Produced By - VFX to WTF: Unexpected Journey from Visual Effects to Finding Meaning | #47: Alfred Lindahl

Episode Date: March 25, 2024

Part 2: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/produced-by/episodes/Sleepless-Nights--Shiny-Awards-The-VFX-Jugglers-Guide-to-Life--48-Alfred-Lindahl-e2ft80s Sleepless Nights & Shiny Awards: The VFX Juggler's Guide to Life | #48: Alfred Lindahl Alfred Lindahl has spent over 15 years bringing creative solutions to life in the world of 3D, VFX and animation. From his early passion for crafting ideas, he's honed his skills in scripting, storyboarding and editing. Whether working solo, collaborating with teams or leading freelance groups, Alfred enjoys every stage of the production process. His diverse background includes co-founding a production company, contributing to large-scale Hollywood VFX projects and gaining valuable client-side experience as an agency producer. Alfred's journey unfolds in this episode, starting with his early explorations in graphics software and culminating in work on major Hollywood films. He'll recount his entrepreneurial spirit as co-founder of a VFX company and the turning point that led him to freelance. Elevate your online presence with the help of Trailblazed, your (and our) favourite digital marketing agency. ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://trailblazed.digital/⁠⁠⁠⁠ If you enjoy the show, please, consider supporting it on Patreon or by buying a virtual coffee (or chocolate). ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/ProducedByPodcast⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.buymeacoffee.com/producedby⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠ Boost your creative career by joining our new Skillshare course and feel free to let us know how you liked it. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://skl.sh/3Rh7ZtY⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Don’t forget to subscribe to our newsletter to stay up to date, get the latest news and much more. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/build-relation/newsletter-follow?entityUrn=7092551882589528065⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Connect with Alfred: ⁠https://alfredlindahl.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/alfredlindahl/ VFX Talks https://www.vfxtalks.com/ Connect with the host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/tomasloucky/⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/thisistommen/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow the podcast: Links: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://linktr.ee/produced_by⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠ Web: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://produced-by-podcast.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://instagram.com/produced_by_podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠ YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT5LHnM6YCaeVzIr0WatOsw⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/41BiG5YvGIgITz1N14hF2E ⁠⁠⁠ Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/produced-by/id1684669642⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ If you enjoy listening to the podcast, please, leave a review on your podcast app, subscribe and share it with your friends. You can also send us a message and share any feedback, advice and tips for guests. About Produced By: Produced By unveils captivating stories of courageous people who set out to pursue careers in highly competitive fields, despite often challenging circumstances. Enter the spotlight with our guests and get inspired, whether your interests are in the creative industries, personal growth or you simply want to have fun. Listen to individuals who represent a wide range of professional backgrounds, geographic locations and career stages. So come along to follow their adventures and learn from life's experiences as we kick off on this epic journey. Thanks for listening and see you soon! Connect with Tomas:X: https://x.com/TomasLoucky⁠⁠⁠Stan: https://stan.store/TommenLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tomasloucky/⁠⁠Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thisistommen/⁠⁠Unproduced:Newsletter: https://unproduced.substack.comYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@unproducednotesSpotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/033Ddo8ibDlLYoaP7FFLIWMore:Links: https://linktr.ee/produced_by⁠⁠⁠Newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://producednewsletter.substack.com/⁠The Podcast Club: https://www.linkedin.com/groups/25420030/Tools & gear that support the show:Metricool: https://f.mtr.cool/HRJBZKRiverside: https://riverside.sjv.io/vDnDodFavikon: https://www.favikon.com?fpr=tommenRa Optics: https://ra-optics.myshopify.com/discount/TOMMEN?rfsn=8803777.591d19JamX: https://jamx.ai/podcasters-offer?ref_id=e02d48af-ef66-4e76-b804-c2e8d282a8bfSome links are affiliate links, which means I may earn a small commission at no extra cost to you. If you find them useful, using these links helps keep the podcast running. Thank you!  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello and welcome to Produced Buy. Just quickly before we begin, if we enjoy the show, please consider supporting it by joining our Patreon. You can choose from a list of memberships and we'll receive some exciting rewards. Thank you and back to the episode. Hello Alfred, thank you for joining us today and welcome to the show. Thank you very much. I'm happy to be here.

So Alfred, can you please introduce yourself? Yes, I'm... From the start, I'm a 3D artist, technical 3D artist, and I've worked in commercials and worked with VFX for film and TV series and stuff like that. But over the years, I've changed a bit into, like, now I teach a lot and I have a podcast about leadership and development in VFX. So I'm still doing I'm still doing the effects as a like a one-man production studio but I'm also doing

teaching and podcasting and different stuff so now I'm a bit more diversified a bit yeah yeah cool and I live in in Stockholm, Sweden with now I have two kids One is just nine months.

So now it's a struggle to find time for anything. So that's why my podcast haven't been releasing new episodes for a while. I hope that after releasing this, you will get some followers and it will put more pressure to continue with your episodes. Yeah, yeah, I need that. So that would be awesome. So can we start with your background? You said you are from Stockholm. So what was your childhood like?

What was it like growing up in Sweden? Yeah, it was very idyllic. It was a really nice childhood. And if we talk about like coming into my career, it's pretty clear my, because my father was a photographer. And he used to work at Saab, the like aerospace company here. So he was a he was actually flying or going up in airplanes, taking pictures of other airplanes and so that was really cool.

Yeah, it sounds excited. And I had a lot of airplane models and stuff like that. It's the company, is it spelled S-A-A-B? Yes. Oh, wow, yeah. I heard of it. It's a big one. Yeah, and then they made cars and stuff like that.

And, but now they're still doing our like military airplanes and stuff like that. Grippans. And some, yeah, exactly. So that's pretty interesting for a small country like Sweden to have our own fighter jets. Yes, small, but as far as I know, it's a very innovative country with some well-known brands. Yeah. It's very cool. Yeah, and that's also something that ties into my upbringing.

That we had computers pretty early. So I'm 38 at the moment. So when I grew up in the late 80s, 90s, we got computers. And since my dad was a photographer, he got to bring Photoshop home so he could train at home. So I had a proper license of Photoshop from when I was, I don't know, seven or something. So I started to experiment with that. Yeah. So I started to experiment with that.

And then Adobe also released a 3D software called Adobe Dimensions that they were supposed to use at my dad's job to replace logos and stuff on airplanes. So when, okay, we have a prospect in Italy. let's put their logo on this airplane so then they could actually wrap the the three door like the logo on the the curved airplane it's so simple today but back then it was a hard thing to do and is this of course still around no i think it was discontinued a long time ago but i think they've released something with the same name later so i'm not sure yeah what's what's what's what's up with that. But so I so I actually started to to work with 3d when I was, I don't know, nine or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. And then I'm going to say that you are quite lucky to start, uh, you know, building the skills from such young age and know probably what career to go to.

Yeah. Well, well, that's that was the thing because I never thought I could work in in this industry to like work with movies and, VFX in that that way. But I still remember what set me onto this path because one of the first movies I got to see in the cinema was the original Lion King. And as a small kid, that was, of course, really cool. And then I saw some behind the scenes footage

of the Wilder Beast running into the ravine. And that was apparently made in 3D. somehow back then. So I saw a breakdown of this on, I guess, public television because there weren't much YouTube stuff back then. Yeah. And that was so inspiring. So when I'm thinking back, like, that was what set me on to this career path, seeing

that breakdown. Yeah. But then I didn't know, I still didn't think you could work with with this until, like, after high school, I studied like graphic design in high school. And then I've found like an education. Oh, you can actually study to be a 3D animator. I wonder what that is. So.

And then I remember when I interviewed to join that school, I said, yeah, my dream would be to work on like Hollywood movies. But I know that that's probably like 10 years. way. But then it took two years and then on my internship I got to work on like Hollywood movies. So it was pretty quick. Do you remember what was the first film that, you know, big one you worked on and you're like, oh, now it happened. Yeah, the first, the first one was Stardust. So I worked at Ghost in Copenhagen. and they worked really closely with the D-Neg in London.

So we got to go to D-Neg if you guys and use their dynamic systems, like they have their own rigid body system back then because they weren't any good ones in Maya or maybe Houdini, but no one used to Houdini back then. So we got to go to D-Negg for a few weeks and simulate in the end of the sequence, in the end of the film there's this,

the main characters run through this hole and there's a witch who's like exploding all the windows or mirrors or whatever it is. So there are glass shards flying everywhere. So that was the first like big, big thing that I could see in the cinema. Like, oh, I did that. So that was, that was really cool.

That was a great feeling. And did you see your name in their credits? They've been a great achievement if you did. Yeah. I don't remember if I was credited on that one. That's a shame. I think I was. I think I was.

And as you said that you studied animation, was it in Sweden, in Stockholm or somewhere abroad? It was a small town in Sweden in Sweden, called Ekshue. And it was like a two-year. two-year education and they just started up the 3D 3D part of it so so the education actually sucked it was like the teachers didn't know what they were talking about and yeah yeah the curriculum was yeah we're doing like graphics for cell phones and that was really crappy back then some vector

format so we're like but but what it gave me yeah we were for sure, guinea pigs. And, but what it gave, gave me was the time to just focus on what I, what I had been doing on my spare time. And also, I met a lot of great people. So we were like helping each other and pushing each other. And we were actually six, six, us, we moved, moved together in a, in a big apartment. And then we had our own, like, like, a room with just our computers.

and you can wake up like if you went in there any time of the day or night there would be someone awake working so that that was like a great like oh i can't sleep let's go up and see what matthias is doing yeah no but it sounds like a good idea there are you know more people working like this together then once one has an issue the other one can help and you know put the brain together so helps with the work overall. Yeah, and I realize that many times just now I share an office with some other freelancers and a small animation company. And I ask one of my friends for help and that I just explained the problem to him.

And then I figure it out while I talk so he doesn't have to do anything. So it helps just to have someone to talk to even if they don't know what you're doing. Yeah. So yeah. And then once you finished your studies, how did you then start looking for a job or how was the industry in general back then? Yeah, we were in the education. We had like internship periods. So we were supposed to go out for 10 weeks and then come back for 10 weeks and for like a last course and then go out again for 10 weeks more on an internship.

So we applied. Because we were the first class, we didn't have anyone to show us how to do it. And like what's the expectations we didn't have any. So I applied to a small company here in Stockholm and went there for an interview and actually got an internship position. But then I heard one of my friends at the school when he was talking to a company in Denmark in Copenhagen called Ghost VFX. And they were interviewing him over the phone. And I could hear them asking him all of these questions that, okay, do you know any scripting? Do you know any animation?

Do you know any rigging? Which he didn't. Like he was more of an artist guy and I was more of a technical guy. and they asked him for all the technical parts. And I could hear this overhearing the conversation. So I was like, hmm, maybe they're looking for someone like me. And Ghost was a bigger, bigger company and they did cooler stuff. So then I applied to them and we both got internship positions there.

Oh, nice. So that was great. I thought in the end took his spot. Yeah, instead of him. It would have been bad. But luckily we both got there. And then the two of us have actually followed. We started a company together later.

And then we were in Copenhagen, but then we ended up in Stockholm, both of us. And now we have kids the same age who are friends. And they share almost the same name. Very independent of each other. We named our kids, like almost the same. No, it sounds like, you know, awesome friendship that started in a young age and continued. But it's really cool. I'm, you know, because I've been both to Stockholm and Copenhagen just to visit,

and I really enjoyed both places. I don't know if it's because it's Scandinavia or just the cities or countries, but the fact that you worked or lived in both makes me kind of jealous because I really enjoy this. It's really good. Well, now it's, now it's winters, no, it sucks. Both Copenhagen and Sweden or Stockholm. And I don't know ghost VFX that well. So is it the company, is it still around?

And if so, how big the company is? Yes. When I started back in 2005, I think it was, we were maybe 25 people based in Copenhagen in one. one office. And now while I was there, they grew to maybe, I don't know, 40 or 40, 50 people. And now I think there are several hundred and they have offices in multiple locations in the world. And they got bought.

Yeah. So now they're like part of the same. I don't know if they got bought by ingenuity studios or if their mother company. So now they're like, I think they shared the CEO with ingenuity studios. And now they're working on like Star Wars and all the all the coolest Hollywood stuff. Back when I was started, they were doing more commercials. And yeah, and then we started to get into more Hollywood stuff with Stardust. And yeah, we worked on Hellboy 2.

And that's awesome. Yeah. So once you started working. there in the ghost can you continue with your journey how did you find it and what were your next steps yeah i can tell you about the first day when we we got there and uh swedish swedish and danish is pretty similar but the pronunciation in denmark is so different that it's really hard for for us swedes to understand and when we got there is it same is it same vice versa or is it same vice versa or is it just from one side to the other.

Yeah, it's, I think it depends on where in Denmark people live. Because back in the days, they only had one TV channel in Denmark, and there were two in Sweden. So if they lived close to Sweden, like if they lived in Copenhagen, they could see Swedish television. So then they learned Swedish, but we never learned Danish. Yeah. So, but now I think, yeah. the younger generation still they have a hard time understanding Swedish as well. You can read it really, really well.

But when you hear it, it's really difficult. But anyways, when we were sitting there, like under a stairs, like tucked away, the two interns. And we got assigned on the project and this project manager, who is so nice when you get to know him. But he was like playing with us interns and he was the mean producer coming there speaking in Danish with us. And we were too shy to like ask questions. And we got assigned to two different things. So my friend Jesper, he got assigned to like animate something and simulate something. And I got assigned to model and do like make it look nice.

which was like we should have been switching roles but we were so so nervous as interns we were like oh how should we do this and but then finally we said is it okay if we switch and he was like yeah sure so it wasn't a big problem we just felt it in for us it felt like a big problem yeah yeah but then then it went went really well and we just yeah we were developed developing a lot. I can tell you that just sitting in an environment where people know what they're doing and you have experienced people to talk to and ask questions. And how did you find the experience if you compare it working in like proper real company compared to your education before? Was it very different? Was it a shock for you or was it quite similar? It was a long time ago now.

So it's hard to remember. But yeah, I think working. working with hard deadlines and projects where where you really have to deliver when you're in school if you miss a deadline there's no like there's not a big company waiting for your delivery yeah so of course that was that was a big difference and i think that that also helped me to really like push myself and to really okay i need to deliver deliver some something. So I need to get this done in time and maybe, maybe plan better and scale. Like, okay, I won't be able to do this. So maybe we can scale it down to this and we have something to deliver. Yeah. And how long you worked in the company? So I stayed at Ghost for two

years. And then the living situation was pretty hard. As a junior in a company, you don't make that much money. And the housing market in Copenhagen is crazy. So I for the first year, I lived in Copenhagen at like first at host host hostos and then finding a room somewhere to rent. And then then then I moved to Malmo and commuted because there's a bridge between Copenhagen and Malmo. But that took like maybe one hour if it was a good day, one way and maybe one and a half, two hours if it was a bad day. So after a year doing that, I felt like, no, I can't do this anymore. So then I actually left Ghost and found a job in that. at Massive, the games company in Malmo.

So you transitioned from working in films to working in games. Yeah, I actually worked in the cinematics team at Massive. So it was very similar. We were still using the same software. Although we did do some in-game cinematics as well, using the game engine and stuff like that. And can you maybe expand a bit on, what does it mean working in cinematics?

Yeah, so we did like the cutscenes in the games and we also made a trailer for the game before it was released. We made this epic war. I don't know. To work on some bigger games? Back then, Massive was doing their own like real-time strategy game called World in Conflict.

So I worked on the, the trailer for the expansion of that game called Soviet assault. Soviet assault. So we animated a lot of like Soviet tanks and stuff like that. Yeah, yeah. And yeah, how was the experience there then? Or how long you stayed there? Yeah, I only stayed there for six months because during the time there,

a few friends we started talking about starting our own company. company. So, but, but the experience working there was, was awesome because everyone was so passionate. Of course, everyone in the in this industry is very passionate about their jobs. But everyone, everyone, everyone were gamers. So during lunch break, we were like playing full of beauty and against each other. And sometimes we had like, we were different floors in the building. So the cinematics team was on one floor. And and like some developers on another floor. And sometimes we had like competitions between different floors,

playing the other teams. So that was awesome. Everyone was eating lunch really quickly to be able to play as much as possible. So that was really fun. Yeah, it sounds like good. But we also, during that time, we also had like leadership problems. We struggled a bit with our boss and, So we're probably going to talk more about stuff like that.

But just to set it up, I got to see what happens in a team when the boss is behaving in this way or when you get conflicts like that, which probably colored me and made me take this other path later in my career. So was it the reason why you left in the end or did you want to pursue the own company? with your friends. Yeah, I think it was part of the reason. Maybe that made it made us hurry up a bit more with the plans to start a company. But so maybe it was a good thing that we got out of there quickly just to start to start this. So we were actually four guys who studied together at this 3D school who, who we've been outworking on different,

different companies. And then we like merged together again. And we had all this experience from different companies, different ways of doing things. And we started talking about maybe we should start something. And one of us was in a company where he met two producers, like one, a film producer and more of a creative director. type. So they also joined. So we were six people, six people like having secret

meetings in like cafes in Malma. So no one, no one would see us like in the back room somewhere because everyone was really like paranoid. What if they figure out we have we're planning to leave? Didn't you or did you know who's going to be kind of the boss of the company or didn't you, didn't you have issues about who's going to lead it? We didn't didn't at first. So this is a fun, fun story because, yeah, we were six, six guys starting this. The company was called Upper First.

And when we were going around talking to like potential clients and we said, yeah, we're six, six people. We're, we don't have a CEO. We're all like leading this on like consensus. We, we are so focused on the same vision. So we're going to, it's going to work. And everyone was telling us, no, that's so stupid. We never, never work.

And it actually worked for maybe three years. It was awesome. The first three years. Yeah. Yeah, we, of course, we had some conflicts. But we were so passionate and we were, in the beginning, it felt a bit unreal or surreal to be able to just go. hang out with your friends in an office that was like we decorated it like a home so we had like half of the office was like a play area with the sofa and the PlayStation and stuff like that

so it was really weird in the first the first few years to just go there in the morning like this is insane that I can just go here work with my friends and we yeah we worked hard but we also played hard and parted a lot and had a good time. If you want to boost your online presents, check out our digital marketing agency called Trailblazed. You can also enroll in a Skillshare course called the 10 Tips on How to Succeed in Your Creative Career, which was inspired by the podcast. Lastly, make sure to subscribe to our weekly newsletter called Creative Spotlight to stay up to date with the show and more. Links are in the show notes. Thanks.

It sounds sorry to interrupt, but like those some American films when they set up a startup at university, party in the evening, working hard during the day. Yeah, yeah, it was a bit like that in the beginning. But then our visions for the company or our needs as people changed. So three of the founders, they had kids and they had kids. like houses or apartments and after a few years they were starting to think okay maybe it's time we start to earn some more money we need to like because in the beginning we were doing a lot of like cool projects we tried to make a name for ourselves so we worked we worked a lot with mtv and did did really cool projects but they didn't pay a lot and and then we did some like boring

like infotainment stuff for industry companies and animating machines and illustrating how stuff worked and those projects paid better but when we were like in the beginning we focused more on the fun fun projects but then after a few years when like some some people's wives and kids started to complain like oh maybe we need to it would be nice to be able to go on a holiday trip or to like we need to move to a bigger bigger apartment maybe you should make some more money not just to play around at work so so then we started to get like different like i was one of the like single bachelor guys and i just i could just continue doing the the small fun projects that didn't pay that well so then we started to like drift apart and like oh we should do this no

we should do this. And then we started to get more conflicts. And then we started to have different opinions on how to, how to get where we wanted to. And then it also started to, for me, it started to be not as inspiring anymore because we were doing more, more like corporate jobs. So after the first three years, we started to drift apart and I started to lose motivation. and but it was still it was still hard like we were still friends and we had fun together and but it started to like we started to yeah yeah what you call it get some friction and it started to lose some of the the like glamour of being a startup now it was more of a regular

job so so i stayed there for three more years so i stayed for six years and in the end it was like well I need to get out of this somehow but it was so hard to leave something you've spent six years to build and we had like employees and so when I left

I think we were roughly how much it grew how many people in the end I think we were 10 people when I left something like that so we had just a few employees.

And we didn't want to grow too much because we didn't. I had seen what happened at Ghost when they grew from 25 to 40 people and how that changed everything. And like when you read about it, you see that there's a phase when you go from five to 15. There's going to be a big shift. So we didn't want to. Yeah, we wanted to grow organically.

But yeah, then I then I finally decided to leave. And that was a really hard decision. And did you also over time set up or make someone as a head of the company or were still together sharing the vision and deciding together? Yeah, a few years in we decided for one of us to be the CEO, like the face of the company. But still we were still doing all the discussions. and so we still had the friction. And is the company still, is the company still around?

No. So when I left, that must have been in 2014, I think. Then they continued for two more years. And then they decided to close it all down. Yeah. And something I'm curious about it may be a good advice if you share. How did you actually in the beginning? look for the client because it might be challenging if the company isn't established yet doesn't

have a name so how did you find clients especially as you said big names like mtv yeah well that what what made me when we when we first started talking about starting something it was those two producer guys who were the key because they had worked in the industry for for a few years and they had the connections and a lot of companies And I think if it would only be the four, the four of us like 3D and 2D artists coming together, then it would have been really hard. But when we had those producer guys who knew how to talk to clients and who knew how to, like invoice and how should we make the deals to appeal to the industry clients and yeah.

Yeah. So that was really the what I, what made me feel comfortable enough to, leave like a safe employment to start start this and I think now now I've seen I've done the same journey myself so I've worked I've worked in the industry like after after I left upper first then I started freelancing just like a one man band and that was really difficult and I struggled a lot to find clients and I like contacted agencies and stuff like that but it was really hard and it was stressful and then I got an employment somewhere and then I left after a year and started freelancing again then it was a bit better and then I like I came back worked for a few more years and then I started freelancing

again three years ago and now finally I feel now I have the connections and I have the maybe the inner calm to do that so now now I am in that position that I have the connections. Yeah. But also like the MTV, the MTV projects, they came from another one of our classmates who actually got like his internship. I think, yeah, I think he had his internship at MTV and then got hired. And he got like rose in the ranks.

So then he could give work to us. Yeah. Yeah. So as you did a few employments and. freelancing in between. What was it that kind of helped you in those freelancing phases? Was it because you got some connections from the employment or maybe you learned some skills and, you know, experiences?

Yeah, that's a really good question. I think, yeah, when I first started freelancing, I had some safety because I could freelance for my old company. so when they needed someone to animate something, they could contact me. And during that time, I also moved. I left Malma and then I moved to Linshaping and a smaller town. But then I ended up in Stockholm. And like Stockholm is, yeah, the capital is a bit bigger.

And I got a freelance gig at the small animation studio. So then I got to know them. I was sitting sitting at their office. So yeah, I think it's more of the, you start to get the connections. So then I got to know them. I got work from them. And then when I got hired again, I started working at important looking pirates, who's like a big VFX studio.

There's something I wanted to ask you about later. Yeah, because I know the company. definitely the name sounds cool i don't know if you know but i'm curious why is it actually called the way it is yeah it's a it's a reference to monkey island the old old game yeah and there's a scene in there where yeah you walk into a bar and you're working to the back room and there are three important looking pirates sitting there and they give you like side quests or thanks you you should do. Okay.

So they actually have at their office, they have a gold room, a conference room that is all gold, like gold curtains, gold like carpet on the floor, gold, gold walls. And in there they have a huge painting of this scene in Monkey Island. Like hand painted, you can see all the brushstrokes, but it's like the pixels painted perfectly. It's so, so cool. That's really something I've been wondering about because I follow the company on social media. They obviously are probably like among the big ones because they work on big also Hollywood blockbusters. I was always curious this name because it just sticks in your mind and I thought why. Yeah.

And do you know are they like the founders fans of the game or? Yes. So when they started they were brainstorming a lot and they were yeah. they still are real nerds. So they were like, okay, what? Going back to their, their inspirations as kids and that's how they landed on this. Yeah. So now it, yeah, it doesn't hurt now that it's like you have ILM, industrial light and magic,

and then you have ILP, important-looking pirates. It's like, yeah, they're almost the same. So how was your experience working? working there. Yeah, it was, the reason I actually started there was I was talking to a friend and I was a bit like, yeah, I don't know what to do with my career. I was struggling a bit with like the direction. And she suggested that, yeah, but you're like a technical guy.

You like to learn and do difficult things. Why don't you apply to a bigger company where you can like work in a team and you can learn from really like specialized people and I had been a bit hesitant to apply to important looking pirates because they felt a bit yeah they felt a bit scary like maybe I I won't fit there and they were a bit mystical they didn't do any like no one no one knew about them they were in a basement somewhere but when I when I finally applied and I got went there on an interview and got to meet the founders like the owners it was yeah you can really feel that the passion and I think that's that's something that is very special about that that place that they still not have any found or any investors or anything it's still just the few guys who started it and they are their artists in the soul and nerds and that's like is like you can feel it in the entire company that it's so inspiring and and i also got that

i got to sit next to one guy who was really technical and he like i started to learn python scripting and and i started to learn match move if you're into vfx terms and yeah i learned learned a lot started to do more effects doing more simulations and that was that was so much fun in the beginning like i felt oh wow this is this is the place to be so many nice people but then after like six months i started to like on a downward spiral i felt i'm just sitting here doing the same thing over and over or like I got good at simulating cloth so I simulated sales for pirate chips for like a TV series called black sales so I spent three months working on one episode and then I jumped on the next project and I simulated like a leather jacket for someone for a commercial and

so then I started to feel like I'm just doing the same thing I'm like like And I didn't think about it back then. But what I realized later is that I need, I really need the variation. So I'm much, much better suited to work on commercials and small projects where it's like one challenge for two weeks and then you jump on a new project and you're a new challenge. But it was also hard to see this because I was really motivated. by the cool, the cool projects at ILP. Because back then we were working on the first season of Westworld and like fear the walking dead.

We worked on a on a Hollywood movie called The Shallows, one of the shark movies. So it was really cool. It's so so cool when you go to a party and someone else, what are you doing? Oh, well, I'm working on this TV series called Westworld. Yeah. So you feel like in those situations, you feel like a rock star when someone else, yeah, what do you do? Yeah, I work in the bank or, yeah. Yeah.

I don't want to talk about that. I feel like I completely understand your point. And it makes sense. I can just agree with that. Yeah, so that's, so it was hard to leave. important looking pirates because i felt this is a really cool place a lot of nice people we're doing like really cool work and it's like the status of working there is so high it's like one of the best places in sweden now it's like one of the best bfx companies in the world i would i would say

winning awards and stuff so absolutely i would say just for my i would say just for my i From my limited knowledge, from what I know from social media or internet, I didn't know the story behind it or haven't spoken with anyone who worked there before. But my impression was also, you know, big company from Sweden working on exciting projects. Also, it's interesting because it's not based in London or US, but it's actually Swedish-based, so it makes it somehow unique. So I've always had this impressionate somehow cool company. Yeah. And I think the really big changes, the big difference is that it's still owned by artists. It's still owned by those people that really care about the final result. And there are no investors saying, well, it's good enough.

Let's send it to the client and they're going to be happy and they're going to approve it. And we don't have to work on it anymore. But they have this like, no, we can still push it. We can make it better for their own. sake and I think that has made their success. They've been so like they've they've over delivered. So so now people come to ILP to to get quality quality work and they know they they get that. And I think that that is also yeah that's also really nice for the people working there because I have one of my friends who worked in a

different studio he was a bit frustrated with that that they were like yeah. We're not allowed to work on it anymore because now the client is happy. But I would still like to polish it a bit more. But no, my producer says it's good enough. And do they have locations? I mean, do they have more locations even outside of Sweden? Or are they based in Stockholm? They still have the main office in Stockholm.

But I think they have a small office in Germany, in Hamburg maybe. And they have a few people in London, I think. I don't know if they have an office or if they're just like a company on paper and then people work remote. Also out of curiosity, are there any other such a well-known or successful or popular VFX companies in Sweden? Yeah, we have goodbye Kansas. Oh, yeah, I heard of it. Yeah, there actually.

Didn't it have troubles during the, unfortunate few months. Yeah. Yeah, they went bankrupt a few months ago. But then they managed to, I don't know if they found some new investors or they managed to pour some more money into it. And so now they're still running. They were like, had different, different directions, but they managed to save the visual

effects part. Yeah. So that is still, still running. But that's a like. it's really interesting to see because that company is like they have a lot of investors it's a public company also it's on a stock exchange oh wow yeah so so there you can really compare and see the differences and like how that affects the company and like yeah that was that was where my friend worked who said, yeah, they say it's good enough.

We have to deliver now. Yeah. They had to make money today for the investors. Yeah. It's interesting comparison for sure. And we're interesting to see that they are such a big company in Sweden. It's not like one of the hubs such as US or UK. So it's very cool.

Yeah. But one thing that is really difficult for. for Swedish companies because people might not know that there are a lot of like tax incentives for film companies to do their, like do parts of their production in London, for example. Then they get like tax deductions. And in Canada, they have a lot of this. And now I think they have it in Germany as well. But there's none of that in Sweden.

So in Sweden, you have to pay full price. So that's why like we have to compete with with quality. Otherwise, like, yeah, they're cheaper. Let's go with them instead. Thank you for listening. If you enjoy the show, please leave us a five-star review on your favorite podcast app, get in touch to provide your feedback,

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