loud and outlining why it's important to you. If you're a parent, reach out to your children and let them know how you feel.

Your colleagues, your neighbors, people at your places of worship, reach out to them too. Tell your friends and family you are a resource for them. Now is the time to be loud and vocal supporters of abortion care and abortion access. We know the vast majority of people in this country do not want to see Roe overturned, but that majority has been silent for far too long. We have to change this narrative. Two, give us or the local abortion fund in your community money. Illinois has long been a receiving state, and the number of people pouring into our state is going to increase.

We have a mandate in Illinois and a receiving state, and the number of people pouring into our state is going to increase. We have a mandate in Illinois and a responsibility. We must take care of each other, and giving to an abortion fund is a way to put your money where your rage is. The National Network of Abortion Funds Fundathon is happening now. You can check out the Chicago Abortions Fund Fundathon at bit.ly slash everycaller. You can also go to our website, chicagoabortionfund.org. This is a massive grassroots initiative that you can be a part of. It's a peer-to-peer fundraiser. You can be a catalyst for abortion justice in your community, and we provide tips, tricks, and even sample tweets and emails for you to use. It's very easy. We're going to have more asks in the days to come as we seek

to not just protect abortion access in Illinois, but to expand it. And we'd really love to have you do that with us. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you Megan Thank you everyone in Chicago for donating what you can to the Chicago Abortion Fund and for everyone listening at home Vote Save America is now your one stop shop for the Fuck Bans Action Plan where you can

donate, volunteer and get to work advancing reproductive justice between right now and November when there are critical races on the ballot that will determine protecting abortion access for a long time to come. So head to votesaveamerica.com and get involved. Okay, we will be back with more news in a bit. Now it's time for OK Stop. It's been a blue-ribbon week of absolutely squalid Republican takes on the leak.

The leak. The unprecedented historical betrayal of knowing what the Supreme Court might do next month anyway. Don't take our word for it. You know the rules of OK Stop, which are, of course, Byzantine. I'll say OK Stop, and then we'll share our opinions. Are you ready? Here it is. Ted Cruz on the leak.

Yeah, it's fine. I have to say it is. Ted Cruz on the leak. Yeah, it's fine. I have to say it is utterly stunning that anyone at the court would leak a draft opinion. In over 200 years of our nation's history, this has never happened. Okay, stop. That was also true of a mob storming the Capitol. But that didn't bother him as much when that happened. He was not as upset about that.

That is the exact thing I would say if a United States senator just happened one day to like a porn tweet. That has probably happened before. On 9-11. Let us never forget. Let us never forget. Let us never forget. He liked a porn tweet on 9-11. And I am appalled. This is the most egregious breach of trust at the Supreme Court that has ever happened.

Okay, stop. It is not. I mean, is it though? I mean, I don't want to be like Jack McCoy from Law and Order, but these justices took an oath and they told Susan Collins and everybody else that they thought Roe was precedent. So I just, I don't know. I think that that was a pretty big breach. They lied. Feels like a breach.

It's called perjury. Stolen seat. Bush versus Gore. Dred Scott. There's a long list. There's a long list of low lights from our friends at the Supreme Court.

Dan, care to add anything? I would say that has anyone ever said so much shit so unconvincingly as Ted Cruz went up? I am. He says appalled like someone who's never experienced the feeling. He's never been appalled. He doesn't have appalled. That's not in his, that is not in his quiver. Appalled. Horny. Hungry.

Envious. Greedy. He laughs at the Simpsons. But he's never been appalled. All right, that's all I got. Let's keep going. Presumably, some left-wing law clerk, angry at the direction the court is going, decided to betray his or her obligation. Okay, stop. You can't just presume something and call it presumably. Presumably, everyone in this audience has a crush on me.

Is it possible? Of course. But we don't have the data. Oh, stop. Oh, stop. It was just a joke. I did want to have a... I also didn't hear it.

You were loud, you were confident, you weren't comprehensible. Two out of three, but it has to be all three. This is the difference between Democratic politicians and Republican politicians. Republican politicians say it would be good if it was a left-leaning person who did this. Therefore, it was a left-leaning person who did this.

Meanwhile, Democrats are like just texting each other articles about who the leak may have come from. What's the theory? What's the theory? Rolling out the red string. Let's get the corkboard up. Speaking of red string, Dan, what do you think? Who leaked this thing? Do you want my theory? I want your theory. And here's the thing? Rolling out the red string. Let's get the cork board up. Speaking of red string, Dan, what do you think? Who leaked this thing?

Do you want my theory? I want your theory. And here's the thing. Oh, no. Obviously, the leak. We're doxing tonight, people. No. Dox.

Dox. Dox. Dox. Dox. We obviously, here at Pod Save America, we'll tow the party line. The leak is not important. What's important is what they fucking do. We agree.

That's true. But the leak is interesting. All right? And we're not making it a party's message, but we can have a fun conversation on where this fucking leak came from. It's interesting, especially because this may not be the decision.

And then we're all going to look like idiots. I am so convinced it was not an opponent of the opinion. I am very convinced it was not. What's your evidence, John? Make your case in 30 seconds or less. Here's my case. It's a draft opinion from February. So if the purpose

was to warn everyone that this was coming and you didn't like the opinion, why wouldn't you have leaked it back in February? Why do you pick now to leak it? But, and also, also, the Wall Street Journal editorial that happened just a couple weeks ago where they said that Roberts didn't want to be

in the majority in this, and that they were worried that there was someone that was going shaky in the majority, and so if you don't want that person to defect to Roberts and the minority, then you put out this opinion to try to box them in. And if you look at where the staples are in the upper left-hand corner, you can tell that it was removed.

There was a watermark. It was removed before it was copied, so it was someone who did not have access to a digital copy, Cui Bono. Before I get to my theory, can we put up the names and addresses of all the Supreme Court clerks first? Docs. Docs. Docs. Docs. Docs. I'm not a party to this.

Docs. Docs. No doxing. Dan, the people are clamoring for you. They're salivating for your theory. Okay, here's what we have to understand. Alright. On this story, there are two reporters on the byline of the story. One is Josh Gerstein, who has covered the courts for many, many years. The other is a guy named Alex Ward, who is a national security reporter who does not cover the courts.

Alex Ward has nothing to offer to that story. Josh Gerstein does not need his help writing it, doesn't need his help understanding the opinion. I was like, oh, maybe Alex Ward is, maybe he comes from right-wing media, or he's tied in with these people. So I went to LinkedIn, where all good investigators go. Turns out, he used to work at Vox,

so I'm going to guess it's a no on that. This is getting good. Doc, so Vox. All leads back to Mattdie iglesias america's twitter scamp so based on the many years we lived in washington if you have a choice between conspiracy and idiocy it's almost always idiocy. So I am convinced that some fucking Supreme Court clerk Yahoo, who got a perfect score on his LSAT but can't match his socks in the morning, left a copy of the opinion on the Metro at a coffee shop. Someone picked it

up, said, this is interesting, knows Alex Ward, called Alex Ward, only reporter they know, calls Alex Ward and says, is this real? Alex Ward goes to Josh Gerstein, the person at Politico who could source it. Josh Gerstein gets it confirmed. They're both on the story. That's how it happened.

Wow. That's what happened. That's what happened. Lock it in. That's it. That's it. All the anger, all the back and forth. It was a left clerk.

It was a right clerk. It was this clerk. Some dummy left it on the train. Happened once, happened a thousand times. Let's continue with the clip. That clerk owed to his or her justice and to the court. This is the predictable result of the Democrats' multi-year campaign to politicize the court, including Chuck Schumer standing on the steps of the court, threatening to, quote,

unleash the whirlwind, including radical Democrats threatening to pack the court, including the effort of many Democrats to personally smear and target Justice Thomas. Okay, stop. First of all, just to go back a second. Have any group of people been more fucking butthurt to be on the precipice of winning a 50-year battle? I mean, these fucking assholes have been trying to, like, they have been trying to rob this bank for 50 years. And now they're in the car and it's filled with gold. They're like, I didn't like the way the teller talked to me. Fucking assholes.

They are assholes. We are in a war against assholes. They are assholes We are in a war against assholes Yeah he is Ted's very upset with anyone who would undermine The legitimacy of the court Unless it's Clarence Thomas refusing to recuse himself From the January 6th cases

Because his wife participated in the fucking coup Insurrection Ginny leaked it Ginny leaked it Ginny leaked it Ginny leaked it Ginny leaked it Doc Ginny I don't have a chant for it

No I'm fine It doesn't chant well Ginny can't be Docs She's Ginny leaked it. Ginny leaked it. Doc Ginny. I don't have a chant for it. You know, I'm fine. It doesn't chant well. It doesn't chant well. Ginny can't be doxed. She's Ginny Thomas. No one asked me. She's self-doxed.

What's up, Alyssa? No one asked me. What, your theory is? Yeah. Well, we didn't know you had a theory. It was sort of a kind of... Because you didn't ask. Okay, I didn't know we were asking everybody for their theory.

Well, everyone gave one. You're right. Except me. You're right, and I'm sorry. So, a war on people with uteri. Just kidding. It was Ginny. What's your theory?

It was Ginny. You think it was Ginny? Totally Ginny. She's totally untrustworthy. She's totally untrustworthy. And she's like, they just need to read her text. I'm sure it's in her text somewhere. She texts everything.

Mark Meadows has it. She's like, someone check her WhatsApp. text everything. Mark Meadows has it. She's like, someone check her WhatsApp. One serious point on all this is because immediately the right wing blamed the left and it almost became treated as

fait accompli that this was the decision or the decision would look something like that. We really don't know that. And it is, I think one thing that made this leak something everybody could talk about is there are a lot of plausible explanations including Dan's train theory which is novel and very interesting so good but but just because people like ted cruz are the loudest doesn't mean that the idea that this isn't some right-wing goon trying to muscle fucking you know brett kavanaugh who may very well

be on the fence and by the way was hoping that this becoming public would box him in but But I don't think it's having that effect. You can imagine having the opposite effect. A week of seeing that those Susan Collins clips, his own clips in the hearing, this opinion being ripped to shreds, like who fucking knows what's about to happen. And they are on the verge of restricting Roe no matter what this decision is. And what I don't want to see is all of a sudden it's not as bad, but it's fucking horrible. And then there's a week of stories about how Democrats have lost their mid as bad, but it's fucking horrible. And then there's a week of stories about how Democrats have lost their midterm issue, which is fucking horseshit.

So let's just keep our heads on a swivel. That's all I'm saying. You know what I mean? What if it was a betrayal from PJ and Squee? I'm telling you, Squee is involved. I was thinking about Squee. I forgot about those guys. I forgot about Squee.

Maybe he did it at the reunion. Is that it? Is that it? Is that the end of the clip? Yeah, right? All of this is the vicious politicization of the court. I don't know how the court does its business going forward. Hey, Ted, don't threaten us with a good time.

And that's OK Stop. Wow. That was a journey. That was a journey. All right, let's get back to the news. This week, after a last-minute endorsement from Donald Trump, J.P.J.D. Mandel Vance won the Ohio Republican Senate primary and

is now the favorite against Democratic Congressman Tim Ryan for the seat being vacated by retiring Senator Rob Portman. A bunch of other Trumpy Republicans also won in Ohio, including a January 6th attendee named J.R. Majewski, who was once, this is a real person, he's running against Marcy Kaptur, it's a real thing, this is live ammo we're playing with. He was once featured on Fox News wearing a QAnon t-shirt after painting Trump's campaign banner on his lawn. This is the newest Republican congressional nominee, he's also a songwriter and a rapper. His MAGA hit, Let's Go Brandon, includes the line, Joe is focused on ice cream while he's crapping his pants. We want our dreams and our freedom.

This is our last chance. So that's something that's happening in Ohio. So good. He's trying to get to Congress. Dan, why did J.D. Vance win this race? So glad you asked the question, John. Thank you. I think there are three reasons he won. The first one is J.D. Vance is a wholly owned subsidiary of Peter Thiel. Peter Thiel is one of the richest men in Silicon Valley. He is the founder of PayPal. He is Mark Zuckerberg's mentor. He sat on the Facebook board for years.

J.D. Vance has worked for Peter Thiel, and Peter Thiel has been grooming him for the Senate seat. So Peter Thiel put in millions and millions of dollars of his own money into a super PAC that ran ads supporting J.D. Vance for basically a year. If those ads did not violate the letter of campaign finance law, they certainly violate the spirit of it, gave him a huge boost. The second reason is, and I hate to say this, but Donald Trump's endorsement gave him a boost of momentum in the final stretch. He was behind in the polls before that. It put him over the top. We can have a longer conversation about what that says about Trump's role, but in this individual race, that mattered a lot. And the third reason is that J.D. Vance was running against the dumbest, most unlikable group of MAGA sock puppets to walk the fucking earth. Like, truly people who are so dumb and so unlikable.

Josh Mandel, Jane Timken, Mike Gibbons. These people were terrible. And J.D. Vance is dishonest, dangerous, a demagogue, but he's not stupid. And he was able to navigate this field and come out ahead. And he is now a very real threat to everything. Not just winning the Senate seat, but he is the kind of person that you worry about being in the Senate because he's that dangerous. So Vance gets 32.2% in this field and wins. gets 32.2% in this field and wins. Some people have made the argument, okay, almost 70% of Republican voters did not vote for the Trump-backed candidate. Lovett, what do you think both J.D.

Vance's win and other MAGA victories in Ohio tell us about Trump's strength among Republican voters, or is this a unique situation, or what do you think? I think Trump is the most popular and important and powerful figure in Republican politics, but he doesn't have limitless ability. I think in a lot of these races, he's a bit like the Yelp of politics. In a crowded field with a lot of options that are all terrible, crushing, field with a lot of options that are all terrible you know crushing getting that yelp number one spot can like really make all the difference but it can't overcome if there's other obstacles like it turns out uh you fucking grope in everybody in every photo for 20 years and the governor nebraska's like fuck this guy like you can't overcome everything he's not all powerful and he doesn't have uh total control over base, but he can make the difference.

And there's no noisier place in the world than the right-wing media environment. And in that noisy, chaotic, substance-free, vibes-first place, Donald Trump coming in and saying, this is my guy, he's got my vibes, it can make all the difference. Yeah, Teal plus Trump plus Tucker. Tucker has loved J.D. Vance from the beginning, and J.D. Vance would go on Tucker's show all the time. It's the

most popular show in Fox primetime. I think you could probably argue that Tucker did as much for J.D. Vance as Donald Trump did, just because he's, you know, he had him on a lot. Alyssa, what kind of campaign, obviously Tim Ryan's an underdog here because Ohio is now a very Republican state. What kind of campaign and message do you think gives Ryan the best chance to defeat Vance? Well, one of the things I've noticed is that in a lot of the interviews that he does, he really sort of like arm's length Biden. And he's like, I'm an independent person, which I appreciate, but, but we have the White House. Why would we not use all the tools in our tool chest?

So what I would say for him is that I hope he uses all the tools in his tool chest. I'm not sure how successful people have been from like running away from a pretty ish popular sitting president. I would hope that, you know, he's going to raise a lot of money and I hope he uses all the money to get out the vote. But mostly I think that he just really, he needs to have a like Ohio message and not like look at Twitter and pivot and be like, this is what people are saying because like, that's not what people in Ohio are hearing or talking about. So I hope that he's like Ohio first listens to his people. But at the same time, he doesn't have to put Joe Biden in all of

his ads. But I really think that he should like embrace the successes that we have had in the last two years, as much as he can. Did you guys see that he had an ad out right away after J.D. Vance won? Tim Ryan had an ad ready to go. And it basically just was like a 30-second ad attacking J.D. Vance for leaving Ohio for San Francisco to make millions and invest in companies that profit from globalization and free trade. He said that J.D. Vance is a big hit at D.C. cocktail parties. And now he says he feels out of place in Ohio because that was a quote from J.D. Vance is a big hit at DC cocktail parties. And now he says he feels out of place in Ohio because that was a quote from J.D. Vance. That was a pretty good ad. I mean, there's a lot of Ted Cruz in J.D. Vance. Very similar. And I thought the Tim Ryan ad was

good. Because you really can. He is a venture capitalist who's supported by big tech, who's a Hollywood producer, a CNN commentator. He left Ivy League educated. All the popular stuff is complete bullshit with him. The thing that if you're going to run a campaign against him with that, Tim Ryan is a candidate who can do that. He has Ohio through and through. He's from Youngstown.

He has none of those vulnerabilities. The thing that is, I think, challenging and sort of worrisome about that is I talked to Sarah Longwell for Political Experts React, the YouTube show we do where we look at campaign ads. Good plug. Good plug. Wow. Smash the subscribe button. Elijah's so happy. And Sarah Longwell does focus groups. She's probably talked to more swing voters than anyone else in American politics for the Republican Accountability Project. And she thinks her take, basically, talking to swing voters, including in Ohio, is voters are pretty cynical and savvy about politicians.

And they kind of bake in the cake that J.D. Vance is full of shit. And that's actually an advantage in some ways, that he's not really as MAG as he says he is. And that is so, and like all the other things that undermine his sort of MAGA-ness are actually validators to swing voters. So there is some risk in that. It's a state that Joe Biden lost by 10 points in 2020. So it's going to be very, very hard. Yeah,

that's right. I thought, I think it's less about like, he's, he's not as MAGA as he says he is. It's so this, this super PAC that Peter Thiel started for J.D. Vance, obviously by law you're not supposed to coordinate

with J.D. Vance's campaign. So they ended up putting all this information and research on a public website, because that's the way that you skirt the law, but it's hard to find public website, and so therefore J.D. Vance's campaign can find it. So Politico found it and ran it today, and it's all opposition research about

the other candidates, but also opposition research about J.D. Vance that Peter Thiel did. And some of the opposition research on J.D. Vance was quite good that they did. He's run as this anti-opioid crusader, but he was working at a law firm

that was lobbying for Purdue Pharma while he was there. which is, I think that's a pretty good, that's a good hit. And worked for China. And he worked for Alibaba, which is like the Amazon of China, which for all of his anti-China stuff. That's also, it's a good hit. There was, speaking of J.D. Vance being another Ted Cruz, that happened to Ted Cruz too. Remember the Ted Cruz, they had to put up hours and hours of unedited footage of Ted Cruz recording advertisements. Remember that? And it was just him sitting on the couch next to his just sullen, furious family trying to do these ads.

Alyssa, on the Democratic side in Ohio, the rematch between Bernie Sanders-backed Nina Turner and Congresswoman Chantel Brown, who was endorsed this time not only by the Democratic establishment, but also by the Congressional Progressive Caucus, turned out to be a complete blowout. It was somewhat close last time. Now Brown won by about 30 points. Do you think that race can tell us anything about where Democratic voters are? No, no, because here's why. Winning begets winning. She already won. She was endorsed by, I mean, Congresswoman Brown was endorsed by Marsha Fudge, who is beloved. She was her protege. And it is not like Nina Turner was running against a Democrat who was going to be part of the Problem Solvers Caucus.

You know, she wasn't this over-the- top. Josh Gottheimer. Josh Gottheimer. I'll do anything to be moderate and get on Fox News. She was someone who supports Medicare for all. You know, Brown supports Medicare for all. She supports raising the minimum wage. So I really just think that it's like they knew who she was. She'd already beat her. She was a member of congress she had successes that she could tout and was endorsed by the progressive caucus so it really was i mean yeah it was very specific yeah i don't think that it was a real like people on uh people on twitter being like the democrat the progressives are no it's this was a very straightforward easy thing

to understand i think you know the know, the Twitter conversation, really. I know. I just can't help it. I get so exercised by the Twitter conversation. I was like, this is so dumb. Why are we fighting amongst ourselves? We have bigger fish to fry. We do.

We do. Okay. When we come back, Dan and I will talk to Michigan State Senator Mallory McMurrah. Please welcome to the stage Michigan State Senator Mallory McMorrow. Welcome. I told my team not to heckle me. We drove all the way here. No heckling.

Based on the applause you got in the beginning, I don't think that's going to be a problem. They're very familiar with you. So we want to get into your speech and the message and advice you might have for Democrats, but I wanted to start with getting your reaction to the leaked Supreme Court opinion about overturning Roe v. Wade.

Ah, yes. What it, your personal personal reaction and also how you think. Can I tell you my theory? Yes. Oh, okay. I love this. My theory. It was the ghost of RBG. She has been haunting that place and waiting for her moment and she is like,

I told our male brethren to get your feet off of our necks. Okay. Possible. It's as possible as all of them. But I brethren to get your feet off of our necks. Okay. Possible. It's as possible as all of them. But I want to get your reaction to the decision itself and also how you think it may impact politics in Michigan this fall. I mean, it is, it was a kick to the uterus.

It really was. We knew that it was coming. I was at an event with Attorney General Nessel in 2019 in Michigan, and she said then Roe was going to fall. And I remember the headlines were, she's exaggerating, that's hyperbole, she's fear-mongering. She was right. And the most damning part is reading the opinion and everything is on the line. This is contraception. This is gay marriage.

This is turning women back into vessels for reproduction. And it is, we got to get mad about it. I'm mad. And I know a bunch of women are mad because we had 10,000 people in Michigan sign up over the past 48 hours to volunteer, to collect signatures, to change our Constitution, to codify access into law. You know, Michigan is one of, I think it has nine states where as soon as law is repealed, abortion will be illegal in that state. You know, obviously, there are a lot of really important elections for all your statewide offices this fall. What can Michigan, what do you, as Michigan Democrats, planning to do in addition to the constitutional amendment? How does that work? Like, what can be, do you think can be done to protect people's rights in Michigan? I mean, we

are going at it on all fronts. I'm the primary bill sponsor of the Reproductive Health Act to codify access into law. I've introduced that for the past three years. Similar legislation in the House. Governor Whitmer filed a lawsuit against the state to force the Michigan Supreme Court to take this up, to try to put it in the Constitution. We've got a ballot initiative circulating, so please go sign up with Planned Parenthood or ACLU if you're a Michigander or you want to come out and help out.

And getting people out to vote. We're going at it on every front. This legislature will not pass my legislation, but that doesn't mean we can't put it up and fight and try and make sure everybody knows we are not just going to let it happen. So I'm sure most of the audience has now seen footage of your now famous speech. I would just love, like, can you take us through the process? Like, when did you decide to write it? How did you figure out what you wanted to say? Like, how did the whole thing come about? I would So I would just, I would note that when John and I were talking about doing

this interview, he said, I can't wait to nerd out with her about speech writing. So you guys will appreciate it. Finally, a Democrat gives a wonderful speech. I don't get to see this a lot. I mean, so I'm a state Senator and I saw somebody on Twitter say, wow, that was a good speech. Whoever wrote that should run for office. And I was like, I did. I'm the one. We don't have staff in the Michigan State Senate to write all of these speeches for us. So it's been a very normal few weeks for me. I'm sure. So I woke up a few weeks ago on a Monday and I got a text from my husband, big friend of the pod, who found a screenshot on Twitter and he showed it to me and it was an email from a colleague in a different part of the state that accused me by name, said Mallory McMorrow D. Snowflake,

which doesn't even make sense. The joke was wrong. Bad joke. Of grooming, supporting pedophilia, and sexualizing kindergartners, and wanting eight-year-olds to believe that they were responsible for slavery. And I just, so it hit, and right away, local reporters started calling me and asking for comments, and I didn't want to say anything in the moment. I had a lot on my calendar that day. I have a job to do. And I just sat on it for the day. And I was home alone with my daughter.

She's one. And I was giving her a bath. And she, I don't know what I said. I said something and she just started laughing hysterically. And I just started crying. And I stayed up a lot of the night. I started writing a lot of things down. I erased a lot of things.

And a lot of what I started writing was calling out the hypocrisy of the Republican Party. And you guys did this. And, you know, one of our ex-speakers of the House was accused of actual grooming of his soon-to-be sister-in-law when she was 15. And I took a lot of that out. I drove to work the next day. It's an hour and a half commute for me. And I just repeated over and over and over what I wanted to say until I felt comfortable with a message that was going to break out of the Republican versus Democratic slap fight. And I wrote it down again when I got to Lansing, and that's the speech we got. I was...

It was quite a speech. I was struck by the fact that you leaned on your background and your personal story, and you repeated a few times. It almost became like a, it was a repetition in the speech, I am a straight, white, Christian, married, suburban mom. Why was it important for you to say that, and why did that become a refrain? So for too long, I think that Democrats have ceded ground on family, community, faith, if it is of your background, if it's

important to you, being married, being a mom, you know, all of these sorts of things. So taking it back, number one. But also, so I flipped a district in 2018. I represent Mitt Romney's hometown and give it up for Bloomfield Hills, Michigan. And I've talked to moms throughout my district who look and are like me, who are frustrated, are frustrated from the past few years of school closures and balancing work and being at home with their kids all the time, and we're seeing groups like Moms for Liberty, you know, this kind of Koch-backed right-wing group that's going to all these school board meetings and pushing CRT fear-mongering, anti-diversity equity and inclusion

and targeting the LGBTQ community. And that's not them. That is not the community I represent. So part of what I wanted to do was reclaim my own identity. I am not a groomer. I am not somebody who befriends children for the purpose of molesting them, because let's call it what it is when they use these hateful smears. And then just to frankly

talk to other women like me to say, I see you and I know you're frustrated, but we have to put our energy somewhere else. And we've seen Christianity weaponized to target and hate kids. Kids. You can't claim that you're protecting kids, this quote-unquote parental rights, if you are targeting already marginalized kids. I am sick of it. Have you heard from sort of democratic leaders across the country since the speech? Have you been getting calls?

Yeah, I've gotten a few calls. A few calls. I heard the president called you. The president called me and I missed it. That's a tough one. That's a tough one. That was rough. What were you doing?

I was putting my daughter to bed and I didn't have my phone in her room, which people have said, like, oh, that's so sweet. That's really nice that you have a rule about not having it. I'm like, no, it's because I forget my phone in her room. And then I'm like, oh, shit, she's sleeping, and I can't go back and get it. And it rang, and my husband saw it and didn't pick it up. So the president left a message. Left a voicemail.

Left a voicemail, as one does, and said, you know, hi, it's Joe Biden, the president left a message, left a voicemail, left a voicemail as one does and said, you know, hi, it's Joe Biden, the president. Like I wouldn't know. And we I don't have my phone up here. I can't play the voicemail. But we talked the next day and it was, you know, a the fact that a speech from a state senator made it to the white house was just amazing the fact that he called back it's actually to the white house yes i've i've heard that story before from from here i think from here but it it meant a lot. So I've talked to James Carville. I've talked to Jamie Harrison.

I've talked to other members of Congress in my state and elsewhere. And I think we might have struck a nerve. I think so, too. I am curious, how did your Republican colleagues, including the writer of said horrendous email, react to the speech? They didn't. I mean, that was part of why I wanted to respond, especially waiting all day Monday when this email goes out. Not one of them even texted or called to say, hey, that was really terrible. I'm sorry.

Not one. And since then, not one of them has talked to me about it and the the woman who wrote the email has doubled and tripled down she went on a local podcast and and just said the most unnerving things and she equated I've got a bill to ban so-called conversion therapy on minors and she she told the hosts that this bill would require counselors to schedule gender reassignment surgery for kids without their parents knowledge and then equated it to if a student has anorexia and went to a counselor and told the counselor i think i'm fat that the

counselor would be required to say yes you are and put you on a diet it is i was gobsmacked and it's just it's so disgusting and And she chairs the Senate Education Committee. She's the most powerful person in the state of Michigan for what goes on in all of our schools. We are not doxing her. The doxing part is over. That was the last segment. I mean, your speech has obviously been held up by a lot of people as a model for how Democrats can deal with these attacks.

What advice would you give to Democrats around the country as they figure out how to message in an environment where they have opponents who say things like what your opponents have said about you? I mean, it's just gone so far. It has gone way too far. gone so far. It has gone way too far. And I gave this speech and I spoke at an event in the district with, you know, a nonpartisan group and it was a dinner and it was attended by Republican women and Democratic women and all kinds of people who said, you're right. I don't agree with you on every issue, but this has gone too far. It's just hate and lies and I'm tired of it. So I think, you know, we're mad. Be mad. Show some emotion. Be angry. Don't just kind of calmly go out and say that this is normal because it's not normal. And we saw in Michigan, there was

a special election for a state house candidate who flipped a district that was a Trump plus 14 by calling it out, by saying this is hate and extremism and it's not welcome in Michigan. Well, we're so glad that you made the speech. I know you're also a Run for Something alumni. I am. Which is amazing. We love Run for Something here. And so other people should run.

You could end up giving a big speech too. So thank you so much for doing that. And maybe you can write talking points for all the other Democrats in the country. Just be you and get mad. There we go. All right. State Senator Mallory McMurray, thank you so much. Thank you so much.

Docs, docs, docs, docs. No doxing. The doxing portion of the evening has passed. Won't be a part of doxing. Now let's play a game. Republicans. They use power like Harry Styles uses fashion, as if they were born to wield it.

They don't get bogged down in the particulars like, is this reprehensible? Is this the opposite of what we said we'd do? Will voters dislike us for doing this? And while this works for them, because of a feckless mainstream press, social media noise, and a right-wing propaganda apparatus that would make your garden variety dictator green with envy, they've gotten pretty cocky. Because they haven't just embraced unpopular positions. They've embraced extremely unpopular positions.

How unpopular? Let's find out in a game we're calling Republicans. Are you Lea Michele shitting in your co-star's wig? Because I don't care who you are, you are going to pay. Wow. Here's how it works. I'm going to ask you a question about polling, and you're going to have to say which is more popular or unpopular.

All right? We're going to play with our co-hosts. All right, here we go. John, you're first. What's more popular, gay marriage or the Rolling Stones? Gay marriage. It's true. It's gay marriage.

70% support. What are the Stones at? The Rolling Stones are stuck, according to a morning console poll, at 69%. Nice. Nice. Nice. Alyssa. Yes. What is more...

What are you going to say? Who or what is more hated? Books or Ellen DeGeneres? Ellen? Correct. 19% of Americans dislike Ellen, while 17% of Americans support book banning but I'd like to see you try to ban Ellen's books

you'll be dead before you hit the ground Dan what's less popular Sean Hannity or forcing women to involve the government in their reproductive health care decisions forcing women it's very close 26% of Americans support Hannity women to involve the government in their reproductive health care decisions. Forcing women. It's very close.

26% of Americans support Hannity. 24% disagree that abortion should be a private medical decision. So they're both very, very unpopular. Which may be related. May be related. John. What's more popular, abortion being legal in most cases, or Adam Sandler? It has to be abortion.

It's actually basically tied. 71% of Americans love Adam Sandler. Wow, he's very popular. 70% obviously support upholding Roe. 76% of Dems and 55% of all Americans think women should be able to get an abortion in all but very specific circumstances. Adam Sandler is the Roe v. Wade of SNL.

Do you have the crosstabs on the Sandler numbers? We can get you the crosstabs. Where how does he play with Gen Z? He plays, we don't know him. Alyssa. What's more popular, the Women's Health Protection Act or Beatle Paul McCartney? I'm going to go with the Health Protection Act. Correct.

84% of Democrats and 62% of all voters support it. Well, it's... 68% have a favorable opinion of Paul McCartney. So actually, he kind of wins there. Why did you give me that one? I mean, he's not even my favorite Beatle. Who? John Lennon.

Jesus Christ. Also, I love Ringo and George Harrison. They had very good solo careers. Don't come at me with music. Dan. White people music. I'm self-aware. Dan.

What's more popular? the constitutional right to an abortion or hot dogs constitutional right correct 70% versus 69% again nice hot dogs it was not clear what would happen if you added mustard pickles and tomatoes and other ungodly things. You put out a hot dog in this city.

It's May, you freaks. What is this weather? John. Another round. Last one. I guess I could skip ahead. I like that one. It's chaos.

No, it's not good. I'll do a couple more. John. Do more Americans believe that the Supreme Court should overturn Roe v. Wade or that it counts as cheating if your partner has sex with a robot? Structurally, that's hard. Sex with a robot? Both hover around 30%. Alyssa, which do people think is worse?

Florida's don't say gay bill or cockroaches? Cockroaches Florida's don't say gay bill An ABC news poll found that 62% of Americans Opposed the don't say gay bill While only 39% of people don't like cockroaches They never lived in New York City Where is this poll?

Where is this ground swallow support for cockroaches. They never lived in New York City. Where is this full what kind of Where's this ground swallow support for cockroaches? That is uncomfortable. We're going to talk about our survey methods. Alright final question

and this can be for everybody. What is more popular abortion rights with Republicans or Bruce Springsteen with Millennials? Bruce Springsteen with Millennials. Abortion rights. Bruce Springsteen with millennials.

Bruce Springsteen. It's a tie. It's a tie. According to Reuters this week, basically half of Republicans said they were more likely to support candidates who support abortion rights in November, which matches how many millennials feel positively about the boss,

which is why so many Republicans are born to run from this decision. Now, before we go, we were going to end our fun right there, but Chicago holds a special place in our hearts. Your pizza's so thick you could drown in it. Your beautiful, your beautiful melodic, well'll get there, you goons. It's coming. What do you think we're doing here? We love your

melodious accents. You're shiny. Like a warm blanket. You're a shiny, shiny bean. Thank you. No thank you. Why is there so much? There's so much. We love that time Dave Matthews band emptied their tour bus toilet

into your river. Yes, that's right. It's time for us to play a quick drinking game with Lucifer's mouthwash, Trump's bathwater, the unholy aperitif, my lord. So we each have a couple shots in front of us.

We're going to need a few audience volunteers. Olivia is out there. Here's what's going to happen. It's time for a game we call This Week in Ooze. Olivia is out there, and basically, Olivia, if you want to play, Olivia is out there. She is going to come. If you raise your hand, you're going to read a quote, and we have to tell you which Republican said it this week. If we get it, we get it. If we don't, we take a shot of Malort. Each volunteer will read two quotes, and for your troubles, you will receive a Tommy John gift card. Tommy Johns. Hey, you gotta wear underwear.

This is for Dan. Which senator incredulously asked if this leaked draft opinion is the final decision and this reporting is accurate, it would be completely inconsistent with what Justice Gorsuch and Justice Kavanaugh said

in their hearings and in our meetings in my office. That is so easy. Well, too bad you didn't get it. No shit. Susan Collins. Born for that question. It was Susan Collins, of course.

This is for Lovett. Okay. Which governor declared they need to figure out who did that and they need to hold them accountable because that's a real significant breach of trust? You want to talk about an insurrection, that's a judicial insurrection to be taking that out and trying to kneecap a potential majority through extra-constitutional means.

Who said this dumbass thing? The nemesis of Disney himself, Ron DeSantis. That's correct. I'm still going to take this shot, though. Did you write the question? That was in my opening prompt. Ridiculous. Unbelievable.

Because I unironically like this. I know it seems like I'm performing. I do. I don't think it's bad. I don't understand why people think it's bad. I think, in fairness, what are the odds that Lovett heard the prompt? I didn't cheat. I didn't cheat. There's video evidence. Somebody.

I didn't cheat. No one's accusing you of cheating. We're just surprised you heard the prompt. I just think you wrote the question. Yeah, yeah. Of course. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I said it earlier.

If I'm on stage, I'm just waiting for my turn to talk. Thinking about what I said, thinking about what I will say. This is for F turn to talk. Thinking about what I said, thinking about what I will say. This is for Fevro. Which senator tweeted, it is a sad day for the Supreme Court and a dangerous day for the rule of law. The radical assault on our institutions and the Constitution

itself has reached a new level with the release of a draft opinion on a major issue facing the court on Tuesday. Oh, no. I'm definitely drinking Malort. I think I know. It sounds like a Ben Sass tweet. Is that?

No. Lindsey Graham. Oh. Oh, my God. What the fuck? Are you getting? Fucking gasoline. Yeah.

With hints of licorice. This is disgusting. It's not so bad. Why are you so crazy? I like it. It'll clean the COVID right out of you. Ugh. It's my booster.

Yeah. This is for Alyssa. Ugh. Which absolute lurch tweeted, how many of the women rallying against overturning Roe are overeducated, underloved millennials who sadly returned from protest to a lonely microwave dinner with their cats

and no bumble matches? Mother of three cats right here, Matt Gaetz. Yes. And can we also just say, fuck that guy? That's good. Hi, what's your name? Manesh. Okay. I don't know why, I should have asked the other people, too. It's just I forgot.

He drinks one sip of Malort. It's chaos. I'm loose. All right, this is for Dan. Who insisted, as a decision, Roe v. Wade is widely acknowledged joke. Moral questions aside, Roe is the most embarrassing court decision hands down last century. Every part of it, from its invented constitutional justification to its meaningless parameters, mocks the idea of sober jurisprudence.

Someone's drinking some Malort. Pucker up. It goes down smooth. Was it John Cornyn? It's Tucker Carlson. Fuck, it was right there.

Let's go, Dan. Bottoms up. I just want to... They can warn you, but it's always worse than you think. I just want to be clear about what's happening on this stage right now. Because I think what we're realizing is that Malort is queer culture. Because, what's next? This is for Levitt. Who tweeted this week,

if your response is to SCOTUS news is to dust off your stupid pink hat from 2016 and go march to support to re-evaluate your entire life and then deleted it after 27 seconds? What a strange place to go. Who did that? Who are they shadowboxing

again? Who went off and got their pink hats? Nobody. Nobody got their pink hats. I need to think. Ben Shapiro. Lauren Bulbert. Oh. Please.

Your bargain basement MTG. The MTG you can get. You know? When MTG won't go to the prom with you, yes, Lauren Boebert. This is for Vavro. Who said on Wednesday, I think we are we will resurrect that

case and challenge this issue again because the expenses are extraordinary and the times are different than when Piler versus Doe was issued many decades ago. What? This is getting...

That's legit obscure. I thought I was supposed to get the really hard ones, and they were supposed to get easy ones. Did we not talk about this in prep? Can I phone a friend? Can I call Tommy? Just drink your Malort. Yeah, is this Price is Right?

Can someone yell it out? What's the answer? Texas Governor Greg Abbott. It was right there. I told you. Oh, I didn't hear you. Drink the Malort. A real shot's worth.

Wow, that's good. That was a good drink. Little easier the second time. No, not. This is still going? I cannot lie. We each get two. Is that it?

Are we done? We keep going? Jesus cannot lie. We each get two. Is that it? Are we done? We keep going? Jesus. We have to go to St. Louis pretty early. All right, this is for Alyssa, who just announced today that they wouldn't vote for the Women's Health Protection Act because it, quote,

doesn't protect the right of a Catholic hospital to not perform abortions. That right has been enshrined in law for a long time, unquote. Susan Collins. Who? Oh, yeah. Susan Collins. You got it, girl.

Drink the Malort. That's horse shit. I knew. No, first of all, I knew half the quote, not the whole quote. I will drink some Malort because I'm not a pussy, but... That's interesting. See what I'm saying? I don't hate it.

We don't hate it. No, it's herbal. It is, it's herbal. It's interesting. See what I'm saying? I don't hate it. We don't hate it. No, it's herbal. It is, it's herbal. It's herbal. It's like, you know that smell that's like, oh. Oh, like WD-40? Yeah, it's like, has someone been weed whacking nearby? It's like someone did that with just a hint of orange.

Plus licorice. I'm not saying, alright. Okay. One more for Lovett. Oh, Jesus. This week, a certain smoke show tweeted, years ago, in this video, I was being crass with a friend.

Trying to be funny. We were acting foolish and joking. That's it. I'm not backing down. I told you there would be a drip-drip campaign. Yeah, we're well aware of your drip-drip, Madison. It's Madison Cawthorn. It is Madison Cawthorn.

I know what you're wondering. Probably still would. All right. That's the game. Thank you, Malort. Thank you, Chicago. That is our show for tonight. Thank you to State Senator Mallory McMorrow.

Thank you to Megan Jiafo. Thank you to Alyssa Mastromonaco. Thank you to MSG Entertainment and the Chicago Theater. Please go to vote. Save america.com slash row. Thanks everybody. This was so fun. Hot Save America is a Crooked Media production.

The executive producer is Michael Martinez. Our senior producer is Andy Gardner-Bernstein. Our producer is Haley Muse, and Olivia Martinez is our associate producer. It's mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick. Kyle Seglin and Charlotte Landis sound engineer the show. by Andrew Chadwick. Kyle Seglin and Charlotte Landis sound engineer the show. Thanks to Tanya Sominator, Sandy Gerard,

Hallie Kiefer, Ari Schwartz, Andy Taft, and Justine Howe for production support. And to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Phoebe Bradford,

Milo Kim, and Amelia Montu. Our episodes are uploaded as videos at youtube.com slash crooked media. We'll see you next time.