Realfoodology - 12: Eat to Glow with Celeste Thomas

Episode Date: November 18, 2020

I talk with my bestie Celeste Thomas, Registered Nurse, skincare expert & green beauty fanatic about how to get "glowy" skin from the inside out.  In this episode Celeste teaches us how we can Eat to Glow, the ins and outs of beauty products and how to navigate the skincare aisle. Use code REALFOODOLOGY for $20 off at https://www.thetruespoon.com/ Show Links: https://www.thetruespoon.com/skincare/skin-confident-course/ https://www.instagram.com/celestethomas/ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCyurOaA9dDVAWBtAZO4Esdw?view_as=subscriber If you have any questions that you want answered on the show, send me an email to [e-mail]

On today's episode of The Real Foodology Podcast, premature aging, acne, all those things, we look at systemic inflammation and really it shows up on your skin. Your skin is an outward facing organ that really is kind of when things bubble up in the rest of the systems in your body, you see the effect on your skin. Hi guys. Welcome back to another episode of The Real Foodology Podcast. I'm your host, Courtney Swan. Today's episode is with actually one of my very close friends here in LA, Celeste Thomas. She's a holistic skincare and wellness lifestyle blogger. And she has eat to glow recipes on her website. She covers green beauty, skincare practices, recommended products, which is actually one of my favorite things about her Instagram. She does these dupes on her Instagram

where she takes really popular skincare or beauty products. So like, let's say a really popular Chanel lip gloss, and she breaks down why that one is not super great for health and toxic because of the different ingredients that are in there. And then she gives you an alternative that is non-toxic and comparable to that product. Love it. She is such an amazing resource for all things skincare and beauty, which is why I wanted to have her on today to talk all about that. She's going to go into her journey a little bit, but I will give you a preview. So she suffered from really bad acne for a long time and was not able to figure out what was going on or manage that acne until she changed up her diet. And then she started using more non-toxic and clean products. So we have a really candid conversation about food and how food affects your skin and really how your skin reflects what's going on

inside of your body. So it's a really fun, great conversation, lots of good information. I'm really excited for you guys to hear this episode. So my producer Drake, when he was listening to this podcast, he mentioned that it wasn't super clear what the difference is between a serum and an oil, et cetera, a lot of the things that Celeste and I go over in this episode. So I wanted to take a moment to talk about that. This is really exciting. Organifi now has kids stuff. They just released two kid products. One is called easy greens, and it's a refreshing green apple juice where kids will never know that it's packed with veggies. And the other one is called protect. It's a delicious wild berry punch, like the Kool-Aid that we used to have as a kid, but without any sugar.

This is really exciting. And if you've listened to the podcast for a while, you know that I'm a huge fan of Organifi and most specifically because every single product that they make is glyphosate residue free. So you know that you're going to be able to give these powders to your kids and know that they will be able to consume them safely without any glyphosate in it. So let's break down each one. The Easy Greens is a nourishing and delicious blend of superfoods and veggies that provides essential nutrients, probiotics, and digestive enzymes to bring balance to kids' growing bodies without fillers, additives, or junk. It helps to fill in nutritional gaps, aids in growth and development, supports digestive health, has a rich micronutrient profile, and includes digestive

enzymes. This would be a great way to sneak in greens for your little one without them actually knowing that it's healthy for them. And the second one, which is the wild berry punch similar to Kool-Aid, is called Protect, and it is to support your child's daily immune health with food-derived nutrients that work to strengthen their body's first line of defense. I know just through girlfriends of mine that have children that when your kids are going to school, going to daycare, they're coming home sick a lot more often just because they're getting exposed to different kids

and different viruses when they're out in the world playing with kids. So this would be a great way to help to support your little one's immune health. It's organic and it's also made with real whole food ingredients. It has a delicious berry taste and it's low sugar and it's gentle enough for kids to take every single day. And I really love the ingredients in this one. It's orange and acerol cherry, which is a powerful source of vitamin C and antioxidants, astragalus, elderberry, and propolis. These are all really great for overall immune health. If you want to try the products that I talked about today or any of the Organifi products, go to Organifi.com

slash realfoodology and use code realfoodology for 20% off. Again, that's Organifi. It's O-R-G-A-N-I-F-I dot com slash realfoodology. Do you want to hear the biggest discovery of our time for promoting healthy aging? Of course you do, because all of us are concerned about aging. There is a class of ingredients called senolytics that were discovered less than 10 years ago, and they are being called the biggest discovery of our time for promoting healthy aging and enhancing your physical prime. Now, when I'm talking about aging here, I'm not just talking about on a superficial level, wrinkles and saggy skin. I'm talking about energy, joint pain, your ability to show up for your life, cognitive function. I'm talking about the real effects of cellular aging on the body and what it does to our body as we age. Now, as we age, everyone accumulates something called senescent

cells in their body. They cause symptoms of aging, such as aches and discomfort, slow workout recoveries, sluggish mental and physical energy associated with that middle age feeling. They're also known as zombie cells. They're old and worn out and not serving a useful function for our health anymore, but they're taking up space and nutrients from our healthy cells. Much like pruning the yellowing and dead leaves off of a plant, qualia senolytic removes those worn out senescent cells to allow for the rest of them to thrive in the body. And you just take these supplements two days a month. That's right. Just two days a month. Qualia Synalytic is an amazing product that helps to remove these senescent cells. And if you want to hear more about the product and more about these senescent cells that affect aging, go back

to the episode that I did with Dr. Greg Kelly of Ne neurohacker. So you can dive more into the details of all of it. But the formula that I'm talking about qualia synolytic is non GMO, it's vegan, it's gluten free, and the ingredients are meant to complement one another, factoring in the combined effect of all the ingredients together. If for some reason you don't like the product, you're not feeling the effects of it. It also has a 100 day money back guarantee. If you want to resist aging at the cellular level, try Qualia Synalytic. Go to neurohacker.com slash realfoodology for up to $100 off, and make sure to use code realfoodology at checkout for an additional 15% off.

That's neurohacker, N-E-U-R-O-H-A-C-K-E-R.com slash realfoodology for an extra 15% off your purchase. Thanks to Neurohacker for sponsoring today's episode. And also before going into that, if you're a male and you're listening to this and you think that this does not apply to you, this absolutely applies to you. You have skin just like women do, and you have the same hydration needs. And trust me when I say this, that at some point in your life, you're going to wish that you started moisturizing and taking better care of your skin. So it's not just for women. So a serum is a skincare product that you can apply to your skin

after cleansing, but before moisturizing. And the intent of it is to deliver powerful ingredients directly into the skin. Serums are essentially supplements for your skin. They have a lightweight texture and smaller molecules, molecular structure, which is smaller than found in like oils and moisturizers and lotions. They're able to deeply penetrate, penetrate the skin and deliver a very high concentration of active ingredients. So hence the supplement for your skin. It makes them a great tool for targeting specific skin care concerns like wrinkles, and they can be super moisturizing.

They have ingredients like hyaluronic acid, which is an incredibly moisturizing component of a lot of these serums, and it helps the skin retain moisture. But that doesn't mean that these are moisturizers in the traditional sense. Face lotions and creams are richer and they're able to create a barrier on top of the skin to help like keep it all in. So you don't want to just use a serum. You want a serum in conjunction with a face oil and a moisturizer. I know this is a lot, but trust me when I say as someone who didn't pay a lot of attention to my skin and my skincare routine when I was younger, I wish that I had started doing this when I was like 18, because the difference that I have seen in my skin in the last couple of years after really

implementing a skincare routine, I mean, it's dramatic. I look back at photos of myself when I was in my 20s. I look younger now in my 30s than I did when I was in my 20s. My complexion is really like glowing now in a way that I never experienced when I was in my 20s, even though I was in my youth. Then I'm still in my youth, but I really see a difference. So I highly recommend if you're listening to really start implementing a skincare routine into your nightly and your morning routine. It's not that hard. You can find pretty inexpensive products now at like Target, CVS, and a lot of them carry these non-toxic lines. And I highly recommend that you check out Celeste Thomas's Instagram and her blog because she gives so many amazing

resources. And she talks about a lot of very effective and very affordable products that will really help you start getting into this routine. And once you start doing it, you'll get so, you'll be so excited with the results that you won't want to stop, which is what happened to me. And now I have like a full step routine that I do. Um, also that being said, I said that I was going to cover what face oils are. So face oils on the other hand have an emollient texture and they provide a boost of nutrition and hydration. They provide the skin with lipids, which fortify the skin barrier. And they're usually composed of one or more oils extracted

from fruits, nuts, and seeds. And depending on the type of formula, facial oils may have additional benefits besides just nourishing and strengthening the skin barriers, such as anti-inflammatory or antioxidant properties. And they play a really important role because increasing the moisture in your skin and providing it with oils is fundamental for a healthy and glowing complexion. And you don't want to just use a face oil. You want to use a face oil and a moisturizer because face oils can only penetrate the skin so much. And I read that if you just use a face oil, sometimes your, your body will get used to that and then it will stop producing its own form of hydration, its own oil. So you want to use a face oil and a moisturizer. And I figured I would go over this

too, because I know that there's a lot of different things out there. We have serums and face oils, and then exfoliants and moisturizers. So there's a specific order that you want to put everything in because you want your skin to be in a position where it's able to absorb and take in everything that you're putting on the skin. And there's certain things that if they are put in the wrong order will not work as effectively. I know this sounds really overwhelming. Again, go to Celeste Thomas's page. She is such an amazing resource for all of this. And also just do a little bit of a Google. It's what I did when I first started getting into this,

but I want to help you with this as well. So this is the order that I do my nightly routine. And this is what I've read is the best way to do it. So you want to do your cleanser first, and then you want to do an exfoliant after that. It can either be a chemical exfoliant, which is what I use every night, or it can also be like an actual scrub, but be careful about the scrubs that you get. And Celeste and I talk about this in the episode. My favorite chemical exfoliant that truly changed my skin and the tone of it, the surface of it, everything is glycolic acid, glycolic acid exfoliates, it hydrates and it boosts collagen production.

It's perfect for dry and sun damaged skin. There's also lactic acid that you can use, which is a little bit more gentle and it also hydrates the skin. So you do the exfoliant and then after that you put on your toner and then you put on your serum after that. And then your oil, your eye cream, and then finally your moisturizer. If you're doing this in the morning, make sure that you add a sunscreen or an SPF over that. I don't do my full routine in the morning. To be honest, in the morning, all I do is vitamin C mixed with a serum because that helps

brighten the skin. And you don't want to mix vitamin C with some of the other stuff like retinol or glycolic acid. So I do the vitamin C in the morning and then I just put an SPF and a sunscreen on. So at night, what I just explained, that's the order and what I do at night. And then the morning's a lot more simple. And especially cause I'm usually like, well, pre pandemic vibes, like rushing out the door and I don't have time to do a full like 10 step routine, but that is the, that's it. That's the order. And with that, let's get to a fan question.

Before I get to the question, I just have a little disclaimer. As always, these answers and this podcast are just for educational and informational purposes only. I am an integrative nutritionist, but I'm not a doctor. And I don't know you personally. I don't know what's going on in your body. So just know that this information on this podcast is not a sub for individual medical or mental health advice.

And it doesn't constitute a provider patient relationship. As always, talk to your doctor first. So today's question is all about Thanksgiving, which was perfect timing. And Jean writes, with Thanksgiving coming up, I wanted to ask you a few questions about yours. Personally, I always struggle with Thanksgiving. I don't like eating until I get sick, and my family isn't as healthy as I am, so there aren't a lot of super healthy options at the table. How do you navigate this? I would love to hear any sort of tips and tricks or ideas that you may have around how to make it a little bit easier during the holidays. I'm also curious what your Thanksgiving looks like. What are your favorite foods and what,

if anything, do you make every year? So this is a great question because I think a lot of people struggle with this. I can relate to this as well. I'm not super into the idea of just eating until I'm sick and then laying around all day because it just doesn't feel super good in my body. But over the years, I have learned to really have compassion for myself around this holiday and around that whole, that tradition, some ways around it that I've found that have helped me besides just changing my mindset. Because look, you have to remember it's one day out of the year. It would be different if you were doing this every single day, then I would say, you know, you may want to talk to someone about that. Um, but Thanksgiving is about coming together with your family, spending time with them. And if you have a day where you just eat a

lot and you don't feel super great and you lay around, it's just a day, you know, you wake up the next day, go for a walk, make better food choices, and you move on with your life and you just give yourself kindness and compassion around that. That being said, something that has really helped me with this a lot is every morning on Thanksgiving, I do some sort of exercise, whether that be I get my parents and my dog and we go for a walk around the neighborhood for an hour before we go and start making food and, or, or before we go to our friend's house for the day for dinner, whatever it is. Um, I've gotten up some, some mornings and done like a spinning class before.

Cause some of the workout places in my hometown offer like quote unquote turkey burns, which I hate that word because it implies that we need to burn off her turkey, which I don't think is healthy, but I do think it's fine to go and get a workout and just move your body and sweat a little bit to make yourself feel better. You know, um, that being said, I should say, since we were in a pandemic right now, I wouldn't recommend going to a workout class, but walking is free. Grab your family, encourage your family, cousins, parents, whatever, siblings to just go for a walk around the neighborhood. Or I know a lot of families, their tradition is to do a marathon the morning of.

Maybe you sign up your whole family for a marathon that morning, whatever it is. And if no one joins you, put in your headphones and just go for a walk. Say, you know what? I'll be back in an hour. I'm just going to move my body before we get into the, you know, the festivities. So that would be my first, um, suggestion. I would also say something that I struggle with in the past is that I was so in anticipation of this like huge meal that I wouldn't eat everything or I wouldn't eat anything until my Thanksgiving meal. But then you get to that point where you are so starving that you just want to clear out everything. But then you get to that point where you are so starving that you

just want to clear out everything. And then you just eat up, you just end up eating so much more than you would because you were starving and you've been waiting in anticipation for this meal all day. So my suggestion to you is to wake up in the morning, eat as you do. Don't try to not eat anything up until that meal, unless if you're just not hungry, if it just naturally happens that way, that's great. Listen to your body, but also don't try to not eat in anticipation for this huge meal, because what's going to happen is you're just going to eat more and you're not going to feel great. And look, it's not about the eating. It's about feeling good in your body and not feeling like you have to overcompensate for not eating

all day. And again, if you do get to a point where you load up your plate and you eat more than you had hoped that you would and you feel sick, just give yourself compassion. It's one day. So I hope that this helps. And then as far as, okay, so you also asked what my Thanksgiving looks like. So mine has been really different over the years. I was touring. If you listen to my first episode that I released, I worked as a tour manager for a very long time with bands and we were always on the road during Thanksgiving. So the majority of my 20s, I spent Thanksgiving on the road and it was usually my job. Well, not my job, but I took it on as my job to plan some sort of Thanksgiving. And I would always go to Whole Foods and I would get, you know, this extravagant,

like prepared meal. There was actually one year we were in Florida. I was with the band 303 and they just gave me their credit card. And I went to Whole Foods and I just bought a Thanksgiving dinner for the whole band and crew, which was really fun. It was interesting. We were just in a hotel room, like microwaving meals, which sounds sad, but it was actually such a fun experience because it was our whole band and crew and it was really fun. But, um, so mine have looked really different every year. Some year we went to, um, a family member of one of the bands houses, like someone's parents threw us a Thanksgiving cause we had happened to be in their hometown. More recently, since I haven't been on tour as much lately, I fly home and I see my family in Texas because they're usually in Texas during this time. And we usually make a

couple of sides and then we go over to a family friend's house and we have a really big Thanksgiving with them. Considering everything with COVID, I don't know what we're doing this year because we're not going to go see that family this year. So what I've been trying to do the last couple of years, I had a Friendsgiving last year and I had all my friends text in the group chat what they were going to make. So we'd kind of coordinate that we had all the bases covered. I did the turkey last year, which was terrifying for me because as someone who was vegetarian for five years, I still don't do great with raw meat, but I did it. I cried during the process though. I'm very sensitive about animals, even though I do eat meat now, I'm still sensitive to the nature of eating animals.

Um, and everyone brought a different side. My favorite things on the Thanksgiving table are the stuffing. I'm actually not even huge on turkey. Like, I don't know. I could take it or leave it. I love stuffing. I love gravy. I love like a sweet potato mash, but I hate it when they put marshmallows in it. I don't know.

I don't want my sweet potatoes to be sweet. And I love a really good like harvest green salad. Give me some like pomegranate seeds in there. Maybe some squash, balsamic. Love it. So that's kind of what my Thanksgivings look like. I'm curious to hear what yours look like. So feel free to write me on Instagram at realfoodology, send me photos, whatever you feel inclined to do. I would love to see a little glimpse into your Thanksgiving. And with that, let's get into the episode. Welcome, Celeste. I am so excited to be here. I mean, Courtney and I are always hanging out, so this is just such a fun time to actually

sit down and have some intentional conversations, and I'm just so excited for your podcast and to be a guest. Thank you. Happy to be here. Yeah. I mean, it's interesting. If you had told me five years ago that I would be as concerned with skincare as I am now, I would have laughed because I was so

focused on just foods and that's a huge important part of it. And that's something that I really want you to touch on today. Um, but I did not really understand skincare and how much it also does play a role. It really is multifaceted. Completely. And I think it is funny because we're both women, we're millennials, we're in our 30s, and you start to see the impact of skincare and how you take care of your body as you age with every decade. And I think even looking at our contemporaries and people we may have gone to high school with, those that treat their body with respect and really fuel it well and take care of their skin look so vibrant. And then those who might not put emphasis on that just look a little different. So as we age, it is really important. And there's so many things you can do to really

heal your skin and maintain the health of it long-term and really just promote a glowy, effervescent look. Yeah. I'm glad you touched on that too, because I wish that I had started this when I was younger. I'm really glad that I figured it out now, but had I started really being concerned with my skin when I was like in my early twenties, I would be in a different place now. Completely. And your skin's absolutely stunning. So you are in a perfect place, but yeah, that's, that's something that I, I touch on a lot and talk about and really, um, you know, I want to get into the food stuff. I could get into product stuff with longevity of your skin. But I think it really is so important to talk about free radicals, oxidative stress, and really how that can prematurely age your skin.

So there's so many things in our diet that can either contribute to the health of our skin and the longevity and making it look super young or really take away and harm the longevity of our skin. Yes, absolutely. Okay. I'm really excited to get into that. Before we dive into that, why don't you just give a little introduction for people that I've not heard of you yet? Yeah. So you probably said my name at the beginning. So, okay. You know my name and I am a registered nurse and holistic skincare expert. I worked in the field of aesthetics and dermatology for seven years. And I am a registered nurse and holistic skincare expert. I worked in the field of aesthetics and dermatology for seven years. And over the course of that time, I was really trying to heal my own acne. I used all of Western philosophy to try to heal my skin. I knew everything about really the medical aspect of skincare, and it wasn't working for my very

severely acne prone skin. So it took me learning about more of the Eastern modalities, holistic healing practices to have the healthy, clear skin that you see today. So I'm super passionate about sharing that message with as many people as possible and helping them become more skin confident and really just achieve their healthiest best skin. I love that so much. I mean, just, I know people listening to this won't be able to see your beautiful, healthy skin, but I'm looking at, I'm like, you're literally glowing. And I know that's part of your thing is the eat to glow. And, uh, you know, I talk a lot about food here and the connection between what you feed your body and how it really shows up on

your skin. I'm very interested to hear about your, um, every, your journey with acne. I want to hear about that. Cause I I'll share a little bit about mine, but I want to hear yours first because I also had a little bout of acne for a bit, but I want to hear kind of, um, yeah, your journey. Yeah. So I'm really genetically acne prone. My mom had really bad acne and really took her until her thirties to kind of grow out of it, but she never really learned how to take care of her skin. And so when I was dealing with it as an adolescent, I was just kind of lost and really looking at branding and marketing

and grocery stores, whatever said acne on it to try to heal my skin. Like the Neutrogenas and... Completely. And it was just one of those things. It was always with me. I was waking up with a new breakout every other day, and it was really just of those things. It was always with me. I was waking up with a new breakout every other day and it was really just drastically affecting my confidence, especially in high school and college. It's the last thing you want to do. And the last thing you're truly focused on. So I did the proactive. I've been on almost every medication just short of Accutane for acne. And

you know, I would just always struggle with my skin. And to this day, if I'm not really consistent with my diet and with my home practices and with my skincare, I break out. That's the first thing that happens. It's so interesting. It's been a lifelong journey. I bet. Imagine having a metabolic coach in your pocket that you could access at any point, any time in the day, whenever you want. That's what Lumen is. Lumen is the world's first handheld metabolic coach. It's a device that measures your metabolism through your breath. And on the app, it lets you know if you're burning fat or carbs and gives you tailored guidance to improve your nutrition, workout, sleep, and even stress management. I have so many podcast episodes about metabolic flexibility and why it is so incredibly important

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fromourplace.com and enter my code real foodology checkout to receive 10% off site-wide that's from our place.com code real foodology. Our place offers a 100 day trial with free shipping and returns. Yeah. So that was, um, so I had an experience. I was always that kid. Everyone's going to listen to this and be like, fuck you. But I was that kid that went through high school and I never had a single pimple. And then I went through college and again, still didn't have any pimples. And then I think I was 24 maybe. And all of a sudden I just broke out in the craziest cystic acne all along my chin, just out of nowhere. And I had never experienced it before. I didn't really know what was going on. And this was really, it was also interestingly around the

same time that I was starting to get into healthy eating. And this was really, it was also interestingly around the same time that I was starting to get into healthy eating. And I was starting to see the connection between the foods that you're putting your body and your skin, but I still couldn't figure out what was going on. So it took me about four, it was almost five years, um, to figure out, I mean, I tried everything. I didn't actually go on medications, but I had, you know, the antibiotic creams. I had all of the topical stuff. I tried the proactives, all of the face washes, everything, nothing was working. And I was like, I don't understand, you know, I'm eating salads and I'm eating healthy foods. And this is what I'm so excited for you to touch on today because yes, eating healthy

helps, but there is also certain foods that can trigger acne. Also, what really was happening for me ultimately was that I had a really severe hormonal imbalance going on. And someone told me, um, I can't remember who it was. Someone along the way, it was like, go get a hormonal panel done and see what's going on. And for me, I had really low progesterone and higher estrogen. I think it was, and it just was causing, and it was, I mean, it was horrible. It's the second one cystic acne pimple would go down. I would have another one the next day. Yep. And estrogen dominance is a huge problem with acne. And

really there's a lot of foods that can trigger estrogen dominance too. When we talk about diet for skincare, as far as inflammation, inflammation, premature aging, acne, all those things, we look at systemic inflammation and really it shows up on your skin. Your skin is an outward facing organ that really is kind of when things bubble up in the rest of the systems in your body, you see the effect on your skin and it's kind of the mirror as to what's going on in the inside of your body. So there's certain foods that can really trigger those negative side effects of skin that we don't want to see, right? The acne, redness, inflammation. And the first culprit is refined sugar. It's just one of the most inflammatory foods you can eat. And really from ingesting it to really

getting into your bloodstream and eventually showing up on your face. Acne is so related to refined sugar. So if you can eliminate that from your diet, I mean, literally every system in the body is going to have a reduction in inflammation that's going to be beneficial for you. Yeah. And dropping the sugar has so many other health benefits as well. I mean, people who are longtime followers of mine and listening to this podcast will know, I talk about sugar all the time. Like you said, it really, um, to boil it down, it just leads to chronic inflammation in the body and we see it affect every area. Completely. And people need to think about this specifics. I'm not talking about real fruit and real food sources. That's fine. Eat fruit to the cows come home. Like I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about the agaves. I'm talking about the refined, whatever date

sugar, coconut sugar, whatever sugars you think are, are okay. You know, I just really, really advocate for a diet free of refined sugars for skin health. I love it. Well, you're in safe company here because I do the same. Completely. That's why we're friends. That's totally why we're friends. It's just that we're banning sugar. Not why we're friends. But we both hate sugar.

We both hate sugar. We put Stevia in our matchas before this. We did. And you know what? It's the sugar. So once you can cut that down, get it out of your condiments, get it out of your foods, then we need to talk about the refined oils. We need to talk about the inflammatory oils in the same way that inflames the rest of your body. Those canolas,

any hard seed oil that takes intense chemicals and a processing system to break them down. Those are not things you want in your body. They negatively impact your skin and cause inflammation. Yeah. I mean, as you know. Yeah, but it's interesting, though. It's why I wanted to have you on here and have this conversation, because I make the connection with disease, like chronic disease, and when people are struggling in different areas in their life.

But for me, I haven't talked too much about the like connection with the skin other than I know, like what you said earlier, what ha what's happening in your body is being mirrored on your skin completely. And when we talk about those really highly processed oils and the sugars, they are also killing off the healthy bacteria in our microbiome that directly correlate to skin health. Your microbiome as a whole is on the surface of your skin. It's inside your body. It's really all the fungi and bacteria that surround you and are in you. So if you're not supporting your gut and the flora there, the flora on your skin is being dramatically impacted as well. And that flora on your skin

is actually fighting off acne bacteria because it's a healthy bacterial blanket on the surface of your skin. So it's so correlated to every chronic disease you're talking about. We're so much more of a whole entity where everything is connected than people want to really think about or connect. Absolutely. Yeah. And I'm so glad that you brought up the microbiome too. Again, I always, I mean, it's so funny. Like I'm so concentrated and focused on the bacteria in our gut, but you're right. It's all around us, all over our body. Um, so you said, okay, so number two is refined oils. What's the next? The next one that I really like to talk about is something that is really important in our American diets because we are caffeine and coffee addicts. Hello. Hi. I love my coffee. Right? And it's okay,

but there's certain factors. So the first factor is caffeine stimulates cortisol. Cortisol is a stress hormone. It actually causes acne. It's a stress response. The other thing about coffee besides just the caffeine, as I was reading Dr. Perricone's book, he's a really influential dermatologist. He's amazing. And in his acne book, he talks about some evidence-based research studies that the oils in coffee actually increase sebum production in the cellular level and can be a factor in acne. That's so interesting. Okay. So I'm curious though, because as someone who I drink coffee every day and I've been drinking it for, I don't know, since I was in high school, um,

it doesn't seem to affect me because I figured out now I've, you know, I got rid of that cystic acne when I figured out my hormonal imbalance. But so does that mean that someone that has maybe an issue with, with seven, wait, what is it? Sebum? Yeah. Sebum oil production that coffee is going to affect you worse. Completely. So if you're someone who has drier skin or isn't super oily, it might not be a problem. Or maybe you're not as genetically acne prone. Maybe it's more hormonal for you. It might not be a problem. The other thing is you're probably drinking a really high quality organic coffee that's less inflammatory. Yep. And I don't drink a lot. I only have like one cup a day. And that's the thing. That's not really going to impact you a whole lot, but most people

in our age range in this country are drinking two to three, four, five coffees a day. Plus they're also potentially drink. This is the other aspect of coffee. They're drinking them later in the afternoon, in the evening, which is preventing them from getting really high quality sleep, which will also impact the skin because the hormones released when you're sleeping are the ones that are going to help your skin rehydrate and also help with cell turnover. Such a great point. I would have never even thought about that. There's so many factors. So coffee is one of those ones you really have to be careful with. And if you're someone who's not drinking a lot of coffee, one cup a day, it's fine.

Yeah. Don't drink poor quality coffee. Don't have more than one or two a day. And then you're not going to want to drink them six hours before you go to bed. Well, that's, that's easy for me because if I have a coffee afternoon, I won't go to sleep. So completely. Yeah. But for some people that drink them at like 4 PM, if they're having, if they're struggling with acne, maybe it's something that, you know, start drinking your coffee earlier in the day, do a matcha later in the afternoon, if well, but matcha still is caffeine. Right. So it would probably still can actually make the, the end of the onset longer than a coffee. So yeah. Yeah. Our matcha tonight. I was just going to say, I'm like, what time is it? I'm going to have to take some melatonin tonight. Calm down.

The interesting thing is, you know, I went to a, um, an event with one of the top sleep specialists in Los Angeles. And he said that even if you don't think the caffeine is affecting you, it is impacting the quality of your sleep cycle. Oh, absolutely. So there's no getting around it. Everyone listening, you can have your coffee, you can have the flavor, just moderation and high quality organic coffee. Yes, exactly. Because then also you're reducing pesticide exposure. There's a lot of reasons. Yes. Supporting better farming practices, more eco-friendly coffee. Completely. And then the last one that I'll touch on with food is dairy. And so the thing about dairy, as you know, it's all about the quality of dairy. So if you're having an unpasteurized, beautiful bacteria-filled, raw, organic dairy product,

and it works for your specific constitution. I think that's great, but there has been a lot of evidence published that if you're genetically acne prone, like myself, dairy can really exacerbate your acne. Yeah. I've heard this a lot. I actually, I have a girlfriend who, um, every single time that she even basically has like a bite of dairy. I mean, I've, I've seen it before my eyes. She will get a pimple within like four hours. It's very wild. Yep. It's, it's inflammation. It's, you know, genetics. And if that's you, there's so many great alternatives these days. Yes. Plus if you want to just go have a crazy dairy filled night and then you wake up with breakouts, at least you have the power to know what it is. Exactly. If you're raging with your dairy one night, you'll be fine.

It's fine. You'll have a couple of pimples and then you know, next time that maybe you have to weigh the pros and cons of having that dairy completely. And I find that that's the major issue with people and their skin health is they don't know what it is. They're buying all of these different potions and lotions are going to all these doctors and they feel so defeated and like they have no control and they have no idea what's going on. So it's, I've been there. I've been so depressed by my skin because I'm trying so many things and nothing's working. So there really is kind of like a systematic way to go through your lifestyle and test and try different things without wanting to just blow your brains out. Like, absolutely not. Honestly, that's really harsh, but when you're in the depths of your acne despair, it is painful. No, it's real. I mean, coming from also, like I said,

I also had a similar experience. I mean, I had the, the, um, cystic acne for almost five years and it was scarring on my face. And I had those scars for a couple of years afterwards. I mean, it's a miracle they went away, but so we've all, I think I would guess the majority of people have been through some sort of acne situation throughout their life, whether it was, you know, adolescence or now, I know a lot of people are struggling now with adult acne. Um, I think that a lot of it has to do with the growth hormones and stuff that we have in our food. And I think, um, you kind of touched on this with the dairy, but really getting away from the industrial dairy and getting back to more like organic raw,

if you can. I mean, I know raw dairy is, um, illegal, I think in a lot of states, but I know, which is very funny. So many things that could be illegal and should be illegal, but the raw dairy. But the raw dairy. That's really something to watch out for. Like really going after the hard ones here. Yeah. And, you know, the reason why is because organic dairy is legally, they're not allowed to put the growth hormones in there. And I think that is a lot of what is it's because, you know, it's messing with our own natural, our body's natural hormones. So if you can, you're listening, if you can, um, switch to organic pasture raised dairy,

because we know that pasture raised cows are, um, living their lives, grazing, they're getting vitamin D from the sunlight. So it's better for you. And then their stomachs aren't, they're not sick because they're eating grass as their stomachs were designed to digest instead of corn and soy. Um, and they have a higher, uh, omega three than omega six. And I want, is there a connection between omega threes and omega sixes in the skin that you know of? Yeah. So, um, I don't want to speak incorrectly, but when your omega imbal is off, I forget if it's three, six or nine, which one is in excess in most processed foods. So when you have an excess of omega-6 and you're not balanced, it causes inflammation in the body. Guess what? Inflammation

in the skin. So much of the skin is tied to inflammation in the body. I was just going to say, we're seeing a theme here with inflammation. I also talk a lot about inflammation in general because like I was saying earlier, we see so many of the chronic diseases that we're seeing in this country now can all be brought back to inflammation. So recurring theme here. It's all about inflammation. Truly. And once you get those certain practices in place with your skincare routine, and I like to talk about Eat to Glow, which is glowy skin diet all the time. And it's really just implementing those little changes. And I know it can seem really daunting for people who are just starting

this journey, but there are great alternatives for everything. And a lot of things you can make yourself quickly, easily. You get the recipe down. You can make your own non-dairy milks. You can make your own. Yeah, it's so easy to do that. So, so many things. So I just want to encourage people. It's the little changes slowly over time that really make the biggest difference.

It's not completely starting a whole new diet plan starting from tons of processed food to, you know, you're turning your own butter. Yeah. plans starting from tons of processed food to, you know, you're turning your own butter. Yeah. There there's no need to turn your own butter unless if you feel so inclined. Yeah. And then we'll take some. Thank you. Please. Oh no. I mean, that's so true. And I think it's really important to remember that because, um, I don't want anyone to get overwhelmed and, you know, it's important to remember too, that, you know, you can take all's important to remember too, that, you know, you can take all of this information in and implement it, but if it doesn't, if, if you're still not seeing the results that you wanted, you have to remember too, that everyone were so bio-individual. So like what works for me and you may not work for someone

else. And I always say, you know, it's like, um, it's kind of like having a little bit of like a science experiment with your body. You kind of have to test different things and see what works, you know? Yep. And it needs to be a constant evolution too. That goes with what you're eating. That also goes with your skincare products. Yes. It's a big one. And I want to talk about products too, because I know you're the queen. Um, I also wanted to touch. So another thing that I am very interested in, so I, for the longest time, I would, I would argue that I still struggle with this a little bit is dullness in the skin. I'm so concerned about, I want to be, you know, I want my skin to be bright and glowy. And I find that

often my skin looks kind of dull and I think it's gotten better over the years as I've become more honed in on that. But is that, I mean, I would, I would assume by what I know, it's probably a combination of what you eat as well as the skin products that you use. Yeah. So there's a few glow hacks I have for you. Yes. Yes. First one is water. Yep. It's really, yeah. We're drinking my water drinking water right now. It's really amazing what internal hydration will do for your skin. It's kind of crazy. So drinking, you know, half your body weight in ounces is a great place to start. So that's great. Then most people don't realize that they have so much dead skin on the surface of their face. They have a keratinized hard layer of skin and they can put as many body

or as many facial oils, as many products on top, but unless you're really exfoliating and Courtney and I have talked about this before, but unless you're exfoliating and I'm not talking about just necessarily only scrubs. Um, I love enzymes. I love alpha hydroxy acids. I love any kind of chemical exfoliant masks, especially if you're sensitive, sensitive skin, but really getting off that keratinized dead layer of skin and then using your skincare products on that fresh baby skin to give you that glow. Okay. So I want to touch, I want to go into those chemical exfoliants a little bit because when I was at the peak of my acne, I was told you need to scrub it off. And I was getting all of these, like, um, I don't even

know what you call it, like sugar exfoliants. And they were kind of, you know, like the, it just felt very harsh on my skin. And it wasn't until, I mean, it was very recent, like probably a year or two ago that I even understood that there were such things as chemical exfoliants. And, um, yeah. Can you dive into this a little bit and explain different ones and talk about it? Physical exfoliants or anything with a scrubber and dive into this a little bit and explain different ones and talk about it? Physical exfoliants or anything with a scrubber and those can be a little harsher. You want to get something that has a rounded bead. You don't want anything like those apricot scrubs that we used to use that are super harsh, but really physical scrub, physical exfoliant scrubs are

for people a lot of times with mature skin or oily skin or non-sensitive skin, because they can injure your skin. If you have acne, if you have rosacea, if you have active things that are inflammatory sources on your skin and you scrub them, you're going to make that worse. You're going to potentially create a wound with your acne, spread bacteria. So I really think that physical exfoliants are more expert level skincare. Oh, okay. Those are for people who, you know, your skin to the T, you know, that you're not too dehydrated at the moment, you know, all the details, maybe you leave it for your esthetician, but the chemical exfoliants, even though it sounds scary, it sounds like chemical bad. Ooh. Yeah. No,

pretty much what chemical exfoliant means is the chemicals are, they're a solvent. So they're breaking down that sebum, that oil, those dead skin cells, and just slowly, but surely eating them away. And, and they're not interfering with the rest of your healthy living skin. So, okay. It's so interesting. I, like I said, I didn't even know that they existed. So, um, for some, for people that are listening that are new to these as well, what are some of the chemical exfoliants that you would use and what would you use them under different circumstances? Completely.

So I love to start people off with enzymes. Enzymes are naturally derived either from lactose, from fruits, veggies, and they're the most gentle of the chemical exfoliants. So those are ones you could use if you have acne-prone skin, super sensitive skin. I love to use enzymatic masks all the time. Oh, there's one in particular, sorry to interrupt you, is it Naturopathica that has like a cherry enzyme? Is that? Okay. Everyone talks about it all the time. It's the best. It smells like cherry pie. Everyone listening, you have to get it. Courtney, I'll put it in the show notes. Yes, I will. Fantastic. So that's like a great entry point. Most chemical exfoliant products have

some sort of acid, lactic acid, malic acid. There's a glycolic acid, the acids. We love the acids are great chemical exfoliants. Okay. Amazing. And so, um, could anyone start using them or would you say, um, like, let's say I have, so I have pretty dry skin. I don't really break out anymore. And I use glycolic acid and I've really found when I started using that, that my skin did start kind of brightening up a little bit completely. And people with dry skin think that they can't use things like that because it'll make them drier, but really you need to use that in order to get off that dry, flaky skin. But then you need to nourish and hydrate and moisturize with other products. So you can't just do a mask and then go to bed. Your skin's going

to become even more dehydrated. You're going to wake up like a raisin. Completely. Like full raisin. Yeah. So then it does take a few more steps in order to have that glowy skin, but really, you know, doing that three times a week at night, as long as your skin is reacting well, you're not leaving your mask on for too long, which a lot of people do. You're following the directions. Everyone, everyone is guilty. And then doing your, your next steps, you know, your, your toner or your essence and then your serums, your mist, your moisturizer. It depends on how intense you want to get with your skincare routine. I mean, I like a good 15, 20 steps sometimes. Oh my God. Same. I mean, I do, but then while I'm in the middle of it the whole time, I'm like, Oh my God, why? I just want to go to bed. Why I'm on step

two and I have like 15 more to go. And you can keep it simple. Everyone listening, like you could have a three-step skincare routine that works great for you and you're doing, using your chemical exfoliants and living your best life. Yeah. Okay. So that's a good question. So let's say someone listening, they're like, okay, I am not wanting to do the like 15 step. What would you say, or maybe your top three to five most important products for someone who wants glowy, beautiful skin like yours? Oh, so again, bio individually individuality bio. Yeah. So you have to look at what your skin type is, what's happening with it. But a gentle cleanser is so important. We talk about the microbiome of the skin. We don't want to be

over stripping the skin that will cause more oil production, irritation. So really that's like most people are not cleansing properly. They're not cleansing with the right things. You really want to make sure that you cleanse your skin so that it's clean. Yep. Get all that makeup off, get your makeup off. I love to do a one minute wash with a little massage to make sure that you cleanse your skin so that it's clean. Yep. Get all that makeup off. Get your makeup off. I love to do a one-minute wash with a little massage to make sure that you're really, really cleansing. Then using a toner or an essence. Okay.

And a toner usually has a little bit more chemicals fully in it. Fully in it. And essence is usually a little more gentle. Really what you're doing is you're prepping, you're priming, you're balancing the pH for your serum. Okay. So then that, and then if you have a four step routine, do a serum. If you don't, you just want to do three, then a nice hydrating and moisturizing moisturizer. So not an oil. Okay. If you have a three step routine, I do not think an oil should be one of the steps. Okay. Actually, I want to touch on

oils because you hear often that people that have more oily skin or more acne prone skin, that they shouldn't use oils. Is that true? It all depends on the oil. It all depends on the quality of the oil. It depends on your skin. If you're really acne prone, I would stay clear of oils until you really figure out and have a great relationship with your skin and what ingredients work and what don't. Okay. It's just think about coconut oil at the grocery store. You can buy a $25 coconut oil. You can buy a $3 coconut oil. Yeah. The quality matters and it will, the amount it'll clog your pores really determines on the quality and the amount in each product. Yep. So you have to be careful. Okay. So I know that this is something that you're very passionate about. And so am I, because we're on the subject of quality.

I want to dive a little bit into non-toxic skincare and why that is something that you promote so heavily. Um, I talk a lot about ingredients and, um, I think for the most part, people are really starting to understand the importance of the ingredients of their food but we you and i know that with skincare and beauty products in general they're really not regulated at all yep so the beauty labeling laws really haven't changed a lot since the 30s which is frightening which is crazy but in in the eu they have i think over 3 000 banned. I think we have like 30 banned ingredients in the United States, which pretty much means that any company can put anything into your products. And you are absorbing whatever it is from your skin directly into your bloodstream.

So in essence, you're ingesting it the same way you would food. And our skin is our largest organ. It's our largest organ. So you're essentially eating whatever you're putting on your skin. Completely. And with food, we have the FDA, which is questionable at best, but at least there's some regulations. With skincare, there's hardly any. So really you have to focus on what the ingredients are, what's going into your body, not only for the way your skin's going to look, but I mean, the immunotoxicity of a lot of these skincare products when I'm researching, because I research and look up every single ingredient of even what's out there because I love to do dupes. Yes. Oh, you

did a really good one the other day on your Instagram. You guys have to go check it out. Chanel lip gloss. Yeah. It's terrible. I know. But it's one of those things you just really have to figure it out because when you're looking at those ingredients and, and the potential for not only irritation, inflammation, but carcinogens and their bioaccumulative a lot of the times, which people don't realize. Exactly. Which means that over time they accumulate in your body. So if you're using this skincare cream for your whole life. Oh, well, and you think about too, so I'm going to get these numbers wrong because I don't remember the exact numbers, but I looked this up one time. The average woman, think about all the products that we use every day,

the lotions, the creams, the perfume, even the deodorant, all of that, then the makeup. We are exposed to somewhere, I mean, it was like a couple hundred different toxins a day with just all the stuff that we use. And you think about like, okay, so, you know, a little bit here and there. Okay. That's fine. But we're using that every single day. And like you about like, okay, so, you know, a little bit here and there. Okay. That's fine. But we're using that every single day. And like you said, it's bioaccumulative. So over time, we're accumulating that not to mention because there's no regulating bodies for it. We don't even know what all of the reactions are for all these different chemicals in our body at the same time. Yep. Not at all. And there's no way we ever really will. I mean, no one's going to be the

guinea pig for that. Exactly. And there's so many other factors involved. It's hard to correlate certain things with other things. And yeah, um, it's, I find that incredibly interesting. And for people who are new to this listening, there is a website, um, called environmental working group and they have, I forgot what their thing is called. Skin Deep. Skin Deep database. Yes. So good. And like we said with food, you just incorporate the things that you like, the non-toxics you like. And these days they're not your hippie grocery store products. These are highly efficacious, wonderful, chic packaging, smell great. Yep. They're amazing. So you don't have to sacrifice. Yeah. And they work. Completely effic Like, yep. And this is what I love so much about your Instagram because I find out about so many new,

amazing products. I'm like, Oh man, that's so cool. I didn't even know that, you know, like for example, that mask that I mentioned earlier, it's really cool. And you know, another really interesting thing, and this kind of comes back to the hormonal aspect of it. So a lot of these ingredients that we find in some of these more like conventional skincare products, um, are estrogenic, which means that they raise estrogen levels in our body, which is very ironic because sometimes we're using these products to help with acne or, you know, other sorts of skin conditions. And then if we're raising our hormones, then it's completely. Well, and most of them, most of the toxins are hormone disrupting.

Yes. Anyways. Yeah. Like change the estrogen, change all of, of your sex hormones. All, you know, it's, it's really, really a problem. Yeah, it really is. And it's a choice. I mean, I think about it all the time.

Like we live in LA, we're exposed to enough toxins. Like we might not move to Montana tomorrow, but like, why would I put toxic chemicals on my endocrine glands and literally on my underarms with deodorant where it's so close to my breast tissue and I have breast cancer and my family. I mean, we have to really protect ourselves and women's health is so overlooked in every category. It's really, really a travesty and it really, it pains me and makes me so sad and upset. And cosmetics and beauty is a huge, it's a huge red flag right there. No one cares. No one cares about, about women's issues in the healthcare space. All the testing is done on males. No one cares. So why would they care about makeup and beauty products? Exactly. It's why we

don't have regulations on them and why we don't have a lot of studies. If this was going on male faces every day for the most part, and there are men that wear makeup and that's- Of course. Yeah. Obviously. We love it. We're here for it. We love it. Yeah. We're definitely here for that. But if this was a common male space, there would be so many more regulations.

Yeah. I know. It's infuriating. God, it's so true. I'm so glad that you brought up that point because it's very true. Yeah. And again, like we were saying earlier with the food, it's just all connected. What you're putting on your skin in your body. Um, you said this so well earlier, it's like, what is happening inside your body? Your skin is a mirror of that. So I always say, if there's something going on with your skin, it usually means that there's something internal happening and we need to get to the bottom of that. Completely. And when you do, it's going to make your life so much better. So it's perfect. So thank you, skin, for telling us that we need to change some things and that's okay. That's so true. Okay. So you talk a lot

about eat to glow and we touched just very briefly on this, but I want to go kind of into the food aspect of that. Like what are some foods that you recommend to glow? Yes, this is such a good question. I'm glad you asked it. And instead of giving you like a five, five of my top foods to help you glow, like you'll find on the internet, which is kind of BS. It's all about seasonality. It's about organic seasonal food. And really the earth is a lot smarter than we are and what your skin needs in certain climates at certain times of the year. That's what's seasonally in season. Like that's what you should be eating. It's so true. It's so true. We always forget that, you know, cause we're so lucky that we can, we have produce at our fingertips, you know, at the grocery store now, but we forget to shop locally and season or seasonally more,

but like in the summer with the stone fruits, you have the vitamin C right there. And it's the, you know, right kind of bioavailable vitamin C for what you need. So really just shop your farmer's markets. If you don't have access to farmer's markets, look online, what seasonal get things that are local as well, because anything organic and local and seasonal will have the right kind of bacteria to support your microbiome's needs in the right season. Yes. Okay. So I'm glad you brought up the microbiome because I want to touch on this too. The microbiome for people that are listening that aren't aware of what it is. So we have a colony of bacteria really all over our body, but specifically we're talking

about the microbiome in the gut. And this is where 70 to 80% of your immune system lies. We produce 90% of our serotonin there as well. And what's happening in the gut oftentimes, um, is going to show up on your skin and obviously love to talk about food here. And I want to talk a little bit about how to certain foods that we can eat in order to, um, yeah, to help our microbiome support it. Yes. So we want to talk about prebiotics, probiotics, postbiotics, everything. So pretty much you want to inoculate that system with healthy bacteria. Some die off. It's always good to have a constant flow of new bacteria, but you also need to feed the bacteria.

So things like garlic, like onions, like oats, there's prebiotic fiber in so many foods. And that's, again, where we go to the seasonality and bioavailability. When you're eating seasonal, local, wonderful, real food and produce, that's what your microbiome needs to thrive. It's not packaged, sterilized food from a box. Exactly. Well, because you have to remember bacteria are living organisms. Completely. And bacteria actually, I mean, it's so vilified, but we need it. Completely. It's very important. And I do love to eat fermented foods. I eat

fermented foods every day. And that really does help bolster your GI system because all of our ancestors not only had fermentation practices, but they had food like we're talking about, raw, unpasteurized. They didn't really sterilize anything. So you had a lot of healthy bacteria in the world. Now in our current food system, you're not going to get that beautiful bacteria unless you have your own garden. So using fermented foods and really helping to inoculate that microbiome every day is helpful. Yes. That's such a good point. And some great foods that we know for that are sauerkraut, yogurt. If you're dairy free, we can do like coconut yogurt and you have a great recipe for that too. Yeah, we'll put that in the show notes too. Yes, we will. Yeah. I'm struggling to remember other foods right now um kimchi for any veggies i ferment

it's like that portlandia episode like can you ferment that because i've fermented that let me tell you i've done some weird things like trying to ferment apples like that was an interesting one it actually was kind of good it It was like apple relish. No one else would eat it, but I thought it was tasty. I would try it. Yeah. I'm like, it's got bacteria. Great. I'm in. The best is fermented hot sauce. Oh yes. Oh my God. And fermented salsas. So good. I love it. Well, there goes my computer. Let's see. There was so many things I wanted to cover, but I feel like we kind of covered the majority of everything that I wanted to go over. Are there other things that we didn't talk about that you wanted to? Just if anyone needs like an actionable step-by-step easy way to start incorporating some changes in their life to have their healthiest

glowy skin. I have a course. It pretty much takes everything we talked about today and a little bit more product recommendations and breaks it down. Easy video modules, easy checklist. So people can just systematically go through their lifestyle and slowly but surely without any pressure, feelings of being overwhelmed, knock it out. So Skin Confident course. And I'll give a discount. It'll be in the show notes if anyone wants to check it out. And also, if anyone has any specific questions, I check all of my DMs like a crazy person.

And I'm happy to give you any help or assistance you need with your skin. Yeah, she's so good about that. Also, her Instagram is a great resource for it. Like I said earlier, I'm always learning about new fun products that really work too, which is cool. She's very honest about the products that she finds and whether or not she likes them, which is really refreshing and lots of makeup too, which I've been getting more into makeup. And she has a lot of amazing resources for non-toxic just beauty products in general which is really really helpful and then of course the diet aspect of it it's kind of like an all all-encompassing um beauty products diet everything you need for good beautiful glowy skin which is really um it's great it's just so fun. It's really fun. It's fun to watch your, your stories and

your dog and all the cute stuff that you post. So I just love it. Turkey and Ponza. Our dogs are best friends. Well, we're best friends. Then our dogs are best friends. If you ever want to look at either of our Instagrams and see all that, you'll get to know our dogs and their cute little relationship. I love it so much. Well, then I guess that's it for today. Thank you so much for coming on, Celeste. This was so informative. I learned things today, which is really cool.

So I hope everyone listening got a lot that they can take away from today. Thank you so much for having me. And I'm just so excited to listen to more episodes of this amazing podcast and hear all of your wisdom about food because I definitely learned things today too. Yay. Thank you so much for coming on. One more thing before we go. Celeste, where can people find you? So they can find me on YouTube at Celeste Thomas for really in-depth skincare combos and tutorials and things like that. That's great. On Instagram at Celeste Thomas as well. And then my website, The True true spoon is where you can find recipes and different blog posts and stuff like that. Yay. Thanks again. Thanks again for listening to this week's episode

of the real foodology podcast. The show is produced and mixed by Drake Peterson and Christopher McCone of Peterson McCone productions. Hit them up up if you guys have any podcast needs. They are amazing. My theme music is by the singer Georgie. Please subscribe, rate, and comment on either Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or any major podcast platform. If you want to find me on IG,

my handle is RealFoodology. See you guys next week. so I know that's fire It's funny Cause I always see