Realfoodology - Why Your Acne Keeps Coming Back - and How to Stop It for Good

Episode Date: August 12, 2025

262: If you want to get rid of your acne for real, do not miss this episode. Clearstem founders Danielle Gronich and Kayleigh Christina have built more than just a skincare company - they’ve created a community of people dedicated to treating the root cause of acne so it stays away for good. For my listeners thinking about going on Acutane, Spironolactone, or any of the other intense hormone-disrupting acne treatments, please hear out Danielle and Kayleigh first (Alix Earle, they got you). They’re sharing some of their tried-and-true tips for better skin, and the supplements, topicals, and dietary shifts to make it happen.  Topics Discussed: → Why acne is more than skin deep  → Foods most closely linked to acne  → Top pore clogging agents  → Why Spironolactone became the new “it” acne drug - and how to ween yourself off of it  → A acne-safe skincare regiment for Alix Earle that will actually work   → Acne treatment myths  Sponsored By: → Clearstem | Check out https://www.clearstem.com/REALFOODOLOGY for 15% off! Timestamps:  → 00:00:00 - Introduction  → 00:02:41 - Antiaging & Acne  → 00:05:00 - Acne Struggles   → 00:14:39 - Clearstem Acne Panel: How it Works   → 00:19:53 - Pore Cloggers + Filler Agents  → 00:33:55 - Foods That Cause Acne  → 00:39:10 - Supplements, Antidepressants, & Acne → 00:43:46 - Acne Medication Myths  → 00:50:10 - Vitamins That Impact Acne  → 00:54:50 - Acutane and Spirolactone  → 00:59:05 - Clearstem’s Advice for Alix Earle  → 01:03:10 - Courtney’s Clearstem Recs Check Out: → Clearstem Instagram  → Kayleigh Christina  → Danielle Gronich Check Out Courtney:  →  LEAVE US A VOICE MESSAGE →  Check Out My new FREE Grocery Guide! →  @realfoodology →  www.realfoodology.com →  My Immune Supplement by 2x4 →  Air Dr Air Purifier →  AquaTru Water Filter →  EWG Tap Water Database Produced By: Drake Peterson

On today's episode of the Real Foodology podcast, acne is not a vanity issue whatsoever. It is at its core an issue in the body that your body needs something that it's not getting and that can be either, you know, stopping a food that is not agreeing with you or it can be stuff on your skin that is just not compatible with your pores and your oil. So it's really not a vanity issue. It is a mental health issue and your body trying to communicate with you through the alarm bells of your skin. That's really why we create the education that we do is to help support people who are in that period of life, find relief and solutions faster, and also provide a support system and community. Hello, friends. Welcome back to another episode of the Real Foodology podcast.

I'm your host, Courtney Swan, and today I sit down with the founders of Clearson, who also happen to be my dear friends, Kaylee and Danielle. I love the skincare. If you follow me on Instagram, you know, I post about them all the time. A lot of acne-based skin care companies that are targeting specifically acne have ingredients in there that actually age your skin. And this is the exact opposite. Not only does it treat acne, but it also has anti-aging properties as well. So for my girlies that are not dealing with acne, also my guys that are not dealing with acne but are worried about aging skin, you can still use the skincare line. I love their products. I love the ethos of this company. Not only are they helping people get rid of their acne, but they're also helping people

get to the root cause of it. It's not just all about the surface level, although we will talk about triggers for acne that are on the surface level, but we know that oftentimes acne is a deeper issue, usually having to do with diet and gut issues, and we get into all of this. We talk about my favorite products with ClearSim, and they give so much amazing tips and tricks and hacks. You're not going to want to miss this episode. It's so great. And if you want to try any of the clearstem products, make sure that you go to clearstem.com and use code real foodology and you were going to save some money. But make sure that you stay tuned to the very end because they give me their protocol and what they would do if Alex Earle was their client. So you're not going to want to miss

it. I hope you love this episode. If you could take a moment to rate and review it, it helps this show get into more ears, more listeners. And it just means so much to me. Thank you so much for the support. Love you guys. Hope you love the episode. I'm so happy to have you both on today. I've had Kayle on before, but now we have Danielle. So we have both of you guys. Thank you so much for coming on today. It's a fall party. We're so happy to be here with you. Yes. Okay. So one of the first things that I learned from y'all that kind of blew my mind was the fact that acne skin care can often cause aging and they don't pay attention to the aging side of it at all. What is what makes clear them different from that? Yes, we always let people know that they're not crazy if they're feeling

this way. The acne products that dry them out and over-rely on drying out the skin and the antibacterial approach that actually annihilates your skin barrier and causes accelerated aging. When your skin is chronically dry, you get UV damage faster. That's when you get brown spots, pigmentation, wrinkles, melasma, like it literally opens the floodgates to all damage. So then you try to use anti-aging products and they all have these poor clogging filler agents. And when I say most of them, like 95% of products that I've ever reviewed in my decade of doing this have poor clogging filler agents. Wow.

So then you're, you know, getting maybe some anti-aging ingredients like peptides, but it's loaded or it's loaded into an ingredient that has a base filler that's clogging you up. Wow. One of the keys to aging the most gracefully and having the best skin as you get older is protecting your skin barrier. And there's always micro-damage we can create, like microneedling and really have. healthy peels and exfoliation, things like that are micro-damaged for repair. But when you're using products that are consistently creating damage every single day, so let's say you're using

really drying products. Maybe you're also incorporating a really drying retinol. Maybe on top of that, you're also taking a prescription. Like, for example, a spyrnalactone, like spiroinolactone has a side effect of drying out the skin a little bit for some people. And then on top of that, you're also washing your face in hot water, all of a sudden, you're aggressively accelerating the aging of your skin. So we want to make sure that we're really protecting our skin barrier, which is why when we formulated clear stem, it has those elements that get in the pore, physically dissolve the clog and what's causing the acne at the same time hydrating and strengthening the skin barrier. Clearstem is so different because now you are not forced to choose

between anti-acne products that age your skin or anti-aging products that break you out. Before we always had to choose, and every woman in her 30s, who's also breakout prone, was stuck in this impossible place, and Clearstim came and solved that. Yeah, it's incredible. And I want to know, because both of you all have personal stories and how you got started with all this. And I want to hear your stories because my listeners will love this. It's super relatable. Okay. So my personal acne journey was, it still goes on. I just turned 40. I'm still prone to breaking out. It runs in my family really bad on both sides. And I wound up having to do three rounds of acutam. over the course of my 20s, and my acne would come right back every single time within a couple of months. And in between all the acutane, I was on spyrinal lactone, like probably at least four times

going on and off that, spent years on antibiotics, years switching birth controls. And it was so frustrating because it got really bad when I went to college, and I was also studying biology and genetics and immunology. And I would show up to my dermatology appointments with a list of curious questions to ask, and they would not be able to answer it. any of them, like even simple things about how diet impacts your skin or whether dairy is a trigger, they would just be like, well, there's no studies on that. And that was the end of the conversation. So crazy. So that's why I didn't go into medical school is because of what I was going through with my skin. I was like, I don't want to join this system if it's just prescription

writing. So I was in the corporate world, my whole 20s, doing all the acutane. When the last round failed, I was 29. And I was like, screw this. I'll have to figure it out myself. So I became an anesthetian learned all about the skin and that treating acne was the medical profession I'd always dreamed of but didn't know existed. And I started San Diego Acne Clinic and met Kaylee. Yeah. I still thank God every single day for Danielle in meeting her because she broke me out of what we like to call either the vicious acne cycle or a little more positive, the clear skin chase that we are all after all the time. But honestly, I was in that vicious acne cycle at the time. So I had gotten up birth control. I was in my mid-20s at the time. I decided to get off birth control. I was so

passionate about health and wellness. I was going through a few different programs to even bump up my knowledge even more within the health and wellness and nutrition space. I'm an integrative health practitioner now. So I was really passionate about getting off prescriptions and actually getting to the root cause of what was going off my body. And also just having my hormones fluctuate naturally, just really being in touch with my own body. So when I was 24 years old, I got off birth control, and I was also on Prozac during this time as well. So what we know now, because there's a lot of studies on it, but so many women who are put on birth control at a really young age are very soon after prescribed an antidepressant or an anti-anxiety medication. And it's now very much linked that birth control can cause these side effects of having more anxiety, feeling more depressed.

So it's a pretty high number that women are on both at the same time if they were put on birth control. So I get off both in my mid-20s, and my skin completely freaks out, bright red, inflamed cystic acne, up both sides of my cheek, down my neck. I have a whole wealth of other issues going on in my body at the time. But I spent about a year trying to fix my acne myself. I put myself through every single protocol I could possibly imagine every diet, every elimination, Sebo, low Fodmap diet, anti-parasitic, you name it. Nothing was working. Nothing was changing.

I didn't know anything about skincare at the time. I really knew just, at the time, Instagram stories didn't even exist. So we found out our knowledge from just Googling and Pinterest and, like, magazines still. So, like, and just like what you are marketed towards. Like, those are really, like, the only three places that we were hearing this information. This was in 2015. And so I first tried. like really, really clean DIY things at home. Nothing worked. Then I tried clean skin care from

some local boutiques. It just got even worse. Then I tried really harsh topicals. And I tried drugstore, just like classic drugstore brands that like were all fed help with acne. Then I tried dermatologists and like clinical based ones, everything. My skin was just getting worse, like worse and worse and worse. So finally I broke down, went to multiple doctors, multiple dermatologists. The only solutions I was given was go back on birth control, go on antibiotics, acutane. They were just skipping spiroinolactone at this point because my acne was so aggressive. Didn't want to go back on birth control and antibiotics certainly didn't make sense to me because how aggressive my acne was, there was clearly something wrong and I just felt antibiotics could act

like I felt personally antibiotics could make it worse because my gut was clearly compromised at the time. So I started the process to go on acutane. My mom was calling me begging me not to go on it. She was like, it's so destructive to your liver. Like please don't do this. And I truly felt like I had no other option at the time. So I started the process for anyone that's listening that's never been on Accutane. You have to take two pregnancy tests 30 days apart and you also have to consent to being on two forms of birth control. Two forms? Yeah, so whether it's a birth control and condoms or signing documents that's saying you'll be absent. So I went through that process and thank goodness a few days before I was about to pick up my prescription

for Accutane. One last Google search, I found San Diego Acne Clinic. Didn't you. Danielle spent three hours with me. And everything we went over in her clinic is now everything that's rolled into clear stem and how we educate and talk to our consumer and take them through the San Diego Acne Clinic checklist. But now Clearstem consumers have access to it. Danielle cleared my skin in two months. Wow.

Yeah. We identified my root causes of acne, eliminated them. Poor clogging ingredients, certain supplements, certain foods. And I got on proper topical. I learned how to properly exfoliate and restore my skin barrier and, yeah, completely clear my skin in two months. I wish that I had found you when I was in my 20s, Danielle, because I was also struggling with really deep cystic acne all along my jaw for four years.

And similar to Kaylee's story, I felt like I tried everything under the sun, every topical, every drugstore, every harsh chemical, and I tried changing my diet. I felt like I tried everything. And this is what makes me so excited about Clear Stem, because I know that when you're in that place, you're so desperate that you will literally do anything to get rid of it. Yes. Even in between my rounds of acutane, I was like looking on Craigslist to like try to buy some. I was so desperate. Oh, God. I mean, it's horrible. And now that you guys have Clear Sam and I want to talk about the acne panel because this to me was so revolutionary. When you guys came out with this, I was, oh my God,

I was like, yes, because not only are you creating the topical solutions, but you're also creating the ability for people to get to the root cause of it. And I wish that I'd had access to this. in my 20s when I was dealing with this. So can we talk about the acne panel and what you test for? Definitely. I'd first love to know what finally solved it for you. Yeah. Okay, so I think it was a combination of a couple things. Someone told me that I needed to address my liver. Yes. Love them for that. Yeah. So, and throughout the whole process, I was doing hormone panels, like towards the end of it, towards the beginning of it, I was doing all the stuff I mentioned, and then towards the end, I started getting tips from people like, okay, you should get a hormone panel done. You need to

address your liver, so cleanse out your liver. So I was doing a lot of stuff to protect my liver and take like dandelion root and stuff like that. And then I think for me looking back was when I started eating meat, I think it normalized a lot of things in my body. Were you vegan at the time? I was, yeah. Okay. Yes, a lot of my vegan clients. And you know what, there is no perfect diet for everyone. The perfect diet is the one that you're going to get the most nutrition and that makes you happy, right? So we don't want to demonize vegan or carnivore or anything in between. But I have noticed that a lot of my vegan clinic patients, unless you're meal prepping like crazy and eating a ton of beans and lentils, you're not getting enough protein. Their blood sugar seems to be really, really high.

It's just too carb heavy. I think that was my issue. That's the issue for most people, right? And it's not like carbs are bad at all, but if you don't have the right amount of protein to balance it out, it's going to be problematic for most people's blood sugar. And I've noticed that the skin doesn't repair as well. When people start adding in really clean meat or fish, even if it's a few times a week, they tend to start feeling better, have more energy, and their skin does tend to respond a little more favorably. Probably from the collagen, too, I would assume, right? All of it.

All of it. Repairing and the protein. Yeah, that's really fascinating. I think, and I didn't draw the, there was no connection made until years later, and I started looking back at the timeline, and I started getting this really aggressive acne around the time that I had gone vegetarian. It was maybe a couple months into it, and then it didn't go away until after I started eating meat again.

It was really interesting. And before that, I had never dealt with acne in my whole life. I was like, what is going on? I was in my 20s. Like, I never really had it when I was in high. I had a little bit, but not like this. And this was the kind where one would go away and then another one would pop up literally the next day.

Oh, my gosh. I was like, for four years, I was like, dear gone. Yeah. It was horrible. And you know, the crazy thing is, is you are studying yourself in the mirror every single day when you're struggling with acne that there may be like 20 cysts or breakouts on your face, but you notice every. single new one coming. Oh yeah. You can feel them pulsing throughout the day. I just I remember

that like very almost like obsessive component to that time in life where like every time I walk by a mirror I was stepping in. I was looking. I was examining. Could I pop any of them? And then just like the negative cycle in my head would just be going crazy. And that's really why we create the education that we do is to help support people who are in that period of life, find relief and solutions faster and also provide a support system and community. Like our clear system community is so supportive. The acne lab panel that we were just talking about that we'll dive a little more into. But when everyone goes through the acne lab panel, they are automatically entered into our

membership, which is an online community of everyone who's gone through the acne lab panel. And there's a ton of videos in their support, but there's a chat group in there. And everyone is helping each other all of the time, giving solutions too, because maybe some people are shifting their diet, what they're eating. for breakfast, lunch, or dinner, maybe there's people who are vegan who are introducing meat for the first time or need to get a higher protein diet while living a vegan lifestyle in the community is so welcoming, so supportive, just meets everyone where they are and provides like, oh, I've been making this for breakfast and like this is meat free or like this isn't is vegan

or like this is how I slowly introduce meat back into my diet or fish or whatever it may be, but it's the most beautiful group of humans. That's so cool. I love having the support for people like that. It's necessary because you don't get that from, you're not going to get that from your dorm. That's not what they're there for. And our medical system, not going to rant about it, but our medical system is prescription based. And they've got about seven to 12 minutes per patient, and then they've got to see more. The average doctor is so overwhelmed. They want to do better. They want to look in other places, but they are often penalized if they run labs that are not deemed medically necessary. They literally get penalized by the insurance companies.

That is insane. Yep. So if your liver comes, if your markers come back within, quote, normal range, they're not allowed to run anymore, most of them, right? So it's an issue because normal in America is not healthy. So our acne lab panel actually looks at a lot more markers, looks at about 86 markers from the lens of how the markers are impacting your skin specifically. And we look at optimal ranges for things like liver and T-cell.

We look at gut function. And we also look at something called IGF, insulin-like growth factor, which is a huge driver of hormonal acne, especially on the chin and jaw, and it comes from dairy. So we can actually tell people with certainty, hey, your IGF1 is high. You need to cut out dairy and weigh protein because no one wants to cut out cheese until they're actually handed the proof that they need to cut out cheese, right? So that's the level of precision that we're able to deliver for people when they have been told that their labs are, quote, normal, even though they're covered in cystic acne. The insulin-like gross factors, the glucose levels lately have been alarming. Yeah, fasting glucose.

Yeah, we were just talking about it with Hannah on our team who runs the acne lab panel, and she always gives us updates to new patterns she's seeing at alarming rates. And the first one, which was months ago, was heavy metals. She was like, I am seeing numbers that never before my career I've seen. and in the young patients, too. And then the most recent one she's been sharing with us that are at alarming levels is the fasting glucose. Even mine is really, really high.

And even though I don't eat sugar now and I certainly don't eat sugar in the morning, I was talking to a longevity doctor about this. I was like, why is it still so high? I take inocatal. I've taken berberine. Why is mine still so high? And she said it can be your body got programmed that way from what you ate when you were young. So a lot of the sugary things that we are loaded with as kids.

like frosted flakes and weedies and all the stuff. Pop tarts. All the stuff. All the stuff we ate as kids. That can have a programming effect that we then have to deal with later, even though we're not eating that way anymore. But to your point and to Kaylee's point, too, when you're going through it, you're trying everything. But if you don't have the full puzzle, you're going to be missing key pieces and you won't get where you need to go. And then you have no clue of what you tried worked. Like say you switched to products without pork cloggers, but you were still eating a bunch of dairy. You're not going to know if it was the products or not. You're going to be like these products didn't work for me, but it was your diet all along, or vice versa.

So, yeah, really piecing together the entire complete puzzle is what was missing in the acne community, and that's what Clearstem takes a lot of pride in. It's the internal and external components of acne and skin health tied in a way that no one has ever done before, and that's why we've grown so fast. Yeah, I mean, it's revolutionary. Never have we seen a company that is trying to help you address it with the topical, but then also trying to help you address it internally. So this is what I love so much about ClearStem, is you all really care. You built an amazing community around this, and you're truly helping people get to the root cause so they can get rid of their acne. I feel like so many of these companies, they say they want to help you get rid of your acne, but then if they actually get rid of your acne, then you no longer have a use of these products anymore.

And that's what's so cool about you have your acne panel. And then also not only is it targeting acne, but it's also targeting anti-aging. You know, like I use all of your products, and I'm obsessed with them, and I don't even have acne, and I still, I love them. And your skin looks flawless. glowing. All of the formulas can be looked at and consider it. Like, if you didn't know anything about acne, you'd look at the ingredients stack and be like, this is the best anti-aging line I've ever seen. Yes. Or you'd look at it and be like, this is like one of the cleanest lines I've ever seen. We don't use parabens or thalates or any of that stuff. But it's actually all

of those things without the poor clogging filler agents that break everybody out. And that is the key differentiator. So even if you don't have acne, it's going to transform your skin. It just also won't clog you up. Okay. So let's talk about this because this is another thing. There have been a things that you guys have blown my mind with. And one of them was, there are so many products on the market that are targeted to acne-prone skin, or they will say that they don't have pork-clogers, and they actually have pork-clogers. Yeah, that's the non-comitogenic term. It's the clinical way of saying no pork-loggers, right? But the term is non-comitogenic, you know, low-comitaginacy rating. It has to do with comodones. That's the technical name for a pimple.

So brands put that on there, and they don't go through the actual testing. We see it all the time. The enforcement on things like this is minuscule. And in order for someone to actually, like, create a situation where there would be enforcement, they would have to know that that product broke them out. Hire an attorney who would take on their case and somehow prove that those products gave them acne. That's really hard to do because acne is multifaceted. So a lot of these brands just put it on there, and they march forward, especially a lot of these brands on Amazon. They're from some offshore lab that does not give a shit about you.

And they will say every marketing term in the book just to get you to buy their stuff because they go by the keywords that people want to hear. So the marketing deception is really high in the skin care industry. And that's why we first of all, we know as acne specialists what those ingredients are. And we even made a checker so people can verify everything else they're using. But we actually go ahead the step further and put all of our formulas through actual comedogenic testing, which is expensive. Not every brand is going to invest in that. Yeah. What's interesting, too, about the community genesis testing is it's not as comprehensive as our

lens of pork cloggers. So a lot of times it comes down to, is this ingredient going to cause an allergic reaction? That's not always, acne's not necessarily an allergic reaction. Obviously, we know how many things contribute to acne. So it's a little more focused on, like, rashes and just like, again, other, like, allergy reactions to things. So it's, even when brands do put it through commutagency testing and put non-communogenic on the front, many times I've turned it over and it still has coconut oil and shea butter in it, which is still something that can break people out, especially for the acne prone, coconut oil is the number one no-no.

But there's still a lot of ingredients that aren't included in that testing. It just hasn't been updated, and it hasn't been updated through a lens of poor clogging ingredients as comprehensive as our research has shown. Yeah, and a lot of formulas might start out. Like, say they did all their checks and balances and the product was safe, people reformulate all the time to reduce their cost of goods. Or they get bought out by a big conglomerate, you know, say like a L'Oreal bought them, for example. Nothing's wrong with L'Oreal, but you know what I mean.

They get bought up by someone for a store of business, reduce your cogs, reduce the cost of goods. They do that by using the cheap fillers. You'll see things like Ethel-Hexylpomitate, which the average consumer is not aware of. It's not taught about it. Not taught about in medical school, but it's this complex. and filler agent derived from palm oil or coconut oil that has a long shelf life. And brands use this all the time. It's in a ton of makeup and a ton of sunscreen and a ton of moisturizers. The irony is that when I had acne, I was putting coconut oil on my face. Oh, we all tried that.

Every 10 years it comes back. Society has amnesia every decade. Every 10 years, we forget everything. And all the estheticians that have been doing this for a while are screaming. Stop doing this. But then they get super busy and they're doing extractions of little gold balls of wax from the coconut oil. And we see it like every 10 years. I feel like beef tallow is the new coconut oil. What are your thoughts about beef tallow on the face? It's not as bad as coconut oil in terms of comedogenesis. So that comedogenic scale is a zero to five for its likelihood to clog your pores, right?

Zero is totally safe like water, hyluronic acid, aloevara. Then most stuff is in the middle. And then the fives are the things like coconut oil, ethyl-huxlepomotate, ice-pros. groupomera state. So, you know, that's zero to five. Beef tallow sits at a two. So if you do the math, that's about a 40% chance that's going to clog your pores if you're acne prone. That is too high of a chance. Yes. If, so some people say like, oh my God, I did, I switched to beef tallow and it healed my acne. Okay, to me, that says what you were using before was higher on the comedogenic scale. Maybe you were using something like coconut oil. So the perception is that it's helping or

their skin was so dry because they were relying on benzoporoxide every day that their barrier was so compromised and that kept ruining their skin that giving it a little bit of hydration in the form of beef tallow made them come back alive again, right? So everything is not bad or good in a, you know, vacuum. It's in relation to everything else you're using and what you were using before. But for the acne prone, beef tallow is not your best friend. There are so many better options. Yeah. I personally wouldn't put beef tall on my face. Also, it's gross. It's weird to me the sourcing of it as well. Like, we always talk about how brands love to use every, bit of leftover product. So beef tallow is typically something that was used over before. A lot of times

when you see a new marketing trend, it came from something that was left over. Colostrum is a big one of that too. Left over, you're not really supposed to have colostrum past what, like 10 days old. Because like colostrum only comes out of breast milk for the first five days a week. It's like about that. Don't count me on that. But it doesn't come out for the entire time out of your breast milk. And we're starting to eat it every single day, which to me is just, just noted in my head. I'm not sure how I feel about it, but it's one of those things that like, I feel like it's a little, we'll see. We'll see what happens with claustrum. But same with beef tallow, it's left over. It's rendered beef fat. If it's not from grass fed, grass finished

cows, toxins get stored in fat. So you are having the place of the animal where the most toxins are stored. And then you are putting that all over your body, which we know what we put on our body, gets absorbed into our bloodstream. That is wide knowledge. It's why doctors will prescribe topical estrogen or topical magnesium, because we know it gets absorbed through our bloodstream. So now we're putting this rendered beef fat where we don't know the source. We have no idea what that cow went through or what toxic things are in that fat. And we're putting it under our body and it's going into our bloodstream. Personally, doesn't sit well with me. To each their own, but I don't know. I don't know. It's the stuff that's left over in your pan after you ground

meat. It is gross. Put it on your feet. If you have cracked heels, put it on your feet, elbows, knees, and toes. But also, be careful bottom of the feet, because that's like one of the quickest ways to absorb things into your bloodstream, like through skin, bottoms of feet. So cracked heels, like go for like the elbows, knees, backs of heels. How about just avoid and use castor oil? Which actually is even thicker, but has a comedogenic rating of zero. What? Yeah, you can put It doesn't put it on your face? I wouldn't put it on your face, though, because it can stimulate hair growth. Yeah.

Oh, that's true. That's true. I just put it on the eyebrows. Yeah. Yeah. Don't put it on over your face. But it is actually acne safe, even though it's thick. So the comedogenic conversation is not well understood at all.

It is not covered in medical school. That's why it's not being talked about in your dermatology appointments. We're the ones talking about it. And it's a big deal. There's something called Acne Cosmetica, which is going to get more attention. There's some old studies on it, but it's literally the acne that has caused not from hormones, not from bacteria, but from cosmetics. And there's a lot of different reasons something could break you out. Some people are allergic to some types of fragrances and high

quantities, but for the most part, it's poor clogging ingredients. So, yum. I want to know what are some products that people don't normally think about that have poor cloggers in them? A big one is hair conditioner. Yes. Yes. This also blew my mind from y'all. So a lot of people who struggle with scalp or back acne or heavier on your sleep side. But most people identify with back acne a little bit more. Hair conditioner is the number one cause. Number two, there is an internal component to back acne. And a lot of times it's linked to the bladder. So we can easily see that through our acne lab panel. But we always like removing the first and easiest variable, which would be hair conditioner, right? Because blood work takes a little longer.

it's a very high percentage that it's coming from your hair conditioner because it's meant to physically coat your hair. So when you're washing it off in the shower, it's going to physically coat your back and then clog your pores. And especially if we're sweating, you work out, ponytail, hair in general, just touching. So, yeah, so swapping out for non-poor clogging hair conditioner. Yeah, people always blame the pillowcase. It's not your poor pillowcase. It's your hair conditioner that's getting the residue on your pillowcase. That's mixing with your sweat and dead skin and being driven into your pores at night because our pores kind of like constrict at night when our body temperature fluctuates. So you can have a brand new pillowcase every

night but have a really, you know, thick coconut oil based conditioner and still break out. But it's not inherently the pillowcase. That's so fascinating. I would have never thought about this until you guys came out with your shampoo and conditioner, which I love, by the way. Isn't it good? It's the best. I actually also have it in my guest bathroom. And recently my, my fiance's parents stayed with us. And after they left, she literally texted me. And she said, what was that shampoo and conditioner that you had in the bathroom? I loved it. And so I sent her a link because she loved it. Oh, my gosh. I'm so cute. Yeah, product took us like a year and a half to formulate. Oh my gosh. It's so good. All the other acne safe conditioners out

there, there's not many, but there's a few. They are so drying. They make your hair feel terrible, especially if you're like a blonde or do any or you have like curly hair, ethnic hair. You need a little more moisture. They're terrible. And most conditioners have pork cloggers in it, especially for drier hair. Like the more moisturizing formulas are going to have things like shay butter and coconut oil. So we had to make one that was moisturizing and like salon quality, because that's what we want. But without those butters, we actually sourced an entirely different butter called Kokom butter that's similar to Shea Butter, but doesn't have any comedogenic properties. It's amazing. And Hector's mom loves it now, too. So I've better hooked on it.

I love it. The other. ones are too just if you're doing a full sweep of your products um moisturizers and sunscreens are the top one with poor cloggers and then when it comes to makeup i know we've mentioned this already but i just want to re-reference it companies reformulate all of the time and so a lot of times we'll run into someone and you know they'll be like what's causing my acne we're like taking a look at their face and it's in the exact pathway of a bronzer and so we're like this looks like your bronzer like it's in the direct Pathway you put it on. They're like, no, no, no, it can't be my bronzer. I've used the same bronzer for 10 years. This actually happened on a live podcast like a year ago. It was so funny.

Yeah, yeah. She was like, no, it's, it is not my bronzer. I've used it for 10 years. And we sit there and we look it up and we found like three big pork cloggers in it. She removed it. Her acne started going down within a few days. Wow. So again, they could have reformulated it. That's definitely one cause of it. But another one is our skin can change and our hormones change as we get older. So what affected us when we were younger may affect us differently. Also, things can affect us more the week before our period. Testosterone is higher, which means there's a thicker oil that's produced in our skin. So our pores clog a little bit faster.

So there's also certain times in the month where things may break us out that don't necessarily break us out the other times the month. So it's just something to be really aware of during the week before your period. And just in general, when you go to buy a new version of your favorite bronze or your favorite foundation, recheck it, and always make sure, I know this is like kind of frustrating sometimes, but the most up-to-date ingredients are always on the packaging. You'll see this on websites all the time. It'll have a little asterisk to the bottom, and it'll say ingredients subject to change, reference the packaging for most up-to-date ingredients.

I know. Yeah, it's on every single product page. I know it's a little frustrating, but just cross-reference really quick to make sure it matches. Because it's easier to copy and paste off the product page, of course, indoor poor clogging checker. But when you get it, just do like a quick double check if you think it's breaking you out. You know, I mean, if it starts to signal something. Yeah. And just because some, that's such a good point. People think they've been using something so long that they rule it out as a possibility. We got to get rid of that. That's the black or white thinking. And, you know, it's usually the culprits are right in front of you. They're in the things you're using daily. And brands do reformulate all the time.

And also, your skin kind of changes. Getting off birth control can make something break you out that never used to break you out. So it's really good to just sit down, clean slate, look through all your products, just copy paste the ingredient deck into our checker. It'll show you in red which ingredients are known to clog pores. And then you can see, okay, maybe it's only one ingredient and it's really far down on the deck, which means it's a lower percentage of the formula. It might be okay for you.

You know what I mean? If you're not that acne prone. But you'll have that information. If there's like five ingredients in red and they're the top ingredients that make up the most of the product, you've got to get that out of your life. You'll never get clear. Yeah, that poor clogger checker is amazing. That's great. I love that you guys created that. We do feel it's the most comprehensive one out there. There's a lot of like, I feel like everyone's got a list now, right? And then people want to like add stuff to theirs to make it seem like it's the most extreme or whatever.

And we get, you know, asked a lot like what's with the differences in some poor clogging list. That's because we have a very different method of making ours. It's based on 10 years of clinical expertise. at San Diego Acne where me and my team extract the pores and look at what's inside. How hard is it? How yellow is it? And we match it to the products that the person was using. And then we have cosmetic chemists on our team that also specialize in acne. And then we have our blood work wing where we can see what aggravates some people based on like a heightened immune system or situation. Right. So our list is edited and it's like extremely comprehensive but without fear mongering. Yeah. So I want to go, I want to move into diet.

because I know diet also plays a huge role with acne as well. What are some of the biggest diet triggers that can contribute to acne? I want to add some context first. We always recommend the foods and supplements where we're about to talk about. We always recommend that people do an elimination diet with them. So recommended removing these for 60 days. Then slowly integrating them back in, if you choose, like if there's one that you want to slowly integrate back in, seeing how your body responds. These are not things that you necessarily have to. remove forever, but this is a part of a healing protocol. Like, if you really want to get clear and you want to get out of the clear, or get in the clear skin cycle, get out of the vicious

acne cycle, you should eliminate these for 60 days, see how your skin responds, bring it back in slowly, because there are things that can perpetuate your acne and keep you stuck in that cycle. So just want to create context. We never want to create fear of food. We know sometimes a lot of people when they take allergy tests, random foods will show up that are being triggered for random reasons. And all of a sudden, people have these extreme fear of foods. Like, lettuce will show up. Strawberry, like, very random foods. But it's not necessarily that they're allergic to the rest of their, like for the rest of their life. It is that period of time of healing, integrate it back in. Yeah. I will say this too. Sometimes those show up if you eat those foods a lot.

Yes, that too. Yeah. You're just overdoing it. So the first one we always like to talk about, which was my biggest trigger is eggs. I was making, when I met Danielle. It's one of my biggest triggers, too. I cannot have eggs, literally. I was making egg bowls. Egg bowls was a part of my personality. I was, I remember the look of sadness on your face

when I told you you needed to cut them out for a while? I didn't know what to do with my life when Danielle told me that, which is a lot of times, like, what our community meets us with, too? They're like, what do you mean? I was, this was the time of Snapchat, like stories, and then stories was just coming out on. Instagram too. My whole personality was making different egg bowls every single morning. So when Danielle told me to remove eggs, I was like, you don't understand the people like my

egg balls. What am I going to do for stories now? People what they want. Yeah, eggs was a big one for me, though. I've been able to integrate them back in, so I just want to share this with everyone, about two days a week. And I'm fine with that. There's been days where I overdo it back to back. And sure enough, my jaw line, here comes some more acne. But I know exactly that it was. I was like, I went too hard on those eggs. So I'm good one to two days a week with eggs now. Eggs is a big one for people for multiple reasons. A big one is albumin protein.

It can clog up our lymphatic system a little bit. Get stuck. You'll see acne around your jaw line, a little bit under your jaw as well. So if you're struggling with someone struggling with those bumps, also excess chicken can also be a little link to this too. Because at one point, I was overdoing it with rotissory chicken. Like, you know, when you buy a rotissory chicken, all of a sudden, you're like eating a lot of it because you're making a salad and you're also.

also eating it because you're hungry, and all of a sudden, like, you're eating way more chicken than you'd ever normally eat. If I ever overdue with that, I will see breakouts in the same pathways that I see eggs. So that's a big one. It also dampens our system a little bit, too. We were actually just talking to Dr. Axe about this a few weeks ago, and we were going off on eggs, and he was like, yeah, I see it dampen the immune system a lot for people. You create an immune burden for a lot of people. I've heard this too. It's a part of a lot of elimination protocols. So there's a reason for that. It's on the top allergen list. Like, there's a lot of brands that are like, we don't include the seven top

allergens. Eggs is on there. So it's just something to notice. Quality does matter, but not as it relates to acne. Like, if you want to bring eggs back in, go that pasteurase, go organic, go corn-free, soy-free, all of those things. But it's not necessarily going to shift the way you break out from acne. And so eggs is a top one. Yeah, definitely a huge one. Even after my three rounds of acutane. I had become an esthetician. My products were perfect. My skin was really, really good, like flawless for like a year and a half. But then I noticed that, so a couple of things happened. I wasn't eating enough because I was seeing like 12 patients a day. So I was doing like hardcore intermittent fasting and I messed with my digestive system. So whenever I would eat

meat, I would get crazy food coma. So I was like, I need my protein, but it needs to be softer and more easy to digest. So I was getting the best eggs ever from the farmer's market. And I was having like three or four of those a day. And this was before we knew about eggs. a trigger. My acne was, it came back full vengeance, cystic acne, face, neck, chest, back. It was devastating. And then just after doing more research, I figured out that that might be what it was, eliminated them. And then within like three weeks, there was no new ones. Everything had gone down. But it's a big trigger. And they were the highest quality ever. So I did try to reintroduce them back. I can have like maybe one egg a month, but I won't go more than that. If I have more than that,

I will get assist. But I'm more acne prone than Kaylee. And your level of acne-prone or how acne-prone you are is also going to factor into how much of these rules you need to embrace and how strictly. But we always encourage everyone know for themselves. Elimination tests are a sign of discipline and self-care. You do it. And then you purposefully go have an omelet or you go have a bunch of cheese and you see what happens. Yeah. Well, and you'll have this amazing supplement. It's called mind-body skin. And I have some friends. that anytime they want to eat, you know, something that normally will cause them to break out. Like, for example, I have a friend that loves cheese.

And she can't always do it because whenever she does it, whenever she eats it, she breaks out. But she said that when she takes one of these and she eats cheese, that she doesn't normally break out. Yeah. Yep. My body skin is incredibly, incredibly effective. Yeah. I formulated this in direct proportion to the lab work that was coming back from all my clinic

patients. I had partnered with a different lab work person who had both Eastern training and Western in training. And she was just phenomenal. She helped me tremendously with a random, like, liver thing that I was dealing with. And I wound up sending all my clinic patients to her, and people would come back with the same stuff over and over and over again. Mind body skin was formulated to address those patterns. So there is, you know, bioavailable vitamin A, which helps with inflammation and oil and skin shedding. Then there's dim, which is totally necessary nowadays to help with estrogen metabolism. There's a liver and lymph blend with dandelion and milk thistle. Then there is 5HTP for

stress response that helps with that PMS acne. And then there is some glutathione and some digestive support as well. So it makes your body less acneic. Like all the systems that are responsible for your skin's behavior, it helps to calm them down. That way, when you do have something like cheese or milk that has that hormonal surge, your body's more equipped to handle it and you just don't break out as much. Yeah. We also have a mind body skin too that is the exact same just free of 5HTP because what we noticed, we launched our mind body skin and a lot of our community told us like, hey, I'm on SSRI medication and it's not always recommended from doctors to be on two things that enact on your serotonin levels. And since 5HTP does have a correlation and acts on serotonin, it's best and

recommended to not be on an SSRI, depression or anxiety medication, and also 5HTP. And we heard this. We listened to our community and we immediately formulated one without 5HTP. So anyone who is on an SSRI medication, which a lot of people who are struggling, who are struggling with acne are. So we made the mind body skin to our second version for that community. Yeah, that's interesting. I wonder what the correlation is there. I mean, I think it's like acne. Maybe they're also in birth control. Yeah, yeah, birth control. stressed out. Yeah.

Life is stressful. And acne is not just a cosmetic or like a vein issue or I want to look prettier in any way. It really is a psychological issue. People who are struggling with acne, it's weighing on them. They're looking in the mirror. They're becoming obsessive about it. They don't feel as good about themselves. They don't put themselves out there for as many opportunities.

They may say no to dates. Like Danielle and I both went through that. Like I stopped hanging out with friends. Like I didn't leave my house. I would cancel on dinners. I would cancel just being in any groups of people whatsoever. And so we've both been there. We understand the mindset of our community during that time and life.

And we know how many people just turn to medication to really support themselves during it. And so we're here to support everyone else in every which way, whether someone's on a medication or not on a medication, we can support with our skin care and also mind-body skin in both ways. Yeah. Acne is not a vanity issue whatsoever. It is at its core an issue in the body that your body needs something, that it's not. getting and that can be either, you know, stopping a food that is not agreeing with you or it can be stuff on your skin that is just not compatible with your pores and your oil. So it's really not

a vanity issue. It is a mental health issue and your body trying to communicate with you through the alarm bells of your skin. Exactly. Well, it's a sign and a symptom. Our bodies are always trying to tell us things. And it's a sign and symptom that something needs to be addressed and you need to figure out what that is so that you can you can heal your body you know there is a plus side to it you know inflammation shows up in different ways in people if you're acne prone it's going to show up in your skin if you have a weakened gut it's going to show up as like ibs so that the stress and you know anything going on in your body it's going to show up some way this is just how it shows up for us but at least we can see it and we have to deal with it instead of it just being like a silent killer

and turning into you know some you know chronic condition down the line or turning into cancer or something like that, you know what I mean? So at least we have the alarm bells going off loud and in our face, literally, when there's something wrong so that we can pay immediate attention to it. Yes. Okay, so we've been talking a lot about acutane, and I want to know what your opinion is on acutane and also spirulactin. Is that how you say it? Spirnalactone. Okay, spirnalactone. Okay, what are you? Spiro. See, Spiro. It's spiro for sure. Spirolactone. Is that you say? Spiro no lactone. Yes, but you can call it Spiro. So I want to know your thoughts on Tretanoan. Oh, no.

We can talk about Tritanoin. I definitely want to talk about that, too. Tretanoin. Go off. I want to hear. So let's talk about that first. So there's a couple, so there's different types of retinoles. Some are over the counter. Some are, you know, some are great from a lot of people. Like for anti-aging, a lot of people swear by their retinol. That is fantastic. It's an exfoliant, but it's a different type of exfoliant that kind of keeps working long after you take it off. and it is known to be a little bit disruptive to the barrier, especially when you get in the higher strengths or the higher, like the more aggressive

compounds, especially the ones that they prescribe for acne. So trotenoin is kind of like the generic term or the generic version, if you will, and then there's retinae. Most people get put on retinae, and it's the white cream version, and it has a poor clogging filler agent in it. It has isopropyl mirror state. And isopropal mirror state, if you are a real acne specialist, is you know to stay the hell away from that ingredient. It's like the number one thing that you

memorize, like when you're looking at people's ingredients for them. Isopropylumera state breaks you out. That is like one of the key filler agents in the white version of retinae. A lot of people, you know, get a really nasty purge when they first start and they're told to just wait it out. They're told to give it a few months, you know. And we all know that like getting back in with your derm isn't that easy. It can take two months to get an appointment. You get there. Like, oh, it's acclimating. Wait again. And then you maybe get another appointment three months later. You're going through hell for like six months, hoping that it's going to finally work for you. For some people, it does.

For some people, it gets them a little bit better, but not really. And it's so aggressive that their scars can't heal. And their scars are still really, really red, and their skin feels waxy. And for some people, it makes it far worse, and it never gets better. That is what happened to me, and it's happened to so many people I know. And it's because it's still clogging the pore as it's exfoliating. So you're peeling a little bit. You're getting all the symptoms of dryness.

peeling and flakiness. And then you're also breaking out and causing new acne at the same time. It is maddening. So if you have tried retinae and it has not worked for you and it's been months and months, stop taking it, stop using it. It's not compatible with you. I have several, several friends that have gotten a form of dermatitis on the face. Perioral dermatitis is another thing that it can cause. It can also flare up rosacea, eczema, all that. I think it's just very inflammatory, in my opinion, for most people. Courtney and I have a mutual friend who went on retina. obviously just for like anti-aging, for acne, for all the things.

And then she got perioral dermatitis, tongue twister with everything, parieteratitis. And then she went back to dermatologist and got put on antibiotics for her PD. I was going to call it PD, faster, easier, then got put on antibiotics. Then there was like something that went on with her gut. I think she, oh, then she got like inflamed or something weird happened with that. And then she was put on steroids because of it. all because she went on retinae in the beginning. And I remember, like, she actually came to our pop-up shop last year on Abbott Kinney.

She was, like, in tears. And she was like, I've been through this crazy cycle, and it all started with just putting this cream on my face. She was like, I wish they just would have told me or, like, said this could happen or could lead to this. I would have asked for other options or maybe chosen not to do it. But she truly felt like she wasn't given the choice. And that's what was so upsetting.

So we put her on, we put her on clear stand. We got her on, like, like, a barrier. of routine, strengthening barrier routine, and her skin is better. But that was so traumatic for her. Yeah. So traumatic for her. And feeling like you're stuck in this like, it's like Alice in Wonderland, like chasing the like white rabbit, right? You're like on this medication. Then you're on this medication because the side effects for them from the first one. You're still on birth control because you're too scared to get off of it. You're getting like yeast infections and like gut issues from the antibiotics. I had one client who was on antibiotics for like seven years for her acne. It turned her

gums blue. Oh my gosh. I don't know if it's reversible. I pray that it is because they were actually dark blue. I had never heard of such a thing. Obviously, that's very rare. Yeah. But like, holy shit. But nobody should be on antibiotics for seven years. And I'm, by the way, if you're listening, you've been on them for years, this is not directed towards you. It's directed towards the medical community and also the dermatologists that are not helping people get to the root cause. They're just slathering topicals and creams on. They don't ever actually address the real issue. They're not looking at the internal and also looking at the pork loggers. And it's so outdated too because we have so many doctor friends, nurses that all say like everyone's so antibiotic resistance anyways that a lot

of them, like this is, again, this is from them telling me that a lot of them aren't even working anymore. And so it's actually like really outdated information and outdated practice to put people on antibiotics for that long when it's not appropriate to. And I've had like first-hand, doctors tell me this, nurses tell me this, and they're frustrated when other people in the medical system, like other doctors or other nurses, the doctors will put people on antibiotics for that long of a time because it's just not appropriate. And antibiotics eventually stop working. Like your immune is like the bacteria get stronger, they get resistant.

It happens really quickly. And in my experience, usually the bacteria is just a symptom. It's not the root cause, like at all. So even if you're doing like a topical antibiotic, works for. a little while, you think everything is great. A month later, it's not working anymore. It's not the root cause. The root cause for most people is poor clogging ingredients topically. And when I say most people, I am going to drop the 80-20 rule with this. In my experience, you might have other things going on, like a hormonal issue or something in your diet. But for 80% of people,

topical poor-clogers are the thing that is contributing to the most of their acne. And it's the thing that you have to change if you're ever going to actually get clear. So antibiotics are not even a part of the equation for most people. It's poor cloggers and then things in their diet or vitamins that they're taking that are accidentally spiking their testosterone. Oh, yeah, like B12, right? Too much B12. Oh, so common. Too much vitamin D. Too much vitamin D. Yep. And then too much much zinc. And then biotin. Biotin doesn't necessarily mess with your hormones, but it can kind of stimulate hypercarotinization, which clogs your pores. So fascinating. Yeah, all of those in excess amounts. And you might not be taking a standalone of this, but I always like to tell people. I know

Courtney, you educate about this so much is check the ingredients of all the things you're consuming that are packaged because now with marketing, everyone wants to put something interesting on their label in order to stand out amongst the saturated crowd of beverages and foods and greens powders and protein powders, et cetera. So they'll want to put immunity on it. When you put immunity on a front of pack, you had like the front of packaging, you have to put the correlating claim. Like you have to put the ingredient that allows you to make that marketing claim. So usually that's vitamin D and zinc. So you have to add more vitamin D and zinc to something that maybe shouldn't even have vitamin D and zinc in it. And usually it's a very low

quality of it too. And then anything that has beauty on the front, turn it around, it has biotin added to it. Like that's how they're able to make. So it's a marketing claim and these things are like five in one. You have your protein powder and your beauty and your collagen and your immune. And it's like, guys. And then you're also taking a standalone immune supplement. And then you're having a green juice that's like plus immunity. That also has vitamin D and zinc added. So it's just like the excessive amounts that are in everything. There's nothing wrong with these supplements. We need to have healthy levels of these nutrients and vitamins in our body. But it's building up in all of these areas that we don't even know they exist in. So just be familiar.

If you have regular things in your diet, be really familiar with what's on the back of the packaging, like what's in the full ingredient list. And don't always be sold for the marketing that tries to add everything, like be everything to everyone, don't necessarily, like if you look at a plain protein powder versus one that's plus beauty, plus immunity, all those things, you don't necessarily need that. You might be getting those other things in other form. So look at the ingredients first. Yes. Always read the ingredients. And I know people are going to say, well, how much is too much? Here is what I have seen and personally myself experienced. With B12, I won't take a supplement that has more than like 300% RDV. I'm also extremely acne prone. Some of the

people can take a supplement that has a little bit more than that, but you'll see like a B B complex that has 12,000 percent RDB. The levels are extremely high in a lot of these supplements. Even I think Celsius has like a thousand percent of B12 because it gives you energy because it can spike your testosterone, right? So the levels for B12 that I personally advise my clinic patients to stay under would be about 400 percent RDB. So that's going to rule out pretty much any B12 supplement. Granted, if you have been put on a protocol because of an extreme deficiency that has been verified by blood work. That is different. You do what your, you know, provider is guiding you to do, but just know that it can cause, it can cause hormonal acne.

For vitamin D, I've noticed that above, above 200% RDV is where people can start to see an issue, and it shows up on the chin where they'd have a go-tie. So too much vitamin D can potentially raise testosterone, but it can also mess with an enzyme that has to do with DHT, dehydrotestosterone. So it can affect an enzymatic pathway. It is also itself a hormone. And if you're taking a standalone that has way too much and it doesn't have the appropriate co-factors and you're on this thing forever that is building up in your fat, it's going to mess with your hormones. It is itself a hormone.

You can't just take it and affect it to not have a ripple effect. So the right co-factor, you're better off taking a lower dose D, but with the co-factors. Vitamin K and magnesium. Yeah. I like the Mary Ruth's one. It comes in a little dropper and it has the K-2 and you can measure it out. you can dose down versus just like a big old soft gel that has 800% RDB, right? So the Mary Ruth's liquid with D and K2, I love that one for people.

And then the other one, biotin, I tell people to stay under like 300% RDB. That one is a big one. And you'll notice if you're taking too much because you'll get little bumps on your arms and like more little bumps everywhere. And then zinc, I've seen it be okay in levels around 150% RDB. above that, you might start to notice acne around your mouth and your mustache area. Zinc is known to spike testosterone. So fascinating.

I never knew any of this until I heard Kaylee talk about it last time. This is incredible to know. Well, the thing is you hear about these vitamins, generally because when we're so deficient, that can cause a problem. You know, like being told to take vitamin D for acne is kind of a normal thing. But that, I think that study was not poorly run, but that's a different rant. But too much of something without the proper metabolism of it is going to create it's going to create a side effect, right? So we want to be normal, healthy levels. We don't want to

be too much of anything. We don't want to be deficient of anything. We do need to really supplement strategically and focus on getting it through our diet. Yes. Okay, so we have about five minutes, and I have two questions that I really want to get through before we have to end. Because we brought it up, can we quickly explain thoughts on acutane and spirro? Simcolds. You got it. So I've done acutane three separate times, very, very familiar with it. It can be an amazing godsend for some people. For the perfect person, you know, they'll do it once, they'll act, and will never come back. That is the ultimate goal. And for most people, it is safe. It's a bitch to go through. You're peeling, your knuckles are bleeding, your ears are peeling, your eyes are dry.

My vision was like getting permanently damaged in my third round because it creates such dry eye. So there's a lot of side effects. A lot of people do get depression or they get the achy bones, and sometimes it doesn't go away when you stop. So it is definitely something that you are going to put your body through. So make no mistake about it. If you're going to do it, do it in tandem with all the other things that you need to do anyway, like knowing what you're eating that's breaking you out. You can't just go back to having way protein after the acutane.

Your acne is going to come right back. So eliminate those things. You'll get clearer faster and then also remove pork loggers from your skin care. A lot of people reach out and they're like, can I still use clear some if I'm on acutane? Well, you can't take our supplement because that would be too much A. But you can get on our skin care and your results will skyrocket and it'll be less likely to come back. Yeah. So that's just, you know, if you're going to do it, do what's right for you.

But also, you know, do everything else that you need to support your body and actually address the root cause. Otherwise, probably going to come right back. Yes. And then spiroanalactone, I feel like everyone is just on this right now. Yeah, it feels like the new candy. You know, like everyone was put on birth control for acne at a young age. It feels like now this is what we're putting up anyone who's struggling with acne in their 20s. 30s because they're typically already on birth control. So it's like what else can we put them on?

It truly feels like every young woman that we run into struggling with acne has been put on spirinalactone. Like it is alarming how many women are on it because it is a testosterone suppressant. Yeah. And so if you're on birth control that's enacting on your hormones and then you're also in Spiro that's enacting on your testosterone, you eventually need to get off of them at some point in your life, especially if you want to get pregnant. Yes. You need to get off both. And so a lot of people come to us, sadly, like out of so much fear. They went on spirnalactone. This is typically the case that we get.

Young women, they are wanting to get married. They are struggling with acne, and they just want a quick fix. Of course, they're about to get married. They want something that's going to fix it as fast as possible. They get put on Spiro. They get addicted to having clear skin. Who wouldn't? So they don't want to get off or they're terrified to get off.

Fast forward, a year, two years, three years, four years. they're wanting to prepare to get pregnant. They come to us saying, I am terrified to get off of this. I'm terrified to go back to what my skin used to look like. I'm terrified that I was on it for this long in the first place, but I've been so scared to get off of it. And we really coached them through it. Our dermatologist, part of the clear stem team, always recommends that you can take mind-body skin and spirow at the same time and wean off of Spiro as well and then continue mind-body skin. So that can be really, really helpful for people as they're working to try. transition off of it, depending on the milligram that they're taking, especially if they're weaning

down from 200, 150, 100 milligrams of it. Average, most people are around 100 milligrams of Spiro. And so, again, our dermatologist says that you can take mind-body skin and Spiro at the same time, help support your body while you're transitioning. And then there's a lot of other things you can do to help transition off. Of course, anything supporting your liver, because how much everything's enacting on your hormones, getting the lymphatic system moving, making sure that you're sweating, making sure you're having bowel movements. It's very similar to, if you want to transition off a birth

control as well, we want to really support our liver, our lymph system, and be sweating and having the bowel movements to get everything off. And then, of course, making sure that all of your topicals, because you might have a testosterone surge after, again, our protocol for transitioning off can really help to mitigate the testosterone rebound effect. But some easy variables that you can eliminate is removing all poor cloggers and using clear stem, replacing your makeup with non-poor clogging can really just help support your skin as you're transitioning off of it. I love that. If Alex Earle was your client, what would you do with her? I feel like I had her same journey. I would do what I do with my clinic patients. I would go

through what she's eating and when I can tell that the diet conversation hasn't been had with her in the way that it needs to because some of the stuff she shares, like either has a ton of biotin or she's eating eggs or something like that. I don't know. I don't. I don't follow her that closely, but my team will always be like, look what she's eating. We got to tell her. So I would have a diet conversation and rule out the obvious triggers, eggs, dairy, and possibly gluten. Just because of her pattern, where it is on her face, that is, I think there's something going on with her detox pathways or her immune system. Gluten is a silent but constant inflammatory pressure on the immune system, especially in that area.

So we go through all the internal stuff. I would clean the heck out of her makeup bag. I would tell all of her makeup artists, they can only, what they can use. My favorite acne safe foundations right now are the forget the filler by Annie Lawless. That is the best full coverage, totally acne safe makeup that I have used lately. I'm obsessed. So I know she likes to do her makeup kind of, you know, a little bit on the heavier side just for content or whatever. So I put her on that makeup.

And then I would get her on the clear skin kit and our, our, our, our, sun, can't talk today, our sunscreen because when you're struggling with acne that long of a time, you do want to eliminate all the variables. You don't just want to like swap out a 20 step routine for another 20 step routine. You want to go bare bones. So just pick one makeup that you love and stick to it. Don't go doing a bunch of different things just because you want to play with products. Now's not the time, right? And communicate to your makeup artist that this is what we're using or just come with your base already on. That's what I do. And then I would get on our clear skin kit. Those are the four things that make up the cornerstone of a clinical acne safe routine. So you have your physical

exfoliant, which is our vitamin scrub, gets the top layer of dead skin away, takes off like makeup residue and stuff like that that we all have on our skin. And then clarity. It comes with our clarity serum, which is our mandelic acid blend that also has turmeric and green tea. That physically unclogs the congestion. The stuff that's inside the pore deep down that is creating like the plug, that needs to be dissolved. Mendelic acid is the best way to do it. Retinels don't unclog your pore. Mandelic acid does. And it does it. You leave it on your skin for 15 minutes. Wake up in the morning. Your skin is clearer. It's amazing how effective it is. So I would have her do that every single night just because we want to really clear up, clear up the

skin as fast as possible. So I'd have her do it every single night, possibly twice a day. And then I would get her on our cell renus serum, which is our OG scar reversing serum. And then have her use our moisturizer because most moisturizers do you break people out. And I'm, you know, almost positive that what she's using is breaking her out topically. So yeah, the clear skin kit and then our sunscreen and then I would just keep her only on that. Yeah. When I look at Alex Earle's skin, I feel so emotional because I literally see my skin in that. I see when I was dealing with my aggressive acne all over my face, I see her picture right now. I'm like, oh my gosh, that's where I was. And that's honestly where a lot of our community finds themselves into. And everyone goes to our acne lab panel. So I do

three things. We take her through our checklist, which is the poor cloggers, the excess supplementation, in the dietary triggers. Remove those. Second, absolutely have her do the acne lab panel because we have to find the root causes. It could be parasites, could be heavy metals, it could be yeast, bacteria. Like there's a lot of things. It could be underlying infection, probably immunity with how much she travels or something acting on her immune system. So we'd take her through the acne lab panel. And three, I would fly her to San Diego Acne Clinic because I know a lot of people say they can help with acne, but Danielle has people that fly all over the world, like world. to come to San Diego Acne Clinic, and she deals with some of the most aggressive cases

when people are at their wits end, and they are like, I have been to everyone, every anesthetian, every dermatologist, every person that claims they struggle with acne, and Danielle clears their skin. So I would get her booty out to Danielle ASAP for treatments. I would love to take care of Alex. Yes. And make a massive difference very quickly. We need to get her out to your clinic.

Well, in the essence of time, can you just tell everyone where they can find. all of your products and I just want to tell my audience that okay so this is my favorite product literally of all time gentle clean cleanser you guys all have to get this cleanser I have tried I feel like every face wash under the sun and this is the best cleanser I've ever tried it gets all of your makeup off but it doesn't leave your skin feeling dry and stripped it actually somehow miraculously still leaves your skin feeling like dewy and moisturized it's the craziest thing I'm obsessed and I cannot live without this product I'm so happy you said that it is actually clinically proven to keep your skin hydrated eight hours after you're done cleansing.

It's the best. It is truly the best. So everything we talked about on this podcast, our root cause of acne checklist, our acne lab panel, our products can all be found on clearstem.com. Same with our poor clogging checker. It's under our resources tab. And then on all socials, clear stem skin care. Danielle's Instagram is Danielle the acne guru. Mine is Kaylee Christina. We also have a lot of fun information. We post a lot about non-poor-clogging alternatives to your favorite makeup. Like, basically everything we don't make, we share non-poor-clogging alternatives too. So count us as a resource for yourself. Yeah. And go check out all of the amazing stuff they have on their website. You'll also have this new ACV clear, which I really love. Obsessed. Apple cider vinegar is a game changer for so many

people. It's amazing. And it tastes good. We made it taste good. That's the thing. I was actually shocked. It does taste good. I like it. Yeah. It supports your liver and lymph, too. We love. while you're on the go because girls are going places. We're always out. We're brunting. We're on the move. We're traveling. And it's, you know, you can't control what you eat all the time, but you can definitely control how you're going to digest it. And that's what ACV clear does. Oh, it's the best. And I wish we had time to go over all of your supplements and everything, but everybody's just going to need to go check out the website. Check out all the goodies they have on there. I love everything that you all are doing. Thank you so much for coming on today.

Thank you so much. Thank you, Courtney. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening to The Real Foodology podcast. This is a Wellness Loud production produced by Drake Peterson and mixed by Mike Fry. The theme song is by Georgie. You can watch the full video version of this podcast inside the Spotify app or on YouTube. As always, you can leave us a voicemail by clicking the link in our bio. And if you like this episode, please rate and review on your podcast app. For more shows by my team, go to WellnessLoud.com.

See you next time. The content of this show is for educational and informational purposes only. It is not a substitute for individual medical and mental health advice. doesn't constitute a provider-patient relationship. I am a nutritionist, but I am not your nutritionist. As always, talk to your doctor or your health team first. Are you ready to rock middle age? I'm Dr. Tina Moore, Gen X, Truth Teller, and Holistic Physician.

On the Dr. Tina show, one of Apple Podcast's top alternative health shows, I share what actually works for metabolic health, hormones, and strength, backed by decades of clinical results, not trends. From loving the gym and hitting your protein goals to peptides and microdosing gLP ones it's all done the right way not the hype way because menopause doesn't have to suck if you're fit new episodes every thursday produced by drake peterson and wellness loud