#14 - Ed Morris: From The First Experience To Life Time Interest in Editing
00:02Ed Morris is a London-based freelance assistant editor with experience working on TV dramas, short films, trailers and more,currently working as a second assistant editor on a bright new six-part BBC drama.At he discovered his passion for editing at college while working on a group project in his very first editing experience.He is interested in and he has been developing his editing skills since then when studying film at university and getting proficient in different editing software.The global pandemic hit just when Ed was about to graduate but he still finished to land a job in a startup where he was responsible for various aspects of production.After that he worked shortly in the post-production house as a runner. Ancili found his correct job where he sees himself developing further.A sense for this episode to hear a detailed introduction to editing.Find out what celebrity used to join Ed and his colleagues for lunch and get inspired by Ed's opportunity to travel
01:01around the world in his very first job. Enjoy.Hello Ed, thank you for doing us today and welcome to the show.Good to be on, thanks for having me.Can you please for the beginning try to introduce yourself?Yeah, so name's Ed, living in London from London,probably working as assistant editor in filming TV.That's the career I want to go down.Been doing it for six months in filming TV.
01:27And yeah, I'm looking to hope you continue going forward.are we working on some exciting projectsyeah so working onone right nowsix part drama for the BBCwhere the same creatorStephen Knight is the show creatorso the same dude
01:41that did be it blunderswell yes yeahSCS Rogue Heroesthis is kind of his new ventureI think they've just finishedwrapped finished productionso yeah we're now moving intothe fine cut stage of it
01:52yeah it's been a really goodreally fun and first kind of majorshow to be on so busy oneso yeahlearning a lotI can imagine yeahWell, let's start with your beginnings.So, where did you decide to pursue filmmaking in the first place?
02:06I did Sixth Form, which was year 12 and year 13 over here in the UK.And I did media beforehand, but that was kind of a very broad, you know,do posters and music videos and kind of ad birds.You can just kind of do a range of things and learn a lot about publicationand all that kind of media terminology, which was fun, very practical.and then kind of fluffed a bunch of GCC so I couldn't do.Vaila was I was predicted to do in college.So I should ask you, I don't know what is it in GCC.
02:38So kind of like, they're the exams that you did in year 11.So when you're 16, you do these exams.And that basically then determines what things you can do in college.And then from college you go to university.So they give you like a prediction of what grades you could getand you kind of outline what things you could do all hand.going into college basically. So these GTCs are supposed to set you up. So, you know, everyonegoes on about them and, right, I mean, they're redundant now, but whatever. But yeah, so kind of
03:09messed them up a little bit. So I've not got stuck with film, but they were kind of like,do media, it's basically the same thing. Do you want to just kind of try film and do film and see what it'slike? So it's okay, fine. So was out of those types of media still film, the one that was the mostinteresting too? No, I was more interested in IT and business. It wasn't a film nerd or watched a lot offilms with dad and stuff. It was never like a film buff, film nerd from nerdy age, but was always moreof a practical learner. Struggled a lot with exams and writing and that kind of stuff. So it was more of avisual practical learner. Yeah. And so I kind of heard me doing IT. And I was always a big fan of like gaming andcomputers and stuff. So at that kind of connection, I guess. But anyway, yeah, so it took film and
03:55hated it for the first two weeks.It was really boring.It was just, yeah.Was it like at, sorry, at uni or even before?This is at college, yeah.Yeah, year 12.So it would have been 17, 17, maybe, 1317, something like that.And I can't really remember too much of why I didn't like it.
04:12I think it just, I think because I didn't really want it to solve withand the people in the class were just a bit, not my friends, not what type of people.So I kind of wasn't really interested in it.And then you get two weeks to drop a subject when you first do.levels. So I was going to drop that. And then basically our teacher was like, it's time to dosomething practical. So he gave us a little camera and was like, just go shoot a film basically.Go and just shoot something for 10 minutes at the end of the lesson.Anyway, so we went and got a camera and just started playing around with it and started filming
04:40stuff. And then, yeah, then signed Edited it. And I was like, oh, this is actually well fun.We signed Editing on Final Cup Pro, that's cool. And it was, yeah, it was really fun.Since then, it kind of changed my persona. And since then, I was like, you know what,this is fun. I'm quite good at this. Let's see what happens. Yeah. It's kind ofdeveloped it over the course of the next two years while being at college.Was it coincidence that you were editing that film or was everyone editing their own film?Yeah, she kind of got paired up.So I just got paired with the person sitting next to me.
05:06So we both kind of filmed it.I think he was doing drama as well.So he was bored into acting it.So he was acting in it.And I was just, well, I'm filming it.And then we both kind of sat down and thought to figure out what the hell final cut wasand what the hell to do with it.And because it was new, because it was fresh, it was really fun.
05:22And again, coming for someone who likes to be.computers and be a visual, creating that kind of magic there. It was really interesting. Sothat kind of gets kicked off where I am now and what would eventually later then to go touniversity and study it there. And did you since then know that you want to focus on editing?Yeah, since then I was very subtle visions as in that's the route. Because it was,holding the camera is incredibly fun. You know, he's wicked. But the stuff that you can doin front of the computer in the editing software is something that really appealed to me andsaying I was quite good at.
05:54So I thought, yeah, that's the route.Sounds good at least you could throughout those yearskeep developing that editingbecause you already knew what you want to do.Yeah, exactly.And then going to uni, you think,yeah, you've got to try everything.But, you know, there's always something
06:08in the back of your mind thinkingthat you get drawn to.And why did you actually decide to study at uni?I mean, could have just developed your editing skills?It's a very good point.It's a very good point.Yeah, I didn't really know too muchabout the film industry.
06:21didn't we know anyone other than the people in my class.Yeah, I really just did know how big of an industry it was.So I kind of wanted to go and learn, you know, just learn a bit moreand learn the actual mechanics behind it was a lot of the course.Well, the A level it was doing at college was more film theoryand you watch a film, analyze it.You know, it doesn't take you into the industry or doesn't, you know,open those corridors to make you learn that kind of side of it.
06:47I just again, wanted to go and, yeah, learn a bit more about editingand thought, you know, I could go watch a bunch of YouTube videosto learn myself, but it would be better if I was learning from people who, you know, wouldbe in, you know, the industry or who were kind of top professionals and, and also to meet otherfellow filmmakers, right, you know, that's the main thing to, you know, meet other people andwork on our network.Start from day one.And why did you pick the university you went to?
07:11Did you ever go to there, the open day and the end or?Nope, because back then, I've never been to London before, so I moved to London to study there,so I've thereor maybe I was there likein an opening dayjust to have a lookafter I studied thereso in that sense
07:27that's differentbut I had to look onlinejust was like you knowtop film scores in Londonjust because you knowautomatically memy brain wasLondon's the place to be
07:36so I had to look aroundand the middle of sectorthink was at the timewas top fiveI think in theI don't actuallyalso in the countryor in London
07:43I think it might have beenin countryfor film rightyeahyeah I think I heard itas wellfrom someyeah
07:50I think it was, yeah, maybe even top three.Top three, there you go, then.Yeah, clearly it's good at something.So I think you guys are, okay, let's go, let's go have a look at that.I think other options were like Redden and maybe Bournemouth,but I think I wanted to stay in London.So I think, yeah, I wouldn't have a look at that.Went to the Open Day.
08:08And, I mean, yeah, it's really modern.It's really new.They'd spent, like, $80 million on media facilities.So, yeah, the grade was worth like $80 million, I think.So it was, you know, it was new, modern and look good and of course looked good.I think, yeah, that's all they gave.They took you around all the green screens studio and the motion capture studiosand all the, yeah, the massive TV stage.
08:32So, also they give you all the works.And it didn't look really, really cool.So, you know, yeah.Yeah, the truth is that, you know, the facilities, like, you know, what was it called, in a grove?If you look at those mags, the PCs, even the cameras and stuff,it looks really great.So no surprise that if you come there for the opening,it makes very good impression.
08:52Yeah, exactly.They show you the bells and whistles.I still remember when I came for the first time to the editing roomand I saw all those Macs, I was like, wow, this is cool.And I can imagine for the editor it looks even better.Well, exactly, yeah.It was like you're heaven.And then also, I think I managed to not sneak up,
09:11but just wandering around the grave,you saw the edit suites, the actual singleer edit basethat they had in that corridor.it in I think it was probably the first time I've seen an actual edit suite and itcould go in there because there's lots they weren't given a tour of that but it looked wickedyou know I think that's yeah and thinking this is where I will be spending most of my timeyeah exactly you know spend my time in here then that's that I'll be worth itcan you think of some ideas or advice for someone who wants to go to uni or who is at
09:43uni so what you do to you know take advantage of that or some tips yeah I guess depends on whatyou want to get out of it if you want to go to study film and really crack on and do welland make the most of it then yeah i've got to just make the most of it and do everything you canand you know be as involved and as active as possible and you know always be about andmake sure you're there on time and make sure you're messaging everyone and you know don't be a ghostdon't be a stranger because you know it does come around to buy you know you're there for threeyears and if you're doing that start with you know people are going to remember that and you reallygot a kind of yeah these people you're going to be working with you know you could be working with them for
10:24the next 10 years you know you finish uni and these people could be looking to get your jobs oryou could be wanting to work with them as soon as you finish because you've got a good relationship andyeah you've really got to make sure that you're always on it you know and always focusedbut I didn't say you kind of you know you can't relax in chill time because you can equally do thatYou know, you have three years. You're not studying seven days a week, so you can afford to go to the pub, basically.Yeah, enjoy yourself a bit.Yeah, exactly, because you won't get those three years ever again. That's all that.I'd love to go back there if I could, but you can't, so.
10:58And in the third year, when there was a COVID, what actually was your main work instead of final project, since it couldn't be filmed?So, yeah, luckily, us editors, we had, the university, had contract with edit stuff, which is basically,be like a short film library.So they, you know, can get the rights for certain films,like only short films and get the footage and all that kind of stuff.So we still managed to edit a short film,but it was just we had to pick from a list basically of six short films.Was it like unedited footage and you read through?
11:31So yeah, it's quite a similar.Imagine, you know, shoot a short film and you've just got all the raw files,all the sound files, and you've got a script and a storyboard.They kind of give you those assets.And then you create the story and you cut the story.and you cut the film from there.It was very similar in that respect.It was quite good.
11:46We had a script, we had a storyboard.And then, yeah, you could go from there, basically.How long was it in the end, short film?Eight minutes.So I did overtime, which is basically an Australian horror comedy.And it's really fun to do it, actually.And, you know, it was quite nice having, you know, it was shot really well.And there was a lot of coverage for everything.
12:05And I tried to, unfortunately, there is an actual edited version online, right?So, oh, that film.Yeah, yeah, of that film, you know, the proper thing for it.So it was hard to.Yeah, the only bad side.I watched it beforehand, so I thought, I mean, this is really, really good.And then, you know, as I was cutting, it was so easy to go, oh, what did they do there?And trying to go back.
12:27So I was trying to refrain from it as much as possible, but there was a few instances where I was like, I need a bit of inspiration.So going to the source material, it was a little bit of a cop-out.But managed to make it.I managed to make it my own.But is it like, I understand.easy but it's actually a good idea ifif they provide a footage of filmthat is edited online because then
12:47anyone can basicallyfollow it or would it be too obviouswell exactly I mean that is theI'm not sure if yeah I meanI guess if that's you know if it's written in the script like thatthen of course you know there is setand beats you've got a hit but yeahif you know you could obviously you could recut it
13:03completely differently you know see thingsin a different perspective so you couldtake it a different angle but yeah I thinkfor the experience I had at the timeto follow it as much as possiblebut not yeah I mean it was different and it looked differentso what edit was betterin the end you know they had
13:19you know they managed to get a color grade on it and stuffand they got it yeah I thinktheir composer was a bit better than mineso yeahprobably better paidbut probably probablythey might have had a bit more time on it as wellno I understand I mean it was
13:35considering the situation it wasdifficult yeah it's difficultI mean I was really happy with the end productI think, you know, unfortunately, well, fortunately for editors, I think they had it a bit easier than, like you say, cinematographers or, yeah, producers who couldn't quite get their work out there.And what software have you been using during Munich?It was all Premiere Pro.And then in the final year, I should learn Avid now because it's about time.But avid media composer is the default.
14:01I mean, you know, 99% of the time is the default for film and TV.Yeah, I think I heard it from someone, actually.Yeah, in the UK and America specifically.So, you know, there is the 1% that still cut film and TV on Adobe, you know, Premiere Pro, which is great.But, yeah, so I was always using that up until uni, which is a great.I think this is a great beginner editing software to use.And then if you can make the jump to avid, I feel like you should, you know, because it is a great bit of kit.So I was learning that in third year.
14:31And we're using that on the TV show that we're working on now.So it was very handy to have that experience cutting with it before going into this job.Was Avidavit available, attune?Yeah, yeah, it was.they didn't teach it. They offered the course101 and 110 course they offered, but they didn'tfundamentally teach it, but luckily ourthird teacher. I think because we all said we
14:51will learn it, he kind of thought us a little bitof it, which is good, but the default teacherthan they would do was Premier. Yeah.And can you compare those twosoftwares, a Premiere Pro and Avit?I can, yeah, I mean,ultimately, you know, depending on the editingsoftware that you pick, depends on the project
15:07that you're working on, and depending on whatyou need it for. So, you know, Premier'sreally, really good at doing things quite quicklyand it's really good fortemp graphics, you know, there's a lotof sound work that you can do and there's a lot ofeffects and there's a lot of things youhave at your disposable to make, especially
15:23your temp word really, really, really good.What is the temp work?So, I mean, depending on, so, for instance,in a film and TV perspective, you woulddo kind of temp work in the offline editwhich you then provide and turn overto a sound department.Oh, they're an online department and they would also do the
15:38part of the finishing touches. So,Premiere's really good at that because you can do a lot of advanced stuff in that software before 10 and over to, you know, picture or sound, for instance.So you can get some really, really good looking stuff in Premiere.You know, with Avid, you have to kind of transcode everything and you have to work with Avis native codex, which can be quite annoying.And, you know, it's a lot harder to, not harder, but it's just more a workaround to kind of get your project up and running.Whereas Cromer is very much a drag and drop.Can you say it's easier?It's easier to learn Premiere.
16:11I do think it, you know, Premiere is an easier software to learn.And of course you have really easy access to After Effects as well with Premiere,so you can collaborate between two of those softwares.It is more user-friendly and more beginner-friendly.It kind of holds your hand for a little bit as you're working.And does it also differ based on what content you are working on?If, for example, we're doing music videos or YouTube videos,you will use rather Premiere Pro?
16:36whereas for working in the industry as you are, he would go for Avid, or it doesn't really matter?I mean, yeah, again, it's all kind of down to the editor's preference,but the majority from what I've seen is film and TV, they kind of stick to Avid Media Composer.And then a lot of video-based work is done, you know, YouTube, Instagram, Reels, TikTok,a lot of that is done in premiere.Yeah, but it's all down to the editor of the editor-in-to-the-addered to the editor of,have you seen everything everywhere all at once?Yeah, sure.
17:08Yeah, so the editor, Paul Rogers, he just won an Oscar for his editing on that film.He used Premier Pro for that.I didn't know.Yeah, so exactly, exactly, you wouldn't really know.It's not really, and his reasoning was that he was very proficient in that software.And he thought that, you know, in order to get the best story possible, he wanted to use that to serve that story.So, yeah, it's not something so it's all down to that preference.But of course, there is a more, there is a shift in terms of who uses what.
17:32so. And what about the, I know there is also Da Vinci right and Final Cut. Those are also quite a bigediting software. Yeah, yeah, correct. And what can you say something about those? Yeah, I think so.Yeah, like you say, when I was at school, we used Final Cut Pro and it was great because it's reallyeasy to use. You kind of just track and drop everything and don't really worry about anything.I don't know, it's obviously, you know, Saturday in hindsight it's bad, but when you're, yeah, 16,it's quite, it's a very easy software to learn. And obviously, because it's native to,Apple, it runs very, verysmoothly, of course, on Apple products.
18:07DaVinci Resolve, it's reallyreally powerful at the moment, and, you know,they've just launched an iPad versionso you can actually edit on an iPad,which is massive, especially on the newiPads, yeah, you can do a lot of goodwork on that. But yeah, Divinti is great,because also that's free. There is obviously a paid version,
18:22but the free version is really, really good, because you canalso, the kind of radius of,you know, capabilities of that program,they're huge. So,instead of doing a workflow,between a different editing software, you could just use results to do a kind of an end-to-endproducts, you know, projects, which is really helpful. So I think if you can, you know,and a lot of these different softwares have advantages and disadvantages, you know, so I think if you
18:47can use, if you know how to navigate between them, you can use them, you know, just to youradvantage. It's hard to say one's better than the other. Of course, people have their preferencesand, you know, fundamentally there are certain things which one's better at them. The otherisn't but if you can use all of them then you know I think it's gonna just benefit you a lot morecan you use all of them not I mean to a base level right so you know I haven't touched finalcut since yeah since school but I'd sound pretty confident working around the other three yetand is there one you would recommend for beginners to start with I'd recommend premier pro yeahI mean is there a free version I guess not or yeah I don't think there is unfortunately
19:29yeah most things nowadays to say subscription riseI think there might be a free versionI think there's definitely a trialif you use it as a trial like a seven-day trialbut yeah I think it'sI'd like everything getting a little bit more expensiveeach month nowjust a quick one
19:43if you enjoy our podcastplease give us a review on your favorite podcast appsubscribe or share it with your friendsfor more information visit the show notesthank you and back to the showso as you mentionedeverything everywhere or at oncehow did you like the film
19:59I feel like I need to watch it the second time.What about you?Actually, I went to the cinema, and it was a few months ago,so before it got such a big hype from Academy Awards,and I think it was amazing.It was a beautiful, funny film, very well done, you know,considering the budget and the resources they had.I think it was great.
20:20Yeah, you take them into consideration.It deserved what it got, you know.Yeah.So how did you start planning your way into the industry?although understandably there was a COVID but still how did you go about it?Yeah, yeah.Well, that lockdown was, I mean, I don't know, Matt, you had a great lockdown.Oh, you had or you didn't have?
20:40Yeah, I had a very good lockdown, yeah.I don't know if it's sarcasm or not.No, no, I was living, yeah, so living with eight friends in the same house.And we're all living together, you know, it was an eight-man house.And, yeah, COVID hit, so it wasn't.Everyone stayed where they were.Yeah, I was getting furloughed from, you know,a uni job that I was at.
20:59So I was getting paid and it was really, really hot that summer.So we were just sitting in our garden and doing nothing but, you know,just having a few drinks for a few months.So, yeah, it's great.Anyway, yes, because the industry kind of stops.And my plan, I wanted to go into a post house and kind of work my way up from there.And just to see what it was like, you know, the actual industry,what that would be the place to be.
21:21So I kind of wanted to go in there.You know, when COVID hit, I think they kind of stopped.You know, it wasn't really hiring people because everyone went remote.So that option kind of, yeah, dried out a bit.But I ended up picking up, yeah, got off of the job,a new video production company.And it was a startup, and it was run by two guys who owned another business.So they had like a parent company,
21:42and they kind of built this video production business on the side.So it was called LNG TV.So they fired that.I think I remember when you started there,like a posting that you worked there.As far as I remember, like a good job,considering that it was kind of during,or after a COVID and also for a job
22:00after early? Yeah, so I've got itI think yeah, I started officially in Novemberso yeah, graduated or fakegraduated, you know, in Julyand then I think we just came out of that waveof COVID and then we wentback into lockdown again in likeDecember, but I managed to get that job in November
22:15and my role basicallywas to do everythingyou know, production wiseso the two guys that were running it werethe producers and they werein charge of getting, you know, thebusiness was podcast interviews, social media content for the lit-fired natural gas sector, whichis a very niche sector. And it's basically energy in a short summary. Yeah, so the idea was they
22:40would go and get some guests and some people to interview and we would interview. Honestly,people were multi-billion pound businesses. You know, you'd get the CEOs on, you know, the managingdirectors on. And they would basically do guys that run it would interview these people becausethey were all in a kind of a small, kind of like the film industry, right? It's a verysmall industry, but everyone knows everyone. It was a large industry, but everyonethis is small industry in that respect. It was the same for that. It's a massive industry,but they dealt with a very niche area of that. And our goal was basically bring it intothe daylight, right, modernise it a little bit and inform people what was going on, what was
23:15happening, kind of some of the stories that were happening as well, because there's a veryinteresting concept. So they take these massive liquefired natural gas ships, right? These massive,literally they're huge.They're like,honestly like,I think they're likethe second or thirdlargest ships
23:31that you buildbut honestly it's hugeand they havethey store this gasso they liquefired of gasbasicallyand store itand transport it
23:39over the worldand that's whatyeah,I'm pretty surethe UK uses it.So I guess it was alsoquite educational for you.It was yeah,
23:47I mean it was,yeah,it wasn't quite my capacitybut you knowI learned a lot about itthat was for sure.But anyway,so yeah,
23:53that was thereand we would interviewthese people basicallyand my role was to basically bring it to life from getting the guest to publish in the videoI would do everything production-wise in that pipelineout of curiosity why was it focused on this specific niche areathe two guys that run a company their parent company or their other business was a recruitment firm for that industrythen they had a lot of connections already and they were doing a lot of stuff in that industry
24:21and they wanted to add something to their kind of existing business yeah which was aa video company basically.So yeah, we'd do that for two years.So I was film and edit.We had a small studio in Mill Hilland yeah, we had a, you know,a multi-camera set up studioand we would film and edit
24:36five episodes a day,maybe one or two days a weekand, yeah,sharing them out over the course ofI think we did it for just over a year,which is great.And we'd also,we were the media company,
24:49media partner for some conferences.So we went to Dubai,went to Rome,and we kind of did some interviewsof Xbox Pops.there in person, which was great.You know, got to travel, got to see Dubai, which was great.Two minutes that we were kind of walking in and out of the conference.
25:04I remember you're posting like filming from Dubai.Wow, that's look. That looks exciting.It was a jump, yeah.I mean, it was a very, very busy time.So it was, you know, it was just me doing the work.I'd film and edit basically, you know, at the same time.So we would film during the day when the conference was open from 9 to the 6,we would film and then they had wanted, you know, same day turnarounds.
25:24so I would then edit fromyou know seven till three in the morninggetting those you know we all the people that weinterviewed would be edited those during the nightto give to the first thing in the morningso it was that you know three days so it was reallyit's very very intense but it was you knowseeing the country was still you know it was a great opportunity
25:43yeah and then we did the same in Rome two months laterit was a great you know for me it was great you knowjust out of uni just after COVID managed to you knowlearn a lot did you enjoy working there thenYeah, yeah, because I had a lot of creative freedom.You know, I built the studio,hit it out, you know, came up with the kind of style of the show,and, yeah, kind of had a lot of free reign in terms of building it up.
26:08And, yeah, it was really exciting.So in that respect, it was great, you know.You said they had to studio in Mill Hill,so it wasn't that far away from the handle, right?No, yeah, I think that's why, you know,when I got the, when he was Adam, when he rang me up,and off of me the job, he was one of the reasons was,he was like, yeah, we're kind of someone that's local, you know,
26:27who's going to, you know, appreciate the space around us and,and working kind of this small environment.You know, it wasn't a master's studio, it was possible, but we did well to make it work, you know.And how did you get, I mean, how did you find and then get the job in the first placeas a, in the fresh graduated?Yeah, yeah, it's a good point.I had a website and was trying to be as active as possible on LinkedIn,if that helps, you know, I think it does.
26:51So it was trying to be as active as possible.And anyway, he found my website.He was looking, you know, London, I don't know what he type of in or whatever, but anyway,he suddenly stumbled across my website and, you know, had my phone on there, had on my portfolio of work.And he wanted someone who could kind of, yeah, film, edit, you know, do sound work, do a bit of camera, you know,kind of do a bit of end-to-end to a project.So that's what he wanted and that's what I was hired into do.So, yeah, it was from there, found my website, gave me a call.
27:18I think gave me a call in August.But, yeah, it didn't actually start until November.So was the company already established the startup or was it starting?The start was, yeah, started fresh.You know, I came in in November and I think New Year's Day we launched a promo for it.So yeah, it was very much in the new year.We started it, you know, created a logo.Well, they had it so, yeah, we created a logo, create a, you know, a launch video, a promo,
27:43created a new website.And again, kind of similar to, obviously, what you're doing.We didn't have any guests.So we kind of launched a promo and then backlogs a few guests and then pumped them all out.the same time. But yeah, I think we then actually launched our first podcast in, I think it wasMarch. So yeah, started in November, launched it in January and then got our first podcast online inMarch because there was a lot of kinks we had to work out between then, yeah. So you could havebeen quite important whether it succeeds or fails. Well, that was there. Yeah, I mean, there was,
28:14there was no pressure, right? And we did a lot of research into podcasting and, you know, shows onlineand we were very much a video podcast.So it was something up with a style and a flavorwhich is going to make a stand out, right?You know, one thing you had to kind of look goodbecause it was such a small, you know, niche topicto try and expand the out to a wider audience.There needs something to kind of capture the right, right?
28:36So we tried to do as much as possible.And it was always innovating and changing thingsbecause we was all new to it, right, you know.When it comes to such a niche area,I feel like, you know,I assume that there weren't any podcastsin that areasince it's...
28:51Yeah, there wasn't.There wasn't.Hence why I thinkthat's why we managedto go to Dubai and to Romebecause there was no one therewho were willing to get,you know,
28:59high quality interviews and content basically.There was no content for this industryand all the stuff,you know,these multi-billion dollar companies,you know,you look at their websiteand they just got no content,
29:11they've got no evidence in terms ofthere's no videos on there,you know,anything like that.So, yeah,we were kind of that gap in the marketwhich we wanted to fill.and we started doing it organically
29:21so we weren't paying foradvertisement or we weren't paying for marketingwe were all trying to push the first yearwe were just kind of let's just build itand create a foundationand see how it does and see what we need to doin the next year you knowhow did the goal
29:33so yeah the first year I think went quite wellwe had launched in Januaryand then by the end of the yearI think we had 70 interviewsall in all so yeah more than one a weekwhich was good and yeah like you saymanaging to go to international conferencesand capture
29:49Inton News Live was great.So it was its success.And then, unfortunately, as it come to the second year,their main business, their core business,was starting to, you know, boom again after COVID.So a lot of effort went into their business.And I started doing a lot of video content and branded content,promos, that kind of thing for their business.
30:08They were recruitment firm.So it kind of took a back step from the TV side of it.And then, unfortunately, the TV, you know,their LG TV, which was what I was hired in for,wasn't really picking up.because there was only three of us and they were obviously really really busy doing their own thing.There was a time where, yeah, unfortunately, out of part ways because out of best interest, yeah, it kind of just ran its course.But, yeah, it was good fun and I hope that they managed to pick it back up.
30:32Yeah, I was curious to hear what was kind of the end of it or if it ended or what was the...Yeah, I mean, it just kind of fizzed out a bit, you know, they were, you know, two guys were, we've had a great hearts and they were really, you know, invested in their industry and we're really, really good at it.because I think they were juggling their core businessand then this kind of staff, which they had as well,was struggling to, you know, it needed investment in it,you know, it needed money into it to make it boom,how they wanted to boom,and they weren't ready to invest that money into it,
31:01basically, I think, and invest that time.It kind of needs to be a, it was a full-time job, you know,and, yeah, unfortunately that suffered for it.I also wonder, because I don't know what is the audienceof this specific area,but wasn't it kind of risky that there will not be enough of audience,or at least from what I know nowthere may not be
31:22not that many peopleYeah I meanThe thing is it's a niche industryBut people in that industryThere's vast amounts of people in itYou knowSo these companies all over the worldThat's the thing
31:33It's a global audienceIt's just reaching that audienceAnd I think that's the one thingThe audience was thereWe just weren't reaching themAnd I think because we were doing it organicallyIt obviously didn't helpBut you know
31:45Yeah they were there to be reachedYou know the audience was there to be gainedit was just kind of a matter of timeand yeah I mean a matter of timeand a matter of determination and a matter of moneyI guess and you would eventually get thereyeah but honestly sounds like a gooddefinitely good first job after really
32:00yeah yeah yeah yeah I mean yeahI mean setting up the studio and there's a lot of thingsto think about and then traveling with you knowwe technically had our studio made that into a mobile studioto take onto a plane doing all that by yourselfit was challenging and you know you have tothink about a lot of things and workout a lot of things. Yeah, but that's what it's been about and I was glad to learn a lot of things
32:22and ideas, you know. And how did you find editing, as you said, under the pressure that it needsto be that in a few hours? Well, yeah, luckily, I mean, when we went away, yeah, when we was atthese conferences, it was a case of luckily beforehand, kind of created a template, you know,beforehand, created a project, filled it with music, sound effects and graphics and created abase layout of what our edit would be beforehand. So when we got there, we could kind of justliterally cut it all together, created a lot, you know,made sure the cameras all set up as they should be,and then it was a case of just, we shot a mobile camera,
32:55so it was a case of, you know, as soon as we brought it in,making a few quick cuts, thudding up a little bit,and it was good to go.And looking at it afterwards,could you notice, or probably not you,but like a regular person, notice that it was done quickly?Or not really, was it still?I mean, I think because it was, yeah, but yeah, yeah.
33:13I mean, it did kind of make sure to do as muchquality checking as possible,given the time restraints.And I think, you know, there is obviously a few things.Yeah, I think as days were not, I think also by the second and third day,we'd, yeah, there's a lot of things that were a lot better.You know, we obviously had a few sound issues.I think on day one, because we were there's a lot of interference.
33:30And there was, you know, marks were playing up and all that kind of jazz.And, you know, there's always always want to tweak lighting and all that kind of thing.But yeah, I think, you know, looking back on it, I think I was happy with the outcome.I think we did 15 interviews.There was this great.Both.for something you name.Video and audio, right?
33:48Yeah, yeah, yeah.So it's basically just kind of like,yeah, we had a host, two chairs,hosted it on one side,guess it on the other side,and, yeah, three cameras,all roll at the same time,and then had an audio mixer.
33:58So yeah, we're doing it all kind of live.Did they go to YouTube or website?Yeah, so yeah, it was a YouTube audience.Then from that,then when we came back to the UK,we would then create, you know, out of these,they raised two, five and 15 minutes,depending on the guests that we had.
34:14We would then obviously slice those up,and release social media bites and little snapshots.And just to use over the course of the next few weeks,yeah, it was intense.But it's good fun.I would do a lot of things differently, you know,I think going back out there,or if I was to be hired again,
34:30you know, probably do things a little bit differently.But again, you don't know those things until you've gone awayand learn a bit more and then you come back and, you know,all that kind of stuff.But, you know, I'm glad I left it where I left it a good place, I think.Oh, yeah, that was good.So what was the next job?one of the reasons I did leave was because I wanted to get back into film and TV
34:47you go to uni well yeah I went to uni for to be in that industry to be the film TV industryso yeah I wanted to get back into it and got off it from the farmjust to start running you know was like I just need to get in there one way or anotherso he went in as a runner for the farm for the farm it's post-productionyeah so it's now called picture shop but it was originally the farmoh okay okay yeah it's not a picture shop but I think they're still in quite a big transition periodSo I think the farm, people are still recognising it as that at the moment until they kind of get a bit of vegetable bars down.But so anyway, yeah, we're enjoying that.
35:23And yeah, had a wicked.That's it for three months in the end.Yeah, three months running.But yeah, it was over the summer, so August to October.But yeah, it was great fun, learned a lot.But quickly realized that it was, you know, post house is a great.I think you should want to be an Ocelain, it's tough.You can struggle a lot to work your way up the ladder there.
35:44So it was a case of, okay, I've learned what I need to learn, you know,navigated a bit of how the industry works now and what role was a witch and, you know,who's talking to who and which projects are being worked on in these areas and, you know,what kind of stuff's coming in and out.So because I was like, okay, fine, this sounds good.But, yeah, my mate actually, you know, messaged me, reached out and said,hey, we're looking for an assistant head of stuff for this new BBC drama.Do you want to have a CV?
36:11You know, I'll try and good you on it.So, yeah, did that, got the job, and now that's where we are now.So, yeah, so left the farm in October and then started this role, yeah, shortly after.We're coming back to networking and making good corrections at the early, right?Yeah, exactly, yeah, he was from uni, he was the year above, yeah, reached out,and he was like, yeah, I'll give you an opportunity in a few.And how did you get the job in that picture of?Yeah, as you see, these, I think I just kept hailing and my CV,
36:40and eventually they got back and was like, yeah, join an interview.So we did a group interview and then a one-to-one interview.Yeah, I was really excited to start working there, to be fair,because I had left me in my old job with nothing lined up,just kind of thought, I need to, yeah, go and do it.So left and then was applying everywhere,and yeah, luckily the farm came back relatively quicklyand, yeah, had two interviews.
37:02Yeah, and they started.And how big is the competition, like there to get into such a post-production host?So there's eight people in my group interview,and I think they had three group interviews on that dayand they were hiring three people.So, you know, and this was for a runner.So it's very very demanding, but as soon as you're in, you're in.But how it then did work is over the course of then the next three months,
37:25I remember some of the people that were in that interview were getting called backbecause people come and go in post-production houses all the time.People are always joining and leaving and other people are leaving and get promoted.So they're always kind of recruiting and always hiring.So over the next three months, I kind of recognize.some people in those interviews that were thenthat then started, you know, after me.So if you make a good impression,
37:46but maybe if it doesn't happen first time, thenI'm sure, you know, they'll keep you on recordand remember you for a future date.And what about sometips when it comes to CV orcavilator or application in general?I think you shouldadd a lot of attention to the place you're applying for,
38:02especially in a post-production house. I thinkbecause they work on very specific things.So the farm is very much unscriptedwith the old scripted thing and thedocumentary but it's mainly unscripted TVthey do a lot of sound work there as wellso if you want to work forthe farm or now picture shop if you want to work
38:18for picture shop on most projects or you want to getinto a bit of post producer or you want to get into soundthen you should really tailor your CV towards thatyou can obviously make a generic one if you want to just goand get some experience but I think if you want to gowork at those post houses you should reallytailor it to their you know to what they're lookingfor because they do look for certain things
38:36because they were working on different showsand different genresyeah and when it comes to interviewdid it meet your expectations for interview or was ityeah the group interview was this classic groupingsyou know everyone on zoom everyone obviously making himtrying to make an impression and also it wasn't the personyeah the group one was over zoom and there was one in person
38:56you know is every group interview over rightif i was trying to you know get their voice heard andmake an impression which you know and that's unfortunateyou can't all you can't be yourself as muchbecause i think you're over zoom and you've got to wait your turn to stickand all this stuff but they're in-person one just be yourself be friendly be bubbly these peoplewere normal people right there where it is they're not gonna you know they're not in a suityou know they're not going to ask you to come in in a suit you know this kind of things you've got
39:23to be just relax chill and yeah friendly and make sure that you can kind of hold a conversation with thembecause of me i think that's what they're there for they want you to be able to you know be bubblybe friendly and keep a conversation going they were you know you want to be able to stand and sayroom as this person more than five minutes. So I think ultimately you've got to just be,just be a genuine good person, you know. Don't try it. Try it or see. But don't overworkyourself to the point where you start to crumble or break down or, yeah, be something you'renot. Because you leave and you'll be like, why did I do this? These people, they're justnormal people. They're just looking for a conversation to have with you. And there was no kind
40:00of deeming pressure on it. So I think you should go into it. And can you introduce a bit the roleof post-production or other?Like what are the activities, responsibilities?You are just there to service any clients that you've got in your building.So at the farm, we had four buildings.I was situated in the Newman building, which is the kind of the flagship.There's six stories.So it's kind of just to service the clients that you've got in those buildings.
40:25So being on call to take requests, keeping everything tidy, clean, restogged,carrying out any orders that they want, you know.You're obviously not there to service the editors or the producers that are there.You're there to service the postman.house, if that makes sense.So if you're working on me, production itself,then you're there to service the crew or, you know,the production, but we're here to service under the client service team
40:48and to make sure that the building is operating as should be, you know.So you need to represent the company.You're representing the company, yeah, yeah.But of course, yeah, it involves, obviously, going and speaking to headsersand, you know, taking lunch orders, asking what they want and keep making sure they're happybecause if they're happy, then the business is happy.So, yeah, that's the mind.And where is the office in London out of curiosity?
41:11So it's down Newman Street, so just off Top of Quote Road.So like literally central Oxford Street?Yeah, where the new Elizabeth line has been built, the road opposite that.Sounds like a bit blue jacket.Yeah, they got a few.So they got that one there, Newman Street.Then I got moved to Uncle, which is down the Bonio Street, which is, again, justOxford Street, but the other side, that makes sense.
41:34in that building actuallyit was called the Fast Buildingbecause they would work onfast turnaround showsso things that needs to be editedin 24 hoursthey would come in really quicklyand do that
41:46but yeah Michael McIntyrecame down againOh was itIt's quite coolMichael McIntyreI don't knowHe's quiteHe's done a few things on Lively Apollo
41:56and he's got a couple of new shows outWhy was he there?He got a yeahHe's got a production companyHe owns a production companyI believe soHe had a few shows in the mixand he was just coming and he'd over see him now and again
42:07come get some lunch so yeah just got certain things with himso he saw him now and again that's all right that's cooland you said or like what is as you said beforeif you start as a runner like this the career progression doesn't lead to editorsee if you want to be an offline you know story editornot as much it'd be very very hard you can it's not impossiblejust it's very very hard it's more situated a thing forif you want to be an online at self-colorist
42:33post producer or you know audio re-recorded mixer you know if you want to be in the sounddepartment then that is great for you you know yeah and since that's not what you wanted you decidedto live by yourself pretty much yeah when the opportunity came in i thought this is a great opportunityto now work on a project in the area that i want to go and see and then start getting creditsbecause again if you work in a post even if you're you know an edit assistant in a post house you're notgetting credits you know you're not working directly on the project so it's hard to build up thatportfolio. So yeah, now I've got the opportunity to work, you know, self-employed. So now we areself-employed. Yeah, now I'll be self-employed. So I'm on this job until October when my contract
43:12runs out then, but I'll have to look for the next thing. Hopefully that's across that bridge when it comesto it. But yeah, you know, so I'll get credit after the end of this, which is good. And I hope youcan use that to get the next one. So then are putting to stay freelance and get next job? Ordo you want to get employed for the company and editor somewhere else?Yeah, I think I'd rather stay moving from project to project.I'm really happy.I'm really enjoying being an assistant answer at the moment.And I'd like to do that for a little bit longer and maybe start assembling some things later on down the line.
43:44But yeah, kind of would like to really crack this assistant role and get a lot of technical skills under my belt before I make the jump.But that is also the idea and goal.But yeah, I think I'm project-to-project-based.It suits me a lot better, I think.And when did you start on this project?started mid-Novemberoh so it's like a yearyeah it's quite unheard of to be fair
44:06yeah especially as a second assistantthe first assistant I'm working withhe'll be on it until a bit longerbut yeah it's quite a long timewhich is really really luckymy contract was only until Aprilwhen they sent to filmingbut they decided to extend me
44:19which has been great so it's been a goodyou have to worry about funand the next thing you knowyeah yeah I agreewell at before openingany other topicI would finish for todayand agree to do part two sometime in the future if we are up for it.
44:35Yeah, you'll be never a year that you know where I'm at.No, I mean, because we didn't really discuss your current joband more about the editing.And I also wanted to ask you,because I know that you do some drone filming and stuff like that,so I was curious about it as well.Okay, fair.I would finish some time, I don't know when,
44:57but we can agree on a part two in the future.if you are up for it.Yeah, sounds good.Sounds good.Look forward to it.Okay, so let's finish it for today.We'll do second part in the future.So thank you and good luck in the meantime.
45:14Cheers, Thomas.Appreciate it, mate.Take care.Thank you for listening to Produced Bye.Subscribe to our podcast and your favorite podcast at,leave a review or send us your feedback.For more information about the host,links from the episode and ways to connect with us,
45:30visit the show notes.If you know someone who would be an ideal guest for our podcast, please get in touch.Thank you and see you soon.
There aren't comments yet for this episode. Click any sentence in the transcript to leave one.