Podcast: The Ride - Unlocked: The Michael Graves Causeway (Scott's Birthday Shot)

Episode Date: May 29, 2026

Scott just turned 40 years old. What says 40 more than a quiet, attraction-free path that connects two outstandingly dated Disney World hotels?Is it too late to ask for separate Swan-and-Dolphin-shaped cakes, connected by a marzipan causeway?Enjoy this unlocked episode from the PTR Patreon! "Marfalump" episode is up at: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Patreon.com/PodcastTheRide⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠FOLLOW PODCAST: THE RIDE:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://twitter.com/PodcastTheRide⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/podcasttheride⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BUY PODCAST: THE RIDE MERCH:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.teepublic.com/stores/podcast-the-ride⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠PODCAST THE RIDE IS A FOREVER DOG PODCAST⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://foreverdogpodcasts.com/podcasts/podcast-the-ride⁠ See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Jason Sheridan. Wow. Hi. And then you are that man. How does it feel? You're the last man standing. Oh, I'm out of control. I'm a wild man.

He's going to be whiling out for the next couple months flaunting his 30sness. It's a while, yeah. Oh, yeah, the clock's ticking on me, too. I know, I know. Only a little bit more time is left for you. But for now, I think what you should do is enjoy this stretch in which the podcast is hosted by one childless man in his 30s and two older men, two men who are getting a little bit older. The numbers are climbing, thus making them a little bit older, despite being very hip and youthful. That's right.

What if I just know sold that and people were just tuning in and they thought you were insane about your age? Possibly. You'd have to really be paying attention to the runners anyway to know that that is the... I guess that's true. But what if I was just like, I only mentioned? You know, you have a real complex, Scott. What if I just gaslit the audience in you? You could fully flip it, and then I'd be left looking really desperate, going like, no, no, no, I was saying the thing

that you say all the time. And I was doing the, you're the one who talks about seeming really hip and youthful, but then also you go too far the other way and bemoan being older so much. Yeah, like I... Listen to the other episodes, audience.

I couldn't tell you which one, but it's in there somewhere. Classic Scott. Oh, not classic Scott. No, that's not one of my frequent runners. Chardonnay is my runner. Age concerns is not my runner. Age is nothing but a number is what I say

Almost daily Ha, there we go, you flipped it back on yourself You've just, well you know what I always say is Enigma's Never Age You know, as long as you have these healthy attitudes about age Then 40 is nothing You know, life just becomes one big freak off Wow, when you put it like that

Really, everything sounds so good I think so, yeah, yeah And that's what you should do for the next couple months You know, just go ahead and get your freak off I was going to say the more wholesome 40 is the new 30 Every few years, it's like X age is the new blank age I feel like only in the broad spectrum of that like compared to you know the way that cavemen aged Then yes 40 does seem like hey it's not it's not too bad you still got a long way to go

Yeah so I mean compared to hundreds or thousands of years ago Yeah well that's true yeah but yeah usually be like do you know 29 is the new 41. What? Somebody's going to have to issue, just like start sending me charts in the mail because I can't track what age is the new what and are any of them not the new anything

is the 38 just remained 38. The people need to write headlines also. So there's a lot of like this this study shows that being disorganized is good for your brain. Yeah, yeah. And you're like, what is this bullshit? It's just streams of garbage backed by no actual science.

It's funny also how, yeah, there's of course that world of, you know, red wine actually takes a few years off your life. Big change. Red wine is now incredibly healthy. Now it adds to your life. And the way those like flip back and forth all the time are just random, you know, carrots, they'll kill you. Actually, carrots make you live another 12. And those headlines definitely still exist, but they go all the way down CNN.com where they're like down for the, in the like sad for subscribers only in other regions and it's the sign that I have been doom scrolling if I make it all the way down to the sad regular headlines that are kind of from the before times you know what I mean yeah and that's

sometimes where you get like very clearly fake things that's like I think last year is when I stumbled upon some sort of AI generated Don Knott's article but it will say like so and so sad final days it'll be almost like an old tabloid headline yeah yeah you start hits the Urgnet bullshit. Yeah, there's different you start to get

to Conan O'Brien's disgusting house or something like that or someone there was, there's one famous one where it's like so-and-so's

disgusting wife. It's like, it's just someone very inocuous. It's like Charles Barkley or is that like I forget what the specific end.

I wonder who that is. I'm trying to figure it out. I just Google disgusting life and what I have found is just a bunch of the broadest stock photos I've ever seen in my life like two nerds you know the way they used to portray nerds when we were kids I do the tape and the glasses look at that yeah it's still now these this just looks like a photo of two nerds to me yeah that's I would not call either of these people disgusting no that is a very unfair categorization istock dot com yeah the point is as listeners you are hearing this I am now 40 years old now

we're recording it before I'm 40, so I feel pretty calm about it. I feel in a good place about it. I don't know if that changes on the day. I don't know if you wake up and it just hits you like a ton of bricks. Did you have, have you ever had any sort of like age-related freak out freak out? I'm hoping to have a couple of age-related freak-offs. No, you don't want that. That's bad.

Why? Does that mean something bad? I don't think you know what those things means. Yeah, have you ever had that? You know, kind of not. Okay. Then you probably be fine. No, I think as I stressed at the top, I am not the one with the age stress runner.

And that is true. And even as my voice ends up in this desperate pleading territory, I swear this is the case. Actually, dude, yeah, no, I feel great about it. This is probably fine then. Like, maybe when you hit like 70, you'll be, like, you'll feel something here. Yeah, yeah, probably. That seems strange. Unless by then 70 is the new 40.

I text it someone who would know. And the Zergnet headline, I text it, Patrick Monaghan because I'd heard him joke about it before. And it's funny. Larry Byrd's repulsive. Oh, no. Poor Larry Bird's wife. That is a good little punchup from Charles Barkley's disgusting wife to Larry Bird's

repulsive. Is that? Does that exist as a Google search? Repulsive is never used as a good thing. Nasty can be good. Repulsive, I've never seen. No, there's not really, no, there's never really a good slant on repulsive. Prince didn't write a song called Repulsive Girl, I don't think.

Or any of his other artists like vanity or... Maybe some future generation will reclaim the word repulsive. Let's start using it. I mean, Rita Repulsa is... And I love her. It's cool. Yeah, we like her. I'm a big fan.

So, Repulsa has positive attributes. She's up to no good all the time. Sure she is. That's true. And she yells a lot. She yells at Lord Zed. They are very much like a married couple when Lord Z shows up. That's true.

I guess they do get married, so they are literally married. But then he locks her away because he's tired of her yelling. Yeah. He puts her back in that thing that she came out of at the start of the show. Some enterprising salesman out there has gone to the website Enda Store and created a shirt that says meet Larry Bird's repulsive wife. Oh my God. It's really funny. It's a little headline.

It says ad at the bottom so you know that it is like a weird clickbait. It's a real cop out of an ad because it doesn't show you the wife. so it doesn't let you decide. You got to look. It's just him looking real grim, presumably looking at the wife or thinking about the wife. What if Larry Bird's wife looks like Eye Guy from Power Rangers? You know, I guy off the top of your head?

I got a lot of Googling. I really was always creeped out by Eye guy. Oh, yeah, right. He's just full of eyes. It's just all eyes. I mean, similarly, like, there'll be horror characters that are all teeth or made up of a lot of teeth but this is all eyes

I think that it's possible that you know what if I guy got a look from the queer eye guys there might be some way to make over I guy and kind of lessen some of the you know you don't want to change who I guy is but if you could draw attention away

from some of the more I look they wouldn't say repulsive they'd be all nice and uplifting and everything I don't know what words they would use but I think they would find a way to make eye guy beautiful and make I guy a beautiful wife for any man out there. If there was a place to do a sketch and you could get the guys. If sketch comedy was still a commodity.

Yeah, the queerie. A tan and Jonathan to really, they'd also help with his personal problems. That's kind of the magic of queer eye from what I understand. Actually, this is honestly the first thing that's that we've discussed that now I suddenly do feel old because I'm realizing how long ago it would have had to have been for me to be. working at a website where I could have said, okay, so what if I guy was on queer eye? Wow, God, we did it. We got in the front of Huffington Post. We got 40,000 views.

We're in the money. This website's going to live forever. Never going to end. Do you think, I'm Sabaum probably has the I guy costume somewhere in a closet, probably not far away from here. God, he would sue the hell out of that sketch. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Parity law, right?

No, not to me. Larry Bird Photoshop next to I-Gy guy at the altar if anyone wants to do it. I guess you can put like a bow in I-Gy's hair if you really need to make it like a female-I-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy-Gy. I think per the makeover notion, I think that a nice white veil would like accessorize I-Gy very nicely. Yeah. And maybe take your eyes away from his eyes, which cover his entire body. Now you're thinking a little bit, well, beautiful veil. Are some of those eyes part of the wedding garb?

I'm creeped out all over again looking at these eye guy photos. I guy always gets me. Yeah. And just speaking of everybody's runners, it feels like I guy, I'm staring at eye guy, I don't think even you could find a way to think of how I guy looks like a penis.

He looks like a bunch of eyes. Well, hold on a second here. All right, Mike the genius starts tinkering. No, no, no. The first time I looked at the couple of these pictures, I went, the side of his head, one on each side. And they're like, yeah, a couple of the eyes are kind of on tentacles, sort of well,

and to the point where you might call them one-eyed monsters. Yeah, they're right here and here. Damn, you did it. He's got two dicks hanging out of the back of his head. And I don't even, I don't even disagree on this one. Yeah, no, they're dicks. Jeez, I will try to keep issuing this challenge then for arbitrary things. If I can think of another one during the episode, I trust you and your abilities to find

Dix Everywhere. And that's another thing. You know, live every day like it's a freak off. Find Dicks everywhere. These are the things that keep you young. There's so many bad quotes on this episode already. Hey, look, I'm feeling good. And you know, fun, silly conversations like this keep you young. That's right. Yes, you guys are, you guys are helping me. You're seeing me into 40 very nicely. And you're especially helping me with another installment of the birthday shot program. This is we've been doing this. This is the third year now that we've been doing this where one of us chooses an extremely indulgent topic that is specific to us because it is our birthday. And I thought a lot about what it would be. I think, you know, look how dirty we got very quickly. I realized that maybe this isn't the year, given how dirty everything seems to have gone in the recent past. I decided to wait on the follow-up, which is the connollingus-based music of Marvin Cs. That's going to come in a later year. What I'm going to try to do is I'm going to, I'm going to going to just literally take things to my happy place. A place that has very much become my happy place and that I think I get to do an extremely

indulgent topic on my 40th birthday. I think it could only be this. It is the Michael Graves Causeway. Thank you for, thank you for the clap. I appreciate the clap. No claps from Jason. Jason doesn't want to clap. We talked about this earlier, but I've still been looking at my pictures of the Michael

Graves Causeway. also trying to. Now I'm starting to get alerts about my universal Hollywood password, which we were talking about is constantly locking us out. But you're dealing with that right now while we're talking about we're trying to talk about

Well, you do had the 40-year-old Rammies, so I was just letting you get a little energy out, you know. He was letting me get a little energy out while he dealt with other business on his phone. Yeah. So I have pictures. I have web about the causeway too.

Okay, great. I just wanted to refresh myself of what it looked like. You got to pretend your eye guy and you got 70 eyes on your body and you got to have all those eyes trained on the Michael Graves Clauseway. On the beautiful Michael Graves Causeway. Yes, the beautiful Michael Graves Causeway. Now that we've said that phrase a couple of times and I'm sure we'll say it many more, some listeners might be asking, what the fuck is the Michael Graves Causeway?

Well, the Michael Graves Causeway is in Walt Disney World. thus making it the first of any of the birthday shots that are on theme park property. Right. It is not a ride, but it is near rides. It is on ground owned by Disney near hotels that are weirdly not operated by Disney. We can get into some of that stuff. But I actually went theme parky this time around. And though you may not know what the Michael Graves Causeway is, here I'll do this Larry Bird style clickbait headline and say,

it is steadily becoming my favorite part of Walt Disney World. Wow. Is it number one definitively? I don't know if it's going to stay there forever. But I feel like after my visits and experiences there over the last, I think six years has been, you know, the time in which I've really gotten to know and explore and understand the Michael Graves Causeway. It is right now at this point in time, at 40. I'll just declare it. Yes.

The Michael Grives Cosway is my favorite thing in Disney World. So you are going to Florida. You could transport to Florida. Florida right now. Yeah. And it doesn't have to take a plane, so it's not a huge thing. Okay, okay. And you can get transported to one place in Disney World and walk around that area.

Yep. And that's it. Yeah, yeah. Do I have a limited amount of time? Let's say you have an hour to hang and you can't go very far. So you could not go to the boardwalk. You could not go to the cake shop. You could just be in this one zone.

Yes. Are the rules that I would also get to go in the nearby Swan and Dolphin Hotels? Sure. Then absolutely. No question. That's exactly what I'm doing at that hour. Got it. It's become in sort of a similar, less science fiction situation, if I have an hour to kill while

I'm waiting for a lift or even to go to the airport and it's kind of like not enough to get in a lot where I could get stuck in a line and be on the ride when I actually need to be getting to the airport. Like in those weird little thoughts of time, absolutely this is a place. Wow, that's an interesting question in general, though. The hour hang in Orlando, do you have an answer? Yes. the magical transport

to one zone. Probably very similar. You can't go to all islands but you could go to Marvel Superhero Island. Well, I was going to say the garden walk, the boats, not the garden walk in Anahe,

but the, just the, the paths and the boat waterway at Universal Orlando. Okay. It's kind of a big zone, but would you want to get on a boat? Is that what you're...

Yeah, I'd want to get on a boat. Which was the boat? Which was the boat? Which was the boats? Well, let's see If I want the Like camera action or Oh, or cut

Or cut or chow Or let's do lunch One of them is cut I don't know I think I just picked a movie term Because so many of them The good ship Cut

Those might be right Yeah Ship lollipop Chow is definitely Chow is one Boats pulling up Oh it's we're losing our light Yeah right

Golden Hour seems like The kids are gone in 20 minutes Star won't come out of trailer On the bag of the boat Okay, so that's your choice Out of money shoot canceled That's your choice My choice is just I think

Like... Aerosmith Courtyard? Erasmuth gift shop Hmm Genuine question because I would count Tower Terror in that I essentially see that with you It was like a favorite zip Oh, sunset boulevard

No I think mine is some American Pavilion and World Showcase Or maybe I want Mexico Pavilion in World Showcase. America Pavilion? One of the pavilions in World Showcase. If I'm just going there to hang for an hour. Yeah, and he wants to

salute. He loves saluting. Because if this is more of just a hang-based thing, I just want to hang an Epcot, which I don't get to do out here. Yeah. I don't, it doesn't need to be American pavilion, but that's where the stage is. That's where Eat to the Beat is. So if you can time that out to see the Huba Stank experience featuring just the bass player from Hube Stank. Is Harvey Danger playing

Eddie to the beat? Because I was, I would love to hear flagpole sit at Epcot. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome half of all saints. I started following Smashmouth on Instagram. And just, I'm shocked at how quickly this new guy has just taken over after Steve Harwell died. I know he was not doing well, and I think they had replaced him before he had passed away. But still, I'm just like, none of you people know this isn't the guy in the audience. It ain't no joke.

I wish Steve Harwell would choke It's about me Now I'm the new star of the band now Look I'm sure he gave his blessing But I'm just like guys they got another like bowling shirt guy And he's just like no one in the audience Well like the audience doesn't know The auditions involved no singing

They just watched a bunch of like Spike-Hare goate guys come in And then like all the rest of smashed mouth They just he just walks in and then they go Turn around Three quarter please I believe this will work Yeah, looking good pal

Get out of here bowling for soup We know who you are You're not fooling any of us You've already got a bad You already have a way to get into each of the beach You got like three gigs A lot of projects Jarrett Reddick

He's got a lot of gigs Wow What's the name of the singer of Smashmouth? The new one? Yeah yeah I don't even want to learn it Oh my God, okay okay I'm not mad at them

Text Patrick Monaghan See if he knows Yeah text Patrick As usual really what this is about is I'm mad at the audience when I saw Bear Naked Ladies because I'm sure half of them don't know Steven's gone. That's really what this is about, I think. Well, there'd be a bunch of smashout people out there going,

like, Mike's a farewell fan. No, they're right. They're right. They're right. I stopped buying albums after Astrolin. But you do, you know that it is not Steve Harwell. You know that. I do know that. Yeah. You do know that the bowling shirt guy changed. You just don't know the bowling shirt guy's name.

Yeah. And you will learn. I imagine, in fact, that you will learn, and the name will start getting said twice an episode. Like I said, I just start. started following smashball. So you're learning. Your journey is just beginning.

My journey's just beginning. Yeah. Anyway. You did go to that motorcycle rally in 2020 to see them play, right? Yeah, right, yeah. Yeah, you were there. Did you mean, yeah. Yeah, Mike was a Sturgis super spreader.

Sturgis. Yeah, Sturgis. Where Road Wild was, where Jay Leno wrestled. I think that was the WCW event. I think it was in Sturgis. Oh, really? I believe. Oh, wow.

I could be wrong. Proud history. Yep. Let me say some basic. Let me just step. through the basics of what the Michael Graves causeway is. Michael Graves was a very esteemed postmodern architect who did a lot of like kind of bold and risky buildings throughout this country and throughout other countries as well.

He was the most prolific in the 80s and the 90s. And it was during this time that he designed a number of very visually striking projects for the Walt Disney company. He had a bit of like a whimsical flare to the point where some of the stuff that he built, you know, architecture critics would turn up. their nose and like a Ted's silly isn't it the colors a bit tacky aren't they this made him kind of a perfect candidate though to do stuff for the Disney companies the things that were a little bit more playful and fun uh including the swan and dolphin hotels i think people know the swan and dolphin

hotels but let me go all the way back these are in walt disney world they are in the epcot resort area they were built in 1990 they don't really have like a theme per se uh it's not like being being in Hawaii, like the Polynesian, it's just more of a feel. It's more of a vibe, the swan and dolphin. Kind of like meant for like upscale business travelers, touches of whimsy, but just like very bold color, very, you know, striking architecture.

They are two separate hotels, but that are very much of a piece. You can cross from one or the other across a lake. They're across a lake from each other. Well, how do you cross the lake? Why on the Michael Graves causeway? That's how you cross between the Swan and the Dolphin. Now that is all,

a lot of very dry stuff in order to set up what I want to say about it, which is that visually, aesthetically, color-wise, decor-wise, this area and these hotels rock my fucking shit. I love staring at the swan and the dolphin, and there is no better place to do it than in this cool path that connects the two. The colors just send me right back to 1990, every aspect of it, Every stripe and every squiggle and every logo. It is just like a perfect spot where it is always 1990,

where the Disney decade is just beginning, where it didn't go south midway through, where the hopes and dreams of Eisner are all ahead of us. And he started with the bold vision of these hotels. These hotels exist because of Eisner. I think when you are looking at these, you are looking inside Eisner's heart. This is how I feel.

This is his, like, this is Eisner's vision of the 1990s, and they've done little things here and there. They've tweaked him here and there, but nothing has ever fully rained on the parade of the swan and dolphin and therefore the Michael Graves Causeway. Yeah. Those are my very earnest feelings about this place. Do you have any earnest feelings about this place or would you care about at all if it was not something that I talked about sometimes? Well, you know what? We were not, we never really ventured back to the swan and dolphin when I was a child. I don't know if it was like my mom saying, oh, Disney doesn't own the swan.

and dolphin when I was little. But there was an element to like, well, I'm not that interested. I like the big swan and dolphin sculptures. That was a question I had if we like these. Yeah. I do too. But I don't, we didn't go back there. It wasn't something as a kid I was, I was connected to because I was much more ride

focused and we would do a little boardwalk, but not much. And we never stayed at boardwalk or the other one. Oh, geez. So it was not something I went. So I don't have any hard nostalgia for. it back in the day. Nor is mine either. Mine is not nostalgia for being there.

It's actually, maybe I feel the closest that I've felt to this thing that you talk about with Pleasure Island where it's nostalgia for things that didn't happen. Yeah. It's like nostalgia for a life that I couldn't have where like I'm imagining if I was 40 in 1990 and I'm in like a lavender business casual shirt and a busy tie and I have a conference to go to. And thus I am, you know, in my smart conference a tie. or well it makes sense to stay at the swan.

It'll be just steps away. Maybe I'll go to the parks, but I think I'll spend most of my time in the Finns lounge or whatever. What's that seafood restaurant that I wanted to go to last time? Todd English's Blue Zoo. Todd English's Blue Zoo is what I wanted to do. Todd English, I think, a Vegas perennial as well. There's so much stuff every time we don't get to do that I want to do.

I know, I know. That's why I'm feeling like the next time I go, I need to just carve out three days for Swantholphin only. That's why next time we go, we need to do the whole month. My idea. We will move the family in for a month to Orlando. I think we got to do it. Mike thinks that if he pitches this to the audience,

that that will help either of our unwilling wives want to do this plan of yours. I get the groundswell going. The commenters say they want it, Lindsay, are you in now? Maybe some millionaire will offer his houses to us. You know, maybe some very rich person will make it so easy that we'll be able to have to do it. And a millionaire in Florida has like fucking. 28 rooms in his house. That's right. Three unwilling wives, one of whom lived in Orlando for a while, and I think it's had her fill

of extended Orlando stays. If just the boys have to go and live together, then that's what we'll have to do. Sorry, family. Well, it shouldn't be a problem for Jason as the childless man among us. And you and I, I guess we'll figure it out. See you next year. We'll deal with divorce court in 2027. Yeah, and I think Florida, you can get it done. quick. I think they have a way, a loophole, I think, down there. Actually, you know, while I'm here, can I just

change my name as well? You can do a lot. You can mess with your wife's records for some reason. I'm checking the box for divorce and I'm checking the box for my name is outlaw now. If you ask the guy at the stand at medieval times, he can do all sorts of stuff. Fake ID, passport, messing with,

any kind of thing you need. Just ask. And just like regular fun stuff, like putting your face on E.T.'s body. He used to work at Universal and now he worked, now he makes fake IDs and stuff. Divorce licenses that are binding only in Florida. But, you know, they get the job done. God.

What a dream. You be out, maybe my Florida name is Blue Zoo. Oh, yeah, that's good. Yeah, I think I can't be, I can't be wrestler-style. I'm just kind of like, it's a little more mellow, I'm just Blue Zoo. Blue Zoo was so close to Blue Choo. Yeah. So close.

My Florida. Jason's nickname in Florida. Blue Choo. These are my boys, Blue Zoo and Blue Choo. Jason goes to a nearby medical facility to get just a drip of Blue Chew intervenously every day. Yeah, you don't chew this one. Still called that. You inject it.

Welcome. Have you guys ever been to Blue Zoo before? This is so it was started by Todd English just so, you know, we offer a light seafood fair. Yeah, sounds good. Do you offer like salmon that's been cooked in Blue Chew? Any Blue Chewew forward sauces? Blue Chewitch. battered chicken

finally chicken and fish that tastes like sweet tarts by the time you've eaten all that breading you kind of like something starts happening

and then you're like gotta get the check check please chick please check please gotta go got to go potting can I get some help standing up

we had a similar oh yeah those aren't owned by Disney kind of vibe but I was like riding by on the boats from the boardwalk

or Beach and Yacht Club. It wasn't until I was much, much older I learned about like, oh, it's a dolphin fish. Obviously, it's not a dolphin mammal. It's a type of fish. What do you mean? What do you mean? The big statues.

There's a swan and there's a big statue of a fish. Yes. That does not, despite it being called, the dolphin doesn't resemble a dolphin at all. You're just saying it's not a dolphin. It's not a dolphin, but I think it's variety of fish that is occasionally there's something about it.

It wasn't just plucked out of the blue. You mean there's some sort of significance for why they chose that fish is what you're saying? Oh, I don't know. But I think I've conveyed probably plenty of times over the years that, like, a big thing with me is wandering around old hotels and old malls that haven't changed since we were kids.

Because I think that when you do that, when you are in a really good iteration of that, and you're looking around and in like some, big way and just the way the ceiling is done or the way the columns are done or the escalators or the tiles or even just little details logos or like I don't know this little like inlet thing that the tiniest escalator you've ever seen goes to and it's a weird awkward space and like a weird teal chair is there if you can find any zone like this and often in theme parks too I think there's corners of Epcot Center that are like this thank god exploring spaces that have not changed in many

many decades very much I think is as close as you can come to time travel in our real world I often end up in places and feeling like Marty McFly walking around, taking it all in when he first gets to 1955, just look in every which direction, jaw, gape. No, that makes a lot of sense. I mean, there is some inherent thing in a human being that loves like discovery or excavating or figuring out like, oh, look, I'm like happening upon like fossils or something. but really my version of it is going to like that West Hills Mall where there's still a crown books and not realizing the crown books is still there and turning a corner and going crown books I thought this place has been closed for 30 years and then like I go in there and it's just disgusting in there and it's like almost like a used bookstore at this point but I'm like this is the

only crown I haven't seen a crown books in 30 years why is it still here like things like that I understand and I get it with this because it is so 90s is it more boring than the idea of giant lizards walking the earth, yes, but it's more accessible. I can't walk around the world the way the dinosaurs saw it, but I can walk around these buildings the way that Michael Eisener and Frank Wells saw them. Yes, that's our version of it, is finding stuff or happening upon, we were just in Paso Robles and we found a barbecue restaurant called Big Bubba's Barbecue, and there's like an old prospector fortune teller in there, and I'm walking around and they're like, I discovered this

place, and I'm like, there's a jail cell you can eat in. Wow, I'm taking photos. I'm getting so excited. Really? Whoa. Yeah. Oh, I got to go to this. There's two jail cells.

Cell one, sell two. And it's just like, it's not even like you go into it. It's just like a cage has been constructed around two tables. It's not even that impressive. But it's enough. But it's enough. That's plenty. Yeah, yeah.

It seems like a real cousin, honestly, of Dean Norris's Barbecue Restaurant and Tonecular. Similar, yes. Where there's a little graveyard outside. Right. You can see Hank's grave. Oh, yeah. I don't know if I spoiled that for We'll get to it eventually

Yeah absolutely But that's completely how I feel And I've Being that I've been in pursuit of that In Mals and Hotels and Hotels Forever I think I don't think I think I was a latecomer In realizing how little This particular zone had changed

And I think it all hit me Where my Michael Graves-Clazwead journey began Which was we were all down there in 2019 The first time we all went together We did kind of a Magic Kingdom morning And then it started like Tarrantial Downpour crazy Florida a storm and we were like desperate for lunch i actually specifically recall we went to see sunny eclipse

and then crowds were super insane and i remember saying to aaron well i don't want to get stuck eating here now here i know is the home of your jason's favorite toppings bar let's say the entire galaxy to put it in sunny eclipse terms well the toping bar what i wanted to eat topping bar has been a little unreliable in the past few years but not the but the chicken fingers are still beloved uh still very beloved by me reliable beloved does see i always think of it as a general term of like oh there or not like there's more people that when you say something is beloved yeah it means that's a lot of love coming at it when he says beloved he means by him when he says tastemaker he means that you influenced him yeah but when he says that stuff it makes sense to me

yeah well yeah i was just clarifying i showed my family like look we can order we can get on the people mover put our order in and then we get to the place. The future is now, Jason. The future is now. Tomorrow is today. Is the toppings bar gone though? Because we wandered in there last trip or two trips ago. We wandered in there.

I don't know that I saw the toppings bar. Don't tell them this. I saw the one time I went in in the last few years, the toppings bars were there, but there was just printed out pictures of burger toppings. Like laminated pictures. So you're all you can... That's like the meals and hook.

Yeah. Yeah. So like, so basically the all you can eat iceberg lettuce train has been stopped. You cannot get as much lettuce as you want. That was in Iger 1 maybe, in Iger 2. No way. Yeah. Is it smoke jumpers?

Can you still get as much iceberg as you want? I haven't been in there a little bit. I haven't been to smoke jumpers in a day in a while. I never think about eating smoke jumpers. Jason, Jason with the Soren theme playing, just stacking up iceberg slice after icebergs slates. He's got... He's got... Iceberg.

He's got a calculator next to him, and he's computing how much money he's saving by getting all these toppings for free. And then it makes him feel like he's flying over the Serengetty. Jane, break the garbage bag. This is like, this is $3 for the Weissburg lettuce in this bag. So I... Yeah, I was dying to get out of toppings land with apologies. And it was kind of that situation of like, I'm just got to... We just got to get on a bus to somewhere anywhere.

What's leaving right now? Swan and Dolphin. Let's go see what's going on there. Jumped on those with no expectation. Like, we can eat something there. I don't know. But the true attraction was walking around and realizing like, holy shit, this is not, this is the most locked in time place. Maybe anywhere on property.

It's like a place where like hypercolor early 90s is still alive because we've lost so much of that. Now we've lost electric umbrella. and Epcot and we've lost in inventions and wonders of life, I feel like was a good zone for this color pattern and stuff. Or like the land, you know, the land doesn't have the crazy umbrella things anymore. It does feel like this should have been painted, like somebody should have painted this new colors like 10 years ago. I'm not saying they should.

I'm saying it feels though. It's not something I never really even thought about that it still looks like that. Because yes, it definitely feels like there's some sort of weird gray and white that it's been painted. I know. That would take the fun out of it. I am so scared that this is going to happen at some point. Yeah.

Because it has happened to other Michael Graves buildings. When I developed this interest of like, all right, let me look up the people who built the, the architects behind the places that have always struck me really are in my all life, because maybe I can use that like liner notes in an album and kind of follow, you know, the architect into, all right, well, they also built that and they also built that. And sure enough, this worked for me with Michael Graves. because I discovered a place in the Hoya, California that he built, that mainly it's a higher regency there, I believe,

but it's part of a very pretentiously named zone called the Aventine. He built the Aventine, which is just these crazy grounds for, I assume people work there and there's fancy restaurants and health clubs and stuff. But I got to walk around the Aventine, and it was Swan and Dolphin, too. I was losing my mind. I did this like a decade ago, and like, holy shit, it's exactly the same. It's all the same colors. It's the same. It's like the tents and the rails and the columns and all the same things. And then I was down there a couple years ago and I even wanted to go take a walk around and look at it. And they changed it. They painted it. Boring ass colors. And I was being so verbose and mad about this that my son started like asking, what's wrong? Why are you mad, dad? Oh, they painted, they repainted that hotel and they shouldn't have. And then he kept saying throughout the day, I'm mad. Why are you? Why are you?

you mad because they repainted that hotel and they shouldn't have oh yeah i'm warping this kid i'm turning them into me it's all it's all yeah they look like it looked like it looked like it looked like there's my avantine and then it looked this now it's just boring it's boring white and gray why would you do this do you have you gone hard enough into the history of some of these guys where you like know what their big hotel break was like their first big thing was a little bit I think I know with graves to some extent, it's a building that a lot of people didn't like in Louisville. I have the name of it somewhere, the Humana building in Louisville, Kentucky, and then the Portland building, which is like a municipal building in Portland.

And I think those are the things that got Eisner's attention. And then Swan and Dolphin was his Disney break. And I think Eisner liked that he was a little bit criticized and that not everybody liked the stuff. this reminded me of the excellent answer that he gave to your excellent question, like about that he didn't really want to be the host until somebody said he's horrible, he shouldn't be the host. Right, right. Suddenly, he really wants to be the host.

I mean, I don't know how you become an architect. You go to school and then like, what's the, what's the, how do you get it? You just design something and people put bids in, I assume for something and they go, I like this design and I go with this guy? I think so. There's something to that because you can look up a lot of these guys work and you can see like things that they designed. and built and bids that they did for things that never ended up getting built.

This all kind of exists because of Eisner being really opinionated, not knowing what he wants, but knowing kind of vaguely what he likes and what he doesn't like. He said to, all right, let me see, this is a Michael Grace quote. Michael didn't like those tall, all-glass buildings. He referred to them as refrigerator boxes. He wanted the architecture to tell a story. And that is why we had. And if you think, if you add up.

all of the stuff that Eisner built in his, like I was just started to go, like, what are the hotels in Eisner era? It's Swan and Dolphin, Grand Floridian, boardwalk, yacht and beach, Wilderness Lodge, Animal Kingdom Lodge, Grand California now here, Caribbean Beach, Por Orleans,

the All-Star Resorts, which are less my speed, but they are interesting. All the hotels in Paris. All of that is, and this is a lot, it's almost the main thing for me of why I can't get on board with this anti-Eisner philosophy. Because of those hotels.

Yeah. Yeah. Look what he caught. We didn't have any of that. Setting aside that we didn't have Disney MGM Studios. It is interesting to think about how much the complexion of Disney World. And I do think people, we've talked about this many, many times, people that still are like, oh, well, Disney World is better.

They're talking about the bubble. They're talking about the Disney bubble. They're talking about the hotels. I don't even know if everybody knows that they're talking about it when they say that. But I think most people are talking about that specifically. Yeah. But it is interesting to think about what it looks like with, all of that stuff or with more like boring looking hotel like you can imagine like yeah imagine it

it does seem like a lot less fun yeah just so much fun injected into the all the all the uh spaces when you when you have that eisner mad to that eisener eye for whimsy or whatever you want to call it he just he commissioned all this stuff that was bold and striking and with and with color i i here's something he said about his architecture taste Buildings architecture is something that stay with you in a way nothing else does. It's subliminal. You don't even know what you know about architecture, yet you get angry or you feel good and you don't understand why you feel good.

Wow. Yeah. What would he – oh, I would love to know. This is a great question that he would probably be diplomatic about, but what does he think about some of this like DVC stuff, like this big Polynesian DVC? I don't like it. That's been the subtext of what I've been talking about. Right.

And as I started saying, he didn't like those tall, tall, all-glass buildings. look what the company is building now. Right. They would never, there would never be anything as weird and bold as swan and dolphin today. It would, if you would, fine, somebody convinces him to build some stuff by the Polynesian, I feel like it would be, it would match better to the original hotel. I feel like that would be a priority for him. I'm a little offended that they built Swan Reserve and that this in no way reflects

the aesthetic of the Swan and Dolph, like the very specific aesthetic and color scheme. Right, that's just kind of a cube across the street, isn't it? Yeah, pretty much. And it's fine. I went over. there. It's pleasant. I had a nice meal there, actually. When did they build the extra towers at contemporary?

2009, 2010? Those are, I stupidly, the first time I went back to Disney World after a long time booked contemporary and was like, wait a minute, we're in the, what? We're in the towers? Sucked. Like, who cares? What are we doing if we're not in the actual building?

Yeah. So it all grows out of Eisner not wanting to just have boring buildings around. To that end, I think before Eisner was on board, they made a deal with the group called Tishman, because they knew they needed somewhere with convention space. So they went to an outside group and said, all right, you guys can have a hotel and it was going to be in that like Buena Vista area. And it was just going to be another one of those hotels. Some of those have their charm. But it's like they're regular hotels.

They're normal. And then as described in that book that I have, like the Disney architecture book with the Secret Eisner signature, he's, Eisner is like, he's like, he's like, sleep. sleepless at night. He's like he spent two nights in a row tossing and turning. And the result of that ended up being, we got to get out of that deal. I don't want to do, I don't want to build those stupid hotels. We got to build something better. We got to build something cooler. He started pursuing that. The Tishman group said, okay, we will sue you for $1.3 billion, please. And it was kind of a credible lawsuit or at least something that they had to back away from. So, but at this point, he's stuck on like, I'm sorry, we are not building some stupid boring hotel. I want to do something

weird and cool. So here's a deal that I will cut. Tishman, you can do it, but I want my guys to design it. It's going to be weird and choicey, but you can run it for 99 years. And in fact, we will actually put it closer to the parks, because we're going to start putting hotels in this Epcot area that are walkable to Epcot and DisneyMGM Studios. So it's a better spot for you. And go ahead, you can have that for 99 years. And that is why you have these weird hotels that are not run by Disney. Wow. I mean, the fire of the man. Honestly, had I been at the, the, fable's meeting that you had, yeah, I think the only thing I would have wanted to say to him was thank you for the swan and thawain and I really, I was just there and I just, I trip out when I'm

there. You know, I know you were accusing my friend of being on psychedelic drugs. I feel like I'm on psychedelic drugs. That I bet he would have been like, and that makes total sense why you're saying that to me. You must have be of sound mind. Thank you. for that compliment. I agree, yes. I trip out too when I'm there. Now your friend here, a little bit weird.

You need to find some better company. So what is it that trips me out about this zone so much, exactly? I mean, is it just that it feels like it's 1990 there? Yes. Does it make me feel like I'm five years old again? Yes. Is it so bad to want to feel like I'm five years old again here at 40? Now I'm mostly against infantilism on this show.

I do not use this little such and such boy terminology that everybody takes so much thrill in saying. You don't like when we say go-go-gag-ga. I'm a little hotel boy. Change me, Scotty. Do my mid-record dippy change. Yeah, you don't like that. Mikey made up, Mikey did his record ploppy.

I just, you don't like it when we're at Cosmic Rays and I pretend to put a diaper on using the iceberg lettuce at the all you can. Take topping bar? Why is it that combination of body parts and liquids coming out of body? Why does that gross me out so much less than the one that you did a few episodes ago? You mean wearing lattice as a diaper is fine? It seems cute.

It is. I'm so much more okay with that than I'll say really quickly. Skip ahead if you're offended. Ejaculating tuna. Tuna. Well, I think I just said tuna. I don't know that I said tuna salad. Oh, chunks of tuna.

Whatever it was. It doesn't have to be chung. I mean, it's whatever you want it to be. Hmm. I think I want it to be not discussed any further. Live fish, live tuna coming out of your peeble. Okay, so moving on. I think what I like.

I said when you'll introduce it, I'm trying to top it. What are you going to say? The statues are mythological. They're representations of mythological dolphins. Like the dolphins that were drawn with like depictions of, of king tritons. or all the statues are whatever the way that specific way that they represent the big fish yeah the one fish is like on its head almost yeah balancing on its neck or whatever a fish yeah well it's like keeping the keeping the fountains up above it um i mean like as far as stuff that

i like when i'm wandering around here i mean the causeway and by the way i don't consider this the swan and dolphin episode because i'm not going to really touch on the restaurants and the amenities and the things to do with the swan and dolphin I'm, of course, talking about the causeway. But the causeway is a great spot to see those carriers. It's your best spot, I would say. Yeah. You know, to take in the views of, I love that they did this.

I love that there's this whole, like, almost like a shared backyard between the two hotels. And then on the other side are the portcochairs. You don't even have to look at the cars arriving at the portcochairs. You have a great view only for pedestrians, which I think is lovely. But it's a great place to check out those characters, which I feel like I've gone back and forth. At times I've found the swan and particularly the dolphin, the characters I mean, to be sort of goofy looking. This weird squat fish that isn't like any dolphin I've ever seen. I guess it's a dolphin from mythology is what we have learned.

I guess I've found it kind of silly before, but as I embrace all aspects of the Michael Graves Causeway, I love him now. I love that he's this weird squat dude. If you painted them, they would fit at an All-Star Resort, I think. Have you painted them differently, I guess. Yeah, I think the fact that it's like a minimal color scheme makes it feel less gaudy than what's at the All-Star Resort. But it is like, it's this playful touch that kind of like brightens what are otherwise sort of austere. I think like it's like the architecture is very austere, but then those characters and the colors kind of like make it sillier and more women. Yeah, it would be like All Star Animals Resort, and you could put those there, and you painted them more like realistic colors.

All Star Animals would be kind of good. Did they ever think about that? I don't know. Is it too close to Animal Kingdom Lodge? Well, but it's cheaper than Animal Kingdom Lodge. It is similar, but it would be the budget animal place. Would it all be Disney character animals? Um, no.

Oh. New animals. Okay. Great. Hey, I'm designing now. Could we design? Is there like an easy to use? a program where we could design a hotel

like a like a theme park video game or like roller coaster type? I know there's real programs to be an architect I just mean like is there some like easy way we could do it? Well now AI can do it and I guess AI is the answer yeah architects are running scared man because AI can just do it for you yeah oh man it's gonna make

a lot of mistakes some of those might be on the retaining rolls but uh yeah no the hotel what's built will fall apart in 10 months yeah I love because I like the episodes where we'd be like kind of pitch ideas like tomorrow in and stuff. Is there a way we could all just pitch like nine new Disney World hotels?

Oh, yeah, that's good. Yeah. I figure out a way to. There's a lot of themes that are untouched on, I think. Right. Yeah, yeah. And figure out where they go. And stuff that would be more in the Eisner spirit and less just like some of the

such and such tower. Exactly. It could be either in a new original spirit or in the Eisner spirit, I feel like. Yeah. But yeah, we could pitch on where we want new hotels to go in Disney World. Maybe that's a future episode. Sure. Yeah, yeah.

Let's help them improve. Let's help them like get in touch with that Eisener's your spirit and make cooler, silly or hotels again. All-Star Animals is not one of the ones I'll pitch. Okay. That's just a freebie. That's just free. That's off the dome.

But when you get even like hardcore thinking about it. Oh, yeah. We're going to, yeah, we're going to go wild here. Just don't use AI for that list. Don't use a cheat sheet. To make the list? No, not to make the list. But yeah, I don't know.

We'll see. I'll have to find a program that's not AI. What is paying architect? Grand word generator to inspire you, man. You know, when you're doing your morning pages and your freewriting, look to that for inspiration. Was that technically AI, though? Random worry generators?

It's a program doing things for you. Kind of paved the way for AI. Just in terms of like besides that it reminds me of 1990, why does this knock me out so much walking around these places and all of the graves properties? I think what I like is this like austerity mixed with whimsy. I feel like this place especially, but a lot of them, it's like ancient Rome with its grandeur and its size and its columns and its hallowed halls mixed with Barbie's dream house. Yes, very good point.

Like it's so it feels like where Barbie and her friends go for conferences. Yeah, because it does, I mean, as soon as I saw it or when I was looking into it again, I was just there, but it was like, oh, this looks like a toy we had when I was little. Yes, it's so toy. It's really toy. And it also, and it reminds me of the movie toys. Which I've become increasingly fascinated by as the years go on. Not a good movie by any means, but the production design is like, I would happily live in the movie toys. Can I move into toys, please?

Just clear out all the unpleasant characters and things that happen. This color scheme, too, is something, and I still can't figure out. There's something, some, I don't know if it's a cartoon. There's some color scheme this reminds me of. The tan and brown? Well, is it orangey brown? I was trying to find a word for. the color I think is considered that that orange is considered coral it's somewhere between i didn't

have that at my disposal it's somewhere between pink and orange yeah uh because it kind of oscillate depending on the lighting during the day and then like turquoise i would say turquoise and coral are probably the primaries feels like a 90s color turquoise was big in the 90s i feel like and i do love turquoise i think one of the things just just singing about the colors that sticks out about Michael Graves' work. And when you look at some of the buildings we mentioned, look at some of the pictures, that comes up,

that color scheme comes up a lot. But usually found more, I think of it as homes or buildings in the southwest. Sure. And Graves, I think, maybe one of the things that made his work, quote unquote, controversial, was putting that color scheme

in the middle of Louisville or Burbank or... Yes, next to a bunch of buildings that don't necessarily match it. Yeah, but it adds the uniqueness just as his like cutouts or the use of black squares or recessed squares add to the uniqueness. Turquoise also more of a southwest kind of thing.

There's that one McDonald's where to fit in with like the local town I don't know where it says the arches are turquoise, not yellow. Is that a new Mexico thing? I think so. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you're right.

There are touches of that. Yeah, there's a little bit, and then it feels sometimes related to that Memphis style, which I associate with the early 90s style of Taco Bells. Yeah, yeah. And also there's something like,

there's things that feel, it feels like cubist at times too, because he'll use just big blunt shapes. Like, here's big triangle and here's big square. Right. It's like, you know, big semi-sub. circle or whatever, which adds to the toy thing. Like you could just see like the Lego version of all these places.

It looks some of the pictures of it, and this is a good picture of the causeway, some of the pictures of it look like it's either like a base of some kind or it looks like, and I'm sure this will come up, but like it looks like the celebration scene at the end of Star Wars or something. Wow, it does. Like it's so like the scope of it and this photo is just massive. Like it looks otherworldly. in a way as well

and it's just yeah there's like there's a pyramid in the center but it's not a big pyramid there's also wings to it it does feel like it feels Star Warsy and it might specifically feel like prequally well yes and a good way in the best way yes yeah I agree

there's something alien about it it is like it's like a mashup of what we were just saying that like it's New Mexico plus Memphis plus like CD-ROM plus Rome it is like some weird like an alien took a bunch of unrelated human culture and threw it all together. Yeah, I mean, it also, like,

like, when you would be a kid and you'd be drawing a base or something and, like, you draw like, yeah, I know what a pyramid is and I would draw a pyramid and a pyramid out of stuff coming out of it. Like, especially when it's at, especially at night, it looks like that.

And during the day, it doesn't, it has different magic during the day, but it... Well, I think that's where the colors really shine more. Yes. And the very Florida feel, because we've mentioned all these aesthetics,

but like, really, it feels just so Florida. Those colors. Yeah. And then the fact that I always, I get them mixed up, but I think the dolphin is the one that has, it has big banana leaves as the subtle texture and pattern on it. And then the swan has waves.

Like they took like charming 50, 60s kind of peach, uh, Miami, you know, like seaside hotels and then just like blew it up by 30. Right. And so, so the causeway,

and the causeway is almost like the bridge between the two bases, the two like. bases for the aliens or whatever. They are like bases and some... That's the thing I always feel about malls, you know? Like, Glendale Gallery is a good example where, like, it's been modernized and it's been like, you know, they've tried to boringify it as much as they can.

However, you can't take away that just weirdly next to the Dick's sporting goods and the Panda Express, there's just this, like, scary tube skylight that makes you feel like you're in 2001. That is weird. They can't really get rid of that. I love any place that, like, no matter how, dull ass of an art designer they put in there to take all the character out of it you can't change that you can't change big scary roofs so i don't think it's a v and roofs it's not hooves yeah it's

roof roughs it should be more fun roofs um but uh they took a lot of that fun out of woodfields they can't take that so there's some of it left how much fun was left do you feel like were you disappointed by the the woodfield that we saw in 2019 i'm a little bit as well i mean And you used to be like a little walkthrough where there'd be like fish tanks and stuff down in the sort of the middle of the mall. And I think that stuff is all going unless I didn't see it, but I think all that stuff is gone. Pretty fun. And obviously like there's still like the weird way like the levels go and there's almost like a one point five. Like there's floor one, there's floor two and then there's one point five, which is where the McDonald's is.

That stuff is still there. I was trying to explain that with the little, here's this little alcove that a half escalator goes to. That's something they don't do anymore. Yeah, it doesn't make any, I don't think it makes sense. Like it doesn't make sense. sense to do it other than it's fun. Yeah. Yeah.

But I always love it when there's, here's this little zone and what's there. I don't know, one door, one chair. Why is this this way? The McDonald's was on its own floor in Woodfield. It's like the ceiling is half as high. Yeah. So it's literally like, love that weird. Point five.

Let me see if there's a good photo of it. There's all the weird. There's a lot of like stores and restaurants and like tunnels around like Minneapolis and Toronto. It reminds me of that like oddly narrow or like here's the lowest ceiling subway you'll ever go in. Right, right. I mean subway the restaurant, not subway the transportation. I think

the McDonald's is closed. Damn it. That sucks. That's why we have to hold on to these landmarks the best we can and celebrate them. So many good. To what you were saying about like that it's like kids drawings, a critic said at the time about these buildings, it's as if they took an architect, gave him a hallucinogen and asked him to design the kind of hotel he would have liked to stay in

when he was 12 years old. Hell yeah. Yeah. You can see it here. This is the 1.5 floor or whatever. Like, that's where McDonald's is at Woodfield or where it used to be. It's seven and a half floor of the Woodfield Mall. But that's not a floor that goes around the mall. It's only for this. Yeah, why?

How does it end up that way? I don't know, but it was fun. Wow. Can you see that, Jason? Like right here. It's a weird little McDonald's shelf. It had its own floor. It's a couple of the things on that area, too.

But it was, and it's not, there's not like a copy of it on the other side. It's just a wedge. It's like a little ledge. Weird special, unpredictable. You got to like bump into these things and discover them. Here's another thing that like, here's where I feel relatively justified in just walking around mouth agape when I'm in the causeway. I started thinking about it. I was like, that dolphin is pretty tall.

That pyramid is tall as hell. Yes. Where does it rank against other really tall structures in Disney World? Guess what? That is the tallest building in Disney World. The highest peak of that is 257 feet. That is 57.5 feet taller. than Expedition Everest,

which is the other highest thing. Tower Terror is right below that. So Dolphin Pyramid, biggest thing in Walt Disney World. It doesn't feel that way for some reason, but it is. And if you start thinking about it, Disney properties,

none of them have anything that crazy tall. So if you look up all the other ones, there is nothing that tall. The Dolphin Pyramid is the tallest thing Disney has ever built anywhere. That is interesting because there's so much, like, Yeah, yeah.

I think the pyramid aspect, I think it's like you could tell if it was like a wider skyscraper, then you'd be more aware of it. The fact that it all goes up to a point, I think, disguised it. But it makes me feel justified in why, like, when we went a couple months ago, that I had a great time, just Kevin Tully and I, we went and got ice cream and whatever is downstairs at the dolphin, and then just sat on a bench and stared up at the pyramid for a while. Right. A great way to spend an evening.

I believe you were still busy at jelly rolls. And that is what I chose to do was just, you know, admire the might of man at the base of the Graves Pyramid. Right. Which I think is, look, it's in terms of my Michael Graves Causeway journey, it's no small part of it that on two separate occasions it has been my refuge from jelly rolls. Not one, but two pianos playing things that I don't want to hear. Well, it's so close to there. I know. It was so close.

Yes. It is. Yeah. to feel that piece of mind. It's just like, 2019, that's what happened. It, like, sheltered us from the rain. Then, 2021, I went back for this Bachelor party, and I've talked about that before.

I was, like, crazy and fun, but hectic. And then, like, the one moment of peace I got was, oh, my God, these buildings to just, like, stare at these canopies and stroll and be calm. Because I don't know how you guys feel. I think Jason probably feels this way less. Mike, I feel like the way you and I have been doing Disney World

in the recent past. We just go and go and go, like Vegas. We have not been, I think, like, in order to keep things tidy so we can get back to the kids quick, we've, like, I have not felt at rest at Disney World in a very long time. I don't know if I've ever felt at rest of Disney World. Really? I'm sort of surprised you're saying that. I, like, because I feel like you've, like, recently you've, like, kicked in a little more time to relax. Yeah. But I've always felt like you, like, I don't know, you've had more, like, sprawling family trips and chilled out and stuff.

Yeah. I don't, my family, though, would go, go, for a long time. Right, right, right. Yeah. It's like you're here once. And even if like, I don't know, sometimes it can feel like a waste to like just sit around. Like, yes, they have a nice pool. Yeah.

So, so many places have a nice pool. That's why you got to do 30 days? It's the problem. It's 30 days. You hear that, Aaron and Lindsay and Jane? But yes, I mean, what's funny is every, I mean, we're very lucky going to Disney World and doing cool stuff. But it's very like, you're like, oh, gosh, I wanted to take some more time and enjoy myself.

Last trip, the most, I felt calm. my thing for an hour the day after we did our live show and I was alone at volcano bay and I was in the lazy river and I went ah okay I don't have anything that like don't have so much to do our shows are done and that was like that was the kind of like hour hour and a half I had when I was just alone with my thoughts no phone because I put it in the locker so I got to like I got 90 minutes of like actual relaxing. Everything else is like very high, like, I don't want to say high pressure,

but very, um, uh, intense fun. Yeah. And it is fun. It's great, but it's like a, you know, like, and I like the time shift has been fucking me up lately. My sleeps are always horrible. So I just,

I really like hold on to and value anywhere that makes me feel calm. And this place does. I think especially because it's like grand Disney built places that I can admire. Yeah. But where there is nobody. And there's,

gentle breeze and there's water and like beautiful landscaping and and and you can just feel nobody being there because everybody rushed off to the parks but if I can grab a little moment then I'm still I still feel like I'm getting my you know quote unquote Disney rocks off because I'm looking at a big silly dolphin yeah but I'm also like actually at peace see I I have found at universal like right outside of like right next to the poor cochet of sapphire falls there's a spot where you can just uh uh like this smoking area where you can just sit and stare at the neon sign of cabana bay is so relaxing and they play like chill music that just gets chiller and chiller as the night goes on so to just sit there with a yingling tall boy from from

the quick service like a cafe slash convenience store in the hotel. Wow. Wow. That's beautiful. Yeah. There's one I didn't know about. And look up at Oventure. Oventure is like a cool cool design building

to look at from the outside. For a recent building, I think Oventura's got some flavor and some cool. Yeah, at a very cool that weird shape. Yeah. Yeah. It's unique shape. So, but as we're talking about this, you know, we mentioned that it is a bubble and you mentioned people looking fondly on like a lot of the eyes and their stuff.

But that was like the biggest period of expansion at Disney World. It seems like. And it also seems like when they expand now, it is function built in lieu of form. Right. It's we need a bigger DVC tower. We sold too many timeshares. We need more convention space because that's such a big business. Sure, sure.

This, like the Disneyland Hotel DVC, which we haven't talked about, too much. I think it would look okay if it wasn't in the zone of all the other hotel parts. Yeah. I don't know why it looks like. I don't know why they did that.

I'm just confused by the thinking. Why wouldn't it look exactly like the other towers in the Disneyland hotel? Yeah. It's just like brown and there's some fun colors in the little like area between rooms.

Yeah, I like it in there and a little steamboat Willie Pool. But I don't, I don't get it. Yeah. Same thing with the Polynesian world. I'm like, why does this not look better? It's weird. There are some,

When it first opened, I saw a video where someone stayed at like the cheapest available rooms. And that is because we're on the backside of the hotel and you open your hotel room and it looks out on just a road and a park across the street and houses. And it's like, guys, plant some tree. Like, have a wall of trees or something. Have some palm trees or something. Right, right.

Did you know about the top of the world lounge? Do we know about this? Is that a club lounge? There's a club lounge, I think, at the top of Disneyland Hotel that I wasn't even, I've never heard of, really. But I think it's a DVC or it's like expensive room. Maybe it's expensive room. Right, right. Maybe it's, I don't even know if that's what it's called.

I don't think any of us ever stayed at club level, which is where. Yes, it's club level. That's what it is. There's a lounge where you can always get like soda and snacks. And a lot of the day, like small bites, mac and cheese or finger food. It's called the high key club. that's what it's been branded. Not the high tea club.

Not the high tea. I'm in that, but that's a club of me and I don't know. A couple other guys. All the guys you'll start hanging out with in Orlando. Yeah.

Let me shout out some other grave stuff. His other Disney works, which I think are all of a piece. Swan and Dolphin, he did the Hotel New York in Disneyland Paris, which I got to go to, and they're trying to blandify that.

That's the one that got the Marvel changeover, which, Even for me, that one was a little, like, insanely outdated 92. Before the trip. It's a strange thing. It is sad, but it's not his fault that there's like a, there's an area meant to be an ice rink that's just dry. I think the vast majority of the year.

Uh-huh. He built the post office in Celebration Florida, which is one big weird rotunda. And it's definitely the weirdest post office I've ever seen. We've got to go see that. I would really like to see. I know. I thought about making the trip one time, but it was rainy and, like, I don't want to make the lift driver take me to...

Yeah. Take me to the post office in celebration. We hear it's a big party at Halloween in celebration. Oh, yeah, yeah. That's a little birdie told us. Big party. Let's do it for... We've got to go.

That's a Halloween episode. Yeah. But he also did the team Disney building, which is the sort of famous building on the Disney lot in Burbank, that I think all of us probably pass by a fair amount, given our proximity to it. And I truly am always like, well, I get to see. see Michael Graves architecture in my neighborhood.

This rules because it's different colors, but it's colors that's still, like, I don't know, it almost feels a little more classic, like it's a little less crazily 90s than Swan and Dolphin, but like, I don't know, it's such a treat. I love getting to see those dwarves. I, like, is it a coincidence that that is the location that I chose to strike at during the WGA strike? You know, yeah, I'm mad about this. Yes, you know, it'll give us what we want, but also, yeah, I'll take in some Michael

Graves architect. that's fine. I've been in it. Me too. I've got to get to do it. I've been in it. I've been in it. Years ago, I went to the lot Christmas party with a friend of, some friends of friends.

And they're like, oh, there's the Lucas offices. And I'm like, oh, the one with the Bronze Yoda statue outside. Yeah, I figure. Oh, really? I didn't know that. The Lucas fell. I mean, it's all, that was probably 10 years ago. So everything's probably flipped at this point.

Well, you got cool stuff. there. You got that. It used to be like a reflecting pool, but now it's just a walkway, and it's where all the Disney legends are installed perfectly. And they've got a partner's statue, uh, the Walt and Mickey, and I think the Roy and Mini won on the bench. So they got bonuses of those. What? So was Swan and Dolphin Open what year? 90. In 1990? Yeah. Okay, because I'm trying to figure out here, Michael Graves is like 56 when Swan and Dolphin Open. So I just to tie it in, what if your creative output was going to peak in your like mid to late 50s? That's something to look forward to.

That's what I'm looking forward to with myself as well. I got a lot of things cooking that have never cooked fully. I'd like them to cook so I'd like the thing. Maybe I can hit a Michael Graves arc to my career. Well, it also, you know, to be, I feel like there is nothing that I'm itching to do creatively that is dependent on me still being 21. You know what I mean? Well, that's, yeah.

The fact that here, this is a creative outlet that the listener is listening to and that you two are participating in that has been, you know, a bunch of talk about architecture from 35 years ago. Cool isn't part of it for me. It doesn't need to be.

That is something I'm aiming for is that like what I want to do, I feel like hopefully I can do really well at 56. You're looking for a graves arc, basically. We love that. That's what we're, yeah, that's what we're hoping for. Yeah.

I would love to be making a Princeton professor salary like him as well, which is what he did at this time. Okay. That can happen to. I bet these gigs paid pretty well, too. That is good to hear. That is a good thing to you. Yeah. Jason could be teaching podcasting at Ithaca at that point.

He could be a professor of podcasting. No, when we did PTR, just use PTR as an example again. Oh, by the way, we're doing it still. Make no mistake. Oh, yeah. This class is ending early. Got to talk about Astro Orbiter 2. Oh, did I say two?

I meant 20. Twenty, two. The secret of good podcasting is when you bring up something that the audience likes, like, say, ejaculating tuna, you want to keep building on that and referencing it over and over again. A runner is what we call it. And then you take a long break from it, and then when it comes back,

they're surprised, and they're like, I like this again. Yeah, sure. I like the tuna. That's how it'll play out. Rest the games? God. rest the game. I think that's a game that a game that a lot of people would love to be rested forever, myself

included. That's fine. I don't need to, but you've been bringing it up. I'm, well, I'm coping, I'm processing.

As I assess the last 40 years of my life, I have to think about some of the most disturbing things I've ever heard in that 40 years. Yeah, well, I understand that. You've got to take stock of it all. Yes,

I've heard about horrors that have happened throughout the world and throughout history, and yet what resonates almost the highest, to me is the thing you said about ejaculating tuna. Warm tuna coming out of your euthra. You know, sometimes as you go about recognizing sexual beings, no, that has nothing to do with that.

Don't you dare. There can be some clumsiness, some growing pains. If you consider that part of being a sexual being, you're the biggest pervert on the earth. Well, exploration, you'll never know. Much like the port of entry, you'll never know what you'll find down in an alley.

You thought it was gross when he said it too. You were a pulsed via. This guy was one of the filthiest guys I met when I came out to Los Angeles. So now he's Mr. Proper. I don't know what happened. He's acting like he's,

oh, well, I agree. That's my wish for 40s that Jason wilds out, that he gets his freak off and that we start getting that wild jakes on. You really, really got it. The old guy I know

would have tried to top me at that point. But this guy's like a very scholarly kind of guy. Topping. That's a sexual bee. Topping and bottoming. You're learning. You're learning. So general.

You got to get really... You would have said something vile 20 years ago, 15 years ago. Tell us one hotel that you want to top. Oh. If you had to top a hotel. Well, that adventurer is awfully tall. Okay, all right. The power you would feel topping is such a tall hotel.

Your topping is hard because he hears toppings and he thinks toppings bar at cosmic race. So it's a confusing a bunch of feelings. Let me talk about this one is often in the causeway especially. Share so much in common

with the team Disney building. The team Disney building is where Michael Eisner worked. Right. So he had it designed to be his office, to be an office fit for a chairman and CEO

of a Walt Disney company and including, here's this quote. This is what he told Michael Graves. Look, everyone here will have some design priorities for you, but I have only one.

priority. When I come into work each morning and go up to my office, I'll probably have very little to smile about. So do something that will make me smile when I arrive. And that is why the seven dwarves are holding up that building. Do you think there were other options pitch to him? There were. Yes. Okay. Yeah, because he saw the design. He said it looks like a bank. And then he's just put some characters in it or something. And then he just kind of arbitrarily put Mickey and stuff in. He's like, it's like, it's got to be something where it's like, where you are trying to tie it in. and that is why he turned it into with the phrase, here's a term I've never heard,

carry added. That's why the seven dwarves are cariadids. Those are load-bearing statues. That's like in Roman architecture, when there is like a statue of a woman or a man and they are supporting that. That is what the seven dwarves are. Interesting.

And so I assume it's the seven dwarves because they're the first movie, not because he loves the seven dwarves? I think because, I think it makes sense, like just Mickey, that's only one character. So I think the dwarves get you

like a whole bunch of characters to all line up and all be supporting it. But yeah, it's that. I think it's the fact that the company is built on that that lot would not exist without the seven drawers. It's another question for him where like, did you actually like any of this stuff on like a real level or you just understood it was good?

He didn't strike me as somebody who's like a dork for things. But I wonder if it's like... No, that's like... I think he's like, yeah, he was all about feel architecturally. Yeah. Not so much about the details. But he gave these transformative notes that did, like, I don't think we wouldn't have the dwarves on that building, if not for what he said. We wouldn't have the swan and the dolphin on the swan and dolphin.

Right. I just keep trying to go, I'm like formulating the interview in my head. Oh, yeah. It's a problem now. Yeah. Well, so I'm practicing some of this because I know I'm going to have a swan and dolphin chunk. 30 minutes on swan and dolphin. But that's why, but I feel like maybe on some level because, you know, we've all been lucky enough to go in the team Disney building, but we can't do it.

it all the time. No. We can go to the swan and dolphin, technically, whenever we want. And like, on this trip, I did use it for work because I was working on our live shows, which thank you listeners for providing me the opportunity to achieve a fantasy of being like a businessman on vacation with work to do in the swan and the dolphin. But I feel like, you know, I'm popping into the business center. I'm walking through these like narrow, columned hallways, you know, in these grand spaces. And I'm like, you know what? I feel like I'm Eisner right now. Wow. I think I'm getting a little bit of a fantasy of how it must have felt for him to be in this kind of odd, austere, but silly, cartoony space. Like, it makes me feel like I'm the CEO and chairman of the Walt Disney Company in 89.

What a feeling. Like, I'm working out details of, like, Danny Glover's trying to screw me on the Angels in the Outfield contract. We've got to hammer this out. Well, look, we'll get Larry Fishburn in here in a second. Okay. It doesn't have to be Glover. If he's going to play hardball, we'll play hardball back. Did you figure T-surging, too?

Because, you know, Eisner's had to have, like, off-the-charts testosterone at that point. He was just so, like, a virile. And he could have, like, I mean, if he wanted to, you would have had, like, every time he made love, you would have a kid. It would just be, he was, his sperm was so powerful. Well, that is what's happened to me, Michael. Oh, well, that's a good point. The rare occasions where I've been forced to be a sexual being. Two for two.

Hey, here we go. Now you two got it. Only when necessary. Only. Yeah. Yep. I have eaten a fish covered in blue chue, and now we are going to make love for one and only one time. Perhaps a second if a brother is desired.

Put my blindfold on. Think of England. Not for fun either. It's not a fun blindfold. For the first son, I thought of the swan, and the second son I thought of the dolphin. I'm wearing protective gear all over my body, except for the one part that needs to be exposed. And if we need to have a girl, I'll think of the wretched swan reserve. and I'll hold it against her.

But anyways, I'm like, okay, so let me just make sure I get stuff out about the causeway. I love the symmetry of it. I love that you're on this path. And if you're looking straight ahead this way, you're looking straight at the swan, and you spin around and you're looking at the dolphin. I love that, I love being in a causeway at all.

I didn't know that word before. A causeway. I had to think about what a causeway is. I guess where it is, it's not a, like the Golden Gate Bridge is not a causeway. That's a bridge, because that's elevated. That's up high. That's if you have a body of water and you have some kind of structure.

It could be manmade. It could be a bunch of rocks put together like a jetty or it could be a low bridge. But it's like bisecting in a low way a body of water. And that's what a causeway is. Interesting. Yeah, I never heard that before the show. Teaching me words. Causeway.

Carriadids causeways. I'm trying to think of other famous cause. Are there other famous causeways? Is this the most famous causeway in the world? I was, well, I don't think so. because even our listeners might not know what it is. I was looking up famous causeways. I never heard of these goddamn causeways.

This is what passes for a famous causeway? Not to me. Can you mention a famous causeway? I cannot, off the top of my head. There's a movie called Causeway I've never heard of. I think you've got, well, I have to watch it. It'll probably teach us something. Okay.

There's a lot in Florida, I think. Yeah. Like connecting small islands, I think. In South Jersey, the Jersey Shore there are causeways because you've got Mars's end bay. and the ocean. So a lot of stuff needs to be connected.

And a lot of the short towns are on what's called barrier islands, which are stretches long, kind of elongated islands that are just off the mainland. Gotcha. Okay, so you know causeways. You grew up with causeways.

But for us, it's a rare delicacy. There were no causeways in Woodfield. I wouldn't imagine. But I love that. I love the lake aspect. You're on Crescent Lake. That is where you are. and some of it is shaped like a crescent,

like the part that they built for this area. And I love the way the grass is there. I love that it slopes right down to the lake and there's no barricades. You can go sit there. You can think about how happy you are to not be at the dueling piano bar. You can think about your life

and have a moment of peace. It's just so calm there. The breeze is wonderful there. I love looking at the cascading fountain that kind of steps down the dolphin because that thing is insane. If you start thinking about the size of those pieces of those big cement pieces or whatever they're made of.

Like all flowing into a big shell that's held up by several dolphins all kind of fanning out who look like they're really put out and unhappy to be supporting a fountain. As far as, okay, so Eisner's like, I want a place that tells a story. Listen to what this motherfucker said. This is Michael Graves talking about what he built and why it's there. Jason, I think you mentioned something about black boxes. There's black boxes in both of the hotels, right? And there was a room, people have asked why.

Why are there those? Was there like a plan for a monorail to be going through those? That was an urban legend. I don't think that was ever planned. I think it was like a choice, like an architectural design choice. Yes, yeah, yeah. Well, yeah, it was. And he was asked about this.

Like, was that for a never-built monorail? He says, no, not at all. Not at all. It is the heart of the mountain that has exploded. The mountain that is rising out of the Everglades, which is the main pyramid in the dolphin. The dolphin is this mountain. It has struggled its way to thrust out of the tropical rainforest.

That's why there are banana leaves painted along the side of the building. It is a mountain that dramatically rose, and in the process, its heart exploded. And the water cascades nine stories down the side of the hotel, passing through the five clamshell basins to a fountain and eventually splashing into Crescent Lake. The walkway from the railings to the landscaping mimic waves that splash onto the side of the swan. There's a story here. Wow. It explodes. It's a heart of a mountain.

that exploded out of the Everglades. The fence doesn't just have fun turquoise squiggles that I like because it's 1990 and it looks like Peewey's Playhouse or something. Those are waves that are flowing all the way to the swan and that are consistent with the railings on the Swan Hotel and with the big waves that are painted on the Swan.

There's a story being told and you are part of it when you're in the Michael Graves Causeway. Story living, you would call it in a lot of ways. I would happily call it that. Or story staying because you're not living there permanently. Though it's not just weird squiggles. They're telling a tale. It's about flow.

It's about man trying to emulate nature. But that said, I love all the squiggles. I love all the colors. I love that it's all like canopies and circus tents. Like it's this big weird like 1990 carnival. Like so many of those Epcot things were. It feels like very world's fair in here. That's an aesthetic I'm always chasing.

And all of this stuff is true with the Aventine too. This guy just had a vibe. He knew how to spread it from hotel. hotel. I just love his taste. And it really is all his taste because he designed every back of every chair in that hotel. He picked the art in the rooms. He designed the China when you went to the restaurants. Every tiny thing was Michael Graves because he was a detail oriented guy because he also designed tea kettles for Target. He designed 200 Target products. Like there's an entire Michael Graves line that a lot of people might have items from. Michael Graves design, is that what it is?

Yeah. Because I looked at them and I'm like, oh, there's a whole website for. full of like items that I guess he designed before he passed away or it's just a company now that he has I think it's yeah it's all still done in his name and his in his philosophy and yeah it was a lot of like home design stuff but and then I forget what happened but I think he lost he lost his mobility he had like a horrible health incident and then he starts designing medical equipment wheelchairs and things that are like more aesthetically pleasing that it doesn't have to people don't have to be in these clunky awful things that maybe you can get some fun Michael grave squiggles uh in your wheelchair or whatever helps you with your mobility.

Yeah, it's a very interesting guy. He's had a long cry. I didn't realize, because he passed away like 10 years ago, but they're really like, I'm curious to see, like, how much stuff there is about, like, treating architects and designers in the same way that I want to watch, like, a rock and roll documentary about. Like, I want that same, like,

to understand the same, like, arc of their careers and where they go. I mean, there's a few. Some, I mean, I don't know of something. You can watch, there is a documentary that's pretty good about John Portman, my other favorite guy who did the Bonaventure. Yeah. Similar thing where we just, we went recently and we're just walking around astounded and dumb.

You know what? Like you want to get back about the Swan and Dolphin. You know what I mean? You want to eat hours of just so much footage of him designing and figuring things out. Well, I want to see every scrimshel idea. Yes. Yes.

Testing different colors for the, because also if you look at old photos, yeah, they've like, they've blandified it, but there used to be big cloth banana leaves coming out of every lamp in the lobby of these places. They were so insane. What you do

have, I bought a very industrial kind of book. I have two of these. It's a compendium of all of his college textbooks. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, no, it's for like, like architecture industry professionals mainly. But this book I have here,

Michael Graves Building and Projects, 1990 to 1994. And this has like schematics for everything. This has like designs for, this has designs of buildings that never got done for that are everything. from homes to hospitals to like what would have been like a massive campus in downtown L.A. that never got built. But the one I really wanted to show, I think everybody's going to trip out on this.

He designed a Vegas hotel in 1994 that was never built. And that is called the Paradise Hotel and Casino. Paradise spelled D-I-C-E as in Casino D-D-E. And this is even pushing my limits of gaudy color. This is so insane. It's this big, like, hexagon with massive fountains on top and very much in the mode of the, of the dolphins. It's like two-dimensional giant macaws.

Whoa. All, like, perched above humongous dice. This, if this had gotten off the ground. Yeah, paradise. These colors, like, how many colors do you see here? I mean, it's kind of in shadow, so I can't tell a lot, though. It's like 20 at once. It definitely looks like a six.

Some sort of set you would, like a knock off Lego set you would buy or something as kids or your grandma didn't know, right? So she got you some sort of like alternate brand Legos. Oh, a wrong Lego. Yeah, because it was cheap. You want to, yeah, right, you want to like, make, you want to Cinderella Castle and she got you this. This is called Paradise. This is just as good. So many stripes and squiggles and colors all fighting each other and there's a big pineapple and three leaf, not four leaf, clovers.

Like etched into the three leaf around. I think they're much more common than four. Too aspirational four leaf clover's. I think if this had been built in the mid-90s, they would have imploded it already. That's exactly. I saw it and they immediately thought, oh, that would have been gone. There's no way. This would have existed for six years.

Right. That's the issue with a lot of this. Architecturally, when something is built in its time, then when that time passes and tastes change or the perspectives change, then they're like, oh, that's old, that's like not, that's like 20, 30 years old, like redo the inside or like paint the outside. But if you wait long enough, people might, there might be a desire for. It comes back around.

Yes, yeah, yeah, as I hope it does for people. I don't know. I don't know if everyone, like, maybe a lot of people look at these and think like, ugh, old 90s bullshit. Well, it also depends where it is. I mean, Disney World is just a perfect place for these things to live forever. Yeah, and in different parts of the real world, I can understand how you might want to

Yeah. Anything can live forever there unless it's the rivers of America. Well, that's true. They need of the space. They really need of this space. It's gone. Well, Burbank, the Seven Dwarz building,

I think maybe got approved, got, you know, built easier because Southern California has a history of thematic architecture. Oh, sure. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, no, it feels common here. And it makes sense in Florida.

These are, these buildings are so Florida, and they're so early 90s, Florida, which is an important time for Florida. It's the reason any of us care. and why we go there and where all the parks invested the most money. Yeah. And it's just they have to leave these

the way they are as a testament to that era. And I go here and I feel like I'm in that era. I just love also that you can see yacht club from here. You can see boardwalk from here. You can see spaceship earth from here. It's so grand at night that it's a perfect spot to see. Like, I'd imagine fireworks, though I haven't done it. You can see spaceship earth twinkling.

And oh, and we've missed a big thing. This is where the friendship boats arrived. Oh, right. mentioned the friendship. This is also serves as the dock of the friendship boats and at least which take you to the other hotels and to Epcot and to Hollywood Studios. And one of, at least one of those is still extremely 90s, like very pink and purple and teal. So it's an area, it's where the 90s are alive at Disney World, the most of all. Also in recent years, they have done, there is a light show that you can see in the Michael Graves Coswood. They light up in a subtle,

but really impactful way. They light up that fountain and they light up those palm trees and it's cool as hell i saw one to lionel richies all night long that's a perfect like florida party kind of song they also do big grand disney stuff they did circle of life and we were hanging out there a month or so ago yeah and i was i didn't see i think i know we were going you i didn't see this but you texted about it and i was jealous i walk out and it is a star wars light show it's like main star wars theme and colors are flashing on and off and that's cool then it turns into duel of the fates yes it becomes phantom Phantom menace, incredible piece of music,

Duel of the Fates, and they're lighting everything up deep red, Empire style, and it's like, it was nuts, it was awesome. That is like, that's a piece of music you don't expect to hear in this, like, calm and, like, it's a place I go to be calm, but now I'm, now I'm caught up in a dang Star War.

Yeah. You're like Quigon, Don John, or whatever his name is. Quigon Jin, you know that. Don't pretend you don't know that. I don't know anything. I don't remember nothing. But you mentioned the prequel. I don't think it ever struck me, the prequelism of this.

And then here I am walking through. The literal prequel song. Geez. So cool. The big piece of music. So anyways, just where this all goes, I've like, on like four separate visits, I became very affectionate for this place, for giving me some calm, for rescuing me from jelly rolls.

And then I have this stretch of time that was deeply, insanely busy. with baby and movie and Oscars and the podcast, balancing all of it. It was an amazing time and when I would sign up for again tomorrow, but I've never had a thing like that where like every second of my life was accounted for. And it was definitely breaking me at various times, as you'd expect that it would. And there was one of those nights where I was like, I don't even, I got to get to bed right now. I don't even have time to relax. What can I do?

What can I do that's going to, like, transport me? I know. I will do a YouTube walkthrough of the Michael Graves Causeway. And then it occurs to me, wait a minute, there are balconies. their balconies at this hotel. Could I not have my own little outdoor space for just a brief flicker of time in the Michael Graves Causeway?

And from that point on, as I got through these kind of arduous insane months, that was where my heart was the whole time. Like that was the end of the rainbow for me. Like when this is, oh, any time a day got really stressed so I was like, don't worry, Michael Graves Causeway, Michael Graves Causeway, you will be at the Michael Graves Causeway. And so got really got my heart set on it.

And then we went and we did our shows there. And now I finally have the reason. But then I had planning to do. Then I had to like, wait a minute, what part of the Michael Griff's Causeway do I want to be in? I have to get exactly the right part because I don't want to be up there and feel like I only half got it. I want my full tilt Michael Griff's Causeway experience. And I want to have a fucking beer up there. I want to do what you're saying with the yingling.

I want to have my moments and feel like that era has passed and I am now at peace. But then what that took was like strategy. What do I do? I like the dolphin more. The dolphin's really cool, and the swan's a little more understated. But, you know, what it's got to be. I got to stay in the swan because that's going to give me a view of the dolphin. That's what I want.

I want to look at the dolphin. And then I was like, here's what I'm going to go on street view, and I'm going to pick the kind of balcony I want. Because I don't want a fireworks view. Don't give me your fireworks. Throw your fireworks on the garbage. I want to look at the tallest building the Disney ever built. So then I got to do that kind of street view that's dependent on like somebody just taking a picture and doing that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because it's not a real street. But I start trying to identify like, okay, that looks pretty straight on. I think I can get one of those. All right, I think I could do it. So I picked my, I picked the general zone that I wanted to do. And I booked a room with a balcony. And in three separate ways, I asked hotel employees to make sure that I had that kind of room that I wanted. Yeah.

They'll go out of your way at their way at Disney World and especially at a convention hotel. Sure. They know they're dealing with like high rollers. Well, that's right. And that's exactly what I want to hear about. Yeah. I want to feel like I'm a high roller at the Paradise Casino. But I did it online when I booked.

Then I made a phone call and I asked and then I did it at the front desk again. And I was like, how do I frame this? I can't say I want to look at the Michael Grave. Causeway. They have no idea what that is. I even only barely found out what it is. By the way, that is, I think some of my fascination with it, too, is that there is a plaque of, like, you know, there's plenty of beautiful places in Disney World. Like, you know, you're strolling along the Yacht and Beach Club, and like, that's very nice, but it doesn't have a name. I love that this has a name that it's the Michael Graves Causeway, and I know this because of a brass plaque that is in several spots between those hotels. And I think it's just delighted me being able to say the Michael Graves Causeway. but I did not say to any employees, please give me a room with a view of the Michael Grub's You never said it once? I was like,

I would have, I would have said it once and then explain what it was, but I would have been for me. The Michael Gras Causeway, by the way. I mean, in the future, I'm going to do a lengthy podcast episode as a birthday shot where I explain what it is,

but for the time being what it is. I might explain that, but I would have definitely like done a little bit like, I know what the name of it is. I'm a little smarty boy. I'm a little smarty boy. I'm kind of a fan of your hotel. I'm kind of a naughty little.

smarty boy in a lot of ways. So that's just who I am. I don't think it's unreasonable to say, oh, I'd love a view of the waterways and the boat docks and the big dolphin or the big. But we're talking about specifically trying to say the name. You're totally right. You're totally right.

But I was worried still. I still felt like I had to be really specific and say, I want a view of the dolphin. Because I think a lot of people actually want a that is fireworks and B that is kind of of the boardwalk. Because they seemed a little like, oh, they were like, that's the view you want. I said, yes, I'm craving.

architecture, don't you see? I am craving a beautiful symmetrical view of palm trees. I hammered it through. Kevin Tully said, you're on a list of some kind now. That's fine. That's totally fine. I think it used to be pretty standard practice to not just ask for it. Or like, I feel like people who got really used to staying at place would like, and if we

could get room 305, that would be great. That's our favorite. Sure, sure. No, it's not the craziest thing to do, but I think the specificity of it and what was chasing made me feel weird. But let me tell you, this was worth it. When I walked in, when I first got blasted by that view, my God, the feel it was everything I built it up to be to have my own little perch on what has slowly become my favorite part of Disney. It felt incredible. It felt like cheating. It felt like how could this even be possible? And I didn't even break

the bank doing it because guess what? Those hotels are not as expensive as the Disney ones because they aren't owned by. So they actually can get a pretty good deal there. So I'm like, How did I even get away with this? Well, the answer is nobody else gives a shit about the Michael Graves Causeway. So you're not getting, plenty of people have had this and then didn't mean anything to them. It's just like, that's true. They were even maybe like, this hotel looks stupid. But not me, damn it.

I appreciated every facet of it. I appreciated the railings with the weird squiggles and like big leaves on them. Like getting to stare at having my own private view of a couple of the swan fountains that are there. Like I got perspectives I wouldn't have had otherwise. this was a dream. This was as blissful as I wanted it to be. It was an achievement. Could we get, you know, when you search Mighty Akron,

Podcasts the ride comes up, I come up. These are some of the first worlds. You have to be the number one fan of the Michael Graves Causeway. I think so. I think so. You're number one in the world. How do I assert this? How does that transfer?

This would be a great 40th birthday present for me to try to up the SEO. I'm just to double check to make sure I searched Mighty Akron. Podcast to ride Wiki comes up first, then I read it with Mighty Akron, then me tweeting about it, my account, and then fifth is Mountain Banshee from the official Avatar Wikipedia.

Wow, wow. It's fifth. You've shoved it so far down. Right. Man, well, I want to aspire to the heights you've hit. So, I mean, well, do I just have, we need one of those wiki pages, I guess. That seems like a first thing.

Yes, right. And I'll just post picture after picture of me being really happy in the causeway. Okay. So, so many pictures like that. So you get ahead

of Michael Gray's design. You get ahead of a website chronicling. Like, after Michael Grace died, this Walcoy was renamed the Michael Grace Causeway in his honor.

Yeah, yeah. No, I want to shove down his legacy, the man who was himself, a great architect. I want to, I want to be, well,

but only for the causeway. Sure, there was him, but what about me who likes what he did? Right. I'm number one. Well, look, I've done it to Avatar,

and I'm very proud of it. Yeah. You have punished a venerable franchise. That's right. Mighty Akron, yeah. So I'll have that, you'll have that. And then for Jason, let's figure something out maybe like tuna come or something. Well, be something like you'll be...

I think that's your thing, brother. You think so? I don't need two things, though. I do think it is very deep. I will really, really assert that it's vastly Michael's thing. And I also don't want that to get to know... I'll have two things. Ends on.

The other thing, too, is like, I was... I ended up having my magical special... beer. What you were saying, Mike, after the shows, you could finally relax. Oh, yeah. I was so juiced, amped, wired after the shows, as I always am. Thank you, everybody who came, who's listening to this, by the way. But the, then I was like, all right, I don't need this beer, but I need the moment very much. So I, like, kind of choked down half a beer at 2 a.m. just to say I did. Right. And then I was like, water is something I need. And then what I did, I took a walk through the causeway, through all of the grounds. I discovered the pool area. I didn't

even know they had. Fake rocks. There is a grotto there. I went into the gym thinking that's a source for water. And indeed it was the empty, I met the empty swan gym at 2.30 in the morning, which in a very Florida fashion was playing the appliance direct ad, weird local ad that you only see when you're in Florida. It's an appliance store where they test dishwashers by putting a full red velvet cake in it.

And I was like, there's my friend. I've been seeing Appliance Direct man for decades when I've been coming here. Appliance Direct. And then I was in, like, I'm in the Dolphin Lobby by myself. I'm on the ground. Was I saying, what is the freight, Port Coucher? Did I say right or wrong? I don't, I always say Port Coucher, but I don't, I don't know if I'm correct.

Let's see. I'm not even going to try. Let's give it a look. Let's have Google. The hotel pull-up area. Port Coucher is what I am seeing. Port Coucher. I'm looking at the port cachet.

I'm staring at the damn neon in the port coshire, all by my lonesome at 2.30 in the morning. I got the causeway to myself. I'm on a great trip. We had wonderful times doing these shows. I have it all to myself. And then I go back up. I get one more look on my little private slice of heaven up in the balcony. And you know what I thought about while I was up there?

I thought about my wonderful family. I listened to my favorite songs and I looked at pictures of my beautiful kids. And I thought, I'm on top of the world. and that's that is how I want to feel at 40 you know why don't I have any problems with this why am I not having any complexes because I got to have a transcendent moment in the Michael Graves Causeway

wow and I feel great your reminder alarm went off for like oh god I gotta wake up for a virtual cue I think I didn't that day I think I told everybody sorry could it be taking my time and the nice thing is your relationship with the Michael Graves Causeway

is only beginning. Yeah, you're right. That's the way to think about it. When you think about aging and your life, you're going to have more experiences with this causeway. I found it in a beautiful way with Aaron in 2019 when she was pregnant with our first at that time. And now at some point I'm going to get to return

to the Michael Graves Causeway with our two children. Stroll the Causeway. I'll be strolling the Causeway with my two boys. And they'll say, when are we going on rides? and you will say we're not because you're asking about that we're going to be, I'm punishing you for not understanding the significance of this.

These two beautiful hotels are cities unto themselves when it comes to dining and shopping. But again, I taught my oldest to be mad that they painted one of Michael Graves' work. So maybe he too will want to just run the grounds. It's possible. I think he may well if I raise him right, then that'll be the case.

But you also say to them, look, we have 30 days here. We have all the, the time in the world. We don't have to rush anything. Rides can happen next week. Not this week. That's right.

That's right. You know what's one more just little crazy coincidence is that I, in thinking, where have I heard the phrase Causeway before? I've heard it in one of my favorite songs on what has become perhaps my favorite album of all time, Donald Fagin's the Nightfly. The solo debut of the singer of Steely Dan released on October 1st, 1982, the day that Depcott Center opened my favorite place and my favorite album released on the same day. And what's so crazy is the lyrics echo, the way that I found the place in the first place.

If I may read a passage. In my dreams, I can hear the sound of thunder. I can see the causeway by the big hotels. That happy day will find each other on that Florida shore. You'll open your umbrella and we'll walk between the raindrops back to your door. Wow, do you want any in the episode? I suppose I do. No, I have 70 more minutes.

Very well. You survive podcast, The Ride. Thanks for subscribing to the second gate. If you want to dig even deeper, join us in our VIP tier. Club 3, where you get one more bonus episode every month and our regular episodes. Ad-free. There, I've done it. I've said everything I need to say.

That's me at 40. I love Michael Graves. I love Donald Fagan. I love my wife. I love my kids. And now we cede the birthday shot floor to the little, stinky, nasty, huby, naughty, smarty, repulsive tuna 40s boy. Lettuce diaper boy.

Lettis diaper boy. Thank you for getting all my accolades. Forever. This has been a Forever Dog production. Executive produced by Mike Carlson, Jason Sheridan, Scott Gairdner, Brett Boehm, Joe Sillio, and Alex Ramsey. For more original podcasts, please visit Foreverdog Podcasts.com. and subscribe to our shows on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Keep up with the latest Forever Dog news by following us on Twitter and Instagram at Forever Dog Team and liking our page on Facebook.