Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:1253 The Quantum Bridge Project

Episode Date: May 3, 2026

Rick writes "I was on your show about two years ago regarding my investigations into the potential paranormal aspects of the Bigfoot phenomenon. I would like to update you on my efforts (Quantum Bridge Project) and the progress we've made to date. As you know, I used to be the State Director for the Virginia Chapter of the Mutual UFO Network and investigated numerous UFO sighting reports to include purported "abduction" cases. I transitioned to the paranormal realm because of the apparent similarities in certain cases. I've been with the Center for Paranormal Research and Investigations (CPRI) for the past twenty-four years and, within the past eight years, started conducting "cryptid" research for the same aforementioned reasons. I chose CPRI because of their philosophy and the way they approached the paranormal using the scientific method. The organization has MDs, PhDs in sociology, educators, nurses, chemists, current and former law enforcement officers, etc. CPRI is a Virginia 501(c) nonprofit, educational organization with a Board of Directors. I approached their Board with a written research proposal requesting that we investigate the "cryptid" phenomena in the same fashion they approach the paranormal; using certain specialized instrumentation and equipment like thermal imaging/ recording devises, remote data loggers designed to measure various EM/ radiological fields, and certain environmental conditions. My proposal involved locating a potentially credible cryptid investigator and working with them in their respected field research areas in order to capture supporting data during a sighting. This would not only validate that something is actually occurring, but to potentially explain certain aspects of the phenomenon. I've attached this particular proposal for your reference. One of my investigators located Harley Owens; a fairly new cryptid investigator in the East Tennessee area. Some of his sightings have been validated by other independent investigators, so I decided to work with him. His research area is near Cosby, TN, which is one of the areas the late Scott Carpenter used to investigate. Over the past two years, Ive independently investigated this area with Harley to further gauge his credibility before devoting CPRI resources to this geographical area. During that time, I've seen strange tree structures, heard screams, roars, and strange "barn owl" sounds, I have also seen those infamous" lights" that are seemingly associated with the Bigfoot phenomenon. On one occasion, I saw one of these "lights" at night on my thermal imager. It was moving intelligently through the forest. Interestingly enough, when I tried to see the light without the thermal, it wasn't visible. When I looked through the thermal, it would reappear, indicating it had some type of invisible heat source. Harley was next to me and wanted to see the light through the thermal. When he looked through it, he saw the light and, as it approached a dirt road, he said the light "transformed" into an upright being exhibiting a heat signature. It walked across the road and up an incline towards an adjacent knoll. I didn't see this; however, about one minute later, I heard a loud scream and an "owl' like vocal come from this same knoll. This scream was extremely loud and lasted about two to three seconds. It also sounded like some type of primate. It was immediately followed by an "owl" vocal, which didn't seem right. On another investigation in July of 2024, Harley and I were in his research area one night when we heard a loud, very intimidating roar (not scream) coming from another Ridgeline adjacent to a cemetery, which is the apparent focal point of the activity. This roar was so intimidating and loud, we were concerned for our safety. You could actually feel "rage" coming from whatever made it. I've never heard anything quite like it before, so we decided to pack everything up in order to make a quick exit if the situation called for it. We didn't stay too much longer before we left the area. As you probably know, these so called "orb" sightings are very common in both Bigfoot and paranormal cases, which leads me to some information you and your listeners may find very interesting. Back in 2003, CPRI investigated a case near Bedford, VA. This case involved a lady who lived on a farm in a double wide home. The lady reported seeing shadows, hearing voices and reported poltergeist type activity throughout the house. During the course of our investigation, she related an incident that occurred in the early 80s. She was getting ready for bed, had just turned off the bedroom lights when she saw three "orbs" hovering in a level, straight line at the foot of her bed. They appeared to be the size of a softball and each exhibited a different color; one was orange, one was light blue and the last was reddish They emitted light and then moved in unison (line formation) down her hallway and made a 90 degree left turn into her dinning room. She immediately went to the dinning room to see where they went and couldn't locate them. It was as if they just disappeared. The following morning, she went back into the dinning room and noticed three circular discolored/ burnt marks on her window screen. She believed these orbs went through the screen because they weren't there before, the window was left open and each mark was about the same size of these orbs. We asked her about the screen and, fortunately, she had rolled it up and kept it in her barn and forgot about it. We went to the barn and she pulled it out. The screen still had these three strange marks on it, so we asked if we could have it analyzed. She agreed, so we gave it to one of our members who happened to be a Radiochemist and worked for a federal lab in eastern Virginia. He's no longer with CPRI, so I'm not at liberty to divulge his name or where he worked without permission. He took the screen to his lab for analysis. A few weeks later, he sent us a report with his findings, which were intriguing. I've attached a document containing excerpts of his report to keep him and his employer's information confidential. According to the report, the discolored sections of the screen were highly irradiated. The areas were so irradiated we decided to ask the lady some health questions. Around the same time as the orb incident, she did experience bad flu symptoms, nausea, fever and general weakness, which lasted about a week or two. She thought it was just the flu, but did reveal additional information that brings doubt to that conclusion. A few years later, the had to have hip replacement surgery. After the surgery, the doctor asked if she had ever had radiation therapy. When she said no, the doctor said the bone structure of her hip was porous. It appeared to have been subjected to a type of radiation. Apparently she may have been exposed to a great deal of radiation that night. This is not to say that all orb phenomena contains radioactive properties, but it appears these lights did. In March of 2025, I assembled a team from CPRI and we (along with Harley) conducted a preliminary investigation of the Cosby site. The team consisted of Harley, myself, an archeologist, University Professor and another retired law enforcement officer. We did take some instrumentation with us. During the course of three days, we found several unusual tree structures, interviewed a resident in the area and conducted night surveillance. The primary location was the site of an old cemetery, which seems to be the focal point of the activity. We were able to witness unusual light activity in the cemetery. This took the form of small red points of moving light. Another larger red light was also seen depending in a straight line towards the same Ridgeline that the "roar" was heard a year earlier. Our archeologist witnessed a large, indistinct dark mass cross in front of him through the cemetery. He was wearing an Apple Smart Watch with embedded bio sensor at the time. He was able to pull the heart rate data from the watch and, at the exact time he witnessed this event. His heart rate jumped from 66 BPM to 124 BPM. On one occasion, our professor also witnessed a small green light hovering about thirty feet above the cemetery. These lights couldn't readily be explained. They didn't match the will-o-the-wisp (swamp methane gas ignition) phenomena because the weather was cool, it hadn't rained, low humidity and most of the colors seen were red instead of the signature faint blue-violet glow."

It looked like somebody was bent over and had their head in the window of the deer blind and it either heard me or smelt me and he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up and that shocked me. They don't make people that that big. The way it moved, almost as if it was gliding across the bed. I've never seen anything moves like that in my life. They were screaming at each other in gibberish. It sounded like a language and they were chuntering away back and forwards, back and forwards, back and forward.

I know what a bear looks like and there is no way on this planet that what I saw were bears. Back on one, what are you reporting? Somebody out here. What's going on now, sir? That's sort of a bitch is about 6'9. I don't know. Do you see a mouse, sir? Yes, I'm looking right in. Uh-oh.

Hi, I'm Becky. And I'm Mercedes. We're looking for a guy with big feet, 6-8, brown eyes. Always hides. We found him on our favorite podcast. Woo! Sadwatch Chronicles! Welcome to the show.

Tonight we'll be speaking with Rick Artestring and Dr. Jack Tremel. I interviewed Rick probably two or three years ago, and I remember him making the comment to me, why don't UFO paranormal and cryptid researchers get together and compare notes? Maybe there's something there? Maybe there's not. And I thought it was a fantastic idea. Rick was the state director for Mufon there in Virginia. And he investigated UFO sightings and reported abduction cases there in Virginia. And he created this group, Quantum Bigfoot project and it was to include cryptid, paranormal, and UFO researchers and also many scientists were welcome into the group and the goal was to kind of search for answers and hopefully provide

people with answers. So we'll be going into that tonight along with their experiences. If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com And if you get a chance, check out Sasquatch Chronicles.com. You can become a member and get additional shows.

Let's jump into it tonight. I want to welcome Rick to the show. Rick, thanks for coming back. Thanks for having me back. I appreciate it. Yeah, and I also want to welcome Dr. Jack Tremel to the show. Jack, thank you so much for being here.

here. I am delighted. Thank you. It's my pleasure having both of you on. And I wanted to talk a little bit about the Quantum Bridge Project. How did it start if you would walk me into kind of the goals of it and where you're at today? Okay. For your listeners that haven't heard me before on your last show, I'm retired law enforcement. I have been involved with Mufon. I was a state director. for about five years here in Virginia. Each Mufon chapter, you know, each state has a Mufon chapter, which is the mutual UFO network. And basically they investigate UFO sightings and file reports with the parent organization

and in an objective scientific type manner. I did that for five years. I was state director for Virginia. And then I went into the paranormal realm because in the UFO field, I found there's certain crossover elements of paranormal. I mean, sometimes, especially with abduction cases, they experience paranormal type of activity in their homes and around their persons, kind of like a altergeist type activity, a haunting, classic haunting type of activity. Intrigued me. So, Winnihan transitioned to the paranormal and joined the Center for Paranormal Research and Investigations back in 2002.

I've been with them ever since. And the CPRI, short of synonym of paranormal research and investigation, they're very credible organization as far as I'm concerned, more credible than most paranormal groups because they adopt the scientific method philosophy. And they approach it that way. And they're very objective, very critical. And they're basically data-oriented and data-based organizations. They don't necessarily rely on experience.

They're more interested in the data associated with the experience itself. I found them to be very credible. So I started working with them. And throughout the course of that, my investigations in the paranormal, I started coming across certain cases in the literature where people involved in paranormal incidents start seeing these cryptic creatures like dogman, bigfoot, crawlers, that type of thing. And then my focus seemed to shift a little bit. I stuck with the paranormal, but I started to looking at a little bit.

a little bit more into this cryptic field because again, like I said before, the crossover elements were there. I talked with you and I talked with you a little bit about it and some of my experiences that I had. And after we talked, I got more in depth in it and I started to think, you know, brainstormed with that a project that a paranormal group, a reputable group, which I believe CPR is, if they can get involved in the cryptic area, bringing their their philosophy, their equipment and all this into the fold, then maybe we would come on some of the answers, you know, or at least develop new questions that need to be addressed. Now, we needed some data associated with these sightings of these creatures to see if, you know, there's an environmental change with them. We have certain, you know, we have data loggers and equipment that might be able to measure that. And then we got into the orb phenomena. A lot of orb phenomena is witnessed around the Bigfoot

in the dogman areas and that increased my interest because CPR I had a case. We investigated back in 2003 involving orbs that apparently went through a screen. We got a hold of the screen and had it now analyzed by a radiochemist. And the results of that were extraordinary. But in short, that's what we're at right now. And I've developed the Quantum Bridge where CPRI works with a cryptid researcher. in his area of responsibility and his research area

to try to find some data associated with these things. That's everything in a nutshell. Man, do I have a case for you guys? I talked about it on the last member show so I won't really go too much into it. But this gentleman, he contacted me because of these cryptids on his property.

So as we're talking, how it all kind of started was he saw this gray alien kind of down in the bushes near his home and he didn't know what it was and he took a picture of it in fact he took several pictures of it and it does look like a freaking gray alien i'm waiting to get all of his videos and pictures before i post a show but he told me he goes you know and he didn't know what dogman was he goes you know it sounds crazy but i saw a freaking werewolf on my property ever since since he saw that werewolf on his property or dog man, whatever title you want to give it,

the activity actually started in the home. And a lot of this weird paranormal poltergeist type activity is going on in the home. He describes seeing this weird black fog come out of his mother's bedroom. He's kind of an older gentleman and he's taken care of his mom in her old age. And he describes this weird black fog that comes out of her room. And he claims to have it on video, but basically what he told me is, imagine like a black electrical fog that looks like it's alive. It'll crawl down the wall. It'll crawl up the ceiling. And he goes, I don't know if this is demonic. I don't know if this is aliens. I don't know what's going on. I just want it to stop. But then there's way more to it than what I'm saying. But that's kind of the gist of it.

and you do see with UFO encounters, alien encounters, oftentimes people will report paranormal stuff going on in their home after an event like that. What about yourself, Jack? How did you get involved in this? And what was kind of your interest? So for those who are just meeting me, I'm a sociologist. I work at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. and I'm really interested in the supernatural and in the unexplained.

And so I teach a lot of courses related to that and I've done a lot of research related to that. So I'm kind of like what you would call a sociologist of the unexplained. And for me, what Rick is talking about with the Quantum Bridge dovetails very nicely with some theories I'm evolving as a result of my research about people. experiencing these things. And by the way, I just saw before we got on air that there's a report that says 3.5 million Americans claim that they have had an encounter or have been abducted by aliens. And I still can't believe that number. I'm going to check it out. But that's mind-blowing that one out of every 100 Americans has experienced that or claimed to have experienced that. And so I look at it through the lens of three things.

the physical, the psychological, and the phenomenal, and things like spiritual belief and religion fall into that phenomenal area. And what people believe is tantamount to me because as a sociologist, if people believe something, then sociologically speaking, it's true because they're going to arrange their life as if it were true. And they're going to live their life as if it were true. And so it becomes true in that sense. And so as I've developed, my studies of the supernatural, including cryptids and aliens and all kinds of things, in addition to just the classic, what people would call paranormal, I've really become to appreciate that the science is only a teeny part of the equation. And if people believe they've experienced

something, whether they did or not in a scientific way is less important to me than it used to be. And it's more important to me that they're living their lives as if it was something that happened. Jack, did you ever have an experience that kind of led you down this path? It's funny. I tell my students a story about when I was a kid in New York City living in an old crumbling brownstone. My parents were not very well off at all. We were very poor. And so we were living in this creepy old brownstone on the seventh floor. And I would always see a woman come into my room late at night in white, of course, there you go, stereotype, the classic woman in white. And I never was scared. She looked like she was taking care of me, almost like an angelic

kind of feeling to it. And when I told my mother about this, I got a spanking and was told that was her coming into check on me and never talk about it again. And so early in my life, I was shamed into not asking questions about things like that. So when I grew up and became a sociologist, I decided nobody's going to tell me I can't study this anymore and be interested in it. And so other things have happened to me in my life, but that's sort of like the, what would you call it, the founding story of how I got interested as a very young child and then pursued it later as an adult. Yeah, and I didn't realize the woman in white is more common than I originally thought. The very first time I heard about it was actually from a Bigfoot researcher, and he was a hardcore,

this is an ape, flesh and blood, there's nothing odd about this. And I remember around a campfire one night, he was telling me about running into this woman in white. And it was weird. He was kind of like describing a spirit. And if you look into that ape canyon attack that actually happened in Washington back in the 20s, Fred Beck talks about the woman in white. In fact, they found the mind because of the woman in white.

He describes this spirit. Then shortly after that, everyone knows the rest of the story that, you know, they were attacked by these quote unquote apes in Ape Canyon. But that whole encounter of Fred Beck and those miners is a lot more strange than most people think. Have you ever looked into that? Yeah, I've read things about the encounter itself and some side notes about it that weren't readily available to the public. There were a lot of paranormal type events that occurred around that incident. The woman in white, they kept seeing, you know, light phenomena, that type of thing before.

And even, I don't know if it happened after the incident because they fled. But before the incident, that was their claim. And it wasn't readily, that information wasn't really put out there because it didn't meet the narrative, I guess. But yeah, there's a lot more that went on with that whole event than most people realize. And Wes, if I can add something, the woman in white motif is almost a misnomer, in my opinion, because what people may be seeing is some kind of entity or aura that has no color at all. And it may be that it is manifesting through a part of the visual spectrum in the ultraviolet perhaps or where there wouldn't be any color.

You're not going to see a woman in red. You're not going to see a woman in blue. And that that aura comes closest to people thinking, well, it's glowing in the dark or I see it. You know, I see it there. I just, it doesn't have any color. And so I think maybe it's a misnomer to call it the woman in white because it may be that people are seeing something that's in a different part of the visual spectrum. Yeah, I think in most cases, I would. would agree with you on that, Jack. Like I was telling you that Bigfoot researcher, we were sitting

around a campfire, and he had kind of gotten lost in the woods. And he describes coming across this woman in white. And based on his description, I would agree with you. It just seemed like something bright. I don't know that I would call it white. He did. But I've heard other accounts where I think your theory applies. I've also heard accounts where that theory doesn't apply. I remember had these two brothers on and they talked about this homeless woman in white. They would see all the time and she would cross over their property

and never speak to them. They would try and talk to her, but she would never speak to them, but they would always bring her up. And they would see her during the daytime. And it never clicked with them that she was never dirty. You know, they're wearing snake boots

and they have mud up to their knees, but it never clicked with them why she was never dirty. the reason why they thought she was homeless is because none of her clothes fitter and that's a whole other story but I understand we're coming from Jack tell me about different events that have happened with this group I know there's one in particular with the lights sure um uh pre uh quantum bridge or you know before moving into the present or I know from here

email you brought up Harley. I think he's a Bigfoot researcher down south. I want to say Tennessee. Yeah, Harley. Yeah, he's the, he's an investigator in eastern Tennessee that I'm working with. Harley is a good guy. He's very enthusiastic. He's very, he's very, he's very much go-getter. But he's, you know, in the beginning was very inexperienced with regard to this type of thing. I think you had him on your show at one point, um, where he relayed, or related an experience he had in Virginia at a work site where he actually saw these things and actually recorded vocals. Well, ever since that point, he became very, very interested in this and started doing

some research in eastern Tennessee. He started seeing things and experiencing things that, you know, initially I had some doubts about until he started inviting other independent researchers on these treks with him and they were experiencing these things. and seeing the, you know, Bigfoot-type creatures and so forth. And my interest peaked at that point, and I started to work with him. I said, well, it's a good possibility we might be able to get something out of this particular area. So I started working with him.

I've been out there to the Cosby area, Cosby East Tennessee, maybe five or six times, and experienced something on at least three different occasions there. I have never seen anything as far as Bigfoot dog man, any type of cryptid or anything like that, but I have heard screams and roars that I couldn't readily explain, especially the roar that I heard back in July of 24. And I've also seen unusual light phenomenon out there. I had a thermal imager, and I was scanning the woodline around this particular cemetery, which seems to be the focal point of this activity. We go, we set up at the cemetery,

and we just sit there listening and record and observe. And I saw this light, the pinpoint of light, white light, well, it appeared white in the thermal because I had it on a white heat setting. And it was going through the wood line, appeared to be intelligently operated. And I would take the thermal down and I wouldn't see it. I put the thermal back up to my eye and it would appear. So apparently it was whatever it was invisible to the eye, but visible to the heat spectrum.

So, you know, I thought this was interesting and I was following it. Harley was standing next to me and I gave the thermal to Harley. Well, he asked for it and he said, let me take a look. I gave it to him, he looked at it. And it was approaching this dirt road, which led from the road to the, the cemetery itself. And he says that whatever it was, the slight transitioned into a, some type of creature, upright creature, exhibiting heat, and it took two or three steps across the road and went up an incline toward a, a knoll on the other side. I, you know, shocked me when he said

that. I said, well, let me see. And by the time I got the thermal, I didn't see anything. But about a minute later, up on the knoll, I actually heard a scream, rather loud scream, which lasted maybe two to three seconds. I couldn't identify the screen. But later, it sounded primate, sound like a primate. If you can recall what a chimpanzee sounds like when it screams, that's what this particular scream sounded like. And I didn't know of any other wildlife in the area that could produce that type of sound. I may be wrong. But right after this scream, almost immediately after this scream, I heard what sounded like a barn owl hoot three times. Right at the very end, I thought that was interesting. And then I started reading and watching your show and looking at past

cases. And it seems like this owl sound is very common with Bigfoot phenomenon. And that just sparked my interest. And I continue going out there with him. We've said we found unusual tree structures. We also, I think we found a, uh, what looks like a, you know, very, a footprint, but wasn't very discernible because it was on an incline. It was slid down. The, the, the, the, whatever step on this particular spot slid down and kind of disoriented or, you know, the print itself. And I did cast it, but it's, you know, somewhat, it can't very, you can't see it very clearly, even in the cast. We've, you know, I've heard, I roar, like I said, last July after 24. We were outside at the cemetery at night.

I was, we were sitting there doing the observation surveillance. And on adjacent ridge, probably straight line distance, maybe a mile and a half, two miles. I heard this what sounded like a roar, sounded like a T-Rex. Like, sounded like a T-Rex from Jurassic Park. and I just gave me show bumps the hair stood up on the back of my neck and we just looked at each other and I said you know

that sounded threatening and the roar itself sounded like it had rage to it and I told him I said well it's because we had I had my vehicle there I had the tailgate up and I had a tar over the back of the tailgate set up and everything in case it rained and I said let's take everything down

and put everything in and if we have to make a quick exit, we can just hop in the vehicle and leave because we point it toward the road that leads to the adjacent road. So we'll make a quick exit. It bothered me. It really did. Unless there was somebody on that hill

with a loudspeaker, playing the T-Rex sound from the Jurassic Park movie, I can't see someone doing that. That was perplexing to me and somewhat bothered me a little bit. But, you know, we continued investigating and eventually he reported to me that he actually saw a dogman type creature when he was hiking up on the hilltop near that ridge.

And he said the dogman creature came out, looked at him from behind a tree. And he took off running and he said, whatever it was, paced him in the woods to his right. And he couldn't see it anymore, but he could actually hear the footfalls. and it paced him all the way out, ran with him all the way out to the trailhead. But it stopped at a creek. I guess it couldn't jump the creek or whatever. But he looked at that dog man creature and he was somewhat upset about that. And, you know, he had a lot of experiences at home to some paranormal stuff.

Something was banging on the side of his house or in a shed. And he lives in somewhat of a residential area. So I can't see these things coming down and doing that without. being readily seen. He had a lot of experiences, some paranormal, and that's what, you know, keyed me into work with him a bit more. Wes, since you had mentioned that black crawling like thing earlier, Rick, you should also throw in that one of our investigators more recently when we were there saw a black mass with indistinct edges around it moving across the ground. And,

With the naked eye, there was nothing there, but he saw that. Am I describing that correctly, Rick? Yeah. He are one of our members is an archaeologist. And I'm not going to mention his name because I don't know if he wanted me to do that, but very credible guy, very good guy. And he's very objective. He's not prone to fantasy or anything like that.

He was sitting in my RV, which was set up down there at the cemetery. And the RV was facing the cemetery itself. He jumped up and said, did you see that? And I said, no. He says, something just moved across the cemetery. And he was, he looked a bit, he looked visibly shaken by it a little bit. He says, he said, we went outside, looked around, we couldn't find anything. And he says it was large, dark, no discernible edges to it.

it was just a dark mass that crossed in front of him from right to left. We start to think about it and he had a eye watch or Apple Watch, rather. And in the Apple Watch, there's a biosensor that measures heartbeat. His heartbeat at that particular moment jumped from 62 to maybe 120-some beats per minute in that short period of second or two. So something happened that affected him physically. So, yeah, that's true. Jack, it was an interesting encounter that we can't explain to this day.

Was he seeing things? I don't think so. But, yeah. Yeah, it'd be kind of hard to fake your heartbeat, like doubling in speed. The light that you saw, how big was it? Through my image, thermal imagers, probably, it was just a pinpoint of light. It wasn't, I couldn't see any distinct large mass to it. It was just a pinpoint of light.

And I was moving. That's all I could see at that point. I had the settings on White Hot, which would have, you know, it would have shown up white. I didn't have it. I didn't switch it at that time. I was just more concerned about what it was I was just looking at. I didn't know. I thought it might have been, you know, somebody walking through the woods or something.

But there was no sound associated with it. The distance I would guess to make would probably be 50 to 70 yards maybe. And, you know, then when Harley claims to have seen, you know, that just was kind of icing on the cake. And, you know, I had some doubt about what he might have seen, but then when he said it went up the hill toward a specific knoll, and from that particular knoll, I heard it's green. And those ow sounds.

So something happened. I didn't get a chance to look at it. And right this point in time, I don't doubt what Harley said or saw. So I find it interesting that you guys are using thermals to actually capture these lights. It seems like every time I've tried to use a thermal or I've talked to other people that have used a thermal. You never see them when viewing it through the thermal. The minute you take your eye off the thermal camera, bam, there's a light. But that's not necessarily set in stone.

I remember one time I was out there with a buddy of mine and he was looking through the thermal and he's looking up at the sky and he's like, oh wow, check that out. It's a UFO. And I remember looking up and there was nothing there. When I looked through the thermal, I was like, oh, wow, there's actually something there. It's very strange in this genre. You know, after I captured the very first time when I captured that light, it was just this pretty ball of light. I captured it on a night vision camera and I don't know what they are. I remember I had an aboriginal elder from Australia contact me and he said they travel through the lights and I thought this guy was insane. I was like, okay, I'm sure there's medication for what you have. I don't know about all that.

And he told me, he goes, if you look at the light, you'll see a face in it or you'll see faces in it. And I mentioned that one time on the air. and one of my members actually took still shots of the ball of light that we captured. And it did look like there was a freaking face in the ball of light. And I know Parodolia, you know, if you look at the bushes long enough, you'll see 20 Sasquatches. But this kind of stood out to me. I kind of looked at it and was like, oh, wow, that's actually looks like a face.

What's your theory on the lights, Jack? It's confusing because I've had different kinds of light experiences, including seeing faces inside a light. And I've shown those pictures to my CPR colleagues who say it's Paradoia and it's matrixing. But I have those if you ever want to take a look at them. They clearly look like faces to me. But then I've also seen some lights that clearly have. something like a plasma trail around them and they they have intentionality. They stop and start and move as if they are trying to make decisions consciously about where to go and not go,

or maybe they're controlled by somebody that has that intention. And then I've seen lights that are more like oras that almost seem to be associated with other events, like some kind of, you know, auditory kind of event happening shortly thereafter. after or seeing something visual that you can't explain. And so, as far as cryptids go, I have limited experience with this, but I do think there's one story in my past where there has been a light and I was being followed through the woods and I don't know if I've ever told Rick this story. My kid left a blanket on the top of a mountain top and we were all in a hotel because it

was snowing furiously. And I, my wife made me go back and hike a mile and a half up the top of the mountain in a snowstorm to get the little kid's blanket because they weren't going to go to sleep without it. And when I got up to the top of the mountain, I was hearing strange kind of animal noises that I don't know how to describe. And I assumed it was a bear, plenty of bear in that country. And it started following me the way down and I didn't have any equipment with me. I just, I would freeze in my butt off to begin with and I just wanted to get back to the car. But it mirrored my movement all the way down the mountain. And when I got to the bottom of the mountain, I was close enough to my car that I felt like I could run there and get in

if necessary and I turned around to confront it. And that's when I did see this kind of weird light on the mountain further up the trail and it was moving in and out of the trees indistinctly, but it was clearly there. And it's snowing like crazy, so it's not something that would be reflecting from moonlight or something like that. And I'm like, whatever it is, I'm out of here. And I got in the car and left. But I just assumed that was a bear. I had never connected the fact that it might be something else and that that light might be tied to that. Yeah, that's really interesting, Jack, that not only did you see the light, but it was mirroring your movements as you came down the mountain. And you hear I witness to say that, you know, like when they stop, it stops.

When they move, it moves. And I'll say over 90% of the time, they don't see what it is. And I've said this a million times on the show. I would say about 10 years ago, maybe 11 or 12 years ago is when I really started becoming interested in the lights because I would interview people who would have these things on their property, these creatures, they would talk about the big foot encounter, they would talk about what's going on on the property. And they always seem to end the conversation with, oh, and by the way, I'm also seeing these weird lights that show up. And it wasn't until about half a dozen times where I stopped and go, well, wait a minute, tell me about these lights. Bigfoot aside, tell me about these lights. And people would go on and on about seeing

these lights. And they seem to show up about the same time the creature showed up. Most of the time, though, people won't see the lights and the creature at the same time. What is your theory, Rick, and why people are seeing these lights and these cryptic encounters? To be quite honest, I don't know. I don't know what they represent. I know they are associated with the phenomenon some way, shape, or form, or the activity on the property is associated with the lights. Maybe there's some type of environmental situation or environment that produces these lights. In some occasions, I thought these lights might have been what they refer to as the Willow Whisp, which is the methane, you know, the swamp gas, which is methane that ignites. And but the problem is, you know, that only happens under certain circumstances.

There has to have been a recent rainstorm, rotting foliage, humidity. And they only appear in it like a green violet type of color and pretty much, you know, close to the ground. But some of these lights that people are seeing in what I saw doesn't fit that at all because what I saw was off the ground. the terrain I was looking at was hilly. It would go into ravines up on top of a hill. Another Noah would go down into another ravine. And this light appeared to be straight-lined. It was coming right across that.

I mean, it didn't follow the terrain whatsoever that I could tell. You know, that's just, it's weird. I don't know what it represents. Like I said, back in 2003, we, CPRI investigated the case near Bedford, Virginia, or a lady was reporting some type of weird phenomena in her house. She owned a farm. And we went there. We did an investigation and went through the numbers.

And we found out from her later that in I think it was early 80s, she experienced orb activity or witnessed some orbs in her bedroom. She was getting ready for bed, turning the lights out, was getting ready to get into the bed itself. She looked at the foot of her bed. she saw three orbs floating at the foot of her bed in a straight line. They were about the size of a softball. They had different colors.

It was orange, reddish, bluish, and then yellow. And she says after a second or two, they started moving in unison. And the line formation down her hallway, and made a sharp 90-degree turning left into her dining room. It shocked her. So she went into, went in the hallway, looked in the dining room, couldn't see them. So she sat to go to bed and somewhat upset her, but she went to bed anyway. And the next morning she got up and went into the dining room to check around. And one of her

dining room windows was open and just a screen was in the window. And she looked at the screen and she saw three discolored spots in the shape of a circular shape of about the size of a softball. And she surmised that they probably went through the screen, you know, because they weren't there prior to this incident. They were about the same size. And, you know, she just surmised that that's probably what it was, that these orbs or whatever it was, whatever they were, went through the window. She eventually took the screen out, rolled it up, stuck it in her barn.

Well, when she told us about this, we asked her if she still had the screen itself. She says she believed she did, and she went out to the barn, pulled it out, and luckily she still had it after 20 years. And she, we looked at the screen and did have certain, what I wouldn't say burn, but discolored spots on it, three circular spots on it and thought that was interesting. We asked if we could have it analyzed. And she agreed. So we took the screen and had one of our members who was a radio chemist, worked for a lab

in Eastern Virginia, and he decided that, you know, give it to me, I'll check it out. And we gave it to him and a few weeks later, he sent us a report. The report is extraordinary. If you want me, I can, you know, I've got the report, excerpts of the report itself. And if you'd like, I can touch base on it. Yeah, please do. That's a little lengthy, but I think your listeners would probably find it interesting, especially those who are radio chemists or some of a scientific background,

they might find this analysis interesting in and of itself. Now, I can't vouch for what he's saying here to be accurate because I'm not qualified too. He was a very credible guy, very serious about his work, very objective, very critical, but this is what he wrote. I received a large piece of window screen and on the screen with four discolored spots. He said four. The marks consisted of three large circular spots and one smaller irregularly shaped spot. I took eight one inch by one inch samples of the screen. The first four samples were of the spots in question. The samples all included a part of the border of the affected and unaffected area. The other four samples were randomly spaced cuttings across the

rest of the screen. I tested all eight screen samples for carbon residue using a gentle swipe technique. No carbon residue was present. I then tested for any loose particulate using a very mild solvent rinse. Aside from a bit of normal particulate, he's got in parentheses, dust. That would be expected on any type of window screen there was, and there was no loose other loose particulate on the screen itself. I then analyzed the screen using a Kevx, K-E-V-X, X-ray fluorescence spectrometer, Model 770. The screen is composed of a fiberglass material that has been evenly coated with an aluminum powder coating to resist wear. The aluminum coating contained many non-aluminum metallic impurities. The spectroscopy showed that there was a smaller amount of iron impurities

in the affected samples. The iron seemed to have been replaced with a new isotope that wasn't present in other samples. The isotope is cobalt 60. It is my opinion that the iron impurities were barraged with a strong neutron flux. This would also explain the increased level of of the brittleness that is present in the affected samples, as opposed to the very flexible nature, not the coating on the unaffected areas. Neutron flux causes defects in the crystalline structure of most metals that would explain why the aluminum coating had become so brittle and stiff. However, the strangest anomaly would have to be the fact that the events witnessed, witnesses were still alive. Neutron radiation is particularly harmful to the human body. The level

of radiation that would need to be generated in order to activate the pieces of screen in such a short length of time would have been quite high, much higher than what is considered a lethal dose, would have to have been absorbed by the witnesses. This leads me to believe that the radiation was somehow contained within the spheres observed. There is no known theoretical way that a free-floating non-solid sphere could admit much less contained such a high level of radioactivity, especially neutron radioactivity, which is usually associated with trans-serrantic elements. This leads me to believe that some force of unknown origin passed through the screen, and while doing so, emitted a large burst of radiation, but for a short period of time

as to not seriously harm or kill the witnesses. So he was, you know, there was much more to it, but those are the highlights of his particular analysis. We thought that was very interesting. When we found out about the radiation, potential radiation exposure of this lady, we started interviewing her further. She said that we told her about the results, and she said, well, you know, within two weeks after that happened, I got a bad case of the flu, and she remembered it distinctly. She said she had, you know, weakness, vomiting, nausea, that type of thing. And she said that, you know, it lasted about a week or two.

And she just, when it clear it up, she just, you know, forgot about it. Later, in a few years later, she had hip replacement surgery. And after the surgery, the doctor who did the hip replacement asked her, have you ever been subjected to radiation therapy? And she said, no, nothing I'm aware of. He says, well, the bones in your joint were porous and similar, course, in a way that's similar to have been subjected to radiation therapy or some type of radiation exposure. She said, well, nothing I'm aware of.

So that's interesting in of itself. It might be another data point that might want to take into consideration with regard to his analysis. But yeah, that's interesting. I'm not sure that these orbs that people are seeing associated with these Bigfoot creatures or cryptids are irradiated. but in this particular case it appears that these particular orbs witness were radiated to a high degree. I kind of think that they are.

And you know, it's interesting that his paper, his research found that Cobalt 60 because that's an artificial isotope. I think it has like a half-life of like five years. I think so, yeah. I think I've done some research

on it, but I've forgotten most of the research. Yeah, but the cobalt 60 in the isotope that's manufactured, somewhat similar to what you get in a nuclear reactor. That's in the, and what I understand speaking to him, he says that the radiation was so high that it would have been, you know, if you were standing next to a nuclear reactor for a few seconds, that would probably produce the same results. But she didn't, you know, she didn't die or anything like,

she was just sick. I don't know if the radiation was emitting constant, that constant amount, or it took that amount to get through the screen itself, if that's the case. I don't know. And I can't comment on the scientific evaluation because I'm not qualified to. I can just relate to what he said. You know, when me and my brother captured that light on night vision and the inside of the light looked like power. I mean, it wasn't, it didn't hurt your eyes to look at. It was kind of a pretty light.

But my night vision camera had almost died because I had spent so much time trying to figure it out on our way there. And that's probably the reason why I actually got it on video is because I had the camera in my hand. And I can't really prove this on a scientific level because you can't really say feelings. You can measure feelings. But I had a feeling that this thing was intelligent. This thing was just as interested in us as we were in it. But I didn't want to get too close. And I remember even telling Woody like, keep your distance.

Don't get too close to the saying. It made me nervous. And when we left, that light followed us. It wasn't like a high speed chase. It was like, wow, that light's still there. It's still coming through the trees. And it went on for miles. That light followed us.

I interviewed this guy, gosh, many, many years ago. He was an Australian. And he had these lights on video, pictures, videos. And he kind of had this claim of like, oh, I can call them in. And I was like, okay, sure. But this guy could actually call them in. I mean, they would show up. And he had gotten so comfortable with these lights that one day he decided he was

going to go touch it. and he had his dog with him. So he reaches out to touch this light that's in his yard. And he described it as like a softball size. I think it was a blue light. He reached out to touch it. And that was the last thing he remembered. He woke up in the hospital.

His dog had actually died of radiation poisoning. And he was on death's doorstep. I interviewed him probably a year later. And from the previous couple of years that I interviewed him, him to when I interviewed him at this point, the second interview, we were doing it over Zoom. He looked like a cancer patient that had about two days left to live. He looked like he was dying. And I asked him, I said, what happened? And he said, you know, I went to touch this light and that was the last thing I remembered. He goes, I ended up in the hospital. And the doctor said,

do you, do you work in a nuclear power plant? He's like, no, I don't work. a nuclear power plant. And they couldn't figure out there was so much radiation he was giving off that he should be dead. And I remember hearing that thinking, what in the world

are these lights? And why are they showing up when these cryptids are around? Very interesting anecdote to go along with this. Rick and I could send you this footage of this light that was captured

on surveillance camera. So no human was present, but later we saw it on review. And in this case, it moved with intention. It was solid in the center, but you could see a little bit of an aura around it. And when it moved, it left a plasma trail, which intrigued my physicist friend. But there was a horse nearby. And the horse was grazing in the middle of the night while this is happening. And as the light gets close to the horse, you can see.

it reflecting off the horse's skin and body and fur, but the horse did not see it. And so, as best we can tell on this full spectrum camera, it was luminescing in the ultraviolet range. But it did move apparently with what looked like intentionality. But the anecdote related to this is that in addition to not being able to explain the light, this horse died not too long after this incident happened and because it was 29 years old, we chalked it up to old age. But now we're talking about these things possibly irradiating and this thing was all around that course. And so there's no way to prove it or disprove it, but it's just an interesting thing to think about. I'm always intrigued by the fact that there were three of them in the story

with the woman and the screen, Y3. But in one of the video clips that... that the Air Force released last year of unidentified objects, there were three of them, or circular three moving together in tandem. And I noticed, if I'm allowed to mention that I watch Skinwalker Ranch every now and then, they've had a couple of incidents where they had three of them moving in tandem with each other. And they were circular light-like objects. And so I wonder what magic there is three. Interesting number. That guy can get into a whole new realm.

Conversation. Conversation exactly with the number three and paranormal. But yeah, that's very interesting. That is interesting, Jack. I didn't think about that, that lady that had the three orbs in her home and how they went through this screen.

I know in the paranormal world, and I've been told this by a few exorcists, that any time you see things show, open threes. It's a way of mocking God, kind of a way of mocking the Trinity. In my experience, I think it is because about 15 years ago, and I think I mentioned this the last time I was on your show, I investigated a very serious haunting situation in Manassas Park, Virginia, a lady and her husband. She was being brutally attacked, scratched, beaten, thrown about by something unseen.

And I did an investigation on that. And after about two years, I was able to get some video evidence of it. Got in touch with a religious demonologist that I know from Connecticut, Dave Considine. And he's pretty much a protege of Ed and Lorraine Warren, if you're familiar with him. He told him what was going on. He says it could very well be what type of influence called oppressive, demonic oppressive activity. or oppression. And so I started to look at it in that respect from that vantage point and started, you know,

researching and he told me precisely what I needed to do because I'm Roman Catholic and so is he. And I started using certain things to help her out and apparently helped her a lot. But in her scratches, when she got scratched, she would get scratched on her arms, legs, thighs, her back, neck. they were always in sets of three, all of them. And they were very similar in that two, there was three linear scratches side by side. And they were always similar in that two were longer than the third one,

which I thought was interesting. I've got photos of those things, if you'd like me to send them to you. But, you know, she was, you know, what we did was Roman Catholic and the Roman Catholic tradition. You know, holy water and blessed incense was very, efficacious against the demonic spirits. So she started using those

and certain specific prayers that we gave her and seemed to put a halt to a lot of this activity for a long time until it kind of came back on her with a vengeance. Tacked her more and that's when we got involved. And Dave Considine and I started communicating with each other. Eventually, you know, I was able to get video evidence of her getting scratched and I was able to confirm that.

And I sent the evidence to Dave. he consulted a Roman Catholic priest in the Chicago area. And the Chicago priest, the specific of Chicago priest, was an exorcist that he had worked with in the past. The exorcist says it looks like it's legitimate demonic oppression. And he says he wanted to give another diagnostic test to see if it was in fact spiritual in nature instead of her just, you know, something happening other than that. she was a cutter or whatever. But anyway, he said what he was going to do is he was going to do a Catholic Mass in her name

on a Sunday morning at about 8 o'clock, which would have been 9 o'clock Central or Eastern, rather. And he wanted us to be there. And we made up the excuse that we'd go in and get something or maybe take her to church. So we went in there at about 9 o'clock. My wife and I, we talked with her and met her. And she was at exactly 9 o'clock, she became very, very ill. She had a migraine headache. She was nauseous.

She was light sensitive. She couldn't need the curtains open. And she's not prone to that, that I recall. She's not prone to those type of headaches. And it happened around the time that this mass was going on her name, we confirmed later later, that the priest did in fact do that. And when she had that violent reaction, we kind of surmise that, hey, you know, maybe there's something going on here. We got seven days a week, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year, and this happens at one point during that period of time.

The reason dictates that there might be something to it. So in short, they authorized me to do what's referred to as a deliverance type of exercise. So a regular solemn exorcism in the Catholic Church, no one can perform that unless you were an ordained priest with permission of your mission. Well, they gave me permission to do this with a specific prayer. And I'm not going to mention the prayer, but it's a specific prayer to St. Michael. And St. Michael, so it happens to be my confirmation name, my middle name of St. Michael, Michael after St. Michael. You know, went in there and had Holy Water, so that said that specific prayer.

there was no grand finale or anything like it. It was quite peaceful. But there was a sense of the environment changed and the environment became very calm and soothing. And I was, you know, it's something, you know, inside me said, this is over. It's done. From that point on, she never had another attack. And it's been over 10 years and we pretty much keep track with her, track of her on Facebook. She has no, she's had no further attacks since then. that was interesting. And I did an investigation and we asked, I'm pretty sure that her ailment came from a curse that a co-worker had put on her because he made certain statements. He did certain things that indicated that. So I'm not certain that that was the case, but sure it's sure lent it

itself to being that case in this particular instance. So, you know, that everything in a nutshell, that's that's the three scratches and the number three, with regard to negative entity haunting in these cases. I appreciate sharing that, Rick. I've heard many accounts like that where people get scratched and it's always three scratches or sometimes even in alien abduction encounters. They always show up in threes,

which I think is weird. And as you look across the different genres, you'll see common things. Like, for example, this mind speak. It shows up in Bigfoot encounters. It shows up in dog man encounters. When you look at the alien encounters where people are being abducted or they're communicating with these sayings,

if you listen to the eyewitnesses, the aliens never talk with their mouth. It's always to their mind. And you know, even going back to Dogman for a second, if you listen to the behavior most of these dogman encounters, it doesn't sound like an animal. It sounds more like a demon. I remember I had this one guy on the show one time. He shot at one.

And this thing would torment this guy. It would focus on him. And if you really listen to how he described the behavior, it sounds like a demon. Like getting off on tormenting this guy. Do you think it's all kind of related? Or do you think these are all separate things going on

and there's just a lot of weird coincidences. I'll go first and having my base in the paranormal side of things it's pretty typical to think about residual versus active and those categories seem to work okay

for a lot of the data that people get. There are certain things that happen over and over at certain locations whereas active events often, in my experience, seem targeted at specific people. We have a member of our team who constantly gets touched. Why not the other 35 people in our organization? Why always this person is the one getting touched? And so just speaking purely about the paranormal world, it does seem like some people get targeted specific.

specifically by some of the more active phenomenon. There's something about something else I didn't add in my email to US. Harley, I told you that Harley was experiencing some paranormal activity while investigating this Bigfoot stuff going on in eastern Tennessee. Well, I told you that he experienced a dogman sighting, and which pretty much bothered him a great deal. It bothered him. He was upset with it somewhat, and he was kind of an obsession with him.

He's always thinking about this particular dog man that he encountered because it bothered him. And then one day, he said that he called me up later one day. And he says, something happened that I think he should know. And I said, what was that? He says, I was sitting in my car. I just came out of the grocery store. I was sitting in my car and I started thinking heavily about this dogman incident that I

had and it would start to bother me. And while I was sitting in the car, I felt this warm, stinging sensation. on the side of my neck. And I said, well, what happened? He says, well, I looked at myself in the rearview mirror. And I had scratches on my neck. And I said, was any way it could have happened? He could have accidentally done?

He says, no, I was just sitting here still when it happened. And they weren't there before. And I just felt this warm heat and then this pain, stinging pain. And he took a photograph of it and sent it to me. There were scratch marks on his neck. Three scratch marks, similar to the ones from the lady I spoke about before. Too long, one shorter than the other. I don't know what the implication of that is, but I start to think heavily on that.

I said, could this be demonic in some way? Or is it something else that's similar that, even if it weren't demonic, there's some other type of phenomenon that's occurring that's similar to the demonic? I don't know. but I didn't mention that in my email because, you know, I don't know, I went to put a lot of information in there in a short period of time.

But that's what happened to him, which is interesting. Yeah, I appreciate sharing that. It crosses my mind a lot, you know, being in this field. Is it deception and it's all kind of related or are these truly separate things going on? I'm not so sure. You know, I think about in scripture where it talks about the fallen angels landing on Mount Herman, why would they have to land on Mount Herman if it's an interdimensional being?

The way they describe it, it almost sounds like they're landing some sort of ship or something on Mount Herman. And that's the scripture version. If you read the Ananaki version, there are aliens that landed and on and on. and on. It's the same story, just a different perspective. And I appreciate you guys coming on and sharing your insight. What's kind of next for the Quantum Bridge project? Well, we're looking at continuing our research. We're trying to find as many locations as possible that we could work in and as many researchers, cryptic researchers, as possible so that we can gather the data that we need. Like I said, CPRI is data-oriented. If we can, you know, maybe we may not be

able to explain the phenomenon completely, but if we can correlate environmental data changes in the environment with the sightings of these creatures, then, you know, that it may give us some data points to work off of, and we can just proceed further from there, but it's got to start somewhere. And, you know, as far as I know, there's, there are no other groups like this. working in tandem with cryptid researchers to try to collect this data. And we're going to keep trying. We're going to drive forward and we'll see what happens in the future. Yeah, and how can people reach out to you?

You can contact us Center for Parenthood Research and Investigations in Virginia. I don't know precisely know what the email addresses. But we do have a Facebook page and I think of the website. So you can contact them that way or, you know, you can put my email address in the comments on your show. That would be, that would be okay too. I think the generic email is info at centerpr.org. Thanks so much, Dr. Trimmel. And I hope people go and check out the Quantum Bridge Project.

I welcome more eyes and different mindsets into this subject. hopefully we'll get answers and and like I said maybe it's all not connected and I'm reading too much into it but I'm not so sure about that the quantum bridge project I really appreciate you coming on Rick and Jack thank you so much for taking the time it was great thank you thank you Wes I appreciate you having me back thanks again guys and that's it for tonight everyone remember if you've had an encounter, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. And if you get a chance to check out Sasquatch Chronicles.com, you can become a member and get additional shows. Until next time, everyone.

I'm going. Light song, this is my home, there's your memories of you deal, and close it the sky, memories of you deal. Lighter, whiteer, light, so we put my eyes in, white, white, so we put my eyes in, whiter, this is my home, this is my home, does my own, there's a few, this guy. If you're in the sky, a mascara A maskerolice of you do.