Produced By - Being Real Online: Why Authenticity Builds Opportunity | 143: Victoria Michaels

Starting point is 00:00:00 I know probably many people that are listening are building their own businesses. And I think that there can become times where you're just like, am I doing the right thing? Or is this going to work or I'm putting in so much work. And my thing is just to stick with it. Like consistently stay in your lane. Do what your true, true gift is, your true skill, what no one else can do but you. Use that with your personality and who you are and just stay in that lane.

Starting point is 00:00:25 Like it will eventually work out. The only way it won't work out is if you quit. And that's something that I think we have to keep our minds on is like, I have to harness my mind for success. And it's not going to come tomorrow. And it's going to be hard and it's going to grow me in ways I've never grown before. But hello, this is business. Welcome to it. And just keep going.

Starting point is 00:00:45 And one day you will be the person that you've admired throughout your journey. So I just want to really cheer people on because I know that it's hard out there. But I absolutely believe that anyone can be successful online just as long as they put in the work and they stay long enough. Before we dive into today's episode, please hit that subscribe button. Your support helps us grow and inspire more people on their journeys. Thank you. Hello, Victoria. Thank you for joining us today and welcome to the show.

Starting point is 00:01:16 Thank you so much for having me. We were just talking about enunciating your name. So, Tomas, which I'm going to get butcher the whole time. Sorry in advance. No, it's a good one, Vicki. I like it that way. I'm sorry. So, Victoria, if there are people who don't know you, can you please introduce yourself?

Starting point is 00:01:36 Yes, so let's see. So I am a copywriter and a ghostwriter. I primarily copyright and ghostwriter on LinkedIn. Most of my content is for founders and CEOs. And I've been in business probably since I was 18. So it's been a great, long, awesome journey. I have a lot of business acumen and I know about the digital marketing landscape, but although it's changed over the years and I've kind of.

Starting point is 00:02:00 narrowed down my niche as LinkedIn. So that's where I've been sitting for the last couple of years is on LinkedIn. I was actually hoping that you would include your cool tagline that you've got on LinkedIn. When I saw it, it made me a lot, and I think it stands out. Yeah, so it's LinkedIn's most expensive ghost ride. It's a good one. Well, and I wanted to change it, but people are like, no, don't change it. Like, we love it, we love it, we love it.

Starting point is 00:02:27 So I've just kept it. Like at first it was a joke, but people have actually, it's actually attracted a lot of attention, which I think, you know, in the social media landscape, it's kind of good because the more eyeballs, the more potential there's a client there. So I think that's always to anyone that I think that's thinking about like, oh, should I rebrand or should I do this? And is this too much? The answer will always be no. It is not too much.

Starting point is 00:02:53 The more that we can go outside the box of what normal people are doing, the better it goes for us. So definitely a testament to that. I agree. And I think it's also smart because if someone reaches out to you, then they cannot complain about the prices. Yeah. Because they must expect it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've had some people be like, I can't afford you before they even know what the prices. I'm like, okay, so that might be a reason to think about it. But then I've had other people, I've just been like, this is just kind of what I am. They're expecting like an astronomical number. And it was it? And they're like, oh, okay, cool. So I think the idea. The idea of, to get someone in the door and then we can discuss like budget and pricing later.

Starting point is 00:03:32 Of course. And also I think what's important is that on LinkedIn, you've got obviously a lot of competition, a lot of people who focus on ghostwriting and this type of content and services. So you see many people with tagline like LinkedIn Ghostwriter and stuff like this. So it's really important to stand out somehow. And if you've got a tagline like this, it just makes it unique, stand out and memorable.

Starting point is 00:03:54 So it's definitely a great idea. Absolutely. Yeah. It's been fun. It's been fun. So I think I'm going to keep it for a little while until, you know, I think of something better. Yeah. And Victoria, before we discuss more what you do and your area of expertise and LinkedIn,

Starting point is 00:04:12 can you tell us more about your background, such as where you come from and what is it like for you where you're from? I'll give you the pageant answer. One day, one day I'll write a book and share all the interesting things. But I'll probably give you some, some, a little bit of insight. So I'm from the United States. I grew up in a very rural town. So I didn't grow up with a lot. I grew up a little bit of poverty.

Starting point is 00:04:37 And I decided that I wanted to escape that. So I really put on my hat of like, how do I get out of the situation and become better than what would have been expected of me? Because that wasn't much. I have a lot of just like images of thinking about when I'm, I was a kid like, okay, what do I want to be like? And seeing that image and I've walked through life trying to meet that expectation that I had set so long ago. But yes, basically in my goal to escape poverty and, you know, just life, I basically had

Starting point is 00:05:11 utilized my skills that I had taught myself a long time ago about like how to build a website, how to design graphics. I was a naturally pretty good writer, did really well in school for writing. And so when I was 18, I figured like, oh my gosh, like maybe I can start a business. And so basically I went through the process of I created a list of like niche women entrepreneurs. And I literally started sending cold DMs when I was 18 years old. Like literally just graduated high school had no, oh my God, like no experience, zero experience, selling, marketing, zero. But all I knew is, okay, well, I taught myself these skills and maybe someone would find it valuable because their website sucks and their graphics sucks.

Starting point is 00:05:51 Maybe I can help them. And I started to get clients. I started to get like a really, really big client. And then she just started referring people. And then over the years, I just continued to scale the business. I eventually hired contractors. I bought my competitor. And eventually I got to.

Starting point is 00:06:08 Oh, really? Bought your competitor. Yes. Oh, wow. That's a good. I wasn't expecting that. Yeah, yeah. It's an interesting.

Starting point is 00:06:18 I don't even remember how old I was maybe like 22, but I just remember like going to the bank and just being like, you know, that's got this big type. tag for a competitor and just being like so dumb had no idea what I was doing like this all was just I had no no idea what I was doing but I bought out my competitor and I've eventually scaled it to where I was like working part time like we were managing like a hundred client accounts at one point so it was it was a great it was a great journey and then by the time I was 30 I sold it and was like I'm going to go starting to do something else because I got burnt out from being in front of the computer my entire 20s I don't think a lot of people talk about like how important it is to like leave your home because a lot of people are like, oh my God, I'm going to be a digital no matter. Oh my God, I don't have to work outside my home. But there's a lot of social skills that I felt like I missed out on like being chronically online in my 20s.

Starting point is 00:07:12 You forget there is life outside as well. Yeah. I can later on I can talk a little bit about how I got to LinkedIn. But that's my star. That's how I kind of got like the entrepreneur life going. Yeah. Yeah. And you said before that when you're starting out, you are sending DMs or pitches or pitching people. But back then, I assume it wasn't LinkedIn yet. So how did you do it? Was it over email or?

Starting point is 00:07:37 Yeah. So I basically had a website to where it was kind of like a directory. And so I was able to send like a private message. So I, you know, it's what it wasn't LinkedIn, but it was like some like really, really random like place where all these emails was kind of almost like a community where they were. And so I could just send out private messages. I didn't utilize email at the time. Maybe eventually I did, but it was just all private messages. And it was just interesting. Like I think I don't even remember what the pitch was. It was just more of like, hey, I do this.

Starting point is 00:08:07 This is the price. Here's my website. Are you interested? And like a sales guru would be like, oh my God, that will never work. I don't know. Like I've got the code at 18 that no one's talking about. But I don't know. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:08:21 And I assume it was also different, obviously, period of time before when you weren't getting pitches like from every second DM so it was much different time than these days yeah yeah it was it was an interesting period it was definitely interesting and sometimes i like say to myself i wish i was i had that like dumb young and stupid like vibe and i could carry it out throughout life because i think as you progress through life then you start to be like ooh yeah yeah i feel cringe about sending this DM to this you know founder of like this million dollar company. But back then, I don't think I would have cared.

Starting point is 00:08:55 I would have just been like, who cares? It's an interesting dynamic, yeah. But I think it's kind of funny or natural if you like cringe of the stuff that you used to send before or used to do because it shows the progress and the evolution that you just improved and it's different. I can see it like with my stuff or content or messages that I used to send before as well. Yeah, I know. I know.

Starting point is 00:09:16 It would be interesting. I wish like the internet would give us like a scroll. back of like all of our crap that we did and you know how they do like those viral like year and reviews like we need to do that life and be like this is how creation was back then and we are and you said before that your background that you came from a village or from poverty so what was then like the reaction of your family when they saw such success and such mindset that you grew your company and achieved everything yeah you know i'd like to give you that that answer i think it was more of when you grow up in poverty and then it's not sometimes always the best situation. So I actually

Starting point is 00:09:58 left home at a pretty young age and was kind of out on my own doing it solo. I think eventually like when when like I reestablished connection with my family, I think that they were just like blown away because they couldn't understand it. And we come from a world where things happen to people and we don't always have the best opportunities. But I think even just the way I talk, the way I carried myself, it was hard for them to even understand because it was just so different from where I came from. And I still carry the native accent from, you know, where I grew up. Sometimes when I get on calls, people will point that out. I'm like, I tried to erase all of it, but that stays. I'm like, cool. Thanks for pointing that out.

Starting point is 00:10:44 Can you try that accent? I assume that I wouldn't really recognize it since I'm not native, so I don't know as much, but maybe it will be funny, and I would be curious to hear. Well, what I'm speaking now, like, typically is the way that I typically speak, but I think if you compare my accent to another American, they're like, oh, Lord, or especially people in the UK love to be like, where are you from? And I'm like, I'm from the United States. I grew up in a small town. Like, this is how I sound.

Starting point is 00:11:13 It'll be okay. We'll get through this conversation. So I always love that. pointed out, but then it's, you know, it's just, I'm just part of an American, but, you know, so many people have accents, so many people come from different backgrounds. And I laugh it out a lot, but then I think sometimes, like, you know, if I was in a different country, like, how would that feel? And I always am like, you know what? Because we have to be careful of the things we say. But I think that's something that makes people unique, that everyone speaks differently. And

Starting point is 00:11:43 everyone obviously has different background, comes from different places. So I think it's nice that not everyone is the same. Yeah, I love that. I love that. And then also I'd be curious, what was like your motivation or kind of your drive? Because obviously coming from such a different background, what was that that kept pushing you to continue? Because obviously it wasn't easy at start, especially if you didn't have support. Yeah, I think, you know, it was interesting because, like, I did well in school, but I didn't have the person that was like, how's your homework? or what are your grades or you have a project coming up. Do you need help? So a lot of it. And I think this is why I've always been an entrepreneur is because everything's just so self-led. So I've kind of like

Starting point is 00:12:29 self-regulated myself throughout life. But it wasn't until I became a teenager that I had met a woman that was very successful in life. And she basically started helping me with my schooling and started to kind of breathe into me that there was actually a value, that there was talent, that that I could become something in life. And a lot of times when you grow up in poverty and you're not doing well in the school, you're kind of looked at like kind of like a push away kid, like, oh, they're just bad or they don't pay attention or they talk too much. And you're not like celebrated for who you are. But once I started to realize like, oh my gosh, like I have skills, all the things, then that started to help carry me forward. And I just saw the, the,

Starting point is 00:13:12 a different dynamic between like how this person was living and how my my family of origin was living. And I was just like, I can't be like this. I can't grow up and become this. And so I just is literally just literally climbing out of it and just being like we're going to find a way. We're going to make a way and we're going to, you know, become something. I'm still working on the something, but we're getting there. But it's something like early mentor, right? Someone who was mentoring. Yeah, it was an early mentor. I think I met her when I was like 13, 14 and she's actually stayed with me throughout my entire life like she's just always just been like It's really nice.

Starting point is 00:13:49 Great person. Yeah. And it's and it really just kind of highlights the power of that one person that believes in you and like the difference that they can make. It's a really nice message because you never know if you can be such a person for someone else as well. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Especially these days like with social media or LinkedIn, you never know who's maybe following you in a background and following your journey. learning from you and you may be impacting them in a similar way so it's really nice to hear yeah that's it that's a huge goal eventually like i want to like do a little bit of like some motivational speaking and just try to inspire like youth and just younger girls that are you know going through similar definitely

Starting point is 00:14:28 break out of your life no i'm sure there are already people like in a background following and learning from you maybe just no one said that but i'm pretty sure that there are such people already Well, that's con. Thank you. And if you then look at your career, you said like in your, I don't know, if around you were 30 or after your 20s, you realized that you went through some kind of burnout and didn't want to continue in that career. Was there like one moment that led you to such a realization or was it like a continued process or what made you to realize that you want to change? Yeah, you know, it was funny. I just remember I would always like go to my computer and open my computer and do the same thing. day after day and just like I hate my life and just be like and I felt like oh my gosh I'm always in front of a computer I'm missing out on life I'm not living and again it's something that we

Starting point is 00:15:22 really don't talk about when you're someone that your entire business is based online I just was just I just felt miserable at a point that I was just like I just literally cannot do this anymore and I kind of felt like there was there was something else. I was supposed to be doing. And I think I needed, and I sold my business because I wanted to try to explore and figure out like where I was supposed to be in this world and in this life. And people are like, well, if you hadn't such successful business, why did you sell it? And I was like, because I was miserable.

Starting point is 00:15:55 I was miserable and I spent my 20s online. It's not fun. I'm sorry to hear of course, but I was just going to say that people don't see like the whole picture and because they see that you are successful, you make money. and maybe work from home. They think that you've made it, you know, you are happy and everything, but they don't see what's actually the picture behind it. That, as I always try to say, you don't see the whole picture and you don't know what's

Starting point is 00:16:20 actually going on. So I think, although I'm sorry to hear that, that's like example of that people don't really know what's going on. Yeah, no. And it's good. I'll share, if you don't mind, I can share how I got to LinkedIn. Yes, please, of course. Yeah, so it was, I kind of decided that I wanted to do different.

Starting point is 00:16:38 career and I had my focus on being a midwife. I know this is so crazy. How do you go from this to that? So I actually started the process of going to midwifery school. I was attending birth. I was facilitating like the whole birth process with a midwife. I wasn't doing the delivery, but I was there for it. So we, I spent, I spent about a good year of my life doing that. And I think that's probably if I look back, that's been my favorite thing I've done. But the only, the only thing was is I didn't have much of a life. Like I remember one time being on a date with a dude and I get a message that the mom was delivering and I was like, I have to go. And the dude spoke about I was like leaving.

Starting point is 00:17:18 This is a real thing. And during that time, I went through EMT school. So I was on an EMT truck and I couldn't drive the ambulance and it was terrible. And they called me Barbie EMT. And so that was. Oh, yeah. So it was a lot of like, you know, figuring out like what I wanted to do. But the thing was is that I had spent so long.

Starting point is 00:17:38 business that my brain would always go to the business aspect of things. And so eventually, like, I had decided, like, you know, what I need to figure out, like, something a little bit more back to my roots of, like, you know, digital marketing, etc. And then that's when I actually started my LinkedIn profile. And yeah, so that's kind of like I sold a business, tried a bunch of careers, a lot of weird careers. And then I eventually was like, we're getting on LinkedIn. And now we're going to now we're going to figure out what's next.

Starting point is 00:18:06 So that was, yeah, it's been an interesting job. journey. But also, why was it to LinkedIn specifically because it could be any, any platform? So was it because of like a work-related platform? What was reason for LinkedIn? Yeah. So my friend, I think it was around, I think it was like around COVID or right before COVID. She's like, you need to get on LinkedIn. She's like, maybe this is really bad. She tells me, she was, maybe you'll find a friend. Maybe you'll find a boyfriend. That was, we, we stayed away from number two. but number three was like maybe you'll find like a new opportunity like maybe you'll find something that you really want to do and so that was like I literally got it on there and started you know building my

Starting point is 00:18:46 account so I chose LinkedIn for that reason and then I think because like my background was really strange like you were an entrepreneur for like 12 years and then you did like this weird medical stuff like and you don't have a degree and you sound like this want to deal with you um so I couldn't I'd actually I was using LinkedIn to apply it to jobs and like I couldn't get a job. And then I part of my journey was hiring a career coach to figure out like how do I like mesh this really crazy background and how do I basically find a, find a role that would be really, really cool. And so like he taught me about like personal branding, building out your LinkedIn. And then I, because of my entrepreneurial background, I started making lists like I did in the past of like companies that I wanted to work for and I started

Starting point is 00:19:33 cold DMing them. And one company was like, yeah, we'll hire you. Like, we're super interested in what you could do. So basically I was like a clinical consultant, which was really, really cool. And that, that started my process. But during that time of like finding a job, I started like posting on LinkedIn and had a lot of good like response, started getting viral content out. And so then I was like, okay, I'm going to start really, really digging into this platform because there's something there. And then long story short, a career coach eventually invited me to become a partner. company and then I started teaching professionals how to utilize LinkedIn, how to build out their profiles, how to get hired, and then eventually I transitioned back to working for myself.

Starting point is 00:20:14 So it's been a crazy, it's been a crazy journey about, I would say all in all, like about three years of like actually like coaching and doing the LinkedIn game. I always like to like a remind or ask how long you've been there because I think that people always want quick results and think that it's. that happens, I don't know, in a few weeks or overnight. So I think it's good always and important to remind how long it takes to give some kind of perspective and show that it doesn't happen just like that. Yeah, it's, yeah, it's a process.

Starting point is 00:20:47 Yeah, and I think the thing that makes me the sickest of all is people always like, I want to go viral or why is my post being ticked up? I'm like, there's a whole like a million factors behind that. Like, literally if you're there on LinkedIn just to go viral, like you're going to be very sad. You're going to live very sad. If you're there, if you're there to build that leadership, cool. If you're there to get clients, cool, we can show you how to do that. But if you're just there to build viral posts, no.

Starting point is 00:21:14 Go to TikTok. I agree. And good luck on TikTok as well. Yeah. In Gantz, you can do it. But as you said, that you joined LinkedIn, and you got someone like to help you considering your experience, how to position yourself and kind of start,

Starting point is 00:21:34 based on this experience, it's also obviously experience of throughout your career and helping others. What will be then your advice for people who join the platform and maybe they don't know how to position themselves? For example, you hear this advice if you shoot niche or not. So maybe any advice from you, how to start? Yeah, I think the first is figuring out what your goal is.

Starting point is 00:21:56 So again, like if you're there, like let's say you're happily employed and you just want like a presence. get on LinkedIn and just start build out your account to show like what you're doing, the metrics, like the value brought to your position. And maybe every so often, once a month, every few weeks, just post something. Just so you have a digital footprint, that's a professional digital footprint. I think that's super, super valuable because you never know when that position is going to be eliminated. Or you never know in five years or so if you're like, I want a pay raise, I want a promotion.

Starting point is 00:22:30 or I don't like this job, I'm going to go somewhere else. If you're starting from complete scratch, that's going to suck. And that's going to take it a lot longer to get to where you need to go. So that's for that. Again, like if you're someone that's in the market, I think it's really, really important to get your profile up to speed, let your employer know everything that you've done. You're optimizing that profile for the role that you want, not the role that you have.

Starting point is 00:22:55 That's really, really specific if you're a job seeker, you would build out your profile with specific keywords, so recruiters can find you. It's basically like advertising yourself for the job that you want. And then if you're someone that is there to make money online, that is like the way so many people I feel like are going to LinkedIn. A lot of that I feel like is number one figuring out, like who you are, what you're here to do and who you're here to serve.

Starting point is 00:23:22 That's number one. You have to get that right. And don't pick you think you should pick. Like what, you know, I should only do. do this, like you really, really want to figure out, like, what makes the most sense and also where there's opportunity, like profit opportunity, because if you're selling to someone that can't buy, what's, you know, what's the point? Unless it's a nonprofit or something, you'd do good work, that's great. But if you want to make money online, you have to make sure it's the right audience.

Starting point is 00:23:49 There's a whole, like, perspective about whether or not you niche down. I do feel like if you can niche down, in my opinion, it's better because you become one to one versus one to many. I think it's better to be very, very specialized than to be generalized. Even in the job market, if you can be a specialist of something, you get hired more than a generalist. Generals are harder to kind of like say like, this is my value. So I recommend that. And all of it is got the banner. You've got the optimized headline. You've got the about and you've got your experience section. But there's like if you're doing it for business, it's a whole different strategy. Yeah. And there are, I feel like there are these days so many.

Starting point is 00:24:30 talented and great people that you can either follow and letter from them. If you are nice, you can even text them for advice and so many people that you can even ask for help to help with the profile. Exactly. Yeah, I feel like, I almost feel like nowadays, like there's almost like no excuse not to have one. It's like it's so, so important just to have, just to have it up there. So I've been really just challenging people to get online and get your presence known. And it's always interesting when you see the statistics of how many people are using the platform and then actually how many people are posting consistently on LinkedIn because compared to other platforms it's still such a, or at least from what I remember, such a small number, so such

Starting point is 00:25:14 untapped potential. And it's never late to start. Yeah, I agree. I agree. Yeah. I think it's great. And even like, even for people that are like really, really high up, like really, really high CEOs and founders. Like, they always have, like, the gray banner, like, on top. Like, they don't have anything come on. I'm just like, it would be really cool if you could share what you're doing in your career. Like, it would be really neat. Like, I mean, there's still so many opportunities, like a book dealer, a brand dealer, you know, inviting this. It's somewhere that they never thought that they would be, but I still just think everyone benefits from the profile. So, that's not. I think so. And I guess sooner or later, they realize.

Starting point is 00:25:57 One thing I didn't expect when I switched to Riverside was how impressed my guests would be. I just send them the link, they join me in the virtual studio, and we're ready to go. No tech issues, no awkward setup, just smooth. It makes the whole experience feel more professional, not just for me, but for them too. I can stay focused on the actual conversation instead of fixing problems or explaining how things work. If you want your podcast to feel like a real production without a stress, check out Riverside. The link is in the description. And Victoria, from your experience, I think it's also quite important, like a topic as something that people struggle with.

Starting point is 00:26:40 What would be your advice how to find your first clients? Man, okay, so we talked about figuring out who you actually want to work with. I think the first thing is obviously you've got a know down like the service that you're offering. and then your offer. So you've got to get that like super, super like knelt down. So it just makes sense. Like you really, really need to spend time to think about it.

Starting point is 00:27:02 Not time where you overanalyze it because a lot of people do that and they stay stuck and that they don't know. We're out there. Just put it out there. The best way to know if your offer is going to be picked up that's going to be sold is you put it in front of people. And if they like it, they'll jump on it. But for me, and what I would recommend is basically two different things.

Starting point is 00:27:22 This is number one, your content. So I would recommend, like, getting very, very heavy on the problems that your ICP, your ideal client profile, customer, etc., is dealing with because you want them to go to your content. You want them to, like, be able to see and feel themselves within, like, this message that you have. This is not my strategy, but I'm going to drop it is Yasmin talks about, even though we are going niche in our content with your hook and your re-hook on your LinkedIn post to

Starting point is 00:27:51 go very broad with that. So we're not niche down those first two lines, but then after that, niche down, just so when you are posting your very, very niche content, you basically won't eliminate like the rest of your, you know, followers. You want to kind of at least get their attention on it and then niche down. So I think that that's important. And then the second thing is, it's the DM strategy. People talk about like go and comment on their stuff and then go send the DM. Great. Some people aren't posting. Then you're going to need to say, that initial DM. For me, people that are very busy, I feel like sometimes it's best to just get the DM out in a perfect world. We can spend time like warming up our audience, but it doesn't

Starting point is 00:28:32 always work out like that. So I always know that the warm people for you to get your offer in front of are those profile viewers because you're posting great content, your followers, your commenters, those are all like the warm people. And I can guarantee to people that if they've been building content for a while and they've got a strong offer, if they spend, I would say 30 days going out and every day like messaging the profile views followers the commenters, they'll be able to get a client. Like I've seen it on repeat in many, many different industries. Like you can get a client. And then the other part of it is what I call like prospecting, which is actually adding like a lot of not a lot, but cool people to your to your network.

Starting point is 00:29:12 None of that is a pitch first. It's just more of like connecting with them, starting a conversation. Eventually you can maybe move into a business. This is. the only one that I don't, would never like pitch to automatically. It's just, it's just too, much for them. I feel the same and I think sometimes people forget that, for example, when they pitch you, you get similar pitch from many other people. And I know that not everyone is the same, but sometimes it's just annoying if like so many people send it to all the time, then you are wasting time with messages just to get a pitch after. So I would say, I feel like sometimes people don't use common sense or I don't know how to say it, but sometimes it's just annoying, not going to

Starting point is 00:29:55 lie. Yeah, I think when we lead with like money in mind, I feel like it really screws up our potential and our opportunity. A lot of people are on LinkedIn to make money and that's great. But you've got to build up some type of relationship, some type of things. So you can, you can almost ask for the opportunity to say, hey, this is what I do and this is this is how we work together. I think a lot of the time, too, is you have to treat a lot of this like a networking event too, You know, you're not, you know, I come up to me a networking event and just be like, hey, this is what I do. Here's my car. Like, call me tomorrow.

Starting point is 00:30:25 Let's set up a meeting. It's super, super cringe. So we have to come up the same thing. And the more mature, the, like, the more mature the follower, the more mature the audience, you have to even more walk slower because they're like, no, no, no, no. Because they've been doing business like, OG from like day one. And they're just like, you're just like, completely threw you out. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:30:47 I agree. And I can see myself that it really. makes a difference if there is someone who's, for example, been showing up in my content, in my post, and it feels like there is some kind of relationship with me. And, you know, like engagement so that I know the person compared to someone who just shows up in your DMs and tries to pitch you something or say, oh, I've been following engineer content, but I'm sorry, I've never seen you. I don't even know who you are. So it really makes a difference if someone shows some kind of effort in advance. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. It's a game changer. I've

Starting point is 00:31:19 believe. I think so too. And Victoria, we kind of discussed it before, like the virality and this thing. I don't want to ask you that question, but still, I get, I'm sure you do two, like, DMs once in a while, how to grow. So what would be your advice related, like, to the content or to LinkedIn if people want to grow faster their brand? Again, I don't want to say how to go viral. I don't like to say that, but I'm shed it, you know, what I mean. Yeah. I think, I think a lot of it has to do like, you know, I think moving our brain away from viral, like I said, like move it less from viral and more about like building the audience that will come for your content. A lot of the, the creators, the big people that we see, like they spent hours upon hours actually building their

Starting point is 00:32:06 audience. And so, but when they continued to do that and then started posting and continued to post, like they built that community. So the community came for their stuff. It wasn't always that they just had great content that went viral. They literally spent hours engaging and building up that network. So I think that that's really important is to go out and establish that audience that will see value in your content and want to come forward. And that's like the easiest, easiest way to grow is establishing relationships. So some of that is engaging on their content and just continuing to engage, maybe send a DM and just learn a little bit about them because next time your content comes on their feed, they're going to start supporting it.

Starting point is 00:32:46 I do think that there are ways that you can go viral as if you're looking at, okay, you know, what industry am I in and who are like the top players? Again, if it's the top players, you have to be careful because they may have spent, you know, years building up that audience. Some, let's be honest, you have engagement pods going on. So you look like 5,000 creators underneath their thoughts. Yeah. And all the comments, that sound pretty much the same and don't.

Starting point is 00:33:15 anything available. But you can, but you can start to find out like, okay, like this person's been posting about this and I'm seeing a trend. Like if you post about this, like it gets a lot of engagements. You can kind of hack the system with that to see like, okay, these are these are good posts. They do really well. What's my take on it? And kind of recreate that with your own, you know, wording, all things.

Starting point is 00:33:38 Don't copy. That would be the way. But I think it takes a while to build up the audience. but building up the audience and posting really, really specific pain-driven content will be very, very helpful. And then a lot of times people like to see, like, the thought leadership. So, like, not even like the thought leadership, but more of, like, who you are behind the scenes, what you're doing, like, what's your life?

Starting point is 00:33:59 Like, that resonates with people. You move beyond, like, being like a Google, you know, like, you know, here are my five ways of doing X, Y, and Z and becoming a human and a person that people want to work with. So I look at LinkedIn as a slow drip process. I really do. And then will be people that will be like, I've like mine 500 viral posts. And if you post this, you'll go viral. I mean, fine.

Starting point is 00:34:22 But I don't know. I'm a little, what's the word? A little annoyed with the term viral these days. I'm like, I'm so over it. I understand. And I think sometimes maybe it will be good if people actually experience to know what is it like to go viral because then they find out that it's not really anything probably to want if you get like audience and engagement but if those people do not really want to follow you it's only because of one post they don't come again they don't come

Starting point is 00:34:52 back so what's the point of it yeah and it's weird too because like people will go viral and then the next post won't go viral and they're like but i went viral okay yeah yeah yeah exactly yeah we just have to be careful social media like you have to really get very, very focused on like, why are we here? What's the goal? What are we doing? And go after that and try not to like look at all things because there's a lot of things if you are on social media that are very distracting and you just got to stay in your lane, stay focused, understand who you are, what you're doing and just, you know, follow that track because it can be very, very challenging to like build a business with all the noise. So I cut that out and just be like, I'm here to get clients.

Starting point is 00:35:39 and that be your goal. It is very true and I think it's always worth reminding, do not compare yourself to others. Yeah, exactly. Good to see it as motivation or inspiration, but, you know, it's similar to what we discussed before that you never see the whole picture so you don't know what is really going on in the background.

Starting point is 00:36:00 Yeah, 100%. 100%. And Victoria, it's similar to what we discussed before when you experience some kind of burnout in your previous career, what is it then that helps you not to prevent it? Because obviously it's not easy to keep showing up regularly. So what is it that helps you? How do you prevent it?

Starting point is 00:36:20 Or how do you make sure to enjoy the process and keep showing up no matter what? Yeah, I mean, I have an interesting personality because I'm like, it's like the energized or bunny. Like I'm like cranked up and I go all day long and then suddenly I just crash out and I'm I'm on the suite. Like, I mean, yesterday I took a dance class for an hour. I did an hour weightlifting class. I sat in a sauna for 30 minutes and then I had like a whole business day.

Starting point is 00:36:46 Like just, it's very crazy. So I'm someone that just goes. And then I fill my life up with just activities and people and places and things just for me. Standing upside down. Yeah. I don't know. Like for me, I just, I get excited about life and things like that. But like I said, I do.

Starting point is 00:37:05 eventually like will crash out and feel like you're very tired. I would say over the years, you know, things, things that will like really help me to just like stay grounded, being outside, being in nature, like water, ocean, those are all great things for me. Like anything that I can be like grounded. I love like yoga practice. I think that that's incredible. I think more slow pace if you're someone that goes like really, really like crazy. I think sometime in your day you have to have like that slow-paced moment. Even if it's like people are against like watching TV or whatever, like that's nonproductive, but stuff like that is about say the S word, but stuff like that is calming.

Starting point is 00:37:43 Like they just takes your brain out of other business. So I think whatever you can do that keeps you invigorated, it keeps you feeling happy, keeps you feeling healthy, do that and incorporate that in your day and don't make your life about business and about doing things for other people. you've got to plug yourself into that, you know, even if it's an hour a day, an hour or daytime. I think that that will help. But you always have to check in with yourself. Like, how's my body?

Starting point is 00:38:11 How's my mind? Am I sick? Like I will be on a journey probably forever based upon my personality of like making sure I don't burn out. Like I just recently discovered like I'm telling you. I was like, I'm not feeling super good. And I was like, well, what have I been doing the past week? And I was like, okay, yeah, I stayed out 2 a.m. Salsa dancing.

Starting point is 00:38:29 that probably. But as you say, it's like an impression that I've got, because as I follow you on Instagram and I see what stuff you do, I actually enjoy it because I think it's great if there is someone positive, is enjoying life and doing like all kinds of adventures. It helps me to remind myself to actually enjoy life as well and, you know, have experiences and everything. So I think it's a good thing. Yeah, I really, I think in October, I'll try I was working with a photographer that had been like we were really, really close in business and he had suddenly passed. And I think like, sorry to your doubt. Yeah, it was just, it was one of those things to where you're, and I think many of us have had people that are close to us that pass.

Starting point is 00:39:14 But I think like that had like shook me to be like, oh my goodness, like your, your every second, every moment is a gift right now on this planet. And it's, it's really has moved me into like, what am I doing here? What's the purpose here? And so it's moved me into. And so it's moved me into. to making sure like I'm living life to the fullest, not sleeping on life. So, and for me, living life to the fullest is doing things. Other people, it's a book. It's quiet time. But I think it's really important because we just never know. Like, yeah. It's very true.

Starting point is 00:39:46 And Victoria, just to be aware of time, I like to ask kind of lighter questions at the end, although we kind of discuss it now, but you kind of said that. But what are some of your hobbies or things that you enjoy doing? your free time if there is anything left from what you said yeah i mean definitely i love dancing i'm supposed to be teaching like zumba classes but i haven't like focused on that so i'm supposed to be doing that i love sauce to dancing i love great food great coffee great conversations meeting new people traveling i've been to bosnia like a couple of times like i love that those are the things that invigorate me and then i live near the ocean so being around ocean being around water i definitely

Starting point is 00:40:27 like the explorer person. So every day I want something new. I want to explore. I want to, you know, see life. I haven't done as well on like sitting down to read a book or there's other things. I'm like, you should do more of that. But I think right now I'm in the phase of like live life to the fullest. So that's kind of what I've been what I've been after. I have to go ahead. Sorry. I was just going to say that I like it. And I think that's the right mindset to lift to the first. As I said before, it's always good to remind them for myself as well when I hear something like this. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Starting point is 00:40:59 And I think the biggest thing, lesson I've learned, 2025, friendship is like everything. When you're building a business, when you're living life, like that is everything. Like surround yourself with great people. And it makes the journey just so much better. Yep, that is true. And you said you like traveling?

Starting point is 00:41:20 What's your maybe favorite destination or favorite place that you want to visit? So I definitely want to go back to Italy. I want to go back to Sarajevo. When I was in Bosnia the last time, I was at the Istanbul airport. And I was so tired. I didn't actually go get the tour of the city. So I want to go back to Istanbul and actually like see the city. Those are Africa's big on my list. It's time for Africa. Yeah. Sorry. That's on my list too. But yeah, I And then I don't know if you ever see people on Instagram that are just like girls that are literally dropped like in the middle of like the craziest places.

Starting point is 00:42:01 I want that to be me. Like I want to be like in a place that's just so crazy and just so wild. And they're just like, wow. How is she surviving? Yeah. My friend from Italy says I'm like Simba. It's like the little like lion cubs. Every time.

Starting point is 00:42:14 go place she's like don't talk to anyone here's how you get on the train here's how you pay for your ticket yeah but i think this is what makes the best memories in the end isn't it yeah yeah absolutely it's more enjoyable and memorable so i i hope that you know that you do it and we'll see it on instagram or even on lincoln because it's fun i have so too yeah i will i will we'll get we'll get there and you said that before and it's like one of the questions that I like to ask. So I assume I may know the answer, but when it comes to the books, if you read any before or remember, have you got any recommendations? I have to go through my list. I know it's very cliche, but I am a big fan of Formosie's books.

Starting point is 00:43:01 Like, love them or hate him, whatever. Like, the man's been very successful. And I do genuinely feel like in his books he is trying to, like, help people be successful in business. So I have, I have been following a lot of his books. Like, I love, I love his books. Those have been my more recent ones. Like, I do a lot of, like, Brene Brown. Like, I like, I like reading her stuff. The Bat, excuse my language, but the badass series were really my favorite, like, a couple of years back.

Starting point is 00:43:28 I loved reading those. You know, these days I'm more podcasts and I'm more short snippets of stuff. Oh, but I forgot. My most favorite book is the two books by David Goggins. So I think that was probably my two, like, most recent, like, yeah. So it can't hurt me and the second one, right? Oh, okay, okay. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:43:51 Oh, my God, Guggins is a good one. It's always a good motivational videos and motivational shorts. Yeah, I ran, 20204, I ran a marathon by myself because of Gagons. Like, just listening to stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm like, I'm like a Gagons fan. Like any day that I feel like a wamp on like what would.

Starting point is 00:44:12 Gagins do and I pop out of him. Let's go. I always imagine his voice screaming. I don't want to be, don't want to use any swear words, but you can imagine what it would be like. I listen to those words a lot, you know. Sometimes we need that like, you remember like when you were a kid and you didn't want to jump into the pool. You need that, you need like your pair or someone to like push you into the deep end and you can't swim. Like that's Gagans. Like we all need him. Yeah. Yeah. And you mentioned marathon. What was it like then? Obviously it's a big thing.

Starting point is 00:44:47 So what was the experience like? I was stupid. I remember, I'm going to tell you, I'm going to tell you really quick. I remember that I was supposed to run 10 miles. And I'm not computing that into kilometers. So I'm sorry. But I was supposed to run a long distance. And I was like, okay, this is going to suck.

Starting point is 00:45:06 I have to run this. And then by the time I ran that, I was like, if I just run a little bit more, that's half of a marathon. I was like, well, I could do that. So then I did that. And then my dumb self was like, well, if I could do that, then if I do it again, just run back, then that would be full marathon. Probably within like two miles of that decision, I was like freaking out. My brain was like firing on all cylinders. And we had just had really bad flooding.

Starting point is 00:45:33 And in the area I was at the time when it floods, alligators come out. So I was running in the dark. Oh, my God. I cannot imagine what it's like It was crazy I had like the worst like blister on my foot Like just nasty But I finished the last like two hours of it

Starting point is 00:45:51 Like I literally ran like a quarter mile Between one person's house and the other person's house And they came outside and were like Are you okay? I'm like yeah I'm trying to finish a marathon Because I was so I learned about the alligators And yeah This is my life

Starting point is 00:46:08 I think of things to do and then I get myself into situations and then I have to figure out how to get out. But when I finished the marathon, I felt amazing. I felt like I could do anything. Like, I was just like I'm on top of the world. And that feeling was pretty cool. So I hope to experience that one again. Yeah, that's very cool.

Starting point is 00:46:26 And as I said, I cannot imagine what is like with alligators around and stuff like that. But as I said before, at least it's more memorable and more fun of them. Yeah, it was pretty cool. It was cool. And Victoria, can you please just summarize where people can find you, follow you and promote any of your services? Yes, so I live in Charleston, South Carolina, if you want to come visit my house. Like a weirdo. I'm just kidding.

Starting point is 00:46:54 I'm on LinkedIn. So it's Victoria Michaels, LinkedIn.com slash V strategy. So that's me. I'm on Instagram. If you want to connect with me on LinkedIn, I can show you that. But that's more of my personal account. You just get to see, like, the madness. behind the person. So I tell people like, this is madness. LinkedIn's my professional like

Starting point is 00:47:15 buttoned up like, hi. Hi, it's me. But yeah, that's how you can find me. I love connecting with people. Yeah, I'm big people person. So I'm super, I'm super happy to be here today. It's nice like talking. Cool. I'm the one who's grateful for that because as I said before, I've been enjoying your content on Instagram and LinkedIn, but I like Instagram. It's like kind of less polished and you get to see people's life a bit more. And I just wanted to say that I know you mentioned it a few times throughout this recording that you work with Yasmin. And I know I wanted to ask you like, how did you get there and what is it like to work together? Because obviously, Yasmin is a big name. But I just wanted to say that I wanted to make this recording, this episode

Starting point is 00:47:59 primarily about yourself because I already feel like that we could be talking for much longer, but I like to try to keep this under one hour. So maybe in the few, future, we can continue whether talking more about yourself, your experience with Yasmin or something like that. So I just wanted to say that I haven't forgotten, but I know about it. There is just so much to discuss. Yeah. The only thing I'll say is that about him is that he's a really genuine, really solid dude, like super, super solid. And he's a really hard worker, a good person. So I will say those three things about him. And I'll probably, probably will always say those things. So those are my three things about him.

Starting point is 00:48:37 He's in Dubai. Like, who cares about Yas when they're nice to fly? Like on all this like, you know what, dude? Like, ooh, I just had the best burger in Dubai, like, for over it. Yeah, I saw it on Instagram. Because I saw him posting something with Transformers. I was like, oh my God, it's a favorite movie of my when I was young. I loved it.

Starting point is 00:48:57 I mean, I still love it. But I saw it. I was like, oh, that's so cool. I know. I just wanted to mention that his name was actually mentioned throughout my podcast, like with the people that I've spoken with so many times as well. So, you know, even if you are biased, that it must be true because so many people said that and it's definitely making a great impact.

Starting point is 00:49:15 So I guess I can only agree with that. Yeah. If you ever have a chance and you're close to the Bosnia than I am, join us in Bosnia one time. It would be fun. It would be fun. It's very great. Yeah. Burger together, yeah.

Starting point is 00:49:29 So, Victoria, very last question. Is there anything I should have asked you and did not? Any final piece of message, advice or anything you would like to share with the audience before we finish? You know, I'm not always someone that likes to talk about me. I feel like it's weird. I'm weird. And so I'm like, you want to care about a weird person. But I feel like for the audience, we'll go to them.

Starting point is 00:49:50 I feel like for them, yeah, I want to leave with like a takeaway message. I know probably many people that are listening are building their own businesses. And I think in that, like, there can become times where you're just like, am I doing the right thing? or is this going to work or I'm putting in so much work. And my thing is just to stick with it, like consistently stay in your lane. Do what your true, true gift is, your true skill, what no one else can do but you. Use that with your personality and who you are and just stay in that lane. Like it will eventually work out.

Starting point is 00:50:24 The only way it won't work out is if you quit. And that's something that I think we have to keep our minds on is like, I have to harness my mind for success. and it's not going to come tomorrow and it's going to be hard and it's going to grow me in ways I've never grown before. But hello, this is business, welcome to it. And just keep going. Just keep going. And one day you will be the person that you've admired throughout your journey.

Starting point is 00:50:50 So I just want to really cheer people on because I know that it's hard out there. But I absolutely believe that anyone can be successful online just as long as they put in the work and they stay long enough. I like it. I only agree and I think that's a perfect message to finish with. So Victoria, huge thank you. As I said, been enjoying your content and I'm very happy that we made it. Of course, in the future we can catch up again because there is so much more to discuss. So thank you once again. Keep sharing the great content. Keep being positive because I'm sure that outside of me there are so many other people who enjoy it, to whom you inspire and have fun with you. So thank you and wish you all the best.

Starting point is 00:51:33 Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for listening to Prejudice Buy with comment. Check the show notes for all the links. And don't forget to subscribe, like and share your feedback. Speak soon.

Produced By - Being Real Online: Why Authenticity Builds Opportunity | 143: Victoria Michaels

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